Re: [Elecraft] [K2] New Antenna

[Phil Kane]

Just a note to say that I now have a Cushcraft R8 vertical (40-6
meters) in the air, mounted on a 10 foot mast at the back corner of my
deck which is 8 feet AGL.  The "monster" is 40 feet tall counting the
mast, guyed about 80% up.  We had a raising crew of six people this
morning, and because I did all the assembly and prep work beforehand, up
it went, nice and easy.

Made a couple of PSK31 contacts on 40 and 20 meters and got good reports
(does Mexico count as "real" 40-meter DX if it is a border town?).

C U on the air.

73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane
Elecraft K2/100   s/n 5402

From a Clearing in the Silicon Forest
Beaverton (Washington County)  Oregon
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Re: [Elecraft] K2 - Initial Alignment & Test Part 1 - Issues

[AJSOENKE]

Whoa! Is this deja vu (all over again). Maybe you missed the exchange  
between me and Gary a couple days ago over the same question.  
 
I suspected I was having the identical problem you are having because of  
some of the random button pushing that took place during the assembly of K2 sn  
6281. I had forgotten the eeprom reset command and Gary was able to provide it. 
 It worked great to clear the problem.  Incidentally, the 2 in 0250.xx  
actually looks more like a ? without the dot, like in a K3 cw text  display.  
Anyway . . .ready?
 
1. Power off.  2. press and hold keys 4 - 5 - 6 simultaneously ( I  used a 
short pencil to do this ) and press power on. 3. you should first see  INFO 
201- 
wait around 10 seconds you should see ELECrAFt then 7100.0 c with  
annunciator marks as indicated in the manual.
 
Good luck, let me know how it turns out. 
 
This does not preclude the possibility of an initial soldering problem  
somewhere, but eventually you'll need to do this to get back on track.
 
73 AL WA6VNN
 
++
 
In a message dated 3/16/2008 5:11:16 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Maybe there is someone on the list that has been  through this issue and 
can lend me their insight.

I am on page 42  which is the Alignment and Test Part 1 section of the 
assembly  notes.

My relays all click as expected, I get the Elecraft message and  then I 
get a  message on the screen: 0250.33r and at the same  time
"VFO B, RIT, and XIT" are all flashing. I am expecting 7100.00c  
according to the book.  The "0250.33r" message will change as the RIT  is 
adjusted.   --I don't see any references in the troubleshooting  to this.

The other weird thing is that when I turn the VFO the display  does not 
change.

The other initial tests seem fine. (Voltages,  relays, etc)

I am going to hold off going any further until I understand  why the 
message does not look right for where I am in the book.

Any  thoughts or ideas?

Thanks, JH

-- 

John Hoaglun
NG0R -  EN25
http://www.hoaglun.com


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Re: [Elecraft] Amplifier Vacuum Tubes

[AJSOENKE]

Having lived in Santa Barbara most of my life I have had the privilege of  
friendship with many of the staff of the original EiMac Vacuum Tube company. 
One 
 of the last of their original Tech staff, Rad Leonard, Just passed on a few  
months ago. In the course of these acquaintances I was privy to many of the  
stories of the development of these vacuum tubes. I'm sure there are published 
 accounts as well. The main thrust of these tails was the incredible 
meticulous  crafting they had to go through to make these tubes right. There 
are 
innumerable  accounts of their dealings with government contracts and the 
failings 
of their  competitors who were attempting to copy their designs. The usual 
government  contract gave the design right to the government who would then 
offer 
those  designs to competitors for competitive bidding. The companies original 
trade  secrets were not a part of the deal. The outcome was that detailed 
designs were  not enough to build a successful product. The details of the 
exact 
alloys used  for such critical components as filaments and cathodes, plates 
and gridwires;  the thermal design of the feedthru pins and the correct 
composition of the base  materials are all very critical.  I have never been 
convinced 
 that these devices could be 'copied'.  Like so many devices from the  vacuum 
tube era, including the rigs we used, the heart of success was the  original 
design concept and philosophy - The very things that are lost when  something 
is merely copied.
In the world of today, there is a belief that our technology is superior to  
that of the past and we can use that technology to create copies of things 
that  are better than the original. All that and make it cheaper and in more  
volume.  It just doesn't work like that!  I have my hat off to the  guys at 
Svetlana for getting as far as they have.  Some call it mojo,  others know it 
is 
skill coupled with a philosophy and experience.  If they  keep trying and 
acknowledge their failures the worldwide market will eventually  re-learn a lot 
that 
has been lost of the past. In the mean time - some of these  old amps that 
are laying around gathering dust may have some very useful spare  parts in them.
 
73 Al WA6VNN
 
 
+++

In  a message dated 3/16/2008 1:23:17 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]  writes:
I have an amplifier with four 572B tubes.  I have  been
running the same Cetron 572Bs since 1976 in this
Dentron Clipperton L  and in a Hunter Bandit before. 
This summer I decided to lay in another set  to stretch
the life of the amp.  I ordered a quad of the  premium
Chinese Tubes from the distributor that I considered
to be the  best available.  When I received and
installed them they didn't  work.  After some
investigation and head scratching I found that one  of
them had an open filament.

The distributor replaced them with  another set and a
rude accusation that I ruined the tubes by  overdriving
them.

The second set lasted a month, but were not as good  as
the 30 year old Cetrons when installed and were dead
by the end of the  two CQWW DX contests.  I pulled the
new tubes and reinstalled the  Cetrons which are still
going strong.

I emailed the distributor and  asked what he would
recommend that I do and how he would be willing  to
help.  After my second email, I received a very rude
phone call  from the "Customer Service Department"
which essentially told me to stuff  it.

My conclusion is that amplifier tube supply as far as
572Bs are  concerned is dead now.  The Chinese are not
making a good product and  the US distributor feels
that he can do nothing about it, so his  present
approach it to stonewall the problem.

My next amplifier will  be whatever I deem the best
solid state amp available at a price that I  can
manage.  I hope that my Clipperton will hang in until
I can  recover from paying for my K3.


Willis 'Cookie' Cooke  
K5EWJ
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 ATU Balun question

[Bob Cunnings]

You brought back an old memory.

Many years ago I made a bifilar wound air-core 1:1 balun. I was
inspired by the 1974 ARRL Antenna Book, which described it on pg. 102,
fig. 3-43(B). Figure 3-43(A) presented a 4:1 balun. On the same page
is a photograph of a broadband unit, made of airdux type coil stock in
an aluminum housing. I'll quote from the book, which fortunately I
still have:

"In practice, a single set of coils can be designed to work over the
3.5 to 30 MHz range. Design is complicated because there is mutual
coupling between turns, which modifies the characteristic impedance.
However, suitable units are available commercially (B&W 3975)."

I wound the 1:1 on an old phenolic coil form I had and put it in an
upside down pickle jar attached to a post at the feedpoint of a 40 m
delta loop. Not a very challenging application - single band and all.
The antenna was already matched to a 50 ohm feedline pretty well with
a quarter wave section of RG-59, but I wanted to limit currents on the
outside of the coax. It didn't seem to make the antenna any worse!

Air-core baluns don't get mentioned much anymore, but as you suspected
they can be made to work, within certain limits.

Bob NW8L

On Sun, Mar 16, 2008 at 12:21 PM, Mike Scott <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> We had a prior discussion about the use of the K3 ATU driving an antenna on
>  multiple bands fed with open wire feed line with a short length of coax and
>  a Balun on the transceiver end. The discussion mentioned that Baluns have
>  losses when SWR is high and that the proper Balun was 1:1.
>
>  The Balun losses lead me to think air core and whether the losses could be
>  avoided...
>
>  Baluns do three things: Transform impedances, transform unbalanced to
>  balanced, force currents to be equal and opposite (current Balun). We don't
>  need impedance transformation as that is what the ATU does, I am not sure we
>  absolutely need common mode choking of the current Balun; it depends on
>  whether asymmetry has been introduced in the doublet or feed line.
>
>  Is there any problem with using an un-tuned 1:1 air coil transformer with
>  unbalanced primary and balanced secondary? I am thinking back to link
>  coupled transmitter days. Many tuners used a topology like this but they
>  tuned the primary or secondary for impedance matching purposes. Since the
>  ATU is there to match impedances the minimum we need is low-loss unbalanced
>  to balanced conversion. If the Balun core is the primary mechanism for loss
>  generation at high SWR, why not get rid of it?
>
>  I make my own Airdux style coils. I could wind an "Airdux style" coil in
>  bifilar fashion (equal number of turns) and feed one winding unbalanced and
>  leave the other winding balanced to connect to the open wire feed line. I am
>  not sure if I am going to get efficient 160M to 6M coupling out of one coil
>  but what is wrong with this picture?
>
>  Similar construction with different hookup could take the same bifilar coil
>  arrangement and turn it into a 1:1 current Balun if that was a better
>  solution.
>
>  The coil could go into an outside the window weather proof box.
>
>  Mike Scott - AE6WA
>  Tarzana, CA (DM04 / near LA)
>  K3-100 #508/ KX1  #1311
>
>
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[Elecraft] K3: my assembly pictures

[Wim Dewilder]

Here's an attempt to post a link to my K3 assembly pictures

< URL:http://www.dewilder.com/public/k3/index.html >

enjoy 
- Wim


  

Never miss a thing.  Make Yahoo your home page. 
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
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[Elecraft] Elecraft CW Net preliminary report

[Kevin Rock]

Good Evening,
   This report will be a little truncated as compared to the regular version.  
I will put all in order again tomorrow if Verizon puts my phone line back 
together.  Problem is the database is on one computer and the phone line which 
works is run into another room.  This computer is normally used for writing 
firmware for microcontrollers but in a pinch does double duty as an email box.  
Hopefully Verizon will get everything back to normal soon so I don't have to 
run around the house to create documents and then email it.

The lists in their short form:

On 14049.5 kHz at 2300z:
N0AR - Scott - MN - K2
KL7CW - Rick - AK - KX1 
AB9V - Mike - IN - K3 
W0CZ - Ken - ND - K3 
K9DMV - Joe - IL 
NO8V - John - MI 
N0BK - Bruce - MN - K2 
WB8YQJ - Don 
NE5DL - David - TX - K2 
N2YC - John - NY
N0JRN - Jerry - MO 
K1EV - Bill - CT - K2 

On 7044.5 kHz at 0100z:
W6ZH - Pete - CA - K2 
W0CZ - Ken - ND - K3
AB9V - Mike - IN - K3 
N2YC - John - NY
KL7CW - Rick - AK - KX1
N7KRT - Jeff - TX 
K1THP - Dave - CT 
NO8V - John - MI
NE5DL - David - TX - K2 
W5TM - Ed - OK
N0JRN - Jerry - MO
KT5E - Jay - CO - K3

   Omissions in the above list are due to both expediency and lack of memory.  
I have all the data necessary to fill in the blanks but it is spread around 
between my notes and the database the length of the house away.  I still can 
make errors so expect a deluge of email on Tuesday.  Luckily I will have more 
time after that day is over to fix the errors.  On Wednesday I am going to 
sleep until Sam tells me he is hungry or his fire needs tending.  His yowl 
could wake the dead!  He gets me from horizontal to vertical at a moment's 
notice.  
   Until a bit later stay well,
  73,
 Kevin.  KD5ONS (Net Control Operator under some deadlines )

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Re: [Elecraft] [K2] : Laptop UPS

[VR2BrettGraham]

G3RXQ asked F4FNT about the Dell OEM UPS (probably
meaning power supply) for his laptop that made noise &
G4ILO then added:


> By any chance was the UPS manufactured in China ?

That's not a very fair bet; almost every bit of consumer electronics is
manufactured in China or has most of its components manufactured there.

However, if the suggestion is the responsibility for poor EMC lies in
China, that's not true.  A lot of the responsibility comes down to the
purchasers, who want minimum prices and do not care about features that
only benefit non-purchasers.


An OEM laptop supply originally sold into EU will have
had to conform with EN-something-I-can't-recall-now
(conducted & radiated emissions standard).  Either that
standard is not sufficient for F4FNT's circumstances or
that particular supply conducts and/or radiates more
than it should.

Where a product is assembled generally has nothing
to do with its design.  This particular kind of product will
have little room for assembly to impact EMC
performance, whilst the design will.

G4ILO is spot on - basically you get what you pay for
& if there is a demand for cheaper products, then
somebody is going to supply them.  EMC is an area
where it is easy to cut BOM costs & get away with it,
as for the vast majority of consumers it does not matter
& many countries don't seem to bother to make sure
product delivered actually meets the standards insisted
upon.

73, VR2/KBrett7Graham/p.

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Re: [Elecraft] OT: the value of "accurate measures" for ham radio

[VR2BrettGraham]

KR2Q asked:


I have received some good (private) replies to my query about the need
for accuracy and I've learned a lot about how other think.

Shown below is one reply that I feel is worth sharing.  I'm not an
engineer, so I found this to be especially enlightening.  I assume
some (many?) will cry sacrilege, but since this is not me speaking,
don't yell at me.  I'm only the piano player!





Comments?


The Bird 43 is a product that was designed some
50-odd years ago, with rated accuracy of +/- 5% at full
scale.

The slugs themselves add to that, how much I can't find -
maybe another +/- 5%?

A characterized Bird 43 (or any other piece of T&M
kit) used with appropriate care & understanding, has the
potential of providing results similar to what it was
characterized against.

73, VR2/KBrett7Graham/p.

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Re: [Elecraft] WAS K3/10 For Sale or Trade; NOW rev BUTTON

[drewko1]

On Sun, 16 Mar 2008 22:05:59 -0400, I wrote:

>
>Okay, so I like audible enunciators.  No need for jokes about 'roger
>beep'... 
>


Uh, I mean "annunciator" not enunciator, if that makes a little more
sense...

73,
Drew
AF2Z

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[Elecraft] Amplifier Vacuum Tubes

[Brett Gazdzinski]

I would like to point out that there are loads of good tubes around,
many places have a lot of old US tubes, I use some 100TH tubes made in the 
1950's,

and also have a pile of 811a, 812a, 813,s, 4-125, 4-400,etc.
No I dont want to sell any, but there are loads of good tubes around.
Unless overloaded, most tubes seem to keep working for a long time.

I would not get any tubes from China, Russian tubes are sometimes ok,
and the ones from Eastern Europe seem good, but best is old US tubes.

