subject:"Re\: \[MBZ\] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question"


Thanks Mitch,
That was how I proceeded so far.  Asked my wife to hold the spark plug 
wire while I pulled the started but she declined.  Probably good as if I 
had done that she's still be making my life miserable. ;-)
When the Gen stopped (in the dark and cold naturally) I topped it off 
but no good.  Yesterday I opened up the fuel shutoff and made sure the 
screen was clean which it was.  Fuel flows great!
I associated the engine note change with the engine going lean before 
shutting down but now I'm at the point of needing to test the black boxes.


Thanks for the comments,  my wife rolled it into the garage to get it 
out of the weather (it's always been stored indoors except for a couple 
of nights after it died.   I need to light my kero heater and warm it up 
out there a little before I start checking things out.


Wish I had a wiring diagram to make things easier.  I'll contact 
Troybilt to se what info they have


LarryT

On 01/12/2019 8:30 PM, Mitch Haley via Mercedes wrote:

The old way to manage the 'oil alert' shutoff was to short out the ignition 
like an ignition switch does.
Some generators have a solenoid on the carb operated by the oil level switch, 
usually through a control box.

If the engine note changed before shutdown, the shutdown wasn't purely 
electrical. Switching off the ignition just results in the engine coasting to a 
stop and quickly.
But it might involve a fuel shutoff like is found on the carburetors of my 
Subaru generator and the Briggs engine on my Trail Mower. The mixture would go 
lean and then the engine would cut out when it got too lean to sustain fire.

But if it is the oil alert, is it because the oil level is low, the switch is 
bad, the wiring is bad, or the 'black box' is bad?
I'd say step one is to make sure the oil level reads maximum.
Step two, shut off the fuel, take the hose off at the carb, put the end of the 
hose in a container, and turn the fuel back on. Does the gas tank supply fuel 
to the carb?
Step 3, put the plug wire on a loose spark plug and hold it while the wife pulls the 
starter rope. If you say "yeow" and drop the plug, the ignition is good. I used 
to use #3 as a last resort in my youth when working on motorcycles and lawn mowers, but 
it's a fast and effective test.
After step 3 it gets less simple to diagnose.

Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

Thank you Sir!  I will check that 1st and let ya'll know.  Sounds like a 
definite likelihood.  Hope that's it, then I won't have to worry about 
testing the black boxes.  Ethanol in the fuel has caused problem for me 
in small engines before, usually the needle and seat.  I wish the corn 
farmers would let that go!  I hear some in the govt are pushing for even 
higher ethanol levels in the near future.  Even more problem for gas 
engines!


LarryT

On 01/12/2019 11:10 PM, G Mann via Mercedes wrote:

Check the carb float bowl for water.  Your post says engine speed increased
or sound changed before shutdown...

Water in fuel migrates into the float bowl... and accumulates in the
bottom, as water level increases, less and less fuel can pass through the
main jet in the center of the carb just above the fuel bowl... finally,
water level rises to the point where the main jet gets no gas, and water,
being heavier than gas, shuts off the flow of gas to fuel jet. Engine dies,
restart doesn't happen because engine is "out of gas" at the main jet...
fuel in tank can not over power water in bowl.. dead engine..

Put a can under the carb bowl, remove the bolt at center of float bowl,
drop bowl, with contents into can.. Inspect for water Bet that is your
problem..

Ethanol gas is hydroscopic.. it draws moisture and absorbs it .. said
moisture then condenses in to carb in droplets.

On Sat, Jan 12, 2019 at 6:31 PM Mitch Haley via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:


The old way to manage the 'oil alert' shutoff was to short out the
ignition like an ignition switch does.
Some generators have a solenoid on the carb operated by the oil level
switch, usually through a control box.

If the engine note changed before shutdown, the shutdown wasn't purely
electrical. Switching off the ignition just results in the engine coasting
to a stop and quickly.
But it might involve a fuel shutoff like is found on the carburetors of my
Subaru generator and the Briggs engine on my Trail Mower. The mixture would
go lean and then the engine would cut out when it got too lean to sustain
fire.

But if it is the oil alert, is it because the oil level is low, the switch
is bad, the wiring is bad, or the 'black box' is bad?
I'd say step one is to make sure the oil level reads maximum.
Step two, shut off the fuel, take the hose off at the carb, put the end of
the hose in a container, and turn the fuel back on. Does the gas tank
supply fuel to the carb?
Step 3, put the plug wire on a loose spark plug and hold it while the wife
pulls the starter rope. If you say "yeow" and drop the plug, the ignition
is good. I used to use #3 as a last resort in my youth when working on
motorcycles and lawn mowers, but it's a fast and effective test.
After step 3 it gets less simple to diagnose.

Mitch.

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PMO Carbs / Weber Parts / Oil Analysis
91 300D
74 911  

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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

I watched the video and all the pages on their site but never saw any 
price.  Any idea?

Larry

On 01/12/2019 11:21 PM, Craig via Mercedes wrote:

On Sat, 12 Jan 2019 21:10:19 -0700 G Mann via Mercedes
 wrote:


Put a can under the carb bowl, remove the bolt at center of float bowl,
drop bowl, with contents into can.. Inspect for water Bet that is
your problem..

Ethanol gas is hydroscopic.. it draws moisture and absorbs it .. said
moisture then condenses in to carb in droplets.

What about using http://www.mrfunnel.com/Mr._Funnel/Home.html ?


Craig

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91 300D
74 911  

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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

      One thing I noticed about Mr Funnel was the FAQ saying "Do not 
fill from a gas pump into portable fuel containers using Mr. Funnel" 
which would seem to make it much more difficult to use.  Am I supposed 
to take my Gen to the gas station whenever it needs fuel?   That would 
negate a lot of the positives IMO.  Or am I not understanding what 
they're suggesting?


  I was laying here thinking and evidently, I did a bad thing - when I 
bought the generator I test ran it and changed the oil. Then put it in 
my small storage barn where it stays plugged in (electric start).  So 
it's been in the barn out of the wind and rain but we have summers with 
high humidity and moisture certainly could have gotten into the fuel in 
the tank there.  I guess I was shooting myself in the foot when I bought 
5-10 gal of fuel for the gen last summer when we had a hurricane bearing 
down.  I left the gas cans (also stored in the barn) and used them in 
the lawn mowers.  But the fuel tank of the gen was full (ready to be 
used) and sucking moisture in from the air.  Even though the fuel tank 
cap is  very snugly fitted, I suspect airborne moisture could still get 
into the gen tank and my storage tanks.  It seems to be a bad idea to 
stockpile fuel for emergencies.  We were without power for 7 days and a 
hurricane that got us for 9 days. Unfortunately, the local gas stations 
also lost power so we were screwed without a fuel storage ability.  Now 
it seems like even that is a bad idea.
    While the funnel may not work that well as reported by G Mann, (and 
his liquor and water analogy) ;-) I gotta think they're onto something 
with the concept.  After all, they have water filtration straws that 
will (reportedly) filter contaminates from dirty water and make it 
drinkable.  I'm not ready to test it but they are sold everywhere and if 
they didn't work I would think the company would have been sued into 
oblivion by now.   Seems like a Mr Funnel would work with fuel.


Thanks again for the great suggestions/conversations.
Larry

On 01/13/2019 6:56 AM, Larry Turner via Mercedes wrote:
Thank you Sir!  I will check that 1st and let ya'll know.  Sounds like 
a definite likelihood.  Hope that's it, then I won't have to worry 
about testing the black boxes.  Ethanol in the fuel has caused problem 
for me in small engines before, usually the needle and seat.  I wish 
the corn farmers would let that go!  I hear some in the govt are 
pushing for even higher ethanol levels in the near future.  Even more 
problem for gas engines!


LarryT
On 01/12/2019 11:10 PM, G Mann via Mercedes wrote:
Check the carb float bowl for water.  Your post says engine speed 
increased

or sound changed before shutdown...

Water in fuel migrates into the float bowl... and accumulates in the
bottom, as water level increases, less and less fuel can pass through 
the

main jet in the center of the carb just above the fuel bowl... finally,
water level rises to the point where the main jet gets no gas, and 
water,
being heavier than gas, shuts off the flow of gas to fuel jet. Engine 
dies,

restart doesn't happen because engine is "out of gas" at the main jet...
fuel in tank can not over power water in bowl.. dead engine..

Put a can under the carb bowl, remove the bolt at center of float bowl,
drop bowl, with contents into can.. Inspect for water Bet that is 
your

problem..

Ethanol gas is hydroscopic.. it draws moisture and absorbs it .. said
moisture then condenses in to carb in droplets.

On Sat, Jan 12, 2019 at 6:31 PM Mitch Haley via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:


The old way to manage the 'oil alert' shutoff was to short out the
ignition like an ignition switch does.
Some generators have a solenoid on the carb operated by the oil level
switch, usually through a control box.

If the engine note changed before shutdown, the shutdown wasn't purely
electrical. Switching off the ignition just results in the engine 
coasting

to a stop and quickly.
But it might involve a fuel shutoff like is found on the carburetors 
of my
Subaru generator and the Briggs engine on my Trail Mower. The 
mixture would
go lean and then the engine would cut out when it got too lean to 
sustain

fire.

