Re: [Cooker] helix
On Thursday 14 December 2000 00:42, you wrote: Well... So far. I just decided to look into that by starting esd with a strace. My problem was that esd uses tcp (by default?!?!?), that is is wrapped by tcpd, that my hosts.deny says ALL: ALL and that my hosts.allow says nothing for esd... I added ALL: localhost and I now get the glorious sound! So. What should hosts.allow actually say for esd? I don't have anything for ESD in hosts.allow. Hmmm Since you say it was working immediately after the install and then stopped, you may be right that installing the Helix updates might solve the problem. Or, you might try installing only the updated esd packages. RSwaim
Re: [Cooker] helix
On Monday 11 December 2000 23:40, Armisis Aieoln wrote: Tried, but it killed my gnome all together dave If it just does not show in menu at bootup. you must do this after logging in to any other window or desktop manager: chmod +x /etc/X11/gdm/Sessions/Gnome that got me going... P.S. you would not believe how long it took me to find this out! P.S. #2 All of the Gnome programs will disappear from your KDE menus after this but they WILL be in your GNOME menus! On Tuesday 12 December 2000 03:36, you wrote: Anyone has tried to install helix... With success?
Re: [Cooker] helix
On Thursday 14 December 2000 15:49, you wrote: snip (1) Save a copy of /etc/X11/wmsession.d/02gnome (2) Save a copy of /usr/bin/startgnome Could you send me a copy of your 02gnome and startgnome files? I found out too late :-( You can use your editor to create them. The contents of my 02gnome file are: NAME=Gnome ICON=gnome-logo-icon-transparent.xpm DESC=Gnome Environment EXEC=/usr/bin/startgnome SCRIPT: exec /usr/bin/startgnome And the contents of startgnome are: export HELP_BROWSER=gnome-help-browser /usr/X11R6/bin/xsetroot -cursor_name left_ptr -solid "#99" /usr/bin/createbackground.sh $HOME/.gnome png exec /usr/bin/gnome-session Place 02gnome in /etc/X11/wmsession.d, and place startgnome in /usr/bin. RSwaim
Re: [Cooker] helix
snip (1) Save a copy of /etc/X11/wmsession.d/02gnome (2) Save a copy of /usr/bin/startgnome Could you send me a copy of your 02gnome and startgnome files? I found out too late :-( (3) Run Helix installer (4) When Helix installer finishes, it'll restart your X Server. Gnome will not be an option, so login to KDE. (5) Copy the 02gnome and startgnome files back to their original directories (6) Rename .gnome, .gnome-desktop, .gnome-private, and .mc directories in your /root directory and all user directories. (e.g. I renamed mine to ..gnome2, .gnome-desktop2, etc.). The directories will be recreated when you login to Gnome. (7) Reboot (8) You should now be able to login to Gnome w/o (many) problems.
Re: [Cooker] helix
I too tried it. H ! Now Sawfish produces windows without borders and title bars !!! Rats ! Oh yes, here they come, in the time it's taken to launch kmail, download some e-mails, find this one, draft a reply and almost press the send button ! Owen On Tuesday 12 December 2000 5:40 am, you wrote: Tried, but it killed my gnome all together dave On Tuesday 12 December 2000 03:36, you wrote: Anyone has tried to install helix... With success?
Re: [Cooker] helix
On Tuesday 12 December 2000 15:51, you wrote: I too tried it. H ! Now Sawfish produces windows without borders and title bars !!! Rats ! Ack! Hit the wrong button, sorry for that other reply. :-b Before installing the Helix Gnome packages, save a copy of your /etc/X11/wmsession.d/02gnome and /usr/bin/startgnome files. When the Helix installer finishes its installation, these files will be removed. Because of this, the Gnome option will not be present in the gdm or kdm login screens (doesn't matter which one you choose, it'll be removed no matter which one you choose). After completion, the Helix installer will restart your X server, so the next step is to login to KDE (since Gnome won't be an option) and copy the two files you saved back to their original directories. Secondly, rename the .gnome, .gnome-desktop, .gnome-private, and .mc directories in your /root and /home directories. When you log back in to Gnome, these directories will be recreated. If you don't recreate these directories, it'll be VERY unstable. So, to sum up and repeat the steps in order: (1) Save a copy of /etc/X11/wmsession.d/02gnome (2) Save a copy of /usr/bin/startgnome (3) Run Helix installer (4) When Helix installer finishes, it'll restart your X Server. Gnome will not be an option, so login to KDE. (5) Copy the 02gnome and startgnome files back to their original directories (6) Rename .gnome, .gnome-desktop, .gnome-private, and .mc directories in your /root directory and all user directories. (e.g. I renamed mine to .gnome2, .gnome-desktop2, etc.). The directories will be recreated when you login to Gnome. (7) Reboot (8) You should now be able to login to Gnome w/o (many) problems. The Helix Gnome updates work pretty well on Mandrake 7.2 after following the above steps, but I still experience some very minor problems every now and then that I can't quite put my finger on (and I'm not even certain if the problems are caused by Helix Gnome, or something else). I think that if I had it all to do over again, I'd probably just skip the Helix updates. Most of the gnome packages in LM 7.2 are still current and I don't see any major differences. Your system might be more stable if you just leave it the way it is. RSwaim
Re: [Cooker] helix
On Tuesday 12 December 2000 15:51, you wrote: I too tried it. H ! Now Sawfish produces windows without borders and title bars !!! Rats !
Re: [Cooker] helix
On Wednesday 13 December 2000 20:38, you wrote: Do you get sound? That's the main reason why I consider using helix. Since mandrake 7.2, I no longer have sound with gnome (except for the very first time I login after the install). Even root does not get sound with gnome, so it's not a permission problem. Yes, I get sound, but then I was getting sound before installing Helix Gnome anyway (if I remember correctly). However, my sound card does not show up in HardDrake, I had to use sndconfig to get it working. Is it only Gnome that doesn't give you sound? In other words, do you get sound in KDE? Although I do get sound, if I use any of the Gnome desktop sound effects, they tend to stutter quite a bit. Instead of getting one bell ring, I'll get about 5 or 6. I suspect the problem lies with ESD not liking my OPL3-SA card. Btw, this stuttering problem has plagued me in every Linux distro that I've ever run, including Mandrake, Red Hat, SuSE, and Caldera. RSwaim
Re: [Cooker] helix
On Wednesday 13 December 2000 16:21, you wrote: (1) Save a copy of /etc/X11/wmsession.d/02gnome (2) Save a copy of /usr/bin/startgnome (3) Run Helix installer (4) When Helix installer finishes, it'll restart your X Server. Gnome will not be an option, so login to KDE. (5) Copy the 02gnome and startgnome files back to their original directories (6) Rename .gnome, .gnome-desktop, .gnome-private, and .mc directories in your /root directory and all user directories. (e.g. I renamed mine to .gnome2, .gnome-desktop2, etc.). The directories will be recreated when you login to Gnome. (7) Reboot (8) You should now be able to login to Gnome w/o (many) problems. The Helix Gnome updates work pretty well on Mandrake 7.2 after following the above steps, but I still experience some very minor problems every now and then that I can't quite put my finger on (and I'm not even certain if the problems are caused by Helix Gnome, or something else). I think that if I had it all to do over again, I'd probably just skip the Helix updates. Most of the gnome packages in LM 7.2 are still current and I don't see any major differences. Your system might be more stable if you just leave it the way it is. RSwaim Thanks for the recipe... I'll try. Do you get sound? That's the main reason why I consider using helix. Since mandrake 7.2, I no longer have sound with gnome (except for the very first time I login after the install). Even root does not get sound with gnome, so it's not a permission problem. -- Jean Meloche [EMAIL PROTECTED] e-gold # 133947
Re: [Cooker] helix
On Wednesday 13 December 2000 21:14, you wrote: On Wednesday 13 December 2000 20:38, you wrote: Do you get sound? That's the main reason why I consider using helix. Since mandrake 7.2, I no longer have sound with gnome (except for the very first time I login after the install). Even root does not get sound with gnome, so it's not a permission problem. Yes, I get sound, but then I was getting sound before installing Helix Gnome anyway (if I remember correctly). However, my sound card does not show up in HardDrake, I had to use sndconfig to get it working. Is it only Gnome that doesn't give you sound? In other words, do you get sound in KDE? Although I do get sound, if I use any of the Gnome desktop sound effects, they tend to stutter quite a bit. Instead of getting one bell ring, I'll get about 5 or 6. I suspect the problem lies with ESD not liking my OPL3-SA card. Btw, this stuttering problem has plagued me in every Linux distro that I've ever run, including Mandrake, Red Hat, SuSE, and Caldera. RSwaim My card was always detected automatically just fine. I always had sound with kde and exactly once with gnome: the very first time I logged in with gnome after the install. Since then, there was never any sound. All applications that use esd said that "perhaps there is no sound support in the kernel". Xmms, for example said that, but if I configure it to use the oss driver, all was fine. So it's only through esd that there is a problem. Well... So far. I just decided to look into that by starting esd with a strace. My problem was that esd uses tcp (by default?!?!?), that is is wrapped by tcpd, that my hosts.deny says ALL: ALL and that my hosts.allow says nothing for esd... I added ALL: localhost and I now get the glorious sound! So. What should hosts.allow actually say for esd? -- Jean Meloche [EMAIL PROTECTED] e-gold # 133947
Re: [Cooker] helix
On Tuesday 12 December 2000 04:36, you wrote: Anyone has tried to install helix... How nice.. Who is anyone btw? -- \ Christian A Strømmen / \ Number1/NumeroUno @ Undernet - Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] / \ Web: www.realityx.net - Cell: +47 911 43 948 / Live your life by your dreams, not by the limits of reality...
