Bug#818370: [Pkg-dns-devel] Bug#818370: Fails to bind ports but suggests it started

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Robert Edmonds <edmo...@debian.org> [2016-07-05 00:50 +0200]:
> I can replicate this bug with unbound 1.5.8-1, but not with 1.5.9-1. It
> looks like it was fixed by:
> 
>   * debian/unbound.init: Add "pidfile" magic comment (Closes: #807132)

Thanks for following up!

-- 
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`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
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Re: GR Proposal: replace "Chairman" with "Chair" throughout the Debian Constitution

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Kurt Roeckx <k...@roeckx.be> [2016-07-08 16:09 +0200]:
> Would it make sense to either have this as separate option,
> not modifying the Chainman or as seperate GR?

I've been convinced last night that my amendment is not needed, so
let's just leave it.

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
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"the perfect gun is an idealist without any ideal."
  -- mc 900 ft jesus


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Re: GR Proposal: replace "Chairman" with "Chair" throughout the Debian Constitution

[martin f krafft]

I would like to propose the following amendment to Marga's GR:

In addition to the proposed change, the project shall vote to
empower the DPL together with the Project Secretary to make minor
editorial changes in our foundation documents without requiring
the process of a GR.

To protect our foundations, such a change must be announced and can
only be put into effect following a four week period during which no
opposing GR has been launched.

Thanks,

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
  `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing systems
 
"never speak disrespectfully of society.
 only people who can't get into it do that."
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Re: [Debconf-team] Fwd: Debconf16 attendance certificate

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Bernelle Verster <bernel...@gmail.com> [2016-07-08 14:51 +0200]:
> Please try one more time?

Done.

> As for 'getting it signed' (cate's reply), we can try the
> 'official stamp' farce we had to endure for visas.

There's nothing to say against including a scanned signature bitmap…

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madd...@debconf.org> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
  `-  DebConf16: Cape Town: http://debconf16.debconf.org
  DebConf17: Montreal: https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf17


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Re: [Debconf-team] Fwd: Debconf16 attendance certificate

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Bernelle Verster <bernel...@gmail.com> [2016-07-08 14:41 +0200]:
> Rather, if we could find a way for people to maybe generate one
> based on some permission script generated by the website (is that
> even possible??) that they can download and print themself?

Sounds like a great idea. Should be doable with a SVG merge on the
server. I know LCA did this, but my last attempt to get the code
has not been successful. Couldn't be too complex, I think. I can try
to get in touch with LCA again though if you want, if you think that
incorporating their stuff will be easier than writing it ourselves.

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madd...@debconf.org> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
  `-  DebConf16: Cape Town: http://debconf16.debconf.org
  DebConf17: Montreal: https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf17


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Re: [Debconf-discuss] Android wizard around?

[martin f krafft]

Hey, thanks for all the responses. Nothing we tried yesterday
worked. No number of reboots made DNS work.

This morning, however, it just worked, and now works across reboots.
Pixie magic.

Sorry for the noise…

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madd...@debconf.org> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
  `-  DebConf16: Cape Town: http://debconf16.debconf.org
  DebConf17: Montreal: https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf17


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Re: [Debconf-discuss] Tennis courts

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Wouter Verhelst <wou...@debian.org> [2016-07-05 11:10 +0200]:
> So rather than trying to organize a tournament, I'm going to call
> Connie later today and reserve a court and two rackets[1] for,
> say, two hours on thursday thursday afternoon, from 16:00 through
> 18:00.

I'm in. Depending on price, maybe reserve two courts. Unless we are
a lot of people, I think I'd prefer at least to start out with
singles.

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madd...@debconf.org> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
  `-  DebConf16: Cape Town: http://debconf16.debconf.org
  DebConf17: Montreal: https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf17


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Re: [Debconf-discuss] Laptop to give away @dc16: HP 630

[martin f krafft]

This laptop is still up for grabs… if you want it, just give me
a mail with a sentence describing your use case.

> I have a HP 630 notebook to give away. If someone wants to put it to
> good use to further Free Software, it's yours.
> 
> http://www.cnet.com/products/hp-630-15-6-p-p6200-windows-7-home-premium-64-bit-4-gb-ram-320-gb-hdd-series/specs/
> 
> It's not a high-performance machine, nor is it light or very
> portable:
> 
>   - Dual-core Intel Celeron @1.5GHz
>   - 4Gb RAM
>   - 300G harddrive
>   - HDMI, SD-MMC, VGA, LAN, USB, DVD-RAM
>   - US-English keyboard
> 
> If you want it, drop me a line by Friday and I'll bring it along.

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madd...@debconf.org> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
  `-  DebConf16: Cape Town: http://debconf16.debconf.org
  DebConf17: Montreal: https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf17


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[Debconf-discuss] Android wizard around?

[martin f krafft]

Hey,

in my sysyphus-like quest to run a modern privacy-preserving Android
phone, I've been playing with Orbot (Tor) and several other security
apps. Now the thing can't do DNS anymore, and I can't for the sake
of life figure out why it's no longer working.

Is there anyone here knowledgeable in Android and willing to have
a look?

Thanks!

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madd...@debconf.org> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
  `-  DebConf16: Cape Town: http://debconf16.debconf.org
  DebConf17: Montreal: https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf17


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[Debconf-discuss] Early DC18 plans (was: [Debconf-announce] DebConf Announcements for 2016-07-04)

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Jonathan Carter (highvoltage) <jcar...@linux.com> [2016-07-04 11:25 
+0200]:
> If you enjoy this DebConf, are you interested in hosting DebConf18 in
> your city? There will be a session on Friday afternoon, come and show us
> your early plans!

If there's interest among people to discuss a bit what running
DebConf means before you present early plans, let us know. If it
helps, we can have a chat beforehand and try to answer some of the
early questions.

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madd...@debconf.org> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
  `-  DebConf16: Cape Town: http://debconf16.debconf.org
  DebConf17: Montreal: https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf17


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Re: [Debconf-discuss] Werewolves at DebConf16: Sunday 21:00 location tba.

[martin f krafft]

We'll be meeting in the UCT pub. There's either a back room we can
use, or in the dining area. Provided it's open. If not, then one of
the Fuller hacklabs or the dining room.

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madd...@debconf.org> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
  `-  DebConf16: Cape Town: http://debconf16.debconf.org
  DebConf17: Montreal: https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf17


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Re: [Debconf-team] Some questions

[Martin F. Krafft]

I spoke with him and while the situation is not ideal (especially the way up to 
menzies, isn't there maybe a route through buildings with elevators for which 
we could get keys? ), he'll cope. He can also travel in a normal bus and fold 
his chair.
-- 
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[Debconf-discuss] Werewolves at DebConf16: Sunday 21:00 location tba.

[martin f krafft]

Hello,

rumour has it that there are (again) werewolves among us, and it's
time for diligent villagers to erradicate them beasts before they
devour us all. This will happen tonight from 21:00 in a location to
be announced. (do you know of a room we could use?)

Werewolf is a variation of Mafia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mafia_(party_game) and it's become
a tradition at DebConf (since DC11 I believe). The game involves
bluffing, lies, and deceit, cheating on your friends, and watching
tables turn quickly against you. If this isn't your type of game, go
play Mao instead. ;)

If you haven't played, don't worry: it's easy to learn and you
should just try it.

Hope to see you there!

Wrraar,

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madd...@debconf.org> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
  `-  DebConf16: Cape Town: http://debconf16.debconf.org
  DebConf17: Montreal: https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf17


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Re: [Debconf-team] Ad-Hoc sessions

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Allison Randal <alli...@lohutok.net> [2016-07-01 17:15 +0200]:
> Really, it's best if they submit ad-hoc sessions as BoFs through
> the web form. It takes me 2 minutes to add a session to the main
> schedule, makes it more visible for attendees to join the session,
> and saves us so much pain trying to cross-reference from paper to
> electronic schedules.

This has not worked reliably in the past (bottlenecks…), which is
why we went for the flipcharts, and those seemed to work well last
year.

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madd...@debconf.org> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
  `-  DebConf16: Cape Town: http://debconf16.debconf.org
  DebConf17: Montreal: https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf17


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[Debconf-discuss] Non-Thinkpad/Apples you can recommend?

[martin f krafft]

Hey,

considering Lenovo has really gone downhill with their hardware and
judging how they interpret "next business day" to be a best effort
sort of non-promise (and then mess up the parts delivery), I'd be
really interested to hear from people at DC16 with other hardware
that they can recommend. If you're the proud owner of a rugged
laptop running Debian, please consider to ping me on IRC ('madduck')
or reply to this mail (reply-to set) and I'll come and find you
(starting Saturday…).

Thanks,

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madd...@debconf.org> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
  `-  DebConf16: Cape Town: http://debconf16.debconf.org
  DebConf17: Montreal: https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf17


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[Debconf-discuss] Laptop to give away @dc16: HP 630

[martin f krafft]

Hey,

I have a HP 630 notebook to give away. If someone wants to put it to
good use to further Free Software, it's yours.

http://www.cnet.com/products/hp-630-15-6-p-p6200-windows-7-home-premium-64-bit-4-gb-ram-320-gb-hdd-series/specs/

It's not a high-performance machine, nor is it light or very
portable:

  - Dual-core Intel Celeron @1.5GHz
  - 4Gb RAM
  - 300G harddrive
  - HDMI, SD-MMC, VGA, LAN, USB, DVD-RAM
  - US-English keyboard

If you want it, drop me a line by Friday and I'll bring it along.

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madd...@debconf.org> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
  `-  DebConf16: Cape Town: http://debconf16.debconf.org
  DebConf17: Montreal: https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf17


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[de] Campact such IT-Analyst*innen/-Projektmanager*innen

[martin f krafft]

Hey,

Germany-based non-profit Campact is seeking someone to join their IT
team in Verden (Niedersachsen). Apparently they run mostly Ubuntu.
Details can be found here:

  http://www.talents4good.org/itpm_campact/

Campact is politically active in Germany with the goal to educate.
Please refer to http://campact.de for more information.

If you have concrete questions, I am sure you can write to Kevin (in
Cc), he calls Campact the best employer of the world. ;)

Cheers,

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
  `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing systems
 
"america may be unique in being a country which has leapt
 from barbarism to decadence without touching civilization."
  -- john o'hara


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Re: [Debconf-team] DebConf T's

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Tammy Manning <mungoj...@gmail.com> [2016-06-01 10:24 +0200]:
> They all fall within our Budget, apart from the Hoodies that are
> a little more expensive. We can source money from the Swag items,
> as not all of them come to the full Budget. If you like the Hoodie
> idea.
>
> Cape Town in Winter is known for its rain, and cold temperatures
> on some days. I would strongly suggest, going with the Long Sleeve
> options.

I'd say this is something you local guys know how to decide best.

If you want some input:

T-Shirts are ubiquitous, but they are also most useful. Long-sleeves
and hoodies aren't going to be worn much in summer or even inside,
around the year. But they could be a refreshing change from the
norm.

In general though I'd probably like to suggest to opt for less of
higher quality than more of lesser quality, i.e. a better t-shirt
over a lower-quality hoodie.

> There are different Material options:
> a) Hemp and Organic Cotton - super soft and comfortable
> b) Plastic Bottles and Cotton - Yep, you'd be surprised at how soft Plastic
> Bottles can be! The T's are made out of recycled plastic bottles. The
> fibres are then woven with the cotton to create the fabric.
> c) Cotton - lovely and soft.

If you care about my opinion:

Fairtrade organic all the way, so the first two sound good. The only
question I have on the recycled plastic is how breathable the
resulting fabric is. Cotton and hemp are great (but they soak up
moisture/sweat too), while nylon shirts are really not too great in
terms of breathability and daily use (they are good for sports
though). So where do the plastic bottles slot in in that spectrum?

Hope this helps,

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madd...@debconf.org> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
  `-  DebConf16: Cape Town: http://debconf16.debconf.org
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Bug#825254: Normalise resolution on save

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Jeffrey Ratcliffe <jeffrey.ratcli...@gmail.com> [2016-05-31 19:41 
+0200]:
> Given that for most people, the page size is more important than the
> resolution (obviously the two are linked), an implementation for this
> would be to add a checkbutton to the save menu:
> 
> * force all pages to be 

Yeah, that sounds like what I was looking for.

Thanks for your consideration!

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
  `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing systems
 
there are two groups of people in the world: those who believe that
the world can be divided into two groups of people, and those who
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Bug#825394: systemd kill background processes after user logs out

[martin f krafft]

also sprach John Paul Adrian Glaubitz <glaub...@physik.fu-berlin.de> 
[2016-05-30 23:30 +0200]:
> Well, come on. Look what the usual arguments against it are: "This
> has been the default for the past 30 years and now it has changed
> and I am forced to change two options." This is not, by any
> stretch, a technical argument. This is just being against change
> for the sake of it being a change.

Wrong conclusion. If you don't understand the value of being able to
consider more than just the technical side, then maybe Debian isn't
the right project for you.

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
  `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing systems
 
eleventh law of acoustics:
  in a minimum-phase system there is an inextricable link between
  frequency response, phase response and transient response, as they
  are all merely transforms of one another. this combined with
  minimalization of open-loop errors in output amplifiers and correct
  compensation for non-linear passive crossover network loading can
  lead to a significant decrease in system resolution lost. however,
  of course, this all means jack when you listen to pink floyd.


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Bug#825394: systemd kill background processes after user logs out

[martin f krafft]

also sprach John Paul Adrian Glaubitz <glaub...@physik.fu-berlin.de> 
[2016-05-30 23:30 +0200]:
> Well, come on. Look what the usual arguments against it are: "This
> has been the default for the past 30 years and now it has changed
> and I am forced to change two options." This is not, by any
> stretch, a technical argument. This is just being against change
> for the sake of it being a change.

Wrong conclusion. If you don't understand the value of being able to
consider more than just the technical side, then maybe Debian isn't
the right project for you.

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
  `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing systems
 
eleventh law of acoustics:
  in a minimum-phase system there is an inextricable link between
  frequency response, phase response and transient response, as they
  are all merely transforms of one another. this combined with
  minimalization of open-loop errors in output amplifiers and correct
  compensation for non-linear passive crossover network loading can
  lead to a significant decrease in system resolution lost. however,
  of course, this all means jack when you listen to pink floyd.


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Bug#825394: systemd kill background processes after user logs out

[martin f krafft]

also sprach John Paul Adrian Glaubitz <glaub...@physik.fu-berlin.de> 
[2016-05-30 22:19 +0200]:
> I'm sorry, but this is a very bad argument. People who are in
> charge of hundreds of systems almost never use the default
> settings but use something like FAI, …

In this case: agreed. In general, I just wanted to point out that
a head count in Debian never translates to number of systems.

> It's honestly very frustrating to read bug reports like these as
> they are usually written by people who lack the necessary
> background or refuse to accept that their particular use case is
> not the common use case. And I have more the impression that these
> bug reports are merely written to stir up emotions because, again,
> the systemd developers dared to touch something in the Linux
> software stack which has not been touch for years while solving
> yet another long-existing problem.