But if it is the oil alert, is it because the oil level is low, the 
switch

is bad, the wiring is bad, or the 'black box' is bad?
I'd say step one is to make sure the oil level reads maximum.
Step two, shut off the fuel, take the hose off at the carb, put the 
end of

the hose in a container, and turn the fuel back on. Does the gas tank
supply fuel to the carb?
Step 3, put the plug wire on a loose spark plug and hold it while 
the wife
pulls the starter rope. If you say "yeow" and drop the plug, the 
ignition

is good. I used to use #3 as a last resort in my youth when working on
motorcycles and lawn mowers, but it's a fast and effective test.
After step 3 it gets less simple to diagnose.

Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

2019-01-13 Thread Craig via Mercedes

On Sun, 13 Jan 2019 09:10:56 -0500 Larry Turner via Mercedes
 wrote:

>        One thing I noticed about Mr Funnel was the FAQ saying "Do not 
> fill from a gas pump into portable fuel containers using Mr. Funnel" 
> which would seem to make it much more difficult to use.  Am I supposed 
> to take my Gen to the gas station whenever it needs fuel?   That would 
> negate a lot of the positives IMO.  Or am I not understanding what 
> they're suggesting?

They mean to fill the gas can from the pump, then put the Mr. Funnel in
the generator's tank and pour the gas through it into the generator's
tank. That way if the gas in the gas can gets contaminated, you will
still get cleaned fuel into the generator's tank.


Craig

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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

2019-01-13 Thread Max Dillon via Mercedes

Larry,

Sounds like you simply need to drain / clean the carb, drain and refill the 
tank. Take old stale gas to a recycling place. 

I only store fuel that is ethanol free. In my area, many gas stations have a 
dedicated pump just for ethanol free. Fill my storage as necessary, add a 
stabilizer, but make every effort to consume within a year. Generally in the 
spring I'll put all the leftover fuel into our gasser car. I also store the 
generator with no fuel in the carb (shut off fuel then run the generator until 
it dies). 
-- 
Max Dillon
Charleston SC

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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

2019-01-13 Thread Dan Penoff via Mercedes

Blue pumps here. Costs about the same as premium unleaded. Only stuff I use in 
any gasoline powered off road equipment.  Well worth the additional cost.

-D


> On Jan 13, 2019, at 9:26 AM, Max Dillon via Mercedes  
> wrote:
> 
> Larry,
> 
> Sounds like you simply need to drain / clean the carb, drain and refill the 
> tank. Take old stale gas to a recycling place. 
> 
> I only store fuel that is ethanol free. In my area, many gas stations have a 
> dedicated pump just for ethanol free. Fill my storage as necessary, add a 
> stabilizer, but make every effort to consume within a year. Generally in the 
> spring I'll put all the leftover fuel into our gasser car. I also store the 
> generator with no fuel in the carb (shut off fuel then run the generator 
> until it dies). 
> -- 
> Max Dillon
> Charleston SC
> 
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> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
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> 


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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

2019-01-13 Thread Jim Cathey via Mercedes

> Now it seems like even that [fuel storage] is a bad idea.

Storing _gasoline_ is the bad idea.  Diesel, and especially propane, store well.

You can stock up on gasoline for an anticipated emergency.  But after the threat
has passed you must use it up somehow, because it _won't_ keep.

I wonder how gasoline would store in (sealed) propane tanks?  No atmospheric
exchange at all, so no change in volatile fractions or water; no continuing 
supply
of free oxygen for oxidation of volatiles.

-- Jim


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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

> On January 13, 2019 at 6:56 AM Larry Turner via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
>   I wish the corn 
> farmers would let that go! 

Five years ago, if I wanted petroleum based gasoline, I could go to the 
airplane pumps (at airstrips that aren't staffed 24/7) and get a jug of 100LL, 
or I could drive 90 miles to Lake Michigan and and pay avgas prices for mogas 
at a marina.

But the last 2-3 years, E0 outlets have been popping up all over, for around $1 
a gallon more than 87 octane E10. Now I can buy 'outdoor power equipment fuel' 
(89 octane non ethanol) about 25 miles away in Nashville or Mason. Or for a 
dollar a gallon more than 89 octane I can still get 100LL at the airport ten 
miles away on weekends (when the pump asks for my registration number, I tell 
it I'm putting 5 gallons of gasoline in Air Force One). For my purposes the 89 
octane is actually a better fuel than avgas.  Last fall I didn't bother with 
getting a jug of E0 for the generator, I now keep the generator empty and once 
a month I dump my 6 gallons of generator gas in a car and buy fresh generator 
gas. 

I bought half a gallon of Top Tier 93 octane E10 for the chain saws a couple 
weeks ago. In April I'll dump any leftovers in a lawn mower. Fortunately 
there's one Marathon station in Charlotte that has a separate hose for each 
grade of fuel, so I actually get 93 octane when I buy a small quantity of 93 
octane. Does anybody know how much gas you have to pump before the grade you're 
buying comes out of a single hose multigrade pump?

Mitch

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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

> On January 13, 2019 at 9:41 AM Jim Cathey via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> I wonder how gasoline would store in (sealed) propane tanks?  No atmospheric
> exchange at all, so no change in volatile fractions or water; no continuing 
> supply
> of free oxygen for oxidation of volatiles.

Just the oxygen built into the fuel, due to the oxygenated fuel mandates that 
gave us MTBE in the 1990s and Ethanol now. 

My question is whether the zero Ethanol mogas is oxygenated or not. 
I wouldn't worry about filling a 55 gallon drum with avgas and using it five 
years later, but I don't know if any of our pump gas is that safe.

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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question


Thanks Max,
    Sounds like a plan.  Once I drain the bowl I'll know better how 
much water I may have in my gas cans.  I suspect the gas in my Gen is 
much older than the fuel in the gas cans - maybe going back to 2012.  
The gas cans are used for the lawn mowers and usually end up empty at 
some point every Summer, especially since I'm not the one taking care of 
the grass anymore.

I'll let ya'll know what I find...

It's not supposed to get above 34F today so I need to bundle up even in 
the garage.   Br


Larry

On 01/13/2019 9:26 AM, Max Dillon via Mercedes wrote:

Larry,

Sounds like you simply need to drain / clean the carb, drain and refill the 
tank. Take old stale gas to a recycling place.

I only store fuel that is ethanol free. In my area, many gas stations have a 
dedicated pump just for ethanol free. Fill my storage as necessary, add a 
stabilizer, but make every effort to consume within a year. Generally in the 
spring I'll put all the leftover fuel into our gasser car. I also store the 
generator with no fuel in the carb (shut off fuel then run the generator until 
it dies).


--
LarryT
Youroil.net
PMO Carbs / Weber Parts / Oil Analysis
91 300D
74 911  

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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question


> On January 13, 2019 at 11:46 AM Larry Turner via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
>  I suspect the gas in my Gen is 
> much older than the fuel in the gas cans - maybe going back to 2012.  


Ouch. 
Now I'm leaning strongly towards a fuel inlet screen in the carb being clogged. 
How long did the generator run on antique fuel before it quit?

Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

2019-01-13 Thread Curt Raymond via Mercedes

I've been buying the canned stuff for the saw. It's expensive but I only use 
maybe a half gallon a year and as it doesn't go bad it's worth it.

Curt

Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android 

  On Sun, Jan 13, 2019 at 10:35 AM, Mitch Haley via 
Mercedes wrote:   
> On January 13, 2019 at 6:56 AM Larry Turner via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
>   I wish the corn 
> farmers would let that go! 

Five years ago, if I wanted petroleum based gasoline, I could go to the 
airplane pumps (at airstrips that aren't staffed 24/7) and get a jug of 100LL, 
or I could drive 90 miles to Lake Michigan and and pay avgas prices for mogas 
at a marina.

But the last 2-3 years, E0 outlets have been popping up all over, for around $1 
a gallon more than 87 octane E10. Now I can buy 'outdoor power equipment fuel' 
(89 octane non ethanol) about 25 miles away in Nashville or Mason. Or for a 
dollar a gallon more than 89 octane I can still get 100LL at the airport ten 
miles away on weekends (when the pump asks for my registration number, I tell 
it I'm putting 5 gallons of gasoline in Air Force One). For my purposes the 89 
octane is actually a better fuel than avgas.  Last fall I didn't bother with 
getting a jug of E0 for the generator, I now keep the generator empty and once 
a month I dump my 6 gallons of generator gas in a car and buy fresh generator 
gas. 

I bought half a gallon of Top Tier 93 octane E10 for the chain saws a couple 
weeks ago. In April I'll dump any leftovers in a lawn mower. Fortunately 
there's one Marathon station in Charlotte that has a separate hose for each 
grade of fuel, so I actually get 93 octane when I buy a small quantity of 93 
octane. Does anybody know how much gas you have to pump before the grade you're 
buying comes out of a single hose multigrade pump?

Mitch

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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

2019-01-13 Thread Max Dillon via Mercedes

Canned gas?  Same as white gas, for Coleman stove?
-- 
Max Dillon
Charleston SC

On January 13, 2019 1:30:44 PM EST, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
 wrote:
>I've been buying the canned stuff for the saw. It's expensive but I
>only use maybe a half gallon a year and as it doesn't go bad it's worth
>it.
>
>Curt

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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

2019-01-13 Thread Curley McLain via Mercedes

no, the deal now is the chainsaw companies want to sell you a liter of 
benzin/oil for $8.   I think husquarna started it, but Stihl has it 
now.   the under 50 crowd is too inept to mix gas and oil.


Max Dillon via Mercedes wrote on 1/13/19 1:38 PM:

Canned gas?  Same as white gas, for Coleman stove?



