Re: Linux, Twitter, Mysql, Github, etc, all plan to remove blacklist and whitelist, master and slave.

Mark London writes: > Spamassassin is not alone. And that is how dictatorships and injustices are created: blindly following, because a lot of others do. Hitler, Mussolini and Franco where the worst. Luckily we also had the saviours, Stalin, Mao and Pol Pot. -- Cecil Westerhof Senior Softwa

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

On 10 Jul 2020, at 20:02, Luis E. Muñoz wrote: On 10 Jul 2020, at 12:29, @lbutlr wrote: If people are so fragile that they have to hold on to terms that are extremely offensive to some of their peers, they will get more spam. Oh noes. I keep hearing about this mythical people that get terri

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

John Hardin writes: > On Fri, 10 Jul 2020, jdow wrote: > >> And every ancillary script sysadmins have written has to be rewritten. >> Every user_prefs has to be rewritten. You are forcing a boatload of >> hurt on innocent people. This is purely lifting a leg and peeing on >> something to mark it

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

"Kevin A. McGrail" writes: > A common question we are receiving is what about using this terminology > instead, for example allow/deny. > > The use of welcomelist and blocklist has evolved from discussions since > April and work done creating patches.  We found that using these names > of welcome

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

"Bill Cole" writes: > On 10 Jul 2020, at 5:12, hospice admin wrote: > >> $0.02 from a woman of colour ... >> >> I personally find stuff like this just a little bit patronising ... >> more of a matter of kicking the real problem into the weeds than >> actually doing anything practical to 'fix' it.

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

sha...@shanew.net writes: > On Fri, 10 Jul 2020, Axb wrote: > >> On 7/10/20 8:31 PM, Bill Cole wrote: >>> The SpamAssassin Project has a particular self-interest in attracting >>> contributors from a diversity of cultures, because we are always at risk >>> of mislabelling a pattern of letters o

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

I voted aginst it, loudly. On 7/11/20 4:35 AM, Noel Butler wrote: Who is "we" Name the people who decided this pathetic communist dictatorship change and who want to enforce this upon members of 160 odd other countries just because theirs is fucked up? I want names I want to see the voting,

Re: Linux, Twitter, Mysql, Github, etc, all plan to remove blacklist and whitelist, master and slave.

I don't see a problem since blacklist/whitelist are terms the computer industry just grabbed from hotel reservation desks or some place like that. It's not going to stop their use by the general public of course. As for master/slave those were picked up by mechanical designers and borrowed fo

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

huh? I dont see that subject in the thread, I guess thats what you mean, I dunno, you're not talking to an american On 11/07/2020 12:38, Charles Sprickman wrote: > Read Red Scare hours on the timeline tonight... > > On Jul 10, 2020, at 10:35 PM, Noel Butler wrote: > > Who is "we" > > Name

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

Read Red Scare hours on the timeline tonight... > On Jul 10, 2020, at 10:35 PM, Noel Butler wrote: > > Who is "we" > > Name the people who decided this pathetic communist dictatorship change and > who want to enforce this upon members of 160 odd other countries just because > theirs is fucked

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

Who is "we" Name the people who decided this pathetic communist dictatorship change and who want to enforce this upon members of 160 odd other countries just because theirs is fucked up? I want names I want to see the voting, come on lets be transparent, who are they, and who are hte ones who

Re: Linux, Twitter, Mysql, Github, etc, all plan to remove blacklist and whitelist, master and slave.

The proposed name changes were proposed for many years in the software community.   For example in 2014, Drupal opted to use "primary/replica" instead, and Django followed suit the same year with "leader/follower".    In 2018, there apparently was a renewed interest in changing the names by man

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

On 2020-07-10 20:02, Luis E. Muñoz wrote: > > I keep hearing about this mythical people that get terribly offended by > the use of these words. I've been working in IT since the 90s, and I've > never actually seen one in real life. Do they really exist? > What black people are asking for is to

Re: spamhaus enabled by default

> On Jul 10, 2020, at 7:56 PM, RW wrote: > > On Fri, 10 Jul 2020 18:25:33 -0400 > Charles Sprickman wrote: > > >> Also I just dug up the letter and the wording used was “commercial >> use”. There was no mention of what the volume was or what the limit >> would be. >> > > The default is to