Brett

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Re: [Elecraft] [K2] : Laptop UPS

[WILLIS COOKE]

Well I didn't plug it into my K3 with the transformer
isolation because my K3 is in its gestation period and
I am waiting for delivery.  But, I don't think that it
would have avoided the problem.  I was using
transformer isolation with a Rascal Interface.  The
hum came through the push to talk ground circuit.  One
of my friends had to replace the transistor PTT
interface with an Opto Isolator to eliminate his
ground loop problem.  I have a separate power feed for
my radio equipment that comes from a box at my meter
loop and quite different ground length from the house
wiring.  You need your computer fed from the same
power source as the radio equipment even if you have a
K3.

--- Brett Howard <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> This is why we transformer isolate our audio. 
> If/when you get a K3
> you'll have this feature built right into the rig. 
> For me I just built
> a cable for the PSK/RTTY and what not and put
> transformers in a box in
> the middle of the cable.
> 
> 
> On Sun, 2008-03-16 at 05:57 -0700, WILLIS COOKE
> wrote:
> 
> > I don't know if it applies to your situation or
> not
> > Raymond, but I had a lot of hum on when I
> connected my
> > 110V Lap top to my TS-850 for PSK-31.  I had the
> > charger plugged into a house circuit and my radio
> > equipment plugged into a separate circuit for the
> > radio station.  When I moved the charger plug to
> the
> > radio circuit the hum went away.
> > 
> > --- Raymond METZGER <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
> > 
> > > Hi Elecrafters,
> > > 
> > >  
> > > 
> > > I am interested to know what solution can be
> used to
> > > avoid the noise
> > > generated by the 220 V AC (OEM) UPS of my recent
> > > Dell Latitude Laptop.
> > > 
> > > For the time being, I can only use the laptop
> with
> > > my K2/100 if the laptop
> > > is powered by its internal battery.
> > > 
> > >  
> > > 
> > > Raymond METZGER
> > > 
> > > F4FNT
> > > 
> > > K2 5,636 - K3 expected at month end (ordered 8
> > > September, "Katiegram"
> > > received last Friday)
> > > 
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> > > 
> > 
> > 
> > Willis 'Cookie' Cooke 
> > K5EWJ
> > ___
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>   
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> 


Willis 'Cookie' Cooke 
K5EWJ
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Re: [Elecraft] WAS K3/10 For Sale or Trade; NOW rev BUTTON

[drewko1]

On Sun, 16 Mar 2008 15:49:15 -0400,  Ed K1EP wrote:

>At 3/16/2008 03:05 PM, Bill NY9H wrote:
>>During Clipperton & Ducie  I found myself,  ( AS DID SEVERAL OTHERS  :(   )
>> out of band calling after I managed to hit the UN-split button 
>> missing the REV button. I don't need any help looking stupid.
>>
>>Using the single rcvr SUB button as REV makes great sense to me.
>
>I found that somehow the split function got turned off (by some 
>software combination or band switching combination) and I was called 
>UP several times.  I found the SPLIT SAVE function, which greatly 
>helped me out there.
>


Maybe it would be useful to be able to "transmit-lock" one of the
VFO's; i.e., temporarilly disable it from transmitting altogether.

Another idea: provide an audible enunciator whenever A/B is pressed.
For example: a single beep for A and a double beep for B (or
alternatively, a high tone beep for A and a low tone for B). This tone
enunciator would tell you instantly which vfo you have selected and
would quickly become ingrained in your operating habits. (Better yet::
"di-dah" for A and "dah-di-di-dit" for B would be way cool! Perhaps
there are other rig functions that could benefit from Morse code
enunciators?)

As for Split, I wouldn't mind having a periodic audio warning to
remind me that it is on; perhaps some low-profile chime every
x-seconds with user-selectable volume, tone and beep rate. (But then
again, I am a cw op so not worried about it getting out over the
mic...)

Okay, so I like audible enunciators.  No need for jokes about 'roger
beep'... 

73,
Drew
AF2Z

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Re: [Elecraft] REV Button - Rig Comfort

[Paul Christensen]

Please leave the REV button exactly as it is now, for those who like it 
that way. But if the sub-rx is not installed, please also make the unused 
SUB button do the same as the existing REV button.


Agreed, Ian.  I mis-spoke as to activating the REV function by depressing 
SUB via a menu item.  Operation by simply enabling/disabling of the sub-rx 
would be fine.  Tnx!


Paul, W9AC 


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[Elecraft] No 6M scanning?

[Ken Kopp]

Six meters is probably the only band I would
-want- to scan ... ever.  Well, maybe 10M when
watching for an opening. (:-))

73! Ken Kopp - K0PP
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

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[Elecraft] K2 #6425 low/no sensitivity - suggestions?

[TF3KX]

Hi - I am in the process of constructing my K2 and have two problems that may
or may not be related.

Problem 1:  Low, almost nonexistent RX sensitivity during Alignment II.  I
can manage to copy a carrier from my MFJ antenna analyzer and I have used
this to verify that IF and input circuits are peaked.  Injecting this signal
into the antenna terminal I can also verify that PRE and ATT work as
expected, as well as the crystal different filter bandwidths.  Using an IF
carrier from the MFJ I have poked a low level signal into various parts of
the IF chain.  An interesting thing is that I hear this signal much weaker
in the K2 audio when I touch it to the INPUT of IF-amp U12 (MC1350) than to
its OUTPUT.  In other words, that IF amp does not amplify, but rather
attenuate the injected signal.  I have re-checked all connections around
U12, re-flowed the solder, checked T7 and removed the overload diodes D40
and D41 - with no improvement.

Problem 2:  Low 8V regulator output, 7.56V.  As a result I could only adjust
the U2 pin 5 voltage to 3.60V using R1, in Alignment I.  Probing the
voltages derived from the 8V supply, they are of course 5-10% lower than
expected.  All DC voltages on U12 are consequently a little low, but
otherwise not abnormal.

I plan to get a local replacement for the 8V regulator, just in case.  But
does anyone have comments on the low sensitivity?  Would the low 8V level be
a possible cause for this?

73 - Kristinn, TF3KX
-- 
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[Elecraft] K2 - Initial Alignment & Test Part 1 - Issues

[John Hoaglun]

Maybe there is someone on the list that has been through this issue and 
can lend me their insight.


I am on page 42 which is the Alignment and Test Part 1 section of the 
assembly notes.


My relays all click as expected, I get the Elecraft message and then I 
get a  message on the screen: 0250.33r and at the same time
"VFO B, RIT, and XIT" are all flashing. I am expecting 7100.00c 
according to the book.  The "0250.33r" message will change as the RIT is 
adjusted.   --I don't see any references in the troubleshooting to this.


The other weird thing is that when I turn the VFO the display does not 
change.


The other initial tests seem fine. (Voltages, relays, etc)

I am going to hold off going any further until I understand why the 
message does not look right for where I am in the book.


Any thoughts or ideas?

Thanks, JH

--

John Hoaglun
NG0R - EN25
http://www.hoaglun.com


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[Elecraft] ECN 16 Mar 20m

[Fred Jensen]

Well, I listened on 14059.51 until 2340Z.  Occasionally could hear a 
character or two from Kevin, well into the noise.  I'm building the KAF2 
and if it was done, I might have picked him out.  Never heard an offer 
of QNB although a number of the midwest stations were 579 or better.


Won't make the 40m net.  At least I tried for 20m

Had Tom been there, report would have been:

NOSS DE K6DGW GE QNI WX SUN 70F QRU TU QNB DE K6DGW

73,

Fred K6DGW
- Northern California Contest Club
- CU in the 2008 Cal QSO Party  4-5 Oct 08
- www.cqp.org
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[Elecraft] RFTB - tonight!

[Larry Makoski W2LJ]

The March Run for the Bacon is tonight; and I apologize for the short notice!  
I just now realized today is the 3rd Sunday of the month!

Sunday night - March 16th from:
9 - 11 PM EDT
8 - 10 PM CDT
7 - 9 PM MDT
6 - 8 PM PDT

This is a 2 hour, fun filled, friendly QRP CW contest open to ALL radio 
amateurs. Membership in the Flying Pigs QRP ARCI is not required. For the scoop 
on the details, please go to:

http://www.gentzow.com/fpqrp/fpqrprun.php

This month, in addition to the normal certificates, there WILL BE A 1ST PLACE 
PRIZE 
This month's top place scorer (who has not qualified for winning a prize so far 
in 2008) will win a set of Flying Pigs coasters!  You can quaff a few brews and 
prevent your beer glass/mug from damaging your table.

Please use the Autolog; and have your entry posted at no later than March 23rd.

Hope to catch you on the bands; and good luck to all!

73 de Larry W2LJ
FP# 612

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[Elecraft] Re: VP6DX -- the true story ?

[Eric Scace K3NA]

Hi Dave --

  There is a lot of information about hearing available on the web.  As 
always, one should cross-check sources and exercise some skepticism.


  Hearing is logarithmic.  Turning down the gain makes it more likely 
that signals will stay below the triggering threshold for the 
attenuation reflex, so signals will remain more "different" in strength.


  Frequency discrimination, in Hz, is better at lower frequencies than 
at higher frequencies.  The optimum point for greatest frequency 
discrimination depends on the individual.  Mine is around 400 Hz.  Some 
people are lower, some higher... but 400-500 Hz is a good starting 
point.  Hearing is less sensitive (and dynamic range is a little 
smaller) at lower frequencies, so there are tradeoffs.  There was an 
on-line test for frequency discrimination available on the web... so try 
a search.


73,
  -- Eric K3NA

on 08 Mar 14 Fri 11:58 dave said the following:

Eric,

Where could one learn more about this very valuable, if arcane, 
subject?  Human hearing, that is, and how it relates to picking out 
signals.


I've long turned my volume down to aid in picking out signals.  They 
seem to "pop" out of the noise much better at low volumes than at 
high.  I've attributed this to the greater sensitivity of the ear at 
low volumes than at high, but that may not be correct.  My 
understanding is that he ear is logarithmic, the louder the sound, the 
lower the ear response.


Also, are you suggesting that we'd help ourselves in picking out weak 
ones by raising the pitch of our CW tone?  I kinda prefer the lower 
tones, but your comments seem to say that higher pitch, if we could 
stand it, would be better.


Thanks for the very interesting comments.  Postings such as your's are 
why I continue to subscribe to the list - in spite of all the "noise" 
here, hee hee!



73 de dave
ab9ca





Eric Scace K3NA wrote:

Igor --

  Your question about DSP is an interesting one.

  In my limited understanding of the K3 signal path, there is always 
a DSP operation on the signal for filtering.   While noise blanking, 
noise reduction, and audio effects can all be switched off, I don't 
know if it is possible to remove ALL digital signal processing from 
the signal path; i.e., operate only with the crystal filters.


  We certainly had plenty of marginal openings where we were required 
to work a pileup of signals just at the level of the underlying 
band/antenna noise.  But... the antenna/band noise were a significant 
step above the receiver's underlying noise floor (10 dB)... or one 
turned on the pre-amp to bring the band/antenna noise above the 
underlying receiver noise floor.  In this case, the pileup was not at 
the receiver's MDS level.


  Furthermore, the operating positions were not equipped with a 
second, different receiver and associated switching so that the 
operator could do a real-time A/B comparison between the K3 and 
"Brand X".


  Yes, signal range could be from S1 (or less) to S9+40 dB, so more 
than 90 dB.  However, several other aspects of human hearing come 
into play:


  1.  The most sensitive part of audio spectrum for typical hearing 
is 2 to 5 kHz.  If we take a K3 with very wide filters, and no 
antenna, in an extremely quiet listening environment, and just 
gradually advance the audio gain until we can just begin to hear the 
receiver noise floor, we will be listening to a higher-pitch hiss in 
this range of 2 to 5 kHz.  White noise at lower frequencies won't be 
perceptible yet until the receiver gain is advanced another 10 dB (at 
which point frequencies down to 500 Hz are audible) or 20 dB (good 
for frequencies down to 250 Hz).
  If we narrow the receiver bandwidth so we are only listening to 
100-700 Hz, for example, the receiver noise floor will appear about 
10 dB louder (relative to the minimum threshold of hearing) at the 
higher end.


  2.  Another frequency-sensitive aspect of human hearing is the 
attenuation reflex.  This reflex tightens two muscles in the ear, one 
of which tightens the ear drum slightly and the other moves the three 
bones of the middle ear to reduce the transmission to the cochlea 
(inner ear).  This is our own, human protective AGC.
  The attenuation reflex begins to act at 65-70 dB above the 
threshold of hearing at 200 Hz... but 80 dB above the threshold of 
hearing at 700 Hz.
  The "slope" of the attenuation reflex is about -0.6; i.e., a signal 
that is 18 dB above the attenuation reflex threshold will be reduced 
to just 6 dB above that threshold (i.e., 12 dB attenuation added) by 
the time it reaches the inner ear.


  Now let's look at an operator listening to a K3 in a perfectly 
quiet listening environment (no other local sounds).  If he adjusts 
the receiver so that antenna/band noise is 5 to 10 dB above his 
threshold of hearing at a pitch of 400 Hz, and then tunes across a CW 
signal that is +95 dB above the band/antenna noise floor, that CW 
signal will be about 100 to 105 dB above the

Re: RE[Elecraft] V Button - Rig Comfort

[Bill W4ZV]

Ian White GM3SEK wrote:
> 
> 
> No, I do not want any new menu affecting the REV button!
> 
> Please leave the REV button exactly as it is now, for those who like it 
> that way.
> 
> But if the sub-rx is not installed, please also make the unused SUB 
> button do the same as the existing REV button.
> 
> 

I agree, make the choice REV>SUB enabled or disabled.  One caution on the
latter point.  Holding SUB with the current firmware enables LINK (which
will be used to slave the KRX3), so that needs to be disabled if the REV
function is added to SUB for rigs without a KRX3.  Wayne might have some
reasons he may not want to do this but I can assure you he will give it
careful thought.

73,  Bill
-- 
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Re: [Elecraft] Amplifier Vacuum Tubes

[WILLIS COOKE]

--- Paul Meier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> I would broadcast to everyone the name of the
> company that has no customer 
> service so others won't deal with them and get hurt.
> 
> Paul K7PM 
> 
> 
I thought that I had done just that, but it went out
as a private communication to one member.  The company
was RF Parts who I thought to be the premier supplier
of all such tubes and parts.  I hesitated to mention
their name because I thought that they might be a
victim of poor Chinese quality control as we all are
when we are stuck with buying their products.  But I
received another story which parallels mine that
happened nine years ago.  I really wanted RF Parts to
redeem themselves, not so much for the $180 that I am
out for the tubes, but so that the ham community could
have a good reliable supplier for our amplifier parts.
 

Willis 'Cookie' Cooke 
K5EWJ
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Re: [Elecraft] re: VP6DX

[Eric Scace K3NA]

Doug, Dan, et al --

  On Ducie Island we had a 9.6 kbit/s dial-up Internet connection with 
long latency.  Actual throughput was substantially less than this.  1-2 
kbit/s would be a good estimate.


