RE: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices

[Mark Dodge]

Crap, I'm moving to Seattle 


Mark Dodge
MD Computers
602-421-0329 
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of jeff.lane
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 4:57 PM
To: The Hardware List
Subject: Re: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices

Spokane


- Original Message -
From: "Mark Dodge" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "'The Hardware List'" 
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 2:15 PM
Subject: RE: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices


> You don't live in Washington do you?
>
>
> Mark Dodge
> MD Computers
> 602-421-0329
> -Original Message-
> BTW. Our new piece of crap Governor just signed a 9.5 cent increase in our
> state gas taxes..highest in the US..again! OH..$6.00 per 
> carton
> increase for cigarettes, $6.00 per gallon booze, reinitiated the only 
> estate
> taxes, and a whole lot more. We really need that right now!

Re: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices

[jeff.lane]

My next door neighbor just moved up there.

Small world


- Original Message - 
From: "Julian Hale" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: "The Hardware List" 
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 10:37 PM
Subject: Re: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices



Hey, no shit... I just live a little north of you.  I'm in Elk.

Julian

At 04:57 PM 8/17/2005, jeff.lane wrote:

Spokane

- Original Message - From: "Mark Dodge" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "'The Hardware List'" 
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 2:15 PM
Subject: RE: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices


You don't live in Washington do you?





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Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
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Re: [H] Hard Drive Failure

[warpmedia]

If it's hot to the touch, wait for it to cool & try again to backup the 
data.


rls wrote:

For the condition you describe - you would have to send it back to a service
that would actually remove the platters and install them in another drive
casing. The cost for that would be steep and probably a month turn around.

Re: [H] Gas prices

[Eli Allen]

There is no known way of using man made fusion reactors.

- Original Message - 

Helium3, however, which could be harvest and we know how the process 
works,

is fairly to very viable.

Re: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices

[Julian Hale]

Hey, no shit... I just live a little north of you.  I'm in Elk.

Julian

At 04:57 PM 8/17/2005, jeff.lane wrote:

Spokane

- Original Message - From: "Mark Dodge" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "'The Hardware List'" 
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 2:15 PM
Subject: RE: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices


You don't live in Washington do you?

Re: [H] Gas prices

[jeff.lane]

Well said.


- Original Message - 
From: "Bill Cohane" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: "The Hardware List" 
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 6:45 PM
Subject: Re: [H] Gas prices



At 17:00 08/17/05, jeff.lane wrote:
Like cold fusion? There were a couple of scientists, in Utah, several 
years ago that claimed they had made cold fusion work. That is clean, 
safe, perpetual, fusion .I don't recall their names but they had the 
scientific world standing on it's head for sometime until they 
discovered that it was not completely perfect, i.e., infinitely 
renewable. My question would be just how long did this run without 
renewal? After the idea of infinity went away nobody heard anything 
about these guys. If they had discovered pure cold fusion we could 
power a whole city in a clean reactor no bigger that a service 
station, if that big. The pellet to run a car thingall of it 
runs forever. Anybody think this won't or can't happen, or for that 
matter, may already be there???


Most scientists consider Cold Fusion to have been a fiasco. Stanley 
Pons and Martin Fleischmann (the two Univ. of Utah Chemists who claimed 
to have first observed it) never could explain the physics behind their 
"discovery". (Neutrons are always released by fusion reactions and none 
were ever detected with this so called cold fusion. In addition, most 
other scientists trying to verify the Univ. of Utah  experiments failed 
to detect any energy release. The whole mess was probably due to the 
unreliability of closed calorimetry experiments.)


So Physicists have pretty much debunked cold fusion. Interestingly, the 
DOE (Dept. of Energy) still occasionally gets suckered by cold fusion 
claims. These guys still seem willing to spend our tax dollars on 
research grants for things like perpetual motion machines, Kirlian 
photographs of the human aura, "zero point energy", "ball lightning", 
"magnet therapy", etc. The most frequent warning sign of voodoo science 
is that claims are pitched directly to the media, like the way the two 
scientists from the Univ. of Utah released their "results", instead of 
in scientific journals where they can be reviewed and tested by 
reputable scientists.


That said, Cold Fusion still has believers, but not much confirmation.

Regards,
Bill 




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Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
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Re: Re: [H] Gas prices

[Analyst]

On 17 Aug 2005 at 18:29, Greg Sevart wrote:

> ...but given that we produce something like ~40% of our oil
> DOMESTICALLY, and the majority of the remainder comes from Canada,
> Mexico, and Venezuela, we wouldn't need to replace 100% of our oil
> consumption with oil from the ANWR. 

Even if we only replaced 50% of are imported oil, that would merely double the 
six months to a year.



> When I was researching the issue back in spring of 2002, the figure
> that I heard was that ANWR oil could COMPLETELY REPLACE middle-eastern
> imports for a period of 30 years. 

I seriously doubt that. Remember the rest of Energy Secretary Abraham's quote:

"Americans should not overestimate this region's ability to provide the nation 
with energy independence"

Something I doubt he would say if the region could "COMPLETELY REPLACE 
middle-eastern imports for a period of 30 years"



> That being said, I have mixed feelings on drilling in the ANWR. It
> would be 5-12 years before any useful oil came from it 

Not to mention that because it would involve drilling trough permafrost, it 
would be North of $80/barrel oil or more. That won't help us with the price at 
all.


Vince

Different take on RE: [H] Inexpensive blank DVD media

[rls]

My advice for those that burn a number of disks -->

Buy Good or Great 8X media - the cost savings from going to 16X to 8X more
that offsets buying the great media.

Then buy another DVD burner --> at $50 you will offset the media cost
differential.

Then either copy to both burners at once - or run different copy jobs on
both burners at the same time. I do that 95% of the time and have yet to
burn a coaster as a result.

Or I can rip on one and copy on the other. 

All I use is TY or Verb. - 50/50 8X and 16X but in so doing I have never
unhappy with an 8X burn speed as I have been using the dual DVD option for
over a year.

Since I currently have another DVD burner laying around, I just might toss
that in the case too - would like to see how it burns off the SATA side.

Again - at $50 I don't know that it's a big deal.

RE: Re: [H] Gas prices

[Michael Decker]

Nope, drilling in the ANWR was dropped from the energy bill before it
passed.  (Drilling for/pumping oil has been permitted in other parts of
Alaska, mostly the North Slope area, for a long time.)

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Ben Ruset
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 4:59 PM
To: The Hardware List
Subject: Re: Re: [H] Gas prices

Didn't drilling in Alaska just pass?

I consider myself an environmentalist and I support drilling in Alaska. 

Re: [H] Gas prices

[Ben Ruset]

Ball lightning is real - I have seen it.

Bill Cohane wrote:

So Physicists have pretty much debunked cold fusion. Interestingly, the 
DOE (Dept. of Energy) still occasionally gets suckered by cold fusion 
claims. These guys still seem willing to spend our tax dollars on 
research grants for things like perpetual motion machines, Kirlian 
photographs of the human aura, "zero point energy", "ball lightning", 

RE: [H] Gas prices

[nobozoz]

As of this afternoon, LA, CA area average unleaded regular gas price is
$2.77 per gal.

_jim

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Rick Quilhot
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 7:04 PM
To: 'The Hardware List'
Subject: RE: [H] Gas prices


2.799 Jackson, Michigan

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mark Dodge
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 5:05 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 'The Hardware List'
Subject: RE: [H] Gas prices


2.53 here in Phoenix


Mark Dodge
MD Computers
602-421-0329
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Bobby Heid
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 9:24 AM
To: 'The Hardware List'
Subject: RE: [H] Gas prices

I paid $2.45US/gallon on Monday.

Bobby

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Thane
Sherrington
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 12:15 PM
To: hardware@hardwaregroup.com
Subject: [H] Gas prices


Our gas prices climbed $0.06 per litre yesterday, so we are at $4.27 US
per gallon now.  Just wondering what you're paying down in there.

T

Re: Re: [H] Gas prices

[Wayne Johnson]

At 09:45 PM 8/17/2005, FORC5 typed:

drug cartel ought to be looking here :{)
new black market


There was a James Bond movie where they put some drug into gasoline then 
distilled the gasoline once it arrived at it's final destination. I wonder 
if that added horsepower but I would be afraid to put anything in gasoline 
these days for fear of running the liquid gold. ;-)



--+--
   Wayne D. Johnson
Ashland, OH, USA 44805
 

RE: [H] Gas prices

[Chris Reeves]

Helium3, however, which could be harvest and we know how the process works,
is fairly to very viable.

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Bill Cohane
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 8:45 PM
To: The Hardware List
Subject: Re: [H] Gas prices

At 17:00 08/17/05, jeff.lane wrote:
>Like cold fusion? There were a couple of scientists, in Utah, several 
>years ago that claimed they had made cold fusion work. That is clean, 
>safe, perpetual, fusion .I don't recall their names but they had the 
>scientific world standing on it's head for sometime until they 
>discovered that it was not completely perfect, i.e., infinitely 
>renewable. My question would be just how long did this run without 
>renewal? After the idea of infinity went away nobody heard anything 
>about these guys. If they had discovered pure cold fusion we could 
>power a whole city in a clean reactor no bigger that a service 
>station, if that big. The pellet to run a car thingall of it 
>runs forever. Anybody think this won't or can't happen, or for that 
>matter, may already be there???

Most scientists consider Cold Fusion to have been a fiasco. Stanley 
Pons and Martin Fleischmann (the two Univ. of Utah Chemists who claimed 
to have first observed it) never could explain the physics behind their 
"discovery". (Neutrons are always released by fusion reactions and none 
were ever detected with this so called cold fusion. In addition, most 
other scientists trying to verify the Univ. of Utah  experiments failed 
to detect any energy release. The whole mess was probably due to the 
unreliability of closed calorimetry experiments.)

So Physicists have pretty much debunked cold fusion. Interestingly, the 
DOE (Dept. of Energy) still occasionally gets suckered by cold fusion 
claims. These guys still seem willing to spend our tax dollars on 
research grants for things like perpetual motion machines, Kirlian 
photographs of the human aura, "zero point energy", "ball lightning", 
"magnet therapy", etc. The most frequent warning sign of voodoo science 
is that claims are pitched directly to the media, like the way the two 
scientists from the Univ. of Utah released their "results", instead of 
in scientific journals where they can be reviewed and tested by 
reputable scientists.

That said, Cold Fusion still has believers, but not much confirmation.

Regards,
Bill 

RE: [H] Gas prices

[Rick Quilhot]

2.799 Jackson, Michigan

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mark Dodge
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 5:05 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 'The Hardware List'
Subject: RE: [H] Gas prices


2.53 here in Phoenix 


Mark Dodge
MD Computers
602-421-0329 
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Bobby Heid
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 9:24 AM
To: 'The Hardware List'
Subject: RE: [H] Gas prices

I paid $2.45US/gallon on Monday.

Bobby

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Thane
Sherrington
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 12:15 PM
To: hardware@hardwaregroup.com
Subject: [H] Gas prices


Our gas prices climbed $0.06 per litre yesterday, so we are at $4.27 US
per gallon now.  Just wondering what you're paying down in there.

T

Re: [H] Gas prices

[Bill Cohane]

At 17:00 08/17/05, jeff.lane wrote:
Like cold fusion? There were a couple of scientists, in Utah, several 
years ago that claimed they had made cold fusion work. That is clean, 
safe, perpetual, fusion .I don't recall their names but they had the 
scientific world standing on it's head for sometime until they 
discovered that it was not completely perfect, i.e., infinitely 
renewable. My question would be just how long did this run without 
renewal? After the idea of infinity went away nobody heard anything 
about these guys. If they had discovered pure cold fusion we could 
power a whole city in a clean reactor no bigger that a service 
station, if that big. The pellet to run a car thingall of it 
runs forever. Anybody think this won't or can't happen, or for that 
matter, may already be there???


Most scientists consider Cold Fusion to have been a fiasco. Stanley 
Pons and Martin Fleischmann (the two Univ. of Utah Chemists who claimed 
to have first observed it) never could explain the physics behind their 
"discovery". (Neutrons are always released by fusion reactions and none 
were ever detected with this so called cold fusion. In addition, most 
other scientists trying to verify the Univ. of Utah  experiments failed 
to detect any energy release. The whole mess was probably due to the 
unreliability of closed calorimetry experiments.)


