[newbie] Defrag?
After two weeks of trial and error I began to wonder about defraging my Mandrake dedicated box. I have version 8.2 with a standard installation. Does this version have a defraging utility? TIA, Owen Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Defrag?
On Tuesday 05 November 2002 07:29 pm, you wrote: After two weeks of trial and error I began to wonder about defraging my Mandrake dedicated box. I have version 8.2 with a standard installation. Does this version have a defraging utility? TIA, Owen This gets asked a lot but basically, because of the way Linux is setup (superior), you don't have to defrag -- /\ Dark Lord \/ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Defrag?
After two weeks of trial and error I began to wonder about defraging my Mandrake dedicated box. I have version 8.2 with a standard installation. Does this version have a defraging utility? TIA, Owen This gets asked a lot but basically, because of the way Linux is setup (superior), you don't have to defrag What is it about Linux's setup that makes defrag unnecessary? Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Defrag?
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: After two weeks of trial and error I began to wonder about defraging my Mandrake dedicated box. I have version 8.2 with a standard installation. Does this version have a defraging utility? TIA, Owen This gets asked a lot but basically, because of the way Linux is setup (superior), you don't have to defrag What is it about Linux's setup that makes defrag unnecessary? The best way is to think of your file file system as a bunch of folders with those transparent envelopes for inserting paper. Let's imagine you have a twenty-page report to file. The Windows method is to look for the first empty envelope and start slotting in pages from there. This works well enough in a new folder, but once you start removing pages (deleting files) you end up putting, say, the first ten pages in, then finding the next envelope is full, so you put the next ten pages somewhere else. The more the disk gets used, the more files get split up, so eventually you have to go through and swap all the pages round - i.e. defragment. The UNIX/Linux method is that if you have a twenty-page report to file, you look through the folder for a space which has at least twenty free envelopes. Consequently, files only get split up if they're very big and your disk is very, very full. Logical, really, and not a new technology - this type of filesystem has been around since the 1980s. Defragmentation, like virus-checking, is one of those cures for problems which Microsoft introduced, but which people now accept as an inevitable part of using a computer. Sir Robin -- A free man ought not to learn anything under duress. Compulsory physical exercise does no harm to the body, but compulsory learning never sticks in the mind. - Plato Robin Turner IDMYO, Bilkent University Ankara 06533 Turkey www.bilkent.edu.tr/~robin Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Defrag?
On Tuesday 05 November 2002 05:06 pm, Jan Wilson wrote: * [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [021105 10:49]: This gets asked a lot but basically, because of the way Linux is setup (superior), you don't have to defrag What is it about Linux's setup that makes defrag unnecessary? Jan, in addition to the answers already given : Linux file systems : ext2, ext3, XFS and Reiser don't need defragging. However, the newly ported JFS from IBM is extremely fast and reliable, but needs an occasional defrag. HTH Kaj Haulrich Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Defrag?
Ronald J. Hall wrote: On Tuesday 05 November 2002 07:29 pm, you wrote: After two weeks of trial and error I began to wonder about defraging my Mandrake dedicated box. I have version 8.2 with a standard installation. Does this version have a defraging utility? TIA, Owen This gets asked a lot but basically, because of the way Linux is setup (superior), you don't have to defrag I've known this for some time, but can anyone direct us to an online explaination/description of Linux file systems? TIA Bob [EMAIL PROTECTED] Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Defrag?
On Wed, 2002-11-06 at 03:00, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: After two weeks of trial and error I began to wonder about defraging my Mandrake dedicated box. I have version 8.2 with a standard installation. Does this version have a defraging utility? TIA, Owen This gets asked a lot but basically, because of the way Linux is setup (superior), you don't have to defrag What is it about Linux's setup that makes defrag unnecessary? You can run an FSCK from the text console logon...that's basically the whole shebang...otherwise, ext2fs and ext3fs don't need to be defragmented as it were. -- Wed Nov 6 09:20:00 EST 2002 |____ | | / \ /| |'-. | | .\__/ || | | | | _ / `._ \|_|_.-' | | | / \__.`=._) (_ |kuhn media australia | |/ ._/ || |http://kma.0catch.com | |'. `\ | | |stephen kuhn | ;/ / | | |email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] | smk ) /_/| |.---.| |mobile: 0410-728-389 | ' `-`' | Mountain Dew and doughnuts... because breakfast is the most important meal of the day. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Defrag?