I disagree with your assessment. At least for my part, I am
a systemd supporter, especially after having seen the great work our
Debian packagers have done.

However, this does not mean I have to agree with every change that
systemd is imposing, and as I wrote in my original message,
Unix/Linux has become successful (also) *because* it doesn't just
break with tradition, but adheres to standards and doesn't surprise
people.

The proposed default might very well be what our users want, but we
have no way of knowing and until we do, we should refrain from
making invasive changes, whether in the systemd ecosystem or
anywhere else.

As such, I appreciate that Martin reverted the default and I trust
that the debian-systemd team will find a solution suitable for the
universal operating system.

> A reasonable person wouldn't even mind about such changes.

I am sure you didn't mean to call everyone unreasonable who minds
about this change.

> They would either just disable the feature completely or use the
> provided mechanisms to white-list individual processes which takes
> less time than writing up such a bug report and stirring up
> emotions.

We are Debian developers. We love what we do and we cherrish our
product. We do not satisfy ourselves with hacks, or turn a blind eye
to problems, and I hope that will never change.

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  proud Debian developer
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"although occasionally there is something to be said for solitude."
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Bug#825394: systemd kill background processes after user logs out

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Martin Pitt <mp...@debian.org> [2016-05-29 11:13 +0200]:
> I believe this *is* it the expected thing to do on personal
> computers. This is certainly different in environments like
> universities where one often does put long-running stuff in the
> background, but this doesn't appeal to me as being the behaviour
> to optimize for.

The problem with this statement that I have is that we're the
universal operating system, and while that should not keep us from
"optimising", we really ought not light-heartedly move away from how
things have worked ever since the inception of multics/unix/linux.

It may well be that a non-negligible part of our user base would
benefit from this new behaviour, but at this stage, assuming that
the majority would want this change and calling those speaking up
here a "vocal minority" is IMHO not the right thing to do. Even if
you were to have a GR over this, I don't think the right response
should be to just fix it one way for everyone, especially not since
those people in charge of hundreds of systems have exactly one vote,
similar to those who just develop for their own home workstation.

We have a tool to handle divergent default behaviours in Debian and
it's called debconf. systemd-logind should engage debconf and prompt
on upgrade/install what the local behaviour should be. And until the
point comes that we have enough data to determine that we're
inconveniencing the majority of our users with the default (i.e.
they are choosing the other behaviour), we should leave the default
as how it's been.

> However, this really shouldn't be such a general problem: If/when
> we can change tmux and screen to use PAM or enable lingering, then
> I think we get the best of both worlds: Logging out would clean up
> properly, but the (relatively few) users who use screen/tmux on
> a PC would get the expected behaviour of those processes
> surviving.

There is more than tmux and screen. For instance, my shell knows
that I specifically do *not* want it to HUP background processes
when I leave the shell session:

  http://git.madduck.net/v/etc/zsh.git/blob/HEAD:/.zsh/zshrc/99_TODO#l31

Please do not assume that everything is as simple as how you're
portraying it to be. Linux is a very very very diverse ecosystem and
it grew to be such as a function of the principle of least surprise,
among other things.

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Bug#825394: systemd kill background processes after user logs out

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Martin Pitt <mp...@debian.org> [2016-05-29 11:13 +0200]:
> I believe this *is* it the expected thing to do on personal
> computers. This is certainly different in environments like
> universities where one often does put long-running stuff in the
> background, but this doesn't appeal to me as being the behaviour
> to optimize for.

The problem with this statement that I have is that we're the
universal operating system, and while that should not keep us from
"optimising", we really ought not light-heartedly move away from how
things have worked ever since the inception of multics/unix/linux.

It may well be that a non-negligible part of our user base would
benefit from this new behaviour, but at this stage, assuming that
the majority would want this change and calling those speaking up
here a "vocal minority" is IMHO not the right thing to do. Even if
you were to have a GR over this, I don't think the right response
should be to just fix it one way for everyone, especially not since
those people in charge of hundreds of systems have exactly one vote,
similar to those who just develop for their own home workstation.

We have a tool to handle divergent default behaviours in Debian and
it's called debconf. systemd-logind should engage debconf and prompt
on upgrade/install what the local behaviour should be. And until the
point comes that we have enough data to determine that we're
inconveniencing the majority of our users with the default (i.e.
they are choosing the other behaviour), we should leave the default
as how it's been.

> However, this really shouldn't be such a general problem: If/when
> we can change tmux and screen to use PAM or enable lingering, then
> I think we get the best of both worlds: Logging out would clean up
> properly, but the (relatively few) users who use screen/tmux on
> a PC would get the expected behaviour of those processes
> surviving.

There is more than tmux and screen. For instance, my shell knows
that I specifically do *not* want it to HUP background processes
when I leave the shell session:

  http://git.madduck.net/v/etc/zsh.git/blob/HEAD:/.zsh/zshrc/99_TODO#l31

Please do not assume that everything is as simple as how you're
portraying it to be. Linux is a very very very diverse ecosystem and
it grew to be such as a function of the principle of least surprise,
among other things.

-- 
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: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
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Bug#825254: Normalise resolution on save

[martin f krafft]

Package: gscan2pdf
Version: 1.4.0-1
Severity: wishlist

I generally scan with 300 DPI. Occasionally, I'll edit a page in
Gimp and then it gets saved with 70 DPI. As a result, this page will
be blown out of proportion in the resulting PDF.

It would be really cool if saving could also include an optional
normalisation step for the page resolution, such that all pages in
the final PDF have the same granularity.

Thanks,

-- System Information:
Debian Release: stretch/sid
  APT prefers unstable
  APT policy: (500, 'unstable'), (1, 'experimental')
Architecture: amd64 (x86_64)

Kernel: Linux 4.4.0-1-amd64 (SMP w/8 CPU cores)
Locale: LANG=en_NZ, LC_CTYPE=en_NZ.UTF-8 (charmap=UTF-8)
Shell: /bin/sh linked to /bin/dash
Init: systemd (via /run/systemd/system)

Versions of packages gscan2pdf depends on:
ii  imagemagick8:6.8.9.9-7+b2
ii  libconfig-general-perl 2.60-1
ii  libfilesys-df-perl 0.92-5+b2
ii  libgoo-canvas-perl 0.06-2+b2
ii  libgtk2-ex-simple-list-perl0.50-2
ii  libgtk2-imageview-perl 0.05-2+b2
ii  libhtml-parser-perl3.72-1
ii  libimage-magick-perl   8:6.8.9.9-7
ii  liblist-moreutils-perl 0.413-1+b1
ii  liblocale-gettext-perl 1.07-1+b1
ii  liblog-log4perl-perl   1.47-1
ii  libossp-uuid-perl [libdata-uuid-perl]  1.6.2-1.5+b2
ii  libpdf-api2-perl   2.025-2
ii  libproc-processtable-perl  0.53-1+b1
ii  libreadonly-perl   2.040-1
ii  librsvg2-common2.40.15-1
ii  libsane-perl   0.05-2+b3
ii  libset-intspan-perl1.19-1
ii  libtiff-tools  4.0.6-1
ii  libtry-tiny-perl   0.24-1
ii  sane-utils 1.0.25-2+b1

Versions of packages gscan2pdf recommends:
ii  djvulibre-bin  3.5.27.1-5
pn  libgtk2-ex-podviewer-perl  
ii  sane   1.0.14-11
ii  tesseract-ocr  3.04.01-4
ii  unpaper6.1-1+b1
ii  xdg-utils  1.1.1-1

gscan2pdf suggests no packages.

-- debconf-show failed


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`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
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Re: [Debconf-team] timing for sessions

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Allison Randal <alli...@lohutok.net> [2016-05-03 22:55 +0200]:
> > 10:00-10:45am First Talk/BoF
> > 10:45-11:15am Morning Tea/Coffee Break
> > 11:15-12:00pm Second Talk/BoF

Do we really need a break after the first session of the day, when
breakfast has just ended and lunch is about to begin?

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Re: [Debconf-team] timing for sessions

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Gunnar Wolf <sis...@gwolf.org> [2016-05-02 19:05 +0200]:
> Given what we have always seen at DebConf, I would:
> 
> - Start a bit later. Starting at 10AM feels more natural.

Also don't forget the morning briefings, if the local team want
them. Those might then be at 09:45 in the plenary room.

Have you guys looked at the DC15 schedule grid? We oriented
ourselves on DC14 and DC13 and it worked out quite well, I thought.

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: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
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Re: [Debconf-team] timing for sessions

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Tammy Manning <mungoj...@gmail.com> [2016-05-01 11:15 +0200]:
> Wouldn't it be better to keep 2 hours for lunch time 12-2pm. In one hour we
> won't be able to get through everyone eating lunch, especially according to
> the set up of any of the caterers.

Strong +1. Even 1½ hours is too tight for almost every conference
IME.

-- 
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: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
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Re: [libreoffice-users] Re: Deleting external links

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Andreas Säger  [2016-04-20 17:20 +0200]:
> DDE("soffice";"path_name","ref") and URL links
> 'file:///path/name.ods'#$Sheet.A1 are established by formula
> expressions. Before you can delete them in the links dialog, you
> have to remove all formula references.

I don't want to remove all links. I want to remove those links that
are no longer in use.

Here's a simple example: let's assume $A$1 has the contents
"blue.ods", and I fill $B1:$B100 with a formula along the lines of

  # effectively copy 100 cells from blue.ods#Sheet 1 column B
  DDE("soffice"; $A$1; CONCATENATE("Sheet 1.$B$"; ROW()))

This will generate 100 links.

Now I change "blue.ods" to "red.ods" and recalculate. Now I have 200
links, but 100 of those are no longer in use.

Does this make sense?

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Re: [libreoffice-users] Re: Err:504 with DDE links since LO 4→5 upgrade

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Andreas Säger  [2016-04-20 17:11 +0200]:
> Works for me. DDE works with system notation ("C:\path name\file
> name.ods") and with URL notation
> "file:///C:/path%20name/file%20name.ods". Try the system notation.

For testing purposes, I made a copy of the file and used the
absolute path in system notation. The result is the same.

I did notice that — with relative or with absolute paths — that the
DDE() calls work in some contexts, but not in others. It seems very
very brittle and I cannot figure out why.

> Call menu:Edit>Links to inspect links and delete unused links.

See my other question on the list: There are thousands of unused
links there and I can't delete them other than individually, which
can't be the solution.

I wouldn't be surprised if Libreoffice just can't handle all these
inactive links and chokes.

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[libreoffice-users] Deleting external links

[martin f krafft]

Hey list,

we are dealing with a rather complex spreadsheet and looking at
Edit→Links, there are literally thousands of links in there that are
no longer used anywhere in the document. Opening the document (and
saving, and sometimes editing, and …) takes several minutes, and we
think this is due to the sheer massive number of links.

We found that links can be individually deleted (broken), but we
were wondering if there's a way to do so in bulk? Or better yet, how
can I automatically remove unused references in this list?

Thanks for any hints,

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[libreoffice-users] Err:504 with DDE links since LO 4→5 upgrade

[martin f krafft]

Hey list,

We're dealing with a complex document containing hundreds of DDE
links. Worse yet, those DDE links are dynamically created, e.g.
using the following formula to reference filename ($B$2), sheet name,
($B$3), column ($B$6), and row (in column $A starting at $A8):

  =DDE("soffice";
CONCATENATE("file:./";$B$2);
CONCATENATE("$";$B$3;".$";$B$6;"$";$A8);
0)

This worked very well a year ago, but when we tried to open it as of
late, we get "Err:504" (parameter list error) all over.

The only thing that's changed is that we've since upgraded from
Libreoffice 4 to version 5.

Are you aware of (a) the relevant change, and (b) a remedy to this
problem, so that we can use DDE links as we used to with Libreoffice
5.1.2?

Thanks,

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Re: [Debconf-team] [Debconf-sponsors-team] Job Fair: team input please

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Bernelle Verster <bernel...@gmail.com> [2016-04-20 10:54 +0200]:
> Our first local Silver sponsor is making us work very hard :) but I
> think this is an excellent opportunity to build partnerships and find
> out how best to interact with sponsors. Their main interest is the job
> fair, and they have some questions, that I would like your input on
> please:

These are all not new points and it's a real shame that we have not
written up our experience for the final report, or elsewhere.

> 1. Stand space - do we have set limits?

We stayed clear from taping boundaries onto the ground, but we
measured the available space, did the maths and communicated the
area expectations to the sponsors. It all worked out and while some
sponsors used up more space than others, nobody complained or got
into each others' way.

I'd still think it's necessary to communicate the rules up front so
that it's easier to enact when necessary.

If you're planning 2×2 as your e-mail said, then that's pretty
tight. I'd probably go for 3×3 instead if possible, and also
communicate that there'll be 1–2m between stalls of space.

> 2. Finger food allowed?

In our case it wasn't possible due to the regulations by the hostel.
That'll be the main thing to check. But at the same time, we also
have a liability as organisers and should make sure that the finger
food is professionally prepared and served, and not be afraid to ask
for documentation proving basic food standards.

> 3. Any general requirements?

Setup and teardown times
Noise

Other than that, I'd suggest to communicate to people that you're
open to anything but that you'd ask sponsors to engage up front if
they want to do something beyond the ordinary. I think your (quoted)
e-mail did a good job at that. But what did you mean with "no naked
ladies"?? Can there be naked men? ;)

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Re: [Debconf-team] Suggestion for DC17+ fundraising brochure: advertising service vs. ad space

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Louis-Philippe Véronneau <poll...@riseup.net> [2016-04-12 22:56 
+0200]:
> If you have numbers about "unique site visits" this does means you are
> logging IP addresses, right?

I really don't know enough about the available technology on this.
IP addresses is probably how awstats does it, but one could also use
a cookie, which is somewhat "worse" in that it's more
distinct. Obviously it makes someone more trackable, but at the end
of the day, it'll depend on how you use the information. There are
benefits to this — whether applicable to DebConf or not is
a separate question of equal relevance — and I'm suggesting to
evaluate the equation.

But allow me a thought: I'd assume right now that apache serving
debconf.org is writing logs including IP addresses (I would also not
be surprised if Ganneff disabled this, but the machines are in
Germany and there are probably legal obligations to store them).
I think it'd already be a great gain for someone to grep these data
once and produce a "20.000 IP addresses visited between the DC15
press release and the end of the conference", and then to never look
at the data again until the next set, when s/DC15/DC16/.

This is valuable information that people we contact can use to pitch
our conference in their boards and committees. We are Debian and as
such I do believe that many of our sponsors are not just buying our
services, but are happy to support us, certainly the person who
we're talking to. Providing the additional information will simply
make their job easier.

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Re: [Debconf-team] Suggestion for DC17+ fundraising brochure: advertising service vs. ad space

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Jerome Charaoui <jer...@riseup.net> [2016-04-12 21:08 +0200]:
> I have no knowledge of how current operations are set up, but I'm a
> little concerned that if these numbers were to be collected in a
> privacy-respectful way (eg. honoring DNT), then the numbers offered
> would not compare very favorably against other similar "investments" by
> potential sponsors.

I need to set something straight that's obviously causing confusion.

