Re: newbie

[Eric & Amy]

I took a good image that I have used in basilisk and vmac and "wrote" it to
the drive using a disk utility.
Something must have been lost in the translation.

- Original Message - 
From: "Allan Hunter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Vintage Macs" 
Sent: Thursday, May 05, 2005 2:28 PM
Subject: Re: newbie


> What do you mean when you say it "has a image on it w/ system 7.3 or
> something like that"?
>
> What, literally, is on the external drive?  Does it have the
> diskimage copied to it?  (that won't work).  Or did you (or someone
> else) take the diskimage and install it to the hard drive? (that
> should work).
>
> The SCSI chain may not be terminated properly with the internal drive
> totally unplugged.  Try plugging the ribbon cable back into the
> internal HD, but not the power cord.  That should terminate the chain
> but the internal drive won't actually spin up and cause problems.
>
>
>
> At 1:33 PM -0400 5/5/05, Eric & Amy wrote:
> >Ok i have my external SCSI drive formatted and it has a image on it w/
> >system 7.3 or something like that.
> >I disconnected the bad internal one and fired it up.
> >but instead of the blinking disk w/ the question mark on it,
> >now i get nothing.
> >
> >
> >
> >--
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> -- 
> Allan Hunter
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
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>
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Re: newbie

[Allan Hunter]

Shouldn't matter.  A Mac that can't find a bootable drive where it 
was expecting one will poll to see if it finds one elsewhere.  For 
example, if your System Folder is hosed and you attach a Zip drive 
with a bootable Zip cartridge and then power up your Mac, you'll 
normally see the beginnings of an attempted boot from the messed-up 
system, followed by a folder with the flashing question mark, 
followed after a moment or two by a smiling Mac and it then boots 
from the Zip.

A System Folder that's hosed in such a way that it crashes the Mac, 
or a drive that's screwed up on a hardware level, requires bypassing 
the normal bootup volume or drive, as in this case where the user was 
instructed to unplug the messed-up internal drive.  Normally this 
would cause the Mac to either sit dark for a moment or show the 
flashing questionmark folder, but then to switch to smiling Mac once 
it finds bootable media on the SCSI chain.


At 1:54 PM -0400 5/5/05, Chuck Underhill wrote:
Hi,
I think mopst likely the cause is that you didnt go into control panel
and switch your "startup disk". You might need to boot from floppy and
do that. :)

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Re: newbie

[Allan Hunter]

What do you mean when you say it "has a image on it w/ system 7.3 or 
something like that"?

What, literally, is on the external drive?  Does it have the 
diskimage copied to it?  (that won't work).  Or did you (or someone 
else) take the diskimage and install it to the hard drive? (that 
should work).

The SCSI chain may not be terminated properly with the internal drive 
totally unplugged.  Try plugging the ribbon cable back into the 
internal HD, but not the power cord.  That should terminate the chain 
but the internal drive won't actually spin up and cause problems.


At 1:33 PM -0400 5/5/05, Eric & Amy wrote:
Ok i have my external SCSI drive formatted and it has a image on it w/
system 7.3 or something like that.
I disconnected the bad internal one and fired it up.
but instead of the blinking disk w/ the question mark on it,
now i get nothing.

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Re: newbie

[Ken]

My Reply follows quote. On 05/05/2005 10:54 [EMAIL PROTECTED] said:  

>
>Hi,
>
>I think mopst likely the cause is that you didn't go into control
>panel and switch your "startup disk". You might need to boot from
>floppy and do that. :)
>
>Cheers!
>>-Original Message-
>>From: Vintage Macs [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf
>>Of Eric & Amy
>>Sent: Thursday, May 05, 2005 1:34 PM
>>To: Vintage Macs
>>Subject: Re: newbie
>>
>>Ok i have my external SCSI drive formatted and it has a image on it 
>>w/system 7.3 or something like that.
>>I disconnected the bad internal one and fired it up.
>>but instead of the blinking disk w/ the question mark on it,
>>now i get nothing.
---
Is the external SCSI drive properly terminated and the ID set
to something other than 7?

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Re: newbie

[Chuck Underhill]

Hi,

I think mopst likely the cause is that you didnt go into control panel
and switch your "startup disk". You might need to boot from floppy and
do that. :)

Cheers!
-Original Message-
From: Vintage Macs [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of
Eric & Amy
Sent: Thursday, May 05, 2005 1:34 PM
To: Vintage Macs
Subject: Re: newbie


Ok i have my external SCSI drive formatted and it has a image on it w/
system 7.3 or something like that.
I disconnected the bad internal one and fired it up.
but instead of the blinking disk w/ the question mark on it,
now i get nothing.



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Re: newbie

[Eric & Amy]

Ok i have my external SCSI drive formatted and it has a image on it w/
system 7.3 or something like that.
I disconnected the bad internal one and fired it up.
but instead of the blinking disk w/ the question mark on it,
now i get nothing.



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Re: newbie

[Manuel Marques]

Hey, I have a 5200/75 with that Cache/ROM DIMM problem. Would a 5260
board do the trick? I found out something on eBay but they only
shipped to USA, and I live in Portugal...

On 4/28/05, TVirkkala <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> The school district in my neck of the woods...
> 
> > Yeah, I've always wondered how much good equipment gets thrown away by
> > schools, or given to recycling centers by individual users. I'm sure
> > that there are people who even recyle their "old" 3 GHz computer when
> > they buy a new 3.2GHz one.
> >
> > I've made a couple of salvages from schools and individuals, you just
> > have to know who to contact, where to look, and what questions to ask.
> 
> ...is getting rid of all their Macs. I picked up quite a few Molars last
> year, not to mention 5xx0 AIOs. (Need any 5260 boards?)
> 
> I have free 5x0s for anyone who wants to pick them up in Southwest
> Washington.
> 
> I've been able to pick computers up at auction. The school gets rid of
> them cheap. And around here, there's only a limited Mac crowd, and they
> are giving away their oldies, buying new stuff. So every year until the
> Mac supply is gone I'll have new Old Macs. I don't have much competition,
> except for those LEMlisters here whom I remember to invite to the auctions
> (last year the auction was allegedly in the paper, but I never saw it, and
> didn't know its exact time or date until a few hours before the event).
> 
> Last year the school threw away a color laserprinter that was in perfect
> shape - until it was dropped on the floor in the holding room!
> 
> Aaaargh. It seems a shame. But progress is often marked by the carcasses
> at the side of the road we travel down, pell mell. Nicely, it's just old
> equipment, not the human dead, that our society puts aside so readily in
> the course of our onward push.
> 
> t
> 
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-
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Re: newbie

[Gregg Eshelman]

--- Allan Hunter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> At 10:29 AM -0400 5/1/05, Eric & Amy wrote:
> >Is there any way to prepare the drive under windows
> to boot up the LCIII.