On Tuesday 05 November 2002 11:00 am, you wrote: After two weeks of trial and error I began to wonder about defraging my Mandrake dedicated box. I have version 8.2 with a standard installation. Does this version have a defraging utility? TIA, Owen This gets asked a lot but basically, because of the way Linux is setup (superior), you don't have to defrag What is it about Linux's setup that makes defrag unnecessary? It does its own housekeeping so that a defrag is unnecessary. -- /\ Dark Lord \/ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] defrag and linux
At 11:45 PM 9/5/2002 +1000, you wrote: Well I've set up a lot of dual boot machines and defragging the FAT32 partitions has never caused a problem (even using the crappy defragger built in to 9x). I've lost the original message, but it would seem that we are tackling this from the wrong premise - i.e. that ME is just lamentable and defragging is causing the problem. Yes it is lamentable, but it doesn't normally behave like this. My guess is therefore, that there is something somewhat amiss with the way your partitioning is setup. Is there a disk geometry expert in the house? Brian If I may add something here: ME is the strangest beast M$hit ever put out. It doesn't follow their conventional disk geometry schemes. The NT 2k partitioning for example is virtually the same. Ditto for win98 95. Also, if he's using a third party defragger (Norton, distemper, etc) they WILL Screw ME to hell back. They also screw linux most times. Esp. if they do a surface scan repair job. Diskeeper is a little better from what I hear. Nortons (esp. the speedisk feature) is prone to corrupting linux partitions. Their answer: tough shit. Deal with it. We only support M$ products. IIRC the original poster was using norton. If that's the case you've just pooched your linux install. If not, well this just adds to the knowledge base no? --- Femme Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] defrag and linux
WILL Screw ME to hell back. They also screw linux most times. Esp. if they do a surface scan repair job. Diskeeper is a little better from Hmm. I recall borrowing a copy of some commercial drive repair software - supposedly able to find and recover marginal sectors on a drive. Anyway, the drive I had was a Seagate 125 megger (this was back in 1992 or thereabouts). Anyhow, the software started out and then quit several hours later 2/3 of the way through. I was left with a pretty much damaged drive: part of the disk was good, the rest of it was very prone to errors. Unfortunately, I was just getting introduced to Unix at that time (imagine trying to maintain a partition on a somewhat marginal drive, without the bad sector detection/avoidance -- at least back then, it was absent). :( Glad I tossed that drive and got a Maxtor soon after. :) I installed a (very old) distro of linux on that puppy and since then - no MS anywhere on my drives. Femme Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] defrag and linux
downloaded and triedsame shit, i weren't able to boot anymoreany other idea? Brian Parish wrote: On Wed, 2002-09-04 at 09:12, Miark wrote: Where? Miark Brian Parish [EMAIL PROTECTED] saith: Well at the risk of being drawn and quartered, note that you can download a free version of Diskkeeper for 98/ME... Here: http://www.executive.com/downloads/menu.asp cheers Brian P.S. This is the defragger that M$ licenses for 2K and XP, so it may look familiar ;-) Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com -- Dr Daniele de Sanctis, PhD student Homo sum humani nil alienum a me puto -|-- X-ray Structural Biology Unit (B2) | phone and fax ++ 39 010 5737306 Advanced Biotechnology Center (CBA) | e-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] Largo Rosanna Benzi 10 | web http://alcor.ge.infm.it/daniele.htm 16132 Genova - Italy | -|-- Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] defrag and linux
Well I've set up a lot of dual boot machines and defragging the FAT32 partitions has never caused a problem (even using the crappy defragger built in to 9x). I've lost the original message, but it would seem that we are tackling this from the wrong premise - i.e. that ME is just lamentable and defragging is causing the problem. Yes it is lamentable, but it doesn't normally behave like this. My guess is therefore, that there is something somewhat amiss with the way your partitioning is setup. Is there a disk geometry expert in the house? Brian On Thu, 2002-09-05 at 22:47, Daniele de Sanctis wrote: downloaded and triedsame shit, i weren't able to boot anymoreany other idea? Brian Parish wrote: On Wed, 2002-09-04 at 09:12, Miark wrote: Where? Miark Brian Parish [EMAIL PROTECTED] saith: Well at the risk of being drawn and quartered, note that you can download a free version of Diskkeeper for 98/ME... Here: http://www.executive.com/downloads/menu.asp cheers Brian P.S. This is the defragger that M$ licenses for 2K and XP, so it may look familiar ;-) Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com -- Dr Daniele de Sanctis, PhD student Homo sum humani nil alienum a me puto -|-- X-ray Structural Biology Unit (B2) | phone and fax ++ 39 010 5737306 Advanced Biotechnology Center (CBA) | e-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] Largo Rosanna Benzi 10 | web http://alcor.ge.infm.it/daniele.htm 16132 Genova - Italy | -|-- Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
RE: [newbie] defrag and linux
I don't know if this was luck, but I reinstalled w2k on my dual boot mdk/w2k, and had to do nothing with the mbr. It just booted as normal. Tony. -Original Message- From: Richard Holt [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, September 03, 2002 8:24 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [newbie] defrag and linux Hello, On Tue, 03 Sep 2002 13:21:13 -0400, Mark Weaver [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Daniele de Sanctis wrote: didn't try anything yet, but i'd like to say that that happened also on another laptop with windows98 and another question: i'm thinking of installing windows 2k on my windows partition. that installation could produce problem to the linux partition (maybe in principle not, but.)thank u daniele daniele, Win2K and Mandrake should get along just fine. I've got XP and Mandrake running on a workstation at home and play real nice together. The only time I've heard of folks having trouble with those two or others similar as in NT and Linux is with bootloaders other then LILO. That is not to say that the other BL's aren't any good or you shouldn't use them. Thats just the only instance that i've heard of that being a problem. I had a similar situation. Only booted to Windows once in the last couple of weeks but it hung and stepped on the registry. Quickest solution was just Reinstall. Worked fine for Windows but overwrote the MBR. Reboot with CD#1 in the drive choosing repair. Read the directions about using mount /mnt or some such and then running /sbin/lilo. Exit, Exit, Reboot and all was fine again. regards, Richard. So...load away. Mark -+-+-+-+-+-+-+- Business Computer Projects - Disclaimer -+-+-+-+-+-+-+- This message, and any associated attachment is confidential. If you have received it in error, please delete it from your system, do not use or disclose the information in any way, and notify either Tony S. Sykes or the postmaster mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] immediately. The contents of this message may contain personal views which are not necessarily the views of Business Computer Projects Ltd., unless specifically stated. Whilst every effort has been made to ensure that emails and their attachments are virus free, it is the responsibility of the recipient(s) to verify the integrity of such emails. Business Computer Projects Ltd BCP House 151 Charles Street Stockport Cheshire SK1 3JY Tel: +44 (0)161 355-3000 Fax: +44 (0)161 355-3001 Web: http://www.bcpsoftware.com http://www.bcpsoftware.com/ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] defrag and linux