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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

2019-01-13 Thread Curley McLain via Mercedes

Last couple of times I rented a concrete saw, they made me buy the 
stuff.  The first time I returned it, unopened with no complaint.   The 
last time, it was a different kid, and he whined and didn't wanna give 
me a refund on it, Had ta use it Blah, blah...   I stayed there until 
they took it back and gave me the refund.  (husquarna)


Max Dillon via Mercedes wrote on 1/13/19 1:38 PM:

Canned gas?  Same as white gas, for Coleman stove?



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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

2019-01-13 Thread Curt Raymond via Mercedes

White gas doesn't have any octane, so no. The hardware store has cans of E0 in 
various 2 stroke mixes, something like $15/gal but the saw and weed eater like 
it.
Curt

Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android 
 
  On Sun, Jan 13, 2019 at 2:38 PM, Max Dillon wrote:   
Canned gas?  Same as white gas, for Coleman stove?
-- 
Max Dillon
Charleston SC

On January 13, 2019 1:30:44 PM EST, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
 wrote:
>I've been buying the canned stuff for the saw. It's expensive but I
>only use maybe a half gallon a year and as it doesn't go bad it's worth
>it.
>
>Curt  
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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

They rented you a $1000 tool with the agreement you'd only use the special fuel 
in it, you used other stuff anyway, and demanded they refund your money?

Here's a true story that made me somewhat mad just hearing about it. 
A friend of mine loaned his Stihl saw to his boss at the university, along with 
his can of carefully mixed premium gas and Stihl synthetic oil. You can borrow 
my saw, I'll even furnish the gas, but ONLY MY GAS GOES IN MY SAW. 

Professor bossman gives it back with the full can of gas. 
When questioned on it, the good Doctor informed him that he had some old gas in 
the shed at the cabin he needed to get rid of (and didn't think it was good 
enough to run in bossman's mower).

Mitch.

> On January 13, 2019 at 2:53 PM Curley McLain via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> Last couple of times I rented a concrete saw, they made me buy the 
> stuff.  The first time I returned it, unopened with no complaint.

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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

> On January 13, 2019 at 3:00 PM Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> White gas doesn't have any octane, so no. The hardware store has cans of E0 
> in various 2 stroke mixes, something like $15/gal but the saw and weed eater 
> like it.

My buddy in the Stihl story has been running that stuff for the last five years 
or so, about as long as I've been mixing sawgas by the half gallon instead of 
the gallon. So he pays $5-6 for a qt instead of paying $2 for a half gallon 
like I do. Sounds costly, but I'm sure he doesn't miss the extra $10 a year in 
his pocket and life's easier when all you have to do is grab a sealed can of 
gas off the shelf when you want to go cut firewood. And life's much easier now 
that he never has to take his saw in for a carburetor rebuild. 

Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

2019-01-13 Thread Rick Knoble via Mercedes

https://www.menards.com/main/tools-hardware/automotive/automotive-maintenance/motor-oil-filters/trufuel-reg-50-1-mix-engineered-fuel-oil/6525638/p-1485847166612-c-9112.htm?tid=5454550268061549339&ipos=6

15% off this week with the sale bag. 

Rick
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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

2019-01-13 Thread OK Don via Mercedes

Here in OK, E0 is 20 - 30 cents more per gallon than E1o, and 100LL is
$2.00 more per gallon. I run E0 in the Cessna as much as possible. Lead
fouling of plugs and rings is still a problem for aircraft engines, and
eliminated synthetic oil as an option.

On Sun, Jan 13, 2019 at 9:35 AM Mitch Haley via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

>
> > On January 13, 2019 at 6:56 AM Larry Turner via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >   I wish the corn
> > farmers would let that go!
>
> Five years ago, if I wanted petroleum based gasoline, I could go to the
> airplane pumps (at airstrips that aren't staffed 24/7) and get a jug of
> 100LL, or I could drive 90 miles to Lake Michigan and and pay avgas prices
> for mogas at a marina.
>
> But the last 2-3 years, E0 outlets have been popping up all over, for
> around $1 a gallon more than 87 octane E10. Now I can buy 'outdoor power
> equipment fuel' (89 octane non ethanol) about 25 miles away in Nashville or
> Mason. Or for a dollar a gallon more than 89 octane I can still get 100LL
> at the airport ten miles away on weekends (when the pump asks for my
> registration number, I tell it I'm putting 5 gallons of gasoline in Air
> Force One). For my purposes the 89 octane is actually a better fuel than
> avgas.  Last fall I didn't bother with getting a jug of E0 for the
> generator, I now keep the generator empty and once a month I dump my 6
> gallons of generator gas in a car and buy fresh generator gas.
>
> I bought half a gallon of Top Tier 93 octane E10 for the chain saws a
> couple weeks ago. In April I'll dump any leftovers in a lawn mower.
> Fortunately there's one Marathon station in Charlotte that has a separate
> hose for each grade of fuel, so I actually get 93 octane when I buy a small
> quantity of 93 octane. Does anybody know how much gas you have to pump
> before the grade you're buying comes out of a single hose multigrade pump?
>
> Mitch
>
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-- 
OK Don

*“Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of
our people need it sorely on these accounts.”* – Mark Twain

"There are three kinds of men: The ones that learns by reading. The few who
learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence
for themselves."

WILL ROGERS, *The Manly Wisdom of Will Rogers*
2013 F150, 18 mpg
2017 Subaru Legacy, 30 mpg
1957 C182A, 12 mpg - but at 150 mph!
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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

You can't use synthetic oil with low lead gas in a piston engine airplane?
I always used to use 89 octane leaded gas in my Saab with 5W30 Mobil One. 

The 'pump gas plus $2' for 100LL holds true here, but they put the E0 pump gas 
in the middle instead of closer to the price of E10.

Mitch.  

> On January 13, 2019 at 3:50 PM OK Don via Mercedes  
> wrote:
> 
> 
> Here in OK, E0 is 20 - 30 cents more per gallon than E1o, and 100LL is
> $2.00 more per gallon. I run E0 in the Cessna as much as possible. Lead
> fouling of plugs and rings is still a problem for aircraft engines, and
> eliminated synthetic oil as an option.

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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

2019-01-13 Thread OK Don via Mercedes

The last time it was tried was in the '70's when Mobil came out with a semi
synthetic AV oil. The lead in the oil formed a sludge that blocked oil
passages in the engines. IIRC, there were law suits and Mobil pulled the
oil from the market. Bear in mind that large air cooled aircraft engines
have much looser tolerances due to the wide temp swings in operation, thus
more fuel can get into the crankcase.

On Sun, Jan 13, 2019 at 2:57 PM Mitch Haley via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> You can't use synthetic oil with low lead gas in a piston engine airplane?
> I always used to use 89 octane leaded gas in my Saab with 5W30 Mobil One.
>
> The 'pump gas plus $2' for 100LL holds true here, but they put the E0 pump
> gas in the middle instead of closer to the price of E10.
>
> Mitch.
>
> > On January 13, 2019 at 3:50 PM OK Don via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> > Here in OK, E0 is 20 - 30 cents more per gallon than E1o, and 100LL is
> > $2.00 more per gallon. I run E0 in the Cessna as much as possible. Lead
> > fouling of plugs and rings is still a problem for aircraft engines, and
> > eliminated synthetic oil as an option.
>
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-- 
OK Don

*“Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of
our people need it sorely on these accounts.”* – Mark Twain

"There are three kinds of men: The ones that learns by reading. The few who
learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence
for themselves."

WILL ROGERS, *The Manly Wisdom of Will Rogers*
2013 F150, 18 mpg
2017 Subaru Legacy, 30 mpg
1957 C182A, 12 mpg - but at 150 mph!
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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

2019-01-13 Thread Curley McLain via Mercedes

I have not taken my stihl in because it needed a rebuild in ~40 years.  
I mix a gallon a year, and use it to light bonfires etc,  and yes, it 
has ethanol in it.   But I do dump the tank and run the saw dry each 
time it is stored for any length of time.


True, if I only used the canned mixed gas in the saw, a liter would last 
a year or 4.


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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

> On January 13, 2019 at 4:17 PM OK Don via Mercedes  
> wrote:
> 
> Bear in mind that large air cooled aircraft engines
> have much looser tolerances due to the wide temp swings in operation, thus
> more fuel can get into the crankcase.

My 1977 Saab would go 10,000 miles without appreciable oil loss. I used to 
change the "Lee Two Stage Maxi Oil Filter" every 5k and the oil every 10k. 
(whatever happened to Lee filters, anyway?) 
IIRC, that's not the way it works in a piston engine Cessna. Is the oil 
consumption measured in quarts per day when flying cross country?

Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

2019-01-13 Thread OK Don via Mercedes

Oil consumption is measured in hours per quart, with different engines,
cylinders, and ring configurations giving different results. Ours gets
about 5 hours per quart of Phillips 20W-50. We have chromed cylinders and
iron rings - which burn more oil than stell cylinders and chrome rings.
However, the cylinders ($1200 - $1500 each) last much longer.

On Sun, Jan 13, 2019 at 3:48 PM Mitch Haley via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

>
> > On January 13, 2019 at 4:17 PM OK Don via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >
> > Bear in mind that large air cooled aircraft engines
> > have much looser tolerances due to the wide temp swings in operation,
> thus
> > more fuel can get into the crankcase.
>
> My 1977 Saab would go 10,000 miles without appreciable oil loss. I used to
> change the "Lee Two Stage Maxi Oil Filter" every 5k and the oil every 10k.
> (whatever happened to Lee filters, anyway?)
> IIRC, that's not the way it works in a piston engine Cessna. Is the oil
> consumption measured in quarts per day when flying cross country?
>
> Mitch.
>
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>

-- 
OK Don

*“Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of
our people need it sorely on these accounts.”* – Mark Twain

"There are three kinds of men: The ones that learns by reading. The few who
learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence
for themselves."

