Re: How to go to a new website in Safari

[Justin Harford]

cmd+l takes you to the address bar.
On Sep 25, 2009, at 10:53 PM, Kevin Gibbs wrote:

 Guys,
 AS some of you may know, I'm a guy who doesn't yet own a Mac but  
 wishes to learn as much as I can before buying one.  If I open  
 Safari and want to go to a new website using a link which is not on  
 the current page, How do I either move myself into the address bar  
 to type a new url, or, what is the equivalent of the windows command  
 CTRL o in Internet Explorer that opens the dialog box in which you  
 type a new url to go to.  Assume that I don't automatically move  
 into the HTML content area when Safari opens.  In fact, make no  
 assumptions as to whether I'm in the toolbar, the body of a webpage,  
 or anywhere else I might be dumped when Safari opens with VO  
 active.  Currently, I'm grabbing occasional opportunities to  
 practice on my wife's Power PC based 17 inch Mac Powerbook running  
 Leopard.  I haven't gone into VO Utility to customize how VO  
 navigates in Safari.  I'm familiar with DOM and haven't tried Group  
 Mode.  If there's a difference between how you do this in Leopard  
 and how you'd do it in Snow Leopard, please let me know both recipes.
 Thanks,
 Kevin

 


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Automator

[Justin Harford]

Has anyone tried to use automator since upgrading to SL?  I find I get  
an access of busy signals which at times renders the app nearly  
impossible to use.

Justin Harford 

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Re: unzipping password-protected archives

[Justin Harford]

Howdy there.

You also have the option of using the built in unzip program in the  
terminal.

1.  Open terminal from the utilities folder
2.  in the terminal window, type sudo unzip file path.

~/ is a short cut for the home directory, so if I had file.zip in my  
home folder I would type

sudo unzip ~/file.zip

This is what I use to unzip my bookshare files.

Regards
Justin Harford
On Sep 26, 2009, at 10:30 PM, Esther wrote:


 Hi Anna,

 You need to get the Unarchiver from:

 http://wakaba.c3.cx/s/apps/unarchiver.html

 or else use Stuffit Expander. This is actually mentioned on
 BookShare's FAQ page.  I still keep a copy of Stuffit Expander around,
 though I haven't come across a file that I absolutely had to use this
 (and no other alternative expander) for at least three or four years.
 Some of the password-protected formats are proprietary, meaning that
 there are licensing fees involved.  My main objection to using Stuffit
 Expander is that Smith-Micro, perhaps the third company to own this
 product after the original developer got bought out, makes you supply
 an email address to get access to the product and then sends out huge
 amounts of spam advertising.  If anyone absolutely insists on using
 Stuffit Expander, the last edition that can be obtained through the
 versiontracker link that doesn't require you to supply an email
 address can be found at this link:

 http://www.versiontracker.com/dyn/moreinfo/macosx/182

 This points to the page for Stuffit Expander 13.0.2 (2008-11-06),
 which is the last version that you can directly download as a
 diskimage file without registering an address at the Smith-Micro site.
 It still worked as of three months ago.

 Otherwise, almost every file you need to unpack that isn't already
 covered by the Mac's BOM Archive expansion, including the ones from
 BookShare, can be handled by the Unarchiver.

 HTH.

 Cheers,

 Esther

 Woody Anna Dresner wrote:


 Hi,

 I just downloaded a book from Bookshare and tried to unpack it, and I
 was surprised to find out that the archive program that comes with  
 the
 Mac doesn't know how to handle password-protected zip files. I was
 told it couldn't open the file, and that was it. Is there some  
 setting
 I can change to make it work, and if not, is there an accessible
 program for the Mac that can do the job?

 Thanks,
 Anna





 


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notes in mail

[Justin Harford]

Has anyone noticed that you can't read notes anymore in mail?

Or has someone figured out how to do it?

Justin Harford 

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Re: VO and screenwriting software

[Justin Harford]

Probably better go out and google.  If you end up finding that all the  
graphical apps don't work well however, you might consider the  
screenplay package class for LaTeX.  You might experience a bit of a  
learning curve at the beginning, but it might be worth it.  I looked  
at the manual screenplay.pdf file and it looks as though the package  
was written with the Academy of of Motion Picture Arts and Sciences in  
mind.

Justin Harford
On Sep 25, 2009, at 10:32 AM, Israel wrote:


 Hi Everyone!

 I am wondering does anyone use a screenwriting software with VO?
 Which software is accessible?

 All the playwrights and screenwriters I know insist on Final Draft or
 Movie Magic- the top two Hollywood standards.  After much research, I
 bought Final Draft 7.13 and it worked fine when I was using my PC but
 upon buying my Mac, I learned that most aspects of FD and MM for that
 fact are accessible with VO except the actual part where I would  
 write/
 edit my screenplays.

 Montage by Mariner Sotware makes it a point to state that it is 100%
 accessible to the blind and visually impaired, but various Hollywood
 screenwriters including John August give them credit for at least
 trying to compete with the Big 2 but that the software does not always
 format your scripts properly as Final Draft or Movie Magic do.  I know
 Final Draft released a version 8 a few months back, but I've not been
 able to find out if it is accessible with VO.  So, if anyone knows or
 has suggestions on screenwriting software which does properly format
 and is very much accessible with VO, I'd appreciate it.

 Israel Antonio

















 


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Re: iPhone honored by NFB

[Justin Harford]

Sweet.
On Sep 25, 2009, at 11:53 AM, Chris Blouch wrote:


 I didn't notice this mentioned on the list previously. I was one of  
 the
 speakers at the NFB Web Accessibility Day in Baltimore MD on Tuesday  
 and
 during the lunch Marc Maurer, President of the NFB, gave out some  
 awards
 to companies they felt were leaders in the accessibility space. In
 particular they gave an award of commendation to Apple for the iPhone
 and iPod touch for doing what many folks said could not be done - to
 make a touch screen UI fully accessible. I know that the NFB in the  
 past
 has been a follower in recognizing the feat of design and engineering
 that accessibility on the iPhone is but it sounds like at least the  
 top
 brass are now fully aware as Dr. Maurer gave clear praise to Apple and
 the work done there. Lets hope NFB now give full and fair promotion in
 the rest of its communications.

 http://www.nfb.org/nfb/NewsBot.asp?MODE=VIEWID=468SnID=1364143865

 As a side note, it was interesting to overhear the questions folks had
 of the Apple rep before and after the presentation. Some wanted to  
 know
 more or how it worked (apparently having never tried an iPhone/iPod
 Touch). The Apple rep also pointed out that the gesture technology has
 been backported to Snow Leopard for use with trackpads which was  
 warmly
 received. I'm sure everyone on this list is fully aware of these  
 things
 but it kind of surprised me that a room full of accessibility  
 'experts'
 were so unaware.

 CB

 


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Re: iPhone honored by NFB

[Justin Harford]

Uh yeah.
On Sep 25, 2009, at 2:59 PM, Jean-Philippe Rykiel wrote:

 Sorry for a very down-to-earth question, but does the IPhone come  
 with V O as well?
 JPR
 http://myspace.com/jeanphilipperykiel
 - Original Message -
 From: Chris Blouch
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 10:48 PM
 Subject: Re: iPhone honored by NFB


 Some have difficulty comprehending what is new and, by definition, not
 well understood. So they define the new in terms of what's known from
 the past, but when something is a revolution rather than an evolution
 the comparisons fail. Some will lodge those failures as the fault of
 what was being measured and dismiss it as being flawed. Others, more
 rarely, will correctly realize that the measurement framework has  
 failed
 and reevaluate their worldview. The NFB has been measuring sharks  
 for a
 long while and Apple brought in an leopard. It will take time for the
 definition of 'good' to be redefined.

 CB

 william lomas wrote:
  they can soon praise the iPhone yet slam the mac?
  hyppocrits
 
 
  
 


 


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Re: load of rubbish!

[Justin Harford]

Wow just listened.

Well I would have to say that apple made a mistake.  They designed  
their phone for competent blind people.

Regards
Justin Harford
On Sep 25, 2009, at 2:55 PM, Chris Blouch wrote:


 For those curious, the audio can be found here:

 http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b00mr52m

 I was able to listen here in the states just fine.

 CB

 william lomas wrote:
hi for those who can listen to the In Touch listen again  
 from last
 night, on bbc radio 4
 they are saying the IPHone is totally inaccessible why do they not
 give apple credit, where it is due





 


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Re: Need a Version of Adium that I Can Tolerate

[Justin Harford]

So the latest version is 1.3.6.

I just google older versions of adium and there is a website from  
which older versions can be downloaded.  It gives you a list of them  
and the dates they were released.  Anyone remember when adium became  
accessible?

I tried a version from Februray of 2008, and it seemed to work fine.   
Try it out.

J
On Sep 24, 2009, at 8:15 AM, magkisa83 wrote:


 Hi guys,

 It's tiffanitsa at gmail dot com using my new e-mail and the name I
 hope to make legal one day.  Anyway, I'm totally fed up with Adium.
 The newer version started showing me tons of contacts all of a sudden,
 including ones that I'd already deleted.  I downloaded 1.3.4, hoping
 it would let me add and delete accounts properly, but of course, no
 such luck.  It won't connect my yahoo and I can't add a new account
 cause it keeps sending me back to my list of contacts.  I can't edit
 an existing account cause I can't find any option.  I didn't even
 bother trying to change the sounds.  What version of Adium is actually
 usable?  I know there was one that I used to use that worked nicely.
 It was when it still called the unknown field html or htm or whatever.
 Also, the one right after that was nice.  If there's a better program
 out there, please let me know.

 Thanks,
 Eleni

 


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Re: facebook chat

[Justin Harford]

Nope haven't noticed.
On Sep 24, 2009, at 2:22 PM, william lomas wrote:


   Hi has anyone else using adium noted that the facebook chat client
 plugin is inaccessible?
 I.e. it doesn't show the latest messages as in MsN etc?


 


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Re: Need a Version of Adium that I Can Tolerate

[Justin Harford]

Whatever.  The latest stable release not beta.  But anyway she was  
asking about older versions not newer ones.

J
On Sep 24, 2009, at 2:43 PM, Chantel Cuddemi wrote:


 No it isn't. There's beta version. It's version four point something I
 think.
 On Sep 24, 2009, at 5:21 PM, Justin Harford wrote:


 So the latest version is 1.3.6.

 I just google older versions of adium and there is a website from
 which older versions can be downloaded.  It gives you a list of them
 and the dates they were released.  Anyone remember when adium became
 accessible?

 I tried a version from Februray of 2008, and it seemed to work fine.
 Try it out.

 J
 On Sep 24, 2009, at 8:15 AM, magkisa83 wrote:


 Hi guys,

 It's tiffanitsa at gmail dot com using my new e-mail and the name I
 hope to make legal one day.  Anyway, I'm totally fed up with Adium.
 The newer version started showing me tons of contacts all of a
 sudden,
 including ones that I'd already deleted.  I downloaded 1.3.4, hoping
 it would let me add and delete accounts properly, but of course, no
 such luck.  It won't connect my yahoo and I can't add a new account
 cause it keeps sending me back to my list of contacts.  I can't edit
 an existing account cause I can't find any option.  I didn't even
 bother trying to change the sounds.  What version of Adium is
 actually
 usable?  I know there was one that I used to use that worked nicely.
 It was when it still called the unknown field html or htm or
 whatever.
 Also, the one right after that was nice.  If there's a better  
 program
 out there, please let me know.

 Thanks,
 Eleni







 


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Re: Voiceover crashing when Using google search

[Justin Harford]

This is curious.  I just googled iPhone, so I pressed cmd+option+f to  
jump to the search box in the tool bar, typed yphone pressed return,  
and then waited for the page to load.  Vo interacted automatically  
with the html content, and I pressed vo right arrow until I found the  
results and had no problem.

What are your web settings?

Justin Harford
On Sep 24, 2009, at 9:39 PM, Pete Nalda wrote:



 On Sep 24, 2009, at 2:27 PM, Howard Dupuis wrote:


 It is not just you. But for me, at least, it restarts as quickly as  
 it
 crashes.

 Simon Cavendish wrote:
 Dear All,

 I wonder whether any of you can test this and confirm. When I use
 google search and bring up google text box with command+option+f,  
 and
 type my search and then press enter, and when I move vo+arrow keys  
 to
 navigate to the results, Voiceover crashes. It happens every time.
 Has
 anyone else noticed that? I dont want to bother Accessibility if it
 is
 just me.

 With best wishes, Simon

 I couldn't replicate the problem here.  cmd+option+f worked just fine
 for me even with voiceover on.  btw running macbook pro w/10.6.1

 Egun On, Lagunak! (Basque for G'day, Mates)
 Pete Nalda
 http://www.myspace.com/musikonalda




 


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Re: Safari - is there a way to stop the address bar from completing websites please?

[Justin Harford]

Press the spacebar once before typing the address.
On Sep 23, 2009, at 11:46 AM, James  Nash wrote:


 Hi everyone,

 Is there a way to stop the Safari address bar from completing web site
 addresses please?

 Thank you

 Take care

 James

 


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Re: windows 7

[Justin Harford]

Boot camp is actually pretty accessible now.  You now have the ability  
to set the size of the partition that boot camp makes with snow  
leopard.  You can install windows 7 just fine, or at least I was able  
to anyway.  I don't use it much though and I don't know if there are  
drivers I'm unaware of.  I doubt it.  But when you get into installing  
windows, its just not accessible because its windows and that's how it  
is.  If you have one of those unattended installation disks, it should  
be pretty easy.

J
On Sep 21, 2009, at 6:42 PM, May McDonald wrote:


 Hi everyone.  I have just discovered that I will unfortunately have to
 put windows on my mac machine.  There's a chat site that I go on and
 they haven't fixed their client yet to work with mac.  Does anyone
 know if windows 7 will be able to go on the macbook?  All I could find
 on the subject was about windows xp and vista.  Also, is bootcamp
 accessible since it is on the macbook or should I try something else
 to install windows?

 May and Wynter with a y

 


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Re: reading from links that just expand question

[Justin Harford]

Do you use groups mode?  It could be that VO is not detecting the  
dynamically changing HTML content which is a weakness of groups mode.   
Why don't you send us the URL so we could varify what you are talking  
about.

  J
On Sep 21, 2009, at 7:20 PM, Christina wrote:


 Hi list,

 I am trying to read a page of FAQ's.  The problem is that when I click
 on the link for the question, some text just kind of expands from the
 link and I cannot access the text with the vo arrow keys nor can I
 interact with it.  It's as if the text with the answer does not even
 exist on the page.  I know this is happening because my hubby told
 me.  I have encountered this on other websites in the past.  Is there
 a way to access that text so that voiceover will read it to me?

 I hope the above all made sense.  :)

 Thanks,
 Christina

 


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Re: windows 7

[Justin Harford]

I did this on a macbook pro original purchased in april of 2006.
On Sep 21, 2009, at 8:10 PM, chris polk wrote:


 what version of the macbook are you using?

