[AsburyPark] Re: RNC Talking Points
Wasn't going to comment on Vick, but what's the difference between Vick and Dick Cheney, on a controlled hunt, where he shot his friend in the face and was with 2 women, neither of which, were their wives? Mind you, I DON'T condone any of the activities going on, on his property! I think Vick, whose relatives were staying there, are the culprits in all this, ratted HIM, out, because it was on Vick's property and Vick, is taking the slam for them! Rather than see his relatives go to jail, they were lured into getting a deal from the authorities that, if they delivered Vick, they'd get off, which is how this probably worked! What if Vick and his relatives went deer hunting, as many men do in this region and bear hunting, too? Would any of you be so judgemental? NONE of you know the REAL story! Vick IS a prominent Black Football Player, that YOU probably think he doesn't deserve. It's the OJ syndrome! 9 out of 10 of you think OJ did it! I don't, but feel he knows who did! You weren't there, either! Judge lest ye be judged, is an old adage. Just as Sen. Craig called Clinton a naughty boy, hypocritically, WHO is the naughty boy, now? Just an observation of how white America thinks, when a prominent Black, is pre-judged. Remember, I don't condone torturing ANY animals! Let the flames begin! --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, asburycouple [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So the fact that he was running a gambling ring and financing the entire operation doesn't bother you at all? The fact that he enjoyed engaging in torture doesn't bother you (oh sorry, you're a neocon so that one probably doesn't bother you) --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, justifiedright justifiedright@ wrote: The AP Press ran a column today that raised the same issue about how we treat humans and animals in association with the Vick controversey. Yes, I say let him play football, since the rule in the NFL is that there is no lifetime ban for killing people (see Little and Lewis). Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[AsburyPark] Re: RNC Talking Points
The difference is, Vick has admitted to participating in killing the dogs, which include drowning and electrocution. I think it's sad that you are playing the race card on this one. --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, 2fine4u [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Wasn't going to comment on Vick, but what's the difference between Vick and Dick Cheney, on a controlled hunt, where he shot his friend in the face and was with 2 women, neither of which, were their wives? Mind you, I DON'T condone any of the activities going on, on his property! I think Vick, whose relatives were staying there, are the culprits in all this, ratted HIM, out, because it was on Vick's property and Vick, is taking the slam for them! Rather than see his relatives go to jail, they were lured into getting a deal from the authorities that, if they delivered Vick, they'd get off, which is how this probably worked! What if Vick and his relatives went deer hunting, as many men do in this region and bear hunting, too? Would any of you be so judgemental? NONE of you know the REAL story! Vick IS a prominent Black Football Player, that YOU probably think he doesn't deserve. It's the OJ syndrome! 9 out of 10 of you think OJ did it! I don't, but feel he knows who did! You weren't there, either! Judge lest ye be judged, is an old adage. Just as Sen. Craig called Clinton a naughty boy, hypocritically, WHO is the naughty boy, now? Just an observation of how white America thinks, when a prominent Black, is pre-judged. Remember, I don't condone torturing ANY animals! Let the flames begin! --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, asburycouple asburycouple@ wrote: So the fact that he was running a gambling ring and financing the entire operation doesn't bother you at all? The fact that he enjoyed engaging in torture doesn't bother you (oh sorry, you're a neocon so that one probably doesn't bother you) --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, justifiedright justifiedright@ wrote: The AP Press ran a column today that raised the same issue about how we treat humans and animals in association with the Vick controversey. Yes, I say let him play football, since the rule in the NFL is that there is no lifetime ban for killing people (see Little and Lewis). Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[AsburyPark] Re: RNC Talking Points
Dear Flamethrower, Before making comments like this please read the entire indictment. It does not matter in the least what color this POS is, he clearly is a sadistic monster and he should be away from the general population, as far away as possible. --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, 2fine4u [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Wasn't going to comment on Vick, but what's the difference between Vick and Dick Cheney, on a controlled hunt, where he shot his friend in the face and was with 2 women, neither of which, were their wives? Mind you, I DON'T condone any of the activities going on, on his property! I think Vick, whose relatives were staying there, are the culprits in all this, ratted HIM, out, because it was on Vick's property and Vick, is taking the slam for them! Rather than see his relatives go to jail, they were lured into getting a deal from the authorities that, if they delivered Vick, they'd get off, which is how this probably worked! What if Vick and his relatives went deer hunting, as many men do in this region and bear hunting, too? Would any of you be so judgemental? NONE of you know the REAL story! Vick IS a prominent Black Football Player, that YOU probably think he doesn't deserve. It's the OJ syndrome! 9 out of 10 of you think OJ did it! I don't, but feel he knows who did! You weren't there, either! Judge lest ye be judged, is an old adage. Just as Sen. Craig called Clinton a naughty boy, hypocritically, WHO is the naughty boy, now? Just an observation of how white America thinks, when a prominent Black, is pre-judged. Remember, I don't condone torturing ANY animals! Let the flames begin! --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, asburycouple asburycouple@ wrote: So the fact that he was running a gambling ring and financing the entire operation doesn't bother you at all? The fact that he enjoyed engaging in torture doesn't bother you (oh sorry, you're a neocon so that one probably doesn't bother you) --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, justifiedright justifiedright@ wrote: The AP Press ran a column today that raised the same issue about how we treat humans and animals in association with the Vick controversey. Yes, I say let him play football, since the rule in the NFL is that there is no lifetime ban for killing people (see Little and Lewis). Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Werner Confined 22 hrs/day
because he has no income other than his rents So he rents out rooms or apts in a building that has so many violations? - Original Message From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, September 2, 2007 5:05:28 PM Subject: [AsburyPark] Re: Werner Confined 22 hrs/day Just got another call from Werner. He was taken out of the holding area yesterday (Sat.) at 11 AM and placed into Pod A-1 in the Monmouth County Correctional Institute, Freehold, where he is confined 22 hours a day in a 2-man cell with three people in it. He gets two hours out of the cell, one at a time, but the hours are chosen randomly. One cell-mate must sleep on the concrete floor. Werner alernates between the floor and sleeping with a toilet in his face. Werner slept on a concrete floor in the holding area, prior to being processed, which included an injection for tuberculosis. There was no choice - the nurse said, you have to take it, says Werner. She was reluctant to tell him what it was for. The move to the Pod means Werner has to wait, possibly a week, for his own PIN number to make the only calls he's allowed to make - collect. For now he must borrow another inmate's PIN to call out. And the calls cannot be made to cell phones. Werner says he obtained the refinancing necessary to comply with the repairs the city wants him to make on his house. He showed this documentation to municipal court Judge Apostolou along with the contract with 3CG, a Middletown contractor, for the first phase of the repairs. He planned to select other contractors for subsequent work as things progressed. Ironically, the first payment on the refi was due yesterday. If he can't get payments made during his 45-day incarceration he may go into default on the loan. Why is Judge Apostolou being so severe? Residents of A.P. know a few property owners that have owed far more in code violation fines. A lawyer who works regularly in Asbury Park municipal court tells me he's frequently frustrated at how Apostolou lets junkies out of jail all the time. And, this is over a porch! But, this same lawyer says that the court saw that Werner had yet to start the work, which it saw as inexcusable . Werner explains that it took a long time to secure financing because he has no income other than his rents and a $35,000 lien, he knew nothing about, surfaced in the process. The court wanted him to pay the lien and contest it later. But Werner didn't have the money to pay it and held that it was illegitimate Was Werner singled out last Friday? Hardly, a source close to the court says the judge sent lots and lots of people to jail Friday. Was he having a bad day? If the jail is overcrowded it may work to Werner's advantage. When he does get out, Werner better check out that 911 call that started all of this. Certainly his reputation was damaged by the false accusation that a body was in his basement. There should've been an official apology, since the department should've listened to the tape -- and when it did listen after the home was inspected, it should've taken a very public step in undoing the damage to Werner's privacy and reputation. What excuse can there be for not doing that? For now Werner must beg for a pencil, since inmates aren't allowed to have money on them; yet they must buy everything, including something as minor as a pencil. Nagging questions remain. The judge only had before him the fines and the prolonged timeframe with which to pass judgment. However the officials who have made a cottage industry out of pursuing Werner - one property owner in a city of blighted properties - know if their motives are objective -- or not. Is the law being applied equally here? Everyone in this city - regardless of how they feel about Werner Baumgartner, must ask their officials: was the incarceration of Werner Baumgartner an equal carriage of justice? Or an attempt to silence any public critiques of the city and its developers? Maureen Maureen Nevin Asbury Radio -The Radio Voice of Asbury Park -Silenced by the FCC, but why?? 88.1FM - 6 Years on the Air!! Would've been 7 this July... Asbury's Own Live Talk Showhttp://groups. yahoo.com/ group/AsburyPark /post?postID= rHJIZqKLU40eDTc2 KMHNHZwPoANfvykU f-QXIwGa01YupXx_ FSgz9T8CYowEoqrp 7AvGNPp3ZyP4oWOT uAg 601 Bangs Avenue - Forced from here by FCC... Listen 8 - 10 PM Thursdays on 88.1FM or Ooops, see below... Listen Live or Later on the Web http://www.asburyra dio.com/ Call the show 732-775-0821 oops, not since the FCC visited this litte 100watt station - four times!! Call me 732-774-0779 fax 502-0463 Still can call this number... Speak up - It's America!! Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL.com. Yahoo! oneSearch: Finally, mobile search that gives answers, not web links.
