hare of Bill's
> market.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Frank Eggink
> To: Orion-Interest
> Sent: 4/21/01 7:01 AM
> Subject: On large programming teams [RE: A Swedish Idea]
>
> The following is one of the classic readings on programming at large. 25
> years old an
- Original Message -
From: "Frank LaRosa" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Orion-Interest" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Sunday, April 22, 2001 11:45 PM
Subject: Re: On large programming teams [RE: A Swedish Idea]
> Adding more programmers to a product early in
cause this serves to reduce the quality of
the programming.
- Original Message -
From: "Frank Eggink" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Orion-Interest" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Saturday, April 21, 2001 7:01 AM
Subject: On large programming teams [RE: A Swedish
probably the closest, and they don't really have a cutting share of Bill's
market.
-Original Message-
From: Frank Eggink
To: Orion-Interest
Sent: 4/21/01 7:01 AM
Subject: On large programming teams [RE: A Swedish Idea]
The following is one of the classic readings on programmin
gt;
> >I suppose that the country they're from produce the shittiest code of em all
> >:)
> >
> >Johan
> >- Original Message -
> >From: "Joseph B. Ottinger" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >To: "Orion-Interest" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]&g
;-) Forgot the funny side of it. It has been a long week.
/David
- Original Message -
From: "Kemp Randy-W18971" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Orion-Interest" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, April 20, 2001 2:53 PM
Subject: RE: A Swedish Idea
> Yes, but
amateur
nights.
-Original Message-
From: David Kinnvall [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2001 2:32 PM
To: Orion-Interest
Subject: Re: A Swedish Idea
They never get there about as much as this thread in its current
shape provides any value whatsoever to Orion users
Just for the sake of completeness, let's all chip in for a car to see what
happens in this circumstance. Maybe we can get rid of ALL of them at once,
just to see if Orion goes away THEN.
Then, for the sake of yet more completeness, let's try to somehow legally
eradicate all of BEA's employees, to
d have gotten off this mailing list.
Paul
>From: "Frank LaRosa" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Reply-To: Orion-Interest <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>To: Orion-Interest <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Subject: Re: A Swedish Idea
>Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2001 00:52:23 -0500
>
>What'
To: "Orion-Interest" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2001 4:17 PM
Subject: Re: A Swedish Idea
>
> God forbids, what if one of them got into car accident, would there still
be
> Orion.
>
t need a manager. Especially two guys that are as obviously
>skilled and laser-focussed on their goals as these two.
>
>See, Joe and Mike? I'm cured!!!
>
>dedmike
>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On
try at solo stardom?
[:^b
dedmike
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Kemp
> Randy-W18971
> Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2001 11:49 AM
> To: Orion-Interest
> Subject: RE: A Swedish Idea
>
>
> OSS is like
God forbids, what if one of them got into car accident, would there still be
Orion.
ril 19, 2001 7:08 PM
Subject: RE: A Swedish Idea
> Yes, and like many turtles, they never get there.
>
> Believing in fairy tales is not a good basis for conducting business. The
> turtle and rabbit story is a way to tell average children 'yes, you might
> be stupid and slow, b
inal Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Jay Armstrong
> Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2001 10:17 AM
> To: Orion-Interest
> Subject: Re: A Swedish Idea
>
>
> The groomsmen at my wedding were named Schotanus, Schloss and Schnakenberg
> -
--Original Message-
> From: Hani Suleiman [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2001 10:03 AM
> To: Orion-Interest
> Subject: RE: A Swedish Idea
>
>
>
> Unlike all those OSS products huh.
>
>
> On Thu, 19 Apr 2001, Kemp Randy-W18971 wrote:
>
Bill company code so much, as their practice of releasing alpha or beta
quality products as production quality.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Jay Armstrong [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2001 8:06 AM
> To: Orion-Interest
> Subject: Re: A Swedish Idea
&
>Johan
>> >- Original Message -
>> >From: "Joseph B. Ottinger" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> >To: "Orion-Interest" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> >Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2001 4:20 PM
>> >Subject: Re: A Swedish Idea
>>
The groomsmen at my wedding were named Schotanus, Schloss and Schnakenberg
-- no kidding -- if they all lived in the same city, they'd be on the same
page in the phonebook. So, bring on the Germanic hordes!
