Re: Stus-List mast collar tangs C& C 33-2

[Ronald B. Frerker via CnC-List]

My '73 30-1 is also without the tangs.  No holes in mast either, so there're 
not just missing.RonWild CheriSTL


  From: Randy Stafford via CnC-List 
 To: cnc-list  
Cc: randy.staff...@comcast.net
 Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2016 3:33 PM
 Subject: Re: Stus-List mast collar tangs C& C 33-2
   
Interesting that apparently only some but not all C models have these mast 
collar tangs. Mine (C 30 MK I hull #7, designed 1971-sh built 1972) does not 
have them.  It has a bulkhead about a half-foot forward of the mast that is 
strongly tabbed to the cabin top, which is presumably the design element 
intended to prevent upward flexing of the cabin top.  I could see how tangs 
fastened to mast and collar could do the same thing, using the mast as a 
structural member.  I wonder when and under what circumstances C chose to use 
tangs vs. bulkheads.
Cheers,Randy StaffordS/V GrenadineC 30-1 #7Ken Caryl, CO
From: "jhnelson via CnC-List" 
To: "cnc-list" 
Cc: "jhnelson" 
Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2016 12:43:50 PM
Subject: Re: Stus-List mast collar tangs C& C 33-2

Cabin top flexes upward, doors won't close. Boat flexes more than it 
should.Generally I don't think anything catestrophic would happen...immediately 
anyway. But flexing the Cabin top is likely not great.


Sent from my Samsung device

 Original message 
From: Wayne Anstey via CnC-List  
Date: 2016-05-31 3:25 PM (GMT-04:00) 
To: Frederick G Street via CnC-List  
Cc: Wayne Anstey  
Subject: Re: Stus-List mast collar tangs C& C 33-2 

What happens if you don't put them on at all and only put the wedges in?

Wayne Anstey
Resilience
1964 C 30mk1
Bedford, N S, Canada 

Sent from my Bell Sony device over Canada’s largest network.

 Bruce Pope via CnC-List wrote 

> Hi Doug.
> 
> 
> I had the same problem on my 29-2.  Installed the mast for the first time 
> after transport,  tuned the rigging, everything set up and then... found the 
> tangs in a galley drawer where I had stored them for transport.  I had to 
> slacken all rigging before I could get the holes to align.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: CnC-List  on behalf of Persuasion37 via 
> CnC-List 
> Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2016 4:17 AM
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc: Persuasion37
> Subject: Re: Stus-List mast collar tangs C& C 33-2 
> 
> Hi Doug.
> 
> 
> On my 37 I cannot install the bolts if I tune the mast first.  I've done this 
> a couple of times now and the only thing to do is loosen everything, install 
> the bolts and re-tune.
> 
> 
> Mike
> 
> C 37
> 
> Long Sault
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> 
> On May 30, 2016, at 8:05 PM, doug.welch--- via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> When I was rigging my new to me 33-2 we couldn't locate one of the the mast 
> collar tangs so I had a friend fabricate a duplicate. Both are now misaligned 
> and the holes are about 1/4 inch too high to slip the bolt in (the boat is 
> fully rigged). My friends have different opinions on this.  One says release 
> the rigging and the tangs will slightly deform the cabin top when we reset 
> the mast. Another days remake the tangs so the bolts line up with jokes in 
> the mast when it's fully rigged. Looking for help from you folks. 
> 
> 
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Doug
> 
> Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!


___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!


  ___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List mast collar tangs C& C 33-2

[doug.welch--- via CnC-List]

Thanks to all for your input. A friend and I slacked off all the standing and 
running rigging and got the bolts in. 
Cheers Doug

Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android 
 
  On Tue, 31 May, 2016 at 21:39, Dennis C. via CnC-List 
wrote:   Eliminating load on the collar is why I attached Touche's halyard 
blocks to the mast.  See:

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B_sb5TfIENvsdTZpUEFRcjZ1SEE

Dennis C.
Touche' 35-1 #83
Mandeville, LA



  
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List mast collar tangs C& C 33-2

[Dennis C. via CnC-List]

Eliminating load on the collar is why I attached Touche's halyard blocks to
the mast.  See:

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B_sb5TfIENvsdTZpUEFRcjZ1SEE

Dennis C.
Touche' 35-1 #83
Mandeville, LA
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Stus-List Ready for summer. Splashed today

[schiller via CnC-List]

We finally splashed today.  Was waiting for the weather window to move 
the boat north from South Haven, Michigan to Whitehall, Michigan (about 
70 miles).  Our standard procedure on launch is to hold the boat in the 
slings just was water level while making a check of all potential 
entrances of water into the boat.  If there are no leaks they drop you 
to full buoyancy for engine start and exhaust flow.  This year I found a 
pretty significant leakage of water from the port side forward cockpit 
scupper.  After stuffing myself into the Starboard locker to check it 
out I found the hose had been wearing on the exhaust mixing elbow of my 
Universal 25 engine.  I re-powered in 2006 and the yard replaced the 
hose with the engine.  They hauled us back out and we went over to the 
over priced local boat yard and bought new hose.  The only good part was 
that the old hose came off pretty easy.  The new hose didn't go on quite 
as easy but I got it on. We added a section of split water heater hose 
between the elbow and scupper hose for some added wear life.  The rest 
of the day went much better.  Motored down to the Municipal Marina and 
got tied up. Bent the sails on and now I just need to complete the 
provisioning for the trip on Friday.


Neil Schiller
1970 Redwing 35, Hull #7
(C 35, Mark I)
"Corsair"
In the water and getting ready to leave South Haven for good.
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List mast collar tangs C& C 33-2

[robert via CnC-List]

 The tang were devised to anchor the mast collar to the mast to 
eliminate the upward flexing of the deck as the halyard loads were 
transferred vertically to the collar which, without the mast tangs, 
would ultimately result in the surrounding deck to deform flexing 
upwards.  Not a good thing!


On my old 1984, there is still an original label on the mast that says 
to install the mast tangs before the rig is tensioned.  I can only 
assume C put that there for a reason...one hich I clearly understand.


Rob Abbott
AZURA
C 32 - 84
Halifax, N.S.





On 2016-05-31 3:25 PM, Wayne Anstey via CnC-List wrote:

What happens if you don't put them on at all and only put the wedges in?

Wayne Anstey
Resilience
1964 C 30mk1
Bedford, N S, Canada

Sent from my Bell Sony device over Canada’s largest network.

 Bruce Pope via CnC-List wrote 

> Hi Doug.
>
>
> I had the same problem on my 29-2.  Installed the mast for the first 
time after transport,  tuned the rigging, everything set up and 
then... found the tangs in a galley drawer where I had stored them for 
transport.  I had to slacken all rigging before I could get the holes 
to align.

>
>
>
>
> From: CnC-List  on behalf of 
Persuasion37 via CnC-List 

> Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2016 4:17 AM
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc: Persuasion37
> Subject: Re: Stus-List mast collar tangs C& C 33-2
>
> Hi Doug.
>
>
> On my 37 I cannot install the bolts if I tune the mast first.  I've 
done this a couple of times now and the only thing to do is loosen 
everything, install the bolts and re-tune.

>
>
> Mike
>
> C 37
>
> Long Sault
>
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>
> On May 30, 2016, at 8:05 PM, doug.welch--- via CnC-List 
 wrote:

>
> When I was rigging my new to me 33-2 we couldn't locate one of the 
the mast collar tangs so I had a friend fabricate a duplicate. Both 
are now misaligned and the holes are about 1/4 inch too high to slip 
the bolt in (the boat is fully rigged). My friends have different 
opinions on this.  One says release the rigging and the tangs will 
slightly deform the cabin top when we reset the mast. Another days 
remake the tangs so the bolts line up with jokes in the mast when it's 
fully rigged. Looking for help from you folks.

>
>
>
> Cheers,
>
> Doug
>
> Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If 
you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All 
Contributions are greatly appreciated!



___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!


___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Toilet Repair Wilcox Crittenden

[Richard gonesailing via CnC-List]

That's not a Wilcox it's a Jabsco

Sent from my iPad
   \ | /
 (@ @) 
--o00--(_)--00o--
416-805-3020 cell 
416-231-7890 fax
..._/)..._/)..._/)..._/)
I'd rather be sailing

This e-mail and any files attached  may be privileged and /or confidential and 
intended solely for the addressee. If you are not the intended recipient please 
notify the sender immediately and then delete the e-mail and any attachments. 
Any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of this 
information is prohibited.

The views and or opinions expressed in this e-mail are not necessarily the 
views of Richard Custom Homes Inc. or any of its subsidiaries. The company 
accepts no liability for its accuracy or completeness and the sender does not 
waive any related rights and obligations.  You should ensure that you have 
adequate virus protection as Richard Custom Homes Inc. does not accept 
liability for any viruses.

 

> On May 31, 2016, at 2:53 PM, Eugene Fodor via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Trying to identify the correct toilet repair kit for my marine head on my C 
> 29 Mark II 1984/85. It is clearly a Wilcox Crittenden. The pump is leaking 
> fresh water out of the top when pumping and when heeled over there is 
> significant backflow from the tank. :-( I'm pretty sure the joker valve is 
> shot. Here's some pictures of the pump and head:
> 
> https://goo.gl/photos/VrEo64B65gto2wU19
> 
> The following kit looks like it's the right one.
> 
> http://www.westmarine.com/buy/wilcox-crittenden--headmate-maintenance-kit--135301
> 
> Has anyone else had experience repairing these? Does that look like the right 
> kit?
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Gene Fodor
> C 29 Mark II
> Hawk
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Toilet Repair Wilcox Crittenden

[Chuck Gilchrest via CnC-List]

I just bought the rebuild kit for $72 at Jamestown Distributors (USD) but it 
seems the Thetford Headmate pump assembly is currently back ordered from those 
that are listing it on their websites.

I get a slight amount of back flow if the head is pumped empty which I suspect 
is the joker valve either worn or not seating properly. Also, the handle 
doesn’t want to stay in the down position in either the empty or flush 
position, which makes me believe there is back pressure even when the intake 
side is shut.

Chuck Gilchrest

S/V Half Magic

1983 LF 35

Padanaram, MA

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Marek 
Dziedzic via CnC-List
Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2016 6:50 PM
To: Dennis C. via CnC-List 
Cc: Marek Dziedzic 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Toilet Repair Wilcox Crittenden

 

And it is almost cheaper, as well. I had just replaced a pump in my head and I 
paid $95 for the pump, and the repair kit was $85 (both CAD). It was a Jabsco, 
so not the same, but in the process I got a locking handle as a bonus.

 

I made a mistake to remove the waste hose off the old pump. What a pain.

 

Marek

 

Sent from Mail   for Windows 10

 

From: Dennis C. via CnC-List  
Sent: May 31, 2016 16:35
To: CnClist  
Cc: Dennis C.  
Subject: Re: Stus-List Toilet Repair Wilcox Crittenden

 

You may want to consider a new pump assembly.  If it's a WC Head Mate 1460-C 
then the pump assembly should be Part 015461.

There are a couple of benefits of replacing the entire pump assembly.  Your old 
pump cylinder may be scored or worn.  It's usually quicker and easier than 
installing a rebuild kit.  

Dennis C.

 

On Tue, May 31, 2016 at 1:49 PM, Eugene Fodor via CnC-List 
 > wrote:

Trying to identify the correct toilet repair kit for my marine head on my C 
29 Mark II 1984/85. It is clearly a Wilcox Crittenden. The pump is leaking 
fresh water out of the top when pumping and when heeled over there is 
significant backflow from the tank. :-( I'm pretty sure the joker valve is 
shot. Here's some pictures of the pump and head:

 

https://goo.gl/photos/VrEo64B65gto2wU19

 

The following kit looks like it's the right one.

 

 

 
http://www.westmarine.com/buy/wilcox-crittenden--headmate-maintenance-kit--135301

 

Has anyone else had experience repairing these? Does that look like the right 
kit?

 

Thanks,

 

Gene Fodor

C 29 Mark II

Hawk


___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

 

___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Toilet Repair Wilcox Crittenden

[Sam Wheeler via CnC-List]

If it's just the joker valve, you don't need to buy a WC part (which seems
hard to find).  I picked up a Jabsco valve at West Marine because it's all
they had and it worked fine in my WC head.  Seems like all the 3" joker
valves are basically interchangeable.  Pretty easy job, too, and much
cleaner than I expected it to be.

I was only having back-flow issues though.  Not sure if it would solve your
water leak problems.

Sam

On Tue, May 31, 2016 at 4:09 PM, David via CnC-List 
wrote:

> Not only easier but less frustrating...I did a rebuild and damned thing
> still leaked.
>
> David F. Risch
> (401) 419-4650 (cell)
>
>
> --
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Date: Tue, 31 May 2016 20:19:58 -0230
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Toilet Repair Wilcox Crittenden
> From: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> CC: dziedzi...@hotmail.com
>
>
> And it is almost cheaper, as well. I had just replaced a pump in my head
> and I paid $95 for the pump, and the repair kit was $85 (both CAD). It was
> a Jabsco, so not the same, but in the process I got a locking handle as a
> bonus.
>
>
>
> I made a mistake to remove the waste hose off the old pump. What a pain.
>
>
>
> Marek
>
>
>
> Sent from Mail  for
> Windows 10
>
>
>
> *From: *Dennis C. via CnC-List 
> *Sent: *May 31, 2016 16:35
> *To: *CnClist 
> *Cc: *Dennis C. 
> *Subject: *Re: Stus-List Toilet Repair Wilcox Crittenden
>
>
> You may want to consider a new pump assembly.  If it's a WC Head Mate
> 1460-C then the pump assembly should be Part 015461.
>
> There are a couple of benefits of replacing the entire pump assembly.
> Your old pump cylinder may be scored or worn.  It's usually quicker and
> easier than installing a rebuild kit.
>
> Dennis C.
>
> On Tue, May 31, 2016 at 1:49 PM, Eugene Fodor via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
> Trying to identify the correct toilet repair kit for my marine head on my
> C 29 Mark II 1984/85. It is clearly a Wilcox Crittenden. The pump is
> leaking fresh water out of the top when pumping and when heeled over there
> is significant backflow from the tank. :-( I'm pretty sure the joker valve
> is shot. Here's some pictures of the pump and head:
>
> https://goo.gl/photos/VrEo64B65gto2wU19
>
> The following kit looks like it's the right one.
>
>
> http://www.westmarine.com/buy/wilcox-crittenden--headmate-maintenance-kit--135301
>
> Has anyone else had experience repairing these? Does that look like the
> right kit?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Gene Fodor
> C 29 Mark II
> Hawk
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All
> Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
>
> ___ This list is supported by
> the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help
> us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
> ___ This list is supported by
> the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help
> us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
> 
>  Virus-free.
> www.avast.com
> 
> <#m_5027298172980277044_m_-6962828210403472641_m_1565679386810833791_DDB4FAA8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2>
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All
> Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Toilet Repair Wilcox Crittenden

[Robert Boyer via CnC-List]

You know there is a much better way to deal with biological wastes on a boat!

