[Cooker] WebDAV - Is it safe now?

[Robert Fox]

In Cooker - can we try WebDAV now?  Is it safe?

Thx,
R.Fox

Re: [Cooker] Cooker is frozen / 9.0 schedule

[Randy Welch]

Warly wrote:

> 
> Regarding your argument about too rapidly released beta, you are right, in
> a not so far away future we may have only 1 release every 1 or 2 years, and
> a beta period of 6 months with one beta every 1 an a half month.
> 

That would be better.  A release a year sounds nice.  A 
release every two years and one could accuse Mandrake of 
being a Slackware. ;-)

> ...
> 
> I regret the 3 releases a year time...
> 

Yea, that's killer.

-randy

Re: [Cooker] possible dm service problem

[Ben Reser]

On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 10:22:07PM -0500, Igor Izyumin wrote:
> Couldn't you just switch back to the console with CTRL-ALT-F1 after X starts?

You're assuming the user *knows* to do this...

-- 
Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
http://ben.reser.org

If your love has no hope of being welcomed do not voice it; for if it 
be silent it can endure, a guarded flame, within you.
- The Wisdom of the Sands

Re: [Cooker] FWBuilder gone?

[Ben Reser]

On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 08:43:53PM -0400, Rubin Bennett wrote:
> I looked high and low for fwbuilder (and it's extra bits) and coudn't
> find it on beta2; hopefully it's only the beta that's missing one of my
> favorite packages?!

It's in contrib and contrib isn't on the beta CDs:
http://mirror.brain.org/linux/mandrake/Mandrake-devel/cooker/i586/Mandrake/RPMS2/fwbuilder-1.0.3-2mdk.i586.rpm

-- 
Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
http://ben.reser.org

If your love has no hope of being welcomed do not voice it; for if it 
be silent it can endure, a guarded flame, within you.
- The Wisdom of the Sands

Re: [Cooker] Corrent missing dependancies from cooker.

[Ben Reser]

On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 04:13:50PM -0700, Brook Humphrey wrote:
> This is from a current fmirror and is up to date is of now.
> When you run MakeCD these are the files with messed up dependancies.

These emails probably aren't very helpful.  I'm pretty sure people at
Mandrake run MakeCD on a regular basis and see this anyway...  

-- 
Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
http://ben.reser.org

If your love has no hope of being welcomed do not voice it; for if it 
be silent it can endure, a guarded flame, within you.
- The Wisdom of the Sands

Re: [Cooker] weird klipper behaviour during high load or laggy x-session

[Ben Reser]

On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 07:22:37PM -0500, Igor Izyumin wrote:
> On Wednesday 21 August 2002 06:09 pm, Per Øyvind Karlsen wrote:
> > When using klipper with Actions enabled it keep show up for no reason
> > about every minute when the system is under high load, under a slow
> > x-session, practically whenever things are slow.
> >
> > This gets _REALLY_ annoying after a while;)
> 
> WHY on earth would you want to keep actions enabled?  Klipper is the single 
> most annoying KDE app, and "actions" is the most annoying feature I have ever 
> encountered.

Because some of us find actions useful...  I had to disable them because
it was annoying me.  Incidentally this is a known KDE bug.  It's been in
the KDE bug database for months.  The author has done nothing about it.
I just turned off actions by default and started using Ctrl+Alt+R
anytime I wanted an action... *sigh*

-- 
Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
http://ben.reser.org

If your love has no hope of being welcomed do not voice it; for if it 
be silent it can endure, a guarded flame, within you.
- The Wisdom of the Sands

[Cooker] Re: [Contrib-Rpm] ecore-cvs20020821-1mdk

[Ben Reser]

On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 10:15:43PM +0200, Olivier Thauvin wrote:
> [Contrib-RPM]
> 
> --=-=-=
> Name: ecoreRelocations: (not relocateable)
> Version : cvs20020821   Vendor: MandrakeSoft
> Release : 1mdk  Build Date: Wed Aug 21 21:41:27 2002
> Install date: (not installed)   Build Host: klama.mandrake.org
> Group   : Development/Other Source RPM: (none)
> Size: 59659License: BSD
> Packager: Olivier Thauvin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> URL : http://www.enlightenment.org/efm.html
> Summary : Enlightened Core X interface library
> Description :
> Ecore is brub.

You call that a description?  What the hell is brub?

-- 
Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
http://ben.reser.org

If your love has no hope of being welcomed do not voice it; for if it 
be silent it can endure, a guarded flame, within you.
- The Wisdom of the Sands

[Cooker] Re: [Contrib-Rpm] tmda-0.61-1mdk

[Ben Reser]

On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 05:15:25PM +0200, Vincent Danen wrote:
> TMDA is an OSI certified software application designed to significantly
> reduce the amount of SPAM/UCE (junk-mail) you receive.  TMDA combines a
> "whitelist" (for known/trusted senders), a "blacklist" (for undesired
> senders), and a cryptographically enhanced confirmation system (for unknown,
> but legitimate senders).

aka Gremlin (sorry couldn't resist, it's an inside joke).

-- 
Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
http://ben.reser.org

If your love has no hope of being welcomed do not voice it; for if it 
be silent it can endure, a guarded flame, within you.
- The Wisdom of the Sands

Re: [Cooker] Re: [CHRPM] kdelibs-3.0.3-5mdk

[Ben Reser]

On Thu, Aug 22, 2002 at 07:49:56AM +0200, Laurent Montel wrote:
> Fix khtml.
> Fix updateAction in kcommand.cc

Okay thanks.  There's a bug in kcompletionbox.cpp that I'm trying to
figure out.  Only happens in Xinerama.  I should have a patch in the
next couple days.  When I do I'll pass it along to you. Just wondering
if someone beat me to it. :)

-- 
Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
http://ben.reser.org

If your love has no hope of being welcomed do not voice it; for if it 
be silent it can endure, a guarded flame, within you.
- The Wisdom of the Sands

Re: [Cooker] Re: [CHRPM] kdelibs-3.0.3-5mdk

[Laurent Montel]

Le Wednesday 21 August 2002 23:06, Ben Reser a écrit :
> On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 08:45:27AM +0200, Laurent MONTEL wrote:
> > --=-=-=
> > Name: kdelibs  Relocations: (not
> > relocateable) Version : 3.0.3 Vendor:
> > MandrakeSoft Release : 5mdk  Build Date: Wed
> > Aug 21 08:24:57 2002 Install date: (not installed)   Build
> > Host: ke.mandrakesoft.com Group   : Graphical desktop/KDE
> > Source RPM: (none)
> > Size: 6794086  License: ARTISTIC BSD
> > GPL_V2 LGPL_V2 QPL_V1.0 Packager: Mandrake Linux KDE Team
> > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > URL : http://www.kde.org/
> > Summary : K Desktop Environment - Libraries
> > Description :
> > Libraries for the K Desktop Environment.
> >
> > --=-=-=
> >
> > * Tue Aug 20 2002 Laurent MONTEL <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 3.0.3-5mdk
> >
> > - Update code
>
> Uhh what exactly was changed here?
Fix khtml.
Fix updateAction in kcommand.cc
Regards.

Re: Actually... Re: [Cooker] Wishlist: spam filtering

[Ben Reser]

On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 10:13:04PM -0400, allen wrote:
> Conceptually I'd need just one rule   iptables -A input -j QUEUE
> Plus the rpm -ivh of a hogwash-iptables.rpm or rather "by" 
> such an rpm.  

Yes but a real person needs to be there to insert such a rule in the
right place.  If you put it in the wrong place in the chain it could
have drastic results.  There is no program that automatically installs
the hogwash rule into iptables for you...  The context of the rule is
very important especially in procmail and iptables.  In order to decern
the context you'd need an AI.  Which you aren't going to get from an rpm
package produced by Mandrake.

> If there's a market, your bank account would argue with you.
> 
> But then, I'm not even suggesting that there might be thousands or
> even millions of people and businesses of all sizes with a 
> spam problem...

And enterprises have system admins who can take the 20 minutes to
install and configure spamassassin.  They don't leave such things to end
users to setup.  And that's ultimately what the request is trying to
take care of.

-- 
Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
http://ben.reser.org

If your love has no hope of being welcomed do not voice it; for if it 
be silent it can endure, a guarded flame, within you.
- The Wisdom of the Sands

Re: [Cooker] Wishlist: spam filtering

[Ben Reser]

On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 09:37:50PM -0500, Igor Izyumin wrote:
> Well, yes, but it does rely on keywords and headers to score the email.  
> Sometimes, even a wrong header combination will cause it to trigger.  It 
> doesn't know the context of the email message (you'd need AI for that), yet 
> it scores email based solely on its content (unlike razor-type tools which 
> compare a message against a database).  

Yeah but spamassassin uses every piece of information about the message
it can to come up with a score.  Some of that is content based.  It can
even use Razor to get some of that score.  Plus with autowhitelisting
spamassassin gets better and better about false positives.  I can't
remember the last time it grabed an email that I really wanted and put
it in the spam folder.  Fact is I rarely even looka the spam folder.

> My point wasn't that it sucks, just that it is far from foolproof, does have 
> false positives, and doesn't have a "reasonable" default configuration.  If 
> it is incorporated into Mandrake as an easily enabled option, you would 
> probably have to provide a configuration drake for it.

Well I don't really think it has a bad default config.  I've made very
few alterations to mine.  A few blacklist and whitelist entries where I
disagree with it about what is spam.  And a couple extra rulesets.  But
for the most part it's the default config.

Now most of my users are using the default config.  And I rarely get
complaints about it.  I've been running spamassassin for a while now for
all my users.  So I think I have enough experience to make these
statements.

But a drake type tool or hell any tool to help users config spamassassin
woudl be a good thing...

-- 
Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
http://ben.reser.org

If your love has no hope of being welcomed do not voice it; for if it 
be silent it can endure, a guarded flame, within you.
- The Wisdom of the Sands

Re: [Cooker] Wishlist: spam filtering

[Ben Reser]

On Thu, Aug 22, 2002 at 01:27:12AM -0400, Richard G. Houser wrote:
> POP may not support folders, but the local machine would most certainly
> do so.  As a mail client is on the downstream end, POP shouldn't be a
> concern.  I do think it might be worthwhile to include a most basic
> fetchmail configuration GUI and an extremely basic procmail filter tool
> (similar to a simple match version of what mozilla-mail supports).
> 
> Also, I've yet to check where the defaults in cooker are presently, but
> last I could recall not all of the shipped mail clients were defaulting
> to the same mail directories (I had to change the pinerc in 8.2 to sync
> up with some other clients defaulting to ~/Mail instead of ~/mail -- not
> sure, but think it was kmail).

Fact is that most users don't get their email that way.  And most
clients (apparently kmail does) doesn't support filtering stuff though
extrnal programs.  Most of the graphical (read that newbie friendly)
clients check directly via POP or IMAP.  Most users don't know how to
setup fetchmail, procmail, et al.  My mail has a rather convulted setup
that makes it end up on the local mail folders.  But the fact is that
most newbies just don't understand such things.  They just want to pop
their mailservers into the client and go...

Finally, I don't know about you but most of my users don't use Linux to
read thier emails.  And almost none of them have access to the server
any other way than POP.  Automatically putting things in folders is a
"bad idea" because you don't know if the local machine is the final
destination or if the user picks it up to read by POP.  There is no way
to know that for sure...  

It comes down to this.  At install time there is too little information
to know what is going to happen with the email on the server.  And even
then not all users may do the same thing with it.  In the end to get
anything to achieve what the request is you'll have to make many
assumptions about what the machine is used for.  Considering that
Mandrake doesn't attempt to have a "Server" install or a "Desktop"
install there's really no way to know.  And even then some people read
their email on servers with clients like mutt or pine.  And others
download with POP.

-- 
Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
http://ben.reser.org

If your love has no hope of being welcomed do not voice it; for if it 
be silent it can endure, a guarded flame, within you.
- The Wisdom of the Sands

Re: [Cooker] Wishlist: spam filtering

[Richard G. Houser]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Ben Reser wrote:
| On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 07:20:30PM -0400, allen wrote:
|
|>The obvious solution if the goal is to provide something out of the box
|>that works with one or more mail clients is to dump "such" mail into
|>a spam folder of the particular user.
|
|
| Which means POP users will never see it because POP doesn't support
| "folders".  Once again there is no solution that works right in all
| insallations and configurations.  Try again.
|

POP may not support folders, but the local machine would most certainly
do so.  As a mail client is on the downstream end, POP shouldn't be a
concern.  I do think it might be worthwhile to include a most basic
fetchmail configuration GUI and an extremely basic procmail filter tool
(similar to a simple match version of what mozilla-mail supports).

Also, I've yet to check where the defaults in cooker are presently, but
last I could recall not all of the shipped mail clients were defaulting
to the same mail directories (I had to change the pinerc in 8.2 to sync
up with some other clients defaulting to ~/Mail instead of ~/mail -- not
sure, but think it was kmail).
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Re: [Cooker] Is anyone mirroring Cooker on WAIX (Western Australia)?

[Richard G. Houser]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Leon Brooks wrote:
| I can't get more than about 1.2kb/s sustained out of any of the listed
Cooker
| mirrors, which means by the time I download the missing pieces the next
| release will be out. This is a far cry from the 150kB (yes, bytes) I was
| getting at the bandwidth party I picked up the first dose of Cooker from.
|
| If you have a Cooker mirror and free traffic through WAIX (ie, WestNet,
| ArachNet, iiNet, Comindico, CanTech, Chime, Connect.com, iQnet, SingTel,
| Starwon etc, list here:
http://www.waia.asn.au/waix/participants.shtml) can I
| please make arrangements to sponge from your mirror at a full 8kb/sec?
This
| can be done midnight-to-dawn-only, no worries, to suit your free-traffic
| requirements if necessary.
|
| I'd get ADSL, but dear Telstra assure me that I'm too far from the
exchange
| for it to work.
|
| Cheers; Leon
|

It might be worth it to you to consider purchasing a set of cooker CDs
and arrange to have them shipped via snail-express-mail.  Or, even
better, wait a week or two for the first release candidate.  Once the
feature freeze is fully in place, you can probably get a system that
changes little enough you could copy off all the files from the CDs and
do a little renaming work based off the ftp lists on the mirrors and
rsync (to only transfer the deltas) them up to date (its still going to
be very, very slow going).  I heard a mention somewhere about a script
that automates the renaming for you -- probably on this mailing list.