Re: [Cooker] helix
Tried, but it killed my gnome all together dave On Tuesday 12 December 2000 03:36, you wrote: Anyone has tried to install helix... With success? -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Linux - Cause I dont do windows or ovens! [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Registered System: 83659
Re: [Cooker] helix gnome
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Ray) writes: I want to try helix gnome under 7.2. Has anyone done this and how do you start it? I can't even find where to start gnome anymore. What version of gnome-core package do you have on your system ? There was one buggy version which had a broken startgnome .. -- Frédéric Crozat MandrakeSoft
Re: [Cooker] helix gnome
gnome-core-1.2.1-38 The big question is why isn't it in the login panel as a choice anymore? On Mon, 09 Oct 2000, you wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Ray) writes: I want to try helix gnome under 7.2. Has anyone done this and how do you start it? I can't even find where to start gnome anymore. What version of gnome-core package do you have on your system ? There was one buggy version which had a broken startgnome ..
Re: [Cooker] helix gnome
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Ray) writes: gnome-core-1.2.1-38 The big question is why isn't it in the login panel as a choice anymore? That's a bug !! But I don't have it here.. What login manager are you using ? -- Frédéric Crozat MandrakeSoft
Re: [Cooker] helix gnome
I believe it is kdm.. The standard Mandrake login.. This is a rc1 10-06-2000 build. On Mon, 09 Oct 2000, you wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Ray) writes: gnome-core-1.2.1-38 The big question is why isn't it in the login panel as a choice anymore? That's a bug !! But I don't have it here.. What login manager are you using ?
Re: [Cooker] helix gnome
I added the following file to /etx/X11/wmsession.d/ and now it shows up and works.. So it is just missing drom the install On Mon, 09 Oct 2000, you wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Ray) writes: gnome-core-1.2.1-38 The big question is why isn't it in the login panel as a choice anymore? That's a bug !! But I don't have it here.. What login manager are you using ? NAME=Gnome ICON=gnome.xpm DESC=Gnome desktop EXEC=/usr/bin/gnome-session SCRIPT: exec /usr/bin/gnome-session
Re: [Cooker] helix gnome
I installed Helix under 7.2 Beta 3 and it worked just fine. Ugg... I say it worked just fine, the installation worked just fine. I never actually logged into gnome or helix. I just wanted all the updated proggies. JJ [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Ray) writes: I want to try helix gnome under 7.2. Has anyone done this and how do you start it? I can't even find where to start gnome anymore.
Re: [Cooker] helix gnome
Hello, You can access the Helix code from 195.92.249.252 and go to the directory /pub/linux/helix/distributions/Mandrake-7 My success with 'raw' Helix code has diminished to such a point that I've almost given up. The Mandrake Gnome seems to have everything anyway. About the only thing I keep updated from Helix these days is the GIMP. From the console try desktopcfg (from desktopcfg-1.3.2-2mdk :-) ). It does not seem to give access to every window manager I have installed, but Gnome, KDE, WindowMaker are all there plus some others. By going to say FVWM2 you can very often navigate to the window manager you want and lodge it as the default. Failing that then switchdesk gives access to either Gnome or KDE. Owen On Sun, 08 Oct 2000, you wrote: hey, If u want to use gnome just select gnome from the drop down menu list when logging into linux. That is if u use graphical boot up. I am not sure about how to change the desktop under the console though. --Khawar Zia - Original Message - From: "Ray" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, October 07, 2000 7:59 PM Subject: [Cooker] helix gnome I want to try helix gnome under 7.2. Has anyone done this and how do you start it? I can't even find where to start gnome anymore.
Re: [Cooker] helix gnome
I just use different ~/.xinitrc for my different wm's. Here is my gnome: [root@cs5884-a /root]# cat .xinitrc.gnome #!/bin/sh .. $HOME/.bashrc xsetroot -solid '#056' imwheel konsole exec /usr/bin/startgnome On Sat, 07 Oct 2000, you wrote: well I would if it was there. There was a choice in 7.1 but not in 7.2. All that I have is kde anf the desktops like enlightenment, blackbox, and such... No gnome On Sat, 07 Oct 2000, you wrote: hey, If u want to use gnome just select gnome from the drop down menu list when logging into linux. That is if u use graphical boot up. I am not sure about how to change the desktop under the console though. --Khawar Zia - Original Message - From: "Ray" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, October 07, 2000 7:59 PM Subject: [Cooker] helix gnome I want to try helix gnome under 7.2. Has anyone done this and how do you start it? I can't even find where to start gnome anymore.
Re: [Cooker] helix gnome
hey, If u want to use gnome just select gnome from the drop down menu list when logging into linux. That is if u use graphical boot up. I am not sure about how to change the desktop under the console though. --Khawar Zia - Original Message - From: "Ray" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, October 07, 2000 7:59 PM Subject: [Cooker] helix gnome I want to try helix gnome under 7.2. Has anyone done this and how do you start it? I can't even find where to start gnome anymore.
Re: [Cooker] helix gnome
well I would if it was there. There was a choice in 7.1 but not in 7.2. All that I have is kde anf the desktops like enlightenment, blackbox, and such... No gnome On Sat, 07 Oct 2000, you wrote: hey, If u want to use gnome just select gnome from the drop down menu list when logging into linux. That is if u use graphical boot up. I am not sure about how to change the desktop under the console though. --Khawar Zia - Original Message - From: "Ray" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, October 07, 2000 7:59 PM Subject: [Cooker] helix gnome I want to try helix gnome under 7.2. Has anyone done this and how do you start it? I can't even find where to start gnome anymore.
Re: [Cooker] helix gnome
Hi I put helix over 7.2 and had reinstall 7.1 t get machine to run gnome agian. ROY Ray wrote: I want to try helix gnome under 7.2. Has anyone done this and how do you start it? I can't even find where to start gnome anymore.