[AsburyPark] Re: Werner Jailed by AP Judge
--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, dfsavgny [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What assistance does Werner need to get sprung? $ Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[AsburyPark] Re: Werner Confined 22 hrs/day
--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Allan Peterson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: because he has no income other than his rents So he rents out rooms or apts in a building that has so many violations? Wrong. He gets no rental income at all from the building he lives in . Once again, he lives there by himself. Whatever rental income he gets is not from there. Frank D. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[AsburyPark] Asbury Park on the travel channel
Should you be indoors today at 2 pm, check out Anthony Bourdain: No Reservations on the Travel Channel. A large part of the show is about Asbury, but keep in mind it was shot years ago while AP was still in pretty bad shape, so it's not a flattering portrait. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[AsburyPark] Re: Werner Confined 22 hrs/day
--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Allan Peterson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Asbury (no longer on the) Radio aslo reported: Baumgartner, a watchdog and constant critic of the city's boards and consultants, attracted the occasional fines for violations on his property on Fifth Avenue. But the summonses billowed out of control after city officials gained access to his residence following a 911 call that police in Howell interpreted to be naming Baumgartner's home address. Form this I get the impression that there were violations prior to the call of a body in the basement. Is this true? Maureen wrote very clearly that the summonses billowed out of control after city officials gained access to his residence... So there had been summonses. She said summonses. I can confirm that. You ask about violations. That I do not know for sure. Frank D. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[AsburyPark] Re: Asbury Park on the travel channel
R U kidding? Pedro Martinez makes his comeback today at 1:00. No way I'm changing the channel. --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Hinge [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Should you be indoors today at 2 pm, check out Anthony Bourdain: No Reservations on the Travel Channel. A large part of the show is about Asbury, but keep in mind it was shot years ago while AP was still in pretty bad shape, so it's not a flattering portrait. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[AsburyPark] Re: Werner Confined 22 hrs/day
Oh, now we're the coy Allen Peterson. The Allen Peterson who is reveling in the silencing of Asbury Radio. To answer you coy question for the benefit of those who really don't know: Werner's intention has been to restore rather than repair his historic home on 5th Avenue. Most informed people are well aware that in postponing the restoration on the home's exterior for these reasons, he has incurred fines, which he has been paying - which is in sharp contrast to others who have contested the fines and saved themselves thousands of dollars. And to answer your other coy and misleading question: You know the reports I've written refer to his home - not his rental properties. I guess you would prefer that he had rented out the units in his home, which is his right to do, instead of using it as a single family. You are in real estate, didn't you say, Allen Peterson? Where's your office? --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Allan Peterson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Asbury (no longer on the) Radio aslo reported: Baumgartner, a watchdog and constant critic of the city's boards and consultants, attracted the occasional fines for violations on his property on Fifth Avenue. But the summonses billowed out of control after city officials gained access to his residence following a 911 call that police in Howell interpreted to be naming Baumgartner's home address. Form this I get the impression that there were violations prior to the call of a body in the basement. Is this true? - Original Message From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, September 2, 2007 5:05:28 PM Subject: [AsburyPark] Re: Werner Confined 22 hrs/day Just got another call from Werner. He was taken out of the holding area yesterday (Sat.) at 11 AM and placed into Pod A-1 in the Monmouth County Correctional Institute, Freehold, where he is confined 22 hours a day in a 2-man cell with three people in it. He gets two hours out of the cell, one at a time, but the hours are chosen randomly. One cell-mate must sleep on the concrete floor. Werner alernates between the floor and sleeping with a toilet in his face. Werner slept on a concrete floor in the holding area, prior to being processed, which included an injection for tuberculosis. There was no choice - the nurse said, you have to take it, says Werner. She was reluctant to tell him what it was for. The move to the Pod means Werner has to wait, possibly a week, for his own PIN number to make the only calls he's allowed to make - collect. For now he must borrow another inmate's PIN to call out. And the calls cannot be made to cell phones. Werner says he obtained the refinancing necessary to comply with the repairs the city wants him to make on his house. He showed this documentation to municipal court Judge Apostolou along with the contract with 3CG, a Middletown contractor, for the first phase of the repairs. He planned to select other contractors for subsequent work as things progressed. Ironically, the first payment on the refi was due yesterday. If he can't get payments made during his 45-day incarceration he may go into default on the loan. Why is Judge Apostolou being so severe? Residents of A.P. know a few property owners that have owed far more in code violation fines. A lawyer who works regularly in Asbury Park municipal court tells me he's frequently frustrated at how Apostolou lets junkies out of jail all the time. And, this is over a porch! But, this same lawyer says that the court saw that Werner had yet to start the work, which it saw as inexcusable . Werner explains that it took a long time to secure financing because he has no income other than his rents and a $35,000 lien, he knew nothing about, surfaced in the process. The court wanted him to pay the lien and contest it later. But Werner didn't have the money to pay it and held that it was illegitimate Was Werner singled out last Friday? Hardly, a source close to the court says the judge sent lots and lots of people to jail Friday. Was he having a bad day? If the jail is overcrowded it may work to Werner's advantage. When he does get out, Werner better check out that 911 call that started all of this. Certainly his reputation was damaged by the false accusation that a body was in his basement. There should've been an official apology, since the department should've listened to the tape -- and when it did listen after the home was inspected, it should've taken a very public step in undoing the damage to Werner's privacy and reputation. What excuse can there be for not doing that? For now Werner must beg for a pencil, since inmates aren't allowed to have money on them; yet they must buy everything, including something as minor as a pencil. Nagging questions remain. The judge only had before him the fines and the prolonged timeframe with which to pass judgment. However the officials who
[AsburyPark] Re: Werner Jailed by AP Judge
Please read my posts again, including the one from my site. I don't think you've drawn the intended points here. As for your anonymity, it is relevant if you're hiding it to avoid reprisals, since that's exactly what we're talking about here. Maureen Maureen Nevin Asbury Radio -The Radio Voice of Asbury Park -Silenced by the FCC, but why?? 88.1FM - 6 Years on the Air!! Would've been 7 this July... Asbury's Own Live Talk Show_http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/post?postID=rHJIZqKLU40eDTc2KMHNHZwPoANfvykUf-QXIwGa01YupXx_FSgz9T8CYowEoqrp7AvGNPp3ZyP 4oWOTuAg_ (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/post?postID=rHJIZqKLU40eDTc2KMHNHZwPoANfvykUf-QXIwGa01YupXx_FSgz9T8CYowEoqrp7AvGNPp3ZyP4oWOTuAg) 601 Bangs Avenue - Forced from here by FCC... Listen 8 - 10 PM Thursdays on 88.1FM or Ooops, see below... Listen Live or Later on the Web _http://www.asburyradio.com/_ (http://www.asburyradio.com/) Call the show 732-775-0821 oops, not since the FCC visited this litte 100watt station - four times!! Call me 732-774-0779 fax 502-0463 Still can call this number... Speak up - It's America!! ** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
[AsburyPark] The People Argue, The President Visits The Troops