I'm afraid I cannot help you with the download however, as I'm in the US.
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[Cooker] GDL Package

[Tom Jakubowski]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Hi all,

While bored, I decided to look for a project to help develop for. I found
a suitable one (gnome-mud for the interested) and checked out the CVS
sources... yadda yadda, I run configure, but alas! it complains of not
finding the 'gdl' library. So, being the keen Mandrake user I am, I try
'urpmi gdl' and 'urpmi gdl-devel', to no avail. I fire up rpmdrake, do a
search for 'gdl', and find nothing.

So I google for 'gdl', and find it's the GNOME devtools library. Once 
again, I search for mandrake packages like "devtools" in vain. I consult 
someone for help, and he tells me to see if "gnome-devel" has it, but it 
appears to not (as it was installed and ./configure still wouldn't detect 
gdl).

It seems that 'gdl' *is* a real library (as opposed to a fake one), able 
to be built from teh gnome sources, but that it's not available as a 
package (at least not a Mandrake rpm).

Well, I'm no packager, so I humbly request that someone take the time to 
package this library and put it up for inclusion in cooker and future 
releases of Mandrake.

PS: I'm not subscribed to cooker@ for pure volume concerns, so please make 
sure any replies to me go to both the list and myself (I believe pine 
does this automatically).

Thank you.

- -- 
Tom Jakubowski (tom@crystae)

PGP Public Key: http://crystae.homeip.net/~tom/pgp-public.txt

I am the "ILOVEGNU" signature virus. Just copy me to your signature.
This email was infected under the terms of the GNU General Public
License.

"A computer without a Microsoft operating system is like a chocolate cake 
without mustard."
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[Cooker] Is anyone mirroring Cooker on WAIX (Western Australia)?

[Leon Brooks]

I can't get more than about 1.2kb/s sustained out of any of the listed Cooker 
mirrors, which means by the time I download the missing pieces the next 
release will be out. This is a far cry from the 150kB (yes, bytes) I was 
getting at the bandwidth party I picked up the first dose of Cooker from.

If you have a Cooker mirror and free traffic through WAIX (ie, WestNet, 
ArachNet, iiNet, Comindico, CanTech, Chime, Connect.com, iQnet, SingTel, 
Starwon etc, list here: http://www.waia.asn.au/waix/participants.shtml) can I 
please make arrangements to sponge from your mirror at a full 8kb/sec? This 
can be done midnight-to-dawn-only, no worries, to suit your free-traffic 
requirements if necessary.

I'd get ADSL, but dear Telstra assure me that I'm too far from the exchange 
for it to work.

Cheers; Leon

Re: [Cooker] wine %description

[Per Øyvind Karlsen]

hehe, this  thread started to get amusing now:)
anyways, no offence whatsover and thanks for a insightful discussion

ahh, one more hour of sleep then I'm off to work *sigh*

Re: Actually... Re: [Cooker] Wishlist: spam filtering

[allen]

On Wednesday 21 August 2002 10:18 pm, Ben Reser wrote:
> On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 07:15:37PM -0400, allen wrote:
> > http://www.prismnet.com/~aef/index2.html
> > http://hogwash.sourceforge.net
> > I'm not actually trying to promote these things for this purpose at this
> > time, I am just saying that this issue is really not "impossible".

> First of all your examples are all things that manipulate iptables rules
> and require a lot of setup to make work on the users perspective.
> Comparing that to something that is going to (without an user
> intervention) modify procmail rules and not cause an interaction (and
> procmail is rife with interactiosn) is silly.

Yes and no.  You are actually assuming quite a lot here.  Seriously, humbly.
( I would take this part off-line and post a summary, 
  can be a while off topic )

> But that's beside the point.  It's a waste of Mandrake's time because
> the *correct* way of implementing this is providing hooks in the client
> and the server.  

Whatever.  I'm not suggesting anything other than the fact that it is not 
impossible ;)

> This will probably happen sooner or later and Mandrake
> would spend a lot of time and energy implementing something that: a)
> would break for a lot of people and b) will become obsolete when the
> clients do implement the hooks.

I understand and yes, no reason not to have the right hooks in the right
places.

However there is also no reason to have to have what you might 
consider "enterprise" or "edge-level" rules administered in each
and every application throughout your network...

Thus there are things that can make a pervasive difference from
a single vantage even just a single machine...

Things like hogwash.

> So it's just not worth the time.

IPTables is installed on my beta 3.

Conceptually I'd need just one rule   iptables -A input -j QUEUE
Plus the rpm -ivh of a hogwash-iptables.rpm or rather "by" 
such an rpm.  

Like... squid, snort, etc.,

Time is money. 

If there's a market, your bank account would argue with you.

But then, I'm not even suggesting that there might be thousands or
even millions of people and businesses of all sizes with a 
spam problem...

;)

-AEF

Re: [Cooker] possible dm service problem

[Igor Izyumin]

On Wednesday 21 August 2002 09:57 pm, David Walser wrote:
> If you boot in Interactive mode where you answer y/n
> to all the startup services, if you say yes to dm,
> isn't it gonna start and have X take over possibly
> before you've had a chance to answer y/n on all of the
> remaining things that start after dm?

Couldn't you just switch back to the console with CTRL-ALT-F1 after X starts?
-- 
-- Igor

[Cooker] ispell is not loaded during install

[Jonathan Drews]

package:  ispell-3.2.06-5mdk (and the ispell specific language package)

Mandrake 9.0 Beta 3


 The package ispell was not loaded during the Mandrake install. This was for 
english (en). 

[Cooker] possible dm service problem

[David Walser]

If you boot in Interactive mode where you answer y/n
to all the startup services, if you say yes to dm,
isn't it gonna start and have X take over possibly
before you've had a chance to answer y/n on all of the
remaining things that start after dm?

Was just laying in bed trying to sleep when I thought
of this, so I got up and asked :o)

__
Do You Yahoo!?
HotJobs - Search Thousands of New Jobs
http://www.hotjobs.com

[Cooker] 9.0 schedule

[Todd Lyons]

Brent Hasty wrote on Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 07:38:24PM -0700 :
> Is there a projected release date for MDK 9.0 yet?

Warly wrote on Tue, Aug 20, 2002 at 10:40:23AM +0200 :
> 
> Cooker is entered in its first frozen state.
> That means that new versions of packages will not be accepted, except if
> they correct release critical bugs.
> New releases are allowed, though.
> Expect a beta 4 or rc 1 by the end of this week or beginning of next week,
> then a new rc in the beginning of september.
> Deep freeze (not more upload, only very critical bugs), after that.
> Final arround the 13th.
> All this may change a little bit.

Blue skies...   Todd
-- 
  Todd Lyons -- MandrakeSoft, Inc.   http://www.mandrakesoft.com/
UNIX was not designed to stop you from doing stupid things, because 
  that would also stop you from doing clever things. -- Doug Gwyn
   Cooker Version mandrake-release-9.0-0.3mdk Kernel 2.4.19-4mdk



msg71986/pgp0.pgp
Description: PGP signature

[Cooker] Is there a projected release date for MDK 9.0 yet?

[Brent Hasty]

Is there a projected release date for MDK 9.0 yet?
-- 
"The place of the material world in the universe is that of an exquisitely 
beautiful precipitate or varied cloud-work in the universal Æther, determined 
by a geometrical necessity" ~ Professor John G. Macvicar1870 ~

Brent Hasty
http://www.Hasty-Solutions.com

[Cooker] game frozen-bubble freezes

[Jonathan Drews]

Application: frozen-bubble-0.9.3-6mdk
Mandrake 9.0 Beta 3
Computer: WalMart (Microtell)




 The game frozen-bubble freezes on startup. I find this information when 
running it at the x-term:

[beta3@localhost beta3]$ frozen-bubble
[[ Frozen-Bubble-0.9.3 ]]

  http://www.frozen-bubble.org/

  Copyright (c) 2000, 2001, 2002 Guillaume Cottenceau.
  Artwork: Alexis Younes <73lab at free.fr>
   Amaury Amblard-Ladurantie 
  Soundtrack: Matthias Le Bidan 
  Design & Programming: Guillaume Cottenceau 

  Sponsored by MandrakeSoft 

  This program is free software; you can redistribute it and/or modify
  it under the terms of the GNU General Public License version 2, as
  published by the Free Software Foundation.

[SDL Init] ALSA lib dlmisc.c:97:(snd_dlsym_verify) unable to verify version 
for symbol snd_config_hook_load
ALSA lib conf.c:2561:(snd_config_hooks_call) symbol snd_config_hook_load is 
not defined inside (null)
ALSA lib conf.c:2968:(snd_config_update_r) hooks failed, removing 
configuration
/dev/dsp: Resource temporarily unavailable
[Graphics...] [50 levels]
Warning: can't initialize sound (reason: No available audio device).
Ready.
X Error of failed request:  BadDrawable (invalid Pixmap or Window parameter)
  Major opcode of failed request:  145 (MIT-SHM)
  Minor opcode of failed request:  3 (X_ShmPutImage)
  Resource id in failed request:  0x2cd
  Serial number of failed request:  1952
  Current serial number in output stream:  1953
 


Fatal signal: Broken Pipe (SDL Parachute Deployed)
X connection to :0.0 broken (explicit kill or server shutdown).

Again I find this in my /var/log/messages, even though my sound works:

Aug 21 19:57:42 localhost kernel: Assertion failed! chan->is_active == 
sg_active(chan->iobase),via82cxxx_audio.c,via_chan_maybe_start,line=1196

The behaviour of this game, when it freezes, is identical, to the freeze i get 
when running toppler. Both problems are sound related.

Re: [Cooker] wine %description

[Igor Izyumin]

On Wednesday 21 August 2002 09:20 pm, Richard G. Houser wrote:
> Anyone else think it might be beneficial to either include the words
> "wrapper" or "compatibility layer" in this description?  These two come
> to my mind immediately whenever I think of WINE.  As an added bonus for
> the "wrapper" description, many of the Windows gamers that started at
> least 2+ years ago are likely to be familiar with Glide or OpenGL
> wrappers.  A lot of drivers just before that had buggy OpenGL support
> and some applications only supported the proprietary Glide API so these
> wrapper DLLs were a must to use many programs with the newer hardware.

That would simply confuse things.  My opinion: who cares?  It's just a package 
description, not anything which pretends to be an authoritative source.  
Hardly anybody ever reads these things.  If they do, they'll understand what 
it's supposed to do if you just call it an emulator.  People know what 
emulators are, they would get confused if you say that it is a "an API 
compatibility wrapper for Win32 binaries" or something like that.  If they 
want more details on how it works, they will do a google search and go to 
winehq.com which clarifies things on the nuts and bolts.

"Too much detail" is a major problem with package descriptions.  When people 
decide whether to install a package or not, they want to know WHAT a program 
does, not HOW it does it.
-- 
-- Igor

Re: [Cooker] Wishlist: spam filtering

[Ben Reser]

On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 07:11:34PM -0500, Vox wrote:
>   But KMail can use spamassassin directly, or so I remember reading
>   somewhere...probably spamassassin's site itself.

Indeed you're right.  With a little bit of setup:
http://kmail.kde.org/tools.html

Wonder if there's a way to make Kmail use spamassasin if it's installed
automatically.  What I'm talking about is more like a checkbox that
says:
[ ] Filter mail through spamassassin if available

Then Mandrake can just ship it with it on...

-- 
Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
http://ben.reser.org

If your love has no hope of being welcomed do not voice it; for if it 
be silent it can endure, a guarded flame, within you.
- The Wisdom of the Sands

Re: [Cooker] Wishlist: spam filtering

[Igor Izyumin]

On Wednesday 21 August 2002 09:13 pm, Ben Reser wrote:
> On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 07:15:51PM -0500, Igor Izyumin wrote:
> > Besides, what happens if the spam filter catches a non-spam email?  You
> > can never trust those systems, because they are pretty stupid.  Only
> > sufficiently advanced users should be using them, and only when they know
> > the consequences.  The best solution to the spam problem is to not stick
> > your email into every form out there (or to have a "junk" email addy on
> > hotmail or something).  Trying to filter spam with stupid keyword-based
> > tools (spamassassin) is dangerous, and making it a default is insane.
>
> spamassassin isn't keyword based it's score based.  Putting "penis
> enlargement" in this email isn't going to cause everyone's spam assassin
> to score my email as spam.  And spam assassin just tags email as
> suspected spam what you do with it is completely up to you...

Well, yes, but it does rely on keywords and headers to score the email.  
Sometimes, even a wrong header combination will cause it to trigger.  It 
doesn't know the context of the email message (you'd need AI for that), yet 
it scores email based solely on its content (unlike razor-type tools which 
compare a message against a database).  

