--- Ronn!Blankenship <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I keep thinking there ought to be ones that read "My
> kid is on academic
> probation at School X" or "My kid is on permanent
> detention at School X" . . .
I *have* seen a "My kid beat up your honor student!"
bumper sticker, at least twice. It
At 12:52 PM 8/31/03 -0500, Julia Thompson wrote:
Erik Reuter wrote:
>
> On Sun, Aug 31, 2003 at 09:34:45AM -0700, Doug Pensinger wrote:
>
> > So the parent was putting up the articles 'cause he was proud of his
> > son, why were you putting the loosing articles up?
>
> Fair and balanced reporting?
Julia Thompson wrote:
Erik Reuter wrote:
On Sun, Aug 31, 2003 at 09:34:45AM -0700, Doug Pensinger wrote:
So the parent was putting up the articles 'cause he was proud of his
son, why were you putting the loosing articles up?
Fair and balanced reporting?
If there's a limited amount of bulletin
At 12:52 PM 8/31/2003 -0500, you wrote:
Erik Reuter wrote:
>
> On Sun, Aug 31, 2003 at 09:34:45AM -0700, Doug Pensinger wrote:
>
> > So the parent was putting up the articles 'cause he was proud of his
> > son, why were you putting the loosing articles up?
>
> Fair and balanced reporting?
If there'
Erik Reuter wrote:
>
> On Sun, Aug 31, 2003 at 09:34:45AM -0700, Doug Pensinger wrote:
>
> > So the parent was putting up the articles 'cause he was proud of his
> > son, why were you putting the loosing articles up?
>
> Fair and balanced reporting?
If there's a limited amount of bulletin board
Kevin Tarr wrote:
Did anyone write a rebuttal? Was it obvious who posted the article?
Where I have worked, everything had to be pre-approved, with a set
posting date. Even if you were selling a car or announcing a co-worker
having a baby. Where I'm at now, there are no rules. Postings go up tha
At 12:49 AM 8/31/2003 -0500, you wrote:
At 09:21 PM 8/30/03 -0500, Julia Thompson wrote:
"Ronn!Blankenship" wrote:
>
> At one institution where I was filling in for their astronomy prof
while he
> was on sabbatical, someone had posted an article from some education
> newsletter on the bulletin boa
On Sun, Aug 31, 2003 at 09:34:45AM -0700, Doug Pensinger wrote:
> So the parent was putting up the articles 'cause he was proud of his
> son, why were you putting the loosing articles up?
Fair and balanced reporting?
--
Erik Reuter http://www.erikreuter.net/
__
"Ronn!Blankenship" wrote:
>
> At 09:21 PM 8/30/03 -0500, Julia Thompson wrote:
> >"Ronn!Blankenship" wrote:
> > >
> > > At one institution where I was filling in for their astronomy prof while he
> > > was on sabbatical, someone had posted an article from some education
> > > newsletter on the bul
At 09:21 PM 8/30/03 -0500, Julia Thompson wrote:
"Ronn!Blankenship" wrote:
>
> At one institution where I was filling in for their astronomy prof while he
> was on sabbatical, someone had posted an article from some education
> newsletter on the bulletin board in the faculty office area in which th
"Ronn!Blankenship" wrote:
>
> At one institution where I was filling in for their astronomy prof while he
> was on sabbatical, someone had posted an article from some education
> newsletter on the bulletin board in the faculty office area in which the
> author explained why it was inconceivable th
At 10:11 AM 8/30/03 -0500, Julia Thompson wrote:
William T Goodall wrote:
>
> On Friday, August 29, 2003, at 09:34 pm, Kevin Tarr wrote:
>
> > (I know, English isn't his first language)(And I'm not assuming he is
> > Democrat, but 41 percent of the other teacher's failed and I'd lay
> > odds that
William T Goodall wrote:
>
> On Friday, August 29, 2003, at 09:34 pm, Kevin Tarr wrote:
>
> > (I know, English isn't his first language)(And I'm not assuming he is
> > Democrat, but 41 percent of the other teacher's failed and I'd lay
> > odds that more than half of those who failed are.)
