Re: [MBZ] SDL idle shudder
I think the idle should be ~ 800. There is an adjustment at the IP, towards the block. Kinda close quarters, but it's doable. I used a deep socket to loosen the counter nut. Turn the slotted bolt to change the idle speed. IIRC, CW is more, CCW is less RPM. On 1/16/07, Luther [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The SDL's idle runs about 550-600 at it's lowest point and it likes to shudder after dropping from a higher RPM. How do I go about setting this to the correct speed? TIA all, -- Luther KB5QHUAlma, Ark '87 300SDL (271,xxx mi) head case? '83 300SD (242 kmi) for sale '82 300CD (163 kmi) '82 300D (74 kmi) getting donor engine '85 300D (280,176) parts car ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- Hans Neureiter, Houston, TX '82 300SD, '95 E300D
Re: [MBZ] SDL idle shudder
Check the wiring on the rack position solenoid, too -- that engine have electronic idle control, and if it's not working, the mechanical idle speed is usually too low for smooth running. Most common failure is the wires breaking in the three-wire plug on the back (rack position solenoid). Peter
Re: [MBZ] SDL idle shudder
The SDL idle is electronically governed. There is what looks like a test plug near the fuse box. You adjust the idle by lifting up the cap, turning it one way or the other then putting it back on. From memory, one notch is 50 RPM. Thanks, Tom Hargrave www.kegkits.com 256-656-1924 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Hans Neureiter Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 6:15 PM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] SDL idle shudder I think the idle should be ~ 800. There is an adjustment at the IP, towards the block. Kinda close quarters, but it's doable. I used a deep socket to loosen the counter nut. Turn the slotted bolt to change the idle speed. IIRC, CW is more, CCW is less RPM. On 1/16/07, Luther [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The SDL's idle runs about 550-600 at it's lowest point and it likes to shudder after dropping from a higher RPM. How do I go about setting this to the correct speed? TIA all, -- Luther KB5QHUAlma, Ark '87 300SDL (271,xxx mi) head case? '83 300SD (242 kmi) for sale '82 300CD (163 kmi) '82 300D (74 kmi) getting donor engine '85 300D (280,176) parts car ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- Hans Neureiter, Houston, TX '82 300SD, '95 E300D ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] FW: Today's Diesel Prices
Thanks, Tom Hargrave www.kegkits.com 256-656-1924 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 4:27 PM To: Weekly Highway Diesel Prices Subject: Today's Diesel Prices ** ** ** * **** * * *** U.S. Department of Energy** ** ** * Energy Information Administration * **** ******* To unsubscribe/change address, ** ** ** ** ** * see the message footnotes * * EIA, the Nation's clearinghouse for energy statistics. *** ** (NOTE: To best view this document, your email software should be set to view the item in an 80 character format, using a non-proportional font, e.g. courier) ** On-highway diesel prices, by week and PADD (Self Service Cash Price in Dollars per Gallon, Including Taxes) Diesel Prices Web URL: http://tonto.eia.doe.gov/oog/info/wohdp/diesel.asp US NATL EASTNEWCENTLOWER GULF ROCKY WEST DATEAVG COAST ENGLAND ATL ATL MIDWEST COAST MTN COAST CA PADD PADDPADDPADDPADDPADDPADD PADD I IA IB IC II III IV V -- - - --- - - --- - - - - 070115 2.463 2.437 2.622 2.559 2.368 2.408 2.391 2.625 2.749 2.773 070108 2.537 2.520 2.672 2.633 2.458 2.483 2.459 2.682 2.824 2.856 070101 2.580 2.565 2.710 2.681 2.503 2.534 2.500 2.697 2.853 2.883 061225 2.596 2.587 2.737 2.710 2.520 2.550 2.514 2.713 2.856 2.885 061218 2.606 2.599 2.730 2.722 2.535 2.555 2.519 2.716 2.887 