Now try to stay focused: Randy's idea was whether or not MySQL and Orion
should talk abou
e of releasing alpha or beta quality products as production
>quality.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Jay Armstrong [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2001 8:06 AM
> To: Orion-Interest
> Subject: Re: A Swedish Idea
>
>
> Generally, I ag
From: Jay Armstrong [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2001 8:06 AM
To: Orion-Interest
Subject: Re: A Swedish Idea
Generally, I agree with the comment about Micro$oft quality of code, though
I've seen some pretty horrible code from outside the US, too. :)
Bill Gates may b
're from produce the shittiest code of em all
> >:)
> >
> >Johan
> >- Original Message -
> >From: "Joseph B. Ottinger" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >To: "Orion-Interest" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >Sent: Wednesday, April 18,
uot;Orion-Interest" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2001 4:20 PM
>Subject: Re: A Swedish Idea
>
>
>> Personally, I'm becoming more and more convinced that not only is Sweden
>> full of lousy programmers, but they're all lousy in congruent wa
On Wed, Apr 18, 2001 at 05:04:48PM -0600, Jay Armstrong wrote:
> Fair enough, Mike, but my bottom line was: Why not ... address that issue
> (having MySQL and Orion folks talk to each other) directly?
Why?
> Randy had a good thought -- the Thought Police should quit stomping on it.
>
> The issu
ssage-
From: Hani Suleiman [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2001 4:24 PM
To: Orion-Interest
Subject: RE: A Swedish Idea
Argh, I really did try hard not to respond, but I can resist no longer...
'it's good enough for NASA' means nothing, nor is it relevant. Win9
y, April 18, 2001 4:20 PM
Subject: Re: A Swedish Idea
> Personally, I'm becoming more and more convinced that not only is Sweden
> full of lousy programmers, but they're all lousy in congruent ways just to
> make the rest of the world's jobs harder.
>
> I say we all s
eforge.net/projects/hsqldb
web
http://hsqldb.sourceforge.net
dedmike
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Neville
> Burnell
> Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2001 10:10 PM
> To: Orion-Interest
> Subject: RE: A Sw
Michael J. Cannon wrote: Interbase is not 'free.'
Well, Michael, I already made a post of the parts in the Interbase licence
that states that the database product is free. I think I read the licence
very carefully, and as far as I can see, the licence is indeed free. The
licence includes sentenc
Subject: RE: A Swedish Idea
hmmm...autoupdate...Magnus, Carl? what do we need to include in hsqldb
to
prevent this? (Credit to you Stan and whoever else contributes)...
dedmike
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Stan
8, 2001 3:00 PM
> To: Orion-Interest
> Subject: Re: A Swedish Idea
>
>
>
> At first a zillion people picked up the continued development of
> HypersonicSQL (because it's *awesome* for development, but anyway...
> SourceForge was flooded with clones, but I believe that
I would guess that it would be MySQL making the majority (all?) of the
changes to support J2EE platforms, not just Orion. To Orion, it's just
another storage mechanism.
As for "why bother?". Well, that's what "open" software is all about.
Open minds, open discussions, open ideas, etc, etc. Som
> For developers looking to seriously develop commercial-class or commercial
> software and resell it, licenses are EVERYTHING, and the specific wording is
> VERY IMPORTANT if you wish to have a business that appeals to the corporate
> types or serious commercial customers (not to mention one that
On Wed, 18 Apr 2001, Jay Armstrong wrote:
>
> But, let's say it doesn't support transactions. What's wrong with starting
> a dialog?
>
Why bother? So the people who bleat about mySQL all the time are
happier? Frankly I'd rather the Orion team concentrate on functionality
and J2EE implementat
dmike
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Hani Suleiman
> Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2001 4:24 PM
> To: Orion-Interest
> Subject: RE: A Swedish Idea
>
>
> Argh, I really did try hard not to respond, but I can
Ottinger
> Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2001 1:56 PM
> To: Orion-Interest
> Subject: Re: A Swedish Idea
>
>
> On Wed, Apr 18, 2001 at 06:34:09PM +0100, William Jones wrote:
> > Would some people please just grow up.
>
> I agree! (Wait, am I included?)
>
> > If you do
a good modeling,
prototype database. For the record, I use both mysql (for testing and
prototyping) and Oracle 8I (for the real stuff). And everyone can learn
from them in how to write good documentation.
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Dan North [mailto:[EMAIL PROTE
nore the licensing issue and their IP at their
peril!