> I suppose it *might* be possible to format the drive
> HFS and then 
> boot up Basilisk (Mac emulator) and then use the
> emulator running 
> System  7 to install System 7 to the drive -- ??

I've formatted IDE drives to HFS, using Basilisk 2
under Win98SE, but I don't recall booting off one.
Might have tried it once to see if it'd work.

It should be possible to do the same with a SCSI
controller and drive, then move the drive to a Mac.

An alternate option is to create a disk image for
use with Basilisk 2 then install the System to it,
then connect up a formatted SCSI drive and copy all
the contents of the disk image to the real drive.

Nero Burning ROM can create bootable Mac CD-ROMs
from Basilisk 2 disk images, as long as the image
is small enough to fit on a CD-R. Nero will also
burn HFS volumes directly from SCSI hard drives.

Yet another way is to use a large capacity removable
media drive (like a Zip 100) with Basilisk 2.
Install a System or Mac OS to a disk then use that
disk in the same type of drive connected to the Mac.
I've used an external SCSI Zip 100 that way several
times.

It will be total Fandemonium, Summer 2005!
Check website for further info.
http://www.fandemonium.org

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Re: newbie

[NODEraser]

Unless you happen to have a Windows server at your house, you'd also
have to buy a SCSI controller, and then an adapter to get you down to
50-pin narrow.

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Re: newbie

[Mark Benson]

On 1 May 2005, at 19:20, Allan Hunter wrote:
Not really.  Or at least not effectively.
I mean, with some 3rd party utilities you *can* format the drive as  
HFS, which is necessary for a Mac-bootable drive; but you can't  
then go onwards to install the Mac operating system.

And since that means that you have to boot your Mac from some other  
media (floppy, installation CDROM, etc) to install the OS, at which  
point you could format the drive as HFS on the Mac, being able to  
do that part from a PC doesn't save you much.

I suppose it *might* be possible to format the drive HFS and then  
boot up Basilisk (Mac emulator) and then use the emulator running  
System  7 to install System 7 to the drive -- ??

It's a non-simple operation at best.  It would be like installing a  
bootable Windows 95 to a disk using on the MacOS.  Formatting the  
disk as FAT-32 would only be the beginning.

You can get utilities for Windows that will write Mac disk images to  
1.4MB floppies however. I don't know the specifics cause I started  
68k Mac-ing with a 7500 on standby to do all that for me. I have done  
it though but it was along time ago. The name HFSExplorer rings a  
bell somewhere.

--
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Re: newbie

[Allan Hunter]

At 10:29 AM -0400 5/1/05, Eric & Amy wrote:
Is there any way to prepare the drive under windows to boot up the LCIII.

Not really.  Or at least not effectively.
I mean, with some 3rd party utilities you *can* format the drive as 
HFS, which is necessary for a Mac-bootable drive; but you can't then 
go onwards to install the Mac operating system.

And since that means that you have to boot your Mac from some other 
media (floppy, installation CDROM, etc) to install the OS, at which 
point you could format the drive as HFS on the Mac, being able to do 
that part from a PC doesn't save you much.

I suppose it *might* be possible to format the drive HFS and then 
boot up Basilisk (Mac emulator) and then use the emulator running 
System  7 to install System 7 to the drive -- ??

It's a non-simple operation at best.  It would be like installing a 
bootable Windows 95 to a disk using on the MacOS.  Formatting the 
disk as FAT-32 would only be the beginning.

--
Allan Hunter
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

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Re: newbie

[Eric & Amy]

Is there any way to prepare the drive under windows to boot up the LCIII.


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Re: newbie

[Gregg Eshelman]

--- Mark Benson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Well you learn something new every day I guess, but
> the fact that it  
> does nasty things to the RAM contents makes me even
> less likely to  
> want to use it. I still stand by the fact it slowed
> down any Mac I  
> ever used it on and also made it less stable,
> chronically so in 7.5.

On Macs that I've used RAM Doubler on, I turned the
compression OFF so it was only using the virtual
memory function, which is better than Apple's. Then
I'd also run RAM Charger 8.1 because it's a far
better memory manager than what was built into the
System or Mac OS.

It will be total Fandemonium, Summer 2005!
Check website for further info.
http://www.fandemonium.org

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Re: newbie

[Mark Benson]

On 27 Apr 2005, at 12:53, Liam Proven wrote:
Are you getting a bit confused here? Sounds to me like you're muddling
RAMdoubler and virtual memory.
RAMdoubler uses Zip-style compression on the contents of memory; it
doesn't copy stuff to and from disk. Essentially, it compresses the
contents of those bits of memory that belong to programs which aren't
currently executing. It's an /alternative/ to virtual memory, which
moves unused stuff in memory out onto disk.
I use RAMdoubler on my Classic II under MacOS 7.6.1. 761 requires 12MB
of RAM and a Classic II can only take up to 10MB, so without some
assistance, it's not terribly stable and you can't run much. With
RAMdoubler, the machine thinks it has 20MB and is fine - and faster
than when using VM.
Well you learn something new every day I guess, but the fact that it  
does nasty things to the RAM contents makes me even less likely to  
want to use it. I still stand by the fact it slowed down any Mac I  
ever used it on and also made it less stable, chronically so in 7.5.

--
Mark Benson
AIM - SilValleyPirate
MSN - [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: newbie

[Stephen Conrad]

H, my 5260 won't boot and I think its because the kitties knocked
the KB off the top and it hit the cord for the external HDs. Would
that require a new board inside?

Steve

On 4/29/05, NODEraser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Define SW Washington... I'm in Portland, and might have room for a
> spare Mac. That is, if the masters of my storage space will put up
> with something else in my old room.
> 
> On 4/28/05, TVirkkala <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > The school district in my neck of the woods...
> >
> > > Yeah, I've always wondered how much good equipment gets thrown away by
> > > schools, or given to recycling centers by individual users. I'm sure
> > > that there are people who even recyle their "old" 3 GHz computer when
> > > they buy a new 3.2GHz one.
> > >
> > > I've made a couple of salvages from schools and individuals, you just
> > > have to know who to contact, where to look, and what questions to ask.
> >
> > ...is getting rid of all their Macs. I picked up quite a few Molars last
> > year, not to mention 5xx0 AIOs. (Need any 5260 boards?)
> >
> > I have free 5x0s for anyone who wants to pick them up in Southwest
> > Washington.
> >
> > I've been able to pick computers up at auction. The school gets rid of
> > them cheap. And around here, there's only a limited Mac crowd, and they
> > are giving away their oldies, buying new stuff. So every year until the
> > Mac supply is gone I'll have new Old Macs. I don't have much competition,
> > except for those LEMlisters here whom I remember to invite to the auctions
> > (last year the auction was allegedly in the paper, but I never saw it, and
> > didn't know its exact time or date until a few hours before the event).
> >
> > Last year the school threw away a color laserprinter that was in perfect
> > shape - until it was dropped on the floor in the holding room!
> >
> > Aaaargh. It seems a shame. But progress is often marked by the carcasses
> > at the side of the road we travel down, pell mell. Nicely, it's just old
> > equipment, not the human dead, that our society puts aside so readily in
> > the course of our onward push.
> >
> > t
> >
> > --
> > Vintage Macs is sponsored by  and...
> >
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Re: newbie

[NODEraser]

Define SW Washington... I'm in Portland, and might have room for a
spare Mac. That is, if the masters of my storage space will put up
with something else in my old room.