AL-ASAD AIR BASE, Iraq (AP) - _President Bush_ (http://get.lingospot.com/f?url=http://search.breitbart.com/q?s=President+Bushsid=breitbart.comamp;eid=c slamp;tid=ab80ac75bamp;site=breitbart.com) and his national security team made a first-hand assessment of the war in Iraq and prospects for political reconciliation Monday as a showdown nears with Congress over the U.S. troop buildup. The president secretly flew 11 hours to this air base in a remote part of Anbar province, bypassing Baghdad in a symbolic expression of impatience with political paralysis in the nation's capital. The gesture underscored the U.S. belief that the spark for progress may come at the local level. Defense Secretary Robert Gates arrived ahead of Bush and conferred with senior U.S. officials, including Gen. David Petraeus and Ambassador Ryan Crocker, before a session with Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki, President Jalal Talabani, and other top Iraqi officials from Baghdad. To a large degree, the setting was the message: Bringing al-Maliki, a Shiite, to the heart of mostly Sunni Anbar province was intended to show the administration's war critics that the beleaguered Iraqi leader is capable of reaching out to Sunnis, who ran the country for years under _Saddam Hussein_ (http://get.lingospot.com/f?url=http://search.breitbart.com/q?s=Saddam+Husseinsid= breitbart.comamp;eid=cslamp;tid=5e1f511dbamp;site=breitbart.com) . Bush has held up Anbar as an example of recent progress, especially on the security front, although the province is still economically deprived and not yet stable enough to turn over to full Iraqi control. Next week, Petraeus, the top U.S. commander in Iraq, and Crocker testify before Congress. Their assessment of the conflict, along with a progress report the White House must give lawmakers by Sept. 15, will determine the next chapter of the war. The United States cannot sustain the troop buildup indefinitely. And with Democrats calling for withdrawals and a rising U.S. death toll that has topped 3,700, the president is hardpressed to give al- Maliki's government much more time to find a political solution to the fighting. Bush stopped in Iraq ahead of his visit to Australia for an economic summit with Asia-Pacific leaders. The trip was a closely held secret for obvious security reasons, although speculation about the trip arose late last month when _first lady_ (http://get.lingospot.com/f?url=http://search.breitbart.com/q?s=first+ladysid=breitbart.comamp;eid=cslamp;tid=a585da888amp;site=breitbar t.com) _Laura Bush_ (http://get.lingospot.com/f?url=http://search.breitbart.com/q?s=Laura+Bushsid=breitbart.comamp;eid=cslamp;tid=fb4779149amp;site= breitbart.com) said she was staying home to tend to a pinched nerve in her neck. The president, who also went to Iraq at Thanksgiving 2003 and in June was scheduled to leave for Australia on Monday, but Air Force One took off from Andrews Air Force Base Sunday evening instead. He was joined by his top advisers, including National Security Adviser Stephen Hadley. Joining Gates were Gen. Peter Pace, chairman of the _Joint Chiefs of Staff_ (http://get.lingospot.com/f?url=http://search.breitbart.com/q?s=Joint+Chiefs%20of%20Staffsid=breitbart.comamp;eid=cslamp;tid=d76722fbbamp;sit e=breitbart.com) , and Adm. William Fallon, the top U.S. commander in the _Middle East_ (http://get.lingospot.com/f?url=http://search.breitbart.com/q?s=Middle+Eastsid=breitbart.comamp;eid=cslamp;tid=8166b510camp;site=breitbart. com) . Fallon flew aboard Gates' Air Force plane from Washington. Pengon press secretary Geoff Morrell said the session at al-Asad would be the last big gathering of the president's war advisers with Iraqi leaders before he makes a decision on a way forward in Iraq. The White House arranged Bush's trip at a pivotal juncture in the Iraq debate. Some prominent GOP lawmakers have broken with Bush on his war strategy, but so far, most Republicans have stood with Bush. In exchange for their loyalty, they want to see substantial progress in Iraq soon. Making his case before the Sept. 15 report deadline, Bush recently delivered a series of speeches to highlight how the temporary military buildup has routed out insurgents and foreign fighters. The president has described what he calls bottom-up progress in Iraq and often cites a drop in violence in Anbar Province, once a hotbed of insurgency. The turnaround occurred when Sunni Arab leaders joined forces with U.S. troops to hunt down members of al-Qaida, although it's unclear whether they'll back a unified Iraqi government as well. Critics of the war argue that while the troop buildup may have tamped down violence, the Iraqis are making almost no headway toward political reconciliation. They cite a handful of gloomy progress reports trickling out of Washington that show some success in curbing violence, but little
[AsburyPark] Re: Clearwater Paraphernalia?
Yeah, what about those tax dollars. Federal tax dollars? I didn't vote for Bush. I didn't vote for a war, yet my dollars are being used despite my vote, and against my principles. Now, Bush and company are well into a campaign in which they don't answer questions and do as they please without consequence, or caring. They are avoiding accountability, all the while reminding us if we don't fight the war, we have to fight the terrorists. Many will argue that the war has made the whole world a more dangerous place, and given rise to a greater number of terrorists who continue to learn and divise new tactics. A vast majority of Americans oppose Bush and the war, yet our dollars, many of which are unaccounted for, get spent despite public and global opinion. Explain that away. If I chose to protest by not paying my taxes, then i'd be in big trouble. I'd probably wind up in jail. Mission accomplished. Yeah right. --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Mario [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 9/2/2007 11:00:08 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: What's any of it got to do with clean water in Monmouth County, the purpose for which they were entrusted with tax money? I was having fun with your choice of the phrase abortion paraphernalia (probably literature). Not so much fun regarding the hot-button anti-Jewish which I explained fully in post 28508. To have it your way next year, pass the following manual along to the Clearwater Festival organizers: A manual that gives advance staffers extensive instructions in the art of deterring potential protestors. Among other things, any event must be open only to those with tickets tightly controlled by organizers. Those entering must be screened in case they are hiding secret signs. Any demonstrators who manage to get in anyway should be shouted down by rally squads stationed in strategic locations. And if that does not work, they should be thrown out It directs advance staff to ask local police to designate a protest area where demonstrators can be placed, preferably not in the view of the event site or motorcade route. Volunteers should examine people before they reach security checkpoints and look out for signs. Make sure to look for folded cloth signs. These squads should be instructed always to look for demonstrators, it says. The rally squad's task is to use their signs and banners as shields between the demonstrators and the main press platform. If the demonstrators are yelling, rally squads can begin and lead supportive chants to drown out the protestors (USA!, USA!, USA!). As a last resort, security should remove the demonstrators from the event site. A couple attended an open taxpayer-sponsored July Fourth event wearing T-Shirts with the red cirle and diagonal bar over the prez's name; they were handcuffed and booked. Their case resulted in the release of the redacted document last month Link below contains transcript and downloadable PDF, DOC or text files:Click here: George W. Bush's Presidential Advance Manual | YourLeaders.org http://www.yourleaders.org/george_w_bushs_presidential_advance_manual If it's just tax dollars you're concerned with, I'd say probably just chump change compared to the Billions of lost cash and weaponry since March 20, 2003 over there. http://www.newsday.com/news/opinion/ny-vpirq295350177aug29,0,949654.stor\ y http://www.newsday.com/news/opinion/ny-vpirq295350177aug29,0,949654.sto\ ry http://www.abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory?id=3539163 http://www.abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory?id=3539163 http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/story/16076312/the_great_iraq_swind\ le http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/story/16076312/the_great_iraq_swin\ dle Why no outrage over those tax dollars? Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [AsburyPark] The People Argue, The President Visits The Troops
In a message dated 9/3/2007 11:28:28 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: AL-ASAD AIR BASE, Iraq (AP) - _President Bush_ (http://get.lingospot.com/f?url=http://search.breitbart.com/q?s=President+Bushsid=breitbart.comamp;eid=c slamp;tid=ab80ac75bamp;site=breitbart.com) and his national security team made a first-hand assessment of the war in Iraq and prospects for political reconciliation Monday as a showdown nears with Congress over the U.S. troop buildup. _Troops Blast Surge: We've Out-Stayed Our Welcome_ (http://www.mcclatchydc.com/homepage/story/19377.html) ** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
Re: [AsburyPark] The People Argue, The President Visits The Troops
It's a clear middle finger to Maliki. Zooming in and out of a U.S. airbase in a foreign country that is under U.S. occupation and NOT meeting with that country's leaders only serves to reinforce the view generally held by a majority of people around the world that Iraq is really a U.S. possession, and does not act as its own country. Also, tellingly, Bush skipped Baghdad going to Anbar. According to the AP bypassing Baghdad in a symbolic expression of impatience with political paralysis in the nation's capital. But isn't Baghdad where the surge is? Isn't the surge the operation he is supposed to be assessing so he can tell us what a success it is? On Sep 3, 2007, at 1:12 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 9/3/2007 11:28:28 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: AL-ASAD AIR BASE, Iraq (AP) - President Bush and his national security team made a first-hand assessment of the war in Iraq and prospects for political reconciliation Monday as a showdown nears with Congress over the U.S. troop buildup. Troops Blast Surge: We've Out-Stayed Our Welcome Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL.com. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[AsburyPark] Ocean Grove meeting dominated by same sex marriage issue
