Re: New names of repositories
I have opened the Jira ticket: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-23935 I have also prepared PRs to update all occurrences of "incubator-nuttx" to "nuttx" in the three repositories. Please *DO NOT* merge them until after the repositories have been renamed!!! https://github.com/apache/incubator-nuttx/pull/7669 https://github.com/apache/incubator-nuttx-apps/pull/1437 https://github.com/apache/incubator-nuttx-website/pull/80 Thanks to everyone for your input and help! Cheers, Nathan On Wed, Nov 23, 2022 at 4:10 AM Sebastien Lorquet wrote: > > +1, too > > Sébastien > > Le 22/11/2022 à 14:30, Nathan Hartman a écrit : > > After hearing back from Infra about the repository naming convention, > > all the recent feedback has been to stay with the default and just > > remove "incubator-" from our repo names, giving: > > > > https://github.com/apache/nuttx > > https://github.com/apache/nuttx-apps > > > > Shall I go ahead and open the Jira ticket to do that? > > > > Cheers, > > Nathan
Re: New names of repositories
+1, too Sébastien Le 22/11/2022 à 14:30, Nathan Hartman a écrit : After hearing back from Infra about the repository naming convention, all the recent feedback has been to stay with the default and just remove "incubator-" from our repo names, giving: https://github.com/apache/nuttx https://github.com/apache/nuttx-apps Shall I go ahead and open the Jira ticket to do that? Cheers, Nathan
Re: New names of repositories
+1 Em ter., 22 de nov. de 2022 às 10:30, Nathan Hartman escreveu: > > After hearing back from Infra about the repository naming convention, > all the recent feedback has been to stay with the default and just > remove "incubator-" from our repo names, giving: > > https://github.com/apache/nuttx > https://github.com/apache/nuttx-apps > > Shall I go ahead and open the Jira ticket to do that? > > Cheers, > Nathan -- Flavio de Castro Alves Filho flavio.al...@gmail.com Twitter: http://twitter.com/#!/fraviofii LinkedIn profile: www.linkedin.com/in/flaviocastroalves
Re: New names of repositories
+1 вт, 22 лист. 2022 р. о 16:35 Gregory Nutt пише: > +1 Let's do it! > > On 11/22/2022 7:30 AM, Nathan Hartman wrote: > > After hearing back from Infra about the repository naming convention, > > all the recent feedback has been to stay with the default and just > > remove "incubator-" from our repo names, giving: > > > > https://github.com/apache/nuttx > > https://github.com/apache/nuttx-apps > > > > Shall I go ahead and open the Jira ticket to do that? > > > > Cheers, > > Nathan > > >
Re: New names of repositories
+1 Let's do it! On 11/22/2022 7:30 AM, Nathan Hartman wrote: After hearing back from Infra about the repository naming convention, all the recent feedback has been to stay with the default and just remove "incubator-" from our repo names, giving: https://github.com/apache/nuttx https://github.com/apache/nuttx-apps Shall I go ahead and open the Jira ticket to do that? Cheers, Nathan
RE: New names of repositories
+1 >-Original Message- >From: Nathan Hartman >Sent: 22 November 2022 13:30 >To: dev@nuttx.apache.org >Subject: Re: New names of repositories > >After hearing back from Infra about the repository naming convention, all the >recent feedback has been to stay with the default and just remove >"incubator-" from our repo names, giving: > >https://github.com/apache/nuttx >https://github.com/apache/nuttx-apps > >Shall I go ahead and open the Jira ticket to do that? > >Cheers, >Nathan
Re: New names of repositories
+1 :-) -- CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info
Re: New names of repositories
Ok! +1 On 11/22/22, Nathan Hartman wrote: > After hearing back from Infra about the repository naming convention, > all the recent feedback has been to stay with the default and just > remove "incubator-" from our repo names, giving: > > https://github.com/apache/nuttx > https://github.com/apache/nuttx-apps > > Shall I go ahead and open the Jira ticket to do that? > > Cheers, > Nathan >
RE: New names of repositories
Ok from me //Alin -Original Message- From: Nathan Hartman Sent: den 22 november 2022 14:30 To: dev@nuttx.apache.org Subject: Re: New names of repositories After hearing back from Infra about the repository naming convention, all the recent feedback has been to stay with the default and just remove "incubator-" from our repo names, giving: https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://github.com/apache/nuttx__;!!JmoZiZGBv3RvKRSx!7pBPRw-m9zdGEIOK5hGfMZsKBSb1mH2hvGpMYd65kA6s2hRw75LAa6YUjFbcrOg32iG3vvO9_ow53v-3ATYj4qL1SA$ https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://github.com/apache/nuttx-apps__;!!JmoZiZGBv3RvKRSx!7pBPRw-m9zdGEIOK5hGfMZsKBSb1mH2hvGpMYd65kA6s2hRw75LAa6YUjFbcrOg32iG3vvO9_ow53v-3ATbTbs2f3A$ Shall I go ahead and open the Jira ticket to do that? Cheers, Nathan
Re: New names of repositories
After hearing back from Infra about the repository naming convention, all the recent feedback has been to stay with the default and just remove "incubator-" from our repo names, giving: https://github.com/apache/nuttx https://github.com/apache/nuttx-apps Shall I go ahead and open the Jira ticket to do that? Cheers, Nathan
Re: New names of repositories
Hi, Also voting to let as-is One more reason to keep the OS code under the "nuttx" name without some sort of suffix: this is the main name of the project, and has been for years. When you want to clone this repo from a command line, you dont want to go check on github if this is nuttx-core nuttx-main nuttx-foobar or nuttx-whatever. This is just nuttx. Minor reason but for day-to-day usability it could be useful to many people :) Sebastien Le 20/11/2022 à 21:09, Alin Jerpelea a écrit : +1 let is as it is :) On Sun, 20 Nov 2022, 20:23 Tomek CEDRO, wrote: On Sun, Nov 20, 2022 at 8:20 PM Gregory Nutt wrote: On 11/20/2022 1:18 PM, Tim Hardisty wrote: Might I humbly suggest that "if it isn't broken, don't fix it"? Just stick with the names already in use (minus the incubator, as will happen anyway). Just tried searching the Apache website for "RTOS" and NuttX is top of the list; searching the Apache GitHub repositories similarly and NuttX is the only repo that comes up. If it does go to a vote, you can guess what mine will be for :) ... After flip-flopping for a couple of days, I have come to the same conclusion as well. +1 :-) :-) :-) -- CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info
Re: New names of repositories
+1 let is as it is :) On Sun, 20 Nov 2022, 20:23 Tomek CEDRO, wrote: > On Sun, Nov 20, 2022 at 8:20 PM Gregory Nutt wrote: > > > > On 11/20/2022 1:18 PM, Tim Hardisty wrote: > > > Might I humbly suggest that "if it isn't broken, don't fix it"? > > > > > > Just stick with the names already in use (minus the incubator, as will > happen anyway). Just tried searching the Apache website for "RTOS" and > NuttX is top of the list; searching the Apache GitHub repositories > similarly and NuttX is the only repo that comes up. > > > > > > If it does go to a vote, you can guess what mine will be for :) > > > > ... > > > > After flip-flopping for a couple of days, I have come to the same > > conclusion as well. > > +1 :-) :-) :-) > > -- > CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info >
Re: New names of repositories
On Sun, Nov 20, 2022 at 8:20 PM Gregory Nutt wrote: > > On 11/20/2022 1:18 PM, Tim Hardisty wrote: > > Might I humbly suggest that "if it isn't broken, don't fix it"? > > > > Just stick with the names already in use (minus the incubator, as will > > happen anyway). Just tried searching the Apache website for "RTOS" and > > NuttX is top of the list; searching the Apache GitHub repositories > > similarly and NuttX is the only repo that comes up. > > > > If it does go to a vote, you can guess what mine will be for :) > > ... > > After flip-flopping for a couple of days, I have come to the same > conclusion as well. +1 :-) :-) :-) -- CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info
Re: New names of repositories
On 11/20/2022 1:18 PM, Tim Hardisty wrote: Might I humbly suggest that "if it isn't broken, don't fix it"? Just stick with the names already in use (minus the incubator, as will happen anyway). Just tried searching the Apache website for "RTOS" and NuttX is top of the list; searching the Apache GitHub repositories similarly and NuttX is the only repo that comes up. If it does go to a vote, you can guess what mine will be for :) ... After flip-flopping for a couple of days, I have come to the same conclusion as well.
Re: New names of repositories
On Sun, Nov 20, 2022 at 8:02 PM Nathan Hartman wrote:
> Okay, I did that, and I have received responses from Infra that are
> quite helpful:
>
> (1) Infra requires repos to be named ${project}-${reponame} because of
> technical reasons related to LDAP. (This was not previously documented,
> but a note has been added to [1] in response to my question.)
>
> (2) If we don't request otherwise, Infra will by default simply remove
> "incubator-" from our repo names, so we would get:
>
> * https://github.com/apache/nuttx
> * https://github.com/apache/nuttx-apps
Looks like this is the best and most preferred option then? :-)
This also requires no additional modifications of the current source code? :-)
When underscores are required then local git clone can solve that? :-)
I am still wondering on adding -rtos part just to attract attention of
more users/developers.. but this part may not be really necessary and
this is the project managers decision :-)
--
CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info
Re: New names of repositories
Might I humbly suggest that "if it isn't broken, don't fix it"?
Just stick with the names already in use (minus the incubator, as will happen
anyway). Just tried searching the Apache website for "RTOS" and NuttX is top of
the list; searching the Apache GitHub repositories similarly and NuttX is the
only repo that comes up.
If it does go to a vote, you can guess what mine will be for :)
On 20/11/2022, 19:02, "Nathan Hartman" wrote:
On Sun, Nov 20, 2022 at 9:46 AM Gregory Nutt wrote:
> Could we simplify the options before a vote be discussing the
> possibilities that you have listed with INFRA?
Okay, I did that, and I have received responses from Infra that are
quite helpful:
(1) Infra requires repos to be named ${project}-${reponame} because of
technical reasons related to LDAP. (This was not previously documented,
but a note has been added to [1] in response to my question.)
(2) If we don't request otherwise, Infra will by default simply remove
"incubator-" from our repo names, so we would get:
* https://github.com/apache/nuttx
* https://github.com/apache/nuttx-apps
(3) When renaming repos, Infra is careful to preserve our existing
stars and forks. (They can, upon request, archive the repos and create
new ones, which would lose the existing stars and forks, but we
definitely don't want that!)
Additional note: I looked through the list of Apache repos at [2] (all
81 pages of them!!) and none had underscores or CamelCase.
So, bottom line, it looks like the name 'nuttx-apps' is pretty much set
in stone (unless we want to change 'apps' to something else), and
regarding the main repo, it could be one of the following (I'm just
including the items that were suggested earlier):
* nuttx
* nuttx-core
* nuttx-rtos
* nuttx-kernel
* nuttx-${something}
So that narrows down what we need to decide, which should make our
lives easier. :-)
[1] https://infra.apache.org/project-repo-policy.html
[2] https://github.com/orgs/apache/repositories
I have permission to share this reply verbatim:
[[[
On Sun, Nov 20, 2022 at 1:33 PM fluxo wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Nov 20, 2022, at 9:20 AM, Nathan Hartman
wrote:
> >
> > Hi all,
> >
> > Over in NuttX-land, we just graduated the Incubator and are having a
> > community-wide discussion [1] regarding what to name our repositories.