So Physicists have pretty much debunked cold fusion. Interestingly, the 
DOE (Dept. of Energy) still occasionally gets suckered by cold fusion 
claims. These guys still seem willing to spend our tax dollars on 
research grants for things like perpetual motion machines, Kirlian 
photographs of the human aura, "zero point energy", "ball lightning", 
"magnet therapy", etc. The most frequent warning sign of voodoo science 
is that claims are pitched directly to the media, like the way the two 
scientists from the Univ. of Utah released their "results", instead of 
in scientific journals where they can be reviewed and tested by 
reputable scientists.


That said, Cold Fusion still has believers, but not much confirmation.

Regards,
Bill 

Re: Re: [H] Gas prices

[FORC5]

drug cartel ought to be looking here :{)
new black market
At 05:00 PM 8/17/2005, Analyst Poked the stick with:
To really get your blood
boiling, gasoline in Venezuela is only 25 cents a gallon.
Anybody want to captain a tanker full of gasoline back to the U.S. ?
(Talk about ridin' a rocket)

Vince

-- 
Tallyho ! ]:8)
Taglines below !
--
Imagine the silence if everyone said only what they know.

RE: [H] Hard Drive Failure

[rls]

For the condition you describe - you would have to send it back to a service
that would actually remove the platters and install them in another drive
casing. The cost for that would be steep and probably a month turn around.

"-Original Message-
"From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:hardware-
"[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Brian Weeden
"Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 8:26 PM
"To: hwg
"Subject: [H] Hard Drive Failure
"
"  I came home after I was away for a few days to find a SATA HD in one
"of my PCs not responding.  On reboot the BIOS hangs trying to find the
"drives and then eventually gives up and doesn't detect it.
"
"When I got the case open I knew it was bad.  It makes a clicking sound
"repeating every couple seconds and with my hands on the case I can
"feel something inside hitting the casing.  And when it powers down it
"has that weird gyroscope effect where the spinning part causes angular
"momentum.
"
"I am pretty sure I am screwed with this and it is dead.  But since I
"had 150GB of video and audio data on it I would like to make sure.
"Would the symptoms I describe generally be attributed to a serious
"mechanical failure that is not recoverable?
"--
"Brian

Re: [H] Gas prices

[Al]

Thane Sherrington <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Too bad the US wouldn't kick the shit out of Saudi Arabia then, and get the 
> price here down to a better level.

You say that so nonchalantly, like the lives involved are worthless.

I don't understand,
Al

RE: [H] Sygate scoops up Sygate... (Symantec scoops up Sygate)

[Thane Sherrington]

At 09:13 PM 17/08/2005, James Maki wrote:

(I corrected the subject line)

I guess this will be the end of a free version of Sygate Personal Firewall 
and the beginning of the product being screwed up.. Has Symantec ever 
acquired any product and then made real improvements? (Norton, Central 
Point Software, Winfax, Ghost, etc.).


Nope.  They are a destroyer.  Worse than MS, I think.

T 

Re: [H] Gas prices

[Thane Sherrington]

At 05:17 PM 17/08/2005, Zulfiqar Naushad wrote:

Gas prices expensive???

Here in Saudi Arabia the state price (i.e. nothing less or more than
the state price is available at any gas station) is .90 halalas (cent
equivalent of a riyal(dollar)) per liter.
i.e 1 Gallon = 90 US cents.
BWAHAHAHAH!!!
Almost every car here in Saudi is a V6 or a V8!!!
They love suburbans and expeditions here!!!


Too bad the US wouldn't kick the shit out of Saudi Arabia then, and get the 
price here down to a better level.


T 

[H] Hard Drive Failure

[Brian Weeden]

  I came home after I was away for a few days to find a SATA HD in one
of my PCs not responding.  On reboot the BIOS hangs trying to find the
drives and then eventually gives up and doesn't detect it.

When I got the case open I knew it was bad.  It makes a clicking sound
repeating every couple seconds and with my hands on the case I can
feel something inside hitting the casing.  And when it powers down it
has that weird gyroscope effect where the spinning part causes angular
momentum.

I am pretty sure I am screwed with this and it is dead.  But since I
had 150GB of video and audio data on it I would like to make sure. 
Would the symptoms I describe generally be attributed to a serious
mechanical failure that is not recoverable?
-- 
Brian

Re: [H] Sygate scoops up Sygate... (Symantec scoops up Sygate)

[jeff.lane]

No

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  James 
  Maki 
  To: 'The Hardware List' 
  Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 5:13 
  PM
  Subject: RE: [H] Sygate scoops up 
  Sygate... (Symantec scoops up Sygate)
  
  (I corrected the subject line)
   
  I guess this will be the end of a free version of Sygate 
  Personal Firewall and the beginning of the product being screwed up.. Has 
  Symantec ever acquired any product and then made real improvements? (Norton, 
  Central Point Software, Winfax, Ghost, etc.). 
   
  Jim Maki
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  


From: Francisco 
Tapia

http://www.technewsworld.com/story/sXQaBx5Sybx8rO/Symantec-Scoops-Up-Sygate-Technologies.xhtmlI've 
been using Sygate for quite some time, and it's been an excellent 
product.  I currently run the Pro version on my home system, and have 
found it to be a great value,  
 
This corp buy out leaves me 
wondering how well the next defenition files will be like, and what support 
might be like for the product.-- -Francisco
  
  

  No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG 
  Anti-Virus.Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.12/75 - Release Date: 
  8/17/2005

RE: [H] Sygate scoops up Sygate... (Symantec scoops up Sygate)

[James Maki]

(I corrected the subject line)
 
I guess this will be the end of a free version of Sygate 
Personal Firewall and the beginning of the product being screwed up.. Has 
Symantec ever acquired any product and then made real improvements? (Norton, 
Central Point Software, Winfax, Ghost, etc.). 
 
Jim Maki
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

  
  
  From: Francisco 
Tapia
  
  http://www.technewsworld.com/story/sXQaBx5Sybx8rO/Symantec-Scoops-Up-Sygate-Technologies.xhtmlI've 
  been using Sygate for quite some time, and it's been an excellent 
  product.  I currently run the Pro version on my home system, and have 
  found it to be a great value,  
   
   This corp buy out leaves 
  me wondering how well the next defenition files will be like, and what support 
  might be like for the product.-- 
-Francisco

Re: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices

[jeff.lane]

Spokane


- Original Message - 
From: "Mark Dodge" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: "'The Hardware List'" 
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 2:15 PM
Subject: RE: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices



You don't live in Washington do you?


Mark Dodge
MD Computers
602-421-0329
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of jeff.lane
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 1:44 PM
To: The Hardware List
Subject: Re: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices

Hell, we can grow ethanol. Read the stars, guys, we are getting screwed! 
The

oil companies have been crying for years that oil prices are way behind
inflation. I say, so what! I thought the idea was to keep inflation down 
in

the first place. The Government needs to include fuel and food in the
inflation indicators. Of course, if they do prime interest rates would be 
at

50% or more by now!

We have plenty of alternatives to gas and batteryso why not use them? 
We

all know why. I think if this keeps up, and I see no reason for it not
too(with the oil companies' and Arab greedcan you say jihad in
disguise), we will see a flood of small companies offering conversions to
anything from chicken manure to corn flakes.

BTW. Our new piece of crap Governor just signed a 9.5 cent increase in our
state gas taxes..highest in the US..again! OH..$6.00 per 
carton
increase for cigarettes, $6.00 per gallon booze, reinitiated the only 
estate

taxes, and a whole lot more. We really need that right now!

Sorryhad a senior moment and had to get that out. My fixed income will
go up about $2.50 a month. Chris, you're rightI will not do math in
class

Jeff

From: "Ben Ruset" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

Subject: Re: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices



A few years ago BMW showed off a 5 series that ran off water. It
cracked the water into hydrogen within the car itself.

Of course that tech won't ever see the light of day. :(


From: 007 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Wed Aug 17 13:26:05 CDT 2005
To: The Hardware List 
Subject: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices



The most fuel efficient cars use heavy water.

007.

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Christopher
Fisk
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 2:16 PM
To: The Hardware List
Subject: Re: Re: [H] Gas prices


On Wed, 17 Aug 2005, Ben Ruset wrote:


It's funny, though, that the gas companies are posting record profits.
So I really wonder how much of this is an increase in oil price, and
how much is just an excuse to charge more for gasoline.


I look at it this way, assuming that a gas company wants to make 5%
profit on every gallon of gas, it's in thier interest to have thier
costs go up 5% because then thier profit goes up too.

Instead of making 5cents on gas that costs them $1.00 to make they
make 6 cents profit on gas that cost them $1.05 to make (Or similar,
you get my point =)


Also, the gas we have now was made with oil that cost $50/barrel
instead of oil that cost $65/barrel, yet we're being charged the

$65/barrel price!



Christopher Fisk
--
I WILL NOT DO MATH IN CLASS
I WILL NOT DO MATH IN CLASS
Lisa Simpson on chalkboard in episode BABF07




--
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.12/75 - Release Date: 8/17/2005

Re: [H] Gas prices

[jeff.lane]

OOPSyou and Ben. Long day...


- Original Message - 
From: "Gary Udstrand" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: "The Hardware List" 
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 1:56 PM
Subject: Re: [H] Gas prices



Ethanol is a boondoggle.  It has been demonstrated that it takes more
fossil fuel is used to create Ethanol than it provides in return.
Ethanol programs are nothing more that governments subsidies for ADM.

-Gary



jeff.lane said the following on 8/17/2005 3:43 PM:


Hell, we can grow ethanol. Read the stars, guys, we are getting
screwed! The oil companies have been crying for years that oil prices
are way behind inflation. I say, so what! I thought the idea was to
keep inflation down in the first place. The Government needs to
include fuel and food in the inflation indicators. Of course, if they
do prime interest rates would be at 50% or more by now!

We have plenty of alternatives to gas and batteryso why not use
them? We all know why. I think if this keeps up, and I see no reason
for it not too(with the oil companies' and Arab greedcan you say
jihad in disguise), we will see a flood of small companies offering
conversions to anything from chicken manure to corn flakes.

BTW. Our new piece of crap Governor just signed a 9.5 cent increase in
our state gas taxes..highest in the US..again! OH..$6.00
per carton increase for cigarettes, $6.00 per gallon booze,
reinitiated the only estate taxes, and a whole lot more. We really
need that right now!

Sorryhad a senior moment and had to get that out. My fixed income
will go up about $2.50 a month. Chris, you're rightI will not do
math in class

Jeff

From: "Ben Ruset" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

Subject: Re: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices



A few years ago BMW showed off a 5 series that ran off water. It
cracked the water into hydrogen within the car itself.

Of course that tech won't ever see the light of day. :(


From: 007 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Wed Aug 17 13:26:05 CDT 2005
To: The Hardware List 
Subject: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices




The most fuel efficient cars use heavy water.

007.

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Christopher
Fisk
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 2:16 PM
To: The Hardware List
Subject: Re: Re: [H] Gas prices


On Wed, 17 Aug 2005, Ben Ruset wrote:


It's funny, though, that the gas companies are posting record profits.
So I really wonder how much of this is an increase in oil price,
and how
much is just an excuse to charge more for gasoline.



I look at it this way, assuming that a gas company wants to make 5%
profit
on every gallon of gas, it's in thier interest to have thier costs
go up
5% because then thier profit goes up too.

Instead of making 5cents on gas that costs them $1.00 to make they
make 6
cents profit on gas that cost them $1.05 to make (Or similar, you
get my
point =)


Also, the gas we have now was made with oil that cost $50/barrel
instead
of oil that cost $65/barrel, yet we're being charged the $65/barrel
price!


Christopher Fisk
--
I WILL NOT DO MATH IN CLASS
I WILL NOT DO MATH IN CLASS
Lisa Simpson on chalkboard in episode BABF07







--
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.12/75 - Release Date: 8/17/2005

Re: [H] Gas prices

[jeff.lane]

Right, Gary. I agree with you and Russ. I was just giving an example of one 
way to tell the oil cartels to take a hike.


Jeff

- Original Message - 
From: "Gary Udstrand" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: "The Hardware List" 
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 1:56 PM
Subject: Re: [H] Gas prices



Ethanol is a boondoggle.  It has been demonstrated that it takes more
fossil fuel is used to create Ethanol than it provides in return.
Ethanol programs are nothing more that governments subsidies for ADM.