WILL ROGERS, *The Manly Wisdom of Will Rogers*
2013 F150, 18 mpg
2017 Subaru Legacy, 30 mpg
1957 C182A, 12 mpg - but at 150 mph!
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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

2019-01-13 Thread fmiser via Mercedes

> Curley wrote:

> I have not taken my stihl in because it needed a rebuild in ~40
> years. I mix a gallon a year, and use it to light bonfires etc,
> and yes, it has ethanol in it.  

I don't know what you folk do different - or what it is that I do
different.  But my experience is _zero_ fuel trouble in 30+ years
of trying to use _only_ ethenol laced gasoline.  Yup - I used to
carefully choose the station so I could get E10.  It's now so
common I don't have to search for it.

I burn at least 4 gallons a year in my chain saws, a lot less than
that in the line trimmer.  My mowers are all 4 cycle, and the
newest is at least 25 years old.  They two get only E10.

And there the carburetor fed small-block Cheby engines.  After
switching to E10 I no longer had to clean the carburetors every
couple years.  It was that experience that caused me to shift to
always try to use E10 and it has been a rare fueling that was
otherwise.

All these engines sit for long periods of time.  And Missouri is
not known for it's low humidity I would expect condensation to be
common.

Again - zero problems that I can blame on fuel.   The closest was
this fall, the one chainsaw didn't start.  I opened the
carburetor, found nothing wrong - clean as a pin.  Put it back
together and it runs fine.  Was that fuel?  I suppose it could
have been - but I didn't change the fuel in the tank.  Once it was
running I worked it until it was empty, filled with fresh(er) fuel
and kept cutting.

So am I just lucky?  Is it the steady diet of E10?   I don't know,
but I'm still using E10 almost exclusively for all engines that
don't use diesel.

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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

2019-01-14 Thread Curt Raymond via Mercedes

Buddy Been cuts trees into firewood as a side gig. He cuts on pump gas, at the 
end of each day he dumps the pump gas and runs a little canned gas in. His 
"cheap" saw cost more than twice as much as my good saw...

Curt

Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android 
 
  On Sun, Jan 13, 2019 at 4:36 PM, Curley McLain via 
Mercedes wrote:   I have not taken my stihl in because 
it needed a rebuild in ~40 years.  
I mix a gallon a year, and use it to light bonfires etc,  and yes, it 
has ethanol in it.   But I do dump the tank and run the saw dry each 
time it is stored for any length of time.

True, if I only used the canned mixed gas in the saw, a liter would last 
a year or 4.

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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

2019-01-14 Thread Curt Raymond via Mercedes

I think it's the steady diet. I don't have any issues in anything that gets run 
regularly, it's when they sit for an extended period that problems appear.The 
snowmobiles are the worst, run hard, get wet, sit all summer under a 
tarp...Seafoam gas additive helps a lot.
Curt

Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android 

  On Mon, Jan 14, 2019 at 1:31 AM, fmiser via Mercedes 
wrote:   > Curley wrote:

> I have not taken my stihl in because it needed a rebuild in ~40
> years. I mix a gallon a year, and use it to light bonfires etc,
> and yes, it has ethanol in it.  

I don't know what you folk do different - or what it is that I do
different.  But my experience is _zero_ fuel trouble in 30+ years
of trying to use _only_ ethenol laced gasoline.  Yup - I used to
carefully choose the station so I could get E10.  It's now so
common I don't have to search for it.

I burn at least 4 gallons a year in my chain saws, a lot less than
that in the line trimmer.  My mowers are all 4 cycle, and the
newest is at least 25 years old.  They two get only E10.

And there the carburetor fed small-block Cheby engines.  After
switching to E10 I no longer had to clean the carburetors every
couple years.  It was that experience that caused me to shift to
always try to use E10 and it has been a rare fueling that was
otherwise.

All these engines sit for long periods of time.  And Missouri is
not known for it's low humidity I would expect condensation to be
common.

Again - zero problems that I can blame on fuel.  The closest was
this fall, the one chainsaw didn't start.  I opened the
carburetor, found nothing wrong - clean as a pin.  Put it back
together and it runs fine.  Was that fuel?  I suppose it could
have been - but I didn't change the fuel in the tank.  Once it was
running I worked it until it was empty, filled with fresh(er) fuel
and kept cutting.

So am I just lucky?  Is it the steady diet of E10?  I don't know,
but I'm still using E10 almost exclusively for all engines that
don't use diesel.

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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

2019-01-14 Thread Mitch Haley via Mercedes

> On January 14, 2019 at 7:01 AM Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> Buddy Been cuts trees into firewood as a side gig. He cuts on pump gas, at 
> the end of each day he dumps the pump gas and runs a little canned gas in. 
> His "cheap" saw cost more than twice as much as my good saw...

That seems excessive, but not harmful assuming he properly disposes of the pump 
gas. 
I didn't run any saws in 2018, so when I mixed gas this month I dumped out the 
cup of 2017 gas in my saw. Put half a tank of fresh gas in it and I had it 
running in under ten pulls of the starter. Which reminds me, I now have a cup 
of premix in my used oil container. 
It was easiest to just lay the saw on its side in the oil collector and let all 
the old gas drain out. 
Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

2019-01-14 Thread MG via Mercedes

That kind of stuff is what made me buy a
battery chainsaw. At 40 volts with two 4 amp
and two 2 amp batteries I can cut wood for 30
min straight. That uses up one tank of oil
for the chain and at my age is all I want to
do. Any more then that and I end up hurting
so this way not only do I not have to do the
pull start dance but it limits my pain.
That's a win win for me.

As for what it can do. Just last weekend I
cut down a 28" diam dead tree with it and
used one of the 4 amp batteries so it will do
what I want. That sucker made a real bang
when it hit the ground. Lots of fun and a
great sense of satisfaction.

Mitch Haley via Mercedes wrote:

On January 13, 2019 at 3:00 PM Curt Raymond via Mercedes
wrote:

White gas doesn't have any octane, so no. The hardware store has cans of E0 in
various 2 stroke mixes, something like $15/gal but the saw and weed eater like
it.

My buddy in the Stihl story has been running that stuff for the last five years or so, about as long as I've been mixing sawgas by the half gallon instead of the gallon. So he pays $5-6 for a qt instead of paying $2 for a half gallon like I do. Sounds costly, but I'm sure he doesn't miss the extra $10 a year in his pocket and life's easier when all you have to do is grab a sealed can of gas off the shelf when you want to go cut firewood. And life's much easier now that he never has to take his saw in for a carburetor rebuild.

Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

2019-01-14 Thread Curt Raymond via Mercedes

 I think I've been misunderstood, he dumps it back into the big can. That way 
if the saw accidentally gets left for a long time its had the good gas in it. 
He goes through a quart of canned gas in like 2 years...
-Curt

On Monday, January 14, 2019, 8:44:08 AM EST, Mitch Haley 
 wrote:  

> On January 14, 2019 at 7:01 AM Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> Buddy Been cuts trees into firewood as a side gig. He cuts on pump gas, at 
> the end of each day he dumps the pump gas and runs a little canned gas in. 
> His "cheap" saw cost more than twice as much as my good saw...

That seems excessive, but not harmful assuming he properly disposes of the pump 
gas. 
I didn't run any saws in 2018, so when I mixed gas this month I dumped out the 
cup of 2017 gas in my saw. Put half a tank of fresh gas in it and I had it 
running in under ten pulls of the starter. Which reminds me, I now have a cup 
of premix in my used oil container. 
It was easiest to just lay the saw on its side in the oil collector and let all 
the old gas drain out. 
Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

2019-01-14 Thread Scott Ritchey via Mercedes

This is the main reason I went to LP for my standby generator: storage.  
Natural gas would be OK too if available (not here) and dependable during an 
emergency.  
LP also powers my kitchen stove and two fireplaces, a bonus.  I can keep the 
place habitable in winter with one direct-vent fireplace,  
But the main draw of LP is that I can keep hundreds of gallons on hand at all 
times and get similar amounts delivered quickly during normal times.
One lesson from my time in hurricane alley is that by the time you know you 
need emergency supplies it’s too late to get them.


> -Original Message-
> From:  Jim Cathey via Mercedes
> ...
> 
> Storing _gasoline_ is the bad idea.  Diesel, and especially propane, store 
> well.
> 
> You can stock up on gasoline for an anticipated emergency.  But after the
> threat has passed you must use it up somehow, because it _won't_ keep.
> 


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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question


Hi Guys,
Finally had the weather and inclination to work on the generator. 
following your suggestion to check the fuel, I removed all fuel from the 
tank and let it air out, then hooked my battery charger to the battery 
and then cranked and check for spark.  I got zero spark while cranking 
and decided to check out the coil thinking it might be bad.  At least 
that was a cheap option.


What I found when I pulled the cover with the recoil starter I found one 
of the pedestals that hold the coil/magneto assy near the magnet had 
completely broken away!   As I removed the broken pieces I could see a 
hole in the crankcase where the pedestals was formed.  The 2 pedestals 
are a integral part of the case BTW.  I 1st thought I was seeing the 
piston in the hole, but as I turned the engine by hand I noted I must be 
seeing a sleeve rather than the piston as the part I could see thru the 
hole was not moving as I turned the engine.