On Wed, 04 Sep 2002 05:26, Mark Weaver wrote: Angus Auld wrote: Hi there, I've been running a dual-boot on my Dell Dimm for a few months now w/Mdk 8.2 and WinMe, and they seem to cohabitating peacefully on my hd. I have defragged my Win partition a few times and it hasn't caused any problems for Mdk. Am I courting disaster and holding out on luck alone?? I hardly use ME at all anymore, and I've thought about just dumping it and letting Mdk have the whole drive. Is this particular to laptops or are desktops involved too? Any further info about possible problems caused by Win defrag would be greatly appreciated. TIA for any feedback. --Angus Hi Angus, Maybe you're just one of the lucky few. If so, we'll just take comfort in the fact that there are actually folks out there that haven't been bitten by the ME dragon. Frankly, ME is THE worst thing to ever come out of Redmond, Washington. I can't believe they actually released that mess and called it an Operating System. The only thing worse then that is the fact that they actually got paid money by people for the thing. The old adage is still true however. If it isn't broke then don't fix it. If you're not having any trouble then leave it be. I wouldn't do any extensive system or disk maintainence on it though using _any_ tools native to ME though. Not with it's current track record of misfortune and dataloss. If, on the other hand you were to go out and purchase a Windows XP Home edition, (however, the professional edition is much perfered if you've got to), I'm sure your computer would be far happier and your data MUCH safer. Mark MUCH safer, yeah right. It would then belong to Micro$oft. If you have no further use for ME Angus by all means trash it. Me, i still resort back to my Windows to get screen shots for manuals, etc. -- Michael Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] defrag and linux
On Wed, 2002-09-04 at 09:12, Miark wrote: Where? Miark Brian Parish [EMAIL PROTECTED] saith: Well at the risk of being drawn and quartered, note that you can download a free version of Diskkeeper for 98/ME... Here: http://www.executive.com/downloads/menu.asp cheers Brian P.S. This is the defragger that M$ licenses for 2K and XP, so it may look familiar ;-) Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] defrag and linux
didn't try anything yet, but i'd like to say that that happened also on another laptop with windows98 and another question: i'm thinking of installing windows 2k on my windows partition. that installation could produce problem to the linux partition (maybe in principle not, but.)thank u daniele Mark Weaver wrote: Daniele de Sanctis wrote: dear all, i have a laptop with a winME partition and a linuxM (8.2) partition, they lived and grown up without problem until when i decided to make a defrag of the windows partition, this cause a big problem to linux, at booting it faced a kernel panic, not being able ti find the INIT. it happened on another laptop in my lab, so the question is: how that winblows can make problem to the linux partition? and also, how can i defrag that partition, without causing problem at the linux's one?\ thank u daniele daniele, I've been hearing more and more of bad things happening to the partition tables on disks partitioned for both windows and Linux when the Windows installed on the disk in ME. The first thing I would do if I were you, and I'm be painfully serious, I would take that ME disk and through as far away as humanly possible. Then reload your Windows side with 98 or some NT variant. NT4 or XP. IF you've got to run windows at least use something that works. For some as yet unknown reason ME is doing bad things to partitions tables. I'm going to have to get a disk with ME on it and install the sucker just to get to the bottom of this very strange mystery. And I will. For now though you may want to pass the kernel the location of the INIT at boot time at the LILO prompt. Boot your Mandrake install CD's in rescue mode, then from the menu that loads choose to go to the console. The init file your kernel is looking for live here: /etc/sysconfig/init At the LILO prompt you would pass this information to the kernel: LILO: linux 3 /etc/sysconfig/init Give that a shot and see what happens. From the sound of things ME's defreg has hosed your partition tables which is why your kernel can't see the / (root) partition of your Linux installation where the init file lives. While you've got the system booted in rescue mode you may try checking to if Linux fdisk will correctly display your partition table by issuing this command as root: fdisk /dev/hda ENTER let us know how you make out... Mark Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com -- Dr Daniele de Sanctis, PhD student Homo sum humani nil alienum a me puto -|-- X-ray Structural Biology Unit (B2) | phone and fax ++ 39 010 5737306 Advanced Biotechnology Center (CBA) | e-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] Largo Rosanna Benzi 10 | web http://alcor.ge.infm.it/daniele.htm 16132 Genova - Italy | -|-- Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] defrag and linux
Hi there, I've been running a dual-boot on my Dell Dimm for a few months now w/Mdk 8.2 and WinMe, and they seem to cohabitating peacefully on my hd. I have defragged my Win partition a few times and it hasn't caused any problems for Mdk. Am I courting disaster and holding out on luck alone?? I hardly use ME at all anymore, and I've thought about just dumping it and letting Mdk have the whole drive. Is this particular to laptops or are desktops involved too? Any further info about possible problems caused by Win defrag would be greatly appreciated. TIA for any feedback. --Angus - Original Message - From: Daniele de Sanctis [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Tue, 03 Sep 2002 17:51:42 +0200 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [newbie] defrag and linux didn't try anything yet, but i'd like to say that that happened also on another laptop with windows98 and another question: i'm thinking of installing windows 2k on my windows partition. that installation could produce problem to the linux partition (maybe in principle not, but.)thank u daniele Mark Weaver wrote: Daniele de Sanctis wrote: dear all, i have a laptop with a winME partition and a linuxM (8.2) partition, they lived and grown up without problem until when i decided to make a defrag of the windows partition, this cause a big problem to linux, at booting it faced a kernel panic, not being able ti find the INIT. it happened on another laptop in my lab, so the question is: how that winblows can make problem to the linux partition? and also, how can i defrag that partition, without causing problem at the linux's one?