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

On 10 Jul 2020, at 12:29, @lbutlr wrote: If people are so fragile that they have to hold on to terms that are extremely offensive to some of their peers, they will get more spam. Oh noes. I keep hearing about this mythical people that get terribly offended by the use of these words. I've bee

Re: spamhaus enabled by default

On Fri, 10 Jul 2020 18:25:33 -0400 Charles Sprickman wrote: > Also I just dug up the letter and the wording used was “commercial > use”. There was no mention of what the volume was or what the limit > would be. > The default is to use these list unregistered. Did that ISP register or did Spamha

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

I am having a hard time reconciling the statements below. On 10 Jul 2020, at 13:21, Bill Cole wrote: We have no way of knowing how many people have thought less of SA because of terminology or whether any of those people might have otherwise become involved enough in the project to be contribu

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

force my nonsense on you. > Square? > > {^_^} > > On 20200710 15:26:49, Charles Sprickman wrote: >> What makes you think anyone on the list wants to hear your complaints and >> your snide crypto-fascism? >> Take it private or open an issue in the bug tra

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

1) You would not know fascism if it jumped up and bit your nose off. 2) You try to force your nonsense on me and I'll force my nonsense on you. Square? {^_^} On 20200710 15:26:49, Charles Sprickman wrote: What makes you think anyone on the list wants to hear your complaints and your

RE: Linux, Twitter, Mysql, Github, etc, all plan to remove blacklist and whitelist, master and slave.

Pf, twitter, microsoft, oracle all billion dollar companies only removing some words The news is full of black minorities having higher risk of death in coronavirus. Unemployment is highest amongst ethnic minorities. And these companies are only concerned filling their pockets, stori

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

On Fri, 2020-07-10 at 15:01 -0700, jdow wrote: > On 20200710 13:43:21, Bill Cole wrote: > > On 10 Jul 2020, at 8:37, Mauricio Tavares wrote: > > > > > I do agree that accept works better than welcome here. > > > > There's a practical issue in that:

Linux, Twitter, Mysql, Github, etc, all plan to remove blacklist and whitelist, master and slave.

Spamassassin is not alone. https://www.google.com/search?q=whitelist+blacklist&rlz=1C1CHBD_enUS893US893&sxsrf=ALeKk02i5oEeNFMyRbCSyvz1P74SAG8W8A:1594419806351&source=lnms&tbm=nws&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiwobjR3MPqAhVUknIEHbzFCdwQ_AUoAXoECA0QAw&biw=1008&bih=5900

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

; user_prefs has to be rewritten. You are forcing a boatload of hurt on > innocent people. This is purely lifting a leg and peeing on something to mark > it as YOURS. Isn't that rather selfish? > {^_^} > > On 20200710 13:27:45, Kevin A. McGrail wrote: >> Hello all, >>

Re: spamhaus enabled by default

> On Jul 10, 2020, at 5:56 PM, Charles Sprickman wrote: > > >> On Jul 10, 2020, at 5:35 PM, Kris Deugau wrote: >> >> Charles Sprickman wrote: >>> That’s unrealistic. Many ISPs these days that aren’t the “big boys” with >>> dedicated staff for every facet of ISP operations, they are one and

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

ather selfish? {^_^} The intent is to be fully backwards-compatible, so it's (hopefully) *not* going to be that bad. On 20200710 13:27:45, Kevin A. McGrail wrote: Hello all, A common question we are receiving is what about using this terminology instead, for example allow/deny.

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

to simply see the world burn so they can step in and take control. They are so ignorant of history they do not realize they are among the first for the gulags and firing squads they believe they will be running. {+_+} On 20200710 14:57:33, Eric Broch wrote: No one has answered my question. What

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

On 20200710 13:58:32, Bill Cole wrote: On 10 Jul 2020, at 3:38, Olivier wrote: Axb writes: the US problems won't be fixed with renaming B&W lists. Seriously.. you have more important issues... While thet change in names will not fix any societal issue, No one has suggested tha

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

On 20200710 13:43:21, Bill Cole wrote: On 10 Jul 2020, at 8:37, Mauricio Tavares wrote:   I do agree that accept works better than welcome here. There's a practical issue in that: we have the WLBLEval plugin that has cemented the initial. FWIW, the use of "blocklist"

