Re: MD: Size of WAV files from decoded MP3 files
From: "J. Coon" [EMAIL PROTECTED] I think they will be the same size. True. They are. But the point of my discussion was that an interpolative filter creates that data in an attempt to reconstruct the song. It mimics what it thinks the original data was...an even more difficult task than compressing the data imo. The original data which the compression codec threw away is lost forever. What I was questioning was what (if any) effect this digital guesswork would have on the sonic fidelity. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Size of WAV files from decoded MP3 files
From: "Taky Cheung" [EMAIL PROTECTED] If you convert an mp3 back to wave using uncompressed PCM, that's the same as the wave file you ripped from CD. Bob was right, the size of the wave file is depends on the frequency, bit depth, and mono/stereo channel. I realize that. But I also know that the data "restored" is not the original data lost in compression because that data is gone forever. An MPEG 1 Layer 3 decoder uses a sophisticated interpolative filter in an attempt to accurately replace the lost data. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: recompressing (was MiniDisc Your Music)
From: "David W. Tamkin" [EMAIL PROTECTED] You aren't recompressing compressed data; you are compressing the decompressed output of a previous compression. The various codecs have overlap in what they consider expendable; they are not orthogonal to one another. David, I'm not sure exactly what you mean by the statement : "You aren't recompressing compressed data; you are compressing the decompressed output of a previous compression." As I understand it, in MP3 compression (as in MD compression) data is thrown away...ie: lost forever. Hence the term "lossy compression". The data thrown away in the compression process is gone, never to be recovered again. Now, I am aware that converting an MP3 back into a .wav file produces a VERY large file similar in size, if not exactly the same size as the original .wav file. But I was under the impression that this was accomplished by use of an interpolative filter which essentially "guesses" how the file should look when reconstructed. Am I wrong about this? Now, as to what degree of compression occurs when that file is then rencoded to MD, here I will have to confess complete ignorance. But I venture to say that at least SOME additional data is lost, thereby compromising fidelity that much further. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Size of WAV files from decoded MP3 files
From: "Bob Norton" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yes. The size of a WAV file depends only on the length of the recording, the bit resolution used and the sampling frequency. Bob...you completely missed my point here. I was referring to .wav files created by decoding an MP3 file. Not to the original .wav file as ripped or recorded from a CD. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MiniDisc Your Music
From: "Ken Clinger" [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2. If you get a MiniDisc recorder you'll have the ability to convert and playback any standard audio format including MP3, Real Audio, Windows Media audio, ripped CD tracks, and Liquid Audio! This is the kind of thing I just don't understand. The writer (I realize it wasn't you Ken) is leaving people with a false impression (imo). If you take an MP3, RA, WM, LA, or any OTHER type of compressed audio file you care to name, and record that file to minidisc, it has just been compressed again. Data has been lost not once but twice. This simply HAS to have deliterious effects on fidelity. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: earbuds
From: "Jim Gray" [EMAIL PROTECTED] This may have already been answered some time ago, but what should I pay = for a really decent pair of earbuds, and what model is recommended? = thanx... I agree with Mike...Koss' 'The Plug' is great sounding and goes for $19.95 (USD) plus tax. The Etymotic Research plugs are absolutely awesome of course...but too pricey. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: External battery packs and portable electronics
From: "Francisco J. Huerta" [EMAIL PROTECTED] That, and the fact he hates MD, makes me think he is not an objective reviewer... close to an a**hole. Oh well. [shrug] No use continuing this thread. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Philips EXP103 Expanium vs Memorex MPD8505CP
From: "las" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Someone (I think it was Don Capp) recently was praising their Phillips Expanium. I was wondering if it has any major advantages over the Memorex MPD8505CP? The size and weight of both is close (the Phillips is a tenth of an inch thinner, only 8 hundreds of an inch wider, 8 hundredths of an inch shorter but weighs a tenth of a pound more. Same warranty and accessories. The Phillips is sleeker looking. But for $70 I can give up a little sleek. I understand that the original version of the Memorex had skipping problems, but the revised version is OK. The Memorex is about $70 less. As I recall the Memorex doesn't support bitrates any higher than 128kbps (reliably) and only supports the ISO9660 file format, which means that files are limited to an 8 character file name. Other than that, the unit is great from what I've heard. Sounds good and very reliable. However...IF "someone" were to be in the market for a CD-MP3 player (which I know you aren't since you don't care for mp3) then I would recommend that they wait for the TDK Mojo to be released at the beginning of April. It will have all the various bells and whistles that you could possibly want in an MP3-CD player...which is about typical of second gen products imo. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: what is an SACD?