-Gary



jeff.lane said the following on 8/17/2005 3:43 PM:


Hell, we can grow ethanol. Read the stars, guys, we are getting
screwed! The oil companies have been crying for years that oil prices
are way behind inflation. I say, so what! I thought the idea was to
keep inflation down in the first place. The Government needs to
include fuel and food in the inflation indicators. Of course, if they
do prime interest rates would be at 50% or more by now!

We have plenty of alternatives to gas and batteryso why not use
them? We all know why. I think if this keeps up, and I see no reason
for it not too(with the oil companies' and Arab greedcan you say
jihad in disguise), we will see a flood of small companies offering
conversions to anything from chicken manure to corn flakes.

BTW. Our new piece of crap Governor just signed a 9.5 cent increase in
our state gas taxes..highest in the US..again! OH..$6.00
per carton increase for cigarettes, $6.00 per gallon booze,
reinitiated the only estate taxes, and a whole lot more. We really
need that right now!

Sorryhad a senior moment and had to get that out. My fixed income
will go up about $2.50 a month. Chris, you're rightI will not do
math in class

Jeff

From: "Ben Ruset" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

Subject: Re: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices



A few years ago BMW showed off a 5 series that ran off water. It
cracked the water into hydrogen within the car itself.

Of course that tech won't ever see the light of day. :(


From: 007 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Wed Aug 17 13:26:05 CDT 2005
To: The Hardware List 
Subject: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices




The most fuel efficient cars use heavy water.

007.

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Christopher
Fisk
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 2:16 PM
To: The Hardware List
Subject: Re: Re: [H] Gas prices


On Wed, 17 Aug 2005, Ben Ruset wrote:


It's funny, though, that the gas companies are posting record profits.
So I really wonder how much of this is an increase in oil price,
and how
much is just an excuse to charge more for gasoline.



I look at it this way, assuming that a gas company wants to make 5%
profit
on every gallon of gas, it's in thier interest to have thier costs
go up
5% because then thier profit goes up too.

Instead of making 5cents on gas that costs them $1.00 to make they
make 6
cents profit on gas that cost them $1.05 to make (Or similar, you
get my
point =)


Also, the gas we have now was made with oil that cost $50/barrel
instead
of oil that cost $65/barrel, yet we're being charged the $65/barrel
price!


Christopher Fisk
--
I WILL NOT DO MATH IN CLASS
I WILL NOT DO MATH IN CLASS
Lisa Simpson on chalkboard in episode BABF07

Re: Re: [H] Gas prices

[Greg Sevart]

and that:

"the roughly 10 billion barrels of oil expected to be found there would be 
the equivalent of JUST SIX MONTHS OF U.S. CONSUMPTION"


http://www.sacbee.com/news/special/power/032001abraham.html


Vince






...but given that we produce something like ~40% of our oil DOMESTICALLY, 
and the majority of the remainder comes from Canada, Mexico, and Venezuela, 
we wouldn't need to replace 100% of our oil consumption with oil from the 
ANWR. When I was researching the issue back in spring of 2002, the figure 
that I heard was that ANWR oil could COMPLETELY REPLACE middle-eastern 
imports for a period of 30 years. Folks, in 30 years, we probably won't be 
driving internal combustion powered vehicles, so it sounds good to me.


That being said, I have mixed feelings on drilling in the ANWR. It would be 
5-12 years before any useful oil came from it, and I fully expect 
alternatively fueled cars to be pretty popular by then. I think it is more 
of a political thing ("See! We did something! Vote for me again!") than a 
real measure to offset either high energy prices or reliance on unstable 
regions.



Greg

Re: Re: [H] Gas prices

[Analyst]

On 17 Aug 2005 at 15:58, Ben Ruset wrote:


> Didn't drilling in Alaska just pass?

No, it is supposed to be jammed into the upcoming budget bill.



> I consider myself an environmentalist and I support drilling in Alaska. 

You'll likely be disappointed. Spence Abraham, who was this administration's 
Secretary of Energy in the first term, told the Sacramento Bee newspaper that:

"Americans should not overestimate this region's ability to provide the nation 
with energy independence"

and that:

"the roughly 10 billion barrels of oil expected to be found there would be the 
equivalent of JUST SIX MONTHS OF U.S. CONSUMPTION"

http://www.sacbee.com/news/special/power/032001abraham.html


Vince

Re: Re: [H] Gas prices

[Analyst]

On 17 Aug 2005 at 15:26, Ben Ruset wrote:

> Further proof that the oil companies are gouging customers outside the
> mideast. You can't tell me that there is a ~$1.60/gal charge that goes
> to only pay transport and taxes.
> 
> >From: Zulfiqar Naushad <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >Date: Wed Aug 17 15:17:29 CDT 2005
> >To: The Hardware List 
> >Subject: Re: [H] Gas prices
> 
> >Gas prices expensive???
> >
> >Here in Saudi Arabia the state price (i.e. nothing less or more than 
> >the state price is available at any gas station) is .90 halalas (cent
> > equivalent of a riyal(dollar)) per liter.
> >
> >i.e 1 Gallon = 90 US cents.

To really get your blood boiling, gasoline in Venezuela is only 25 cents a 
gallon.

Anybody want to captain a tanker full of gasoline back to the U.S. ? (Talk 
about ridin' a rocket)


Vince

[H] Sygate scoops up Sygate...

[Francisco Tapia]

http://www.technewsworld.com/story/sXQaBx5Sybx8rO/Symantec-Scoops-Up-Sygate-Technologies.xhtml

I've been using Sygate for quite some time, and it's been an excellent
product.  I currently run the Pro version on my home system, and
have found it to be a great value, When the sasser exploit hit machines
in my company, I did not suffer the same fate of being rebooted because
of external machines hitting my box.  I was able to download the
patch and helpout my fellow suffering co-workers.  Only recently
did I ever have any issues, and that was more of the way the cisco vpn
client is written... I migrated to the correct build from Sygate and
have not had any issues.

This corp buy out leaves me wondering how well the next defenition
files will be like, and what support might be like for the product.

-- -Franciscohttp://pcthis.blogspot.com |PC news with out the jargon!http://sqlthis.blogspot.com | Tsql and More...

Re: [H] Gas prices

[joeuser]

Brazil beat us to the punch with the Ethanol thing - they are WAY ahead 
of us. Friggin sad too.


Ben Ruset wrote:


I am all about Ethanol. Unfortunately in the US the corn farmers are pushing 
for it. Making Ethanol from Corn is the most inefficient way of doing it, and 
supposedly yeilds less energy than what was spent in producing it.

Making Ethanol from sugar cane, as Brazil has done, makes MORE energy than what 
was spent in producing it, and has limited Brazil's dependance on foreign oil.


--
Cheers,
joeuser (still looking for the 'any' key)

RE: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices

[Mark Dodge]

You don't live in Washington do you? 


Mark Dodge
MD Computers
602-421-0329 
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of jeff.lane
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 1:44 PM
To: The Hardware List
Subject: Re: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices

Hell, we can grow ethanol. Read the stars, guys, we are getting screwed! The
oil companies have been crying for years that oil prices are way behind
inflation. I say, so what! I thought the idea was to keep inflation down in
the first place. The Government needs to include fuel and food in the
inflation indicators. Of course, if they do prime interest rates would be at
50% or more by now!

We have plenty of alternatives to gas and batteryso why not use them? We
all know why. I think if this keeps up, and I see no reason for it not
too(with the oil companies' and Arab greedcan you say jihad in
disguise), we will see a flood of small companies offering conversions to
anything from chicken manure to corn flakes.

BTW. Our new piece of crap Governor just signed a 9.5 cent increase in our
state gas taxes..highest in the US..again! OH..$6.00 per carton
increase for cigarettes, $6.00 per gallon booze, reinitiated the only estate
taxes, and a whole lot more. We really need that right now!

Sorryhad a senior moment and had to get that out. My fixed income will
go up about $2.50 a month. Chris, you're rightI will not do math in
class

Jeff

From: "Ben Ruset" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

Subject: Re: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices


>A few years ago BMW showed off a 5 series that ran off water. It 
>cracked the water into hydrogen within the car itself.
>
> Of course that tech won't ever see the light of day. :(
>
>>From: 007 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>Date: Wed Aug 17 13:26:05 CDT 2005
>>To: The Hardware List 
>>Subject: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices
>
>>The most fuel efficient cars use heavy water.
>>
>>007.
>>
>>-Original Message-
>>From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Christopher 
>>Fisk
>>Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 2:16 PM
>>To: The Hardware List
>>Subject: Re: Re: [H] Gas prices
>>
>>
>>On Wed, 17 Aug 2005, Ben Ruset wrote:
>>
>>> It's funny, though, that the gas companies are posting record profits.
>>> So I really wonder how much of this is an increase in oil price, and 
>>> how much is just an excuse to charge more for gasoline.
>>
>>I look at it this way, assuming that a gas company wants to make 5% 
>>profit on every gallon of gas, it's in thier interest to have thier 
>>costs go up 5% because then thier profit goes up too.
>>
>>Instead of making 5cents on gas that costs them $1.00 to make they 
>>make 6 cents profit on gas that cost them $1.05 to make (Or similar, 
>>you get my point =)
>>
>>
>>Also, the gas we have now was made with oil that cost $50/barrel 
>>instead of oil that cost $65/barrel, yet we're being charged the
$65/barrel price!
>>
>>
>>Christopher Fisk
>>--
>>I WILL NOT DO MATH IN CLASS
>>I WILL NOT DO MATH IN CLASS
>> Lisa Simpson on chalkboard in episode BABF07

RE: [H] Gas prices

[Mark Dodge]

2.53 here in Phoenix 


Mark Dodge
MD Computers
602-421-0329 
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Bobby Heid
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 9:24 AM
To: 'The Hardware List'
Subject: RE: [H] Gas prices

I paid $2.45US/gallon on Monday.

Bobby

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Thane Sherrington
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 12:15 PM
To: hardware@hardwaregroup.com
Subject: [H] Gas prices


Our gas prices climbed $0.06 per litre yesterday, so we are at $4.27 US per
gallon now.  Just wondering what you're paying down in there.

T

Re: Re: [H] Gas prices

[FORC5]

hope so, especially since Canada is drilling not far from
where we want to drill.
but that is only a beginning, lot more to do.
I suspect the Caribou population may double.
fp
At 01:58 PM 8/17/2005, Ben Ruset Poked the stick with:
Didn't drilling in Alaska just
pass?
I consider myself an environmentalist and I support drilling in Alaska.

>From: FORC5 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Date: Wed Aug 17 15:55:00 CDT 2005
>To: The Hardware List 
>Subject: Re: [H] Gas prices
>PPL here bitch about the prices but are not willing to doanything
about it. Non new refineries in 30 years, and no drilling inAlaska.
>me, I'd say piss on the Saudi's ( no offense ) , let them see if they
cansquirt that oil on the sand and grow food with it !!! >:-}
>if it were up to me I'd cut them off completely, then there might be
aoil price war and prices may come down.
>BTW I'm tired of *adjusted for inflation* BS. inflation did not go
up150% in a year
>
>bo haha
>
>At 01:17 PM 8/17/2005, Zulfiqar Naushad Poked the stick with:
>Gas prices expensive???
>
>Here in Saudi Arabia the state price (i.e. nothing less or
morethan  
>the state price is available at any gas station) is .90
halalas(cent  
>equivalent of a riyal(dollar)) per liter.
>
>i.e 1 Gallon = 90 US cents.
>
>
>BWAHAHAHAH!!!
>
>Almost every car here in Saudi is a V6 or a V8!!!
>
>
>They love suburbans and expeditions here!!!
>
>
>
>On Aug 17, 2005, at 7:14 PM, Thane Sherrington wrote:
>
>Our gas prices climbed $0.06 perlitre yesterday, so we are at 

>$4.27 US per gallon now.  Just wondering what you're paying
downin  
>there.
>
>T
>
>
>-- 
>Tallyho ! ]:8)
>Taglines below !
>--
>And all the children are above average in our system.

-- 
Tallyho ! ]:8)
Taglines below !
--
And all the children are above average in our system.

Re: Re: Re: [H] Gas prices

[Ben Ruset]

The oil companies probably had them killed or paid off.