2.917 061211 2.621 2.610 2.749 2.730 2.546 2.563 2.540 2.724 2.931 2.963 061204 2.618 2.610 2.716 2.717 2.555 2.578 2.537 2.707 2.860 2.860 061127 2.567 2.537 2.634 2.652 2.479 2.554 2.490 2.680 2.760 2.710 061120 2.553 2.521 2.625 2.638 2.461 2.554 2.469 2.647 2.724 2.690 061113 2.552 2.530 2.616 2.643 2.473 2.562 2.470 2.623 2.673 2.677 061106 2.506 2.508 2.613 2.628 2.448 2.493 2.449 2.577 2.606 2.637 061030 2.517 2.530 2.629 2.646 2.472 2.501 2.462 2.577 2.602 2.645 061023 2.524 2.537 2.636 2.651 2.480 2.502 2.477 2.563 2.628 2.669 061016 2.503 2.521 2.623 2.636 2.462 2.459 2.461 2.539 2.655 2.703 061009 2.506 2.533 2.649 2.654 2.471 2.448 2.446 2.584 2.697 2.751 061002 2.546 2.567 2.678 2.694 2.503 2.467 2.490 2.679 2.789 2.835 060925 2.595 2.600 2.730 2.746 2.526 2.506 2.526 2.827 2.892 2.910 060918 2.713 2.699 2.832 2.844 2.625 2.624 2.636 3.052 3.014 3.002 060911 2.857 2.826 2.955 2.958 2.757 2.787 2.770 3.236 3.137 3.125 060904 2.967 2.911 3.009 3.032 2.850 2.937 2.872 3.318 3.199 3.175 060828 3.027 2.955 3.035 3.074 2.897 3.026 2.923 3.346 3.229 3.200 060821 3.033 2.953 3.049 3.078 2.890 3.041 2.923 3.349 3.237 3.221 060814 3.065 3.017 3.077 3.130 2.964 3.065 2.974 3.311 3.218 3.220 060807 3.055 3.026 3.061 3.104 2.989 3.070 2.988 3.208 3.113 3.130 060731 2.980 2.958 2.991 3.030 2.924 2.988 2.925 3.052 3.066 3.093 060724 2.946 2.925 2.972 3.002 2.888 2.951 2.895 2.987 3.047 3.097 060717 2.926 2.906 2.970 2.992 2.864 2.927 2.868 2.960 3.051 3.097 060710 2.918 2.887 2.947 2.963 2.849 2.919 2.866 2.966 3.060 3.113 060703 2.898 2.874 2.948 2.951 2.834 2.887 2.845 2.958 3.056 3.119 060626 2.867 2.864 2.952 2.956 2.816 2.819 2.822 2.960 3.068 3.140 060619 2.915 2.907 2.960 2.990 2.867 2.873 2.859 3.018 3.117 3.185 060612 2.918 2.909 2.979 2.997 2.866 2.874 2.848 3.041 3.149 3.217 060605 2.890 2.881 2.969 2.992 2.825 2.837 2.805 3.043 3.159 3.227 060529 2.882 2.873 2.966 2.987 2.815 2.824 2.798 3.044 3.161 3.227 060522 2.888 2.877 2.982 2.987 2.820 2.836 2.801 3.024 3.175 3.234 060515 2.920 2.907 3.003 3.014 2.853 2.870 2.829 3.074 3.192 3.242 060508 2.897 2.884 2.972 2.983 2.834 2.841 2.814 3.054 3.180 3.244 060501 2.896 2.892 2.979 2.987 2.843 2.853 2.832 3.012 3.098 3.163 060424 2.876 2.888 2.961 2.978 2.843 2.847 2.817 2.903 3.026 3.103 060417 2.765 2.788 2.865 2.876 2.743 2.735 2.725 2.756 2.881 2.933 060410 2.654 2.676 2.769 2.767 2.629 2.614 2.601 2.680 2.812 2.881 060403 2.617 2.639 2.731 2.727 2.593 2.578 2.579 2.629 2.753 2.812 060327 2.565
Re: [MBZ] SDL idle shudder
Hans Neureiter wrote: I think the idle should be ~ 800. There is an adjustment at the IP, towards the block. Kinda close quarters, but it's doable. I used a deep socket to loosen the counter nut. Turn the slotted bolt to change the idle speed. IIRC, CW is more, CCW is less RPM. On 1/16/07, Luther [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The SDL's idle runs about 550-600 at it's lowest point and it likes to shudder after dropping from a higher RPM. How do I go about setting this to the correct speed? TIA all, The idle (engine warm and the electric idle actuator disconnected) should be 570 rpm. That is set using the screw above the actuator. With the actuator connected, the idle should be 620 rpm. If it's a bit high or low it can be moved up or down by moving the plug from position 3 or 4 either lower or higher. If the overvoltage control fails (or it's fuse blows) or the speed sensor fails there will be NO electronic control of the actuator and the idle will run low and be a bit unstable. Marshall -- Marshall Booth Ph.D. Ass't Prof. (ret.) Univ of Pittsburgh School of Medicine [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [MBZ] front lug bolts 300SDL