So it appears I will have to find a replacement motor which are avail 
for $400-$500.  IOW, about 1/2 of my original investment in the 
generator.  I could probably close the hole in the case with JB or such, 
but would have no way to mount the coil and set the air gap consistently.


It strange that this part would break away from the engine; I didn't 
find anything loose that could cause this kind of damage but it is what 
it is.  I don't think I ran it for more than 30 -36 hours.   I contacted 
Troy-Bilt and B&S but both just restated their 1 year warranty and went 
no further.  No joy in Mudville.


I'd love to find a case for the 420cc B&S engine but so far my search 
has turned up empty.   Anyway, lots of people gave me suggestions about 
what to look for when I was troubleshooting.


Thanks again to all who helped...
LarryT

On 01/12/2019 11:10 PM, G Mann via Mercedes wrote:

Check the carb float bowl for water.  Your post says engine speed increased
or sound changed before shutdown...

Water in fuel migrates into the float bowl... and accumulates in the
bottom, as water level increases, less and less fuel can pass through the
main jet in the center of the carb just above the fuel bowl... finally,
water level rises to the point where the main jet gets no gas, and water,
being heavier than gas, shuts off the flow of gas to fuel jet. Engine dies,
restart doesn't happen because engine is "out of gas" at the main jet...
fuel in tank can not over power water in bowl.. dead engine..

Put a can under the carb bowl, remove the bolt at center of float bowl,
drop bowl, with contents into can.. Inspect for water Bet that is your
problem..

Ethanol gas is hydroscopic.. it draws moisture and absorbs it .. said
moisture then condenses in to carb in droplets.

On Sat, Jan 12, 2019 at 6:31 PM Mitch Haley via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:


The old way to manage the 'oil alert' shutoff was to short out the
ignition like an ignition switch does.
Some generators have a solenoid on the carb operated by the oil level
switch, usually through a control box.

If the engine note changed before shutdown, the shutdown wasn't purely
electrical. Switching off the ignition just results in the engine coasting
to a stop and quickly.
But it might involve a fuel shutoff like is found on the carburetors of my
Subaru generator and the Briggs engine on my Trail Mower. The mixture would
go lean and then the engine would cut out when it got too lean to sustain
fire.

But if it is the oil alert, is it because the oil level is low, the switch
is bad, the wiring is bad, or the 'black box' is bad?
I'd say step one is to make sure the oil level reads maximum.
Step two, shut off the fuel, take the hose off at the carb, put the end of
the hose in a container, and turn the fuel back on. Does the gas tank
supply fuel to the carb?
Step 3, put the plug wire on a loose spark plug and hold it while the wife
pulls the starter rope. If you say "yeow" and drop the plug, the ignition
is good. I used to use #3 as a last resort in my youth when working on
motorcycles and lawn mowers, but it's a fast and effective test.
After step 3 it gets less simple to diagnose.

Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

2019-02-12 Thread Jim Cathey via Mercedes

I think if you were so inclined you could absolutely fabricate some kind of 
JB-Weld attached perch for your coil.
Might take a bit of doing, but could it be all that worse than my welding the 
crankcase back together on my
tiller when it threw a rod through the side?

-- Jim


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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

2019-02-12 Thread Curt Raymond via Mercedes

 What size is the generator?If it were me I'd either 

1. troll Craigslist for a replacement similar to what you have for a fraction 
of the new price
2. Buy a "Champion" brand from FLAPS or Tractor Supply or whatever. We have one 
at camp, we've had it, I forget, 6 or 7 years and its been great. Cheap too.

3. Buy a Honda and be done with it. While the Honda will be 2x$ option #2 it 
will last you the rest of your life and be MUCH quieter, probably use less fuel 
too.
If I needed a generator for home I'd go for option #3. Luckily I have a Fred 
who gave me a generator which currently lives at my in-laws house. I attribute 
it (ie being prepared) to why we haven't lost power this year...

-Curt

On Tuesday, February 12, 2019, 12:48:18 PM EST, Larry Turner via Mercedes 
 wrote:  

 Hi Guys,
Finally had the weather and inclination to work on the generator. 
following your suggestion to check the fuel, I removed all fuel from the 
tank and let it air out, then hooked my battery charger to the battery 
and then cranked and check for spark.  I got zero spark while cranking 
and decided to check out the coil thinking it might be bad.  At least 
that was a cheap option.

What I found when I pulled the cover with the recoil starter I found one 
of the pedestals that hold the coil/magneto assy near the magnet had 
completely broken away!   As I removed the broken pieces I could see a 
hole in the crankcase where the pedestals was formed.  The 2 pedestals 
are a integral part of the case BTW.  I 1st thought I was seeing the 
piston in the hole, but as I turned the engine by hand I noted I must be 
seeing a sleeve rather than the piston as the part I could see thru the 
hole was not moving as I turned the engine.

So it appears I will have to find a replacement motor which are avail 
for $400-$500.  IOW, about 1/2 of my original investment in the 
generator.  I could probably close the hole in the case with JB or such, 
but would have no way to mount the coil and set the air gap consistently.

It strange that this part would break away from the engine; I didn't 
find anything loose that could cause this kind of damage but it is what 
it is.  I don't think I ran it for more than 30 -36 hours.   I contacted 
Troy-Bilt and B&S but both just restated their 1 year warranty and went 
no further.  No joy in Mudville.

I'd love to find a case for the 420cc B&S engine but so far my search 
has turned up empty.   Anyway, lots of people gave me suggestions about 
what to look for when I was troubleshooting.

Thanks again to all who helped...
LarryT

On 01/12/2019 11:10 PM, G Mann via Mercedes wrote:
> Check the carb float bowl for water.  Your post says engine speed increased
> or sound changed before shutdown...
>
> Water in fuel migrates into the float bowl... and accumulates in the
> bottom, as water level increases, less and less fuel can pass through the
> main jet in the center of the carb just above the fuel bowl... finally,
> water level rises to the point where the main jet gets no gas, and water,
> being heavier than gas, shuts off the flow of gas to fuel jet. Engine dies,
> restart doesn't happen because engine is "out of gas" at the main jet...
> fuel in tank can not over power water in bowl.. dead engine..
>
> Put a can under the carb bowl, remove the bolt at center of float bowl,
> drop bowl, with contents into can.. Inspect for water Bet that is your
> problem..
>
> Ethanol gas is hydroscopic.. it draws moisture and absorbs it .. said
> moisture then condenses in to carb in droplets.
>
> On Sat, Jan 12, 2019 at 6:31 PM Mitch Haley via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>
>> The old way to manage the 'oil alert' shutoff was to short out the
>> ignition like an ignition switch does.
>> Some generators have a solenoid on the carb operated by the oil level
>> switch, usually through a control box.
>>
>> If the engine note changed before shutdown, the shutdown wasn't purely
>> electrical. Switching off the ignition just results in the engine coasting
>> to a stop and quickly.
>> But it might involve a fuel shutoff like is found on the carburetors of my
>> Subaru generator and the Briggs engine on my Trail Mower. The mixture would
>> go lean and then the engine would cut out when it got too lean to sustain
>> fire.
>>
>> But if it is the oil alert, is it because the oil level is low, the switch
>> is bad, the wiring is bad, or the 'black box' is bad?
>> I'd say step one is to make sure the oil level reads maximum.
>> Step two, shut off the fuel, take the hose off at the carb, put the end of
>> the hose in a container, and turn the fuel back on. Does the gas tank
>> supply fuel to the carb?
>> Step 3, put the plug wire on a loose spark plug and hold it while the wife
>> pulls the starter rope. If you say "yeow" and drop the plug, the ignition
>> is good. I used to use #3 as a last resort in my youth when working on
>> motorcycles and lawn mowers, but it's a fast and effective test.
>> After step 3 it ge

Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question


I thought that kind of stuff only happened to me!  Condolences.

Thanks for the suggestion!  I suppose I could fill the hole with JB and 
shape it so I'd have room to drill and tap it.  Then it would just be a 
matter of finding the right spacers and washers (which I've been 
"collecting" for 50 years) until I could adjust a air gap that would work.


How tight is the tolerance on the air gap?  Would I have much wiggle 
room or is it really precise, like points?


On 02/12/2019 12:52 PM, Jim Cathey wrote:

I think if you were so inclined you could absolutely fabricate some kind of 
JB-Weld attached perch for your coil.
Might take a bit of doing, but could it be all that worse than my welding the 
crankcase back together on my
tiller when it threw a rod through the side?

-- Jim




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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

2019-02-12 Thread Jim Cathey via Mercedes

With all glues I like to use stronger filler and only gap-fill with glue.  So, 
find a nut or bolt that fits into your hole and glue that into place, etc.  I 
have no idea about the tolerances of the air gap, but I'm guessing it's a lot 
less fussy than points.

-- Jim


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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

2019-02-12 Thread MG via Mercedes

How about using some of that aluminum solder 
rod that the AC people use to solder the 
aluminum lines in AC units. You could solder 
the perch right back onto the case. You may 
even be able to build it up a bit to make it 
hold better. Should be stronger then JB weld. 
I used some to fix a hole in the condenser 
joint on the 123 last year and it has worked 
great so far. Got it at a welding supply 
store. It was only about $28 for 5 sticks. If 
I remember right they have different 
formulations for strength. Just takes a 
propane torch to do the job.


Jim Cathey via Mercedes wrote:

I think if you were so inclined you could absolutely fabricate some kind of 
JB-Weld attached perch for your coil.
Might take a bit of doing, but could it be all that worse than my welding the 
crankcase back together on my
tiller when it threw a rod through the side?