Re: [Cooker] helix gnome
Ray wrote: I want to try helix gnome under 7.2. Has anyone done this and how do you start it? I can't even find where to start gnome anymore. Hello Ray. You can start gnome by editing your .xinitrc file (located in your home dir) If it does exist, then comment out whatever is in there and put one single line in there that says: exec gnome-session or if the file isn't there: cd echo "exec gnome-session" .xinitrc now startx Hope this helped /Björn
Re: [Cooker] Helix-gnome in cooker/mandrake
Well the goal is great, but if I got you right you are talking about harrasing the Helix people until they give up. I don't like that plan... Instead we should contact them and offer our help in converting the packages to use the new menusystem. I assume that Helix are not refusing to do this just to piss us off, but for the lack of time and resources. //Snaggen, don't know anything about RPM's but still willing to help At 11 September, 2000 John Grange wrote: Dear list , after reading a post earlier today i have an idea! , we are a big group here now on this list, and i'm sure there are more than a few of us who would like the mandrake helix gnome packages to be compleetly compatible with mandrake 7.1+ menu system. I suggest that we campain to email the helix-gnome team to modify the mandrake packages to use our menu system ( wich is the same as debian no? ) Let's email them and get this problem fixed once and for all. -DarkWlf -- Mattias Eriksson E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tvistevägen 26 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 907 36 UMEA Tel:090-198800 SWEDEN 070-5636769 'I don't fight for a cause Hemsida: http://www.acc.umu.se/~snaggen I fight for the fight' PGP: http://www.acc.umu.se/~snaggen/snaggen.asc
Re: [Cooker] Helix-gnome in cooker/mandrake
On Mon, 11 Sep 2000, you wrote: Dear list , after reading a post earlier today i have an idea! , we are a big group here now on this list, and i'm sure there are more than a few of us who would like the mandrake helix gnome packages to be compleetly compatible with mandrake 7.1+ menu system. I suggest that we campain to email the helix-gnome team to modify the mandrake packages to use our menu system ( wich is the same as debian no? ) Let's email them and get this problem fixed once and for all. -DarkWlf I'm down for this, of course I'd like it the other way around and have mdk be compliant with helix-gnome package, but any compliance is good. -- Bryan Paxton Public key can be found at http://speedbros.org/bryan.paxton.asc
Re: [Cooker] Helix-gnome in cooker/mandrake
On Mon, 11 Sep 2000, you wrote: I'm down for this, of course I'd like it the other way around and have mdk be compliant with helix-gnome package, but any compliance is good. g I sent this before I finished. Have you laid out a plan about doing this ? At a glance this seems like an easy task, when in all actuality it's far from that. It's mostly the hacks that mdk does to gnome that breaks the compliance with vanilla helix-gnome. menus , default pixmaps dir(which will fubar your desktop icons hence the need to remove your ~/.gnome/metadata.db) , the all in all default settings , etc... So, what to do. : ) -- Bryan Paxton Public key can be found at http://speedbros.org/bryan.paxton.asc
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
Yoann Vandoorselaere [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Guillaume Cottenceau [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Bryan Paxton [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: [...] Run helix-gnome raw and then mdk's helix-gnome and you'll see what I mean : ) The problem is that with Helix Gnome you'll have only Gnome or Helix specific programs. The good thing of the menu system is that you have the gnome, kde, and wm-unaware programs in the menus of all your window managers. Okay, this costs a bit of the polished style of Helix Gnome, and it's less cute. It's good for people who know well Gnome, and the apps that ship with the distributions. But a newbie will like to have all the apps in his menus. Ok, so if i follow you, you care about newbies, but not about experienced user ? Yes, you perfectly got me. Experienced users most of the time bring their own config files and so on. They are likely to tweak the system and they like it. They most of the time use their own menus with 4 entries, or only command line.. At least, give them the opportunity to use standard menus, period. Okay, that's your position, let's not start an endless discussion about this, we already know both our positions, it's no use trolling all over :-). (or in private..) -- Guillaume Cottenceau -- Distribution Developer for MandrakeSoft http://www.mandrakesoft.com/~gc/
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
Bryan Paxton [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: [...] At least, give them the opportunity to use standard menus, period. Yes, this is where I agree also. And it's not only what Yoann said but also if we dumb down the enviorment too much we're going to end up with stupid users. The environment is already moving to simplify. That's the natural way to do things. You can always tweak everything if you want! Now there's nothing wrong having a nice menu system, but I will say that the current menu system is far from nice. What people can not like is the way it looks. But it's the Mandrake look! If you don't like it you can use another distrib or vanilla Helix. It's purely normal to tweak the way things look, in order to get something which looks "Mandrake". Take a look at this http://speedbros.org/menukludge.jpg Now ask yourself what the submenus probably look like : ) Okay, this is Gnome touch. Now what? You like it, install vanilla Helix! I don't care. -- Guillaume Cottenceau -- Distribution Developer for MandrakeSoft http://www.mandrakesoft.com/~gc/
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1) - other menu ideas
- Original Message - From: "Guillaume Cottenceau" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, August 10, 2000 9:55 AM Subject: Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1) Bryan Paxton [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: [...] At least, give them the opportunity to use standard menus, period. Yes, this is where I agree also. And it's not only what Yoann said but also if we dumb down the enviorment too much we're going to end up with stupid users. The environment is already moving to simplify. That's the natural way to do things. You can always tweak everything if you want! Now there's nothing wrong having a nice menu system, but I will say that the current menu system is far from nice. What people can not like is the way it looks. But it's the Mandrake look! If you don't like it you can use another distrib or vanilla Helix. It's purely normal to tweak the way things look, in order to get something which looks "Mandrake". This is interesting if only for the approach they take to structuring the menus. I organize my bookmarks this way, why not my menus? Hmmm. www.redmondlinux.org It seems that some of their goals are compatible with Mandrake. Hoyt
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
Yoann Vandoorselaere [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: [...] Experienced users most of the time bring their own config files and so on. They are likely to tweak the system and they like it. They most of the time use their own menus with 4 entries, or only command line.. Ok... /me take a deep breath. I urge you to stop being an integrist : You can't categorise people like you do... Why? -- and why treating me of integrist? Life is categorising people -- the problem is not to categorise, the problem is to make abusive conclusions with your categories. We know that some categories of people act mostly in one way. That does not mean that some of them don't follow the masses! But we know things, such as: - an experienced user knows basics of vi and emacs - a newbie is bored when he has to manually start kppp before starting his email client You can't disagree with that simple statements! If we don't categorise things we can't move towards. I know you don't like it, but let's face it Yoann: Linux-Mandrake is mostly bought by newbies/ unexperienced users. We have to study what they would like to have and react to that. And that does *not* mean that the distribution is no more useable for experienced users! Let's stop that debate which is wrong. The point is that we have to adapt to the masses. [...] Okay, that's your position, let's not start an endless discussion about this, we already know both our positions, it's no use trolling all over :-). That's not trolling. That's what free software is all about. No, free software is not "all about" endless discussions. We have to discuss, that's a very agreed point everywhere including inside MandrakeSoft, and in the cooker mailing list. I want to have the choise and i want to give the choise to the user for him to be happy. Yes, we all want. Mainly our position is that it's too much work and not the way we want to move too. The present position of MandrakeSoft on the menu problem is, if I guess right, to try to provide a tool so that the users will have their menus filles with all the applications he has installed. You know that keeping the original Helix menus is not good because we will lack all KDE and wm-independant applications. Ok, maybe you don't care, but just consider our goal: to provide in the menus all the applications. Ok, we all agree that the "look" of the Helix menus is much cleaner and cute than the original Mandrake Gnome in the 7.1 But the way to go is not to revert to original Helix menus because we would lack our goal which is to have cross-wm menus. Your point, to leave the user the choice betweem mandrake menu and helix menu, is very valid. The only problem is that here at MandrakeSoft you are the guy who cares the more about this problem; the other ones don't want to do it. I know that you already have many things to do, but the way to go if you want your point to become reality, is to study concretly the problem, write down what would be necessary to do, patch the menu system to be able to revert to the original menus, and show us all a prototype for that. (I did not want that it becomes an endless discussion, but apparently..) -- Guillaume Cottenceau -- Distribution Developer for MandrakeSoft http://www.mandrakesoft.com/~gc/
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1) - other menu ideas
"Hoyt" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: What people can not like is the way it looks. But it's the Mandrake look! If you don't like it you can use another distrib or vanilla Helix. It's purely normal to tweak the way things look, in order to get something which looks "Mandrake". This is interesting if only for the approach they take to structuring the menus. I organize my bookmarks this way, why not my menus? Hmmm. www.redmondlinux.org Hey, we HAVE to choose ONE structure for the menus! So, to you, also the grouping for the RPM is bad, and should follow your bookmarks? naahhh.. It seems that some of their goals are compatible with Mandrake. ? -- Guillaume Cottenceau -- Distribution Developer for MandrakeSoft http://www.mandrakesoft.com/~gc/
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
On Thu, Aug 03, 2000 at 03:43:53PM -0700, Chmouel Boudjnah wrote: Alexander Skwar [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Yes, please delete all the text editors, mkXYfs, fdisk :-) you kidding do you understand there is a real difference between what you say and what i say ? Sorry, not really. You said that you don't include the Helix updater because it messes up the configuration that's shipped with Mandrake. Doesn't a well placed rm -rf /usr/bin/* do the same? So, where's the BIG difference? Alexander Skwar -- Homepage: http://www.digitalprojects.com | http://www.dp.ath.cx Sichere Mail? Mail an [EMAIL PROTECTED] fuer GnuPG Keys ICQ:7328191
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
Bryan Paxton [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: [...] Run helix-gnome raw and then mdk's helix-gnome and you'll see what I mean : ) The problem is that with Helix Gnome you'll have only Gnome or Helix specific programs. The good thing of the menu system is that you have the gnome, kde, and wm-unaware programs in the menus of all your window managers. Okay, this costs a bit of the polished style of Helix Gnome, and it's less cute. It's good for people who know well Gnome, and the apps that ship with the distributions. But a newbie will like to have all the apps in his menus. -- Guillaume Cottenceau -- Distribution Developer for MandrakeSoft http://www.mandrakesoft.com/~gc/
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
Guillaume Cottenceau [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Bryan Paxton [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: [...] Run helix-gnome raw and then mdk's helix-gnome and you'll see what I mean : ) The problem is that with Helix Gnome you'll have only Gnome or Helix specific programs. The good thing of the menu system is that you have the gnome, kde, and wm-unaware programs in the menus of all your window managers. Okay, this costs a bit of the polished style of Helix Gnome, and it's less cute. It's good for people who know well Gnome, and the apps that ship with the distributions. But a newbie will like to have all the apps in his menus. Ok, so if i follow you, you care about newbies, but not about experienced user ? At least, give them the opportunity to use standard menus, period. -- -- Yoann http://www.mandrakesoft.com/~yoann/ An engineer from NVidia, while asking him to release cards specs said : "Actually, we do write our drivers without documentation."
