[FairfieldLife] Re: Does anybody believe Speaker Pelosi?
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Ben brbenjaminass...@... wrote: Billy could be in the dictionary under the word red neck.. right? Don't insult the rednecks.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Does anybody believe Speaker Pelosi?
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Mike Dixon mdixon.6...@... wrote: Well do you? Nancy Pelosi? I think of a man and I take away reason and accountability.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Does anybody believe Speaker Pelosi?
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, BillyG. wg...@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Mike Dixon mdixon.6569@ wrote: Well do you? Nancy Pelosi? I think of a man and I take away reason and accountability. Billy could be in the dictionary under the word red neck.. right?
[FairfieldLife] Re: Does anybody believe Speaker Pelosi?
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, BillyG. wg...@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Mike Dixon mdixon.6569@ wrote: Well do you? Nancy Pelosi? I think of a man and I take away reason and accountability. Somebody must as she is still there.N.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Does anybody believe Speaker Pelosi?
Robert wrote: Funny, how all these macho guys, were so big, way back when... Maybe so, but I don't think Nancy Pelosi thinks it's funny. She has to face the voters soon and they're not very impressed that Nancy didn't object to the enhanced interrogations. She apparently knew all about them - so she's a obviously a co-conspirator and should be charged as well. Now Nancy is in a real pickle! I'm amazed at how Nancy Pelosi's current circumstances are similar to the Democrats' accusations that Bush lied us into the Iraq war. They saw the same intelligence that Bush (and Clinton before him) saw, indicating that Saddam had WMD. Few if any questioned the validity of the information. Most voted for the war. But when the war became unpopular they turned and claimed they had been misled by Bush. This was all a lie and political posturing, but it was effective then. I'm glad to see the Republicans are a little smarter this time and are countering more effectively. I wonder if it is possible to tie the Dems current hypocrisy to the earlier event. Read more: 'Pelosi in a Pickle' Posted by Glenn Reynolds http://pajamasmedia.com/instapundit/78716/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Does anybody believe Speaker Pelosi?
Well, I can't imagine a professional public servant employee of the CIA lying to congressional leaders, in an Intelligence Committee briefing, but I can imagine a politician like Nancy Pelosi lying every single day in a press conference on TV. sparaig wrote: I can easily imagine a CIA representative shading the facts presented to a member of Congress in a way commensurate with White House policy. But, you can't imagine a politician trying to lie to the American public in order to win another election? If the CIA's interrogation methods were so outrageous that they now warrant a truth commission - a process likely to destroy the careers of Bush administration and CIA officials who supported the policies - why is it that they did not even rate a milquetoast memo when the San Francisco Democrat learned of them? Full report: 'Now the lady doth protest too much' By Debra J. Saunders San Francisco Chronicle, Sunday, May 17, 2009 http://tinyurl.com/o6fg38
[FairfieldLife] Re: Does anybody believe Speaker Pelosi?
authfriend wrote: CIA has quite a well-established reputation by now for lying, or at least shading the truth, to Congress and even to the president. There's no evidence that the CIA lied to any members of congress. But there is ample proof that politicians lie all the time just in the course of giving a public press conference. It's pretty obvious that Nancy Pelosi is lying - she knew all about EITs since 2003 and she obviously approved of them, otherwise she would have objected to their use. But questions remain about why she did not raise objections to the interrogation methods at the time. If her goal today was to clarify the situation, she failed... Full story: 'Pelosi says CIA lied on 'torture' By James Coomarasamy BBC News, May 14, 2009 http://tinyurl.com/oetpso
[FairfieldLife] Re: Does anybody believe Speaker Pelosi?
I can easily imagine a CIA representative shading the facts presented to a member of Congress in a way commensurate with White House policy. do.rflex wrote: Besides, the question of what Pelosi knew or didn't, or when she did or didn't know, is irrelevant to how W. and Cheney broke the law and authorized torture. Bush and Cheney didn't break any laws, you moron, and they didn't torture anyone. What is important is that the interrogations worked and saved lives. You can compile every reasoned criticism of the Bush administration's conduct of the war against terrorism and there is one undisputable fact: In over five years since the 9-11 catastrophe, the United States has not been attacked again. Apparently, Nancy Pelosi approved of the 'torture', since she didn't object to it. If she broke the law she would be a co-conspirator, along with all the other congressional leaders who were on the same intelligence committee. House Speaker Nancy Pelosi was briefed on the use of enhanced interrogation techniques on terrorist suspect Abu Zubaydah in September 2002, according to a report prepared by the Director of National Intelligence's office and obtained by ABC News... Full report: 'Intelligence Report: Pelosi Briefed on Use of Interrogation Tactics in Sept. '02' By Rick Klein ABC News, The Note, May 07, 2009
[FairfieldLife] Re: Does anybody believe Speaker Pelosi?
