[AsburyPark] Re: one more lastly: Fluff - Reality

[oakdorf]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "John C. LiDestri" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
JD,

You, dan and ALL the rest are needed, as is something in the form of
the ESP. Infill can happen as well, THAT is where the plan should be.
My wife has cousns in S. Beach in a little 2 bed and they love it.
They also could move to fancier digs as they could afford it. But
there is a great mix for everyone. And a few wrong turns away, under
Shaqs Giant Banner, are 1,000 homeless people getting food the night
of a BB game.

>From a $20 millon condo to that.

AP is a City - lots of brillant people, well off, invesrots, hucksters
and bucksters, artists, risk takers, gamblers and ordinary people.

All drawn to AP for one reason or another.

I might be at the Brick W Friday night. Someone told me one of their
friends is playing.



 
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[AsburyPark] Re: Coaster Article on Esperanza Shutdown

[jerseyjohn99]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "oakdorf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Yes, every private and public developer is hurting - depending 
where 
> they are in their cycle etc.
> 
> The bank cut are doing little to help.
> 
> But taking a look at Metro, they never had full crews on the 
project. 
> That's why I think they were looking for a partner real early on. 
The 
> heavy marketing push didn't do want they wanted - help sell at 
least 
> 3/4 of the building which MIGHT of helped them find a partner or 
> buyer.
> These of course are just thoughts, Maybe thy have a new 
partner/buyer 
> lined up and all our griping is meaningless.
> 
> 
> It's up to the City Council and partners to find out. Maybe a call 
to 
> Pru Insurance or North Fork.
> 
> The Council should also get a firm handle on how many of the 70 
> contracts are real amd how many were "insider" contractshow 
many 
> with actual deposits in escrow.
>

Hi guys,

I haven't been reading this board in months, but the news report on 
Esperanza drew me back here. 

Oak:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/message/24943

So, after selling 30 units in 3 weeks they got another 40 units in 7 
months? No wonder they closed the sales office. Weren't covering the 
rent.

Hope you guys took my advice & opened up that line of credit back in 
April:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/message/23850

Happy Holidays all!



 
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[AsburyPark] Re: one more lastly: Fluff - Reality

[dfsavgny]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "John C. LiDestri" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 
> It was also upsetting to see the generalizations that I read this 
> morning on a post about the people that would be attraced to this 
> building.  

That was gabrielle, the poor little rich girl faux hipster failed artist who 
would rather have shit on the bw. The rest of us welcome as many millioniares 
as we can get here. You belong here because you want to be here. We'll have 
drinks this summer. 
> 



 
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Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Johnson's Comments on Metro in the Coaster

[Allan Peterson]

Since there wasn't a performance bond, makes it easier to bail.



- Original Message 
From: dfsavgny <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2007 4:22:57 PM
Subject: [AsburyPark] Re: Johnson's Comments on Metro in the Coaster

--- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] ups.com, "oakdorf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED] > wrote:
>
> 
> > 
> > Johnson also said that delays in construction of the Esperanza, due to
> > waiting for CAFRA permits and having the state perform inspections
> > instead of the city, may have impacted sales.

Metro was not in play for the original CAFRA filing which was approved
in January 2004. I guess I am at fault since I made the CAFRA permit
get pulled because the City submitted the June WRP for the permit but
when I said that plan would not permit the previous height if C-8 was
demolished Aaron said the June plan was not valid, only the earlier
March "draft."

That cause even poor Joe D to lose faith.

The reality is as you put it. But if they could get the financing (and
they can it just costs more) it would still work. Yes, they took their
sweet time and never had a full crew on. You know what? Too many pots
on the stove. There is a shortage of gas and they decide what pot they
want to really cook and eat.





  

Never miss a thing.  Make Yahoo your home page. 
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Re: [AsburyPark] Re: one more lastly: Fluff - Reality

[MarioAPNJ]

In a message dated 12/13/2007 9:01:13 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

I  really consider myself a very down to earth and caring person, to 
be  stereotyped as someone that could give a shit about a community 
because of  that fact that I can afford a luxury condo is 
disturbing. Buying a  lifestyle...disturbing. Buying a  lifest
that I would like a pool  and a game room to entertain my friends as 
well as be steps away from a  beautiful beachhopefully with no 
human shit left on it. I would like  to do my tequilla shot either 
pool side or at the beach bar...that is a  lifestyle I find very 
appealing.
 
 
 

Good for you to challenge those simplistic  accusations.
 
 



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[AsburyPark] Re: one more lastly: Fluff - Reality

[John C. LiDestri]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "oakdorf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Let's continue bashing until John gets back his $$$ (if he wants):


I am not exactly sure how to replyI find quite a bit of this 
funny, especially the name contest, on the other hand I feel very 
shaken and also saddened by the situation.  Of course I would like 
my money back, but I would like even more to have this project seen 
to completion.seems like a long shotyou never know

It was also upsetting to see the generalizations that I read this 
morning on a post about the people that would be attraced to this 
building.  

I really consider myself a very down to earth and caring person, to 
be stereotyped as someone that could give a shit about a community 
because of that fact that I can afford a luxury condo is 
disturbing.  Buying a lifestyleyes I am not afraid to admitt 
that I would like a pool and a game room to entertain my friends as 
well as be steps away from a beautiful beachhopefully with no 
human shit left on it.  I would like to do my tequilla shot either 
pool side or at the beach bar...that is a lifestyle I find very 
appealing.

I am also being realistic, if this does't come through we are in a 
buyers market for at least the next 6 months so I can look for 
something elsehopefully with my deposit returned and in my 
pocket!

John



 
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Re: [AsburyPark] Re: As if life weren't depressing enough...

[MarioAPNJ]

 
In a message dated 12/13/2007 5:15:43 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

BTW, I like  that Sen Mitchell. I worked with him on the Deutsche Bank
Bldg. He was the  mediator between my client, the insurer, and DB and
the Lower Manhattan  Development Corp. A real class act. maybe he can
mediate throwing partners  out. 


 
 
 
_Newsmaker: George  Mitchell_ 
(http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/sports/july-dec07/mitchell_12-13.html) 
Former Sen. George Mitchell issued his report Thursday on  the use of 
steroids in Major League Baseball. Mitchell details the report in an  interview 
with 
Jeff Brown.
 
Full text transcript and realaudio here >>> _Online  NewsHour: Newsmaker 
Interview | Report Names Players for Steroids | December 13,  2007 | PBS_ 
(http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/sports/july-dec07/mitchell_12-13.html)  



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Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Coaster Article on Esperanza Shutdown

[lightgrw]

oakdorf wrote:
>
> Gary,
>
> I think the steinbach building (which is a rental) has 38 vacancies.
> Thats out of 63.
>







 
**  looks like there are 2 floors with about 3-4 apts rented.  The 
person must have been in one of those areas.

I just think that if the Steinbach's building is a hard sell, it's gotta 
be tough anywhere in town.  That's a great location for an apartment 
building with lots of restaurants and nightlife nearby and walking 
distance to train.  I realize the oceanfront is probably a different 
audience but to me Steinbach's is full if in a decent housing market or 
if priced for the market.

I may be totally wrong, but that's how I see it.


 
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[AsburyPark] Re: Coaster Article on Esperanza Shutdown

[oakdorf]

learn from the mistakes and fix them. 
> 
> Talk like that builds up defenses. One of the worst things in 
fighting with a spouse or partner is to go sleep on the couch. Make up 
sex is wonderful.
>
HAve you been in my house since last week? I got home at 2:30 am from 
AC last week at the stupid real estate show

She told me to go and have fun and "do what I would do.." MY mistake 
was coming home at all and NOT doing what she would do.

I gave up the couch the other night and moved back to my nice warm bed. 

Guess I'll take your last line of advice.

I'll just tell her that  wasted 4 days on yahoo taking about AP and 
this guy said "One of the worst things in fighting with a spouse or 
partner is to go sleep on the couch. Make up sex is wonderful."

Guess where I'll be. Besides that, my in-laws are over.




 
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[AsburyPark] Re: Coaster Article on Esperanza Shutdown

[dfsavgny]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, lightgrw <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> True, but eventually accountability and results have to come into play 
> as well.


Agreed. But, we have spent the better part of 6 years yelling at each other to 
no effect. I am not interesting in assessing blame. The time has come to 
collectively learn from the mistakes and fix them. 

Talk like that builds up defenses. One of the worst things in fighting with a 
spouse or partner is to go sleep on the couch. Make up sex is wonderful. 





 
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Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Coaster Article on Esperanza Shutdown

[MarioAPNJ]

 
The Eighth Circle of Hell (Bolgia 9) is reserved for  Sowers of Discord

(28) The poets come to the edge of the ninth  ditch, and look down at a 
parade of hideously mutilated souls. These are the  SOWERS OF DISCORD, and just 
as 
their sin was to rend asunder what God had  meant to be united, so are they 
hacked and torn through all eternity by a  great demon with a bloody sword. 
After each mutilation the souls are compelled  to drag their broken bodies 
around 
the pit and to return to the demon, for in  the course of the circuit their 
wounds heal in time to be inflicted  anew. - Dante


In a message dated 12/13/2007 6:58:30 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

"A  nation divided against itself cannot stand"

--- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com) ,  
"dfsavgny" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> 
> --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com) ,  
"justifiedright" 
> wrote:
>  >
> >
> > Then tell it to this guy:
> >
>  > "If Councilman Loffredo and his supporters are blaming this
> >  situation on the
> > state of housing market, they are being  disingenuous at best," Keady
> > said.
> >
> >  That's not exactly an offer to build a coalition. And throwing in
>  "and
> > his supporters" is politically unwise since that alienates  not just
> John
> > but alot of other folks. It's hardly a  disingenuous belief
> considering
> > what's happening in the  world.
> >
> > I'll give him a pass in light of the new  detante. But he has to meet
> me
> > half way and avoid that  sort or rhetoric.
> >
> 
> 
> I am with you 100% on  that.
> 
> They will beat their swords into plowshares and their  spears into
> pruning hooks. Nation will not take up sword against  nation, nor will
> they train for war anymore. — Isaiah
> <_http://en.wikipediahttp://en.http://en.wiki_ 
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Book_of_Isaiah) >  2:4 & Micah
> <_http://en.wikipediahttp://en.http://en.wik_ 
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Book_of_Micah) >  4:3
>







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[AsburyPark] Re: Coaster Article on Esperanza Shutdown

[oakdorf]

Gary,

I think the steinbach building (which is a rental) has 38 vacancies. 
Thats out of 63.

I posted numbers back in August.Go to Steinbachbuilding.com you can 
see whats available.

Yes, every private and public developer is hurting - depending where 
they are in their cycle etc.

The bank cut are doing little to help.

But taking a look at Metro, they never had full crews on the project. 
That's why I think they were looking for a partner real early on. The 
heavy marketing push didn't do want they wanted - help sell at least 
3/4 of the building which MIGHT of helped them find a partner or 
buyer.
These of course are just thoughts, Maybe thy have a new partner/buyer 
lined up and all our griping is meaningless.


It's up to the City Council and partners to find out. Maybe a call to 
Pru Insurance or North Fork.

The Council should also get a firm handle on how many of the 70 
contracts are real amd how many were "insider" contractshow many 
with actual deposits in escrow. 




 
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[AsburyPark] Re: Coaster Article on Esperanza Shutdown

[justifiedright]

Gary I'm sure folks can make reasonable arguments for one of the 
many different theories about what prompted Metro's actions (of 
course there is only one truth and only they know it; the rest of us 
are speculating).  

The issue I brought up is whether it's right to accuse someone of 
being "disingenuous" which is kind of a gentlman's way of calling 
someone a liar.

It's quite reasonable for someone to assert the National Market is 
the problem  with Metro, and someone can "genuinely" hold the view, 
considering that the country IS in a real estate near-disaster right 
now.  I hold the view myself.