\ thank u daniele daniele, I've been hearing more and more of bad things happening to the partition tables on disks partitioned for both windows and Linux when the Windows installed on the disk in ME. The first thing I would do if I were you, and I'm be painfully serious, I would take that ME disk and through as far away as humanly possible. Then reload your Windows side with 98 or some NT variant. NT4 or XP. IF you've got to run windows at least use something that works. For some as yet unknown reason ME is doing bad things to partitions tables. I'm going to have to get a disk with ME on it and install the sucker just to get to the bottom of this very strange mystery. And I will. For now though you may want to pass the kernel the location of the INIT at boot time at the LILO prompt. Boot your Mandrake install CD's in rescue mode, then from the menu that loads choose to go to the console. The init file your kernel is looking for live here: /etc/sysconfig/init At the LILO prompt you would pass this information to the kernel: LILO: linux 3 /etc/sysconfig/init Give that a shot and see what happens. From the sound of things ME's defreg has hosed your partition tables which is why your kernel can't see the / (root) partition of your Linux installation where the init file lives. While you've got the system booted in rescue mode you may try checking to if Linux fdisk will correctly display your partition table by issuing this command as root: fdisk /dev/hda ENTER let us know how you make out... Mark Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com -- Dr Daniele de Sanctis, PhD student Homo sum humani nil alienum a me puto -|-- X-ray Structural Biology Unit (B2) | phone and fax ++ 39 010 5737306 Advanced Biotechnology Center (CBA) | e-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] Largo Rosanna Benzi 10 | web http://alcor.ge.infm.it/daniele.htm 16132 Genova - Italy | - -- ___ Get your free email from http://mymail.operamail.com Powered by Outblaze Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] defrag and linux
Daniele de Sanctis wrote: didn't try anything yet, but i'd like to say that that happened also on another laptop with windows98 and another question: i'm thinking of installing windows 2k on my windows partition. that installation could produce problem to the linux partition (maybe in principle not, but.)thank u daniele daniele, Win2K and Mandrake should get along just fine. I've got XP and Mandrake running on a workstation at home and play real nice together. The only time I've heard of folks having trouble with those two or others similar as in NT and Linux is with bootloaders other then LILO. That is not to say that the other BL's aren't any good or you shouldn't use them. Thats just the only instance that i've heard of that being a problem. So...laod away. Mark Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
RE: [newbie] defrag and linux
I know there is a problem with the defrag tool on WinME. The problem is resolved with a patch download (though windows update). The problem is not just related to dualboot. In fact, the defrag utility (if not patched) can break your boot partition (even if it's a windows partition). I don't know if this thread is related exactly to this issue nor I can test it (I use Windows ME/XP and Linux on seperated machines). Albert Charron Trisotech Inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: Angus Auld [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, September 03, 2002 1:17 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [newbie] defrag and linux Hi there, I've been running a dual-boot on my Dell Dimm for a few months now w/Mdk 8.2 and WinMe, and they seem to cohabitating peacefully on my hd. I have defragged my Win partition a few times and it hasn't caused any problems for Mdk. Am I courting disaster and holding out on luck alone?? I hardly use ME at all anymore, and I've thought about just dumping it and letting Mdk have the whole drive. Is this particular to laptops or are desktops involved too? Any further info about possible problems caused by Win defrag would be greatly appreciated. TIA for any feedback. --Angus - Original Message - From: Daniele de Sanctis [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Tue, 03 Sep 2002 17:51:42 +0200 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [newbie] defrag and linux didn't try anything yet, but i'd like to say that that happened also on another laptop with windows98 and another question: i'm thinking of installing windows 2k on my windows partition. that installation could produce problem to the linux partition (maybe in principle not, but.)thank u daniele Mark Weaver wrote: Daniele de Sanctis wrote: dear all, i have a laptop with a winME partition and a linuxM (8.2) partition, they lived and grown up without problem until when i decided to make a defrag of the windows partition, this cause a big problem to linux, at booting it faced a kernel panic, not being able ti find the INIT. it happened on another laptop in my lab, so the question is: how that winblows can make problem to the linux partition? and also, how can i defrag that partition, without causing problem at the linux's one?\ thank u daniele daniele, I've been hearing more and more of bad things happening to the partition tables on disks partitioned for both windows and Linux when the Windows installed on the disk in ME. The first thing I would do if I were you, and I'm be painfully serious, I would take that ME disk and through as far away as humanly possible. Then reload your Windows side with 98 or some NT variant. NT4 or XP. IF you've got to run windows at least use something that works. For some as yet unknown reason ME is doing bad things to partitions tables. I'm going to have to get a disk with ME on it and install the sucker just to get to the bottom of this very strange mystery. And I will. For now though you may want to pass the kernel the location of the INIT at boot time at the LILO prompt. Boot your Mandrake install CD's in rescue mode, then from the menu that loads choose to go to the console. The init file your kernel is looking for live here: /etc/sysconfig/init At the LILO prompt you would pass this information to the kernel: LILO: linux 3 /etc/sysconfig/init Give that a shot and see what happens. From the sound of things ME's defreg has hosed your partition tables which is why your kernel can't see the / (root) partition of your Linux installation where the init file lives. While you've got the system booted in rescue mode you may try checking to if Linux fdisk will correctly display your partition table by issuing this command as root: fdisk /dev/hda ENTER let us know how you make out... Mark Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com -- Dr Daniele de Sanctis, PhD student Homo sum humani nil alienum a me puto -|-- X-ray Structural Biology Unit (B2) | phone and fax ++ 39 010 5737306 Advanced Biotechnology Center (CBA) | e-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] Largo Rosanna Benzi 10 | web http://alcor.ge.infm.it/daniele.htm 16132 Genova - Italy | - -- ___ Get your free email from http://mymail.operamail.com Powered by Outblaze Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] defrag and linux