> >
> > We're *not* ready to rename them yet, since there is still a debate
> > going on.
> >
> > Rather, I'm writing only to ask some questions so we can narrow down
> > our choices:
> >
> > (1) Does Infra have a convention or preference on the use of hyphens,
> > underscores, CamelCase, for repo names, i.e., are any of these
> > preferred, not allowed, etc:
> >
> > https://github.com/apache/nuttx/nuttx-apps
> > https://github.com/apache/nuttx/nuttx_apps
> > https://github.com/apache/nuttx/NuttXApps
> >
> > (2) Is it possible to put our repos in a subdirectory, e.g.,
> >
> > https://github.com/apache/nuttx/nuttx
> > https://github.com/apache/nuttx/apps
>
> Congratulations on your graduation!
>
> The Infra convention requires project repos to be named with the
convention of $project-$reponame in order to map the project LDAP group to the
permissions scheme.
>
> Examples for the above would thus be:
>
> https://github.com/apache/nuttx
> https://github.com/apache/nuttx-apps
>
> When the time comes, please open an Infra Jira ticket to rename your
repositories, considering the aforementioned naming scheme. We can do so in a
way that preserves the existing stars/forks and redirects the old name. If you
wish to start anew you may also do that by creating new repos via
https://selfserve.apache.org/ and Infra can archive the old incubator repos.
>
> Do be careful if you file the incubator -> TLP ticket that without
knowledge of your desires for renaming, Infra would simply remove 'incubator-'
from the name of the repo(s).
>
> Up to you(r project.)
>
> > (Background info: In our pre-Incubator days, the repos were called
> > 'nuttx' and 'apps'.)
> >
> > (3) If there is a repo naming convention, is it documented somewhere
> > that I can share with our mailing list?
>
> It's documented insofar as much as selfserve will only allow the creation
of repos following the pattern I mentioned.
>
> -fluxo (Chris)
> ASF Infra
>
>
> >
> > Thank you very much,
> > Nathan
> >
> > [1] https://lists.apache.org/thread/2o3rrh0qnoh53j4ro0gxompxr13lc59d
>
]]]
Cheers,
Nathan
Re: New names of repositories
On Sun, Nov 20, 2022 at 9:46 AM Gregory Nutt wrote:
> Could we simplify the options before a vote be discussing the
> possibilities that you have listed with INFRA?
Okay, I did that, and I have received responses from Infra that are
quite helpful:
(1) Infra requires repos to be named ${project}-${reponame} because of
technical reasons related to LDAP. (This was not previously documented,
but a note has been added to [1] in response to my question.)
(2) If we don't request otherwise, Infra will by default simply remove
"incubator-" from our repo names, so we would get:
* https://github.com/apache/nuttx
* https://github.com/apache/nuttx-apps
(3) When renaming repos, Infra is careful to preserve our existing
stars and forks. (They can, upon request, archive the repos and create
new ones, which would lose the existing stars and forks, but we
definitely don't want that!)
Additional note: I looked through the list of Apache repos at [2] (all
81 pages of them!!) and none had underscores or CamelCase.
So, bottom line, it looks like the name 'nuttx-apps' is pretty much set
in stone (unless we want to change 'apps' to something else), and
regarding the main repo, it could be one of the following (I'm just
including the items that were suggested earlier):
* nuttx
* nuttx-core
* nuttx-rtos
* nuttx-kernel
* nuttx-${something}
So that narrows down what we need to decide, which should make our
lives easier. :-)
[1] https://infra.apache.org/project-repo-policy.html
[2] https://github.com/orgs/apache/repositories
I have permission to share this reply verbatim:
[[[
On Sun, Nov 20, 2022 at 1:33 PM fluxo wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Nov 20, 2022, at 9:20 AM, Nathan Hartman
> > wrote:
> >
> > Hi all,
> >
> > Over in NuttX-land, we just graduated the Incubator and are having a
> > community-wide discussion [1] regarding what to name our repositories.
> >
> > We're *not* ready to rename them yet, since there is still a debate
> > going on.
> >
> > Rather, I'm writing only to ask some questions so we can narrow down
> > our choices:
> >
> > (1) Does Infra have a convention or preference on the use of hyphens,
> > underscores, CamelCase, for repo names, i.e., are any of these
> > preferred, not allowed, etc:
> >
> > https://github.com/apache/nuttx/nuttx-apps
> > https://github.com/apache/nuttx/nuttx_apps
> > https://github.com/apache/nuttx/NuttXApps
> >
> > (2) Is it possible to put our repos in a subdirectory, e.g.,
> >
> > https://github.com/apache/nuttx/nuttx
> > https://github.com/apache/nuttx/apps
>
> Congratulations on your graduation!
>
> The Infra convention requires project repos to be named with the convention
> of $project-$reponame in order to map the project LDAP group to the
> permissions scheme.
>
> Examples for the above would thus be:
>
> https://github.com/apache/nuttx
> https://github.com/apache/nuttx-apps
>
> When the time comes, please open an Infra Jira ticket to rename your
> repositories, considering the aforementioned naming scheme. We can do so in a
> way that preserves the existing stars/forks and redirects the old name. If
> you wish to start anew you may also do that by creating new repos via
> https://selfserve.apache.org/ and Infra can archive the old incubator repos.
>
> Do be careful if you file the incubator -> TLP ticket that without knowledge
> of your desires for renaming, Infra would simply remove 'incubator-' from the
> name of the repo(s).
>
> Up to you(r project.)
>
> > (Background info: In our pre-Incubator days, the repos were called
> > 'nuttx' and 'apps'.)
> >
> > (3) If there is a repo naming convention, is it documented somewhere
> > that I can share with our mailing list?
>
> It's documented insofar as much as selfserve will only allow the creation of
> repos following the pattern I mentioned.
>
> -fluxo (Chris)
> ASF Infra
>
>
> >
> > Thank you very much,
> > Nathan
> >
> > [1] https://lists.apache.org/thread/2o3rrh0qnoh53j4ro0gxompxr13lc59d
>
]]]
Cheers,
Nathan
Re: New names of repositories
On Sun, Nov 20, 2022 at 9:46 AM Gregory Nutt wrote: > > On 11/20/2022 6:21 AM, Nathan Hartman wrote: > > ... > > Are we ready to call a [VOTE] thread or does anyone have more > > input/arguments/suggestions? > > ... > > Good job, Nathan. I think you have summarized the options and issues well. > > Could we simplify the options before a vote be discussing the > possibilities that you have listed with INFRA? Are you on good speaking > terms with anyone there? Since they are responsible for creating and > managing all of the repositories, they must have some standards and > conventions (or at least recommendations and preferences). We should > take those into account as well. > > Obviously, they are following a pattern in the naming of Apache > repositories, but I cannot find any published repository naming > standards or conventions. That's a great idea. There isn't much point to voting on names that might not be possible. I'll go ahead and ask right now. Cheers, Nathan
Re: New names of repositories
On 11/20/2022 6:21 AM, Nathan Hartman wrote: ... Are we ready to call a [VOTE] thread or does anyone have more input/arguments/suggestions? ... Good job, Nathan. I think you have summarized the options and issues well. Could we simplify the options before a vote be discussing the possibilities that you have listed with INFRA? Are you on good speaking terms with anyone there? Since they are responsible for creating and managing all of the repositories, they must have some standards and conventions (or at least recommendations and preferences). We should take those into account as well. Obviously, they are following a pattern in the naming of Apache repositories, but I cannot find any published repository naming standards or conventions. Greg
Re: New names of repositories
The discussion has two aspects: (1) delimiter, and (2) name for the main repo. I studied all the feedback from this thread and found that there were 5 suggested delimiter styles: * hyphen (e.g., nuttx-apps) * underscore (e.g., nuttx_apps) * subdirectory (e.g., nuttx/rtos, nuttx/apps) * none (e.g., nuttxapps) * CamelCase (e.g., NuttXApps) and four suggested names for the main repo (shown without delimiters): * nuttx * nuttx rtos * nuttx core * nuttx kernel I made a list of all permutations of all suggested delimiters and names: [1] nuttx, nuttx-apps [2] nuttx, nuttx_apps [3] nuttx, nuttx/apps [4] nuttx, nuttxapps [5] NuttX, NuttXApps [6] nuttx-rtos, nuttx-apps [7] nuttx_rtos, nuttx_apps [8] nuttx/rtos, nuttx/apps [9] nuttxrtos, nuttxapps [10] NuttXRTOS, NuttXApps [11] nuttx-core, nuttx-apps [12] nuttx_core, nuttx_apps [13] nuttx/core, nuttx/apps [14] nuttxcore, nuttxapps [15] NuttXCore, NuttXApps [16] nuttx-kernel, nuttx-apps [17] nuttx_kernel, nuttx_apps [18] nuttx/kernel, nuttx/apps [19] nuttxkernel, nuttxapps [20] NuttXKernel, NuttXApps I suggest to call a [VOTE] thread with all of the above and see which one wins. Note: If we find that the winning option cannot be done (e.g., suppose 'nuttx/rtos' wins and we find out we can't do directories, or 'NuttXKernel' wins but we find out we can't do capital letters) then we'll need to have another vote without those options. Below I will make a summary of all the arguments that I saw: # Delimeter The following delimiters showed up in this mail thread: * hyphen (e.g., nuttx-apps) * underscore (e.g., nuttx_apps) * subdirectory (e.g., nuttx/rtos, nuttx/apps) * none (e.g., nuttxapps) * CamelCase (e.g., NuttXApps) The following arguments were presented: Arguments regarding hyphen '-': * Pro: Are recommended for URLs by Google [1] * Pro: Other Apache projects use hyphens (e.g., mynewt-core) [2] * Con: Some toolchains or filesystems have problems [3] (workaround exists: git clone [4]) * Con: Filenames should not begin with hyphen because of command line interpretation Arguments regarding underscores: * Pro: Workaround for toolchains or filesystems that don't like hyphens * Con: Hard to see when underlined link, doesn't work in AWS S3 [5] Arguments regarding a subdirectory: * Pro: Gives us our own namespace to use old repo names 'nuttx' and 'apps' * Con: We don't know if we can do that. We have to ask Infra. No arguments were presented regarding none or CamelCase, but some names were suggested with these styles. References: [1] https://lists.apache.org/thread/h0418pyxsvk85qfvogdrny3zp2qnzz8m [2] https://lists.apache.org/thread/54vbjnwoqzod81yg882rkwst4kg7trno [3] https://lists.apache.org/thread/boo25hsh3b9416tlcvk3n3m1jcv4nph0 [4] https://lists.apache.org/thread/hp88vysm493gh8l5l2l78qynx9jyobtq [5] https://lists.apache.org/thread/90dh04mpkkcj0j4bqbfjrxos2dv1k2hx # Repository Names To avoid showing 5 duplicates with different delimiters, I'll show the different possibilities with a space. Feel free to imagine that the space is your favorite delimiter. :-) Regarding the main repo, the suggestions were (with some choice of delimiter): * nuttx * nuttx rtos * nuttx core * nuttx kernel Regarding the apps repo, all suggestions were (with some choice of delimiter): * nuttx apps (Note: We cannot use just 'apps' because we have to coexist with other Apache projects in the same namespace -- unless we can have our own directory, but we don't know if we can do that.) The following arguments were presented: nuttx rtos: * Pro: Makes it clear to those who don't know that NuttX is a RTOS [6] * Con: NuttX is more than a traditional RTOS, nuttx is semantically cleaner [7] nuttx core: * Pro: Many projects use 'core' (e.g., mynewt-core) [8] * Con: Looks like library or core dump [9] nuttx kernel: * Con: Confusion. NuttX is not a kernel in all build modes [10] References: [6] https://lists.apache.org/thread/dbxygkvx2gd208vtoytzn9ojo0r8w7ll [7] https://lists.apache.org/thread/kjydczss1dgmrxms9y1ryv56clhoj2hm [8] https://lists.apache.org/thread/54vbjnwoqzod81yg882rkwst4kg7trno [9] https://lists.apache.org/thread/0lzwjh2s2tyj4b56cj7gds1lok74236j [10] https://lists.apache.org/thread/3v0m12kl0wtpfn7rk0ykl3cj9vn5h0qw Are we ready to call a [VOTE] thread or does anyone have more input/arguments/suggestions? Thanks, Nathan