-- Jim


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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

Hi Curt,
It's a 7000w with 10.5Kw peak.   The engine is 420cc and while I have 
been unable to locate the HP it is supposed to be 14-ish.  It's called a 
B&S Type 2100 w/elec. start, if interested.

Thanks for the suggestion to look at CL, I will hopefully find a repl 
engine or suitable Generator.  It could be a basket case if the price 
was right.  My existing Generator could provide any parts needed, exc 
the case.

The Champion is an option, probably available at our local Ag Supply.  
The Honda too much $'s for my limited need.  Of course, the need is 
often inversely proportional to the preparedness which dates back to one 
of Murphy's many Laws.

Thanks for the options...

Larry

On 02/12/2019 1:18 PM, Curt Raymond wrote

What size is the generator?
If it were me I'd either

1. troll Craigslist for a replacement similar to what you have for a 
fraction of the new price

2. Buy a "Champion" brand from FLAPS or Tractor Supply or whatever. We 
have one at camp, we've had it, I forget, 6 or 7 years and its been 
great. Cheap too.

3. Buy a Honda and be done with it. While the Honda will be 2x$ option 
#2 it will last you the rest of your life and be MUCH quieter, 
probably use less fuel too.

If I needed a generator for home I'd go for option #3. Luckily I have 
a Fred who gave me a generator which currently lives at my in-laws 
house. I attribute it (ie being prepared) to why we haven't lost power 
this year...

-Curt

On Tuesday, February 12, 2019, 12:48:18 PM EST, Larry Turner via 
Mercedes  wrote:

Hi Guys,
Finally had the weather and inclination to work on the generator.
following your suggestion to check the fuel, I removed all fuel from the
tank and let it air out, then hooked my battery charger to the battery
and then cranked and check for spark.  I got zero spark while cranking
and decided to check out the coil thinking it might be bad.  At least
that was a cheap option.

What I found when I pulled the cover with the recoil starter I found one
of the pedestals that hold the coil/magneto assy near the magnet had
completely broken away!   As I removed the broken pieces I could see a
hole in the crankcase where the pedestals was formed.  The 2 pedestals
are a integral part of the case BTW.  I 1st thought I was seeing the
piston in the hole, but as I turned the engine by hand I noted I must be
seeing a sleeve rather than the piston as the part I could see thru the
hole was not moving as I turned the engine.

So it appears I will have to find a replacement motor which are avail
for $400-$500.  IOW, about 1/2 of my original investment in the
generator.  I could probably close the hole in the case with JB or such,
but would have no way to mount the coil and set the air gap consistently.

It strange that this part would break away from the engine; I didn't
find anything loose that could cause this kind of damage but it is what
it is.  I don't think I ran it for more than 30 -36 hours.   I contacted
Troy-Bilt and B&S but both just restated their 1 year warranty and went
no further.  No joy in Mudville.

I'd love to find a case for the 420cc B&S engine but so far my search
has turned up empty.   Anyway, lots of people gave me suggestions about
what to look for when I was troubleshooting.

Thanks again to all who helped...
LarryT

On 01/12/2019 11:10 PM, G Mann via Mercedes wrote:
> Check the carb float bowl for water.  Your post says engine speed 
increased

> or sound changed before shutdown...
>
> Water in fuel migrates into the float bowl... and accumulates in the
> bottom, as water level increases, less and less fuel can pass 
through the

> main jet in the center of the carb just above the fuel bowl... finally,
> water level rises to the point where the main jet gets no gas, and 
water,
> being heavier than gas, shuts off the flow of gas to fuel jet. 
Engine dies,

> restart doesn't happen because engine is "out of gas" at the main jet...
> fuel in tank can not over power water in bowl.. dead engine..
>
> Put a can under the carb bowl, remove the bolt at center of float bowl,
> drop bowl, with contents into can.. Inspect for water Bet that 
is your

> problem..
>
> Ethanol gas is hydroscopic.. it draws moisture and absorbs it .. said
> moisture then condenses in to carb in droplets.
>
> On Sat, Jan 12, 2019 at 6:31 PM Mitch Haley via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com > wrote:
>
>> The old way to manage the 'oil alert' shutoff was to short out the
>> ignition like an ignition switch does.
>> Some generators have a solenoid on the carb operated by the oil level
>> switch, usually through a control box.
>>
>> If the engine note changed before shutdown, the shutdown wasn't purely
>> electrical. Switching off the ignition just results in the engine 
coasting

>> to a stop and quickly.
>> But it might involve a fuel shutoff like is found on the 
carburetors of my
>> Subaru generator and the Briggs engine on my Trail Mower. The 
mixture would
>> go lean and then

Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

2019-02-12 Thread Curt Raymond via Mercedes

 Thats a pretty big one. Electric start is pretty nice.

If you don't need it right away the best time to look is in spring. Somebody 
buys a generator during an outage and in the spring gets rid of it because they 
"Won't need that again." or they bought one 2 years ago, the gas got some water 
in it and it won't start. IIRC thats how Fred got the generator I have.
Which reminds me I need to take my 1200w generator apart, it'll run okay but is 
difficult to start, I'm sure the carb needs cleaning. Its got barely any time 
on it and has sat a lot.

-Curt

On Tuesday, February 12, 2019, 3:47:53 PM EST, Larry Turner 
 wrote:  

  Hi Curt, 
 It's a 7000w with 10.5Kw peak.   The engine is 420cc and while I have been 
unable to locate the HP it is supposed to be 14-ish.  It's called a B&S Type 
2100 w/elec. start, if interested.  

 Thanks for the suggestion to look at CL, I will hopefully find a repl engine 
or suitable Generator.  It could be a basket case if the price was right.  My 
existing Generator could provide any parts needed, exc the case.

 The Champion is an option, probably available at our local Ag Supply.  The 
Honda too much $'s for my limited need.  Of course, the need is often inversely 
proportional to the preparedness which dates back to one of Murphy's many Laws.

 Thanks for the options...

 Larry

 On 02/12/2019 1:18 PM, Curt Raymond wrote

 What size is the generator? If it were me I'd either 

  1. troll Craigslist for a replacement similar to what you have for a fraction 
of the new price 
  2. Buy a "Champion" brand from FLAPS or Tractor Supply or whatever. We have 
one at camp, we've had it, I forget, 6 or 7 years and its been great. Cheap too.

  3. Buy a Honda and be done with it. While the Honda will be 2x$ option #2 it 
will last you the rest of your life and be MUCH quieter, probably use less fuel 
too. 
  If I needed a generator for home I'd go for option #3. Luckily I have a Fred 
who gave me a generator which currently lives at my in-laws house. I attribute 
it (ie being prepared) to why we haven't lost power this year...

  -Curt

  On Tuesday, February 12, 2019, 12:48:18 PM EST, Larry Turner via Mercedes 
 wrote:  

   Hi Guys,
 Finally had the weather and inclination to work on the generator. 
 following your suggestion to check the fuel, I removed all fuel from the 
 tank and let it air out, then hooked my battery charger to the battery 
 and then cranked and check for spark.  I got zero spark while cranking 
 and decided to check out the coil thinking it might be bad.  At least 
 that was a cheap option.

 What I found when I pulled the cover with the recoil starter I found one 
 of the pedestals that hold the coil/magneto assy near the magnet had 
 completely broken away!   As I removed the broken pieces I could see a 
 hole in the crankcase where the pedestals was formed.  The 2 pedestals 
 are a integral part of the case BTW.  I 1st thought I was seeing the 
 piston in the hole, but as I turned the engine by hand I noted I must be 
 seeing a sleeve rather than the piston as the part I could see thru the 
 hole was not moving as I turned the engine.

 So it appears I will have to find a replacement motor which are avail 
 for $400-$500.  IOW, about 1/2 of my original investment in the 
 generator.  I could probably close the hole in the case with JB or such, 
 but would have no way to mount the coil and set the air gap consistently.

 It strange that this part would break away from the engine; I didn't 
 find anything loose that could cause this kind of damage but it is what 
 it is.  I don't think I ran it for more than 30 -36 hours.   I contacted 
 Troy-Bilt and B&S but both just restated their 1 year warranty and went 
 no further.  No joy in Mudville.

 I'd love to find a case for the 420cc B&S engine but so far my search 
 has turned up empty.   Anyway, lots of people gave me suggestions about 
 what to look for when I was troubleshooting.

 Thanks again to all who helped...
 LarryT

 On 01/12/2019 11:10 PM, G Mann via Mercedes wrote:
 > Check the carb float bowl for water.  Your post says engine speed increased
 > or sound changed before shutdown...
 >
 > Water in fuel migrates into the float bowl... and accumulates in the
 > bottom, as water level increases, less and less fuel can pass through the
 > main jet in the center of the carb just above the fuel bowl... finally,
 > water level rises to the point where the main jet gets no gas, and water,
 > being heavier than gas, shuts off the flow of gas to fuel jet. Engine dies,
 > restart doesn't happen because engine is "out of gas" at the main jet...
 > fuel in tank can not over power water in bowl.. dead engine..
 >
 > Put a can under the carb bowl, remove the bolt at center of float bowl,
 > drop bowl, with contents into can.. Inspect for water Bet that is your
 > problem..
 >
 > Ethanol gas is hydroscopic.. it draws moisture and absorbs it .. said
 > moisture then condense

Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

2019-02-12 Thread MG via Mercedes

The last time I did one of those air gap was 
.010 in. Should still be the same. Used to be 
a feeler gauge set always had a brass .010 
blade on it for just that use. It probably 
doesn't matter too much other then a larger 
gap would make a weaker spark and too small a 
gap could cause the flywheel to hit the mag 
and knock it loose and put a hole into the 
case which sounds like what happened to your 
engine. Possibly one bolt not properly tightened?