>From: "jeff.lane" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Date: Wed Aug 17 16:00:17 CDT 2005
>To: The Hardware List 
>Subject: Re: Re: [H] Gas prices

>Like cold fusion? There were a couple of scientists, in Utah, several years 
>ago that claimed they had made cold fusion work. That is clean, safe, 
>perpetual, fusion .I don't recall their names but they had the scientific 
>world standing on it's head for sometime until they discovered that it was 
>not completely perfect, i.e., infinitely renewable. My question would be 
>just how long did this run without renewal? After the idea of infinity went 
>away nobody heard anything about these guys. If they had discovered pure 
>cold fusion we could power a whole city in a clean reactor no bigger that a 
>service station, if that big. The pellet to run a car thingall of it 
>runs forever. Anybody think this won't or can't happen, or for that matter, 
>may already be there???
>
>Jeff
>
>- Original Message - 
>From: "007" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>To: "The Hardware List" 
>Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 11:49 AM
>Subject: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices
>
>
>>I was referring to fission technology (U235).  Since fusion is years away.
>>
>> 007.
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of 007
>> Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 2:26 PM
>> To: The Hardware List
>> Subject: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices
>>
>>
>> The most fuel efficient cars use heavy water.
>>
>> 007.
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Christopher Fisk
>> Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 2:16 PM
>> To: The Hardware List
>> Subject: Re: Re: [H] Gas prices
>>
>>
>> On Wed, 17 Aug 2005, Ben Ruset wrote:
>>
>>> It's funny, though, that the gas companies are posting record profits.
>>> So I really wonder how much of this is an increase in oil price, and how
>>> much is just an excuse to charge more for gasoline.
>>
>> I look at it this way, assuming that a gas company wants to make 5% profit
>> on every gallon of gas, it's in thier interest to have thier costs go up
>> 5% because then thier profit goes up too.
>>
>> Instead of making 5cents on gas that costs them $1.00 to make they make 6
>> cents profit on gas that cost them $1.05 to make (Or similar, you get my
>> point =)
>>
>>
>> Also, the gas we have now was made with oil that cost $50/barrel instead
>> of oil that cost $65/barrel, yet we're being charged the $65/barrel price!
>>
>>
>> Christopher Fisk
>> -- 
>> I WILL NOT DO MATH IN CLASS
>> I WILL NOT DO MATH IN CLASS
>>  Lisa Simpson on chalkboard in episode BABF07

Re: [H] PC won't boot/bad caps

[FORC5]

bad caps on mb's in my pile
Abit
Asus
MSI
DFI
ECS
Compaq
Soyo
Epox
I do not believe any body is immune and I often wonder about other
electronic gear like TV's etc.
Power supplies I have not kept a pile on
fp

At 01:19 PM 8/17/2005, Francisco Tapia Poked the stick with:
Sounds like power to me, I've
had PCs come to me where the fans all worked, but the system woudln't
even post, some had issues w/ the cd/dvd drives not ejecting... I would
plug them into known good PSs and that was the problem everytime.  I
had a 300w Antec on my Epox w/ Amd2000xp, after 2 1/2 years after
powering it off it would not boot up again, I swapped out the PS and all
was well.  EpoX generally do not have the bad caps problem the
generally plauges ECS (IME).

On 8/17/05, FORC5
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:


first response for me, had a ecs k7s5a pro this week with 6 bad caps,
also check in the power supply for bad caps.

fp

At 08:06 AM 8/17/2005, Mark Dodge Poked the stick with:

Check the caps on the MB to see if any are bulging. 


Mark Dodge

MD Computers

602-421-0329 

-Original Message-

From:

[EMAIL PROTECTED]

[
 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
On Behalf Of Jerry Jones

Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 7:47 AM

To: The Hardware List

Subject: [H] PC won't boot

Built my wife's PC about a year ago. Epox MB with an Athlon, 2 sticks
of

256MB RAM, 2 hard drives, DVD drive, and a Radeon 9800SE vid card.
Recently

when she turns on the PC it usually will not boot and just makes a
sound

that is kind of an alternating high then low beep. Hitting the reset
button

will usually cause it to then boot.

Yesterday I pulled off the cover of the case to check out the
problem. After

checking that the video and memory were seated and all cables
were

connected, I plugged it back in and tried to turn it on.When power is
turned

on the case fans spin, the cpu and video card fans also are spinning
but

nothing else happens. It does not display anything on the monitor.
Hitting

reset does nothing at all. Everything appears to be getting power,
but the

boot process just does not seem to be starting. Oddly, the DVD drive
will

not open it's tray when the button is pushed.

I have tried swapping video cards with a known working one from my
kids pc

and get the same thing. I have swapped the power connecters on the
hard

drives and the DVD drive. I have tried disconnecting each hard
drive

individually and then both hard drives. I have tried booting with
just one

stick of memory. At this point I am at a loss for what might be
wrong. Could

the CPU be dead? The motherboard? Or does it sound like a power
supply

problem?

Jerry 

-- 

Tallyho ! ]:8)

Taglines below !

--

Mary had potatoes, wine, salad, and a little lamb.



-- 
-Francisco
http://pcthis.blogspot.com |PC
news with out the jargon!
http://sqlthis.blogspot.com |
Tsql and More...

-- 
Tallyho ! ]:8)
Taglines below !
--
And all the children are above average in our system.

Re: Re: [H] Gas prices

[jeff.lane]

Like cold fusion? There were a couple of scientists, in Utah, several years 
ago that claimed they had made cold fusion work. That is clean, safe, 
perpetual, fusion .I don't recall their names but they had the scientific 
world standing on it's head for sometime until they discovered that it was 
not completely perfect, i.e., infinitely renewable. My question would be 
just how long did this run without renewal? After the idea of infinity went 
away nobody heard anything about these guys. If they had discovered pure 
cold fusion we could power a whole city in a clean reactor no bigger that a 
service station, if that big. The pellet to run a car thingall of it 
runs forever. Anybody think this won't or can't happen, or for that matter, 
may already be there???


Jeff

- Original Message - 
From: "007" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: "The Hardware List" 
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 11:49 AM
Subject: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices



I was referring to fission technology (U235).  Since fusion is years away.

007.

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of 007
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 2:26 PM
To: The Hardware List
Subject: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices


The most fuel efficient cars use heavy water.

007.

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Christopher Fisk
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 2:16 PM
To: The Hardware List
Subject: Re: Re: [H] Gas prices


On Wed, 17 Aug 2005, Ben Ruset wrote:


It's funny, though, that the gas companies are posting record profits.
So I really wonder how much of this is an increase in oil price, and how
much is just an excuse to charge more for gasoline.


I look at it this way, assuming that a gas company wants to make 5% profit
on every gallon of gas, it's in thier interest to have thier costs go up
5% because then thier profit goes up too.

Instead of making 5cents on gas that costs them $1.00 to make they make 6
cents profit on gas that cost them $1.05 to make (Or similar, you get my
point =)


Also, the gas we have now was made with oil that cost $50/barrel instead
of oil that cost $65/barrel, yet we're being charged the $65/barrel price!


Christopher Fisk
--
I WILL NOT DO MATH IN CLASS
I WILL NOT DO MATH IN CLASS
 Lisa Simpson on chalkboard in episode BABF07

Re: Re: [H] Gas prices

[Ben Ruset]

Didn't drilling in Alaska just pass?

I consider myself an environmentalist and I support drilling in Alaska. 

>From: FORC5 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Date: Wed Aug 17 15:55:00 CDT 2005
>To: The Hardware List 
>Subject: Re: [H] Gas prices

>PPL here bitch about the prices but are not willing to doanything about it. 
>Non new refineries in 30 years, and no drilling inAlaska.
>me, I'd say piss on the Saudi's ( no offense ) , let them see if they 
>cansquirt that oil on the sand and grow food with it !!! >:-}
>if it were up to me I'd cut them off completely, then there might be aoil 
>price war and prices may come down.
>BTW I'm tired of *adjusted for inflation* BS. inflation did not go up150% in a 
>year
>
>bo haha
>
>At 01:17 PM 8/17/2005, Zulfiqar Naushad Poked the stick with:
>Gas prices expensive???
>
>Here in Saudi Arabia the state price (i.e. nothing less or morethan  
>the state price is available at any gas station) is .90 halalas(cent  
>equivalent of a riyal(dollar)) per liter.
>
>i.e 1 Gallon = 90 US cents.
>
>
>BWAHAHAHAH!!!
>
>Almost every car here in Saudi is a V6 or a V8!!!
>
>
>They love suburbans and expeditions here!!!
>
>
>
>On Aug 17, 2005, at 7:14 PM, Thane Sherrington wrote:
>
>Our gas prices climbed $0.06 perlitre yesterday, so we are at  
>$4.27 US per gallon now.  Just wondering what you're paying downin  
>there.
>
>T
>
>
>-- 
>Tallyho ! ]:8)
>Taglines below !
>--
>And all the children are above average in our system.

Re: [H] Gas prices

[Gary Udstrand]

Ethanol is a boondoggle.  It has been demonstrated that it takes more
fossil fuel is used to create Ethanol than it provides in return.  
Ethanol programs are nothing more that governments subsidies for ADM.

-Gary



jeff.lane said the following on 8/17/2005 3:43 PM:

> Hell, we can grow ethanol. Read the stars, guys, we are getting
> screwed! The oil companies have been crying for years that oil prices
> are way behind inflation. I say, so what! I thought the idea was to
> keep inflation down in the first place. The Government needs to
> include fuel and food in the inflation indicators. Of course, if they
> do prime interest rates would be at 50% or more by now!
>
> We have plenty of alternatives to gas and batteryso why not use
> them? We all know why. I think if this keeps up, and I see no reason
> for it not too(with the oil companies' and Arab greedcan you say
> jihad in disguise), we will see a flood of small companies offering
> conversions to anything from chicken manure to corn flakes.
>
> BTW. Our new piece of crap Governor just signed a 9.5 cent increase in
> our state gas taxes..highest in the US..again! OH..$6.00
> per carton increase for cigarettes, $6.00 per gallon booze,
> reinitiated the only estate taxes, and a whole lot more. We really
> need that right now!
>
> Sorryhad a senior moment and had to get that out. My fixed income
> will go up about $2.50 a month. Chris, you're rightI will not do
> math in class
>
> Jeff
>
> From: "Ben Ruset" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
> Subject: Re: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices
>
>
>> A few years ago BMW showed off a 5 series that ran off water. It
>> cracked the water into hydrogen within the car itself.
>>
>> Of course that tech won't ever see the light of day. :(
>>
>>> From: 007 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>> Date: Wed Aug 17 13:26:05 CDT 2005
>>> To: The Hardware List 
>>> Subject: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices
>>
>>
>>> The most fuel efficient cars use heavy water.
>>>
>>> 007.
>>>
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Christopher
>>> Fisk
>>> Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 2:16 PM
>>> To: The Hardware List
>>> Subject: Re: Re: [H] Gas prices
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, 17 Aug 2005, Ben Ruset wrote:
>>>
 It's funny, though, that the gas companies are posting record profits.
 So I really wonder how much of this is an increase in oil price,
 and how
 much is just an excuse to charge more for gasoline.
>>>
>>>
>>> I look at it this way, assuming that a gas company wants to make 5%
>>> profit
>>> on every gallon of gas, it's in thier interest to have thier costs
>>> go up
>>> 5% because then thier profit goes up too.
>>>
>>> Instead of making 5cents on gas that costs them $1.00 to make they
>>> make 6
>>> cents profit on gas that cost them $1.05 to make (Or similar, you
>>> get my
>>> point =)
>>>
>>>
>>> Also, the gas we have now was made with oil that cost $50/barrel
>>> instead
>>> of oil that cost $65/barrel, yet we're being charged the $65/barrel
>>> price!
>>>
>>>
>>> Christopher Fisk
>>> -- 
>>> I WILL NOT DO MATH IN CLASS
>>> I WILL NOT DO MATH IN CLASS
>>> Lisa Simpson on chalkboard in episode BABF07
>>
>

Re: Re: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices

[Ben Ruset]

I am all about Ethanol. Unfortunately in the US the corn farmers are pushing 
for it. Making Ethanol from Corn is the most inefficient way of doing it, and 
supposedly yeilds less energy than what was spent in producing it.