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

On 20200710 12:34:03, @lbutlr wrote: On 10 Jul 2020, at 02:06, Matus UHLAR - fantomas wrote: thought guys can also mean women, at least I've seen it being used that way… Yes, guy/s is gender neutral, but many women do not agree. Far more use it themselves. You males have lost contr

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

On 20200710 12:34:03, @lbutlr wrote: On 10 Jul 2020, at 02:06, Matus UHLAR - fantomas wrote: thought guys can also mean women, at least I've seen it being used that way… Yes, guy/s is gender neutral, but many women do not agree. Far more use it themselves. You males have lost contr

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

And every ancillary script sysadmins have written has to be rewritten. Every user_prefs has to be rewritten. You are forcing a boatload of hurt on innocent people. This is purely lifting a leg and peeing on something to mark it as YOURS. Isn't that rather selfish? {^_^} On 20200710 13:

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

In other words "I am going to pee on the product and if you don't like it go pound sand." Well, I am pounding sand in your general direction, loudly. {^_^} On 20200710 13:21:41, Bill Cole wrote: On 10 Jul 2020, at 5:12, hospice admin wrote: $0.02 from a woman of colour ..

Re: Really simple setup guide

On Fri, 10 Jul 2020 14:26:17 +0200 Matthew Broadhead wrote: > i am starting to remember that sa-learn is being called from dovecot Previously you indicated that you had 755293 ham trained (from 788787-33494). Unless you have an extreme number of FPs your training is mostly from auto-learning. >

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

No one has answered my question. What about the the word "Apache"?  Are their 'redlist[s]' out there who'll be offended by this name? For all the talk about giving SA more appropriate and descriptive names the motivation for changing them (whitelist, blacklist) was ultimately to be politically

Re: spamhaus enabled by default

> On Jul 10, 2020, at 5:35 PM, Kris Deugau wrote: > > Charles Sprickman wrote: >> That’s unrealistic. Many ISPs these days that aren’t the “big boys” with >> dedicated staff for every facet of ISP operations, they are one and two man >> shops running WISPs in rural areas or developing countri

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

I've seen managers pee on projects this way and destroy companies. I hated it then. I hate it now. And you are triggering me horridly. {+,+} I stick my tongue out in your general direction. On 20200710 12:29:42, @lbutlr wrote: On 10 Jul 2020, at 01:38, Olivier wrote: Axb writes

Re: spamhaus enabled by default

Charles Sprickman wrote: That’s unrealistic. Many ISPs these days that aren’t the “big boys” with dedicated staff for every facet of ISP operations, they are one and two man shops running WISPs in rural areas or developing countries. It’s not the 90’s anymore. It’s a terrible default, even hom

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

On Fri, 10 Jul 2020, jdow wrote: And if you REALLY want a hair raising read dig around for a copy of William Shirer's "The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich." Then tell me there is no resemblance at all between that and current events. I *so* do not want to read that book again... -- John H

Re: Really simple setup guide

Matthew Broadhead skrev den 2020-07-10 13:00: i have 788787 messages in my bayes_seen directory.  33494 are flagged 's'.  i am not sure why it seems to have no effect on the spam coming through diffrent bayes user in user_prefs incorrect amavisd bayes user mapping pr recipient hardcoded globa

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

On Fri, 10 Jul 2020, sha...@shanew.net wrote: On Fri, 10 Jul 2020, Axb wrote: On 7/10/20 8:31 PM, Bill Cole wrote: The SpamAssassin Project has a particular self-interest in attracting contributors from a diversity of cultures, because we are always at risk of mislabelling a pattern of let

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

On 20200710 11:52:11, Ralph Seichter wrote: * Eric Broch: As stated earlier by another very aware poster, this is nothing less than, "Newspeak." That was actually me, in message <87lfjr78zu@wedjat.horus-it.com>. However, you did not quote the first part of the s

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

On 20200710 11:31:57, Bill Cole wrote: On 10 Jul 2020, at 3:06, Rupert Gallagher wrote: Whatever you do under the hood, make sure it does not affect external behaviour. On your motivation, bear in mind that *lists here contain computer addresses, not people, Which is an argument FOR

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

lso ignores the detail that the "Owner/Slave" relationship between human beings exists today and is fully legal in some countries (Mauritania) and illegal but not prosecuted in others (Saudi Arabia and others). BLM is closer to Black Lives Mangled as I see it.) {^_^} On 20200710 10:11