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Richard J. Williams willy...@... wrote: authfriend wrote: CIA has quite a well-established reputation by now for lying, or at least shading the truth, to Congress and even to the president. There's no evidence that the CIA lied to any members of congress. But there is ample proof that politicians lie all the time just in the course of giving a public press conference. It's pretty obvious that Nancy Pelosi is lying - she knew all about EITs since 2003 and she obviously approved of them, otherwise she would have objected to their use. But questions remain about why she did not raise objections to the interrogation methods at the time. If her goal today was to clarify the situation, she failed... (snip) I don't get it...wasn't the pres., in charge...at the time...? Isn't this just a way for the guys that came up with this stuff, to hide behind her skirt... BTW, saying that the CIA doesn't lie, is like saying that water isn't wet... R.G.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Does anybody believe Speaker Pelosi?
Another BINGO moment with our FFL poet leary-ette. To me, the Dems are running scared that the dark underbelly of elitism may be exposed and suddenly the American public will have undeniable evidence that the Dems and Repugs are identical twins when it comes to spin, diversion, semantics and blame shifting. Since the Dems have put out so much we're not in the least like those murderous lying war mongers it could be stultifying to see such deep resonance between assumed to be foes. I can think of no other process that would benefit our American self image than to have a large and in your face revelation of how strong our congressionals are in league with BigMoney, BigMilitary, and BigPolitic. Nancy's pulled out the cork in Pandora's box, but I expect that BigMedia will fully cooperate with ignoring her mistake. If BigMedia did clamor for the release of the recorded CIA information sessions with Nancy, all of America will see our beloved leaders calmly cherry picking amongst the most vile of torture techniques like they were picking out their favorite doughnuts at Crispy Creme. Edg --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, raunchydog raunchy...@... wrote: The Speaker's House it is not clean Moneychangers own it Sucked dry to bone the common folk Forced in debt we loan it The Speaker's House it is not clean Torture advocating The truth obscured by blaming game And prevaricating The Speaker's House it is not clean Pelosi on petard She takes the rap for right wing flap Bush/Cheney crimes ignored The Speaker's House it is not clean Belies a Truth Commission Obama's open can of worms Mistaken his volition The Speaker's House it is not clean C.I.A. accuses Pelosi twists before the blow Under bus of bruises The Speaker's House it is not clean Sweet justice must be done To cleanse the stain our nation bears From torture's bloody run The choice of cleaning Speaker's house Or turn blind eye to crime Rise to honor integrity Proud beacon light must shine raunchydog
[FairfieldLife] Re: Does anybody believe Speaker Pelosi?
Duveyoung wrote: ...all of America will see our beloved leaders calmly cherry picking amongst the most vile of torture techniques like they were picking out their favorite doughnuts at Crispy Creme. You need to stop with all the exagerations, Edg. The U.S. doesn't torture people. Maybe you should get some smarts and read the law. Torture means to inflict severe physical or mental pain or suffering. Splashing water on a terrorist's face in the shower hardly describes torture. According to the law in Iraq and Afghainistan, murder is punishable by a public hanging. Apparently you don't even know that the U.S. Senate already rejected a bill in 2006 to make waterboarding illegal. Abu Zubaydah was one of the highest ranking members of al Qaeda - Osama bin Laden's senior lieutenant. According to what I've read, Zubaydah had been involved in every major al Qaeda terrorist operation including 9/11, and was planning future terrorist attacks against the U.S.A. What would you do to stop him - hold his hand and pat him on the back? Both memos noted that the legislative history of the 1994 torture statute was scant. Neither house of Congress had hearings, debates or amendments, or provided clarification about terms such as severe or prolonged mental harm. There is no record of Rep. Jerrold Nadler -- who now calls for impeachment and a criminal investigation of the lawyers -- trying to make any act (e.g., waterboarding) illegal, or attempting to lessen the specific intent standard... Read more: 'Critics Still Haven't Read the 'Torture' Memos' By Victoria Toensing Wall Street Journal, May 16, 2009 http://tinyurl.com/qg9rqx The United Nations Convention Against Torture and Other Cruel, Inhuman or Degrading Treatment: www.globallawbooks.org The Speaker's House it is not clean Torture advocating The truth obscured by blaming game And prevaricating
[FairfieldLife] Re: Does anybody believe Speaker Pelosi?