It's not just slumping values, it's the credit problem.  There's no 
money to borrow.  This one-two punch of slumping values and scarce 
money is a developer's worst nightmare.

Nothing disingenuous about that.

It's quite reasonable.

That's not to suggest the theory you present is not reasonable.  It 
is.

Only Metro know which of these reasonable theories (or another) is 
the truth, and they ain't saying.



  



--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, lightgrw <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Is it possible that Metro is also looking at the sales figures for 
some 
> of the other projects like the Steinbach's building and blaming 
the 
> housing market in Asbury Park as much or more than national 
housing 
> problems.
> 
> I'm not sure how many people have moved into places like the 
Steinbach's 
> building but it doesn't seem like there are ever that many lights 
on at 
> night.  About a month ago I was talking to someone who lived there 
and 
> they said there was like one other apartment rented on their floor.
> 
> Maybe they realized they might be stuck with a half sold building 
if 
> they continued.   If that was part of their thinking at all then 
doesn't 
> it beg the question of whether or not the entire plan for the 
oceanfront 
> was truly sound in being so heavy towards residential?
> 
> 
> 
> justifiedright wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com 
> > , "dfsavgny"  
wrote:
> >
> > > I think we are entering a period in which there is going to be 
great
> > > thought by the City in how to move forward and right the 
wrongs of the
> > > past. Thus, I suggest no more divide and conquer.
> >
> > Then tell it to this guy:
> >
> > "If Councilman Loffredo and his supporters are blaming this
> > situation on the
> > state of housing market, they are being disingenuous at best," 
Keady
> > said.
> >
> > That's not exactly an offer to build a coalition. And throwing 
in "and
> > his supporters" is politically unwise since that alienates not 
just John
> > but alot of other folks. It's hardly a disingenuous belief 
considering
> > what's happening in the world.
> >
> > I'll give him a pass in light of the new detante. But he has to 
meet me
> > half way and avoid that sort or rhetoric.
> >
> >
>




 
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Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Coaster Article on Esperanza Shutdown

[lightgrw]

True, but eventually accountability and results have to come into play 
as well. If someone looked at the various condo projects in Asbury for 
the redevelopment for the first time and saw a few with limited 
residents, a few totally empty, and projects stalled... wouldn't that 
make them question the plan a bit?

Maybe that's what is needed as much as a united front. The Council was 
largely united towards this plan for years and years. Is the result in 
2007-2008 what they expected at this point? Do they believe things are 
headed in the right direction?

The Metro situation doesn't mean the sky is falling but I think it poses 
an excellent point of the need to reflect and evaluate how things have 
gone and where they appear to be headed.


Jack Pitzer wrote:
>
> "A nation divided against itself cannot stand"
>
> --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com 
> , "dfsavgny" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> >
> > --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com 
> , "justifiedright" 
> > wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > Then tell it to this guy:
> > >
> > > "If Councilman Loffredo and his supporters are blaming this
> > > situation on the
> > > state of housing market, they are being disingenuous at best," Keady
> > > said.
> > >
> > > That's not exactly an offer to build a coalition. And throwing in
> > "and
> > > his supporters" is politically unwise since that alienates not just
> > John
> > > but alot of other folks. It's hardly a disingenuous belief
> > considering
> > > what's happening in the world.
> > >
> > > I'll give him a pass in light of the new detante. But he has to meet
> > me
> > > half way and avoid that sort or rhetoric.
> > >
> >
> >
> > I am with you 100% on that.
> >
> > They will beat their swords into plowshares and their spears into
> > pruning hooks. Nation will not take up sword against nation, nor will
> > they train for war anymore. — Isaiah
> >  > 2:4 & Micah
> >  > 4:3
> >
>
>  



 
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[AsburyPark] Re: Increases in Education Aid Range From 2 to 20 Percent

[asburycheech]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> The districts that would fare the worst under the plan are cities like  
> Newark, Asbury Park and Camden, each of which would receive a 2
percent  increase.  
> _Increases in  Education Aid Range From 2 to 20 Percent Under
Corzine Plan - 

> I don't know how this translates in real dollar terms. An optimistic
 spin 
> would be that since we get so much to start with, 2% isn't so bad. 
 And 
> compared to what we would have received without the new formula. 


Hi Mario,
Speaking for myself, you are, once again, oh so right!
Frank




 
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[AsburyPark] Re: Coaster Article on Esperanza Shutdown

[Jack Pitzer]

"A nation divided against itself cannot stand"

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "dfsavgny" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> 
> --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "justifiedright" 
> wrote:
> >
> >
> > Then tell it to this guy:
> >
> > "If Councilman Loffredo and his supporters are blaming this
> > situation on the
> > state of housing market, they are being disingenuous at best," Keady
> > said.
> >
> > That's not exactly an offer to build a coalition.  And throwing in
> "and
> > his supporters" is politically unwise since that alienates not just
> John
> > but alot of other folks.  It's hardly a disingenuous belief
> considering
> > what's happening in the world.
> >
> > I'll give him a pass in light of the new detante.  But he has to meet
> me
> > half way and avoid that sort or rhetoric.
> >
> 
> 
> I am with you 100% on that.
> 
> They will beat their swords into plowshares and their spears into
> pruning hooks. Nation will not take up sword against nation, nor will
> they train for war anymore. — Isaiah
>   2:4 & Micah
>   4:3
>





 
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[AsburyPark] Re: Coaster Article on Esperanza Shutdown

[dfsavgny]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "justifiedright" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>
>
> Then tell it to this guy:
>
> "If Councilman Loffredo and his supporters are blaming this
> situation on the
> state of housing market, they are being disingenuous at best," Keady
> said.
>
> That's not exactly an offer to build a coalition.  And throwing in
"and
> his supporters" is politically unwise since that alienates not just
John
> but alot of other folks.  It's hardly a disingenuous belief
considering
> what's happening in the world.
>
> I'll give him a pass in light of the new detante.  But he has to meet
me
> half way and avoid that sort or rhetoric.
>


I am with you 100% on that.

They will beat their swords into plowshares and their spears into
pruning hooks. Nation will not take up sword against nation, nor will
they train for war anymore. — Isaiah
  2:4 & Micah
  4:3

Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Coaster Article on Esperanza Shutdown

[lightgrw]

Is it possible that Metro is also looking at the sales figures for some 
of the other projects like the Steinbach's building and blaming the 
housing market in Asbury Park as much or more than national housing 
problems.

I'm not sure how many people have moved into places like the Steinbach's 
building but it doesn't seem like there are ever that many lights on at 
night.  About a month ago I was talking to someone who lived there and 
they said there was like one other apartment rented on their floor.

Maybe they realized they might be stuck with a half sold building if 
they continued.   If that was part of their thinking at all then doesn't 
it beg the question of whether or not the entire plan for the oceanfront 
was truly sound in being so heavy towards residential?



justifiedright wrote:
>
>
>
> --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com 
> , "dfsavgny" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > I think we are entering a period in which there is going to be great
> > thought by the City in how to move forward and right the wrongs of the
> > past. Thus, I suggest no more divide and conquer.
>
> Then tell it to this guy:
>
> "If Councilman Loffredo and his supporters are blaming this
> situation on the
> state of housing market, they are being disingenuous at best," Keady
> said.
>
> That's not exactly an offer to build a coalition. And throwing in "and
> his supporters" is politically unwise since that alienates not just John
> but alot of other folks. It's hardly a disingenuous belief considering
> what's happening in the world.
>
> I'll give him a pass in light of the new detante. But he has to meet me
> half way and avoid that sort or rhetoric.
>
>  



 
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[AsburyPark] Re: Coaster Article on Esperanza Shutdown

[justifiedright]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "dfsavgny" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:


> I think we are entering a period in which there is going to be great
> thought by the City in how to move forward and right the wrongs of the
> past. Thus, I suggest no more divide and conquer.

Then tell it to this guy:

"If Councilman Loffredo and his supporters are blaming this
situation on the
state of housing market, they are being disingenuous at best," Keady
said.

That's not exactly an offer to build a coalition.  And throwing in "and
his supporters" is politically unwise since that alienates not just John
but alot of other folks.  It's hardly a disingenuous belief considering
what's happening in the world.

I'll give him a pass in light of the new detante.  But he has to meet me
half way and avoid that sort or rhetoric.




 
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[AsburyPark] Re: Coaster Article on Esperanza Shutdown

[dfsavgny]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, lightgrw <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>

> We have one voice of reason. Maybe this is the time to take
advantage of 
> an opportunity.
>

I think we are entering a period in which there is going to be great
thought by the City in how to move forward and right the wrongs of the
past. Thus, I suggest no more divide and conquer. An election is 18
months away. Those in office today can show why they should or should
not be relected by how they approach this and attempt to put this
redevelopment on the right path.

My first reaction to the Metro was "disastrous." While one project
does not a redevelopment make, and I understand that we will survive,
I am not ignorant of the effect it had on onlookers in light of the
unfortunate history of previously failed redevelopment plans here,
including C-8.




 
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Re: [AsburyPark] Coaster Article on Esperanza Shutdown

[lightgrw]

 From the article, Keady said:

“The year-round community needs to benefit from the fact that Asbury Park
needs to be a resort destination,” he said. “We need to go back to what
worked in the past for Asbury Park.”

He continued, “What worked in the past would work for it in the future.”



We have one voice of reason. Maybe this is the time to take advantage of 
an opportunity.

Hinge, wanna work with me on a proposal?

Anybody else interested in setting ideas in motion regarding tourism and 
entertainment to
give to them?







Keady said part of the problem is that the city has not been marketed to
middle class people.


I totally agree! I think Asbury wants to get a young, hip crowd but has 
priced itself to a very small degree of the audience it could have.



James Keady wrote:
>
> City Beachfront Project Put on Hold
> By JOANNE L. PAPAIANNI and ELLEN CARROLL
>
> After more than a year of planning and promotion the ambitious Esperanza
> luxury condominium complex on the Asbury Park beachfront is closing down
> production, at least temporarily.
>
> Dean Geibel, owner of Metro Homes and developer of the site, said the
> project could be on hold a “shorter versus longer” period of time, but 
> would
> not comment further.
>
> Those working at the site on Ocean Avenue were sent home Friday.
> Geibel said 70 of the luxury units have been sold and any money left on
> deposit by customers will continue to be held in an escrow account, 
> until a
> decision is made about the future of the project.
>
> The most luxurious of the three residential projects under construction in
> the city’ redevelopment beachfront area, the Esperanza’s plan calls for
> amenities such as 24-hour concierge, a fitness center, restaurants, a pool
> and decks overlooking the ocean in addition to 224 units.
>
> The Esperanza is being built on the site where another high-rise unit was
> planned but later abandoned and imploded to make way for this new project.
> City Manager Terry Reidy said the City Council will hold a special meeting
> Fri., Dec. 14 to discuss the “temporary slow down” of the Esperanza, which
> means hope in Spanish.
>
> “I truly believe that Asbury Park does not rise and fall on one project,”
> Reidy said. “The council will take a look at the agreement and make 
> sure the
> city does everything to protect its interest in the matter. It is 
> important
> for the city to stay close and work with them while they re-engineer their
> project. Winter time is the best time to take that kind of action, to look
> at a project and see how to make it work.”
>
> Deputy Mayor Jim Bruno said the city will survive.
>
> “We have so much more going on,” he said. “With Madison Marquette in
> partners with Asbury Partners and taking over the retail on the
> boardwalk…they have some exciting things planned for the summer of 2008.
>
> Hopefully, the market is going to change sooner rather than later. But 
> this
> is not an Asbury thing. It’s happening all over the country.”
>
> Bruno said the timing of the announcement was not the best coming as 
> it did
> two weeks before Christmas.
>
> “We just hope the new year is better for Metro Homes,” he said.
>
> Larry Fishman, chief operating officer of Asbury Partners, the city’s
> beachfront master developer, said he expected that Metro Homes will either
> redesign its project or perhaps another developer will step in to complete
> it.
>
> He also noted that Paramount Homes, working on three residential 
> projects at
> the north end of the city, has just about completed its three 
> buildings. It
> is 85 percent built out and approximately 50 residents are living in units
> there either part time or full time, said Carolyn Villani, vice 
> president of
> sales and marketing for Paramount.
>
> “It’s important to let people know we are going strong,” Villani said. 
> “I am
> sure Metro will work something out. To rebuild a city does not happen
> overnight. We believe in the dream.”
>
> Councilman Ed Johnson said the shut down only highlights the need for a
> dispute resolution agreement for all development projects in the city.
> He said he believed all development projects in the city should be subject
> to performance guarantees and requirements and developers not meeting 
> those
> requirements should pay penalties.
>
> “If things are not being done according to a timetable, what do we do to
> protect the people of Asbury Park,” Johnson said.
>
> Johnson admits that developers were caught up in the economic downturn and
> collapse of the housing market, but believes that residents should 
> have some
> protection.
>
> Johnson also said that delays in construction of the Esperanza, due to
> waiting for CAFRA permits and having the state perform inspections instead
> of the city, may have impacted sales.
>
> “It turned so 