Making Ethanol from sugar cane, as Brazil has done, makes MORE energy than what 
was spent in producing it, and has limited Brazil's dependance on foreign oil.


>From: "jeff.lane" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Date: Wed Aug 17 15:43:42 CDT 2005
>To: The Hardware List 
>Subject: Re: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices

>Hell, we can grow ethanol. Read the stars, guys, we are getting screwed! The 
>oil companies have been crying for years that oil prices are way behind 
>inflation. I say, so what! I thought the idea was to keep inflation down in 
>the first place. The Government needs to include fuel and food in the 
>inflation indicators. Of course, if they do prime interest rates would be at 
>50% or more by now!
>
>We have plenty of alternatives to gas and batteryso why not use them? We 
>all know why. I think if this keeps up, and I see no reason for it not 
>too(with the oil companies' and Arab greedcan you say jihad in 
>disguise), we will see a flood of small companies offering conversions to 
>anything from chicken manure to corn flakes.
>
>BTW. Our new piece of crap Governor just signed a 9.5 cent increase in our 
>state gas taxes..highest in the US..again! OH..$6.00 per carton 
>increase for cigarettes, $6.00 per gallon booze, reinitiated the only estate 
>taxes, and a whole lot more. We really need that right now!
>
>Sorryhad a senior moment and had to get that out. My fixed income will 
>go up about $2.50 a month. Chris, you're rightI will not do math in 
>class
>
>Jeff
>
>From: "Ben Ruset" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
>Subject: Re: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices
>
>
>>A few years ago BMW showed off a 5 series that ran off water. It cracked 
>>the water into hydrogen within the car itself.
>>
>> Of course that tech won't ever see the light of day. :(
>>
>>>From: 007 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>>Date: Wed Aug 17 13:26:05 CDT 2005
>>>To: The Hardware List 
>>>Subject: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices
>>
>>>The most fuel efficient cars use heavy water.
>>>
>>>007.
>>>
>>>-Original Message-
>>>From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>>[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Christopher Fisk
>>>Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 2:16 PM
>>>To: The Hardware List
>>>Subject: Re: Re: [H] Gas prices
>>>
>>>
>>>On Wed, 17 Aug 2005, Ben Ruset wrote:
>>>
 It's funny, though, that the gas companies are posting record profits.
 So I really wonder how much of this is an increase in oil price, and how
 much is just an excuse to charge more for gasoline.
>>>
>>>I look at it this way, assuming that a gas company wants to make 5% profit
>>>on every gallon of gas, it's in thier interest to have thier costs go up
>>>5% because then thier profit goes up too.
>>>
>>>Instead of making 5cents on gas that costs them $1.00 to make they make 6
>>>cents profit on gas that cost them $1.05 to make (Or similar, you get my
>>>point =)
>>>
>>>
>>>Also, the gas we have now was made with oil that cost $50/barrel instead
>>>of oil that cost $65/barrel, yet we're being charged the $65/barrel price!
>>>
>>>
>>>Christopher Fisk
>>>-- 
>>>I WILL NOT DO MATH IN CLASS
>>>I WILL NOT DO MATH IN CLASS
>>> Lisa Simpson on chalkboard in episode BABF07

Re: [H] Gas prices

[FORC5]

PPL here bitch about the prices but are not willing to do
anything about it. Non new refineries in 30 years, and no drilling in
Alaska.
me, I'd say piss on the Saudi's ( no offense ) , let them see if they can
squirt that oil on the sand and grow food with it !!! >:-}
if it were up to me I'd cut them off completely, then there might be a
oil price war and prices may come down.
BTW I'm tired of *adjusted for inflation* BS. inflation did not go up
150% in a year
bo haha
At 01:17 PM 8/17/2005, Zulfiqar Naushad Poked the stick with:
Gas prices expensive???
Here in Saudi Arabia the state price (i.e. nothing less or more
than  
the state price is available at any gas station) is .90 halalas
(cent  
equivalent of a riyal(dollar)) per liter.
i.e 1 Gallon = 90 US cents.

BWAHAHAHAH!!!
Almost every car here in Saudi is a V6 or a V8!!!

They love suburbans and expeditions here!!!

On Aug 17, 2005, at 7:14 PM, Thane Sherrington wrote:
Our gas prices climbed $0.06 per
litre yesterday, so we are at  
$4.27 US per gallon now.  Just wondering what you're paying down
in  
there.
T


-- 
Tallyho ! ]:8)
Taglines below !
--
And all the children are above average in our system.

Re: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices

[jeff.lane]

Fuel cells are a very good alternative and should be practically available 
in the near future.


Jeff

- Original Message - 
From: "Christopher Fisk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: "The Hardware List" 
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 11:39 AM
Subject: Re: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices



On Wed, 17 Aug 2005, Ben Ruset wrote:

A few years ago BMW showed off a 5 series that ran off water. It cracked 
the water into hydrogen within the car itself.


Of course that tech won't ever see the light of day. :(


This doesn't make sense.  It takes energy to split water into Oxygen and 
hydrogen.  To then burn that hydrogen to power the car is just a waste of 
energy.  Why not just use the energy used to crack the water to power the 
car?  There is no such thing as a perpetual motion machine =)




Christopher Fisk
--
BOFH Excuse #330:
quantum decoherence

Re: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices

[jeff.lane]

Hell, we can grow ethanol. Read the stars, guys, we are getting screwed! The 
oil companies have been crying for years that oil prices are way behind 
inflation. I say, so what! I thought the idea was to keep inflation down in 
the first place. The Government needs to include fuel and food in the 
inflation indicators. Of course, if they do prime interest rates would be at 
50% or more by now!


We have plenty of alternatives to gas and batteryso why not use them? We 
all know why. I think if this keeps up, and I see no reason for it not 
too(with the oil companies' and Arab greedcan you say jihad in 
disguise), we will see a flood of small companies offering conversions to 
anything from chicken manure to corn flakes.


BTW. Our new piece of crap Governor just signed a 9.5 cent increase in our 
state gas taxes..highest in the US..again! OH..$6.00 per carton 
increase for cigarettes, $6.00 per gallon booze, reinitiated the only estate 
taxes, and a whole lot more. We really need that right now!


Sorryhad a senior moment and had to get that out. My fixed income will 
go up about $2.50 a month. Chris, you're rightI will not do math in 
class


Jeff

From: "Ben Ruset" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

Subject: Re: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices


A few years ago BMW showed off a 5 series that ran off water. It cracked 
the water into hydrogen within the car itself.


Of course that tech won't ever see the light of day. :(


From: 007 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Wed Aug 17 13:26:05 CDT 2005
To: The Hardware List 
Subject: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices



The most fuel efficient cars use heavy water.

007.

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Christopher Fisk
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 2:16 PM
To: The Hardware List
Subject: Re: Re: [H] Gas prices


On Wed, 17 Aug 2005, Ben Ruset wrote:


It's funny, though, that the gas companies are posting record profits.
So I really wonder how much of this is an increase in oil price, and how
much is just an excuse to charge more for gasoline.


I look at it this way, assuming that a gas company wants to make 5% profit
on every gallon of gas, it's in thier interest to have thier costs go up
5% because then thier profit goes up too.

Instead of making 5cents on gas that costs them $1.00 to make they make 6
cents profit on gas that cost them $1.05 to make (Or similar, you get my
point =)


Also, the gas we have now was made with oil that cost $50/barrel instead
of oil that cost $65/barrel, yet we're being charged the $65/barrel price!


Christopher Fisk
--
I WILL NOT DO MATH IN CLASS
I WILL NOT DO MATH IN CLASS
Lisa Simpson on chalkboard in episode BABF07

Re: Re: [H] Gas prices

[Ben Ruset]

Further proof that the oil companies are gouging customers outside the mideast. 
You can't tell me that there is a ~$1.60/gal charge that goes to only pay 
transport and taxes.

>From: Zulfiqar Naushad <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Date: Wed Aug 17 15:17:29 CDT 2005
>To: The Hardware List 
>Subject: Re: [H] Gas prices

>Gas prices expensive???
>
>Here in Saudi Arabia the state price (i.e. nothing less or more than  
>the state price is available at any gas station) is .90 halalas (cent  
>equivalent of a riyal(dollar)) per liter.
>
>i.e 1 Gallon = 90 US cents.
>
>
>BWAHAHAHAH!!!
>
>Almost every car here in Saudi is a V6 or a V8!!!
>
>
>They love suburbans and expeditions here!!!
>
>
>
>On Aug 17, 2005, at 7:14 PM, Thane Sherrington wrote:
>
>> Our gas prices climbed $0.06 per litre yesterday, so we are at  
>> $4.27 US per gallon now.  Just wondering what you're paying down in  
>> there.
>>
>> T
>>
>>

Re: Re: Re: Re: [H] Gas prices

[Ben Ruset]

So then if you're already filling your tank, what's the point of cracking more? 
Seems like it would add needless expense, complexity, and weight to the vehicle.

>From: Thane Sherrington <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Date: Wed Aug 17 15:00:37 CDT 2005
>To: The Hardware List 
>Subject: Re: Re: Re: [H] Gas prices

>At 04:51 PM 17/08/2005, Ben Ruset wrote:
>>If you're cracking hydrogen in your car why would you need to fill up at a 
>>station?
>
>Because cracking hydrogen requires more power than you can generate on 
>current solar panels small enough to fit on a car roof.  IIRC, there's a 
>company here that sells a 4x2 solar panel that generates 10W.  There's no 
>way that's enough power to generate hydrogen on the fly.
>
>T 

Re: [H] PC won't boot

[Francisco Tapia]

Sounds like power to me, I've had PCs come to me where the fans all
worked, but the system woudln't even post, some had issues w/ the
cd/dvd drives not ejecting... I would plug them into known good PSs and
that was the problem everytime.  I had a 300w Antec on my Epox w/
Amd2000xp, after 2 1/2 years after powering it off it would not boot up
again, I swapped out the PS and all was well.  EpoX generally do
not have the bad caps problem the generally plauges ECS (IME).

On 8/17/05, FORC5 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:


first response for me, had a ecs k7s5a pro this week with 6
bad caps, also check in the power supply for bad caps.
fp
At 08:06 AM 8/17/2005, Mark Dodge Poked the stick with:
Check the caps on the MB to see
if any are bulging. 

Mark Dodge
MD Computers
602-421-0329 
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[
mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Jerry
Jones
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 7:47 AM
To: The Hardware List
Subject: [H] PC won't boot
Built my wife's PC about a year ago. Epox MB with an Athlon, 2 sticks
of
256MB RAM, 2 hard drives, DVD drive, and a Radeon 9800SE vid card.
Recently
when she turns on the PC it usually will not boot and just makes a
sound
that is kind of an alternating high then low beep. Hitting the reset
button
will usually cause it to then boot.
Yesterday I pulled off the cover of the case to check out the problem.
After
checking that the video and memory were seated and all cables were
connected, I plugged it back in and tried to turn it on.When power is
turned
on the case fans spin, the cpu and video card fans also are spinning
but
nothing else happens. It does not display anything on the monitor.
Hitting
reset does nothing at all. Everything appears to be getting power, but
the
boot process just does not seem to be starting. Oddly, the DVD drive
will
not open it's tray when the button is pushed.
I have tried swapping video cards with a known working one from my kids
pc
and get the same thing. I have swapped the power connecters on the
hard
drives and the DVD drive. I have tried disconnecting each hard drive
individually and then both hard drives. I have tried booting with just
one
stick of memory. At this point I am at a loss for what might be wrong.
Could
the CPU be dead? The motherboard? Or does it sound like a power
supply
problem?
Jerry 

-- 
Tallyho ! ]:8)
Taglines below !
--
Mary had potatoes, wine, salad, and a little lamb.



-- -Franciscohttp://pcthis.blogspot.com |PC news with out the jargon!http://sqlthis.blogspot.com
 | Tsql and More...

Re: [H] Gas prices

[Zulfiqar Naushad]

Gas prices expensive???

Here in Saudi Arabia the state price (i.e. nothing less or more than  
the state price is available at any gas station) is .90 halalas (cent  
equivalent of a riyal(dollar)) per liter.


i.e 1 Gallon = 90 US cents.


BWAHAHAHAH!!!

Almost every car here in Saudi is a V6 or a V8!!!