On 4/28/05, TVirkkala <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> The school district in my neck of the woods...
> 
> > Yeah, I've always wondered how much good equipment gets thrown away by
> > schools, or given to recycling centers by individual users. I'm sure
> > that there are people who even recyle their "old" 3 GHz computer when
> > they buy a new 3.2GHz one.
> >
> > I've made a couple of salvages from schools and individuals, you just
> > have to know who to contact, where to look, and what questions to ask.
> 
> ...is getting rid of all their Macs. I picked up quite a few Molars last
> year, not to mention 5xx0 AIOs. (Need any 5260 boards?)
> 
> I have free 5x0s for anyone who wants to pick them up in Southwest
> Washington.
> 
> I've been able to pick computers up at auction. The school gets rid of
> them cheap. And around here, there's only a limited Mac crowd, and they
> are giving away their oldies, buying new stuff. So every year until the
> Mac supply is gone I'll have new Old Macs. I don't have much competition,
> except for those LEMlisters here whom I remember to invite to the auctions
> (last year the auction was allegedly in the paper, but I never saw it, and
> didn't know its exact time or date until a few hours before the event).
> 
> Last year the school threw away a color laserprinter that was in perfect
> shape - until it was dropped on the floor in the holding room!
> 
> Aaaargh. It seems a shame. But progress is often marked by the carcasses
> at the side of the road we travel down, pell mell. Nicely, it's just old
> equipment, not the human dead, that our society puts aside so readily in
> the course of our onward push.
> 
> t
> 
> --
> Vintage Macs is sponsored by  and...
> 
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> -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299   |  Free iBook!   |
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Re: newbie

[TVirkkala]

The school district in my neck of the woods...
Yeah, I've always wondered how much good equipment gets thrown away by
schools, or given to recycling centers by individual users. I'm sure
that there are people who even recyle their "old" 3 GHz computer when
they buy a new 3.2GHz one.
I've made a couple of salvages from schools and individuals, you just
have to know who to contact, where to look, and what questions to ask.
...is getting rid of all their Macs. I picked up quite a few Molars last 
year, not to mention 5xx0 AIOs. (Need any 5260 boards?)

I have free 5x0s for anyone who wants to pick them up in Southwest 
Washington.

I've been able to pick computers up at auction. The school gets rid of 
them cheap. And around here, there's only a limited Mac crowd, and they 
are giving away their oldies, buying new stuff. So every year until the 
Mac supply is gone I'll have new Old Macs. I don't have much competition, 
except for those LEMlisters here whom I remember to invite to the auctions 
(last year the auction was allegedly in the paper, but I never saw it, and 
didn't know its exact time or date until a few hours before the event).

Last year the school threw away a color laserprinter that was in perfect 
shape - until it was dropped on the floor in the holding room!

Aaaargh. It seems a shame. But progress is often marked by the carcasses 
at the side of the road we travel down, pell mell. Nicely, it's just old 
equipment, not the human dead, that our society puts aside so readily in 
the course of our onward push.

t

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Re: newbie

[NODEraser]

Yeah, I've always wondered how much good equipment gets thrown away by
schools, or given to recycling centers by individual users. I'm sure
that there are people who even recyle their "old" 3 GHz computer when
they buy a new 3.2GHz one.

I've made a couple of salvages from schools and individuals, you just
have to know who to contact, where to look, and what questions to ask.

--
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Re: newbie

[Manuel Marques]

Gregg Eshelman wrote:
--- Manuel Marques <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
 

Oops. Well I THOUGHT there were there, but I dunno
if there is an updater from 7.0.1 to 7.1?
   

Apple has never released 7.1 for free and there is
no updater to convert 7.0.x to 7.1.
To get 7.1, you have to "find" it elsewhere. ¬_¬ ;)
It will be total Fandemonium, Summer 2005!
Check website for further info.
http://www.fandemonium.org
__
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com 

 

OK. Well I have a LCIII with system 7.1, but was pre-installed, and I 
got the computer from a university who wanted to destroy the computer 
(how come? the computer is fine!) and it is also the Portuguese version, 
so I can't help a lot. :(

Regards
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Re: newbie

[Gregg Eshelman]

--- Manuel Marques <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Oops. Well I THOUGHT there were there, but I dunno
> if there is an updater from 7.0.1 to 7.1?

Apple has never released 7.1 for free and there is
no updater to convert 7.0.x to 7.1.

To get 7.1, you have to "find" it elsewhere. ¬_¬ ;)

It will be total Fandemonium, Summer 2005!
Check website for further info.
http://www.fandemonium.org

__
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Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com 

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Re: newbie

[NODEraser]

The 40MB hard drive I've got has the following software on it:

Finder 6.1.7
System 6.0.7
HyperCard 2.1
MS Works 2.00b
MS Word 4

If anyone is interested in it, e-mail me off list at
[EMAIL PROTECTED] . I'd be willing to get it up for free (minus
shipping of course), unless you've got something to trade/offer in
return.

On 4/27/05, Manuel Marques <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Oops. Well I THOUGHT there were there, but I dunno if there is an updater
> from 7.0.1 to 7.1?
> 
> 
> Manuel Marques
> http://manuelmarque.no.sapo.pt/
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Vintage Macs [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of
> NODEraser
> Sent: quarta-feira, 27 de Abril de 2005 18:02
> To: Vintage Macs
> Subject: Re: newbie
> 
> I've found System 7.0.1 on the Apple site under English-North
> Ameirican, but no 7.1.
> 
> On 4/27/05, Arnel Tuazon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > On 4/27/05 3:04 AM, "Mark Benson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > > It's an old and long-played out argument. Some of us prefer 7.1 because
> > > it's smaller and much faster. You can add most of 7.5.3 or later
> > > features to it without trouble (I have several OS 8.1 extensions
> > > running fine under 7.1 on my IIci) if you have both OS's to hand (and
> > > as 7.5.3 is free then you should have). 7.1 is in the long run a much
> > > more efficient system version, especially with LCIIIs having such a low
> > > RAM ceiling, and does lack the ability to run later stuff if you don't
> > > mind shuffling extensions.
> >
> > So true. I tried both OSes on my IIsi and I'll stick to 7.1.  7.5.3 just
> > slowed down the whole thing and was quirky with some programs and this was
> > with my RAM maxed to 65MB.
> >
> > > I also tend to avoid RAM Doubler, yeh sure it's a neat idea, but it
> > > also drains valuable CPU time copying back and forth from RAM to disk
> > > and back, and if you have an original spec 40MB drive then your gonna
> > > see still more reduction.
> > >
> > Also correct.  Before my 64MB upgrade I only had 16MB and I tried RAM
> > doubler (because I was cheap).  It seemed to work like a charm until I
> > noticed some educational programs tended to crash every now and then
> (they'd
> > simply hang).  Once I removed RAMDoubler, everything worked great again.
> >
> >
> > --
> > Vintage Macs is sponsored by <http://lowendmac.com/> and...
> >
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> >
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> >
> 
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Re: newbie

[Manuel Marques]

Oops. Well I THOUGHT there were there, but I dunno if there is an updater
from 7.0.1 to 7.1?