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
On Wed, 09 Aug 2000, you wrote: Guillaume Cottenceau [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Bryan Paxton [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: [...] Run helix-gnome raw and then mdk's helix-gnome and you'll see what I mean : ) The problem is that with Helix Gnome you'll have only Gnome or Helix specific programs. The good thing of the menu system is that you have the gnome, kde, and wm-unaware programs in the menus of all your window managers. Okay, this costs a bit of the polished style of Helix Gnome, and it's less cute. It's good for people who know well Gnome, and the apps that ship with the distributions. But a newbie will like to have all the apps in his menus. Ok, so if i follow you, you care about newbies, but not about experienced user ? At least, give them the opportunity to use standard menus, period. Yes, this is where I agree also. And it's not only what Yoann said but also if we dumb down the enviorment too much we're going to end up with stupid users. Now there's nothing wrong having a nice menu system, but I will say that the current menu system is far from nice. Take a look at this http://speedbros.org/menukludge.jpg Now ask yourself what the submenus probably look like : ) -- Bryan Paxton "Defacing the RIAA website would cause a major shitstorm for us good guys." - someone "Good point. I still can't get over how Janet Reno's parents defaced her/it and they still walk the streets free and clear." - someone else Public key can be found at http://speedbros.org/Bryan_Paxton.asc
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
Bryan Paxton [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: On Wed, 09 Aug 2000, you wrote: Guillaume Cottenceau [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Bryan Paxton [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: [...] Run helix-gnome raw and then mdk's helix-gnome and you'll see what I mean : ) The problem is that with Helix Gnome you'll have only Gnome or Helix specific programs. The good thing of the menu system is that you have the gnome, kde, and wm-unaware programs in the menus of all your window managers. Okay, this costs a bit of the polished style of Helix Gnome, and it's less cute. It's good for people who know well Gnome, and the apps that ship with the distributions. But a newbie will like to have all the apps in his menus. Ok, so if i follow you, you care about newbies, but not about experienced user ? At least, give them the opportunity to use standard menus, period. Yes, this is where I agree also. And it's not only what Yoann said but also if we dumb down the enviorment too much we're going to end up with stupid users. Now there's nothing wrong having a nice menu system, but I will say that the current menu system is far from nice. Take a look at this http://speedbros.org/menukludge.jpg you're missing some icon, already availlable in development version and gnome-icons tarball -- -- Yoann http://www.mandrakesoft.com/~yoann/ An engineer from NVidia, while asking him to release cards specs said : "Actually, we do write our drivers without documentation."
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
On Wed, 09 Aug 2000, you wrote: Bryan Paxton [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: On Wed, 09 Aug 2000, you wrote: Guillaume Cottenceau [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Bryan Paxton [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: [...] Run helix-gnome raw and then mdk's helix-gnome and you'll see what I mean : ) The problem is that with Helix Gnome you'll have only Gnome or Helix specific programs. The good thing of the menu system is that you have the gnome, kde, and wm-unaware programs in the menus of all your window managers. Okay, this costs a bit of the polished style of Helix Gnome, and it's less cute. It's good for people who know well Gnome, and the apps that ship with the distributions. But a newbie will like to have all the apps in his menus. Ok, so if i follow you, you care about newbies, but not about experienced user ? At least, give them the opportunity to use standard menus, period. Yes, this is where I agree also. And it's not only what Yoann said but also if we dumb down the enviorment too much we're going to end up with stupid users. Now there's nothing wrong having a nice menu system, but I will say that the current menu system is far from nice. Take a look at this http://speedbros.org/menukludge.jpg you're missing some icon, already availlable in development version and gnome-icons tarball Not missing them, the mdk packages simply don't have them(or do they ?). The was install mdk packages on in place of helix packages and well you can see the result : ) -- Bryan Paxton "Defacing the RIAA website would cause a major shitstorm for us good guys." - someone "Good point. I still can't get over how Janet Reno's parents defaced her/it and they still walk the streets free and clear." - someone else Public key can be found at http://speedbros.org/Bryan_Paxton.asc
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
On Wed, 09 Aug 2000, you wrote: Bryan Paxton [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: On Wed, 09 Aug 2000, you wrote: Bryan Paxton [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: [...] Run helix-gnome raw and then mdk's helix-gnome and you'll see what I mean : ) The problem is that with Helix Gnome you'll have only Gnome or Helix specific programs. The good thing of the menu system is that you have the gnome, kde, and wm-unaware programs in the menus of all your window managers. Okay, this costs a bit of the polished style of Helix Gnome, and it's less cute. It's good for people who know well Gnome, and the apps that ship with the distributions. But a newbie will like to have all the apps in his menus. *nod* this has been said : ) what is the maning of "nod" ? .. "no" ? no *nod* as in an action of nodding to agree with you : ) And I think it goes from helix mdk problem to the menu system problem. i don't understand your position.. And you perfectly explained the problem. It's not particularly a helix mdk problem, it's the menu system that is current being used. It's horrible IMHO. This is what mostly takes away from that nice and polished look you mentioned. The menus after a post of installing a few rpms is awful. But I believe this is trying to be solved(other threads on the cooker ml). -- Bryan Paxton "Defacing the RIAA website would cause a major shitstorm for us good guys." - someone "Good point. I still can't get over how Janet Reno's parents defaced her/it and they still walk the streets free and clear." - someone else Public key can be found at http://speedbros.org/Bryan_Paxton.asc
Re: [Bryan Paxton evil7@bellsouth.net] Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome
From: Bryan Paxton [EMAIL PROTECTED] gnome icons on the desktop get chunked The reason for this is the gnome icons from helix aren't included (or is this the reason ?) so all the icons on the desktop get flipped to gnome-application-x-gnome-app-info.png So I go to change them And they won't change : ( there was an error about placement. So there seems to be a bug in one of two things. Your mc/gmc or there's just a compatibility problem between the helix-gnome config files in ~/ and your helix-gnome packages. This needs to be looked into futher though : ) This problem should not longer appear now. Could you try to download last version of Gnome from cooker, and remove your .gnome-desktop directory as .gnome/metadata.db to recreate icons database. Be sure to update also Midnight Commander -- Frédéric Crozat MandrakeSoft
[Bryan Paxton evil7@bellsouth.net] Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
Please Bryan comment on Cooker i'm not the Gnome Team. On Thu, 03 Aug 2000, you wrote: Bryan Paxton [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Yeah, but mdk needs to keep the helix-gnome packages compliant with helix-gnome. and cooker ?, we design an Operating System we don't ship only a few desktop packages... I then exited gnome, and fired up X again and sorry but it's just friggin nasty IMHO. Basically what I'm trying to get through this is, keeping helix-gnome raw, the way it comes, and only lil minute tweaks should be made. Suggestions are welcome, our Gnome team will be happy to discuss with you about the choice they did. What's wrong with the default configuration ? It's not particulary that default config, but I will comment on a few things. But first stability with compatibility : ) gnome icons on the desktop get chunked The reason for this is the gnome icons from helix aren't included(or is this the reason ?) so all the icons on the desktop get flipped to gnome-application-x-gnome-app-info.png So I go to change them And they won't change : ( there was an error about placement. So there seems to be a bug in one of two things. Your mc/gmc or there's just a compatibility problem between the helix-gnome config files in ~/ and your helix-gnome packages. This needs to be looked into futher though : ) Ok now on to the minute problems of the default config a.k.a. pretty graphics. This is IMHO, I'm sure a lot of people will disagree with me, but well for one thing the icons that come with helix aren't included, which are quite nice IMHO. 2). I understand trying to promote mdk, but those mdk folders in the gnome menu and the logo in the helix-gnome splash screen are just tacky IMHO. Also might want to consider going with the new default helix theme, the theme name is 5 over here, or at least that's how it shows up in gnomecc and /usr/share/themes. Keep the helix icons for the gnome menu, they're completely destroyed and makes the menu look funky. My 4 last statements we're just rants, but the first one is a problem. You need to look at this from an end-users point of view. Rather, a user that has installed helix from helixcode and not mdk and is switching to mdk's packages. From my experience, people are gonna be highly pissed when a lot of they're pretty graphics(icon settings) are broke, as well desktop icons that don't seem to work at all. Give it some thought : ) Bryan Paxton -- MandrakeSoft Inchttp://www.mandrakesoft.com San-Francisco, CA USA --Chmouel
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Andreas Simon) writes: Anton Graham wrote: You are correct that there are some striking differences between the two. One that comes to mind immediately is the mdk GNOME's inability to properly display GTK themes with light colored text. They look fine in the preview window, but you end up with black text on your dark brown buttons after you apply the thing. BTW, a fix for this is to just delete /usr/share/gtkrc Thanks, I'm correcting gnome-libs (which was providing /usr/share/gtkrc) right now... -- Frédéric Crozat MandrakeSoft
Re: [Bryan Paxton evil7@bellsouth.net] Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
Submitted 03-Aug-00 by Bryan Paxton: So there seems to be a bug in one of two things. Your mc/gmc or there's just a compatibility problem between the helix-gnome config files in ~/ and your helix-gnome packages. This needs to be looked into futher though : ) I spent many hours on this problem myself during the testing of 7.1. If you kill your ~/.gnome directory you get those bland, unchangeable icons the next time you start gmc. But simply deleting the ~/.gnome/metadata.db fixes it. Why the regenerated metadata.db is different from the one generated when the .gnome directory is created is beyond me. -- _ _|_|_ ( ) *Anton Graham /v\ / [EMAIL PROTECTED] /( )X (m_m) GPG ID: 18F78541 Penguin Powered!