From: "Bob Willcox" [EMAIL PROTECTED] No, DSD does not use PCM encoded. Its a single bit encoding at 2.8224 MHz. Consequently it doesn't have a "word" length. It can, though, be easily converted into any of the common PCM formats. Bob, my faux pas in that regard has been loong ago corrected. In fact, this post is at least a couple of weeks old. It's just Yahoo Groups actin' screwy (so what else it new). Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: External battery packs and portable electronics
From: "las" [EMAIL PROTECTED] BTW that's where the assh0le [sic] Ken Pohmann (or whatever the jerks name is) get his start. I didn't like him them (he reviewed new CDs and was just as clueless about music as he is about audio. Aside from being an objectivist (bound to offend the golden eared) what is it exactly that makes Ken Pohlman an asshole and "clueless" about audio? Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: External battery packs and portable electronics
From: "las" [EMAIL PROTECTED] You are fairly new to the list so you probably didn't see the article that was posted here a few years ago where he totally trashed MDs claiming they were inferior to Dolby C cassettes. All you have to do is read some of his articles and if you know anything, you start to say to yourself, "how'd this guy ever get a job as an "expert" True, I am new to the list. However, I am a LONG time reader of a number of audio mags, both pro and home oriented. I have been reading Stereo Review (now Sound Vision) since the 70's and am VERY familiar with Ken Pohlman's work. And I fail to see how Ken's having an opinion that differs from yours, however radically, makes him an asshole. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: More on CD vs. MD Sound Quality
From: "las" [EMAIL PROTECTED] One of the fundamental things you have wrong is this 5 to one compression. It is not compression. If set up correctly 80% of the digital information on a CD not heard by the human ear. Don't confuse bit wise reduction with compression. U...you lost me there Larry. ATRAC is indeed lossy compression. A great deal of data is "thrown away" in order to fit it onto those tiny little discs. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Question for Don
From: "Mike Burger" [EMAIL PROTECTED] In other words, you really can't take the cost factor into consideration for your personal debate, and then decry the same factor in the overall debate. Mike...I think the use of the word "doesn't" was a typo and he meant to say that such extra costs should be factored in. At least I think so anyway. I gave him the benefit of that doubt. :-) Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Question for Don
From: "James Jarvie" [EMAIL PROTECTED] I have three questions for you Don, and please don't take this as any sort of criticism or sarcasm, because it's not meant that way (though it may sound it). No problem James. But thanks for the qualifiers. 1. It's apparent that you are very fond of MP3s and your Expanium (of which I never heard until you weighed in on this list). My question is: do you do minidiscs at all? I assume you must because you're on this list. I can't, however, remember you talking about using MDs personally (though you seem to know enough about them to suggest that either you do or you have used them). If you have mentioned using MDs personally and I missed it,them I apologize. Absolutely no apologies necessary. The answer is yes. I own a Sharp MD-SR60 but I use it for one VERY specific purpose and that is for the recording of live music. In fact, I use it so extensively that I am considering the purchase of one of the "pro" recorders (either the HHB or the Marantz) because they include so many features of interest to the pro recordist (XLR inputs, high headroom mic preamp, built in limiter, digital inputs AND outputs, and so on). 2. If you are using MDs as well as your Expanium, then my second question is: do you find that you have uses for both, or do has the Expanium taken the place of MDs for you. Yes, as I hope the above comments made obvious. I use the MD recorder almost exclusive for live recording. And I use the Expanium for portable personal audio (CD and mp3 playback). 3. Have you listened to any classical music on either (especially orchestral stuff, though it's more common to find chamber music than orchestral on MP3s). Yes. And I have recorded a bit of classical music as well. Some has turned out well and some...well...ahem. I have to admit that your description of the Expanium intrigues mebut I can't afford more kit right now. That's ok. Save your duckies for the second generation CD/mp3 playback units that are just hitting the market now. The Rio Volt and the TDK Mojo are gonna be KILLER players (with id3 tag support and some other nifty features) and will cost significantly less. Also, just to weigh in on the previous debate. Yes, I have a computer. No, I cannot burn CDs (older computer not fast enough - can't afford / justify the cost to get a new one). Still, I think if we are going to debate this issue, that it must be granted that anyone considering using MP3s has the neccessary gear, and that it shouldn't be factored into the cost equation. Oh, I agree with that James. I just enjoy playing the Devil's Advocate. :-) Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: The far horizon of MP3 storage
From: "Mike Burger" [EMAIL PROTECTED] What I'm saying is that before people go getting all verklempt over the Nazis' use of machines, some of which the government undoubtedly owned prior to their parade of "undesirables" to the camps, does not make IBM...the German arm or the parent company...complicit in Hitler's plans or actions. A. The dulcet voice of reason. 'Tis music to my ears. I'm also Jewish. Which only adds further credence to your clear headed rationale. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: The far horizon of MP3 storage
From: "Michael Burger" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Ok, ok...let's not get crazy. Next, we'll be yelling to sue the companies that made the chemicals used in the gas chambers, or the companies that made the guns and bullets. And I'm quite sure that IBM machines were being used to count the number of Japanese Americans that were placed into relocation camps here in the US, during WWII, etc. IBM made a tool. The Nazis were the ones who used the tool for their purposes. Let's leave the blame where it belongs. Mike...brace yourself. We agree! :-D Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Best buy, phasing out MD equip ??