Bob Boyer
S/V Rainy Days (1983 C Landfall 38 - Hull #230)
Blog: dainyrays.blogspot.com
Email: dainyr...@icloud.com
Annapolis, MD (presently in Baltimore)

> On May 31, 2016, at 7:09 PM, David via CnC-List  wrote:
> 
> Not only easier but less frustrating...I did a rebuild and damned thing still 
> leaked.
> 
> David F. Risch
> (401) 419-4650 (cell)
> 
> 
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Date: Tue, 31 May 2016 20:19:58 -0230
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Toilet Repair Wilcox Crittenden
> From: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> CC: dziedzi...@hotmail.com
> 
> And it is almost cheaper, as well. I had just replaced a pump in my head and 
> I paid $95 for the pump, and the repair kit was $85 (both CAD). It was a 
> Jabsco, so not the same, but in the process I got a locking handle as a bonus.
> 
>  
> 
> I made a mistake to remove the waste hose off the old pump. What a pain.
> 
>  
> 
> Marek
> 
>  
> 
> Sent from Mail for Windows 10
> 
>  
> 
> From: Dennis C. via CnC-List
> Sent: May 31, 2016 16:35
> To: CnClist
> Cc: Dennis C.
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Toilet Repair Wilcox Crittenden
> 
>  
> 
> You may want to consider a new pump assembly.  If it's a WC Head Mate 1460-C 
> then the pump assembly should be Part 015461.
> 
> There are a couple of benefits of replacing the entire pump assembly.  Your 
> old pump cylinder may be scored or worn.  It's usually quicker and easier 
> than installing a rebuild kit.  
> 
> Dennis C.
> 
> On Tue, May 31, 2016 at 1:49 PM, Eugene Fodor via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> Trying to identify the correct toilet repair kit for my marine head on my C 
> 29 Mark II 1984/85. It is clearly a Wilcox Crittenden. The pump is leaking 
> fresh water out of the top when pumping and when heeled over there is 
> significant backflow from the tank. :-( I'm pretty sure the joker valve is 
> shot. Here's some pictures of the pump and head:
> 
> https://goo.gl/photos/VrEo64B65gto2wU19
> 
> The following kit looks like it's the right one.
> 
> http://www.westmarine.com/buy/wilcox-crittenden--headmate-maintenance-kit--135301
> 
> Has anyone else had experience repairing these? Does that look like the right 
> kit?
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Gene Fodor
> C 29 Mark II
> Hawk
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!
> 
> 
> 
> ___ This list is supported by the 
> generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay 
> for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
> ___ This list is supported by the 
> generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay 
> for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
> 
>   Virus-free. www.avast.com
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Installing linear autohelm on LF38

[Chuck Gilchrest via CnC-List]

I did see them.  That's one crowded space!
Chuck

Sent from my iPhone

> On May 31, 2016, at 2:16 PM, Frederick G Street via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Yup.  Did you look at the photos I posted on my web server?
> 
> — Fred
> 
> Fred Street -- Minneapolis
> S/V Oceanis (1979 C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI
> 
>> On May 31, 2016, at 1:02 PM, Chuck Gilchrest via CnC-List 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Fred,
>> I’m assuming that the main issue is there is insufficient room above or 
>> below the hub of the radial to affix a tiller arm, correct?
>> Chuck
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Toilet Repair Wilcox Crittenden

[David via CnC-List]

Not only easier but less frustrating...I did a rebuild and damned thing still 
leaked.

David F. Risch
(401) 419-4650 (cell)


To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Date: Tue, 31 May 2016 20:19:58 -0230
Subject: Re: Stus-List Toilet Repair Wilcox Crittenden
From: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
CC: dziedzi...@hotmail.com









And it is almost cheaper, as well. I had just replaced a pump in my head and I 
paid $95 for the pump, and the repair kit was $85 (both CAD). It was a Jabsco, 
so not the same, but in the process I got a locking handle as a bonus.
 
I made a mistake to remove the waste hose off the old pump. What a pain.
 
Marek
 
Sent from 
Mail for Windows 10
 

From: Dennis C. via CnC-List

Sent: May 31, 2016 16:35

To: CnClist

Cc: Dennis C.

Subject: Re: Stus-List Toilet Repair Wilcox Crittenden

 




You may want to consider a new pump assembly.  If it's a WC Head Mate 1460-C 
then the pump assembly should be Part 015461.




There are a couple of benefits of replacing the entire pump assembly.  Your old 
pump cylinder may be scored or worn.  It's usually quicker and easier than 
installing a rebuild kit. 





Dennis C.





On Tue, May 31, 2016 at 1:49 PM, Eugene Fodor via CnC-List
 wrote:



Trying to identify the correct toilet repair kit for my marine head on my C 
29 Mark II 1984/85. It is clearly a Wilcox Crittenden. The pump is leaking 
fresh water out of the top when pumping and when heeled over there is 
significant
 backflow from the tank. :-( I'm pretty sure the joker valve is shot. Here's 
some pictures of the pump and head:



https://goo.gl/photos/VrEo64B65gto2wU19





The following kit looks like it's the right one.



http://www.westmarine.com/buy/wilcox-crittenden--headmate-maintenance-kit--135301





Has anyone else had experience repairing these? Does that look like the right 
kit?



Thanks,



Gene Fodor
C 29 Mark II
Hawk





___



This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!















___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!



Virus-free. www.avast.com


  ___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Toilet Repair Wilcox Crittenden

[Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List]

And it is almost cheaper, as well. I had just replaced a pump in my head and I 
paid $95 for the pump, and the repair kit was $85 (both CAD). It was a Jabsco, 
so not the same, but in the process I got a locking handle as a bonus.

I made a mistake to remove the waste hose off the old pump. What a pain.

Marek

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: Dennis C. via CnC-List
Sent: May 31, 2016 16:35
To: CnClist
Cc: Dennis C.
Subject: Re: Stus-List Toilet Repair Wilcox Crittenden

You may want to consider a new pump assembly.  If it's a WC Head Mate
1460-C then the pump assembly should be Part 015461.

There are a couple of benefits of replacing the entire pump assembly.  Your
old pump cylinder may be scored or worn.  It's usually quicker and easier
than installing a rebuild kit.

Dennis C.

On Tue, May 31, 2016 at 1:49 PM, Eugene Fodor via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Trying to identify the correct toilet repair kit for my marine head on my
> C 29 Mark II 1984/85. It is clearly a Wilcox Crittenden. The pump is
> leaking fresh water out of the top when pumping and when heeled over there
> is significant backflow from the tank. :-( I'm pretty sure the joker valve
> is shot. Here's some pictures of the pump and head:
>
> https://goo.gl/photos/VrEo64B65gto2wU19
>
> The following kit looks like it's the right one.
>
>
> http://www.westmarine.com/buy/wilcox-crittenden--headmate-maintenance-kit--135301
>
> Has anyone else had experience repairing these? Does that look like the
> right kit?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Gene Fodor
> C 29 Mark II
> Hawk
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All
> Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Arrival by private boat in the US by a "visa exempt" citizen

[Bmue via CnC-List]

Arrival on a commercial vessel is a non issue. Private /charter boat seems to 
be the problem. Or did you mean to say you've gone back and forth n your own or 
charter boat?

___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List mast collar tangs C& C 33-2

[Edward Levert via CnC-List]

My C 30 Mk I, possibly hull 19, had its halyards exit at the base of the
mast through a turning block. The halyard then led horizontally to a winch
on the box structure molded into the cabin top. All halyard loads were not
transferred vertically to the deck. My 1981 C 34 has numerous halyards
exiting the base of the mast and led to blocks on the collar which was
bolted to the deck. Blocks then turned the halyard to wherever the winch
was located. Before the tangs were used, I heard of at least 1 local C 35
of unknown Mark having reports of the deck lifting. The halyard loads were
transferred vertically to the collar which in turn caused the deck to
deform flexing upwards. The tang were devised to anchor the collar to the
mast to eliminate the upward flexing of the deck.

Ed
CYC 34 Briar Patch
New Orleans, La.




On Tue, May 31, 2016 at 3:33 PM, Randy Stafford via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Interesting that apparently only some but not all C models have these
> mast collar tangs. Mine (C 30 MK I hull #7, designed 1971-sh built 1972)
> does not have them.  It has a bulkhead about a half-foot forward of the
> mast that is strongly tabbed to the cabin top, which is presumably the
> design element intended to prevent upward flexing of the cabin top.  I
> could see how tangs fastened to mast and collar could do the same thing,
> using the mast as a structural member.  I wonder when and under what
> circumstances C chose to use tangs vs. bulkheads.
>
> Cheers,
> Randy Stafford
> S/V Grenadine
> C 30-1 #7
> Ken Caryl, CO
>
> --
> *From: *"jhnelson via CnC-List" 
> *To: *"cnc-list" 
> *Cc: *"jhnelson" 
> *Sent: *Tuesday, May 31, 2016 12:43:50 PM
> *Subject: *Re: Stus-List mast collar tangs C& C 33-2
>
> Cabin top flexes upward, doors won't close. Boat flexes more than it
> should.
> Generally I don't think anything catestrophic would happen...immediately
> anyway. But flexing the Cabin top is likely not great.
>
>
>
> Sent from my Samsung device
>
>
>  Original message 
> From: Wayne Anstey via CnC-List 
> Date: 2016-05-31 3:25 PM (GMT-04:00)
> To: Frederick G Street via CnC-List 
> Cc: Wayne Anstey 
> Subject: Re: Stus-List mast collar tangs C& C 33-2
>
> What happens if you don't put them on at all and only put the wedges in?
>
> Wayne Anstey
> Resilience
> 1964 C 30mk1
> Bedford, N S, Canada
>
> Sent from my Bell Sony device over Canada’s largest network.
>
>  Bruce Pope via CnC-List wrote 
>
> > Hi Doug.
> >
> >
> > I had the same problem on my 29-2.  Installed the mast for the first
> time after transport,  tuned the rigging, everything set up and then...
> found the tangs in a galley drawer where I had stored them for transport.
> I had to slacken all rigging before I could get the holes to align.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > From: CnC-List  on behalf of
> Persuasion37 via CnC-List 
> > Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2016 4:17 AM
> > To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> > Cc: Persuasion37
> > Subject: Re: Stus-List mast collar tangs C& C 33-2
> >
> > Hi Doug.
> >
> >
> > On my 37 I cannot install the bolts if I tune the mast first.  I've done
> this a couple of times now and the only thing to do is loosen everything,
> install the bolts and re-tune.
> >
> >
> > Mike
> >
> > C 37
> >
> > Long Sault
> >
> >
> > Sent from my iPad
> >
> >
> > On May 30, 2016, at 8:05 PM, doug.welch--- via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
> >
> > When I was rigging my new to me 33-2 we couldn't locate one of the the
> mast collar tangs so I had a friend fabricate a duplicate. Both are now
> misaligned and the holes are about 1/4 inch too high to slip the bolt in
> (the boat is fully rigged). My friends have different opinions on this.
> One says release the rigging and the tangs will slightly deform the cabin
> top when we reset the mast. Another days remake the tangs so the bolts line
> up with jokes in the mast when it's fully rigged. Looking for help from you
> folks.
> >
> >
> >
> > Cheers,
> >
> > Doug
> >
> > Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android
> >
> > ___
> >
> > This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All
> Contributions are greatly appreciated!
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All
> Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All
> Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>

Stus-List I-94 Form

[ALAN BERGEN via CnC-List]

It doesn't look like you need an I-94 form before you arrive.  See the
following link:
http://internationaloffice.berkeley.edu/i-94

Alan-Bergen
35 Mk III Thirsty
Rose City YC
Portland, OR
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Fwd: Questions asked by Banff Park tourists

[Randy Stafford via CnC-List]

Send 'em out my way :) 

Randy 
Ken Caryl, CO 

- Original Message -

From: "Joe via CnC-List Della Barba"  
To: "cnc-list@cnc-list.com"  
Cc: "Joe Della Barba"  
Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2016 12:52:48 PM 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Fwd: Questions asked by Banff Park tourists 



I have had French visitors to * Maryland * wanting to see cowboys and other 
wild west movie scenes and make comments about where was my horse and Indian 
attacks. 

Joe 




From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Ronald B. 
Frerker via CnC-List 
Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2016 14:41 
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
Cc: Ronald B. Frerker 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Fwd: Questions asked by Banff Park tourists 





Just messing with him! 


Here in STL a tourist asked me why we built the Arch; I told them it was so 
they could put a red light on top so airplanes wouldn't hit it. Seemed to 
satisfy them. 


BTW, MO is one of a few states where we might need passports to fly to other 
states. Apparently there's a few states where the drivers license won't be 
sufficient ID any longer. Haven't followed that lately to see where it's at. 


Some on the list might want to take note since it was more than just MO. 


Ron 


Wild Cheri 


C 30-1 


STL 









From: Bmue via CnC-List < cnc-list@cnc-list.com > 
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
Cc: Bmue < anitteb...@yahoo.ca > 
Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2016 12:35 PM 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Fwd: Questions asked by Banff Park tourists 





Don't think that's what he meant...a) anyone owning a C has provided evidence 
of some smarts already ,maybe it's merely suggestions for how to behave "in 
character" whenever you come up here so the Canadians don't get confused. 



___ 

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated! 

___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List mast collar tangs C& C 33-2

[Randy Stafford via CnC-List]

Interesting that apparently only some but not all C models have these mast 
collar tangs. Mine (C 30 MK I hull #7, designed 1971-sh built 1972) does not 
have them. It has a bulkhead about a half-foot forward of the mast that is 
strongly tabbed to the cabin top, which is presumably the design element 
intended to prevent upward flexing of the cabin top. I could see how tangs 
fastened to mast and collar could do the same thing, using the mast as a 
structural member. I wonder when and under what circumstances C chose to use 
tangs vs. bulkheads. 

Cheers, 
Randy Stafford 
S/V Grenadine 
C 30-1 #7 
Ken Caryl, CO 

- Original Message -

From: "jhnelson via CnC-List"  
To: "cnc-list"  
Cc: "jhnelson"  
Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2016 12:43:50 PM 
Subject: Re: Stus-List mast collar tangs C& C 33-2 

Cabin top flexes upward, doors won't close. Boat flexes more than it should. 
Generally I don't think anything catestrophic would happen...immediately 
anyway. But flexing the Cabin top is likely not great. 



