Re: Market Forces Applied to Lower Education

2005-10-06 Thread Gruss Gott
> Cameron wrote: > Charter schools are independent single schools and do not represent a > Free Market System in any way shape or form. > I haven't read about it in a year or so, but Milwaukee has a mix of charter schools, magnet schools, and vouchers. I'd say that's fairly close to a free market

Re: Market Forces Applied to Lower Education

2005-10-06 Thread Gruss Gott
> Larry wrote: > It it can be reliably shown that charter schools > and vouchers don't work If by "don't work" you mean "work well enough to be reaffirmed for the last 25 years in Milwaukee" then I agree. ~| Discover CFTicket - T

[rant] election results

2005-10-06 Thread Dana
Yes yes the election was Tuesday, and it is Thursday. I have just been too depressed to face up to reality. The mayor. The mayor who ws caught and reprimanded for accepting graft. Who admitted it. The one who never saw a petroglyph he didn't want to pave over, who makes no secret of being in the p

Re: What Teachers Make

2005-10-06 Thread Tony
she has never paid a dime, and is CERTAINLY my highest trafficed client s'ok, she has special reprieve. agreed. thread done :) ciao On 10/6/05, Charlie Griefer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > ok. -that- was funny. > > let's end this thread on a high note :) > > On 10/6/05, Michael Tangorre <[EMAI

Re: Market Forces Applied to Lower Education

2005-10-06 Thread Cameron Childress
On 10/6/05, Larry C. Lyons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > You talk about market forces and choice. Charter schools are part of > the school choice movment. Charter schools are independent single schools and do not represent a Free Market System in any way shape or form. > Similarly voucher programs

Re: What Teachers Make

2005-10-06 Thread Charlie Griefer
ok. -that- was funny. let's end this thread on a high note :) On 10/6/05, Michael Tangorre <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > From: Tony [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > my mother is a teacher, and is a saint ;) > > So stop charging her hosting!!! :-) > > > > ~

RE: What Teachers Make

2005-10-06 Thread Michael Tangorre
> From: Tony [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > my mother is a teacher, and is a saint ;) So stop charging her hosting!!! :-) ~| Find out how CFTicket can increase your company's customer support efficiency by 100% http://www.hou

Re: Market Forces Applied to Lower Education

2005-10-06 Thread Dana
But if they help the kids they helpif there is for example a charter-school called nuestres valores that had a mariachi progrm and emphasized history and social science and marketed itself to students in gang-ridden barrio schools, well, that school is so not for my son, but it might be exc

Re: Market Forces Applied to Lower Education

2005-10-06 Thread Larry C. Lyons
You talk about market forces and choice. Charter schools are part of the school choice movment. Similarly voucher programs also are a strong part of it. It it can be reliably shown that charter schools and vouchers don't work (for the majority of students they may not) then that sort of diminishes

Re: Market Forces Applied to Lower Education

2005-10-06 Thread Cameron Childress
On 10/6/05, Larry C. Lyons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Most recent analyses show that Charter schools are either no different I'm going to start calling you Larry "straw man" Lyons. At no time have I talked about charter schools. This is at least the third (maybe the fourth) unrelated program y

Re: Noose Tightening For Rove?

2005-10-06 Thread Gruss Gott
> Jerry wrote: > I don't know if his agenda still matches with his controller's agenda. > Yeah, I think that's true. Anybody that thinks Mr. Bush won because of policy is nuts; he won because of the Christian right. It's an element the left doesn't have so it's a tie breaker. That Christian sup

Re: What Teachers Make

2005-10-06 Thread Dana
hehe, nice. On 10/6/05, Larry C. Lyons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > lynx browser and a 2800 baud modem? She'd have to have the patience of > a saint for that. > > larry > > On 10/6/05, Tony <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > my mother is a teacher, and is a saint ;) > > > > she was a catholic nun pr

Re: What Teachers Make

2005-10-06 Thread Larry C. Lyons
lynx browser and a 2800 baud modem? She'd have to have the patience of a saint for that. larry On 10/6/05, Tony <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > my mother is a teacher, and is a saint ;) > > she was a catholic nun prior to meeting my father > after she decided to have a family. > > she is truly a sai