Re: [Bryan Paxton evil7@bellsouth.net] Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
Chmouel Boudjnah [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Please Bryan comment on Cooker i'm not the Gnome Team. From: Bryan Paxton [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1) To: Chmouel Boudjnah [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2000 07:22:47 -0500 Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Thu, 03 Aug 2000, you wrote: Bryan Paxton [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Yeah, but mdk needs to keep the helix-gnome packages compliant with helix-gnome. and cooker ?, we design an Operating System we don't ship only a few desktop packages... I then exited gnome, and fired up X again and sorry but it's just friggin nasty IMHO. Basically what I'm trying to get through this is, keeping helix-gnome raw, the way it comes, and only lil minute tweaks should be made. Suggestions are welcome, our Gnome team will be happy to discuss with you about the choice they did. What's wrong with the default configuration ? It's not particulary that default config, but I will comment on a few things. But first stability with compatibility : ) gnome icons on the desktop get chunked The reason for this is the gnome icons from helix aren't included(or is this the reason ?) so all the icons on the desktop get flipped to gnome-application-x-gnome-app-info.png So I go to change them And they won't change : ( there was an error about placement. So there seems to be a bug in one of two things. Your mc/gmc or there's just a compatibility problem between the helix-gnome config files in ~/ and your helix-gnome packages. This needs to be looked into futher though : ) Ok now on to the minute problems of the default config a.k.a. pretty graphics. This is IMHO, I'm sure a lot of people will disagree with me, but well for one thing the icons that come with helix aren't included, which are quite nice IMHO. 2). I understand trying to promote mdk, but those mdk folders in the gnome menu and the logo in the helix-gnome splash screen are just tacky IMHO. Also might want to consider going with the new default helix theme, the theme name is 5 over here, or at least that's how it shows up in gnomecc and /usr/share/themes. Keep the helix icons for the gnome menu, they're completely destroyed and makes the menu look funky. My 4 last statements we're just rants, but the first one is a problem. You need to look at this from an end-users point of view. Rather, a user that has installed helix from helixcode and not mdk and is switching to mdk's packages. From my experience, people are gonna be highly pissed when a lot of they're pretty graphics(icon settings) are broke, as well desktop icons that don't seem to work at all. Give it some thought : ) Bryan Paxton -- -- MandrakeSoft Inchttp://www.mandrakesoft.com San-Francisco, CA USA --Chmouel -- -- Yoann http://www.mandrakesoft.com/~yoann/ I worry about my child and the Internet all the time, even though she's too young to have logged on yet. Here's what I worry about. I worry that 10 or 15 years from now, she will come to me and say 'Daddy, where were you when they took freedom of the press away from the Internet?' -- Mike Godwin
Re: [Bryan Paxton evil7@bellsouth.net] Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
oops, wrong manip, sorry for the duplicate... -- -- Yoann http://www.mandrakesoft.com/~yoann/ An engineer from NVidia, while asking him to release cards specs said : "Actually, we do write our drivers without documentation."
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
Bryan Paxton écrivit : *nod* I understand, and I fully understand that it will be for the most part inexperienced users using mdk. See the follow up post I made to chmoel's response. I didn't even know about the below bug you mentioned : ) But I don't mean taking out functionality of updating the menus(which is a whole 'nother situation : p ) but simply keeping everything more compliant and helix-like. ^^^ IMHO, you're wrong. It's not to Mandrake to keep compliant with Helix-GNOME but to Helix-GNOME to keep compliant with Mandrake distribution (and others Linux distributions). They ship different packages for different distributions, they are not distributions makers but they ship alternatives (Mandrake, SuSE, etc.) or complements (Caldera) to Linux distributions. So, if they really want to be used by users, they need to adapt their packages to each distributions. They do it, a little, but don't respect each distributions specifications. It's bad and sad. -- MandrakeSofthttp://www.mandrakesoft.com PARIS, FRANCE --David P.S.: please put question _before_ answer. It's easier to read your messages.
Re: [Bryan Paxton evil7@bellsouth.net] Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
You need to look at this from an end-users point of view. Rather, a user that has installed helix from helixcode and not mdk and is switching to mdk's packages. From my experience, people are gonna be highly pissed when a lot of they're pretty graphics(icon settings) are broke, as well desktop icons that don't seem to work at all. I can only repeat, I don't have such problems with Mandrake and Helix. No broken graphics and the desktop also works all right. Alexander Skwar -- Homepage: http://www.digitalprojects.com Sichere Mail? Mail an [EMAIL PROTECTED] fuer GnuPG Keys ICQ:7328191
Re: [Bryan Paxton evil7@bellsouth.net] Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
On Thu, 03 Aug 2000, Chmouel Boudjnah wrote: Please Bryan comment on Cooker i'm not the Gnome Team. irk I thought I did, I'll forward what I sent to cooker though.
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
This e-mail didn't get sent to cooker(oops) I spent many hours on this problem myself during the testing of 7.1. If you kill your ~/.gnome directory you get those bland, unchangeable icons the next time you start gmc. But simply deleting the ~/.gnome/metadata.db fixes it. Why the regenerated metadata.db is different from the one generated when the .gnome directory is created is beyond me It's not particulary that default config, but I will comment on a few things. But first stability with compatibility : ) gnome icons on the desktop get chunked The reason for this is the gnome icons from helix aren't included(or is this the reason ?) so all the icons on the desktop get flipped to gnome-application-x-gnome-app-info.png So I go to change them And they won't change : ( there was an error about placement. So there seems to be a bug in one of two things. Your mc/gmc or there's just a compatibility problem between the helix-gnome config files in ~/ and your helix-gnome packages. This needs to be looked into futher though : ) Ok now on to the minute problems of the default config a.k.a. pretty graphics. This is IMHO, I'm sure a lot of people will disagree with me, but well for one thing the icons that come with helix aren't included, which are quite nice IMHO. 2). I understand trying to promote mdk, but those mdk folders in the gnome menu and the logo in the helix-gnome splash screen are just tacky IMHO. Also might want to consider going with the new default helix theme, the theme name is 5 over here, or at least that's how it shows up in gnomecc and /usr/share/themes. Keep the helix icons for the gnome menu, they're completely destroyed and makes the menu look funky. My 4 last statements we're just rants, but the first one is a problem. You need to look at this from an end-users point of view. Rather, a user that has installed helix from helixcode and not mdk and is switching to mdk's packages. From my experience, people are gonna be highly pissed when a lot of they're pretty graphics(icon settings) are broke, as well desktop icons that don't seem to work at all. Give it some thought : ) Bryan Paxton I spent many hours on this problem myself during the testing of 7.1. If you kill your ~/.gnome directory you get those bland, unchangeable icons the next time you start gmc. But simply deleting the ~/.gnome/metadata.db fixes it. Why the regenerated metadata.db is different from the one generated when the .gnome directory is created is beyond me -- _ _|_|_ ( ) *Anton Graham /v\ / [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
On Thu, 03 Aug 2000, you wrote: IMHO, you're wrong. It's not to Mandrake to keep compliant with Helix-GNOME but to Helix-GNOME to keep compliant with Mandrake distribution (and others Linux distributions). They ship different packages for different distributions, they are not distributions makers but they ship alternatives (Mandrake, SuSE, etc.) or complements (Caldera) to Linux distributions. So, if they really want to be used by users, they need to adapt their packages to each distributions. They do it, a little, but don't respect each distributions specifications. It's bad and sad. heh I would think they're a little busy coding, I think it's great that they even try to keep the spec files indepenent to each distro as much as they do. But then again, maybe they're right and they should do all the work and we simply reap all the benefits. Bryan Paxton
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
Frederic Soulier [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: A. Where is the "helix-updater" in Mandrake 7.1? we don't ship that, MandrakeSoft != HelixCode B. How are the Mandrake menus built (the consistent menus between different WM) /usr/bin/update-menus and how do you change them? /usr/doc/menu*/menu.txt -- MandrakeSoft Inchttp://www.mandrakesoft.com San-Francisco, CA USA --Chmouel
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
At 03 August, 2000 Chmouel Boudjnah wrote: Frederic Soulier [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: A. Where is the "helix-updater" in Mandrake 7.1? we don't ship that, MandrakeSoft != HelixCode Well, MandrakeSoft != GNU you still ship ALOT of gnu stuff. MandrakeSoft != SUN Still have staroffice on some CD aso. OK, you dont ship it. But would is be that stupid as you try to make it sound? //Snaggen -- Mattias Eriksson E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tvistevägen 26 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 907 36 UMEA Tel:090-198800 SWEDEN 070-5636769 'I don't fight for a cause Hemsida: http://www.acc.umu.se/~snaggen I fight for the fight' PGP: http://www.acc.umu.se/~snaggen/snaggen.asc
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