Sent from my Samsung device 


 Original message  
From: Wayne Anstey via CnC-List  
Date: 2016-05-31 3:25 PM (GMT-04:00) 
To: Frederick G Street via CnC-List  
Cc: Wayne Anstey  
Subject: Re: Stus-List mast collar tangs C& C 33-2 

What happens if you don't put them on at all and only put the wedges in? 

Wayne Anstey 
Resilience 
1964 C 30mk1 
Bedford, N S, Canada 

Sent from my Bell Sony device over Canada’s largest network. 

 Bruce Pope via CnC-List wrote  

> Hi Doug. 
> 
> 
> I had the same problem on my 29-2. Installed the mast for the first time 
> after transport, tuned the rigging, everything set up and then... found the 
> tangs in a galley drawer where I had stored them for transport. I had to 
> slacken all rigging before I could get the holes to align. 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: CnC-List  on behalf of Persuasion37 via 
> CnC-List  
> Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2016 4:17 AM 
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
> Cc: Persuasion37 
> Subject: Re: Stus-List mast collar tangs C& C 33-2 
> 
> Hi Doug. 
> 
> 
> On my 37 I cannot install the bolts if I tune the mast first. I've done this 
> a couple of times now and the only thing to do is loosen everything, install 
> the bolts and re-tune. 
> 
> 
> Mike 
> 
> C 37 
> 
> Long Sault 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad 
> 
> 
> On May 30, 2016, at 8:05 PM, doug.welch--- via CnC-List 
>  wrote: 
> 
> When I was rigging my new to me 33-2 we couldn't locate one of the the mast 
> collar tangs so I had a friend fabricate a duplicate. Both are now misaligned 
> and the holes are about 1/4 inch too high to slip the bolt in (the boat is 
> fully rigged). My friends have different opinions on this. One says release 
> the rigging and the tangs will slightly deform the cabin top when we reset 
> the mast. Another days remake the tangs so the bolts line up with jokes in 
> the mast when it's fully rigged. Looking for help from you folks. 
> 
> 
> 
> Cheers, 
> 
> Doug 
> 
> Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android 
> 
> ___ 
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated! 
___ 

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated! 

___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Stus-List (no subject)

[Dave via CnC-List]

Mine has shims in the mast step to adjust the height.  As another posted, a 
fully tensioned rig  may make it Impossible to align the holes.  


Subject: Stus-List mast collar tangs C& C 33-2


When I was rigging my new to me 33-2 we couldn't locate one of the the mast 
collar tangs so I had a friend fabricate a duplicate. Both are now misaligned 
and the holes are about 1/4 inch too high to slip the bolt in (the boat is 
fully rigged). My friends have different opinions on this.  One says release 
the rigging and the tangs will slightly deform the cabin top when we reset the 
mast. Another days remake the tangs so the bolts line up with jokes in the mast 
when it's fully rigged. Looking for help from you folks.





Cheers,

Doug

Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android 
 

-- next part --
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: 

Re: Stus-List Arrival by private boat in the US by a "visa exempt" citizen

[Paul Baker via CnC-List]

Why not try calling the Victoria clipper or Washington state ferries, I'm 
nether Canadian nor US but i can go to the US without having to drive there 
first. They would perhaps have an idea about it. 

Date: Tue, 31 May 2016 13:29:20 -0600
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Subject: Stus-List Arrival by private boat in the US by a "visa exempt" citizen
From: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
CC: anitteb...@yahoo.ca

It's not really a C question but rather a travel by boat to the US question 
when not a US or Canadian citizen but coming from a visa "exempt" country. So 
holler if I am breaking the "rules".
I have had multiple exchanges with US customs/ border control because 
apparently you need this I94 form (a form that basically confirms that you 
don't need a visa?) in your passport BEFORE you arrive at the US port. However, 
you can only get this form at a land border crossing (nope not at an airport , 
there, you need your ESTA), which means you need to drive across the border get 
the form, pay $6, turn around drive back to Canada and then hop on the boat and 
sail to the US. After 3 months , repeat. I have never gotten an answer on what 
to do when you arrive from the Caribbean. ( can't drive across the border 
first,now, can ya).
Has anybody run into this and knows how to get around this logistical 
impossibility?
Thank you ...
Below, read starting from the bottom...

 SubjectRe arrival in the US by private pleasure boat (or bareboat charter) 
Where would ...  Discussion Thread Response Via Email (CBP I-94 and ESTA 
Officer)04/26/2016 03:23 PMDear Sir/Madame,

There is not another visitor visa that can be obtained ahead of time prior to 
your entry to the US. Even if ESTA is obtained, you are still required by law 
to be inspected upon entry to the US and that includes arrival by boat. ESTA 
does not grant you admission into the US. It is only used for pre-inspection 
purposes prior to your arrival to the US. If you arrive by boat you will need 
to report to the nearest port of entry. If you arrive to the US by air then you 
will need to fly into an international airport where CBP is staffed. 



Best Regards,
Admissibility and Passenger Programs



Please note that in our online tracking software, a “Solved” status simply 
means that we have provided you with the best information we have to your 
question. There may still be steps you need to complete before your situation 
is resolved to your satisfaction. Those steps are explained in our response. If 
you need further clarification on those steps, please feel free to contact us 
back. 

This email is intended for Informational Purposes Only, final determination of 
admission is solely at the discretion of the CBP Officer based upon the 
inspection at the time of entry. Customer By Email04/26/2016 09:30 AMThank you 
for the clarification re airport entry.
I understand that we require the correct documentation. The question is how can 
one obtain this  when arriving by boat e.g. From the Caribbean or, from Europe 
without prior access to a land border?  Is there another option then the I94 
which is only valid for 3 month and has to be obtained at a physical US border?
 E.g. Is there another "visitor visa" that can be obtained well in advance but 
remains valid (e.g. like the ESTA that can be obtained through online 
application and remains valid for 2 years. ) 
Thank you for you assistance.
On Apr 26, 2016, at 7:11, "CBP INFO Center"   
wrote:


 Response Via Email (CBP I-94 and ESTA Officer)04/26/2016 09:11 AMDear 
Sir/Madame,

In order to obtain an I-94 document at the airport where CBP is stationed at 
you need to have a flight booked in order to do so. The I-94 document can only 
be given upon your entry to the US. If you were to obtain the I-94 document at 
an airport you will need to be flying into the US i.e. making an entry to the 
US. 

As far as your arrival by sailboat from the Caribbean you will need to have the 
correct documentation prior to your arrival. If you arrive to the US without 
being inspected by CBP or issued the correct documentation for entry to the US 
you can be considered as a person who entered the US without inspection.


Best Regards,
Admissibility and Passenger Programs



Please note that in our online tracking software, a “Solved” status simply 
means that we have provided you with the best information we have to your 
question. There may still be steps you need to complete before your situation 
is resolved to your satisfaction. Those steps are explained in our response. If 
you need further clarification on those steps, please feel free to contact us 
back. 

This email is intended for Informational Purposes Only, final determination of 
admission is solely at the discretion of the CBP Officer based upon the 
inspection at the time of entry. Customer By Email04/26/2016 09:00 AMThank you 
for the information. Could you please let me know if the form (I94) is 
available at an airport in Canada that 

Stus-List Arrival by private boat in the US by a "visa exempt" citizen

[Bmue via CnC-List]

It's not really a C question but rather a travel by boat to the US question 
when not a US or Canadian citizen but coming from a visa "exempt" country. So 
holler if I am breaking the "rules".

I have had multiple exchanges with US customs/ border control because 
apparently you need this I94 form (a form that basically confirms that you 
don't need a visa?) in your passport BEFORE you arrive at the US port. However, 
you can only get this form at a land border crossing (nope not at an airport , 
there, you need your ESTA), which means you need to drive across the border get 
the form, pay $6, turn around drive back to Canada and then hop on the boat and 
sail to the US. After 3 months , repeat. 
I have never gotten an answer on what to do when you arrive from the Caribbean. 
( can't drive across the border first,now, can ya).

Has anybody run into this and knows how to get around this logistical 
impossibility?

Thank you ...

Below, read starting from the bottom...

 Subject
Re arrival in the US by private pleasure boat (or bareboat charter) Where would 
...
 
 Discussion Thread
 Response Via Email (CBP I-94 and ESTA Officer) 04/26/2016 03:23 PM
Dear Sir/Madame,

There is not another visitor visa that can be obtained ahead of time prior to 
your entry to the US. Even if ESTA is obtained, you are still required by law 
to be inspected upon entry to the US and that includes arrival by boat. ESTA 
does not grant you admission into the US. It is only used for pre-inspection 
purposes prior to your arrival to the US. If you arrive by boat you will need 
to report to the nearest port of entry. If you arrive to the US by air then you 
will need to fly into an international airport where CBP is staffed. 



Best Regards,
Admissibility and Passenger Programs



Please note that in our online tracking software, a “Solved” status simply 
means that we have provided you with the best information we have to your 
question. There may still be steps you need to complete before your situation 
is resolved to your satisfaction. Those steps are explained in our response. If 
you need further clarification on those steps, please feel free to contact us 
back. 

This email is intended for Informational Purposes Only, final determination of 
admission is solely at the discretion of the CBP Officer based upon the 
inspection at the time of entry.
 Customer By Email  04/26/2016 09:30 AM
Thank you for the clarification re airport entry.

I understand that we require the correct documentation. The question is how can 
one obtain this  when arriving by boat e.g. From the Caribbean or, from Europe 
without prior access to a land border?  Is there another option then the I94 
which is only valid for 3 month and has to be obtained at a physical US border?

 E.g. Is there another "visitor visa" that can be obtained well in advance but 
remains valid (e.g. like the ESTA that can be obtained through online 
application and remains valid for 2 years. ) 

Thank you for you assistance.

On Apr 26, 2016, at 7:11, "CBP INFO Center"   
wrote:


 Response Via Email (CBP I-94 and ESTA Officer) 04/26/2016 09:11 AM
Dear Sir/Madame,

In order to obtain an I-94 document at the airport where CBP is stationed at 
you need to have a flight booked in order to do so. The I-94 document can only 
be given upon your entry to the US. If you were to obtain the I-94 document at 
an airport you will need to be flying into the US i.e. making an entry to the 
US. 

As far as your arrival by sailboat from the Caribbean you will need to have the 
correct documentation prior to your arrival. If you arrive to the US without 
being inspected by CBP or issued the correct documentation for entry to the US 
you can be considered as a person who entered the US without inspection.


Best Regards,
Admissibility and Passenger Programs



Please note that in our online tracking software, a “Solved” status simply 
means that we have provided you with the best information we have to your 
question. There may still be steps you need to complete before your situation 
is resolved to your satisfaction. Those steps are explained in our response. If 
you need further clarification on those steps, please feel free to contact us 
back. 

This email is intended for Informational Purposes Only, final determination of 
admission is solely at the discretion of the CBP Officer based upon the 
inspection at the time of entry.
 Customer By Email  04/26/2016 09:00 AM
Thank you for the information. Could you please let me know if the form (I94) 
is available at an airport in Canada that has US customs stationed there. As 
you may appreciate driving to the border to get this form is not always 
practicable. 

It is not quite clear to me how one can overcome this logistical impossibility 
if arriving for example, from the Caribbean by sailboat? Could you please 
advise how these situations can be addressed as the I 94 is only valid for 3 
mth and as such 

Re: Stus-List Toilet Repair Wilcox Crittenden

[Dennis C. via CnC-List]

You may want to consider a new pump assembly.  If it's a WC Head Mate
1460-C then the pump assembly should be Part 015461.

There are a couple of benefits of replacing the entire pump assembly.  Your
old pump cylinder may be scored or worn.  It's usually quicker and easier
than installing a rebuild kit.

Dennis C.

On Tue, May 31, 2016 at 1:49 PM, Eugene Fodor via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Trying to identify the correct toilet repair kit for my marine head on my
> C 29 Mark II 1984/85. It is clearly a Wilcox Crittenden. The pump is
> leaking fresh water out of the top when pumping and when heeled over there
> is significant backflow from the tank. :-( I'm pretty sure the joker valve
> is shot. Here's some pictures of the pump and head:
>
> https://goo.gl/photos/VrEo64B65gto2wU19
>
> The following kit looks like it's the right one.
>
>
> http://www.westmarine.com/buy/wilcox-crittenden--headmate-maintenance-kit--135301
>
> Has anyone else had experience repairing these? Does that look like the
> right kit?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Gene Fodor
> C 29 Mark II
> Hawk
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All
> Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Fwd: Questions asked by Banff Park tourists

[Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List]

I have had French visitors to *Maryland* wanting to see cowboys and other wild 
west movie scenes and make comments about where was my horse and Indian attacks.
Joe

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Ronald B. 
Frerker via CnC-List
Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2016 14:41
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Ronald B. Frerker
Subject: Re: Stus-List Fwd: Questions asked by Banff Park tourists

Just messing with him!
Here in STL a tourist asked me why we built the Arch; I told them it was so 
they could put a red light on top so airplanes wouldn't hit it.  Seemed to 
satisfy them.
BTW, MO is one of a few states where we might need passports to fly to other 
states.  Apparently there's a few states where the drivers license won't be 
sufficient ID any longer.  Haven't followed that lately to see where it's at.
Some on the list might want to take note since it was more than just MO.
Ron
Wild Cheri
C 30-1
STL



From: Bmue via CnC-List >
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Bmue >
Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2016 12:35 PM
Subject: Re: Stus-List Fwd: Questions asked by Banff Park tourists

Don't think that's what he meant...a) anyone owning a C has provided evidence 
of some smarts already ,maybe it's  merely suggestions for how to behave "in 
character" whenever you come up here  so the Canadians don't get confused.

___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Stus-List Toilet Repair Wilcox Crittenden

[Eugene Fodor via CnC-List]

Trying to identify the correct toilet repair kit for my marine head on my
C 29 Mark II 1984/85. It is clearly a Wilcox Crittenden. The pump is
leaking fresh water out of the top when pumping and when heeled over there
is significant backflow from the tank. :-( I'm pretty sure the joker valve
is shot. Here's some pictures of the pump and head:

https://goo.gl/photos/VrEo64B65gto2wU19

The following kit looks like it's the right one.

http://www.westmarine.com/buy/wilcox-crittenden--headmate-maintenance-kit--135301

Has anyone else had experience repairing these? Does that look like the
right kit?

Thanks,

Gene Fodor
C 29 Mark II
Hawk
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List mast collar tangs C& C 33-2

[jhnelson via CnC-List]

Cabin top flexes upward, doors won't close. Boat flexes more than it 
should.Generally I don't think anything catestrophic would happen...immediately 
anyway. But flexing the Cabin top is likely not great.