Re: Woman bounced from Southwest flight for T-shirt

2005-10-06 Thread Larry C. Lyons
The ones that scare me are the women wearing the tshirt that says I'm the bitch who fell off. Don't they have any self-respect? larry On 10/6/05, Dana <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I find it unbelievable that airplanes have speech policies now... I guess > they are entitled but I find the whole t

Re: Market Forces Applied to Lower Education

2005-10-06 Thread Dana
well, not in the sense that it is usually used in education, but they have a special need -- they need to learn english. Some of them however actually score quite high if provided with bilingual mterials, apparently. They have just as much in common with adhd children as to the blind or the deaf i

Re: What Teachers Make

2005-10-06 Thread Tony
my mother is a teacher, and is a saint ;) she was a catholic nun prior to meeting my father after she decided to have a family. she is truly a saint, trust me. www.globalclassroom.org thats her, she's been doing it since her first lynx browser and our first 2800 baud modem... no one alive with

Re: Market Forces Applied to Lower Education

2005-10-06 Thread Larry C. Lyons
Most recent analyses show that Charter schools are either no different in terms of the student's educational achievement or actually perform at a lower level than public school students. For instance the Upjohn institute in a recent study looked at Michigan Charter schools and found that they perfo

Re: Market Forces Applied to Lower Education

2005-10-06 Thread Dana
well... in Albuquerque where a number of schools are failing NCLB, it is true that some schools are not accepting new students. However, some are, and then there are the charter schools. It is also true that bad schools were previously resistant to allowing students to transfer, especially if it in

Re: Woman bounced from Southwest flight for T-shirt

2005-10-06 Thread Ray Champagne
:) Dana wrote: > by the way, since we are talking homeschooling I would like to be > particularly sure to point out that my a key is sticking a bit nd yes, I do > know how to spell instead and mileage. > Dana > > On 10/6/05, Dana <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >>13 and 15 but I'd have said the s

Re: Woman bounced from Southwest flight for T-shirt

2005-10-06 Thread Dana
by the way, since we are talking homeschooling I would like to be particularly sure to point out that my a key is sticking a bit nd yes, I do know how to spell instead and mileage. Dana On 10/6/05, Dana <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > 13 and 15 but I'd have said the same thing ten years ago. Thos

Re: Woman bounced from Southwest flight for T-shirt

2005-10-06 Thread Dana
13 and 15 but I'd have said the same thing ten years ago. Those words are out there, might as well learn them insted of giving them power by making them something shocking. Same reason I don't filter internet. Works for us. Other people's milege may vary. Dana On 10/6/05, Ray Champagne <[EMAIL

Re: What Teachers Make

2005-10-06 Thread Dana
> > of course. However, this would be the same teacher who told me that she > has pupils who don't know their names or their colors, whereas mine is not > only reading but so far ahead she is in her own reading group, and what was > my kid's problem again? And oh by the way, she is on the honor rol

Re: Noose Tightening For Rove?

2005-10-06 Thread Jerry Johnson
I don't know if his agenda still matches with his controller's agenda. I think we will know in the next few weeks if he has broken the leash his handlers had on him. Robert's and Meirs will show us by their actions if Bush fulfilled his promise to his farthest right constituents by padding the cou

Re: What Teachers Make

2005-10-06 Thread Dana
"in the real world, you don't always get to do what you want to do." That's where I was getting this. If it's not what you meant, my apologies for reading in, but it's one of the more common arguments for compulsory school (whether needed or not). Dana On 10/6/05, Charlie Griefer <[EMAIL PROTECT

Re: Noose Tightening For Rove?

2005-10-06 Thread Gruss Gott
> Jerry wrote: > I don't think he is weak now. He is in his second term and has nothing > to be threatened with. > Except losing the control over his agenda, his legacy, and his standing in the party. ~| Find out how CFTicket ca

Re: Speaking of the Boy Scouts...