Re: [AsburyPark] Increases in Education Aid Range From 2 to 20 Percent

[MarioAPNJ]

 
In a message dated 12/13/2007 5:05:38 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

 
And the interactive  >>>   
_New  Jersey School Districts - The New York Times_ 
(http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2007/12/11/nyregion/20071212_JERSEY_GRAPHIC.html)
  




If you put your mouse over tiny AP on the map, it shows the  details:$57, 
718,000 for 2008, and lots more there.
 



**See AOL's top rated recipes 
(http://food.aol.com/top-rated-recipes?NCID=aoltop000304)

[AsburyPark] Re: Increases in Education Aid Range From 2 to 20 Percent

[dfsavgny]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
>> I don't know how this translates in real dollar terms. An
optimistic  spin 
> would be that since we get so much to start with, 2% isn't so bad. 
 And 
> compared to what we would have received without the new formula. 
> Probably in the press tomorrow.
>

Saw that this am. if you go to the interactive graphic you can touch
each district and it shows you what they get. I think we are getting
in excess of $50M




 
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[AsburyPark] Re: As if life weren't depressing enough...

[dfsavgny]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "justifiedright"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/7560358?MSNHPHCP>1=10734
>

The guys were watching it here all day on tv. What's the big fuss? if
these guys want to kill themselves let them. We let people smoke?

BTW, I like that Sen Mitchell. I worked with him on the Deutsche Bank
Bldg. He was the mediator between my client, the insurer, and DB and
the Lower Manhattan Development Corp. A real class act. maybe he can
mediate throwing partners out. He with DLA Piper Rudnick I think.



 
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[AsburyPark] Coaster Article on Esperanza Shutdown

[James Keady]

City Beachfront Project Put on Hold
By JOANNE L. PAPAIANNI and ELLEN CARROLL

After more than a year of planning and promotion the ambitious Esperanza
luxury condominium complex on the Asbury Park beachfront is closing down
production, at least temporarily.

Dean Geibel, owner of Metro Homes and developer of the site, said the
project could be on hold a “shorter versus longer” period of time, but would
not comment further.

Those working at the site on Ocean Avenue were sent home Friday.
Geibel said 70 of the luxury units have been sold and any money left on
deposit by customers will continue to be held in an escrow account, until a
decision is made about the future of the project. 

The most luxurious of the three residential projects under construction in
the city’ redevelopment beachfront area, the Esperanza’s plan calls for
amenities such as 24-hour concierge, a fitness center, restaurants, a pool
and decks overlooking the ocean in addition to 224 units.

The Esperanza is being built on the site where another high-rise unit was
planned but later abandoned and imploded to make way for this new project.
City Manager Terry Reidy said the City Council will hold a special meeting
Fri., Dec. 14 to discuss the “temporary slow down” of the Esperanza, which
means hope in Spanish.

“I truly believe that Asbury Park does not rise and fall on one project,”
Reidy said. “The council will take a look at the agreement and make sure the
city does everything to protect its interest in the matter. It is important
for the city to stay close and work with them while they re-engineer their
project. Winter time is the best time to take that kind of action, to look
at a project and see how to make it work.”

Deputy Mayor Jim Bruno said the city will survive.

“We have so much more going on,” he said. “With Madison Marquette in
partners with Asbury Partners and taking over the retail on the
boardwalk…they have some exciting things planned for the summer of 2008. 

Hopefully, the market is going to change sooner rather than later. But this
is not an Asbury thing. It’s happening all over the country.”

Bruno said the timing of the announcement was not the best coming as it did
two weeks before Christmas.

“We just hope the new year is better for Metro Homes,” he said.

Larry Fishman, chief operating officer of Asbury Partners, the city’s
beachfront master developer, said he expected that Metro Homes will either
redesign its project or perhaps another developer will step in to complete
it.

He also noted that Paramount Homes, working on three residential projects at
the north end of the city, has just about completed its three buildings. It
is 85 percent built out and approximately 50 residents are living in units
there either part time or full time, said Carolyn Villani, vice president of
sales and marketing for Paramount.

“It’s important to let people know we are going strong,” Villani said. “I am
sure Metro will work something out. To rebuild a city does not happen
overnight. We believe in the dream.”

Councilman Ed Johnson said the shut down only highlights the need for a
dispute resolution agreement for all development projects in the city. 
He said he believed all development projects in the city should be subject
to performance guarantees and requirements and developers not meeting those
requirements should pay penalties.

“If things are not being done according to a timetable, what do we do to
protect the people of Asbury Park,” Johnson said.

Johnson admits that developers were caught up in the economic downturn and
collapse of the housing market, but believes that residents should have some
protection.

Johnson also said that delays in construction of the Esperanza, due to
waiting for CAFRA permits and having the state perform inspections instead
of the city, may have impacted sales.

“It turned so fast, but there were delays that were completely unnecessary,”
Johnson said.

“The economy changed and the housing market changed, but that is not the
fault of the people of Asbury Park,” Johnson said.

Johnson said Madison Marquette, beachfront developers are an example of how
things should be done.

“They are a prime example of when you put your mind to do something, you can
get it done,” Johnson said. “Look what they have been able to accomplish in
six months – quite frankly, it’s not that hard to do.”

Councilman John Loffredo said he believes the outcome for the project would
have been different if Metro Homes could have begun the project sooner.
“If they could have gotten into the ground sooner I think things would have
been different for them,” Loffredo said.

But Loffredo echoed the thoughts of many.

“Look, this is nothing different than what’s happening throughout the
country,” he said.

Loffredo also said that he would like to see the Esperanza stay in its
current form.

He said he will be attending a special meeting Friday morning to discuss the
matter, but said if the project is changed it will be mean starting 

Re: [AsburyPark] As if life weren't depressing enough...

[lightgrw]

Interestingly, *Mitchell * called for tougher testing but said players 
should not be punished for “past misdeeds.”


That's kind of how I feel too, although some of the steroids were most 
likely illegal in the United States. If that was the case then how do 
you really treat this situation on a historical level? Especially with 
players like Barry Bonds who were hall of famers BEFORE steroids and the 
took their career to a new level after taking them?

Oh well...


justifiedright wrote:
>
> http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/7560358?MSNHPHCP>1=10734 
> 1=10734>
>
>  



 
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[AsburyPark] Increases in Education Aid Range From 2 to 20 Percent

[MarioAPNJ]

The districts that would fare the worst under the plan are cities like  
Newark, Asbury Park and Camden, each of which would receive a 2 percent  
increase.  
_Increases in  Education Aid Range From 2 to 20 Percent Under Corzine Plan - 
New York Times_ (http://www.nytimes.com/2007/12/13/nyregion/13schools.html)  
 
And the interactive  >>>   
_New  Jersey School Districts - The New York Times_ 
(http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2007/12/11/nyregion/20071212_JERSEY_GRAPHIC.html)
  

 
New Jersey School Districts
Governor Jon S. Corzine has proposed rewriting the formula for state aid to  
local schools. All districts will get a minimum of two percent more in 2008-9  
than they did this year, and most middle class districts will get only small  
increases. Some Abbott districts, the mostly inner-city schools that have  
received millions in aid over the last two decades as the result of a lawsuit,  
would get the minimum. 
=== 
I don't know how this translates in real dollar terms. An optimistic  spin 
would be that since we get so much to start with, 2% isn't so bad.   And 
compared to what we would have received without the new formula. 
Probably in the press tomorrow.
 
 



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[AsburyPark] As if life weren't depressing enough...

[justifiedright]

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/7560358?MSNHPHCP>1=10734



 
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[AsburyPark] Re: Shore Trivia for Foodies

[dfsavgny]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "justifiedright"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Whoops!  Didn't see the rest of the answer.  You're guy is right. My 
> fault.
> 

You know I could have answered that right after Mario first posted it
(even though I had no idea of the answer). I googled it but couldn't
come up with anything but saw that there was a Lindy's restaurant. So
I figured, it's got to be Lindy's, no? I should have bluffed.




 
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[AsburyPark] Re: Shore Trivia for Foodies

[justifiedright]

Whoops!  Didn't see the rest of the answer.  You're guy is right. My 
fault.


--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "justifiedright" 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> No actually, that's wrong.
> 
> The Lindy salad pre-dates Draughting table at the Shore by many 
> years.
> 
> The restaurant that was known for it was I believe in Neptune 
City.  
> Name escapes me.
> 
> Oak?
> 
> 
> --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, MarioAPNJ@ wrote:
> >
> >  
> > Best, only,  and correct entry from a non-member who reads here:
> >  
> >  
> > Lindey Salad and it still on the DT [Draughting Table] menue.  
It 
> was  named 
> > after Lindy Sicliano who use to own Lindy"s Restaurant in 
Neptune 
> City  where 
> > Brennan"s Steak House is located today.  
> > 
> >  
> > Happy Holidaze!
> >  
> > W00t, W00t!
> >  
> > In a message dated 11/29/2007 3:57:35 P.M. Eastern Standard 
Time,  
> > MarioAPNJ@ writes:
> > 
> > Let's see who's up on shore restaurant trivia.
> >  
> > The Lindy Salad:
> >  
> > 1. Who was it named for?
> >  
> > 2. At what restaurant?
> >  
> > 3. Where is it still on the menu?
> >  
> > 4. Triple points for the recipe  ingredients.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >  
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > **See AOL's top rated 
recipes 
> > (http://food.aol.com/top-rated-recipes?NCID=aoltop000304)
> >
>




 
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[AsburyPark] Re: Shore Trivia for Foodies

[justifiedright]

No actually, that's wrong.

The Lindy salad pre-dates Draughting table at the Shore by many 
years.

The restaurant that was known for it was I believe in Neptune City.  
Name escapes me.

Oak?


--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
>  
> Best, only,  and correct entry from a non-member who reads here:
>  
>  
> Lindey Salad and it still on the DT [Draughting Table] menue.  It 
was  named 
> after Lindy Sicliano who use to own Lindy"s Restaurant in Neptune 
City  where 
> Brennan"s Steak House is located today.  
> 
>  
> Happy Holidaze!
>  
> W00t, W00t!
>  
> In a message dated 11/29/2007 3:57:35 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,  
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
> 
> Let's see who's up on shore restaurant trivia.
>  
> The Lindy Salad:
>  
> 1. Who was it named for?
>  
> 2. At what restaurant?
>  
> 3. Where is it still on the menu?
>  
> 4. Triple points for the recipe  ingredients.
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> **See AOL's top rated recipes 
> (http://food.aol.com/top-rated-recipes?NCID=aoltop000304)
>




 
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[AsburyPark] Re: Johnson's Comments on Metro in the Coaster

[dfsavgny]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "oakdorf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> 
> > 
> > Johnson also said that delays in construction of the Esperanza, due to
> > waiting for CAFRA permits and having the state perform inspections
> > instead of the city, may have impacted sales.