Sent from my Samsung device

 Original message 
From: Wayne Anstey via CnC-List  
Date: 2016-05-31  3:25 PM  (GMT-04:00) 
To: Frederick G Street via CnC-List  
Cc: Wayne Anstey  
Subject: Re: Stus-List mast collar tangs C& C 33-2 

What happens if you don't put them on at all and only put the wedges in?

Wayne Anstey
Resilience
1964 C 30mk1
Bedford, N S, Canada 

Sent from my Bell Sony device over Canada’s largest network.

 Bruce Pope via CnC-List wrote 

> Hi Doug.
> 
> 
> I had the same problem on my 29-2.  Installed the mast for the first time 
> after transport,  tuned the rigging, everything set up and then... found the 
> tangs in a galley drawer where I had stored them for transport.  I had to 
> slacken all rigging before I could get the holes to align.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: CnC-List  on behalf of Persuasion37 via 
> CnC-List 
> Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2016 4:17 AM
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc: Persuasion37
> Subject: Re: Stus-List mast collar tangs C& C 33-2 
> 
>  Hi Doug.
> 
> 
> On my 37 I cannot install the bolts if I tune the mast first.  I've done this 
> a couple of times now and the only thing to do is loosen everything, install 
> the bolts and re-tune.
> 
> 
> Mike
> 
> C 37
> 
> Long Sault
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> 
> On May 30, 2016, at 8:05 PM, doug.welch--- via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> When I was rigging my new to me 33-2 we couldn't locate one of the the mast 
> collar tangs so I had a friend fabricate a duplicate. Both are now misaligned 
> and the holes are about 1/4 inch too high to slip the bolt in (the boat is 
> fully rigged). My friends have different opinions on this.  One says release 
> the rigging and the tangs will slightly deform the cabin top when we reset 
> the mast. Another days remake the tangs so the bolts line up with jokes in 
> the mast when it's fully rigged. Looking for help from you folks. 
> 
> 
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Doug
> 
> Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Fwd: Questions asked by Banff Park tourists

[Ronald B. Frerker via CnC-List]

Just messing with him!Here in STL a tourist asked me why we built the Arch; I 
told them it was so they could put a red light on top so airplanes wouldn't hit 
it.  Seemed to satisfy them.BTW, MO is one of a few states where we might need 
passports to fly to other states.  Apparently there's a few states where the 
drivers license won't be sufficient ID any longer.  Haven't followed that 
lately to see where it's at.Some on the list might want to take note since it 
was more than just MO.RonWild CheriC 30-1STL


  From: Bmue via CnC-List 
 To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
Cc: Bmue 
 Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2016 12:35 PM
 Subject: Re: Stus-List Fwd: Questions asked by Banff Park tourists
   
Don't think that's what he meant...a) anyone owning a C has provided evidence 
of some smarts already ,maybe it's  merely suggestions for how to behave "in 
character" whenever you come up here  so the Canadians don't get confused. 

  ___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Installing linear autohelm on LF38

[Robert Boyer via CnC-List]

I think the only complaints about the original LF38 fuel tank is the fact that 
it was built too thin (0.090 inches--even the mfgr's std is now thicker) and 
the difficulty of replacement.  However, if it was made thicker to begin with 
no one would be replacing them between 20 and 30 years of age.

I couldn't do the cruising I have ahead of me with only 16 gallons.  In fact, 
I've ripped out my holding tank and replaced it with a 19-gallon secondary fuel 
tank.  So, now I have 51 gallons of diesel.

Bob Boyer
S/V Rainy Days (1983 C Landfall 38 - Hull #230)
Blog: dainyrays.blogspot.com
Email: dainyr...@icloud.com
Annapolis, MD (presently in Baltimore)

> On May 31, 2016, at 2:25 PM, Patrick Davin via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Yes but if your LF38 has no fuel tank under the radial drive, as on mine, 
> then there is room for a tiller arm I believe. A prior owner removed the 
> original tank and installed a 16g one in the bottom of the stbd lazarette. 
> Eventually I may need more fuel capacity and might have to reconsider the 
> below steering spot, but given how many people complain about that fuel tank 
> I think it's a blessing to have it gone from there. 
> 
> Next year I may consider a below decks autopilot, so it's nice to have more 
> options. Since I recently replaced the Edson radial drive while dropping the 
> rudder, I've been up close down there quite a bit ( 
> https://svviolethour.com/2016/05/03/this-years-haul-out-dropping-the-rudder/ 
> ). There's about 3-4" of exposed rudder stock below the radial drive, with a 
> 1/4" keyway that entire length. However since the radial drive is concave 
> downwards, a tiller arm wouldn't be able to use all of that height-wise - 
> maybe only 1-2". I *think* it would be enough, but the angles would still be 
> tricky. 
> 
> While researching the radial drive I came across this post where a Catalina 
> owner had his Edson radial drive shatter while sailing: 
> https://www.catalina36.org/forum/technical-discussion/radial-disk-shattered
> He didn't have an autopilot on it, but was missing the two outer screws which 
> help align the circumference of the disk (maybe contributed, maybe not). 
> 
> Bob's tiller arm is mounted to the fwd rudder stop platform of the radial 
> drive (there's one on each end, the aft one has the rudder stop). That seems 
> like a better place than randomly drilling through the middle (disc portion) 
> of the drive - at least it's designed to take some shock loads. 
> 
> Other threads on this: 
> http://www.sailnet.com/forums/gear-maintenance/55443-autopilot-drive-mounting-question.html
> http://themarineinstallersrant.blogspot.com/2010/06/you-cant-always-get-what-you-want-and.html
> 
> -Patrick
> 1984 C LF38
> Seattle, WA
> 
>> On Tue, May 31, 2016 at 10:18 AM,  wrote:
>> From: Frederick G Street 
>> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
>> Cc: 
>> Date: Tue, 31 May 2016 12:18:07 -0500
>> Subject: Re: Stus-List Installing linear autohelm on LF38
>> Chuck and all — the steering configuration belowdecks on the Landfall 38s 
>> cannot support a tiller arm.  The quadrant is directly below the cockpit 
>> sole, and directly above the fuel tank.  There simply is no room for 
>> anything on the rudder post.  Wal Bryant got a good photo of this area when 
>> he redid his steering system; I’ve taken the liberty (thanks, Wal!) of 
>> reposting one of his photos on my web server at 
>> www.postaudio.net/webserver/LF38steering.jpg.  Looking past the smiley face 
>> that Wal spray-painted on his new fuel tank, you can see just how tight 
>> everything is back there.
>> 
>> In virtually all of the autopilot installations I’ve seen where the drive is 
>> attached directly to the quadrant, the attachment has been strengthened with 
>> metal plates on one or both sides of the quadrant wheel; this includes Bob 
>> Boyer’s setup, which he emailed me photos of.  Bob, I hope it’s okay for me 
>> to take the liberty again of posting one of these photos at 
>> http://www.postaudio.net/webserver/LF38steering2.jpg.
>> 
>> And Chuck, yes I have been involved in using Octopus hydraulic linear drives 
>> in autopilot installations; I like their tough dependability and strength, 
>> and the fact that they only have a few moving parts.  One of their downsides 
>> in limited spaces, though, is the fact that the actuator rod sticks out the 
>> back of the drive a fair amount when the drive is at the short limit of 
>> travel; this can cause issues with structure nearby, limiting where and how 
>> you can mount the drive.
>> 
>> In any case, there simply isn’t a good spot (really, ANY spot) to mount a 
>> tiller arm on the LF38.
>> 
>> — Fred
>> 
>> Fred Street -- Minneapolis
>> S/V Oceanis (1979 C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI
> 
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our 

Re: Stus-List mast collar tangs C& C 33-2

[Wayne Anstey via CnC-List]

What happens if you don't put them on at all and only put the wedges in?

Wayne Anstey
Resilience
1964 C 30mk1
Bedford, N S, Canada 

Sent from my Bell Sony device over Canada’s largest network.

 Bruce Pope via CnC-List wrote 

> Hi Doug.
> 
> 
> I had the same problem on my 29-2.  Installed the mast for the first time 
> after transport,  tuned the rigging, everything set up and then... found the 
> tangs in a galley drawer where I had stored them for transport.  I had to 
> slacken all rigging before I could get the holes to align.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: CnC-List  on behalf of Persuasion37 via 
> CnC-List 
> Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2016 4:17 AM
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc: Persuasion37
> Subject: Re: Stus-List mast collar tangs C& C 33-2 
> 
>  Hi Doug.
> 
> 
> On my 37 I cannot install the bolts if I tune the mast first.  I've done this 
> a couple of times now and the only thing to do is loosen everything, install 
> the bolts and re-tune.
> 
> 
> Mike
> 
> C 37
> 
> Long Sault
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> 
> On May 30, 2016, at 8:05 PM, doug.welch--- via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> When I was rigging my new to me 33-2 we couldn't locate one of the the mast 
> collar tangs so I had a friend fabricate a duplicate. Both are now misaligned 
> and the holes are about 1/4 inch too high to slip the bolt in (the boat is 
> fully rigged). My friends have different opinions on this.  One says release 
> the rigging and the tangs will slightly deform the cabin top when we reset 
> the mast. Another days remake the tangs so the bolts line up with jokes in 
> the mast when it's fully rigged. Looking for help from you folks. 
> 
> 
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Doug
> 
> Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Installing linear autohelm on LF38

[Patrick Davin via CnC-List]

Yes but if your LF38 has no fuel tank under the radial drive, as on mine,
then there is room for a tiller arm I believe. A prior owner removed the
original tank and installed a 16g one in the bottom of the stbd lazarette.
Eventually I may need more fuel capacity and might have to reconsider the
below steering spot, but given how many people complain about that fuel
tank I think it's a blessing to have it gone from there.

Next year I may consider a below decks autopilot, so it's nice to have more
options. Since I recently replaced the Edson radial drive while dropping
the rudder, I've been up close down there quite a bit (
https://svviolethour.com/2016/05/03/this-years-haul-out-dropping-the-rudder/
). There's about 3-4" of exposed rudder stock below the radial drive, with
a 1/4" keyway that entire length. However since the radial drive is concave
downwards, a tiller arm wouldn't be able to use all of that height-wise -
maybe only 1-2". I *think* it would be enough, but the angles would still
be tricky.

While researching the radial drive I came across this post where a Catalina
owner had his Edson radial drive shatter while sailing:
https://www.catalina36.org/forum/technical-discussion/radial-disk-shattered
He didn't have an autopilot on it, but was missing the two outer screws
which help align the circumference of the disk (maybe contributed, maybe
not).

Bob's tiller arm is mounted to the fwd rudder stop platform of the radial
drive (there's one on each end, the aft one has the rudder stop). That
seems like a better place than randomly drilling through the middle (disc
portion) of the drive - at least it's designed to take some shock loads.

Other threads on this:
http://www.sailnet.com/forums/gear-maintenance/55443-autopilot-drive-mounting-question.html
http://themarineinstallersrant.blogspot.com/2010/06/you-cant-always-get-what-you-want-and.html

-Patrick
1984 C LF38
Seattle, WA

On Tue, May 31, 2016 at 10:18 AM,  wrote:

> From: Frederick G Street 
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc:
> Date: Tue, 31 May 2016 12:18:07 -0500
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Installing linear autohelm on LF38
> Chuck and all — the steering configuration belowdecks on the Landfall 38s
> cannot support a tiller arm.  The quadrant is directly below the cockpit
> sole, and directly above the fuel tank.  There simply is no room for
> anything on the rudder post.  Wal Bryant got a good photo of this area when
> he redid his steering system; I’ve taken the liberty (thanks, Wal!) of
> reposting one of his photos on my web server at
> www.postaudio.net/webserver/LF38steering.jpg.  Looking past the smiley
> face that Wal spray-painted on his new fuel tank, you can see just how
> tight everything is back there.
>
> In virtually all of the autopilot installations I’ve seen where the drive
> is attached directly to the quadrant, the attachment has been strengthened
> with metal plates on one or both sides of the quadrant wheel; this includes
> Bob Boyer’s setup, which he emailed me photos of.  Bob, I hope it’s okay
> for me to take the liberty again of posting one of these photos at
> http://www.postaudio.net/webserver/LF38steering2.jpg.
>
> And Chuck, yes I have been involved in using Octopus hydraulic linear
> drives in autopilot installations; I like their tough dependability and
> strength, and the fact that they only have a few moving parts.  One of
> their downsides in limited spaces, though, is the fact that the actuator
> rod sticks out the back of the drive a fair amount when the drive is at the
> short limit of travel; this can cause issues with structure nearby,
> limiting where and how you can mount the drive.
>
> In any case, there simply isn’t a good spot (really, *ANY* spot) to mount
> a tiller arm on the LF38.
>
> — Fred
>
> Fred Street -- Minneapolis
> S/V Oceanis (1979 C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI
>
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Installing linear autohelm on LF38

[Frederick G Street via CnC-List]

Yup.  Did you look at the photos I posted on my web server?

— Fred

Fred Street -- Minneapolis
S/V Oceanis (1979 C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI

> On May 31, 2016, at 1:02 PM, Chuck Gilchrest via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Fred,
> I’m assuming that the main issue is there is insufficient room above or below 
> the hub of the radial to affix a tiller arm, correct?
> Chuck

___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Installing linear autohelm on LF38

[Robert Boyer via CnC-List]

It “looks" like my quadrant is anodized black aluminum—not bronze.  Small 
plates are used on each side of the aluminum quadrant to reinforce the 
attachment point.  (I say “looks” because I can’t even get close to it from my 
quarterberth.  It must have been a skinny guy that did my installation!)