My point wasn't that it sucks, just that it is far from foolproof, does have 
false positives, and doesn't have a "reasonable" default configuration.  If 
it is incorporated into Mandrake as an easily enabled option, you would 
probably have to provide a configuration drake for it.
-- 
-- Igor

[Cooker] Documentation

[Yura Gusev]

Documentation should be updated (i.e change 8.2 to 9.0)
/mnt/cdrom/tutorial/index.html

Re: [Cooker] wine %description

[Richard G. Houser]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Per Øyvind Karlsen wrote:

| Mandrake is not _ONLY_ targeted at "newbies", and describing wine as
| an emulator when it's not (WINE still stands for Wine Is Not an
| Emulator;) will make "hackers" think of us as stupid;)
| anyways, it's not harder than just grab the description from
| winehq.com/about
|
| From winehq.com/about:
|
| "Wine is an implementation of the Windows Win32 and Win16 APIs on top
| of X and Unix. Think of Wine as a Windows compatibility layer. Wine
| provides both a development toolkit (Winelib) for porting Windows
| sources to Unix and a program loader, allowing many unmodified Windows
| 3.x/95/98/ME/NT/W2K/XP binaries to run under Intel Unixes. Wine works
| on most popular Intel Unixes, including Linux ,
| FreeBSD , and Solaris
| .
|
| Wine does not require Microsoft Windows, as it is a completely
| alternative implementation consisting of 100% Microsoft-free code, but
| it can optionally use native system DLLs if they are available. Wine
| comes with complete sources, documentation and examples and is freely
| redistributable. (The licensing terms
| are the GNU Lesser General
| Public License.)"
|
| This should explain it good enough that most linux users understand
| what it's for, and if it's still not good enough it's just to explain
| it better, but still, claiming that wine is an emulator, when it's
| not, well... it's kinda ..
|
| From the wine package
|
| "%description
| This is an ALPHA release of Wine, the MS-Windows emulator.  This is
| still a developers release and many applications may still not work.
|
| This package consists of the emulator program for running windows
| executables.
|
| Wine is often updated."
|
| I actually don't think this explains it much better for those without
| much technical knowledge, and naming Wine "the MS-Windows emulator",
| that's actually quite stupid.
| Anyways the explanation from winehq is better and correct, and
| probably not more confusing for a new user than the one from the wine
| package
|
|
|
| Ben Reser wrote:
|
|> On Thu, Aug 22, 2002 at 01:42:57AM +0200, Philippe Coulonges wrote:
|>  
|>
|>> In my response, I mistaken your message and the one from Ben Reser.
|>> Rereading it, it may look like you're the one that don't understand
|>> the difference, but he is.
|>>   
|>
|>
|> I most certianly *DO* understand the difference.  But you're applying
|> the term emulator to only processor emulation which is certainly a fine
|> distinction that maybe hackers make, but the dictionary and common users
|> do not make!  And considering that for the most part Mandrake is for
|> common users not hackers (though some of us use Mandrake) we should be
|> using language common users understand not elitist hacker definitions.
|>
|>  
|>
|
|
Anyone else think it might be beneficial to either include the words
"wrapper" or "compatibility layer" in this description?  These two come
to my mind immediately whenever I think of WINE.  As an added bonus for
the "wrapper" description, many of the Windows gamers that started at
least 2+ years ago are likely to be familiar with Glide or OpenGL
wrappers.  A lot of drivers just before that had buggy OpenGL support
and some applications only supported the proprietary Glide API so these
wrapper DLLs were a must to use many programs with the newer hardware.
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Re: Actually... Re: [Cooker] Wishlist: spam filtering

[Ben Reser]

On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 07:15:37PM -0400, allen wrote:
> Uh, it's not really "impossible".  ( ...borrows fireproof pants )
> 
> http://www.prismnet.com/~aef/index2.html   
> ( I mention this one only because of applicability to a stand-alone system
>   based on Mandrake with Netfilter and libipq. )
> 
> http://hogwash.sourceforge.net
> 
> I'm not actually trying to promote these things for this purpose at this time, 
> I am just saying that this issue is really not "impossible".
> 
> Not kidding.  Not enough time and developer bandwidth or it would be more than 
> possible already for this purpose.

First of all your examples are all things that manipulate iptables rules
and require a lot of setup to make work on the users perspective.
Comparing that to something that is going to (without an user
intervention) modify procmail rules and not cause an interaction (and
procmail is rife with interactiosn) is silly.  

But that's beside the point.  It's a waste of Mandrake's time because
the *correct* way of implementing this is providing hooks in the client
and the server.  This will probably happen sooner or later and Mandrake
would spend a lot of time and energy implementing something that: a)
would break for a lot of people and b) will become obsolete when the
clients do implement the hooks.

So it's just not worth the time.

-- 
Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
http://ben.reser.org

If your love has no hope of being welcomed do not voice it; for if it 
be silent it can endure, a guarded flame, within you.
- The Wisdom of the Sands

Re: [Cooker] Wishlist: spam filtering

[Ben Reser]

On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 07:20:30PM -0400, allen wrote:
> The obvious solution if the goal is to provide something out of the box
> that works with one or more mail clients is to dump "such" mail into
> a spam folder of the particular user.

Which means POP users will never see it because POP doesn't support
"folders".  Once again there is no solution that works right in all
insallations and configurations.  Try again.

-- 
Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
http://ben.reser.org

If your love has no hope of being welcomed do not voice it; for if it 
be silent it can endure, a guarded flame, within you.
- The Wisdom of the Sands

Re: [Cooker] Wishlist: spam filtering

[Ben Reser]

On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 07:15:51PM -0500, Igor Izyumin wrote:
> Besides, what happens if the spam filter catches a non-spam email?  You can 
> never trust those systems, because they are pretty stupid.  Only sufficiently 
> advanced users should be using them, and only when they know the 
> consequences.  The best solution to the spam problem is to not stick your 
> email into every form out there (or to have a "junk" email addy on hotmail or 
> something).  Trying to filter spam with stupid keyword-based tools 
> (spamassassin) is dangerous, and making it a default is insane.

spamassassin isn't keyword based it's score based.  Putting "penis
enlargement" in this email isn't going to cause everyone's spam assassin
to score my email as spam.  And spam assassin just tags email as
suspected spam what you do with it is completely up to you...

-- 
Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
http://ben.reser.org

If your love has no hope of being welcomed do not voice it; for if it 
be silent it can endure, a guarded flame, within you.
- The Wisdom of the Sands

Re: [Cooker] wine %description

[Ben Reser]

On Thu, Aug 22, 2002 at 02:06:10AM +0200, Per Øyvind Karlsen wrote:
> Mandrake is not _ONLY_ targeted at "newbies", and describing wine as an 
> emulator when it's not (WINE still stands for Wine Is Not an Emulator;) 
> will make "hackers" think of us as stupid;)
> anyways, it's not harder than just grab the description from 
> winehq.com/about

I didn't say it was.

> From winehq.com/about:
> 
> "Wine is an implementation of the Windows Win32 and Win16 APIs on top of 
> X and Unix. Think of Wine as a Windows compatibility layer. Wine 
> provides both a development toolkit (Winelib) for porting Windows 
> sources to Unix and a program loader, allowing many unmodified Windows 
> 3.x/95/98/ME/NT/W2K/XP binaries to run under Intel Unixes. Wine works on 
> most popular Intel Unixes, including Linux , 
> FreeBSD , and Solaris 
> .
> 
> Wine does not require Microsoft Windows, as it is a completely 
> alternative implementation consisting of 100% Microsoft-free code, but 
> it can optionally use native system DLLs if they are available. Wine 
> comes with complete sources, documentation and examples and is freely 
> redistributable. (The licensing terms 
> are the GNU Lesser General 
> Public License.)"
> 
> This should explain it good enough that most linux users understand what 
> it's for, and if it's still not good enough it's just to explain it 
> better, but still, claiming that wine is an emulator, when it's not, 
> well... it's kinda ..

So submit a patch to change the spec file and be doen with it.  If you
know enough to be looking at the spec you can submit a patch.  That is a
better description but not because it just doesn't call WINE an
emulator.  Because WINE is an emulator.

-- 
Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
http://ben.reser.org

If your love has no hope of being welcomed do not voice it; for if it 
be silent it can endure, a guarded flame, within you.
- The Wisdom of the Sands

Re: ;) Re: [Cooker] wine %description

[Ben Reser]

On Thu, Aug 22, 2002 at 02:34:51AM +0200, Per Øyvind Karlsen wrote:
> Let's try to rephrase this;
> My point is that you don't call wine for an emulator just to make people 
> understand what it's purpose is, when it's not an emulator.
> Especially not when it's not hard to desribe it correctly and at the 
> same time make people understad it's purpose.

The purpose of the a %description is to let people know what the app
does.  If you don't speak in the terms they understand then it's
worthelss...  To some degree it's an emulator.  You guys just want to
use overly broad definitions of the term.  My mother and most of my
non-techie friends won't understand the distinctions you guys are trying
to make.  Now I'm not saying the %description couldn't be imporved.  But
WINE *IS* an emulator at some level.

> eg. people did'nt call PC-DOS, DR-DOS, etc. for MS-DOS emulators just 
> because they could mostly run the same programs.

Doesn't mean they couldn't be called that.

-- 
Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
http://ben.reser.org

If your love has no hope of being welcomed do not voice it; for if it 
be silent it can endure, a guarded flame, within you.
- The Wisdom of the Sands

[Cooker] FWBuilder gone?

[Rubin Bennett]

I looked high and low for fwbuilder (and it's extra bits) and coudn't
find it on beta2; hopefully it's only the beta that's missing one of my
favorite packages?!

Rubin



signature.asc
Description: This is a digitally signed message part

[Cooker] setting KDEHOME in startkde

[Robby Stephenson]

Hi All,

I'm running Mandrake 8.2 with a few PLF packages, along with the unsupported 
kde3 packages for 8.2

robby:~> rpm -q kdebase3
kdebase3-3.0.3-2mdk

I was looking through the /opt/kde3/bin/startkde script a bit. It seems to 
be rather schizophenic about whether $HOME/.kde or $HOME/.kde3 is to be the 
default setting for KDEHOME. I made it a bit more consistent and the diff 
file is attached. The $kdehome variable should be set at the very 
beginning, and then everytime a file from that directory is read or 
written, the variable should be used.

I know things are likelyto have been drastically rearranged for the upcoming 
9.0, not the least of which is the default installation to /usr, but I 
haven't had a chance to try a beta yet. I just want to raise the issue to 
make sure that first-time users don't end up having both a ~/.kde and a 
~/.kde3 with the default, first-time settings split between the two.

Robby

--- startkde.orig	Wed Aug 21 17:11:11 2002
+++ startkde	Wed Aug 21 17:15:28 2002
@@ -30,40 +30,46 @@
 # people's heads. We use colours from the standard KDE palette for those with
 # palettised displays.
 
+# The user's personal KDE directory is usually ~/.kde, but this setting
+# may be overridden by setting KDEHOME.
+
+kdehome=$HOME/.kde
+test -n "$KDEHOME" && kdehome=`echo "$KDEHOME"|sed "s,^\~/,$HOME/,"`
+
 #test "$XDM_MANAGED" || bkg="-solid #C0C0C0"
 #xsetroot -cursor_name left_ptr $bkg
-if [ ! -d $HOME/.kde3/share/config ] ; then
-   mkdir -p $HOME/.kde3/share/config
+if [ ! -d $kdehome/share/config ] ; then
+   mkdir -p $kdehome/share/config
 fi
 
 if [ ! -e /dev/dsp ] && [ ! -e $HOME/.kde3/share/config/kcmartsrc ] ; then
-   echo "[Arts]" > $HOME/.kde/share/config/kcmartsrc
-   echo "StartServer=false" >> $HOME/.kde3/share/config/kcmartsrc
+   echo "[Arts]" > $kdehome/share/config/kcmartsrc
+   echo "StartServer=false" >> $kdehome/share/config/kcmartsrc
 fi
 
 if [ "`whoami`" = root ] ; then
xsetroot -cursor_name left_ptr -solid '#B20003'
 
-   if [ ! -e /root/.kde3/share/config/kdesktoprc ] ; then
-   cp /usr/share/mdk/kde/root-interface/kdesktoprc /root/.kde3/share/config/kdesktoprc
+   if [ ! -e $kdehome/share/config/kdesktoprc ] ; then
+   cp /usr/share/mdk/kde/root-interface/kdesktoprc $kdehome/share/config/kdesktoprc
fi
 
-   if [ ! -e /root/.kde/share/config/kdeglobals ] ; then
-   cp /usr/share/mdk/kde/root-interface/kdeglobals /root/.kde3/share/config/kdeglobals
+   if [ ! -e $kdehome/share/config/kdeglobals ] ; then
+   cp /usr/share/mdk/kde/root-interface/kdeglobals $kdehome/share/config/kdeglobals
fi
 
-   if [ ! -e /root/.kde/share/config/kickerrc ] ; then
-   cp /usr/share/mdk/kde/root-interface/kickerrc /root/.kde3/share/config/kickerrc
+   if [ ! -e $kdehome/share/config/kickerrc ] ; then
+   cp /usr/share/mdk/kde/root-interface/kickerrc $kdehome/share/config/kickerrc
fi
 
-   if [ ! -d /root/.kde3/share/autostart/ ] ; then
-   mkdir -p /root/.kde3/share/autostart/
-   cp /usr/share/mdk/kde/root-interface/klipper.desktop /root/.kde3/share/autostart/
+   if [ ! -d $kdehome/share/autostart/ ] ; then
+   mkdir -p $kdehome/share/autostart/
+   cp /usr/share/mdk/kde/root-interface/klipper.desktop $kdehome/share/autostart/
fi
 