My suggestion did not involve "tracking" visitors or increasing our
visibility with SEO or what-have-you.

I merely tried to suggest to publish an awstats-like, number of
unique site visits, which can be an estimation, just as long as we
arrived at it not in unreasonable fashion.

I am specifically not trying to suggest that we change anything to
get these numbers. Just that it's a common mistake in fundraising to
sell advertising space when sponsors are looking for reach.

If we estimate (based on some real numbers) that we got roughly
20.000 unique visits throughout the period leading up to and during
DC15, then that's already more information than just saying we'll
put the logo on our website. Then the sponsor knows that we're not
talking 50.000 but also not just 5.000 and that will be incredibly
helpful to them.

Anyway, enough said. I wish I had foreseen the misunderstanding and
could have foregone the initial counter-reaction. Sorry for the
aggressive tone.

Is the above now clearer and do you think it's a good idea to
properly check our offering in the light of the aforementioned
fundraising pitfall?

-- 
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Re: [Debconf-team] Suggestion for DC17+ fundraising brochure: advertising service vs. ad space

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Holger Levsen <hol...@layer-acht.org> [2016-04-12 12:20 +0200]:
> > Numerous sponsors have been asking specifics about the services we
> how many exactly?

During DC15 fundraising, it was at least every second. For DC16,
I saw 4 so far, if memory serves right.

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Re: [Debconf-team] Suggestion for DC17+ fundraising brochure: advertising service vs. ad space

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Giacomo Catenazzi <c...@debian.org> [2016-04-12 09:56 +0200]:
> I don't think we ever sell logo space to sponsors, …

You're obviously free to disagree and assume a different view of
what we're doing, but please don't stop other people's efforts just
because you don't see their value.

Numerous sponsors have been asking specifics about the services we
offer, including the number of video viewers, website impressions,
attendance and length of job fair, etc.. I am proposing that we
should provide this information up front, which happens to match the
advice from experienced fundraisers, and I would not be surprised if
that actually translated to more money raised for the organisation
of DebConf and travel sponsorship.

We are not in the business of collecting donations from companies.
If you're not convinced, take a look at our brochure and keep in
mind that we send invoices to sponsors, which they then pay. By
definition then, their contributions are not donations. We are
fundraising and selling services to sponsors, and this is what our
sponsors want and why they give us money. As Debian we do enjoy
a somewhat special treatment and don't get treated with the same
sort of rigour applicable in other contractual situations.

But this isn't a reason why we shouldn't (always) strive to improve
what we're doing. Please don't stand in the way just because you
prefer to look at things differently.

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madd...@debconf.org> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
  `-  DebConf16: Cape Town: http://debconf16.debconf.org
  DebConf17: Montreal: https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf17


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[Debconf-team] Suggestion for DC17+ fundraising brochure: advertising service vs. ad space

[martin f krafft]

Hello,

I am currently working with a bunch of highly professional
fundraisers and learning. There are also a couple of ideas to pass
along for us to consider for the next fundraising brochure(s).

The most common mistake in fundraising (which we also make) is to
sell advertising space ("logo on website"), rather than to sell the
service ("logo on website, 1,234 unique visitors /month").

With a bit of effort, I am sure we can get those numbers to
reasonable accuracy, and then include them in the next brochure.

In the hope that you find this convincing, I've started a wiki page
to collect these numbers. Please have a look to see if you can
contribute. The numbers need not be 100% accurate. For instance,
knowing that our website had ca. 20,000 hits in August 2015 is
a better data point than stating that it had 11,342 visits in March
2016.

Please do make sure to include these specifics and the source from
where you gathered the data to facilitate updating.

https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/Fundraising/Reach

Cheers,

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madd...@debconf.org> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
  `-  DebConf16: Cape Town: http://debconf16.debconf.org
  DebConf17: Montreal: https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf17


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Re: [Debconf-team] Debconf 16 travel budget

[martin f krafft]

also sprach David Bremner <da...@tethera.net> [2016-04-06 01:52 +0200]:
> - These numbers don't include accomodation and food bursaries. The
> budgeting for that was very complicated/confusing last year. We
> would be happy to have a more concrete number to work with.

I am sorry to hear this. I am aware that I bothered you all with too
many implementation details, and many found the complexity of the
assumptions and scenarios confusing.

However, the budget file did have an overview tab which was really
the only tab intended for mass consumption, while the other tabs
contained the details in case more information is needed.

If you would take a peek at the screenshot of the DC15 budget
document, could you fathom what a "more concrete number to work
with" would look like?

http://scratch.madduck.net/dc15_budget.png

Thank you!

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madd...@debconf.org> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
  `-  DebConf16: Cape Town: http://debconf16.debconf.org
  DebConf17: Montreal: https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf17


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Missing letters after suspend

[martin f krafft]

Hi,

I am not sure the following is an X.org issue, but I hope you'll let
me start here.

Please see attached screenshot. This is on a laptop and occurs
occasionally after I bring the system back from suspend. Everything
works just fine, except certain letters (it's always a different set
it seems) are just not displaying.

At first I thought this is limited to GTK apps (Firefox,
Thunderbird, ssh-ask-pass, gscan2pdf), but I also see this with e.g.
the Awesome window manager, which does not link with GTK.

Have you encountered this before? What is going on? Which software
is at fault?

How can I fix this (without rebooting)?

Thank you!

-- 
@martinkrafft | http://madduck.net/ | http://two.sentenc.es/
 
#define emacs eighty megabytes and constantly swapping.
 
spamtraps: madduck.bo...@madduck.net


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Re: Flickering single display in multi-head XRandR setup

[martin f krafft]

Hi Andreas,

Thank you for taking your time to reply. I've since followed up
having found the problem, and I think it must be one of the DP ports
on the graphics card.

Now, you write:

> Perhaps unthinkable, but the connectors of the card might be
> implemented / wired up asymmetrically, e.g. due to an ickily
> varying length of traces, or EMI issues.

This leads me to believe that the connector hardware itself could be
at fault. Seriously, is DP *that* finicky and subject to connection
failures? I'd have thought that it being 2016, the industry would
have finally gotten the hang of it, especially after screwing up
HDMI so badly.

Thanks,

-- 
@martinkrafft | http://madduck.net/ | http://two.sentenc.es/
 
"never eat more than you can lift."
   -- miss piggy
 
spamtraps: madduck.bo...@madduck.net


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Bug#819174: Fails to start with missing cache dir

[martin f krafft]

Package: mopidy
Version: 2.0.0-1
Severity: serious

If /var/cache/mopidy is lost (e.g. because /var/cache is a tmpfs),
mopidy fails to start. However, the FHS specifies that files in
/var/cache must not be relied upon.

The problem here is that mopidy tries to create the directory but
fails due to permissions. Either the directory needs to be created
by systemd, or another location used as a fallback (e.g. /run).

● mopidy.service - Mopidy music server
   Loaded: loaded (/lib/systemd/system/mopidy.service; enabled; vendor preset: 
enabled)
   Active: failed (Result: exit-code) since Thu 2016-03-24 14:49:15 CET; 8s ago
  Process: 21065 ExecStart=/usr/bin/mopidy --config 
/usr/share/mopidy/conf.d:/etc/mopidy/mopidy.conf (code=exited
 Main PID: 21065 (code=exited, status=1/FAILURE)

Mar 24 14:49:15 albatross mopidy[21065]:   File 
"/usr/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/mopidy/__main__.py", line 147, 
Mar 24 14:49:15 albatross mopidy[21065]: 
path.get_or_create_dir(config['core']['cache_dir'])
Mar 24 14:49:15 albatross mopidy[21065]:   File 
"/usr/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/mopidy/internal/path.py", line 
Mar 24 14:49:15 albatross mopidy[21065]: os.makedirs(dir_path, 0o755)
Mar 24 14:49:15 albatross mopidy[21065]:   File "/usr/lib/python2.7/os.py", 
line 157, in makedirs
Mar 24 14:49:15 albatross mopidy[21065]: mkdir(name, mode)
Mar 24 14:49:15 albatross mopidy[21065]: OSError: [Errno 13] Permission denied: 
'/var/cache/mopidy'
Mar 24 14:49:15 albatross systemd[1]: mopidy.service: Main process exited, 
code=exited, status=1/FAILURE
Mar 24 14:49:15 albatross systemd[1]: mopidy.service: Unit entered failed state.
Mar 24 14:49:15 albatross systemd[1]: mopidy.service: Failed with result 
'exit-code'.

-- System Information:
Debian Release: stretch/sid
  APT prefers unstable
  APT policy: (500, 'unstable'), (1, 'experimental')
Architecture: amd64 (x86_64)

Kernel: Linux 4.4.0-1-amd64 (SMP w/8 CPU cores)
Locale: LANG=en_NZ, LC_CTYPE=en_NZ.UTF-8 (charmap=UTF-8)
Shell: /bin/sh linked to /bin/dash
Init: systemd (via /run/systemd/system)

Versions of packages mopidy depends on:
ii  adduser  3.114
ii  debconf [debconf-2.0]1.5.59
ii  gir1.2-gst-plugins-base-1.0  1.6.3-1
ii  gir1.2-gstreamer-1.0 1.6.3-1
ii  gstreamer1.0-plugins-good1.6.3-1
ii  gstreamer1.0-plugins-ugly1.6.3-1
ii  init-system-helpers  1.29
ii  lsb-base 9.20160110
ii  python-gst-1.0   1.6.2-1+b1
ii  python-pkg-resources 20.3.1-1
ii  python-pykka 1.2.1-2
ii  python-requests  2.9.1-3
ii  python-tornado   4.2.1-1+b2
pn  python:any   

Versions of packages mopidy recommends:
pn  gstreamer1.0-alsa
ii  gstreamer1.0-pulseaudio  1.6.3-1
ii  gstreamer1.0-tools   1.6.3-1

Versions of packages mopidy suggests:
pn  mopidy-doc  

-- Configuration Files:
/etc/mopidy/mopidy.conf [Errno 13] Permission denied: u'/etc/mopidy/mopidy.conf'

-- debconf-show failed


-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
  `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing systems


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Bug#819174: Fails to start with missing cache dir

[martin f krafft]

Package: mopidy
Version: 2.0.0-1
Severity: serious

If /var/cache/mopidy is lost (e.g. because /var/cache is a tmpfs),
mopidy fails to start. However, the FHS specifies that files in
/var/cache must not be relied upon.

The problem here is that mopidy tries to create the directory but
fails due to permissions. Either the directory needs to be created
by systemd, or another location used as a fallback (e.g. /run).

● mopidy.service - Mopidy music server
   Loaded: loaded (/lib/systemd/system/mopidy.service; enabled; vendor preset: 
enabled)
   Active: failed (Result: exit-code) since Thu 2016-03-24 14:49:15 CET; 8s ago
  Process: 21065 ExecStart=/usr/bin/mopidy --config 
/usr/share/mopidy/conf.d:/etc/mopidy/mopidy.conf (code=exited
 Main PID: 21065 (code=exited, status=1/FAILURE)

Mar 24 14:49:15 albatross mopidy[21065]:   File 
"/usr/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/mopidy/__main__.py", line 147, 
Mar 24 14:49:15 albatross mopidy[21065]: 
path.get_or_create_dir(config['core']['cache_dir'])
Mar 24 14:49:15 albatross mopidy[21065]:   File 
"/usr/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/mopidy/internal/path.py", line 
Mar 24 14:49:15 albatross mopidy[21065]: os.makedirs(dir_path, 0o755)
Mar 24 14:49:15 albatross mopidy[21065]:   File "/usr/lib/python2.7/os.py", 
line 157, in makedirs
Mar 24 14:49:15 albatross mopidy[21065]: mkdir(name, mode)
Mar 24 14:49:15 albatross mopidy[21065]: OSError: [Errno 13] Permission denied: 
'/var/cache/mopidy'
Mar 24 14:49:15 albatross systemd[1]: mopidy.service: Main process exited, 
code=exited, status=1/FAILURE
Mar 24 14:49:15 albatross systemd[1]: mopidy.service: Unit entered failed state.
Mar 24 14:49:15 albatross systemd[1]: mopidy.service: Failed with result 
'exit-code'.

-- System Information:
Debian Release: stretch/sid
  APT prefers unstable
  APT policy: (500, 'unstable'), (1, 'experimental')
Architecture: amd64 (x86_64)

Kernel: Linux 4.4.0-1-amd64 (SMP w/8 CPU cores)
Locale: LANG=en_NZ, LC_CTYPE=en_NZ.UTF-8 (charmap=UTF-8)
Shell: /bin/sh linked to /bin/dash
Init: systemd (via /run/systemd/system)

Versions of packages mopidy depends on:
ii  adduser  3.114
ii  debconf [debconf-2.0]1.5.59
ii  gir1.2-gst-plugins-base-1.0  1.6.3-1
ii  gir1.2-gstreamer-1.0 1.6.3-1
ii  gstreamer1.0-plugins-good1.6.3-1
ii  gstreamer1.0-plugins-ugly1.6.3-1
ii  init-system-helpers  1.29
ii  lsb-base 9.20160110
ii  python-gst-1.0   1.6.2-1+b1
ii  python-pkg-resources 20.3.1-1
ii  python-pykka 1.2.1-2
ii  python-requests  2.9.1-3
ii  python-tornado   4.2.1-1+b2
pn  python:any   

Versions of packages mopidy recommends:
pn  gstreamer1.0-alsa
ii  gstreamer1.0-pulseaudio  1.6.3-1
ii  gstreamer1.0-tools   1.6.3-1

Versions of packages mopidy suggests:
pn  mopidy-doc  

-- Configuration Files:
/etc/mopidy/mopidy.conf [Errno 13] Permission denied: u'/etc/mopidy/mopidy.conf'

-- debconf-show failed


-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
  `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing systems


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Flickering single display in multi-head XRandR setup

[martin f krafft]

Hello,

I have a new Radeon R9 390 card, driving three monitors, two on
DisplayPort and one on DVI, in this order from left to right:

  DP0 — DVI0 — DP1

Please find my xorg.conf attached, as well as the log file.

There is something very weird going on, which you may witness in the
video downloadable here:
http://scratch.madduck.net/xorg-display-flicker.mp4 (8Mb)

The left-most display (DP0) keeps turning off and on (or resets
itself), and generally, it flickers and the pixels jiggle around.
The other two displays are perfectly fine. The monitor on DP1 is of
exactly the same make as that on DP0.

Do you have any idea what might be going on? Why would the left-most
display of three, all connected to the same card, act up, while the
other two are just fine and stable?

What could be done to diagnose and fix this?