From: "Robert J Lynn Jr" [EMAIL PROTECTED] So? It still requires a computer ($500) and a CD-R burner ($120 old model). I admit, i use my MD for most of my MP3 music on om computer, but I like to take notes with my mic and record off friends at school. So, rules out MP3. Rob...if you'll read Mike's original post then you'll please note that I was responding to specific issues which HE raised (ie : media cost and media capacity). Using internet audio obviously requires a computer and I would venture to say that most if not all of the members of this list actually HAVE one of those. So that's a non-issue. And as far as a CD-R drive is concerned...if you don't have one yet come on and join the fun bro...the 21st century is here. :-D CD writers are practically de rigeur among computer users today. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Best buy, phasing out MD equip ??
From: "las" [EMAIL PROTECTED] I disagree about the quality of MP3s and seriously doubt that you can tell the difference between an MP3 recorded at the "standard" 128 and 192Kbps. All you are doing is using up more disc space. You can disagree all you like Larry. But in AB comparison where A is the original cd and B is a 192kbps mp3 file, the file is sonically indistinguishable from the original cd. That was my point. And yes, that is on a high quality playback system. My Turtle Beach soundcard has RCA stereo outputs being fed to a Denon integrated amp driving Mission speakers and an old MK sub which I retired a few years back from my main home theater system. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Best buy, phasing out MD equip ??
From: "Gerard Naude" [EMAIL PROTECTED] How long is this mp3 vs. md war going to last Whew. Silly me. I didn't know there was a war on. :-) Face it. MD is best for portable recording. MP3 is best for portable playing. I quite agree. That's what I have said from the beginning. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
MD: Interesting article...
From: "Gabriele Intemann" [EMAIL PROTECTED] You might want to have a look at: http://www.dv.com/magazine/2000/1200/rose1200.html ...thanks for the link Gabriele. I wonder if anyone noticed the following quote toward the end of the article. "MiniDisc is used a lot in Hollywood for playback as well. Because its speed is stable, performers can dance or lipsync to it for music videos. Its fast cueing and easy-to-edit track markers make it very flexible in the field...etc...etc." This quote (along with others sprinkled throughout the article) only confirm what I suggested in a previous post...that Mini Disc will be around for the foreseeable future because of it's widespread use in the field of professional pre/post production audio recording. True, you may not be able to find a large selection at the local Circuit City in the near future. But MD is being used extensively by recording professionals (particularly in the film industry). And that fact alone will insure it's survival long after it fades as a mass market consumer medium, even as it did for DAT before it. So fear not Mini Disc lovers...the medium is safe...although you may soon have to shop with pro audio suppliers for equipment and blank media. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Grundig deck?
From: "Ivica Petrovic" [EMAIL PROTECTED] I've seen on the Dixons web site ( www.dixons.co.uk), Grundig mini disc deck which is called Grundig MD-60. It's from their Fine Arts series. I suppose it's not original by Grundig, and would like to know is it a clone of Pioneer or Technics ( or even Sony, which seems less likely)? A playback only unit, from what I can see. Doesn't record. Which accounts for the lower price. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Aiwa F80 - the best portable recorder for live gigs
From: "las" [EMAIL PROTECTED] There is a noticeable improvement when switching to the Aiwa. Noticeable. Not small enough that it is just a question of mind over matter. Have you tested this under double blind conditions? :-D Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Best buy, phasing out MD equip ??
From: "Francisco J. Huerta" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Personally, I think MP3 players are a big hit with... ahem... how to put this politely... people who don't like paying for their music (aka Napster users). And that's it. Are you trying to say that MD users never make copies of CDs which they don't actually own? Are you going to tell me that you've never made an MD copy of a friends CD or a borrowed CD? Do you seriously think that the only people who use MP3 players are people who download their music exclusively from Napster? Francisco...ahem...how to put this politely...bullshit. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Grundig deck?