-   if [ ! -d /root/.kde3/share/apps/kdisplay/color-schemes/ ] ; then
-   mkdir -p /root/.kde3/share/apps/kdisplay/color-schemes/
-   cp /usr/share/mdk/kde/root-interface/Root_interface.kcsrc /root/.kde3/share/apps/kdisplay/color-schemes/
+   if [ ! -d $kdehome/share/apps/kdisplay/color-schemes/ ] ; then
+   mkdir -p $kdehome/share/apps/kdisplay/color-schemes/
+   cp /usr/share/mdk/kde/root-interface/Root_interface.kcsrc $kdehome/share/apps/kdisplay/color-schemes/
fi
 
 else
@@ -73,22 +79,22 @@
   mkdir -p ~/Desktop/ ;
fi
 
-   if [ ! -d ~/.kde3/Autostart/ ] ; then
-  mkdir -p ~/.kde3/Autostart/ ;
+   if [ ! -d $kdehome/Autostart/ ] ; then
+  mkdir -p $kdehome/Autostart/ ;
fi
 
-   if [ -e ~/.drakfw ] && [ "$(cat ~/.kde3/share/apps/konqueror/bookmarks.xml | wc -l | awk '{print $1}')" = "1" ] ; then
-   cp -f /usr/share/mdk/kde/bookmarks.xml ~/.kde3/share/apps/konqueror/
-   perl -pi -e "/\[KonqMainWindow Toolbar bookmarkToolBar\]/ .. /^\s*$/ and s/Hidden=true/Hidden=false/" ~/.kde3/share/config/konquerorrc
+   if [ -e ~/.drakfw ] && [ "$(cat $kdehome/share/apps/konqueror/bookmarks.xml | wc -l | awk '{print $1}')" = "1" ] ; then
+   cp -f /usr/share/mdk/kde/bookmarks.xml $kdehome/share/apps/konqueror/
+   perl -pi -e "/\[KonqMainWindow Toolbar bookmarkToolBar\]/ .. /^\s*$/ and s/Hidden=true/Hidden=false/" $kdehome/share/config/konquerorrc
fi
 
-   if [ ! -d ~/.kde/share/apps/konqueror ] ; then
-   mkdir -p ~/.kde3/share/apps/konqueror/ && cp /usr/share/mdk/kde/bookmarks.xml ~/.kde3/share/apps/konqueror/
+   if [ ! -d $kdehome/share/apps/konqueror ] ; then
+   mkdir -p $kdehome/share/apps/konqueror/ && c

Re: [Cooker] Wishlist: spam filtering

[Levi Ramsey]

On Wed Aug 21 19:15 -0500, Igor Izyumin wrote:
> Besides, what happens if the spam filter catches a non-spam email?  You can 
> never trust those systems, because they are pretty stupid.  Only sufficiently 
> advanced users should be using them, and only when they know the 
> consequences.  The best solution to the spam problem is to not stick your 
> email into every form out there (or to have a "junk" email addy on hotmail or 
> something).  Trying to filter spam with stupid keyword-based tools 
> (spamassassin) is dangerous, and making it a default is insane.

Only the truly insane spamassassin user would auto-delete spamassassin
tagged emails.  Personally, I just route spam-tagged mail into a
separate folder and manually delete spam from there.

-- 
Levi Ramsey
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Was it something I said?
And the stars look down.
Linux 2.4.19-2mdk
  8:30pm  up 1 day,  5:22,  8 users,  load average: 0.45, 0.40, 0.31

Re: ;) Re: [Cooker] wine %description

[Per Øyvind Karlsen]

heh, not really,
I'm not so great at writing english as I once was:o)


Let's try to rephrase this;
My point is that you don't call wine for an emulator just to make people 
understand what it's purpose is, when it's not an emulator.
Especially not when it's not hard to desribe it correctly and at the 
same time make people understad it's purpose.

eg. people did'nt call PC-DOS, DR-DOS, etc. for MS-DOS emulators just 
because they could mostly run the same programs.


allen wrote:

>On Wednesday 21 August 2002 08:23 pm, Per Øyvind Karlsen wrote:
>  
>
>>aye, agree
>>anyways, my point is that describing something wrong is not a good idea
>>even if it would make people easily understand what it's for, especially
>>not when you can explain someting right and still make people as easily
>>understand it's purpose:)
>>
>>
>
>I'm not sure I understand...
>
>Did you just say "Get rid of marketing people ?"
>
>;)
>
>-AEF
>
>
>  
>

Re: [Cooker] wine %description

[Ben Reser]

On Thu, Aug 22, 2002 at 01:10:10AM +0200, Philippe Coulonges wrote:
> Wine Is Not An Emulator.
> 
> As such, it can only work on an Intel platform, executing native Windows 
> binaries.
> Opposite to Windows, Linux works on many hardware platforms, but Wine can't, 
> because it is not an emulator.
> 
> Does it makes the point clearer ?

No because you're still being silly.  Wine may not emulate the
processor.  But it does emulate the DLLs and API functions that
Microsoft Windows provides.  Definition 3 from the American Heritage
Dictionary (from previously provided dictionary.com URL) is:

3. Computer Science.  To imitate the function of (another system), as by
modifications to hardware or software that allow the imitating system to
accept the same data, execute the same programs and achieve the same
results as imiteated the system.

Saying that WINE is not an emulator is runs simply counter to the
everyday definition that most uers understand.  It is an emulator.  It
just isn't emulating a processor which is what you're thinking of when
you say emulator.

-- 
Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
http://ben.reser.org

If your love has no hope of being welcomed do not voice it; for if it 
be silent it can endure, a guarded flame, within you.
- The Wisdom of the Sands

Re: [Cooker] RPM volnorm plugin for xmms

[Levi Ramsey]

On Wed Aug 21 15:21 -0400, Levi Ramsey wrote:
> On Wed Aug 21 12:09 -0700, Bryan Whitehead wrote:
> > I couldn't find a mandrake packgae, but I think this one is by far the 
> > best :)
> 
> Maybe I should package it... I've been meaning to package something for
> Mandrake for a while...

Package uploaded to incoming and available (for i586) at
http://cygnetnet.net/~levi/rpms

-- 
Levi Ramsey
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Was it something I said?
And the stars look down.
Linux 2.4.19-2mdk
  8:00pm  up 1 day,  4:52,  8 users,  load average: 0.25, 0.28, 0.20

[Cooker] xmms-compress in incoming

[Levi Ramsey]

My first rpm...

me: xmms-compressRelocations: (not relocateable)
Version : 1.1   Vendor: MandrakeSoft
Release : 1mdk  Build Date: Wed 21 Aug 2002
07:01:55 PM EDT
Install date: Wed 21 Aug 2002 07:05:04 PM EDT  Build Host:
tatiana.cygnetnet.net
Group   : Sound Source RPM:
xmms-compress-1.1-1mdk.src.rpm
Size: 61986License: GPL
Packager: Levi Ramsey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
URL : http://trikuare.cx/~magenta/projects/xmms-compress.html
Summary : XMMS plugin to normalize audio output
Description :
xmms-compress is (essentially) a dynamic range compressor intended
to keep the output of XMMS at a consistent volume without introducing
audible artifacts.  It is similar to xmms-volnorm, but uses fixed-point
math and thus runs faster.  Many users also report better quality
normalization.
* Wed Aug 21 2002 Levi Ramsey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 1.1-1mdk

- Initial Cooker contrib


-- 
Levi Ramsey
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Was it something I said?
And the stars look down.
Linux 2.4.19-2mdk
  7:15pm  up 1 day,  4:07,  9 users,  load average: 0.10, 0.15, 0.12

Re: [Cooker] wine %description

[Per Øyvind Karlsen]

aye, agree
anyways, my point is that describing something wrong is not a good idea 
even if it would make people easily understand what it's for, especially 
not when you can explain someting right and still make people as easily 
understand it's purpose:)


Adam Williamson wrote:

>On Thu, 2002-08-22 at 00:49, Ben Reser wrote:
>
>  
>
>>I most certianly *DO* understand the difference.  But you're applying
>>the term emulator to only processor emulation which is certainly a fine
>>distinction that maybe hackers make, but the dictionary and common users
>>do not make!  And considering that for the most part Mandrake is for
>>common users not hackers (though some of us use Mandrake) we should be
>>using language common users understand not elitist hacker definitions.
>>
>>
>
>Actually I don't think wine really *does* fit in with most people's
>conception of an emulator. When I run an emulator I expect a recreation
>of the original machine / OS / whatever. wine expressly doesn't provide
>this; you don't run wine and get a windows desktop with a start button
>and an annoying paperclip, etc. you use wine to run windows programs,
>it's not exactly emulating windows because you can't run wine then point
>at something and go "look! windows!". badly phrased, but I hope you get
>what I mean.
>  
>

Re: [Cooker] Wishlist: spam filtering

[allen]

On Wednesday 21 August 2002 08:15 pm, Igor Izyumin wrote:
> Besides, what happens if the spam filter catches a non-spam email?  You can
> never trust those systems, because they are pretty stupid.  Only
> sufficiently advanced users should be using them, and only when they know
> the consequences.  The best solution to the spam problem is to not stick 
> your email into every form out there (or to have a "junk" email addy on 
> hotmail or something).  Trying to filter spam with stupid keyword-based 
> tools (spamassassin) is dangerous, and making it a default is insane.

The obvious solution if the goal is to provide something out of the box
that works with one or more mail clients is to dump "such" mail into
a spam folder of the particular user.

That way it is not zapped, and yet easily zapped.

The point is, the mail came to the machine in order to "hit" spamassassin
or anything else.  It was not blocked before reaching the machine.

Therefore...  many possibilities...

-AEF

Actually... Re: [Cooker] Wishlist: spam filtering

[allen]

On Wednesday 21 August 2002 07:56 pm, Ben Reser wrote:
> An excellent point.  As it stands now the only way to run spamassasin is
> through procmail (well okay Mail::Audit too but nobody really uses that
> [/me puts on flame retardent pants here]).  But if you're using Kmail
> and checking directly via POP or IMAP you can't use procmail so it won't

> work.  Which comes back to my statement that it's impossible to do
> because there are too many different client/server configuration
> possibilities.


Uh, it's not really "impossible".  ( ...borrows fireproof pants )

http://www.prismnet.com/~aef/index2.html   
( I mention this one only because of applicability to a stand-alone system
  based on Mandrake with Netfilter and libipq. )

http://hogwash.sourceforge.net

I'm not actually trying to promote these things for this purpose at this time, 
I am just saying that this issue is really not "impossible".

Not kidding.  Not enough time and developer bandwidth or it would be more than 
possible already for this purpose.

FYI
-AEF

Re: [Cooker] weird klipper behaviour during high load or laggy x-session

[Igor Izyumin]

On Wednesday 21 August 2002 06:09 pm, Per Øyvind Karlsen wrote:
> When using klipper with Actions enabled it keep show up for no reason
> about every minute when the system is under high load, under a slow
> x-session, practically whenever things are slow.
>
> This gets _REALLY_ annoying after a while;)

WHY on earth would you want to keep actions enabled?  Klipper is the single 
most annoying KDE app, and "actions" is the most annoying feature I have ever 
encountered.
-- 
-- Igor

Re: [Cooker] wine %description

[Adam Williamson]

On Thu, 2002-08-22 at 00:49, Ben Reser wrote:

> I most certianly *DO* understand the difference.  But you're applying
> the term emulator to only processor emulation which is certainly a fine
> distinction that maybe hackers make, but the dictionary and common users
> do not make!  And considering that for the most part Mandrake is for
> common users not hackers (though some of us use Mandrake) we should be
> using language common users understand not elitist hacker definitions.

Actually I don't think wine really *does* fit in with most people's
conception of an emulator. When I run an emulator I expect a recreation
of the original machine / OS / whatever. wine expressly doesn't provide
this; you don't run wine and get a windows desktop with a start button
and an annoying paperclip, etc. you use wine to run windows programs,
it's not exactly emulating windows because you can't run wine then point
at something and go "look! windows!". badly phrased, but I hope you get
what I mean.
-- 
adamw

Re: [Cooker] Wishlist: spam filtering

[Vox]

Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 10:58:50PM +0100, Adam Williamson wrote:
> > With all respect, newbie users aren't likely to be using sendmail,
> > procmail and mutt/pine. They're going to be using KMail, or Evolution,
> > and checking their mail directly through these programs. That doesn't
> > leave much space for a Mandrake-created spam filter, though you could
> > provide them with pre-written spam-filtering rules in their own
> > filtering setups. I don't personally think this would be a good idea,
> > though.
> 
> An excellent point.  As it stands now the only way to run spamassasin is
> through procmail (well okay Mail::Audit too but nobody really uses that
> [/me puts on flame retardent pants here]).  But if you're using Kmail
> and checking directly via POP or IMAP you can't use procmail so it won't
> work.  Which comes back to my statement that it's impossible to do

  But KMail can use spamassassin directly, or so I remember reading
  somewhere...probably spamassassin's site itself.

  Vox

-- 
Pain is the gift of the gods, and I'm the one they chose as their messenger
For info on safety in the BDSM lifestyle http://www.the-vox.com

Think of the Linux community as a niche economy isolated by its beliefs.  Kind
of like the Amish, except that our religion requires us to use _higher_
technology than everyone else.   -- Donald B. Marti Jr.