Bob



> On May 31, 2016, at 1:42 PM, Chuck Gilchrest via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Bob (and other LF 38 folks),
> As I don’t have immediate access to Edson’s steering parts data base, can you 
> tell me if the Landfall 38 uses a radial drive wheel (full circle) or 
> quadrant (like a slice of pizza) shaped rudder to cable attachment?  Two 
> somewhat different animals that basically do the same thing, however, Edson’s 
> quadrants are bronze while the radial drive wheels are aluminum.  In 
> autopilot tiller arm installations that are “challenging” due to available 
> space,   there are a few nifty methods of reinforcing a quadrant (the bronze 
> thing) using 2 transverse pieces of ¼”x 1” wide stainless that would set in 
> the gap inside the triangular opening in the quadrant, one above and one 
> below the bronze webbing that keeps the quadrant from twisting.   The steel 
> pieces would bolt to that webbing.  The linear drive ram would attach to that 
> piece of steel providing a contact point at around 8” or so from the rudder 
> post as per Raymarine’s instructions.
>  
> Radial drives are harder to properly re-inforce at a single contact point, 
> partially due to the thin metal and also because the radial is dished and 
> won’t be at 90 degrees to the angle of the rudderpost (and as such with the 
> throw of the ram).   They also have reinforcing ribs designed to bear the 
> loads at the circumference.   However, if a single point attachment on a 
> radial drive is the LAST RESORT, you could cut two 2” “donuts” from aluminum 
> that would sit above and below the radial (taking care to not foul the take 
> up eyes and cables), and either weld the donuts in place (preferable) or bond 
> them using epoxy to the radial prior to drilling the radial for the ram 
> mounting bolt.  In this manner, you’re spreading the load of the attachment 
> pin where it passes through the radial, plus you are giving the radial a bit 
> of lateral structure when the ram is fixed to a single post that sits up from 
> its surface.
>  
> The reason most tiller arm installations are best done with a tiller arm with 
> a hollow channel that accepts the rose joint (ball joint) end of the ram 
> INSIDE the tiller arm is to support the forces placed on the arm by a 
> structure both above and below the ram.  If torque is applied to an pin (or 
> bolt) that sits 90 degrees from a horizontal platform (radial or otherwise), 
> the entire load is being borne by the single attachment point below the joint.
> Perhaps the structure you’ve built to support the ram is sufficiently rigid 
> and in line with your “quadrant” to prevent any twisting motion in a seaway, 
> but I’ve seen plenty of bent or broken tiller arm pins (and even a few 
> twisted tiller arms), where there was so much force applied by the ram to a 
> single po.int attachment that the system failed or even worse, jammed.  If 
> enough force is applied, a bronze tiller arm (or quadrant) will initially 
> bend and then tear.  An aluminum radial drive will simply fracture and break. 
>  Neither is ideal but a broken radial drive wheel could render the boat 
> unsteerable or at the very least, send you scrambling for the emergency 
> tiller.  And remember, this wouldn’t happen when the conditions are nice and 
> smooth with 2’ seas and a mild breeze.
> It would happen when the winds were blowing 30+ and you’re getting green 
> water over the foredeck…
>  
> As much as I dislike wheel pilots, even if my boat was larger than the 
> recommended size for the pilot,  it would be safer to use a wheel pilot and 
> have it disengage when the steering loads became too great than to simply 
> bolt the ram to a radial drive wheel and risk the drive wheel cracking when 
> the loads became more severe.  
> At Edson, I never liked using the words “steering” and “failure” in the same 
> sentence…
> Chuck Gilchrest
> S/V Half Magic
> 1983 LF 35
> Padanaram, MA
>   <>
> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com 
> ] On Behalf Of Persuasi  on37 via 
> CnC-List 
> Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2016 12:19 PM
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
> Cc: Persuasion37 >
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Installing linear autohelm on LF38
>  
> Make that 2 data points.  That is how mine is attached. I think it was 
> installed in ‘98.  Two trips to the Bahamas (one PO) no issues with quadrant. 
>  I would be curious how it would be installed otherwise.
>  
> Miketi
> S/V Persuasion
> C 37 Keel/CB
> Long Sault
>  
> From: Robert Boyer via CnC-List 

Re: Stus-List mast collar tangs C& C 33-2

[Bruce Pope via CnC-List]

Hi Doug.


I had the same problem on my 29-2.  Installed the mast for the first time after 
transport,  tuned the rigging, everything set up and then... found the tangs in 
a galley drawer where I had stored them for transport.  I had to slacken all 
rigging before I could get the holes to align.




From: CnC-List  on behalf of Persuasion37 via 
CnC-List 
Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2016 4:17 AM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Persuasion37
Subject: Re: Stus-List mast collar tangs C& C 33-2

Hi Doug.

On my 37 I cannot install the bolts if I tune the mast first.  I've done this a 
couple of times now and the only thing to do is loosen everything, install the 
bolts and re-tune.

Mike
C 37
Long Sault

Sent from my iPad

On May 30, 2016, at 8:05 PM, doug.welch--- via CnC-List 
> wrote:

When I was rigging my new to me 33-2 we couldn't locate one of the the mast 
collar tangs so I had a friend fabricate a duplicate. Both are now misaligned 
and the holes are about 1/4 inch too high to slip the bolt in (the boat is 
fully rigged). My friends have different opinions on this.  One says release 
the rigging and the tangs will slightly deform the cabin top when we reset the 
mast. Another days remake the tangs so the bolts line up with jokes in the mast 
when it's fully rigged. Looking for help from you folks.


Cheers,
Doug

Sent from Yahoo Mail on 
Android
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Installing linear autohelm on LF38

[Chuck Gilchrest via CnC-List]

Fred,

I’m assuming that the main issue is there is insufficient room above or below 
the hub of the radial to affix a tiller arm, correct?

Chuck

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Frederick G 
Street via CnC-List
Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2016 1:59 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Frederick G Street 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Installing linear autohelm on LF38

 

Chuck — sorry for the bad nomenclature; I use “quadrant” interchangeably (and 
erroneously) to cover both quadrants and radial drives.  The LF38 (mine, at 
least, and I expect most others) has an aluminum radial drive.

 

— Fred


Fred Street -- Minneapolis
S/V Oceanis (1979 C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI

 

On May 31, 2016, at 12:42 PM, Chuck Gilchrest via CnC-List 
 > wrote:

 

Bob (and other LF 38 folks),

As I don’t have immediate access to Edson’s steering parts data base, can you 
tell me if the Landfall 38 uses a radial drive wheel (full circle) or quadrant 
(like a slice of pizza) shaped rudder to cable attachment?  Two somewhat 
different animals that basically do the same thing, however, Edson’s quadrants 
are bronze while the radial drive wheels are aluminum.  In autopilot tiller arm 
installations that are “challenging” due to available space,   there are a few 
nifty methods of reinforcing a quadrant (the bronze thing) using 2 transverse 
pieces of ¼”x 1” wide stainless that would set in the gap inside the triangular 
opening in the quadrant, one above and one below the bronze webbing that keeps 
the quadrant from twisting.   The steel pieces would bolt to that webbing.  The 
linear drive ram would attach to that piece of steel providing a contact point 
at around 8” or so from the rudder post as per Raymarine’s instructions.

 

Radial drives are harder to properly re-inforce at a single contact point, 
partially due to the thin metal and also because the radial is dished and won’t 
be at 90 degrees to the angle of the rudderpost (and as such with the throw of 
the ram).   They also have reinforcing ribs designed to bear the loads at the 
circumference.   However, if a single point attachment on a radial drive is the 
LAST RESORT, you could cut two 2” “donuts” from aluminum that would sit above 
and below the radial (taking care to not foul the take up eyes and cables), and 
either weld the donuts in place (preferable) or bond them using epoxy to the 
radial prior to drilling the radial for the ram mounting bolt.  In this manner, 
you’re spreading the load of the attachment pin where it passes through the 
radial, plus you are giving the radial a bit of lateral structure when the ram 
is fixed to a single post that sits up from its surface.

 

The reason most tiller arm installations are best done with a tiller arm with a 
hollow channel that accepts the rose joint (ball joint) end of the ram INSIDE 
the tiller arm is to support the forces placed on the arm by a structure both 
above and below the ram.  If torque is applied to an pin (or bolt) that sits 90 
degrees from a horizontal platform (radial or otherwise), the entire load is 
being borne by the single attachment point below the joint.

Perhaps the structure you’ve built to support the ram is sufficiently rigid and 
in line with your “quadrant” to prevent any twisting motion in a seaway, but 
I’ve seen plenty of bent or broken tiller arm pins (and even a few twisted 
tiller arms), where there was so much force applied by the ram to a single 
po.int attachment that the system failed or even worse, jammed.  If enough 
force is applied, a bronze tiller arm (or quadrant) will initially bend and 
then tear.  An aluminum radial drive will simply fracture and break.  Neither 
is ideal but a broken radial drive wheel could render the boat unsteerable or 
at the very least, send you scrambling for the emergency tiller.  And remember, 
this wouldn’t happen when the conditions are nice and smooth with 2’ seas and a 
mild breeze.

It would happen when the winds were blowing 30+ and you’re getting green water 
over the foredeck…

 

As much as I dislike wheel pilots, even if my boat was larger than the 
recommended size for the pilot,  it would be safer to use a wheel pilot and 
have it disengage when the steering loads became too great than to simply bolt 
the ram to a radial drive wheel and risk the drive wheel cracking when the 
loads became more severe.  

At Edson, I never liked using the words “steering” and “failure” in the same 
sentence…

Chuck Gilchrest

S/V Half Magic

1983 LF 35

Padanaram, MA

 

___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Installing linear autohelm on LF38

[Frederick G Street via CnC-List]

Chuck — sorry for the bad nomenclature; I use “quadrant” interchangeably (and 
erroneously) to cover both quadrants and radial drives.  The LF38 (mine, at 
least, and I expect most others) has an aluminum radial drive.

— Fred

Fred Street -- Minneapolis
S/V Oceanis (1979 C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI

> On May 31, 2016, at 12:42 PM, Chuck Gilchrest via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Bob (and other LF 38 folks),
> As I don’t have immediate access to Edson’s steering parts data base, can you 
> tell me if the Landfall 38 uses a radial drive wheel (full circle) or 
> quadrant (like a slice of pizza) shaped rudder to cable attachment?  Two 
> somewhat different animals that basically do the same thing, however, Edson’s 
> quadrants are bronze while the radial drive wheels are aluminum.  In 
> autopilot tiller arm installations that are “challenging” due to available 
> space,   there are a few nifty methods of reinforcing a quadrant (the bronze 
> thing) using 2 transverse pieces of ¼”x 1” wide stainless that would set in 
> the gap inside the triangular opening in the quadrant, one above and one 
> below the bronze webbing that keeps the quadrant from twisting.   The steel 
> pieces would bolt to that webbing.  The linear drive ram would attach to that 
> piece of steel providing a contact point at around 8” or so from the rudder 
> post as per Raymarine’s instructions.
>  
> Radial drives are harder to properly re-inforce at a single contact point, 
> partially due to the thin metal and also because the radial is dished and 
> won’t be at 90 degrees to the angle of the rudderpost (and as such with the 
> throw of the ram).   They also have reinforcing ribs designed to bear the 
> loads at the circumference.   However, if a single point attachment on a 
> radial drive is the LAST RESORT, you could cut two 2” “donuts” from aluminum 
> that would sit above and below the radial (taking care to not foul the take 
> up eyes and cables), and either weld the donuts in place (preferable) or bond 
> them using epoxy to the radial prior to drilling the radial for the ram 
> mounting bolt.  In this manner, you’re spreading the load of the attachment 
> pin where it passes through the radial, plus you are giving the radial a bit 
> of lateral structure when the ram is fixed to a single post that sits up from 
> its surface.
>  
> The reason most tiller arm installations are best done with a tiller arm with 
> a hollow channel that accepts the rose joint (ball joint) end of the ram 
> INSIDE the tiller arm is to support the forces placed on the arm by a 
> structure both above and below the ram.  If torque is applied to an pin (or 
> bolt) that sits 90 degrees from a horizontal platform (radial or otherwise), 
> the entire load is being borne by the single attachment point below the joint.
> Perhaps the structure you’ve built to support the ram is sufficiently rigid 
> and in line with your “quadrant” to prevent any twisting motion in a seaway, 
> but I’ve seen plenty of bent or broken tiller arm pins (and even a few 
> twisted tiller arms), where there was so much force applied by the ram to a 
> single po.int attachment that the system failed or even worse, jammed.  If 
> enough force is applied, a bronze tiller arm (or quadrant) will initially 
> bend and then tear.  An aluminum radial drive will simply fracture and break. 
>  Neither is ideal but a broken radial drive wheel could render the boat 
> unsteerable or at the very least, send you scrambling for the emergency 
> tiller.  And remember, this wouldn’t happen when the conditions are nice and 
> smooth with 2’ seas and a mild breeze.
> It would happen when the winds were blowing 30+ and you’re getting green 
> water over the foredeck…
>  
> As much as I dislike wheel pilots, even if my boat was larger than the 
> recommended size for the pilot,  it would be safer to use a wheel pilot and 
> have it disengage when the steering loads became too great than to simply 
> bolt the ram to a radial drive wheel and risk the drive wheel cracking when 
> the loads became more severe.  
> At Edson, I never liked using the words “steering” and “failure” in the same 
> sentence…
> Chuck Gilchrest
> S/V Half Magic
> 1983 LF 35
> Padanaram, MA

___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Fwd: Questions asked by Banff Park tourists

[Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List]

People ask my family in New Mexico if they need current passports to visit 
(from the other 49 states).
Joe
Coquina

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Bmue via 
CnC-List
Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2016 13:35
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Bmue
Subject: Re: Stus-List Fwd: Questions asked by Banff Park tourists

Don't think that's what he meant...a) anyone owning a C has provided evidence 
of some smarts already ,maybe it's  merely suggestions for how to behave "in 
character" whenever you come up here  so the Canadians don't get confused.


 Original message 
From: "Ronald B. Frerker via CnC-List" 
>
Date:31-05-2016 11:21 (GMT-07:00)
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: "Ronald B. Frerker" >
Subject: Re: Stus-List Fwd: Questions asked by Banff Park tourists
What are you suggesting?  Smart Americans don't visit Canada???
Ron



From: ALAN BERGEN via CnC-List 
>
To: "cnc-list-requ...@cnc-list.com" 
>
Cc: ALAN BERGEN >
Sent: Monday, May 30, 2016 8:06 PM
Subject: Stus-List Fwd: Questions asked by Banff Park tourists


Here's something for everyone to think about - especially Americans on the list 
who might be planning a trip to Canada.

Dumbest Questions Asked by Banff Park Tourists submitted by Kurt Mezger
1. How do the elk know they're supposed to cross at the "Elk Crossing" signs?
2. At what elevation does an elk become a moose?
3. Tourist: "How do you pronounce 'Elk'?"
Park Information Staff: " 'Elk' "
Tourist: "Oh".
4. Are the bears with collars tame?
5. Is there anywhere I can see the bears pose?
6. Is it okay to keep an open bag of bacon on the picnic table, or should I 
store it in my tent?
7. Where can I find Alpine Flamingos?
8. I saw an animal on the way to Banff today - could you tell me what it was?
9. Are there birds in Canada?
10. Did I miss the turnoff for Canada?
11. Where does Alberta end and Canada begin?
12. Do you have a map of the State of Jasper?
13. Is this the part of Canada that speaks French, or is that Saskatchewan?
14. If I go to B.C., do I have to go through Ontario?
15. Which is the way to the Columbia Ricefields?
16. How far is Banff from Canada?
 17. What's the best way to see Canada in a day?
18. Do they search you at the B.C. border?
19. When we enter B.C. do we have to convert our money to British pounds?
20. Where can I buy a raccoon hat? ALL Canadians own one, don't they?
21. Are there phones in Banff?
22. So it's eight kilometres away... is that in miles?
23. We're on the decibel system you know.
24. Where can I get my husband really, REALLY, lost??
25. Is that two kilometres by foot or by car?
26. Don't you Canadians know anything?
27. Where do you put the animals at night?
28. Tourist: "How do you get your lakes so blue?"
  Park staff: "We take the water out in the winter and paint the bottom."
  Tourist: "Oh!