Here is the relevant xrandr output:

  % xrandr | grep -A2 '\Screen "Default Screen Section" (0)
[  7417.379] (**) |   |-->Monitor ""
[  7417.379] (==) No device specified for screen "Default Screen Section".
Using the first device section listed.
[  7417.379] (**) |   |-->Device "Radeon R9 290 [DP0]"
[  7417.379] (==) No monitor specified for screen "Default Screen Section".
Using a default monitor configuration.
[  7417.379] (**) Option "DontZap" "yes"
[  7417.379] (==) Automatically adding devices
[  7417.379] (==) Automatically enabling devices
[  7417.379] (==) Automatically adding GPU devices
[  7417.379] (==) Max clients allowed: 256, resource mask: 0x1f
[  7417.379] (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/X11/cyrillic" does not exist.
[  7417.379]Entry deleted from font path.
[  7417.379] (==) FontPath set to:
/usr/share/fonts/X11/misc,
/usr/share/fonts/X11/100dpi/:unscaled,
   

Re: [Debconf-team] Budget and allocated money

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Giacomo Catenazzi <c...@cateee.net> [2016-03-24 07:06 +0100]:
> The allocated money could be (and should be) in line with the
> budget (and its amendments), but the budget should not be a list
> of only allocated money. E.g. in last meeting: video team expenses
> are probably nearer to 5k then 0k, so we must put 5k in budget,
> but it is ok not to allocate yet 5k of money for them (so that 5k
> is not yet free spendable by the video team).

Dear Cate,

I'd like to pick up on your differentiation of budgeted and
allocated funds to be able to understand better where you're coming
from. I am not trying to cause troubles or troll.

Budgeting is a process, which (IMHO) may be roughly divided into two
parts: planning and execution, and I think your differentiation
loosely corresponds to those.

I think that when you say that we should budget 110% or twice the
amount we're allocating, you are saying that we should plan the
budget conservatively (overestimate expenses), but cut individual
budget lines at the time of approval, so that when the budget is
approved, a lesser amount actually gets allocated to and can be
spent by the team.

At the end of the conference, the actual expense will then be
measured not against the initial budget, but against the actual
allocations.

Is this an accurate representation?

We may well be better off speaking of budget and allocations in the
future, if it increase clarity for everyone. However, it might also
confuse those of us regularly working with budgets outside DebConf,
because there, a budget is both: a forecast during the planning
phase, and a controlling resource during the exection (after the
approval), with budget lines and budget cuts and accounts meeting
budget, or going over or staying under, etc..

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madd...@debconf.org> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
  `-  DebConf16: Cape Town: http://debconf16.debconf.org
  DebConf17: Montreal: https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf17


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Bug#818879: sfdisk: Fails to dump when ext4 signature found

[martin f krafft]

Package: util-linux
Version: 2.27.1-6
Severity: normal
File: /sbin/sfdisk
Tags: upstream

In jessie, sfdisk would exit with 0 and print nothing when invoked
on e.g. a LV containing an ext4 filesystem. Tools like backupninja
use the output from --list to iterate over all devices and --dump
the partition table for each. For a device that has no partition
table, the result would simply be empty, but no error reported
— which I think is the correct response:

  # sfdisk -d /dev/mapper/vg-root; echo $?
  0

Unfortunately, commit 8a8d204cd112b3e18bce9c9611495f870bd3b24b (I
think) modified the behaviour of --dump:

  # sfdisk -d /dev/mapper/vg-root; echo $?
  /dev/mapper/vg-root: device contains a valid 'ext4' signature; it is strongly 
recommended to wipe the device with wipefs(8) if this is unexpected, in order 
to avoid possible collisions
  sfdisk: failed to dump partition table: Success
  1

Apart from the sillyness to append "Success" to the last line,
I also don't think the exit code is correct. There is no partition
table, so return an empty result and be done with it.

If upstream disagrees with this, then maybe a flag could be
introduced to override this behaviour, or --list could be told to
only return devices with partition tables.

Thanks,

-- System Information:
Debian Release: stretch/sid
  APT prefers unstable
  APT policy: (500, 'unstable'), (1, 'experimental')
Architecture: amd64 (x86_64)

Kernel: Linux 4.4.0-1-amd64 (SMP w/8 CPU cores)
Locale: LANG=en_NZ, LC_CTYPE=en_NZ.UTF-8 (charmap=UTF-8)
Shell: /bin/sh linked to /bin/dash
Init: systemd (via /run/systemd/system)

Versions of packages util-linux depends on:
ii  libblkid1   2.27.1-6
ii  libc6   2.22-3
ii  libfdisk1   2.27.1-6
ii  libmount1   2.27.1-6
ii  libncursesw56.0+20160213-1
ii  libpam0g1.1.8-3.2
ii  libselinux1 2.4-3+b1
ii  libsmartcols1   2.27.1-6
ii  libsystemd0 229-2
ii  libtinfo5   6.0+20160213-1
ii  libudev1229-2
ii  libuuid12.27.1-6
ii  sysvinit-utils  2.88dsf-59.3
ii  zlib1g  1:1.2.8.dfsg-2+b1

util-linux recommends no packages.

Versions of packages util-linux suggests:
ii  dosfstools  3.0.28-2
ii  kbd 2.0.3-2
ii  util-linux-locales  2.27.1-6

-- debconf-show failed


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: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
  `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing systems


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Bug#783732: status

[martin f krafft]

What's the status of mailman3 for Debian? Has there been any work
done, and if so, where?

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
  `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing systems


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Bug#818465: NSS integration

[martin f krafft]

Package: vmm
Version: 0.6.2-1
Severity: wishlist

I found it useful to make the vmm mail user and domain data
available to NSS. On the one hand, this allows me to directly jump
to mail home directories, e.g.

  cd ~foobar%example.org

but it also helps Spamassassin and other tools identify the home
directory.

Please consider adding this information and the attached file to the
package docs.

Note that I replaced the '@' character with '%' for various reasons,
but mostly due to the way my shell completion is set up (special
handling of the '@' character). YMMV.

To enable, I created the attached /etc/nss-pgsql.conf file for use
by libnss-pgsql2 and added 'pgsql' after 'compat' on the passwd and
group lines of /etc/nsswitch.conf.

Note that you *need* to install a caching layer. I've found unscd to
work quite well. If you don't do this, then there will be
occasional deadlocks if using e.g. Spamassassin for local delivery.

-- System Information:
Debian Release: stretch/sid
  APT prefers unstable
  APT policy: (500, 'unstable'), (1, 'experimental')
Architecture: amd64 (x86_64)

Kernel: Linux 4.4.0-1-amd64 (SMP w/8 CPU cores)
Locale: LANG=en_NZ, LC_CTYPE=en_NZ.UTF-8 (charmap=UTF-8)
Shell: /bin/sh linked to /bin/dash
Init: systemd (via /run/systemd/system)


-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
  `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing systems
connectionstring= hostaddr=127.0.0.1 dbname=mailsys user=nss 
password= 
connect_timeout=1

# you can use anything postgres accepts as table expression

# Must return "usernames", 1 column, list
getgroupmembersbygid= SELECT local_part||'%'||domainname AS name FROM users 
JOIN domain_name USING (gid) WHERE gid = $1 AND is_primary
# Must return passwd_name, passwd_passwd, passwd_gecos, passwd_dir, 
passwd_shell, passwd_uid, passwd_gid
getpwnam= SELECT local_part||'%'||domainname AS name, '*' AS passwd, 
'vmm virtual user' AS gecos, domaindir ||'/'||uid AS homedir, '/bin/true' AS 
shell, uid, gid FROM users JOIN domain_data USING (gid) JOIN domain_name USING 
(gid) WHERE local_part = split_part($1, '%', 1) AND domainname = split_part($1, 
'%', 2) AND is_primary
# Must return passwd_name, passwd_passwd, passwd_gecos, passwd_dir, 
passwd_shell, passwd_uid, passwd_gid
getpwuid= SELECT local_part||'%'||domainname AS name, '*' AS passwd, 
'vmm virtual user' AS gecos, domaindir ||'/'||uid AS homedir, '/bin/true' AS 
shell, uid, gid FROM users JOIN domain_data USING (gid) JOIN domain_name USING 
(gid) WHERE uid = $1 AND is_primary
# All users
allusers= SELECT local_part||'%'||domainname AS name, '*' AS passwd, 
'vmm virtual user' AS gecos, domaindir ||'/'||uid AS homedir, '/bin/true' AS 
shell, uid, gid FROM users JOIN domain_data USING (gid) JOIN domain_name USING 
(gid) WHERE is_primary = 't'
# Must return group_name, group_passwd, group_gid
getgrnam= SELECT domainname, '*' AS passwd, gid, NULL AS members FROM 
domain_name WHERE domainname = $1 and is_primary
# Must return group_name, group_passwd, group_gid
getgrgid= SELECT domainname, '*' AS passwd, gid, NULL AS members FROM 
domain_name WHERE gid = $1 and is_primary
# Must return gid.  %s MUST appear first for username match in where clause
groups_dyn   = SELECT domainname, '*' AS passwd, n.gid, NULL AS members 
FROM domain_name n JOIN users u on (n.gid=u.gid) WHERE n.is_primary AND 
u.local_part||'%'||n.domainname = $1 and n.gid <> $2
allgroups   = SELECT domainname, '*' AS passwd, gid, NULL AS members FROM 
domain_name WHERE is_primary


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Re: [Debconf-team] Registration Feature Request: Organization / Company Name field

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Allison Randal <alli...@lohutok.net> [2016-03-16 17:06 +0100]:
> If we're doing that, perhaps we should also provide a "badge line
> 1" field? Also optional, and if they leave it blank we'll default
> to their full name from the system. Some people prefer to have
> their IRC nick big and bold, for example.

All in favour of leaving it up to everyone how to represent
themselves, but I think it'd also be good if we encouraged proper
behaviour. Free-form *will* get abused and even though it won't
matter for the regulars (who'll get a laugh out of it), it'll
present a barrier to newcomers.

We've received a bit (not much) of negative feedback about the DC15
badge swapping that took place towards the end of the conference
— which was just a fun hack, and probably the people involved didn't
consider all consequences.

Let them write whatever they want on their badges, but please also
make sure they know that badges are primarily for others to identify
you, not for amusement purposes.

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madd...@debconf.org> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
  `-  DebConf16: Cape Town: http://debconf16.debconf.org
  DebConf17: Montreal: https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf17


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Bug#818370: Fails to bind ports but suggests it started

[martin f krafft]

also sprach martin f krafft <madd...@debian.org> [2016-03-16 15:05 +0100]:
> I have no idea why it failed to bind the port on ::1. Nothing else
> has this port bound.

The loopback interface was not up.

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
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Bug#818370: Fails to bind ports but suggests it started

[martin f krafft]

Package: unbound
Version: 1.5.8-1
Severity: normal

Starting unbound.service yields the following, which means that
unbound was started, startup failed, but systemd thinks everything
is fine.

● unbound.service
   Loaded: loaded (/etc/init.d/unbound; bad; vendor preset: enabled)
  Drop-In: /run/systemd/generator/unbound.service.d
   └─50-insserv.conf-$named.conf, 50-unbound-$named.conf
   Active: active (exited) since Wed 2016-03-16 15:03:27 CET; 5s ago
 Docs: man:systemd-sysv-generator(8)
  Process: 22336 ExecStop=/etc/init.d/unbound stop (code=exited, 
status=0/SUCCESS)
  Process: 22353 ExecStart=/etc/init.d/unbound start (code=exited, 
status=0/SUCCESS)

Mar 16 15:03:27 fishbowl systemd[1]: Starting unbound.service...
Mar 16 15:03:27 fishbowl unbound-anchor[22362]: /var/lib/unbound/root.key has 
content
Mar 16 15:03:27 fishbowl unbound[22353]: Starting DNS server: 
unbound[1458137007] unbound[22366:0] error: 
Mar 16 15:03:27 fishbowl unbound[22353]: [1458137007] unbound[22366:0] fatal 
error: could not open ports
Mar 16 15:03:27 fishbowl unbound[22353]:  failed!
Mar 16 15:03:27 fishbowl systemd[1]: Started unbound.service.


I have no idea why it failed to bind the port on ::1. Nothing else
has this port bound.

-- System Information:
Debian Release: stretch/sid
  APT prefers unstable
  APT policy: (500, 'unstable'), (1, 'experimental')
Architecture: amd64 (x86_64)
Foreign Architectures: i386

Kernel: Linux 4.4.0-1-amd64 (SMP w/4 CPU cores)
Locale: LANG=en_NZ, LC_CTYPE=en_NZ.UTF-8 (charmap=UTF-8)
Shell: /bin/sh linked to /bin/dash
Init: systemd (via /run/systemd/system)

Versions of packages unbound depends on:
ii  adduser 3.114
ii  dns-root-data   2015052300+h+1
ii  libc6   2.22-3
ii  libevent-2.0-5  2.0.21-stable-2+b1
ii  libfstrm0   0.2.0-1
ii  libprotobuf-c1  1.2.1-1
ii  libpython2.72.7.11-4
ii  libssl1.0.2 1.0.2g-1
ii  openssl 1.0.2g-1
ii  unbound-anchor  1.5.8-1

unbound recommends no packages.

unbound suggests no packages.

-- Configuration Files:
/etc/unbound/unbound.conf changed [not included]
/etc/unbound/unbound.conf.d/root-auto-trust-anchor-file.conf [Errno 2] No such 
file or directory: 
u'/etc/unbound/unbound.conf.d/root-auto-trust-anchor-file.conf'

-- no debconf information


-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
  `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing systems


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Re: [Debconf-team] Donations to DebConf

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Giacomo Catenazzi <c...@debian.org> [2016-03-17 14:38 +0100]:
> Should we handle donation also this year?
> Using SPI? Onsite? Both?

DebConf e.V. in Germany is also still open:

  http://debconf15.debconf.org/verein.xhtml

I'd say: all the channels we have, but definitely on-site (including
a donation box for cash and drinks coupons). We took in 4.200 € in
donations for DC15, of which 2.550 € were collected on site.

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madd...@debconf.org> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
  `-  DebConf16: Cape Town: https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf16
  DebConf17 in your country? https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf17


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Re: [Debconf-team] Diversity Sponsorships

[martin f krafft]

also sprach David Bremner <da...@tethera.net> [2016-03-16 16:19 +0100]:
> How, if at all do you (collectively) want this to interact with the
> regular bursaries process?

It's my understanding that the fundamental difference between
bursaries and outreach is that the former is concerned with vetting
financial aid applications, while the latter is more about actively
getting people to come.

Molly's initial explanation at DC14 involved a hypothetical envelope
she'd pass to someone, with everything they needed to come:
invitation, background info, airline voucher, confirmation of paid
room etc., so as to make them feel a lot more welcome and to
facilitate their decision to join us, rather than expecting them to
figure out how to sign up and apply for financial aid.

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madd...@debconf.org> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
  `-  DebConf16: Cape Town: http://debconf16.debconf.org
  DebConf17: Montreal: https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf17


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Re: [Debconf-team] Diversity Sponsorships

[martin f krafft]

also sprach David Bremner <da...@tethera.net> [2016-03-17 22:16 +0100]:
> I'd like to keep any additions to the bursaries instructions
> relatively brief just because we already know people won't read
> them.

Why do we give money to those people then (and accept making our
lives harder)?

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madd...@debconf.org> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
  `-  DebConf16: Cape Town: http://debconf16.debconf.org
  DebConf17: Montreal: https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf17


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Re: quantity of DPL candidates?