Manuel Marques
http://manuelmarque.no.sapo.pt/


-Original Message-
From: Vintage Macs [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of
NODEraser
Sent: quarta-feira, 27 de Abril de 2005 18:02
To: Vintage Macs
Subject: Re: newbie

I've found System 7.0.1 on the Apple site under English-North
Ameirican, but no 7.1.

On 4/27/05, Arnel Tuazon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On 4/27/05 3:04 AM, "Mark Benson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > It's an old and long-played out argument. Some of us prefer 7.1 because
> > it's smaller and much faster. You can add most of 7.5.3 or later
> > features to it without trouble (I have several OS 8.1 extensions
> > running fine under 7.1 on my IIci) if you have both OS's to hand (and
> > as 7.5.3 is free then you should have). 7.1 is in the long run a much
> > more efficient system version, especially with LCIIIs having such a low
> > RAM ceiling, and does lack the ability to run later stuff if you don't
> > mind shuffling extensions.
>
> So true. I tried both OSes on my IIsi and I'll stick to 7.1.  7.5.3 just
> slowed down the whole thing and was quirky with some programs and this was
> with my RAM maxed to 65MB.
>
> > I also tend to avoid RAM Doubler, yeh sure it's a neat idea, but it
> > also drains valuable CPU time copying back and forth from RAM to disk
> > and back, and if you have an original spec 40MB drive then your gonna
> > see still more reduction.
> >
> Also correct.  Before my 64MB upgrade I only had 16MB and I tried RAM
> doubler (because I was cheap).  It seemed to work like a charm until I
> noticed some educational programs tended to crash every now and then
(they'd
> simply hang).  Once I removed RAMDoubler, everything worked great again.
>
>
> --
> Vintage Macs is sponsored by <http://lowendmac.com/> and...
>
> Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com   | Enter To Win A |
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Re: newbie

[vrstern]

If the original poster is not interested, I would be.  I have the exact 
same situation - a perfectly good LCIII with a dead HD.  I had a SCSI CD 
drive hooked up to it, but was still unable to get it to boot.  Maybe 
because I don't really know what I'm doing.  I also have a SCSI HD that I 
would like to access - at least to see what is on it.  Right now it is not 
set-up, but if anyone has any suggestions on what to do, I would appreciate it.

Also, if anyone is interested in the entire set-up, I would be happy to 
give it away (after I hopefully access the external drive).  The only catch 
is that it would have to be picked up in the greater Boston area.

Vanessa
At 01:03 PM 4/27/05, you wrote:
Did you ever find a hard drive? I have a 40MB one laying around, I
think it was pulled from an LC or Classic II. It's even got system and
some other stuff loaded on it, but I'd have to pop it in my LC to see
exactly what.
On 4/27/05, NODEraser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I've found System 7.0.1 on the Apple site under English-North
> Ameirican, but no 7.1.
>
> On 4/27/05, Arnel Tuazon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > On 4/27/05 3:04 AM, "Mark Benson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > > It's an old and long-played out argument. Some of us prefer 7.1 because
> > > it's smaller and much faster. You can add most of 7.5.3 or later
> > > features to it without trouble (I have several OS 8.1 extensions
> > > running fine under 7.1 on my IIci) if you have both OS's to hand (and
> > > as 7.5.3 is free then you should have). 7.1 is in the long run a much
> > > more efficient system version, especially with LCIIIs having such a low
> > > RAM ceiling, and does lack the ability to run later stuff if you don't
> > > mind shuffling extensions.
> >
> > So true. I tried both OSes on my IIsi and I'll stick to 7.1.  7.5.3 just
> > slowed down the whole thing and was quirky with some programs and 
this was
> > with my RAM maxed to 65MB.
> >
> > > I also tend to avoid RAM Doubler, yeh sure it's a neat idea, but it
> > > also drains valuable CPU time copying back and forth from RAM to disk
> > > and back, and if you have an original spec 40MB drive then your gonna
> > > see still more reduction.
> > >
> > Also correct.  Before my 64MB upgrade I only had 16MB and I tried RAM
> > doubler (because I was cheap).  It seemed to work like a charm until I
> > noticed some educational programs tended to crash every now and then 
(they'd
> > simply hang).  Once I removed RAMDoubler, everything worked great again.
> >
> >
> > --
> > Vintage Macs is sponsored by  and...
> >
> > Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com   | Enter To Win A |
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> >
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> > at 1-800-iPOD.COM
> > Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
> > www.1800ipod.com
> >
>
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Re: newbie

[NODEraser]

Did you ever find a hard drive? I have a 40MB one laying around, I
think it was pulled from an LC or Classic II. It's even got system and
some other stuff loaded on it, but I'd have to pop it in my LC to see
exactly what.

On 4/27/05, NODEraser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I've found System 7.0.1 on the Apple site under English-North
> Ameirican, but no 7.1.
> 
> On 4/27/05, Arnel Tuazon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > On 4/27/05 3:04 AM, "Mark Benson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > > It's an old and long-played out argument. Some of us prefer 7.1 because
> > > it's smaller and much faster. You can add most of 7.5.3 or later
> > > features to it without trouble (I have several OS 8.1 extensions
> > > running fine under 7.1 on my IIci) if you have both OS's to hand (and
> > > as 7.5.3 is free then you should have). 7.1 is in the long run a much
> > > more efficient system version, especially with LCIIIs having such a low
> > > RAM ceiling, and does lack the ability to run later stuff if you don't
> > > mind shuffling extensions.
> >
> > So true. I tried both OSes on my IIsi and I'll stick to 7.1.  7.5.3 just
> > slowed down the whole thing and was quirky with some programs and this was
> > with my RAM maxed to 65MB.
> >
> > > I also tend to avoid RAM Doubler, yeh sure it's a neat idea, but it
> > > also drains valuable CPU time copying back and forth from RAM to disk
> > > and back, and if you have an original spec 40MB drive then your gonna
> > > see still more reduction.
> > >
> > Also correct.  Before my 64MB upgrade I only had 16MB and I tried RAM
> > doubler (because I was cheap).  It seemed to work like a charm until I
> > noticed some educational programs tended to crash every now and then (they'd
> > simply hang).  Once I removed RAMDoubler, everything worked great again.
> >
> >
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Re: newbie

[NODEraser]

I've found System 7.0.1 on the Apple site under English-North
Ameirican, but no 7.1.