2005-10-06 Thread Paul Ihrig
Cub Scout = Yes Webelos = Yes Arrow of Light = Yes Boy Scout = Yes Eagle = NO OA = No Philmont = Not Sure National Jamboree = Pretty Sure think i made it to the rank befor eagle. first class? quit when i got my front tooth knocked out while horsing around at a meeting.. things i still love about

RE: What Teachers Make

2005-10-06 Thread Ken Ketsdever
Bravo!! -Original Message- From: Charlie Griefer [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, October 06, 2005 2:04 PM To: CF-Community Subject: Re: What Teachers Make we're all online enough that i'm sure we all get innundated with these things daily. this is one of the (very) few that I f

RE: What Teachers Make

2005-10-06 Thread Ken Ketsdever
Neither I nor the poem said a word about telling the kid to sit down and shut up. I think the quote was closer to; I won't let you get a drink of water because you bored, when you should be using this time to study. I didn't expect this type of Rove-ism from you. I'm a bit disappointed.

RE: Market Forces Applied to Lower Education

2005-10-06 Thread Ian Skinner
"the best public schools would become very popular and would eventually[sic] have to instate admissions requirements. That's not a bad thing IMHO." IMHO, it is. The "best" public schools will get to set high standards and thus get to pick best and brightest students, yeah for them. What happe

Re: Noose Tightening For Rove?

2005-10-06 Thread Jerry Johnson
I don't think he is weak now. He is in his second term and has nothing to be threatened with. On 10/6/05, Gruss Gott <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Jerry wrote: > > Not without Bush's approval, it can't. > > And do yo usee that happening at this point? > > > > I think the political pressure is th

Re: Speaking of the Boy Scouts...

2005-10-06 Thread Jerry Johnson
Of course, on the other hand, the Boy Scout troop in my sister's neighborhood (the one where I was a Cub Scout/Webelos leader years earlier) had a troop owned clubhouse that had a scumbag scoutleader living in it and molesting kids. I painted and sheetrocked that damned clubhouse. It was only 7 ho

RE: Speaking of the Boy Scouts...

2005-10-06 Thread Ken Ketsdever
Asst Scoutmaster - Rocklin California Scoutmaster - Okinawa Japan Eagle 1980 Order of Arrow 1978 -Original Message- From: Cameron Childress [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, October 06, 2005 1:56 PM To: CF-Community Subject: Speaking of the Boy Scouts... Was anyone else here in

Re: Market Forces Applied to Lower Education

2005-10-06 Thread Gruss Gott
> Cam wrote: > I'm also not sure why you think that there would not be schools and > programs for handicapped, hyperactive, and non english speakers. > There would be - as the market demands them. > Well, it'd have to be a bit more than that for special needs kids as some areas couldn't have a who

RE: Speaking of the Boy Scouts...

2005-10-06 Thread Ken Ketsdever
Eagle 1980 Order of Arrow 1978 -Original Message- From: Cameron Childress [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, October 06, 2005 1:56 PM To: CF-Community Subject: Speaking of the Boy Scouts... Was anyone else here in Boy Scouts? Eagle? Yes. Order of Arrow? Yes. Philmont? Yes. Nat

Re: Woman bounced from Southwest flight for T-shirt

2005-10-06 Thread Ray Champagne
how old? although, after "knowing" you for the past year + , I'd think that you were one of those people who would turn the whole thing into an educational thing for your kid, no matter the age. free speech and all that. which is cool, IMO. Dana wrote: > My kid? no problem. > > Dana > > O

Re: Speaking of the Boy Scouts...

2005-10-06 Thread Tony
Cub Scout = Yes Webelos = Yes Arrow of Light = Yes Boy Scout = Yes Second Class Scout = Yes Eagle = No National Jamboree = I think, wayyy back. i learned a couple GREAT things: 1. how to torment and be tormented 2. how to smoke a cigarette 3. how to drink a beer 4. how to make nice fires 5. how t

Re: Noose Tightening For Rove?

2005-10-06 Thread Gruss Gott
> Jerry wrote: > Not without Bush's approval, it can't. > And do yo usee that happening at this point? > I think the political pressure is there to do it - he's very weak now. However if Mr. Fitzgerald needs more time, unless he's just cracked something big, then there isn't much of a case.