They love suburbans and expeditions here!!!



On Aug 17, 2005, at 7:14 PM, Thane Sherrington wrote:

Our gas prices climbed $0.06 per litre yesterday, so we are at  
$4.27 US per gallon now.  Just wondering what you're paying down in  
there.


T

Re: Re: Re: [H] Gas prices

[Thane Sherrington]

At 04:51 PM 17/08/2005, Ben Ruset wrote:
If you're cracking hydrogen in your car why would you need to fill up at a 
station?


Because cracking hydrogen requires more power than you can generate on 
current solar panels small enough to fit on a car roof.  IIRC, there's a 
company here that sells a 4x2 solar panel that generates 10W.  There's no 
way that's enough power to generate hydrogen on the fly.


T 

Re: Re: Re: [H] Gas prices

[Ben Ruset]

If you're cracking hydrogen in your car why would you need to fill up at a 
station?

>From: Thane Sherrington <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Date: Wed Aug 17 13:56:41 CDT 2005
>To: The Hardware List 
>Subject: Re: Re: [H] Gas prices

>At 03:52 PM 17/08/2005, Gary VanderMolen wrote:
>
>
>>Did someone repeal the laws of physics and chemistry?
>>
>>It takes more energy to crack water than you get back when
>>recombining the hydrogen and oxygen.
>
>I think that report was a misunderstanding of the technology.  The idea is 
>to use solar power in a large plant to crack water into hydrogen.  You 
>would fill up with hydrogen at a gas station, and burn it in your 
>car.  Hummer is releasing a model that does this as well.  Hydrogen is an 
>energy carrier like oil, it isn't free energy.
>
>T 

Re: [H] Gas prices

[joeuser]

Were saying it was running about 2.00 and under just a year or so ago.



Henrik Tived wrote:


so what were you saying about your high gas price ?? :-)



--
Cheers,
joeuser (still looking for the 'any' key)

Re: [H] Gas prices

[joeuser]

Same here in North central Kansas (rural) took 60..0 to fill up today 
and then I was told it'll be higher by the end of the week. Freaking BS.




Gary Udstrand wrote:


Between $2.49 and $2.69 a gallon at the stations that I drive by on my
way to the office.  Nothing like a $100.00 fill up to start the day.  :-O


--
Cheers,
joeuser (still looking for the 'any' key)

RE: [H] PC won't boot

[FORC5]

first response for me, had a ecs k7s5a pro this week with 6
bad caps, also check in the power supply for bad caps.
fp
At 08:06 AM 8/17/2005, Mark Dodge Poked the stick with:
Check the caps on the MB to see
if any are bulging. 

Mark Dodge
MD Computers
602-421-0329 
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[
mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Jerry
Jones
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 7:47 AM
To: The Hardware List
Subject: [H] PC won't boot
Built my wife's PC about a year ago. Epox MB with an Athlon, 2 sticks
of
256MB RAM, 2 hard drives, DVD drive, and a Radeon 9800SE vid card.
Recently
when she turns on the PC it usually will not boot and just makes a
sound
that is kind of an alternating high then low beep. Hitting the reset
button
will usually cause it to then boot.
Yesterday I pulled off the cover of the case to check out the problem.
After
checking that the video and memory were seated and all cables were
connected, I plugged it back in and tried to turn it on.When power is
turned
on the case fans spin, the cpu and video card fans also are spinning
but
nothing else happens. It does not display anything on the monitor.
Hitting
reset does nothing at all. Everything appears to be getting power, but
the
boot process just does not seem to be starting. Oddly, the DVD drive
will
not open it's tray when the button is pushed.
I have tried swapping video cards with a known working one from my kids
pc
and get the same thing. I have swapped the power connecters on the
hard
drives and the DVD drive. I have tried disconnecting each hard drive
individually and then both hard drives. I have tried booting with just
one
stick of memory. At this point I am at a loss for what might be wrong.
Could
the CPU be dead? The motherboard? Or does it sound like a power
supply
problem?
Jerry 

-- 
Tallyho ! ]:8)
Taglines below !
--
Mary had potatoes, wine, salad, and a little lamb.

Re: Re: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices

[Christopher Fisk]

On Wed, 17 Aug 2005, Ben Ruset wrote:


The energy to crack the water was from solar panels mounted on the roof.

Apparently they have a similar system now hybridized with a gasoline 
engine in a 7 series.


Again, why?  Just use the damn electricity from the solor panels to power 
the car, none of this "make your own hydrogen" step.


Solar panels can't provide enough power to run a full sized car, let alone 
enough to crack the water into hydrogen at a rate to power a car.


I believe you are reading the page wrong too.  This image here explains:

http://www.bmwworld.com/images/cars/7er/clean_energy.gif

The hydrogen is created via solor power elsewhere, not "cracked in the 
car".



The physics of it just wouldn't work at this time.


Christopher Fisk
--
BOFH Excuse #250:
Program load too heavy for processor to lift.

Re: Re: [H] Gas prices

[Thane Sherrington]

At 03:52 PM 17/08/2005, Gary VanderMolen wrote:



Did someone repeal the laws of physics and chemistry?

It takes more energy to crack water than you get back when
recombining the hydrogen and oxygen.


I think that report was a misunderstanding of the technology.  The idea is 
to use solar power in a large plant to crack water into hydrogen.  You 
would fill up with hydrogen at a gas station, and burn it in your 
car.  Hummer is releasing a model that does this as well.  Hydrogen is an 
energy carrier like oil, it isn't free energy.


T 

Re: Re: [H] Gas prices

[Gary VanderMolen]

Ben Ruset wrote:

A few years ago BMW showed off a 5 series that ran off water. It cracked the 
water into
hydrogen within the car itself. 


Of course that tech won't ever see the light of day. :(



Did someone repeal the laws of physics and chemistry?

It takes more energy to crack water than you get back when
recombining the hydrogen and oxygen.

Gary VanderMolen

RE: Re: [H] Gas prices

[007]

I was referring to fission technology (U235).  Since fusion is years away.

007.

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of 007
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 2:26 PM
To: The Hardware List
Subject: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices


The most fuel efficient cars use heavy water.

007.

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Christopher Fisk
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 2:16 PM
To: The Hardware List
Subject: Re: Re: [H] Gas prices


On Wed, 17 Aug 2005, Ben Ruset wrote:

> It's funny, though, that the gas companies are posting record profits. 
> So I really wonder how much of this is an increase in oil price, and how 
> much is just an excuse to charge more for gasoline.

I look at it this way, assuming that a gas company wants to make 5% profit 
on every gallon of gas, it's in thier interest to have thier costs go up 
5% because then thier profit goes up too.

Instead of making 5cents on gas that costs them $1.00 to make they make 6 
cents profit on gas that cost them $1.05 to make (Or similar, you get my 
point =)


Also, the gas we have now was made with oil that cost $50/barrel instead 
of oil that cost $65/barrel, yet we're being charged the $65/barrel price!


Christopher Fisk
-- 
I WILL NOT DO MATH IN CLASS
I WILL NOT DO MATH IN CLASS
Lisa Simpson on chalkboard in episode BABF07

Re: Re: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices

[Ben Ruset]

The energy to crack the water was from solar panels mounted on the roof.

Apparently they have a similar system now hybridized with a gasoline engine in 
a 7 series.

http://www.bmwworld.com/models/750hl.htm

>From: Christopher Fisk <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Date: Wed Aug 17 13:39:10 CDT 2005
>To: The Hardware List 
>Subject: Re: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices

>On Wed, 17 Aug 2005, Ben Ruset wrote:
>
>> A few years ago BMW showed off a 5 series that ran off water. It 
>> cracked the water into hydrogen within the car itself.
>>
>> Of course that tech won't ever see the light of day. :(
>
>This doesn't make sense.  It takes energy to split water into Oxygen and 
>hydrogen.  To then burn that hydrogen to power the car is just a waste of 
>energy.  Why not just use the energy used to crack the water to power the 
>car?  There is no such thing as a perpetual motion machine =)
>
>
>
>Christopher Fisk
>-- 
>BOFH Excuse #330:
>quantum decoherence

Re: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices

[Christopher Fisk]

On Wed, 17 Aug 2005, Ben Ruset wrote:

A few years ago BMW showed off a 5 series that ran off water. It 
cracked the water into hydrogen within the car itself.


Of course that tech won't ever see the light of day. :(


This doesn't make sense.  It takes energy to split water into Oxygen and 
hydrogen.  To then burn that hydrogen to power the car is just a waste of 
energy.  Why not just use the energy used to crack the water to power the 
car?  There is no such thing as a perpetual motion machine =)




Christopher Fisk
--
BOFH Excuse #330:
quantum decoherence

Re: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices

[Ben Ruset]

A few years ago BMW showed off a 5 series that ran off water. It cracked the 
water into hydrogen within the car itself.

Of course that tech won't ever see the light of day. :(

>From: 007 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Date: Wed Aug 17 13:26:05 CDT 2005
>To: The Hardware List 
>Subject: RE: Re: [H] Gas prices

>The most fuel efficient cars use heavy water.
>
>007.
>
>-Original Message-
>From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Christopher Fisk
>Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 2:16 PM
>To: The Hardware List
>Subject: Re: Re: [H] Gas prices
>
>
>On Wed, 17 Aug 2005, Ben Ruset wrote:
>
>> It's funny, though, that the gas companies are posting record profits. 
>> So I really wonder how much of this is an increase in oil price, and how 
>> much is just an excuse to charge more for gasoline.
>
>I look at it this way, assuming that a gas company wants to make 5% profit 
>on every gallon of gas, it's in thier interest to have thier costs go up 
>5% because then thier profit goes up too.
>
>Instead of making 5cents on gas that costs them $1.00 to make they make 6 
>cents profit on gas that cost them $1.05 to make (Or similar, you get my 
>point =)
>
>
>Also, the gas we have now was made with oil that cost $50/barrel instead 
>of oil that cost $65/barrel, yet we're being charged the $65/barrel price!
>
>
>Christopher Fisk
>-- 
>I WILL NOT DO MATH IN CLASS
>I WILL NOT DO MATH IN CLASS
>   Lisa Simpson on chalkboard in episode BABF07

RE: Re: [H] Gas prices

[007]

The most fuel efficient cars use heavy water.

007.

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Christopher Fisk
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 2:16 PM
To: The Hardware List
Subject: Re: Re: [H] Gas prices


On Wed, 17 Aug 2005, Ben Ruset wrote:

> It's funny, though, that the gas companies are posting record profits. 
> So I really wonder how much of this is an increase in oil price, and how 
> much is just an excuse to charge more for gasoline.

I look at it this way, assuming that a gas company wants to make 5% profit 
on every gallon of gas, it's in thier interest to have thier costs go up 
5% because then thier profit goes up too.

Instead of making 5cents on gas that costs them $1.00 to make they make 6 
cents profit on gas that cost them $1.05 to make (Or similar, you get my 
point =)


Also, the gas we have now was made with oil that cost $50/barrel instead 
of oil that cost $65/barrel, yet we're being charged the $65/barrel price!


Christopher Fisk
-- 
I WILL NOT DO MATH IN CLASS
I WILL NOT DO MATH IN CLASS
Lisa Simpson on chalkboard in episode BABF07

RE: Re: [H] Gas prices

[Thane Sherrington]

At 03:23 PM 17/08/2005, Bobby Heid wrote:

I hope you meant $30/barrel!  LOL.


Sorry, barrel. :)

T 

RE: Re: [H] Gas prices

[Bobby Heid]

I hope you meant $30/barrel!  LOL.

Bobby

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Thane Sherrington
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 2:15 PM
To: The Hardware List
Subject: Re: Re: [H] Gas prices



There was a study in Canada that found that the real cost of oil is $30 per 
gallon.  Everything above that is fear.

Re: Re: [H] Gas prices

[Christopher Fisk]

On Wed, 17 Aug 2005, Ben Ruset wrote:

It's funny, though, that the gas companies are posting record profits. 
So I really wonder how much of this is an increase in oil price, and how 
much is just an excuse to charge more for gasoline.


I look at it this way, assuming that a gas company wants to make 5% profit 
on every gallon of gas, it's in thier interest to have thier costs go up 
5% because then thier profit goes up too.