> >
>
On Friday, August 29, 2003, at 09:34 pm, Kevin Tarr wrote:
At 01:10 PM 8/29/2003 +0100, you wrote:
On Friday, August 29, 2003, at 03:42 am, Doug Pensinger wrote:
Gautam Mukunda wrote:
Chomsky just speaks to elites - like you. That's
where his power comes from.
I can see we're going to need a
At 01:10 PM 8/29/2003 +0100, you wrote:
On Friday, August 29, 2003, at 03:42 am, Doug Pensinger wrote:
Gautam Mukunda wrote:
Chomsky just speaks to elites - like you. That's
where his power comes from.
I can see we're going to need a definition of elite before we continue
this discussion. I
Doug Pensinger wrote:
> Gautam Mukunda wrote:
>
>> Chomsky just speaks to elites - like you. That's
>> where his power comes from.
>
> I can see we're going to need a definition of elite before we
> continue this discussion. I don't know how I could be considered
> elite in any sense of the wo
On Friday, August 29, 2003, at 03:42 am, Doug Pensinger wrote:
Gautam Mukunda wrote:
Chomsky just speaks to elites - like you. That's
where his power comes from.
I can see we're going to need a definition of elite before we continue
this discussion. I don't know how I could be considered elit
Gautam Mukunda wrote:
Chomsky just speaks to elites - like you. That's
where his power comes from.
I can see we're going to need a definition of elite before we
continue this discussion. I don't know how I could be considered
elite in any sense of the word.
Doug
_
--- Doug Pensinger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Gautam Mukunda wrote:
> No, I think the guy that has an audience of millions
> that take him
> very seriously and lies about a hell of a lot more
> than the poverty
> rate in the '50s is far worse than some guy most of
> us haven't even
> heard of
Gautam Mukunda wrote:
They do. One says that Pol Pot was a pretty good guy.
The other was wrong about poverty rates in the 1950s.
Do you really think that they're the same?
No, I think the guy that has an audience of millions that take him
very seriously and lies about a hell of a lot more tha
--- Erik Reuter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I don't see the difference between not criticizing
> Chomsky, and not
> criticizing Limbaugh. They both spout a lot of kooky
> things. Your
> argument about speaking without a script is a
> rationalization -- if
> Limbaugh cannot avoid ad-libbing all the
> How about if we change Jan's statement to something like:
>
> C) everyone [who wants to own a gun and who has not been convicted of a
> violent crime or diagnosed with a serious mental or emotional illness]
> should [be allowed to choose to] have a gun.
>
> Can we all agree with that?
>
No. I
Ronn!Blankenship wrote:
No. On the flip side, if I'm a law-abiding citizen who knows how to
handle and use a gun, should I be relegated to second-class status
because I choose to own and carry a gun?
From an earlier post of mine:
All that being said, there are too much a cult of arms in this
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: Killer Bs Discussion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Politics, was [L3] Re: fight the evil of price discrimination
Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2003 09:23:46 EDT
> How about if we change Jan's statement to something like:
>
> C) ev
At 09:01 PM 8/8/03 -0700, Doug Pensinger wrote:
Ronn!Blankenship wrote:
No. On the flip side, if I'm a law-abiding citizen who knows how to
handle and use a gun, should I be relegated to second-class status
because I choose to own and carry a gun?
From an earlier post of mine:
All that being s
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:brin-l-
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Doug
Pensinger
> Sent: Saturday, August 09, 2003 12:40 AM
> To: Killer Bs Discussion
> Subject: Re: Politics, was [L3] Re: fight the evil of price
discrimination
>
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
--- Ronn!Blankenship <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> At 01:20 AM 8/11/03 -0700, Jan Coffey wrote:
>
> >--- Doug Pensinger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > >
> > > But you made the claim that an armed society is a polite society.
> > > You haven't backed up that claim with _any_ statistics or studies.