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Ian Jackson <ijack...@chiark.greenend.org.uk> [2016-03-15 17:26 
+0100]:
> I think it reflects the fact that being the DPL is an
> unfortunately large commitment for a single person.
> 
> There have been various proposals to replace the single DPL with
> a board, which I think are a good idea.  But I worry that
> decisionmaking would be too slow if everything had to be done by
> committee.  Perhaps we could have a board which granted each board
> member broad authority (which they would be expected to exercise
> for urgent or uncontroversial matters) and left within-board
> voting to dealing with controversies or big decisions.

What sort of decision-making are we talking about? We require the
DPL to sign off on expenses, but this could be solved with
a (collaboratively generated) budget. What other decisions are in
the DPL realm? I don't mean the constitutionally assigned roles, but
those decisions which the DPL wouldn't defer to someone who knows
better already? For if there weren't many of those, another
consideration would be just to get rid of the DPL position and
spread powers wider and closer to where the work is being done.

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
  `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing systems
 
"in the country of the blind,
 the one-eyed man is not king.
 he is taken to be a hallucinating lunatic."
 -marshall mcluhan


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[Aptitude-devel] Bug#246672: aptitude: quit directly instead of pressing a key to continue

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Manuel A. Fernandez Montecelo <manuel.montez...@gmail.com> 
[2016-03-14 14:36 +0100]:
> So implemented now.

Wow, thank you very much! I'll be testing it shortly!

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
  `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing systems
 
dies ist eine manuell generierte email. sie beinhaltet
tippfehler und ist auch ohne großbuchstaben gültig.


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Bug#246672: aptitude: quit directly instead of pressing a key to continue

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Manuel A. Fernandez Montecelo <manuel.montez...@gmail.com> 
[2016-03-14 14:36 +0100]:
> So implemented now.

Wow, thank you very much! I'll be testing it shortly!

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
  `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing systems
 
dies ist eine manuell generierte email. sie beinhaltet
tippfehler und ist auch ohne großbuchstaben gültig.


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Bug#816899: net backend no longer works since upgrade to jessie

[martin f krafft]

Package: sane-utils
Version: 1.0.26~git20151121-1
Followup-For: Bug #816899

I believe I found the source of this bug report: saned hard-codes
the local_only argument of sane_get_devices() to TRUE, which causes
the backends to skip all remote scanners. Hence, in my case, the
hpaio:/net/* scanner is not returned by sane_get_devices() and hence
saned cannot export it.

The reason this hasn't been a problem in the past is that hplip
seems to have ignored the flag prior in the versions up until and
including 3.12 in wheezy. However, this has since been fixed¹ (could
not find anything in the changelog though).

¹) https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=743593#c18

Is there a reason why saned must hard-code local_only to true? Why
not make this configurable, ideally with a command-line option?

Thanks,

-- System Information:
Debian Release: stretch/sid
  APT prefers unstable
  APT policy: (500, 'unstable'), (1, 'experimental')
Architecture: amd64 (x86_64)
Foreign Architectures: i386

Kernel: Linux 4.4.0-1-amd64 (SMP w/4 CPU cores)
Locale: LANG=en_NZ, LC_CTYPE=en_NZ.UTF-8 (charmap=UTF-8)
Shell: /bin/sh linked to /bin/dash
Init: systemd (via /run/systemd/system)

Versions of packages sane-utils depends on:
ii  adduser3.113+nmu3
ii  debconf [debconf-2.0]  1.5.58
ii  init-system-helpers1.29
ii  libavahi-client3   0.6.32~rc+dfsg-1
ii  libavahi-common3   0.6.32~rc+dfsg-1
ii  libc6  2.22-1
ii  libieee1284-3  0.2.11-12
ii  libjpeg62-turbo1:1.4.2-2
ii  libsane1.0.25+git20150927-1
ii  libsystemd0229-2
ii  libusb-1.0-0   2:1.0.20-1
ii  update-inetd   4.43

sane-utils recommends no packages.

Versions of packages sane-utils suggests:
pn  avahi-daemon  
ii  unpaper   6.1-1

-- no debconf information


-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
  `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing systems


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Re: [sane-devel] saned does not find hpaio scanner

[martin f krafft]

I traced the problem to

  
https://sourceforge.net/p/hplip/mailman/hplip-devel/thread/46a1257e.5060...@cab.cnea.gov.ar/

tl;dr: hplip changed and now the hpaio backend no longer ignores the
local_only flag. In the past, saned/hpaio was able to access network
printers, even though saned asked it to search local_only. This has
now been "fixed" to avoid a deadlock situation:

  https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=743593#c18

The question now becomes: how can I tell saned to please also
consider non-local devices, i.e. pass local_only=0 to the
sane_hpaio_get_devices() call?

Or is there a better solution?

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
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[Aptitude-devel] Bug#246672: aptitude: quit directly instead of pressing a key to continue

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Manuel A. Fernandez Montecelo <manuel.montez...@gmail.com> 
[2016-03-11 00:22 +0100]:
> So having that into account, what's the reply to the question
> above?

It seems a bit too much to have to return to ncurses and let
aptitude not only rebuild its cache, but also build views etc.

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
  `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing systems
 
"distrust all those who love you extremely
 upon a very slight acquaintance and without any visible reason."
-- lord chesterfield


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Bug#246672: aptitude: quit directly instead of pressing a key to continue

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Manuel A. Fernandez Montecelo <manuel.montez...@gmail.com> 
[2016-03-11 00:22 +0100]:
> So having that into account, what's the reply to the question
> above?

It seems a bit too much to have to return to ncurses and let
aptitude not only rebuild its cache, but also build views etc.

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
  `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing systems
 
"distrust all those who love you extremely
 upon a very slight acquaintance and without any visible reason."
-- lord chesterfield


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[sane-devel] saned does not find hpaio scanner

[martin f krafft]

Hey,

We have a scanner available through a network and since we wanted to
avoid having to install the hplip drivers on all workstations, we
thought we'd employ saned to make the scanner available on the
network.

This worked fine until we upgraded to Debian jessie / sane 1.0.24
(from 1.0.22).

Now, while I can access the scanner from the "scan server" just
fine:

  # scanimage -L
  device `hpaio:/net/HP_LaserJet_3052?ip=192.168.14.30' is a Hewlett-Packard 
HP_LaserJet_3052 all-in-one

saned does not know about it anymore:

  # SANE_DEBUG_DLL=255 SANE_DEBUG_NET=255 SANE_DEBUG_HPAIO=255 sudo -Eu saned 
saned -d
  [saned] main: starting debug mode (level 2)
  [saned] saned (AF-indep+IPv6) from sane-backends 1.0.24 starting up
  [saned] check_host: access by remote host: 192.168.14.33
  [saned] init: access granted to madduck@192.168.14.33
  [sanei_debug] Setting debug level of dll to 255.
  [dll] sane_init: SANE dll backend version 1.0.13 from sane-backends 1.0.24
  [dll] sane_init/read_dlld: attempting to open directory `./dll.d'
  [dll] sane_init/read_dlld: attempting to open directory `/etc/sane.d/dll.d'
  [dll] sane_init/read_dlld: using config directory `/etc/sane.d/dll.d'
  [dll] sane_init/read_dlld: considering /etc/sane.d/dll.d/libsane-extras
  [dll] sane_init/read_config: reading dll.d/libsane-extras
  [dll] add_backend: adding backend `ls5000'
  [dll] sane_init/read_dlld: considering /etc/sane.d/dll.d/hplip
  [dll] sane_init/read_config: reading dll.d/hplip
  [dll] add_backend: adding backend `hpaio'
  [dll] sane_init/read_dlld: done.
  [dll] sane_init/read_config: reading dll.conf
  [dll] sane_get_devices
  [dll] load: searching backend `hpaio' in 
`/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/sane:/usr/lib/sane'
  [dll] load: trying to load `/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/sane/libsane-hpaio.so.1'
  [dll] load: dlopen()ing `/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/sane/libsane-hpaio.so.1'
  [dll] init: initializing backend `hpaio'
  [sanei_debug] Setting debug level of hpaio to 255.
  [hpaio] sane_hpaio_init(): scan/sane/hpaio.c 323
  [dll] init: backend `hpaio' is version 1.0.0
  [hpaio] sane_hpaio_get_devices(local=1): scan/sane/hpaio.c 342
  [dll] load: searching backend `ls5000' in 
`/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/sane:/usr/lib/sane'
  [dll] load: trying to load 
`/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/sane/libsane-ls5000.so.1'
  [dll] load: dlopen()ing `/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/sane/libsane-ls5000.so.1'
  [dll] init: initializing backend `ls5000'
  [dll] init: backend `ls5000' is version 1.0.0
  [dll] sane_get_devices: found 0 devices
  [saned] bailing out, waiting for children...
  [saned] bail_out: all children exited

Why is the libsane-hpaio.so backend not finding the scanner that
scanimage can access?

Thanks,

-- 
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 people who prepare the carcasses for dissection in biology
 laboratories."
 -- michael moyer, executive editor of _popular science_
 
spamtraps: madduck.bo...@madduck.net


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Bug#246672: aptitude: quit directly instead of pressing a key to continue

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Manuel A. Fernandez Montecelo <manuel.montez...@gmail.com> 
[2016-03-10 18:04 +0100]:
> I don't know if your complaint is more the speed side of reloading
> the cache, or that you just don't see the need and don't want
> curses to be restored just for quitting.  In the latter case,
> maybe it would not be very difficult to implement what you ask,
> but the reloading of the cache would continue to be there.

Shouldn't the reloading of the cache happen in the background right
away? Why do I need to hit a key for it to start. Instead, start it
right away, and let the user hit a key to continue or 'q' to quit.
If s/he continues, then the UI can pick up the background process.
If 'q' is pressed instead, say that "aptitude is shutting down"
until the background process returns.

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
  `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing systems
 
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 it is flat and slimy
 and has gills through which it can see."
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Bug#816899: net backend no longer works since upgrade to jessie

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Jörg Frings-Fürst <deb...@jff-webhosting.net> [2016-03-07 03:58 
+0100]:
> If you use the version 1.0.25+git20150927-1 then please update
> to 1.0.26~git20151121-1 from experimental or 1.0.25-2 from testing
> / unstable and test it again.

I have upgraded to experimental. Unfortunately, the problem
persists.

> If you are using the version 1.0.24-8 at jessie please update
> to 1.0.24-8+deb8u1.

I cannot find such a version anywhere.

https://packages.debian.org/jessie/sane-utils

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
  `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing systems
 
"when faced with a new problem, the wise algorithmist
 will first attempt to classify it as np-complete.
 this will avoid many tears and tantrums as
 algorithm after algorithm fails."
-- g. niruta


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Bug#817246: gziptoany fails with signal 13 since upgrade to jessie

[martin f krafft]

Package: cups-core-drivers
Version: 2.1.3-3
Severity: normal
File: /usr/lib/cups/filter/gziptoany

Since the upgrade to jessie, we cannot print any longer. Here is the
relevant debug log:

  Started filter /usr/lib/cups/filter/gziptoany (PID 7212)
  Started filter /usr/lib/cups/filter/hpcups (PID 7213)
  Started backend /usr/lib/cups/backend/hp (PID 7214)
  prnt/hpcups/HPCupsFilter.cpp 530: cupsRasterOpen failed, fd = 0
  PID 7212 (/usr/lib/cups/filter/gziptoany) did not catch or ignore signal 13.
  PID 7213 (/usr/lib/cups/filter/hpcups) stopped with status 1.
  Hint: Try setting the LogLevel to "debug" to find out more.
  prnt/backend/hp.c 902: ERROR: null print job total=0
  PID 7214 (/usr/lib/cups/backend/hp) exited with no errors.
  End of messages
  printer-state=3(idle)
  printer-state-message="Filter failed"
  printer-state-reasons=none

as you can see, gziptoany failed without any additional information
that could be useful (the LogLevel hint does not help when debug
level is already selected).

This is reproducible with various different PDF files and only
occurs when printing happens via the network (using ipps://…). The
printer is advertised using the (old) cups broadcast, using
cups-browsed on both server and client. Printing locally on the
print server works fine.

-- System Information:
Debian Release: stretch/sid
  APT prefers unstable
  APT policy: (500, 'unstable'), (1, 'experimental')
Architecture: amd64 (x86_64)
Foreign Architectures: i386

Kernel: Linux 4.4.0-1-amd64 (SMP w/4 CPU cores)
Locale: LANG=en_NZ, LC_CTYPE=en_NZ.UTF-8 (charmap=UTF-8)
Shell: /bin/sh linked to /bin/dash
Init: systemd (via /run/systemd/system)

Versions of packages cups-core-drivers depends on:
ii  cups-daemon2.1.3-3
ii  cups-filters-core-drivers  1.8.2-3
ii  libc6  2.21-9
ii  libcups2   2.1.3-3

Versions of packages cups-core-drivers recommends:
pn  avahi-daemon  

cups-core-drivers suggests no packages.

-- no debconf information


-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
  `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing systems


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Bug#817246: gziptoany fails with signal 13 since upgrade to jessie

[martin f krafft]

Package: cups-core-drivers
Version: 2.1.3-3
Severity: normal
File: /usr/lib/cups/filter/gziptoany

Since the upgrade to jessie, we cannot print any longer. Here is the
relevant debug log:

  Started filter /usr/lib/cups/filter/gziptoany (PID 7212)
  Started filter /usr/lib/cups/filter/hpcups (PID 7213)
  Started backend /usr/lib/cups/backend/hp (PID 7214)
  prnt/hpcups/HPCupsFilter.cpp 530: cupsRasterOpen failed, fd = 0
  PID 7212 (/usr/lib/cups/filter/gziptoany) did not catch or ignore signal 13.
  PID 7213 (/usr/lib/cups/filter/hpcups) stopped with status 1.
  Hint: Try setting the LogLevel to "debug" to find out more.
  prnt/backend/hp.c 902: ERROR: null print job total=0
  PID 7214 (/usr/lib/cups/backend/hp) exited with no errors.
  End of messages
  printer-state=3(idle)
  printer-state-message="Filter failed"
  printer-state-reasons=none

as you can see, gziptoany failed without any additional information
that could be useful (the LogLevel hint does not help when debug
level is already selected).

This is reproducible with various different PDF files and only
occurs when printing happens via the network (using ipps://…). The
printer is advertised using the (old) cups broadcast, using
cups-browsed on both server and client. Printing locally on the
print server works fine.

-- System Information:
Debian Release: stretch/sid
  APT prefers unstable
  APT policy: (500, 'unstable'), (1, 'experimental')
Architecture: amd64 (x86_64)
Foreign Architectures: i386

Kernel: Linux 4.4.0-1-amd64 (SMP w/4 CPU cores)
Locale: LANG=en_NZ, LC_CTYPE=en_NZ.UTF-8 (charmap=UTF-8)
Shell: /bin/sh linked to /bin/dash
Init: systemd (via /run/systemd/system)

Versions of packages cups-core-drivers depends on:
ii  cups-daemon2.1.3-3
ii  cups-filters-core-drivers  1.8.2-3
ii  libc6  2.21-9
ii  libcups2   2.1.3-3

Versions of packages cups-core-drivers recommends:
pn  avahi-daemon  

cups-core-drivers suggests no packages.