Re: [Cooker] wine %description

[Per Øyvind Karlsen]

ah, I actually got to the point afterwards:)
anyways, if something's wrong, it should be corrected, even if it's just 
a %description
The maintaner could just explain shortly that wine is a windows 
implementation, and that people may think of it as windows for linux, or 
something similar, whatever that's correct
:)
Philippe Coulonges wrote:

>-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
>Hash: SHA1
>
>Le Jeudi 22 Août 2002 01:00, Per Øyvind Karlsen a goretquoté :
>
>  
>
>>?
>>
>>
>
>Wine Is Not An Emulator.
>
>As such, it can only work on an Intel platform, executing native Windows 
>binaries.
>Opposite to Windows, Linux works on many hardware platforms, but Wine can't, 
>because it is not an emulator.
>
>Does it makes the point clearer ?
>
>CU
>CPHIL
>
>- -- 
>  ()Campagne du ruban ASCII :
>  /\Contre les mails en HTML et les vcard !
>-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
>Version: GnuPG v1.0.7 (GNU/Linux)
>
>iD8DBQE9ZB3TYJwqltj/jHgRAlqVAKCJVBzjRSFPSMcRp7Nnicgls5Y2sACeLPzW
>NQUoGz3KIGlHTsA/UgkHadU=
>=zmp5
>-END PGP SIGNATURE-
>
>
>
>
>  
>

Re: [Cooker] wine %description

[Per Øyvind Karlsen]

Mandrake is not _ONLY_ targeted at "newbies", and describing wine as an 
emulator when it's not (WINE still stands for Wine Is Not an Emulator;) 
will make "hackers" think of us as stupid;)
anyways, it's not harder than just grab the description from 
winehq.com/about

 From winehq.com/about:

"Wine is an implementation of the Windows Win32 and Win16 APIs on top of 
X and Unix. Think of Wine as a Windows compatibility layer. Wine 
provides both a development toolkit (Winelib) for porting Windows 
sources to Unix and a program loader, allowing many unmodified Windows 
3.x/95/98/ME/NT/W2K/XP binaries to run under Intel Unixes. Wine works on 
most popular Intel Unixes, including Linux , 
FreeBSD , and Solaris 
.

Wine does not require Microsoft Windows, as it is a completely 
alternative implementation consisting of 100% Microsoft-free code, but 
it can optionally use native system DLLs if they are available. Wine 
comes with complete sources, documentation and examples and is freely 
redistributable. (The licensing terms 
are the GNU Lesser General 
Public License.)"

This should explain it good enough that most linux users understand what 
it's for, and if it's still not good enough it's just to explain it 
better, but still, claiming that wine is an emulator, when it's not, 
well... it's kinda ..

 From the wine package

"%description
This is an ALPHA release of Wine, the MS-Windows emulator.  This is
still a developers release and many applications may still not work.

This package consists of the emulator program for running windows 
executables.

Wine is often updated."

I actually don't think this explains it much better for those without 
much technical knowledge, and naming Wine "the MS-Windows emulator", 
that's actually quite stupid.
Anyways the explanation from winehq is better and correct, and probably 
not more confusing for a new user than the one from the wine package



Ben Reser wrote:

>On Thu, Aug 22, 2002 at 01:42:57AM +0200, Philippe Coulonges wrote:
>  
>
>>In my response, I mistaken your message and the one from Ben Reser.
>>Rereading it, it may look like you're the one that don't understand the 
>>difference, but he is.
>>
>>
>
>I most certianly *DO* understand the difference.  But you're applying
>the term emulator to only processor emulation which is certainly a fine
>distinction that maybe hackers make, but the dictionary and common users
>do not make!  And considering that for the most part Mandrake is for
>common users not hackers (though some of us use Mandrake) we should be
>using language common users understand not elitist hacker definitions.
>
>  
>

Re: [Cooker] messy shutdown?

[Ben Reser]

On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 04:18:36PM -0700, David Walser wrote:
> If you start dm as a service, it can start getting
> started before some of the other services, and some of
> the other services don't really need to be done before
> X starts, so you can basically boot to X faster this
> way.  With inittab, it wouldn't start launching until
> *all* services had started.
> 
> In fact, I can now remember people asking for Mandrake
> to do just this.

That's what I assumed was the reason.  But it would be nice to know
why...

> Peter Ruskin also suggested we did this to "copy
> someone else," so I'm wondering if RH has gone this
> way.
> 
> I guess I'm not against them doing this, although so
> close to release was not smart, as its causing
> problems, and I hope they all get ironed out.  It
> would have also been nice if flepied (I think he made
> the change) had posted a short note when he made the
> change explaining why.  It took me a while to (I
> think) figure it out.

Agreeded...

-- 
Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
http://ben.reser.org

If your love has no hope of being welcomed do not voice it; for if it 
be silent it can endure, a guarded flame, within you.
- The Wisdom of the Sands

Re: [Cooker] Wishlist: spam filtering

[Igor Izyumin]

On Wednesday 21 August 2002 06:54 pm, Ben Reser wrote:
> Tell the email clients and the mail servers to put hooks in for using
> tools like spamassassin.  As it stands now it's not designed to be used
> by the average end user.  All that could/would change if email clients
> (in particular) and mail servers included hooks for spamassassin and
> it's brethren.  But they don't.  Which leaves us with using procmail.
> And parsing and adding procmail rules for someone is pretty much
> impossible to do in a way that is reliable.  So don't ask Mandrake to
> fix this.  Ask your favorite mail client/server author to add support
> for it.
>
> Simply making their client/server capable of internally sending messages
> to spamd would be more than sufficient to make this possible.

Besides, what happens if the spam filter catches a non-spam email?  You can 
never trust those systems, because they are pretty stupid.  Only sufficiently 
advanced users should be using them, and only when they know the 
consequences.  The best solution to the spam problem is to not stick your 
email into every form out there (or to have a "junk" email addy on hotmail or 
something).  Trying to filter spam with stupid keyword-based tools 
(spamassassin) is dangerous, and making it a default is insane.
-- 
-- Igor

Re: [Cooker] Wishlist: spam filtering

[Ben Reser]

On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 05:39:57PM -0400, Richard Tango-Lowy wrote:
> "Think like a user, Luke."
> 
> My sister would like to replace windows with linux on her machine. She
> gets a lot of spam, and is certainly not competent to set up a spam filter
> on her own. It would be nice if Mandrake was able to take care of it for
> her (and all the other non-hacker users in the world).

Tell the email clients and the mail servers to put hooks in for using
tools like spamassassin.  As it stands now it's not designed to be used
by the average end user.  All that could/would change if email clients
(in particular) and mail servers included hooks for spamassassin and
it's brethren.  But they don't.  Which leaves us with using procmail.
And parsing and adding procmail rules for someone is pretty much
impossible to do in a way that is reliable.  So don't ask Mandrake to
fix this.  Ask your favorite mail client/server author to add support
for it.

Simply making their client/server capable of internally sending messages
to spamd would be more than sufficient to make this possible.

-- 
Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
http://ben.reser.org

If your love has no hope of being welcomed do not voice it; for if it 
be silent it can endure, a guarded flame, within you.
- The Wisdom of the Sands

Re: [Cooker] Wishlist: spam filtering

[Ben Reser]

On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 10:58:50PM +0100, Adam Williamson wrote:
> With all respect, newbie users aren't likely to be using sendmail,
> procmail and mutt/pine. They're going to be using KMail, or Evolution,
> and checking their mail directly through these programs. That doesn't
> leave much space for a Mandrake-created spam filter, though you could
> provide them with pre-written spam-filtering rules in their own
> filtering setups. I don't personally think this would be a good idea,
> though.

An excellent point.  As it stands now the only way to run spamassasin is
through procmail (well okay Mail::Audit too but nobody really uses that
[/me puts on flame retardent pants here]).  But if you're using Kmail
and checking directly via POP or IMAP you can't use procmail so it won't
work.  Which comes back to my statement that it's impossible to do
because there are too many different client/server configuration
possibilities.

-- 
Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
http://ben.reser.org

If your love has no hope of being welcomed do not voice it; for if it 
be silent it can endure, a guarded flame, within you.
- The Wisdom of the Sands

Re: [Cooker] weird vim behaviour under konsole/kde-3.0.3

[Per Øyvind Karlsen]

Per Øyvind Karlsen wrote:

> On a norwegian keyboard layout, whenever using the 'End' key in vim, 
> it outputs F+ instead, I'm not quite sure if this only happens 
> when using norwegian keyboard layout nor if it's only konsole related, 
> but I'm quite sure this weird behaviour showed up after upgrading to 
> kde-3.0.3, and it does'nt seem to happen when using vim from eg. console
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
hmm, after doing some checking, I'm not that quite certain that this is 
even reprodusable, it seem's like this only happened on one terminal in 
konsole, the others seem fine, maybe I just hit some buttons causing 
this, I'll come back and bitch about this later if it happens again;)

Re: [Cooker] Question

[Igor Izyumin]

On Wednesday 21 August 2002 01:26 pm, Philippe Coulonges wrote:
> Speaking of the Mandrake Linux bookmarks, could you consider putting
> http://validator.w3.org in it. I include it for all my users and explain
> how this tool can serve to determine who of the browser or the site is
> faulty.
>
> Everybody should use this.

It's not particularly useful for determining who is at fault, though.  Any 
given page will have errors in it unless it has been validated previously and 
the errors were fixed (that thing whines about every single stupid thing), 
and you can make web pages that are awful but validate perfectly.
-- 
-- Igor

Re: [Cooker] wine %description

[Ben Reser]

On Thu, Aug 22, 2002 at 01:42:57AM +0200, Philippe Coulonges wrote:
> In my response, I mistaken your message and the one from Ben Reser.
> Rereading it, it may look like you're the one that don't understand the 
> difference, but he is.

I most certianly *DO* understand the difference.  But you're applying
the term emulator to only processor emulation which is certainly a fine
distinction that maybe hackers make, but the dictionary and common users
do not make!  And considering that for the most part Mandrake is for
common users not hackers (though some of us use Mandrake) we should be
using language common users understand not elitist hacker definitions.

-- 
Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
http://ben.reser.org

If your love has no hope of being welcomed do not voice it; for if it 
be silent it can endure, a guarded flame, within you.
- The Wisdom of the Sands

Re: [Cooker] Multimedia audio controller: Intel Corp. 82801BA/BAM AC'97 Audio (rev 02)

[Jairo E. Serrano C.]

agpgart : Intel Corporation|82815 815 Chipset Host Bridge and Memory 
Controller Hub
Card:Intel 815  : Intel Corporation|82815 CGC [Chipset Graphics Controller]
unknown : Intel Corporation|82820 815e (Camino 2) Chipset PCI
i810-tco: Intel Corporation|82820 815e (Camino 2) Chipset ISA Bridge 
(ICH2)
unknown : Intel Corporation|82820 815e (Camino 2) Chipset IDE U100
usb-uhci: Intel Corporation|82820 815e (Camino 2) Chipset USB (Hub A)
unknown : Intel Corporation|82820 815e (Camino 2) Chipset SMBus
usb-uhci: Intel Corporation|82820 815e (Camino 2) Chipset USB (Hub B)
i810_audio  : Intel Corporation|ICH2 810 Chipset AC'97 Audio Controller
8139too : Realtek|RTL-8139
Card:ATI Rage 128: ATI|Rage 128 Pro
unknown : Virtual|Hub []
unknown : Virtual|Hub []

-- 
Jairo E. Serrano C.
Savio 2002

Re: [Cooker] wine %description

[Philippe Coulonges]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Le Jeudi 22 Août 2002 01:00, Per Øyvind Karlsen a goretquoté :
> ?

Sorry.

In my response, I mistaken your message and the one from Ben Reser.
Rereading it, it may look like you're the one that don't understand the 
difference, but he is.

For Linux PPC, I was just kidding.

CU
CPHIL

- -- 
Je compose de la musique aussi naturellement
qu'une truie peut pisser.
-- Mozart.
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Version: GnuPG v1.0.7 (GNU/Linux)

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0Vc7X4cAnknYytN2CEINZv4=
=ECgG
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

Re: [Cooker] wine %description

[Philippe Coulonges]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Le Jeudi 22 Août 2002 01:00, Per Øyvind Karlsen a goretquoté :

> ?

Wine Is Not An Emulator.

As such, it can only work on an Intel platform, executing native Windows 
binaries.
Opposite to Windows, Linux works on many hardware platforms, but Wine can't, 
because it is not an emulator.

Does it makes the point clearer ?

CU
CPHIL

- -- 
  ()Campagne du ruban ASCII :
  /\Contre les mails en HTML et les vcard !
-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: GnuPG v1.0.7 (GNU/Linux)

iD8DBQE9ZB3TYJwqltj/jHgRAlqVAKCJVBzjRSFPSMcRp7Nnicgls5Y2sACeLPzW
NQUoGz3KIGlHTsA/UgkHadU=
=zmp5
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

Re: [Cooker] Multimedia audio controller: Intel Corp. 82801BA/BAM AC'97 Audio (rev 02)

[Jairo E. Serrano C.]

/sbin/lsmod
Module  Size  Used byNot tainted
loop   11376   0  (autoclean)
lp  6720   0  (unused)
parport_pc 21672   1
parport23936   1  [lp parport_pc]
nls_iso8859-15  3356  18  (autoclean)
msdos   5356   0  (autoclean)
vfat9548   0  (autoclean)
fat31864   0  (autoclean) [msdos vfat]
isofs  25652   1  (autoclean)
inflate_fs 17860   0  (autoclean) [isofs]
udf85472   0  (autoclean)
sr_mod 15096   2  (autoclean)
floppy 49340   0  (autoclean)
binfmt_misc 5696   1
snd-seq-oss26176   0  (unused)
snd-seq-midi-event  3208   0  [snd-seq-oss]
snd-seq32976   2  [snd-seq-oss snd-seq-midi-event]
snd-pcm-oss36228   0
snd-mixer-oss   9016   0  [snd-pcm-oss]
snd-intel8x0   11008   0
snd-ac97-codec 24868   0  [snd-intel8x0]
snd-pcm49568   0  [snd-pcm-oss snd-intel8x0]
snd-timer   9932   0  [snd-seq snd-pcm]
snd-mpu401-uart 2752   0  [snd-intel8x0]
snd-rawmidi12864   0  [snd-mpu401-uart]
snd-seq-device  3836   0  [snd-seq-oss snd-seq snd-rawmidi]
snd24804   0  [snd-seq-oss snd-seq-midi-event snd-seq 
snd-pcm-oss snd-mixer-oss snd-intel8x0 snd-ac97-codec snd-pcm snd-timer 
snd-mpu401-uart snd-rawmidi snd-seq-device]
soundcore   3780   0  [snd]
r128   75352  19
agpgart31840   1  (autoclean)
nfsd   65904   8  (autoclean)
lockd  46480   1  (autoclean) [nfsd]
sunrpc 60316   1  (autoclean) [nfsd lockd]
ip_vs  62040   0  (autoclean)
usb-uhci   21676   0  (unused)
usbcore57984   1  [usb-uhci]
af_packet  13000   1  (autoclean)
8139too14472   1  (autoclean)
mii 1152   0  (autoclean) [8139too]
supermount 14532   3  (autoclean)
reiserfs  169840   1  (autoclean)
ide-cd 28744   0
cdrom  26848   0  [sr_mod ide-cd]
ide-scsi8180   1
scsi_mod   90436   2  [sr_mod ide-scsi]
rtc 6560   0  (autoclean)
ext3   59724   2
jbd38452   2  [ext3]
-- 
Jairo E. Serrano C.
Savio 2002

[Cooker] new contrib package qinx-0.3.src.rpm

[Elliott Martin]

I have uploaded an rpm for the Qinx KDE style to the contrib dir, in case 
anyone else wants to use it.