  We could have downloaded new firmware, if we felt it was critical to 
do so.  We did not feel that any aspect of K3 behavior warranted taking 
the time to:

  -- download new firmware;
  -- interrupt an operator to install it on one radio for a "soak test" 
to make sure it didn't introduce any problems; and, if all seemed well,
  -- interrupting six other operators to install the firmware on their 
radios.


73,
  -- Eric K3NA


on 08 Mar 16 Sun 10:56 Doug Faunt N6TQS +1-510-655-8604 said the following:

Elecraft has done everything necessary to allow this.  It's up to the
DXpedition and their priorities.  I've got to say, any trip I've been
on has had the capability.

73, doug

   From: "Dan Barker" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2008 08:05:36 -0400

   You'd think they'd have some way to communicate a small zip file to an
   Island. It's possible a future Dxpedition might desperately need an
   firmware. They must have had a laptop along. Planning for this may help
   some day (or not).

   Dan / WG4S / K2 #2456 


   -Original Message-
   From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
   [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of wayne burdick
   Sent: Monday, March 10, 2008 12:14 PM
   To: Elecraft Reflector
   Subject: [Elecraft] re: VP6DX 


   
   Several issues have already been addressed by later revisions of 
   firmware. They were not in a position to load new firmware from Ducie 
   Island, and were a few revisions behind by the time they started the 
   operation.

   

  

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[Elecraft] K3: power calibration

[Mike Short]

 I haven't seen too much info here on the calibration done on the Bird
meters.
Just because it says Bird, does not make it accurate. Like any other test
equipment,
It must be calibrated periodically. Have all the meters referenced been
calibrated by a 
Known standard? If not, results are suspect...

Mike

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[Elecraft] K3: power calibration

[Curt Knight]

Aloha,

I also was not able to achieve a satisfactory transmitter power
calibration using a borrowed Bird wattmeter and dummy load, in fact I
was not able to get the Bird to read more than about 75 watts no
matter what power level I set.  I repeated the calibration using my
own Elecraft WM1 and the calibration looked OK on both LP and HP, and
the power according to WM1 topped out at about 106 watts.

There are a lot of unknowns here, and I don't know if these results
are really inconsistent given the expected accuracy of the Bird meter
and the WM1.  I have two questions for the group:  1) what is the
acceptable range of maximum power output from a K3, and 2) do the low
power calibration and the high power calibration interact, so that the
low power calibration must be done before trying the high power
calibration.  The Bird meter did not have a low power slug and I
wasn't able to do a low power calibration with it, but the WM1 works
over a wide power range and I did the WM1 calibrations in sequence.
Unfortunately I haven't been able to get the Bird back for a re-check
yet, maybe later this week.

Curt AH6RE
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Re: [Elecraft] REV Button - Rig Comfort

[Ian White GM3SEK]

Paul Christensen wrote:

 I believe what Ian and others are
stating is that in the single Rx configuration, the REV button would work
just as it does now, only via a menu,


No, I do not want any new menu affecting the REV button!

Please leave the REV button exactly as it is now, for those who like it 
that way.


But if the sub-rx is not installed, please also make the unused SUB 
button do the same as the existing REV button.



--

73 from Ian GM3SEK
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[Elecraft] OT Re: Amplifier Vacuum Tubes

[Bill W4ZV]

If I were looking for a 1.5 kW tube amp today, I would look for one using
either two 3CX800A7 (peak-rated 3CPX800A7) or one 8877 (peak-rated
3CPX1500A7).  Reasonably priced Eimac pulls from periodic maintenance of MRI
equipment in many hospitals ensures they should be around for quite awhile. 
Pulls are available from many sources including hams like WA8WZG and another
guy whose call escapes me at the moment.

http://www.wa8wzg.net/forsale.htm

I would personally avoid Chinese glass tubes for quality reasons and Russian
ceramic tubes (i.e. GU74B/4CX800) which are becoming scarce and expensive.

And hopefully Elecraft will resume their solid-state amp project once the K3
settles down!

73,  Bill




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Re: [Elecraft] Missing pan head screws

[Wim K6TE]

exactly same here for S/N 593  and I used two extra zinc ones aswell.


Mark Hampton wrote:
> 
> Same problem as me - there were two 6.4mm black pan-head screws missing
> from the KIO3 hardware bag.   I did the same as others and used the same
> sized zinc version to attach o/p transistors to bottom.  
> 
> Now to decide what filters to order to complement my 2.7 SSB one
> 
> Mark M5MDH
> 

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Re: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade

[Paul Christensen]

I have to admit that I would like to know the answer to this one too!


Vic, the idea is to minimize any propensity for Tx error.  Far too many ops 
call the DX station incessantly without listening.  These are the guys I 
would really hate to see using A/B.


If you're really cognizant about your operations, it can work well.  I would 
like to avoid the embarrassment of transmitting by accident at every 
opportunity.  By contrast, no matter what state the REV button is in when 
operating split after the initial set-up, I won't transmit on the DX 
station -- unless I've spun VFO B down so low as to create interference. 
That's a far less likely situation.


Paul, W9AC 


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Re: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade

[Vic K2VCO]

ab2tc wrote:

Why would you transmit if you don't hear
the DX says he is listening?


I have to admit that I would like to know the answer to this one too!
--
73,
Vic, K2VCO
Fresno CA
http://www.qsl.net/k2vco
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Re: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade

[ab2tc]

I don't understand why. If you forget to get back to the DX' transmit
frequency, you will not hear him. Why would you transmit if you don't hear
the DX says he is listening? I think most of the cases of transmitting on
the wrong frequency is because SPLIT is turned off. I know I have made this
mistake but *never* because the A/B was in the wrong state.

Knut - AB2TC


This is A/B approach is a "transmit on the wrong VFO" accident waiting to
happen.   The tap again is what can get lost in the heat of the action.

There simply is no substitute for a second VFO/sub rx that is in RX all the
time.
That being said.  One could always tell (just after the FT-1000MP's came out
in numbers) who what using a new MP.  They were the ones transmitting on the
DX's frequency.  Nothing is foolproof.

de K3KO


ab2tc wrote:
> 
> Why not use the A/B button instead of REV when working split? No
> acrobatics necessary. Tap it once, tune the other frequency, tap it again
> and you are back where you started.
> 
> 73 de ab2tc - Knut
> 
> 
> 
> John Reiser-3 wrote:
>> 
>> I don't have any trouble holding the REV button on my K3 with my index 
>> finger while turning the VFO A knob with my thumb.  I do that a lot
>> working 
>> DX like Ducie.  Maybe it's a question of getting used to the placement of 
>> the button with a new radio.
>> 
>> I have never used an Omni-VI, so I don't know whether its front-panel
>> layout 
>> is easier to use or not.
>> 
>> Just wanted to get my 2 cents worth in on this thread before it becomes 
>> accepted truth that the K3 layout is hard to use.  It's plenty easy for
>> me.
>> 
>> 73,  John, W2GW
>> 
>> 
>> - Original Message - 
>> From: "Ian White GM3SEK" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> To: 
>> Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2008 12:33 PM
>> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade
>> 
>> 
>>> Paul Christensen wrote:
>  I also find it is much easier to hold the REV button and tune the VFO 
> with one hand when working split on the Omni-VI than the K3.

That's one K3 limitation that I have not experienced with most other 
transceivers.   Of all the panel buttons, the placement of the REV
button 
is probably the most critical.   Other controls maybe touched up 
periodically but when you're working split with a paddle in one hand, 
split mode requires a very ergonomic one-hand operation.  I would have 
preferred the K3's REV button placed either in place of the red Freq. 
Entry button so that the right index finger can be used while using the 
thumb and other fingers to find the Dx stations listening frequency -- 
or in the alternative, placement of the REV button on the lower left of 
the main VFO so that the right thumb is used.  I am right-handed so I am 
naturally biased.

The Ducie guys with their K3s never ran into this dilemma as the DX 
station. It manifests only for the mere mortals trying to work the DX 
station.  Of course, when the sub-receiver is offered, this all becomes 
moot point but not everyone will want the optional sub-rx.

>>>
>>> A useful feature for K3s that don't have the sub-receiver would be to 
>>> duplicate the REV function on the SUB button.
>>>
>>>
>> 
>> 
> 
> 

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RE: [Elecraft] [K2] : Laptop UPS

[Raymond METZGER]

Hi Stewart,

Yes, the 90 W AC power supply of my Dell is made in China.
Do you mean there is a special treatment against the "Chinese syndroma" ?

Raymond
F4FNT

-Message d'origine-
De : Stewart Baker [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Envoyé : dimanche 16 mars 2008 13:53
À : Raymond METZGER; Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Objet : Re: [Elecraft] [K2] : Laptop UPS

By any chance was the UPS manufactured in China ?

73
Stewart G3RXQ
On Sun, 16 Mar 2008 09:05:37 +0100, Raymond METZGER wrote:
>
> I am interested to know what solution can be used to avoid the 
> noise generated by the 220 V AC (OEM) UPS of my recent Dell Latitude 
> Laptop.






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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Scanning, no 6M

[Vic K2VCO]

Mike Scott wrote:

I just started to use the scanning capability of the K3. After scanning the
17M CW segment with some success, I thought, wow lets go scan 6M CW segment.

I get an error saying scanning not allowed on this band. I can't think of a
better use for scanning than 6M to find an opening.

Now I wonder why scanning doesn't work on 6M, I didn't find anything in the
manual.


I believe the reason is something like this: FCC regulations require 
that a 'scanner' capable of operating above 30 mHz must be certified to 
be blocked for cellular frequencies (around 800-900 mHz I think). In 
order to keep from delaying the release of the K3 any longer while 
getting this certification, Elecraft chose to block scanning above 30 
mHz. At some point they will likely do what's necessary for the 
appropriate paperwork and then enable scanning on 6 meters.


Your (if you live in the US) government at work. Note: I do not work for 
Elecraft, this is not an 'official' explanation.

--
73,
Vic, K2VCO
Fresno CA
http://www.qsl.net/k2vco
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Re: [Elecraft] REV Button - Rig Comfort

[Paul Christensen]

"I am all for making changes to buttons to make things easier, but I
wonder if some are jumping the gun a little to fast here.  This is a NEW
radio and it takes time for an operator to get use to it.  Change is good,
but change to make the rig similar to other rigs might not be the answer."


Lee:

It's not a matter of jumping the gun, nor getting used to a new radio.  I
also don't believe there is a right or wrong answer as to the placement of
the REV button since every operator likely prefers a slightly different
method whether its a finger, thumb, short stretch to the button, long
stretch to the button, etc.

I worked the 5T5 station last night on 40M and having a closer REV button
would have been a welcome addition.  I believe what Ian and others are
stating is that in the single Rx configuration, the REV button would work
just as it does now, only via a menu, those of us with smaller hands or
those of us who have become accustomed to a shorter-distanced REV button can
have an alternative via the Sub button.

I've also tried using A/B in the past and the results have been disastrous.
I am not the world's best DX split operator and myself along with many
others (the ones calling on the DX frequency), need all the help we can get.
Moreover, the distance to the A/B button is only slightly closer than it is 
for REV.  Incorporating Ian's idea of a menu-adjustable option using SUB 
makes a lot of sense.


Paul, W9AC

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[Elecraft] Amplifier Vacuum Tubes

[WILLIS COOKE]

I have an amplifier with four 572B tubes.  I have been
running the same Cetron 572Bs since 1976 in this
Dentron Clipperton L and in a Hunter Bandit before. 
This summer I decided to lay in another set to stretch
the life of the amp.  I ordered a quad of the premium
Chinese Tubes from the distributor that I considered
to be the best available.  When I received and
installed them they didn't work.  After some
investigation and head scratching I found that one of
them had an open filament.

The distributor replaced them with another set and a
rude accusation that I ruined the tubes by overdriving
them.

The second set lasted a month, but were not as good as
the 30 year old Cetrons when installed and were dead
by the end of the two CQWW DX contests.  I pulled the
new tubes and reinstalled the Cetrons which are still
going strong.

I emailed the distributor and asked what he would
recommend that I do and how he would be willing to
help.  After my second email, I received a very rude
phone call from the "Customer Service Department"
which essentially told me to stuff it.

My conclusion is that amplifier tube supply as far as
572Bs are concerned is dead now.  The Chinese are not
making a good product and the US distributor feels
that he can do nothing about it, so his present
approach it to stonewall the problem.

My next amplifier will be whatever I deem the best
solid state amp available at a price that I can
manage.  I hope that my Clipperton will hang in until
I can recover from paying for my K3.


Willis 'Cookie' Cooke 
K5EWJ
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Re: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade

[K3KO]

This is A/B approach is a "transmit on the wrong VFO" accident waiting to
happen.   The tap again is what can get lost in the heat of the action.

There simply is no substitute for a second VFO/sub rx that is in RX all the
time.
That being said.  One could always tell (just after the FT-1000MP's came out
in numbers) who what using a new MP.  They were the ones transmitting on the
DX's frequency.  Nothing is foolproof.

de K3KO


Why not use the A/B button instead of REV when working split? No acrobatics
necessary. Tap it once, tune the other frequency, tap it again and you are
back where you started.

73 de ab2tc - Knut



John Reiser-3 wrote:
> 
> I don't have any trouble holding the REV button on my K3 with my index 
> finger while turning the VFO A knob with my thumb.  I do that a lot
> working 
> DX like Ducie.  Maybe it's a question of getting used to the placement of 
> the button with a new radio.
> 
> I have never used an Omni-VI, so I don't know whether its front-panel
> layout 
> is easier to use or not.
> 
> Just wanted to get my 2 cents worth in on this thread before it becomes 
> accepted truth that the K3 layout is hard to use.  It's plenty easy for
> me.
> 
> 73,  John, W2GW
> 
> 
> - Original Message - 
> From: "Ian White GM3SEK" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: 
> Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2008 12:33 PM
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade
> 
> 
>> Paul Christensen wrote:
  I also find it is much easier to hold the REV button and tune the VFO 
 with one hand when working split on the Omni-VI than the K3.
>>>
>>>That's one K3 limitation that I have not experienced with most other 
>>>transceivers.   Of all the panel buttons, the placement of the REV button 
>>>is probably the most critical.   Other controls maybe touched up 
>>>periodically but when you're working split with a paddle in one hand, 
>>>split mode requires a very ergonomic one-hand operation.  I would have 
>>>preferred the K3's REV button placed either in place of the red Freq. 
>>>Entry button so that the right index finger can be used while using the 
>>>thumb and other fingers to find the Dx stations listening frequency -- 
>>>or in the alternative, placement of the REV button on the lower left of 
>>>the main VFO so that the right thumb is used.  I am right-handed so I am 
>>>naturally biased.
>>>
>>>The Ducie guys with their K3s never ran into this dilemma as the DX 
>>>station. It manifests only for the mere mortals trying to work the DX 
>>>station.  Of course, when the sub-receiver is offered, this all becomes 
>>>moot point but not everyone will want the optional sub-rx.
>>>
>>
>> A useful feature for K3s that don't have the sub-receiver would be to 
>> duplicate the REV function on the SUB button.
>>
>>
> 
> 

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Re: [Elecraft] Split using REV vs VFO A/B

[Leigh L. Klotz, Jr.]