From: "PrinceGaz" [EMAIL PROTECTED] It is described on Dixons' web site as the "Grundig MD-60 Minidisc Record Deck", and looking at the pic of it (using the zoom option) the three rotary dials to the left of the disc input/display are (from left) phone level, record level, jog dial. Hmmm. Must be a recorder then...although the link I followed had it listed as a player. Forgive my assumption that it was just that. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Best buy, phasing out MD equip ??
From: "Francisco J. Huerta" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Don, you really have to understand that most of the people have their own opinions. The fact that you don't agree with me doesn't mean I'm full of it. Francisco...what I'm REALLY trying to understand is exactly where I said you were "full of it". I objected to the following statement as bullshit... "Personally, I think MP3 players are a big hit with... ahem... how to put this politely... people who don't like paying for their music (aka Napster users). And that's it." ...and I still do. I use an MP3 player primarily because I can load one disc for a six hour plane flight and never once listen to the same song twice. So I object to your the rather blanket "and that's it" nature of your statement. I think that the MP3 format makes a LOT of sense for the portable audio user. Naturally, when I'm at home, I'd prefer to listen to the actual CD as opposed to ANY compressed format, MD included. Of course, the fact that I can download music from the internet and listen to it IS a plus imo...but I digress. :-) Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Best Earbuds?
From: "Dan Scellen" [EMAIL PROTECTED] I need a pair of good earbuds. What are the best earbuds for around $30 or under? I personally think that Koss' 'The Plug' is the best for the money. There are better...Etymotic Research for example...but they are much more expensive. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Best buy, phasing out MD equip ??
From: "Dan Frakes" [EMAIL PROTECTED] You have to buy a computer, a CD burner, the Expanium, and some discs just to start using it. Easily over $1000 for an entry-level machine, closer to $2000 for a good system. Well Dan. You got me. I know when I've been licked. Darn. You do have to have a computer. You do have to have a CD burner and some CD-R or CD-RW media. Seriously now. Do you have a computer? OK. Then you're almost there. Do you have a CD burner? They're getting pretty cheap of late ya know. At that point, 50 cents for 4-10 hours of music (of inferior sound quality)... Here's where we part company. You would never now the difference between my Expanium playing MP3 files and my Expanium playing the original CD. I guarantee it. Inferior sound quality? Nope. Not at all. But then, don't believe me. Just burn a CD full of MP3s and borrow an Expanium...maybe a Circuit City store demo model...and listen for yourself. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Best buy, phasing out MD equip ??
From: "Mike Burger" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unfortunately, the statement says "Personally, I think...". It's not far fetched to take it to mean that you feel he's full of it when you tell him his statement is BS. Geez guys. Do you just WANT to fight or what? I object to the statement. Period. That is all. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Best buy, phasing out MD equip ??
From: "Mike Burger" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Not looking for a fight...just pointing out to you the hows of his response. G Nah. Seems to me that every time I disagree with Francisco you have to chest up. Are you two best buds or something? G Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Best buy, phasing out MD equip ??
From: "Matt Wall" [EMAIL PROTECTED] I dont know what encoder your using, but personally i can still hear a difference between 192 and an original CD, espeically with horns and extremely tight low's. Then I bow deeply to your obviously superior ears. I cannot hear that difference and I listen on some pretty serious gear. Indeed, the only difference which I think I might hear is in the area of low bass impact. But then, that could be just my imagination. if you dont like that equipment your too big of an audio snob and you shouldn't be even thinking of MD or MP3 :P Not really sure where you're coming from with these comments. I merely included an equipment list with my original post because I wanted to head off any speculation about the equipment used and it's relative effect on perceived audio quality. I was trying to clarify that I was listening through a decent system and not through the typical cheesy computer speakers. Sorry if it seemed "snobbish" to you. :p Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Best buy, phasing out MD equip ??
From: "Matt Wall" [EMAIL PROTECTED] sarcasm yeah i wouldn't know the difference, but then again i lost my hearing douring the war too I'm sincerely sorry to hear that. I understand they're making great strides with high fidelity hearing aids these days. Perhaps this link will be of assistance : http://www.digital-recordings.com/publ/pubaids.html All the best! Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Best buy, phasing out MD equip ??