 On Sep 21, 2009, at 8:04 PM, Justin Harford wrote:


 It does not exactly mean you can't do it without sighted assistance.
 It means that you have a choice between partitioning your drive 50/50
 or just giving windows 32 gb.  I supposed you might be able to use  
 the
 disk utility on the boot CD  to partition the drive more precicely  
 but
 then you wil have to erase your mac partition and start from scratch.
 So in this respect boot camp could be accessible, but installing
 windows remains the same story unless you have an unattended
 installation CD.

 I have not had these audio problems in boot camp with windows.  All
 you do is turn up the system volume.

 Justin Harford
 On Sep 21, 2009, at 7:51 PM, chris polk wrote:


 Hi:
 just my observations here.
 In windows xp/vista/7 on the new mackbook pros that came out in  
 june,
 there are audio issues.
 the volume is really low and can not be adjusted. there is a patch
 that someone wrote, but it still isn't the same quality audio as if
 you were in sl.

 this is not a problem in fusion, only booting the windows OS  
 natively
 using bootcamp partition.

 Chris
 On Sep 21, 2009, at 7:46 PM, Justin Harford wrote:


 Boot camp is actually pretty accessible now.  You now have the
 ability
 to set the size of the partition that boot camp makes with snow
 leopard.  You can install windows 7 just fine, or at least I was
 able
 to anyway.  I don't use it much though and I don't know if there  
 are
 drivers I'm unaware of.  I doubt it.  But when you get into
 installing
 windows, its just not accessible because its windows and that's how
 it
 is.  If you have one of those unattended installation disks, it
 should
 be pretty easy.

 J
 On Sep 21, 2009, at 6:42 PM, May McDonald wrote:


 Hi everyone.  I have just discovered that I will unfortunately  
 have
 to
 put windows on my mac machine.  There's a chat site that I go on
 and
 they haven't fixed their client yet to work with mac.  Does anyone
 know if windows 7 will be able to go on the macbook?  All I could
 find
 on the subject was about windows xp and vista.  Also, is bootcamp
 accessible since it is on the macbook or should I try something
 else
 to install windows?

 May and Wynter with a y













 


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Re: windows 7

[Justin Harford]

Hello
On Sep 21, 2009, at 9:30 PM, chris polk wrote:

 you can fix the  caps lock easy enough with fusion

How do you do this?

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Re: Using voice over during a call on iphone.

[Justin Harford]

Send your opinions to accessibil...@apple.com.

I had an extensive correspondence over this with them a while back.   
The more people they see with that opinion, the more likely it is that  
we will get a fix.

J D
On Sep 19, 2009, at 11:37 AM, Tony Bernedal wrote:


 Hi Donna.
 aha, you need speaker phone aktiv. Not a good solution in my opinion
 regarding privacy but maybe it works with headset but we hope apple
 makes v o speaks in the earpeace in future update.
 But it works now. Many thanks for your anser.
 Regards Tony


 2009/9/19, Donna Goodin goodi...@msu.edu:

 Hi Tony,

 Re using Vo while on a call:

 1.  Hold the phone away from you to activate speaker phone.
 2.  Two finger flick up to get VO speaking.
 3.  While VO is speaking, press the volume switch up untill you  
 have the VO
 voice volume where you want it.

 You will then be able to press the keypad button to actifvate the  
 keypad.

 If you have the latest upgrade on your phone, VO will remember the  
 volume,
 and you will only have to do this once.
 Best,
 Donna

 -Original Message-
 From: Tony Bernedal t...@bernedal.net
 Sent: Saturday, September 19, 2009 1:46 PM
 To: macvisionaries macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Subject: Using voice over during a call on iphone.


 Hi all.
 I have looked around the webb but can't find answer to my ipone  
 question.
 I have used the iphone for a couple of days and so far no problem.
 But a question. How do I activate voice over during a call? I red
 somewhere that you can flick two fingers upwards to get v o speaking
 but that didn't work.
 I need v o during calls so I can navigate the phone keypad so I for
 example can use tone controled systems.
 Any Idea?
 And when I'm at the keybord, does anyone know of a good skin or case
 to use with the Iphone? I'm afraid dropping it so I want some skin or
 case that makes it little more easy to hold.
 But so far I like it.
 Regards Tony








 


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Re: Typing special characters

[Justin Harford]

Lindsay

You should consider asking your linguistics teachers what they know  
about LaTeX and unicode.

J
On Sep 18, 2009, at 2:35 PM, Lindsay Yazzolino wrote:


 Hi,

 I am currently taking a linguistics course, and am wondering if it is
 possible to type Unicode characters using the Mac. Much of the
 coursework involves typing IPA symbols, and up until I have been using
 what I call the cheater method (copying and pasting symbols from a
 table online). I would much prefer to be able to type these symbols
 myself for the sake of efficiency and practicality, and would
 appreciate any input any of you may have. Thanks.

 Lindsay

 


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writing accents in LaTeX

[Justin Harford]

Hi all

Just felt like posting this.  it is possible to easily write LaTeX  
documents in Spanish and other languages where accents, tildes and  
other things are used.  I know for Spanish that to do this, you type  
in the preamble

\usepackage[spanish]{babel}
\uselanguage{spanish}
\usepackage[utf8]{inputenc}

Then yu must save your document in a utf8 encoding and then you can  
have your accents show up in your document output without having to do  
code.  Much better if you want to spellcheck and listen to the docs  
read out to you with the beautiful infovox ivox voices.

Regards
Justin Harford 

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Re: Changing level of description in the Finder's Column view

[Justin Harford]

That is peculiar.  If you go to set a custom setting for the column  
view, it simply ignores your preference and sets it back to default.   
I just set mine to low and that worked.

J
On Sep 18, 2009, at 2:25 PM, James  Nash wrote:


 Hi folks,
 I've found the listing in the Verbosity table for Column view, but I
 can't figure out how to change it. Can anyone please help?

 Thank you

 Take care

 James

 


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Re: A possible solution to the Voice Over not responding when using certain options in Keyboard Commander

[Justin Harford]

I don't use my system voice though for the time and unread messages  
commands though.

J
On Sep 17, 2009, at 6:16 AM, James  Nash wrote:


 Hi folks,

 Firstly, thank you to Anna for telling me how to enable the option for
 hearing how many unread messages are in Mail via Keyboard commander.
 After experiencing the same issues as some list members where Voice
 Over would not respond after using a command I think I've found a
 solution. I use Fred as my default Voice Over voice, so make sure that
 your System voice is different from your favourite Voice Over voice
 and you should be able to use VO with these commands without any
 trouble.

 HTH

 Take care

 James

 


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Re: Typing Spanish characters

[Justin Harford]

Another thing worth mentioning if you don't want to change back and  
forth between keyboard layouts is that you can use the option key.

option+e then type a vowel and it puts an accent over it
option+n and then type the n and it putes a tilde over it

option+u and then type u and it puts a dialisis over it.
option+shift+q? makes an inverted question mark
option+1 makes an inverted exclamation mark.

You might not like that voiceover still, even when localized in  
Spanish, does not read inverted questions and exclamations right.  I  
changed this in the pronunciation dictionary so it says, pregunta  
invertida and exclamación invertida etc

On Sep 17, 2009, at 2:21 AM, Simon Cavendish wrote:


 Dear Lindsay,

 In System Preference (which you will find in the dock) interact with
 the scroll area and choose language and text button. There you will
 find a few tabs that will help you customise various features to do
 with foreign languages. One of the tabs is input tab where you check
 the keyboards you wish to use. once you have checked them, they will
 appear in a menu on your menu bar which you activate with control+f8.
 Then you arrow left a few times, and there you will find your button.
 The keyboard which is currently active is immediately spoken. press
 down arrow to open your menu and arrow down and vo+spacebar on the
 keyboard layout you want.

 You can also use keyboard shortcut keys to file through your enabled
 keyboards and stop at teh one you wish.

 Hope this helps.

 Simon

 


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lowering the verbosity of the finder column view

[Justin Harford]

Hi all

I wanted to know if anyone else on here uses column view in finder,  
and if anyone else has found a way to cut down on the verbosity of  
voiceover in this view?  It seems to want to announce a list view  
everytime I right arrow into a foler, but I really don't care to hear  
this since I already know that I'm in a list.  That's all the column  
view is.  Could anyone direct me to the correct verbosity settings  
that need to be tampered with to get rid of this?

Regards
Justin Harford 

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Re: Spanish Braille tables

[Justin Harford]

Hi Lindsay

If you can find any Spanish braille tables that show the different  
symbols for Spanish braille, there is a couple on this list who can  
make Spanish braille tables available.  For example, you could find  
the tables in JAWS and send them out to Anne Robertson, who is on this  
list.  Here is the address Anne Robertson a...@anarchie.org.uk

Regards
J




On Sep 16, 2009, at 3:36 PM, Lindsay Yazzolino wrote:


 Hi,

 I am taking a Spanish course and am wondering if the Mac supports the
 use of Spanish Braille tables so that I can read documents with a
 Braille display. Thanks.

 


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Re: a few questions about Iphone OS 3.1

[Justin Harford]

I would say its a bug.  I just tried it on my iPhone and I didn't even  
get three items when I tried to flick down through headers, but I  
looked at it with my mac first and I certainly know as well as you do  
that there are quite a few headings on the page.

What are other people finding?

Justin
On Sep 16, 2009, at 6:05 PM, John J Herzog wrote:


 Hi listers,
 I am currently using a new Ipod touch with voiceover, and I have
 several questions.
 First, in the mailbox, is there a way to delete messages without first
 clicking on each one? If I decide that I do not want the message based
 on the subject alone, how can I remove it? Second, and somewhat
 related, is there a way to select multiple messages at once and get
 rid of them at the same time?
 Finally, I have a question about Safari. Sometimes, when pages load,
 and I swipe down with two fingers to get to the next heading, not all
 headings are displayed on the page. In some rare instances, it only
 takes  me to the first three headings, when I know there is more
 information on the page separated by further headers. For an example
 of this, go to www.engadget.com. Notice that even when you do a read
 all in safari, it somehow doesn't show the whole site, as doing a read
 all with the mac shows substantially more content. What's going on  
 here?
 Thank you for any help you can provide to these inquiries.

 John

 


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Re: MacOS RFBD Downloader

[Justin Harford]

Except one problem, I don't want to buy a victor stream or booksense. :)

Regards
Justin
On Sep 15, 2009, at 6:25 AM, Woody Anna Dresner wrote:


 Hi justin,

 RFBD offers their books in DAISY as well as protected WMA, and you
 can connect a Victor Stream or Book Sense to the Mac, so you can play
 RFBD books without needing protected WMA.

 Best,
 Anna


 


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Re: awesome new keyboard command in itunes 9

[Justin Harford]

Lol that command has been around since iTunes 4 or 5 probably.  I used  
it all the time when iTunes wasn't accessible.  Yep that's old news.

J
On Sep 14, 2009, at 8:36 AM, BlindMacMan wrote:


 Hello!

 Just as an add-on to your Command-Option-F find in iTunes, after you
 enter your search term in the search field, you can  press  OPTION-
 RETURN and your search  will take place inn the iTunes Store, not your
 Library.

 I would also like to point out that these keyboard commands have been
 around since iTunes 7ish...

 Lou.

 On Sep 13, 9:17 am, Scott Rutkowski scott7...@internode.on.net
 wrote:
 Hi all.

 Just discovered an awesome command in itunes 9 that you all may  
 really
 love.

 Command option f for fred will put you right in to the search field  
 if
 your a long way away from it say in the store or something.
 Very very cool and i'll be using it all the time.
 


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Re: Turning off Maiol preview pane

[Justin Harford]

Hi there

I think the problem here is with the VO mouseclick command.  It  
doesn't work here.  You have to do a real mouseclick with the mouse  
button.

If you don't have a laptop, this may be a bit harder, but it can be  
done.  Go to universal access, click on the mouse and trackpad tab.   
Check press the option key 5 times to turn mousekeys on.  I had to  
click this with the mouse, not sure why, but the second time I checked  
it it worked with vo space.  Then route the mouse to the horizontal  
splitter in the mail window, and press function+I  or function+5 if  
you imagine an embetted number pad on the laptop.  Hmm, I should think  
that on a desktop this would just be numpad 5.

I hope that works.

Justin Harford
On Sep 14, 2009, at 11:23 AM, Brett Campbell wrote:


 Hello,

 I visited the archives and believe I followed the instructions
 correctly, but I can't turn the preview pane on and off.  I like to
 use the preview pane for the most part.  However, I like to turn it
 off when I examine the contents of my junk folder before deleting.
 This is what I've been trying.  I navigate to the horizontal splitter,
 route the mouse with VO, command F5 and double click the mouse with
 the num pad commander.  I've tried the same sequence with VO, shift,
 space double click with no results.
 I had no trouble turning off the preview pane with Leopard.  This is
 not a complaint about SL, just letting you know that I'm capable of
 doing it.
 I'd appreciate suggestions and apologize for bringing this up again
 after it was already discussed not too long ago.
 Thanks,

 Brett


 


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Re: kill application command

[Justin Harford]

Howdy

Press cmd+option+esc to bring up the force quit apps dialog.  I  
believe that cmd+option+shift+esc is supposed to just force quit the  
app in focus but I have never done that before.

J
On Sep 14, 2009, at 4:57 PM, anouk radix wrote:


 Hello, A bit disturbingly to me although os x itself has only hung
 once on me several applications often need to be force quit and
 restarted before they work again, this is now a bit of a lengty
 process because you have to go to the appl e menu and then force quit,
 verification which often cannot be gone to by  command-tab so then you
 have to go to application chooser and then you have to reconfirm and
 see if you want to report it or not. Is there no immediately command
 which just lets you quit the application without further questions? i
 have to force quit applications like vlc safari and zoom several times
 a day, in general i get a lot of busy and (application) busy messages
 and when this is going on i get no voicover feedback at all. To me at
 least things seem a lot more sluggish then they were.
 Greetings, Anouk

 


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Re: preventing adium from reading message history

[Justin Harford]

After interacting with the unknown, press vo+cmd+shift+left arrow to  
wrap to the bottom.  Conversely, press vo+shift+end to go to the  
bottom of the window.

Justin
On Sep 14, 2009, at 6:09 PM, anouk radix wrote:


 Hmm i did turn off message history and still i get this.

 On Sep 15, 2009, at 2:54 AM, chris polk wrote:


 yes, if you turn off message history. but this can be a pain if you
 close a window and want to see the last thing someone said.

 On Sep 14, 2009, at 5:52 PM, anouk radix wrote:


 Hello, everytime i go into a chat window adium shows all the  
 messages
 i have received from that person which takes a long time to go
 through, is it possible for adium to only show the current message
 and
 nothing else?
 Greetings, Anouk,







 


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Re: MacOS RFBD Downloader

[Justin Harford]

Right I was about to say the same thing.  This is great that we have a  
way to download RFBD books to our macs, but still annoying that we  
haven't got a way to play them.

Do you have any suggestions Greg?

This is a really great idea.

Justin Harford
On Sep 14, 2009, at 10:19 PM, michael A. Babcock wrote:


 hi;
 very good, now, if we could get .wma protected files, to play on the
 mac, smile
 mike

 On Sep 14, 2009, at 9:07 PM, Greg Kearney wrote:


 This AppleScript application will ask you to find a .rfbd file and
 will then download that book into your downloads directory in the
 background. You will find your completed book in your downloads
 directory of your home directory. If you have Growl installed you  
 will
 get a notification when the process is completed.