Just to confirm, if you lock A and use REV to tune and slip off, you're 
still safe from changing A because the VFOs lock independently.

Leigh/WA5ZNU

Doug KR2Q wrote:


I don't have to worry about "slipping" off of the REV button and
tuning the "wrong" VFO.  Equally, since the DX qrg was LOCKED, it is
impossible for me to tune the "wrong" VFO.

Like anything, you have to try it for a while to figure out if it will
really work for you or not.  After doing it both ways for a while, I
find that I don't use REV any longer.  A/B is both easier (no holding)
and safer (no chance of slipping off the button).

So...give it a try.  I think you'll like it!


  

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Re: RE[Elecraft] V Button - Rig Comfort

[ab2tc]

Maybe we can all continue this subject on this thread? No S/W design changes
are necessary. The radio already has an A/B button as does nearly any other
modern radio, certainly the entire ICOM line and I believe TenTec. Just tap
the A/B button, do your tuning on the other frequency, tap A/B again and
you're back. Many split errors right now on 14205 (9x03 - gud sig here in
CNY). I think in most cases this error occurs because you forget to turn the
SPL function on.

73, ab2tc, Knut


Lee Buller wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> I am all for making changes to buttons to make things easier, but I wonder
> if some are jumping the gun a little to fast here.  This is a NEW radio
> and it takes time for an operator to get use to it.  Change is good, but
> change to make the rig similar to other rigs might not be the answer.
> 
> I found for one that I did not have any trouble working Clipperton on
> split more using the REV key.  Hold the button and tune the knob with my
> thumb.  (What got me about Clipperton was some of the ops - editorial
> comment)  I got use to doing it, so I am in the process of retraining
> myself from the previous rig.
> 
> That is the keyretraining my brain for the K3.  The K3 is not an Omni
> VI+, or a 930 or a 940 or a 850 or a 756PROxx...it is a K3.  It is unique
> (or different) and it has been planned by a group of excellent engineers
> and operators.
> 
> I for one am learning to appreciate the planning, engineering and
> development of the unit.
> 
> Lee - K0WA
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In our day and age it seems that Common Sense is in short supply.  If you
> don't have any Common Sense - get some Common Sense and use it.  If you
> can't find any Common Sense, ask for help from somebody who has some
> Common Sense.  Is Common Sense divine?
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> 
> 

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[Elecraft] Elecraft Amps and World Domination

[Lee Buller]

Now that I have your attention with the subject line

I have researching HF amplifiers for a future purchase.  I currently have a 
little old AL80A and I would like to have a little more oompf in my signal from 
time to time.  

QRPers, you may delete this message now

I have been asking some of those who are in the know about these things and it 
looks like the electron power tube might be taking a fall in the near future. 
Kaput!  According to some, Eimac might get out of the business all together 
because of economics.  They do no glass tubes but some metal ceramic tubes, 
mostly for broadcast and medical applications.  Broadcasters are moving to 
solid state so pulls are becoming scarcer for tubes.  The Russian sources for 
tubes is drying up because they have stripped much of their equipment bare to 
sell it.  There is not a lot of new production as I understand it going on in 
Russia.  Some say it is pretty bad over there.  China might do some tube 
manufacturing for several years, but will change to manufacturing high powered 
silicon and dump the tubes when a profit can be seen.  I do not think China is 
into the metal ceramic tubes now.

So, where does that leave us hams?  There is a move to solid state amps because 
tubes are not being manufactured in great numbers and will get fairly expensive 
in years to come.

Now I would like to hear some other comments concerning this.

Lee - K0WA



In our day and age it seems that Common Sense is in short supply.  If you don't 
have any Common Sense - get some Common Sense and use it.  If you can't find 
any Common Sense, ask for help from somebody who has some Common Sense.  Is 
Common Sense divine?
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[Elecraft] REV Button - Rig Comfort

[Lee Buller]

I am all for making changes to buttons to make things easier, but I wonder if 
some are jumping the gun a little to fast here.  This is a NEW radio and it 
takes time for an operator to get use to it.  Change is good, but change to 
make the rig similar to other rigs might not be the answer.

I found for one that I did not have any trouble working Clipperton on split 
more using the REV key.  Hold the button and tune the knob with my thumb.  
(What got me about Clipperton was some of the ops - editorial comment)  I got 
use to doing it, so I am in the process of retraining myself from the previous 
rig.

That is the keyretraining my brain for the K3.  The K3 is not an Omni VI+, 
or a 930 or a 940 or a 850 or a 756PROxx...it is a K3.  It is unique (or 
different) and it has been planned by a group of excellent engineers and 
operators.

I for one am learning to appreciate the planning, engineering and development 
of the unit.

Lee - K0WA





In our day and age it seems that Common Sense is in short supply.  If you don't 
have any Common Sense - get some Common Sense and use it.  If you can't find 
any Common Sense, ask for help from somebody who has some Common Sense.  Is 
Common Sense divine?
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Re: [Elecraft] WAS K3/10 For Sale or Trade; NOW rev BUTTON

[Ed K1EP]

At 3/16/2008 03:05 PM, Bill NY9H wrote:

During Clipperton & Ducie  I found myself,  ( AS DID SEVERAL OTHERS  :(   )
out of band calling after I managed to hit the UN-split button 
missing the REV button. I don't need any help looking stupid.


Using the single rcvr SUB button as REV makes great sense to me.


I found that somehow the split function got turned off (by some 
software combination or band switching combination) and I was called 
UP several times.  I found the SPLIT SAVE function, which greatly 
helped me out there.


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Re: [Elecraft] KPA 800 price

[Ken K3IU]

I'm not sure what the date of this info is, but I have a sheet of paper 
describing the KPA 800 and it says the Assembled price is $3995 and the 
Kit is $3595. This info could be 18+ months old. There is no date on it. 
I suspect that that price will inflate somewhat by the time it is 
introduced.


73,
Ken K3IU


Jim Wiley wrote:
I seem to remember the KPA1500 being about $5500 to $6500 depending on 
whether it was a semi-kit or factory assembled.  But, that is at least 
2 years old, so I am confident there will be adjustments when the amps 
finally appear.  No info on the KPA800 - but if I remember correctly, 
it was about 2/3 the price of the higher power version. I am sure a 
note to Wayne or Eric would get you some better info and  a possible 
release date.  At one time, they were waiting on FCC  approval before 
they could sell them, then the K3 came along and distracted 
everybody.  The FCC tests should certainly be done by now, so once the 
K3 backlog gets worked down, I would expect to see something on the 
amps again.



- Jim, KL7CC
.

DOUGLAS ZWIEBEL wrote:

It's too long ago now and most certainly no longer valid (even if they
will ever be available), but does anyone recall the "mentioned" prices
for the KPA1500 and 800?

Thanks,
de Doug KR2Q
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Re: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade

[Doug Faunt N6TQS +1-510-655-8604]

   Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2008 12:15:58 -0700 (PDT)
   From: Bill W4ZV <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

   Also I would personally find it very difficult to do REV using the K3's SUB
   button due to the very tight spacing of the SUB location.  There's simply no
   way my fingers would fit while depressing SUB and trying to turn the VFO
   knob with another finger.  The spacing is far too tight, not to mention the
   position of SUB being very low even with the bail extended.  To me it looks
   more like a two-hand operation than one-hand due to the very tight spacing. 
   Maybe a Menu option could make everyone happy, but I like it the way it is
   now.

Err, what Ian and I are suggesting would not in any way interfer with
your doing it that way.  It would just allow those of us with smaller
hands (and those who might prefer lower hands and/or higher radios) to
have a more convenient function, using a button that is currently
serving no useful purpose.  You'd lose nothing, others would gain.

73, doug

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[Elecraft] OT: the value of "accurate measures" for ham radio

[DOUGLAS ZWIEBEL]

Dear Elecraft reflectorees

I have received some good (private) replies to my query about the need
for accuracy and I've learned a lot about how other think.

Shown below is one reply that I feel is worth sharing.  I'm not an
engineer, so I found this to be especially enlightening.  I assume
some (many?) will cry sacrilege, but since this is not me speaking,
don't yell at me.  I'm only the piano player!


[snip]
I do have to chuckle when I read about these accurate measurements on a Bird
wattmeter. Back in the 80's when I was involved with RF generators, we used
Bird slugs in the power monitoring section. We used a calorimeter to
calibrate the slugs. It was not uncommon to have the slugs off by as much as
60%! We had a box of over 200 slugs that were too far off to try to
calibrate. We threw them out. Should have saved then and sold them at Ham
fests. Would have been a good laugh when  someone said they checked their
power with a Bird meter.

Had one customer who called and bitched that his new 13.56MHZ 15KW generator
was putting out only 12KW at max power. He had tried two new Birds and they
read the same thing. Since we designed the 15KW generators to run continuous
at 18KW, we took our 13.56MHZ 20KW calibrated Bird to the customer. We
showed him that at the 15KW setting it was putting out 15KW and that when at
maximum as he was checking it, it was putting out 18KW. He was embarrassed
with his new Birds.
[end snip]

Comments?

de Doug KR2Q
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[Elecraft] Split using REV vs VFO A/B

[DOUGLAS ZWIEBEL]

Like others (and most recently, Bill, ZV), I have used the TF-SET
(Rev) for decades.  And like still others, I found myself doing "bad"
things for VP6 when using the K3.  Still not sure how that happened.
LOL.

As I previously posted here, but possibly worth repeating, I have now
changed my modus operandi for split operation to using (as also just
posted) the VFO A/B button instead of the REV button.

I LOCK VFO A on my listening frequency (the DX xmitting QRG).  When I
want to "tune around amongst the other callers," I tap A/B and tune
around.  When done (by whatever measure...taking too long or found the
guy being worked), I just tap A/B again.

I don't have to worry about "slipping" off of the REV button and
tuning the "wrong" VFO.  Equally, since the DX qrg was LOCKED, it is
impossible for me to tune the "wrong" VFO.

Like anything, you have to try it for a while to figure out if it will
really work for you or not.  After doing it both ways for a while, I
find that I don't use REV any longer.  A/B is both easier (no holding)
and safer (no chance of slipping off the button).

So...give it a try.  I think you'll like it!

de Doug KR2Q
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Re: [Elecraft] [META] Nabble threads?

[Dr. Werner Furlan]

Rick, 

Rick Kunath schrieb am 16 Mar 2008 um 11:12:

> Another way message threading gets messed up is folks using the digest
> method of getting the list. Basically, if you are on digest and you reply,
> you are breaking the thread as your digest message is it's own thread. So
> for digest list readers, just don't reply, unless you want to break the
> existing message thread, which you (in digest mode) are not a part of. Go
> to Nabble and properly reply to keep the existing thread intact, or set
> your list preferences to get individual emails. Then a reply is to the
> actual thread.

this is just a test if Pegasus Mail replies to your mail and does not break the 
thread. 
I receive the reflector in digest mode btw. 
The list server is sending a mime-digest and I can read the messages as if 
they were sent as single messages. 

73! de Werner OE9FWV



-- 
 Meine Schwester ist sehr krank. Sie nimmt jeden Tag eine Pille. Aber sie
 tut das heimlich, damit sich meine Eltern keine Sorgen machen.


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Re: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade

[Bill W4ZV]

Bill W4ZV wrote:
> 
> 
> I used a TS-930S for many years and learned to depress TF-SET (Kenwood's
> equivalent to REV) with my left index finger and tune the Main VFO with my
> left pinky.  Since I found it very natural to do the same with REV in the
> K3, out of curiosity I actually measured the distance of both rigs from
> the TF-SET/REV button to the edge of the Main VFO knob.  Both are
> ~4"...which explains why the K3 felt very natural to me.  
> 

Correction...make that 4" from the TF-SET/REV button to the *center* of the
Main VFO knobs.  

Also I would personally find it very difficult to do REV using the K3's SUB
button due to the very tight spacing of the SUB location.  There's simply no
way my fingers would fit while depressing SUB and trying to turn the VFO
knob with another finger.  The spacing is far too tight, not to mention the
position of SUB being very low even with the bail extended.  To me it looks
more like a two-hand operation than one-hand due to the very tight spacing. 
Maybe a Menu option could make everyone happy, but I like it the way it is
now.

73,  Bill

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[Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade

[Don Rasmussen]

>>> Just wanted to get my 2 cents worth in on this
thread before it becomes accepted truth that the K3
layout is hard to use.  <<<

>From the subject line I was more concerned that it
would become accepted truth that everyone had a K3/10
for sale. ;-)

I heard from Doug and he did accept an offer on his
K3/100, for the same amount that a new one would sell
for assembled if you could get it now.

He said he looks forward to being back in line for a
new K3 very soon, and the wait is certain to be
shorter than the first time around. 

[Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade
John Reiser reiserj at optonline.net 
Sun Mar 16 13:46:02 EST 2008 

Previous message: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade 
Next message: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade 
Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ] [ subject ] [
author ] 



I don't have any trouble holding the REV button on my
K3 with my index 
finger while turning the VFO A knob with my thumb.  I
do that a lot working 
DX like Ducie.  Maybe it's a question of getting used
to the placement of 
the button with a new radio.

I have never used an Omni-VI, so I don't know whether
its front-panel layout 
is easier to use or not.

Just wanted to get my 2 cents worth in on this thread
before it becomes 
accepted truth that the K3 layout is hard to use. 
It's plenty easy for me.

73,  John, W2GW


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Re: [Elecraft] WAS K3/10 For Sale or Trade; NOW rev BUTTON

[Bill NY9H]

During Clipperton & Ducie  I found myself,  ( AS DID SEVERAL OTHERS  :(   )
out of band calling after I managed to hit the UN-split button 
missing the REV button. I don't need any help looking stupid.


Using the single rcvr SUB button as REV makes great sense to me.

bill   


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[Elecraft] Re" Acuurate power measurement...

[Dave G.]