From: "Richard Lang" [EMAIL PROTECTED] If you're talking about the general audio market (remember we are talking about audio products), the expense of a computer does need to be factored in. Indeed. Point well made and well taken. But I would contend that MD has not exactly met with mainstream acceptance either and that it is not going to do so in the future. Both items are at present a small niche market in the larger audio equipment marketplace compared to the sales of CD players, DVD players, and even consumer CD recorders. However, there nevertheless remains a viable market for both products and I believe that sales stats over the next few quarters will show that MP3 devices have been very hot sellers with the major electronics retailers. For example, DVD players which also decode MP3 files have been flying off the Circuit City shelves here locally, and I don't exactly live in the center of the audio/video universe. I'm not saying the Expanium isn't a great product that doesn't suit you immensely - I'm sure it is and does. But I suspect there is a reason that things like MP3 players aren't that mainstream yet - MD has one strong thing going for it and that is that people can hook it up to their CD players and burn copies or plug earphones into the things and hear music. Nice and simple. Richard, far be it from me to downplay the many merits of MD. I love it. I use it. Frequently. I just take exception to the apparent attitude that MP3 is somehow an inferior compression format...especially at high bitrates. That is simply and patently untrue. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Best buy, phasing out MD equip ??
From: "Dan Frakes" [EMAIL PROTECTED] And you can't edit after you create, you can't record from a mic All true. And all categories in which MD carries the day, hands down. and you can't take it with you... Not true. I carry it with me all the time. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Best buy, phasing out MD equip ??
From: "Dan Frakes" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sorry, Don, but you're wrong on that one. Again, just because you can't tell the difference doesn't mean others can't. Again...I bow to the golden ears. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Copyright and Napster
From: "Stainless Steel Rat" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Monday February 12 3:17 PM ET Court Says Napster Must Stop Good. Now maybe people will quit bitching about Napster (both sides). Besides, the file sharing genie is well and truly out of the bottle since the source code is widely distributed and the Gnutella source code was always open source. It can't be stopped. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Best buy, phasing out MD equip ??
From: "Mike Burger" [EMAIL PROTECTED] blink To tell the truth, I never noticed any correlation between his posting and my defense. I tend to jump to the defense of anyone I feel has at least made a valid point, and I feel has dismissed out of hand. sigh I didn't dismiss him out of hand. I disagreed with his statement. That's all. I guess I need to watch my threads a little more carefully. G Not on my account...I'm just one of the nobodies around here. G Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Best buy, phasing out MD equip ??
From: "Richard Lang" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Maybe this is so in the U.S. Here in NZ I would say MD acceptance is similar to the reported position in the UK - two years ago no-one had heard of it, now more and more people have portables, many people (maybe still not most) have heard of the concept. I've noticed that Richard. Based upon what I've read in various UK audio and pro sound/recording publications it seems that MD is far more established in the UK than it ever has been in the US. Interesting. Seems to be used quite often for two track mastering in home studios over there...at least based upon what I've read in Sound-On-Sound and other mags. Over here I would say the home studio mastering device of choice is the DAT recorder, closely followed by the CD recorder. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: md-l-digest
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] I was at Fry's Electronics here in San Diego (a large chain store) two days ago and saw the new Sony dual tray CD recorder, price $499.00. Looks like Sony is going to start selling CD recorders now. Glenn Yep. Just saw the same unit on Saturday at Best Buy. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Best buy, phasing out MD equip ??
From: "Mike Burger" [EMAIL PROTECTED] You tell me. I can get a decent MD recorder for much $40-50USD less, and not have to pay as much for the media. What's a CF card cost these days for a card with enough capacity to hold an hour or so worth of music? I wouldn't know Mike. My Expanium uses CD-R and CD-RW media which costs me approximately 80 cents per disc. And each disc has the capacity to hold well over one hundred songs even at high bitrates (say 192kbps). That works out to 8 plus hours of VERY high quality (ie: practically indistinguishable from the CD) music on one 80 cent disc. You do the math. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Best buy, phasing out MD equip ??
From: "Zaheer Mahmood" [EMAIL PROTECTED] I think MP3 players are massivley overhyped and will die down in the next few years just like the Internet bubble... The internet bubble? Internet use continues to grow daily with a slight slowdown but no sign of stopping. As for MP3 players...don't knock it until you've tried it. My Expanium is the best entertainment investment I've made in years. And at 199 USD how much more inexpensive does it have to get? Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Some food for thought/fuel for discussion...
From: "David W. Tamkin" [EMAIL PROTECTED] The lossiness of ATRAC is not orthogonal to the lossiness of MP3 encoding. If a song was on a CD but you have it as a 10:1 .mp3 file, and you play the .mp3 file as input to MD, the resulting MD track is 1/5, not 1/50, the size of the original CD track. There is a lot of extrapolation in decoding the .mp3 file into S/PDIF or into analog output, and, because of overlap in the algorithms, a disproportionate part of what ATRAC discards comes from the extrapolation rather than from the retained data. You're telling me that compressing the file twice doesn't effect the audio quality? Not sure I'm getting you here. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Some food for thought/fuel for discussion...