Hello, On Tue, 03 Sep 2002 13:21:13 -0400, Mark Weaver [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Daniele de Sanctis wrote: didn't try anything yet, but i'd like to say that that happened also on another laptop with windows98 and another question: i'm thinking of installing windows 2k on my windows partition. that installation could produce problem to the linux partition (maybe in principle not, but.)thank u daniele daniele, Win2K and Mandrake should get along just fine. I've got XP and Mandrake running on a workstation at home and play real nice together. The only time I've heard of folks having trouble with those two or others similar as in NT and Linux is with bootloaders other then LILO. That is not to say that the other BL's aren't any good or you shouldn't use them. Thats just the only instance that i've heard of that being a problem. I had a similar situation. Only booted to Windows once in the last couple of weeks but it hung and stepped on the registry. Quickest solution was just Reinstall. Worked fine for Windows but overwrote the MBR. Reboot with CD#1 in the drive choosing repair. Read the directions about using mount /mnt or some such and then running /sbin/lilo. Exit, Exit, Reboot and all was fine again. regards, Richard. So...load away. Mark Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] defrag and linux
On Wed, 2002-09-04 at 03:51, Mark Weaver wrote: Albert Charron wrote: I know there is a problem with the defrag tool on WinME. The problem is resolved with a patch download (though windows update). The problem is not just related to dualboot. In fact, the defrag utility (if not patched) can break your boot partition (even if it's a windows partition). I don't know if this thread is related exactly to this issue nor I can test it (I use Windows ME/XP and Linux on seperated machines). O, it's quite related, although you're likely going to be drawn and quartered at sunrise for propogating windows knowledge on a Mandrake Linux list. ';) Mark Well at the risk of being drawn and quartered, note that you can download a free version of Diskkeeper for 98/ME which will defrag your FAT32 partition in a fraction of the time compared with the garbage in W$ and probably with less likelihood of trashing your linux setup. HTH Brian Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] defrag and linux
Brian Parish wrote: On Wed, 2002-09-04 at 03:51, Mark Weaver wrote: Albert Charron wrote: I know there is a problem with the defrag tool on WinME. The problem is resolved with a patch download (though windows update). The problem is not just related to dualboot. In fact, the defrag utility (if not patched) can break your boot partition (even if it's a windows partition). I don't know if this thread is related exactly to this issue nor I can test it (I use Windows ME/XP and Linux on seperated machines). O, it's quite related, although you're likely going to be drawn and quartered at sunrise for propogating windows knowledge on a Mandrake Linux list. ';) Mark Well at the risk of being drawn and quartered, note that you can download a free version of Diskkeeper for 98/ME which will defrag your FAT32 partition in a fraction of the time compared with the garbage in W$ and probably with less likelihood of trashing your linux setup. HTH Brian HI Brian, I'll have to look into that. I know someone who could really put that to good use. However, for my windows machines I've fallen in love with the Norton System Works 2002. There's a disk utility on there, I think it's called Speed Disk, that really makes short work of a defrag. My workstation at work is a Win2K box with a 20GB drive and the thing was finished with it in 20 minutes. 'Bout knock me for a loop when I came back to my office and found it finished after running an early morning errand. Mark Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] defrag and linux
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Tuesday 03 September 2002 10:24 am, Albert Charron did speak unto the huddled masses, saying: I know there is a problem with the defrag tool on WinME. The problem is ME, from start to end, is the worst POS ever created... - -- Everyone seems so impatient and angry these days. I think it's because so many people use Windows at work. Do you think you'd be Mr. Politeness Man after working on Windows 8 hrs. or more? shane Profile at: http://dmoz.org/profiles/shen.html Proud to be a DMOZ editor since 10-98 Mandrake Users Club Member http://www.linux-mandrake.com/en/club/ Registered linux user #101606 http://counter.li.org/ -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.0.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org iD8DBQE9dXggBwq+ZwvIN/oRAtYSAJ9wfOgR7ZnkYNXo/Gfvft1r93kHxgCfaRj2 DoS1Ah+Xz7SLXJX/0UdcsM0= =bGp1 -END PGP SIGNATURE- Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
[newbie] defrag and linux
dear all, i have a laptop with a winME partition and a linuxM (8.2) partition, they lived and grown up without problem until when i decided to make a defrag of the windows partition, this cause a big problem to linux, at booting it faced a kernel panic, not being able ti find the INIT. it happened on another laptop in my lab, so the question is: how that winblows can make problem to the linux partition? and also, how can i defrag that partition, without causing problem at the linux's one?\ thank u daniele -- Dr Daniele de Sanctis, PhD student Homo sum humani nil alienum a me puto -|-- X-ray Structural Biology Unit (B2) | phone and fax ++ 39 010 5737306 Advanced Biotechnology Center (CBA) | e-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] Largo Rosanna Benzi 10 | web http://alcor.ge.infm.it/daniele.htm 16132 Genova - Italy | -|-- Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] defrag and linux
This is a multi-part message in MIME format... =_1030981495-3326-399 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit dear all, i have a laptop with a winME partition and a linuxM (8.2) partition, they lived and grown up without problem until when i decided to make a defrag of the windows partition, this cause a big problem to linux, at Ouch - was this prior to install? Maybe you hit the wrong partition. Linux partitions don't need to be defragging, and if yuu had a linux on a windows partition (but then Mandrake doesn't support this) then defragging would indeed cause problems. The physical location of your kernel is stored in the boot sector someplace, and that means anytime you replace it, or move it around (which defragging would do) yuou need to rerun the lilo / grub programs. daniele Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Defrag, Scandisk utilities on linux?