Re: What Teachers Make

2005-10-06 Thread William Bowen
> I can't tell you how many time I was told to read to my children, wtf. So was/am I. I choose not to take it as an insult. And, given the opportunity, might reply, "I do, regularly, I think my children's performance in their studies speaks to that fact." slight smile. turn and walk away. What's

room reservation system

2005-10-06 Thread Ray Champagne
Warning: cf-talk/cf-comm cross-post! We have a potential client that runs a medium-sized inn, and would like to have an application where they could have people reserve rooms online. the app's scope and specs are pretty much up in the air now, but I

Re: Woman bounced from Southwest flight for T-shirt

2005-10-06 Thread Dana
My kid? no problem. Dana On 10/6/05, Ray Champagne <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > they aren't stuck in a narrow tube with nowhere else to go. > > how would you feel if your child were sitting next to this woman? > > just playing devil's advocate, btw. i could care less and have no plans > for ch

Re: Speaking of the Boy Scouts...

2005-10-06 Thread Cameron Childress
On 10/6/05, Jerry Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > As someone said, it is a locally run thing. If the people around you > are accepting, then the troop will also be for the most part. If the > people around you are biggoted, then the troop will probably be as > well. But in my experience the ki

Re: Woman bounced from Southwest flight for T-shirt

2005-10-06 Thread Ray Champagne
they aren't stuck in a narrow tube with nowhere else to go. how would you feel if your child were sitting next to this woman? just playing devil's advocate, btw. i could care less and have no plans for children. i'm the devil :) Dana wrote: > I find it unbelievable that airplanes have speech

Re: Market Forces Applied to Lower Education

2005-10-06 Thread Cameron Childress
On 10/6/05, Larry C. Lyons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Except that private schools can be selective. Public schools have to > take in all students, even those who are mentally handicapped, > hyperactive, cannot speak english etc. Yet all their scores are > factored into the NCLB assessments. Such

Re: Noose Tightening For Rove?

2005-10-06 Thread Jerry Johnson
Not without Bush's approval, it can't. And do yo usee that happening at this point? On 10/6/05, Larry C. Lyons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > not really, the jury's term can be extended. > > larry > > On 10/6/05, Jerry Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Don't forget Fitzgerald only has 13 days

Re: Market Forces Applied to Lower Education

2005-10-06 Thread Sam
My daughter is 2-1/2 and our neighbor is 7, from Arizona. The 7 year old asked my wife what the name of a shape was, when told it was an octagon she said, "See, your daughter said it was a hexagon." We laughed and a few minutes later we heard the neighbor telling our daughter: "it's not an oval, it

Re: Speaking of the Boy Scouts...

2005-10-06 Thread Jerry Johnson
It hasn't become such a place, really. Or nothing has really changed and in parts of the country they always were that way. I considered myself an athiest and then agnostic from age 10 on, and there were some repurcussions in Boy Scouts from that, but less than I got in school, baseball and public

Re: Woman bounced from Southwest flight for T-shirt

2005-10-06 Thread Dana
I find it unbelievable that airplanes have speech policies now... I guess they are entitled but I find the whole thing incredibly stupid. What's next, I get to have the cops pull someone over for one of theose t-shirts that says "If you can read this the bitch fell off"? Dana On 10/6/05, Ken Ket

Re: Market Forces Applied to Lower Education

2005-10-06 Thread Cameron Childress
On 10/6/05, Larry C. Lyons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > What I'm saying is that look at the last debacle. What happened was > that the ideologies took over. We're seeing the same with the > so-called No Child Left Behind legislation. Its not about what is best > for the kid, its more what is best

Re: Noose Tightening For Rove?

2005-10-06 Thread Larry C. Lyons
not really, the jury's term can be extended. larry On 10/6/05, Jerry Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Don't forget Fitzgerald only has 13 days left to finish whatever he > wants to finish. Then he is done. > > On 10/6/05, Gruss Gott <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > Sam wrote: > > > We should

Re: Noose Tightening For Rove?