 NOTE: This application will quit after it starts the download. The
 Download itself will continue and may take a considerable amount of
 time depending on the title and the speed of your internet  
 connection.

 If you find this program useful please consider making a donation to
 the Association for the Blind of Western Australia at the address
 below:

 Association for the Blind of Western Australia
 61 Kitchener Avenue, PO Box 101
 Victoria Park 6979, WA Australia

 Gregory Kearney
 Manager - Accessible Media
 Association for the Blind of Western Australia
 61 Kitchener Avenue, PO Box 101
 Victoria Park 6979, WA Australia

 Telephone: +61 (08) 9311 8202
 Telephone: +1 (307) 224-4022 (North America)
 Fax: +61 (08) 9361 8696
 Toll free: 1800 658 388 (Australia only)
 Email: gkear...@gmail.com





 


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Re: VLC does not work on Snow Leopard at the moment

[Justin Harford]

I'm listening to VLC right now.

Justin
On Sep 12, 2009, at 7:11 AM, James  Nash wrote:


 Hi folks,

 From what i've been reading http://www.jbkempf.com/blog/ VLC does not
 currently seem to work on Snow Leopard. Just thought I'd pass this  
 on. I
 apologize if this is out of date news.

 Take care

 James


 


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Re: Voice Over and Arabic?

[Justin Harford]

I think another good question here might be, how is the localization  
in Arabic.  Certainly assistivewear have had an arabic voice for the  
last 6 months, but can the system localize in Arabic?

Justin
On Sep 12, 2009, at 8:12 AM, Yuma Antoine Decaux wrote:


 Hi,

 There is an infovox ivox arabic language voice pack in theworks. The
 developer has recently asked for beta testers, but i guess youwouldn't
 beable to do it since, i aussme, you do not own a mac yet. Or do you
 Here is the link anyway to the third party voice developer. They give
 you a 30 trial before you decide to purchase which is amp
 le time for anyone.
 here is the link

 http://www.assistiveware.com/download.php
 Best

 


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Re: iTunes is Buggy?

[Justin Harford]

Hello

One thing I can say is that the tab key sort of works under the mac.   
The thing about it is that it is not disabled, but that it is just not  
working with vo.  This goes back to the issue of the broken cursor  
tracking in iTunes.  The keyboard cursor is moving through the lists,  
its just that vo is not reading what is under it.

Justin
On Sep 11, 2009, at 9:01 AM, Woody Anna Dresner wrote:


 Hi,

 I thought I figured out a way to pick a particular artist from the
 playlist browser, but when I went back and tried again, it didn't
 work. The method I tried involved stopping interacting with the column
 browser, typing a few letters, arrowing around a bit, and starting to
 interact again. iTunes 9 seems really shaky; sometimes something
 works, and sometimes it doesn't.

 Thanks to Google, I did figure out how to get albums to show as well
 as artists in the new Column browser, the iTunes 9 successor to the
 playlist browser. Once you turn on the browser with Command-B, go to
 the View menu. There's a Column Browser submenu where you can check or
 uncheck columns such as artist, album, and genre. You can also change
 the location of the browser; it can be on the top or on the left of
 the screen. Changing this setting appears to have no effect on
 accessibility.

 Another area for serious concern is that there appears to be no way to
 move between different sections of the iTunes window. Ironically,
 navigation is better in Windows in this area; in Windows F6 takes you
 between the Source list, the search box, and the track list. With
 itunes 8, Tab served some of this function; at least it usually took
 me to the Source list and search box. Tab sometimes does something
 with iTunes 9, but often it has no effect at all. It's tedious and
 time-consuming to have to VO-arrow through every control to get to
 what you want.

 Finally, while access to the store is certainly better on the Mac than
 in Windows, it leaves a lot to be desired. Has anyone figured out a
 way to get around in a long list of songs and preview the ones they
 want? I searched for the Essential Michael Jackson and got a table
 which, if I VO-Right Arrow through it, shows one song after another,
 with preview images, song titles, and buy buttons. However, if I try
 to interact with the table so I can move up and down a column to see
 quickly what the tracks are, it doesn't work. The table is reported as
 containing only three rows, which is obviously ridiculous, and all I
 see is the preview for the first track and the buy button for the
 last. I've tried the regular VO interact command and also VO-Equals,
 but neither works. Furthermore, pressing Enter on a Preview image
 results in unpredictable behavior. sometimes I am asked if I want to
 buy a track, and sometimes a different page entirely loads.

 I plan to write all this to accessibil...@apple.com, but I'd like
 confirmation of the problems first.

 It's ironic that Apple improved the accessibility of the Mac and
 iPhone but decreased it significantly in iTunes. I think the more
 constructive comments they hear from the more people, the better.

 Best,
 Anna


 


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Re: upgrading.

[Justin Harford]

That's right.  It is set to automatically install as an upgrade to  
what you have.  You won't lose anything.

Justin
On Sep 11, 2009, at 11:54 AM, erik burggraaf wrote:


 Hi guys, I'm pretty sure I won't break anything heren but...  Sighs
 when I went to install snowleppard today I got an install button much
 earlier in the process than I expected.  I was hoping for a backup and
 install option so I could save my data and settings, but all I got was
 introduction screen, licence screen, and customization screen before
 the install button.  This is my work computer, so I want some
 reassurance that if I hit this install button I won't lose my data.
 Is that the case?  Thanks,

 erik burggraaf
 A+ sertified technician and user support consultant.
 Phone: 888-255-5194
 Email: e...@erik-burggraaf.com


 


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Re: so slow

[Justin Harford]

Nope its not the ram.  My mac has 4 gb of ram and it is still quite  
slow.  it is the quicknav.  Turn it off and it works better.

Justin
On Sep 10, 2009, at 6:42 AM, Jessi and Goldina wrote:


 I find voiceover to be a tad bit more sluggish when arrowing through
 when quicknav is on, but maybe that's just cuz my mac only has a gig
 of ram. I'm not sure why quicknav would make a difference, and really
 it's only like a milisecond slower, but I notice it. other than that I
 don't find it slow.
 On 2009-09-10, at 12:31 PM, william lomas wrote:


  hi why is voiceover so damn slow now when arrowing through mail
 messages?
 I may go back to leopard it is so painstakingly clumsy at navigating
 with the usual arrow keys through characters in a message





 


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Re: Multi-language spell checking in Snow Leopard [was Re: About nisus writer and spell checking]

[Justin Harford]

So that's what it is.  I love being able to write in Spanish and  
English now without having to change languages for spell check.  If  
anything, SL has been an improvement for bilingual people.

J
On Sep 10, 2009, at 10:34 AM, Esther wrote:


 Hello James and Annie,

 I don't use Nisus Writer Pro, but I've read that there are a few bugs
 in the spell checking under Snow Leopard that will be sorted in the
 next beta release, in case Annie is using Snow Leopard.

 I've also read that Snow Leopard itself supports multiple language
 spell checking, based on the languages you check to have it check
 under System Preferences in Language  Text.  Danish is one of the
 languages. This doesn't work for all applications, but it works in
 TextEdit and Safari, for example.

 Here's the link to the TUAW article on Unsung Snow Leopard feature:
 multiple language spell-checker:
 http://www.tuaw.com/2009/09/04/unsung-snow-leopard-feature-multiple-language-spell-checker/

 This seems like a great feature for people who work with multiple
 languages in the same document.

 Cheers,

 Esther

 James  Nash wrote:


 Hi Annie,

 Yes there is a Danish localization. It should be possible to spell
 in check
 in Danish but you ay need to set the dictionary to Danish.

 HTH

 Take care

 James
 - Original Message -
 From: Annie Skov Nielsen annieskovniel...@gmail.com
 To: MacVisionaries macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2009 10:01 AM
 Subject: About nisus writer and spell checking



 Hi.

 I have downloaded a trial of nisus writer. I really like that
 program.
 But I can not find out how to spell check in danish. It works fine  
 in
 english. Do anybody know if it is possible to spell check in danish,
 and how I can do it.

 Best regards Annie.






 


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Re: iPhone 3GS iPod Application Extended Playback Features Now Accessible With VoiceOver Screen Reader

[Justin Harford]

Hey there Mark

This is not new with 3.1.  We have had this since the original release  
back in June.

Regards
Justin
On Sep 10, 2009, at 11:33 AM, M. Taylor wrote:


 [As Posted on the Candleshore BLOG]

 iPhone 3GS iPod Application Extended Playback Features Now  
 Accessible With
 VoiceOver Screen Reader

 Hello Everyone,

 I am delighted to report that with the 3.1 iPhone 3GS firmware  
 update, those
 of us using Apple's VoiceOver screen reader now have access to the  
 extended
 playback features available in the onboard iPod application.

 The extended playback features include the ability to adjust the  
 playback
 speed, set the number of times a track will repeat, and use the  
 Scrubber Bar
 to adjust playback start position.

 VoiceOver users, do the following to access the extended playback  
 features:

 1.
 While a track is playing/Paused, use a Split-Tap on any area of the  
 Display
 Screen labeled Album Art, by VoiceOver to toggle access to the  
 extended
 playback features.  Currently, when this command is used as stated  
 above,
 VoiceOver will say, Album Art, image.

 NOTE 1:
 A Split-Tap is when one parks a single finger on the Display Screen,  
 then
 quickly taps another area of the Display Screen with a second finger.

 2.
 When the extended playback features are displayed, use standard  
 navigation
 gestures to scroll through the options including Scrubber Bar (track
 position), 30-Second Rewind Button, Repeat Button, and the Playback  
 Speed
 Button.

 Note 2:
 Use a Split-Tap to cycle between the various states of both the  
 Repeat and
 Playback Speed buttons.

 Enjoy,

 Mark


 


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Re: Victor Reader Soft Macintosh

[Justin Harford]

Haha you *are pretty naive.

We have to remember that RFBD don't just serve the blind, but also  
people with other print disabilities.

J
On Sep 8, 2009, at 3:51 PM, Chris Gilland wrote:

 If RFBD made it, and it's for the blind and disabled, wouldn't that  
 naturally probably mean it's accessible?  Maybe I'm very naive but...

 Chris.

 From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com  
 [mailto:macvisionar...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of michael A.  
 Babcock
 Sent: Tuesday, September 08, 2009 6:26 PM
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Subject: Victor Reader Soft Macintosh

 is this software accessible? I don't wanna spend $125 on it, from  
 rfbd, and find out it's not accessible.
 thanks
 mike
 Victor Reader Soft Macintosh


 


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Re: A solution for stopping voiceover from saying empty in the contacts table in Adium

[Justin Harford]

Awesome thank you so much.

J
On Sep 8, 2009, at 8:37 PM, Dan Eickmeier wrote:


 Hi all,a friend   of mine who's not on this list, was playing with
 verbosity settings, and we found that if you go under list, and
 customise it so that the status isn't spoken, this will fix the
 problem of voiceover saying empty in the contacts table of Adium.  So
 for those who were finding that to be annoying, there's a solution.


 


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Re: using macbook with closed lid?

[Justin Harford]

This is, from what I have read, quite possible.  Basically you connect  
the keyboard and the braille display to the computer, close the  
computer lid, and then start typing on the keyboard to wake it up.   
I'm pretty sure this can be done with bluetooth if you allow bluetooth  
devices to wake the computer from sleep.

The thing about this is that you run the risk of overheating your  
computer, especially if you have it cooped up in a backpack on top of  
being closed.

Let us know how it works.

Justin Harford
On Sep 7, 2009, at 4:04 AM, anouk radix wrote:


 Hi everyone, i go to school with my laptop everyday by bus, this ride
 takers 45 minutes. I always take my dog with me. I would like to use
 my laptop for studyig diring this time but there is not much room.
 Luckily i have a quite compact braille display and the new os x has
 bluetooth support. But is it possible to use my mbp with the lid
 closed? Normally it goes on standby but since i can scroll through a
 document with just my braille display i wouyld like to be able to keep
 my laptop in its case and just my braille display on my lap, there is
 no room for the whole deal.
 Can anyone tell me if this is possible, i cant find it in energy  
 saver.
 Greetings, Anouk

 


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Re: Clickable

[Justin Harford]

I don't drink coffee.
On Sep 7, 2009, at 4:31 AM, Chris Hofstader wrote:


 Dude, switch to the decaf, the people on this list all (to my
 knowledge) volunteers and they do their best to help each other out.
 Further examination of your clickable issues may be indicated but
 you needn't be so snotty about it.

 Happy Alexander Berkman Day,
 cdh
 On Sep 7, 2009, at 12:33 AM, Justin Harford wrote:


 Hello
 On Sep 6, 2009, at 2:28 AM, Krister Ekstrom wrote:

 Those things that VO has
 reported as being clickable have in fact been clickable

 OK very well.  So in this article

 http://www.examiner.com/x-6741-SF-Family-Examiner~y2009m9d6-Boy-11-stabbed-on-SF-bus-Friday-nearly-dies

 pretty much every single item of text in the article itself is
 clickable.  I did vo space on one of the blocks of text, and it did
 nothing.  I then clicked on it with the mouse and it gave me a spam
 window.  When I say text items, I mean the text of the article.  So
 again, you insist that this is all clickable, but then how is it
 clickable when I click on it and it either does nothing, or gives  
 me a
 pop-up?




 


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Re: audio higjack pro

[Justin Harford]

I used audio hijack today and it worked great.
On Sep 7, 2009, at 12:36 PM, James  Nash wrote:


 I'm not sure but I thought sound flower was part of the instant hijack
 althoug not directly connected.
 - Original Message -
 From: Dan Eickmeier va3...@yahoo.ca
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Sent: Monday, September 07, 2009 8:07 PM
 Subject: Re: audio higjack pro



 And what about Sound Flower?  Is that actually working under Snow
 Leopard?  Or not yet?
 On Sep 7, 2009, at 11:40 AM, Steven M. Sawczyn wrote:


 Yes, but instant hijack for apps is broken.

 HTH,

 Steve

 On Sep 7, 2009, at 5:57 AM, william lomas wrote:


 hi in snowleopard can one use audio highjack for system and mike
 audio?
 Will











 


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Re: applescript idea

[Justin Harford]

That would be neat.

J
On Sep 7, 2009, at 2:35 PM, Yuma Antoine Decaux wrote:


 Hi everyone,

 I was just hacing a milkshake and thought of a possible script to help
 polyglotts in this list?

 I believe this should be possible, bbut since i am not acquainted
 enough with applescript, please those of you who know some or are
 veterans, give me some pointers :)

 Basically, i always have the voice over menu open for switching
 languages, and though it's not that many manipulations away, i wish
 there is something more fluid and streamlined, sort of slick in its
 behavior.

 This could apply to safari, mail, and perhaps at a later date,
 documents.

 SO, if there are variables that can specify a language, either in an
 html body, it's address quote country suffixe? unquote or checking
 redundant words and common nouns in the subject line of a mail, the
 applescript would switch automatically to the given language.

 Now is this possible? getting handlers to pre-process document
 contents to see if it is in a given language could be done right?

 I have the applescript documentation, but since this list is about
 communicating, and i like to brainstorm before really engaging in any
 type of project :) i wanted your advice, opinion and comment.