Arik Ashepa wrote: are there any? Arik Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://wwwmandrakestorecom It depends on the filesystem for defrag Reiser, XFS, ext2 and ext3 hardly need them because they set up files in such a way that fragmentation is kept very low (Look on the expert list archives for my article on this) JFS does have a defrag, and there is an old one for ext2 which worked usefully with the ext filesystem, but was hardly worth running with ext2 (no speed gain) All have a scandisk which has the generic name fsck (filesystems check) Some of these are very very very quick, like 10 G in 3 seconds because they write a journal of what they are doing and simply play it back until it doesn't match, which is where they know it was left off (The journal is written to disk ahead of the actual disk operation) Ext2 can take a while to do an fsck, but the fact that it scatters superblocks across the partition in which it is defined usually assures that glitches can be rebuilt without serious data loss Yes, even if the master superblock is corrupted, there are several backups ext3, XFS, Reiserfs, and JFS are called journaling filesystems and they have fairly high data integrity and fast rebuild times except for ext3, they are rather fast on everyday applications ext2 is an older filesystem equal in speed to journaling filesystems or even a bit faster in some circumstances Its major slowness is in rebuilding a big partition All 5 filesystems are built for facilitating the design and implementation of high security, and only JFS really allows fragmentation to occur My ext2 partitions have something like 17% fragmentation on the average and seem to hang right there regardless of how many files I add or take away With really radical test programs (forming and resizing 100,000 tinu files 2k to 10k in size, I managed to push fragmentation up to 313% but then it dropped when I deleted those contrived files Civileme Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://wwwmandrakestorecom
[newbie] Defrag, Scandisk utilities on linux?
are there any? Arik Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://wwwmandrakestorecom
Re: [newbie] Defrag, Scandisk utilities on linux?
You don't need to defrag as fragmentation ain't a problem with a REAL filesystem As for Scandisk - fsck is the equivalent There are various flavors depending on which fs you are running man fsck will get you started HTH Brian On Sun, 2001-03-04 at 23:22, Arik Ashepa wrote: are there any? Arik Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://wwwmandrakestorecom Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://wwwmandrakestorecom
Re: [newbie] defrag in Linux?
On Fri, 23 Feb 2001 15:36, Tom Brinkman wrote: On Thursday 22 February 2001 08:35 pm, Mark Weaver wrote: Ryan Le Gros wrote: the way the linux file system works keeps your drive defragmented at all times. thats one of the reasons its absolutely vital that you shut your machine down properly. Not if you're running with ReiserFS. :) I don't know if I'll ever go back to ext2. Not that there's anything wrong with it..its just that Reiser is...Well, one day the power went out while I was running and when it came back on the comp came back up and never missed a beat. At that moment I was sold on ReiserFS. hehehe, first time i used ReiserFS, shortly after the install I hit the power off button on purpose. Didn't even blink an eye while rebooting ;) Been using Rfs since last summer with no problems http://oss.software.ibm.com/developerworks/opensource/jfs/?dwzone=op ensource looks like an up'an comer tho too. Ext3 should be finished soon as well, with suport in Kernel 2.4 to follow soon afterward. However, this appears to be basically Ext2 with journalling support and a few extras. ReiserFS, on the other hand, was written from the ground-up with journalling. To add to this, it has some other truly great features that most people seem to forget in the euphoria of getting journalling. Unlike most filesystems (Ext2 included), ReiserFS does *not* have clusters, which makes it *very* space-efficient and much quicker. I used to hate the idea of cluster waste eating up precious hard drive resources - but not any more. -- Sridhar Dhanapalan. "There are two major products that come from Berkeley: LSD and UNIX. We don't believe this to be a coincidence." -- Jeremy S. Anderson
RE: [newbie] defrag in Linux?