-- no debconf information


-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
  `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing systems


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Re: Problem with partnership form

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Paul Wise <p...@debian.org> [2016-03-06 16:24 +0100]:
> In January I discovered that the only non-archive email address behind
> partn...@debian.org is bouncing. This means that Debian needs a new
> partners team. I informed the DPL about this in the hope that he would
> put out a call for volunteers.

Who could put Catalyst on the website meanwhile?

The partners programme is due for revision. It'll take a lot longer
than we should wait to add new people.

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madd...@debconf.org> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
  `-  DebConf16: Cape Town: http://debconf16.debconf.org
  DebConf17: Montreal: https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf17


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Bug#816899: net backend no longer works since upgrade to jessie

[martin f krafft]

Package: sane-utils
Version: 1.0.25+git20150927-1
Severity: important

Since I upgraded our "scan server" to jessie (sane-utils 1.0.22.7-4
to 1.0.24-8), clients cannot use it via the network anymore. Suffice
it to say that scanimage -L locally still works, but that's
accessing the device directly and not going via saned.

When a client makes a request (scanimage -L), they are told that no
scanners were identified, but this happens after a successful
conversation with the server:

  % SANE_DEBUG_NET=255 scanimage -L
  [sanei_debug] Setting debug level of net to 255.
  [net] sane_init: authorize != null, version_code != null
  [net] sane_init: SANE net backend version 1.0.14 (AF-indep+IPv6) from 
sane-backends 1.0.25git
  [net] sane_init: Client has little endian byte order
  [net] sane_init: searching for config file
  [net] sane_init: trying to add scanner
  [net] add_device: adding backend scanner
  [net] add_device: backend scanner added
  [net] sane_init: done reading config
  [net] sane_init: evaluating environment variable SANE_NET_HOSTS
  [net] sane_init: evaluating environment variable SANE_NET_TIMEOUT
  [net] sane_init: done
  [net] sane_get_devices: local_only = 0
  [net] connect_dev: trying to connect to scanner
  [net] connect_dev: [0] connection succeeded (IPv6)
  [net] connect_dev: sanei_w_init
  [net] connect_dev: net_init (user=madduck, local version=1.0.3)
  [net] connect_dev: freeing init reply (status=Success, remote version=1.0.3)
  [net] connect_dev: done
  [net] sane_get_devices: finished (0 devices)

  No scanners were identified. If you were expecting something different,
  check that the scanner is plugged in, turned on and detected by the
  sane-find-scanner tool (if appropriate). Please read the documentation
  which came with this software (README, FAQ, manpages).
  [net] sane_exit: exiting
  [net] net_avahi_cleanup: stopping thread
  [net] net_avahi_cleanup: done
  [net] sane_exit: closing dev 0x562a410df020, ctl=126
  [net] sane_exit: finished.

The server sees the request and authorizes it based on the subnet:

  # saned -d
  [saned] main: starting debug mode (level 2)
  [saned] saned (AF-indep+IPv6) from sane-backends 1.0.24 starting up
  [saned] check_host: access by remote host: 2001:a60:f0fb:0:2ad2:44ff:fe8c:5bd
  [saned] init: access granted to madduck@2001:a60:f0fb:0:2ad2:44ff:fe8c:5bd
  [saned] bailing out, waiting for children...
  [saned] bail_out: all children exited

Even if I crank up debug level on the server to 255 (-d255), I don't
get any additional information, other than the following four lines
before it says "bailing out":

  [saned] process_request: waiting for request
  [saned] process_request: got request 1
  [saned] process_request: waiting for request
  [saned] process_request: got request 10

I cannot access the scanner via the net backened from localhost
either, so firewalling is also not in the way. Apart, I've verified
that the daemon listens on the right sockets, and the port is open
all the way between clients and process.

To me, it looks like saned is either not seeing any scanners, or not
passing them on. However, the saned user can access the device just
fine (su -c 'scanimage -L' saned) and running saned as root also
doesn't improve things.

In short, either something drastically changed without
a corresponding NEWS.Debian entry, or something broke.

-- System Information:
Debian Release: stretch/sid
  APT prefers unstable
  APT policy: (500, 'unstable'), (1, 'experimental')
Architecture: amd64 (x86_64)
Foreign Architectures: i386

Kernel: Linux 4.4.0-1-amd64 (SMP w/4 CPU cores)
Locale: LANG=en_NZ, LC_CTYPE=en_NZ.UTF-8 (charmap=UTF-8)
Shell: /bin/sh linked to /bin/dash
Init: systemd (via /run/systemd/system)

Versions of packages sane-utils depends on:
ii  adduser3.113+nmu3
ii  debconf [debconf-2.0]  1.5.58
ii  init-system-helpers1.29
ii  libavahi-client3   0.6.32~rc+dfsg-1
ii  libavahi-common3   0.6.32~rc+dfsg-1
ii  libc6  2.21-9
ii  libieee1284-3  0.2.11-12
ii  libjpeg62-turbo1:1.4.2-2
ii  libsane1.0.25+git20150927-1
ii  libsystemd0229-2
ii  libusb-1.0-0   2:1.0.20-1
ii  update-inetd   4.43

sane-utils recommends no packages.

Versions of packages sane-utils suggests:
pn  avahi-daemon  
ii  unpaper   6.1-1

-- no debconf information


-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
  `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing systems


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Bug#816886: Duplicate text in description

[martin f krafft]

Package: cups-browsed
Version: 1.8.2-3
Severity: minor

The APT description contains a duplicate paragraph:

 cups-browsed is also useful with a CUPS >= 1.6 client to allow the
 latter to browse the printer list of CUPS < 1.6 servers (by using
 the old 'cups' protocol in BrowseRemoteProtocols).
 .
 cups-browsed is also useful with a CUPS >= 1.6 server to allow CUPS
 < 1.6 clients to browse its printer list (by using the old 'cups'
 protocol in BrowseLocalProtocols).

-- System Information:
Debian Release: stretch/sid
  APT prefers unstable
  APT policy: (500, 'unstable'), (1, 'experimental')
Architecture: amd64 (x86_64)
Foreign Architectures: i386

Kernel: Linux 4.4.0-1-amd64 (SMP w/4 CPU cores)
Locale: LANG=en_NZ, LC_CTYPE=en_NZ.UTF-8 (charmap=UTF-8)
Shell: /bin/sh linked to /bin/dash
Init: systemd (via /run/systemd/system)

Versions of packages cups-browsed depends on:
ii  init-system-helpers  1.29
ii  libavahi-client3 0.6.32~rc+dfsg-1
ii  libavahi-common3 0.6.32~rc+dfsg-1
ii  libavahi-glib1   0.6.32~rc+dfsg-1
ii  libc62.21-9
ii  libcups2 2.1.3-3
ii  libglib2.0-0 2.47.1-1
ii  libldap-2.4-22.4.42+dfsg-2+b2

Versions of packages cups-browsed recommends:
pn  avahi-daemon  

cups-browsed suggests no packages.

-- no debconf information


-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
  `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing systems


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Bug#816886: Duplicate text in description

[martin f krafft]

Package: cups-browsed
Version: 1.8.2-3
Severity: minor

The APT description contains a duplicate paragraph:

 cups-browsed is also useful with a CUPS >= 1.6 client to allow the
 latter to browse the printer list of CUPS < 1.6 servers (by using
 the old 'cups' protocol in BrowseRemoteProtocols).
 .
 cups-browsed is also useful with a CUPS >= 1.6 server to allow CUPS
 < 1.6 clients to browse its printer list (by using the old 'cups'
 protocol in BrowseLocalProtocols).

-- System Information:
Debian Release: stretch/sid
  APT prefers unstable
  APT policy: (500, 'unstable'), (1, 'experimental')
Architecture: amd64 (x86_64)
Foreign Architectures: i386

Kernel: Linux 4.4.0-1-amd64 (SMP w/4 CPU cores)
Locale: LANG=en_NZ, LC_CTYPE=en_NZ.UTF-8 (charmap=UTF-8)
Shell: /bin/sh linked to /bin/dash
Init: systemd (via /run/systemd/system)

Versions of packages cups-browsed depends on:
ii  init-system-helpers  1.29
ii  libavahi-client3 0.6.32~rc+dfsg-1
ii  libavahi-common3 0.6.32~rc+dfsg-1
ii  libavahi-glib1   0.6.32~rc+dfsg-1
ii  libc62.21-9
ii  libcups2 2.1.3-3
ii  libglib2.0-0 2.47.1-1
ii  libldap-2.4-22.4.42+dfsg-2+b2

Versions of packages cups-browsed recommends:
pn  avahi-daemon  

cups-browsed suggests no packages.

-- no debconf information


-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
  `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing systems


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Problem with partnership form

[martin f krafft]

Hello,

I was told the following about a problem with the form to register
as a new partner:

  I have been trying to submit a proposal to become a Debian partner here:
  https://www.debian.org/partners/partners-form

  Unfortunately, once I have filled out the form and hit submit, I get this:
  “Forbidden
  You don't have permission to access /cgi-bin-local/cgiemail/partners-form.txt 
on
  this server.”

The form data are as follows, and maybe you could import them to
save Jason the extra work.

--
Company name: Catalyst
Your name: Jason Ryan
Will you be the primary contact? Yes
Your email: ja...@catalyst.net.nz
Address: L6, 150 Willis Street, Wellington, New Zealand
Telephone: 64-4-8032393
website : http://catalyst.net.nz
 
Brief description of your company:
Catalyst is a Wellington based, global open source company. We have offices in
New Zealand, Australia and the United Kingdom and work with public and private
sector organisations around the world.  
 
Primary products/services:
Bespoke development, cloud hosting, e-learning, CMS (Drupal and Silverstripe).
 
How are you currently using Debian and how do you plan
to utilize Debian in the future?
Many of our server are Debian. Now there is an LTS we are planning on moving 
more of them onto Debian from Ubuntu.
 
What are you doing to aid the Debian project?
Please provide detailed information.
Sponsorships of Debconf in 2014 and 2016. Regular bug squashing parties for our 
staff on company time. Planning to allocate 20% on one FTE to paid Debian 
packaging work.
 
How is Debian helping to accomplish your goals?
As a Free and Open Source software company, Debian supports our hosting, 
application development and our community building work. It is also the 
distribution that is most closely aligned with our own values.
 
What could Debian do to help you better achieve your goals?
LTS has been the single biggest contribution to allowing us to migrate servers 
to Debian. We would like to be able to contribute more to ensure the long term 
viability of this project.
 
Any other comments / questions you may have:
Nope.

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madd...@debconf.org> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
  `-  DebConf16: Cape Town: http://debconf16.debconf.org
  DebConf17: Montreal: https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf17


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Re: [Debconf-team] pre-registration or registation opens and CfP announcements

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Allison Randal <alli...@lohutok.net> [2016-03-04 19:11 +0100]:
> Registration is no longer necessary to submit an event (that was
> an implementation detail of summit), we can remove that text from
> the CFP.

I think you still need to create a user account or authenticate
through SSO though, but no additional information especially
pertaining to the conference is required.

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madd...@debconf.org> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
  `-  DebConf16: Cape Town: https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf16
  DebConf17 in your country? https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf17


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___
Debconf-team mailing list
Debconf-team@lists.debconf.org
http://lists.debconf.org/mailman/listinfo/debconf-team

Re: questions about audit and budget processes

[martin f krafft]

Daniel,

as I said before, you raise points that are (a) mostly valid and (b)
not new. I don't want to discuss this without concrete steps coming
of it, and all you ever do is ask questions.

Allow me to refute your point about portfolio management though, and
offer two ideas about alternative uses of the money.

also sprach Daniel Pocock <dan...@pocock.pro> [2016-03-03 15:18 +0100]:
> Why wouldn't people also potentially volunteer some time for
> portfolio management?

I'd consider this a really bad idea. Portfolio management is perhaps
*the* profession that benefits the most from a professional (or at
least one of them), contract-based separation between client and
actor, with extrinsic motivation of the actor. Even that's
impossible to properly tie down, but I certainly would never want to
see some people point fingers at others and claiming that they have
lost us money because the markets didn't do as they'd have hoped.

Would these volunteers invest in Microsoft? Google? Apple? Nestlé?
Weapons manufacturers? Companies that exploit resources?

> Personally I'd rather avoid seeing Debian become either a lender
> or borrower, unless the transaction was very conservative or
> highly strategic.

FSconservancy would be highly strategic, and while we don't have any
other uses for the money, they can use it to defend our cause, and
we'd benefit even if the loan was never repaid.

An alternative use of our money would be to spend it on sprints,
outsourcing of tasks, such as accountancy (and organisation of
sprints/events) to third parties, as well as using some of it to
design and fund a proper marketing campaign.

I'll eat a broom (with stick, German idiom) if we didn't manage to
replace the substance with a cash flow before it's depleted,
assuming it's done properly with enough freedom and the project's
backing.

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
  `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing systems
 
"women love us for our defects.
 if we have enough of them,
 they will forgive us everything,
 even our gigantic intellects."
  -- oscar wilde


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Re: questions about audit and budget processes

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Martin Wuertele <mar...@wuertele.net> [2016-03-03 14:06 +0100]:
> Greenpeace internationl: IFRS for SME
> Medecins Sans Frontieres: IFRS
> Human Rights Watch: US GAAP
> WWF: UK GAAP
> Human Rights Watch: US GAAP

Apart from their non-profit nature, all of these are run like
businesses, employ hundreds of people and handle handles hundreds of
tens of thousand of transactions each year.

> Especially IFRS for SME fits quite well the needs of NPO/NGO
> organisations similar to the Debian project.

Aiming for such a standard put the bar even higher in terms of
accountancy standards, and require consolidation at the end of the
fiscal year. At least in Germany, the accounting standard is also
defined by your turnover. For instance, DebConf e.V. isn't even
allowed to do submit a P statement, but the authorities require
a simple income-expense report instead, which cannot always be
simply inferred from a ledger (cf. accruals and deferrals,
Rechnungsabgrenzungsposten).

I certainly won't stand in the way of someone else committing to do
the work (and to keep up with it), or the project agreeing to step
up the pay for an accountant with the necessary knowledge, but
I don't see the benefit, for reasons stated above. At the moment,
Debian is a holding with very few transactions, and we don't even
have a proper tax home.

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
  `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing systems
 
"and the sea isn't green
 and i love the queen
 and what exactly is a dream?
 and what exactly is a joke?"
  -- syd barrett


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Re: questions about audit and budget processes

[martin f krafft]

Daniel,

the points you bring up are hardly new. You are also mostly talking
about keeping books, not auditing.

The biggest problem with keeping books seems to be that it's
a merciless and boring job, but one that needs to be done without fail
(or else it's about as useful as not doing it at all). This is why
I've argued in the past that we should not rely on volunteers to do
this, but instead outsource it to a third party, and establish
procedures to require trusted organisations to send their reports
there regularly or get their trust revoked.