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jst...@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig LEnglish5@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Mike Dixon mdixon.6569@ wrote: Well do you? Do you have reason to take the word of one public servant over another, given neither is under oath? Besides, I can imagine plenty of scenarios where there's enough wiggle room around the facts for both sides to cliam they're telling the whole truth and nothing but the truth. One reason to give Pelosi's version a little more weight is that she is still advocating for a Truth Commission. The whole reason Republicans have been making such a big deal about her dispute with the CIA is that they figure if the truth would reflect badly on her, she'd back off calling for an investigation. But she hasn't; she's made even more of an issue of it since this business with the CIA came out, including in her press conference on Thursday. A good point. Its plausible that she's confident enough in her version of the situation that she's willing to face ridicule and scrutiny. More power to her, in that case. Lawson
[FairfieldLife] Re: Does anybody believe Speaker Pelosi?
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Richard J. Williams willy...@... wrote: sparaig wrote: Do you have reason to take the word of one public servant over another, given neither is under oath? Well, I can't imagine a professional public servant employee of the CIA lying to congressional leaders, in an Intelligence Committee briefing, but I can imagine a politician like Nancy Pelosi lying every single day in a press conference on TV. I can easily imagine a CIA representative shading the facts presented to a member of Congress in a way commensurate with White House policy. Lawson
[FairfieldLife] Re: Does anybody believe Speaker Pelosi?
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig lengli...@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Richard J. Williams willytex@ wrote: sparaig wrote: Do you have reason to take the word of one public servant over another, given neither is under oath? Well, I can't imagine a professional public servant employee of the CIA lying to congressional leaders, in an Intelligence Committee briefing, but I can imagine a politician like Nancy Pelosi lying every single day in a press conference on TV. I can easily imagine a CIA representative shading the facts presented to a member of Congress in a way commensurate with White House policy. CIA has quite a well-established reputation by now for lying, or at least shading the truth, to Congress and even to the president.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Does anybody believe Speaker Pelosi?
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig lengli...@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Richard J. Williams willytex@ wrote: sparaig wrote: Do you have reason to take the word of one public servant over another, given neither is under oath? Well, I can't imagine a professional public servant employee of the CIA lying to congressional leaders, in an Intelligence Committee briefing, but I can imagine a politician like Nancy Pelosi lying every single day in a press conference on TV. I can easily imagine a CIA representative shading the facts presented to a member of Congress in a way commensurate with White House policy. Lawson Besides, the question of what Pelosi knew or didn't, or when she did or didn't know, is irrelevant to how W. and Cheney broke the law and authorized torture. Philip Zelikow, who was State Department counselor for Condi Rice and executive director of the 9/11 Commission, testified last week before Congress that torture was a collective failure and it was a mistake, perhaps a disastrous one. ~~ Maureen Dowd http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/17/opinion/17dowd.html?ref=opinion
[FairfieldLife] Re: Does anybody believe Speaker Pelosi?
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jst...@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig LEnglish5@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Richard J. Williams willytex@ wrote: sparaig wrote: Do you have reason to take the word of one public servant over another, given neither is under oath? Well, I can't imagine a professional public servant employee of the CIA lying to congressional leaders, in an Intelligence Committee briefing, but I can imagine a politician like Nancy Pelosi lying every single day in a press conference on TV. I can easily imagine a CIA representative shading the facts presented to a member of Congress in a way commensurate with White House policy. CIA has quite a well-established reputation by now for lying, or at least shading the truth, to Congress and even to the president. Yes, this seems to be part of the job description... There must be a few elitist groups, as part of the organization, that would need to be kept secret because of their secret activities... You never could get the whole truth from them... Remember Ollie North, and the Iran/Contra hearings... Seems Ollie is still on the scene, as though nothing had happened? And the Reagan election of the 1980... Reagan had inside communication with the Iranians, in that they were released as part of an agreement, to get him elected... And so it goes... Only the raising of awareness and consciousness can produce a strong enough mirror to expose the lies, and manipulations..
[FairfieldLife] Re: Does anybody believe Speaker Pelosi?