From: "J. Coon" [EMAIL PROTECTED] So, how does it sound? That is really the crux of the matter. Exactly. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Effects of different ATRAC versions
From: "las" [EMAIL PROTECTED] *Weird, because as far as I know you should not have been able to make that recording in the first place. AC3 tracks are usually marked SCMS final. I thought that the DVD's sound can be copied just like a CD Also, while you can't copy a DVD using a stand alone unit. On a computer you can copy DVD's if you have the right software. Right. You can (of course) record the audio from a DVD via the analog outputs of the DVD player. And, on a computer, you can digitally "rip" the contents of a DVD (both audio AND video) just as you can an audio CD given the right hardware (a DVD-ROM drive) and the right software (a DVD ripper). Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: CD vs MD
From: "Donald Person" [EMAIL PROTECTED] What I was referring to was the ease of use... Here we obviously agree. My statement (when you read it in the proper context) was OBVIOUSLY not a comparison of audio quality, but ease-of-use. Please don't jump on a statement just to blurt out a statement containing information we all already know. Sorry dude. Don't be so testy. Just trying to promote discussion, that's all. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: PC ABX
From: "Churchill, Guy" [EMAIL PROTECTED] The ultimate sound comparison site. Yep. Great site isn't it Guy? It's amazing how many audiophile conventions melt away like fog when exposed to the brutality of ABX comparisons. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: The future of minidisc. (was Best buy, phasing out MD equipm
From: "Robin Landy" [EMAIL PROTECTED] That said, I think in the long term, Minidisc is doomed. As soon as someone comes up with a personal MP3 player with integrated IBM Microdrive, I think MP3 will have found its 'killer player'. Afterall, it'll be *tiny* with massive capacity. In fact, does anyone know this hasn't happened already? Not that I'm aware of...but the Nomad Jukebox is getting damned close! Once again...all the more reason for MD to be marketed as a live recording medium. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Carver Fire
From: "J. Coon" [EMAIL PROTECTED] That is the way it works in conventional physics. That is how a hot air balloon rises, it is part of what makes the wind blow. However, in the field of audiophidialia, things are reversed. Usually based on the latest issue of some magazine. That is why you can easily tell the difference between different brands of minidisc blanks. The more expensive ones always sound the best. So put away your intellect, what you were taught in elementary school, high school physics and even what you learned at an institution of higher learning. What the heck do the learned professors know any way? Just go visit you local audio store and swallow the hook line and sinker the salesman has for you and remember that "He has a HIGH SCHOOL diploma",... and he gets a commission. Heheheheheh. A man after my own heart Jimbo! You know snake oil when you see it. My motto? "If it disappears when the blindfold goes on, then it doesn't exist." Of course, perhaps the "golden ears" listen with their eyes. ;-) Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: what is an SACD?
From: "Francisco J. Huerta" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Uhm... don't think so. Sorry you don't think so. I heard 'em both together under double blind conditions (ABX comparator). Couldn't tell the difference. I'll bet you couldn't either. ;-) Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: THX Certified?
From: "las" [EMAIL PROTECTED] I wonder if Lucas owns a Mini Disc recorder? The way I look it it, if he isn't into the format, we can discount him straight out. No. But I'm quite sure he probably has a portable DAT recorder. Ahem. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: THX Certified?
From: "las" [EMAIL PROTECTED] He's right about this Ratman even though I haven't a clue with Timbre matching and Decorrelation are. Timbre matching = special EQ settings used to correct for different speaker reproduction characteristics... for example, it is most commonly used to correct for the effect caused by surround sound information as it passes from the front (and generally more coherent) channels to the rear (and generally more diffuse) channels Decorrelation = uses out-of-phase information (in the rear surround channels) to give the illusion of a larger/broader rear soundstage (i.e. a "more open" sound)...only used when the rear channel information is a matrixed mono signal rather than discrete - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: what is an SACD?
From: "Matthew Bullis" [EMAIL PROTECTED] I noticed this as a format that you can buy on CDNow.com for some albums. What is this format? Thanks a lot. SACD = Super Audio Compact Disc. It's a new high bitrate (24 bit word lengths) CD format developed by Sony. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: THX In Layman's Terms
From: "las" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Now Dolby Digital is a discrete set up while Dolby Surround and it's enhanced version, Pro Logic were matrixed kind of similar to SQ quadraphonic sound. Correct! Go to the head of the class! ;-) Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: THX In Layman's Terms
From: "las" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Carver of Carver electronics once noticed what he felt was a marked improvement in the sound while he had his fire place going. He experimented and added a circuit to some of his equipment that infused that background sound into the system. ROTFL! What a snake oil salesman! Bob could sell shoes to double amputees. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: THX...yadda...yadda...yadda...