Metro was not in play for the original CAFRA filing which was approved
in January 2004. I guess I am at fault since I made the CAFRA permit
get pulled because the City submitted the June WRP for the permit but
when I said that plan would not permit the previous height if C-8 was
demolished Aaron said the June plan was not valid, only the earlier
March "draft."

That cause even poor Joe D to lose faith.

The reality is as you put it. But if they could get the financing (and
they can it just costs more) it would still work. Yes, they took their
sweet time and never had a full crew on. You know what? Too many pots
on the stove. There is a shortage of gas and they decide what pot they
want to really cook and eat.




 
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[AsburyPark] Re: Johnson's Comments on Metro in the Coaster

[oakdorf]

> 
> > 
> > Johnson also said that delays in construction of the Esperanza, due 
to
> > waiting for CAFRA permits and having the state perform inspections
> > instead of the city, may have impacted sales.
> 

again, maybe they wanted to flip it and it failed.




 
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[AsburyPark] Re: Name that site contest

[dfsavgny]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> Anyone care to judge which Circle Asbury Partners should go to?
>  
> I say the Eighth, anything Bolgia 4 and above.


An the decades long cycle of failed redevelopment has relegated AP to
Acheron.




 
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[AsburyPark] Re: Johnson's Comments on Metro in the Coaster

[oakdorf]

> 
> Johnson also said that delays in construction of the Esperanza, due to
> waiting for CAFRA permits and having the state perform inspections
> instead of the city, may have impacted sales.
> 
> 

WRONG WRONG WRONG.

PRICE
PERCEPTION
SALE APPROACH COMBINED WITH PRICE

Another real builder told me that Metro had only about 1/2 of the 
amount of people that should of been on the project way back when.

The things weren't selling as fast as they expected given the 
marketing. What then is the excuse for Welsey Grove - it's ugly? Or the 
Steinbach?

I've been through with quite a few people. They like them, but aren't 
willing to pay the number. Maybe some of the banks simply didn't want 
to give loans without more down on these condos.

THINGS ARE OVERPRICED for AP or WHAT YOU GET.

There are X number of people with over $400k to spend
Out that, you have to convince those to buy into AP.

PRICING FOR AP.



 
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[AsburyPark] Re: Name that site contest

[dfsavgny]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> In a message dated 12/13/2007 3:56:59 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,  
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
> 
> Anyone care to judge which Circle Asbury Partners should go to?
>  
> I say the Eighth, anything Bolgia 4 and above.

Aaron goes into Bolgia otto.




 
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[AsburyPark] Johnson's Comments on Metro in the Coaster

[dfsavgny]

Councilman Ed Johnson said the shut down only highlights the need for
a dispute resolution agreement for all development projects in the city.

He said he believed all development projects in the city should be
subject to performance guarantees and requirements and developers not
meeting those requirements should pay penalties.

"If things are not being done according to a timetable, what do we do
to protect the people of Asbury Park," Johnson said.

Johnson admits that developers were caught up in the economic downturn
and collapse of the housing market, but believes that residents should
have some protection.

Johnson also said that delays in construction of the Esperanza, due to
waiting for CAFRA permits and having the state perform inspections
instead of the city, may have impacted sales.

"It turned so fast, but there were delays that were completely
unnecessary," Johnson said.

"The economy changed and the housing market changed, but that is not
the fault of the people of Asbury Park," Johnson said.



 
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[AsburyPark] Maxie Update

[Anthony Granito]

 

Hi All -

 

We hope your holiday season if off to an enjoyable start. We just wanted to
give you the latest update on Maxie and thank you once again for your
thoughts, prayers and help. I ran across a quote the other day from Pamela
Dugdale that sums up our feelings for you all: Dogs bring out the best in
humankind. You all have truly demonstrated this again and again and we are
grateful.

 

Maxie still hasn't come home and we are now trying to follow up on one more
credible lead. We received a call about two weeks ago from a woman who lives
in the senior building at 206 First Ave in Asbury. She said she thinks she
spotted Maxie in her building. She said she saw a man with a dog in the
elevator around Nov 14, around the time Maxie first went missing. She had
never seen him with a dog before so she commented on the dog and asked where
he got it. He said he found the dog on the beach, loose.

 

At the time, the woman hadn't seen our flyer, so she didn't think much about
it. Two weeks later she saw our flyer, recognized the dog, and called us.
Unfortunately she doesn't know what apartment the man lives in and the
building is very large. She promised to keep an eye out for him and let us
know if she sees him or Maxie again. Both the timing, when this man claimed
he found the dog on the beach, and the location, make sense. And the woman
seemed sure it was Maxie, so we are viewing this as a credible lead. Any
help you can offer in following up on this lead would as always be welcomed
and greatly appreciated.

 

We have spent time watching the building in the hope of seeing him bring her
down for a walk, but no luck so far. The building is large and has many
entrances and exits. We continue to go past the building and,
coincidentally, will be moving next week to a building just a few blocks
away from the senior building. We are looking into our ability to get inside
the building, and if we can we will canvass all the occupants (or as many as
possible). 

 

As Christmas presents for ourselves and for our male English Bulldog,
Muscles, and to help us in the healing process, we bought new puppies
Anthony N. and Rick now have a 9 week old female Pug, Bella, and Anthony G
has a 13 week old male English Bulldog, Tank. Both new additions are
adorable and are bringing lots of joy to us, just what we needed!! But we
still need Maxie to come home to make us feel complete as a family!!

 

Wishing you and your animal friends all the best during the holidays!

 

Anthony N - 510 First Ave

Rick G - 510 First Ave

Anthony G - 600 8th Ave

 

P.S. We will be getting our pets chipped.

Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Name that site contest

[MarioAPNJ]

In a message dated 12/13/2007 3:56:59 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

The  inscription over the entranceway to hell in Dante's Divine  Comedy.
 
 

Surprisingly, next to Will S, Divine Comedy remains one of my students'  
favorites.  It turned one of our football heroes into an English  teacher.  
Wiki 
does a neat job for the Ninth Circles of Hell.
 
Anyone care to judge which Circle Asbury Partners should go to?
 
I say the Eighth, anything Bolgia 4 and above.
 
 
_The  Divine Comedy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia_ 
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circle_of_hell#The_Circles_of_Hell)  
 
 
W00t, W00T!

 
 



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[AsburyPark] Re: Name that site contest

[dfsavgny]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "oakdorf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> 
> > Or as an alternative
> > 
> > "Lasciate ogne speranza, voi ch'intrate"
> >
> 
> Very good.
> 
> Leave every hope, those who enter
>

Abandon all (every) hope, ye who enter here

The inscription over the entranceway to hell in Dante's Divine Comedy.



 
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Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Name that site contest

[MarioAPNJ]

 
In a message dated 12/13/2007 3:45:15 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

Or as  an alternative

"Lasciate ogne speranza, voi  ch'intrate"


 
Dante knew his shitake.
 
But, sometimes this is just as effective:
 
“You don't like it, take the gas pipe.”Uncle Abe, Radio  Days
 
I refuse to erase it from the DVR
 
 
 



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[AsburyPark] Re: Name that site contest

[oakdorf]

> Or as an alternative
> 
> "Lasciate ogne speranza, voi ch'intrate"
>

Very good.

Leave every hope, those who enter



 
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[AsburyPark] Re: Name that site contest

[dfsavgny]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "oakdorf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> 
> got it.
> 
> technology is great.


makes us look smart




 
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[AsburyPark] Re: Name that site contest

[oakdorf]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "dfsavgny" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> 
> --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, lightgrw  wrote:
> >
> > causa perdida
> >
> 
> And inscribed over the entryway (from my family's coat of arms)
> 
> Futue te ipsum et caballum tuum
>

got it.

technology is great.



 
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[AsburyPark] Tax Sale

[Allan Peterson]

Tax sale list is on the city website.


  

Never miss a thing.  Make Yahoo your home page. 
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[AsburyPark] Re: Name that site contest

[dfsavgny]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "dfsavgny" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
> --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, lightgrw lightgrw@ wrote:
> >
> > causa perdida
> >
>
> And inscribed over the entryway (from my family's coat of arms)
>
> Futue te ipsum et caballum tuum
>


Or as an alternative

"Lasciate ogne speranza, voi ch'intrate"

[AsburyPark] Re: Name that site contest

[dfsavgny]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, lightgrw <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> causa perdida
>

And inscribed over the entryway (from my family's coat of arms)

Futue te ipsum et caballum tuum

Re: [AsburyPark] Shore Trivia for Foodies

[MarioAPNJ]

 
Best, only,  and correct entry from a non-member who reads here:
 
 
Lindey Salad and it still on the DT [Draughting Table] menue.  It was  named 
after Lindy Sicliano who use to own Lindy"s Restaurant in Neptune City  where 
Brennan"s Steak House is located today.  

 
Happy Holidaze!
 
W00t, W00t!
 
In a message dated 11/29/2007 3:57:35 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

Let's see who's up on shore restaurant trivia.
 
The Lindy Salad:
 
1. Who was it named for?
 
2. At what restaurant?
 
3. Where is it still on the menu?
 
4. Triple points for the recipe  ingredients.



 



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Re: [AsburyPark] Name that site contest

[lightgrw]

causa perdida




> __ 



 
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[AsburyPark] Name that site contest

[oakdorf]

What if Ivanka comes to town? Or Paris? I have great name if they 
partner with me...


NAME THE NEW ESPERANZA SITE CONTEST
Beers on me plus $10:

Order your t-shirts


Take a pick:
(I took "rayo" )

there's no hope of that 
no hay esperanza de eso 

I hope you're satisfied! 
¡estarás contento! 

I hope so 
eso espero 

I hope not 
espero que no 

I hope you like it 
espero que te guste 

let's hope so 
¡ojalá! 

a ray of hope 
un rayo de esperanza 

con esperanza hope 
esperar 

glimmer of hope 
rayo 

I only hope you're right 
¡ojalá tuvieras razón! 

I hope he comes 
¡ojalá venga! 

we all hope for peace 
todos ansiamos la paz 

(deseo, esperanza) hope 
ilusión f n

give up hope 
desesperar  



 
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[AsburyPark] Re: Great Stocking Stuffer - AP should market this too

[justifiedright]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "oakdorf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Dan is right.
> 
> AP should celebrate Hannukah. 

And I'd have no problem with that.

However, to celebrate Christmas but ditch the name, that's a very 
different thing than not celebrating it at all.   That's a 
deliberate insult.  It's no oversight either.  They made a conscious 
decision to change the name.

Imagine the outrage if AP changed the name of another holiday.  If 
we didn't acknowledge Kwanzaa by its name, Hannukah by its name, Gay 
Pride day by its name, I'd complain with those groups.

I don't know why the favor isn't returned. I know I can't do 
anything about it either.

Like I said, probably more than a few private snickers at my expense 
because it does upset me.  

Next AP retailer to go broke without my $3,000.00 won't be 
snickering that day, and neither will I. 

But I might bring it up to Gilmour.



 
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[AsburyPark] Re: Great Stocking Stuffer - AP should market this too

[oakdorf]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "dfsavgny" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>

> 
> But how about the poor jewish cop, fireman or santitation guy?
> Everyone thinks he's a failure.
> 

Add to that the one trying to sell $800,000+ condos in AP instead of 
focusing on commercial stuff.