___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Installing linear autohelm on LF38

[Chuck Gilchrest via CnC-List]

Bob (and other LF 38 folks),

As I don’t have immediate access to Edson’s steering parts data base, can you 
tell me if the Landfall 38 uses a radial drive wheel (full circle) or quadrant 
(like a slice of pizza) shaped rudder to cable attachment?  Two somewhat 
different animals that basically do the same thing, however, Edson’s quadrants 
are bronze while the radial drive wheels are aluminum.  In autopilot tiller arm 
installations that are “challenging” due to available space,   there are a few 
nifty methods of reinforcing a quadrant (the bronze thing) using 2 transverse 
pieces of ¼”x 1” wide stainless that would set in the gap inside the triangular 
opening in the quadrant, one above and one below the bronze webbing that keeps 
the quadrant from twisting.   The steel pieces would bolt to that webbing.  The 
linear drive ram would attach to that piece of steel providing a contact point 
at around 8” or so from the rudder post as per Raymarine’s instructions.

 

Radial drives are harder to properly re-inforce at a single contact point, 
partially due to the thin metal and also because the radial is dished and won’t 
be at 90 degrees to the angle of the rudderpost (and as such with the throw of 
the ram).   They also have reinforcing ribs designed to bear the loads at the 
circumference.   However, if a single point attachment on a radial drive is the 
LAST RESORT, you could cut two 2” “donuts” from aluminum that would sit above 
and below the radial (taking care to not foul the take up eyes and cables), and 
either weld the donuts in place (preferable) or bond them using epoxy to the 
radial prior to drilling the radial for the ram mounting bolt.  In this manner, 
you’re spreading the load of the attachment pin where it passes through the 
radial, plus you are giving the radial a bit of lateral structure when the ram 
is fixed to a single post that sits up from its surface.

 

The reason most tiller arm installations are best done with a tiller arm with a 
hollow channel that accepts the rose joint (ball joint) end of the ram INSIDE 
the tiller arm is to support the forces placed on the arm by a structure both 
above and below the ram.  If torque is applied to an pin (or bolt) that sits 90 
degrees from a horizontal platform (radial or otherwise), the entire load is 
being borne by the single attachment point below the joint.

Perhaps the structure you’ve built to support the ram is sufficiently rigid and 
in line with your “quadrant” to prevent any twisting motion in a seaway, but 
I’ve seen plenty of bent or broken tiller arm pins (and even a few twisted 
tiller arms), where there was so much force applied by the ram to a single 
po.int attachment that the system failed or even worse, jammed.  If enough 
force is applied, a bronze tiller arm (or quadrant) will initially bend and 
then tear.  An aluminum radial drive will simply fracture and break.  Neither 
is ideal but a broken radial drive wheel could render the boat unsteerable or 
at the very least, send you scrambling for the emergency tiller.  And remember, 
this wouldn’t happen when the conditions are nice and smooth with 2’ seas and a 
mild breeze.

It would happen when the winds were blowing 30+ and you’re getting green water 
over the foredeck…

 

As much as I dislike wheel pilots, even if my boat was larger than the 
recommended size for the pilot,  it would be safer to use a wheel pilot and 
have it disengage when the steering loads became too great than to simply bolt 
the ram to a radial drive wheel and risk the drive wheel cracking when the 
loads became more severe.  

At Edson, I never liked using the words “steering” and “failure” in the same 
sentence…

Chuck Gilchrest

S/V Half Magic

1983 LF 35

Padanaram, MA

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Persuasi  
on37 via CnC-List 
Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2016 12:19 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Persuasion37 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Installing linear autohelm on LF38

 

Make that 2 data points.  That is how mine is attached. I think it was 
installed in ‘98.  Two trips to the Bahamas (one PO) no issues with quadrant.  
I would be curious how it would be installed otherwise.

 

Miketi
S/V Persuasion
C 37 Keel/CB
Long Sault

 

From:   Robert Boyer via CnC-List 

Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2016 12:12 PM

To:   cnc-list@cnc-list.com 

Cc:   Robert Boyer 

Subject: Re: Stus-List Installing linear autohelm on LF38

 

Mine is attached to the quadrant and it has been working fine for about 10 
years now.   I realize that is only one data point.  The attachment point can 
only see the load that is resisted by the rudder, which at most times is small.

Bob Boyer 

s/v Rainy Days

C Landfall 38 (Hull # 230)

Annapolis, MD (presently in Baltimore)

blog:   dainyrays.blogspot.com

email:   

Re: Stus-List Fwd: Questions asked by Banff Park tourists

[Bmue via CnC-List]

Don't think that's what he meant...a) anyone owning a C has provided evidence 
of some smarts already ,maybe it's  merely suggestions for how to behave "in 
character" whenever you come up here  so the Canadians don't get confused. 


 Original message 
From: "Ronald B. Frerker via CnC-List"  
Date:31-05-2016  11:21  (GMT-07:00) 
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
Cc: "Ronald B. Frerker"  
Subject: Re: Stus-List Fwd: Questions asked by Banff Park tourists 

What are you suggesting?  Smart Americans don't visit Canada???
Ron



From: ALAN BERGEN via CnC-List 
To: "cnc-list-requ...@cnc-list.com"  
Cc: ALAN BERGEN 
Sent: Monday, May 30, 2016 8:06 PM
Subject: Stus-List Fwd: Questions asked by Banff Park tourists


Here's something for everyone to think about - especially Americans on the list 
who might be planning a trip to Canada.


Dumbest Questions Asked by Banff Park Tourists submitted by Kurt Mezger
1. How do the elk know they're supposed to cross at the "Elk Crossing" signs?
2. At what elevation does an elk become a moose?
3. Tourist: "How do you pronounce 'Elk'?"
  Park Information Staff: " 'Elk' "
  Tourist: "Oh".
4. Are the bears with collars tame?
5. Is there anywhere I can see the bears pose?
6. Is it okay to keep an open bag of bacon on the picnic table, or should I 
store it in my tent?
7. Where can I find Alpine Flamingos?
8. I saw an animal on the way to Banff today - could you tell me what it was?
9. Are there birds in Canada?
10. Did I miss the turnoff for Canada?
11. Where does Alberta end and Canada begin?
12. Do you have a map of the State of Jasper?
13. Is this the part of Canada that speaks French, or is that Saskatchewan?
14. If I go to B.C., do I have to go through Ontario?
15. Which is the way to the Columbia Ricefields?
16. How far is Banff from Canada?
 17. What's the best way to see Canada in a day?
18. Do they search you at the B.C. border?
19. When we enter B.C. do we have to convert our money to British pounds?
20. Where can I buy a raccoon hat? ALL Canadians own one, don't they?
21. Are there phones in Banff?
22. So it's eight kilometres away... is that in miles?
23. We're on the decibel system you know.
24. Where can I get my husband really, REALLY, lost??
25. Is that two kilometres by foot or by car?
26. Don't you Canadians know anything?
27. Where do you put the animals at night?
28. Tourist: "How do you get your lakes so blue?"
  Park staff: "We take the water out in the winter and paint the bottom."
  Tourist: "Oh!
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 


___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!


___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Fwd: Questions asked by Banff Park tourists

[Ronald B. Frerker via CnC-List]

What are you suggesting?  Smart Americans don't visit Canada???Ron


  From: ALAN BERGEN via CnC-List 
 To: "cnc-list-requ...@cnc-list.com"  
Cc: ALAN BERGEN 
 Sent: Monday, May 30, 2016 8:06 PM
 Subject: Stus-List Fwd: Questions asked by Banff Park tourists
   

Here's something for everyone to think about - especially Americans on the list 
who might be planning a trip to Canada.





Dumbest Questions Asked by Banff Park Tourists submitted by Kurt Mezger

1. How do the elk know they're supposed to cross at the "Elk Crossing" signs?2. 
At what elevation does an elk become a moose?3. Tourist: "How do you pronounce 
'Elk'?" 
    Park Information Staff: " 'Elk' " 
    Tourist: "Oh".4. Are the bears with collars tame?5. Is there anywhere I can 
see the bears pose?6. Is it okay to keep an open bag of bacon on the picnic 
table, or should I store it in my tent?7. Where can I find Alpine Flamingos?8. 
I saw an animal on the way to Banff today - could you tell me what it was?9. 
Are there birds in Canada?10. Did I miss the turnoff for Canada?11. Where does 
Alberta end and Canada begin?12. Do you have a map of the State of Jasper?13. 
Is this the part of Canada that speaks French, or is that Saskatchewan?14. If I 
go to B.C., do I have to go through Ontario?15. Which is the way to the 
Columbia Ricefields?16. How far is Banff from Canada? 17. What's the best way 
to see Canada in a day?18. Do they search you at the B.C. border?19. When we 
enter B.C. do we have to convert our money to British pounds?20. Where can I 
buy a raccoon hat? ALL Canadians own one, don't they?21. Are there phones in 
Banff?22. So it's eight kilometres away... is that in miles?23. We're on the 
decibel system you know.24. Where can I get my husband really, REALLY, 
lost??25. Is that two kilometres by foot or by car?26. Don't you Canadians know 
anything?27. Where do you put the animals at night?28. Tourist: "How do you get 
your lakes so blue?" 
  Park staff: "We take the water out in the winter and paint the bottom."
  Tourist: "Oh!
 


 
  

___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!


  ___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Installing linear autohelm on LF38

[Frederick G Street via CnC-List]

Chuck and all — the steering configuration belowdecks on the Landfall 38s 
cannot support a tiller arm.  The quadrant is directly below the cockpit sole, 
and directly above the fuel tank.  There simply is no room for anything on the 
rudder post.  Wal Bryant got a good photo of this area when he redid his 
steering system; I’ve taken the liberty (thanks, Wal!) of reposting one of his 
photos on my web server at www.postaudio.net/webserver/LF38steering.jpg.  
Looking past the smiley face that Wal spray-painted on his new fuel tank, you 
can see just how tight everything is back there.

In virtually all of the autopilot installations I’ve seen where the drive is 
attached directly to the quadrant, the attachment has been strengthened with 
metal plates on one or both sides of the quadrant wheel; this includes Bob 
Boyer’s setup, which he emailed me photos of.  Bob, I hope it’s okay for me to 
take the liberty again of posting one of these photos at 
http://www.postaudio.net/webserver/LF38steering2.jpg.

And Chuck, yes I have been involved in using Octopus hydraulic linear drives in 
autopilot installations; I like their tough dependability and strength, and the 
fact that they only have a few moving parts.  One of their downsides in limited 
spaces, though, is the fact that the actuator rod sticks out the back of the 
drive a fair amount when the drive is at the short limit of travel; this can 
cause issues with structure nearby, limiting where and how you can mount the 
drive.

In any case, there simply isn’t a good spot (really, ANY spot) to mount a 
tiller arm on the LF38.

— Fred

Fred Street -- Minneapolis
S/V Oceanis (1979 C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI

> On May 31, 2016, at 9:50 AM, Chuck Gilchrest via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> David,
> You are spot on with that assessment.  Aluminum Radial drive wheels in 
> particular are cast so that the steering loads are carried tangentially along 
> the outer edge of the wheel (in the groove).  Drilling a hole in the casting 
> 90 degrees from the designed load plane and through bolting an attachment 
> point for a linear drive wheel will likely result in the cast wheel 
> fracturing under serious loads.  If the radial was to break, you would lose 
> both your autopilot AND the cable steering.
> I have seen several autopilot installations (not on LF 38 mind you) in 
> confined spaces using an Octopus drive and 8" tiller arms.  Perhaps that 
> could be an option.  Maybe Fred may have experience with those regarding  
> compatibility with different control heads...
> Chuck Gilchrest 
> S/V Half Magic
> 1983 LF 35
> Padanaram MA
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On May 31, 2016, at 9:59 AM, David via CnC-List  > wrote:
> 
>> It is my understanding that attaching a ram directly to a quadrant is not 
>> recommended by Edson etc.   Quadrants are not engineered for those point 
>> loads.
>> 
>> Chuck?
>> 
>> David F. Risch
>> 1981 40-2
>> (401) 419-4650 (cell)
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Stripping Cabin Sole

[Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List]

John

One caution.  The veneer on newer Teak and Holly marine plywood is extremely 
thin.  Be careful not to do much if any sanding along with this

Mike

Persistence
Halifax, NS

-Original Message-
From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of John Pennie 
via CnC-List
Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2016 1:36 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: John Pennie
Subject: Stus-List Stripping Cabin Sole

Has anyone used a water based paint stripper to remove varnish from the cabin 
sole?  I’m going to have to refinish them in place so I’m concerned about any 
stripper that might seep through and end up in the bilge. Lots of plastic stuff 
down there that may not react too well.

John


___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Stripping Cabin Sole

[Ron Ricci via CnC-List]

John,

I've refinished several pieces of my cabin sole by removing them and doing it 
in my workshop.  Removal is easy.   It allowed me to clean and seal the edges 
and the underside.  I also was able to repair places where the teak edging tape 
had broken off.  It was well worth the minimal extra effort.

Just my two cents.

Ron

-Original Message-
From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of John Pennie 
via CnC-List
Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2016 12:36 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: John Pennie
Subject: Stus-List Stripping Cabin Sole

Has anyone used a water based paint stripper to remove varnish from the cabin 
sole?  I’m going to have to refinish them in place so I’m concerned about any 
stripper that might seep through and end up in the bilge. Lots of plastic stuff 
down there that may not react too well.

John


___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!


___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Stripping Cabin Sole

[Joel Aronson via CnC-List]

I used CitriStrip, but not in place.  It is about the consistency of
pudding.  It will get between the boards, but the ooze into the bilge would
be minimal.

Joel

On Tue, May 31, 2016 at 12:36 PM, John Pennie via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Has anyone used a water based paint stripper to remove varnish from the
> cabin sole?  I’m going to have to refinish them in place so I’m concerned
> about any stripper that might seep through and end up in the bilge. Lots of
> plastic stuff down there that may not react too well.
>
> John
>
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All
> Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>



-- 
Joel
301 541 8551
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Installing linear autohelm on LF38

[Dave Godwin via CnC-List]

Also, too: I realized that the pictures do not show it but the important point 
is that the drive arm is attached to a bronze tiller arm 
 
from Edson. As I seem to recall, the arm is secured by a 1/4” S.S. key slotted 
into the rudder shaft.