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

On 20200710 05:16:15, Martin Gregorie wrote: On Fri, 2020-07-10 at 10:36 +0200, Matus UHLAR - fantomas wrote: On 10.07.20 08:50, Axb wrote: the US problems won't be fixed with renaming B&W lists. Seriously.. you have more important issues... while I am not a fan of renaming, I t

Re: Really simple setup guide

Matthew Broadhead skrev den 2020-07-10 11:02: i tried to set up bayes training before but i feel that i was unsuccessful.  is there a definitive guide on setting this up on postfix with amavis?  if my user were the one that was training it for the other users that would be ideal are you sure yo

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

On 10 Jul 2020, at 3:38, Olivier wrote: Axb writes: the US problems won't be fixed with renaming B&W lists. Seriously.. you have more important issues... While thet change in names will not fix any societal issue, No one has suggested that it will or can. for a product like SpamAssassin

Re: Really simple setup guide

Marc Roos skrev den 2020-07-10 12:10: You can add rspamd they have all inclusive soluation and they do not even like if you want to customize the 3000 line counting configuration file to do just one check. i find that its hard to configure rspamd, thats one of the reasons i dropped trying with

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

Why not concentrate on making Spamassassin a better filter instead of worrying about offending anyone. Have a look at DSPAM. It's much better than Spamassassin's probabilistic Bayes filter, but DSPAM's weakness is in its inability to whitelist. On 7/10/2020 2:27 PM, Kevin A. McGrail wrote: H

Re: spamhaus enabled by default

> On Jul 10, 2020, at 1:57 PM, RW wrote: > > On Fri, 10 Jul 2020 18:01:30 +0200 > Philipp Ewald wrote: > >>> Most smaller sites have no problem unless they use third party DNS >>> resolvers which are blocked. if you're local resolver is forwarding >>> to some ISP's resolver then you also get

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

On 10 Jul 2020, at 8:37, Mauricio Tavares wrote: I do agree that accept works better than welcome here. There's a practical issue in that: we have the WLBLEval plugin that has cemented the initial. FWIW, the use of "blocklist" in spamfighting goes back to the '90s, when the primary r

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

Hello all, A common question we are receiving is what about using this terminology instead, for example allow/deny. The use of welcomelist and blocklist has evolved from discussions since April and work done creating patches.  We found that using these names of welcomelist and blocklist are non o

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

On 10 Jul 2020, at 5:12, hospice admin wrote: $0.02 from a woman of colour ... I personally find stuff like this just a little bit patronising ... more of a matter of kicking the real problem into the weeds than actually doing anything practical to 'fix' it. Well, in the context of the Apac

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

On 10 Jul 2020, at 02:06, Matus UHLAR - fantomas wrote: > thought guys can also mean women, at least I've seen it being used that > way… Yes, guy/s is gender neutral, but many women do not agree. -- Train Station: where the train stops. Work Station: …

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

On 10 Jul 2020, at 02:02, jdow wrote: > The problem is that at least one woman (me) reading this list doesn't give a > tinker's damn. The intent is communicated and that's sufficient to satisfy my > sensibilities. Seems I grew up and became an adult when I wasn't looking. > Things like this jus

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

On 10 Jul 2020, at 01:38, Olivier wrote: > Axb writes: > >> the US problems won't be fixed with renaming B&W lists. >> Seriously.. you have more important issues... > > While thet change in names will not fix any societal issue, for a > product like SpamAssassin that relies heavily on plugins (

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

On Fri, 10 Jul 2020, Axb wrote: On 7/10/20 8:31 PM, Bill Cole wrote: The SpamAssassin Project has a particular self-interest in attracting contributors from a diversity of cultures, because we are always at risk of mislabelling a pattern of letters or words as 'spammy' when in fact it is en

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

On 7/10/20 8:31 PM, Bill Cole wrote: The SpamAssassin Project has a particular self-interest in attracting contributors from a diversity of cultures, because we are always at risk of mislabelling a pattern of letters or words as 'spammy' when in fact it is entirely normal in a cultural context

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

jdow skrev den 2020-07-10 08:42: Be sure to purge every instance of "fork" in the code because it sounds too close to the other F..K word. Get the fork out of there. {O,o} i.e are you guys being just a little stupid here? +1000 :-) hope its not a question anymore