Larry Turner via Mercedes wrote:

I thought that kind of stuff only happened to me!  Condolences.

Thanks for the suggestion!  I suppose I could fill the hole with JB and 
shape it so I'd have room to drill and tap it.  Then it would just be a 
matter of finding the right spacers and washers (which I've been 
"collecting" for 50 years) until I could adjust a air gap that would work.


How tight is the tolerance on the air gap?  Would I have much wiggle 
room or is it really precise, like points?


On 02/12/2019 12:52 PM, Jim Cathey wrote:
I think if you were so inclined you could absolutely fabricate some 
kind of JB-Weld attached perch for your coil.
Might take a bit of doing, but could it be all that worse than my 
welding the crankcase back together on my

tiller when it threw a rod through the side?

-- Jim




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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

2019-02-12 Thread MG via Mercedes

If you are looking for a new engine you might 
want to look at Harbor freight. If you buy at 
the right time you could get 25% off or more. 
Right now their 420cc horizontal shaft engine 
is $360. Wait for a sale and it will go down.

I bought a 6 hp engine to replace the 30 year 
old B&S cast iron one on my log splitter 
because it was having a lot of starting 
problems. With the new engine it starts at 
the first pull and runs a lot stronger due to 
the overhead valves rather then the old L 
head that B&S used for so long. Have had it 
for 2 years so far, it works great and for 
less then $75 after sale and discount. Will 
it last 30 years? Who cares. A new B&S 
probably won't either and costs a whole lot more.

Larry Turner via Mercedes wrote:

Hi Curt,
It's a 7000w with 10.5Kw peak.   The engine is 420cc and while I have 
been unable to locate the HP it is supposed to be 14-ish.  It's called a 
B&S Type 2100 w/elec. start, if interested.

Thanks for the suggestion to look at CL, I will hopefully find a repl 
engine or suitable Generator.  It could be a basket case if the price 
was right.  My existing Generator could provide any parts needed, exc 
the case.

The Champion is an option, probably available at our local Ag Supply.  
The Honda too much $'s for my limited need.  Of course, the need is 
often inversely proportional to the preparedness which dates back to one 
of Murphy's many Laws.

Thanks for the options...

Larry

On 02/12/2019 1:18 PM, Curt Raymond wrote

What size is the generator?
If it were me I'd either

1. troll Craigslist for a replacement similar to what you have for a 
fraction of the new price

2. Buy a "Champion" brand from FLAPS or Tractor Supply or whatever. We 
have one at camp, we've had it, I forget, 6 or 7 years and its been 
great. Cheap too.

3. Buy a Honda and be done with it. While the Honda will be 2x$ option 
#2 it will last you the rest of your life and be MUCH quieter, 
probably use less fuel too.

If I needed a generator for home I'd go for option #3. Luckily I have 
a Fred who gave me a generator which currently lives at my in-laws 
house. I attribute it (ie being prepared) to why we haven't lost power 
this year...

-Curt

On Tuesday, February 12, 2019, 12:48:18 PM EST, Larry Turner via 
Mercedes  wrote:

Hi Guys,
Finally had the weather and inclination to work on the generator.
following your suggestion to check the fuel, I removed all fuel from the
tank and let it air out, then hooked my battery charger to the battery
and then cranked and check for spark.  I got zero spark while cranking
and decided to check out the coil thinking it might be bad.  At least
that was a cheap option.

What I found when I pulled the cover with the recoil starter I found one
of the pedestals that hold the coil/magneto assy near the magnet had
completely broken away!   As I removed the broken pieces I could see a
hole in the crankcase where the pedestals was formed.  The 2 pedestals
are a integral part of the case BTW.  I 1st thought I was seeing the
piston in the hole, but as I turned the engine by hand I noted I must be
seeing a sleeve rather than the piston as the part I could see thru the
hole was not moving as I turned the engine.

So it appears I will have to find a replacement motor which are avail
for $400-$500.  IOW, about 1/2 of my original investment in the
generator.  I could probably close the hole in the case with JB or such,
but would have no way to mount the coil and set the air gap consistently.

It strange that this part would break away from the engine; I didn't
find anything loose that could cause this kind of damage but it is what
it is.  I don't think I ran it for more than 30 -36 hours.   I contacted
Troy-Bilt and B&S but both just restated their 1 year warranty and went
no further.  No joy in Mudville.

I'd love to find a case for the 420cc B&S engine but so far my search
has turned up empty.   Anyway, lots of people gave me suggestions about
what to look for when I was troubleshooting.

Thanks again to all who helped...
LarryT

On 01/12/2019 11:10 PM, G Mann via Mercedes wrote:
> Check the carb float bowl for water.  Your post says engine speed 
increased

> or sound changed before shutdown...
>
> Water in fuel migrates into the float bowl... and accumulates in the
> bottom, as water level increases, less and less fuel can pass 
through the

> main jet in the center of the carb just above the fuel bowl... finally,
> water level rises to the point where the main jet gets no gas, and 
water,
> being heavier than gas, shuts off the flow of gas to fuel jet. 
Engine dies,
> restart doesn't happen because engine is "out of gas" at the main 
jet...

> fuel in tank can not over power water in bowl.. dead engine..
>
> Put a can under the carb bowl, remove the bolt at center of float bowl,
> drop bowl, with contents into can.. Inspect for water Bet that 
is your

> problem..
>
> Ethanol gas is hydroscopic.. it draws moisture and absorbs it .. said
> moi

Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

2019-02-12 Thread Jim Cathey via Mercedes

When talking to your friends and neighbors, which is more satisfying?

1) I bought another generator
2) I bought a parts generator and made one out of two
3) I bought a new harbor freight engine for my generator
4) I fixed the broken block on my generator with JB-Weld

#4 also doesn't really cost anything but your time, and some of us have plenty
of that to allocate to the entertainment budget.  You just have to be willing 
for
it not to work out, but even that gives you a bunch of entertainment and leaves
you with three other choices.

-- Jim


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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

2019-02-12 Thread Dan Penoff via Mercedes

Really, at this point #4 would be a no-brainer, as the investment in materials 
and time is minimal with a chance of a very positive result.

I would try it. WTH, why not?

-D


> On Feb 12, 2019, at 5:17 PM, Jim Cathey via Mercedes  
> wrote:
> 
> When talking to your friends and neighbors, which is more satisfying?
> 
> 1) I bought another generator
> 2) I bought a parts generator and made one out of two
> 3) I bought a new harbor freight engine for my generator
> 4) I fixed the broken block on my generator with JB-Weld
> 
> #4 also doesn't really cost anything but your time, and some of us have plenty
> of that to allocate to the entertainment budget.  You just have to be willing 
> for
> it not to work out, but even that gives you a bunch of entertainment and 
> leaves
> you with three other choices.
> 
> -- Jim
> 
> 
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
> 
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> 
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> 
> 


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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

You know, now that you mention it, I may have some of those alum rods to 
"braze" with - I think I have some that will melt using propane but I 
hopefully left the instructions with the rods.   I'll look tomorrow.


Think that'll stick to cast iron?  Pretty sure that's what the case is 
made of but I have the specs around here I can check.


Thanks for the suggestion!!

Larry

On 02/12/2019 3:20 PM, MG via Mercedes wrote:
How about using some of that aluminum solder rod that the AC people 
use to solder the aluminum lines in AC units. You could solder the 
perch right back onto the case. You may even be able to build it up a 
bit to make it hold better. Should be stronger then JB weld. I used 
some to fix a hole in the condenser joint on the 123 last year and it 
has worked great so far. Got it at a welding supply store. It was only 
about $28 for 5 sticks. If I remember right they have different 
formulations for strength. Just takes a propane torch to do the job.


Jim Cathey via Mercedes wrote:
I think if you were so inclined you could absolutely fabricate some 
kind of JB-Weld attached perch for your coil.
Might take a bit of doing, but could it be all that worse than my 
welding the crankcase back together on my

tiller when it threw a rod through the side?

-- Jim


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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

Yeah, push button is nice.  but the battery wasn't charging properly on 
1 jan (the date it died) and we started it with the pull rope - started 
instantly which surprised me.  Also, I may have a compression release 
because it pulled so easy.


Yeah, waiting til Spring would be ideal, but here in Va we have snow.ice 
in the winter than Hurricanes in the Summer/Fall. So it's hard to say 
when we'll need one again.  Like I mentioned, we bought this one in 2012 
and only used it for (I think) 24-30 hours in ~2014, then again the 1st 
of this year when it started instantly but died after about 6 hours.


Va. kind of strange with odd weather.  Sometimes we get hit hard with 
Hurricanes then Ice storms and both take out the power.  Our 
neighborhood has underground power but it has to get here...


on yours, I would think the needle and jet may be damaged because of the 
Ethanol.   I talked to our local small engine shop who told me that was 
a large part of their business.


Anyway, got to use Sta-Bil as I'm sure you know  

Thanks,
Larry



On 02/12/2019 3:54 PM, Curt Raymond wrote:

Thats a pretty big one. Electric start is pretty nice.

If you don't need it right away the best time to look is in spring. 
Somebody buys a generator during an outage and in the spring gets rid 
of it because they "Won't need that again." or they bought one 2 years 
ago, the gas got some water in it and it won't start. IIRC thats how 
Fred got the generator I have.