 Thanks for reading, and best

 Yuma

 


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Re: Vo-shift-space bar is broken

[Justin Harford]

Works fine here.
On Sep 5, 2009, at 4:58 PM, M. Taylor wrote:


 Hello,

 As yet, I have not been able to get the VO+Shift+Space Bar to work  
 on my
 MacBook Pro in any Finder window or Mac application.

 Several times have tried to do the following:

 1.
 Route the Mouse pointer to the VO curser by entering VO+Command+F5.

 2.
 Enter VO+Shif+Space bar.

 The result is that the Mac acts as if I did not press the Shift.  By  
 the
 way, I am pressing the Left Shift key.

 Mark





 -Original Message-
 From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 [mailto:macvisionar...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of John Panarese
 Sent: Saturday, September 05, 2009 9:41 AM
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Subject: Re: Vo-shift-space bar is broken


 I do not use any virtual machines, so I don't know if that is
 part of the issue.  However, I have not encountered any problems with
 the VO keys-shift-spacebar.


 Take Care

 John Panarese

 On Sep 5, 2009, at 8:49 AM, Krister Ekstrom wrote:


 Hi,
 Can anyone confirm that the actual mouse clicking vo-shift-spacebar  
 is
 broken under Snow leopard? For example, i can no longer double click
 to start a virtual machine from the Fusion virtual machines list.
 There are other places where the clicking won't work either, and this
 also makes me wonder is the dragging broken as well?
 /Krister







 


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Re: Clickable

[Justin Harford]

Hello
On Sep 6, 2009, at 2:28 AM, Krister Ekstrom wrote:

 Those things that VO has
 reported as being clickable have in fact been clickable

OK very well.  So in this article

http://www.examiner.com/x-6741-SF-Family-Examiner~y2009m9d6-Boy-11-stabbed-on-SF-bus-Friday-nearly-dies

pretty much every single item of text in the article itself is  
clickable.  I did vo space on one of the blocks of text, and it did  
nothing.  I then clicked on it with the mouse and it gave me a spam  
window.  When I say text items, I mean the text of the article.  So  
again, you insist that this is all clickable, but then how is it  
clickable when I click on it and it either does nothing, or gives me a  
pop-up?

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Re: A VO Bug: IP addresses

[Justin Harford]

Yep I reproduced it but it is not in just any old text field like you  
said it would be.

J
El Sep 4, 2009, a las 8:27 PM, Chris Polk escribió:


 I can also produce this. weird for sure!

 On Sep 4, 2009, at 8:25 PM, Mike Arrigo wrote:


 Yep, can reproduce this one for sure, very strange.
 On Sep 4, 2009, at 7:02 PM, Buddy Brannan wrote:


 Hi all,

 Wonder who can replicate this? It's sort of important:

 Just type in an IP address. Perhaps any IP address, but for
 argument's
 sake, type into any editable area:
 192.168.1.1

 At least on my machine, it doesn't read back anything close to
 correctly, unless you go through it character by character.

 Anyone else?
 --
 Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA
 Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY










 


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Re: Macintosh Word Processor Software by Mariner Software

[Justin Harford]

Right that has been an interesting thing about them but I vaguely  
remember noting that mac journal was by another developer.

J
El Sep 5, 2009, a las 4:01 AM, James  Nash escribió:

 Well Mac Journal is accessible, but not Mainer Write and nor is  
 Mellel. I've kind of given up with Mellel too. The only options then  
 for word processing would be Nisus Writer and Pages and of course  
 open office. It does depend though on what you want to do. As I said  
 Latex is fantastic, but sometimes it can be a litle time consuming  
 especially when you've missed a brace or typed something incorrectly  
 lol
 - Original Message -
 From: Justin Harford
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Sent: Saturday, September 05, 2009 3:42 AM
 Subject: Re: Macintosh Word Processor Software by Mariner Software

 I stoped holding my breath with Mariner a couple years ago.  I  
 remember they were going to make accessible software but the years  
 went by and the versions went by and nothing happened.

 I think I'll continue to breathe normally.

 Justin
 El Sep 4, 2009, a las 7:16 AM, James  Nash escribió:

 Oh yes, I forgot about this lol. It is supposed to work with VO on  
 version 4 aparently.
 - Original Message -
 From: dannyboy
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Sent: Friday, September 04, 2009 3:05 PM
 Subject: Macintosh Word Processor Software by Mariner Software

 Hello.  Here is a link to another word processing software.  I have  
 not used this yet.  But just wanted to spread the word on one more  
 choice.


 http://www.marinersoftware.com/sitepage.php?page=12







 


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Re: Clickable

[Justin Harford]

but it basically calls things clickable that really are not clickable.

J
El Sep 5, 2009, a las 10:45 AM, Krister Ekstrom escribió:


 I think it's a wonderful thing that it says clickable. This means
 that VO in fact recognizes those kinds of new links that don't look
 like links. It had trouble with this in Leopard.
 /Krister

 5 sep 2009 kl. 16.46 skrev Mac Cougar:


 Hello,

 Snow Leopard is great and sure am glad it is up and running on my
 computer.  When I get on the internet now I keep hearing the word
 clickable at the end of lines.  Any ideas how I can get rid of this.
 It gets annoying after awhile.

 Thanks
 Steve





 


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Re: Letting Apple Accessibility know when they've done a good job

[Justin Harford]

Howdy
El Sep 4, 2009, a las 1:10 AM, James  Nash escribió:

 Also, Lets be grateful that
 NFB et al havne't written a review yet of SL.

Oh heavens no, we wouldn't want them to discover these bugs!

Justin 
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Re: safari sluggish and slow

[Justin Harford]

I just did this with wikipedia and google opened at the same time and  
had no problem.
El Sep 4, 2009, a las 12:53 PM, william lomas escribió:


 all the more reason to wait for updates, everyone dives in to quickly

 On 4 Sep 2009, at 20:06, anouk radix wrote:


 HEllo, yeah so first it crashed and now its very sluggish and slow if
 i open more then one page, wikipedia and google to be excact. I
 constantly get safari is busy or safari is ready messages. I cant do
 much of anything and there is very slow or no response at all to
 commands.
 Greetings, Anouk




 


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Re: cool google feature accessible in snow leopard

[Justin Harford]

humm this does not work for me.  I actually feel like this worked in  
Leopard, and probably better.
El Sep 4, 2009, a las 4:43 PM, John J Herzog escribió:


 Hi listers,
 If you go to google.com, and type in some search terms, you can now
 hit the down arrow to cycle through a list of suggested criteria for
 your search. For instance, typing in best selling books might give you
 best selling books of 2009, best selling books on Amazon, etc.
 To highlight each suggestion, simply hit down arrow after you are
 done typing. To read each suggestion as it's highlighted, use VO down
 arrow. It will read you the current text in the box. To go to the next
 suggestion, simply hit the down arrow again, and then reread it with
 the VO command above.
 I knew you could do this in yahoo for a while, but didn't realize
 google had a similar feature. I think it's really cool, and hope it is
 helpful for someone.

 


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Re: A VO Bug: IP addresses

[Justin Harford]

Howdy

Maybe give us more details on what to do.  I typed
192.1.8.1.1
in textedit and had no prob.

Justin

El Sep 4, 2009, a las 5:02 PM, Buddy Brannan escribió:



 Hi all,

 Wonder who can replicate this? It's sort of important:

 Just type in an IP address. Perhaps any IP address, but for argument's
 sake, type into any editable area:
 192.168.1.1

 At least on my machine, it doesn't read back anything close to
 correctly, unless you go through it character by character.

 Anyone else?
 --
 Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA
 Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY




 


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Re: Difficulties with preview and long documents.

[Justin Harford]

Yep go to view and set it to show single pages rather than single  
continuous pages.
El Sep 4, 2009, a las 1:49 PM, kaare dehard escribió:


 Was wondering if I  could get some tips from you folks. I am reading a
 large document in preview, and I am having difficulties getting it to
 read from a point forward. For example if I tell it to go to page 100
 then navigate over to where the text is displayed, I usually start
 right at the top of the document. any preview/vo settings that can
 assist by being changed?



 


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Re: Macintosh Word Processor Software by Mariner Software

[Justin Harford]

I stoped holding my breath with Mariner a couple years ago.  I  
remember they were going to make accessible software but the years  
went by and the versions went by and nothing happened.

I think I'll continue to breathe normally.

Justin
El Sep 4, 2009, a las 7:16 AM, James  Nash escribió:

 Oh yes, I forgot about this lol. It is supposed to work with VO on  
 version 4 aparently.
 - Original Message -
 From: dannyboy
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Sent: Friday, September 04, 2009 3:05 PM
 Subject: Macintosh Word Processor Software by Mariner Software

 Hello.  Here is a link to another word processing software.  I have  
 not used this yet.  But just wanted to spread the word on one more  
 choice.


 http://www.marinersoftware.com/sitepage.php?page=12



 


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Re: can't control-click on misspelled words

[Justin Harford]

Howdy

This really depends on where you are talking about.  It has never  
worked under email since the days of Leopard (not tiger).  I find it  
still works under textedit.  In safari, has anyone tried that?

Justin
El Sep 3, 2009, a las 8:23 AM, James  Nash escribió:


 I can't comment right now on this as I don't have SL yet, but have you
 looked in the VO help menu as the commands might be different?

 Take care

 James
 - Original Message -
 From: Woody Anna Dresner wadres...@att.net
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Sent: Thursday, September 03, 2009 4:04 PM
 Subject: can't control-click on misspelled words



 Hi,

 Normally I check spelling in e-mail by pressing Command-Semicolon,
 then pressing VO-Shift-M to access the spelling options. This doesn't
 appear to work in Snow Leopard. The misspelled word is highlighted as
 expected, but when I press VO-Shift-M, a different word gets
 highlighted instead. Has anyone else experienced this?

 Thanks,
 Anna





 


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Re: can't control-click on misspelled words

[Justin Harford]

She was using the context menu.

It is true that we can still use the spelling dialog which is what we  
may have to do.  I personally have been more partial to the way  
without the dialog though.

Justin
El Sep 3, 2009, a las 10:32 AM, James  Nash escribió:


 I thought you could use the applications menu - don'tremeber what  
 Mac calls
 it but that should show you possible spellings. Also, doesn't the  
 spelling
 dialogue give you possible spelling corrections?

 Take care

 James
 - Original Message -
 From: Woody Anna Dresner wadres...@att.net
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Sent: Thursday, September 03, 2009 5:32 PM
 Subject: Re: can't control-click on misspelled words



 Hi Justin,

 When I started using Leopard in June, I couldn't use the spell check
 procedure I described in my last message. However, the most recent OS
 update fixed it so I could use that procedure. Looks like Snow  
 Leopard
 broke it again.

 Best,
 Anna





 


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Re: can't control-click on misspelled words

[Justin Harford]

That maybe so but the old ones still work.
El Sep 3, 2009, a las 12:35 PM, Robert Carter escribió:


 Hi,

 I am not at home so can't test it but there are new commands for  
 moving to the next and previous misspelled word. They are vo-e and  
 vo-shift-e

 Robert Carter

 - Original Message -
 From: Woody Anna Dresner wadres...@att.net
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Date: Thursday, Sep 3, 2009 10:36:37
 Subject: Re: can't control-click on misspelled words




 Hi Justin,

 When I started using Leopard in June, I couldn't use the spell check
 procedure I described in my last message. However, the most recent OS
 update fixed it so I could use that procedure. Looks like Snow  
 Leopard
 broke it again.

 Best,
 Anna


 


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Re: copying text from mail?

[Justin Harford]

Hey there

Yep the vo command for select is broken when you are reading a  
message, but that interestingly does not mean we can't highlight  
text.  Just use the conventional word doc commands, shift right/left  
arrow, shift option right/left arrow, shift up/down arrow etc.  Works  
fine.

Justin
El Sep 2, 2009, a las 5:54 PM, Jessi and Goldina escribió:


 hmm. I never had it in leopard, I dunno what causes it. it's weird!!
 maybe the way emails are formatted or something?
 On 2009-09-02, at 4:31 PM, Maxwell Ivey Jr. wrote:


 Hello;  I occasionally have that problem with mail in regular lepard,
 and i can usually get around it by clicking reply and then selecting
 text from the edit field.  After i do my cut and paste, I close the
 draft and press don't save.  Hope that helps, Max
 On Sep 2, 2009, at 4:53 PM, Jessi and Goldina wrote:


 hey guys,

 has the commands for copying text out of mail changed? I noticed  
 that
 I can no longer turn selection mode on, select something and copy it
 in SL?







 


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going to white on black

[Justin Harford]

Hi all

A little while ago someone mentioned they were having trouble toggling  
with white on black and black on white.  After thinking about this a  
little more, I noticed there is another option besides turning off  
VO.  Press vo tab to activate passthrough, and then press the command  
vo + cmd + 8.  VO will announce the change.  Interestingly enough you  
can keep pressing the command toggling back and forth without having  
to do pass through, but when you inact another VO command, then it  
goes back to the usual condition of not working.

Regards
Justin Harford

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interesting bug with the save dialog

[Justin Harford]

Hi all

An interesting SL bug for you.

Go into textedit.  Write a document.  Press cmd s to open the save  
dialog.  Then try to tab over to the place where you select the  
folder, assuming that that you have that checkbox to the right of the  
name field checked.  After you tab past the sidebar, voiceover starts  
uncontrollably stuttering,  Lol it's doing it right now, gosh  
voiceover I didn't think it was that cold!

So basically my VO is completely messed up until I restart it… woof  
much better.  Anyway the save dialog, from this end, is pretty much no  
longer usable with the keyboard cursor.

Let me know what you all find.

Justin Harford 
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alva 544 traveler not connecting

[Justin Harford]

Howdy all

Another thing for you users of the alva 544 traveler or any other  
braille display to look at.

When I plug my alva 544 traveler into my macbook running SL, it  
needn't matter which USB port I choose, it simply will not see my  
computer, or rather, my computer simply won't recognize it.  Is anyone  
else noticing this unfortunate dispute between their braille display  
and their mac?  What could we do to help them settle their differences  
without giving each other and their owners the silent treatment? ;)

Regards
Justin Harford 

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tables in text documents

[Justin Harford]

Hey all

 From what I remember of the quickstart tutorial, under the tables  
section it mentions when navigating tables around HTML and text  
environments or something.  So does that mean that tables work in text  
documents?  I actually tested this under textedit and found that  
tables still don't work that great, but I was wondering if any of the  
people with pages have found this to be different.  I am trying to  
figure out what to tell a friend of mine who is using iworks and who  
is having trouble accessing tables.  She is using Leopard, not Snow  
Leopard.

Perhaps there would be another way if they are not accessible under  
iWorks?  Like now we can read tables under html, so perhaps there  
would be a way to take a microsoft word doc, and save it as an html  
doc through iWorks?  You wouldn't be able to edit but at least you  
could view.  Hmm, you know it would be really cool to be able to save  
a doc as HTML, code the tables, and save it back as doc.