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

* Eric Broch: > As stated earlier by another very aware poster, this is nothing less > than, "Newspeak." That was actually me, in message <87lfjr78zu@wedjat.horus-it.com>. However, you did not quote the first part of the sentence, which I consider just as important: >> Racists are assholes,

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

On 10 Jul 2020, at 3:06, Rupert Gallagher wrote: Whatever you do under the hood, make sure it does not affect external behaviour. On your motivation, bear in mind that *lists here contain computer addresses, not people, Which is an argument FOR changing our terminology. so the reference yo

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

LOL! On 7/10/2020 12:12 PM, Marc Roos wrote: Yes, as of now we don't write apache but ehcapa. If we write every word in reverse nobody has anything to complain any more. So everyone continuing this thread. Please pay you respect to past generations, and write ehcapa, tsiletihw, tsilkcalb etc

RE: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

Yes, as of now we don't write apache but ehcapa. If we write every word in reverse nobody has anything to complain any more. So everyone continuing this thread. Please pay you respect to past generations, and write ehcapa, tsiletihw, tsilkcalb etc!!! -Original Message- Subject: Re:

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

So! What's next, changing the "Apache" name? Wake up! On 7/10/2020 12:00 PM, Eric Broch wrote: There is NO issue! And, this is the point. Using the term "blacklist" in reference to an email server IS NOT RACIST. It was never used to infer anything of the sort, so when people say that they m

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

There is NO issue! And, this is the point. Using the term "blacklist" in reference to an email server IS NOT RACIST. It was never used to infer anything of the sort, so when people say that they must be rid of it because it is racist, there's another agenda going on. Futhermore, "nonsense" is

Re: spamhaus enabled by default

On Fri, 10 Jul 2020 18:01:30 +0200 Philipp Ewald wrote: > > Most smaller sites have no problem unless they use third party DNS > > resolvers which are blocked. if you're local resolver is forwarding > > to some ISP's resolver then you also get blocked. > > No. We are like a ISP... and got more

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

* Eric Broch: > This is not about racism this is about a Marxist (Socialist) > takeover. Huh? Please don't quote me when talking nonsense such as this. It is of course about racism. I just don't consider "improving language" (an ugly euphemism, by the way) a productive way to deal with this issue

Re: spamhaus enabled by default

Philipp Ewald skrev den 2020-07-10 18:23: Thank you for the update! Last time we used spamhaus this was not given. checking logs everyday ? i am kidding aswell

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

My comments were not sarcasm. You're acting the part of a Marxist by dismissing my (and others) speech. You are playing the "Useful Idiot." You say there are no Marxists in the U.S. but that's exactly what BLM claims to be. Also, you will know them by their fruits whether they say it or not.

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

Not sure if this is sarcasm or not... but just in case: Whoever may be the Marxist/Socialists, the're definitely not in the US... Assuming you never lived under such a government you're just talking thru your hat. and now lets put this offtopic blah to rest. On 7/10/20 7:07 PM, Eric Broch w

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

Amen! This is not about racism this is about a Marxist (Socialist) takeover. They don't care if you use the terms whitelist or blacklist, this is a revolution. Soon, it will be as in Dr. Zhivago. You'll come home being dispossessed of your house and belongings under the supervision of the st

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

> On Jul 9, 2020, at 9:00 PM, Kevin A. McGrail wrote: > > IMPORTANT NOTICE > > If you are running trunk, we are working on changing terms like whitelist to > welcomelist and blacklist to blocklist. > > https://bz.apache.org/SpamAssassin/show_bug.cgi?id=7826 >

Re: spamhaus enabled by default

Thank you for the update! Last time we used spamhaus this was not given. Am 10.07.20 um 18:07 schrieb Riccardo Alfieri: Hi, sorry but this will never happen. We are not going to use a "list the world" response to queries from anyone. There are dedicated return codes for that (already included

Re: Really simple setup guide

On 10.07.20 17:35, Matthew Broadhead wrote: should i be going to the dovecot team with this problem? On 10/07/2020 14:26, Matthew Broadhead wrote: i am starting to remember that sa-learn is being called from dovecot yeah, very good idea. in dovecot/conf.d/90-plugin.conf i have plugin {   #