You think my mother didn't call me the other day?





 
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[AsburyPark] Re: Great Stocking Stuffer - AP should market this too

[dfsavgny]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "justifiedright"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> 
> Ditto - but why then the conscious decision to strike the name when 
> they admit in private email that Christmas is really the holiday?
> 
> That's insulting to me.

Why? You want the Christ put back in Christmas? We've passed that rest
stop along time ago. Let's just admit that it has become a reason to
spend money and goodwill. If eliminating some of its dubious religious
origins from it allow more to join in that goodwill, then that's good.




 
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Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Great Stocking Stuffer - AP should market this too

[Allan Peterson]

Well, maybe Asbury will change that like Walmart did.  Last year or the year 
before they refused to say Christmas, this year it is a part of the slogan.


- Original Message 
From: justifiedright <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2007 2:30:33 PM
Subject: [AsburyPark] Re: Great Stocking Stuffer - AP should market this too

--- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] ups.com, Allan Peterson  
wrote:
>
> The Director of Good Times, Tom Gilmor...

He's on my crap list.

Got this long email from him today about all the 
Decemember "Holiday" events in AP, that was laced with quotes from 
Christmas songs, even using the word "Merry," but he took great 
pains to make sure nowhere in the whole email was the 
word "Christmas" recorded.

The same email invites me to a Kwanzaa celebration.

I got a separte emial from the AP Chamner of (no)Commerce inviting 
me to "Holiday" celebrations. I sent back an email that simply 
asked "What holiday are you speaking of?" The response came back 
one word: "Christmas." I then inquired why the event isn't called 
a Christmas celebration and why does no add say that? I still await 
a response.

Don't need one. That the privately admit the holiday is Christmas 
but publically won't say it, I know that it is a conscious effort to 
strike the name. 

I know all that is meaningless to many here, but it hurts my 
feelings.

Nothing I can do about it either.

Except of course the $3,000.00 I drop on Christmas presents every 
year - well not one penny of my Christian American dollars went to 
Asbury this year just because of this issue.

It won't next year either so long as Gilmour and AP make a conscious 
effort to insult me.

As I'm sure they find if funny that I complain about it but can do 
nothing about it, but I note there is nothing they can do about my 
droppoing $3,000 originally intended for AP in stores like Wal-Mart, 
Costco and Target.





  

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[AsburyPark] Re: Great Stocking Stuffer - AP should market this too

[justifiedright]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "oakdorf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Curious, that $3k you're dropping - COULD any of those items be 
> purchased at shops in AP? 

Lots of it.

> Celebrate as you wish. 

Ditto - but why then the conscious decision to strike the name when 
they admit in private email that Christmas is really the holiday?

That's insulting to me.

>Blame it on the lawyers.

You must mean ACLU lawyers. They don't scare me.



 
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[AsburyPark] Re: Great Stocking Stuffer - AP should market this too

[dfsavgny]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "oakdorf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> That's why the Italians always want a Jewish accountant or attorney.
> 

Nail on the head. My father would not even talk to an attorney if he
wasn't Jewish.

But how about the poor jewish cop, fireman or santitation guy?
Everyone thinks he's a failure.

Old stereotypes. Goyum, goyum, gone.





 
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[AsburyPark] Re: Great Stocking Stuffer - AP should market this too

[oakdorf]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "dfsavgny" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
. But then again,
> most of my clients are Jews so if I had to put Happy Hannukah I would.
> >
>

Dan is right.

AP should celebrate Hannukah. 

Well, at least a guess based on tax records.

That's why the Italians always want a Jewish accountant or attorney.

):



 
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[AsburyPark] Re: Great Stocking Stuffer - AP should market this too

[oakdorf]

> 
> As I'm sure they find if funny that I complain about it but can do 
> nothing about it, but I note there is nothing they can do about my 
> droppoing $3,000 originally intended for AP in stores like Wal-
Mart, 
> Costco and Target.
>

Damn, I'm trying to get my desk cleared off.

Curious, that $3k you're dropping - COULD any of those items be 
purchased at shops in AP? If so, are they MORE expensive that then 
box stores? 

didn't we go through this the past couple HOLIDAY SEASONS.

Celebrate as you wish. Blame it on the lawyers.

Happy Hanukkah. Next year, I'll deliver the Latakes and my moms 
brisket. Yum.

I'm even luckier. My wife is a nice Catholic girl.

I always tell everyone, I wish I video of the priest's face when my 
mother-in-law broke the news that I was Jewish...

he got over it.

Merry Christmas.

My kids always thought I screwed up the Christmas lights becuase I 
didn't have them as a kid.

I think we're on year 2 of no lights or tree. The menorah, whcih 
never got lit either, is back on the shelf.

Happy N Year.

What'd you buy?






 
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[AsburyPark] Re: Great Stocking Stuffer - AP should market this too

[dfsavgny]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "justifiedright" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>
> He's on my crap list.
>
> Got this long email from him today about all the
> Decemember "Holiday" events in AP, that was laced with quotes from
> Christmas songs, even using the word "Merry," but he took great
> pains to make sure nowhere in the whole email was the
> word "Christmas" recorded.
>
> The same email invites me to a Kwanzaa celebration.

Does your business send cards that say Merry Christmas or Happy Holiday
to clients?

I know mine say the latter as does everyone I get.  And I am careful
that there are no religious symbols in the cards design. But then again,
most of my clients are Jews so if I had to put Happy Hannukah I would.
>

[AsburyPark] Re: Great Stocking Stuffer - AP should market this too

[justifiedright]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Allan Peterson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
>
> The Director of Good Times, Tom Gilmor...

He's on my crap list.

Got this long email from him today about all the 
Decemember "Holiday" events in AP, that was laced with quotes from 
Christmas songs, even using the word "Merry," but he took great 
pains to make sure nowhere in the whole email was the 
word "Christmas" recorded.

The same email invites me to a Kwanzaa celebration.

I got a separte emial from the AP Chamner of (no)Commerce inviting 
me to "Holiday" celebrations.  I sent back an email that simply 
asked "What holiday are you speaking of?"  The response came back 
one word:  "Christmas."  I then inquired why the event isn't called 
a Christmas celebration and why does no add say that?  I still await 
a response.

Don't need one.  That the privately admit the holiday is Christmas 
but publically won't say it, I know that it is a conscious effort to 
strike the name. 

I know all that is meaningless to many here, but it hurts my 
feelings.

Nothing I can do about it either.

Except of course the $3,000.00 I drop on Christmas presents every 
year - well not one penny of my Christian American dollars went to 
Asbury this year just because of this issue.

It won't next year either so long as Gilmour and AP make a conscious 
effort to insult me.

As I'm sure they find if funny that I complain about it but can do 
nothing about it, but I note there is nothing they can do about my 
droppoing $3,000 originally intended for AP in stores like Wal-Mart, 
Costco and Target.





 
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[AsburyPark] Re: Great Stocking Stuffer - AP should market this too

[dfsavgny]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Allan Peterson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>
> The Director of Good Times, Tom Gilmor said in one of his email blasts
that beach bages would be for sale for hoiliday gifts.  Not sure what
ever happened to that.  Maybe the same person who controls the city
website also dropped the ball on this.
>

No, they are on sale at public works through Dec 21.

Tom also said in today's email blast to

Don your gay apparel

Isn't that de rigueur already [:D]


>

Re: [AsburyPark] Great Stocking Stuffer - AP should market this too

[Allan Peterson]

The Director of Good Times, Tom Gilmor said in one of his email blasts that 
beach bages would be for sale for hoiliday gifts.  Not sure what ever happened 
to that.  Maybe the same person who controls the city website also dropped the 
ball on this.  


- Original Message 
From: justifiedright <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2007 2:12:02 PM
Subject: [AsburyPark] Great Stocking Stuffer - AP should market this too

Belmar hopes shoppers will give the gift of sun and sand

By ERIK LARSEN
COASTAL MONMOUTH BUREAU 

Forget Christmas and Hanukkah: Memorial Day weekend is just 164 days 
away, and that means 2008 beach badges are now on sale at borough 
hall for 2007 prices.

For at least 10 years, the borough has been marketing its beach 
badges as the beach lover's ultimate stocking stuffer, a trend a few 
other coastal towns have adopted in the years since.

"They make a lovely Christmas present," said Pat Croghan of Wall, 
who had come into borough hall on Tuesday to purchase five badges 
for herself and her nieces. The cost of the seasonal badges is $50 
for regular badges and $15 for senior citizens.

"We are the lowest of any town," Borough Clerk Margaret D. Plummer 
said. "And Belmar has one of the busiest beaches."

Plummer, herself a lifelong Belmar resident, buys the badges for 
family as stocking stuffers.

"It's very different. It's unique. It beats a candy cane," Plummer 
said.

Each year, the borough picks a new color for the badges. The color 
for 2008 is burnt orange for the regular badges and white and orange 
for senior citizen badges.

Beach badges are big business in Belmar. During the past summer, 
Belmar sold 13,049 regular badges for a total revenue of $652,450 
and 3,407 senior badges for $51,105.

So far this holiday season, 103 regular beach badges have sold for a 
total amount of $5,150, and 25 senior badges have sold for $375.

Under state law, the revenue collected goes into a dedicated beach 
utility fee, which is used to maintain and beautify the beaches and 
boardwalk.

Plummer, whose great-grandfather was Thomas Dillon, a Belmar mayor 
in the 1930s, said the borough was one of the last beach towns to 
levy a beach badge fee.

The state Public Advocate's Office said the New Jersey Legislature 
first enacted a statute regulating the fees charged by 
municipalities in 1955, and that Belmar began charging a beach 
admission fee in 1933.





  

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[AsburyPark] Great Stocking Stuffer - AP should market this too

[justifiedright]

Belmar hopes shoppers will give the gift of sun and sand

By ERIK LARSEN
COASTAL MONMOUTH BUREAU 

Forget Christmas and Hanukkah: Memorial Day weekend is just 164 days 
away, and that means 2008 beach badges are now on sale at borough 
hall for 2007 prices.

For at least 10 years, the borough has been marketing its beach 
badges as the beach lover's ultimate stocking stuffer, a trend a few 
other coastal towns have adopted in the years since.

"They make a lovely Christmas present," said Pat Croghan of Wall, 
who had come into borough hall on Tuesday to purchase five badges 
for herself and her nieces. The cost of the seasonal badges is $50 
for regular badges and $15 for senior citizens.

"We are the lowest of any town," Borough Clerk Margaret D. Plummer 
said. "And Belmar has one of the busiest beaches."

Plummer, herself a lifelong Belmar resident, buys the badges for 
family as stocking stuffers.

"It's very different. It's unique. It beats a candy cane," Plummer 
said.

Each year, the borough picks a new color for the badges. The color 
for 2008 is burnt orange for the regular badges and white and orange 
for senior citizen badges.

Beach badges are big business in Belmar. During the past summer, 
Belmar sold 13,049 regular badges for a total revenue of $652,450 
and 3,407 senior badges for $51,105.

So far this holiday season, 103 regular beach badges have sold for a 
total amount of $5,150, and 25 senior badges have sold for $375.

Under state law, the revenue collected goes into a dedicated beach 
utility fee, which is used to maintain and beautify the beaches and 
boardwalk.

Plummer, whose great-grandfather was Thomas Dillon, a Belmar mayor 
in the 1930s, said the borough was one of the last beach towns to 
levy a beach badge fee.

The state Public Advocate's Office said the New Jersey Legislature 
first enacted a statute regulating the fees charged by 
municipalities in 1955, and that Belmar began charging a beach 
admission fee in 1933.