Regards
Justin Harford 

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turning pages in PDF

[Justin Harford]

Hi all

I was looking at a PDF print preview in the preview program when I  
found that the commands to go forward and back through pages seem to  
have disappeared.  When I looked in the go menu, I saw the options  
to go to previus and next page, but it didn't have any commands.  I  
was curious if anyone might have discovered these commands at all?  I  
generaly like to view my PDFs page by page so I get a sense of the  
size of each page and the number of pages in a document.

Regards
Justin Harford

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Re: turning pages in PDF

[Justin Harford]

Awesome thanks.
El Sep 1, 2009, a las 2:05 PM, Barry Hadder escribió:


 You use page- up or page down.  If you are using a Macbook, those keys
 will be fn-up or fn-down.


 On Sep 1, 2009, at 3:38 PM, Justin Harford wrote:


 Hi all

 I was looking at a PDF print preview in the preview program when I
 found that the commands to go forward and back through pages seem to
 have disappeared.  When I looked in the go menu, I saw the options
 to go to previus and next page, but it didn't have any commands.  I
 was curious if anyone might have discovered these commands at all?  I
 generaly like to view my PDFs page by page so I get a sense of the
 size of each page and the number of pages in a document.

 Regards
 Justin Harford




 


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snow leopard and rom

[Justin Harford]

Hi all

So I was using 1 gb of ram with my macbook running snow leopard.  I  
upgraded it to 4 gb yesterday and am finding that it works noticably  
better.  So I recommend a a ram upgrade if you are using less than 2  
gb lol.

Justin 

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insertion point solution for windows users

[Justin Harford]

Hi all

While we're all pointing out the new things about SL, I thought I  
would note that now you can choose to mae the cursor read like it does  
with JAWS under windows.  The thing that makes me happy about this is  
that they made it a preference, not one of those changes that you have  
to bear.  So now more people can be happy with it.

Another interesting thing I noticed.  I remember people would have  
problems accidentally activating caps lock, but now when you activate  
it and start typing, it makes a sound with each letter you type, and  
each character you move over with your keyboard cursor.

Interesting
Justin Harford 

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Re: As unreliable as Windows

[Justin Harford]

I found it went faster, about 30 mins, when I did a clean install.

It's sort of more accessible.  I mean they improved the internet quite  
a lot.  But I would argue that finder and iTunes were more better  
integrated with voiceover under leopard.  They really let cursor  
tracking get all mucked up.

Oh well, I was more prepared for this transfering from leopard to snow  
leopard than I was going from tiger to leopard.  It's just that things  
change when apple does upgrades.  I guess there are things that get  
added like braille that make the system ultimately a step forward, but  
then they go and break things that worked really well in the prior  
system which leaves one wondering if it is really a step forward.  I  
guess ultimately it might be a step forward.  I like the new antonio  
voice in the castellian spanish package from acapela.

Regards
Justin Harford
On Aug 29, 2009, at 9:18 PM, Mike Arrigo wrote:


 I found that around 42 percent, it really sped up quite a bit.
 Probably the first part copies a bunch of temporary files and then it
 does the actual install. One thing's for sure, it's more accessible
 than any windows install has ever been.
 On Aug 29, 2009, at 9:28 PM, Rich Ring wrote:



 Well, one thing about the Mac is about as reliable as Windows.
 I am currently doing a clean install of SL on my brand new Mac
 Mini.  About
 twenty minutes ago, I was advised that the install was 19.8 per cent
 complete, and that the time remaining was 29 minutes.  Now, I'm told
 that
 the install is at 55 per cent and the time remaining is 28 minutes.
 Go
 figure!





 


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Re: As unreliable as Windows

[Justin Harford]

Yeah.  I am getting around to playing with the settings too and it is  
working better for me.  It's just weird having to go through this  
process of adjusting the way I use my computer with each update.  Have  
you tried navigating in iTunes in the browser and songs table without  
quicknav turned on?  That's when it doesn't work.  It's weird.  The vo  
cursor tracks the system cursor but the system cursor does not track  
VO.  On top of that the system cursor in iTunes does not read items.   
So if you deactivate quicknav and navigate with the system cursor that  
is why it is silent.  Activate quicknav and navigate with vo cursor,  
and it works better, though has been sluggish with me.  But like I  
said, with the fact that the vo cursor does not track the system  
cursor, if you want to jump to an item in the browser by typing the  
first letters of it, the system cursor goes to it and leaves the vo  
cursor behind, making it look like you didn't move anywhere if you  
arrow up and down to check where you are.

I'm adjusting
Justin
El Aug 30, 2009, a las 3:46 AM, Marie Howarth escribió:


 Justin, what you finding different about finder and itunes? maybe I'm
 missing something here. once I played around with some of the settings
 in VO, everything worked great, if not better.

 On Aug 30, 2009, at 7:24 AM, Justin Harford wrote:


 I found it went faster, about 30 mins, when I did a clean install.

 It's sort of more accessible.  I mean they improved the internet  
 quite
 a lot.  But I would argue that finder and iTunes were more better
 integrated with voiceover under leopard.  They really let cursor
 tracking get all mucked up.

 Oh well, I was more prepared for this transfering from leopard to  
 snow
 leopard than I was going from tiger to leopard.  It's just that  
 things
 change when apple does upgrades.  I guess there are things that get
 added like braille that make the system ultimately a step forward,  
 but
 then they go and break things that worked really well in the prior
 system which leaves one wondering if it is really a step forward.  I
 guess ultimately it might be a step forward.  I like the new antonio
 voice in the castellian spanish package from acapela.

 Regards
 Justin Harford
 On Aug 29, 2009, at 9:18 PM, Mike Arrigo wrote:


 I found that around 42 percent, it really sped up quite a bit.
 Probably the first part copies a bunch of temporary files and then  
 it
 does the actual install. One thing's for sure, it's more accessible
 than any windows install has ever been.
 On Aug 29, 2009, at 9:28 PM, Rich Ring wrote:



 Well, one thing about the Mac is about as reliable as Windows.
 I am currently doing a clean install of SL on my brand new Mac
 Mini.  About
 twenty minutes ago, I was advised that the install was 19.8 per  
 cent
 complete, and that the time remaining was 29 minutes.  Now, I'm  
 told
 that
 the install is at 55 per cent and the time remaining is 28 minutes.
 Go
 figure!











 


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Re: Snowleopard, Safari, and Voiceover

[Justin Harford]

Hey there

How do you make google show more than 10 results?

I have actually found the opposite to be true.  VO was really really  
bad at the comcast homepage in Leopard, now its just bad, but at least  
workable.  everywhere else on the internet is much more responsive.   
That is actually one of the positive things I have found to say about  
Snow Leopard.  I tried a bit with groups mode and found the same to be  
true.  I'll look more into it.  Could you give us a webpage?  It  
seriously could be an issue with groups mode, I know that support for  
groups mode has been not quite as great since the beginning of vo.

Regards
Justin Harford
El Aug 30, 2009, a las 2:07 PM, Marie Howarth escribió:


 I'm not having this issue at all I'm afraid.

 On Aug 30, 2009, at 9:58 PM, Jessi and Goldina wrote:


 hmm, this is odd. cuz didn't it say somewhere that VO was supposed to
 act faster on webpages with lots of content? strange it's the
 opposite?
 On 30-Aug-09, at 1:52 PM, Barry Hadder wrote:


 Using Google, I have always had 100 search results per page and it
 worked just fine with vo and leopard.  Now, anything over 10 and vo
 navigation slows to a crawl.  I'm referring to moving around with  
 the
 vo cursor.  I consider it bairly usable with 10.  I'm using group.
 This tells me that any web page with a lot of content will have
 series
 problems using vo.  I was wondering if anybody else can confirm  
 this.


 I also want to confirm the choppy speech in mail, but I've also
 noticed it everywhere.  It seems to be most noticeable in mail
 however.

 Thanks.








 


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infovox ivox beta

[Justin Harford]

Hi all

Would any one here happen to have tried the infovox ivox voices with  
snow leopard?  How do they work?

J

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Re: Braille tables for other languages

[Justin Harford]

I would love to also see someone help them get braille tables in  
Spanish.  I would more love to do it myself but I don't have the  
necessary resources to send them, I.E access to a windows or linux  
computer with such tables.


Regards
Justin Harford
On 28/08/2009, at 12:02, Anne Robertson wrote:


 Hello everyone,

 My husband has created Braille tables for Snow Leopard in the
 following languages: Danish, French, German, Greek, Hebrew, Norwegian,
 Russian and Swedish.

 He would like to provide any other languages for which the Braille
 codes can be provided. He would particularly like to have Italian,
 Spanish and Portuguese.

 To create a Braille table, he needs the 8-dot patterns, the print
 character equivalents, and the corresponding unicode codes.

 If anyone can help with this, please e-mail us at:
 cons...@anarchie.org.uk

 This is also the address for requesting Braille tables.

 Cheers,

 Anne


 


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Re: voices on os x

[Justin Harford]

Hello all
On Aug 25, 2009, at 12:29 AM, David Niemeijer wrote:

 as Scott pointed out, space on the DVD alone
 would already preclude all such voices to be high quality. All Infovox
 iVox voices together already pretty much fill up a dual layer DVD so
 there would be little space left for the OS :-)

No one is saying they should be high quality.  The iPhone voices would  
suffice.  The iPhone not only has a large number of different language  
voices, but a decent supply of regional voices within those languages  
as well.  It seems like they would have been a bit more stingy if they  
took up so much space.

I guess the point was mainly that at this point, the apple out-of-the- 
box solution for blind users is only available to those who speak  
English comfortably, and who have enough money to fork over for high  
quality acapella voices.  And what of the rest of the people out  
there?  Well they are out of luck for the time being.

 I also want to take this opportunity to point out that Apple does work
 with us and Acapela to ensure good compatibility of VoiceOver with the
 Infovox iVox voices (and visa versa) and foreign languages so Apple
 certainly cares about giving non-English users access to a good VO
 experience.

It just doesn't care about giving them the ability to independently  
install the operating system and manage their bios as it does with the  
rest of its user base.

But since you put it that way, all of us speak English pretty well.  I  
know for me this is quite inconsequential because English is my first  
language and I had the money to pay for Spanish voices for my academic  
work.  It just seemed like not that much to ask for since it's been  
something that is just offered with other solutions.  When I  
downloaded NVDA for my Mexican friend's computer, and started the  
installer, it automatically came up speaking in Spanish.  Linux gives  
similar support.  But of course they both use espeak which is not a  
high quality set of voices.  Quite honestly this thing about high  
quality has only come up since the days of Leopard and Alex.  I used  
to use Fred, which worked just fine before apple broke it, but truly,  
if it is a choice between having low-quality language support vs no  
language support whatsoever, I would have to go with the former.

Regards
Justin Harford

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Re: unnecissary voices/foreign language synthesis

[Justin Harford]

I've been thinking more about this other language synthesizers issue.   
I wonder how hard it would be for apple to include by default the  
voices that it uses for the iPhone on the installation CD of its  
operating system.  That way, a blind person could manage bios and  
system installation in multiple languages no problem.  And they would  
be low quality voices right?  So they wouldn't take that much extra  
space.  Then there could be some way by which we only put certain  
languages on the hard drive through installation.  So maybe, if I  
install my OS in Spanish, the CD will automatically only install the  
Spanish synthesizers.  Or maybe, it could install all synthesizers by  
default.  This would be nice for public computers, but if individuals  
wanted the extra space, they could opt to not install those  
synthesizers as they would opt to not install the extra language  
localizations.

Maybe I might offer another perspective on this.  On no screen reader  
has there been offered a high quality voice like Alex.  In a way,  
apple are already stomping on the shoes of Acapela Group slightly by  
offering an american synthesizer which far out does anything their  
american voices could dish out.  I think that standing behind apple in  
not including other language synthesizers in Mac OS X because of fear  
of hurting Acapela is a silly notion as it  places the interests of  
business before the consumer, but let's discuss that anyway since it  
is a concern.  Usually the place of a company like Acapela would be  
supplying high quality speech synthesis, which it does very well, and  
the place of the company that produces the screen reader would be to  
just provide synthesis.  Freedom scientific have offered foreign  
language with eloquence for a number of years now at no extra cost,  
and of course the same goes for all screen readers using ESpeak.  The  
idea is that you get to listen to stuff read in the language of your  
choice, though it might not be the highest of quality.  If you want  
high quality, you go to a company like Assistive Wear and buy the high  
quality Acapela voices.  In a way, I would almost say that apple would  
have done better to have implemented the iPhone synthesis along side  
Fred and the other English voices, in stead of producing Alex, but  
that's neither here nor there.

The bottom line is that Apple is a company which, by its actions,  
seems to aim to serve an international customer base.  It has been  
possible for many years for a person in France, Germany, or Japan or  
where ever else to install and use the Mac OS in their native  
language.  I think that Apple has demonstrated that it understands  
very well the importance of including a world market in its computer  
revolution.  In 2005, they demonstrated that they also understood the  
importance of including people who use their computers by alternative  
means.  I remember an article from Apple to the developers a few years  
back, which characterized the last 20 years in these terms… in the 90s  
we were working on internationalizing computers so that people of  
different nationalities could use them, then came the new millennium  
where the new challenge has been working on making computers usable by  
people of different physical/sensory ability.  One of the first things  
I noticed about my iPhone is that the accessibility menu is just down  
from international.

It seems like then, apple understand accessibility and international  
as two facets of a single goal, to make their computers usable by as  
many people as possible.  They should understand that accessibility  
and international are practically the same thing because there are  
people with disabilities all over the world, not just in the United  
States.  So yes, apple surely understand this, then there must be some  
reason as was already suggested for why they insist on not  
implementing foreign language synthesizers.  In conclusion, I think it  
would be nice that they should include low quality foreign language  
synthesis in their OS, or if not that, at least they should give us a  
straight forward explanation of why they refuse to do so.  At least  
this way, myself and others needn't be left so dumbfounded at the fact  
that they would include such clever integration of foreign speech  
synthesis and localization in their iPhone, and not in their  
computers.  It really just doesn't make since.

Regards
Justin Harford
On Aug 25, 2009, at 10:50 AM, Scott Howell wrote:


 I think those voices were included for other reasons and happen to
 work with VO.  Of course Bells for example serves no purpose for users
 really, but I suspect they are again there for other purposes.  Of
 course you could always suggest to Apple they remove those voices if
 no one really has a use for them and replace with other voices, which
 support other languages.
 On Aug 25, 2009, at 10:16 AM, william lomas wrote:


  hi all I know bad news

Re: i wait to upgrade

[Justin Harford]

I sure would like to upgrade but since I depend on Acapela infovox  
ivox, as well as LaTeX, I think I will have to wait till both of those  
are fixed with SnowLeopard.

Regards
Justin Harford

On Aug 25, 2009, at 12:29 PM, Chris Blouch wrote:

 Hmm. I bet getting rid of a lot of legacy and multiple-CPU binaries  
 is the bulk of the savings.

 CB

 Brent Harding wrote:

 Getting half the disk space back is one reason of it's own. Will it  
 run
 faster, probably I would imagine. I wonder how they compress half  
 of it out
 without losing half the features? I suppose the old PowerPC code  
 takes just
 as much as the intel, so going universal must double the size.