On 4/27/05, Arnel Tuazon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On 4/27/05 3:04 AM, "Mark Benson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 
> > It's an old and long-played out argument. Some of us prefer 7.1 because
> > it's smaller and much faster. You can add most of 7.5.3 or later
> > features to it without trouble (I have several OS 8.1 extensions
> > running fine under 7.1 on my IIci) if you have both OS's to hand (and
> > as 7.5.3 is free then you should have). 7.1 is in the long run a much
> > more efficient system version, especially with LCIIIs having such a low
> > RAM ceiling, and does lack the ability to run later stuff if you don't
> > mind shuffling extensions.
> 
> So true. I tried both OSes on my IIsi and I'll stick to 7.1.  7.5.3 just
> slowed down the whole thing and was quirky with some programs and this was
> with my RAM maxed to 65MB.
> 
> > I also tend to avoid RAM Doubler, yeh sure it's a neat idea, but it
> > also drains valuable CPU time copying back and forth from RAM to disk
> > and back, and if you have an original spec 40MB drive then your gonna
> > see still more reduction.
> >
> Also correct.  Before my 64MB upgrade I only had 16MB and I tried RAM
> doubler (because I was cheap).  It seemed to work like a charm until I
> noticed some educational programs tended to crash every now and then (they'd
> simply hang).  Once I removed RAMDoubler, everything worked great again.
> 
> 
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Re: newbie

[Arnel Tuazon]

On 4/27/05 3:04 AM, "Mark Benson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> It's an old and long-played out argument. Some of us prefer 7.1 because
> it's smaller and much faster. You can add most of 7.5.3 or later
> features to it without trouble (I have several OS 8.1 extensions
> running fine under 7.1 on my IIci) if you have both OS's to hand (and
> as 7.5.3 is free then you should have). 7.1 is in the long run a much
> more efficient system version, especially with LCIIIs having such a low
> RAM ceiling, and does lack the ability to run later stuff if you don't
> mind shuffling extensions.

So true. I tried both OSes on my IIsi and I'll stick to 7.1.  7.5.3 just
slowed down the whole thing and was quirky with some programs and this was
with my RAM maxed to 65MB.

> I also tend to avoid RAM Doubler, yeh sure it's a neat idea, but it
> also drains valuable CPU time copying back and forth from RAM to disk
> and back, and if you have an original spec 40MB drive then your gonna
> see still more reduction.
> 
Also correct.  Before my 64MB upgrade I only had 16MB and I tried RAM
doubler (because I was cheap).  It seemed to work like a charm until I
noticed some educational programs tended to crash every now and then (they'd
simply hang).  Once I removed RAMDoubler, everything worked great again.


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Re: newbie

[Manuel Marques]

I guess you can get some at Apple's website. (I found my 7.1
Portuguese System over there, check on English-North American Section.

I dunno what's the link, I've got it bookmarked at home. I'll send you later.

Regards

On 4/27/05, Eric & Amy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Where does one find floppies of System 7.1?
> 
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-- 
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-
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http://manuelmarque.no.sapo.pt

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Re: newbie

[Eric & Amy]

Where does one find floppies of System 7.1?

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Re: newbie

[Liam Proven]

On 4/27/05, Mark Benson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I also tend to avoid RAM Doubler, yeh sure it's a neat idea, but it
> also drains valuable CPU time copying back and forth from RAM to disk
> and back, and if you have an original spec 40MB drive then your gonna
> see still more reduction.

Are you getting a bit confused here? Sounds to me like you're muddling
RAMdoubler and virtual memory.

RAMdoubler uses Zip-style compression on the contents of memory; it
doesn't copy stuff to and from disk. Essentially, it compresses the
contents of those bits of memory that belong to programs which aren't
currently executing. It's an /alternative/ to virtual memory, which
moves unused stuff in memory out onto disk.

I use RAMdoubler on my Classic II under MacOS 7.6.1. 761 requires 12MB
of RAM and a Classic II can only take up to 10MB, so without some
assistance, it's not terribly stable and you can't run much. With
RAMdoubler, the machine thinks it has 20MB and is fine - and faster
than when using VM.

-- 
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Home: http://welcome.to/liamsweb * Blog: http://lproven.livejournal.com
AOL, Yahoo UK: liamproven * ICQ: 73187508 * MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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Re: newbie

[Gregg Eshelman]

--- Eric & Amy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I found a external SCSI drive, 40MB at a thrift shop
> that runs.
> Could this work instead, or do i need the internal
> one install first?

You can open up that external case and mount the drive
inside the LC III.

It will be total Fandemonium, Summer 2005!
Check website for further info.
http://www.fandemonium.org

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Re: newbie

[Mark Benson]

On 26 Apr 2005, at 15:46, Manuel Marques wrote:
I've got an LCIII running Mac OS 7.6.1 and it runs fine! But if you
want reliability, you can download System 7.5.3 from Apple's website
that it will run great! (of course I'm here talking, but my LCIII has
20 megs of RAM)
It's an old and long-played out argument. Some of us prefer 7.1 because 
it's smaller and much faster. You can add most of 7.5.3 or later 
features to it without trouble (I have several OS 8.1 extensions 
running fine under 7.1 on my IIci) if you have both OS's to hand (and 
as 7.5.3 is free then you should have). 7.1 is in the long run a much 
more efficient system version, especially with LCIIIs having such a low 
RAM ceiling, and does lack the ability to run later stuff if you don't 
mind shuffling extensions.

Admittedly if you are looking for an easy starter then 7.5.3 is free 
and available. To get the machine running it would be fine.

Simply 7.1 is not the best option, and
7.5.3 has much more, and runs fine on that 8 meg PM! You should then
get a copy of RAM Doubler (I could send you one, if you'd like).
I also tend to avoid RAM Doubler, yeh sure it's a neat idea, but it 
also drains valuable CPU time copying back and forth from RAM to disk 
and back, and if you have an original spec 40MB drive then your gonna 
see still more reduction.