 
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[AsburyPark] Re: one more lastly: Fluff - Reality

[dfsavgny]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "oakdorf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Let's continue bashing until John gets back his $$$ (if he wants):

This is what is filed against the Metro parcel. North Fork has a $9M+
mortgage. The mortgage to partners is really the $4.5M infrastructure
fees and the 7% of sales.  Structured as "Post Closing Consideration"
and mortgage to beat transfer taxes. I turned them into dept of
taxation. What is not shown here is subordination agreement in which
partners' mortgage is subordinate to $11M construction loan from
Prudential Insurance.  Jus look at the liens. metro coming out of this
is as likely as snow in June but it is AP afterall and anything can
happen.

Search Results
1  Type   Direct Party
Indirect Party  Inst. NumRecordedTownNameBlockLotBookPage
NOTICE/SETTLEMENT/MTG COMMITMENT   ESPERANZA URBAN RENEWAL
LLC  NORTH FORK BANK  
2005151295   9/20/2005  ASBURY PARK1761.02  
DEED   ASBURY PARTNERS LLC 
ASBURY PARTNERS LLC   2005168508   10/19/2005
ASBURY PARK1761.02OR-85036493 DEED   ESPERANZA URBAN
RENEWAL LLC  ASBURY PARTNERS LLC
2005168508   10/19/2005  ASBURY
PARK1761.02OR-85036493 DEED   ASBURY PARTNERS LLC
ESPERANZA URBAN RENEWAL LLC   2005168508  
10/19/2005  ASBURY PARK1761.02OR-85036493 DEED
ESPERANZA URBAN RENEWAL LLC  ESPERANZA URBAN
RENEWAL LLC   2005168508   10/19/2005
ASBURY PARK1761.02OR-85036493 DEED   ASBURY PARTNERS LLC
ESPERANZA URBAN RENEWAL LLC   2005168513  
10/19/2005  ASBURY PARK1761.02OR-85036522 MORTGAGE
ESPERANZA URBAN RENEWAL LLC  NORTH FORK BANK
2005168514   10/19/2005  ASBURY
PARK1761.02OR-85036558 MORTGAGE ASSIGNMENT OF LEASES & RENTS
ESPERANZA URBAN RENEWAL LLC  NORTH FORK BANK
2005168566   10/19/2005  ASBURY
PARK1761.02OR-85036580 MORTGAGE   ESPERANZA URBAN
RENEWAL LLC  ASBURY PARTNERS LLC
2005168568   10/19/2005  ASBURY
PARK1761.02OR-85036658 UCC/FINANCING STATEMENT  
ESPERANZA URBAN RENEWAL LLC  NORTH FORK BANK
2005169197   10/19/2005  ASBURY PARK1761.02
NOTICE/SETTLEMENT/MTG COMMITMENT   ESPERANZA URBAN RENEWAL
LLC  NORTH FORK BANK  
2005207982   12/5/2005  ASBURY PARK1761.02  
NOTICE/SETTLEMENT/MTG COMMITMENT   ESPERANZA URBAN RENEWAL
LLC  NORTH FORK BANK  
2005213078   12/9/2005  ASBURY PARK1761.02  
UCC/FINANCING STATEMENT   ESPERANZA URBAN RENEWAL LLC
NORTH FORK BANK   2006008285   1/16/2006
ASBURY PARK1761.02   MORTGAGE   ESPERANZA URBAN RENEWAL
LLC  NORTH FORK BANK  
2006008432   1/16/2006  ASBURY
PARK1761.02OR-85338996 MORTGAGE SUBORDINATION   ASBURY
PARTNERS LLC  NORTH FORK BANK  
2006008460   1/16/2006  ASBURY
PARK1761.02OR-85339158 UCC/TERMINATION   ESPERANZA URBAN
RENEWAL LLC  NORTH FORK BANK  
2006008477   1/16/2006  ASBURY PARK1761.02  
CONSTRUCTION LIEN   ESPERANZA URBAN RENEWAL LLC
SANDY'S CRANE CO INC   2006116355   8/4/2006
ASBURY PARK1761.02OR-85832988 RIGHT TO FILE   ESPERANZA
URBAN RENEWAL LLC  INTERNATIONAL
CONSTRUCTION EQUIPMENT INC   2007043672  
3/28/2007  ASBURY PARK1761.02OR-86401175 CONSTRUCTION
LIEN   ESPERANZA URBAN RENEWAL LLC
THACKRAY CRANE RENTAL INC   2007050902  
4/13/2007  ASBURY PARK1761.02OR-86434243 CONSTRUCTION
LIEN   ESPERANZA URBAN RENEWAL LLC
CAPE ATLANTIC PILING & GENERAL CONTRACTING INC   2007056738
4/23/2007  ASBURY PARK1761.02OR-86458559 CONSTRUCTION
LIEN   ESPERANZA URBAN RENEWAL LLC
RALPH CLAYTON & SONS   2007057644   4/24/2007
ASBURY PARK1761.02OR-86462625 CONSTRUCTION LIEN  
ESPERANZA URBAN RENEWAL LLC  RALPH CLAYTON &
SONS   2007057645   4/24/2007 
ASBURY PARK1761.02OR-86462662 CONSTRUCTION LIEN  
ESPERANZA URBAN RENEWAL LLC  CL

[AsburyPark] Re: one more lastly: Let's All Pile On

[dfsavgny]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "oakdorf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Let's continue bashing until John gets back his $$$ (if he wants):


This is what is filed against the parcel. The mortgage to North Fork is
for $9+M. The mortgage to Partners is really the $4.5 infrastructure
costs and the 7% of gross sales. Scumbags structured as Post Closing
Considerations to escape transfer taxes. I tipped dept of taxation about
that but never heard back from them.


Also, I don't know why it is not filed directly against the property
(doesn't appear in the list) but there is a mortgage subordination
agreement where Partners has to subrogate their lien to a $11M
construction loan from Prudential. It is a "related" document. The
construction loan doesn't appear either. Just look at the liens and lis
pendens. Metro coming out of this is as likely as it being 90 degrees
tomorrow. But again, this is AP and anything is possible.

Search Results
1  Type   Direct Party
Indirect Party  Inst. NumRecordedTownNameBlockLotBookPage
NOTICE/SETTLEMENT/MTG COMMITMENT   ESPERANZA URBAN RENEWAL
LLC  NORTH FORK BANK  
2005151295   9/20/2005  ASBURY PARK1761.02  
DEED   ASBURY PARTNERS LLC 
ASBURY PARTNERS LLC   2005168508   10/19/2005
ASBURY PARK1761.02OR-85036493 DEED   ESPERANZA URBAN
RENEWAL LLC  ASBURY PARTNERS LLC
2005168508   10/19/2005  ASBURY
PARK1761.02OR-85036493 DEED   ASBURY PARTNERS LLC
ESPERANZA URBAN RENEWAL LLC   2005168508  
10/19/2005  ASBURY PARK1761.02OR-85036493 DEED
ESPERANZA URBAN RENEWAL LLC  ESPERANZA URBAN
RENEWAL LLC   2005168508   10/19/2005
ASBURY PARK1761.02OR-85036493 DEED   ASBURY PARTNERS LLC
ESPERANZA URBAN RENEWAL LLC   2005168513  
10/19/2005  ASBURY PARK1761.02OR-85036522 MORTGAGE
ESPERANZA URBAN RENEWAL LLC  NORTH FORK BANK
2005168514   10/19/2005  ASBURY
PARK1761.02OR-85036558 MORTGAGE ASSIGNMENT OF LEASES & RENTS
ESPERANZA URBAN RENEWAL LLC  NORTH FORK BANK
2005168566   10/19/2005  ASBURY
PARK1761.02OR-85036580 MORTGAGE   ESPERANZA URBAN
RENEWAL LLC  ASBURY PARTNERS LLC
2005168568   10/19/2005  ASBURY
PARK1761.02OR-85036658 UCC/FINANCING STATEMENT  
ESPERANZA URBAN RENEWAL LLC  NORTH FORK BANK
2005169197   10/19/2005  ASBURY PARK1761.02
NOTICE/SETTLEMENT/MTG COMMITMENT   ESPERANZA URBAN RENEWAL
LLC  NORTH FORK BANK  
2005207982   12/5/2005  ASBURY PARK1761.02  
NOTICE/SETTLEMENT/MTG COMMITMENT   ESPERANZA URBAN RENEWAL
LLC  NORTH FORK BANK  
2005213078   12/9/2005  ASBURY PARK1761.02  
UCC/FINANCING STATEMENT   ESPERANZA URBAN RENEWAL LLC
NORTH FORK BANK   2006008285   1/16/2006
ASBURY PARK1761.02   MORTGAGE   ESPERANZA URBAN RENEWAL
LLC  NORTH FORK BANK  
2006008432   1/16/2006  ASBURY
PARK1761.02OR-85338996 MORTGAGE SUBORDINATION   ASBURY
PARTNERS LLC  NORTH FORK BANK  
2006008460   1/16/2006  ASBURY
PARK1761.02OR-85339158 UCC/TERMINATION   ESPERANZA URBAN
RENEWAL LLC  NORTH FORK BANK  
2006008477   1/16/2006  ASBURY PARK1761.02  
CONSTRUCTION LIEN   ESPERANZA URBAN RENEWAL LLC
SANDY'S CRANE CO INC   2006116355   8/4/2006
ASBURY PARK1761.02OR-85832988 RIGHT TO FILE   ESPERANZA
URBAN RENEWAL LLC  INTERNATIONAL
CONSTRUCTION EQUIPMENT INC   2007043672  
3/28/2007  ASBURY PARK1761.02OR-86401175 CONSTRUCTION
LIEN   ESPERANZA URBAN RENEWAL LLC
THACKRAY CRANE RENTAL INC   2007050902  
4/13/2007  ASBURY PARK1761.02OR-86434243 CONSTRUCTION
LIEN   ESPERANZA URBAN RENEWAL LLC
CAPE ATLANTIC PILING & GENERAL CONTRACTING INC   2007056738
4/23/2007  ASBURY PARK1761.02OR-86458559 CONSTRUCTION
LIEN   ESPERANZA URBAN RENEWAL LLC
RALPH CLAYTON & SONS   2007057644   4/24/2007
ASBURY PARK1761.02OR-86462625 CONSTRUCTION LIEN  
ESPERANZA URBAN RENEWAL LLC

[AsburyPark] Re: my last.. On "The Tipping Point"

[oakdorf]

--- 

GIVE BACK THE MONEY IN ESCROW.

ESCROW.

THAT MEANS IT'S HELD IN T-R-U-S-T for SPECIFIC PERFORMANCE





 
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Re: [AsburyPark] Re: my last.. On "The Tipping Point"

[Allan Peterson]

Hold up and lets get the facts correct.  I don't recall being a big cheerleader 
for Metro.  I liked the building design, and the ad campaign.  However when 
conditions changed and they did not, I posted a warning that they are going too 
far.  I agree something else is at play and I would be surprised if they stay 
in business.



- Original Message 
From: dfsavgny <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2007 10:49:42 AM
Subject: [AsburyPark] Re: my last.. On "The Tipping Point"

--- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] ups.com, Allan Peterson  wrote:
>
> The Metro collapse should not come as a shock to anyone. As I
stated before you can not advertise out of a slump. I did not
understand the business model of heavy advertising and promotions with
nothing to sell combined with a depressed market.

Yeah, but you were also one of their biggest cheerleaders too.

Listen, if they had 70, or even 50 units under contract, I don't know
why they are crying. You only worry if you are built out and you are
not selling. The just got above ground for godsakes! There's something
else at play here.

> By the way, you had to love the last release that a penthouse was
sold for 2.4. I never noticed any info on that buyer.

I heard it was one of the owners of Motif.