 - Original Message -
 From: william lomas lomaswill...@googlemail.com
 To: General discussions on all topics relating to the use of Mac  
 OS X by
 the blind disc...@macvisionaries.com
 Sent: Tuesday, August 25, 2009 9:25 AM
 Subject: i wait to upgrade



 hi all i will wait I think to upgrade and see what other users say
 regarding performance etc. if what we have now works and we are  
 happy
 with its usage then why upgrade at present
 regards just my thoughts, will








 


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Re: Turning off screensaver in Leopard

[Justin Harford]

Interesting.  If I press VO right arrow it definitely won't go past  
83%, but if I just press right arrow, it pushes it the rest of the way  
to 100%.

Hope this helps
Justin
On Aug 25, 2009, at 12:32 PM, Daniel K. Gartmann wrote:


 Hi,

 I can't push the slider to never on the screensaver tab. It only  
 gets up to 83 %, so the screensaver keeps kicking in after a while.

 Anybody got any ideas as to how to move it all the way to never to  
 turn it completely off? Clicking on never with vo+space doesn't do  
 the trick for me.

 Thanks and best regards

 Daniel


 


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Re: unnecissary voices/foreign language synthesis

[Justin Harford]

If you checked the sending information for tha message, you would see  
that I CCed accessibility, along with the other messages I and others  
have sent them in the past.

Regards
Justin
On Aug 25, 2009, at 12:49 PM, Scott Howell wrote:


 And as I keep saying, make your concerns known.  It's one thing to
 state your feelings here, but quite another in stating them to Apple.
 If enough people really want this and write to Apple, then there is a
 very good chance it will appear on the right radar screens.  There is
 a number of features that ended up in Snow Leopard as a direct result
 of people making their wishes known.  So, send your suggestion to 
 accessibil...@apple.com
  and keep reminding them from time to time.  If you think about it,
 this is how many features find their ways into many products.
 On Aug 25, 2009, at 3:22 PM, Justin Harford wrote:


 I've been thinking more about this other language synthesizers issue.
 I wonder how hard it would be for apple to include by default the
 voices that it uses for the iPhone on the installation CD of its
 operating system.  That way, a blind person could manage bios and
 system installation in multiple languages no problem.  And they would
 be low quality voices right?  So they wouldn't take that much extra
 space.  Then there could be some way by which we only put certain
 languages on the hard drive through installation.  So maybe, if I
 install my OS in Spanish, the CD will automatically only install the
 Spanish synthesizers.  Or maybe, it could install all synthesizers by
 default.  This would be nice for public computers, but if individuals
 wanted the extra space, they could opt to not install those
 synthesizers as they would opt to not install the extra language
 localizations.

 Maybe I might offer another perspective on this.  On no screen reader
 has there been offered a high quality voice like Alex.  In a way,
 apple are already stomping on the shoes of Acapela Group slightly by
 offering an american synthesizer which far out does anything their
 american voices could dish out.  I think that standing behind apple  
 in
 not including other language synthesizers in Mac OS X because of fear
 of hurting Acapela is a silly notion as it  places the interests of
 business before the consumer, but let's discuss that anyway since it
 is a concern.  Usually the place of a company like Acapela would be
 supplying high quality speech synthesis, which it does very well, and
 the place of the company that produces the screen reader would be to
 just provide synthesis.  Freedom scientific have offered foreign
 language with eloquence for a number of years now at no extra cost,
 and of course the same goes for all screen readers using ESpeak.  The
 idea is that you get to listen to stuff read in the language of your
 choice, though it might not be the highest of quality.  If you want
 high quality, you go to a company like Assistive Wear and buy the  
 high
 quality Acapela voices.  In a way, I would almost say that apple  
 would
 have done better to have implemented the iPhone synthesis along side
 Fred and the other English voices, in stead of producing Alex, but
 that's neither here nor there.

 The bottom line is that Apple is a company which, by its actions,
 seems to aim to serve an international customer base.  It has been
 possible for many years for a person in France, Germany, or Japan or
 where ever else to install and use the Mac OS in their native
 language.  I think that Apple has demonstrated that it understands
 very well the importance of including a world market in its computer
 revolution.  In 2005, they demonstrated that they also understood the
 importance of including people who use their computers by alternative
 means.  I remember an article from Apple to the developers a few  
 years
 back, which characterized the last 20 years in these terms… in the  
 90s
 we were working on internationalizing computers so that people of
 different nationalities could use them, then came the new millennium
 where the new challenge has been working on making computers usable  
 by
 people of different physical/sensory ability.  One of the first  
 things
 I noticed about my iPhone is that the accessibility menu is just down
 from international.

 It seems like then, apple understand accessibility and international
 as two facets of a single goal, to make their computers usable by as
 many people as possible.  They should understand that accessibility
 and international are practically the same thing because there are
 people with disabilities all over the world, not just in the United
 States.  So yes, apple surely understand this, then there must be  
 some
 reason as was already suggested for why they insist on not
 implementing foreign language synthesizers.  In conclusion, I think  
 it
 would be nice that they should include low quality foreign language
 synthesis in their OS, or if not that, at least they should give us a
 straight

Re: unnecissary voices/foreign language synthesis

[Justin Harford]

Hi there Will

It's as Anne said, it's quite disingenuous of them to act as though  
they never knew we wanted those voices to be included.  Of course they  
knew.  There must be a reason behind the decision not to include them   
be it technical or political.

Did Anne give you a french braille table?  I wonder if they might have  
done one in Spanish, or if other braille languages will be supported  
in SnowLeopard?

Quite honestly guise, I think Apple really are on the ball with  
accessibility.  You know the first iPhone I ever used was the one I  
pre-ordered for myself.  I had that much confidence in Apple that I  
was fine with ordering an iPhone with the accessibility enhancements  
without seeing them in advance, but just because a company can go so  
far with accessibility, doesn't mean they can do no wrong, and the  
user base should not be afraid to point out when they do do wrong.  I  
try to do this in as civil a way as I know.  If you don't agree with  
this, then let me know.

Regards
Justin Harford
On Aug 25, 2009, at 1:14 PM, william lomas wrote:


 Justin and all, they told me that they would consider it in the future
 it is as though they had not even known we wanted these features.
 Also, braille support although thanks to Anne and her husband, we are
 able to get the french and other language tables, through them.
 Will

 On 25 Aug 2009, at 21:09, Justin Harford wrote:


 If you checked the sending information for tha message, you would see
 that I CCed accessibility, along with the other messages I and others
 have sent them in the past.

 Regards
 Justin
 On Aug 25, 2009, at 12:49 PM, Scott Howell wrote:


 And as I keep saying, make your concerns known.  It's one thing to
 state your feelings here, but quite another in stating them to  
 Apple.
 If enough people really want this and write to Apple, then there  
 is a
 very good chance it will appear on the right radar screens.  There  
 is
 a number of features that ended up in Snow Leopard as a direct  
 result
 of people making their wishes known.  So, send your suggestion to 
 accessibil...@apple.com
 and keep reminding them from time to time.  If you think about it,
 this is how many features find their ways into many products.
 On Aug 25, 2009, at 3:22 PM, Justin Harford wrote:


 I've been thinking more about this other language synthesizers
 issue.
 I wonder how hard it would be for apple to include by default the
 voices that it uses for the iPhone on the installation CD of its
 operating system.  That way, a blind person could manage bios and
 system installation in multiple languages no problem.  And they
 would
 be low quality voices right?  So they wouldn't take that much extra
 space.  Then there could be some way by which we only put certain
 languages on the hard drive through installation.  So maybe, if I
 install my OS in Spanish, the CD will automatically only install  
 the
 Spanish synthesizers.  Or maybe, it could install all synthesizers
 by
 default.  This would be nice for public computers, but if
 individuals
 wanted the extra space, they could opt to not install those
 synthesizers as they would opt to not install the extra language
 localizations.

 Maybe I might offer another perspective on this.  On no screen
 reader
 has there been offered a high quality voice like Alex.  In a way,
 apple are already stomping on the shoes of Acapela Group slightly  
 by
 offering an american synthesizer which far out does anything their
 american voices could dish out.  I think that standing behind apple
 in
 not including other language synthesizers in Mac OS X because of
 fear
 of hurting Acapela is a silly notion as it  places the interests of
 business before the consumer, but let's discuss that anyway since  
 it
 is a concern.  Usually the place of a company like Acapela would be
 supplying high quality speech synthesis, which it does very well,
 and
 the place of the company that produces the screen reader would be  
 to
 just provide synthesis.  Freedom scientific have offered foreign
 language with eloquence for a number of years now at no extra cost,
 and of course the same goes for all screen readers using ESpeak.
 The
 idea is that you get to listen to stuff read in the language of  
 your
 choice, though it might not be the highest of quality.  If you want
 high quality, you go to a company like Assistive Wear and buy the
 high
 quality Acapela voices.  In a way, I would almost say that apple
 would
 have done better to have implemented the iPhone synthesis along  
 side
 Fred and the other English voices, in stead of producing Alex, but
 that's neither here nor there.

 The bottom line is that Apple is a company which, by its actions,
 seems to aim to serve an international customer base.  It has been
 possible for many years for a person in France, Germany, or Japan  
 or
 where ever else to install and use the Mac OS in their native
 language.  I think that Apple has demonstrated that it understands

snowleopard student discount

[Justin Harford]

Hello all

Does anyone know if they will offer a student discount for snowleopard  
as they did with leopard?

Regards
Justin Harford

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Re: say it's not so apple

[Justin Harford]

I think it's a preference hopefully.

Justin
On Aug 24, 2009, at 1:28 PM, Marie Howarth wrote:


 one feature I just read they have in snow leopard is voice over will
 now read the whole website to you. I cannot say I'm happy about this,
 the one thing about VO I love is it does what I want it too not what
 it thinks I want it too. ugh. apple why listen to them?
 sorry, but what do others think?


 


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Re: skype and the chat frame

[Justin Harford]

Are you using groups mode?  If so, the below suggestion won't work at  
all.  This is a defect with groups mode where it does not work with  
dynamically changing html.  Otherwise, I would add to the suggestion  
and say that at the top of the chat contents, pressing VO shift cmd  
left arrow can be useful too.  Depends on the key command to which you  
are adjusted.

Regards
Justin Harford
On Aug 24, 2009, at 3:08 PM, Chantel Cuddemi wrote:


 Vo shift function right arrow will fix this. It'll bring you to the
 end of the chat.
 On Aug 24, 2009, at 5:46 PM, Yuma Antoine Decaux wrote:


 Hi everyone,

 I've been using skype on the mac for about a month now, and  
 everything
 is accessible, or the key paths have been memorized. I have a problem
 though while chatting. The chat frame doesn't refresh, and i have to
 close the chat window and reopen it again from the contact list to
 have an updated conversation.

 Anyone stumble upon this problem? I have the latest skype release  
 2.8.

 Some clarity would be well appreciated

 best




 


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Re: Safari 4.0.3

[Justin Harford]

LOL I didn't really notice this until now that you guys have pointed  
it out.  I personally would prefer that it say the completed addresses  
but there you go.  It does seem to read the options if you arrow up  
and down.

Justin
On Aug 16, 2009, at 1:19 PM, Marie Howarth wrote:


 It only says unhighlighted if you continue to type an address it
 already has in the address bar. if you type a different letter and the
 address changes, it says another address. And seen as some people were
 complaining that voice over kept saying the addresses while still
 typing. now it doesn't do that, and still, well, lol

 On Aug 16, 2009, at 7:43 PM, william lomas wrote:


 yup i wondered why it said unselected

 On 16 Aug 2009, at 19:00, Barry Hadder wrote:


 I've just started using it and I've noticed one annoying thing right
 off the bat.  When I type a url in the address bar and it auto-
 completes it, all VO says is not high-lighted.



 Scott Howell wrote:
 Folks, have any of you upgraded to the most recent version of  
 Safari
 and had any issues?  I read an article that indicated there were
 some
 problems and so I thought I'd ask before upgrading.

 Thanks,






 


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Re: Voice Over in Snow Leopard

[Justin Harford]

Alex wrote:

  anyways in the
 ipod iand the IPhone, t is that of nuance

Umm… is this English that you are writing to me? 
  
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Re: Voice Over in Snow Leopard

[Justin Harford]

It will.
On Jul 7, 2009, at 10:13 AM, william lomas wrote:


 what I meant to say was I am not sure if voice over itself will ship
 with voices in italian, greek, arabic, russian polish, etc. or whether
 we are still locked down to using acapella

 On 7 Jul 2009, at 18:07, Koumanova Rostislava wrote:


 i did not understand this post.
 i know that you have to buy the foreign languages.
 rk
 Il giorno 07/lug/09, alle ore 18:06, william lomas ha scritto:


 it says on the site the quickstart is localised in eighteen  
 languages
 with nine new ones and with the voices you can hear it in your own
 languages
 but i hope that the eighteen or so work with pre-defined foreign
 voices

 On 7 Jul 2009, at 16:51, Simon Cavendish wrote:


 O yes, I entirely agree. They have always acknowledged my posts,  
 and
 I'm sure they are trying to do their best in Braille support. I
 wouldn't be without my Mac now. No regrets switching on my part!

 With best wishes, Simon
 On 7 Jul 2009, at 16:44, James  Nash wrote:


 I hear what you're saying Simon. To Apple's credit, they have
 always
 acknowledged my messages and have offered support where they  
 can. I
 still
 like and would continue to use Windows for things but I do miss
 Mac.
 That's
 why I'm going to purchase a new one.
 - Original Message -
 From: Simon Cavendish simon.cavend...@googlemail.com
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Sent: Tuesday, July 07, 2009 4:34 PM
 Subject: Re: Voice Over in Snow Leopard



 I have been e-mailing Apple accessibility regarding providing a
 broader support in refreshable Braille for other languages. I do
 hope
 Snow Leopard is going to bring this aspect to those of us who
 would
 benefit from it. It would certainly accelerate my leaving Windows
 behind altogether.

 With best wishes

 Simon
 On 7 Jul 2009, at 11:50, James  Nash wrote:


 Well on the Snow Leopard page there is a host of different
 features.
 Yes, I
 think I remember reading that something - it may have been Voice
 Over - was
 localized in about 40 different languages. But I'm not sure  
 about
 Braille
 support. However, if you can some way implement BRLTTY or ask
 Apple
 to do so
 we may get native foreign language Braille support. I think  
 Apple
 is
 Linux
 based, so this should not be too difficult.

 Take care

 James
 - Original Message -
 From: william lomas lomaswill...@googlemail.com
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Sent: Tuesday, July 07, 2009 11:39 AM
 Subject: Re: Voice Over in Snow Leopard



 is there a complete list of new features? i.e.
 .do we get new language voices i wonder
 . new braille support in other alnguages?
 etc
 i guess we will not know these details really until the product
 is
 out

 On 7 Jul 2009, at 11:29, James  Nash wrote:


 Hi,

 It sounds like Snow Leopard is an upgrade. Is this the case?
 Fortunately, I
 have a copy of 10.5 which I bought last year so if so then  
 there
 shouldn't
 be any problem.