The difference between 100% power output and 90% power output equates 
to approximately 0.45dB; which is well below the difference threshhold that 
the human ear can detect.

My question is:- can todays' highly advanced rigs, with their tailored AGC 
and DSP circuits, detect this change in signal input enough to make a 
detectable difference in audio output??

--
Dave G.   KK7SS
'65 MK III Sprite in Richland, WA
"Two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity.
But I'm not so sure about the universe."  ... Albert Einstein.

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Re: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade

[ab2tc]

Why not use the A/B button instead of REV when working split? No acrobatics
necessary. Tap it once, tune the other frequency, tap it again and you are
back where you started.

73 de ab2tc - Knut



I don't have any trouble holding the REV button on my K3 with my index 
finger while turning the VFO A knob with my thumb.  I do that a lot working 
DX like Ducie.  Maybe it's a question of getting used to the placement of 
the button with a new radio.

I have never used an Omni-VI, so I don't know whether its front-panel layout 
is easier to use or not.

Just wanted to get my 2 cents worth in on this thread before it becomes 
accepted truth that the K3 layout is hard to use.  It's plenty easy for me.

73,  John, W2GW


- Original Message - 
From: "Ian White GM3SEK" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2008 12:33 PM
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade


> Paul Christensen wrote:
>>>  I also find it is much easier to hold the REV button and tune the VFO 
>>> with one hand when working split on the Omni-VI than the K3.
>>
>>That's one K3 limitation that I have not experienced with most other 
>>transceivers.   Of all the panel buttons, the placement of the REV button 
>>is probably the most critical.   Other controls maybe touched up 
>>periodically but when you're working split with a paddle in one hand, 
>>split mode requires a very ergonomic one-hand operation.  I would have 
>>preferred the K3's REV button placed either in place of the red Freq. 
>>Entry button so that the right index finger can be used while using the 
>>thumb and other fingers to find the Dx stations listening frequency -- 
>>or in the alternative, placement of the REV button on the lower left of 
>>the main VFO so that the right thumb is used.  I am right-handed so I am 
>>naturally biased.
>>
>>The Ducie guys with their K3s never ran into this dilemma as the DX 
>>station. It manifests only for the mere mortals trying to work the DX 
>>station.  Of course, when the sub-receiver is offered, this all becomes 
>>moot point but not everyone will want the optional sub-rx.
>>
>
> A useful feature for K3s that don't have the sub-receiver would be to 
> duplicate the REV function on the SUB button.
>
>

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[Elecraft] Configuration Save

[Bill W4ZV]

Dick Dievendorff wrote:
> 
> A configuration from one version can be restored to a different version.
> 

If you haven't stored a working configuration using Dick's Configuration
Save utility in the K3 Loader, I highly recommend you do so.  I've made a
habit of periodically saving my configurations since I got my K3 in
December.  Just yesterday I had a problem which was solved by reloading the
previous configuration.  I think of it like the System Restore feature in
Windows.  Eventually I figured out what was wrong but is was really nice to
be able to revert to a previously working configuration, thanks to Dick's
utility.

73,  Bill

-- 
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Re: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade

[John Reiser]

I don't have any trouble holding the REV button on my K3 with my index 
finger while turning the VFO A knob with my thumb.  I do that a lot working 
DX like Ducie.  Maybe it's a question of getting used to the placement of 
the button with a new radio.


I have never used an Omni-VI, so I don't know whether its front-panel layout 
is easier to use or not.


Just wanted to get my 2 cents worth in on this thread before it becomes 
accepted truth that the K3 layout is hard to use.  It's plenty easy for me.


73,  John, W2GW


- Original Message - 
From: "Ian White GM3SEK" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: 
Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2008 12:33 PM
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade



Paul Christensen wrote:
 I also find it is much easier to hold the REV button and tune the VFO 
with one hand when working split on the Omni-VI than the K3.


That's one K3 limitation that I have not experienced with most other 
transceivers.   Of all the panel buttons, the placement of the REV button 
is probably the most critical.   Other controls maybe touched up 
periodically but when you're working split with a paddle in one hand, 
split mode requires a very ergonomic one-hand operation.  I would have 
preferred the K3's REV button placed either in place of the red Freq. 
Entry button so that the right index finger can be used while using the 
thumb and other fingers to find the Dx stations listening frequency -- 
or in the alternative, placement of the REV button on the lower left of 
the main VFO so that the right thumb is used.  I am right-handed so I am 
naturally biased.


The Ducie guys with their K3s never ran into this dilemma as the DX 
station. It manifests only for the mere mortals trying to work the DX 
station.  Of course, when the sub-receiver is offered, this all becomes 
moot point but not everyone will want the optional sub-rx.




A useful feature for K3s that don't have the sub-receiver would be to 
duplicate the REV function on the SUB button.



--

73 from Ian GM3SEK
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Re: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade

[Bill W4ZV]

Luther B. Phillips wrote:
> 
> 
> I also find it is much easier to hold the REV button and tune the VFO 
> with one hand when working split on the Omni-VI than the K3.
> 

Interesting.  This came up fairly recently either here or on the K3 Yahoo
Group.  I used a TS-930S for many years and learned to depress TF-SET
(Kenwood's equivalent to REV) with my left index finger and tune the Main
VFO with my left pinky.  Since I found it very natural to do the same with
REV in the K3, out of curiosity I actually measured the distance of both
rigs from the TF-SET/REV button to the edge of the Main VFO knob.  Both are
~4"...which explains why the K3 felt very natural to me.  I do have big
hands (~10" thumb tip to pinky tip) so this probably doesn't work for people
with smaller spans.  BTW I suspect the 930/940 probably had more all time
units in the field than any other rig.  

73,  Bill  W4ZV

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Re: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade

[T. David Yarnes]

That could be a very good thing Greg.  I agree with the
comments about the reverse button.  When I was chasing the
Ducie Island and Clipperton Island folks, I found it very
easy to hit the wrong button when trying to check the
reverse frequency.  It was mostly operator error, but things
get so frantic trying to work DX using split, it is hard not
to make a mistake now and then.  Of course, the 2nd RX will
help a bunch when it becomes available.

While we are on the subject of ergonomics and ease of
operator use, I might toss out another feature I wish we
could have--don't know if it's possible, but it would be
nice.  On my FT-1000MP Mark V, I have a wired remote pad
which allows me to do certain things.  For example, I can
trigger the memory buttons.  I find that to be a very handy
thing when I am having to repeatedly send from the memory.
On RTTY or CW I could send my call or whatever by just
pushing a button on a pad instead of reaching up so often to
hit the button on the TXCVR itself.  It can actually get a
little tiring doing that.  A pad like this might also be
able to trigger the reverse button.  Using the buttons on
the rig itself is fine usually, but when frequent repeated
uses are called for , an accessory pad like this might work
better.  I realize this may not be possible with the K3, and
if it is it would be an accessory option, but it would be
handy.

Dave W7AQK
- Original Message - 
From: "Greg" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: "Doug Faunt N6TQS +1-510-655-8604" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>;
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: 
Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2008 9:51 AM
Subject: RE: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade



I'll bring this with Wayne.  If he approves I'll put it on
the update list.
The request will be for a menu option to swap the SUB and
REV functions.
But remember there won't be an icon to indicate the
status.  So once you set
it - it's up to the user to remember.

Greg


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Doug
Faunt N6TQS
+1-510-655-8604
Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2008 9:39 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade


What a great idea!!! :-)

Our messages crossed.

73, doug

  Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2008 16:33:12 +
  From: Ian White GM3SEK <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

  Paul Christensen wrote:
  >>  I also find it is much easier to hold the REV button
and tune the
  >>VFO with one hand when working split on the Omni-VI
than the K3.
  >
  >That's one K3 limitation that I have not experienced
with most other
  >transceivers.   Of all the panel buttons, the placement
of the REV
  >button is probably the most critical.   Other controls
maybe touched up
  >periodically but when you're working split with a
paddle in one hand,
  >split mode requires a very ergonomic one-hand
operation.  I would have
  >preferred the K3's REV button placed either in place of
the red Freq.
  >Entry button so that the right index finger can be used
while using the
  >thumb and other fingers to find the Dx stations
listening frequency --
  >or in the alternative, placement of the REV button on
the lower left of
  >the main VFO so that the right thumb is used.  I am
right-handed so I
  >am naturally biased.
  >
  >The Ducie guys with their K3s never ran into this
dilemma as the DX
  >station. It manifests only for the mere mortals trying
to work the DX
  >station.  Of course, when the sub-receiver is offered,
this all becomes
  >moot point but not everyone will want the optional
sub-rx.
  >

  A useful feature for K3s that don't have the
sub-receiver would be to
  duplicate the REV function on the SUB button.
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RE: [Elecraft] K3 Firmware downloads

[Dick Dievendorff]

A configuration from one version can be restored to a different version.  

No firmware program instructions are saved in the configuration save.

Dick, K6KR



-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Bruce Bowman
Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2008 11:07 AM
To: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 Firmware downloads

Related to this, what is the action of the Configuration Save feature in 
the K3 Utility? Can a configuration saved from an earlier f/w level be 
applied to a current/different f/w level? or do you have to keep 
configurations matched to the f/w? Is any f/w code saved as part of the 
configuration?

Bruce, NM5B
Santa Fe, NM



> My IC-7800 requires that you install each firmware upgrade.
>
> I believe that ICOM must be using a "delta patch" sort of technology. 
> The
> Elecraft K3 uses a "completely replace" approach.
>
> Those of us who test K3 firmware that hasn't yet been released to 
> customers
> need the ability to bounce back and forth between firmware versions.
>
> That's why there is an "Advanced Mode" option on the K3 Utility View 
> menu
> which displays check boxes and buttons necessary to load firmware 
> that's
> older than the version installed in the radio.  I must load firmware 5 
> to 10
> times a day, and I think the firmware developers may do it much more 
> often
> than that.
>
> 73 de Dick, K6KR
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Bill NY9H [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2008 9:40 AM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 'Nelson Wittstock'; Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
> Subject: RE: [Elecraft] K3 Firmware downloads
>
> much like other radio/s...
> You will not find the necessity of " going back"  to retrieve a stable
> version.
>
> None of the changes has had me EVER thinking I wanted to go backwards.
>
> bill.
>
>
> At 11:57 PM 3/15/2008, Dick Dievendorff wrote:
>>Each firmware version completely replaces its predecessor. There is no 
>>need
>>to load each intermediate version, just the most recent available.
>>
>>Dick, K6KR
>
>
>
>
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> 


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Re: [Elecraft] [META] Nabble threads?

[David Woolley (E.L)]

Rick Kunath wrote:

David Woolley wrote:

Outlook is possibly a particular problem, as it can thread Usenet but 
not email.


Outlook can thread email messages. It isn't set to do that by default 
though. And most people don't have it set that way.


Many people use back versions of Outlook because it costs money.  The 
version my office uses can group by subject, but can only properly 
thread Usenet, not email.


Another way message threading gets messed up is folks using the digest 
method of getting the list. Basically, if you are on digest and you 
reply, you are breaking the thread as your digest message is it's own 


Providing you take the right form of digest, this is not true. 
Admittedly most users of the digest probably don't know how to use it 
properly.  Actually Outlook handles this better than Thunderbird, 
although thunderbird still threads properly.


The digests I receive are in MIME multipart/digest format, and you can 
extract the individual articles and reply to them, in which case they do 
thread properly.  You only get a problem if people try to reply to the 
whole digest, rather than an individual message.




--
David Woolley
"The Elecraft list is a forum for the discussion of topics related to 
Elecraft products and more general topics related ham radio"

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[elecraft] Missing pan head screws

[MARK HAMPTON]

Same problem as me - there were two 6.4mm black pan-head screws missing from 
the KIO3 hardware bag.   I did the same as others and used the same sized zinc 
version to attach o/p transistors to bottom.  

Now to decide what filters to order to complement my 2.7 SSB one

Mark M5MDH
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[Elecraft] K3 ATU Balun question

[Mike Scott]

We had a prior discussion about the use of the K3 ATU driving an antenna on
multiple bands fed with open wire feed line with a short length of coax and
a Balun on the transceiver end. The discussion mentioned that Baluns have
losses when SWR is high and that the proper Balun was 1:1. 

The Balun losses lead me to think air core and whether the losses could be
avoided...

Baluns do three things: Transform impedances, transform unbalanced to
balanced, force currents to be equal and opposite (current Balun). We don't
need impedance transformation as that is what the ATU does, I am not sure we
absolutely need common mode choking of the current Balun; it depends on
whether asymmetry has been introduced in the doublet or feed line.

Is there any problem with using an un-tuned 1:1 air coil transformer with
unbalanced primary and balanced secondary? I am thinking back to link
coupled transmitter days. Many tuners used a topology like this but they
tuned the primary or secondary for impedance matching purposes. Since the
ATU is there to match impedances the minimum we need is low-loss unbalanced
to balanced conversion. If the Balun core is the primary mechanism for loss
generation at high SWR, why not get rid of it?

I make my own Airdux style coils. I could wind an "Airdux style" coil in
bifilar fashion (equal number of turns) and feed one winding unbalanced and
leave the other winding balanced to connect to the open wire feed line. I am
not sure if I am going to get efficient 160M to 6M coupling out of one coil
but what is wrong with this picture?

Similar construction with different hookup could take the same bifilar coil
arrangement and turn it into a 1:1 current Balun if that was a better
solution.

The coil could go into an outside the window weather proof box.

Mike Scott - AE6WA
Tarzana, CA (DM04 / near LA)
K3-100 #508/ KX1  #1311



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Re: [Elecraft] [K2] : Laptop UPS

[David Woolley (E.L)]

Stewart Baker wrote:

By any chance was the UPS manufactured in China ?


That's not a very fair bet; almost every bit of consumer electronics is 
manufactured in China or has most of its components manufactured there.


However, if the suggestion is the responsibility for poor EMC lies in 
China, that's not true.  A lot of the responsibility comes down to the 
purchasers, who want minimum prices and do not care about features that 
only benefit non-purchasers.  Beyond that are the marketing 
organisations that wouldn't know what EMC measurements actually mean, 
and the corporate management that only knows how to manipulate the stock 
market.


If you buy something from a UK/US marketing organisation, and it is of 
poor quality, they cannot "blame their tools", by saying it was the 
suppliers fault; they should have chosen better suppliers, or paid 
people with appropriate technical knowledge, to do quality control.


Governments also have a responsibility.

--
David Woolley
"The Elecraft list is a forum for the discussion of topics related to 
Elecraft products and more general topics related ham radio"

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Firmware downloads

[Bruce Bowman]

Related to this, what is the action of the Configuration Save feature in 
the K3 Utility? Can a configuration saved from an earlier f/w level be 
applied to a current/different f/w level? or do you have to keep 
configurations matched to the f/w? Is any f/w code saved as part of the 
configuration?