Re: New names of repositories
+1 for nuttx and nuttx-apps V čet., 17. nov. 2022 22:47 je oseba Nathan Hartman < hartman.nat...@gmail.com> napisala: > Hi all, > > As mentioned in the other thread, the repos need to be renamed to > remove "incubating". > > In the discussion from a few months ago [1] several reasons were given > why not to use hyphens in the names (they confuse some tools and > underscores are safer). > > Two possibilities for repo names were given: > > 1) nuttx and nuttx_apps > > or > > 2) nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps > > Which do we want? > > Cheers, > Nathan > > [1] https://lists.apache.org/thread/8fn2m2v8qd3sl9r8jg4bs2f9xq7mwg85 >
Re: New names of repositories
Hi Zou, You don't feel sorry, all suggestions are welcome. Since you aren't aware of that previous discussion it was a honest mistake! Initally NuttX didn't have an apps/ directory, it became part of NuttX when the support to build-in applications was included and in fact the initial apps/ repository was integrated inside the same repository (in Subversion) but as Mr. Greg explained apps/ is not necessary to have NuttX kernel, you can create you own application and just pass its entry point to be used by the kernel to start up. BR, Alan On 11/19/22, fft wrote: > sorry for mytentative idea! > > > BR, > > > > ---Original--- > From: "Gregory Nutt" Date: Sat, Nov 19, 2022 08:26 AM > To: "dev" Subject: Re: New names of repositories > > > Isn't it possible to merge the nuttx and apps into only one > repository？e.g: >|-rtos > |-apps > > We discussed this option a couple of years ago and decided against it. > I > was VERY strongly opposed to the idea then and I still am. > > - apps is NOT part of NuttX. It is an achitecturally unrelated, mish > mash > or useful applications for NuttX, but it is not NuttX. > - I consists of mostly 3rd party code and should not contaminate the clean > modularity of the OS. > > If we want to consider this kind of code change than I would insist on a > vote and I most certainly would vote -1. I don't care about care > about > hyphens or other cosmetics but I would not support any such corruption of > the modularity of the RTOS. > > This must never happen.
Re: New names of repositories
As i said, i am not advocating breaking up repositories. It would help modulartiy, but is not worth the price.Submodules refer to versioned code so changes to the submodule have no impact to the built code until until the version referenced by the submodule is updated. I think that would alleviate most of the concerns that you expressed.However, submodules have their own issues I wouldn't ever attempt that again either. They are a maintenance nightmare.Sent from my Galaxy Original message From: Nathan Hartman Date: 11/19/22 8:52 PM (GMT-06:00) To: dev@nuttx.apache.org Subject: Re: New names of repositories On Sat, Nov 19, 2022 at 10:26 AM Gregory Nutt wrote:> On 11/19/2022 9:02 AM, Tomek CEDRO wrote:> > On Sat, Nov 19, 2022 at 3:53 PM Thiago Costa de Paiva wrote:> >> From these, the valid argument is that it would be non-standard (not a> top level name) related to Appache rules, which I think is indeed not> acceptable. It would not imply any source code organization change nor> submodules:> >>> >> git clone /nuttx/core nuttx> >> git clone /nuttx/apps apps> > The use of submodules was also considered before (I also proposed> > that) and turned out to be a bad idea :-) :-)>> At one time, I was moving all major NuttX components into sub-modules> in order to better modularize the system. I had arch/ and> Documentation/ moved into their own repositories.>> But I got endless complaints from users. Everyone hated this so I ended> up merging these back into nuttx/. That was a tough job because of the> duplicated history in the nuttx/, arch/, and Documentation/> repositories. I really wouldn't recommend going through that again.I strongly recommend AGAINST splitting the NuttX repo into multiple repos.There are many reasons for this but here is a big one: You'll lose atomicchangesets, which is a very important part of version control. One of thebiggest problems with CVS, which all modern version control systems aredesigned to avoid, is that changes that touched multiple files were notatomic; each file had its own version number, so you needed an out-of-bandway to keep track of which changes made up a given changeset. Compare how asingle git commit hash number re-creates an exact replica of the entiretree as it looked when that changeset was committed. Splitting up the repois a step in the wrong direction.That said, nuttx and nuttx-apps *should* remain separate for the followingreason: because the apps are, by their nature, separate and optional. It isimportant that users will always be able to supply their own appsrepository, while our apps repository can be seen as demonstration,testing, a baseline against which to build a custom apps, an example of howto build a custom apps, and even as documentation in the form of sourcecode of how to write programs that run on NuttX. But whatever happens,nuttx-apps should remain separate from nuttx.CheersNathan
Re: New names of repositories
Maybe if we chose simply nuttx + nuttx-apps then it would be easier to separate step by step nuttx-doc, nuttx-cpu from "just" nuttx? Sooo manyy chooiiccesss :-) :-) On Sun, Nov 20, 2022 at 12:01 AM Tomek CEDRO wrote: > > On Sat, Nov 19, 2022 at 9:01 PM Alin Jerpelea wrote: > > how about > > nuttx-core > > nuttx-apps > > rtos part would clearly say what is NuttX even / especially for people > who do not know it yet, i.e. FreeRTOS is self-explanatory :-) > > thus nuttx-rtos + nuttx-apps / nuttx_rtos + nuttx_apps whatever fits > required conventions seems more intuitive :-) > > core looks more like a library or a coredump and does not really > directly leads to rtos :-) > > if project repo split is planned at some point then it could be > nuttx-kernel, nuttx-libs, nuttx-drv, nuttx-cpu-riscv, > nuttx-board-esp32c3, nuttx-doc, nuttx-apps, etc, maybe even higher or > lower granularity :-) > > but whatever works and is more desired would be fine i am sure that > there will be ways to overcome toolchains limitations when stuff > inside fits requirements :-) > > -- > CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info -- CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info
Re: New names of repositories
On Sat, Nov 19, 2022 at 9:01 PM Alin Jerpelea wrote: > how about > nuttx-core > nuttx-apps rtos part would clearly say what is NuttX even / especially for people who do not know it yet, i.e. FreeRTOS is self-explanatory :-) thus nuttx-rtos + nuttx-apps / nuttx_rtos + nuttx_apps whatever fits required conventions seems more intuitive :-) core looks more like a library or a coredump and does not really directly leads to rtos :-) if project repo split is planned at some point then it could be nuttx-kernel, nuttx-libs, nuttx-drv, nuttx-cpu-riscv, nuttx-board-esp32c3, nuttx-doc, nuttx-apps, etc, maybe even higher or lower granularity :-) but whatever works and is more desired would be fine i am sure that there will be ways to overcome toolchains limitations when stuff inside fits requirements :-) -- CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info
Re: New names of repositories
how about nuttx-core nuttx-apps then we locally clone to nurtx_core nuttx_apps Best regards Alim On Sat, 19 Nov 2022, 16:50 Jukka Laitinen, wrote: > +1 for > > nuttx > nuttx-apps > > Petro Karashchenko kirjoitti lauantai 19. marraskuuta 2022: > > Hi, > > > > My two cents are that I think we should not rock the boat and just remove > > "incubator-" prefix from current repos that results in: > > > > nuttx > > nuttx-apps > > > > Best regards, > > Petro > > > > сб, 19 лист. 2022 р. о 17:03 Tomek CEDRO пише: > > > > > On Sat, Nov 19, 2022 at 3:53 PM Thiago Costa de Paiva wrote: > > > > From these, the valid argument is that it would be non-standard (not > a > > > top level name) related to Appache rules, which I think is indeed not > > > acceptable. It would not imply any source code organization change nor > > > submodules: > > > > > > > > git clone /nuttx/core nuttx > > > > git clone /nuttx/apps apps > > > > > > The use of submodules was also considered before (I also proposed > > > that) and turned out to be a bad idea :-) :-) > > > > > > > > > > Anyway, from all the discussion, since hyphens should not be used > > > according to what Greg said previously, I think we have only two > options: > > > > > > > > nuttx > > > > nuttx_apps > > > > > > > > > Then you are pro option 1 :-) > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Nov 17, 2022 at 10:47 PM Nathan Hartman > > > wrote: > > > > (..) > > > > In the discussion from a few months ago [1] several reasons were > given > > > > why not to use hyphens in the names (they confuse some tools and > > > > underscores are safer). > > > > > > > > Two possibilities for repo names were given: > > > > 1) nuttx and nuttx_apps > > > > or > > > > 2) nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps > > > > > > Based on my experience I am pro 2 choice as it clearly distinguishes > > > rtos part from the apps part, is a self explanatory at first sight, > > > and is more compatible with the potential use cases.. also as Gregory > > > explained this nuttx_rtos part is really the whole RTOS part :-) > > > > > > Best regards :-) > > > Tomek > > > > > > -- > > > CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info > > > > >
Re: New names of repositories
+1 for nuttx nuttx-apps Petro Karashchenko kirjoitti lauantai 19. marraskuuta 2022: > Hi, > > My two cents are that I think we should not rock the boat and just remove > "incubator-" prefix from current repos that results in: > > nuttx > nuttx-apps > > Best regards, > Petro > > сб, 19 лист. 2022 р. о 17:03 Tomek CEDRO пише: > > > On Sat, Nov 19, 2022 at 3:53 PM Thiago Costa de Paiva wrote: > > > From these, the valid argument is that it would be non-standard (not a > > top level name) related to Appache rules, which I think is indeed not > > acceptable. It would not imply any source code organization change nor > > submodules: > > > > > > git clone /nuttx/core nuttx > > > git clone /nuttx/apps apps > > > > The use of submodules was also considered before (I also proposed > > that) and turned out to be a bad idea :-) :-) > > > > > > > Anyway, from all the discussion, since hyphens should not be used > > according to what Greg said previously, I think we have only two options: > > > > > > nuttx > > > nuttx_apps > > > > > > Then you are pro option 1 :-) > > > > > > On Thu, Nov 17, 2022 at 10:47 PM Nathan Hartman > > wrote: > > > (..) > > > In the discussion from a few months ago [1] several reasons were given > > > why not to use hyphens in the names (they confuse some tools and > > > underscores are safer). > > > > > > Two possibilities for repo names were given: > > > 1) nuttx and nuttx_apps > > > or > > > 2) nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps > > > > Based on my experience I am pro 2 choice as it clearly distinguishes > > rtos part from the apps part, is a self explanatory at first sight, > > and is more compatible with the potential use cases.. also as Gregory > > explained this nuttx_rtos part is really the whole RTOS part :-) > > > > Best regards :-) > > Tomek > > > > -- > > CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info > > >
Re: New names of repositories