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jst...@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig LEnglish5@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Richard J. Williams willytex@ wrote: sparaig wrote: Do you have reason to take the word of one public servant over another, given neither is under oath? Well, I can't imagine a professional public servant employee of the CIA lying to congressional leaders, in an Intelligence Committee briefing, but I can imagine a politician like Nancy Pelosi lying every single day in a press conference on TV. I can easily imagine a CIA representative shading the facts presented to a member of Congress in a way commensurate with White House policy. CIA has quite a well-established reputation by now for lying, or at least shading the truth, to Congress and even to the president. The CIA might not be the only agency- Seems most of the stuff from DC could fit that category. N.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Does anybody believe Speaker Pelosi?
Yes. However, the issue is NOT Pelosi, it's Rice, Rumsfeld, Bushlite, and Cheney, the actual instigators of the criminal acts. And yes, let's get those photos released that the ACLU is suing over.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Does anybody believe Speaker Pelosi?
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, ultrarishi no_re...@... wrote: Yes. However, the issue is NOT Pelosi, it's Rice, Rumsfeld, Bushlite, and Cheney, the actual instigators of the criminal acts. And yes, let's get those photos released that the ACLU is suing over. Funny, how all these macho guys, were so big, way back when... And now, they all run to hide, behind Nancy's skirt... Pitiful... All of them... How deep this stuff runs in the CIA, who knows... But they will do anything to protect themselves, that's for sure... We'll see, this time, what happens to these fools... R.G.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Does anybody believe Speaker Pelosi?
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Mike Dixon mdixon.6...@... wrote: Well do you? Do you have reason to take the word of one public servant over another, given neither is under oath? Besides, I can imagine plenty of scenarios where there's enough wiggle room around the facts for both sides to cliam they're telling the whole truth and nothing but the truth. L.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Does anybody believe Speaker Pelosi?
--- On Sat, 5/16/09, sparaig lengli...@cox.net wrote: From: sparaig lengli...@cox.net Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Does anybody believe Speaker Pelosi? To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Date: Saturday, May 16, 2009, 8:06 AM --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Mike Dixon mdixon.6...@... wrote: Well do you? Do you have reason to take the word of one public servant over another, given neither is under oath? Besides, I can imagine plenty of scenarios where there's enough wiggle room around the facts for both sides to cliam they're telling the whole truth and nothing but the truth. L. Amen to that, brother. Politicians of any stripe are post-modernists in that they construct reality with their words. To subscribe, send a message to: fairfieldlife-subscr...@yahoogroups.com Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!'Yahoo! Groups Links mailto:fairfieldlife-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.com
[FairfieldLife] Re: Does anybody believe Speaker Pelosi?
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutp...@... wrote: --- On Sat, 5/16/09, sparaig lengli...@... wrote: From: sparaig lengli...@... Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Does anybody believe Speaker Pelosi? To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Date: Saturday, May 16, 2009, 8:06 AM --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Mike Dixon mdixon.6569@ wrote: Well do you? Do you have reason to take the word of one public servant over another, given neither is under oath? Besides, I can imagine plenty of scenarios where there's enough wiggle room around the facts for both sides to cliam they're telling the whole truth and nothing but the truth. L. Amen to that, brother. Politicians of any stripe are post-modernists in that they construct reality with their words. I DO think that Pelosi is showing OCD-ish signs about this though. She's gone pretty far out on a limb in ways that don't seem to make sense for a career politician. L.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Does anybody believe Speaker Pelosi?
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig lengli...@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Mike Dixon mdixon.6569@ wrote: Well do you? Do you have reason to take the word of one public servant over another, given neither is under oath? Besides, I can imagine plenty of scenarios where there's enough wiggle room around the facts for both sides to cliam they're telling the whole truth and nothing but the truth. One reason to give Pelosi's version a little more weight is that she is still advocating for a Truth Commission. The whole reason Republicans have been making such a big deal about her dispute with the CIA is that they figure if the truth would reflect badly on her, she'd back off calling for an investigation. But she hasn't; she's made even more of an issue of it since this business with the CIA came out, including in her press conference on Thursday.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Does anybody believe Speaker Pelosi?
sparaig wrote: Do you have reason to take the word of one public servant over another, given neither is under oath? Well, I can't imagine a professional public servant employee of the CIA lying to congressional leaders, in an Intelligence Committee briefing, but I can imagine a politician like Nancy Pelosi lying every single day in a press conference on TV. Nancy Pelosi is up for re-election soon, right? So, I would probably believe Leon Panetta, the CIA and the others members of the Intelligence Committee that were briefed. Besides, I can imagine plenty of scenarios where there's enough wiggle room around the facts for both sides to cliam they're telling the whole truth and nothing but the truth. CIA officers briefed truthfully on the interrogation of Abu Zubaydah, Mr. Panetta wrote in a memo to agency employees... Full story: 'Panetta's Pelosi Smackdown' Wall Street Journal, MAY 16, 2009 http://tinyurl.com/r2lfye
[FairfieldLife] Re: Does anybody believe Speaker Pelosi?