Bruce, NM5B
Santa Fe, NM



> My IC-7800 requires that you install each firmware upgrade.
>
> I believe that ICOM must be using a "delta patch" sort of technology. 
> The
> Elecraft K3 uses a "completely replace" approach.
>
> Those of us who test K3 firmware that hasn't yet been released to 
> customers
> need the ability to bounce back and forth between firmware versions.
>
> That's why there is an "Advanced Mode" option on the K3 Utility View 
> menu
> which displays check boxes and buttons necessary to load firmware 
> that's
> older than the version installed in the radio.  I must load firmware 5 
> to 10
> times a day, and I think the firmware developers may do it much more 
> often
> than that.
>
> 73 de Dick, K6KR
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Bill NY9H [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2008 9:40 AM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 'Nelson Wittstock'; Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
> Subject: RE: [Elecraft] K3 Firmware downloads
>
> much like other radio/s...
> You will not find the necessity of " going back"  to retrieve a stable
> version.
>
> None of the changes has had me EVER thinking I wanted to go backwards.
>
> bill.
>
>
> At 11:57 PM 3/15/2008, Dick Dievendorff wrote:
>>Each firmware version completely replaces its predecessor. There is no 
>>need
>>to load each intermediate version, just the most recent available.
>>
>>Dick, K6KR
>
>
>
>
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> 


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Re: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade

[Doug Faunt N6TQS +1-510-655-8604]

What Ian said.  The button has no useful function currently with only
one RX.  In fact, maybe having a different keycap for single and
dual-RX K3's would be an option?  It's been a while since I had mine
apart.

73, doug

   Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2008 17:48:10 +
   From: Ian White GM3SEK <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

   Sorry, that isn't what I was suggesting.

   As far as I can tell, the SUB button is completely dead until the KRX3 
   is installed. My suggestion was to put that wasted button to use in 
   radios that don't have the KRX3, by making *both* SUB and REV do exactly 
   the same.

   The difference between the two buttons is their location. REV is good 
   for two-handed tuning, but as Paul identified, a convenient one-handed 
   'hold to reverse' function is vital for radios that don't have a second 
   receiver. The SUB button would add that convenience.

   When the KRX3 is installed, the SUB button has to go back to its labeled 
   function - and that's fine too, because the 'hold to reverse' function 
   is hardly needed at all (the FT-1000 doesn't even have it).

   Swapping SUB and REV is a totally different issue... and I can't see 
   much reason for wanting that.

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Re: [Elecraft] OT: the value of "accurate measures" for ham radio

[Ian White GM3SEK]

DOUGLAS ZWIEBEL wrote:
I don't have a Bird watt meter or 'scope.  I have an off-the-shelf 
Diamond SX200 watt meter that is probably 25 years old.  Here is what I 
found:


0.5 watts on the K3 = 0.7 watts on the SX200 (5 watt scale, with 0.1 
"ticks" below 1 watts)

5.0 watts on the K3 = 4.9 watts on the SX200 (5 watt scale)
20 watts on the K3 = 19.5 watts on the SX200 (20 watt scale)
50 watts on the K3 = 50 watts on the SX200 (200 watt scale)
100 watts on the K3 = "just over" 90 watts on the SX200 (200 watt 
scale).


This looks "good enough" for me.  Of what value is more accuracy?  I 
honestly can't see any for ham radio operations.  I don't know which of 
my two devices is more accurate, but I don't care.  If want to run QRP 
at 1 watt or 5 watts, I'm right in there.  If I am driving an external 
amp, do I care what the driving power really is?  I don't think so.  As 
for 100 watts vs 90 watts, I don't know which one is right (probably 
neither), but so what.  The guy on the other end of the QSO will never 
tell (or even measure) the difference between 90 and 100 watts.  Does 
any of this actually matter?


Yes. If you decide that you want to see 100W on the lowest-reading 
meter, that can lead you into overdriving your transmitter. In that case 
the rest of us *will* be able to tell the difference - in IMD.


(I know that you personally wouldn't fall into that trap, Doug... but 
some people definitely do. It's called Fully Clockwise Syndrome.)



--

73 from Ian GM3SEK
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RE: [Elecraft] K3 Firmware downloads

[Dick Dievendorff]

My IC-7800 requires that you install each firmware upgrade. 

I believe that ICOM must be using a "delta patch" sort of technology.  The
Elecraft K3 uses a "completely replace" approach.

Those of us who test K3 firmware that hasn't yet been released to customers
need the ability to bounce back and forth between firmware versions.

That's why there is an "Advanced Mode" option on the K3 Utility View menu
which displays check boxes and buttons necessary to load firmware that's
older than the version installed in the radio.  I must load firmware 5 to 10
times a day, and I think the firmware developers may do it much more often
than that.

73 de Dick, K6KR


-Original Message-
From: Bill NY9H [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2008 9:40 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 'Nelson Wittstock'; Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: RE: [Elecraft] K3 Firmware downloads

much like other radio/s...
You will not find the necessity of " going back"  to retrieve a stable
version.

None of the changes has had me EVER thinking I wanted to go backwards.

bill.


At 11:57 PM 3/15/2008, Dick Dievendorff wrote:
>Each firmware version completely replaces its predecessor. There is no need
>to load each intermediate version, just the most recent available.
>
>Dick, K6KR




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RE: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade

[AB7R]

Thanks for the clarification Ian.  Will pass it on.

Greg


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Ian White GM3SEK
Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2008 10:48 AM
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade


Greg wrote:
>I'll bring this with Wayne.  If he approves I'll put it on the update list.
>The request will be for a menu option to swap the SUB and REV functions.
>But remember there won't be an icon to indicate the status.  So once you
set
>it - it's up to the user to remember.

Sorry, that isn't what I was suggesting.

As far as I can tell, the SUB button is completely dead until the KRX3
is installed. My suggestion was to put that wasted button to use in
radios that don't have the KRX3, by making *both* SUB and REV do exactly
the same.

The difference between the two buttons is their location. REV is good
for two-handed tuning, but as Paul identified, a convenient one-handed
'hold to reverse' function is vital for radios that don't have a second
receiver. The SUB button would add that convenience.

When the KRX3 is installed, the SUB button has to go back to its labeled
function - and that's fine too, because the 'hold to reverse' function
is hardly needed at all (the FT-1000 doesn't even have it).

Swapping SUB and REV is a totally different issue... and I can't see
much reason for wanting that.


73 from Ian GM3SEK



>-Original Message-
>From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Doug Faunt N6TQS
>+1-510-655-8604
>Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2008 9:39 AM
>To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>Cc: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
>Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade
>
>
>What a great idea!!! :-)
>
>Our messages crossed.
>
>73, doug
>
>   Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2008 16:33:12 +
>   From: Ian White GM3SEK <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
>   Paul Christensen wrote:
>   >>  I also find it is much easier to hold the REV button and tune the
>   >>VFO with one hand when working split on the Omni-VI than the K3.
>   >
>   >That's one K3 limitation that I have not experienced with most other
>   >transceivers.   Of all the panel buttons, the placement of the REV
>   >button is probably the most critical.   Other controls maybe touched up
>   >periodically but when you're working split with a paddle in one hand,
>   >split mode requires a very ergonomic one-hand operation.  I would have
>   >preferred the K3's REV button placed either in place of the red Freq.
>   >Entry button so that the right index finger can be used while using the
>   >thumb and other fingers to find the Dx stations listening frequency --
>   >or in the alternative, placement of the REV button on the lower left of
>   >the main VFO so that the right thumb is used.  I am right-handed so I
>   >am naturally biased.
>   >
>   >The Ducie guys with their K3s never ran into this dilemma as the DX
>   >station. It manifests only for the mere mortals trying to work the DX
>   >station.  Of course, when the sub-receiver is offered, this all becomes
>   >moot point but not everyone will want the optional sub-rx.
>   >
>
>   A useful feature for K3s that don't have the sub-receiver would be to
>   duplicate the REV function on the SUB button.
>___

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RE: [Elecraft] wattmeter calibration

[AB7R]

Mike,

Did you follow the steps on page 46?

You have to set the KXV3 menu to TEST and connect an RF Volt meter to the TX
OUT BNC on the KXV3.  Set power to 1 milliwat (0 dbm) and adjust WMTR for
.224 Vrms on the external meter.

Greg


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of AD6XY - Mike
Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2008 10:22 AM
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: RE: [Elecraft] wattmeter calibration



For the record - I can't get it to work either. If I calibrate the wattmeter
to 5 Watts on 20m it is quite a long way out on several other bands -
ranging from about 3W to about 7W. I am comparing it with an HP8484A so that
might be an issue as it is a microwave head, but I think it goes down to
below 10MHz.

I also completely failed to calibrate the transverter output. This outputs
3mW but the power meter can not see it at all. More worryingly, it always
outputs 3mW regardless of the power setting. If I set the ALC off, then I
can adjust it via the gain setting . It appears there is something amiss
with power measurement.

--
View this message in context:
http://www.nabble.com/wattmeter-calibration-tp16079415p16081501.html
Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

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Re: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade

[Ian White GM3SEK]

Greg wrote:

I'll bring this with Wayne.  If he approves I'll put it on the update list.
The request will be for a menu option to swap the SUB and REV functions.
But remember there won't be an icon to indicate the status.  So once you set
it - it's up to the user to remember.


Sorry, that isn't what I was suggesting.

As far as I can tell, the SUB button is completely dead until the KRX3 
is installed. My suggestion was to put that wasted button to use in 
radios that don't have the KRX3, by making *both* SUB and REV do exactly 
the same.


The difference between the two buttons is their location. REV is good 
for two-handed tuning, but as Paul identified, a convenient one-handed 
'hold to reverse' function is vital for radios that don't have a second 
receiver. The SUB button would add that convenience.


When the KRX3 is installed, the SUB button has to go back to its labeled 
function - and that's fine too, because the 'hold to reverse' function 
is hardly needed at all (the FT-1000 doesn't even have it).


Swapping SUB and REV is a totally different issue... and I can't see 
much reason for wanting that.



73 from Ian GM3SEK




-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Doug Faunt N6TQS
+1-510-655-8604
Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2008 9:39 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade


What a great idea!!! :-)

Our messages crossed.

73, doug

  Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2008 16:33:12 +
  From: Ian White GM3SEK <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

  Paul Christensen wrote:
  >>  I also find it is much easier to hold the REV button and tune the
  >>VFO with one hand when working split on the Omni-VI than the K3.
  >
  >That's one K3 limitation that I have not experienced with most other
  >transceivers.   Of all the panel buttons, the placement of the REV
  >button is probably the most critical.   Other controls maybe touched up
  >periodically but when you're working split with a paddle in one hand,
  >split mode requires a very ergonomic one-hand operation.  I would have
  >preferred the K3's REV button placed either in place of the red Freq.
  >Entry button so that the right index finger can be used while using the
  >thumb and other fingers to find the Dx stations listening frequency --
  >or in the alternative, placement of the REV button on the lower left of
  >the main VFO so that the right thumb is used.  I am right-handed so I
  >am naturally biased.
  >
  >The Ducie guys with their K3s never ran into this dilemma as the DX
  >station. It manifests only for the mere mortals trying to work the DX
  >station.  Of course, when the sub-receiver is offered, this all becomes
  >moot point but not everyone will want the optional sub-rx.
  >

  A useful feature for K3s that don't have the sub-receiver would be to
  duplicate the REV function on the SUB button.
___


--

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[Elecraft] Missing pan head screws

[Mike Scott]

I had the same missing screw problem with my K3 kit and ended up using two
zinc pan head screws to secure the output transistors to the bottom panel.

I also was missing one of the bushings that are used to secure the two fans
for the 100 watt power amplifier. 

Missing three non critical parts isn't too bad I guess. I am sure they
strive for 100% accuracy but, stuff happens. I have requested the missing
items from Elecraft.


Mike Scott - AE6WA
Tarzana, CA (DM04 / near LA)
K3-100 #508/ KX1  #1311



From: G4ILO <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net

Luther B. Phillips wrote:
> 
> Only deviation from instructions was the use 
> of 2 zinc pan-head screws to secure the output transistors to the bottom 
> panel. (was short two black screws)
> 
I did the same when building mine, and so did a couple of other people
judging by a couple of recent posts on the Zerobeat K3 forum. I wonder how
common this is, and whether Elecraft has actually miscalculated the number
of screws required?

-
Julian, G4ILO  K3 s/n: 222 K2 s/n: 392
G4ILO's Shack: www.g4ilo.com
Zerobeat Ham Forums: www.zerobeat.net/smf

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RE: [Elecraft] OT: the value of "accurate measures" for ham radio

[AB7R]

Performing the TX Gain calibration is setting the gain constants for the MCU
by each band.  Once for the LPA at 5W and once for the KPA3 at 50W.  When
doing the calibration if you do not get an error message such as ERR TXG,
then you're good.  If there's a problem, you will see that error message.

73
Greg
AB7R


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Paul Christensen
Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2008 10:13 AM
To: DOUGLAS ZWIEBEL; Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] OT: the value of "accurate measures" for ham
radio


> For the life of me, I don't understand the apparent "need" (not just
> on the Elecraft reflector) for hams who want (demand) that their ham
> radio gear be so incredibly accurate (not to be confused with
> precise).

Doug, the issue is not attaining lab-grade accuracy with the K3.  The issue
is in understanding why some of us running out of calibration range in
approximately the same amounts.  As Greg just addressed, it's on their
priority list.

The other issue relates to my previous post: It would be nice to have a
better understanding of the RF Level Calibration procedure so we know the
alignment has been conducted correctly.

73,

Paul, W9AC



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Re: [Elecraft] OT: the value of "accurate measures" for ham radio

[Stewart Baker]

Succinctly put Paul. Anyway it's on the list.

73
Stewart G3RXQ
On Sun, 16 Mar 2008 13:13:10 -0400, Paul Christensen wrote:
>> For the life of me, I don't understand the apparent "need" (not
just
>> on the Elecraft reflector) for hams who want (demand) that
their ham
>> radio gear be so incredibly accurate (not to be confused with
>> precise).
>>
> Doug, the issue is not attaining lab-grade accuracy with the K3.
 The issue
> is in understanding why some of us running out of calibration
range in
> approximately the same amounts.  As Greg just addressed, it's on
their
> priority list.
>
> The other issue relates to my previous post: It would be nice to
have a
> better understanding of the RF Level Calibration procedure so we
know the
> alignment has been conducted correctly.
>
> 73,
>
> Paul, W9AC
>
>
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RE: [Elecraft] wattmeter calibration

[AD6XY - Mike]

For the record - I can't get it to work either. If I calibrate the wattmeter
to 5 Watts on 20m it is quite a long way out on several other bands -
ranging from about 3W to about 7W. I am comparing it with an HP8484A so that
might be an issue as it is a microwave head, but I think it goes down to
below 10MHz.