Hi, My two cents are that I think we should not rock the boat and just remove "incubator-" prefix from current repos that results in: nuttx nuttx-apps Best regards, Petro сб, 19 лист. 2022 р. о 17:03 Tomek CEDRO пише: > On Sat, Nov 19, 2022 at 3:53 PM Thiago Costa de Paiva wrote: > > From these, the valid argument is that it would be non-standard (not a > top level name) related to Appache rules, which I think is indeed not > acceptable. It would not imply any source code organization change nor > submodules: > > > > git clone /nuttx/core nuttx > > git clone /nuttx/apps apps > > The use of submodules was also considered before (I also proposed > that) and turned out to be a bad idea :-) :-) > > > > Anyway, from all the discussion, since hyphens should not be used > according to what Greg said previously, I think we have only two options: > > > > nuttx > > nuttx_apps > > > Then you are pro option 1 :-) > > > On Thu, Nov 17, 2022 at 10:47 PM Nathan Hartman > wrote: > > (..) > > In the discussion from a few months ago [1] several reasons were given > > why not to use hyphens in the names (they confuse some tools and > > underscores are safer). > > > > Two possibilities for repo names were given: > > 1) nuttx and nuttx_apps > > or > > 2) nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps > > Based on my experience I am pro 2 choice as it clearly distinguishes > rtos part from the apps part, is a self explanatory at first sight, > and is more compatible with the potential use cases.. also as Gregory > explained this nuttx_rtos part is really the whole RTOS part :-) > > Best regards :-) > Tomek > > -- > CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info >
Re: New names of repositories
On 11/19/2022 9:02 AM, Tomek CEDRO wrote: On Sat, Nov 19, 2022 at 3:53 PM Thiago Costa de Paiva wrote: From these, the valid argument is that it would be non-standard (not a top level name) related to Appache rules, which I think is indeed not acceptable. It would not imply any source code organization change nor submodules: git clone /nuttx/core nuttx git clone /nuttx/apps apps The use of submodules was also considered before (I also proposed that) and turned out to be a bad idea :-) :-) At one time, I was moving all major NuttX components into sub-modules in order to better modularize the system. I had arch/ and Documentation/ moved into their own repositories. But I got endless complaints from users. Everyone hated this so I ended up merging these back into nuttx/. That was a tough job because of the duplicated history in the nuttx/, arch/, and Documentation/ repositories. I really wouldn't recommend going through that again. Anyway, from all the discussion, since hyphens should not be used according to what Greg said previously, I think we have only two options: nuttx nuttx_apps Then you are pro option 1 :-) I was an underscore fan. There are reasons to use underscores and reasons to use hyphens -- none are very compelling so I suppose this really ends up being just a personal preference. But I think NuttX should follow the pattern of other 2.4K Apache projects. See https://gitbox.apache.org/repos/asf . All naming follows these rules: * The repository name begins with the project name (I see a couple of exceptions in old projects like NetBeans) * If there is more than one repository, the project name is followed by a hyphen and a component name * ONLY hyphens are used. In all cases, hyphens are used to separate words in the repository name. There is not a single usage of underscore for this in the all 2.4K repository name. Example: mynewt-core.git I think it is important to be consistent with other Apache project naming. Therefore, I am now a hyphen advocate. On Thu, Nov 17, 2022 at 10:47 PM Nathan Hartman wrote: (..) In the discussion from a few months ago [1] several reasons were given why not to use hyphens in the names (they confuse some tools and underscores are safer). Two possibilities for repo names were given: 1) nuttx and nuttx_apps or 2) nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps Based on my experience I am pro 2 choice as it clearly distinguishes rtos part from the apps part, is a self explanatory at first sight, and is more compatible with the potential use cases.. also as Gregory explained this nuttx_rtos part is really the whole RTOS part :-) If we are like other projects and use hyphens, these would be: 1) nuttx and nuttx-apps, or 2) nuttx-rtos and nuttx-apps Since NuttX is the name of the RTOS. nuttx-rtos is kind of redundant, but not terrible.
Re: New names of repositories
On Sat, Nov 19, 2022 at 3:53 PM Thiago Costa de Paiva wrote: > From these, the valid argument is that it would be non-standard (not a top > level name) related to Appache rules, which I think is indeed not acceptable. > It would not imply any source code organization change nor submodules: > > git clone /nuttx/core nuttx > git clone /nuttx/apps apps The use of submodules was also considered before (I also proposed that) and turned out to be a bad idea :-) :-) > Anyway, from all the discussion, since hyphens should not be used according > to what Greg said previously, I think we have only two options: > > nuttx > nuttx_apps Then you are pro option 1 :-) On Thu, Nov 17, 2022 at 10:47 PM Nathan Hartman wrote: > (..) > In the discussion from a few months ago [1] several reasons were given > why not to use hyphens in the names (they confuse some tools and > underscores are safer). > > Two possibilities for repo names were given: > 1) nuttx and nuttx_apps > or > 2) nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps Based on my experience I am pro 2 choice as it clearly distinguishes rtos part from the apps part, is a self explanatory at first sight, and is more compatible with the potential use cases.. also as Gregory explained this nuttx_rtos part is really the whole RTOS part :-) Best regards :-) Tomek -- CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info
Re: New names of repositories
On 11/19/2022 8:31 AM, Tomek CEDRO wrote: As we have this honor and pleasure to talk directly with the NuttX RTOS author.. maybe really we should listen to Gregory Nutt himself as the most experienced person in the room? There was a discussion in this area and the choice is strongly reasoned not just a matter of personal preference.. there are technical reasons why this naming convention is most compatible with environments where NuttX can be used.. Experience and capability is bell-shaped curve. I used to be pretty good when I was young, but not so much now. There are younger people in this list who can think me in circles. Ultimately, naming does come down to personal preference - constrained by good sense and "the way things are". That is inescapable. Which is not to say that naming is not important. Someone (I forget who) was once quoted as saying something like, "If you say it is only a namespace problem, then you don't understand the problem."
Re: New names of repositories
If some toolchain has an issue with hyphen separated name, then it should be solved in scope of that toolchain. In particular, instructions for that particular toolchain should suggest different clone name as a workaround. One broken toolchain should not lead to violating of URL naming standards. On Sat, 19 Nov 2022, 15:53 Thiago Costa de Paiva, wrote: > From these, the valid argument is that it would be non-standard (not a top > level name) related to Appache rules, which I think is indeed not > acceptable. It would not imply any source code organization change nor > submodules: > > git clone /nuttx/core nuttx > git clone /nuttx/apps apps > > Anyway, from all the discussion, since hyphens should not be used > according to what Greg said previously, I think we have only two options: > > nuttx > nuttx_apps > > and > > nuttx > nuttxapps > > Thiago > > > 2022/11/19 15:37:21, Tomek CEDRO: > > Short answer: NO :-) > > > > Long answer: > > 1. This is not how current source code is organized. Implies > > additional work and will break compatibility. > > 2. There will be a problem with git repository. This may not be > > accepted by Apache or will require additional non-standard work that > > will not align with how other projects are organized. Top level names > > should be used. Using nuttx.git is fine but having apps.git among > > other projects will be confusing (what apps are these?). Also might > > imply using git submodules. There was a discussion about that and this > > seems unnecessary complication. > > > > Best regadrs :-) > > Tomek > > > > > > On Sat, Nov 19, 2022 at 3:28 PM Thiago Costa de Paiva > wrote: > > > > > > I am not attached to the name itself, I was just trying to solve the > problem with special characters. Would the following work? > > > > > > nuttx/core > > > nuttx/apps > > > > > > > > > 2022/11/19 08:21:43, Gregory Nutt: > > > > On 11/19/2022 8:12 AM, Gregory Nutt wrote: > > > > > We need to verify, but I do not think that the Apache github > repository > > > > > supports directories > > > > > > > > > > Technically, NuttX is NOT a kernel in most build modes. A kernel > is a > > > > > very specific architectural implementation involving protected > > > > > resources: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kernel_(operating_system) > . > > > > > The Linux kernel is a kernel. NuttX can be a kernel in the > protected > > > > > and kernel build modes, but in general, NuttX is not a kernel so > any use > > > > > of kernel in the naming would be wrong in most cases. > > > > > > > > > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kernel_(operating_system) > > > > > > > > > > More correctly Linux (and NuttX in protected and kernel modes) is a > > > > > monolithic kernel. > > > > > > > > > > Even worse usage is when NuttX is occasionally called a micro > kernel > > > > > which is most certainly is not. A microkernel is an architectural > > > > > alternative to a monolithic kernel: > > > > > > > > > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microkernel > > > > > > > > According to > > > > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operating_system#Types_of_operating_systems > , > > > > NuttX in the flat build mode could be called a "library operating > system" > > > > with regard to memory organization. It is also a real-time, > multi-tasking, > > > > embedded operating system using those definitions. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Thiago Costa de Paiva > > > FSF member: 11963 > > > Linux User: 565327 > > > > > > > > > -- > > CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info > > > > -- > Thiago Costa de Paiva > FSF member: 11963 > Linux User: 565327 > >
Re: New names of repositories
>From these, the valid argument is that it would be non-standard (not a top >level name) related to Appache rules, which I think is indeed not acceptable. >It would not imply any source code organization change nor submodules: git clone /nuttx/core nuttx git clone /nuttx/apps apps Anyway, from all the discussion, since hyphens should not be used according to what Greg said previously, I think we have only two options: nuttx nuttx_apps and nuttx nuttxapps Thiago 2022/11/19 15:37:21, Tomek CEDRO: > Short answer: NO :-) > > Long answer: > 1. This is not how current source code is organized. Implies > additional work and will break compatibility. > 2. There will be a problem with git repository. This may not be > accepted by Apache or will require additional non-standard work that > will not align with how other projects are organized. Top level names > should be used. Using nuttx.git is fine but having apps.git among > other projects will be confusing (what apps are these?). Also might > imply using git submodules. There was a discussion about that and this > seems unnecessary complication. > > Best regadrs :-) > Tomek > > > On Sat, Nov 19, 2022 at 3:28 PM Thiago Costa de Paiva wrote: > > > > I am not attached to the name itself, I was just trying to solve the > > problem with special characters. Would the following work? > > > > nuttx/core > > nuttx/apps > > > > > > 2022/11/19 08:21:43, Gregory Nutt: > > > On 11/19/2022 8:12 AM, Gregory Nutt wrote: > > > > We need to verify, but I do not think that the Apache github repository > > > > supports directories > > > > > > > > Technically, NuttX is NOT a kernel in most build modes. A kernel is a > > > > very specific architectural implementation involving protected > > > > resources: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kernel_(operating_system) . > > > > The Linux kernel is a kernel. NuttX can be a kernel in the protected > > > > and kernel build modes, but in general, NuttX is not a kernel so any use > > > > of kernel in the naming would be wrong in most cases. > > > > > > > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kernel_(operating_system) > > > > > > > > More correctly Linux (and NuttX in protected and kernel modes) is a > > > > monolithic kernel. > > > > > > > > Even worse usage is when NuttX is occasionally called a micro kernel > > > > which is most certainly is not. A microkernel is an architectural > > > > alternative to a monolithic kernel: > > > > > > > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microkernel > > > > > > According to > > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operating_system#Types_of_operating_systems > > > , > > > NuttX in the flat build mode could be called a "library operating system" > > > with regard to memory organization. It is also a real-time, > > > multi-tasking, > > > embedded operating system using those definitions. > > > > > > > > > > -- > > Thiago Costa de Paiva > > FSF member: 11963 > > Linux User: 565327 > > > > > -- > CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info > -- Thiago Costa de Paiva FSF member: 11963 Linux User: 565327