Besides, I can imagine plenty of scenarios where there's enough wiggle room around the facts for both sides to cliam they're telling the whole truth and nothing but the truth... Peter wrote: Politicians of any stripe are post-modernists in that they construct reality with their words... Maybe so, but I don't think that any of the CIA officers that did the briefing to Nancy Pelosi were 'politicians' appointed by Bush. What is troubling is that Nancy Pelosi is using national security as a political football to get herself re-elected. If she was against harsh interrogation techniques, she should have spoken up long before re-election time. But, like a lot of politicians, she wouldn't pause a second before putting politics before national security. Apparently it's a power syndrome with career politicians. The whole Obama policy on national security is very troubling. Maybe it would have been better if the voters had voted for Hillary Clinton - she knows all about national security issues - but, flip-flopper Obama doesn't seem to know what he's doing. In fact, Obama's Justice Department has yet to release critical memos believed to have authorized those actions under President Bush... Read more: 'Commentary: Troubling signs from Obama's administration' By Anthony D. Romero News Observer, Fri, May. 15, 2009 http://tinyurl.com/ocafay
[FairfieldLife] Re: Does anybody believe Speaker Pelosi?
The Speaker's House it is not clean Moneychangers own it Sucked dry to bone the common folk Forced in debt we loan it The Speaker's House it is not clean Torture advocating The truth obscured by blaming game And prevaricating The Speaker's House it is not clean Pelosi on petard She takes the rap for right wing flap Bush/Cheney crimes ignored The Speaker's House it is not clean Belies a Truth Commission Obama's open can of worms Mistaken his volition The Speaker's House it is not clean C.I.A. accuses Pelosi twists before the blow Under bus of bruises The Speaker's House it is not clean Sweet justice must be done To cleanse the stain our nation bears From torture's bloody run The choice of cleaning Speaker's house Or turn blind eye to crime Rise to honor integrity Proud beacon light must shine raunchydog
[FairfieldLife] Re: Does anybody believe Speaker Pelosi?
Mike Dixon wrote: Does anybody believe Speaker Pelosi? God forbid, but if President Obama and Vice President Biden should die or be incapacitated, Nancy Pelosi would become our president. Read other comments: 'She's Losing Her Own' By Peter Wehner Commentary Magazine, April 13, 2009 http://tinyurl.com/pgnapd
[FairfieldLife] Re: Does anybody believe Speaker Pelosi?
do.rflex wrote: Some in the CIA are attempting to exonerate themselves [and by extension, the Cheney/Bush administration] by claiming that they fulfilled their legal obligation to inform Congress, and that Congress *knew about* and *approved* everything they were doing every step along the way with regard to interrogation methods. That is blatantly false... WASHINGTON - A source close to House Speaker Nancy Pelosi now confirms that Pelosi was told in February 2003 by her intelligence aide, Michael Sheehy, that waterboarding was actually used on CIA detainee Abu Zubaydah... Read more: 'Aide told Pelosi waterboarding had been used' By Deirdre Walsh CNN, April 12, 2009 http://tinyurl.com/oaffuz
[FairfieldLife] Re: Does anybody believe Speaker Pelosi?
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Mike Dixon mdixon.6...@... wrote: Well do you? Some in the CIA are attempting to exonerate themselves [and by extension, the Cheney/Bush administration] by claiming that they fulfilled their legal obligation to inform Congress, and that Congress *knew about* and *approved* everything they were doing every step along the way with regard to interrogation methods. That is blatantly false. They are particularly targeting Nancy Pelosi because she is a prominent key Democrat and quite a convenient symbol to use as target practice for the sore loser right wing anti-Pelosi media machine who already hate her. The publicity value for them is BIG. But like most of their loudly broadcasted histrionics, they are lacking in solid conclusive substance. I think the more appropriate question is 'does anyone believe the CIA apologists for the Cheney/Bush debacle?' -- Nancy Pelosi gave a press briefing today on this issue. It's very revealing and I recommend that if readers are interested in this issue by all means watch it. Here's the video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lYwZa8jvNp4