2005-10-06 Thread Sam
I'm pretty confident someone high up is getting indicted, just don't know who. On 10/6/05, Gruss Gott wrote: > > Sam wrote: > > We should know by tomorrow. > > > > Well we might never know. The flurry of volunteer activity could > suggest behind the scenes maneuvering that will allow Mr. Fitzger

Re: Market Forces Applied to Lower Education

2005-10-06 Thread Dana
hey now, watch where you are lumping the hyperactive ;P My kids would improve those test scores if anthing. Just as an aside, they quit requiring testing of homeschoolers in New Mexico because it was too embarrassingfor the schools. NCLB overall was bad in that it created huge incentives for

Re: Noose Tightening For Rove?

2005-10-06 Thread Jerry Johnson
Don't forget Fitzgerald only has 13 days left to finish whatever he wants to finish. Then he is done. On 10/6/05, Gruss Gott <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Sam wrote: > > We should know by tomorrow. > > > > Well we might never know. The flurry of volunteer activity could > suggest behind the sce

Re: Speaking of the Boy Scouts...

2005-10-06 Thread William Bowen
yup Cub Scout = Yes Webelos = Yes Arrow of Light = Yes Boy Scout = Yes Eagle = Yes OA = No Philmont = Yes Charles L. Sommers Canoe Base = Yes, Yes (Summer - canoing, Winter Cross-country skiing) National Jamboree = No And after all that, it tears my heart out that it has become such a religious-c

Re: Market Forces Applied to Lower Education

2005-10-06 Thread Larry C. Lyons
Except that private schools can be selective. Public schools have to take in all students, even those who are mentally handicapped, hyperactive, cannot speak english etc. Yet all their scores are factored into the NCLB assessments. Such is not the case for private schools, so of course they look mu

Re: Speaking of the Boy Scouts...

2005-10-06 Thread Jerry Johnson
Eagle? No. Life Scout. My final scoutmaster hated me and refused to sign off on any more merit badges or service projects. He also broke my thumb in two places (on purpose). Moved on to Explorers. They had girls (like Tammy and Kim). Order of the Arrow? See above. Philmont? No. Summer camp every

Re: Market Forces Applied to Lower Education

2005-10-06 Thread Larry C. Lyons
Who is saying anything about fear of change. I'm saying if you're goiing to have change, it should be objective and measureable. You can specify the specific goals, ie., kids should be able to do x y or z by grade ___. Then use an objective measure to assess it. What I'm saying is that look at the

Re: Noose Tightening For Rove?

2005-10-06 Thread Gruss Gott
> Sam wrote: > We should know by tomorrow. > Well we might never know. The flurry of volunteer activity could suggest behind the scenes maneuvering that will allow Mr. Fitzgerald to drop the case. Then we'd never know exactly what happened only that something did. And Mr. Fitzgerald would have

Re: Speaking of the Boy Scouts...

2005-10-06 Thread Cameron Childress
On 10/6/05, Ray Champagne <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I was. Don't listen to the naysayers. Although I think the Boy Scouts > are bit outdated for todays society, being in taught me many things that > I still use today. I don't think it's outdated at all. I think most of the negative press rel

Re: ahhh....newbies

2005-10-06 Thread Ray Champagne
He he...good point. :) Like I've said before - I ain't doing it. I feel enough like a perv as it is. If any of you want to visit me at my office, I'll gladly point her out. We've got some fantastic leaf peeping right now too in New Hampshire. And I'm not talking about fig leaves, either :)

Re: What Teachers Make

2005-10-06 Thread Dana
And we all know that all children need to be saved from their parents. Don't get me wrong, some do...but the system assumes all. I can't tell you how many time I was told to read to my children, wtf. Dana On 10/6/05, Larry C. Lyons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > I was going to say, it was a gre

Re: Noose Tightening For Rove?

2005-10-06 Thread Larry C. Lyons
Here's hoping Rove's perp walk will be on the evening news tomorrow. larry On 10/6/05, Gruss Gott <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Stephen Gillers, a New York University law professor, said it was > unusual for a witness to be called back to the grand jury four times > and that the prosecutor's legal

Re: Speaking of the Boy Scouts...