Jan Coffey wrote:
--- Doug Pensinger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Jan Coffey wrote:
statistics gatheing techniqes vary and therefore are not comparable.
Bullsh*t. Or at least bullsh*t until you provide evidence that the
above is true, or your own statistics that use the same "gathering
technique
Jan Coffey wrote:
statistics gatheing techniqes vary and therefore are not comparable.
Bullsh*t. Or at least bullsh*t until you provide evidence that the
above is true, or your own statistics that use the same "gathering
techniques" or that make the necessary corrections.
And even if gathering
On Sat, Aug 09, 2003 at 12:43:07PM -0500, Ronn!Blankenship wrote:
> half that wide). Similarly, had the man in Spain (sorry, I forgot
> his name) lost control of his car and been killed in the wreck, he
> could have been counted as a person killed by a meteorite. So with
> such a smal
At 01:20 AM 8/11/03 -0700, Jan Coffey wrote:
--- Doug Pensinger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> But you made the claim that an armed society is a polite society.
> You haven't backed up that claim with _any_ statistics or studies.
Sorry I never made that claim. I did not and do not believe that an
--- Bryon Daly <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I think that some gun rights advocates have almost the same "slippery
> slope"
> mentality that some abortion rights advocates do, where even moderate and
> seemingly resaonable laws are fought against tooth and nail by the pro-*
> side, because they
Ray Ludenia wrote:
>
> Ronn!Blankenship wrote:
>
> > C) everyone [who wants to own a gun and who has not been convicted of a
> > violent crime or diagnosed with a serious mental or emotional illness]
> > should [be allowed to choose to] have a gun.
> >
> > Can we all agree with that?
>
> Most de
On Monday, August 11, 2003, at 09:20 am, Jan Coffey wrote:
The simple truth is that without conceled carry, the only ones with
guns are
the criminals. The power of leathal force is in the hands alone of the
very
people we would prefer did not have that power. With conceled carry
there is
a bala
At 10:03 AM 8/8/03 -0400, Jon Gabriel wrote:
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: Killer Bs Discussion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Politics, was [L3] Re: fight the evil of price discrimination
Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2003 09:23:46 EDT
> How about if we change Jan'
At 11:07 AM 8/11/03 -0700, Doug Pensinger wrote:
Jan Coffey wrote:
The simple truth is that without conceled carry, the only ones with guns are
the criminals.
You see, that's a false statement. Other people, have guns, most of them
aren't packing, but they do have them. And still others are per
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
(And, oh yes: Texas does not have less
crime than other states.)
For instance, the murder rate in Texas in 2000 was 5.9
http://www.cjpc.state.tx.us/stattabs/crimeintexas/00CrimeSection_U.pdf
While the rate in New York for the same year was 5.0
http://www.disastercenter
In a message dated 8/10/2003 3:55:10 PM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
> This very concept is now being chalanged. Not the spoken ability, but the
> assumption made by chomsky et. al. that writen ability is
> also inate is now
> under an increasing amount of attack.
I am no li
At 03:47 PM 8/5/03 -0500, Julia Thompson wrote:
"Ronn!Blankenship" wrote:
>
> At 05:15 PM 8/4/03 -0700, Chad Cooper wrote:
>
> >
> >Wait a sec...
> >I see 50% of all automobiles with at least an American Flag decal, and a
> >fair percentage with an actual flag. Those that use the flag in hate are
>
--- William T Goodall <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> On Monday, August 11, 2003, at 09:20 am, Jan Coffey wrote:
> >
> > The simple truth is that without conceled carry, the only ones with
> > guns are
> > the criminals. The power of leathal force is in the hands alone of the
> > very
> > peopl
statistics gatheing techniqes vary and therefore are not comparable.
--- Doug Pensinger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> (And, oh yes: Texas does not have less
> > crime than other states.)
>
> For instance, the murder rate in Texas in 2000 was 5.9
>
> http://www.cjpc.s
Jan Coffey wrote:
But you made the claim that an armed society is a polite society.