I just got back from Ocean Grove, where I attended their annual meeting, which was dominated by protest and comments about the issue of same sex marriage in the boardwalk pavilion. Frank Pallone Jr. was there arguing that the association has received federal and state money for the boardwalk and other maintenance, and thus should follow the rules pertaining to other public places. What I hear is prejudice hiding behind bureacracy. Here's what kills me; The Came Meeting Association will allow any straight couple to be married there. So, if you are straight, and lets say you've done things like rape, murder, molest children, be dishonest...any of the things that we all find reprehensible, and you find Jesus, and apologize...because you are straight, you are fine. Now, I'm not saying that the straight community is filled with horrible people. It isn't. But. If you are gay, and you love the same God as the straight people, and found the same Jesus, no matter how else you've lived your life...you can't get married there. Because you are gay. That's prejudice. So, the most horrible staight person could get married there, but a person who's only crime in the eyes of the church is being gay will be rejected. Prejudice, plain and simple. Not only that, but if you reduce this to the basic argument that one kind of sex is fine, but the other is a sin...then that is ridiculous. There is plenty of crazy sex going on in the straight world. But no, that's ok. I won't even go into the details of this thought. Use you imagination. The overwhelming feeling at the meeting was that very many people feel like this fight has caused Ocean Grove a great amount of damage. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [AsburyPark] Re: The People Argue, The President Visits The Troops
In a message dated 9/3/2007 2:42:28 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: McClatchy... Ok, I know more about you than I need to. Another meaningless string of words, pretending to know what you don't. McClatchy is #17 corporate media company. Never accessed their news before, but looks as clean as any of the lot. _Click here: McClatchy Company profile and media properties - American media companies at MediaOwners.com_ (http://www.mediaowners.com/company/mcclatchy.html) ** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
[AsburyPark] Re: The People Argue, The President Visits The Troops
Another meaningless string of words, pretending to know what you don't. VVV do you ever use good manners in a discussion or a debate? you are a prime candidate for anger management! KB Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[AsburyPark] Re: Rev. Kev,... Help Me Out
--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Mario [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: But I really am still curious what a bona fide religious group is? I remember all those contentious cases with scientology, marijuana churches, churches requiring ritual slaughter of animals in Manhattan, something about an enema church in AP, et al. If you'd listed all the various credentialing places, I might consider enrolling. I've already had over 16 years of theological instruction. Then I could pontificate from a pulpit somewhere instead of just here. And I could Bless this and Bless that, and Bless Here and There I'd like to Bless all Asbury Park residents and home owners, many who've made this town their home through bad and worse times and are praying for this Renaissance. I'd Bless residents who report good news and those who are gadflies and critics in the best interest of AP. If I found a building suitable for a church, I would not declare any tax exemptions: Christ said to pay Caesar. I'd Bless non- residents who still sincerely believe AP can work. If the zoning board hassled me, I'd preach wherever people would listen; not waste taxpayers' money in litigation. I'd preach about Hell, Fire and Damnation to outsiders who post here usually to reiterate crime stories and their own politics, belying their charity and righteousness. And I'd even be able to sign off as XX The more important element in a minister's life is his call. Without one, you labor in vain. You have a legal right to do all the things you listed above in this country. What you need is the calling of God, without it you wouldn't last long. The one thing most pronounce in the 26 years I have spent in this, is that without the Spirit of God in and with you, you will fail! To call you Reverend Mario, is no big thing. To be a servant of the Lord is another matter. Hence, the remark; levitas Hasnonium pulsatus vos etiamnunc. I fully understand what I am called to do, and I do it as best as I am able. I don't need you to understand, because it won't be you I stand before at judgement, nor will it be you who grants it. Proverbs 14:8 The wisdom of the prudent is to understand his way; But the folly of fools is deceit. KB Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[AsburyPark] Re: Ocean Grove meeting dominated by same sex marriage issue
--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Hinge [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I just got back from Ocean Grove, where I attended their annual meeting, which was dominated by protest and comments about the issue of same sex marriage in the boardwalk pavilion. Frank Pallone Jr. was there arguing that the association has received federal and state money for the boardwalk and other maintenance, and thus should follow the rules pertaining to other public places. What I hear is prejudice hiding behind bureacracy. Here's what kills me; The Came Meeting Association will allow any straight couple to be married there. So, if you are straight, and lets say you've done things like rape, murder, molest children, be dishonest...any of the things that we all find reprehensible, and you find Jesus, and apologize...because you are straight, you are fine. Now, I'm not saying that the straight community is filled with horrible people. It isn't. But. If you are gay, and you love the same God as the straight people, and found the same Jesus, no matter how else you've lived your life...you can't get married there. Because you are gay. That's prejudice. So, the most horrible staight person could get married there, but a person who's only crime in the eyes of the church is being gay will be rejected. Prejudice, plain and simple. Not only that, but if you reduce this to the basic argument that one kind of sex is fine, but the other is a sin...then that is ridiculous. There is plenty of crazy sex going on in the straight world. But no, that's ok. I won't even go into the details of this thought. Use you imagination. The overwhelming feeling at the meeting was that very many people feel like this fight has caused Ocean Grove a great amount of damage. Civil Union is not Marriage, the legislatures stopped short of granting the right to marry. I want to know if a man and a woman can enter into a civil union? who knows? Please tell me! Thanks KB Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[AsburyPark] Re: The People Argue, The President Visits The Troops
Please, please, pretty please. Tell me what this means: McClatchy...OK, I know In a message dated 9/3/2007 2:42:28 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: McClatchy... Ok, I know more about you than I need to. Thanks you so much in advance! --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Kevin Brown [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Another meaningless string of words, pretending to know what you don't. VVV do you ever use good manners in a discussion or a debate? you are a prime candidate for anger management! KB
[AsburyPark] People Argue...Maybe It's Time to Pause
Tonight at 10. Maybe time to pause and learn some more. Inside America's Empire'': Military expert Robert Kaplan travels around the world to see how the U.S. defends against terror threats. Kaplan is a national correspondent for The Atlantic and the Class of 1960 Distinguished Visiting Professor in National Security at the United States Naval Academy. The TV program: Click here: America at a Crossroads. Inside America's Empire | PBS http://www.pbs.org/weta/crossroads/about/show_inside_americas_empire.ht\ ml From Amazon Starting in the Fall of 2003, Robert Kaplan spent six months with Special Forces teams all over the world and with a Marine combat unit in Iraq. His goal was to understand the changing nature of American war fighting techniques from the perspectives of non-coms and junior officersThe United States military is in the process of evolving to fight a new kind of war and Kaplan is there to chronicle this transformation as it takes places in the jungles of Colombia and the Phillipines and the deserts of Afghanistan, Yemen and Iraq. It is an important story and more journalists need to be covering it. 13 WNET Mon 9/3 10:00 PM 21 WHYY Mon 9/3 10:00 PM 713 WNETDT Mon 9/3 10:00 PM 713 WNETDT Tue 9/4 1:00 AM 132 WLIWDT4 Sun 9/9 10:00 PM 132 WLIWDT4 Mon 9/10 2:00 AM 132 WLIWDT4 Mon 9/10 9:00 AM 132 WLIWDT4 Mon 9/10 3:00 PM Nota bene: Noam Chomsky has called Kaplan an untra-right wing jingoist. But Chomsky has more than enough of his own critics ( http://tinyurl.com/e6cxa http://tinyurl.com/e6cxa ) , so I'm betting Kaplan is generically moderate. I'll just look for integrity no matter where he is on that continuum.