7.5.3 does run 'fine' on 8MB of RAM but 7.1 runs 'fast' on 8MB RAM, and 
less. I personally stopped running 7.5 on my machines long ago. It's 
not particularly stable once you start doing real work on them, and 
what you gain in features are usually mostly superfluous or can be 
added simply to 7.1 by dropping the later extensions into the System 
Folder. In addition a lot of software that specifies it requires 7.5 or 
later is usually lying, you just need to add a few extensions to 7.1 
and it works fine. One of my neatest Tricks so far has been to copy the 
whole AppleShare and Networking structure from OS 8.1 to System 7.1 in 
order to gain AppleTalk over IP compatibility, works like a charm.

Oh and as a last note you will need System Enabler 003 to run 7.1 on an 
LCIII. This is also available 'out there' but I wasn't able to put a 
finger on exactly where. I'd guess Apple still have it on FTP in the 
same place as System 7.5.3, that's where I got my copy.

--
Mark Benson
AIM - SilValleyPirate
MSN - [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Visit FlatPackMacs online: 
Visit my Homepage: 
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trash!"

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Re: newbie

[Allan Hunter]

Well, it should be terminated, and set to a SCSI address other than 7 
(system controloler), other than 0 (typically the address of the 
internal SCSI drive), and in case you ever wish to add a CDROM drive, 
other than 3 (traditionally used for CD drives).  Aside from that, 
you shouldn't have to do anything per se to get the system to 
recognize the external one, if by "the system" you mean the hardware.

To get the OPERATING SYSTEM to recognize the drive, you need to 
format/initialize it.  With your internal HD hosed, the question 
becomes "What operating system?".  You can install System 7 to the 
external drive from another Mac if you have access to one; or, if you 
have or can borrow an external SCSI CDROM, you can boot from CD 
(Hmm...or at least I think you can.  Anyone know if an LC III will 
boot from a CD if a CDROM drive is attached and you hold down the "C" 
key?).

Otherwise, you need to have installation floppies.  The installation 
floppies for System 7 will include tools to format and initialize a 
drive, so you can boot from floppy and format the external hard disk 
and then install the OS onto it from floppies.

That's probably your most likely scenario.

At 7:11 PM -0400 4/26/05, Eric & Amy wrote:
Is there anything I have to do to get the system to recognize the external
one?
Eric
- Original Message -
From: "Allan Hunter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Vintage Macs" 
Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 2:00 PM
Subject: Re: newbie

 You can boot from an external SCSI drive.  Might have to unplug the
 messed-up internal one, if it's hanging the system.

 At 1:52 PM -0400 4/26/05, Eric & Amy wrote:
 >I found a external SCSI drive, 40MB at a thrift shop that runs.
 >Could this work instead, or do i need the internal one install first?
 >
 >Eric
 >- Original Message -
 >From: "Mark Benson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
 >To: "Vintage Macs" 
 >Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 7:52 AM
 >Subject: Re: newbie
 >
 >
 >>
 >>  On Tuesday, April 26, 2005, at 12:42PM, Eric & Amy
 ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
 >>
 >>  >Hello
 >>  >I am new to your world of older MAC's.
 >>  >My daughter recieved a LCIII from her grandmother who is a teacher.
 >>  >Her school upgraded to wintel machines and parted ways with thier
MAC's.
 >>  >This particular machine is in need of a hard drive replacement
though,
 >and I
 >>  >am at a loss on which drives would work.
 >>  >Any ideas?
 >>
 >>  Any 50-pin Narrow SCSI hard drive will drop straight in. SCSI
sometimes
 >requires a bit of Voodoo trickery to get working, but as long as the ID
is
 >not set to '7' (usually they are set to '0' on single drive Macs) and the
 >drive is terminated (usually a jumper or a pair of resistor packs) then
it
 >will work OK provided the drive itself is working.
 >>
 >>  The LCIII is a fairly robust machine generally speaking, if not the
 >fastest on the planet. I would recommend you try and acquire a copy of
 >System 7.1 on floppy disk as well as appropriate age copies of Claris
Works
 >(1.0 to 3.0 should run fine) or similar and it'll do great as a
typewriter.
 >>
 >>  --
 >>  Mark Benson
 >>
 >>  http://homepage.mac.com/markbenson
 >>
 >>  --
 >>  Vintage Macs is sponsored by <http://lowendmac.com/> and...
 >>
 >>   Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com   | Enter To Win A |
 >>   -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299   |  Free iBook!   |
 >>
 >>Support Low End Mac <http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html>
 >>
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 >>--> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
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Re: newbie

[Nat]

> From: "Eric & Amy" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Reply-To: "Vintage Macs" 
> Date: Tue, 26 Apr 2005 19:11:53 -0400
> To: "Vintage Macs" 
> Subject: Re: newbie
> 
> Is there anything I have to do to get the system to recognize the external
> one?
> 
> Eric

Just plug it in and make sure it's turned on before you turn on the
Macintosh.  And of course, make sure it is attached securely to the SCSI
port on your Mac.

If the drive is not formatted, not formatted for a Mac, or doesn't have an
OS installed, it still may not boot up.

In those cases, you'll need a boot disk with a copy of the program "Apple SC
HD Setup" or a similar hard-disk formatting utility and a set of Mac OS
System 7 installation disks.

-Nat


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Re: newbie

[Eric & Amy]

Is there anything I have to do to get the system to recognize the external
one?

Eric
- Original Message - 
From: "Allan Hunter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Vintage Macs" 
Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 2:00 PM
Subject: Re: newbie


> You can boot from an external SCSI drive.  Might have to unplug the
> messed-up internal one, if it's hanging the system.
>
>
>
> At 1:52 PM -0400 4/26/05, Eric & Amy wrote:
> >I found a external SCSI drive, 40MB at a thrift shop that runs.
> >Could this work instead, or do i need the internal one install first?
> >
> >Eric
> >- Original Message -
> >From: "Mark Benson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >To: "Vintage Macs" 
> >Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 7:52 AM
> >Subject: Re: newbie
> >
> >
> >>
> >>  On Tuesday, April 26, 2005, at 12:42PM, Eric & Amy
> ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >>
> >>  >Hello
> >>  >I am new to your world of older MAC's.
> >>  >My daughter recieved a LCIII from her grandmother who is a teacher.
> >>  >Her school upgraded to wintel machines and parted ways with thier
MAC's.
> >>  >This particular machine is in need of a hard drive replacement
though,
> >and I
> >>  >am at a loss on which drives would work.
> >>  >Any ideas?
> >>
> >>  Any 50-pin Narrow SCSI hard drive will drop straight in. SCSI
sometimes
> >requires a bit of Voodoo trickery to get working, but as long as the ID
is
> >not set to '7' (usually they are set to '0' on single drive Macs) and the
> >drive is terminated (usually a jumper or a pair of resistor packs) then
it
> >will work OK provided the drive itself is working.
> >>
> >>  The LCIII is a fairly robust machine generally speaking, if not the
> >fastest on the planet. I would recommend you try and acquire a copy of
> >System 7.1 on floppy disk as well as appropriate age copies of Claris
Works
> >(1.0 to 3.0 should run fine) or similar and it'll do great as a
typewriter.
> >>
> >>  --
> >>  Mark Benson
> >>
> >>  http://homepage.mac.com/markbenson
> >>
> >>  --
> >>  Vintage Macs is sponsored by <http://lowendmac.com/> and...
> >>
> >>   Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com   | Enter To Win A |
> >>   -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299   |  Free iBook!   |
> >>
> >>Support Low End Mac <http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html>
> >>
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Re: newbie

[Eric & Amy]

Lol yeah considering they went w/ Gateway machines.