You haven't backed up that claim with _any_ statistics or studies.
Until you do provide data, you're claims are bogus.
Sorry I never made that claim. I did not and do not believe that an armed
society would be
> So the only people you want carrying guns is criminals? You want everyone
> else, every law abiding citizen to be at the mercy of gun toting criminals?
>
I think I'm being baited here, because I don't see any other way what I'm
saying could be so completely misunderstood. But just in case this
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> > So the only people you want carrying guns is criminals? You want everyone
> > else, every law abiding citizen to be at the mercy of gun toting
> criminals?
> >
>
> I think I'm being baited here, because I don't see any other way what I'm
> saying could be so com
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> >[someone else wrote:]
> > How about if we change Jan's statement to
> something like:
> >
> > C) everyone [who wants to own a gun and who has
> not been convicted of a
> > violent crime or diagnosed with a serious mental
> or emotional illness]
> > should [be allow
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> In a message dated 8/3/2003 12:54:16 AM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> writes:
>
> > Now, I think both of them are very important figures,
> > because they are extremely influential. One is the
> > single most cited living intellectual. The other
> > ed
- Original Message -
From: "Jan Coffey" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Killer Bs Discussion" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, August 11, 2003 3:20 AM
Subject: Re: Politics, was [L3] Re: fight the evil of price discrimination
>
> --- Doug Pensinger <
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> So the only people you want carrying guns is criminals? You want
everyone
> else, every law abiding citizen to be at the mercy of gun toting
criminals?
>
I think I'm being baited here, because I don't see any other way what I'm
saying could be so completely misundersto
On Fri, Aug 08, 2003 at 04:28:52PM -0500, Ronn!Blankenship wrote:
>
> If the asterisks are supposed to refer to a footnote, the footnote is
> missing.
He did give a URL.
** Standard Population is 2000, all races, both sexes.
--
"Erik Reuter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://www.erikreuter.ne
At 05:15 PM 8/4/03 -0700, Chad Cooper wrote:
>-Original Message-
>From: David Hobby [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>Sent: Sunday, August 03, 2003 6:57 PM
>To: Killer Bs Discussion
>Subject: Re: Politics, was [L3] Re: fight the evil of price
>discrimination
>
>
>&g
On Fri, Aug 08, 2003 at 04:40:27PM -0500, Ronn!Blankenship wrote:
> Given that the total number of known human¹ deaths due to being struck
> by a meteorite stands at zero, of what meaning is the figure they
> quote?
A number of cars have been struck by small meteorites over the years,
according t
At 09:57 PM 8/7/03 -0700, Doug Pensinger wrote:
Jan Coffey wrote:
C) everyone should have a gun.
I don't want one and neither do a substantial number of people in the
country, possibly approaching a majority. Are we all relegated to second
class status because we refuse to carry a gun?
No. O
> - If guns were made completely illegal (which I gather is your preference
> from the "I don't want ANYONE to carry guns" statement), do you think that
> would keep them out of the hands of criminals?
>
Actually, I do not want to completely criminalize guns. I think people who
hunt or target pr
--- Doug Pensinger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Jan Coffey wrote:
> > statistics gatheing techniqes vary and therefore are not comparable.
>
> Bullsh*t. Or at least bullsh*t until you provide evidence that the
> above is true, or your own statistics that use the same "gathering
> techniques" o
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> In a message dated 8/3/2003 12:54:16 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
>
> > Now, I think both of them are very important figures,
> > because they are extremely influential. One is the
> > single most cited living intellectual. The other
> > e
--- Doug Pensinger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Jan Coffey wrote:
> > --- Doug Pensinger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> >>Jan Coffey wrote:
> >>
> >>>statistics gatheing techniqes vary and therefore are not comparable.
> >>
> >>Bullsh*t. Or at least bullsh*t until you provide evidence that the
Ronn!Blankenship wrote:
> C) everyone [who wants to own a gun and who has not been convicted of a
> violent crime or diagnosed with a serious mental or emotional illness]
> should [be allowed to choose to] have a gun.