Re: [AsburyPark] People Argue...Maybe It's Time to Pause
Sorry. The correct link for that overview is _Click here: Criticism of Noam Chomsky - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia_ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_Noam_Chomsky) Note that to be fair and balanced, and politically correct here, I've provided access to criticisms of the epitome of ultra-left wingdom. Also, note that it's an overview for laymen, not original sources, not for serious researchers or academics; but you can use the new tool to evaluate what's there. _http://tinyurl.com/yu8jyj_ (http://tinyurl.com/yu8jyj) ** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
[AsburyPark] Re: Rev. Kev,... Help Me Out
In a message dated 9/3/2007 3:24:14 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: To call you Reverend Mario, is no big thing. OK. If you say so. You're entitled. I thought it was a big thing because I've had on my mind recent comments by Christopher Hitchens: It's amazing what you can get away with in this country when you call yourself 'reverend.'Then he continued that Deo Vindice (God as Our Defender) was the slogan of Confederate soldiers; and Gott Mit Uns (God with us) worn by German soldiers in WWII. So I'm skeptical that simply repeating God Bless our Troops yaer after year after year means anything in terms of real support. Hitchens was a fervent supporter of the Iraq invasion and a friend to Richard Pearl, so no pinko charges apply. And the right often challenges and ridicules the reverend status of Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson. I fully understand what I am called to do... Fine. But don't expect any posts here which rely solely on your understanding of God (as the definitive answer to our discussions) to go unchallenged because they are inspired by any special insight. Cordiali saluti,
[AsburyPark] A Parable of Civil Discord and the twisted legislature all for political purpose
Civil Unions are discriminatory against non gay's. If I wanted to better protect my assets beyond my death, or to share my family benefits with an adult member of my household, whom was of the opposite sex, I am not afforded any benefits under this arbitrary, capricious and discriminating act in New Jersey. I have a friend who is of the opposite sex. Yet we are like family, she is like my big sister and I want to share my health insurance and make sure my assets are her's to have when I pass. We are not married, nor do we wish to marry. We want civil union rights as well. Without this right for all people it is a violation of all that is decent. I am calling upon all people to fights to see that civil union laws stop discriminating against the majority of Americans. We need to challenge the New Jersey Act in Federal Court... Whose with me... ** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
Re: [AsburyPark] A Parable of Civil Discord and the twisted legislature all for political purpose
The law would allow cohabitating same-sex couples—and hetero couples in which at least one partner is older than 62—to register as domestic partners with the state attorney general's office. Domestic- partnership status would give each partner the right to make decisions if the other is incapacitated, such as arranging funerals and authorizing autopsies. It would also prevent hospitals from denying gay people access to a partner's hospital room—something that can happen when the state does not formally recognize a relationship. http://www.thestranger.com/seattle/Content?oid=171519 On Sep 3, 2007, at 5:09 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Civil Unions are discriminatory against non gay's. If I wanted to better protect my assets beyond my death, or to share my family benefits with an adult member of my household, whom was of the opposite sex, I am not afforded any benefits under this arbitrary, capricious and discriminating act in New Jersey. I have a friend who is of the opposite sex. Yet we are like family, she is like my big sister and I want to share my health insurance and make sure my assets are her's to have when I pass. We are not married, nor do we wish to marry. We want civil union rights as well. Without this right for all people it is a violation of all that is decent. I am calling upon all people to fights to see that civil union laws stop discriminating against the majority of Americans. We need to challenge the New Jersey Act in Federal Court... Whose with me... Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL.com.
[AsburyPark] Prayer and Sacrifice
In a message dated 9/3/2007 5:21:47 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: To the troop himself I imagine it means a great deal. To go into battle, to kill and risk being killed, I think I would want to feel a closeness with God. I would want to be sure in my cause being just, to be able to reconcile the killing with my religeous belief. I didn't allude at all to any soldier's private religious belief. Don't twist my words. The God Bless and the Colors can be hijacked by those claiming to support the troops. In fact, no one, except the soldiers and their families, is supporting in terms of sacrifice Where is the leadership calling for us all to sacrifice, materially or otherwise? Mark Twain had the best take on War Prayer:_Click here: The War Prayer_ (http://thewarprayer.com/war_film.html) ** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Rev. Kev,... Help Me Out
Unfortunately for 'the troop', Jesus did not reconcile the killing with religious belief. The ancient doctrine of just war should aid Christians in making such judgments. War must be a last resort; the authority waging war must be legitimate; the force employed must be proportional to the injury; non-combatants must not to be targeted; the war must be fought to redress a wrong; there must be a reasonable chance of success; the ultimate goal must be to reestablish peace. Unfortunately, however, though these principles are sound, they have been routinely used by war advocates to justify even the most dubious conflicts. Including Iraq. http://tinyurl.com/33b6l2 Instead of critically reviewing the case for and against invading that nation, many evangelicals blithely accepted the Bush administration's war rationale. They implicitly trusted the president, their co-religionist, relying on the administration's dubious (and quickly discredited) claims. For instance, Prison Fellowship founder Charles Colson cited administration arguments in explaining that just war theory should be stretched to include preemption of terrorism. He added: Of course, all of this presupposes solid intelligence and the goodwill of U.S. and Western leaders. Alas, it turns out that such intelligence was entirely lacking. Richard Land pointed to Hussein's development at breakneck speed of weapons of mass destruction he plans to use against America and her allies and the direct line from those who attacked the U.S. [on 9/11] back to the nation of Iraq. Of course, both claims were false. Other evangelical leaders made a humanitarian case for war. James Dobson argued that we are faced with another brutal tyrant. Saddam Hussein must be stopped. Appeasement of tyrants is never successful. Gary Bauer, Chairman of Campaign for Working Families, observed that Saddam Hussein's Iraq was a hell hole of torture and mass murder and that he allowed Iraq to become a safe haven for terrorists. Rev. Falwell entitled one article God is Pro-War. Until Christ's return, he contended, Christians must live as Galatians 6:2 instructs: 'Bear ye one another's burdens, and so fulfill the law of Christ'. Charles Stanley, pastor of Atlanta's First Baptist Church, argued that there are biblical grounds for a government to go to war to liberate others in the world who are enslaved. Scripture does tell believers to lay down their lives for others. But it does not instruct Christians to lay down other people's lives, as in taking the nation into war. Believers get no credit from instructing other people to do the sacrificing. Moreover, the consequences of the Iraq war and occupation – horrific violence and hundreds of thousands of deaths – is anything but humanitarian. On Sep 3, 2007, at 5:15 PM, justifiedright wrote: --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Mario [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Then he continued that Deo Vindice (God as Our Defender) was the slogan of Confederate soldiers; and Gott Mit Uns (God with us) worn by German soldiers in WWII. So I'm skeptical that simply repeating God Bless our Troops yaer after year after year means anything in terms of real support. To the troop himself I imagine it means a great deal. To go into battle, to kill and risk being killed, I think I would want to feel a closeness with God. I would want to be sure in my cause being just, to be able to reconcile the killing with my religeous belief. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[AsburyPark]
Does it seem like there's a new Republican scandal in the news every single week? Well, that may be because there is: January 23, 2007: Republican radio personality Scott Eller Cortelyou of Denver arrested on suspicion of using the Internet to lure a child into a sexual relationship January 29, 2007: Republican former Jefferson County, Colorado, Treasurer Mark Paschall indicted on two felony charges in connection with an allegation that Paschall solicited a kickback from a bonus he awarded one of his employees January 31, 2007: Republican Congressman Gary Miller is named by Republicans as ranking member of oversight subcommittee of House Financial Services Committee despite the FBI's investigation into his land deals February 14, 2007: Major Republican fundraiser Brent Wilkes and former CIA executive director Kyle Dusty Foggo are indicted by a grandy jury for corrupting CIA contracts February 16, 2007: Major Republican donor Abdul Tawala Ibn Ali Alishtari, aka Michael Mixon, is indicted in federal court on charges of providing material support to terrorists March 5, 2007: Ethics complaint filed against Republican Senator Pete Domenici for his role in the Attorney Purge scandal March 6, 2007: I. Lewis Scooter Libby, former chief of staff to Vice President Dick Cheney found guilty of obstruction of justice and perjury March 8, 2007: Republican former U.S. Congressman and Speaker of the House Newt Gingrich admits to extramarital affair March 23, 2007: Former Deputy Interior Secretary J. Steven Griles, an oil and gas lobbyist who became an architect of George W. Bush's energy