Best,
Dave Godwin
1982 C 37 - Ronin
Reedville - Chesapeake Bay
Ronin’s Overdue Refit 
> On May 31, 2016, at 12:31 PM, Dave Godwin  wrote:
> 
> Mike,
> 
> I did mine which is the same as your boat but not a LF38, this way 
> .
> 
> Best
> Dave Godwin
> 1982 C 37 - Ronin
> Reedville - Chesapeake Bay
> Ronin’s Overdue Refit 
>> On May 31, 2016, at 12:19 PM, Persuasion37 via CnC-List 
>> > wrote:
>> 
>> Make that 2 data points.  That is how mine is attached. I think it was 
>> installed in ‘98.  Two trips to the Bahamas (one PO) no issues with 
>> quadrant.  I would be curious how it would be installed otherwise.
>>  
>> Mike
>> S/V Persuasion
>> C 37 Keel/CB
>> Long Sault
>>  
>> From: Robert Boyer via CnC-List 
>> Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2016 12:12 PM
>> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
>> Cc: Robert Boyer 
>> Subject: Re: Stus-List Installing linear autohelm on LF38
>>  
>> Mine is attached to the quadrant and it has been working fine for about 10 
>> years now.   I realize that is only one data point.  The attachment point 
>> can only see the load that is resisted by the rudder, which at most times is 
>> small.
>> 
>> Bob Boyer 
>> s/v Rainy Days
>> C Landfall 38 (Hull # 230)
>> Annapolis, MD (presently in Baltimore)
>> blog: dainyrays.blogspot.com 
>> email: dainyr...@icloud.com 
>> 
>> On May 31, 2016, at 9:59 AM, David via CnC-List > > wrote:
>> 
>>> It is my understanding that attaching a ram directly to a quadrant is not 
>>> recommended by Edson etc.   Quadrants are not engineered for those point 
>>> loads.
>>> 
>>> Chuck?
>>> 
>>> David F. Risch
>>> 1981 40-2
>>> (401) 419-4650 (cell)
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Date: Sun, 29 May 2016 20:36:36 -0500
>>> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
>>> Subject: Re: Stus-List Installing linear autohelm on LF38
>>> From: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
>>> CC: f...@postaudio.net 
>>> 
>>> Jason — there is absolutely no room for a tiller arm on the LF38; you need 
>>> to attach the ram directly to the quadrant, at the proper distance from the 
>>> center of the rudder post for the drive you got.  One option is to orient 
>>> the ram forward to aft, on the port side of the rudder post (access via the 
>>> port quarter berth access hatch).  Otherwise, about your only other option 
>>> is to have the ram oriented athwartship, forward of the rudder post, with 
>>> the access through the cockpit locker. 
>>>  
>>> There are no easy steering system jobs on the LF38.
>>>  
>>> — Fred
>>> 
>>> Fred Street -- Minneapolis
>>> S/V Oceanis (1979 C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI
>>>  
 On May 29, 2016, at 8:32 PM, Jason & Amanda Ward via CnC-List 
 > wrote:
  
 Good Day Everyone.  Now that the sailing season is upon us life is good 
 again.  Life would be even better if I was able to use my autohelm.  I 
 have purchased an Raymarine EV200 linear drive unit and am trying to 
 figure out how to install it below deck.  As all C owners know there is 
 very little room at the best of times and it appears that when they made 
 the LF38, autohelm was never even a consideration.
  
 I was wondering if there are any other LF owners out there that have 
 successfully installed a linear below deck drive that would be willing to 
 pass on their installation process.  Photos would also be appreciated.
  
 Life is good on a boat, even when you are fixing her.
  
 Good sailing and hope to talk soon.
  
 Jason
 Starship LF38
 Lake Winnipeg, Manitoba
>>> 
>>>  
>>> 
>>> ___ This list is supported by 
>>> the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help 
>>> us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>>> 
>>>  
>>> 
>>> Virus-free. www.avast.com 
>>> ___
>>> 
>>> This list is supported by the generous donations of 

Stus-List Stripping Cabin Sole

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Has anyone used a water based paint stripper to remove varnish from the cabin 
sole?  I’m going to have to refinish them in place so I’m concerned about any 
stripper that might seep through and end up in the bilge. Lots of plastic stuff 
down there that may not react too well.

John


___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Installing linear autohelm on LF38

[Dave Godwin via CnC-List]

Mike,

I did mine which is the same as your boat but not a LF38, this way 
.

Best
Dave Godwin
1982 C 37 - Ronin
Reedville - Chesapeake Bay
Ronin’s Overdue Refit 
> On May 31, 2016, at 12:19 PM, Persuasion37 via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Make that 2 data points.  That is how mine is attached. I think it was 
> installed in ‘98.  Two trips to the Bahamas (one PO) no issues with quadrant. 
>  I would be curious how it would be installed otherwise.
>  
> Mike
> S/V Persuasion
> C 37 Keel/CB
> Long Sault
>  
> From: Robert Boyer via CnC-List 
> Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2016 12:12 PM
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
> Cc: Robert Boyer 
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Installing linear autohelm on LF38
>  
> Mine is attached to the quadrant and it has been working fine for about 10 
> years now.   I realize that is only one data point.  The attachment point can 
> only see the load that is resisted by the rudder, which at most times is 
> small.
> 
> Bob Boyer 
> s/v Rainy Days
> C Landfall 38 (Hull # 230)
> Annapolis, MD (presently in Baltimore)
> blog: dainyrays.blogspot.com 
> email: dainyr...@icloud.com 
> 
> On May 31, 2016, at 9:59 AM, David via CnC-List  > wrote:
> 
>> It is my understanding that attaching a ram directly to a quadrant is not 
>> recommended by Edson etc.   Quadrants are not engineered for those point 
>> loads.
>> 
>> Chuck?
>> 
>> David F. Risch
>> 1981 40-2
>> (401) 419-4650 (cell)
>> 
>> 
>> Date: Sun, 29 May 2016 20:36:36 -0500
>> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
>> Subject: Re: Stus-List Installing linear autohelm on LF38
>> From: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
>> CC: f...@postaudio.net 
>> 
>> Jason — there is absolutely no room for a tiller arm on the LF38; you need 
>> to attach the ram directly to the quadrant, at the proper distance from the 
>> center of the rudder post for the drive you got.  One option is to orient 
>> the ram forward to aft, on the port side of the rudder post (access via the 
>> port quarter berth access hatch).  Otherwise, about your only other option 
>> is to have the ram oriented athwartship, forward of the rudder post, with 
>> the access through the cockpit locker. 
>>  
>> There are no easy steering system jobs on the LF38.
>>  
>> — Fred
>> 
>> Fred Street -- Minneapolis
>> S/V Oceanis (1979 C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI
>>  
>>> On May 29, 2016, at 8:32 PM, Jason & Amanda Ward via CnC-List 
>>> > wrote:
>>>  
>>> Good Day Everyone.  Now that the sailing season is upon us life is good 
>>> again.  Life would be even better if I was able to use my autohelm.  I have 
>>> purchased an Raymarine EV200 linear drive unit and am trying to figure out 
>>> how to install it below deck.  As all C owners know there is very little 
>>> room at the best of times and it appears that when they made the LF38, 
>>> autohelm was never even a consideration.
>>>  
>>> I was wondering if there are any other LF owners out there that have 
>>> successfully installed a linear below deck drive that would be willing to 
>>> pass on their installation process.  Photos would also be appreciated.
>>>  
>>> Life is good on a boat, even when you are fixing her.
>>>  
>>> Good sailing and hope to talk soon.
>>>  
>>> Jason
>>> Starship LF38
>>> Lake Winnipeg, Manitoba
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> ___ This list is supported by 
>> the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help 
>> us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>> 
>>  
>> 
>>  Virus-free. www.avast.com 
>> ___
>> 
>> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
>> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
>> are greatly appreciated!
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!

___

Re: Stus-List Installing linear autohelm on LF38

[Persuasion37 via CnC-List]

Make that 2 data points.  That is how mine is attached. I think it was 
installed in ‘98.  Two trips to the Bahamas (one PO) no issues with quadrant.  
I would be curious how it would be installed otherwise.

Mike
S/V Persuasion
C 37 Keel/CB
Long Sault

From: Robert Boyer via CnC-List 
Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2016 12:12 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
Cc: Robert Boyer 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Installing linear autohelm on LF38

Mine is attached to the quadrant and it has been working fine for about 10 
years now.   I realize that is only one data point.  The attachment point can 
only see the load that is resisted by the rudder, which at most times is small.

Bob Boyer 
s/v Rainy Days
C Landfall 38 (Hull # 230)
Annapolis, MD (presently in Baltimore)
blog: dainyrays.blogspot.com
email: dainyr...@icloud.com

On May 31, 2016, at 9:59 AM, David via CnC-List  wrote:


  It is my understanding that attaching a ram directly to a quadrant is not 
recommended by Edson etc.   Quadrants are not engineered for those point loads.

  Chuck?

  David F. Risch
  1981 40-2
  (401) 419-4650 (cell)




--
  Date: Sun, 29 May 2016 20:36:36 -0500
  To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
  Subject: Re: Stus-List Installing linear autohelm on LF38
  From: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
  CC: f...@postaudio.net

  Jason — there is absolutely no room for a tiller arm on the LF38; you need to 
attach the ram directly to the quadrant, at the proper distance from the center 
of the rudder post for the drive you got.  One option is to orient the ram 
forward to aft, on the port side of the rudder post (access via the port 
quarter berth access hatch).  Otherwise, about your only other option is to 
have the ram oriented athwartship, forward of the rudder post, with the access 
through the cockpit locker. 

  There are no easy steering system jobs on the LF38.

  — Fred


  Fred Street -- Minneapolis
  S/V Oceanis (1979 C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI

On May 29, 2016, at 8:32 PM, Jason & Amanda Ward via CnC-List 
 wrote:

Good Day Everyone.  Now that the sailing season is upon us life is good 
again.  Life would be even better if I was able to use my autohelm.  I have 
purchased an Raymarine EV200 linear drive unit and am trying to figure out how 
to install it below deck.  As all C owners know there is very little room at 
the best of times and it appears that when they made the LF38, autohelm was 
never even a consideration.

I was wondering if there are any other LF owners out there that have 
successfully installed a linear below deck drive that would be willing to pass 
on their installation process.  Photos would also be appreciated.

Life is good on a boat, even when you are fixing her.

Good sailing and hope to talk soon.

Jason
Starship LF38
Lake Winnipeg, Manitoba


  ___ This list is supported by the 
generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay 
for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

   Virus-free. www.avast.com  

  ___

  This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!




___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Installing linear autohelm on LF38

[Robert Boyer via CnC-List]

Mine is attached to the quadrant and it has been working fine for about 10 
years now.   I realize that is only one data point.  The attachment point can 
only see the load that is resisted by the rudder, which at most times is small.

Bob Boyer
s/v Rainy Days
C Landfall 38 (Hull # 230)
Annapolis, MD (presently in Baltimore)
blog: dainyrays.blogspot.com
email: dainyr...@icloud.com

> On May 31, 2016, at 9:59 AM, David via CnC-List  wrote:
> 
> It is my understanding that attaching a ram directly to a quadrant is not 
> recommended by Edson etc.   Quadrants are not engineered for those point 
> loads.
> 
> Chuck?
> 
> David F. Risch
> 1981 40-2
> (401) 419-4650 (cell)
> 
> 
> Date: Sun, 29 May 2016 20:36:36 -0500
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Installing linear autohelm on LF38
> From: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> CC: f...@postaudio.net
> 
> Jason — there is absolutely no room for a tiller arm on the LF38; you need to 
> attach the ram directly to the quadrant, at the proper distance from the 
> center of the rudder post for the drive you got.  One option is to orient the 
> ram forward to aft, on the port side of the rudder post (access via the port 
> quarter berth access hatch).  Otherwise, about your only other option is to 
> have the ram oriented athwartship, forward of the rudder post, with the 
> access through the cockpit locker.
> 
> There are no easy steering system jobs on the LF38.
> 
> — Fred
> 
> Fred Street -- Minneapolis
> S/V Oceanis (1979 C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI
> 
> On May 29, 2016, at 8:32 PM, Jason & Amanda Ward via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Good Day Everyone.  Now that the sailing season is upon us life is good 
> again.  Life would be even better if I was able to use my autohelm.  I have 
> purchased an Raymarine EV200 linear drive unit and am trying to figure out 
> how to install it below deck.  As all C owners know there is very little 
> room at the best of times and it appears that when they made the LF38, 
> autohelm was never even a consideration.
>  
> I was wondering if there are any other LF owners out there that have 
> successfully installed a linear below deck drive that would be willing to 
> pass on their installation process.  Photos would also be appreciated.
>  
> Life is good on a boat, even when you are fixing her.
>  
> Good sailing and hope to talk soon.
>  
> Jason
> Starship LF38
> Lake Winnipeg, Manitoba
> 
> 
> ___ This list is supported by the 
> generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay 
> for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
> 
>   Virus-free. www.avast.com
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Installing linear autohelm on LF38

[Chuck Gilchrest via CnC-List]

David,
You are spot on with that assessment.  Aluminum Radial drive wheels in 
particular are cast so that the steering loads are carried tangentially along 
the outer edge of the wheel (in the groove).  Drilling a hole in the casting 90 
degrees from the designed load plane and through bolting an attachment point 
for a linear drive wheel will likely result in the cast wheel fracturing under 
serious loads.  If the radial was to break, you would lose both your autopilot 
AND the cable steering.
I have seen several autopilot installations (not on LF 38 mind you) in confined 
spaces using an Octopus drive and 8" tiller arms.  Perhaps that could be an 
option.  Maybe Fred may have experience with those regarding  compatibility 
with different control heads...
Chuck Gilchrest 
S/V Half Magic
1983 LF 35
Padanaram MA

Sent from my iPhone

> On May 31, 2016, at 9:59 AM, David via CnC-List  wrote:
> 
> It is my understanding that attaching a ram directly to a quadrant is not 
> recommended by Edson etc.   Quadrants are not engineered for those point 
> loads.
> 
> Chuck?
> 
> David F. Risch
> 1981 40-2
> (401) 419-4650 (cell)
> 
> 
> Date: Sun, 29 May 2016 20:36:36 -0500
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Installing linear autohelm on LF38
> From: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> CC: f...@postaudio.net
> 
> Jason — there is absolutely no room for a tiller arm on the LF38; you need to 
> attach the ram directly to the quadrant, at the proper distance from the 
> center of the rudder post for the drive you got.  One option is to orient the 
> ram forward to aft, on the port side of the rudder post (access via the port 
> quarter berth access hatch).  Otherwise, about your only other option is to 
> have the ram oriented athwartship, forward of the rudder post, with the 
> access through the cockpit locker.
> 
> There are no easy steering system jobs on the LF38.
> 
> — Fred
> 
> Fred Street -- Minneapolis
> S/V Oceanis (1979 C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI
> 
> On May 29, 2016, at 8:32 PM, Jason & Amanda Ward via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Good Day Everyone.  Now that the sailing season is upon us life is good 
> again.  Life would be even better if I was able to use my autohelm.  I have 
> purchased an Raymarine EV200 linear drive unit and am trying to figure out 
> how to install it below deck.  As all C owners know there is very little 
> room at the best of times and it appears that when they made the LF38, 
> autohelm was never even a consideration.
>  
> I was wondering if there are any other LF owners out there that have 
> successfully installed a linear below deck drive that would be willing to 
> pass on their installation process.  Photos would also be appreciated.
>  
> Life is good on a boat, even when you are fixing her.
>  
> Good sailing and hope to talk soon.
>  
> Jason
> Starship LF38
> Lake Winnipeg, Manitoba
> 
> 
> ___ This list is supported by the 
> generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help us pay 
> for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
> 
>   Virus-free. www.avast.com
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Stus-List mast collar tangs C& C 33-2

[robert via CnC-List]

The mast collar tangs are always to be installed 'before' the rig is 
tensioned..that's the reason for the 'tangs' in the first 
place..to keep the deck from rising.