- Original Message - 
From: "Ricardo L. A. Bánffy" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Vintage Macs" 
Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 4:54 PM
Subject: Re: newbie


> I wouldn't call that an upgrade ;-)
>
> Eric & Amy wrote:
> > Her school upgraded to wintel machines and parted ways with thier MAC's.
>
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Re: newbie

[Manuel Marques]

yeps. you're darn right!


Manuel Marques
http://manuelmarque.no.sapo.pt/


-Original Message-
From: Vintage Macs [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of
"Ricardo L. A. Bánffy"
Sent: terça-feira, 26 de Abril de 2005 21:55
To: Vintage Macs
Subject: Re: newbie

I wouldn't call that an upgrade ;-)

Eric & Amy wrote:
> Her school upgraded to wintel machines and parted ways with thier MAC's.

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Re: newbie

["Ricardo L. A. Bánffy"]

I wouldn't call that an upgrade ;-)

Eric & Amy wrote:
> Her school upgraded to wintel machines and parted ways with thier MAC's.

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Re: newbie

[Allan Hunter]

You can boot from an external SCSI drive.  Might have to unplug the 
messed-up internal one, if it's hanging the system.


At 1:52 PM -0400 4/26/05, Eric & Amy wrote:
I found a external SCSI drive, 40MB at a thrift shop that runs.
Could this work instead, or do i need the internal one install first?
Eric
- Original Message -
From: "Mark Benson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Vintage Macs" 
Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 7:52 AM
Subject: Re: newbie

 On Tuesday, April 26, 2005, at 12:42PM, Eric & Amy
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
 >Hello
 >I am new to your world of older MAC's.
 >My daughter recieved a LCIII from her grandmother who is a teacher.
 >Her school upgraded to wintel machines and parted ways with thier MAC's.
 >This particular machine is in need of a hard drive replacement though,
and I
 >am at a loss on which drives would work.
 >Any ideas?
 Any 50-pin Narrow SCSI hard drive will drop straight in. SCSI sometimes
requires a bit of Voodoo trickery to get working, but as long as the ID is
not set to '7' (usually they are set to '0' on single drive Macs) and the
drive is terminated (usually a jumper or a pair of resistor packs) then it
will work OK provided the drive itself is working.
 The LCIII is a fairly robust machine generally speaking, if not the
fastest on the planet. I would recommend you try and acquire a copy of
System 7.1 on floppy disk as well as appropriate age copies of Claris Works
(1.0 to 3.0 should run fine) or similar and it'll do great as a typewriter.
 --
 Mark Benson
 http://homepage.mac.com/markbenson
 --
 Vintage Macs is sponsored by <http://lowendmac.com/> and...
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Re: newbie

[Eric & Amy]

I found a external SCSI drive, 40MB at a thrift shop that runs.
Could this work instead, or do i need the internal one install first?

Eric
- Original Message - 
From: "Mark Benson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Vintage Macs" 
Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 7:52 AM
Subject: Re: newbie


>
> On Tuesday, April 26, 2005, at 12:42PM, Eric & Amy
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> >Hello
> >I am new to your world of older MAC's.
> >My daughter recieved a LCIII from her grandmother who is a teacher.
> >Her school upgraded to wintel machines and parted ways with thier MAC's.
> >This particular machine is in need of a hard drive replacement though,
and I
> >am at a loss on which drives would work.
> >Any ideas?
>
> Any 50-pin Narrow SCSI hard drive will drop straight in. SCSI sometimes
requires a bit of Voodoo trickery to get working, but as long as the ID is
not set to '7' (usually they are set to '0' on single drive Macs) and the
drive is terminated (usually a jumper or a pair of resistor packs) then it
will work OK provided the drive itself is working.
>
> The LCIII is a fairly robust machine generally speaking, if not the
fastest on the planet. I would recommend you try and acquire a copy of
System 7.1 on floppy disk as well as appropriate age copies of Claris Works
(1.0 to 3.0 should run fine) or similar and it'll do great as a typewriter.
>
> -- 
> Mark Benson
>
> http://homepage.mac.com/markbenson
>
> -- 
> Vintage Macs is sponsored by <http://lowendmac.com/> and...
>
>  Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com   | Enter To Win A |
>  -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299   |  Free iBook!   |
>
>   Support Low End Mac <http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html>
>
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Re: newbie

[Mark Benson]

 
On Tuesday, April 26, 2005, at 12:42PM, Eric & Amy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

>Hello
>I am new to your world of older MAC's.
>My daughter recieved a LCIII from her grandmother who is a teacher.
>Her school upgraded to wintel machines and parted ways with thier MAC's.
>This particular machine is in need of a hard drive replacement though, and I
>am at a loss on which drives would work.
>Any ideas?

Any 50-pin Narrow SCSI hard drive will drop straight in. SCSI sometimes 
requires a bit of Voodoo trickery to get working, but as long as the ID is not 
set to '7' (usually they are set to '0' on single drive Macs) and the drive is 
terminated (usually a jumper or a pair of resistor packs) then it will work OK 
provided the drive itself is working.

The LCIII is a fairly robust machine generally speaking, if not the fastest on 
the planet. I would recommend you try and acquire a copy of System 7.1 on 
floppy disk as well as appropriate age copies of Claris Works (1.0 to 3.0 
should run fine) or similar and it'll do great as a typewriter.

-- 
Mark Benson

http://homepage.mac.com/markbenson

-- 
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Re: Newbie: How to type an "at" on ADB keyboard?

[Byron Q. Desnoyers Winmill]

On Mon, Apr 12, 2004 at 02:51:15PM -0400, Robert Gray wrote:
> Check it out...go to the keyboard control panel, select "Swiss
> German", and de-select "U.S."  Then go to the Kez Caps utilitz.
> )Notice that some of the kezs have changed locations_=  Donät forget
> to switch the control panel back to zour standard U.S.  :-)

Of course, things get very messy when you don't stick to ASCII.
For example: "Don't" came up as "Don\xe4t" in my text editor (vi),
while it came up as 'Don\"{a}t' (to borrow the notation for LaTeX).
I thought that "'" was part of the ASCII standard (the least
significant 7 bits), so it shouldn't make much of a difference in
an international context -- or should I say a Western European and
North American context.  Pretty much anything goes for that eight
bit, but I suppose there isn't much you can do about that since it
is doubtful that the extra 128 characters could satisfy everybody.