Can you tell us newbies a little bit more about reiser, particularly, was it difficult to configure/set up? Also, If I share a drive with win on another partition, can I switch to reiser? I'm going to look it up now, but I was interested in your subjected opinion of it. -Paul R -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Mark Weaver Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2001 11:36 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [newbie] defrag in Linux? Ryan Le Gros wrote: the way the linux file system works keeps your drive defragmented at all times. thats one of the reasons its absolutely vital that you shut your machine down properly. Not if you're running with ReiserFS. :) I don't know if I'll ever go back to ext2. Not that there's anything wrong with it..its just that Reiser is...Well, one day the power went out while I was running and when it came back on the comp came back up and never missed a beat. At that moment I was sold on ReiserFS. -- Mark "If you don't share your concepts and ideals, they end up being worthless," "Sharing is what makes them powerful." _ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
Re: [newbie] defrag in Linux?
I'm still a newbie myself, so I can't tell you all about reisersf. There is a web site where you can read up on it at http://www.namesys.com. When my tinkering with changes and updates hosed my system, I took advantage of the new install to restructure my partitions. You are given the option during the install to run diskdrake in the expert mode. You can select the type of file system you want (i.e. vfat, ext2, reiserfs etc.). I opted to go with reiserfs on all my former ext2 partitions. I also tried the dreaded power reset button just to see for myself if recovery is all it is said to be. It made a beliver out of me, and you won't find me going back. Barry :-) Paul Rodrguez wrote: Can you tell us newbies a little bit more about reiser, particularly, was it difficult to configure/set up? Also, If I share a drive with win on another partition, can I switch to reiser? I'm going to look it up now, but I was interested in your subjected opinion of it. -Paul R -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Mark Weaver Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2001 11:36 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [newbie] defrag in Linux? Ryan Le Gros wrote: the way the linux file system works keeps your drive defragmented at all times. thats one of the reasons its absolutely vital that you shut your machine down properly. Not if you're running with ReiserFS. :) I don't know if I'll ever go back to ext2. Not that there's anything wrong with it..its just that Reiser is...Well, one day the power went out while I was running and when it came back on the comp came back up and never missed a beat. At that moment I was sold on ReiserFS. -- Mark "If you don't share your concepts and ideals, they end up being worthless," "Sharing is what makes them powerful." _ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
Re: [newbie] defrag in Linux?
ReiserFS is generaly better than Ext2 in almost every way. I, particular, it is faster, more space-efficient (no clusters!) and more crash-tolerant (since it journals). ReiserFS is set up just like any Ext2 partition. Formatting a Reiser partition will erase all data on it. Make sure you kernel supports ReiserFS (Mandrake kernels from Mandrake 7.1 onward do). Of course, you will need to modify your /etc/fstab for the new partition to be mounted at boot. Windos cannot read ReiserFS at all, so if you need Windos keep a spare FAT or NTFS partition. More information on ReiserFS can be found at http://www.namesys.com. On Sat, 24 Feb 2001 02:43, Paul Rodrguez wrote: Can you tell us newbies a little bit more about reiser, particularly, was it difficult to configure/set up? Also, If I share a drive with win on another partition, can I switch to reiser? I'm going to look it up now, but I was interested in your subjected opinion of it. -Paul R -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Mark Weaver Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2001 11:36 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [newbie] defrag in Linux? Ryan Le Gros wrote: the way the linux file system works keeps your drive defragmented at all times. thats one of the reasons its absolutely vital that you shut your machine down properly. Not if you're running with ReiserFS. :) I don't know if I'll ever go back to ext2. Not that there's anything wrong with it..its just that Reiser is...Well, one day the power went out while I was running and when it came back on the comp came back up and never missed a beat. At that moment I was sold on ReiserFS. -- Mark "If you don't share your concepts and ideals, they end up being worthless," "Sharing is what makes them powerful." _ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com -- Sridhar Dhanapalan. "There are two major products that come from Berkeley: LSD and UNIX. We don't believe this to be a coincidence." -- Jeremy S. Anderson
Re: [newbie] defrag in Linux?
- Original Message - From: "John David Molina" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, February 21, 2001 9:27 AM Subject: Re: [newbie] defrag in Linux? El Martes 20 Febrero 2001 11:39, escribiste: - Windows is a virus. - I disagree. Virus DO something right. ;-) Also, virus run useing minimal resources and with tidy and efficiant code. Windows runs with all resources available and then some, and has bloted 500 meg of stuff in its directory. -- John David Molina
Re: [newbie] defrag in Linux?
On Thursday 22 February 2001 08:35 pm, Mark Weaver wrote: Ryan Le Gros wrote: the way the linux file system works keeps your drive defragmented at all times. thats one of the reasons its absolutely vital that you shut your machine down properly. Not if you're running with ReiserFS. :) I don't know if I'll ever go back to ext2. Not that there's anything wrong with it..its just that Reiser is...Well, one day the power went out while I was running and when it came back on the comp came back up and never missed a beat. At that moment I was sold on ReiserFS. hehehe, first time i used ReiserFS, shortly after the install I hit the power off button on purpose. Didn't even blink an eye while rebooting ;) Been using Rfs since last summer with no problems http://oss.software.ibm.com/developerworks/opensource/jfs/?dwzone=opensource looks like an up'an comer tho too. -- Dale Earnhardt, the greatest stock car driver ever. Tom Brinkman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Galveston Bay
Re: [newbie] defrag in Linux?