Mattias Eriksson [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Well, MandrakeSoft != GNU you still ship ALOT of gnu stuff. MandrakeSoft != SUN Still have staroffice on some CD aso. GNU do a distribution of rpm packages ? Staroffice do a distribution of rpm pacakges ? maybe yes but all package included in Mandrake are shipped/configured by MandrakeSoft. OK, you dont ship it. But would is be that stupid as you try to make it sound? Humm sorry about that, 03:AM here and i believe it has repercussion on my posts :-\ -- MandrakeSoft Inchttp://www.mandrakesoft.com San-Francisco, CA USA --Chmouel
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
At 03 August, 2000 Chmouel Boudjnah wrote: Mattias Eriksson [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Well, MandrakeSoft != GNU you still ship ALOT of gnu stuff. MandrakeSoft != SUN Still have staroffice on some CD aso. GNU do a distribution of rpm packages ? Staroffice do a distribution of rpm pacakges ? maybe yes but all package included in Mandrake are shipped/configured by MandrakeSoft. Yes, I know. And ofcource that is the only way it should be. But if you ship helix update you dont ship helix gnome, you just ship a tool to install helixgnome if people would like to do that... //Snaggen -- Mattias Eriksson E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tvistevägen 26 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 907 36 UMEA Tel:090-198800 SWEDEN 070-5636769 'I don't fight for a cause Hemsida: http://www.acc.umu.se/~snaggen I fight for the fight' PGP: http://www.acc.umu.se/~snaggen/snaggen.asc
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
Mattias Eriksson [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Yes, I know. And ofcource that is the only way it should be. But if you ship helix update you dont ship helix gnome, you just ship a tool to install helixgnome if people would like to do that... we can't ship a tools who can screwed a default mdk configuration, maybe a tools for contrib but not for the main/ distrib -- MandrakeSoft Inchttp://www.mandrakesoft.com San-Francisco, CA USA --Chmouel
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
Franck Martin [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: The helix updater is not important as long as the helix updated packages appear in the Mandrake Updates, and fast... Mandrake DO really need a good updater, with unattended updates. it's planned, but it's far far too be easy and can take several month before it going to be implemented (it's not just developing one tools it also to re-see a lot of packages)... -- MandrakeSoft Inchttp://www.mandrakesoft.com San-Francisco, CA USA --Chmouel
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
At 03 August, 2000 Chmouel Boudjnah wrote: Mattias Eriksson [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Yes, I know. And ofcource that is the only way it should be. But if you ship helix update you dont ship helix gnome, you just ship a tool to install helixgnome if people would like to do that... we can't ship a tools who can screwed a default mdk configuration, maybe a tools for contrib but not for the main/ distrib OK, I must admit that you have a quite good point there //Snaggen -- Mattias Eriksson E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tvistevägen 26 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 907 36 UMEA Tel:090-198800 SWEDEN 070-5636769 'I don't fight for a cause Hemsida: http://www.acc.umu.se/~snaggen I fight for the fight' PGP: http://www.acc.umu.se/~snaggen/snaggen.asc
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
Bonsoir, Could you please at least have the mandrake-update read where to find the mirror list from a file /etc/mandrake-update.conf. This should be easy and make us, network administrator, happy...(save bandwidth as well as work). That should be easy... On the long long term, and very very difficult, I found a firm that proposes something like SMS, but with the extra monitoring of system files, which gets reinstalled if deleted by mistake, on a per machine basis. Merci A+ Chmouel Boudjnah wrote: Franck Martin [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: The helix updater is not important as long as the helix updated packages appear in the Mandrake Updates, and fast... Mandrake DO really need a good updater, with unattended updates. it's planned, but it's far far too be easy and can take several month before it going to be implemented (it's not just developing one tools it also to re-see a lot of packages)... -- MandrakeSoft Inchttp://www.mandrakesoft.com San-Francisco, CA USA --Chmouel
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
On Thu, 03 Aug 2000, you wrote: At 03 August, 2000 Chmouel Boudjnah wrote: Mattias Eriksson [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Yes, I know. And ofcource that is the only way it should be. But if you ship helix update you dont ship helix gnome, you just ship a tool to install helixgnome if people would like to do that... we can't ship a tools who can screwed a default mdk configuration, maybe a tools for contrib but not for the main/ distrib OK, I must admit that you have a quite good point there //Snaggen Yeah, but mdk needs to keep the helix-gnome packages compliant with helix-gnome. Up untill now I've been ignoring the mdk helix-gnome packages and sticking with helix-update to update my packages as new ones become available. So I saw this thread and decided to install the mdk packages. I then exited gnome, and fired up X again and sorry but it's just friggin nasty IMHO. Basically what I'm trying to get through this is, keeping helix-gnome raw, the way it comes, and only lil minute tweaks should be made. Run helix-gnome raw and then mdk's helix-gnome and you'll see what I mean : )
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
Franck Martin [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Could you please at least have the mandrake-update read where to find the mirror list from a file /etc/mandrake-update.conf. This should be easy and make us, network administrator, happy...(save bandwidth as well as work). That should be easy... all suggetion for Mandrake-update go to dindin [EMAIL PROTECTED] On the long long term, and very very difficult, I found a firm that proposes something like SMS, but with the extra monitoring of system files, which gets reinstalled if deleted by mistake, on a per machine basis. how difference is from rpm ? -- MandrakeSoft Inchttp://www.mandrakesoft.com San-Francisco, CA USA --Chmouel
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
On Thu, Aug 03, 2000 at 10:24:57PM +1200, Franck Martin wrote: The helix updater is not important as long as the helix updated packages appear in the Mandrake Updates, and fast... Mandrake DO really need a good updater, with unattended updates. This is what I have found: In Mandrake-update.pm file which is installed with the mandrake-update executable, you find the line mirror=http://www.mandrake-soft.com/mirrors.lst. If you modify this line and point it to your corporate mirror, you control what gets updated. It would be nice to upgrade this line by checking in a /etc/mandrake-update.conf file where we should look for the list of mirror. A Network Administrator will remove the default to put his/her own list of mirrors... Now the extra, is to pass a switch to "mandrake-update -a" to automatically update all the packages listed without user intervention (a cron job). Problem: the kernels do not update automatically, despite beeing provided in update... So there must be a switch in the xml to stop the automatic update And glibc doesn't upgrade either, and, and... An automated updater would be _very_ dangerous. The new version of MandrakeUpdate (in Cooker) as some facilities to let people update their system from a Cooker mirror or from any place on a disk. Try it and tell me what you think. This is my 2 Fijian cents. Is that much? ;-) DindinX -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] HF Team
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
Bryan Paxton [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Yeah, but mdk needs to keep the helix-gnome packages compliant with helix-gnome. and cooker ?, we design an Operating System we don't ship only a few desktop packages... I then exited gnome, and fired up X again and sorry but it's just friggin nasty IMHO. Basically what I'm trying to get through this is, keeping helix-gnome raw, the way it comes, and only lil minute tweaks should be made. Suggestions are welcome, our Gnome team will be happy to discuss with you about the choice they did. What's wrong with the default configuration ? -- MandrakeSoft Inchttp://www.mandrakesoft.com San-Francisco, CA USA --Chmouel
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
On Thu, Aug 03, 2000 at 11:03:45PM +1200, Franck Martin wrote: Bonsoir, Could you please at least have the mandrake-update read where to find the mirror list from a file /etc/mandrake-update.conf. This should be easy and make us, network administrator, happy...(save bandwidth as well as work). That should be easy... On the long long term, and very very difficult, I found a firm that proposes something like SMS, but with the extra monitoring of system files, which gets reinstalled if deleted by mistake, on a per machine basis. Please test the latest MandrakeUpdate from Cooker. DindinX -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] HF Team
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
Submitted 03-Aug-00 by Bryan Paxton: Basically what I'm trying to get through this is, keeping helix-gnome raw, the way it comes, and only lil minute tweaks should be made. Part of the problem (as I see it), Brian, is that a large portion of our user base is rather inexperienced. When you run straight helix, you not only lose the continuity in menus between different managers, but your GNOME menus won't be updated when you install a new package that is designed to use the new menu system. Inexperienced users are not likely to be comfortable with having to create their own menu entries for every app. You are correct that there are some striking differences between the two. One that comes to mind immediately is the mdk GNOME's inability to properly display GTK themes with light colored text. They look fine in the preview window, but you end up with black text on your dark brown buttons after you apply the thing. -- _ _|_|_ ( ) *Anton Graham /v\ / [EMAIL PROTECTED] /( )X (m_m) GPG ID: 18F78541 Penguin Powered!