Michael J. Cannon
Project Manager, COO - hsqldb.org
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Dan North
> Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2001 2:08 PM
> To: Orion-Interest
> Sub
OTECTED]]On Behalf Of Jay Armstrong
>> Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2001 11:35 AM
>> To: Orion-Interest
>> Subject: Re: A Swedish Idea
>>
>>
>> C'mon -- lighten up a little on Randy. This is not an issue for every
>> little country with an inferio
e real stuff). And everyone can learn from them in
>how to write good documentation.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Dan North [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2001 2:08 PM
> To: Orion-Interest
> Subject: Re: A Swedish Idea
>
>
> Ok, I'll b
write good documentation.
-Original Message-
From: Dan North [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2001 2:08 PM
To: Orion-Interest
Subject: Re: A Swedish Idea
Ok, I'll bite.
Orion is not an open source product and probably never will be. The fact
that it is fre
cated that our very own GW.
Please read and learn:
http://www.theonion.com/onion3713/bush_regales_guests.html
Mike
- Original Message -
From:
Michael A Third
To: Orion-Interest
Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2001 3:51
PM
Subject: RE: A Swedish Idea
I
think every
ger, COO - hsqldb.org
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Jay Armstrong
> Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2001 11:35 AM
> To: Orion-Interest
> Subject: Re: A Swedish Idea
>
>
> C'mon -- lighten up a little on Randy
ent matter...
- Original Message -
From: "Jay Armstrong" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Orion-Interest" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2001 9:35 AM
Subject: Re: A Swedish Idea
> Given that HypersonicSQL is currently not being maintained (is it?),
EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of William
JonesSent: Wednesday, April 18, 2001 1:34 PMTo:
Orion-InterestSubject: Re: A Swedish Idea
Would some people
please just grow up.
If you don't want
to use Orion then that is your decision. Vote with
Ok, I'll bite.
Orion is not an open source product and probably never will be. The fact
that it is free for development purposes and remarkably inexpensive for
deployment shouldn't alter your perception of (a) the ownership and
proprietary nature of the code, or (b) the quality of the product
ibly the word's
meaning (I know only us college-eddicated peoples know what it meanses),
then please apply said meaning to nearly everything in this thread. Thanks!
:)
> - Original Message -
> From: "Joseph B. Ottinger" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To:
rs list in the ACM
International Programming Contest (c.f. http://acm.baylor.edu/past/default.htm)
- Original Message -
From: "Joseph B. Ottinger" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Orion-Interest" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2001 3:20 PM
Sub
I said it may be a dumb idea.
-Original Message-
From: Hani Suleiman [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2001 9:18 AM
To: Orion-Interest
Subject: Re: A Swedish Idea
Why?!?!
I have an idea, why don't IBM and BEA team up and
release...logicsphere! After all, th
C'mon -- lighten up a little on Randy. This is not an issue for every
little country with an inferiority complex to get hot about.
The possible relationship is based not only on the physical geography, but
also on the "openness" of the products (MySQL is completely open, while
Orion is free for
On Wed, Apr 18, 2001 at 11:54:02AM -0400, Kemp Randy-W18971 wrote:
> I'm from the USA, near Chicago, Il. What countries lead in quality of code?
> I would like to know. No matter what country the product is produced in,
The best country in terms of code/quality ratio is Cameroon.
> you might fi
other facets, such as
> documentation, marketing, and support. And even superman is part of a team
> called the Justice League, since he can't solve everything by himself.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Wednesday, Ap
lto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2001 9:20 AM
To: Orion-Interest
Subject: Re: A Swedish Idea
Personally, I'm becoming more and more convinced that not only is Sweden
full of lousy programmers, but they're all lousy in congruent ways just to
make the rest of the world'
am I the only one on this list considering this useless discussion spam?
karl and magnus are grownups making their own decisions and you don't
actually believe repeating stuff that has been discussed on this list over
and over again, inspires them?
please contribute to getting the technical i
Personally, I'm becoming more and more convinced that not only is Sweden
full of lousy programmers, but they're all lousy in congruent ways just to
make the rest of the world's jobs harder.
I say we all start using Bavarian products, if only because Bavarian names
seem to have a better vowel/cons
Why?!?!
I have an idea, why don't IBM and BEA team up and
release...logicsphere! After all, they're both US companies...
On Wed, 18 Apr 2001, Kemp Randy-W18971 wrote:
> Now this may be a dumb idea, and I am just thinking up brainstorms to promote Orion,
>but it occurred to me that both Mysql a
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