policies, pleads guilty to obstructing justice by lying to a Senate committee March 27, 2007: Criminal charges filed against Republican Pennsylvania State Senator Robert Regola in connection with the death of a teenage neighbor who was shot with the senator's gun; he is accused of three counts of perjury, allowing possession of a firearm by a minor, recklessly endangering another person and false swearing March 27, 2007: Ronald Reagan's budget director, David Stockman, indicted on charges of defrauding investors and banks of $1.6 billion while chairman of Collins Aikman Corp., an auto parts maker that collapsed days after he quit March 28, 2007: Robert Vellanoweth, a Republican activist and appointee of Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger, is arrested on suspicion of gross vehicular manslaughter and felony driving under the influence of drugs or alcohol, after a crash that killed three adults and one child April 18, 2007: The FBI raids the home of Republican Congressman John Doolittle, investigating his ties to Jack Abramoff April 19, 2007: The FBI raids a business tied to the family of Republican Congressman Rick Renzi, as part of an investigation into his business dealings April 23, 2007: The FBI questions Republican Congressman Tom Feeney about his dealings with Jack Abramoff April 23, 2007: Federal auditors find repeat violations of federal election law from the 2004 Senate campaign of Republican Senator Mel Martinez April 26, 2007: David Huckabee, son of Republican Presidential candidate Mike Huckabee, is arrested at an Arkansas airport after a federal X-ray technician detected a loaded gun in his carry-on luggage May 4, 2007: Bruce Weyhrauch and Pete Kott, former Alaska state Republican legislators, were arrested and accused of soliciting and accepting bribes from the corrupt VECO Corporation May 4, 2007: Republican state Assemblyman Michael Cole is censured and stripped of his leadership position after the married father of two spent the night at a 21-year-old intern's apartment May 11, 2007: A field coordinator for Republican Congressman Patrick McHenry is indicted for voter fraud in North Carolina May 12, 2007: NBC News breaks the story that the FBI is investigating Republican Nevada Governor Jim Gibbons for suspicion of accepting bribes in exchange for securing government contracts May 15, 2007: Connecticut Republican Party Chairman Chris Healy is arrested for drunk driving (he pled no contest on June 1, but didn't publicly disclose the event until June 11) May 18, 2007: Republican former South Dakota State Representative Ted Klaudt is charged with eight counts of second-degree rape, two counts of sexual exploitation of a minor, one count of sexual contact with a child younger than 16, two counts of witness tampering and one count of stalking against two foster children in his care May 21, 2007: Republican state Senate candidate Mark Tate is indicted on nine counts of perjury and two counts of election fraud by a grand jury June 11, 2007: Republican Senator Larry Craig is arrested for lewd conduct in the men's bathroom of an airport June 19, 2007: South Carolina Republican state Treasurer and South Carolina Chairman of Giuliani for President Thomas Ravenel is indicted by a grand jury on cocaine
Re: [AsburyPark] A Parable of Civil Discord and the twisted legislature all for political purpose
Washington, D.C., has recognized domestic partnerships since 1992. However, Congress prohibited the District from spending any local funds to implement the law. The prohibition was lifted in the federal appropriations act for the District for the 2002 fiscal year. Domestic partnership in the District is open to both same-sex and opposite-sex couples. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Domestic_partner All couples registered as domestic partners are entitled to the same rights as family members to visit their domestic partners in the hospital and to make decisions concerning the treatment of a domestic partner’s remains after the partner’s death. The measure also grants District of Columbia government employees rights to a number of benefits. Domestic partners are eligible for health care insurance coverage, can use annual leave or unpaid leave for the birth or adoption of a dependent child or to care for a domestic partner or a partner's dependents, and can make funeral arrangements for a deceased partner. The Domestic Partnership Equality Amendment Act of 2006, D.C. Law 16-79, came into effect on April 4, 2006. This act provides that in almost all cases a domestic partner will have the same rights as a spouse regarding inheritance, probate, guardianship, and other rights traditionally accorded to spouses. On Sep 3, 2007, at 5:09 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Civil Unions are discriminatory against non gay's. If I wanted to better protect my assets beyond my death, or to share my family benefits with an adult member of my household, whom was of the opposite sex, I am not afforded any benefits under this arbitrary, capricious and discriminating act in New Jersey. I have a friend who is of the opposite sex. Yet we are like family, she is like my big sister and I want to share my health insurance and make sure my assets are her's to have when I pass. We are not married, nor do we wish to marry. We want civil union rights as well. Without this right for all people it is a violation of all that is decent. I am calling upon all people to fights to see that civil union laws stop discriminating against the majority of Americans. We need to challenge the New Jersey Act in Federal Court... Whose with me... Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL.com.
[AsburyPark] Re: Prayer and Sacrifice
Twist your words? Friend my post didn't even disagree with yours. I simple added a new thought. Don't always jump to the conclusion that if I'm posting I'm doing so to be against you. That's a sure sign of how much you hate me. --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 9/3/2007 5:21:47 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: To the troop himself I imagine it means a great deal. To go into battle, to kill and risk being killed, I think I would want to feel a closeness with God. I would want to be sure in my cause being just, to be able to reconcile the killing with my religeous belief. I didn't allude at all to any soldier's private religious belief. Don't twist my words. The God Bless and the Colors can be hijacked by those claiming to support the troops. In fact, no one, except the soldiers and their families, is supporting in terms of sacrifice Where is the leadership calling for us all to sacrifice, materially or otherwise? Mark Twain had the best take on War Prayer:_Click here: The War Prayer_ (http://thewarprayer.com/war_film.html) ** Get a sneak peek of the all- new AOL at http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [AsburyPark] Re: A Parable of Civil Discord and the twisted legislature all f...
Didn't you mean: More so, now that Congressman Frank Pallone seems so comfortable respecting the Constitution separation between Congress Church... On Sep 3, 2007, at 6:06 PM, Kevin Brown wrote: --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 9/3/2007 5:19:17 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I am calling upon all people to fights to see that civil union laws stop discriminating against the majority of Americans. We need to challenge the New Jersey Act in Federal Court... Whose with me... Why not go to your own congregation? Excuse me, I have an individual right to voice my opinion. Moreso now that Congressman Frank Pallone seems so comfortable crossing the great devide between Congress Church, as he did so elloquently at todays Ocean Grove Association meeting. I wonder if we will be permitted public portion the next time Congress meets in The Capitol. Schneider has never been right, and the upcoming decisions in the Third Circuit will bear me out on this. KB Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[AsburyPark] Re: RNC Talking Points
Edited for brevity: Not playing the race card. You'd have a chip as long as the boardwalk, if you were black, too! Following up. My son, 45, told me that he knows all about Vick and company. He said Vick comes from that environment, the gansta rappers, gangs, drugs, etc. When he became a millionaire, the money didn't gain him, the sophistication, needed, to behave, like someone with some sense! Said that Vick's mother, is also notorious, entering the stadium wearing a jersey with a full length mink coat, acting like a hoochie mama! Well! I stand corrected for sounding like the church lady or Emily Litella, of Saturday Night Live! NEVER MIND! Apologies to all! Not too arrogant, to say I'm sorry! My son, has always been aware of what goes on in the sports world, having played that sport and is a NCAA Champion, when he ran track at Stockton, in South Jersey. Reads Street and Smith and is a walking statistician, on all sports! I normally don't engage him, because he never stops talking, once he gets started! Again, sorry! --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Hinge [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The difference is, Vick has admitted to participating in killing the dogs, which include drowning and electrocution. I think it's sad that you are playing the race card on this one. --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, 2fine4u sharon_b283@ wrote: Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[AsburyPark] Re: RNC Talking Points
Dear Fanny: You're no angel, either! Flame on! Opinions are like A$$-holes; everybody has one! Re-read my post, before you comment! --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, fannyfooster [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dear Flamethrower, Before making comments like this please read the entire indictment. It does not matter in the least what color this POS is, he clearly is a sadistic monster and he should be away from the general population, as far away as possible. --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, 2fine4u sharon_b283@ wrote: Wasn't going to comment on Vick, but what's the difference between Vick and Dick Cheney, on a controlled hunt, where he shot his friend in the face and was with 2 women, neither of which, were their wives? Mind you, I DON'T condone any of the activities going on, on his property! Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [AsburyPark] Re: A Parable of Civil Discord and the twisted legislature all f...