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
The new Mandrake Update rocks my socks. - Original Message - From: "David Odin" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, August 03, 2000 2:13 PM Subject: Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1) On Thu, Aug 03, 2000 at 10:24:57PM +1200, Franck Martin wrote: The helix updater is not important as long as the helix updated packages appear in the Mandrake Updates, and fast... Mandrake DO really need a good updater, with unattended updates. This is what I have found: In Mandrake-update.pm file which is installed with the mandrake-update executable, you find the line mirror=http://www.mandrake-soft.com/mirrors.lst. If you modify this line and point it to your corporate mirror, you control what gets updated. It would be nice to upgrade this line by checking in a /etc/mandrake-update.conf file where we should look for the list of mirror. A Network Administrator will remove the default to put his/her own list of mirrors... Now the extra, is to pass a switch to "mandrake-update -a" to automatically update all the packages listed without user intervention (a cron job). Problem: the kernels do not update automatically, despite beeing provided in update... So there must be a switch in the xml to stop the automatic update And glibc doesn't upgrade either, and, and... An automated updater would be _very_ dangerous. The new version of MandrakeUpdate (in Cooker) as some facilities to let people update their system from a Cooker mirror or from any place on a disk. Try it and tell me what you think. This is my 2 Fijian cents. Is that much? ;-) DindinX -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] HF Team
Latest MandrakeUpdate(Was Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1) )
On Thu, 03 Aug 2000, you wrote: On Thu, Aug 03, 2000 at 11:03:45PM +1200, Franck Martin wrote: Bonsoir, Could you please at least have the mandrake-update read where to find the mirror list from a file /etc/mandrake-update.conf. This should be easy and make us, network administrator, happy...(save bandwidth as well as work). That should be easy... On the long long term, and very very difficult, I found a firm that proposes something like SMS, but with the extra monitoring of system files, which gets reinstalled if deleted by mistake, on a per machine basis. Please test the latest MandrakeUpdate from Cooker. DindinX I was going to post about this, just been busy this morning... This is quite a nice improvement IMHO. A bug which I'm sure you know about is, it doesn't save the packages to ignore list, well after you exit and fire it up again you have to back in and add all the packages to ignore again. dep handling isn't as well though, in fact it's not really handled at all. What should be implemented is the auto-dep from DrakX IMHO as well as asking the user to meet deps bla bla these packages are going to be installed [yes][no] ala urpmi style. But other than that, I think MandrakeUpdate is on the right path. Need a CLI version though : ) But keep up the good work on this, really great job IMHO.
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
Anton Graham wrote: You are correct that there are some striking differences between the two. One that comes to mind immediately is the mdk GNOME's inability to properly display GTK themes with light colored text. They look fine in the preview window, but you end up with black text on your dark brown buttons after you apply the thing. BTW, a fix for this is to just delete /usr/share/gtkrc Cheers, A.
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
*nod* I understand, and I fully understand that it will be for the most part inexperienced users using mdk. See the follow up post I made to chmoel's response. I didn't even know about the below bug you mentioned : ) But I don't mean taking out functionality of updating the menus(which is a whole 'nother situation : p ) but simply keeping everything more compliant and helix-like. Bryan Paxton On Thu, 03 Aug 2000, you wrote: Submitted 03-Aug-00 by Bryan Paxton: Basically what I'm trying to get through this is, keeping helix-gnome raw, the way it comes, and only lil minute tweaks should be made. Part of the problem (as I see it), Brian, is that a large portion of our user base is rather inexperienced. When you run straight helix, you not only lose the continuity in menus between different managers, but your GNOME menus won't be updated when you install a new package that is designed to use the new menu system. Inexperienced users are not likely to be comfortable with having to create their own menu entries for every app. You are correct that there are some striking differences between the two. One that comes to mind immediately is the mdk GNOME's inability to properly display GTK themes with light colored text. They look fine in the preview window, but you end up with black text on your dark brown buttons after you apply the thing.
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
On Thu, Aug 03, 2000 at 03:34:01AM -0700, Chmouel Boudjnah wrote: we can't ship a tools who can screwed a default mdk configuration, Yes, please delete all the text editors, mkXYfs, fdisk :-) Oh, it wsa 03:34 AM when you wrote that, then this is okay .-] Alexander Skwar -- Homepage: http://www.digitalprojects.com Sichere Mail? Mail an [EMAIL PROTECTED] fuer GnuPG Keys ICQ:7328191
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
On Thu, Aug 03, 2000 at 06:45:59AM -0500, Bryan Paxton wrote: Yeah, but mdk needs to keep the helix-gnome packages compliant with helix-gnome. Why? That's the task of Helixcode IMO. I then exited gnome, and fired up X again and sorry but it's just friggin nasty IMHO. Basically what I'm trying to get through this is, keeping helix-gnome raw, the way it comes, and only lil minute tweaks should be made. What do you mean? Helix worked like a charm for me, ie. no problems here. Alexander Skwar -- Homepage: http://www.digitalprojects.com Sichere Mail? Mail an [EMAIL PROTECTED] fuer GnuPG Keys ICQ:7328191
RE: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
I will talk to dindin about mandrake-update... The difference with a RPM, is that: 1) oops a file libveryimportant.so is deleted. 2) The system cron, check from rpms and find out that rpm whatever.rpm is the one installing libveryimportant.so 3) The system does not re-instal the rpm whatever.rpm (you loose your config files), but simply extract libveryimportant.so and copy it where it should be. Mail to admin is sent... You system is kept maintained with all necessary files to run. Extra a hacker trying to infiltrate your system will be defeated as his trojan software will be replaced... Cheers. Franck Martin Database Development Officer SOPAC South Pacific Applied Geoscience Commission Fiji E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Web site: http://www.sopac.org/ http://www.sopac.org/ -Original Message- From: Chmouel Boudjnah [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Thursday, August 03, 2000 11:57 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: David odin Subject: Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1) Franck Martin [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Could you please at least have the mandrake-update read where to find the mirror list from a file /etc/mandrake-update.conf. This should be easy and make us, network administrator, happy...(save bandwidth as well as work). That should be easy... all suggetion for Mandrake-update go to dindin [EMAIL PROTECTED] On the long long term, and very very difficult, I found a firm that proposes something like SMS, but with the extra monitoring of system files, which gets reinstalled if deleted by mistake, on a per machine basis. how difference is from rpm ? -- MandrakeSoft Inchttp://www.mandrakesoft.com San-Francisco, CA USA --Chmouel
RE: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
Salut, I agree an automatic update would be very dangerous, EXCEPT if it is in a controlled environment. This would be an option, disabled by default... Scenario: I make a mirror(1) of the updates. I look through it and decide that some rpm are not cool I copy the cool packages on another place(2), and modify the xml file to reflect the changes My network machines gets updated from (2), without me moving. Advantage: I can add non mdk packages in (2) and get the machines updated Extra TODO: In (2) I place a file somemachine.update.xml. It adds the selected rpms described in somemachine.update.xml to somemachine only. Documentation: Important to understand the structure of the xml files TODO: An editor that create xml files based on the Packages placed in(2). Mandrake-update is then coming closer to the MS SMS job packaging that we all know(??). Problems: security - security. But we are smart enough to put some safeguards (Machine signature, Kerebos system...) RESULT: Mandrake the first Linux to grows alone Think about all the TCO saved by having your support people stay in one place, when there is a package to update due to a security alert. Mandrake as to start to THINK BIG. With 1000's of machine to update on a LAN. Franck Martin Database Development Officer SOPAC South Pacific Applied Geoscience Commission Fiji E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Web site: http://www.sopac.org/ http://www.sopac.org/ -Original Message- From: David Odin [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, August 04, 2000 12:13 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1) On Thu, Aug 03, 2000 at 10:24:57PM +1200, Franck Martin wrote: The helix updater is not important as long as the helix updated packages appear in the Mandrake Updates, and fast... Mandrake DO really need a good updater, with unattended updates. This is what I have found: In Mandrake-update.pm file which is installed with the mandrake-update executable, you find the line mirror=http://www.mandrake-soft.com/mirrors.lst. If you modify this line and point it to your corporate mirror, you control what gets updated. It would be nice to upgrade this line by checking in a /etc/mandrake-update.conf file where we should look for the list of mirror. A Network Administrator will remove the default to put his/her own list of mirrors... Now the extra, is to pass a switch to "mandrake-update -a" to automatically update all the packages listed without user intervention (a cron job). Problem: the kernels do not update automatically, despite beeing provided in update... So there must be a switch in the xml to stop the automatic update And glibc doesn't upgrade either, and, and... An automated updater would be _very_ dangerous. The new version of MandrakeUpdate (in Cooker) as some facilities to let people update their system from a Cooker mirror or from any place on a disk. Try it and tell me what you think. This is my 2 Fijian cents. Is that much? ;-) DindinX -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] HF Team