Re: New names of repositories
> I am not attached to the name itself, I was just trying to solve the problem with special characters. Would the following work? > > nuttx/core > nuttx/apps Again, We need to verify, but I do not think that the Apache github repository supports directories like nuttx/ with repositories under them. And, God forbid, let's not talk about merging repositories! Such directories would have to reside at https://github.com/apache. There are 2.4K GIT repositories there. I don't think there are any directories of repositories there at all. You can see all 2.4K existing repository names here: The convention is - Repositories begin with the project name - *ALL* projects use a hyphen separator after the project name (there is not a single underscored name) - Specific names follow the hyphen-separated project name. core is not a bad name. Many projects use it. The project most like Nutts is MyNewt. They have mynewt-core.git. *Apache Mynewt* mynewt-artifact.git Golang library for parsing, analyzing, and manipulating Mynew... mynewt-blinky.git Apache Mynewt Blinky *mynewt-core.git * Apache Mynewt Core mynewt-documentation.git Apache MyNewt Documentation mynewt-imgmod.git Apache mynewt image modification tool mynewt-lorawan.git Apache mynewt mynewt-mcumgr.git Apache mynewt mynewt-mcumgr-cli.git MCU Manager CLI mynewt-newt.git Apache Mynewt Newt mynewt-newtmgr.git Apache Mynewt Newtmgr mynewt-nfc.git Apache mynewt No commits mynewt-nffs.git Apache NFFS filesystem mynewt-nimble.git Apache mynewt mynewt-pkg-bsp.git Apache Mynewt Pkg-bsp mynewt-pkg-pkg.git Apache Mynewt Pkg-pkg mynewt-pkg-sdk.git Apache Mynewt Pkg-sdk mynewt-site.git Apache Mynewt Site For them core is NOT the operating system. mynewt-core is the central, core logic of OS. The OS itself is spread across numerous repositories. Further dividing NuttX into modules inside of their own repositories could be a good thing. It would be an improvement to the enforcement of the internal modularity of the RTOS and would provide some barriers to code coupling. For example: nuttx-libs, nut tx-network, nuttx-drivers, nuttx-wireless, etc. I am not suggesting that this is something that we should be considering now.The added build complexity would be a bad thing and would certainly piss off a lot of users. It is easy to simplify by cramming everything together. but the price you pay down the road when the code base turns into spaghetti code is too high.
Re: New names of repositories
Short answer: NO :-) Long answer: 1. This is not how current source code is organized. Implies additional work and will break compatibility. 2. There will be a problem with git repository. This may not be accepted by Apache or will require additional non-standard work that will not align with how other projects are organized. Top level names should be used. Using nuttx.git is fine but having apps.git among other projects will be confusing (what apps are these?). Also might imply using git submodules. There was a discussion about that and this seems unnecessary complication. Best regadrs :-) Tomek On Sat, Nov 19, 2022 at 3:28 PM Thiago Costa de Paiva wrote: > > I am not attached to the name itself, I was just trying to solve the problem > with special characters. Would the following work? > > nuttx/core > nuttx/apps > > > 2022/11/19 08:21:43, Gregory Nutt: > > On 11/19/2022 8:12 AM, Gregory Nutt wrote: > > > We need to verify, but I do not think that the Apache github repository > > > supports directories > > > > > > Technically, NuttX is NOT a kernel in most build modes. A kernel is a > > > very specific architectural implementation involving protected > > > resources: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kernel_(operating_system) . > > > The Linux kernel is a kernel. NuttX can be a kernel in the protected > > > and kernel build modes, but in general, NuttX is not a kernel so any use > > > of kernel in the naming would be wrong in most cases. > > > > > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kernel_(operating_system) > > > > > > More correctly Linux (and NuttX in protected and kernel modes) is a > > > monolithic kernel. > > > > > > Even worse usage is when NuttX is occasionally called a micro kernel > > > which is most certainly is not. A microkernel is an architectural > > > alternative to a monolithic kernel: > > > > > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microkernel > > > > According to > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operating_system#Types_of_operating_systems , > > NuttX in the flat build mode could be called a "library operating system" > > with regard to memory organization. It is also a real-time, multi-tasking, > > embedded operating system using those definitions. > > > > > > -- > Thiago Costa de Paiva > FSF member: 11963 > Linux User: 565327 > -- CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info
Re: New names of repositories
As we have this honor and pleasure to talk directly with the NuttX RTOS author.. maybe really we should listen to Gregory Nutt himself as the most experienced person in the room? There was a discussion in this area and the choice is strongly reasoned not just a matter of personal preference.. there are technical reasons why this naming convention is most compatible with environments where NuttX can be used.. On Fri, Nov 18, 2022 at 3:42 PM Gregory Nutt wrote: > +1 for nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps Best regards :-) Tomek On Sat, Nov 19, 2022 at 3:12 PM Gregory Nutt wrote: > > We need to verify, but I do not think that the Apache github repository > supports directories > > Technically, NuttX is NOT a kernel in most build modes. A kernel is a > very specific architectural implementation involving protected > resources: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kernel_(operating_system) . > The Linux kernel is a kernel. NuttX can be a kernel in the protected > and kernel build modes, but in general, NuttX is not a kernel so any use > of kernel in the naming would be wrong in most cases. > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kernel_(operating_system) > > More correctly Linux (and NuttX in protected and kernel modes) is a > monolithic kernel. > > Even worse usage is when NuttX is occasionally called a micro kernel > which is most certainly is not. A microkernel is an architectural > alternative to a monolithic kernel: > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microkernel > > > On 11/19/2022 6:53 AM, Thiago Costa de Paiva wrote: > > How about? > > > > nuttx/kernel > > nuttx/apps > > > > > > 2022/11/19 13:26:53, raiden00pl: > >> +1 for nuttx and nuttx-apps > >> > >> sob., 19 lis 2022 o 12:17 Abdelatif Guettouche < > >> abdelatif.guettou...@gmail.com> napisał(a): > >> > >>> nuttx and nuttx-apps for me too. For the hyphen, as it was said before > >>> people can clone the repo under any name they want. We've been doing > >>> this ever since we joined the incubator and this is how we're > >>> instructing people too: > >>> https://nuttx.apache.org/docs/latest/quickstart/install.html#download-nuttx > >>> > >>> On Sat, Nov 19, 2022 at 6:42 AM fft wrote: > >>>> sorry for mytentative idea! > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> BR, > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> ---Original--- > >>>> From: "Gregory Nutt" >>>> Date: Sat, Nov 19, 2022 08:26 AM > >>>> To: "dev" >>>> Subject: Re: New names of repositories > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> Isn't it possible to merge the nuttx and apps into only one > >>>> repository？e.g: > >>>> >>>> |-rtos > >>>> |-apps > >>>> > >>>> We discussed this option a couple of years ago and decided against > >>> it. I > >>>> was VERY strongly opposed to the idea then and I still am. > >>>> > >>>> - apps is NOT part of NuttX. It is an achitecturally unrelated, > >>> mish mash > >>>> or useful applications for NuttX, but it is not NuttX. > >>>> - I consists of mostly 3rd party code and should not contaminate the > >>> clean > >>>> modularity of the OS. > >>>> > >>>> If we want to consider this kind of code change than I would insist on a > >>>> vote and I most certainly would vote -1. I don't care about care > >>> about > >>>> hyphens or other cosmetics but I would not support any such corruption of > >>>> the modularity of the RTOS. > >>>> > >>>> This must never happen. > > -- CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info
Re: New names of repositories
I am not attached to the name itself, I was just trying to solve the problem with special characters. Would the following work? nuttx/core nuttx/apps 2022/11/19 08:21:43, Gregory Nutt: > On 11/19/2022 8:12 AM, Gregory Nutt wrote: > > We need to verify, but I do not think that the Apache github repository > > supports directories > > > > Technically, NuttX is NOT a kernel in most build modes. A kernel is a > > very specific architectural implementation involving protected > > resources: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kernel_(operating_system) . > > The Linux kernel is a kernel. NuttX can be a kernel in the protected > > and kernel build modes, but in general, NuttX is not a kernel so any use > > of kernel in the naming would be wrong in most cases. > > > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kernel_(operating_system) > > > > More correctly Linux (and NuttX in protected and kernel modes) is a > > monolithic kernel. > > > > Even worse usage is when NuttX is occasionally called a micro kernel > > which is most certainly is not. A microkernel is an architectural > > alternative to a monolithic kernel: > > > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microkernel > > According to > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operating_system#Types_of_operating_systems , > NuttX in the flat build mode could be called a "library operating system" > with regard to memory organization. It is also a real-time, multi-tasking, > embedded operating system using those definitions. > > -- Thiago Costa de Paiva FSF member: 11963 Linux User: 565327
Re: New names of repositories
On 11/19/2022 8:12 AM, Gregory Nutt wrote: We need to verify, but I do not think that the Apache github repository supports directories Technically, NuttX is NOT a kernel in most build modes. A kernel is a very specific architectural implementation involving protected resources: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kernel_(operating_system) . The Linux kernel is a kernel. NuttX can be a kernel in the protected and kernel build modes, but in general, NuttX is not a kernel so any use of kernel in the naming would be wrong in most cases. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kernel_(operating_system) More correctly Linux (and NuttX in protected and kernel modes) is a monolithic kernel. Even worse usage is when NuttX is occasionally called a micro kernel which is most certainly is not. A microkernel is an architectural alternative to a monolithic kernel: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microkernel According to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operating_system#Types_of_operating_systems , NuttX in the flat build mode could be called a "library operating system" with regard to memory organization. It is also a real-time, multi-tasking, embedded operating system using those definitions.