 Take care

 James
 - Original Message -
 From: Scott Howell s.how...@verizon.net
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Sent: Tuesday, July 07, 2009 10:25 AM
 Subject: Re: Voice Over in Snow Leopard



 Maybe so, but it will be worth upgrading and the cost is so
 unreal,
 it
 doesn't make much since to skip this upgrade. There are other
 reasons
 beyond accessibility to upgrade. I can guarantee you that $30
 is a
 very small price to pay for the improvements and many of which
 you
 may
 not have considered or realized.
 On Jul 7, 2009, at 2:47 AM, william lomas wrote:


 i doubt we get new voices except maybe the ones found in  
 the i
 phone.
 I am going to wait to upgrade i think, what I have now works
 fine.
 UPgrading won't give us for example, access to flash content
 so
 no
 point in me upgrading since a lot of sites I use, require
 flash
 navigation which adobe have not yet incorporated into the
 safari or
 other web browsers

 On 7 Jul 2009, at 02:53, Jenny Kennedy wrote:


 Yay! I'm very very glad to hear this wonderful news. A  
 little
 bummed I
 don't have a fancy trackpad. I have heard some of the iPhone
 demos
 and
 gestures just sound so cool and fun.   I guess I'll just put
 up
 with
 old tech. LOL I hope to get an iPhone in the future and will
 be
 happy
 to wait 'til then to try gestures. Unless my getting a new
 macbook
 happens first. But as this one is still fairly newish I'll
 wait.
 Who
 know by the time it comes time for me to get a new macbook
 they'll of
 come up with many more new and cool things. : smiley :
 Can't wait 'til SL comes out. I know it's not too far off
 but.
 It
 sounds so awesome. Am keen to hear any new voices. Have
 always
 liked
 the UK voices. The best thing would be a UK version of Alex,
 with
 the
 breths and all. I still think that's uber cool how Alex  
 voice
 does
 that.
 Jenny

 On 7/6/09, Scott Howell s.how...@verizon.net wrote:

 Jenny, first only the Aluminum MacBooks contain the multi-
 touch
 trackpad unless Apple upgrades the MacBook 

Re: Voice Over in Snow Leopard

[Justin Harford]

Hmm, I just went over the snow leopard description and it is true that  
it makes no mention of other synthesizers, though it does mention that  
the quick-start tutorial is localized in a number of languages.   
Nevertheless, I hardly think supposing that it will have other  
language synthesizers is a terribly outrageous postulation.  I mean  
just look at the technology we have in the iPhone.  It is now possible  
to go through the languages menu, and hear a number of languages  
including french, portuguese both brazilian and portugal, Spanish,  
Chinese, italian etc all spoken.  We know that the iPod shuffle also  
has the ability to pronounce the names of songs in other languages.

Yes I feel safe, without having tried it for myself, in asserting that  
the next version of Mac OS X will not only have language localization,  
but the synthesizers to hear that language spoken.  Granted it won't  
be as nice as Alex.  It certainly would be crazy to think that Alex is  
going to be speaking anything more than English.  The synthesizers  
will be like those on the iPhone.

Regards
Justin Harford
On Jul 7, 2009, at 11:24 AM, James  Nash wrote:


 If that does happen, that's fantastic news. Accapella are fantastic  
 voices
 but it would be cool to  have French and other European and Slavic  
 languages
 etc included by default.
 - Original Message -
 From: william lomas lomaswill...@googlemail.com
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Sent: Tuesday, July 07, 2009 7:15 PM
 Subject: Re: Voice Over in Snow Leopard



 fair enough though we are all blind and have a right to know what  
 will
 be included in my view

 On 7 Jul 2009, at 19:11, Alex Jurgensen wrote:


 Hi,
 Red flag,

 We are moving into grey ares. Please keep the posts NDA compliant.

 Thanks,
 Alex,


 On 7-Jul-09, at 10:46 AM, Justin Harford wrote:


 It will.
 On Jul 7, 2009, at 10:13 AM, william lomas wrote:


 what I meant to say was I am not sure if voice over itself will  
 ship
 with voices in italian, greek, arabic, russian polish, etc. or
 whether
 we are still locked down to using acapella

 On 7 Jul 2009, at 18:07, Koumanova Rostislava wrote:


 i did not understand this post.
 i know that you have to buy the foreign languages.
 rk
 Il giorno 07/lug/09, alle ore 18:06, william lomas ha scritto:


 it says on the site the quickstart is localised in eighteen
 languages
 with nine new ones and with the voices you can hear it in your  
 own
 languages
 but i hope that the eighteen or so work with pre-defined foreign
 voices

 On 7 Jul 2009, at 16:51, Simon Cavendish wrote:


 O yes, I entirely agree. They have always acknowledged my  
 posts,
 and
 I'm sure they are trying to do their best in Braille support. I
 wouldn't be without my Mac now. No regrets switching on my  
 part!

 With best wishes, Simon
 On 7 Jul 2009, at 16:44, James  Nash wrote:


 I hear what you're saying Simon. To Apple's credit, they have
 always
 acknowledged my messages and have offered support where they
 can. I
 still
 like and would continue to use Windows for things but I do  
 miss
 Mac.
 That's
 why I'm going to purchase a new one.
 - Original Message -
 From: Simon Cavendish simon.cavend...@googlemail.com
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Sent: Tuesday, July 07, 2009 4:34 PM
 Subject: Re: Voice Over in Snow Leopard



 I have been e-mailing Apple accessibility regarding  
 providing a
 broader support in refreshable Braille for other languages. I
 do
 hope
 Snow Leopard is going to bring this aspect to those of us who
 would
 benefit from it. It would certainly accelerate my leaving
 Windows
 behind altogether.

 With best wishes

 Simon
 On 7 Jul 2009, at 11:50, James  Nash wrote:


 Well on the Snow Leopard page there is a host of different
 features.
 Yes, I
 think I remember reading that something - it may have been
 Voice
 Over - was
 localized in about 40 different languages. But I'm not sure
 about
 Braille
 support. However, if you can some way implement BRLTTY or  
 ask
 Apple
 to do so
 we may get native foreign language Braille support. I think
 Apple
 is
 Linux
 based, so this should not be too difficult.

 Take care

 James
 - Original Message -
 From: william lomas lomaswill...@googlemail.com
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Sent: Tuesday, July 07, 2009 11:39 AM
 Subject: Re: Voice Over in Snow Leopard



 is there a complete list of new features? i.e.
 .do we get new language voices i wonder
 . new braille support in other alnguages?
 etc
 i guess we will not know these details really until the
 product
 is
 out

 On 7 Jul 2009, at 11:29, James  Nash wrote:


 Hi,

 It sounds like Snow Leopard is an upgrade. Is this the  
 case?
 Fortunately, I
 have a copy of 10.5 which I bought last year so if so then
 there
 shouldn't
 be any problem.

 Take care

 James
 - Original Message -
 From: Scott Howell s.how...@verizon.net
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Sent: Tuesday, July 07, 2009 10:25 AM

Re: Word Processing on Mac OS X

[Justin Harford]

If you use LaTeX you are doing quite well.  LaTeX is far nicer under  
Mac OS X than Windows.

Justin
On Jul 7, 2009, at 1:36 PM, James  Nash wrote:


 Hi Simon,

 Yes I do. i feel sure that if we were to contact them, they would be  
 more
 than helpful. They are now at version 1.3 for Pro. You can get a
 downloadable free 15 day demo if you like.

 Although i use Latex for writing, it is always grat to use a word  
 processor
 like Nisus. When i get my new Mac I will look at the new Nisus  
 version.

 Take care

 James
 - Original Message -
 From: Simon Cavendish simon.cavend...@googlemail.com
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Sent: Tuesday, July 07, 2009 9:03 PM
 Subject: Re: Word Processing on Mac OS X



 Dear James,

 I have been following various posts on this list but to date I  
 haven't
 heard anything reassuring about Pages or Iworks that would persuade  
 me
 that I could ditch Ms Office under Windows. However, I know that some
 people have used Pages and other applications with a degree of
 success. I've looked at the help files in Pages but I found them so
 unhelpful that I gave up.

 I seem to remember that you had some contacts with Nisus Pro. ARe you
 still able to talk to them about accessbility of their application?  
 If
 they took our need on board, I feel they would be a great rival to Ms
 Office on the Mac.

 I am sorry not to be more helpful.

 With best and warmest wishes

 Simon
 On 7 Jul 2009, at 20:48, James  Nash wrote:


 Hi folks,

 Does anyone use Pages or Nisus Writer Pro on Mac OS X or indeed any
 other
 Mac word processor please? If so, what is the acce3ssibility of each
 with
 VO?

 Thanks

 James








 


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Re: Voice Over in Snow Leopard

[Justin Harford]

Hi all

I just got a look at this thread.  It seems that, once again, I am  
ignorant of how we, as equal citizens with equal legal  
responsibilities should view ourselves as apple customers.  I wonder  
if someone might please educate me on what is wrong with the  
proposition that we should have some sort of audio demonstrations of  
upcoming apple accessibility developments.  Please allow me to explain  
myself.

   Of course the idea that we are entitled to this information as  
blind people is completely ridiculous, but I still wonder why no one  
is bothered that apple don't put out a demo of the technology for us  
to listen to.  Scott you said

You are not entitled to know any more than your sighted counterpart.

I agree.  As it is, our sighted counterparts get to see live  
demonstrations of the technologies in which they will invest their  
money.  There was a snow-leopard demo at the last WWDC.  When Leopard  
came out, there was also a WWDC demo and more demos on apple's  
website.  When the iPhone 3gs came out, apple offered a demonstration  
on their website.  When the iPod shuffle came out, apple again offered  
a demo on their website.  In all of these cases, perhaps with the  
exception of the shuffle and maybe the voice control on the iPhone if  
you count that as accessibility, there was no demonstration of  
VoiceOver.  Of course, the blind as such a small customer base should  
give apple no occasion to suffer itself to demonstrate VO before an  
audience of WWDC developers and customers, who couldn't care less, but  
is putting up a little audio demonstration on their accessibility page  
really too much to ask?

It is true.  I'm not entitled to know anything more than my sighted  
counterpart, and I guess at this point, that is how things are.  The  
sighted don't know how accessibility works under snow-leopard, just as  
I don't know.  I know that snow-leopard offers the capability to watch  
movies through finder icons, just as the sighted know.  The average  
sighted joe does not care about accessibility improvements, just as I  
don't care about watching movies through icons.  Something just seems  
wrong here, though I'm having trouble putting my finger on it.

I think that apple customers should be shown the things they care  
about.  Some people care about photos on the mac, so they show them.   
Some people care about listening to music and watching videos, so they  
show it.  Some people want to be productive in a business setting on  
their macs, so they show productivity.  Some people care about the  
development tools, so they show those.  In our case, we care about  
accessibility, why not show it, not because we are blind people  
looking for concessions or special treatment, but as consumers  
spending money on apple products.

I have read the descriptions of snow leopard, and am pretty sure that  
I will buy a copy when it comes out, because the descriptions on  
apple's website are compelling enough.  Even if accessibility  
improvements prove to be minor or non-existent, the improvements in  
speed and stability will make it worth the money.  So, I don't feel  
the need to raise a scandal over the fact that I can't legally listen  
to an audio demonstration of VoiceOver 3.0.  No problem.   
Nevertheless, the fact that people wanting a little taste of future  
apple accessibility developments, like the demonstrations that their  
sighted counterparts get, are so brusquely talked down and at times  
hunted like criminals and reported to the authorities, continues to  
elude me.

This is the view I have of things now.  As I stated before, it is  
becoming increasingly obvious that it is out-of-step with the common  
consensus, so I wonder if someone might not come forward and tell me  
why I am wrong.  The perspectives and premises we hold in life  
profoundly govern the way we carry ourselves in the world.  I most  
certainly would not want to continue harboring views which cause my  
conduct to  be excessively abrasive and unpalatable to those around  
me.  That is why, without sarcasm, I'm asking for a change in  
perspective for me and the others who ignorantly continue in this error.

Best regards
Justin Harford

On Jul 7, 2009, at 12:21 PM, Scott Howell wrote:


 Oh, no, you as a blind person do not have a right to know anything
 different than anyone else. You are not entitled to know any more than
 your sighted counterpart. WHen Apple releases the information about
 Snow Leopard, you can read and make a decision as to whether or not
 you would want to upgrade, just as anyone else would. Being blind does
 not extend any special entitlements and any violation of the NDA that
 was signed is not only breaking a contract between you and Apple or
 whomever you entered into the agreement with, it also jeopardizes
 future involvement in other projects. Point is you agreed to a
 contract and knowing the terms and conditions of that contract, you
 are legally bound

Re: Voice Over in Snow Leopard

[Justin Harford]

Alex wrote:

 There was Snow Leopard and Leopard accessibility
 demonstrations at WWDC both years according to Apple. They just
 weren't in the main keynote I guess.

You guess?  I just watched a WWDC on snowleopard and saw zero (0)  
accessibility demonstration.  Sure they mentioned it regarding the  
iPhone 3gs and that was most appreciated, but was there a  
demonstration, absolutely not.  This is a blatently false assertion.   
Why don't you back it up with proof?

Regards
Justin 

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Re: Voice Over in Snow Leopard

[Justin Harford]

Alex wrote:

 What I meant is that I felt that someone made a comment of something
 that only insiders would know. It was not something that Apple made
 public.

OK OK fair enough.  I suppose there is a marginal possibility that  
apple will defy all logic and not introduce the synthesizer technology  
that they have developed into their next version of mac os x.   
Honestly such a speculation could hardly be insider knowledge, but  
as I stated, common sense.  But you're right, it's marginally  
possible, like a 1% chance that I am wrong.

Feel free to rub it in my face if such a peculiar happening should  
come to fruition.
J

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Re: Turning off MacBook screens?

[Justin Harford]

Dimming the screen down will at least completely turn off the  
illumination, a far cry fromm what most computers will let you do.
On Jul 6, 2009, at 5:43 AM, James  Nash wrote:

 Thanks Scott,

 That is a real shame I think.

 Take care

 James
 - Original Message -
 From: Scott Howell
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Sent: Monday, July 06, 2009 10:46 AM
 Subject: Re: Turning off MacBook screens?

 Screen curtain does not turn the screen off. If you turn the  
 brightness down as far as it will go, that will help save your  
 battery, but I do not believe you can turn the screen off entirely- 
 in other words cut power to it.
 On Jul 6, 2009, at 5:38 AM, James  Nash wrote:

 Hi,

 Am I corect in thinking that the Linux commandline options will  
 work under Mac OS X? If so, if I could find out how to write shell  
 scripts or whatever they are called do you think they would work  
 under Mac OS X? Also, do the Screen Brightness and Screen Curtain  
 options actually turn the screen off?

 Take care

 james
 - Original Message -
 From: Alex Jurgensen
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Sent: Monday, July 06, 2009 5:22 AM
 Subject: Re: Turning off MacBook screens?

 Hi,
 James,

 Just continue with Screen Brightness and Screen Curtain together. I  
 should write a CLI script for this.

 Regards,
 Alex,


 On 5-Jul-09, at 2:39 PM, James  Nash wrote:

 Hi folks,

 This might sound like an odd question, but as i cannot see the   
 screen I was wondering if there was a way to turn it off? I know  
 that you can turn the screen brightness right down and use the  
 Screen Curtain which effectively does this which was what I used  
 to do. But I was wondering if there was a solution via the Command  
 Line. In Linux, this can be achieved by something like dpms off.  
 This keeps the screen off until you either use dpms on our restart  
 the pc.