2005-10-06 Thread Larry C. Lyons
Queen's Scout. (Hey I'm Canadian, we have a slightly different system - more inclusive too.). larry On 10/6/05, Cameron Childress <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Was anyone else here in Boy Scouts? > > Eagle? Yes. > Order of Arrow? Yes. > Philmont? Yes. > National Jamboree? No. > > -Cameron > >

Re: Market Forces Applied to Lower Education

2005-10-06 Thread Dana
I agree. I just don't see what happens in schools to be educationunless education means learning to sit down and shut up. While this *is* a useful skill, and one I need to hone a bit it won't do much for changing the world, or even for earning a living. It might maybe get you into college but

Re: What Teachers Make

2005-10-06 Thread Larry C. Lyons
I was going to say, it was a great little piece. Reminds me of those teachers that helped to save me as a kid. lkarry On 10/6/05, Michael T. Tangorre <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Why does everyone have to comment on everything? Can we just step back, read > something, and think about it... why do

Re: Market Forces Applied to Lower Education

2005-10-06 Thread Ben Doom
I guess I see part of education being teaching people why they (and, by extension, their kids) need to be educated. That's the lack I see, but I've got a pretty skewed viewpoint. I'm old enough to worry about stuff like this, and young enough to hang out with high schoolers. :-\ So, yeah. I

Re: Noose Tightening For Rove?

2005-10-06 Thread Sam
We should know by tomorrow. On 10/6/05, Gruss Gott wrote: > Stephen Gillers, a New York University law professor, said it was > unusual for a witness to be called back to the grand jury four times > and that the prosecutor's legally required warning to Rove before this > next appearance is "an om

Re: Speaking of the Boy Scouts...

2005-10-06 Thread Howie Hamlin
I belonged to a very disfunctional BS troop in the late 60's. Bad experience all around... I did earn some merit badges, though.. --- On Thursday, October 06, 2005 4:55 PM, Cameron Childress scribed: --- > > Was anyone else here in Boy Scouts? > > Eagle? Yes. > Order of Arrow? Yes. > Philmont

Re: Speaking of the Boy Scouts...

2005-10-06 Thread Ray Champagne
I was. Don't listen to the naysayers. Although I think the Boy Scouts are bit outdated for todays society, being in taught me many things that I still use today. Eagle? Yes Order of Arrow? No Philmont? No Nat'l Jamboree? Yes (bonus - never got struck by any lightning, either!) :) Funny

Re: Speaking of the Boy Scouts...

2005-10-06 Thread Dana
Brownies and Girl Guides (Canadian equivalent). Dropped out when we moved to Paris. Dana On 10/6/05, Cameron Childress <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Was anyone else here in Boy Scouts? > > Eagle? Yes. > Order of Arrow? Yes. > Philmont? Yes. > National Jamboree? No. > > -Cameron > > ~~

Noose Tightening For Rove?

2005-10-06 Thread Gruss Gott
Stephen Gillers, a New York University law professor, said it was unusual for a witness to be called back to the grand jury four times and that the prosecutor's legally required warning to Rove before this next appearance is "an ominous sign" for the presidential adviser. "It suggest Fitzgerald ha

Re: Market Forces Applied to Lower Education

2005-10-06 Thread Dana
I think a lot of them *are* able. How did their child learn to talk? To use a toilet? They just think they aren't. Then there are those who really aren't, they do exist, but that's another story. Dana On 10/6/05, Ben Doom <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > OK. > > If you mean that you support the id

RE: Speaking of the Boy Scouts...

2005-10-06 Thread Ian Skinner
Cub Scout, Webelo and Boy Scout, I didn't reach a very high rank as a boy scout though. I dropped out about eighth grade when we moved. The organization in the new town was much more religious then the one in the town I moved from. I think it has gotten much worse in the last twenty years. D

Re: What Teachers Make

2005-10-06 Thread Charlie Griefer
we're all online enough that i'm sure we all get innundated with these things daily. this is one of the (very) few that I felt was worthy enough of passing on. beauty, eye, beholder, all that :) On 10/6/05, Dana <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I have friends who are AOL users who forward me four or

Re: What Teachers Make

2005-10-06 Thread Cameron Childress
On 10/6/05, Michael T. Tangorre <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Why does everyone have to comment on everything? Can we just step back, read > something, and think about it... why does it always have to turn into some > war on here? Way to take a nice poem supporting one of the hardest jobs in > the w