-Elliott

[Cooker] weird klipper behaviour during high load or laggy x-session

[Per Øyvind Karlsen]

When using klipper with Actions enabled it keep show up for no reason 
about every minute when the system is under high load, under a slow 
x-session, practically whenever things are slow.

This gets _REALLY_ annoying after a while;)

Re: [Cooker] messy shutdown?

[David Walser]

--- Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> The question was asked but there has yet to be a
> straight answer.  WHY
> did we switch from inittab to a initscript?

It was me who asked, thanks for reposting my question.
 I was going to earlier today, but something someone
said made me realize (I think) why they did it.

If you start dm as a service, it can start getting
started before some of the other services, and some of
the other services don't really need to be done before
X starts, so you can basically boot to X faster this
way.  With inittab, it wouldn't start launching until
*all* services had started.

In fact, I can now remember people asking for Mandrake
to do just this.

Peter Ruskin also suggested we did this to "copy
someone else," so I'm wondering if RH has gone this
way.

I guess I'm not against them doing this, although so
close to release was not smart, as its causing
problems, and I hope they all get ironed out.  It
would have also been nice if flepied (I think he made
the change) had posted a short note when he made the
change explaining why.  It took me a while to (I
think) figure it out.

__
Do You Yahoo!?
HotJobs - Search Thousands of New Jobs
http://www.hotjobs.com

Re: [Cooker] new contrib package qinx-0.3.src.rpm

[Per Øyvind Karlsen]

Elliott Martin wrote:

>I have uploaded an rpm for the Qinx KDE style to the contrib dir, in case 
>anyone else wants to use it.
>
>-Elliott
>
>
>
>  
>
uhhr, you mean you've uploaded it to 
ftp://ftp.linux-mandrake.com/incoming/ ?
you do know that other people cannot download from incoming?

if you've planned to submit it to mandrake contribs, and have mailed 
[EMAIL PROTECTED], that's the right place, if you're not, you should 
rather upload it somewhere else, where other people will be able to 
download it

oh, btw. I read through this mail before I sent it, and it sounded kinda 
harsh, not my intension at all:)

-Per Øyvind

Re: [Cooker] Multimedia audio controller: Intel Corp. 82801BA/BAM AC'97 Audio (rev 02)

[Todd Lyons]

Jairo E. Serrano C. wrote on Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 06:07:26PM -0500 :
> /sbin/lsmod
> Module  Size  Used byNot tainted
> snd-seq-oss26176   0  (unused)
> snd-seq-midi-event  3208   0  [snd-seq-oss]
> snd-seq32976   2  [snd-seq-oss snd-seq-midi-event]
> snd-pcm-oss36228   0
> snd-mixer-oss   9016   0  [snd-pcm-oss]
> snd-intel8x0   11008   0
> snd-ac97-codec 24868   0  [snd-intel8x0]
> snd-pcm49568   0  [snd-pcm-oss snd-intel8x0]
> snd-timer   9932   0  [snd-seq snd-pcm]
> snd-mpu401-uart 2752   0  [snd-intel8x0]
> snd-rawmidi12864   0  [snd-mpu401-uart]
> snd-seq-device  3836   0  [snd-seq-oss snd-seq snd-rawmidi]
> snd24804   0  [snd-seq-oss snd-seq-midi-event snd-seq 
> snd-pcm-oss snd-mixer-oss snd-intel8x0 snd-ac97-codec snd-pcm snd-timer 
> snd-mpu401-uart snd-rawmidi snd-seq-device]
> soundcore   3780   0  [snd]

The output of lspcidrake showed that it wants to use i810_audio, which
is an OSS driver, but your system is configured for snd-intel-8x0, which
is an ALSA driver.  Modify your /etc/modules.conf by replacing every
occurance of snd-intel8x0 with i810_audio, which will probably be on two
lines.  Then restart your alsa and sound services.  You might have to
manually remove the alsa devices (all of those listed above).

Blue skies...   Todd
-- 
  Todd Lyons -- MandrakeSoft, Inc.   http://www.mandrakesoft.com/
UNIX was not designed to stop you from doing stupid things, because 
  that would also stop you from doing clever things. -- Doug Gwyn
   Cooker Version mandrake-release-9.0-0.3mdk Kernel 2.4.19-4mdk



msg71943/pgp0.pgp
Description: PGP signature

[Cooker] Corrent missing dependancies from cooker.

[Brook Humphrey]

This is from a current fmirror and is up to date is of now.
When you run MakeCD these are the files with messed up dependancies.

MISSING_DEPENDENCIES gnudip-server-2.1.2-4mdk.noarch perl-MD5
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES crossfire-1.0.0-2mdk.i586 crossfire-maps
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES libmonkey-sound0-0.4.1-2mdk.i586 libvorbisfile.so.0
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES bayonne-FrenchF-0.8.0-1mdk.i586 libccscript2-0.0.so.0
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES PyQt-3.1-1mdk.i586 libsip.so.8 libsip8 libqt-mt.so.2
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES crossfire-crossedit-1.0.0-2mdk.i586 crossfire-maps
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES GiNaC-utils-1.0.10-1mdk.i586 libstdc++.so.5(GLIBCPP_3.1)
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES bayonne-0.8.0-1mdk.i586 libccscript2-0.0.so.0
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES dnsutl-1.6-4mdk.i586 libintl.so.1
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES dhcp-conf-0.7.0-4mdk.i586 dhcp
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES camstream-0.25-4mdk.i586 libqt.so.2
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES checkhomeownership-0.02-1mdk.i586 qmail
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES kdebindings-devel-3.0.2-1mdk.i586 
libstdc++.so.5(GLIBCPP_3.1)
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES libicq2000-0.3.2-2mdk.i586 libstdc++.so.5(GLIBCPP_3.1)
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES smtpmap-0.7-1mdk.i586 libstdc++.so.5(GLIBCPP_3.1)
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES qvwm-1.1.12-2mdk.i586 libstdc++.so.5(GLIBCPP_3.1)
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES cryptops-0.4-3mdk.i586 libpisock.so.4
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES vanilla-gum-2.9pl7-3mdk.i586 vanilla-2.9pl7
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES BasiliskII-jit-sheepnet-smp-1.0-0.3mdk.i586 
kernel-smp-2.4.18.21mdk
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES mplayer-radeonvid-smp2.4.19.3-0.90-0.pre6.10mdk.i586 
kernel-smp-2.4.19.3mdk
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES geotiff-1.1.4-2mdk.i586 libgeotiff.so
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES ximian-setup-tools-0.11.0-2mdk.i586 
libconfig_archiver.so.0
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES timed-0.17-4mdk.i586 inetd
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES dvgrab-1.1-0.1b2mdk.i586 libraw1394
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES mplayer-mgavid-smp2.4.19.3-0.90-0.pre6.10mdk.i586 
kernel-smp-2.4.19.3mdk
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES BasiliskII-jit-sheepnet-enterprise-1.0-0.3mdk.i586 
kernel-enterprise-2.4.18.21mdk
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES gsmssend-1.7-1mdk.i586 libskyutils.so
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES dnstouch-0.4-4mdk.i586 libgcc3.1 
libstdc++.so.5(GLIBCPP_3.1)
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES 
mplayer-radeonvid-enterprise2.4.19.3-0.90-0.pre6.10mdk.i586 
kernel-enterprise-2.4.19.3mdk
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES bayonne-UsEngM-0.8.0-1mdk.i586 libccscript2-0.0.so.0
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES BasiliskII-jit-sheepnet-1.0-0.3mdk.i586 
kernel-2.4.18.21mdk
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES lilypond-1.4.2-1mdk.i586 libintl.so.1
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES mplayer-mgavid2.4.19.3-0.90-0.pre6.10mdk.i586 
kernel-2.4.19.3mdk
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES enigma-0.40a-1mdk.i586 libstdc++.so.5(GLIBCPP_3.1)
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES yank-0.2.1-1mdk.i586 libpisock.so.4
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES gfontview-0.5.0-5mdk.i586 libintl.so.1
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES gnustep-base-1.4.0-1mdk.i586 libgnustep-base.so.1
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES mplayer-mgavid-enterprise2.4.19.3-0.90-0.pre6.10mdk.i586 
kernel-enterprise-2.4.19.3mdk
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES gnudip-client-2.1.2-4mdk.noarch perl-MD5-1.7
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES libmonkey-sound0-devel-0.4.1-2mdk.i586 libvorbisfile.so.0
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES kdebindings-3.0.2-1mdk.i586 libstdc++.so.5(GLIBCPP_3.1)
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES ooqstart-gnome-0.8.3-1mdk.i586 libpanel_applet.so.0
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES bayonne-FrenchM-0.8.0-1mdk.i586 libccscript2-0.0.so.0
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES xvnews-2.3.2-3mdk.i586 libintl.so.1
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES xmpi-2.2.3b6-1mdk.i586 lam-runtime
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES lam-devel-6.5.6-15mdk.i586 liblam0-devel
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES openldap1-1.2.12-1mdk.i586 libldap1
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES umlmodeller-1.0.3-5mdk.i586 libkio.so.3 libkdeui.so.3 
libkdeprint.so.0 libkdesu.so.1 libqt.so.2 libkhtml.so.3 libkfile.so.3 
libDCOP.so.1 libkssl.so.2 libksycoca.so.3 libkparts.so.1 libkdecore.so.3
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES denemo-0.5.5-3mdk.i586 libintl.so.1
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES vcd-0.3.5-3mdk.i586 libasound.so.1
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES digikam-0.5-3mdk.i586 libexif.so.5
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES mplayer-radeonvid2.4.19.3-0.90-0.pre6.10mdk.i586 
kernel-2.4.19.3mdk
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES AlephOne-0.12.0-2mdk.i586 libstdc++.so.5(GLIBCPP_3.1)
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES xgospel-1.12d-5mdk.i586 libintl.so.1
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES bayonne-sunrpc-devel-0.8.0-1mdk.i586 sunrpc
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES malsync-2.1.0-1mdk.i586 libpisock.so.5
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES jahshaka-1.8.5-1mdk.i586 libqt.so.2
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES ami-gnome-1.0.11-2mdk.i586 libpanel_applet.so.0
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES aoss-0.9.0-0.3rc1mdk.i586 libalsa-oss0
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES netrek-gum-2.9pl7-4mdk.i586 netrek-vanilla-2.9pl7
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES lilypond-extras-1.4.2-1mdk.i586 libintl.so.1
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES libicq2000-devel-0.3.2-2mdk.i586 
libstdc++.so.5(GLIBCPP_3.1)
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES bayonne-sunrpc-0.8.0-1mdk.i586 libccscript2-0.0.so.0
MISSING_DEPENDENCIES w3cam-0.7.1-1mdk.i586 libintl.so.1

-- 
 -~`'~-~`'~-~`'~-~`'~-~`'~-~`'~-~`'~-~`'~-~`'~-~`'~-~`'~-~`'~-~`'~-~`'~-~`'~-
  Brook Humphrey   
Mobile PC Medic, 420 1st, Cheney, WA 99004, 509-235-9107

[Cooker] Re: [CHRPM] drakxtools-1.1.9-15mdk

[David Walser]

--- Thierry Vignaud <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Name: drakxtools  
> * Wed Aug 21 2002 Thierry Vignaud
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 1.1.9-15mdk
> 
> - add draksound

Yeah!!!  You rock Thierry :o)

Any possibility for this to be integrated into DrakX
(expert mode)?  Maybe a button on the summary screen
(has like timezone, printer, keyboard, and something
else I think currently).