Or would you be willing to invest all the time required to bring our
books to status quo, such that it even makes sense for us to start
keeping them properly?

In my opinion, neither a balance sheet nor a P statement make any
sense and would be far too difficult to create and maintain. We
wouldn't even know what standard to us. IFRS? US-GAAP? Neither of
those are particularly applicable to an organisation of our nature.

I think we should stick to a simple ledger and publish a simplified,
categorised income list at regular intervals. If done
sensibly in hledger, then you get a useful balance sheet for free.

> e) just looking at the SPI balance sheet[4], the amount of money
>that appears to be held in trust appears to be far higher than
>actual expenditure.

Yes. See https://lists.debian.org/debian-project/2015/03/msg00020.html
for my explanation. In short, I think we're too cautious to spend
"substance" and merely scrape by each year with minimum effort. If we
had a dependable cash flow, we could easily and would spend more money
on sprints etc..

> Should the DPL delegate a team to specifically look after long term
> investment of money that Debian doesn't have any immediate plans
> for?

IMHO no.

> Simply keeping such large amounts of money in a bank deposit at
> minimal interest rates appears comparable to using a default
> password but making decisions about such money should be something
> that is separate from the audit team.

I disagree, especially given the low inflation levels. We also have
nowhere near enough money to implement a sensibly balanced,
conservative asset strategy, nor do we have a liquidity plan or
long-term vision as to what to do with those funds.

Anyway, a reasonable investment strategy for Debian with enough
flexibility wouldn't get us more than 2–3% p.a. in interest. Even if
you went ahead to invest 3/4 of our liquidity in such asset classes,
we're talking about 7k p.a. in interest, minus the fees and time
required for management. IMHO, that's not worth the effort, nor the
discussions.

I'd much rather see marketing efforts increase and us building a cash
flow, then learning how to spend it, and then slowly reducing our
substance to a more reasonable level, e.g. through (interest-free)
lending of a large fraction of it to the FSConservancy, or so…

-- 
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: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
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# vim:tw=70


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Bug#720864: [Pkg-dns-devel] Bug#720864: Fails to bind IPv6 socket during DAD

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Robert Edmonds <edmo...@debian.org> [2016-03-01 20:14 +0100]:
> I like the first suggestion even more:
> 
> Watch rtnetlink and react properly to network configuration changes
> as they happen. This is usually the nicest solution, but not always
> the easiest.
> 
> But that is significantly more development work.

Would this enable me to say that unbound should just listen on iface
"eth0"?

> By the way, have you tried "ip-transparent: yes"? According to

No!

> I wonder if IP_FREEBIND would actually be a better fit for the
> functionality described in unbound.conf than IP_TRANSPARENT, since
> unbound.conf doesn't mention any of the proxying properties of
> IP_TRANSPARENT.

I agree.

Meanwhile, I found that adding

  dad-attempts 200

(standard ifupdown feature)

to the iface inet6 stanza in /etc/network/interface would make ifup
wait up to 20 seconds for the DAD to complete… and block meanwhile.
This is enough for my interface to come up with a non-tentative
address and so by the time boot resumes, the address is fully
configured.

-- 
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`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
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Bug#720864: Fails to bind IPv6 socket during DAD

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Robert Edmonds <edmo...@debian.org> [2013-09-23 19:16 +0200]:
> i think the best thing to do, however, is to just make sure in the
> distro that when static IPv6 addressing is used, that we fully bring up
> the network before starting any network daemons.

You'll be at odds with the systemd mafia. On
https://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/systemd/NetworkTarget/ at
the bottom, they specifically write:

  If you write a server: if you want to listen on other, explicitly
  configured addresses, consider using the IP_FREEBIND sockopt
  functionality of the Linux kernel. This allows your code to bind
  to an address even if it is not actually (yet or ever) configured
  locally. This also makes your code robust towards network
  configuration changes.

And in fact, I do agree with them.

Do you think adding IP_FREEBIND is an option?

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
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`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
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Bug#765910: closed by Michael Gilbert <mgilb...@debian.org> (Bug#814693: fixed in isc-dhcp 4.3.3-9)

[martin f krafft]

reopen 765910
thanks

also sprach Debian Bug Tracking System <ow...@bugs.debian.org> [2016-02-29 
00:33 +0100]:
>* Touch dhcpd.leases during postinst if it doesn't exist (closes: #765910).

Thanks for tackling this issue. Unfortunately, I must have expressed
myself unclearly. The fix does not solve the problem. Postinst is
run at installation time. If the file is removed after installation
(e.g. because /var/lib/dhcp is a tmpfs and gets cleaned on every
boot), then the server won't start any longer.

Presumably one might argue that software ought to be able to rely on
the persistence of files in /var/lib, and I won't disagree with
that. However, given the nature of the file, nonexistence is not
a show-stopper at all, and instaed, the daemon itself or at least
the startup mechanism should ensure the file gets created unless
present.

Thanks for your (re-)consideration,

-- 
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Re: [Debconf-team] Event "tracks"

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Carl Karsten <c...@nextdayvideo.com> [2016-02-15 12:07 +1300]:
> I have seen tags be done well and less so.  I am not sure what the
> magic is.

Not claiming that I have said PhD in tagology (Enrico Zini knows
a lot about this topic…), but I think taxonomy is a huge deal here.
Either give everyone space to manage tags using their own taxonomy
(cf. usertags in the BTS), or make sure that you have a very
well-organised, self-explanatory, extensible taxonomy (cf. debtags).

Conversely, I've never been a huge fan of services like del.icio.us
and others, which let you slab anything onto anything really,
exposing it to everyone else. If you tag something with
"interesting", that shouldn't make it "interesting" for me,
automatically.

A pre-defined list of tracks would constitute a very limited
taxonomy, and I fully agree with your sentiment that tracks are
essentially just tags with the (possibly limiting) "feature" that an
event can only be a member of one track. Like that silly
directories-and-files structure we are still stuck with, and it's
the 21st century…

> I hope Waffer has support for tags, or if it doesn't, maybe that
> is a better feature to add instead of track? (and then use tags to
> manage tracks)

We are working on a solution that would allow us to affix free-form
key-value pairs to objects in wafer, accessible via a REST API. If
we manage to put it in place in time, then I suspect it'll get used
a bit by orga, but long-term, I'd hope to be able to open this to
the public such that you can tag events any way you like, and even
share your tag cloud with others. And there could obviously be a tag
cloud curated by the content team with a well-defined taxonomy.

However, we're talking two things here: one is pure information
management mostly useful to the attendees (I think), whereas the
idea of "owned tracks" has wide implications on the way that we
arrive at the conference schedule.

-- 
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: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
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Re: [Debconf-team] Event "tracks"

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Asheesh Laroia <ashe...@asheesh.org> [2016-02-14 09:32 +1300]:
> If people have ideas for tracks, I could possibly be convinced to
> do "own" one such track, which would mean doing the work of
> finding speakers who canA talk interestingly on topics within that
> track. I'd love to hear about people's ideas for tracks.

It's a great idea to explore, I think. The reason why I questioned
the need for tracks is because I (personally) don't see much of
a value of using tracks only to colour-code the schedule, and if
that were our only use, I'd rather leave out this additional form
field and data point. However, if we are ready to explore "owning"
tracks as you suggest, then adding the functionality is well worth
it.

  Allow me to mention linux.conf.au (LCA) in this context. The
  conference runs for only 3 days, but is preceeded by 2 days of
  "miniconfs". For the main conference, keynote speakers are
  actively sought, the rest is submissions-based. Since the
  conference enjoys a very good reputation, the organisers regularly
  get flooded with submissions, and they've made it a habit to pass
  off rejections to miniconfs, if there is a match. My proposal this
  year was passed on to the sysadmin miniconf, for instance.

  Miniconfs on the other hand are similar to the idea of "owned
  tracks". There's a chiefly responsible person setting the theme
  and drafting up a schedule, inviting speakers and vetting
  submissions passed over from the main conference.

In the past few years, we've provided a list of possible tracks in
the call-for-submissions, as a means to help people to come up with
ideas. This list hasn't really changed, and I am not sure we'll
be able to reap much of a benefit if we keep the entries static as
they are and try to find people to take responsibility for each.
That seems a bit like creating arbitrary subtasks and assigning them
to people, which isn't particularly motivating, if it even works.

But how about opening this list and calling for track idea
submissions early enough in the cycle, such that people are
motivated to make "their" idea happen, while also bringing fresh
ideas to the conference, continuously? We'd still have to have
a couple of standard tracks, of course…

Assuming we get a few ideas back, the conference organisers could
then pick some and include them in the call-for-submissions.
Meanwhile, the track owners would also seek for themselves, and when
submissions come in to the content team, they'd refer to the
appropriate track owners.

It'd mean allocating slabs of space in the schedule and bestowing
responsibility of the scheduling to the owners. It might not work
right away, but long-term, this could take quite the burden off the
content team.

  So Asheesh might have proposed the "Applying Debian values and
  techniques to the Web" track, someone else might suggest
  a "Packaging with Git" track, and there might be a "Creative
  content with Debian" theme, or "Debian for kids", etc.. Add
  these to the standard "bits from Debian teams" group of talks, as
  well as the "miscellaneous" pool.

  The next year might be all different.

  And we'd be able to advertise a whole lot of content (general
  ideas anyway) well before finalising the schedule.

I am all in favour and I'd be willing to take ownership of a track,
if this is something we think we can still hammer to shape for DC16…

-- 
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: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
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Re: Good keyboard

[martin f krafft]

also sprach rlhar...@oplink.net <rlhar...@oplink.net> [2016-02-14 11:20 +1300]:
> For the Dvorak layout, just select the appropriate xkb map
> (APPLICATIONS->SETTINGS->KEYBOARD).

Apart from there being no "Applications" menu on my Debian system… ;)


This won't address the issue of having keys labeled physically.
I can touch type, but there are times when I really appreciate to
just being able to hit the key as advertised without having to first
position, gain my bearing, and then move…

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
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 practices by micro$oft. hello pot? it's kettle on line two."
-- michael robertson


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Re: Good keyboard

[martin f krafft]

also sprach jdd <j...@dodin.org> [2016-02-14 07:14 +1300]:
> >http://www.kinesis-ergo.com/shop/advantage-for-pc-mac/
> >
> >Worth every penny.
> >
> wow... needs some learning, so Dvorak probably better :-)

You used to be able to get these with Dvorak, not sure if that's
still the case.

I liked the keyboard, but using it for coding, Vim, etc. just wasn't
very easy. The F-keys are unusably small, and to use keys like
Insert/End/Home etc. always requires you to move your hands as
I found it not doable with just the thumbs.

Hth,

-- 
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: :'  :  proud Debian developer
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Bug#814371: Misleading warning about using apt-get module, which does not exist

[martin f krafft]

Package: ansible
Version: 2.0.0.2-2
Severity: normal

I am running 'apt-get clean' from the command module and ansible is
trying to be super smart:

  changed: [fishbowl]
   [WARNING]: Consider using apt-get module rather than running apt-get

Yeah, except there is no apt-get module.

  dpkg -L ansible | grep -c apt[-_]get
  0

.o0O(feature creep)

-- System Information:
Debian Release: stretch/sid
  APT prefers unstable
  APT policy: (500, 'unstable'), (1, 'experimental')
Architecture: amd64 (x86_64)
Foreign Architectures: i386

Kernel: Linux 4.3.0-1-amd64 (SMP w/4 CPU cores)
Locale: LANG=en_NZ, LC_CTYPE=en_NZ.UTF-8 (charmap=UTF-8)
Shell: /bin/sh linked to /bin/dash
Init: systemd (via /run/systemd/system)

Versions of packages ansible depends on:
ii  python-crypto 2.6.1-6
ii  python-httplib2   0.9.1+dfsg-1
ii  python-jinja2 2.8-1
ii  python-netaddr0.7.18-1
ii  python-paramiko   1.15.3-1
ii  python-pkg-resources  18.8-1
ii  python-yaml   3.11-3
pn  python:any

Versions of packages ansible recommends:
pn  python-selinux  

Versions of packages ansible suggests:
pn  sshpass  

-- debconf-show failed


-- 
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Bug#812953: Include complete patch list in -v output

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Víctor M. Jáquez L. <vjaq...@igalia.com> [2016-02-10 02:45 +1300]:
> I already fixed it:
> 
> https://gitlab.com/vjaquez-misc/mutt-kz/commit/de32bdc4b7d16b25dae5a41298fcd4cdbafb2132
> 
> And uploaded a new version to debian-mentors:
> 
> http://mentors.debian.net/package/mutt-kz

Very cool. I won't jump in to sponsor this, but I am sure someone
will upload it soon.

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
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unbound resolving results in DNSSEC LAME / SERVFAIL… why?

[martin f krafft via Unbound-users]

Hello,

I am a bit baffled by the following problem. Running unbound 1.4.17
on a Debian machine, at irregular but frequent intervals, the
nameservers for madduck.net will be marked "lame". As a result,
names under madduck.net cannot be resolved.

At the same time, running dig +dnssec gives the expected results,
and it all seems proper.

Usually, the problem resolves itself after a bit of time, or after
clearing the infra cache, suggesting that the problem is
intermittent. But the madduck.net nameservers are certainly not
"lame", and their DNSSEC data is being refreshed according to
schedule.

Here is the verb=3 output from the unbound daemon:

  unbound: [2334:0] debug: iterator[module 1] operate: 
extstate:module_wait_reply event:module_event_noreply
  unbound: [2334:0] info: iterator operate: query madduck-net.smtp.madduck.net. 
A IN
  unbound: [2334:0] info: processQueryTargets: madduck-net.smtp.madduck.net. A 
IN
  unbound: [2334:0] info: sending query: madduck-net.smtp.madduck.net. A IN
  unbound: [2334:0] debug: sending to target:  188.174.253.164#53
  unbound: [2334:0] debug: cache memory msg=2139671 rrset=3313082 infra=1892023 
val=221731
  unbound: [2334:0] info: timeouts, concluded that connection to host drops 
EDNS packets 188.174.253.164 port 53
  unbound: [2334:0] debug: iterator[module 1] operate: 
extstate:module_wait_reply event:module_event_reply
  unbound: [2334:0] info: iterator operate: query madduck-net.smtp.madduck.net. 
A IN
  unbound: [2334:0] info: sanitize: removing extraneous answer RRset: 
smtp.h.madduck.net. A IN
  unbound: [2334:0] info: response for madduck-net.smtp.madduck.net. A IN
  unbound: [2334:0] info: reply from  188.174.253.164#53
  unbound: [2334:0] info: query response was DNSSEC LAME
  unbound: [2334:0] info: processQueryTargets: madduck-net.smtp.madduck.net. A 
IN
  unbound: [2334:0] debug: out of query targets -- returning SERVFAIL
  unbound: [2334:0] debug: return error response SERVFAIL

Can anyone make sense of what might be going on?

Thank you,

-- 
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 it does infinite loops in 5 seconds."
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Re: [Debconf-team] Was the DC15 final report cancelled?

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Brian Gupta <brian.gu...@brandorr.com> [2016-02-09 00:33 +1300]:
> I can't find it.