Re: New names of repositories
We need to verify, but I do not think that the Apache github repository supports directories Technically, NuttX is NOT a kernel in most build modes. A kernel is a very specific architectural implementation involving protected resources: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kernel_(operating_system) . The Linux kernel is a kernel. NuttX can be a kernel in the protected and kernel build modes, but in general, NuttX is not a kernel so any use of kernel in the naming would be wrong in most cases. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kernel_(operating_system) More correctly Linux (and NuttX in protected and kernel modes) is a monolithic kernel. Even worse usage is when NuttX is occasionally called a micro kernel which is most certainly is not. A microkernel is an architectural alternative to a monolithic kernel: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microkernel On 11/19/2022 6:53 AM, Thiago Costa de Paiva wrote: How about? nuttx/kernel nuttx/apps 2022/11/19 13:26:53, raiden00pl: +1 for nuttx and nuttx-apps sob., 19 lis 2022 o 12:17 Abdelatif Guettouche < abdelatif.guettou...@gmail.com> napisał(a): nuttx and nuttx-apps for me too. For the hyphen, as it was said before people can clone the repo under any name they want. We've been doing this ever since we joined the incubator and this is how we're instructing people too: https://nuttx.apache.org/docs/latest/quickstart/install.html#download-nuttx On Sat, Nov 19, 2022 at 6:42 AM fft wrote: sorry for mytentative idea! BR, ---Original--- From: "Gregory Nutt" it. I was VERY strongly opposed to the idea then and I still am. - apps is NOT part of NuttX. It is an achitecturally unrelated, mish mash or useful applications for NuttX, but it is not NuttX. - I consists of mostly 3rd party code and should not contaminate the clean modularity of the OS. If we want to consider this kind of code change than I would insist on a vote and I most certainly would vote -1. I don't care about care about hyphens or other cosmetics but I would not support any such corruption of the modularity of the RTOS. This must never happen.
Re: New names of repositories
+1 for nuttx and nuttx-apps. On Sat, Nov 19, 2022, 14:53 Thiago Costa de Paiva wrote: > How about? > > nuttx/kernel > nuttx/apps > > > 2022/11/19 13:26:53, raiden00pl: > > +1 for nuttx and nuttx-apps > > > > sob., 19 lis 2022 o 12:17 Abdelatif Guettouche < > > abdelatif.guettou...@gmail.com> napisał(a): > > > > > nuttx and nuttx-apps for me too. For the hyphen, as it was said before > > > people can clone the repo under any name they want. We've been doing > > > this ever since we joined the incubator and this is how we're > > > instructing people too: > > > > https://nuttx.apache.org/docs/latest/quickstart/install.html#download-nuttx > > > > > > On Sat, Nov 19, 2022 at 6:42 AM fft wrote: > > > > > > > > sorry for mytentative idea! > > > > > > > > > > > > BR, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---Original--- > > > > From: "Gregory Nutt" > > > Date: Sat, Nov 19, 2022 08:26 AM > > > > To: "dev" > > > Subject: Re: New names of repositories > > > > > > > > > > > > Isn't it possible to merge the nuttx and apps into only one > > > > repository？e.g: > > > > > > > |-rtos > > > > |-apps > > > > > > > > We discussed this option a couple of years ago and decided against > > > it. I > > > > was VERY strongly opposed to the idea then and I still am. > > > > > > > > - apps is NOT part of NuttX. It is an achitecturally unrelated, > > > mish mash > > > > or useful applications for NuttX, but it is not NuttX. > > > > - I consists of mostly 3rd party code and should not contaminate the > > > clean > > > > modularity of the OS. > > > > > > > > If we want to consider this kind of code change than I would insist > on a > > > > vote and I most certainly would vote -1. I don't care about > care > > > about > > > > hyphens or other cosmetics but I would not support any such > corruption of > > > > the modularity of the RTOS. > > > > > > > > This must never happen. > > > > > -- > Thiago Costa de Paiva > FSF member: 11963 > Linux User: 565327 > >
Re: New names of repositories
How about? nuttx/kernel nuttx/apps 2022/11/19 13:26:53, raiden00pl: > +1 for nuttx and nuttx-apps > > sob., 19 lis 2022 o 12:17 Abdelatif Guettouche < > abdelatif.guettou...@gmail.com> napisał(a): > > > nuttx and nuttx-apps for me too. For the hyphen, as it was said before > > people can clone the repo under any name they want. We've been doing > > this ever since we joined the incubator and this is how we're > > instructing people too: > > https://nuttx.apache.org/docs/latest/quickstart/install.html#download-nuttx > > > > On Sat, Nov 19, 2022 at 6:42 AM fft wrote: > > > > > > sorry for mytentative idea! > > > > > > > > > BR, > > > > > > > > > > > > ---Original--- > > > From: "Gregory Nutt" > > Date: Sat, Nov 19, 2022 08:26 AM > > > To: "dev" > > Subject: Re: New names of repositories > > > > > > > > > Isn't it possible to merge the nuttx and apps into only one > > > repository？e.g: > > > > > |-rtos > > > |-apps > > > > > > We discussed this option a couple of years ago and decided against > > it. I > > > was VERY strongly opposed to the idea then and I still am. > > > > > > - apps is NOT part of NuttX. It is an achitecturally unrelated, > > mish mash > > > or useful applications for NuttX, but it is not NuttX. > > > - I consists of mostly 3rd party code and should not contaminate the > > clean > > > modularity of the OS. > > > > > > If we want to consider this kind of code change than I would insist on a > > > vote and I most certainly would vote -1. I don't care about care > > about > > > hyphens or other cosmetics but I would not support any such corruption of > > > the modularity of the RTOS. > > > > > > This must never happen. > > -- Thiago Costa de Paiva FSF member: 11963 Linux User: 565327
Re: New names of repositories
+1 for nuttx and nuttx-apps sob., 19 lis 2022 o 12:17 Abdelatif Guettouche < abdelatif.guettou...@gmail.com> napisał(a): > nuttx and nuttx-apps for me too. For the hyphen, as it was said before > people can clone the repo under any name they want. We've been doing > this ever since we joined the incubator and this is how we're > instructing people too: > https://nuttx.apache.org/docs/latest/quickstart/install.html#download-nuttx > > On Sat, Nov 19, 2022 at 6:42 AM fft wrote: > > > > sorry for mytentative idea! > > > > > > BR, > > > > > > > > ---Original--- > > From: "Gregory Nutt" > Date: Sat, Nov 19, 2022 08:26 AM > > To: "dev" > Subject: Re: New names of repositories > > > > > > Isn't it possible to merge the nuttx and apps into only one > > repository？e.g: > > > |-rtos > > |-apps > > > > We discussed this option a couple of years ago and decided against > it. I > > was VERY strongly opposed to the idea then and I still am. > > > > - apps is NOT part of NuttX. It is an achitecturally unrelated, > mish mash > > or useful applications for NuttX, but it is not NuttX. > > - I consists of mostly 3rd party code and should not contaminate the > clean > > modularity of the OS. > > > > If we want to consider this kind of code change than I would insist on a > > vote and I most certainly would vote -1. I don't care about care > about > > hyphens or other cosmetics but I would not support any such corruption of > > the modularity of the RTOS. > > > > This must never happen. >
Re: New names of repositories
nuttx and nuttx-apps for me too. For the hyphen, as it was said before people can clone the repo under any name they want. We've been doing this ever since we joined the incubator and this is how we're instructing people too: https://nuttx.apache.org/docs/latest/quickstart/install.html#download-nuttx On Sat, Nov 19, 2022 at 6:42 AM fft wrote: > > sorry for mytentative idea! > > > BR, > > > > ---Original--- > From: "Gregory Nutt" Date: Sat, Nov 19, 2022 08:26 AM > To: "dev" Subject: Re: New names of repositories > > > Isn't it possible to merge the nuttx and apps into only one > repository？e.g: >|-rtos > |-apps > > We discussed this option a couple of years ago and decided against it. I > was VERY strongly opposed to the idea then and I still am. > > - apps is NOT part of NuttX. It is an achitecturally unrelated, mish > mash > or useful applications for NuttX, but it is not NuttX. > - I consists of mostly 3rd party code and should not contaminate the clean > modularity of the OS. > > If we want to consider this kind of code change than I would insist on a > vote and I most certainly would vote -1. I don't care about care about > hyphens or other cosmetics but I would not support any such corruption of > the modularity of the RTOS. > > This must never happen.
Re: New names of repositories
+1 , nuttx/nuttx-apps, I perfer nuttx, the "X" in NuttX means more possibilities, "X" can be RTOS, or something else archer, BRs, Gustavo Henrique Nihei 于2022年11月18日周五 23:32写道： > I vote for nuttx and nuttx-apps. > I agree with the above reasons for using dashes (-) instead of underscore. > > On Fri, Nov 18, 2022 at 12:12 PM Pierre-Noel Bouteville < > pnb...@hotmail.com> > wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > Why not NuttxKernel and NuttxApp? > > > > Envoyé de mon iPhone > > > > > Le 18 nov. 2022 à 15:43, Xiang Xiao a > écrit > > : > > > > > > But NuttX has more features than traditional RTOS(e.g. FreeRTOS). > > Actually, > > > Xiaomi uses it in the IoT space which has less real time requirements. > > > Other similar OS(e.g. Zephyr) doesn't append rtos suffix. > > > So, I prefer keep nuttx and nuttx-apps. > > > > > >> On Fri, Nov 18, 2022 at 1:39 PM Alin Jerpelea > > wrote: > > >> > > >> hi > > >> I think that nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps is cleaner > > >> > > >> Best regards > > >> Alin > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >>> On Fri, 18 Nov 2022, 01:11 Alan C. Assis, wrote: > > >>> > > >>> I like the second option: > > >>> > > >>> 2) nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps > > >>> > > >>> It makes clear that it is a RTOS :-) > > >>> > > >>> BR, > > >>> > > >>> Alan > > >>> > > >>> On 11/17/22, Nathan Hartman wrote: > > Hi all, > > > > As mentioned in the other thread, the repos need to be renamed to > > remove "incubating". > > > > In the discussion from a few months ago [1] several reasons were > given > > why not to use hyphens in the names (they confuse some tools and > > underscores are safer). > > > > Two possibilities for repo names were given: > > > > 1) nuttx and nuttx_apps > > > > or > > > > 2) nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps > > > > Which do we want? > > > > Cheers, > > Nathan > > > > [1] > https://lists.apache.org/thread/8fn2m2v8qd3sl9r8jg4bs2f9xq7mwg85 > > > > >>> > > >> > > > > > -- > Gustavo Henrique Nihei >
Re: New names of repositories
On Sat, Nov 19, 2022 at 1:25 AM Gregory Nutt wrote: > > > Isn't it possible to merge the nuttx and apps into only one > repository？e.g: > > > |-rtos > > |-apps > > We discussed this option a couple of years ago and decided against it. I > was VERY strongly opposed to the idea then and I still am. > > - apps is NOT part of NuttX. It is an achitecturally unrelated, mish mash > or useful applications for NuttX, but it is not NuttX. > - I consists of mostly 3rd party code and should not contaminate the clean > modularity of the OS. > > If we want to consider this kind of code change than I would insist on a > vote and I most certainly would vote -1. I don't care about care about > hyphens or other cosmetics but I would not support any such corruption of > the modularity of the RTOS. > > This must never happen. +1 :-) -- CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info
Re: New names of repositories
> Isn't it possible to merge the nuttx and apps into only one repository？e.g: > |-rtos > |-apps We discussed this option a couple of years ago and decided against it. I was VERY strongly opposed to the idea then and I still am. - apps is NOT part of NuttX. It is an achitecturally unrelated, mish mash or useful applications for NuttX, but it is not NuttX. - I consists of mostly 3rd party code and should not contaminate the clean modularity of the OS. If we want to consider this kind of code change than I would insist on a vote and I most certainly would vote -1. I don't care about care about hyphens or other cosmetics but I would not support any such corruption of the modularity of the RTOS. This must never happen.