  

Never miss a thing.  Make Yahoo your home page. 
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[AsburyPark] Re: one more lastly: Fluff - Reality

[oakdorf]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "dfsavgny" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> 
> --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "oakdorf"  wrote:
> >
> > "...with thousands of condominiums linging New Jersey 
neighborhoods to
> > their credit, Metro Homes has spent the last 15 years"
> >
> > Thousands?? What's that, one, two or three?
> >
> > several meant three or more, according to Mrs. Tashlik in 9th 
grade.
> >
> > If you use the "thousands" you must define it.
> >
> 
> 
> I count 530 units (including commercial) actually built. Proposed is
> 3,633 units. Don't you just hate guys like us that actually do the 
math?
> 
> 

Sorry. I should of included that - i did the same. 


Let's continue bashing until John gets back his $$$ (if he wants):

1)As the afternoon sun was setting last week, real estate developer 
Dean Geibel looked out of the 13th floor of the Trump Plaza sales 
center office on Montgomery Street, near the Jersey City waterfront.

>From the sales center, Geibel could see in the distance the actual 
Trump Plaza under construction.

"I meet people on the street, and I start going on and on about how 
much I enjoy doing this project," said Geibel, one of the developers 
of the project, and a partner in Hoboken-based Metro Homes.

So far, Geibel hasn't heard the phrase "You're fired!" from the most 
famous developer on the project, real estate mogul and TV personality 
Donald Trump.

But Geibel, who got Trump involved in the project after meeting him 
via a New Jersey golf course, enjoys working with The Donald.

"You never know what he what come up with next," Geibel said, 
referring to some of the project's more interesting luxury amenities. 
What it is
The Trump name is certainly helping the project's recognition, and 
its sales have been brisk.

_

2) Geibel approached Trump in spring 2005 about becoming involved in 
the Jersey City project. They had already struck up a relationship 
when Geibel was golfing on Trump's golf course in Bedminster, N.J. 

"Of course, the Trump name is the gold standard in luxury living, and 
it also adds value to the condos and velocity to the sales," said 
Geibel.

When asked if Trump is just a partner in name only, Geibel laughed.

.

Geibel said the project was reshaped from the original conception. It 
was once known as Harborspire and was to be built by a partnership of 
Hoboken-based Applied Housing and Jersey City developer Joseph 
Panepinto, until they sold their rights to Metro Homes.
--
3)Geibel when asked if Trump's involvement overshadowed Geibel's name 
as a local developer, he said he didn't see a problem taking a 
backseat to Trump.

Geibel, along with his partner Paul Fried are the founders of Metro 
Homes, which since 1993 had built a number of residences in Hudson 
County including currently Gull's Cove, a community of 431 
condominium residences in Jersey City, and MetroStop, 113 condominium 
homes in Hoboken.

$2M penthouses sold .






 
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[AsburyPark] Re: one more lastly: Fluff - Reality

[dfsavgny]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "oakdorf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> "...with thousands of condominiums linging New Jersey neighborhoods to
> their credit, Metro Homes has spent the last 15 years"
>
> Thousands?? What's that, one, two or three?
>
> several meant three or more, according to Mrs. Tashlik in 9th grade.
>
> If you use the "thousands" you must define it.
>


I count 530 units (including commercial) actually built. Proposed is
3,633 units. Don't you just hate guys like us that actually do the math?

Completed Work













Grandview













 * Located at the corner of Greene and   Grand streets, Jersey City,
NJ

 * A 40 unit luxury condominium building


40







Southgate














 * Located at 464 Newark St. in Hoboken,   NJ


 * 6 luxury condominiums and 1 commercial   unit

7







Liberty   Point













 * Located at 187 Warren St. in Jersey   City, NJ


 * Hosting 32 unit luxury condominiums, 1   commercial unit, and 1
restaurant   33







The   Huntington













 * Located at 812 Grand St. and 825 Adams   St. in Hoboken, NJ

 * 110 luxury condominiums



110







Cypress   Point













 * Located at 1330 Clinton St. in Hoboken,   NJ


 * Hosting 53 luxury condominiums


53







The Oz














 * Located on the corner of Newark St. and   Adams St. in Hoboken, NJ

 * Hosting 54 luxurious condominiums and   commercial space
55







The Everard













 * Located between Newark Ave. and 1st on   Jackson St. in Hoboken,
NJ
 * Hosting 20 luxury condominiums and 1   commercial unit
21







Charles   Court













 * Located between 7th and 8th on   Jefferson St. in Hoboken, NJ

 * Hosting 45 luxury condominiums


45







Pembroke   Place













 * Located at the corner of 8th and Monroe   St. in Hoboken, NJ

 * 34 luxury condominiums and 1 commercial   unit

35







Prospect   Hill













 * Located at the corner of 9th and   Jefferson St. in Hoboken, NJ

 * Hosting 80 residential and 2 commercial   units

82







Madison   Place













 * Located at 530 Madison St. in Hoboken,   NJ


 * Hosting 15 unit luxury condominiums


15







The Summit













 * Located at 84 Adams St. in Hoboken, NJ



 * Housing 36 unit luxury condominiums











The Belmont













 * Located at 711 Clinton St. in Hoboken,   NJ



 * A 34 unit luxury condominium building


34







Current   Projects




530







Trump   Plaza: Jersey City Towers












 * Located at Washington and Bay Streets   in Jersey City

 * 862 condominium homes in two towers   stretching higher than 50
stories   862















The   Esperanza at Asbury Park












 * Located in Asbury Park, New Jersey on   Ocean Avenue

 * 224 luxury condominium homes in two   residential towers
224















Mulberry   Street













 * Located in Newark, New Jersey on   Mulberry Street


 * 7 Phase project consisting of 39   buildings incorporating 2000
condominium units.   2000















Metro Stop













 * Adjacent to new light rail station on   9th Street and Jackson
Street in Hoboken, NJ   * 113 luxury unit high-rise with 2  
commercial units

115







Gull's Cove













 * 3 buildings incorporating 432   condominium units

432














3633

[AsburyPark] Re: And lastly...

[Jack Pitzer]

It's the Asbury Partners way of doing things.
1) Forget about restoring everything that made the area unique...tear it down
2) Put up crappy little signs with ugly fonts telling everybody how your city 
is being 
transformed into a "Jewel by the SeaAt No Cost to You" (that should shut 
them up  for 
awhile
3) Hypnotize the town council with delusions of grandure
4) The town is troubled, so maybe they won't notice how many years will go by 
before 
anything happens
5) Find a developer and let them do all the work while you bask in their success
6) Meanwhile, totally ignore the feelings and hurt that this city has endured
7) Greed is a 5 letter word, so nobody should be offended by it
8) Let some hardworking people renovate a historic theater, treat them like 
shit, then 
move them out and let it rot to the ground
9) Promises schmomises
10) When it all doesn't work out, put your tail between your legs and leave, 
and enjoy the 
interest you've accrued from your initial investment, whilst the land you raped 
sits rotting 
away.

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, lightgrw <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> dfsavgny wrote:
> I am simply amazed at development down in here at the Shore. I have
> never, never seen projects move so slow with too small crews.
> 
> 
> 
> I don't know, for some reason Asbury Park moves MUCH SLOWER than 
> everywhere else.  I realize that a lot of these projects are much bigger 
> in scale but just look at surrounding areas.  Long Branch had Pier's 
> Village built in much less time.  Lake Como knocked down a few buildings 
> a built several within a year on its Main Street area.
> 
> Things can happen at a decent pace.  I guess when there's no time limit 
> placed on things, the pace loosens greatly.
>





 
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[AsburyPark] Re: And lastly...

[Jack Pitzer]

It's the Asbury Partners way of doing things.
1) Forget about restoring everything that made the area unique...tear it down
2) Put up crappy little signs with ugly fonts telling everybody how your city 
is being 
transformed into a "Jewel by the SeaAt No Cost to You" (that should shut 
them up  for 
awhile
3) Hypnotize the town council with delusions of grandure
4) The town is troubled, so maybe they won't notice how many years will go by 
before 
anything happens
5) Find a developer and let them do all the work while you bask in their success
6) Meanwhile, totally ignore the feelings and hurt that this city has endured
7) Greed is a 5 letter word, so nobody should be offended by it
8) Let some hardworking people renovate a historic theater, treat them like 
shit, then 
move them out and let it rot to the ground
9) Promises schmomises
10) When it all doesn't work out, put your tail between your legs and leave, 
and enjoy the 
interest you've accrued from your initial investment, whilst the land you raped 
sits rotting 
away.

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, lightgrw <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> dfsavgny wrote:
> I am simply amazed at development down in here at the Shore. I have
> never, never seen projects move so slow with too small crews.
> 
> 
> 
> I don't know, for some reason Asbury Park moves MUCH SLOWER than 
> everywhere else.  I realize that a lot of these projects are much bigger 
> in scale but just look at surrounding areas.  Long Branch had Pier's 
> Village built in much less time.  Lake Como knocked down a few buildings 
> a built several within a year on its Main Street area.
> 
> Things can happen at a decent pace.  I guess when there's no time limit 
> placed on things, the pace loosens greatly.
>





 
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[AsburyPark] from Norman Sturner - Murray Hill Properties

[dfsavgny]

He continued: "The extraordinary real estate financing of the past
seven years has allowed marginal and sometimes part time investors to
increase pricing and competition to unsustainable levels, with very
little capital to lose. Now that the financing market has tightened, I
believe we shall see opportunities arise from owners and sellers who
will not or cannot meet the new loan to value requirements. We see
2008 as a unique buying opportunity year."



 
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[AsburyPark] one more lastly: Fluff

[oakdorf]

"...with thousands of condominiums linging New Jersey neighborhoods to 
their credit, Metro Homes has spent the last 15 years"

Thousands?? What's that, one, two or three? 

several meant three or more, according to Mrs. Tashlik in 9th grade.

If you use the "thousands" you must define it.



 
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Re: [AsburyPark] Re: And lastly...

[lightgrw]

dfsavgny wrote:
I am simply amazed at development down in here at the Shore. I have
never, never seen projects move so slow with too small crews.



I don't know, for some reason Asbury Park moves MUCH SLOWER than 
everywhere else.  I realize that a lot of these projects are much bigger 
in scale but just look at surrounding areas.  Long Branch had Pier's 
Village built in much less time.  Lake Como knocked down a few buildings 
a built several within a year on its Main Street area.

Things can happen at a decent pace.  I guess when there's no time limit 
placed on things, the pace loosens greatly.


 
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Re: [AsburyPark] Re: my last.. On "The Tipping Point"

[MarioAPNJ]

 
In a message dated 12/13/2007 10:15:01 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

I hope the city directs its focus on the Cookman  area.


And Main St corridor -- highly visible to all.



**See AOL's top rated recipes 
(http://food.aol.com/top-rated-recipes?NCID=aoltop000304)

Re: [AsburyPark] Re: And lastly...

[MarioAPNJ]

 
In a message dated 12/13/2007 11:09:27 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

If the  developer makes a pledge to do something as part of a
redevelopment  designation and doesn't do it, the city can declare the
developer in  violation of the redevelopment agreement, and rescind
permission to build  high-rise condos. "

Does the word clusterfuck jump to  mind?


 
lol
 
No it didn't.  New to me, but several great defs at Urban  Dict      
_http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=clusterfuck_ 
(http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=clusterfuck) 




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[AsburyPark] Re: And lastly...

[oakdorf]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "dfsavgny" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
> There are some newer better ones there. Some you could post here and
> think you were talking about AP. Here's one I really like:
> 


I saw all those as well. 

All you have to do is cut and paste and change the town to Asbury.

I want to be the redeveloper.

I have a couple rentals.
I could sheetrock, do minor plumbing, real good at painting. I wanted 
to be an architect, stockbroker. I could shingle a roof if it's not 
to high. I pay my taxes late. I could draw. 

At least I know what the sand feels like in AP and got splinters in 
my feet and my store on the bw was robbed.

Dan, arrange the financing.