Most of the final report content is done. Given the circumstances,
I've suggested an alternative approach on 2015-12-11 (sent to
dc-sponsors-team, and attached to this mail now).

The finances are done:

  https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf15/FinalReport/Finances

-- 
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`. `'`
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--- Begin Message ---
Dear Brian, dear fundraising team,

considering that we lost all momentum working on the DC15 final
report a while ago and that it's still not done, I've been given the
final report concept some thought, and I'd like to propose that we
get rid of the final report as we know it, assuming that this isn't
going to alienate our sponsors.

We've already started collecting content on the wiki, and 80% of it
all is more or less done. The big final step would be to pull this
into a TeX file and brush up the layout, and I personally get
demotivated even thinking about that. Maybe it was a mistake to
collect on the wiki and think we'd later port to TeX, at the time it
sounded like the right approach.

Anyway, it'll be a lot easier to just slap a nice index/table of
contents onto the wiki and brush up the content a big, than to do
the porting, and it would leave us more time to work on what matters
more, which is DC16.

Do you think that we could communicate this to the sponsors
properly? I.e. say that we're trying to streamline our processes and
make better use of volunteer time towards organising a conference,
and that we've therefore decided to abandon the idea of "publishing"
a final report and instead provide reports on the wiki, where they
aren't bound to be static and are more accessible to the team as
well?

-- 
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Re: [Debconf-team] Questions / Information for pre-registration, please review

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Daniel Lange <dl@usrlocal.de> [2016-02-04 17:29 +1100]:
> I recommend to collect all data that we need for bursaries
> decisions and venue accommodation occupancy because contacting
> people individually is a huge amount of work that we should avoid
> where ever we can (reduce orga work load).

Hi Daniel,

I am sorry that I probably wasn't very clear, as I am not trying to
advocate reaching out to people individually, but to reach out to
these people and send them to a separate web form, as soon as we
have the sponsorship questionaire finished.

The advantage of this approach IMHO is two-fold:

First it buys us a bit of time as we can open pre-registration
somewhat close to schedule without finalising bursaries questions.

And second, it takes the weight off pre-registration, so we'll
likely get more data quicker. Surely though, should we choose to
display more than a preliminary question, JavaScript could come to
the rescue here too.

If, on the other hand, we decide to push out more than just
preliminary questions at this stage, then we need to nail those
questions ASAP. For people to decide whether they need financial
aid, we'll need to have reasonably accurate room prices. Are
the prices quoted on the stormpad¹ final?

Comparing the set of questions in the stormpad¹ to the approach we
took for DC15 creates the question for me why we are approaching
this entirely differently. Was DC15's approach not good?

Do we have to ask separately about food and room sponsorship? Do we
have a sizeable number of people for whom it was
either-or-but-not-both? It would be easier if sponsorship was just
for both, not either-or.

¹) https://storm.debian.net/grain/EJgh6cXxCeNTaHQYPyJS5L/

> We need to have rather final accommodation numbers in April (we
> set so April 6th as our internal deadline in
> http://deb.li/DC16meet1) to avoid cancellation cost at UCT.

I don't think we will have final accomodation numbers in April, but
we'll have a better basis for an estimation.

One consideration might be to ask people whether they plan to stay
on campus, or will make their own arrangements anyway.

Travel sponsorships need not be finalised by then, I think. Maybe it
will make sense to regard sponsorship (and outreach) a more
continuous process leading up to the event.

-- 
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Re: [Debconf-team] Questions / Information for pre-registration, please review

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Daniel Lange <dl@usrlocal.de> [2016-02-06 03:50 +1100]:
> 1.1) breakdown of these: # people sleeping at UCT {DebCamp | Debconf}
> -> needs to be detailed later into individual days

We'll be telling UCT exact numbers for each night, right? So knowing
how many people plan to come isn't going to be helpful, unless we
are willing to guess the individual nights from a bell curve overlay
or so.

I think that would be the right thing to do unless we plan to
*close* registrations by early April to meet the 45 day deadline,

> 45 days cancellation policy, see above. So the better we are, the
> more money we can spend on more useful things than empty beds. NB:
> There will be an error margin and we do want to have a small
> reserve for latecomers.

How likely is it that the venue will fill up? Given the current
situation, I am inclined to reserve a smaller number and hope to
book additional beds as we require them.

-- 
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`. `'`
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[Debconf-team] Wafer scheduling and session length (was: talk submissions: wafertest vs. summit)

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Michael Banck <mba...@debian.org> [2016-02-04 21:51 +1100]:
> We could mention a duration for workshops, but maybe it's better
> to write something in the description (or CfP) that we assume it's
> 2h by default but people should get in touch with content if they
> need something else.
> 
> This all assumes that the team can change individual sessions like
> 'social' to mostly random lenghts if need be, is that correct?

While we might implement sanity checks in the scheduling interface,
the actual scheduling of an event is not in any way dependent on the
event, just on the slots. I.e. the scheduling team can drag a 20
minute even across 3 1-hour slots, or squeeze a 3hr workshop into
a 15 minute slot (if such exist).

Most likely, this flexibility will be a feature, but the downside is
that we are going to be operating strictly within "slots".

If we make too many of them (e.g. every 10 minutes), then the
schedule will become unreadable;

If we make the slots too long (30 minutes, or 1hr), then we cannot
schedule 20 minutee events. Well, unless we make it include the
break, see https://github.com/CTPUG/wafer/issues/151

We can have different slots on different days, so we don't have to
operate within a rigid frame all week.

Hope this makes sense,

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madd...@debconf.org> @martinkrafft
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Re: [Debconf-team] talk submissions: wafertest vs. summit

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Gunnar Wolf <gw...@gwolf.org> [2016-02-05 05:43 +1100]:
> Video recording should also be included, it has been marked as an
> important thing by several people. I'd go for recording
> everything, but that's just me ;-)

By this you mean the "okay with being recorded" checkbox?

We are working on a solution to allow free-form data to be attached
to events, so that we can trivially add any additional field without
database migrations.

> Besides that, I agree with the simplification. Explicit URLs can
> be part of the description, duration can be part of the talk type
> (as also discussed later on the thread).

URLs are already supported.

> As for notes... If we have the field, we have to ensure to read
> and act upon it in a timely fashion!

I don't think we should introduce a new communication medium this
way. The two fields are intended

  - for submitters to specify special requests, and maybe this field
should be turned read-only as soon as a submission is undergoing
consideration (i.e. CfP closes)

  - for content team members, they can leave notes with events, e.g.
important considerations the next person handling an event
should keep in mind. This is more data storage than
communication.

> > Note that it was called "Description" (not "Abstract"), which
> > I find slightly more friendly
> 
> Great.

Let's assume upstream wants to keep "Abstract". We do not want to
maintain a fork, not even for small things like this. Maybe we can
parametrise it, but again, I'd like to gauge how important this is.
I.e. is this a priority?

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madd...@debconf.org> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
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Re: [Debconf-team] talk submissions: wafertest vs. summit

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Gunnar Wolf <gw...@gwolf.org> [2016-02-05 05:43 +1100]:
> > The list of evnt types were: Ad-Hoc, BoF, Plenary (admin-only?), Social,
> > Special event (admin-only?), Talk, Workshop
> 
> Ad-hoc is not something we should offer upfront. Traditionally (and
> I'm explicitly not including DC15, as I was not involved) we tried to
> leave a portion of unallocated space in our regular, published
> schedule, and manage ad-hoc talks strictly opening each slot one or
> two days before it happens (or the whole week upon DebCamp start in
> other ocassions, or...)

I feel like there isn't much difference between "unallocated" and
allocated as "unnamed ad-hoc slots", but this is really up to the
content team.

Talk types and allocations are completely dynamic and can be changed
at any point in time later.

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madd...@debconf.org> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
  `-  DebConf16: Cape Town: https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf16
  DebConf17 in your country? https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf17


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[Debconf-team] Event "tracks" (was: talk submissions: wafertest vs. summit)

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Gunnar Wolf <gw...@gwolf.org> [2016-02-05 05:43 +1100]:
> I'd appreciate if we were able to add tracks to our current setup.
> OTOH, we have sometimes defined tracks based on preexisting talks
> rather than (or additionally to) the other way around... So we can
> get to that point later on.

Wafer does not have the concept of tracks, currently. It can
probably added pretty trivially, but before we take this upstream,
I'd really appreciate if we could evaluate this first and conclude
that we really benefit from tracks.

Do we? How do we want to use them?

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madd...@debconf.org> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
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  DebConf17 in your country? https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf17


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[Debconf-team] Multiple speakers (was: talk submissions: wafertest vs. summit)

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Gunnar Wolf <gw...@gwolf.org> [2016-02-05 05:43 +1100]:
> Umh, I feel this to be just the opposite way. Yes, in DebConf we
> usually have a one-speaker majority, but there are usually several
> talks presented by a team of two or more. Requiring authors to
> contact the team, and requiring us to act manually, is a chore. Of
> course, if the system does not allow for this to be cleanly
> represented, I won't make more waves. But I think it's important
> to provide room to specify coauthors.

Wafer requires a "corresponding author" who is regarded as the
mainly responsible person and chief author. Wafer also allows me to
add any number of persons as co-authors. The UI isn't great
(loads the entire list of attendees, so we probably don't want to
expose this), but the functionality is there.

Also see: https://github.com/CTPUG/wafer/issues/169

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madd...@debconf.org> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
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Re: [Debconf-team] Questions / Information for pre-registration, please review

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Stefano Rivera <stefa...@debian.org> [2016-02-04 11:49 +1100]:
> For budgeting purposes, wouldn't the following be sufficient?
> 
> [ ] Plan to attend DebCamp
> [ ] Plan to attend DebConf
> [ ] Will require sponsorship
> 
> This gives us an idea of percentages of attendees wanting to attend
> DebCamp, and percentages needing sponsorship. That's about the best
> we're going to get out of pre-reg, right?

Another (IMHO) good aspect of this is that it'd buy us a bit of time
to work with bursaries to identify the data they need, without
delaying the pre-reg opening. And then we can approach those who
ticked the last box with detailed questions when we implemented the UI.

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madd...@debconf.org> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
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  DebConf17 in your country? https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf17


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Re: integrating an existing git repo in vcsh

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Alan Schmitt  [2016-02-04 00:34 
+1100]:
> I could not find how to do the following in the documentation.
> I already have my .emacs.d under git, and I’m looking into vcsh
> for other configuration files. Is it possible to integrate this
> existing repo in vcsh?

It should be as easy as cloning the repo with vcsh, though I suspect
you'll have to first modify the contents and move all files to
./.emacs.d/, assuming that that's currently the worktree of your Git
repo. vcsh uses ~/ as the worktree, and so your files would
otherwise all be checked out to ~/ instead of ~/.emacs.d/ .

-- 
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Re: [Debconf-team] talk submissions: wafertest vs. summit

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Michael Banck <mba...@debian.org> [2016-02-04 10:19 +1100]:
> * Notes (multiple line entry box)

There's also a notes field for use by orga that the submitter can't
see.

> The list of talk types is not setup yet.

I've written a script that can do this quickly. It's in the dc16 app
management subfolder.

> The list of evnt types were: Ad-Hoc, BoF, Plenary (admin-only?), Social,
> Special event (admin-only?), Talk, Workshop
> 
> The list of durations were: 20min/45min/other

I think we should merge the two. There won't be 20min workshops,
etc.. Also wafer doesn't have duration (yet…; wonder how it does
scheduling?)

Maybe a list like

  - ad-hoc
  - bof (45min)
  - bof (20min)   [probably doesn't actually make sense]
  - plenary
  - social
  - special
  - talk (20min)
  - talk (45min)
  - workshop (2hr) [or whatever]

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madd...@debconf.org> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
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  DebConf17 in your country? https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf17


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Re: [Debconf-team] Questions / Information for pre-registration, please review

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Stefano Rivera <stefa...@debian.org> [2016-02-04 13:48 +1100]:
> > [ ] Will require sponsorship
> 
> This could require a bit of clarification. Do we consider "free
> attendance" to be requiring sponsorship? I think most of us do, but
> presumably some attendees don't.

Maybe two checkboxes, financial assistance required for [ ]travel
and [ ]room? I feel like the former precludes the latter too…

But isn't this something we can obtain with much better quality from
the people once we know who they are, a few weeks down the road?

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madd...@debconf.org> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
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  DebConf17 in your country? https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf17


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Re: [Debconf-team] Questions / Information for pre-registration, please review

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Molly de Blanc <debl...@riseup.net> [2016-02-04 14:41 +1100]:
> Is the goal here to have people actually pre-register or just to
> get some numbers for planning purposes?

Hi Molly,

I am glad you asked this question. I am not sure whether we all have
a shared understanding of why we are wanting to do it this way.

Please allow me to offer how I recall things from all the
discussions. Please feel free anyone to correct or augment.

Previously, we've asked people to register and we've usually had
a 5–10% rate of people who registered but then never bothered to
update their records or show up.¹

This is why we introduced "reconfirmations", and recently some
people have called this approach "backwards".

The pre-reg step we're wanting to try should fulfill the following
purposes:

  - create accounts so that events can be submitted and associated
with them;

  - give a very rough idea of interest in the conference;

  - identify those people in need of financial sponsorship because
we'll need to engage with them for individual data and possibly
specific arrangements;

  - avoid giving people the impression that they registered, so as
to turn the whole thing around and rather than expecting people
to reconfirm, require them to register whan the time is right;

  - get a way to reach out to all interested people to better target
information, such as a reminder to register.

¹) This might be related to registration being free, causing people
to register at no cost even if they didn't know yet whether they'd
go. An idea we were discussing a bit at DC15 and which I am just
sharing here FYI was to charge a certain amount for registration
(say $20), which can be refunded to the participant when they show
up.

> 4) I am traveling with family

We are investigating ways in which a family parent (or an HR person)
can easily manage multiple records. Presumably pre-reg only needs
a number though.

> It's probably safe to assume (for estimation purposes) that people
> who want sponsorship for debconf also want it for debcamp.

In case funds are limited, we've in the past limited sponsorship to
DebConf, expecting people to pay for DebCamp themselves. This won't
be an option for everyone, and so I guess when we reach out to
people in need of financial aid, we'll need to find out what effect
just-DebConf-but-not-DebCamp sponsorship decisions would have on
them.

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madd...@debconf.org> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  DebConf orga team
`. `'`
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Bug#479841: Inconsistent return code of subshell when immediately assigning local variables

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Daniel Shahaf <danie...@apache.org> [2016-01-30 20:47 +1300]:
> I asked upstream and the conclusion was, they won't change this
> behaviour.  However, the behaviour will be pointed out in the manual in
> 5.3 and newer.

Thank you!

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
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Re: Conditional configuration

[martin f krafft]

also sprach mutt-us...@rcdrun.com  [2016-01-30 21:07 
+1300]:
> The efforts to bring back some sources to the original mutt are to
> be made by those developers of the original mutt.

I disagree. The open-source ecosystem works best if you avoid forks
and try instead to move all improvements as far up the stream as you
can.

Anyway, I think this discussion is getting off-topic…

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