RE: New names of repositories
> I vote for nuttx, nuttx-apps +1 David -Original Message- From: James Dougherty Sent: Friday, November 18, 2022 11:21 AM To: dev@nuttx.apache.org Subject: Re: New names of repositories That’s right! and underscores are difficult to see when the file name is displayed as an underlined link you also can’t use underscores with AWS S3 … https://docs.aws.amazon.com/AmazonS3/latest/userguide/bucketnamingrules.html Finally, the Google search engine treats, the hyphen( ‘-‘ ) separator as a word separator but the same does not apply to underscores (‘_’) yes, underscore is great for C code because it is the “space which is not a space” - however, for file names, because of the reasons above it’s problematic… I vote for nuttx, nuttx-apps > On Nov 18, 2022, at 7:07 AM, TimH wrote: > > I see all the other two-word Apache repositories use hyphens not > underscores, and on GitHub they are URLs which as has been pointed out > should ideally be hyphenated? > > To me the underscore looks wrong...but, in the grand scheme of things, > it's just a name and, like Sebastien, I will not lose sleep. I lose enough > of that already, getting trying to get NuttX working on the processor I'm > using LOL. > > > >> -Original Message- >> From: Sebastien Lorquet >> >> Hi, >> >> I would also very much prefer nuttx and nuttx_apps but the other >> option will not prevent me from sleeping well at night. >> >> Sebastien >> >>> Le 18/11/2022 à 15:46, Gregory Nutt a écrit : >>> >>>> But NuttX has more features than traditional RTOS(e.g. FreeRTOS). >>>> Actually, >>>> Xiaomi uses it in the IoT space which has less real time requirements. >>>> Other similar OS(e.g. Zephyr) doesn't append rtos suffix. >>>> So, I prefer keep nuttx and nuttx-apps. >>> >>> I just endorsed nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps, but Xiao is correct. >>> nuttx_rtos is redundant since nuttx is the name of the RTOS. >>> nuttx_apps are miscellaneous applications tailored for the NuttX RTOS. >>> It really is semantically cleaner. >>> >
Re: New names of repositories
On Fri, Nov 18, 2022 at 11:49 AM Gregory Nutt wrote: > The are other Apache RTOSs, or at OSs. There is, at least, > https://mynewt.apache.org/ > > MyNewt uses several repositories, one for each major subsystem. Their > naming uses hyphens: mynewt-core, mynewt-newt, mynewt-nimble, > mynewt-newtmgr, etc. There is something to be said for consistency. If most Apache projects do as mynewt did, then I think we should do similarly. On Fri, Nov 18, 2022 at 11:13 AM Gregory Nutt wrote: > There are some toolchains supported by NuttX that cannot handle hyphens > in paths. So, setting aside personal preferences, there are valid > reasons why hyphens should be avoided. There are also old, obsolete > filesystems that do not support hyphens in names. I think we've been instructing everyone to clone so you end up with this hierarchy: / |-nuttx |-apps So really the URLs to clone from shouldn't interfere with whatever the filesystem supports, right? Besides, if we're worried about hyphen support in the filesystem, Alan pointed out [1] that we have lots of source files with hyphens in the names, so we'd need to rename all of them. [1] https://lists.apache.org/thread/h9ky1n2jycdn8y1p6wg6q7xn74x3q5bp Cheers, Nathan
RE: New names of repositories
+1 :) >-Original Message- > >nuttx and nuttxapps >
Re: New names of repositories
nuttx and nuttxapps Sébastien Le 18/11/2022 à 17:30, Gregory Nutt a écrit : why can’t we just have : nuttx, apps as it has been for a long time (before Apache) … Ultimately, the repository names would appear here: https://github.com/orgs/apache/repositories nuttx/ would probably be fine, but apps/ probably would not be appropriate at that level.
Re: New names of repositories
The advantage of nuttx?kernel et nuttx?apps that both repository are together in listing or folders. You can replace ‘?’ by as you want. I don't see any other examples of folders. We would have to ask, I suppose. PS: Pierre-Noel: Good to see your name in print. It has been awhile.
Re: New names of repositories
Isn’t nuttx supposed to be the Apache RTOS? rtos/nuttx rtos/apps ? The are other Apache RTOSs, or at OSs. There is, at least, https://mynewt.apache.org/ MyNewt uses several repositories, one for each major subsystem. Their naming uses hyphens: mynewt-core, mynewt-newt, mynewt-nimble, mynewt-newtmgr, etc.
Re: New names of repositories
The advantage of nuttx?kernel et nuttx?apps that both repository are together in listing or folders. You can replace ‘?’ by as you want. Envoyé de mon iPhone > Le 18 nov. 2022 à 17:42, James Dougherty a écrit : > > Isn’t nuttx supposed to be the Apache RTOS? > > rtos/nuttx > rtos/apps > > ? > > bah … when I do I upgrade to Apache, it’s gonna break more than just build > scripts and Makefiles :-( > > >> On Nov 18, 2022, at 8:30 AM, Gregory Nutt wrote: >> >> >>> why can’t we just have : >>> >>> nuttx, apps >>> >>> as it has been for a long time (before Apache) … >> >> Ultimately, the repository names would appear here: >> https://github.com/orgs/apache/repositories >> >> nuttx/ would probably be fine, but apps/ probably would not be appropriate >> at that level. >> >>
Re: New names of repositories
Isn't it possible to have a nuttx namespace with two repositories inside? This would also open a possibility to host other projects related to NuttX in the same place in the future. On Fri, 18 Nov 2022, 17:30 Gregory Nutt, wrote: > > > why can’t we just have : > > > > nuttx, apps > > > > as it has been for a long time (before Apache) … > > Ultimately, the repository names would appear here: > https://github.com/orgs/apache/repositories > > nuttx/ would probably be fine, but apps/ probably would not be > appropriate at that level. > > >
Re: New names of repositories
Isn’t nuttx supposed to be the Apache RTOS? rtos/nuttx rtos/apps ? bah … when I do I upgrade to Apache, it’s gonna break more than just build scripts and Makefiles :-( > On Nov 18, 2022, at 8:30 AM, Gregory Nutt wrote: > > >> why can’t we just have : >> >> nuttx, apps >> >> as it has been for a long time (before Apache) … > > Ultimately, the repository names would appear here: > https://github.com/orgs/apache/repositories > > nuttx/ would probably be fine, but apps/ probably would not be appropriate at > that level. > >
Re: New names of repositories
why can’t we just have : nuttx, apps as it has been for a long time (before Apache) … Ultimately, the repository names would appear here: https://github.com/orgs/apache/repositories nuttx/ would probably be fine, but apps/ probably would not be appropriate at that level.
Re: New names of repositories
why can’t we just have : nuttx, apps as it has been for a long time (before Apache) … > On Nov 18, 2022, at 8:13 AM, Gregory Nutt wrote: > > >> I see all the other two-word Apache repositories use hyphens not >> underscores, and on GitHub they are URLs which as has been pointed out >> should ideally be hyphenated? >> >> To me the underscore looks wrong...but, in the grand scheme of things, it's >> just a name and, like Sebastien, I will not lose sleep. I lose enough of >> that already, getting trying to get NuttX working on the processor I'm using >> LOL. > > There are some toolchains supported by NuttX that cannot handle hyphens in > paths. So, setting aside personal preferences, there are valid reasons why > hyphens should be avoided. There are also old, obsolete filesystems that do > not support hyphens in names. > > Some file naming standards, however, do recommend hyphens over underscores. > The primary reason seems to be that if the file name is underlined, then the > underscore character is mostly occluded. > > Paths may not begin with hyphens in most commands because the path is > interpreted as a command option. > > These directory names are never really used in the build, however; the name > $TOPDIR which defaults to $PWD/.. when the OS is configured. The user > selects the actual name of the directories when repositories are cloned so, > regardless of what is decided, it need not effect your way of doing things > other than the git clone. > > For example, in order to build with those troublesome toolchains mentioned > above, I have always cloned the repositories to incubator_nuttx and and > incubator_nuttx_apps to avoid the hyphens which do cause build failures with > those toolchains. > >
Re: New names of repositories
That’s right! and underscores are difficult to see when the file name is displayed as an underlined link you also can’t use underscores with AWS S3 … https://docs.aws.amazon.com/AmazonS3/latest/userguide/bucketnamingrules.html Finally, the Google search engine treats, the hyphen( ‘-‘ ) separator as a word separator but the same does not apply to underscores (‘_’) yes, underscore is great for C code because it is the “space which is not a space” - however, for file names, because of the reasons above it’s problematic… I vote for nuttx, nuttx-apps > On Nov 18, 2022, at 7:07 AM, TimH wrote: > > I see all the other two-word Apache repositories use hyphens not > underscores, and on GitHub they are URLs which as has been pointed out should > ideally be hyphenated? > > To me the underscore looks wrong...but, in the grand scheme of things, it's > just a name and, like Sebastien, I will not lose sleep. I lose enough of that > already, getting trying to get NuttX working on the processor I'm using LOL. > > > >> -Original Message- >> From: Sebastien Lorquet >> >> Hi, >> >> I would also very much prefer nuttx and nuttx_apps but the other option will >> not prevent me from sleeping well at night. >> >> Sebastien >> >>> Le 18/11/2022 à 15:46, Gregory Nutt a écrit : >>> But NuttX has more features than traditional RTOS(e.g. FreeRTOS). Actually, Xiaomi uses it in the IoT space which has less real time requirements. Other similar OS(e.g. Zephyr) doesn't append rtos suffix. So, I prefer keep nuttx and nuttx-apps. >>> >>> I just endorsed nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps, but Xiao is correct. >>> nuttx_rtos is redundant since nuttx is the name of the RTOS. >>> nuttx_apps are miscellaneous applications tailored for the NuttX RTOS. >>> It really is semantically cleaner. >>> >
Re: New names of repositories
I see all the other two-word Apache repositories use hyphens not underscores, and on GitHub they are URLs which as has been pointed out should ideally be hyphenated? To me the underscore looks wrong...but, in the grand scheme of things, it's just a name and, like Sebastien, I will not lose sleep. I lose enough of that already, getting trying to get NuttX working on the processor I'm using LOL. There are some toolchains supported by NuttX that cannot handle hyphens in paths. So, setting aside personal preferences, there are valid reasons why hyphens should be avoided. There are also old, obsolete filesystems that do not support hyphens in names. Some file naming standards, however, do recommend hyphens over underscores. The primary reason seems to be that if the file name is underlined, then the underscore character is mostly occluded. Paths may not begin with hyphens in most commands because the path is interpreted as a command option. These directory names are never really used in the build, however; the name $TOPDIR which defaults to $PWD/.. when the OS is configured. The user selects the actual name of the directories when repositories are cloned so, regardless of what is decided, it need not effect your way of doing things other than the git clone. For example, in order to build with those troublesome toolchains mentioned above, I have always cloned the repositories to incubator_nuttx and and incubator_nuttx_apps to avoid the hyphens which do cause build failures with those toolchains.