Re: What Teachers Make

2005-10-06 Thread Dana
exactly, it's about the disempowerment we take for granted while talking about how great it is that someone is doing such a tough job. Dana On 10/6/05, Cameron Childress <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > On 10/6/05, Charlie Griefer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > FWIW, I saw this on Mike's blog and

Re: What Teachers Make

2005-10-06 Thread Dana
I have friends who are AOL users who forward me four or five of these things a day. If it isn't teachers it's mothers. Dana On 10/6/05, Michael T. Tangorre <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Why does everyone have to comment on everything? Can we just step back, > read > something, and think about i

Re: Market Forces Applied to Lower Education

2005-10-06 Thread Ben Doom
It was one of those one-day things where a teacher from the "business" department (typing, etc.) came into the math class and went over it. Neither a deep nor broad education, but better than nothing. I learned *way* more from my mom, long before this took place. --Ben Cameron Childress wrote:

Re: What Teachers Make

2005-10-06 Thread Charlie Griefer
I've never encountered any conventional wisdom that would suggest that all teachers are saints. nor would I apply a blanket generalization to...well, to anything really. Yes, there are bad teachers. There are bad cops. There are good politicians. They're hopefully the minority. As a whole (an

Re: What Teachers Make

2005-10-06 Thread Cameron Childress
On 10/6/05, Charlie Griefer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > FWIW, I saw this on Mike's blog and suggested that he post it here. I > didn't expect it to start a war. I just saw it as a very cool tribute > to teachers. You can't fool me - you're not new here... Seriously though, it was kinda cool, I

Re: Speaking of the Boy Scouts...

2005-10-06 Thread Ben Doom
Cub scout for a while. Got tired of building bad birdhouses and being held up because I didn't believe in God. Being precocious isn't always a good thing. :-) --Ben Cameron Childress wrote: > Was anyone else here in Boy Scouts? > > Eagle? Yes. > Order of Arrow? Yes. > Philmont? Yes. >

RE: Speaking of the Boy Scouts...

2005-10-06 Thread Michael T. Tangorre
> From: Cameron Childress [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Was anyone else here in Boy Scouts? > Eagle? Yes. > Order of Arrow? Yes. > Philmont? Yes. > National Jamboree? No. Cross reference the nambla.org member list :-) *ducks*

RE: What Teachers Make

2005-10-06 Thread Michael T. Tangorre
Why does everyone have to comment on everything? Can we just step back, read something, and think about it... why does it always have to turn into some war on here? Way to take a nice poem supporting one of the hardest jobs in the world and turn it into a debate about whether or not study hall serv

Re: Market Forces Applied to Lower Education

2005-10-06 Thread Ben Doom
OK. If you mean that you support the idea that education should begin and end with the parents, I agree. On the other hand, I think that's not currently a popular trend -- to many people thinking that the school should do it all -- and it's probably more worthwhile to try and educate the curr

Speaking of the Boy Scouts...

2005-10-06 Thread Cameron Childress
Was anyone else here in Boy Scouts? Eagle? Yes. Order of Arrow? Yes. Philmont? Yes. National Jamboree? No. -Cameron ~| Find out how CFTicket can increase your company's customer support efficiency by 100% http://www.houseoff

Re: Market Forces Applied to Lower Education

2005-10-06 Thread Cameron Childress
On 10/6/05, Ben Doom <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > My checkbook didn't, but my HS did. :-) My HS didn't (at least I didn't take that class), but my parents did, as did the Boy Scouts. -Cameron ~| Save $10 Download ZoneAlarm Sec

Re: What Teachers Make

2005-10-06 Thread Dana
ok, so in your opinion also, the role of this teacher in this situation -- admittedly not of either the teacher's or the student's creation -- is to teach the child how to sit down and shut up? Dana On 10/6/05, Ken Ketsdever <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Self discipline is a taught skill or att

Re: What Teachers Make

2005-10-06 Thread Dana
it's very moving and true of many teachers. Just not all of them, as conventional wisdom would have use believe;P Dana On 10/6/05, Charlie Griefer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > FWIW, I saw this on Mike's blog and suggested that he post it here. I > didn't expect it to start a war. I just saw it