From: "las" [EMAIL PROTECTED] The best way to decide would be to go to a place like Circuit City and ask to hear one of their high end receivers that have switch able THX circuits (like Onkyo). Listen to the sound in the standard Dolby Digital mode and the THX mode and see if you feel it is worth it. Like speakers, you will have to hear them and decide for yourself. Also, who old is your receiver? With the new THX-EX and DTS-ES you may just want to wait a little while and buy a receiver that has these circuits. Larry...he has McIntosh equipment bro. Not exactly the kind of stuff you pick up at Circuit City. ;-) Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: THX...yadda...yadda...yadda...
From: "jgvp" [EMAIL PROTECTED] All my McIntosh components are THX approved; however, a not too inexpensive THX module is required to be incorporated into the Control Preamplifier in order to complete the design and quality control for theatre sound reproduction. I have yet to purchase and have this module installed, so can anyone here state whether or not this is being "penny wise, pound foolish", if you get my drift ? Thanks. My friend, if you have the obviously considerable wherewithall to afford McIntosh home theater gear, then buying the THX module should be well within your means. By all means buy it. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
MD: A question...
...for all the MD gurus. Does anyone know of a MD Recorder that has a digital out (optical or spdif or what-have-you) other than the rather pricey HHB Portadisc professional recorder? Any? Thanks in advance. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: what is an SACD?
From: "las" [EMAIL PROTECTED] How does it stack up against HCDC CDs? They're both very good...very comparable to each other. It's just another in the long line of format wars Larry. Who knows which will be left standing when the dust settles? Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: what is an SACD?
From: "las" [EMAIL PROTECTED] That's one of those human weaknesses that make other people rich. I swear I have spent my life saving to buy things only to have them become obsolescent as soon as I finally get them. It's the nature of the hobby Larry. I've been an audiophile for many years (too many) and it NEVER changes. The new technology is just around the corner. And computers? Even worse! Oi vay! Don C12 - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
MD: THX...yadda...yadda...yadda...
In light of all of the dis and misinformation regarding THX and what it is and/or is not...I thought it might be helpful to post the following article, taken directly from the Lucasfilm/THX website archives : WHAT IS THX? Hi, I'm Laura Ackley, the THX System Designer. I'm responsible for the design of all professional and commercial THX Sound Systems, so I thought I'd try to clear up some of the confusion regarding THX. THX is a set of implemented design and quality control standards for theatre sound presentation. First, the actual physical theatre must meet certain acoustic criteria: It must have low background noise, (no loud air conditioners or projectors), good isolation (so the lucky patron doesn't get to hear the gunfight in the theatre next door), and specific reverberant characteristics based on the volume of each individual theatre. Also, the theatre can't have any nasty slap echoes or reflections. When an individual theatre meets these standards, it means that the dialogue will be more intelligible, the high frequencies will reproduce clearly, the bass will not build up excessively within the room, etc. Most of the sound one hears in the movies comes from behind the screen, from 3 channels usually. (Occasionally 5, but THAT'S a different lecture!) Because of this, the theatre must also have a good length/width ratio. (i.e., No bowling alleys.) From the visual standpoint, this is of course desirable, and from the audio standpoint, it means having a good "stereo image" between the left and right channels, so that the patron is actually hearing in stereo -- in every seat in the house! Once a theatre is accepted for the aforementioned preliminary THX criteria, the owner must choose the equipment to be used from a list provided by us. This list includes amplifiers, processors, screen and surround speakers. They can choose from a number of different products by various manufacturers, but they all the products have been objectively tested here to conform to very high standards. These high-quality components assure a wider dynamic range and more faithfully reproduced sound, plus adequate power for the room size. Incidentally, the ONLY Cinema Processors which were accepted until quite recently were made by Dolby, so any THX theatre was by default a "Dolby" theatre... and ever-so-much more! Thus, we're not in competition with Dolby, we're a COMPLEMENTARY TECHNOLOGY to Dolby Processing. Recently, Ultra-Stereo also had a processor approved for use in THX Theatres. Also, we're not in the business of selling any equipment, just assuring high quality hardware in THX theatres. The ONLY piece of hardware that is specifically "THX" is an electronic crossover network, which is LEASED, not purchased by the theatre. Our design office takes the architectural plans for every theatre, and designs the placement of the screen speakers and surrounds. The screen speakers are set in a special baffle structure behind the screen. This structure has certain acoustic