I also completely failed to calibrate the transverter output. This outputs
3mW but the power meter can not see it at all. More worryingly, it always
outputs 3mW regardless of the power setting. If I set the ALC off, then I
can adjust it via the gain setting . It appears there is something amiss
with power measurement.

-- 
View this message in context: 
http://www.nabble.com/wattmeter-calibration-tp16079415p16081501.html
Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

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[Elecraft] OT: the value of "accurate measures" for ham radio

[Mike Penkas]

Because this is a feature of the radio.  Although this is not a show stopper, 
it is a "feature" that needs slight tweaking bythe Elecraft team.  Ir ia a 
"feature" that like the filter gain adjustmentis not available on many other 
rigs and  we want it to work as spec'd so we have another bragging point!   
   Mike  WA8EBM 
**For
 the life of me, I don't understand the apparent "need" (not just
on the Elecraft reflector) for hams who want (demand) that their ham
radio gear be so incredibly accurate (not to be confused with
precise).  Other than, "it should be able to be more accurate," how
does this impact our operations?

I don't have a Bird watt meter or 'scope.  I have an off-the-shelf
Diamond SX200 watt meter that is probably 25 years old.  Here is what
I found:

0.5 watts on the K3 = 0.7 watts on the SX200 (5 watt scale, with 0.1
"ticks" below 1 watts)
5.0 watts on the K3 = 4.9 watts on the SX200 (5 watt scale)
20 watts on the K3 = 19.5 watts on the SX200 (20 watt scale)
50 watts on the K3 = 50 watts on the SX200 (200 watt scale)
100 watts on the K3 = "just over" 90 watts on the SX200 (200 watt scale).

This looks "good enough" for me.  Of what value is more accuracy?  I
honestly can't see any for ham radio operations.  I don't know which
of my two devices is more accurate, but I don't care.  If want to run
QRP at 1 watt or 5 watts, I'm right in there.  If I am driving an
external amp, do I care what the driving power really is?  I don't
think so.  As for 100 watts vs 90 watts, I don't know which one is
right (probably neither), but so what.  The guy on the other end of
the QSO will never tell (or even measure) the difference between 90
and 100 watts.  Does any of this actually matter?

If it does matter, please let me know why...I'd really like to know!

Thanks,
de Doug KR2Q
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Re: [Elecraft] OT: the value of "accurate measures" for ham radio

[Paul Christensen]

For the life of me, I don't understand the apparent "need" (not just
on the Elecraft reflector) for hams who want (demand) that their ham
radio gear be so incredibly accurate (not to be confused with
precise).


Doug, the issue is not attaining lab-grade accuracy with the K3.  The issue 
is in understanding why some of us running out of calibration range in 
approximately the same amounts.  As Greg just addressed, it's on their 
priority list.


The other issue relates to my previous post: It would be nice to have a 
better understanding of the RF Level Calibration procedure so we know the 
alignment has been conducted correctly.


73,

Paul, W9AC



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Re: [Elecraft] KPA1500 price?`

[Jim Wiley]

I seem to remember the KPA1500 being about $5500 to $6500 depending on 
whether it was a semi-kit or factory assembled.  But, that is at least 2 
years old, so I am confident there will be adjustments when the amps 
finally appear.  No info on the KPA800 - but if I remember correctly, it 
was about 2/3 the price of the higher power version. I am sure a note to 
Wayne or Eric would get you some better info and  a possible release 
date.  At one time, they were waiting on FCC  approval before they could 
sell them, then the K3 came along and distracted everybody.  The FCC 
tests should certainly be done by now, so once the K3 backlog gets 
worked down, I would expect to see something on the amps again.



- Jim, KL7CC
.

DOUGLAS ZWIEBEL wrote:

It's too long ago now and most certainly no longer valid (even if they
will ever be available), but does anyone recall the "mentioned" prices
for the KPA1500 and 800?

Thanks,
de Doug KR2Q
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[Elecraft] K3: power measurement

[Chris Gibson]

I am just getting back into enjoying my K3 #328 after a hospital stay, and
am confused by one aspect of the output power measurement. I suspect the
problem lies with me rather than the radio, but I feel it is worth asking
the question.

Suppose I set the power output using the PWR control at 30W. When I hold
TUNE both the radio and the external power meter indicate an output of near
enough 30W. However, if I transmit in PSK or RTTY both the radio and the
external power meter indicate around 10W. In particular, I seem to be unable
to get more than around 50W output in PSK or RTTY. I am fairly sure that I
was able to obtain a full 120W in these modes when I first used the K3. The
only change is that I have recently upgraded to the latest versions of the
firmware and DSP, without any apparent problems. I would be most grateful
for any advice.

-- 
73 Chris, MØPSK
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RE: [Elecraft] wattmeter calibration

[Greg]

This has been added to the list with high priority.  The range available
will be increased for both WTMTR HP and LP.

73
Greg
AB7R


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Todd Ruby
Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2008 7:10 AM
To: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: [Elecraft] wattmeter calibration


I finished assembly except for PA last week and went through the
calibration sequences. I am not able to have the wattmeter on the K3
match the output reading on the Bird wattmeter. Any suggestions?




73
de
todd
WB2ZAB

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[Elecraft] OT: the value of "accurate measures" for ham radio

[DOUGLAS ZWIEBEL]

For the life of me, I don't understand the apparent "need" (not just
on the Elecraft reflector) for hams who want (demand) that their ham
radio gear be so incredibly accurate (not to be confused with
precise).  Other than, "it should be able to be more accurate," how
does this impact our operations?

I don't have a Bird watt meter or 'scope.  I have an off-the-shelf
Diamond SX200 watt meter that is probably 25 years old.  Here is what
I found:

0.5 watts on the K3 = 0.7 watts on the SX200 (5 watt scale, with 0.1
"ticks" below 1 watts)
5.0 watts on the K3 = 4.9 watts on the SX200 (5 watt scale)
20 watts on the K3 = 19.5 watts on the SX200 (20 watt scale)
50 watts on the K3 = 50 watts on the SX200 (200 watt scale)
100 watts on the K3 = "just over" 90 watts on the SX200 (200 watt scale).

This looks "good enough" for me.  Of what value is more accuracy?  I
honestly can't see any for ham radio operations.  I don't know which
of my two devices is more accurate, but I don't care.  If want to run
QRP at 1 watt or 5 watts, I'm right in there.  If I am driving an
external amp, do I care what the driving power really is?  I don't
think so.  As for 100 watts vs 90 watts, I don't know which one is
right (probably neither), but so what.  The guy on the other end of
the QSO will never tell (or even measure) the difference between 90
and 100 watts.  Does any of this actually matter?

If it does matter, please let me know why...I'd really like to know!

Thanks,
de Doug KR2Q
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RE: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade

[dolfindon]

Hi
 
I also found the black 4-40 1/4 screws to be short. I had 8-10 of the 3/16 
black pan heads, 5 or 6 of the black flatheads and 5 or 6 silver 4-40 1/4 left 
over. I also had plenty of lockwashers. I just used three of the silver 4-40 
1/4 on the transistors in place of the black screws. I think Elecraft needs to 
increase the number on these 1/4 inch screws and maybe include a couple of 
spares like the rest of the black hardware. The case screws are the ones that 
tend to get lost when options or mods are installed so a few extra is always 
nice.
 
Don Brown
KD5NDB



> Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2008 09:23:35 -0700> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: 
> elecraft@mailman.qth.net> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade> > 
> > > Luther B. Phillips wrote:> > > > Only deviation from instructions was the 
> use > > of 2 zinc pan-head screws to secure the output transistors to the 
> bottom > > panel. (was short two black screws)> > > I did the same when 
> building mine, and so did a couple of other people> judging by a couple of 
> recent posts on the Zerobeat K3 forum. I wonder how> common this is, and 
> whether Elecraft has actually miscalculated the number> of screws required?> 
> > -> Julian, G4ILO K3 s/n: 222 K2 s/n: 392> G4ILO's Shack: www.g4ilo.com> 
> Zerobeat Ham Forums: www.zerobeat.net/smf> -- > View this message in context: 
> http://www.nabble.com/K3-10-For-Sale-or-Trade-tp16080516p16080801.html> Sent 
> from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.> > 
> ___> Elecraft mailing list> Post 
> to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net> You must be a subscriber to post to the list.> 
> Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.):> 
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Re: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade

[Paul Christensen]

  A useful feature for K3s that don't have the sub-receiver would be to 
  duplicate the REV function on the SUB button.




What a great idea!!! :-)


I'll second that motion.

Paul, W9AC
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RE: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade

[Greg]

I'll bring this with Wayne.  If he approves I'll put it on the update list.
The request will be for a menu option to swap the SUB and REV functions.
But remember there won't be an icon to indicate the status.  So once you set
it - it's up to the user to remember.

Greg


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Doug Faunt N6TQS
+1-510-655-8604
Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2008 9:39 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade


What a great idea!!! :-)

Our messages crossed.

73, doug

   Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2008 16:33:12 +
   From: Ian White GM3SEK <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

   Paul Christensen wrote:
   >>  I also find it is much easier to hold the REV button and tune the
   >>VFO with one hand when working split on the Omni-VI than the K3.
   >
   >That's one K3 limitation that I have not experienced with most other
   >transceivers.   Of all the panel buttons, the placement of the REV
   >button is probably the most critical.   Other controls maybe touched up
   >periodically but when you're working split with a paddle in one hand,
   >split mode requires a very ergonomic one-hand operation.  I would have
   >preferred the K3's REV button placed either in place of the red Freq.
   >Entry button so that the right index finger can be used while using the
   >thumb and other fingers to find the Dx stations listening frequency --
   >or in the alternative, placement of the REV button on the lower left of
   >the main VFO so that the right thumb is used.  I am right-handed so I
   >am naturally biased.
   >
   >The Ducie guys with their K3s never ran into this dilemma as the DX
   >station. It manifests only for the mere mortals trying to work the DX
   >station.  Of course, when the sub-receiver is offered, this all becomes
   >moot point but not everyone will want the optional sub-rx.
   >

   A useful feature for K3s that don't have the sub-receiver would be to
   duplicate the REV function on the SUB button.
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[Elecraft] K3/10 4sale: why so cheap?

[DOUGLAS ZWIEBEL]

Gee whiz...why did you discount it?  You could probably make a tiny
profit as lots of guys are drooling for one and are willing to ante up
to beat the ~4 month wait.

I think you made an error in judgment with that offering price.  Oh
well!  I'm sure you'll sell it under an hour.

de Doug KR2Q
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RE: [Elecraft] K3 Firmware downloads

[Bill NY9H]

much like other radio/s...
You will not find the necessity of " going back"  to retrieve a stable version.

None of the changes has had me EVER thinking I wanted to go backwards.

bill.


At 11:57 PM 3/15/2008, Dick Dievendorff wrote:

Each firmware version completely replaces its predecessor. There is no need
to load each intermediate version, just the most recent available.

Dick, K6KR


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Re: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade

[Doug Faunt N6TQS +1-510-655-8604]

What a great idea!!! :-)

Our messages crossed.

73, doug

   Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2008 16:33:12 +
   From: Ian White GM3SEK <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

   Paul Christensen wrote:
   >>  I also find it is much easier to hold the REV button and tune the 
   >>VFO with one hand when working split on the Omni-VI than the K3.
   >
   >That's one K3 limitation that I have not experienced with most other 
   >transceivers.   Of all the panel buttons, the placement of the REV 
   >button is probably the most critical.   Other controls maybe touched up 
   >periodically but when you're working split with a paddle in one hand, 
   >split mode requires a very ergonomic one-hand operation.  I would have 
   >preferred the K3's REV button placed either in place of the red Freq. 
   >Entry button so that the right index finger can be used while using the 
   >thumb and other fingers to find the Dx stations listening frequency -- 
   >or in the alternative, placement of the REV button on the lower left of 
   >the main VFO so that the right thumb is used.  I am right-handed so I 
   >am naturally biased.
   >
   >The Ducie guys with their K3s never ran into this dilemma as the DX 
   >station. It manifests only for the mere mortals trying to work the DX 
   >station.  Of course, when the sub-receiver is offered, this all becomes 
   >moot point but not everyone will want the optional sub-rx.
   >

   A useful feature for K3s that don't have the sub-receiver would be to 
   duplicate the REV function on the SUB button.
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Re: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade

[Doug Faunt N6TQS +1-510-655-8604]

   From: "Paul Christensen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2008 12:07:31 -0400

   >  I also find it is much easier to hold the REV button and tune the VFO 
   > with one hand when working split on the Omni-VI than the K3.

   That's one K3 limitation that I have not experienced with most other 
   transceivers.   Of all the panel buttons, the placement of the REV button is 
   probably the most critical.   Other controls maybe touched up periodically 
   but when you're working split with a paddle in one hand, split mode requires 
   a very ergonomic one-hand operation.  I would have preferred the K3's REV 
   button placed either in place of the red Freq. Entry button so that the 
   right index finger can be used while using the thumb and other fingers to 
   find the Dx stations listening frequency -- or in the alternative, placement 
   of the REV button on the lower left of the main VFO so that the right thumb 
   is used.  I am right-handed so I am naturally biased.

What about reassigning the "Sub" button to REV if no subreceiver is
installed?

I tune left-handed, but the middle three fingers are adequate for
that, and reassignment of the SUB button would mean the left-over
digit could be used for the REVERSE function, with either hand.

73, doug

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Re: [Elecraft] wattmeter calibration

[Stewart Baker]

On receive 13.7V drops to 13.2V @ 50W.