RE: Market Forces Applied to Lower Education

2005-10-06 Thread Ian Skinner
No, you're right, although some might have the touch. Why not give them the chance? But, yeah, you'd have better success at higher levels. That being said, many corporate types are also parents so maybe they'd be better than you think. That is, maybe parenthood is the OJT for teaching. Some

RE: What Teachers Make

2005-10-06 Thread Ken Ketsdever
Self discipline is a taught skill or attribute. As I remember we were discussing how a TEACHER (one who teaches) handled and TAUGHT his or her students in study hall (a place where one is given the opportunity to learn other subjects while learning how to study). I see studying as an action that

Re: What Teachers Make

2005-10-06 Thread Charlie Griefer
FWIW, I saw this on Mike's blog and suggested that he post it here. I didn't expect it to start a war. I just saw it as a very cool tribute to teachers. Granted, my kids are 3 and 1, so I've not yet dealt with teachers as 'the parent' yet. Maybe my perception will change. Dunno. But as the st

Re: Market Forces Applied to Lower Education

2005-10-06 Thread Gruss Gott
> Ian wrote: > prepare one to teach 2nd graders reading, writing and math. > That is a skill onto itself, and I doubt is learned in a corporate > environment. > Ha! That's all you do in a corporate environment - work with 2nd graders! LOL! Ah, too funny. No, you're right, although some might h

Re: Market Forces Applied to Lower Education

2005-10-06 Thread Ben Doom
My checkbook didn't, but my HS did. :-) --Ben Sam wrote: > I haven't seen a checkbook in years but don't they come with instructions? > I never knew they actually taught that in school. ~| Discover CFTicket - The leading ColdF

Re: Market Forces Applied to Lower Education

2005-10-06 Thread Dana
nope, didn't take it as pissy. My answer on the other hand probably is, but this is something I have given a lot of thought to that yes, does piss me off ;) but not your answer in particular. Dana On 10/6/05, Ben Doom <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > The counter-argument is that the same could be

Re: Market Forces Applied to Lower Education

2005-10-06 Thread Dana
nothing wrong with *teaching* it. Something wrong, in my opinion with requiring it, and especially with requiring it when reading scores are in the 27th percentile. Dana On 10/6/05, Ben Doom <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > The counter-argument is that the same could be said for math, reading, > h

Re: What Teachers Make

2005-10-06 Thread Dana
I agree, it isn't for everyone. But hi, here I am, never had to study.always finished the books the first week of class. Mind you, my school didn't have study hall, but see my point? Dana On 10/6/05, Cameron Childress <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > On 10/6/05, Ken Ketsdever <[EMAIL PROTECTED

RE: Woman bounced from Southwest flight for T-shirt

2005-10-06 Thread Ken Ketsdever
That makes the stance of the airlines more understandable. I had a hard time with them kicking her off the flight for "Meet the Fockers", especially being it (was / is) a popular movie and seems to have made the jump into pop culture slang. I find the spelling you provided as more profane tha

Re: Market Forces Applied to Lower Education

2005-10-06 Thread Cameron Childress
On 10/6/05, Sam <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I haven't seen a checkbook in years but don't they come with instructions? > I never knew they actually taught that in school. Every statement I get from BoA includes a page called "How to Balance Your Bank of America Account". It has very elementary s

Re: Kill Key Repeat

2005-10-06 Thread Deanna Schneider
Oh sweet! There it is. You have saved my sanity! Thanks. On 10/6/05, Marlon Moyer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > If you're using WinXP, you can hold down the shift key for about five > seconds and then the keyboard accessibility panel will come up. You > can configure the keyboard to not accept ke

Re: What Teachers Make

2005-10-06 Thread Dana
if it's self discipline why enforce it? Say kids, you are expected to know x, and expect them to know it. And remember, in my scenario he doesn't have any honors books. Dana On 10/6/05, Ken Ketsdever <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > I don't buy it. This is study hall, self discipline, open to stud

RE: Market Forces Applied to Lower Education

2005-10-06 Thread Matthew Small
As I recall, those courses are taught in the consumer math classes - remedial stuff for the slower children. As an aside, I don't have a problem with the public school system's teachings so much - I got through it just fine - but what does scare me is that schools seem to be far more dangerous

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