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
Alexander Skwar [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Yes, please delete all the text editors, mkXYfs, fdisk :-) you kidding do you understand there is a real difference between what you say and what i say ? Oh, it wsa 03:34 AM when you wrote that, then this is okay .-] i have to admit i am not really always clear at this time -- MandrakeSoft Inchttp://www.mandrakesoft.com San-Francisco, CA USA --Chmouel
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome + Mandrake menus (mdk7.1)
Franck Martin [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: 1) oops a file libveryimportant.so is deleted. 2) The system cron, check from rpms and find out that rpm whatever.rpm is the one installing libveryimportant.so 3) The system does not re-instal the rpm whatever.rpm (you loose your config files), but simply extract libveryimportant.so and copy it where it should be. Mail to admin is sent... so it's not a tools to replace rpm, but it's usefull only for big network, i'll forward to our PS people. -- MandrakeSoft Inchttp://www.mandrakesoft.com San-Francisco, CA USA --Chmouel
Re: [Cooker] Helix
Ive grabed it and was hopeing to see it in mandrake SOON! It ROCKS!!! and i havent had ANY BUGS dave On Mon, 10 Apr 2000, you wrote: I am probably telling you all something that is very old news ! Please bear with me, I live in the UK where we still pay for Internet access and I only have a 56K modem !!! Any way, has any one else grabbed the latest output from the Helix people. It's GOOD ! Owen -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= LINUX - Why? Cause I dont do windows -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Re: [Cooker] Helix
ArMiSiS AiEoLn a écrit : Ive grabed it and was hopeing to see it in mandrake SOON! It ROCKS!!! and i havent had ANY BUGS We've packaging most of the packages from helix : Stuffs are in cooker . Some packages (gnome-core 1.1.5) are not very stable to be included in the distro! dave On Mon, 10 Apr 2000, you wrote: I am probably telling you all something that is very old news ! Please bear with me, I live in the UK where we still pay for Internet access and I only have a 56K modem !!! Any way, has any one else grabbed the latest output from the Helix people. It's GOOD ! Owen -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= LINUX - Why? Cause I dont do windows -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= -- /\ --^^/°°\^^-- | Daouda LOemail:[EMAIL PROTECTED] | | MandrakeSoft SA| | working on KDE-Gnome interoperability. |
RE: [Cooker] Helix
ArMiSiS AiEoLn a écrit : Ive grabed it and was hopeing to see it in mandrake SOON! It ROCKS!!! and i havent had ANY BUGS We've packaging most of the packages from helix : Stuffs are in cooker . Some packages (gnome-core 1.1.5) are not very stable to be included in the distro! hm, how about contribs? dave On Mon, 10 Apr 2000, you wrote: I am probably telling you all something that is very old news ! Please bear with me, I live in the UK where we still pay for Internet access and I only have a 56K modem !!! Any way, has any one else grabbed the latest output from the Helix people. It's GOOD ! Owen -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= LINUX - Why? Cause I dont do windows -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= -- /\ --^^/°°\^^-- | Daouda LOemail:[EMAIL PROTECTED] | | MandrakeSoft SA| | working on KDE-Gnome interoperability. |
Re: [Cooker] Helix
Daouda LO [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: ArMiSiS AiEoLn a écrit : Ive grabed it and was hopeing to see it in mandrake SOON! It ROCKS!!! and i havent had ANY BUGS We've packaging most of the packages from helix : Stuffs are in cooker . Some packages (gnome-core 1.1.5) are not very stable to be included in the distro! gnome core 1.1.5 (cvs) is more stable than stable gnome-core -- -- Yoann, http://prelude.sourceforge.net It is well known that M$ products don't call free() after a malloc(). The Unix community wish them good luck for their future developments.
Re: [Cooker] Helix
Daouda LO wrote: ArMiSiS AiEoLn a écrit : Ive grabed it and was hopeing to see it in mandrake SOON! It ROCKS!!! and i havent had ANY BUGS We've packaging most of the packages from helix : Stuffs are in cooker . Some packages (gnome-core 1.1.5) are not very stable to be included in the distro! dave On Mon, 10 Apr 2000, you wrote: I am probably telling you all something that is very old news ! Please bear with me, I live in the UK where we still pay for Internet access and I only have a 56K modem !!! Any way, has any one else grabbed the latest output from the Helix people. It's GOOD ! Owen -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= LINUX - Why? Cause I dont do windows -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= -- /\ --^^/°°\^^-- | Daouda LOemail:[EMAIL PROTECTED] | | MandrakeSoft SA| | working on KDE-Gnome interoperability. | Unmm the gnome-core 1.1.5 is not but the later versions are much more stable, and fyi the gnome-core is the whole reason for using the new helix rpms!! imho! though. but it is manly what has been changed except for a few minor bug fix updates in the other stuff. We WANT the bleeding edge! -DarkWlf
Re: [Cooker] Helix-Code Gnome
Hey! The dependency problems are no big deal... Things still work. What's more painful is the bugs relating to the desktop icons and launchers. I found downgrading to the original Mandrake 7.0 gmc fixes lots of problems with helix gnome. In other words, don't use helix code's gmc, use gnome's original... cheers! Patrick Michael Gallagher wrote: Hi, Has anyone had any luck with installing Helix-Code Gnome on Madrake 7.0? I gave it a try, downloading the packages and then installing, but had some problems. A couple dependency problems and that I couldn't correct, libguile.so.4 and libbfd-2.91.0.24.so. When I finished the install and tried Gnome I had a run of problems. Most noticibly that the icons on the desktop were all screwed up. I no longer had harddrive icons, just folder short cuts, as with all the Mandrake icons. Is there anyway to keep the icons? I figure that they're lost when upgrading Gnome, but is there anyway to prevent this? I'm hoping that if I go through and solve the dependencies I'll be all set. I also noticed that I couldn't add any clocks to the panel. If I did, the panel would lock up. Again I'm wondering if the dependencies are causing this. I found the files that I think I needed afterwards when I was reinstalling Gnome from the orginal Mandrake files. I was just curious if anyone else had given it a try. Thanks. ~Mike
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome RPMS
Where are those RPMS??? Axalon Bloodstone wrote: On Sat, 11 Mar 2000, Nitin Raja Bhatia wrote: Hello All, I will be producing Helix Gnome rpms optimized for Mandrake. They will be available shortly. Helix-Gnome is real slick... Raja Already done, just waiting on some files left out of the gnome-media SRPM. I'll put up the rest while i wait i guess. -- MandrakeSoft http://www.mandrakesoft.com/ --Axalon
Re: [Cooker] Helix Gnome RPMS
On Sat, 11 Mar 2000, Nitin Raja Bhatia wrote: Hello All, I will be producing Helix Gnome rpms optimized for Mandrake. They will be available shortly. Helix-Gnome is real slick... Raja Already done, just waiting on some files left out of the gnome-media SRPM. I'll put up the rest while i wait i guess. -- MandrakeSoft http://www.mandrakesoft.com/ --Axalon
Re: [Cooker] Helix-Code Gnome
I installed Helix today, and it's brilliant. This may sway me away from KDE ! But that's not what you want to hear ! Having played with gnome for a couple of years I have been bitten by install scripts before. I just downloaded everything and worked on the assumption that RPM was correct for the 75%ish files it said were older than the mdk versions. The only problem I had was running the gnome panel under Enlightenment, shame 'cos I like E ! but sawmill looks pretty smart too. I also had the dependency problems, I guess Helix will post these as updates sometime. I think this is beta stuff, reading between the lines of publicity. It has a few quirks, but all in all I think it makes major strides in usability. In response to Ivan Kerekes, if the only good thing you found was the fact you got sound working then you weren't looking very far !!! I e-mailed Helix about my two favourite Linux bug bears. They confirmed that they will look into non postscript printers and parallel port scanners - hooray ! Keep going, it's worth the effort. Owen On Thu, 09 Mar 2000, you wrote: Hi, Has anyone had any luck with installing Helix-Code Gnome on Madrake 7.0? I gave it a try, downloading the packages and then installing, but had some problems. A couple dependency problems and that I couldn't correct, libguile.so.4 and libbfd-2.91.0.24.so. When I finished the install and tried Gnome I had a run of problems. Most noticibly that the icons on the desktop were all screwed up. I no longer had harddrive icons, just folder short cuts, as with all the Mandrake icons. Is there anyway to keep the icons? I figure that they're lost when upgrading Gnome, but is there anyway to prevent this? I'm hoping that if I go through and solve the dependencies I'll be all set. I also noticed that I couldn't add any clocks to the panel. If I did, the panel would lock up. Again I'm wondering if the dependencies are causing this. I found the files that I think I needed afterwards when I was reinstalling Gnome from the orginal Mandrake files. I was just curious if anyone else had given it a try. Thanks. ~Mike
Re: [Cooker] Helix-Code Gnome
I'm using it...I've also filed several bug reports with Helix for Mandrake 7.0 dependency. I'd blame both teams really. Mandrake who should become a Helix GNOME partner because it will improve the quality of Mandrake's GNOME support. It's also the Helix team's fault because they basically just copied the Redhat RPMs into a Mandrake directory. There's no possible way they could have installed them on a Mandrake system...way too many dependencys and wrong version libraries. You can get things installed but you will have to --force some of the RPMs (many just due to RPM alpha-numeric naming conflicts) and some such as guile will need symbolic links created (eg, Helix GNOME wants libguile.so.4 and Mandrake only provides libguile.so.3 and libguile.so.5). It works fine once they're installed. -- Steve Fox http://k-lug.com