73
Stewart G3RXQ
On Sun, 16 Mar 2008 09:10:59 -0800, Robert Tellefsen wrote:
> Hi Stewart
> Just out of curiousity, what is the supply voltage
> to your K3 at the K3?
> 73, Bob N6WG
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Stewart Baker" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "Mike Penkas" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

> Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2008 7:18 AM
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] wattmeter calibration
>
>
> Using 3 different pieces of test equipment to measure the RF
> output power, together with a precision dummy load VSWR <1.02, I
> am unable to get more than 44W out at a requested level of 50W.
> WMTR setting is flat out at 30. At 120W I get 106W out.
>
> Raised this with Support and Wayne and they are looking into it.
>
> Also the gain calibration routine in the manual is very sparse
and
> confusing.
>
> 73
> Stewart G3RXQ
> On Sun, 16 Mar 2008 10:45:14 -0400, Mike Penkas wrote:
>> Same here with the wattmeter calibration.  Using a new Array
> Solutions PowerMaster w/
>> 5% accuracy and when I get down to 30 on the calibration it is
> still just under 5 watts
>> or around 45-50 watts.  Same whether on dummy load or perfectly
> matched antenna. And-
>> yes I have done the transmitter gain calibration.
>> Mike WA8EBM
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>
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Re: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade

[Ian White GM3SEK]

Paul Christensen wrote:
 I also find it is much easier to hold the REV button and tune the 
VFO with one hand when working split on the Omni-VI than the K3.


That's one K3 limitation that I have not experienced with most other 
transceivers.   Of all the panel buttons, the placement of the REV 
button is probably the most critical.   Other controls maybe touched up 
periodically but when you're working split with a paddle in one hand, 
split mode requires a very ergonomic one-hand operation.  I would have 
preferred the K3's REV button placed either in place of the red Freq. 
Entry button so that the right index finger can be used while using the 
thumb and other fingers to find the Dx stations listening frequency -- 
or in the alternative, placement of the REV button on the lower left of 
the main VFO so that the right thumb is used.  I am right-handed so I 
am naturally biased.


The Ducie guys with their K3s never ran into this dilemma as the DX 
station. It manifests only for the mere mortals trying to work the DX 
station.  Of course, when the sub-receiver is offered, this all becomes 
moot point but not everyone will want the optional sub-rx.




A useful feature for K3s that don't have the sub-receiver would be to 
duplicate the REV function on the SUB button.



--

73 from Ian GM3SEK
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[Elecraft] K3 Scanning, no 6M

[Mike Scott]

I just started to use the scanning capability of the K3. After scanning the
17M CW segment with some success, I thought, wow lets go scan 6M CW segment.

I get an error saying scanning not allowed on this band. I can't think of a
better use for scanning than 6M to find an opening.

Now I wonder why scanning doesn't work on 6M, I didn't find anything in the
manual.

Mike Scott - AE6WA
Tarzana, CA (DM04 / near LA)
K3-100 #508/ KX1  #1311


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Re: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade

[G4ILO]

Luther B. Phillips wrote:
> 
> Only deviation from instructions was the use 
> of 2 zinc pan-head screws to secure the output transistors to the bottom 
> panel. (was short two black screws)
> 
I did the same when building mine, and so did a couple of other people
judging by a couple of recent posts on the Zerobeat K3 forum. I wonder how
common this is, and whether Elecraft has actually miscalculated the number
of screws required?

-
Julian, G4ILO  K3 s/n: 222 K2 s/n: 392
G4ILO's Shack: www.g4ilo.com
Zerobeat Ham Forums: www.zerobeat.net/smf
-- 
View this message in context: 
http://www.nabble.com/K3-10-For-Sale-or-Trade-tp16080516p16080801.html
Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

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Re: [Elecraft] wattmeter calibration

[Robert Tellefsen]

Hi Stewart
Just out of curiousity, what is the supply voltage
to your K3 at the K3?
73, Bob N6WG

- Original Message - 
From: "Stewart Baker" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Mike Penkas" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; 
Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2008 7:18 AM
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] wattmeter calibration


Using 3 different pieces of test equipment to measure the RF 
output power, together with a precision dummy load VSWR <1.02, I 
am unable to get more than 44W out at a requested level of 50W.
WMTR setting is flat out at 30. At 120W I get 106W out.

Raised this with Support and Wayne and they are looking into it.

Also the gain calibration routine in the manual is very sparse and 
confusing.

73
Stewart G3RXQ
On Sun, 16 Mar 2008 10:45:14 -0400, Mike Penkas wrote:
> Same here with the wattmeter calibration.  Using a new Array 
Solutions PowerMaster w/
> 5% accuracy and when I get down to 30 on the calibration it is 
still just under 5 watts
> or around 45-50 watts.  Same whether on dummy load or perfectly 
matched antenna. And-
> yes I have done the transmitter gain calibration.
> Mike WA8EBM
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Re: [Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade

[Paul Christensen]

 I also find it is much easier to hold the REV button and tune the VFO 
with one hand when working split on the Omni-VI than the K3.


That's one K3 limitation that I have not experienced with most other 
transceivers.   Of all the panel buttons, the placement of the REV button is 
probably the most critical.   Other controls maybe touched up periodically 
but when you're working split with a paddle in one hand, split mode requires 
a very ergonomic one-hand operation.  I would have preferred the K3's REV 
button placed either in place of the red Freq. Entry button so that the 
right index finger can be used while using the thumb and other fingers to 
find the Dx stations listening frequency -- or in the alternative, placement 
of the REV button on the lower left of the main VFO so that the right thumb 
is used.  I am right-handed so I am naturally biased.


The Ducie guys with their K3s never ran into this dilemma as the DX station. 
It manifests only for the mere mortals trying to work the DX station.  Of 
course, when the sub-receiver is offered, this all becomes a moot point but 
not everyone will want the optional sub-rx.


Paul, W9AC 


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[Elecraft] [QRP-L] Palm Paddle Question - How do you get the top off?

[Bruce Beford]

Norm-

Look on the bottom of the paddle casing (once you remove it from it's base).
You will see a round "button" near the front of the unit. While pressing in
this button, push the paddle assembly from the rear, where the wire
connects. This will allow the mechanism to slide out the front for
adjustment.

-Bruce N1RX

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[Elecraft] Elecraft Equipment Covers

[Jim Cox]

I just received my elecraft equipment covers from Rose Kopp.  The 
craftsmanship is very nice, I highly recommend her.  Jim K4JAF


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Re: [Elecraft] [K2] : Laptop UPS

[Robert Tellefsen]

Raymond
I have an IBM Thinkpad with the same problem.
I replaced the IBM switching power supply
with an older analog power supply and the
problem went away (at least from power
supply noise).  The laptop still generates some
noise itself, but much less than the power
supply did.
Good luck and 73
Bob N6WG

- Original Message -
From: "Raymond METZGER" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2008 12:05 AM
Subject: [Elecraft] [K2] : Laptop UPS


> Hi Elecrafters,
>
>
>
> I am interested to know what solution can be used to avoid the noise
> generated by the 220 V AC (OEM) UPS of my recent Dell Latitude
Laptop.
>
> For the time being, I can only use the laptop with my K2/100 if the
laptop
> is powered by its internal battery.
>
>
>
> Raymond METZGER
>
> F4FNT
>
> K2 5,636 - K3 expected at month end (ordered 8 September,
"Katiegram"
> received last Friday)
>
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[Elecraft] K3/10 For Sale or Trade

[Luther Phillips]

I've decided to offer up K3/10 #495 for sale or possible trade. Rig works as 
advertised, has the latest firmware, and is in like-new condition. The only 
installed option is the 5-pole 500 Hz roofing filter. Built from kit 
observing all ESD precautions. Only deviation from instructions was the use 
of 2 zinc pan-head screws to secure the output transistors to the bottom 
panel. (was short two black screws) Manuals, paperwork, and power cord 
included, of course.


Will sell outright for $1,750 (double-boxed shipping and insurance included 
to US only). Digital pics available on request.


Would also be very interested in swapping for a loaded Ten-Tec Omni-VI+ 
(Model 564) in like condition.


Why sell? It's strictly a matter of personal preference, mainly around 
ergonomics issues. The Omni-VI rigs have been my main choice for some time. 
There's no doubt that the K3 has better selectivity, and probably does a 
better job of digging out the weak ones. But, I miss the big display, knobs, 
analog S-meter, one-button pushes for band changes, band stacking, bandwith, 
etc. I also find it is much easier to hold the REV button and tune the VFO 
with one hand when working split on the Omni-VI than the K3.


If interested, please reply direct to: [EMAIL PROTECTED]  to hold down list 
traffic. I subscribe to the digest, so will not see list replies for some 
period of time.


Tnx & 73,
Luther N4UW

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Re: [Elecraft] Don (W3FPR) is Home !!!

[Tom AK2B]

I’m happy to hear everything is ok. When you get right down to it, Don is the
glue that holds this forum together. 

Tom, AK2B


Tom Hammond-2 wrote:
> 
> Just received from Don Wilhelm's XYL, Nancy:
> 
> Don had a kind of a bad day Friday (dehydrated) but he was chomping at the
> bit to come home Saturday and finally around 8:30 PM they let him. He is
> in
> great spirits, has only tiny and manageable pain, and generally like he
> was
> before, except for a bunch of metal staples and without the cancer. I
> printed out the notes you sent with all your get well wishes and prayers
> which pleased him very much. He will probably be at his computer this
> morning but still will have to rest a lot. The brain goes a mile a minute,
> the body says to go lay down. Thank you all for supporting him and
> encouraging me.
> 
> Nancy
> 
> 
> 
> 
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> 

-- 
View this message in context: 
http://www.nabble.com/Don-%28W3FPR%29-is-Home-%21%21%21-tp16078484p16080328.html
Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

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[Elecraft] OT:I am now home

[Don Wilhelm]

I have returned home and all is as good as expected for 6 days after 
major abdominal surgery.  Initial reports from my surgeon indicate that 
he was able to remove the cancer tissue while disturbing only a small 
area of the surrounding tissue.  I still have a lot of recovery to do, 
but I am thankful that the first steps have gone smoothly and pain is at 
a minimum without the use of medication.


I want to thank all of you who sent their good wishes and prayers for me 
during the last week, all are greatly appreciated, and the number was 
overwhelming, and I am sorry that I cannot respond to each 
individually.  I am not yet downloading the reflector comments, so I 
will miss any comments you might make to the reflector for perhaps the 
next week.  Direct email is the best way to reach me, and I will respond 
as my awake time and energy level allows.  Right now, I need a lot more 
than my normal time for rest and healing, but I will get back to normal 
soon.


73,
Don W3FPR


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RE: [Elecraft] wattmeter calibration

[dolfindon]

Hi
 
Same here. I also ran out of range with a setting of 30. I usually use a OHR 
WM2 and the OHR 100 watt dummy load modified with a 20 db pad output. However 
the K3 seems to work fine and the internal wattmeter is accurate at 100 watts 
 
 
Don Brown
KD5NDB



> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net> Subject: Re: 
> [Elecraft] wattmeter calibration> Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2008 10:34:30 -0400> CC: 
> > > Todd brings up a good point. I ran out of range while calibrating at the 
> 5W > and 50W level.. I got pretty close but ran out of adjustable range.> > 
> Also, I am confused as to what is happening with the RF Gain Calibration > 
> procedure. The routine calls for setting power level at a pre-set level > and 
> running through the bands. But how is the value adjusted and saved ? > And if 
> TUNE is depressed later, are the saved values affected? Or, is it > the fact 
> that the RF Gain procedure is conducted while in CONFIG that the > those 
> settings are saved? It's just a very strange procedure and I don't > 
> understand how a relationship is established between the displayed power and 
> > RF Gain setting during setup. Can anyone explain? Tnx!> > Paul, W9AC> > > 
> - Original Message - > From: "Todd Ruby" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>> To: 
> > Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2008 10:09 AM> Subject: 
> [Elecraft] wattmeter calibration> > > >I finished assembly except for PA last 
> week and went through the > >calibration sequences. I am not able to have the 
> wattmeter on the K3 match > >the output reading on the Bird wattmeter. Any 
> suggestions?> >> >> >> >> > 73> > de> > todd> > 
> WB2ZAB___
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Re: [Elecraft] wattmeter calibration

[Stewart Baker]

Using 3 different pieces of test equipment to measure the RF
output power, together with a precision dummy load VSWR <1.02, I
am unable to get more than 44W out at a requested level of 50W.
WMTR setting is flat out at 30. At 120W I get 106W out.

Raised this with Support and Wayne and they are looking into it.

Also the gain calibration routine in the manual is very sparse and
confusing.

73
Stewart G3RXQ
On Sun, 16 Mar 2008 10:45:14 -0400, Mike Penkas wrote:
> Same here with the wattmeter calibration.  Using a new Array
Solutions PowerMaster w/
> 5% accuracy and when I get down to 30 on the calibration it is
still just under 5 watts
> or around 45-50 watts.  Same whether on dummy load or perfectly
matched antenna. And-
> yes I have done the transmitter gain calibration.
> Mike WA8EBM
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[Elecraft] RE: K2 For Sale

[Mike]

Must sell my new K2, #6363.  Built & professionally aligned, with SSB & ATU 
modules, will also include hand mic. Never used, $950.  Need to sell asap.
  Mike Pierce
  KD8DVV
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: [Elecraft] [META] Nabble threads?

[Rick Kunath]

David Woolley wrote:

Outlook is possibly a particular problem, as it can thread Usenet but 
not email.


Outlook can thread email messages. It isn't set to do that by default 
though. And most people don't have it set that way.


It's a lousy excuse of an email client, as is Outlook Express, but 
people still use it a lot, mainly from not knowing how much easier a 
decent client makes dealing with email, and large volumes of email too.


Multiple threads on different subjects, all linked to other threads 
occur when someone does as was mentioned up the thread, they hijack an 
existing thread by replying and changing the subject. Never do this. 
Copy and paste the list address into a new message, or add the list 
email address to your address book. Either way start a new message and 
you'll have a new thread.


Another way message threading gets messed up is folks using the digest 
method of getting the list. Basically, if you are on digest and you 
reply, you are breaking the thread as your digest message is it's own 
thread. So for digest list readers, just don't reply, unless you want to 
break the existing message thread, which you (in digest mode) are not a 
part of. Go to Nabble and properly reply to keep the existing thread 
intact, or set your list preferences to get individual emails. Then a 
reply is to the actual thread.


Once you see how an email client that can properly manage list and other 
messages, thread them properly, separate and archive them into separate 
folders, and generally make your email life easier, you'll wonder how 
you ever did without it for so long. I get thousands of email messages 
each day on several accounts, and without a decent email client, I could 
never manage them all.


Rick Kunath, k9ao
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Re: [Elecraft] Where's the bass?

[Paul Christensen]

No, it's not an issue of "what communications receivers do".  The Orion
passband is flat down to 50hz.


Agreed, Barry.  While not considered "traditional" communications audio,
expanding Rx audio bandwidth down to 50 Hz is a whole new listening
experience.

I also notice that in CW, the K3's Rx audio bandwidth cannot be adjusted to
match the greater bandwidth offered in SSB.  Hopefully, that too will be
addressed later.  On a clear and open band, I enjoy listening to CW with Rx
bandwidths of 3.6K or more.

Paul, W9AC 


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