__
Do You Yahoo!?
HotJobs - Search Thousands of New Jobs
http://www.hotjobs.com

Re: [Cooker] Multimedia audio controller: Intel Corp. 82801BA/BAM AC'97 Audio (rev 02)

[Jairo E. Serrano C.]

 aumix -q
vol 100, 100, P
pcm 100, 100
speaker 67, 67
line 68, 68, P
mic 0, 0, R
cd 81, 81, P
igain 67, 67
line1 68, 68, P
phin 68, 68, P
video 68, 68, P

-- 
Jairo E. Serrano C.
Savio 2002

Re: [Cooker] Multimedia audio controller: Intel Corp. 82801BA/BAM AC'97 Audio (rev 02)

[Jairo E. Serrano C.]

lspcidrake -v
agpgart : Intel Corporation|82815 815 Chipset Host Bridge and Memory 
Controller Hub [BRIDGE_HOST] (vendor:8086 device:1130 subv:8086 subd:4532)
Card:Intel 815  : Intel Corporation|82815 CGC [Chipset Graphics Controller] 
[DISPLAY_VGA] (vendor:8086 device:1132 subv:8086 subd:4532)
unknown : Intel Corporation|82820 815e (Camino 2) Chipset PCI 
[BRIDGE_PCI] (vendor:8086 device:244e)
i810-tco: Intel Corporation|82820 815e (Camino 2) Chipset ISA Bridge 
(ICH2) [BRIDGE_ISA] (vendor:8086 device:2440)
unknown : Intel Corporation|82820 815e (Camino 2) Chipset IDE U100 
[STORAGE_IDE] (vendor:8086 device:244b subv:8086 subd:4532)
usb-uhci: Intel Corporation|82820 815e (Camino 2) Chipset USB (Hub A) 
[SERIAL_USB] (vendor:8086 device:2442 subv:8086 subd:4532)
unknown : Intel Corporation|82820 815e (Camino 2) Chipset SMBus 
[SERIAL_SMBUS] (vendor:8086 device:2443 subv:8086 subd:4532)
usb-uhci: Intel Corporation|82820 815e (Camino 2) Chipset USB (Hub B) 
[SERIAL_USB] (vendor:8086 device:2444 subv:8086 subd:4532)
i810_audio  : Intel Corporation|ICH2 810 Chipset AC'97 Audio Controller 
[MULTIMEDIA_AUDIO] (vendor:8086 device:2445 subv:8086 subd:4532)
8139too : Realtek|RTL-8139 [NETWORK_ETHERNET] (vendor:10ec 
device:8139)
Card:ATI Rage 128: ATI|Rage 128 Pro [DISPLAY_VGA] (vendor:1002 device:5044 
subv:1002 subd:0029)
unknown : Virtual|Hub [] (vendor: device:)
unknown : Virtual|Hub [] (vendor: device:)

-- 
Jairo E. Serrano C.
Savio 2002

[Cooker] kdevelop and automake

[Ben Reser]

kdevelop wants automake 1.5 or newer.  If you don't have automake then
generating a new project won't work right.  Not sure if it should be a
requirement or not.  But if so then kdevelop should Require automake >
1.5...

-- 
Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
http://ben.reser.org

If your love has no hope of being welcomed do not voice it; for if it 
be silent it can endure, a guarded flame, within you.
- The Wisdom of the Sands

[Cooker] weird vim behaviour under konsole/kde-3.0.3

[Per Øyvind Karlsen]

On a norwegian keyboard layout, whenever using the 'End' key in vim, it 
outputs F+ instead, I'm not quite sure if this only happens when 
using norwegian keyboard layout nor if it's only konsole related, but 
I'm quite sure this weird behaviour showed up after upgrading to 
kde-3.0.3, and it does'nt seem to happen when using vim from eg. console

Re: [Cooker] wine %description

[Per Øyvind Karlsen]

?
Philippe Coulonges wrote:

>-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
>Hash: SHA1
>
>Le Mercredi 21 Août 2002 23:18, Ben Reser a écrit :
>  
>
>>On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 10:03:18AM +0200, Per Øyvind Karlsen wrote:
>>
>>
>
>  
>
>>>wine's %description are incorrect, wine is NOT an emulator;)
>>>Time to finally correct this?
>>>  
>>>
>>Blah who cares... It's an emulator of the interface.  Unless you're
>>using the actual windows binaries it's emulation.  Try looking up the
>>word emulator sometime:
>>http://www.dictionary.com/search?q=emulator
>>
>>Most users don't know the fine distinction anyway and frankly using the
>>term emulator is more clear.
>>
>>
>
>It looks like we just found the perfect maintainer for wine in Mandrake PPC.
>
>CU
>CPHIL
>
>- -- 
>Hé papa, je ne savais pas que "FORMAT C:" faisait ca !? 
>-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
>Version: GnuPG v1.0.7 (GNU/Linux)
>
>iD8DBQE9ZBQqYJwqltj/jHgRAu9KAKCl1Cd17pL1mwIok5CXnMPMIXxRJwCZASuT
>icxSSVI77gexQ5bM0HjxyqY=
>=igfu
>-END PGP SIGNATURE-
>
>
>
>
>  
>

Re: [Cooker] wine %description

[Philippe Coulonges]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Le Mercredi 21 Août 2002 23:18, Ben Reser a écrit :
> On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 10:03:18AM +0200, Per Øyvind Karlsen wrote:

> > wine's %description are incorrect, wine is NOT an emulator;)
> > Time to finally correct this?
>
> Blah who cares... It's an emulator of the interface.  Unless you're
> using the actual windows binaries it's emulation.  Try looking up the
> word emulator sometime:
> http://www.dictionary.com/search?q=emulator
>
> Most users don't know the fine distinction anyway and frankly using the
> term emulator is more clear.

It looks like we just found the perfect maintainer for wine in Mandrake PPC.

CU
CPHIL

- -- 
Hé papa, je ne savais pas que "FORMAT C:" faisait ca !? 
-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: GnuPG v1.0.7 (GNU/Linux)

iD8DBQE9ZBQqYJwqltj/jHgRAu9KAKCl1Cd17pL1mwIok5CXnMPMIXxRJwCZASuT
icxSSVI77gexQ5bM0HjxyqY=
=igfu
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

[Cooker] kernel-2.4.19.4: alsa not working

[Michael Reinsch]

Hi!

With the latest kernel  all audio applications froze before starting to play; one has 
to kill them. 

I use the module snd-cs46xx; the soundcard is a Cirrus Logic|CS 4614/22/24 
[CrystalClear SoundFusion Audio Accelerator] in a ThinkPad T20.

Looking at dmesg, I see the following:

dsp_spos: WARNING current parameter data may be overwriten!
dsp_spos: symbol  duplicated
dsp_spos: symbol  duplicated
dsp_spos: symbol  duplicated
dsp_spos: symbol  duplicated
dsp_spos: symbol  duplicated
dsp_spos: symbol  duplicated
dsp_spos: symbol  duplicated
dsp_spos: symbol  duplicated
dsp_spos: symbol  duplicated
dsp_spos: symbol  duplicated
dsp_spos: symbol  duplicated
dsp_spos: symbol  duplicated
dsp_spos: symbol  duplicated
dsp_spos: symbol  duplicated
dsp_spos: symbol  duplicated
dsp_spos: symbol  duplicated
dsp_spos: symbol  duplicated
dsp_spos: symbol  duplicated
dsp_spos: symbol  duplicated
dsp_spos: symbol  duplicated
dsp_spos: SPIOWriteTask not responding
dsp_spos: SPIOWriteTask not responding
dsp_spos: SPIOWriteTask not responding

I hope this helps?

-- 
  Michael Reinsch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>   http://mr.uue.org

Re: [Cooker] Gnome2 + Sawfish (moving & resizing windows)

[Levi Ramsey]

On Wed Aug 21 17:52 -0400, Richard Tango-Lowy wrote:
> Metacity's fine, but it's missing some of the niceties.
> - Can't drag windows between workspaces
> - Can't make session-started apps sticky (like gkrellm).

Personally I've avoided metacity.  I was merely parodizing Red Hat's
common response to sawfish bug reports.

-- 
Levi Ramsey
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Was it something I said?
And the stars look down.
Linux 2.4.19-2mdk
  6:15pm  up 1 day,  3:07,  9 users,  load average: 0.37, 0.36, 0.31

[Cooker] drakxservices list empty on console

[rcc]

the GTK version in X is fine

but on a console drakxservices shows an empty list, there are just the
OK and CANCEL buttons

drakxtools-newt-1.1.9-14mdk

- Mark

Re: [Cooker] Latest Cooker install issues - PROBLEM FOUND

[Thierry Vignaud]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Robert Fox) writes:

> Found the problem.  After a fresh install with latest Cooker, it
> seems to recognize the TV Tuner audio cipset (which it never did
> before!)
>
> The btaudio module was taking precedence over the standard sound device (/dev/dsp)
>
> This should actually come AFTER the standard sound device (ES1371)
> I found my system works just fine without the btaudio!

for the moment, i altered list_modules.pm to list btaudio in other and
not anymore in multimedia/sound.

another solution would be to ensure that btaudio get never in
snd-sound-slot0, detect btaudio special case somewhere and add an
"pre-install btaudio modprobe snd-sound-slot0"
but that would interfere with sound and alsa services

Re: [Cooker] Wishlist: spam filtering

[Adam Williamson]

On Wed, 2002-08-21 at 22:39, Richard Tango-Lowy wrote:
> "Think like a user, Luke."
> 
> My sister would like to replace windows with linux on her machine. She
> gets a lot of spam, and is certainly not competent to set up a spam filter
> on her own. It would be nice if Mandrake was able to take care of it for
> her (and all the other non-hacker users in the world).

With all respect, newbie users aren't likely to be using sendmail,
procmail and mutt/pine. They're going to be using KMail, or Evolution,
and checking their mail directly through these programs. That doesn't
leave much space for a Mandrake-created spam filter, though you could
provide them with pre-written spam-filtering rules in their own
filtering setups. I don't personally think this would be a good idea,
though.
-- 
adamw

Re: [Cooker] Latest Cooker install issues - PROBLEM FOUND

[Robert Fox]

Found the problem.  After a fresh install with latest Cooker, it seems to recognize 
the TV Tuner audio cipset (which it never did before!)

The btaudio module was taking precedence over the standard sound device (/dev/dsp)

This should actually come AFTER the standard sound device (ES1371)
I found my system works just fine without the btaudio!

Here's the modules.conf and the commented out line:

probeall scsi_hostadapter aic7xxx
probeall usb-interface usb-uhci
#alias sound-slot-1 btaudio <--- Had to comment this out 
alias eth0 3c59x
alias sound-slot-0 es1371
alias usb-interface0 usb-uhci

Thx,
R.Fox

On Wed, 2002-08-21 at 22:57, Robert Fox wrote:
> I have installed Cooker this evening (as of this e-mail) on two machines
> - same results:
> 
> Aug 21 22:39:21 localhost depmod: *** Unresolved symbols in
> /lib/modules/2.4.19-4mdk/kernel/drivers/media/video/saa7134.o.gz
> 
> Also please see attached DrakX screenshot - I get something funny about
> the BT878 (TerratecTV+ card) and the sound card - is this normal?
> 
> The sound card did not function on first boot . ..
> 
> Thx,
> R.Fox

Re: [Cooker] Latest Cooker install issues

[Robert Fox]

Follow-up on my sound problem.  It appears that the Brooktree BT878
sound device is taking priority over my CS4297 sound device.

Prior Cooker installs didn't see the Brooktree sound device (only found
one device!) - Here is my lsmod:

sr_mod 15096   0  (autoclean) (unused)
ide-cd 28744   0  (autoclean)
cdrom  26848   0  (autoclean) [sr_mod ide-cd]
es1371 26600   1
ac97_codec  9928   0  [es1371]
gameport1660   0  [es1371]
btaudio10380   1
lp  6720   1
parport_pc 21672   1
parport23936   1  [lp parport_pc]
agpgart31840   3  (autoclean)
af_packet  13000   1  (autoclean)
usb-uhci   21676   0  (unused)
usbcore57984   1  [usb-uhci]
3c59x  27216   1  (autoclean)
nls_iso8859-15  3356   6  (autoclean)
nls_cp850   3580   6  (autoclean)
vfat9548   6  (autoclean)
fat31864   0  (autoclean) [vfat]
supermount 14532   3  (autoclean)
tuner   9536   1  (autoclean)
tvaudio12156   0  (autoclean) (unused)
bttv   66880   0
i2c-algo-bit7432   1  [bttv]
i2c-core   15332   0  [tuner tvaudio bttv i2c-algo-bit]
videodev5792   2  [bttv]
soundcore   3780   0  [es1371 btaudio bttv]
NVdriver  989312  10
rtc 6560   0  (autoclean)
reiserfs  169776   2
aic7xxx   120604   5
sd_mod 11612  10
scsi_mod   91140   3  [sr_mod aic7xxx sd_mod]

Please see attached screensnaps.

Thx,
R.Fox

On Wed, 2002-08-21 at 22:57, Robert Fox wrote:
> I have installed Cooker this evening (as of this e-mail) on two machines
> - same results:
> 
> Aug 21 22:39:21 localhost depmod: *** Unresolved symbols in
> /lib/modules/2.4.19-4mdk/kernel/drivers/media/video/saa7134.o.gz
> 
> Also please see attached DrakX screenshot - I get something funny about
> the BT878 (TerratecTV+ card) and the sound card - is this normal?
> 
> The sound card did not function on first boot . ..
> 
> Thx,
> R.Fox




snapshot1.png
Description: PNG image


snapshot2.png
Description: PNG image

Re: [Cooker] Gnome2 + Sawfish (moving & resizing windows)

[Richard Tango-Lowy]

Metacity's fine, but it's missing some of the niceties.
- Can't drag windows between workspaces
- Can't make session-started apps sticky (like gkrellm).

Rich

Levi Ramsey said:

> Why are you still using sawfish?  Everyone should use Metacity!

ars Cognita   The Art of Knowledge
  -
  Richard Tango-Lowy
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  603 424-6555

Re: [Cooker] messy shutdown?

[Peter Ruskin]

On Wednesday 21 Aug 2002 22:23, Ben Reser wrote:
> On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 11:49:26AM +0100, Adam Williamson wrote:
> > A side-effect of dm starting X is that you don't get to see the
> > status messages of things that run after dm, which is a bit annoying

Actually you *can* do [Alt-F1] as soon as that damned wait cursor appears, 
but *why* on earth should we.  If we didn't want to see that stuff 
rolling down the screen we could use "quiet" at boot -- but for those of 
us who want to know what's going on this is pretty disgraceful.