I wonder if we will be permitted public portion the next time Congress meets in The Capitol. Ever since the First Continental Congress, it has opened with a prayer, and then there is the appointment of Chaplains to the two Houses of Congress however: Madison, however, thought that prayers in the legislature were unconstitutional: Is the appointment of Chaplains to the two Houses of Congress consistent with the Constitution, and with the pure principle of religious freedom? In strictness the answer on both points must be in the negative. The Constitution of the U. S. forbids everything like an establishment of a national religion. The law appointing Chaplains establishes a religious worship for the national representatives, to be performed by Ministers of religion, elected by a majority of them; and these are to be paid out of the national taxes. Does not this involve the principle of a national establishment, applicable to a provision for a religious worship for the Constituent as well as of the representative Body, approved by the majority, and conducted by Ministers of religion paid by the entire nation. The establishment of the chaplainship to Congs is a palpable violation of equal rights, as well as of Constitutional principles: The tenets of the chaplains elected [by the majority] shut the door of worship agst the members whose creeds consciences forbid a participation in that of the majority. To say nothing of other sects, this is the case with that of Roman Catholics Quakers who have always had members in one or both of the Legislative branches. Could a Catholic clergyman ever hope to be appointed a Chaplain? To say that his religious principles are obnoxious or that his sect is small, is to lift the evil at once and exhibit in its naked deformity the doctrine that religious truth is to be tested by numbers. or that the major sects have a right to govern the minor. If Religion consist in voluntary acts of individuals, singly, or voluntarily associated, and it be proper that public functionaries, as well as their Constituents shd discharge their religious duties, let them like their Constituents, do so at their own expence. How small a contribution from each member of Congs wd suffice for the purpose? How just wd it be in its principle? How noble in its exemplary sacrifice to the genius of the Constitution; and the divine right of conscience? Why should the expence of a religious worship be allowed for the Legislature, be paid by the public, more than that for the Ex. or Judiciary branch of the Govt Were the establishment to be tried by its fruits, are not the daily devotions conducted by these legal Ecclesiastics, already degenerating into a scanty attendance, and a tiresome formality? Rather than let this step beyond the landmarks of power have the effect of a legitimate precedent, it will be better to apply to it the legal aphorism de minimis non curat lex: or to class it cum maculis quas aut incuria fudit, aut humana parum cavit natura. From Madison's Detached Memoranda. On Sep 3, 2007, at 6:06 PM, Kevin Brown wrote: --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 9/3/2007 5:19:17 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I am calling upon all people to fights to see that civil union laws stop discriminating against the majority of Americans. We need to challenge the New Jersey Act in Federal Court... Whose with me... Why not go to your own congregation? Excuse me, I have an individual right to voice my opinion. Moreso now that Congressman Frank Pallone seems so comfortable crossing the great devide between Congress Church, as he did so elloquently at todays Ocean Grove Association meeting. I wonder if we will be permitted public portion the next time Congress meets in The Capitol. Schneider has never been right, and the upcoming decisions in the Third Circuit will bear me out on this. KB Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[AsburyPark] Re: Werner Confined 22 hrs/day
So are you a part of the problem or the solution? That was a mean spirited, jab! Truth crushed to the earth will rise again, like the phoenix, rising! This is not Russia, this is America and if you think throwing someone in jail, is a good thing, I feel sorry for you! --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Allan Peterson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Asbury (no longer on the) Radio aslo reported: Baumgartner, a watchdog and constant critic of the city's boards and consultants, attracted the occasional fines for violations on his property on Fifth Avenue. But the summonses billowed out of control after city officials gained access to his residence following a 911 call that police in Howell interpreted to be naming Baumgartner's home address. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[AsburyPark] Re: The People Argue, The President Visits The Troops
Mario, Just shaking my head! When people BUY what Bush is saying, I wonder if they drank the Kool-Aid? Thanks! --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 9/3/2007 2:42:28 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: McClatchy... Ok, I know more about you than I need to. Another meaningless string of words, pretending to know what you don't. McClatchy is #17 corporate media company. Never accessed their news before, but looks as clean as any of the lot. _Click here: McClatchy Company profile and media properties - American media companies at MediaOwners.com_ (http://www.mediaowners.com/company/mcclatchy.html) ** Get a sneak peek of the all- new AOL at http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[AsburyPark] Re: Rev. Kev,... Help Me Out
If you build it, they will come! That includes me! A Feel-Good Church! I like that! --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Mario [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 9/2/2007 11:26:42 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: People do not gain 501 (c) 3 status, charitable and religious organization do. I understand that, but the title reverend permits one to establish such an entity. And these folks explain much in layman's terms for me . Click here: Tax Reporting for Houses of Worship http://www.aicpa.org/pubs/jofa/may2006/mcnair.htm You can not mix apples with oranges, this is why the orange has the right not to be red or green to remain a bona fide orange. Nor is the apple blamed for the orange not tasting the same, even though they are both fruit. Gobbledygook (or the conservative sin of relativism)? Or, wait! Critics of the government not to intimidated by its supporters because they're all citizens? to remain a bona fide orange. But I really am still curious what a bona fide religious group is? I remember all those contentious cases with scientology, marijuana churches, churches requiring ritual slaughter of animals in Manhattan, something about an enema church in AP, et al. If you'd listed all the various credentialing places, I might consider enrolling. I've already had over 16 years of theological instruction. Then I could pontificate from a pulpit somewhere instead of just here. And I could Bless this and Bless that, and Bless Here and There I'd like to Bless all Asbury Park residents and home owners, many who've made this town their home through bad and worse times and are praying for this Renaissance. I'd Bless residents who report good news and those who are gadflies and critics in the best interest of AP. If I found a building suitable for a church, I would not declare any tax exemptions: Christ said to pay Caesar. I'd Bless non-residents who still sincerely believe AP can work. If the zoning board hassled me, I'd preach wherever people would listen; not waste taxpayers' money in litigation. I'd preach about Hell, Fire and Damnation to outsiders who post here usually to reiterate crime stories and their own politics, belying their charity and righteousness. And I'd even be able to sign off as Rev. Mario God Bless us, one and ALL. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[AsburyPark] Re: A Parable of Civil Discord and the twisted legislature all f...
--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Jersey Shore John [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I wonder if we will be permitted public portion the next time Congress meets in The Capitol. Ever since the First Continental Congress, it has opened with a prayer, and then there is the appointment of Chaplains to the two Houses of Congress however: Madison, however, thought that prayers in the legislature were unconstitutional: Is the appointment of Chaplains to the two Houses of Congress consistent with the Constitution, and with the pure principle of religious freedom? In strictness the answer on both points must be in the negative. The Constitution of the U. S. forbids everything like an establishment of a national religion. The law appointing Chaplains establishes a religious worship for the national representatives, to be performed by Ministers of religion, elected by a majority of them; and these are to be paid out of the national taxes. Does not this involve the principle of a national establishment, applicable to a provision for a religious worship for the Constituent as well as of the representative Body, approved by the majority, and conducted by Ministers of religion paid by the entire nation. The establishment of the chaplainship to Congs is a palpable violation of equal rights, as well as of Constitutional principles: The tenets of the chaplains elected [by the majority] shut the door of worship agst the members whose creeds consciences forbid a participation in that of the majority. To say nothing of other sects, this is the case with that of Roman Catholics Quakers who have always had members in one or both of the Legislative branches. Could a Catholic clergyman ever hope to be appointed a Chaplain? To say that his religious principles are obnoxious or that his sect is small, is to lift the evil at once and exhibit in its naked deformity the doctrine that religious truth is to be tested by numbers. or that the major sects have a right to govern the minor. If Religion consist in voluntary acts of individuals, singly, or voluntarily associated, and it be proper that public functionaries, as well as their Constituents shd discharge their religious duties, let them like their Constituents, do so at their own expence. How small a contribution from each member of Congs wd suffice for the purpose? How just wd it be in its principle? How noble in its exemplary sacrifice to the genius of the Constitution; and the divine right of conscience? Why should the expence of a religious worship be allowed for the Legislature, be paid by the public, more than that for the Ex. or Judiciary branch of the Govt Were the establishment to be tried by its fruits, are not the daily devotions conducted by these legal Ecclesiastics, already degenerating into a scanty attendance, and a tiresome formality? Rather than let this step beyond the landmarks of power have the effect of a legitimate precedent, it will be better to apply to it the legal aphorism de minimis non curat lex: or to class it cum maculis quas aut incuria fudit, aut humana parum cavit natura. From Madison's Detached Memoranda. On Sep 3, 2007, at 6:06 PM, Kevin Brown wrote: --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, MarioAPNJ@ wrote: In a message dated 9/3/2007 5:19:17 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, jerseykev@ writes: I am calling upon all people to fights to see that civil union laws stop discriminating against the majority of Americans. We need to challenge the New Jersey Act in Federal Court... Whose with me... Why not go to your own congregation? Excuse me, I have an individual right to voice my opinion. Moreso now that Congressman Frank Pallone seems so comfortable crossing the great devide between Congress Church, as he did so elloquently at todays Ocean Grove Association meeting. I wonder if we will be permitted public portion the next time Congress meets in The Capitol. Schneider has never been right, and the upcoming decisions in the Third Circuit will bear me out on this. KB What does anything you said, have to do with my comment about public portion at US Congress? You need to get some new glasses there buddy! KB Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[AsburyPark] Re: Ocean Grove meeting dominated by same sex marriage issue
You've just described the Right-Winged Republican Agenda, while they hypocritically point fingers at those they deem the enemy, bad for America, Family Value-less, while these so-called straights, fornicate their A$$es off! Same bunch that impeached Clinton, while they were having affairs, while married, molesting pages, getting kickbacks from lobbyists and calling themselves christians! If Ocean Grove is part of Neptune, why is Randy Bishop, putting up with this? He's Neptune's openly gay, Deputy Mayor and lives over there! I really had thought OG, had come into the 21st Century! Well, bring in the ACLU! --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Hinge [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I just got back from Ocean Grove, where I attended their annual meeting, which was dominated by protest and comments about the issue of same sex marriage in the boardwalk pavilion. Frank Pallone Jr. was there arguing that the association has received federal and state money for the boardwalk and other maintenance, and thus should follow the rules pertaining to other public places. What I hear is prejudice hiding behind bureacracy. Here's what kills me; The Came Meeting Association will allow any straight couple to be married there. So, if you are straight, and lets say you've done things like rape, murder, molest children, be dishonest...any of the things that we all find reprehensible, and you find Jesus, and apologize...because you are straight, you are fine. Now, I'm not saying that the straight community is filled with horrible people. It isn't. But. If you are gay, and you love the same God as the straight people, and found the same Jesus, no matter how else you've lived your life...you can't get married there. Because you are gay. That's prejudice. So, the most horrible staight person could get married there, but a person who's only crime in the eyes of the church is being gay will be rejected. Prejudice, plain and simple. Not only that, but if you reduce this to the basic argument that one kind of sex is fine, but the other is a sin...then that is ridiculous. There is plenty of crazy sex going on in the straight world. But no, that's ok. I won't even go into the details of this thought. Use you imagination. The overwhelming feeling at the meeting was that very many people feel like this fight has caused Ocean Grove a great amount of damage. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [AsburyPark] Re: A Parable of Civil Discord and the twisted legislature all f...