properties, and the speaker placement within the structure is coordinated to best match the projected film image. The surround speaker array is designed to provide optimum sound pressure and audience coverage. (and to integrate with the interior design whenever possible). We coordinate all this with the architects, owners, and equipment installers. Once the theatre has been completed or successfully retrofitted, our field technicians visit the theatre to align and "tune" the sound system, then they measure the acoustical characteristics to make sure that they meet our requirements. This test data is then evaluated, and if the theatre passes on all counts, it becomes a "certified" THX site. This, of course, entitles the theatre to use the THX name and show the THX trailer. (You know, "The Audience is Listening.") The theatre is re-tested every 6 months to ensure that the quality of sound remains high. Our "philosophy" is to recreate the film soundtrack mixing environment as closely as possible so that the audience hears the soundtrack as the film-maker intended. (This is all tied up in a DIFFERENT lecture on the history of film sound) In conclusion, we're NOT a method of recording, encoding, OR processing movie soundtracks! We're a design and quality control system for the PLAYBACK ENVIRONMENT. This means that EVERY FILM will sound better in a THX theatre, not just a select few. The premium quality of a THX theatre is often well-demonstrated by "special-effects-extravaganza" films, because they are mixed with a very wide dynamic range and a lot of "loud" or "low" sounds that might distort when played back through a lesser system. THX theatres are especially well-equipped to handle the demands of the new digital theatre soundtracks (like "Cinema Digital" and "SR-D") because of their high performance and headroom. SO, that's the scoop on the THX COMMERCIAL THEATRE and PROFESSIONAL MIXING ROOM system. The new Home THX
Re: MD: THX In Layman's Terms
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] THX receivers process a delayed signal between the rear speakers, enhancing the rear localized effects. These are the 2 significant differences between Pro-logic and THX. Actually Mark, this isn't accurate. THX is not a type of surround processing. The two surround formats which superceded Dolby Pro Logic are Dolby Digital 5.1 and DTS 5.1. THX is simply a set of quality and control standards developed for and intended to be applied to the implementation of discrete surround sound formats. Indeed, contrary to your assertion, the rear channels of current surround formats are discrete channels of information. "Matrixed" rear channel sound ended with Dolby Pro Logic. Other specifications such as timbre match, placement, and THX certified speakers etc etc. are less critical IMO. But those specifications are what THX is. Nothing more. Don - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: DTS and THX
From: "las" [EMAIL PROTECTED] This is a little off topic (so what else is new?). I'm interested in your opinions of the quality of DTS and THX. THX is a set of quality standards being applied to Dolby Digital 5.1 surround recordings (as well as picture transfer quality) to make certain that a particular film or soundtrack or recording or piece of electronic equipment, etc. meets a certain criterion for quality of reproduction and fidelity to the original master recording. It is Lucas' attempt to bring some sort of standardization to an industry floundering in the flood brought on by the brave new world of digital surround formats and crying out for some ordo ab chao. DTS, on the other hand, is actually a surround sound encoding system which (at one time) seemed poised for a battle royale with Dolby Digital in a format war that threatened to rival that of VHS and Beta. But, it was not to be. By the time DTS was out of the gate, Dolby Digital was already established as the dominant player in the field, and the intervening years have done nothing to diminish that. However, there are many in the pro sound industry (both music recording AND foley) who insist that DTS remains the superior format sonically. I am personally VERY impressed with the actual DTS audio recordings I have heard. However, most of them have been live recordings (such as The Eagles 'Hell Freezes Over' on cd and dvd) which use the surround channels for little more than ambience. However, if you want to hear what DTS surround is really capable of, this is a recording you OWE it to yourself to hear. http://www.dmprecords.com/CD-804.htm It is a big band sampler recorded by Tom Jung's DMP Records which places you in the perspective of the band director standing in the middle of a big band which is semi-circled around you. The effect is nothing short of stunning and the recording is absolutely pristine. Check it out. It's an AMAZING recording and worth every dime. Don - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
MD: HHB Portadisc...
Has anyone on the list had any experience at all with this puppy? Willing to share details? I know it's pricey...but check out those features! This is definitely my current lust machine! I want one...badly! Go to : http://www.hhb.co.uk/usa.htm Then use the pull down menu to select 'HHB Portadisc Minidisc Recorder'. No word (from what I can see) on what version of ATRAC is used...but just check out that connectivity! Hummanahummana! Don - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