>
> Can we all agree with that?
Most definitely not! Anyone who wants to own
At 10:57 PM 8/10/03 +1000, Ray Ludenia wrote:
Ronn!Blankenship wrote:
> C) everyone [who wants to own a gun and who has not been convicted of a
> violent crime or diagnosed with a serious mental or emotional illness]
> should [be allowed to choose to] have a gun.
>
> Can we all agree with that?
Mo
In a message dated 8/3/2003 12:54:16 AM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
> Now, I think both of them are very important figures,
> because they are extremely influential. One is the
> single most cited living intellectual. The other
> edits the most important magazine of th Left
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On
> Behalf Of Ronn!Blankenship
> Sent: Friday, August 08, 2003 5:29 PM
> To: Killer Bs Discussion; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: Politics, was [L3] Re: fight the evil of price
discrimination
>
> >
> >I
At 12:28 PM 8/8/03 -0400, Erik Reuter wrote:
Note that deaths are usually quoted as a number per 100,000 people,
which is the case above. For comparison, below I've listed some other
death rates (mostly from NSC's web page). Note that the rate for deaths
from falls is 20 times that quoted above fo
At 05:57 PM 8/8/03 -0400, Erik Reuter wrote:
On Fri, Aug 08, 2003 at 04:40:27PM -0500, Ronn!Blankenship wrote:
> Given that the total number of known human¹ deaths due to being struck
> by a meteorite stands at zero, of what meaning is the figure they
> quote?
A number of cars have been struck by
On Fri, Aug 08, 2003 at 10:03:03AM -0400, Jon Gabriel wrote:
> I'm in complete agreement with this.
Me too. I first heard the idea of licensing guns similar to cars from a
post by David Brin here. Sounds like a good system to me.
> Since someone had mentioned this, I thought I'd post it.
> http:
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> > How about if we change Jan's statement to something like:
> >
> > C) everyone [who wants to own a gun and who has not been convicted of a
> > violent crime or diagnosed with a serious mental or emotional illness]
> > should [be allowed to choose to] have a gun.
>
Guatam wrote:
I don't doubt that Limbaugh makes mistakes. He speaks
for, what, 2 hours a day, five days a week, 40+ weeks
a year, without a script? _Of course_ he makes
mistakes. I have a memory for policy minutiae that
verges on the photographic, and I make mistakes on
this list. I shudder to
> > Will give US accidental gun death statistics for years through 2000.
> >
> > For 2000
> > Number of Deaths 776
> > Population 275,264,999
> > Crude Rate 0.28
> > Age-Adjusted Rate** 0.28
> >
>
> Note that deaths are usually quoted as a number per 100,000 people,
> which is the case above. Fo
> IOW, you (pl.) say you don't "prefer it if ONLY criminals carry weapons",
> you (pl.) just want to change the law so everyone who carries a weapon is
> by definition a criminal . . .