But I'm curious about your use of "Kez Caps utilitz".  I'm fairly
certain that the keyboard layout control panel has nothing to do
with the language.  (At least my computer never spells certain
words the proper way if I switch from US to UK, and I can switch
to CSA for my CSA keyboards and it doesn't give me French.)

Byron.

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Re: Newbie: How to type an "at" on ADB keyboard?

[Robert Gray]

At 22:10:52 +0200 on 4/08/04, In-Hae Felton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

 How do I get an "@" on my SE 1/40 with ADB Keyboard?
ASCII (AMERICAN Standard Code for Information Interchange).  Not all
the world uses American standards.  Some countries even have a
different language.  ;-)  (Sarcasm directed at some of the previous
chauvinistic responses not at In-Hae.)  So it shouldn't surprise us
that keyboard layouts are not universal.
Check it out...go to the keyboard control panel, select "Swiss
German", and de-select "U.S."  Then go to the Kez Caps utilitz.
)Notice that some of the kezs have changed locations_=  Donät forget
to switch the control panel back to zour standard U.S.  :-)
In-Hae discovered on his/her own where the key was located.  As
others suggested, Key Caps allows for a quick and through exploration
of the character map.
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Re: Newbie: How to type an "at" on ADB keyboard?

[Gregg Eshelman]

--- Kim Il Sung <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Now *I'm* surprised. On all of my Macs it's option-*
> (asterisk). Did
> Apple then assign different key combinations for it
> on each keyboard
> (US, German, or, as mine, Swedish)? Then I
> understand why they
> made it option-2 on the new off-topic machines. I
> thought that was
> just another concession to WinDOS, but it seems that
> it really
> needed a fixed position for ALL keyboard layouts.

Dunno. But I can connect my ADB AppleDesign US
keyboard
into an ADB-USB adaptor then plug that into my PC
and it works just fine. :) I can also plug in an
ADB mouse but it's not too useful with only one
button. ;)

=
It's total Fandemonium!
http://www.fandemonium.org

__
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Tax Center - File online by April 15th
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html

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Re: Newbie: How to type an "at" on ADB keyboard?

[Kim Il Sung]

In-Hae Felton asked:

>> How do I get an "@" on my SE 1/40 with ADB Keyboard?
>> I've spent more than 20 Minutes on the web, but google did not turn up
>> any results.

got different replies:

Stefan Daehler:
>Option (ALT) + G.

Timothy Virkkala:
>@ = shift-2

and finally answered the question himself:

>Surprisingly the tips did not work, so I tried it again this morning.
>...and after a lot (!) of try-and-error only came up with
>Shift-Option-1 for the "@" sign. (?)

Now *I'm* surprised. On all of my Macs it's option-* (asterisk). Did
Apple then assign different key combinations for it on each keyboard
(US, German, or, as mine, Swedish)? Then I understand why they
made it option-2 on the new off-topic machines. I thought that was
just another concession to WinDOS, but it seems that it really
needed a fixed position for ALL keyboard layouts.

/Mikael


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Re: Newbie: How to type an "@" on ADB keyboard?

[In-Hae Felton]

Am 09.04.2004 um 08:47 schrieb Timothy Virkkala:

In-Hae Felton, you wrote:

I'm a bit embarrassed to ask, but:

How do I get an "@" on my SE 1/40 with ADB Keyboard?

I've spent more than 20 Minutes on the web, but google did not turn up
any results.
@ = shift-2

Doesn't your system have a keycaps control panel? Or did that come 
later?
Keycaps can show you everything you need.
Thanks for all your replys.

No, I am typing this under OS X on my PowerBook.
Networking (and Internet) does not work on our SE yet.
I did look for the keycaps control panel.
Our German system 7.1 did not have one, nor the old adb keyboard.
(yeah, I am really Germany even my name does not suggest so... :-)
Surprisingly the tips did not work, so I tried it again this morning.
...and after a lot (!) of try-and-error only came up with 
Shift-Option-1 for the "@" sign. (?)

I did not expect it to be different on these old machines.
Hey, the SE was not really built for internet and email.
regards,

In-Hae

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Re: Newbie: How to type an "@" on ADB keyboard?

[aedanmcghie]

On Apr 09, 2004, at 07:47, Timothy Virkkala wrote:

Keycaps can show you everything you need.
Or pick up the old freeware version of PopChar which is even better.

aedan

Look, let me explain something. I'm not Mr. Lebowski;  you're Mr. 
Lebowski. I'm the Dude.  So that's what  you  call me.  That, or Duder. 
His Dudeness.  Or El Duderino, if, you know, you're not into the whole 
brevity thing--



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Re: Newbie: How to type an "@" on ADB keyboard?

[Michael]

on 04/09/2004 12:13 AM, Timothy Virkkala at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> Stefan Daehler, you wrote:
> 
>> Option (ALT) + G.
> 
> That's a copyright sign... I had interpreted what he asked for as what he
> gave - undoubtedly pasted - from elsewhere
> 
> Maybe I missed the point?
> 
> t
>
 
ADB keyboard has no @ on the Keyboard. Like the old keyboard for a Plus.


   Michael


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Re: Newbie: How to type an "@" on ADB keyboard?

[Stefan Daehler]

Original Message:

>Stefan Daehler, you wrote:
>
>> Option (ALT) + G.
>
>That's a copyright sign... I had interpreted what he asked for as what he
>gave - undoubtedly pasted - from elsewhere
>
>Maybe I missed the point?


My mistake, I beg your pardon. 
Did not keep in mind the different keyboard-layout. I'm working on a 
Swiss-German system.

Steff

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Re: Newbie: How to type an "@" on ADB keyboard?

[Timothy Virkkala]

Stefan Daehler, you wrote:

> Option (ALT) + G.

That's a copyright sign... I had interpreted what he asked for as what he
gave - undoubtedly pasted - from elsewhere

Maybe I missed the point?

t


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Re: Newbie: How to type an "@" on ADB keyboard?

[Timothy Virkkala]

In-Hae Felton, you wrote:

> I'm a bit embarrassed to ask, but:
> 
> How do I get an "@" on my SE 1/40 with ADB Keyboard?
> 
> I've spent more than 20 Minutes on the web, but google did not turn up
> any results.

@ = shift-2

Doesn't your system have a keycaps control panel? Or did that come later?
Keycaps can show you everything you need. 


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Re: Newbie: How to type an "@" on ADB keyboard?

[Stefan Daehler]

Original Message:

I'm a bit embarrassed to ask, but:

How do I get an "@" on my SE 1/40 with ADB Keyboard?

I've spent more than 20 Minutes on the web, but google did not turn up 
any results.

Thanks so much.

In-Hae


Option (ALT) + G.

Cheers Steff

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