Instead of making 5cents on gas that costs them $1.00 to make they make 6 
cents profit on gas that cost them $1.05 to make (Or similar, you get my 
point =)



Also, the gas we have now was made with oil that cost $50/barrel instead 
of oil that cost $65/barrel, yet we're being charged the $65/barrel price!



Christopher Fisk
--
I WILL NOT DO MATH IN CLASS
I WILL NOT DO MATH IN CLASS
Lisa Simpson on chalkboard in episode BABF07

Re: Re: [H] Gas prices

[Thane Sherrington]

At 03:02 PM 17/08/2005, Ben Ruset wrote:

I paid $2.55/gal for Regular today.

I just wonder if we'll ever get back to the $1.50/gal days again. As harsh 
as it sounds, low gas prices are a lot more important to me that supporing 
anybody's agenda or liberating other countries.


There was a study in Canada that found that the real cost of oil is $30 per 
gallon.  Everything above that is fear.


T 

Re: Re: [H] Gas prices

[Ben Ruset]

I paid $2.55/gal for Regular today. 

I just wonder if we'll ever get back to the $1.50/gal days again. As harsh as 
it sounds, low gas prices are a lot more important to me that supporing 
anybody's agenda or liberating other countries. 

It's funny, though, that the gas companies are posting record profits. So I 
really wonder how much of this is an increase in oil price, and how much is 
just an excuse to charge more for gasoline.

Re: [H] Gas prices

[Gary Udstrand]

Higher octane needs usually result from higher compression in
performance engines.  This higher compression can result in the fuel
igniting (in the absence of a spark from the plug) before the piston
reaches TDC (well, actually the engine should fire prior to TDC.  It is
just firing earlier than it should in the process).  Retarding the
timing will do nothing to prevent pre-detonation (pinging) in that
case.  Also, higher octane does *not* result in more horsepower.  Octane
represents the resistance of the gas to detonation, the higher the
octane the more resistant the fuel is to detonation.  It does not have
more stored energy.

-Gary



Gary VanderMolen said the following on 8/17/2005 12:13 PM:

> Veech wrote:
>
>> $3.00 + in LA, and I had to buy a car that uses premium!  Wonder how
>> much
>> damage I'll do to run it on regular?
>
>
> Most people don't realize that premium gas is just regular gas
> with some anti-knock compounds added. Modern engines have
> anti-knock sensors, so if you accidentally fill up with gas that is
> lower in octane than your engine requires, the computer will
> retard the timing to take care of it. You won't get all the horse-
> power your engine is rated for, but there should be no damage.
>
> Gary VanderMolen
>
>
>

RE: [H] Gas prices

[007]

As I understand it, the modifiers are using one or both of the following
technologies:

1)  Using Lithium batteries (similar to the ones used in camcorders).

2)  By adding more batteries they are modifying the computer system(s), so
they use less gas and more battery power.


There is a third party company that is doing this mod in California.


I would take the mod. process one step further and replace many of the seats
and body of the hybrids with composite as found in 20+ Million yachts that
travel at 64+ knots


007.

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Thane
Sherrington
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 1:06 PM
To: The Hardware List
Subject: RE: [H] Gas prices


At 01:58 PM 17/08/2005, 007 wrote:
>Modified Toyota hybrids have been known to give 250 Miles/gallon.
>
>Cost of modification is about $14,000

Sweet Jesus.  Is this something that is relatively easy to do?  I want
250mpg. :)

T

Re: [H] Gas prices

[Gary VanderMolen]

Veech wrote:

$3.00 + in LA, and I had to buy a car that uses premium!  Wonder how much
damage I'll do to run it on regular?


Most people don't realize that premium gas is just regular gas
with some anti-knock compounds added. Modern engines have
anti-knock sensors, so if you accidentally fill up with gas that is
lower in octane than your engine requires, the computer will
retard the timing to take care of it. You won't get all the horse-
power your engine is rated for, but there should be no damage.

Gary VanderMolen

Re: [H] Gas prices

[Brian Weeden]

On 8/17/05, Thane Sherrington <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> At 01:58 PM 17/08/2005, 007 wrote:
> >Modified Toyota hybrids have been known to give 250 Miles/gallon.
> >
> >Cost of modification is about $14,000
> 
> Sweet Jesus.  Is this something that is relatively easy to do?  I want
> 250mpg. :)
> 

http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20050813/ap_on_hi_te/hybrid_tinkerers

The 250 mpg was a professor who built a hybrid from the ground up
himself as a demo.  Most of the changes revolve around people adding a
plug-in option to it that increased the average mpg to around 80. 
However, a company plans to start offering kits to do this for around
$12,000.

-- 
Brian

RE: [H] Gas prices

[Hayes Elkins]

Rock on, but where are you getting your juice from?

http://cbs5.com/consumer/consumer_story_225005357.html

"Backers of plug-in hybrids acknowledge that the electricity to boost their 
cars generally comes from fossil fuels that create greenhouse gases, but 
they say that process still produces far less pollution than oil. They also 
note that electricity could be generated cleanly from solar power."


The simple answer is more nuclear, solar, and hydroelectric power for the 
masses (but especially more nuclear, hippies need to STFU) The less 
dependence on fossil fuels in the entire energy demand chain the better.




From: "007" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: The Hardware List 
To: "The Hardware List" 
Subject: RE: [H] Gas prices
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 12:58:12 -0400

Modified Toyota hybrids have been known to give 250 Miles/gallon.

Cost of modification is about $14,000

007.

RE: [H] Gas prices

[Thane Sherrington]

At 01:58 PM 17/08/2005, 007 wrote:

Modified Toyota hybrids have been known to give 250 Miles/gallon.

Cost of modification is about $14,000


Sweet Jesus.  Is this something that is relatively easy to do?  I want 
250mpg. :)


T 

Re: [H] Gas prices

[Gary VanderMolen]

I paid $2.73 for regular at a discount station yesterday
(Bay area).

Gary VanderMolen

Re: [H] Check out this Dell deal, expires 8-17

[Veech]

Yeah, checking around I see that they've been that low in the past, as 
recently as late July.  I'll wait around to see if it goes on sale again, no 
rush.  Man, what a nice monitor.  I've been with a 17" CRT for ages.


Looking at getting one of those hot rod GeForce 7800 cards, hoping they're 
compatible..


- Original Message - 
From: "Greg Sevart" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: "The Hardware List" 
Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 4:59 PM
Subject: Re: [H] Check out this Dell deal, expires 8-17


Definitely a nice price, but that monitor has been down to $750 before, 
and $800 frequently. A same-spec'd 9100 on ebay has been going for around 
$450. Again, a nice price, but not completely exceptional.


That being said, if I hadn't just bought an AMD Athlon 64 X2 4400+ dual 
core, I might have jumped on it. :)
(on a side note, X2's are piss poor overclockers...only able to get to 
2.45GHz stable, 50MHz higher than a 4800+ X2)


Greg

- Original Message - 
From: "Veech" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: "The Hardware List" 
Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 6:39 PM
Subject: [H] Check out this Dell deal, expires 8-17



Hey guys,

Are my eyes deceiving me?  Or is this one of those odd Dell discounts 
that are almost too good to be true?  Check the link, it's for a Dell 
Dimension 9100 system that's fairly stripped down, but it includes their 
highly-rated 24" Flat Panel monitor.


http://configure.us.dell.com/dellstore/config.aspx?c=us&cs=04&kc=6W300&l=en&oc=3d91h3b&s=bsd

Thing is, the monitor itself is over $1000 even on sale, this whole 
system (including the monitor0 is $1299, and $1199 after the mail-in 
rebate.


Here's what I'm thinking, buy this system mainly for the monitor, and 
installing a GeForce 7800 GTX card in it, and having a killer gaming rig. 
I could install my own sound card and DVD/CD-RW from my current system 
and upgrade RAM and the HD's as I go along.


Opinions?

thanks,

Veech

Re: [hardware] Re: [H] Gas prices

[Steve]

In my area  (Sydney) price starts on Wed 
morning  @ 
AU$1.18/litre for regular unleaded i.e.4.72/US 
Gallon or US$3.60. Add another 0.07/l for Premium. By Tues its dropped to 
1.10/l. Then the cycle repeats. 
And the government & the oil companies 
say there is no collusion? 
yeah...right
Diesel is a whopping 1.45/l. Gas about 
37/l

   
   
   
  Original Message - 
  From: 
  Veech 

  To: The Hardware List 
  Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2005 2:45 
  AM
  Subject: [hardware] Re: [H] Gas 
  prices
  $3.00 + in LA, and I had to buy a car that uses premium!  
  Wonder how much damage I'll do to run it on regular?- Original 
  Message - From: "Thane Sherrington" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>To: Sent: 
  Wednesday, August 17, 2005 9:14 AMSubject: [H] Gas prices> 
  Our gas prices climbed $0.06 per litre yesterday, so we are at $4.27 US 
  > per gallon now.  Just wondering what you're paying down in 
  there.>> T> 

RE: [H] Gas prices

[007]

Modified Toyota hybrids have been known to give 250 Miles/gallon.

Cost of modification is about $14,000

007.

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Hayes Elkins
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 12:57 PM
To: hardware@hardwaregroup.com
Subject: RE: [H] Gas prices


It's getting near $3 here in metro DC.

I get a particular feeling of cynicism when I see soccer moms spend over
$120 to fill up a useless land barge who's closest activity to off roading
was encountering a DC pothole on the way to Starbucks. The "Support Our
Troops" stickers usually affixed adds to the irony. No, moron, you are not
supporting our troops, you are supporting terror-funding, filthy Arab
regimes who support our troops' ENEMIES through proxy.

For those keeping score on fuel efficient vehicles, the VW TDI's get the
best real world gas mileage - more than the hybrids. Don't blame Toyota for
their false MPG ratings, blame the incompetents at the EPA for that. Too bad
that TDI's wont give you the government perks a Prius buys you.

>From: Thane Sherrington <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Reply-To: The Hardware List 
>To: hardware@hardwaregroup.com
>Subject: [H] Gas prices
>Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 13:14:54 -0300
>
>Our gas prices climbed $0.06 per litre yesterday, so we are at $4.27 US per
>gallon now.  Just wondering what you're paying down in there.
>
>T
>

Re: [H] Gas prices

[Al]

"Veech" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> $3.00 + in LA, and I had to buy a car that uses premium!  Wonder how much 
> damage I'll do to run it on regular?

Check into buying a pint of octane buster to use with the regular grade
gas.

HTH,
Al

Re: [H] Gas prices

[Brian Weeden]

See, this is the beautiful thing about capitalism that I tried to
explain to my Canadian girlfriend.  Unfortunately in the world we live
in the vast majority of people are not going to do something simply
because it is the "right" thing to do or is for the good of everyone. 
They need an incentive, and capitalism gives them that incentive.

The bottom line here in America is that if there isn't an economic
reason for it, it won't happen and people won't do it.  With gas at
$1-$2 per gallon, there is no economic incentive for people to buy
more fuel efficient cars or for companies to make cars using
alternative fuels.

However, as you see the gas prices climb you now have an economic
incentive on both ends.  Now, all the major car companies are
scrambling to revamp because whomever comes out with the powerful yet
efficient yet stylish new model will seize the market and make a
killing.  And almost everyone I know has said that fuel economy will
play a major factor in their next car purchase.

Major things like this won't change overnight like the dreamers who
don't live in the real world think they should, but things WILL change
over time.  You just have to give the market the right incentive.

BTW, the same argument can be made for the carbon trading market for
greenhouse gases, but that is another discussion entirely.

-- 
Brian

RE: [H] Gas prices

[007]

It's all about math.

Here in the US we pay less for gas but use our cars more often. (Except in a
few cities like NY and DC).

At the end of the day all of us have equal ratio in gas expenses.

007.

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Neil Davidson
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 12:25 PM
To: 'The Hardware List'
Subject: RE: [H] Gas prices


Don't complain.

1 Gallon (US) = 3.79 litres
1 litre   = ~£0.90 (from the BBC news site as of last week)
1 Gallon  = ~£3.41
  = ~$6.16

How's that! :(

> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of
> Thane Sherrington
> Sent: 17 August 2005 17:15
> To: hardware@hardwaregroup.com
> Subject: [H] Gas prices
>
> Our gas prices climbed $0.06 per litre yesterday, so we are
> at $4.27 US per gallon now.  Just wondering what you're
> paying down in there.
>
> T
>

RE: [H] Gas prices

[Hayes Elkins]

It's getting near $3 here in metro DC.