Re: New names of repositories
I vote for nuttx and nuttx-apps. I agree with the above reasons for using dashes (-) instead of underscore. On Fri, Nov 18, 2022 at 12:12 PM Pierre-Noel Bouteville wrote: > Hi, > > Why not NuttxKernel and NuttxApp? > > Envoyé de mon iPhone > > > Le 18 nov. 2022 à 15:43, Xiang Xiao a écrit > : > > > > But NuttX has more features than traditional RTOS(e.g. FreeRTOS). > Actually, > > Xiaomi uses it in the IoT space which has less real time requirements. > > Other similar OS(e.g. Zephyr) doesn't append rtos suffix. > > So, I prefer keep nuttx and nuttx-apps. > > > >> On Fri, Nov 18, 2022 at 1:39 PM Alin Jerpelea > wrote: > >> > >> hi > >> I think that nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps is cleaner > >> > >> Best regards > >> Alin > >> > >> > >> > >>> On Fri, 18 Nov 2022, 01:11 Alan C. Assis, wrote: > >>> > >>> I like the second option: > >>> > >>> 2) nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps > >>> > >>> It makes clear that it is a RTOS :-) > >>> > >>> BR, > >>> > >>> Alan > >>> > >>> On 11/17/22, Nathan Hartman wrote: > Hi all, > > As mentioned in the other thread, the repos need to be renamed to > remove "incubating". > > In the discussion from a few months ago [1] several reasons were given > why not to use hyphens in the names (they confuse some tools and > underscores are safer). > > Two possibilities for repo names were given: > > 1) nuttx and nuttx_apps > > or > > 2) nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps > > Which do we want? > > Cheers, > Nathan > > [1] https://lists.apache.org/thread/8fn2m2v8qd3sl9r8jg4bs2f9xq7mwg85 > > >>> > >> > -- Gustavo Henrique Nihei
Re: New names of repositories
Hi, Why not NuttxKernel and NuttxApp? Envoyé de mon iPhone > Le 18 nov. 2022 à 15:43, Xiang Xiao a écrit : > > But NuttX has more features than traditional RTOS(e.g. FreeRTOS). Actually, > Xiaomi uses it in the IoT space which has less real time requirements. > Other similar OS(e.g. Zephyr) doesn't append rtos suffix. > So, I prefer keep nuttx and nuttx-apps. > >> On Fri, Nov 18, 2022 at 1:39 PM Alin Jerpelea wrote: >> >> hi >> I think that nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps is cleaner >> >> Best regards >> Alin >> >> >> >>> On Fri, 18 Nov 2022, 01:11 Alan C. Assis, wrote: >>> >>> I like the second option: >>> >>> 2) nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps >>> >>> It makes clear that it is a RTOS :-) >>> >>> BR, >>> >>> Alan >>> >>> On 11/17/22, Nathan Hartman wrote: Hi all, As mentioned in the other thread, the repos need to be renamed to remove "incubating". In the discussion from a few months ago [1] several reasons were given why not to use hyphens in the names (they confuse some tools and underscores are safer). Two possibilities for repo names were given: 1) nuttx and nuttx_apps or 2) nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps Which do we want? Cheers, Nathan [1] https://lists.apache.org/thread/8fn2m2v8qd3sl9r8jg4bs2f9xq7mwg85 >>> >>
RE: New names of repositories
I see all the other two-word Apache repositories use hyphens not underscores, and on GitHub they are URLs which as has been pointed out should ideally be hyphenated? To me the underscore looks wrong...but, in the grand scheme of things, it's just a name and, like Sebastien, I will not lose sleep. I lose enough of that already, getting trying to get NuttX working on the processor I'm using LOL. >-Original Message- >From: Sebastien Lorquet > >Hi, > >I would also very much prefer nuttx and nuttx_apps but the other option will >not prevent me from sleeping well at night. > >Sebastien > >Le 18/11/2022 à 15:46, Gregory Nutt a écrit : >> >>> But NuttX has more features than traditional RTOS(e.g. FreeRTOS). >>> Actually, >>> Xiaomi uses it in the IoT space which has less real time requirements. >>> Other similar OS(e.g. Zephyr) doesn't append rtos suffix. >>> So, I prefer keep nuttx and nuttx-apps. >> >> I just endorsed nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps, but Xiao is correct. >> nuttx_rtos is redundant since nuttx is the name of the RTOS. >> nuttx_apps are miscellaneous applications tailored for the NuttX RTOS. >> It really is semantically cleaner. >>
Re: New names of repositories
Hi, I would also very much prefer nuttx and nuttx_apps but the other option will not prevent me from sleeping well at night. Sebastien Le 18/11/2022 à 15:46, Gregory Nutt a écrit : But NuttX has more features than traditional RTOS(e.g. FreeRTOS). Actually, Xiaomi uses it in the IoT space which has less real time requirements. Other similar OS(e.g. Zephyr) doesn't append rtos suffix. So, I prefer keep nuttx and nuttx-apps. I just endorsed nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps, but Xiao is correct. nuttx_rtos is redundant since nuttx is the name of the RTOS. nuttx_apps are miscellaneous applications tailored for the NuttX RTOS. It really is semantically cleaner.
Re: New names of repositories
But NuttX has more features than traditional RTOS(e.g. FreeRTOS). Actually, Xiaomi uses it in the IoT space which has less real time requirements. Other similar OS(e.g. Zephyr) doesn't append rtos suffix. So, I prefer keep nuttx and nuttx-apps. I just endorsed nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps, but Xiao is correct. nuttx_rtos is redundant since nuttx is the name of the RTOS. nuttx_apps are miscellaneous applications tailored for the NuttX RTOS. It really is semantically cleaner.
Re: New names of repositories
But NuttX has more features than traditional RTOS(e.g. FreeRTOS). Actually, Xiaomi uses it in the IoT space which has less real time requirements. Other similar OS(e.g. Zephyr) doesn't append rtos suffix. So, I prefer keep nuttx and nuttx-apps. On Fri, Nov 18, 2022 at 1:39 PM Alin Jerpelea wrote: > hi > I think that nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps is cleaner > > Best regards > Alin > > > > On Fri, 18 Nov 2022, 01:11 Alan C. Assis, wrote: > > > I like the second option: > > > > 2) nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps > > > > It makes clear that it is a RTOS :-) > > > > BR, > > > > Alan > > > > On 11/17/22, Nathan Hartman wrote: > > > Hi all, > > > > > > As mentioned in the other thread, the repos need to be renamed to > > > remove "incubating". > > > > > > In the discussion from a few months ago [1] several reasons were given > > > why not to use hyphens in the names (they confuse some tools and > > > underscores are safer). > > > > > > Two possibilities for repo names were given: > > > > > > 1) nuttx and nuttx_apps > > > > > > or > > > > > > 2) nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps > > > > > > Which do we want? > > > > > > Cheers, > > > Nathan > > > > > > [1] https://lists.apache.org/thread/8fn2m2v8qd3sl9r8jg4bs2f9xq7mwg85 > > > > > >
Re: New names of repositories
+1 for nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps On 11/18/2022 8:39 AM, Tomek CEDRO wrote: nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps :-) -- CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info
Re: New names of repositories
nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps :-) -- CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info
Re: New names of repositories
hi I think that nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps is cleaner Best regards Alin On Fri, 18 Nov 2022, 01:11 Alan C. Assis, wrote: > I like the second option: > > 2) nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps > > It makes clear that it is a RTOS :-) > > BR, > > Alan > > On 11/17/22, Nathan Hartman wrote: > > Hi all, > > > > As mentioned in the other thread, the repos need to be renamed to > > remove "incubating". > > > > In the discussion from a few months ago [1] several reasons were given > > why not to use hyphens in the names (they confuse some tools and > > underscores are safer). > > > > Two possibilities for repo names were given: > > > > 1) nuttx and nuttx_apps > > > > or > > > > 2) nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps > > > > Which do we want? > > > > Cheers, > > Nathan > > > > [1] https://lists.apache.org/thread/8fn2m2v8qd3sl9r8jg4bs2f9xq7mwg85 > > >
Re: New names of repositories
I like the second option: 2) nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps It makes clear that it is a RTOS :-) BR, Alan On 11/17/22, Nathan Hartman wrote: > Hi all, > > As mentioned in the other thread, the repos need to be renamed to > remove "incubating". > > In the discussion from a few months ago [1] several reasons were given > why not to use hyphens in the names (they confuse some tools and > underscores are safer). > > Two possibilities for repo names were given: > > 1) nuttx and nuttx_apps > > or > > 2) nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps > > Which do we want? > > Cheers, > Nathan > > [1] https://lists.apache.org/thread/8fn2m2v8qd3sl9r8jg4bs2f9xq7mwg85 >
Re: New names of repositories
It is of course subjective, but dashes are typically used for URLs, not underscores. Just to quote a Google recommendation https://developers.google.com/search/docs/crawling-indexing/url-structure?hl=en_id=638043215091036715-3041335353=1 [image: image.png] In case some tools have an issue with such a trivial thing, then maybe their quality is not the best and they shouldn't be used :) Am Do., 17. Nov. 2022 um 23:07 Uhr schrieb Brennan Ashton < bash...@brennanashton.com>: > My vote without too much care is to leave it be minus the incubation bit. > We have already been dealing with the hyphens. > > --Brennan > > On Thu, Nov 17, 2022, 1:47 PM Nathan Hartman > wrote: > > > Hi all, > > > > As mentioned in the other thread, the repos need to be renamed to > > remove "incubating". > > > > In the discussion from a few months ago [1] several reasons were given > > why not to use hyphens in the names (they confuse some tools and > > underscores are safer). > > > > Two possibilities for repo names were given: > > > > 1) nuttx and nuttx_apps > > > > or > > > > 2) nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps > > > > Which do we want? > > > > Cheers, > > Nathan > > > > [1] https://lists.apache.org/thread/8fn2m2v8qd3sl9r8jg4bs2f9xq7mwg85 > > >
Re: New names of repositories
My vote without too much care is to leave it be minus the incubation bit. We have already been dealing with the hyphens. --Brennan On Thu, Nov 17, 2022, 1:47 PM Nathan Hartman wrote: > Hi all, > > As mentioned in the other thread, the repos need to be renamed to > remove "incubating". > > In the discussion from a few months ago [1] several reasons were given > why not to use hyphens in the names (they confuse some tools and > underscores are safer). > > Two possibilities for repo names were given: > > 1) nuttx and nuttx_apps > > or > > 2) nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps > > Which do we want? > > Cheers, > Nathan > > [1] https://lists.apache.org/thread/8fn2m2v8qd3sl9r8jg4bs2f9xq7mwg85 >
New names of repositories
Hi all, As mentioned in the other thread, the repos need to be renamed to remove "incubating". In the discussion from a few months ago [1] several reasons were given why not to use hyphens in the names (they confuse some tools and underscores are safer). Two possibilities for repo names were given: 1) nuttx and nuttx_apps or 2) nuttx_rtos and nuttx_apps Which do we want? Cheers, Nathan [1] https://lists.apache.org/thread/8fn2m2v8qd3sl9r8jg4bs2f9xq7mwg85