>
I didn't say that, and I didn't say anything about criminalizing guns. It is
my belief that there are relativ
Gautam Mukunda wrote:
I don't doubt that Limbaugh makes mistakes. He speaks
for, what, 2 hours a day, five days a week, 40+ weeks
a year, without a script? _Of course_ he makes
mistakes. I have a memory for policy minutiae that
verges on the photographic, and I make mistakes on
this list. I sh
At 06:31 PM 8/4/03 -0400, Jon Gabriel wrote:
From: Erik Reuter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: Killer Bs Discussion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Killer Bs Discussion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Politics, was [L3] Re: fight the evil of price discrimination
Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2003 18:
On Sun, Aug 03, 2003 at 07:34:51PM -0700, Gautam Mukunda wrote:
> --- Erik Reuter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Perhaps I've misunderstood your argument, Gauatam, but it seems to
> > me you are quite close to arguing a tautology: those on the Left
> > do not criticize Leftist extremists, and thos
From: Erik Reuter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: Killer Bs Discussion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Killer Bs Discussion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Politics, was [L3] Re: fight the evil of price discrimination
Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2003 18:24:34 -0400
On Mon, Aug 04, 2003 at 04:21
On Mon, Aug 04, 2003 at 04:21:37PM -0500, Julia Thompson wrote:
> Reggie Bautista wrote:
>
> > LIMBAUGH: "The worst of all of this is the lie that condoms really
> > protect against AIDS. The condom failure rate can be as high as 20
> > percent. Would you get on a plane -- or put your children on
Reggie Bautista wrote:
> LIMBAUGH: "The worst of all of this is the lie that condoms really protect
> against AIDS. The condom failure rate can be as high as 20 percent. Would
> you get on a plane -- or put your children on a plane -- if one of five
> passengers would be killed on the flight? Well
--- Reggie Bautista <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Guatam replied:
> >How arrogant. Basically your argument is that
> >Limbaugh is popular because he tricks the stupid
> >average Americans who listen to him, who are too
> dumb
> >and foolish to see through him - unlike the great
> and
> >wise Tom, w
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> He loves America - while hating all kinds of
> Americans who don't happen to be
> exactly like him. Rush Limbaugh succeeds by lying to
> the public, by pandering
> to their prejudices and to their completely
> misplaced resentments and grudges
> and envies and greeds.
Gautam Mukunda wrote:
> --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> > He loves America - while hating all kinds of
> > Americans who don't happen to be
> > exactly like him. Rush Limbaugh succeeds by lying to
> > the public, by pandering
> > to their prejudices and to their completely
> > misplaced resentme
--- "John D. Giorgis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Correct me if I am wrong, but didn't you mean "there
> are certainly
> _individual_ conservatives who support Coulter or
> Falwell, but on the whole
> they are persona non grata on the right."?
>
> JDG
You're exactly right. Oops :-(
=
Gauta
Tom Beck wrote:
> The antidote to offensive speech is MORE speech, not less. I think
sometimes
> people misinterpret politeness and civility as silence.
And silence as acquiescence. This is something I completely agree with.
Silence often ends up meaning that one lets the ridiculous memes hold
> Display and interpret any symbol the way
> you wish to. If others get offended, it is their problem, not yours.
>
As long as *all* they do is feel offended. There have been reports, for
example, of Jews in some European countries being attacked for wearing kippot,
stars of David, and other Je
Ronn!Blankenship wrote:
> >
> > > IOW, why should I "fight fair" in
> > > defending the good
> > > aspects of a symbol if others do not fight fair in contaminating
it?
> >
> > Only one reason would make sense: that you believe in fighting fair
and
> > do not wish to pattern your behaviour on othe
At 03:23 PM 8/4/03 +0530, Ritu wrote:
Ronn!Blankenship wrote:
> What's fair about the "others" contaminating a symbol I
> respect with things
> I don't believe in?
Nothing. But then again, there is nothing unfair in it either. It's
*their* interpretation of the symbol. You may challenge it if you
Ronn!Blankenship wrote:
> What's fair about the "others" contaminating a symbol I
> respect with things
> I don't believe in?
Nothing. But then again, there is nothing unfair in it either. It's
*their* interpretation of the symbol. You may challenge it if you wish
to but that doesn't mean tha
Ronn!Blankenship wrote:
At 09:57 PM 8/3/03 -0400, David Hobby wrote:
Where have you been? Everybody uses symbols differently,
of course. But I saw many flying the flag who seemed to do so out
of some mix of patriotism, jingoism and hate. (Anyway, they would
say things like "Kill all Ara
At 09:57 PM 8/3/03 -0400, David Hobby wrote:
Where have you been? Everybody uses symbols differently,
of course. But I saw many flying the flag who seemed to do so out
of some mix of patriotism, jingoism and hate. (Anyway, they would
say things like "Kill all Arabs!")