Which reminds me I need to take my 1200w generator apart, it'll run 
okay but is difficult to start, I'm sure the carb needs cleaning. Its 
got barely any time on it and has sat a lot.


-Curt

On Tuesday, February 12, 2019, 3:47:53 PM EST, Larry Turner 
 wrote:



Hi Curt,
It's a 7000w with 10.5Kw peak.   The engine is 420cc and while I have 
been unable to locate the HP it is supposed to be 14-ish.  It's called 
a B&S Type 2100 w/elec. start, if interested.


Thanks for the suggestion to look at CL, I will hopefully find a repl 
engine or suitable Generator.  It could be a basket case if the price 
was right.  My existing Generator could provide any parts needed, exc 
the case.


The Champion is an option, probably available at our local Ag Supply.  
The Honda too much $'s for my limited need.  Of course, the need is 
often inversely proportional to the preparedness which dates back to 
one of Murphy's many Laws.


Thanks for the options...

Larry

On 02/12/2019 1:18 PM, Curt Raymond wrote
What size is the generator?
If it were me I'd either

1. troll Craigslist for a replacement similar to what you have for a 
fraction of the new price


2. Buy a "Champion" brand from FLAPS or Tractor Supply or whatever. We 
have one at camp, we've had it, I forget, 6 or 7 years and its been 
great. Cheap too.


3. Buy a Honda and be done with it. While the Honda will be 2x$ option 
#2 it will last you the rest of your life and be MUCH quieter, 
probably use less fuel too.


If I needed a generator for home I'd go for option #3. Luckily I have 
a Fred who gave me a generator which currently lives at my in-laws 
house. I attribute it (ie being prepared) to why we haven't lost power 
this year...


-Curt

On Tuesday, February 12, 2019, 12:48:18 PM EST, Larry Turner via 
Mercedes   wrote:



Hi Guys,
Finally had the weather and inclination to work on the generator.
following your suggestion to check the fuel, I removed all fuel from the
tank and let it air out, then hooked my battery charger to the battery
and then cranked and check for spark.  I got zero spark while cranking
and decided to check out the coil thinking it might be bad.  At least
that was a cheap option.

What I found when I pulled the cover with the recoil starter I found one
of the pedestals that hold the coil/magneto assy near the magnet had
completely broken away!   As I removed the broken pieces I could see a
hole in the crankcase where the pedestals was formed.  The 2 pedestals
are a integral part of the case BTW.  I 1st thought I was seeing the
piston in the hole, but as I turned the engine by hand I noted I must be
seeing a sleeve rather than the piston as the part I could see thru the
hole was not moving as I turned the engine.

So it appears I will have to find a replacement motor which are avail
for $400-$500.  IOW, about 1/2 of my original investment in the
generator.  I could probably close the hole in the case with JB or such,
but would have no way to mount the coil and set the air gap consistently.

It strange that this part would break away from the engine; I didn't
find anything loose that could cause this kind of damage but it is what
it is.  I don't think I ran it for more than 30 -36 hours.   I contacted
Troy-Bilt and B&S but both just restated their 1 year warranty and went
no further.  No joy in Mudville.

I'd love to find a case for the 420cc B&S engine but so far my search
has turned up empty.   Anyway, lots of people gave me suggestions about
what to look for

Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

If one was loose it came that way from the factory.   I guess their QC 
program might be lacking...  One of the things that impressed me when I 
started taking things apart was how snug (tight actually) the fasteners 
were.  I'm sure there must be some torque wrench settings that aren't 
set properly.


Hmmm...  I better check the tightness of other fasteners when I try to 
repair the coil.


Thanks for the info about the coil!  I even have some brass feelers.

Larry

On 02/12/2019 4:07 PM, MG via Mercedes wrote:
The last time I did one of those air gap was .010 in. Should still be 
the same. Used to be a feeler gauge set always had a brass .010 blade 
on it for just that use. It probably doesn't matter too much other 
then a larger gap would make a weaker spark and too small a gap could 
cause the flywheel to hit the mag and knock it loose and put a hole 
into the case which sounds like what happened to your engine. Possibly 
one bolt not properly tightened?


Larry Turner via Mercedes wrote:

I thought that kind of stuff only happened to me!  Condolences.

Thanks for the suggestion!  I suppose I could fill the hole with JB 
and shape it so I'd have room to drill and tap it.  Then it would 
just be a matter of finding the right spacers and washers (which I've 
been "collecting" for 50 years) until I could adjust a air gap that 
would work.


How tight is the tolerance on the air gap?  Would I have much wiggle 
room or is it really precise, like points?


On 02/12/2019 12:52 PM, Jim Cathey wrote:
I think if you were so inclined you could absolutely fabricate some 
kind of JB-Weld attached perch for your coil.
Might take a bit of doing, but could it be all that worse than my 
welding the crankcase back together on my

tiller when it threw a rod through the side?

-- Jim




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Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question

Cool!  That's actually the exact size/configuration I need!  I'll watch 
HF for their sales.  Thanks for the heads up!

Larry

On 02/12/2019 4:56 PM, MG via Mercedes wrote:
If you are looking for a new engine you might want to look at Harbor 
freight. If you buy at the right time you could get 25% off or more. 
Right now their 420cc horizontal shaft engine is $360. Wait for a sale 
and it will go down.

I bought a 6 hp engine to replace the 30 year old B&S cast iron one on 
my log splitter because it was having a lot of starting problems. With 
the new engine it starts at the first pull and runs a lot stronger due 
to the overhead valves rather then the old L head that B&S used for so 
long. Have had it for 2 years so far, it works great and for less then 
$75 after sale and discount. Will it last 30 years? Who cares. A new 
B&S probably won't either and costs a whole lot more.

Larry Turner via Mercedes wrote:

Hi Curt,
It's a 7000w with 10.5Kw peak.   The engine is 420cc and while I have 
been unable to locate the HP it is supposed to be 14-ish. It's called 
a B&S Type 2100 w/elec. start, if interested.

Thanks for the suggestion to look at CL, I will hopefully find a repl 
engine or suitable Generator.  It could be a basket case if the price 
was right.  My existing Generator could provide any parts needed, exc 
the case.

The Champion is an option, probably available at our local Ag 
Supply.  The Honda too much $'s for my limited need.  Of course, the 
need is often inversely proportional to the preparedness which dates 
back to one of Murphy's many Laws.

Thanks for the options...

Larry

On 02/12/2019 1:18 PM, Curt Raymond wrote

What size is the generator?
If it were me I'd either

1. troll Craigslist for a replacement similar to what you have for a 
fraction of the new price

2. Buy a "Champion" brand from FLAPS or Tractor Supply or whatever. 
We have one at camp, we've had it, I forget, 6 or 7 years and its 
been great. Cheap too.

3. Buy a Honda and be done with it. While the Honda will be 2x$ 
option #2 it will last you the rest of your life and be MUCH 
quieter, probably use less fuel too.

If I needed a generator for home I'd go for option #3. Luckily I 
have a Fred who gave me a generator which currently lives at my 
in-laws house. I attribute it (ie being prepared) to why we haven't 
lost power this year...

-Curt

On Tuesday, February 12, 2019, 12:48:18 PM EST, Larry Turner via 
Mercedes  wrote:

Hi Guys,
Finally had the weather and inclination to work on the generator.
following your suggestion to check the fuel, I removed all fuel from 
the

tank and let it air out, then hooked my battery charger to the battery
and then cranked and check for spark.  I got zero spark while cranking
and decided to check out the coil thinking it might be bad. At least
that was a cheap option.

What I found when I pulled the cover with the recoil starter I found 
one

of the pedestals that hold the coil/magneto assy near the magnet had
completely broken away!   As I removed the broken pieces I could see a
hole in the crankcase where the pedestals was formed.  The 2 pedestals
are a integral part of the case BTW.  I 1st thought I was seeing the
piston in the hole, but as I turned the engine by hand I noted I 
must be

seeing a sleeve rather than the piston as the part I could see thru the
hole was not moving as I turned the engine.

So it appears I will have to find a replacement motor which are avail
for $400-$500.  IOW, about 1/2 of my original investment in the
generator.  I could probably close the hole in the case with JB or 
such,
but would have no way to mount the coil and set the air gap 
consistently.

It strange that this part would break away from the engine; I didn't
find anything loose that could cause this kind of damage but it is what
it is.  I don't think I ran it for more than 30 -36 hours.   I 
contacted

Troy-Bilt and B&S but both just restated their 1 year warranty and went
no further.  No joy in Mudville.

I'd love to find a case for the 420cc B&S engine but so far my search
has turned up empty.   Anyway, lots of people gave me suggestions about
what to look for when I was troubleshooting.

Thanks again to all who helped...
LarryT

On 01/12/2019 11:10 PM, G Mann via Mercedes wrote:
> Check the carb float bowl for water.  Your post says engine speed 
increased

> or sound changed before shutdown...
>
> Water in fuel migrates into the float bowl... and accumulates in the
> bottom, as water level increases, less and less fuel can pass 
through the
> main jet in the center of the carb just above the fuel bowl... 
finally,
> water level rises to the point where the main jet gets no gas, and 
water,
> being heavier than gas, shuts off the flow of gas to fuel jet. 
Engine dies,
> restart doesn't happen because engine is "out of gas" at the main 
jet...

> fuel in tank can not over power water in bowl.. dead engine..
>
> Put a can under the carb bowl, remove the bolt at center of floa

Re: [MBZ] OT Troybilt Portable Generator Question