> > :\. I changed from OSS to ALSA and had to check /var/log/messages to
> > make sure it had started correctly, since ALSA is started after dm...
>
> The question was asked but there has yet to be a straight answer.  WHY
> did we switch from inittab to a initscript?

Copy someone else??
-- 
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AMD Athlon(tm) XP 1600+ 513MB.  Kernel: 2.4.19-win4lin
Linux user #275590 (http://counter.li.org/).  up 1:34.
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Re: [Cooker] Wishlist: spam filtering

[Richard Tango-Lowy]

"Think like a user, Luke."

My sister would like to replace windows with linux on her machine. She
gets a lot of spam, and is certainly not competent to set up a spam filter
on her own. It would be nice if Mandrake was able to take care of it for
her (and all the other non-hacker users in the world).
Rich

Ben Reser said:
> On Mon, Aug 19, 2002 at 01:10:05PM -0400, Richard Tango-Lowy wrote:
>> I think I saw something similar pass through this list recently, but
>> with the increasing amount of spam out there, it would a usability
>> coup to include spam filtering (spamassassin, or something similar)
>> out of the box.
>
> Too many mail clients, mail servers, and configuration possibilities to
> do it out of the box.

ars Cognita   The Art of Knowledge
  -
  Richard Tango-Lowy
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  603 424-6555

Re: [Cooker] wine

[Danny Tholen]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Wednesday 21 August 2002 23:13, Xavier Granier wrote:

>   It do nothing.

great bug report :P


- -- 
And ever has it been known that love knows not its own depth until the
hour of separation.
-- Kahlil Gibran
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Version: GnuPG v1.0.6 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org

iD4DBQE9ZAViaeiN+EU2vEIRAn0DAJikLwnbcteW2mh6wBVrzEXpni4YAJ9wsA8z
cCJuqw4omHzFS3Udy/Vj/w==
=4a+j
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Re: [Cooker] xosview

[Ben Reser]

On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 03:15:28PM +0200, polish wrote:
>   I didn't find xosview in 9.0 beta 3.

Contrib packages aren't included on the beta CDs.  But it's in contribs:
[root@occipital breser]# urpmq --sources xosview
http://mirror.brain.org/linux/mandrake/Mandrake-devel/cooker/i586/Mandrake/RPMS2/xosview-1.8.0-5mdk.i586.rpm

-- 
Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
http://ben.reser.org

If your love has no hope of being welcomed do not voice it; for if it 
be silent it can endure, a guarded flame, within you.
- The Wisdom of the Sands

Re: [Cooker] messy shutdown?

[Ben Reser]

On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 11:49:26AM +0100, Adam Williamson wrote:
> A side-effect of dm starting X is that you don't get to see the status
> messages of things that run after dm, which is a bit annoying :\. I
> changed from OSS to ALSA and had to check /var/log/messages to make sure
> it had started correctly, since ALSA is started after dm...

The question was asked but there has yet to be a straight answer.  WHY
did we switch from inittab to a initscript?

-- 
Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
http://ben.reser.org

If your love has no hope of being welcomed do not voice it; for if it 
be silent it can endure, a guarded flame, within you.
- The Wisdom of the Sands

Re: [Cooker] wine %description

[Per Øyvind Karlsen]

Hey, it's kinda silly to call wine an emulator when WINE stands for Wine 
Is Not an Emulator...
anyways, we want perfection!;)
Ben Reser wrote:

>On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 10:03:18AM +0200, Per Øyvind Karlsen wrote:
>  
>
>>wine's %description are incorrect, wine is NOT an emulator;)
>>Time to finally correct this?
>>
>>
>
>Blah who cares... It's an emulator of the interface.  Unless you're
>using the actual windows binaries it's emulation.  Try looking up the
>word emulator sometime:
>http://www.dictionary.com/search?q=emulator
>
>Most users don't know the fine distinction anyway and frankly using the
>term emulator is more clear.
>
>  
>

Re: [Cooker] 9.0 Beta 3: Connection Sharing

[Ben Reser]

On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 12:47:01PM +0200, Guillaume Cottenceau wrote:
> We had this problem for 8.0 or 8.1 (can't remember), it was due
> to the fact that iptables package had a default config file, and
> when booting it removed the rules set up by connection sharing a
> while before in the boot process.
> 
> But I don't have enough time to test that now, I have still much
> rpmdrake stuff to handle :-(.
> 
> I hope I'll have time to fix before the release..

Frankly I don't think connection sharing should be adding rules outside
of the way the iptables startup script works.  Because anyone using the
/etc/sysconfig/iptables file to configure their iptables is going to
overwrite their connection sharing config.  This basically means that
the iptables startup script conflicts with the startup script for
connection sharing.  Of course I'm biased I'm the one who put the
default startup script in iptables back in 8.1 (I think it was 8.1).
IMHO the bug wasn't the default startup script but was how connection
sharing was interfacing with iptables.  But the easy fix for the time
being was removing the default config...

-- 
Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
http://ben.reser.org

If your love has no hope of being welcomed do not voice it; for if it 
be silent it can endure, a guarded flame, within you.
- The Wisdom of the Sands

[Cooker] Gimp-print 4.2.2rc-1 is out

[Mike Graham]

Please update gimp-print rpm as rc 1 fixes Bug in 9.0 Beta 3 for lexmark 
printers and has fixes for epson printers.
Thank you
Mike

Re: [Cooker] wine %description

[Ben Reser]

On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 10:03:18AM +0200, Per Øyvind Karlsen wrote:
> wine's %description are incorrect, wine is NOT an emulator;)
> Time to finally correct this?

Blah who cares... It's an emulator of the interface.  Unless you're
using the actual windows binaries it's emulation.  Try looking up the
word emulator sometime:
http://www.dictionary.com/search?q=emulator

Most users don't know the fine distinction anyway and frankly using the
term emulator is more clear.

-- 
Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
http://ben.reser.org

If your love has no hope of being welcomed do not voice it; for if it 
be silent it can endure, a guarded flame, within you.
- The Wisdom of the Sands

Re: [Cooker] rpmdrake missing dependency on gnupg ?

[Ben Reser]

On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 04:43:24PM +0200, Pascal wrote:
> yes sure, but i still think it might be too alarming to see a line like:
> /usr/bin/gpg: not found  in the grpmi window.

requires means it's *REQUIRED* not that it works better with or has
additional functionality.  grpmi works fine without gnupg.  It emits
warnings about not having gnupg to do the signature checking but that's
not an error, just a warning.  It still works without gnupg.

-- 
Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
http://ben.reser.org

If your love has no hope of being welcomed do not voice it; for if it 
be silent it can endure, a guarded flame, within you.
- The Wisdom of the Sands

Re: [Cooker] Cooker is frozen / 9.0 schedule

[Ben Reser]

On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 11:39:38PM +1000, Ron Stodden wrote:
> You are totally misinformed here.
> 
> 1.  The betas are PATCHED versions of Cooker.

No they are not.  They are just a snapshot of cooker at a point in time
where it worked.

> 2.  Cooker is not frozen.   Beta 3 is out, yet Cooker is still being 
> updated at a rate of about 20 RPMs every day, and the Change logs tell 
> why.It's NOT bugfixes.

Yeah well that's because Mandrake has a bizzare idea of what a beta is.
I think what you're asking is that they not start doing betas until
cooker enters into a partial freeze (i.e. only bug fixes may be
applied).  However, if they were to do that you are very likely to get
the opposite of what you are asking for.  Less time to beta test.

-- 
Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
http://ben.reser.org

If your love has no hope of being welcomed do not voice it; for if it 
be silent it can endure, a guarded flame, within you.
- The Wisdom of the Sands

Re: [Cooker] wine

[Brent Hasty]

On Wednesday 21 August 2002 13:02, Danny Tholen wrote:
My system is running pure linux, on reiserfs partitions.  I also have win4lin 
4.0 installed to make up for what wine is not yet capeable of.  Is it 
possiable to direct wine to the ~/win directory inside of each users home 
directory like it were a fat partiton with full win98 installed in it?

I will be giving the autocad2000 thing a try and let you know the results ;-).

> As people might have noticed,
> wine changed quite a bit. I'm interested in some feedback. Especially
> whether autocad runs or doesn't run.
>
> Also, I would like to ask you to remove your old ~/.wine/config, and give
> me some feedback on the .wine/config that wine auto-creates for you. Does
> it pick up all your windows partitions? Cdrom drives? Does it set the
> windows dir correctly? Especially people with win NT/2k/xp should test
> this, as I have no such system to test with.
>
> Danny

-- 
"The place of the material world in the universe is that of an exquisitely 
beautiful precipitate or varied cloud-work in the universal Æther, determined 
by a geometrical necessity" ~ Professor John G. Macvicar1870 ~

Brent Hasty
http://www.Hasty-Solutions.com

[Cooker] Latest Cooker install issues

[Robert Fox]

I have installed Cooker this evening (as of this e-mail) on two machines
- same results:

Aug 21 22:39:21 localhost depmod: *** Unresolved symbols in
/lib/modules/2.4.19-4mdk/kernel/drivers/media/video/saa7134.o.gz

Also please see attached DrakX screenshot - I get something funny about
the BT878 (TerratecTV+ card) and the sound card - is this normal?

The sound card did not function on first boot . ..

Thx,
R.Fox



1.png
Description: PNG image

Re: [Cooker] Cooker is frozen / 9.0 schedule

[Ben Reser]

On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 10:35:16AM +0100, Adam Williamson wrote:
> So, um, where is anyone going to do development? We release beta 1 on a
> Monday then freeze for a week. Someone reports a showstopper bug on
> Tuesday; where does it get fixed before beta 2? We wait until the end of
> beta 1 phase the next Monday? I don't see how this benefits anyone. I
> also don't see how freezing Cooker to the state of one of the beta .isos
> benefits anyone. Explain, please.

Exactly my thoughts.

-- 
Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
http://ben.reser.org

If your love has no hope of being welcomed do not voice it; for if it 
be silent it can endure, a guarded flame, within you.
- The Wisdom of the Sands

Re: [Cooker] pdc20276

[cooker]

> Sorry if I'm asking obvious questions, I'm new to this list. Are you 
> trying to install Mandrake 9.0 beta3 on a PDC-20276 RAID-0 Array? If so, 
> could you please list in detail what you have done so far, since I am 
> trying to do the very same thing. So far the installer has give me only 
> a "your partition table is too corrupted" error in the partitioning phase 
> of the installation.

At first I tried to install Mandrake 8.2 on my brother's computer with an
MSI K3T RAID motherboard. The raid-controller was not recognised. I also
tried Redhat 7.3 and Suse 8.0 without success.
Then the first 9.0 beta came out. This recognised the PDC-20276. I had
to insmod ataraid and pdcraid by hand and pdcraid gave an Oops.
The second 9.0 beta didn't even recognise the chip and also gave a lot
of problems on my own computer.
The third 9.0 beta did recognise the chip and the modules didn't give
any problem, though I still had to load them by hand. The installation
recognised an "ataraid disk". After partitioning I had to reboot and
then (after loading the modules) I didn't see the ataraid disk anymore.
Unfortunately I don't have time this week to do some more tests, perhaps
next week.

[Cooker] Re: [CHRPM] kdelibs-3.0.3-5mdk

[Ben Reser]

On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 08:45:27AM +0200, Laurent MONTEL wrote:
> --=-=-=
> Name: kdelibs  Relocations: (not relocateable)
> Version : 3.0.3 Vendor: MandrakeSoft
> Release : 5mdk  Build Date: Wed Aug 21 08:24:57 2002
> Install date: (not installed)   Build Host: ke.mandrakesoft.com
> Group   : Graphical desktop/KDE Source RPM: (none)
> Size: 6794086  License: ARTISTIC BSD GPL_V2 LGPL_V2 
>QPL_V1.0
> Packager: Mandrake Linux KDE Team <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> URL : http://www.kde.org/
> Summary : K Desktop Environment - Libraries
> Description :
> Libraries for the K Desktop Environment.
> 
> --=-=-=
> 
> * Tue Aug 20 2002 Laurent MONTEL <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 3.0.3-5mdk
> 
> - Update code

Uhh what exactly was changed here?

-- 
Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
http://ben.reser.org

If your love has no hope of being welcomed do not voice it; for if it 
be silent it can endure, a guarded flame, within you.
- The Wisdom of the Sands

Re: [Cooker] Wishlist: spam filtering

[Ben Reser]

On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 02:12:50PM +0800, Leon Brooks wrote:
> At least spamassassin-postfix-N.N-i586.rpm then?

There are several ways to implement it...  And you can't do any of them
directly through postfix.  It has to be done with procmail.  Messing
around with the system procmail recipies just doesn't seem like a "good
idea."

-- 
Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
http://ben.reser.org

If your love has no hope of being welcomed do not voice it; for if it 
be silent it can endure, a guarded flame, within you.
- The Wisdom of the Sands

Re: [Cooker] Mount problem with Beta 3?

[Olivier Thauvin]

Le Mercredi 21 Août 2002 04:59, J Schonberg a écrit :
> I could be wrong but I was under the understanding that one could not
> mount multiple devices on the same mount point.  I tried mounting the
> ISO images from Beta 3 and discovered that mount allowed this.
>
> Can someone please confirm that this is intended behavior?
>
> Thanks.

Since kernel support MULTI_PATH_IO, yes

-- 
Linux pour Mac !? Enfin le moyen de transformer
une pomme en véritable ordinateur. - JL.
Olivier Thauvin - http://nanardon.homelinux.org/