El Martes 20 Febrero 2001 11:39, escribiste: - Windows is a virus. - I disagree. Virus DO something right. ;-) -- John David Molina
Re: [newbie] defrag in Linux?
the way the linux file system works keeps your drive defragmented at all times. thats one of the reasons its absolutely vital that you shut your machine down properly. Ryan Le Gros - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, February 20, 2001 6:39 AM Subject: [newbie] defrag in Linux? Is there a function (or need) to defrag hard drive(s) under Linux? - Windows is a virus. -
Re: [newbie] defrag in Linux?
The command is e2fsck. Generally there's no need to invoke this, as most Linux distributions are set up to run every 20th boot up or so. Check the man pages on how to use it. Anthony [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Is there a function (or need) to defrag hard drive(s) under Linux? - Windows is a virus. -
RE: [newbie] defrag in Linux?
no need to !! -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: February 20, 2001 10:40 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject:[newbie] defrag in Linux? Is there a function (or need) to defrag hard drive(s) under Linux? - Windows is a virus. - application/ms-tnef
Re: [newbie] defrag in Linux?
this seems like an opportune moment to ask about defragging of win partitions in linux, after encoding a lot of mp3s in linux simultaneously i noticed that when in win and running defrag that my mp3 partition (vfat) was majorly defragmented in a fashion that suggested that each successive cluster belonged to a different file than the one before, after defragging i got far fewer hiccups in playing mp3s both in win and linux esp. when doing other disk intensive activity, the point - is there a way to manually defrag a win drive from linux, i'm guessing that fsck doesn't take care of this? bascule On Tuesday 20 February 2001 10:33 pm, Romanator wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Is there a function (or need) to defrag hard drive(s) under Linux? - Windows is a virus. - Defrag is not need in Linux -- Roman Registered Linux User #179293 The Tux email thread creator
Re: [newbie] defrag in Linux?
E2fsck is more like Windos Scandisc than Defrag, in that it finds and fixes errors (it does not defragment). Linux filesystems (namely Ext2, Ext3 and ReiserFS) are structured so that defragmenting is totally unnecessary. When you run e2fsck on an Ext2 partition, it gives its fragmentation status as a percentage (non-contiguous files). I have never had more than 3% with this. With FAT32 or NTFS this level of defragmentation is nearly impossible to achieve, and even if it was it would not be held for very long. On Wed, 21 Feb 2001 03:05, Anthony wrote: The command is e2fsck. Generally there's no need to invoke this, as most Linux distributions are set up to run every 20th boot up or so. Check the man pages on how to use it. Anthony [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Is there a function (or need) to defrag hard drive(s) under Linux? - Windows is a virus. - -- Sridhar Dhanapalan. "There are two major products that come from Berkeley: LSD and UNIX. We don't believe this to be a coincidence." -- Jeremy S. Anderson
[newbie] Defrag problem during installation
Hello, I just got Mandrake 7.2 and I'm trying to install it in a dual boot with Win98. Using the "recommended" option, and asking it to preserve windows, I get a error message which says my disk (one windows partion with about 4 gigs of free space) is too fragmented. I used the Windows defrag utility twice and also a program called PerfectDisk with the same result. Ideas? Abhishek Roy __ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/
Re: [newbie] Defrag
On Monday 04 December 2000 08:53, you wrote: Jeff Dickman wrote: This is probably me just being obsessive... Does Mandrake have a defrag program? -JD- Here we go again! NO! - Shouldn't be needed. Search through the archives for this list - there is/are a myriad* explanations as to why. Cheers *(Gr, myrias,myriados, myria, ten thousand, innumerable.) http://www.mail-archive.com/expert@linux-mandrake.com/msg17753.html Civileme
Re: [newbie] Defrag
Jeff Dickman wrote: This is probably me just being obsessive... Does Mandrake have a defrag program? -JD- Here we go again! NO! - Shouldn't be needed. Search through the archives for this list - there is/are a myriad* explanations as to why. Cheers *(Gr, myrias,myriados, myria, ten thousand, innumerable.) -- ICQ#: 89345394 Mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] "The number of UNIX installations has grown to 10, with more expected" (The UNIX Programmer's Manual, 2nd Edition, June 1972.)
[newbie] Defrag
This is probably me just being obsessive... Does Mandrake have a defrag program? -JD-
Re: [newbie] Defrag
On Sun, 3 Dec 2000, Jeff Dickman wrote: This is probably me just being obsessive... Does Mandrake have a defrag program? Yes and no. The file system is so smartly built that it fixes defragging by itself, on the fly, in background. You need not do anything for it. Paul -- We are Microsoft of Borg. You will be assimilated. Resistance is - Fatal exception error in MSBORG32.DLL http://nlpagan.net - ICQ 147208 - Registered Linux User 174403 Linux Mandrake 7.2 - Pine 4.30
Re: [newbie] Defrag
ext2, which is Linux's standard filesystem, does not need a defrag programme. Neither does ReiserFS, which comes with Mandrake as an alternative to ext2. Only inefficient filesystems like M$ FAT and NTFS need to be defragged. A Linux defragmenter does exist, but it was designed for the older ext filesystem, which ext2 replaced. Using this on an ext2 or ReiserFS partition will not really prouce much of a performance gain, and may in fact corrupt your data. On Mon, 4 Dec 2000 14:16, Jeff Dickman wrote: This is probably me just being obsessive... Does Mandrake have a defrag program? -JD- -- Sridhar Dhanapalan. Your mouse has moved. Windows must be rebooted to acknowledge this change.