I get a particular feeling of cynicism when I see soccer moms spend over 
$120 to fill up a useless land barge who's closest activity to off roading 
was encountering a DC pothole on the way to Starbucks. The "Support Our 
Troops" stickers usually affixed adds to the irony. No, moron, you are not 
supporting our troops, you are supporting terror-funding, filthy Arab 
regimes who support our troops' ENEMIES through proxy.


For those keeping score on fuel efficient vehicles, the VW TDI's get the 
best real world gas mileage - more than the hybrids. Don't blame Toyota for 
their false MPG ratings, blame the incompetents at the EPA for that. Too bad 
that TDI's wont give you the government perks a Prius buys you.



From: Thane Sherrington <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: The Hardware List 
To: hardware@hardwaregroup.com
Subject: [H] Gas prices
Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 13:14:54 -0300

Our gas prices climbed $0.06 per litre yesterday, so we are at $4.27 US per 
gallon now.  Just wondering what you're paying down in there.


T

Re: [H] Gas prices

[Henrik Tived]

Guys,

stop complaining, Denmark has for the last decade paid close to US$2 per 
litre if not more


DownUnder (Australia) we are currently paying $1.12-1.20 aussie dollars per 
litre (USD$0.77 = AUD$1)


so what were you saying about your high gas price ?? :-)

Henrik

- Original Message - 
From: "Neil Davidson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: "'The Hardware List'" 
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2005 12:24 AM
Subject: RE: [H] Gas prices



Don't complain.

1 Gallon (US) = 3.79 litres
1 litre   = ~£0.90 (from the BBC news site as of last week)
1 Gallon  = ~£3.41
 = ~$6.16

How's that! :(


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of
Thane Sherrington
Sent: 17 August 2005 17:15
To: hardware@hardwaregroup.com
Subject: [H] Gas prices

Our gas prices climbed $0.06 per litre yesterday, so we are
at $4.27 US per gallon now.  Just wondering what you're
paying down in there.

T

Re: [H] Gas prices

[Veech]

$3.00 + in LA, and I had to buy a car that uses premium!  Wonder how much 
damage I'll do to run it on regular?


- Original Message - 
From: "Thane Sherrington" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: 
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 9:14 AM
Subject: [H] Gas prices


Our gas prices climbed $0.06 per litre yesterday, so we are at $4.27 US 
per gallon now.  Just wondering what you're paying down in there.


T

RE: [H] Gas prices

[Neil Davidson]

Don't complain.

1 Gallon (US) = 3.79 litres
1 litre   = ~£0.90 (from the BBC news site as of last week)
1 Gallon  = ~£3.41
  = ~$6.16

How's that! :(

> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of 
> Thane Sherrington
> Sent: 17 August 2005 17:15
> To: hardware@hardwaregroup.com
> Subject: [H] Gas prices
> 
> Our gas prices climbed $0.06 per litre yesterday, so we are 
> at $4.27 US per gallon now.  Just wondering what you're 
> paying down in there.
> 
> T
> 

RE: [H] Gas prices

[Bobby Heid]

I paid $2.45US/gallon on Monday.

Bobby

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Thane Sherrington
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 12:15 PM
To: hardware@hardwaregroup.com
Subject: [H] Gas prices


Our gas prices climbed $0.06 per litre yesterday, so we are at $4.27 US per 
gallon now.  Just wondering what you're paying down in there.

T

Re: [H] Gas prices

[Gary Udstrand]

Between $2.49 and $2.69 a gallon at the stations that I drive by on my
way to the office.  Nothing like a $100.00 fill up to start the day.  :-O

-Gary



Thane Sherrington said the following on 8/17/2005 11:14 AM:

> Our gas prices climbed $0.06 per litre yesterday, so we are at $4.27
> US per gallon now.  Just wondering what you're paying down in there.
>
> T
>

[H] Gas prices

[Thane Sherrington]

Our gas prices climbed $0.06 per litre yesterday, so we are at $4.27 US per 
gallon now.  Just wondering what you're paying down in there.


T

RE: [H] PC won't boot

[Mark Dodge]

Check the caps on the MB to see if any are bulging. 


Mark Dodge
MD Computers
602-421-0329 
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jerry Jones
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 7:47 AM
To: The Hardware List
Subject: [H] PC won't boot

Built my wife's PC about a year ago. Epox MB with an Athlon, 2 sticks of
256MB RAM, 2 hard drives, DVD drive, and a Radeon 9800SE vid card. Recently
when she turns on the PC it usually will not boot and just makes a sound
that is kind of an alternating high then low beep. Hitting the reset button
will usually cause it to then boot.

Yesterday I pulled off the cover of the case to check out the problem. After
checking that the video and memory were seated and all cables were
connected, I plugged it back in and tried to turn it on.When power is turned
on the case fans spin, the cpu and video card fans also are spinning but
nothing else happens. It does not display anything on the monitor. Hitting
reset does nothing at all. Everything appears to be getting power, but the
boot process just does not seem to be starting. Oddly, the DVD drive will
not open it's tray when the button is pushed.

I have tried swapping video cards with a known working one from my kids pc
and get the same thing. I have swapped the power connecters on the hard
drives and the DVD drive. I have tried disconnecting each hard drive
individually and then both hard drives. I have tried booting with just one
stick of memory. At this point I am at a loss for what might be wrong. Could
the CPU be dead? The motherboard? Or does it sound like a power supply
problem?

Jerry 

RE: [H] PC won't boot

[007]

Take out the CPU and reseat it.

007.

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Jerry Jones
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 10:47 AM
To: The Hardware List
Subject: [H] PC won't boot


Built my wife's PC about a year ago. Epox MB with an Athlon, 2 sticks of
256MB RAM, 2 hard drives, DVD drive, and a Radeon 9800SE vid card. Recently
when she turns on the PC it usually will not boot and just makes a sound
that is kind of an alternating high then low beep. Hitting the reset button
will usually cause it to then boot.

Yesterday I pulled off the cover of the case to check out the problem. After
checking that the video and memory were seated and all cables were
connected, I plugged it back in and tried to turn it on.When power is turned
on the case fans spin, the cpu and video card fans also are spinning but
nothing else happens. It does not display anything on the monitor. Hitting
reset does nothing at all. Everything appears to be getting power, but the
boot process just does not seem to be starting. Oddly, the DVD drive will
not open it's tray when the button is pushed.

I have tried swapping video cards with a known working one from my kids pc
and get the same thing. I have swapped the power connecters on the hard
drives and the DVD drive. I have tried disconnecting each hard drive
individually and then both hard drives. I have tried booting with just one
stick of memory. At this point I am at a loss for what might be wrong. Could
the CPU be dead? The motherboard? Or does it sound like a power supply
problem?

Jerry

Re: [H] PC won't boot

[Winterlight]

 then both hard drives. I have tried booting with just one stick of 
memory. At this point I am at a loss for what might be wrong. Could the 
CPU be dead? The motherboard? Or does it sound like a power supply problem?

Jerry


Sounds like a dead motherboard

Re: [H] PC won't boot

[Thane Sherrington]

At 11:46 AM 17/08/2005, Jerry Jones wrote:
each hard drive individually and then both hard drives. I have tried 
booting with just one stick of memory. At this point I am at a loss for 
what might be wrong. Could the CPU be dead? The motherboard? Or does it 
sound like a power supply problem?


I'd start with RAM (try each DIMM in different slots.)  Then power supply.

T 

[H] PC won't boot

[Jerry Jones]

Built my wife's PC about a year ago. Epox MB with an Athlon, 2 sticks of 
256MB RAM, 2 hard drives, DVD drive, and a Radeon 9800SE vid card. Recently 
when she turns on the PC it usually will not boot and just makes a sound 
that is kind of an alternating high then low beep. Hitting the reset button 
will usually cause it to then boot.


Yesterday I pulled off the cover of the case to check out the problem. After 
checking that the video and memory were seated and all cables were 
connected, I plugged it back in and tried to turn it on.When power is turned 
on the case fans spin, the cpu and video card fans also are spinning but 
nothing else happens. It does not display anything on the monitor. Hitting 
reset does nothing at all. Everything appears to be getting power, but the 
boot process just does not seem to be starting. Oddly, the DVD drive will 
not open it's tray when the button is pushed.


I have tried swapping video cards with a known working one from my kids pc 
and get the same thing. I have swapped the power connecters on the hard 
drives and the DVD drive. I have tried disconnecting each hard drive 
individually and then both hard drives. I have tried booting with just one 
stick of memory. At this point I am at a loss for what might be wrong. Could 
the CPU be dead? The motherboard? Or does it sound like a power supply 
problem?


Jerry 

RE: [H] Inexpensive blank DVD media

[Bobby Heid]

Just found this:
Verbatim 16x DVD+R/-R (100 ct) at OD for $37.99 
http://www.fatwallet.com/forums/messageview.php?pos=110&catid=18&threadid=50
8625

Are these any good?

Bobby


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Greg Sevart
Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 9:36 PM
To: The Hardware List
Subject: Re: [H] Inexpensive blank DVD media


> At 06:40 PM 8/16/2005, Greg Sevart typed:
>>Spend a bit more money and get some actually good discs. The Ritek/Ridata 
>>stuff is pretty crappy anymore. They were good when their G04 media first 
>>came out, but have been plagued by quality control and poor dyes ever 
>>since.
>
> I use Ritek DVD-R G05 8x disks & have never had a problem. My Pioneer A08 
> with 3rd party firmware easily burns these at 16x & I save $15 to $20 per 
> hundred as compared to buying Ritek 16x disks.
>

Have you performed PIE/PIF and PO scans on these discs after some time has 
elapsed since burning? A simple "successful burn" is not nearly sufficient 
to determine if the burn was a quality burn. A successful burn can easily 
become unreadable within a week or two (but usually longer) if the burn 
quality itself was poor. Or, the error rate might be such that many readers 
are either unable to read the disc at all, or have to train down to produce 
accurate playback. The Taiyo Yuden and MCC discs and dyes significantly 
outperform Ritek discs in a the majority of burners and firmware. This 
becomes even more important in RW and dual/double layer discs, where buying 
anything other than MCC is being foolish. (consider this: Verbatim/MCC 2.4x 
DVD+R9 DL discs can be successfully burned at 8x and produce excellent scan 
results)
[Disclaimer: The overwhelming majority of my personal experience is with -R 
media.]

Interestingly, you do touch on something I've seen both in reviews and in 
burns and scans I've performed myself. A modern drive with modern media 
produces a terrible result when burning at low speeds. While conventional 
wisdom might suggest that burning an 8x disc at 2x would result in a better 
burn, the PIE/PIF and PO scans provide extremely strong evidence that the 
newer dyes and drives just don't work well at low speeds. Indeed, I've seen 
better burns on 8x media when written at 12x than when written at 4, 6, or 
the even the rated 8x.

In short, if you want your discs to have as long of a shelf life and 
readability as possible, buy a quality burner, use quality media, and burn 
the discs at least at the rated speed.


Greg

Re: [H] Inexpensive blank DVD media

[Greg Sevart]

The problem isn't so much doing the scan...there are a handful of tools out 
there that can do it, and a handful of drives that support it (and a handful 
of those that can scan with any sort of consistency). The problem is being 
able to interpret the results properly, based on the speeds, drive used, the 
media, and the scan parameters. If a single element is off or 
misrepresented, the results are completely worthless. At any rate, I don't 
have the time at the moment (about to leave) to explain it in detail. :)


Greg

- Original Message - 
From: "Thane Sherrington" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: "The Hardware List" 
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 5:18 AM
Subject: Re: [H] Inexpensive blank DVD media



At 10:36 PM 16/08/2005, Greg Sevart wrote:

Have you performed PIE/PIF and PO scans on these discs after some time has 
elapsed since burning? A simple "successful burn" is not nearly sufficient 
to determine if the burn was a quality


How do I do a PIE/PIF or PO scan?

T

Re: [H] Inexpensive blank DVD media

[Thane Sherrington]

At 10:36 PM 16/08/2005, Greg Sevart wrote:

Have you performed PIE/PIF and PO scans on these discs after some time has 
elapsed since burning? A simple "successful burn" is not nearly sufficient 
to determine if the burn was a quality


How do I do a PIE/PIF or PO scan?

T