By I wonder if we will be permitted public portion the next time Congress meets in The Capitol, you were whining that your (we?) religious/conservative viewpoint isn't heard in Congress. Besides being so utterly laughable, and yet, sad and ignorant of how Congress works, my post quite on (your) topic. Religion is unconstitutionally embedded in the workings of Congress. Otherwise, what's the public portion you're seeking the next time Congress? Highway legislation? Ethanol Corn? Legislating one religious belief as superior over all others? On Sep 3, 2007, at 7:46 PM, Kevin Brown wrote: --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Jersey Shore John [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I wonder if we will be permitted public portion the next time Congress meets in The Capitol. Ever since the First Continental Congress, it has opened with a prayer, and then there is the appointment of Chaplains to the two Houses of Congress however: Madison, however, thought that prayers in the legislature were unconstitutional: Is the appointment of Chaplains to the two Houses of Congress consistent with the Constitution, and with the pure principle of religious freedom? In strictness the answer on both points must be in the negative. The Constitution of the U. S. forbids everything like an establishment of a national religion. The law appointing Chaplains establishes a religious worship for the national representatives, to be performed by Ministers of religion, elected by a majority of them; and these are to be paid out of the national taxes. Does not this involve the principle of a national establishment, applicable to a provision for a religious worship for the Constituent as well as of the representative Body, approved by the majority, and conducted by Ministers of religion paid by the entire nation. The establishment of the chaplainship to Congs is a palpable violation of equal rights, as well as of Constitutional principles: The tenets of the chaplains elected [by the majority] shut the door of worship agst the members whose creeds consciences forbid a participation in that of the majority. To say nothing of other sects, this is the case with that of Roman Catholics Quakers who have always had members in one or both of the Legislative branches. Could a Catholic clergyman ever hope to be appointed a Chaplain? To say that his religious principles are obnoxious or that his sect is small, is to lift the evil at once and exhibit in its naked deformity the doctrine that religious truth is to be tested by numbers. or that the major sects have a right to govern the minor. If Religion consist in voluntary acts of individuals, singly, or voluntarily associated, and it be proper that public functionaries, as well as their Constituents shd discharge their religious duties, let them like their Constituents, do so at their own expence. How small a contribution from each member of Congs wd suffice for the purpose? How just wd it be in its principle? How noble in its exemplary sacrifice to the genius of the Constitution; and the divine right of conscience? Why should the expence of a religious worship be allowed for the Legislature, be paid by the public, more than that for the Ex. or Judiciary branch of the Govt Were the establishment to be tried by its fruits, are not the daily devotions conducted by these legal Ecclesiastics, already degenerating into a scanty attendance, and a tiresome formality? Rather than let this step beyond the landmarks of power have the effect of a legitimate precedent, it will be better to apply to it the legal aphorism de minimis non curat lex: or to class it cum maculis quas aut incuria fudit, aut humana parum cavit natura. From Madison's Detached Memoranda. On Sep 3, 2007, at 6:06 PM, Kevin Brown wrote: --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, MarioAPNJ@ wrote: In a message dated 9/3/2007 5:19:17 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, jerseykev@ writes: I am calling upon all people to fights to see that civil union laws stop discriminating against the majority of Americans. We need to challenge the New Jersey Act in Federal Court... Whose with me... Why not go to your own congregation? Excuse me, I have an individual right to voice my opinion. Moreso now that Congressman Frank Pallone seems so comfortable crossing the great devide between Congress Church, as he did so elloquently at todays Ocean Grove Association meeting. I wonder if we will be permitted public portion the next time Congress meets in The Capitol. Schneider has never been right, and the upcoming decisions in the Third Circuit will bear me out on this. KB What does anything you said, have to do with my comment about public portion at US Congress? You need to get some new glasses
[AsburyPark] Re: Prayer and Sacrifice
Mario, There are groups: Blue Star Mothers of America, a support group, that councils spouses of their needs, financially and morally, The USO, The American Legion Auxiliary, VFW and their Auxiliary, Gold Star Mothers, Navy League and America Supports You, which is run by the DoD. We are constantly gathering supplies, such as lotions, soaps, baby wipes, razors and feminine hygiene products and snacks, as Exchanges in Iraq and Afghanistan, are in constant need, for lack of these items being readily available. Not a victory garden, or bond purchases, as we had during WWII and Viet Nam, but many people I know, still buy bonds through payroll deductions. You are correct, that the families and the soldiers are the ones suffering and being sacrificed, while those who have already served, do help by sending care packages over every month, bearing the costs, through donations. I purchased a case of hotel shampoos for $10.00, from a thrift store. It was worth $40.00 and had over 200, 1-ounce bottles. That along with money donated to purchase all of the other items, add up and are largely donated by retired workers, like me. We then have sorting parties, to pack the items. Over 50 cases a month are sent overseas, marked Any Soldier or Female Soldier, when feminine hygiene products are sent. It may not seem like much, but the letters and photos we receive, are worth it. This group did a lot of good, when AP had its' Katrina Drive right after the storm. I met many of the incredible people in this group and those who know me, know that I'm eternally grateful! We come through, when needed, but Bush Co., just don't know how this war is going to affect citizens, for decades to come! It's a shame! --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 9/3/2007 5:21:47 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: To the troop himself I imagine it means a great deal. To go into battle, to kill and risk being killed, I think I would want to feel a closeness with God. I would want to be sure in my cause being just, to be able to reconcile the killing with my religeous belief. I didn't allude at all to any soldier's private religious belief. Don't twist my words. The God Bless and the Colors can be hijacked by those claiming to support the troops. In fact, no one, except the soldiers and their families, is supporting in terms of sacrifice Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Prayer and Sacrifice
In a message dated 9/3/2007 6:11:35 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Twist your words? Friend my post didn't even disagree with yours. I simple added a new thought. Then use transitional words or phrases: however, on the other hand, etc. Otherwise, What we've got here is failure to communicate. Cool Hand Luke That's a sure sign of how much you hate me. You said the magic word. Goucho Marx If that's what you want to think fine.Some men you just can't reach, so you get what we had here last week which is the way he wants it. Cool Hand Luke But don't sully my rep with that childish you hate me. A line can be drawn between a person and their words or ideas. So I can hate the sin while remaining disinterested in the sinner; and now since the sinner broke our bargain, I don't have to buy all those drinks at The Wonder Bar. And I don't like it any more than you men. Cool Hand Luke Cordiali saluti, ** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
[AsburyPark] Re: Prayer and Sacrifice
However or on the other hand sound to me like I would be sayihng something contrary. Perhads, additionally or not only that? --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 9/3/2007 6:11:35 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Twist your words? Friend my post didn't even disagree with yours. I simple added a new thought. Then use transitional words or phrases: however, on the other hand, etc. Otherwise, What we've got here is failure to communicate. Cool Hand Luke That's a sure sign of how much you hate me. You said the magic word. Goucho Marx If that's what you want to think fine.Some men you just can't reach, so you get what we had here last week which is the way he wants it. Cool Hand Luke But don't sully my rep with that childish you hate me. A line can be drawn between a person and their words or ideas. So I can hate the sin while remaining disinterested in the sinner; and now since the sinner broke our bargain, I don't have to buy all those drinks at The Wonder Bar. And I don't like it any more than you men. Cool Hand Luke Cordiali saluti, ** Get a sneak peek of the all- new AOL at http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Rev. Kev,... Help Me Out
Maybe it's just me, but I'd be hearing that ol' commandment Thou Shall Not Kill in my ears all of the time. That commandment never says kill if the battle is correct or anything like that, it's pretty specific. Funny how religion has pretty much abandoned that aspect in the last 100 years or so. On Sep 3, 2007, at 5:15 PM, justifiedright wrote: --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Mario [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Then he continued that Deo Vindice (God as Our Defender) was the slogan of Confederate soldiers; and Gott Mit Uns (God with us) worn by German soldiers in WWII. So I'm skeptical that simply repeating God Bless our Troops yaer after year after year means anything in terms of real support. To the troop himself I imagine it means a great deal. To go into battle, to kill and risk being killed, I think I would want to feel a closeness with God. I would want to be sure in my cause being just, to be able to reconcile the killing with my religeous belief.