If the AP tax lien is still valid on the metro site, someone should 
have some fun and buy it - it probably goes as part of whole package.



 
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[AsburyPark] Re: And lastly...

[dfsavgny]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "oakdorf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> from the hoboken411.com (http://hoboken411.com/?p=9660&cp=1#comments_
> 
>

There are some newer better ones there. Some you could post here and
think you were talking about AP. Here's one I really like:

"Not true Homeworld. Lyndhurst most certainly has the authority.

These developers enter into redevelopment agreements with the
municipalities. If they don't live up to the agreements (like in
Lyndhurst) the city can determine the agreement has been broken and
can go find a new developer under redevelopment law.

If the developer makes a pledge to do something as part of a
redevelopment designation and doesn't do it, the city can declare the
developer in violation of the redevelopment agreement, and rescind
permission to build high-rise condos. "

Does the word clusterfuck jump to mind?




 
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[AsburyPark] Re: Getting Rid of Partners

[dfsavgny]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "oakdorf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> and rid of Metro.
> 
> Mr. G also has an LLC in Hobo called Threesome Partners LLC. 
> 
> Threesome?
> 
> And for Dan, he supports Rudy for pres


No. I hated him as mayor. That Rudy is one, if not the, frontrunner
for the republican primary, says a lot about the republicans.

Rudy is a prick from the word go.




 
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[AsburyPark] Re: my last.. On "The Tipping Point"

[dfsavgny]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Allan Peterson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> The Metro collapse should not come as a shock to anyone.   As I
stated before you can not advertise out of a slump.   I did not
understand the business model of heavy advertising and promotions with
nothing to sell combined with a depressed market.

Yeah, but you were also one of their biggest cheerleaders too.

Listen, if they had 70, or even 50 units under contract, I don't know
why they are crying. You only worry if you are built out and you are
not selling. The just got above ground for godsakes! There's something
else at play here.
 
> By the way, you had to love the last release that a penthouse was
sold for 2.4.  I never noticed any info on that buyer.

I heard it was one of the owners of Motif.





 
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[AsburyPark] Re: And lastly...

[dfsavgny]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "oakdorf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Dean Geibel
> should have stuck to small, four-storey buildings in Hoboken where he
> can pal around with his Lil’ Buddy Dave Roberts. See ‘ya later Metro
> Homes! Have fun blaming the mortgage crunch! 

When they first came I said all they ever did was little stuff.

I am simply amazed at development down in here at the Shore. I have
never, never seen projects move so slow with too small crews. Even in
this credit crisis I have trouble hearing from the construction going
on next door to my office for a 500,000 sf apartment buidling. And it
is in the Garment District.

I wish for one thing for AP - to get back control of the waterfront.
ALL of this stems from one issue - a faulty deal.




 
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[AsburyPark] Re: Getting Rid of Partners

[oakdorf]

and rid of Metro.

Mr. G also has an LLC in Hobo called Threesome Partners LLC. 

Threesome?

And for Dan, he supports Rudy for pres




 
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[AsburyPark] Re: my last.. On "The Tipping Point"

[oakdorf]

---maybe Metro should show real good faith and dedication to AP and 
offer complete refunds PLUS to those that showed good faith in their 
marketing.

Maybe his kids could learn to play on REAL GRASS and learn to get dirty.

That's how you learn to play.

Not artifically.





 
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Re: [AsburyPark] Re: my last.. On "The Tipping Point"

[Allan Peterson]

The Metro collapse should not come as a shock to anyone.   As I stated before 
you can not advertise out of a slump.   I did not understand the business model 
of heavy advertising and promotions with nothing to sell combined with a 
depressed market.  By the way, you had to love the last release that a 
penthouse was sold for 2.4.  I never noticed any info on that buyer.   I am 
sure Paramount will and have benefited from their efforts since they have units 
available today.  I hope the city directs its focus on the Cookman area.  The 
businesses need support and the area is still growing.   It is going to be a 
while before building returns, inventory lowers and credit.  The Metro could 
have a huge impact on the redevelopment, especially if they fold completely.



- Original Message 
From: evosap <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, December 12, 2007 9:11:42 PM
Subject: [AsburyPark] Re: my last.. On "The Tipping Point"

wow..heady shit for the list. idea "viruses" are also called "memes"
richard dawkins apparently came up with the name long before gladwell,
though i mean to get that book...its pretty fascinating to think about
how many memes exist, how they restrict us, control us. i gotta
wonder if geibel and co are this brilliant. i think they just wanted
to make a lot of money and spent too many resources on marketing. 
and then the real estate crash...

i'd give anything for a rerun of the speech he gave at salt water just
a couple of months ago...the one where loffredo was civil servant AND
land hawker.

the whole esperanza vibe was a little...well, viagra
ish...manufactured desire. building facades. "buy a life" "buy an
experience"

i just hope everyone gets over it. asbury isn't the esperanza. i do
hope madison marquette hangs around.





  

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[AsburyPark] Re: Getting Rid of Partners

[dfsavgny]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "oakdorf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> 
> If you don't sell something for a couple years, what do you - stick
> with it hoping 80 more people show up? The ESP being "on hold" may be
> the best at selling anything at at Wesley.

I heard lawyers have been calling up for months trying to put liens on ESP. AP 
reminds me of that line from Apocolypse Now. The bullshit is so high you need 
wings to stay above it. Doesn't this city ever get tired of snake oil salesman?





 
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[AsburyPark] And lastly...

[oakdorf]

from the hoboken411.com (http://hoboken411.com/?p=9660&cp=1#comments_


Trump ruined a lot of small contractors in Atlantic City, way back
during the Trump Taj Mahal debacle. I’m sure he couldn’t care less
about Metro Homes and will take them down easily as well. Dean Geibel
should have stuck to small, four-storey buildings in Hoboken where he
can pal around with his Lil’ Buddy Dave Roberts. See ‘ya later Metro
Homes! Have fun blaming the mortgage crunch! 


They also say that the two tower trump condo will maybe only see one
tower built. Maybe.





 
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[AsburyPark] Lyndhurst - EnCap , Trump, Redvelopment

[oakdorf]

Read this:

Homeworld, Trump is out on that deal too, and he was not the developer
just an investor after the fact. The Endcap project was terminated by
the town.

Check this quote from Lyndhurst Mayor Richard DiLascio, too bad our
Mayor Quimby does not have balls like this guy.

“Before Donald Trump comes to Lyndhurst with his pencil and begins
redesigning the EnCap project, he must take out his pen and sign a
check to finish the Lyndhurst recreation facility and fields as agreed
to by EnCap,” DiLascio said in a statement Tuesday afternoon. “I
believe the failure to perform under current terms makes the entire
original agreement null and void. As far as Lyndhurst is concerned, we
will no longer be bound.”

northjersey.com/page.php?qstr=eXJpc...jUyJnlyaXJ5N2Y3MTdmN3ZxZWVFRXl5Mg==

The Township Council voted unanimously to terminate its agreement with
the developers of the EnCap housing and golf project Tuesday night,
saying the developers didn’t made good on a promise to build playing
fields and a new recreation center.

The 5-0 vote cast further doubt on a controversial proposal that has
been plagued by delays and cost overruns. Donald Trump, who paid $5
million last month to put his name on the project, will have to
renegotiate the deal with Lyndhurst if the EnCap plan is to be
salvaged, township officials said.

“All agreements are off,” Lyndhurst Mayor Richard DiLascio said
Tuesday night. “There is just no deal.



 
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[AsburyPark] Asbury Park police warn residents to lock their cars after break-ins

[Jack Pitzer]

ASBURY PARK — Police are warning residents to lock their cars after a string of 
vehicle 
burglaries in the city.

Thieves stole handbags and a credit card from three vehicles in various parts 
of the 
city between 2 p.m. and 9 p.m. on Tuesday, Detective Capt. David Kelso said. In 
each 
instance the cars were unlocked, he added.

In an earlier incident, a car window was smashed and a GPS system was stolen 
from the car, 
Kelso said.

"We're just reminding people to lock their cars. A lot of times these thieves 
are 
just looking for a car that's open and easy to get into, Kelso said. He also 
reminded people 
not to leave valuables where they can be seen in the car.

Anyone with information on the thefts is asked to call Asbury Park Police at 
(732) 
502-5770 or the department's tip line at (800) 799-8280



 
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[AsburyPark] Re: from city web site

[oakdorf]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Traderdube <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Events for 12/14/2007
> 

"...of a financial nature"

The NJ Lottery is up to $130 million.

I think they should vote to buy one ticket or a couple thousand. 

Maybe the governers office should buy them as well. If they win, it
should ALMOST cover the costs to run the city and schools.

You don't want to see an emergency tax hike to cover budget shortfalls.

Ok, I wasted 2 days here. Back to work.



 
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[AsburyPark] Re: to the point

[oakdorf]

> 
> Point Pleasant has all these things and more, the one thing Point 
> Pleasant doesn't have is an inner city population
> and all the good bad and ugly that comes with the inner city blues. 
> Chief among them, riots, violent crime, gangs,
> drugs, prostitutes. But the biggest difference today between AP & PP, 
> they don't have Larry Fishman dragging their city
> down.
> 
>

right about that.

Other mighty sayings when I was 19 and a few people who had some money
wanted me stuff in biz with them:

"who goes to belmar..." (17th ave opp)
"who eats bagels" (hot bagel bakery in oakhurst)
"Point? for what?"

You're right.

Given all the inner city problems AP had (maybe worse then today..?)
AP has what no other oceanfront resort has - magic.

Either the place is haunted or magical.





 
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[AsburyPark] from city web site

[Traderdube]

Events for 12/14/2007
Start Time9:00 AM
Title
Council Meeting
Location
Council Chambers
Extra Details

December 11, 2007

City Desk:

Please be advised that the Mayor and Council of the City of Asbury Park
will hold a Special Meeting on Friday, December 14, 2007, at 9:00 AM
in the City of Asbury Park Council Chambers, Bangs Avenue, Asbury Park.

The City Council intends to go into Executive Session to discuss
contract negotiations regarding Metro Homes/Waterfront Redevelopment/
Subsequent Developer Agreement issues.  At the conclusion of the Executive
Session, action may be taken in public by the City Council on matters of
a financial nature.

This notice is being posted in compliance with the "Open Public Meeting
Act."

Yours truly,

D.KiKI Tomek
Deputy City Clerk


 
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[AsburyPark] to the point

[Traderdube]

The mighty oak went on" Point has kiddie rides. Point has rental 
housing. Point has motels.
Point is "clean". Point feels safe. Point has Martells. Point has
Pepsi sponsoring. Point has entertainment. Point has weekly fireworks."

Point Pleasant has all these things and more, the one thing Point 
Pleasant doesn't have is an inner city population
and all the good bad and ugly that comes with the inner city blues. 
Chief among them, riots, violent crime, gangs,
drugs, prostitutes. But the biggest difference today between AP & PP, 
they don't have Larry Fishman dragging their city
down.

later on ewosap wrote..." i just hope everyone gets over it. asbury 
isn't the esperanza. i do
hope madison marquette hangs around:
I am not sure who this person is, they are either new to AP, or a thick 
skinned native who is "used" to
watching as AP effs up everything that takes vision and forward 
thinking. At the C-8 implosion I asked 8 or 10
long time APers what they thought would happen on the site. A few 
thought the pile of steel would sit there for years, a few thought
a building would magically rise from the site, most said that a skeleton 
would rise and fail. GET OVER IT? Are you kidding.
Whether any of us want to admit it or not, C-8 is the heart and soul of 
post riot Asbury Park. The relief of no longer having
to look at, let alone listen to, the decayed steel corpse, was amazing. 
At the time, The Baronet was just coming together, new businesses
were rocking on cookman and, and, eroh yeah...Greetings From Asbury 
Park..


 
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