Rob Abbott
AZURA
C 32 - 84
Halifax, N.S.

On 2016-05-31 7:17 AM, Persuasion37 via CnC-List wrote:

Hi Doug.

On my 37 I cannot install the bolts if I tune the mast first.  I've 
done this a couple of times now and the only thing to do is loosen 
everything, install the bolts and re-tune.


Mike
C 37
Long Sault

Sent from my iPad

On May 30, 2016, at 8:05 PM, doug.welch--- via CnC-List 
> wrote:


When I was rigging my new to me 33-2 we couldn't locate one of the 
the mast collar tangs so I had a friend fabricate a duplicate. Both 
are now misaligned and the holes are about 1/4 inch too high to slip 
the bolt in (the boat is fully rigged). My friends have different 
opinions on this.  One says release the rigging and the tangs will 
slightly deform the cabin top when we reset the mast. Another days 
remake the tangs so the bolts line up with jokes in the mast when 
it's fully rigged. Looking for help from you folks.



Cheers,
Doug

Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android 


___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If 
you like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. 
All Contributions are greatly appreciated!



___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!


___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Installing linear autohelm on LF38

[David via CnC-List]

It is my understanding that attaching a ram directly to a quadrant is not 
recommended by Edson etc.   Quadrants are not engineered for those point loads.

Chuck?

David F. Risch
1981 40-2
(401) 419-4650 (cell)


Date: Sun, 29 May 2016 20:36:36 -0500
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Subject: Re: Stus-List Installing linear autohelm on LF38
From: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
CC: f...@postaudio.net

Jason — there is absolutely no room for a tiller arm on the LF38; you need to 
attach the ram directly to the quadrant, at the proper distance from the center 
of the rudder post for the drive you got.  One option is to orient the ram 
forward to aft, on the port side of the rudder post (access via the port 
quarter berth access hatch).  Otherwise, about your only other option is to 
have the ram oriented athwartship, forward of the rudder post, with the access 
through the cockpit locker.
There are no easy steering system jobs on the LF38.
— Fred

Fred Street -- Minneapolis
S/V Oceanis (1979 C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI


On May 29, 2016, at 8:32 PM, Jason & Amanda Ward via CnC-List 
 wrote:Good Day Everyone.  Now that the sailing season 
is upon us life is good again.  Life would be even better if I was able to use 
my autohelm.  I have purchased an Raymarine EV200 linear drive unit and am 
trying to figure out how to install it below deck.  As all C owners know 
there is very little room at the best of times and it appears that when they 
made the LF38, autohelm was never even a consideration. I was wondering if 
there are any other LF owners out there that have successfully installed a 
linear below deck drive that would be willing to pass on their installation 
process.  Photos would also be appreciated. Life is good on a boat, even when 
you are fixing her. Good sailing and hope to talk soon. JasonStarship LF38Lake 
Winnipeg, Manitoba

___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!



Virus-free. www.avast.com


  ___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List mast collar tangs C& C 33-2

[Stevan Plavsa via CnC-List]

Yeah, I made the mistake of forgetting the tangs one year when stepping. I
loosened up all the rigging and actually had to Macguyver a rig using tie
down straps and I forget what else to bring the cabin top down a few mm for
the bolt to clear.
Not making that mistake again.
It sounds like one tang is longer than the other? If they are identical
then you shouldn't have to do more than what's been recommended so far.
However, if they are not identical I would have another one fabricated to
be identical to your existing tang.

Steve
Suhana, C 32
Toronto


On Tue, May 31, 2016 at 6:17 AM, Persuasion37 via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Hi Doug.
>
> On my 37 I cannot install the bolts if I tune the mast first.  I've done
> this a couple of times now and the only thing to do is loosen everything,
> install the bolts and re-tune.
>
> Mike
> C 37
> Long Sault
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On May 30, 2016, at 8:05 PM, doug.welch--- via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
> When I was rigging my new to me 33-2 we couldn't locate one of the the
> mast collar tangs so I had a friend fabricate a duplicate. Both are now
> misaligned and the holes are about 1/4 inch too high to slip the bolt in
> (the boat is fully rigged). My friends have different opinions on this.
> One says release the rigging and the tangs will slightly deform the cabin
> top when we reset the mast. Another days remake the tangs so the bolts line
> up with jokes in the mast when it's fully rigged. Looking for help from you
> folks.
>
>
> Cheers,
> Doug
>
> Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android
> 
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All
> Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All
> Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Overheating YANMAR (Update)

[Sailnomad via CnC-List]

90% of the time, overheating on a yanmar is due to restriction in the
exhaust where the water get injected after the manifold.
Usually it connects to a rubber bellows/hose that can be easily taken out.
Then poke into the exhaust with a large screwdriver and see if you see
flakes of carbon
Ahmet
Winthrop, MA

On Mon, May 30, 2016 at 10:57 PM, Josh Muckley via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> If it was really fouled then he probably would have noticed that it wasn't
> achieving the same thrust to RPM or speed to rpm ratio.  This usually is
> also accompanied by black smoke indicating too much engine load.
>
> I have not heard any reports regarding the condition of the impeller.  I
> have also not heard anything about the intake side of the heat exchanger.
> I'd definitely be checking both of those.  Also the belt on the impeller
> can be difficult to get tight enough to prevent slipping.
>
> You might consider using a garden hose to lightly pressurize the raw water
> system.  You could even do it by shoving the hose up the through-hull from
> outside.  (you'll need the dive gear again)  Then with the boat securely
> tied, load up the engine.
>
> Josh Muckley
> S/V Sea Hawk
> 1989 C 37+
> Solomons, MD
> On May 30, 2016 10:25 PM, "Tim Goodyear via CnC-List" <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
> The 3HM35 has a continuous rating of 3200 rpm with a 1-hour rating higher
> than that, so it is probably worth continuing the hunt for issues (maybe
> around the exhaust water injection?). A properly functioning engine should
> not overheat with load from a few barnacles, should it, or was it really
> fouled?
>
>
> > On May 30, 2016, at 10:14 PM, Tom Buscaglia via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
> >
> > I borrowed a wet suit and regulator from a fellow club member and drove
> the boat (first time!).  Barnacles on prop and shaft came offsite a chisel
> followed by a wire brush.  Aside from poking a wire coat hanger in the
> water intake to the mixing elbo, everything else was the same as those way
> there.
> >
> > We ran all the way back at around 2500 RPM without issue.
> >
> > Guess a crapped up prop can result in overheating problems...Go figure.
> >
> > Tom Buscaglia
> > S/V Alera
> > 1990 C 37+/40
> > Vashon WA
> > P 206.463.9200
> >
> >
> >
> > ___
> >
> > This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All
> Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All
> Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All
> Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Fuel tank

[allen via CnC-List]

Finally resolved fuel tank problem.  I had local vendor Howdy Bailey (Norfolk, 
VA) construct an all new replica out of 3/15 x .160 Marine grade aluminum.

He delivered to Septima Saturday and we maneuvered it down into the aft cabin 
and into its matching tray.  Perfect fit.  We'll hook it up this week after I 
get the material I'm going to use to isolate tank from the tray.

Here's pictures of old tank.  Corrosion begins where tank sat in salty 
condensate. Yes, we drilled a drainage hole to get rid of condensation. 
 
 
 
 
 
Allen Miles
S/V Septima
C 30-2
Hampton, VA




From: allen 
Sent: Sunday, May 22, 2016 5:41 PM
To: Robert Boyer 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Fuel tank


No baffles.  Now that I have to check.  When I had the old diesel removed and 
filtered,  I believe Captain Allen of KleenFuel said that there was/were 
baffles.

I see that Florida Marine listed 1/8" and 1/4" thickness stock in their tanks 
and that 1/4" seems like a wise upgrade.  Good thinking.

Thanks again,

Allen Miles


From: Robert Boyer 
Sent: Sunday, May 22, 2016 3:45 PM
To: allen 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Fuel tank


My tank was also 0.090 inches thick.  I made the replacement tank 1/4 inch 
thick because I never want to change out the tank again!  My tank was built in 
1983, same as my boat.  My tank had NO baffles.


Bob

Bob Boyer 
s/v Rainy Days
C Landfall 38 (Hull # 230)
Annapolis, MD (presently in Baltimore)
blog: dainyrays.blogspot.com
email: dainyr...@icloud.com

On May 22, 2016, at 3:38 PM, allen  wrote:


  Actually Bob my tank has a sticker saying Woodstock Rainbow Mfg of Woodstock 
Ontario made the tank. The phone number listed is now a fax line. The plate 
says they used .091 gauge aluminum back in 02/89.  What I don't know yet is the 
depth and bottom shape of model 1219 model A nor internal baffles, etc.  The 
tray that carried the tank was shallow outboard and deeper inboard.  That seems 
to rule out most of the tanks suggested so far.

  Thanks for the suggestions.

  Allen
  s/v Septima
  C 30-2




  From: Robert Boyer 
  Sent: Saturday, May 21, 2016 11:25 AM
  To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
  Cc: allen 
  Subject: Re: Stus-List Fuel tank


  Florida marine tanks made the original & have the drawings.  They produce 
them fairly quickly too.


  Bob

  Bob Boyer 
  S/V Rainy Days (1983 C Landfall 38 - Hull #230)
  Blog: dainyrays.blogspot.com
  Email: dainyr...@icloud.com
  Annapolis, MD (presently in Baltimore)

  On May 21, 2016, at 10:32 AM, allen via CnC-List  
wrote:


Septima's aluminum 18 gallon fuel tank is shot.  Before I have one 
fabricated locally, do we know of any source that might stock NOS?  
SouthShoreYachts didn't list any.

Allen Miles
s/v Septima
C 30-2
Hampton, VA
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you 
like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All 
Contributions are greatly appreciated!
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List 30MkII 1988 galley thru hull size?

[Allan Rheaume via CnC-List]

Lorne thats a huge hole. Currently your galley sink drain is 1 inch. Another 
thing to consider is the height of that thru hull, theres a false bottom in the 
galley cabinet without much room between it and the thru hull. Add to that the 
90 degree elbow that needs to be added to meet the orientation of the drain 
pipe. Have you considered and air cooled unit?
Allan RheaumeDrumroll 30-2 # 90


  From: Lorne Serpa via CnC-List 
 To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
Cc: Lorne Serpa 
 Sent: Monday, May 30, 2016 3:56 PM
 Subject: Stus-List 30MkII 1988 galley thru hull size?
   
Good day.  I'm asking because I just purchased my boat, but it is 2,000 miles 
away.  I want to plan my install before I get there to install it.
I'm about to order a Isotherm 2551 Compact SP water cooled refrigeration system 
in my 1988 C 30MkII ice box.
It uses a kitchen sink thru hull self pumping fitting in place of the galley 
sink drain thru hull.  The instructions for thru hull installation says 
The skin fitting is to be mounted in the hull instead of existing fitting for 
the galley sink waste water. The hole in the hull shall have a diameter of 60 
mm (2½”).

Anyone know what the galley sink waste water thru hull diameter is?  I wonder 
if I will have to enlarge the hull?

Thank you.


___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!


  ___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List mast collar tangs C& C 33-2

[Persuasion37 via CnC-List]

Hi Doug.

On my 37 I cannot install the bolts if I tune the mast first.  I've done this a 
couple of times now and the only thing to do is loosen everything, install the 
bolts and re-tune.

Mike
C 37
Long Sault

Sent from my iPad

> On May 30, 2016, at 8:05 PM, doug.welch--- via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> When I was rigging my new to me 33-2 we couldn't locate one of the the mast 
> collar tangs so I had a friend fabricate a duplicate. Both are now misaligned 
> and the holes are about 1/4 inch too high to slip the bolt in (the boat is 
> fully rigged). My friends have different opinions on this.  One says release 
> the rigging and the tangs will slightly deform the cabin top when we reset 
> the mast. Another days remake the tangs so the bolts line up with jokes in 
> the mast when it's fully rigged. Looking for help from you folks.
> 
> 
> Cheers,
> Doug
> 
> Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List mast collar tangs C& C 33-2

[Jake Brodersen via CnC-List]

Doug,

 

You may be able to gently raise the cabin top to align the tangs with the holes 
in the mast.

 

Jake

 

Jake Brodersen

C 35 Mk-III “Midnight Mistress”

Hampton VA

 

 

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of 
doug.welch--- via CnC-List
Sent: Monday, May 30, 2016 20:06
To: C List 
Cc: doug.we...@rogers.com
Subject: Stus-List mast collar tangs C& C 33-2

 

When I was rigging my new to me 33-2 we couldn't locate one of the the mast 
collar tangs so I had a friend fabricate a duplicate. Both are now misaligned 
and the holes are about 1/4 inch too high to slip the bolt in (the boat is 
fully rigged). My friends have different opinions on this.  One says release 
the rigging and the tangs will slightly deform the cabin top when we reset the 
mast. Another days remake the tangs so the bolts line up with jokes in the mast 
when it's fully rigged. Looking for help from you folks.

 

 

Cheers,

Doug

Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android 
 

___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!