When others
Gautam Mukunda wrote:
>
> --- David Hobby <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Yes, I feel it is reasonable to call the US flag a
> > "symbol of hatred", in the sense that many who wave
> > it most
> > fervently do so partially out of hate. You seem to
> > have
> > removed all of the modifiers fr
At 07:34 PM 8/3/2003 -0700 Gautam Mukunda wrote:
>Hi Erik. No, I don't think I'm arguing that. There
>are certainly _individual_ conservatives who don't
>support Coulter or Falwell, but on the whole they are
>persona non grata on the right. They have no
>constituency, no influence. Michael Moor
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> He loves America - while hating all kinds of
> Americans who don't happen to be
> exactly like him. Rush Limbaugh succeeds by lying to
> the public, by pandering
> to their prejudices and to their completely
> misplaced resentments and grudges
> and envies and gree
--- Erik Reuter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Perhaps I've misunderstood your argument, Gauatam,
> but it seems to me
> you are quite close to arguing a tautology: those on
> the Left do not
> criticize Leftist extremists, and those who don't
> criticize Leftist
> extremists are lumped into the Left
> One of the reasons that people
> like Rush Limbaugh are so successful at speaking to
> the American public is that - unlike their opponents -
> they _like_ the public. I have lots of problems with
> Rush. But he loves America, and he loves Americans.
> The American people rather like that and t
--- David Hobby <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Yes, I feel it is reasonable to call the US flag a
> "symbol of hatred", in the sense that many who wave
> it most
> fervently do so partially out of hate. You seem to
> have
> removed all of the modifiers from your restatement.
> For compa
>
> No, David, you proved my much larger point.
> Congratulations, _you_ are the perfect example for why
> the left has no relevance to American politics today.
> You pegged it in one - I do say you're an extremist
> too. If you really feel that it's reasonable to call
> the American flag a symbo
On Sun, Aug 03, 2003 at 08:40:53AM -0400, Erik Reuter wrote:
> Perhaps I've misunderstood your argument, Gauatam, but it seems to me
^^^
Gautam
Sorry about that!
--
"Erik Reuter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
On Sat, Aug 02, 2003 at 09:54:16PM -0700, Gautam Mukunda wrote:
> They _are_. But their counterexamples aren't. You, Tom, are so far
> gone in your hatred of everyone who disagrees with you that you can't
> see that there are people on your side of the fence who are equally
> vile as Coulter and
> The other edits the most important magazine of th Left.
>
I can't even reply to the other points, most of which seem to be personal
attacks. However, The Nation is not "the most important magazine of the left." It
has a tiny circulation. I can't even remember the last time I snuck a peak at
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Huh? What does that mean? How does what he said
> prove the case? It seems to
> me the opposite. She has been put forward as an
> example of an extremist whom
> liberals should denounce. But the examples given
> make her seem somewhat less
> extreme to me than, say
--- David Hobby <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> This argument has many flaws, but the most
> important
> one is that I do not have any clear idea of who
> Katha Pollit
> is, and might well have misspelled her name
> repeatedly. : )
> I was responding to YOUR examples of her
> "extremism".
Gautam Mukunda wrote:
...
> > When others have contaminated a symbol with things
> > one
> > does not believe in, one reasonable response is to
> > avoid using
> > the symbol. (Another is to attempt to "reclaim" it,
> > but either
> > should be fair.)
> > So her rhetoric is over-the-to
> > So her rhetoric is over-the-top, but her basic
> > position
> > doesn't seem too far out.
>
> The prosecution rests.
>
Huh? What does that mean? How does what he said prove the case? It seems to
me the opposite. She has been put forward as an example of an extremist whom
liberals shoul
--- David Hobby <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Where have you been? Everybody uses symbols
> differently,
> of course. But I saw many flying the flag who
> seemed to do so out
> of some mix of patriotism, jingoism and hate.
> (Anyway, they would
> say things like "Kill all Arabs!")
> W
Gautam Mukunda wrote:
...
>
> Katha Pollitt, among many other things, famously
> forbade her daughter from flying an American flag
> after September 11th because it was a symbol of, IIRC,
> jingoism and hate.
>
> If that _doesn't_ bother you, then it explains why the
> left has no traction in the
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