Re: spamhaus enabled by default

On 10/07/20 18:01, Philipp Ewald wrote: Am 10.07.20 um 13:54 schrieb Kevin A. McGrail: Here's the policy: https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/spamassassin/DnsBlocklistsInclusionPolicy This was active since 2018? Maybe it would be better to ask if your are commercial or not... AFIK

Re: spamhaus enabled by default

Most smaller sites have no problem unless they use third party DNS resolvers which are blocked. if you're local resolver is forwarding to some ISP's resolver then you also get blocked. No. We are like a ISP... and got more than 50.000 accepted Mails a day so this is totally not in free-use in

Re: Really simple setup guide

should i be going to the dovecot team with this problem? On 10/07/2020 14:26, Matthew Broadhead wrote: i am starting to remember that sa-learn is being called from dovecot in dovecot/conf.d/90-plugin.conf i have plugin {   # man antispam   #setting_name = value   antispam_debug_target = syslog

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

* Kevin A. McGrail: > This is about doing the right thing and getting rid of racially charged > language. I'd appreciate support in this change or at least if you can't > say something nice or helpful, just keep it to yourselves. Is it the official Apache.org position to tell those with differing

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

On 10/07/2020 16:42, jdow wrote: > Be sure to purge every instance of "fork" in the code because it sounds too > close to the other F..K word. Get the fork out of there. > > {O,o} > i.e are you guys being just a little stupid here? I agree, this is just insanity... where will it end. -- Kind

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

On 7/10/20 8:07 AM, Pedro David Marco wrote: >On Friday, July 10, 2020, 10:10:20 AM GMT+2, Axb wrote: >so glad to read this... confirms my picture of you. >now back my pet project: rewrite Tom Sawyer OK... who starts??? :-) once Finished we can rewrite "El Quixote" as well... Perha

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

On Fri, 10 Jul 2020 13:16:15 +0100 Martin Gregorie wrote: >>I think that "welcome list" and " list" are more informational > Still a bit woolly methinks. I think, acceptlist and rejectlist are a > more meaningful pair of terms. Welcome is the only one that is meaningful; accept, block and rejec

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

On Fri, Jul 10, 2020 at 8:16 AM Martin Gregorie wrote: > > On Fri, 2020-07-10 at 10:36 +0200, Matus UHLAR - fantomas wrote: > > On 10.07.20 08:50, Axb wrote: > > > the US problems won't be fixed with renaming B&W lists. > > > Seriously.. you have more important issues... > > > > while I am not a f

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

On Fri, 2020-07-10 at 12:07 +, Pedro David Marco wrote: > OK... who starts??? :-) > once Finished we can rewrite "El Quixote" as well... > That's already been sort of redefined: see https://xkcd.com/556/ Martin

Re: Really simple setup guide

i am starting to remember that sa-learn is being called from dovecot in dovecot/conf.d/90-plugin.conf i have plugin {   # man antispam   #setting_name = value   antispam_debug_target = syslog   antispam_verbose_debug = 1   antispam_backend = pipe   antispam_signature = X-DSPAM-Signature   # acti

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

On Fri, 2020-07-10 at 10:36 +0200, Matus UHLAR - fantomas wrote: > On 10.07.20 08:50, Axb wrote: > > the US problems won't be fixed with renaming B&W lists. > > Seriously.. you have more important issues... > > while I am not a fan of renaming, I think that > "welcome list" and "block list" are mo

Re: Really simple setup guide

it is manual training.  i have been looking through the configuration but i cannot figure out how it is set up.  i think it works when email is moved in and out of spam directory .  i will keep looking and report back if i remember how it was set up. in the meantime i sent a message to the amav

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

>On Friday, July 10, 2020, 10:10:20 AM GMT+2, Axb wrote: >so glad to read this... confirms my picture of you. >now back my pet project: rewrite Tom Sawyer OK... who starts??? :-) once Finished we can rewrite "El Quixote" as well... --Pedro

Re: Really simple setup guide

On 10.07.20 13:16, Matthew Broadhead wrote: i mean bayes_seen table in my MySQL database where did you configure bayes to use mysql? are you sure amavis uses it? and... did you train manually or do you completely rely on automatic training? On 10/07/2020 13:12, Matus UHLAR - fantomas wrote:

Re: spamhaus enabled by default

Here's the policy: https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/spamassassin/DnsBlocklistsInclusionPolicy On 7/10/2020 7:43 AM, Axb wrote: > On 7/10/20 1:40 PM, Philipp Ewald wrote: >>> in local.cf  add: >>> >>> dns_query_restriction deny spamhaus.org >>> >>> that should fix the problem and survive

Re: spamhaus enabled by default

On 7/10/20 1:40 PM, Philipp Ewald wrote: in local.cf  add: dns_query_restriction deny spamhaus.org that should fix the problem and survive SA updates Many Thank! now it's work. but why is this enabled by default? because, under fair use, it's free for all. Most smaller sites have no probl

Re: spamhaus enabled by default

in local.cf add: dns_query_restriction deny spamhaus.org that should fix the problem and survive SA updates Many Thank! now it's work. but why is this enabled by default? Am 10.07.20 um 13:23 schrieb Axb: On 7/10/20 1:20 PM, Philipp Ewald wrote: Hey everyone, we got a nice mail from spam

Re: Really simple setup guide

If you don't know much about Bayes and aren't training HAM and SPAM, it's likely got improper bias.  I'd recommend adding KAM.cf (see my other email) and disable Bayesian and see how it looks. On 7/10/2020 7:00 AM, Matthew Broadhead wrote: > i have 788787 messages in my bayes_seen directory.  3349

Re: Really simple setup guide

> But still a lot of spam comes spamassassin and I wondered if there was a > really great guide out there which might tell me how to tune the spam > filter. Hi Matthew, I would recommend you add KAM.cf Ruleset and see if that helps. https://mcgrail.com/downloads/KAM.cf https://mcgrail.com/d

Re: Really simple setup guide

On 7/10/20 11:02 AM, Matthew Broadhead wrote: i tried to set up bayes training before but i feel that i was unsuccessful.  is there a definitive guide on setting this up on postfix with amavis?  if my user were the one that was training it for the other users that would be ideal unless you te

Re: spamhaus enabled by default

On 7/10/20 1:20 PM, Philipp Ewald wrote: Hey everyone, we got a nice mail from spamhaus. We have used their DNS Query's. Important is that we thought we have disabled them by: score __RCVD_IN_ZEN 0 But tcpdump says we make dns querys to spamhaus, but the result got ignored. you forgot that

spamhaus enabled by default

Hey everyone, we got a nice mail from spamhaus. We have used their DNS Query's. Important is that we thought we have disabled them by: score __RCVD_IN_ZEN 0 But tcpdump says we make dns querys to spamhaus, but the result got ignored. I have removed the configuration lines in /usr/share/spamass

Re: Really simple setup guide

i mean bayes_seen table in my MySQL database On 10/07/2020 13:12, Matus UHLAR - fantomas wrote: On 10.07.20 13:00, Matthew Broadhead wrote: i have 788787 messages in my your? bayes_seen directory what is the bayes_seen directory? I have bayes_seen file, which is part of the bayes databa

Re: Really simple setup guide

On 10.07.20 13:00, Matthew Broadhead wrote: i have 788787 messages in my your? bayes_seen directory what is the bayes_seen directory? I have bayes_seen file, which is part of the bayes database. .  33494 are flagged 's'.  i am not sure why it seems to have no effect on the spam coming th

Re: Really simple setup guide

i have 788787 messages in my bayes_seen directory.  33494 are flagged 's'.  i am not sure why it seems to have no effect on the spam coming through On 10/07/2020 11:40, Matus UHLAR - fantomas wrote: On 10.07.20 11:02, Matthew Broadhead wrote: i tried to set up bayes training before but i feel

Re: Really simple setup guide

i set it up a long time ago and i have never had any success with it.  i can post a copy of my configurations. local.cf required_hits 5.0 report_safe 0 required_score 5 rewrite_header Subject [SPAM] use_bayes  1 bayes_auto_learn   1 bayes_auto_expire  1 # Store bayesian data in MySQL b

Re: IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR PEOPLE RUNNING TRUNK re: [Bug 7826] Improve language around whitelist/blacklist and master/slave

>On Friday, July 10, 2020, 12:26:59 PM GMT+2, Marc Roos wrote: >Hey Pedro, I don't know for sure, I do not want to create a new problem, >but this yahoo, was this word not used during the railroad building to >encourage and push slaves to work harder? Would you mind using different >em

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