 I have tried turning off my laptop screen in Windows, and JFW  
 doesn't like it too much. As VO is built directly into the system  
 i assume it doesn't use video intercept but instead gets its  
 access info direct from the Mac OS X kernel?

 Thanks for any help that you can provide

 Thank you for taking the time to read this.

 Take care

 James











 


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Re: Turning off MacBook screens?

[Justin Harford]

Yes it turns off the backlighth completely, but the pixels are still  
showing your desktop, making it discernable if for example you are  
sitting out in the sun.
On Jul 6, 2009, at 7:40 AM, James  Nash wrote:

 No I don't think you are Scott. However, I did read someone that  
 turning down the screen brightness to zero actually turns off the  
 backlight on the screen - effectively turning it off. I just  
 wondered if this was possible as I have no need for a screen bu from  
 waht I remember turning down the screen brightness increased batery  
 life dramatically.

 Thanks

 James
 - Original Message -
 From: Scott Howell
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Sent: Monday, July 06, 2009 2:04 PM
 Subject: Re: Turning off MacBook screens?

 James, why is that a shame? Surely you recognize that turning off  
 the screen would generally not make a lot of sense. These aren't  
 machines designed exclusively for the blind, so turning off the  
 screen would only benefit those of us who would not typically use  
 the screen. It just isn't one of those features Apple or any other  
 computer manufacturer would really consider. You have the option to  
 turn the screen brightness down to the point where no one could read  
 it and that alone would help conserve battery life. However, to say  
 it is a shame seems a little odd when you consider the larger scope  
 here. I am not sure what purpose this feature would serve even on a  
 lInux machine, but maybe there is something I'm missing here beyond  
 the possible extension of battery life.
 On Jul 6, 2009, at 8:43 AM, James  Nash wrote:

 Thanks Scott,

 That is a real shame I think.

 Take care

 James
 - Original Message -
 From: Scott Howell
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Sent: Monday, July 06, 2009 10:46 AM
 Subject: Re: Turning off MacBook screens?

 Screen curtain does not turn the screen off. If you turn the  
 brightness down as far as it will go, that will help save your  
 battery, but I do not believe you can turn the screen off entirely- 
 in other words cut power to it.
 On Jul 6, 2009, at 5:38 AM, James  Nash wrote:

 Hi,

 Am I corect in thinking that the Linux commandline options will  
 work under Mac OS X? If so, if I could find out how to write shell  
 scripts or whatever they are called do you think they would work  
 under Mac OS X? Also, do the Screen Brightness and Screen Curtain  
 options actually turn the screen off?

 Take care

 james
 - Original Message -
 From: Alex Jurgensen
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Sent: Monday, July 06, 2009 5:22 AM
 Subject: Re: Turning off MacBook screens?

 Hi,
 James,

 Just continue with Screen Brightness and Screen Curtain together.  
 I should write a CLI script for this.

 Regards,
 Alex,


 On 5-Jul-09, at 2:39 PM, James  Nash wrote:

 Hi folks,

 This might sound like an odd question, but as i cannot see the   
 screen I was wondering if there was a way to turn it off? I know  
 that you can turn the screen brightness right down and use the  
 Screen Curtain which effectively does this which was what I used  
 to do. But I was wondering if there was a solution via the  
 Command Line. In Linux, this can be achieved by something like  
 dpms off. This keeps the screen off until you either use dpms on  
 our restart the pc.

 I have tried turning off my laptop screen in Windows, and JFW  
 doesn't like it too much. As VO is built directly into the system  
 i assume it doesn't use video intercept but instead gets its  
 access info direct from the Mac OS X kernel?

 Thanks for any help that you can provide

 Thank you for taking the time to read this.

 Take care

 James
















 


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Re: Turning off MacBook screens?

[Justin Harford]

Not to mention these options are wonderful if you are a partial with  
light sensative eyes.  Before I got my Macbook Pro, if I had a  
headache, I couldn't do homework because all my homework was on my  
gateway, and the bright screen of my gateway would make my headaches  
worse.  When I got my macbook pro, I could work even when I had a  
headache.  I even had instances where I shook off my head pains after  
a couple hours of writing up estronomy problem sets etc.

Justin
On Jul 6, 2009, at 10:17 AM, Scott Howell wrote:

 Of course don't forget you can turn off the backlight for the  
 keyboard on the MacBook Pro as well. There is an option in System  
 Preferences under Keyboard for this and it is to disable keyboard  
 backlight. Illuminate keyboard in low light conditions and  
 unchecking as far as I know will disable this feature.
 On Jul 6, 2009, at 1:02 PM, Justin Harford wrote:

 Dimming the screen down will at least completely turn off the  
 illumination, a far cry fromm what most computers will let you do.
 On Jul 6, 2009, at 5:43 AM, James  Nash wrote:

 Thanks Scott,

 That is a real shame I think.

 Take care

 James
 - Original Message -
 From: Scott Howell
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Sent: Monday, July 06, 2009 10:46 AM
 Subject: Re: Turning off MacBook screens?

 Screen curtain does not turn the screen off. If you turn the  
 brightness down as far as it will go, that will help save your  
 battery, but I do not believe you can turn the screen off entirely- 
 in other words cut power to it.
 On Jul 6, 2009, at 5:38 AM, James  Nash wrote:

 Hi,

 Am I corect in thinking that the Linux commandline options will  
 work under Mac OS X? If so, if I could find out how to write  
 shell scripts or whatever they are called do you think they would  
 work under Mac OS X? Also, do the Screen Brightness and Screen  
 Curtain options actually turn the screen off?

 Take care

 james
 - Original Message -
 From: Alex Jurgensen
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Sent: Monday, July 06, 2009 5:22 AM
 Subject: Re: Turning off MacBook screens?

 Hi,
 James,

 Just continue with Screen Brightness and Screen Curtain together.  
 I should write a CLI script for this.

 Regards,
 Alex,


 On 5-Jul-09, at 2:39 PM, James  Nash wrote:

 Hi folks,

 This might sound like an odd question, but as i cannot see the   
 screen I was wondering if there was a way to turn it off? I know  
 that you can turn the screen brightness right down and use the  
 Screen Curtain which effectively does this which was what I used  
 to do. But I was wondering if there was a solution via the  
 Command Line. In Linux, this can be achieved by something like  
 dpms off. This keeps the screen off until you either use dpms on  
 our restart the pc.

 I have tried turning off my laptop screen in Windows, and JFW  
 doesn't like it too much. As VO is built directly into the  
 system i assume it doesn't use video intercept but instead gets  
 its access info direct from the Mac OS X kernel?

 Thanks for any help that you can provide

 Thank you for taking the time to read this.

 Take care

 James



















 


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Re: brf reader

[Justin Harford]

Lol am I the only one on here who misses hardcopy braille?

Justin
On Jul 4, 2009, at 3:35 PM, Simon Cavendish wrote:


 SCott,

 Braille is very important to me too. There are some small displays
 which perfectly adequate. Blazie have some small displays of 18  to 20
 cells and they are quite adequate. You use a button or bar to advance
 the display but you can still read very fast. I think braille displays
 are just a must for braille blind readers. I would not be without
 them. Brlnote has a 32 cell display but it is a kind of computer as
 well - a bit too bulky. I have sen advertised some smaller and lighter
 almost pocket size braille displays which I crave. I do hope that we
 will always have Braille displays for those of us who just have to
 feel the letters with their finger tips. I know I do.

 Best wishes, Simon
 On 4 Jul 2009, at 20:25, Scott Howell wrote:


 You know Eric you got a good point. I want a braille display very
 badly. I have a long commute, but headphones on the train is not an
 option and I'd love to have a small and compact display I could use  
 to
 do some reading. Actually f anyone knows of a good display that would
 of course work with Leopard and is reasonably priced (subjective I
 know), please advise or at least let me know what you have used. I
 might just dig into my pocket and stimulate some ones economy. :) A
 really big question for me is I think there are some very small
 displays out there and how do folks handle reading with these. I  
 think
 they are wide enough to have maybe two or three words displayed at a
 time? I assume you just learn to scroll right and read with one hand?
 I know it sounds like a silly question, but I have only read braille
 books and the like, so a display is kind of foreign to me.

 tnx,
 On Jul 4, 2009, at 2:04 PM, erik burggraaf wrote:


 No, you're dead on, smiles.  I'm a lazy boy myself, and generally
 speaking I'm just as happy to be read to.  There's something about
 braille though.  Listening is fine, especially if you have a good
 book
 with a really great narrater.  Reading with a speech engine is OK.
 It
 would let me take care of odd chores while I'm listening and still
 get
 access to that book that I can't find in audiobook format.  I like
 reading a book in braille once in a while though, and I'm especially
 going to like it if I don't have to be tied down to my computer by a
 usb cable to do it.  Reading complements listening and helps keep
 spelling and grammer skills sharp as well as just providing an
 alternative to listening to cheesie speech synthesizers.  I can't
 stand the thought of paper braille but there's definitely an
 attraction for me in pulling out my braille connect and going to  
 town
 on a book.  I have to run around the city all the time for work and
 the transit system takes a while to get anywhere.  So, I can plan to
 be on the road anywere from one hour to 2 or three to get where I
 need
 to be on any given day.  Braille books are really handy for that.  I
 can take my braille display and read my book and still pay strict
 attention to stop announcements and such.  I can even stand on a bus
 or a train with my arm around a pole and the other hand scrubbing  
 the
 display.  Kind'a makes me feel like any other guy with a paperback  
 or
 a news paper.

 Best,

 erik burggraaf
 A+ sertified technician and user support consultant.
 Phone: 888-255-5194
 Email: e...@erik-burggraaf.com

 On 4-Jul-09, at 1:15 PM, Jenny Kennedy wrote:


 Ah Eric, I think I see your point?
 It looks as if the CNIB has what the NLS calls web braille. You  
 just
 want to grab the books that come in the web braille brf format and
 read them in braille from your mac like people do when they put  
 them
 on something like a braille note?  That's fair enough, some people
 like reading braille over listening to spoken word. Pointless or
 not,
 brf seems to be the file of choice by groups who provide electronic
 access to their libries for braille content. There's nothing wrong
 with wanting to read a book in braille via a braille display, note
 taker or whatever.
 Having said this though, I've gotta say I'm with Josh and find it
 faster and just more enjoyable to have whatever it is read to me  
 and
 wish that the different programs who offer etexts to us would
 offer a
 HTML or TXT version along with the BRF version. But then you run
 into
 all that copyright stuff so I guess you deal with things as they
 are.
 : smile :

 Am I kind of right? Or have I missed the mark altogether?

 Best regards
 Jenny

 On 7/4/09, Josh de Lioncourt overl...@lioncourt.com wrote:


 With the advent of grade 2 translation in screen readers for
 English,
 the point of BRF files is basically non-existent. They only were
 ever
 there because, initially, screen readers didn't translate into
 grade
 2, so BRF files were a convenient way to read books without the
 painful necessity of reading them in computer Braille, (AKA Grade
 0).

 These days, BRF 

Re: daisy player for IPhone

[Justin Harford]

No
On Jun 30, 2009, at 1:03 PM, Jane Jordan (Gmail) wrote:


 That reminds me of something.  Is it true you can buy an iPhone G3  
 without
 the plan download new software for it, and it will talk like the new  
 ones?
 Or basically an iPod touch and get the new software and it will talk  
 like
 the new iPhones?

 Jane



 -Original Message-
 From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 [mailto:macvisionar...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of william lomas
 Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2009 4:01 PM
 To: General discussions on all topics relating to the use of Mac OS  
 X by the
 blind
 Subject: daisy player for IPhone


   hi wouldn't it be cool if we had a daisy player for the IPhone and
 IPod touch line of products, so that owners of these devices would
 just need one device?
 Will



 Internal Virus Database is out of date.
 Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
 Version: 8.0.169 / Virus Database: 270.10.5/1882 - Release Date:  
 1/8/2009
 8:13 AM


 


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Re: daisy player for IPhone

[Justin Harford]

I'm curious when we are going to see the other apps that he has been  
writing about.  They must have one heck of a development team to be  
focused on so many different programs simultaneously.

J
On Jun 30, 2009, at 2:42 PM, Scott Howell wrote:


 Alex, how do you plan to work with the issue of authorizing the
 devices etc? Glad someone is working on it.
 On Jun 30, 2009, at 5:24 PM, Alex Jurgensen wrote:


 Hi,
 All,

 Daisy is coming tothe iPhone sooner than you think. Using OS
 technology, the software development team at VIPBC have been hard at
 work on a DAISY book Application.

 Regards,
 Alex,






 


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Re: website audio question

[Justin Harford]

Just turn off the java and plugins under security
On Jun 17, 2009, at 7:46 AM, Alex Jurgensen wrote:


 Hi,

 I know that Webkit can detect if VO is running, so you may just
 request this as a feature. I'm sure non-VO users will approve as well.
 It has to come from Apple/The Webkit crew.

 Regards,
 Alex,


 On 16-Jun-09, at 8:10 PM, Maxwell Ivey Jr. wrote:


 Hi group;  Ok, so can someone tell me how I turn the audio off when a
 webpage loads?  I tell you nothing is more annoying than having to
 turn my vo volume all the way up just to try to get to the one link i
 need so their music will stop playing.  In jaws it was the escape  
 key,
 but I've never found anything about how to do this on a mac.  Please
 help.  Thanks, Max




 


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Re: Mac-cessibility Quick Tip #24

[Justin Harford]

Cool.  Hey you guys should post a tip about changing your facebook  
status with adium.  It would be worth mentioning that you can chat  
over facebook too.  I have never been able to find a win program that  
can do this.

Justin
On Jun 13, 2009, at 6:37 PM, Cara Quinn wrote:


 Mac-cessibility quick Tip #24 is now posted at:

 http://www.lioncourt.com/2009/06/13/mac-cessibility-quick-tip-24/

 Skype users, enjoy!

 Cara  :)
 ---
 Follow me on Twitter!

 https://twitter.com/ModelCara

 View my Online Portfolio at:
 http://www.onemodelplace.com/CaraQuinn


 


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Re: Podcast about VO in Snow Leopard

[Justin Harford]

Arhrhrhrhrhrhrhrhrhrrhrhrhrhr
On Jun 14, 2009, at 10:44 AM, Buddy Brannan wrote:



 On Jun 14, 2009, at 1:29 PM, Jessi and Goldina wrote:

 yeah, I don't know how this can be snow leopard since it's not out
 yet, unless maybe they got a developer copy? but I'm listening to it
 anyway lol

 Three words for you:
 Yo ho ho!

 And five more:
 Ye be walkin' the plank.

 Nuff said if you know where to look.


 


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Re: looking for world clock that work with vo?

[Justin Harford]

No
On Jun 13, 2009, at 4:06 PM, Alex Jurgensen wrote:


 Hi,

 Won't the widget wrok?

 Regards,
 alex,


 On 13-Jun-09, at 3:37 PM, Maurice Mines wrote:


 hi I am looking for a world clock that will with vo I need to know
 what time it is in diferent time zonesboth here in the us and in
 japan. enay ides?




 


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