Dave, It's not that they'll fall off, they won't. It's that the grease reduces friction actually causes you to over torque the bolts or nuts, causing the bolts or studs to over stretch. This weakens them. Thanks, Tom Hargrave www.kegkits.com 256-656-1924 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of dave walton Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 7:54 AM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] front lug bolts 300SDL I've been greasing the lug nuts/bolts on all my cars for the last 40 years. Haven't had one fall off yet. I use anti-seize now because it is more politically correct that lithium grease. Same idea though. I do check that they are snug now and then. -Dave Walton On 1/16/07, Trampas [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have broken and drilled a few in my time. My car still has long bolts, but I use anti-seize, yea, yea complain all you want but I have never broken a bolt that I installed. Trampas -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of John W. Reames III Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 5:28 AM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] front lug bolts 300SDL On Mon, 15 Jan 2007, Werner Fehlauer wrote: And I suspect the bolts can stand a lot of abuse, because I've never had one fail, even after I've undone a severely over-tightened one and then re-torqued it properly. The M-B bolts would probably withstand 150-200 lb-ft and still not fail, IMO. I've got to test this; I twisted the end off of a 1/2x3/8 husky adapter trying to remove lug bolts that this happened to. A week of PB blaster and a lot of prayer, and I will reconvene next weekend. I felt the bolt start to twist, and saw the head kick sideways in the hole a little. I ordered new shorty bolts. -j. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] Heavy lifting
www.boeing.com/news/releases/2007/q1/070116d_pr.html
Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Quality
Rusty, I can understand that statement I'm sure you can too. Mercedes are not built with Mercedes parts, they never have been. Just look under the hood inside cabin and start counting all of the parts labeled bosch, beher, becker, etc. Do the same with a Mercedes manufactured in the 70's and you will see the same mix of manufacturers. All of the wheel bearings on my early 70's Mercedes were made in Japan. And guess what? These same manufactures build parts for Volvo, BMW, Porsche, SAAB VW! So, who owns Mercedes quality? It's all of the subs who manufacture parts for them. And except for some of the inferior junk sold at the discount auto stores, the quality of auto parts, from engine controllers to radiators has been trending up for years. I've been around long enough to remember the days when you did not dare take a car with more than 60,000 miles on the clock on the open road for fear of a breakdown. But by the time the mid-80's models were rolling off the assembly lines, every good vehicle was going past 100,000 miles. Now, you see cars going 200,000 or more miles without major problems and no-one who understands cars seems to care what miles are on a car as long as it's in good shape. I'm sure that today's Mercedes are more reliable (better quality) than those manufactured in the 90's and those manufactured in the 90's are more reliable (better quality) than those manufactured in the 80's, etc, etc. Thanks, Tom Hargrave www.kegkits.com 256-656-1924 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Rusty Cullens Sent: Monday, January 15, 2007 9:14 AM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Quality Ok, all this talk of mercedes quality has me going. I must tell a true story of the last time I was in Germany. I was meeting with a very large Exporter of MB parts and during a break I was speaking with a 80 year old German fella that had been with Mercedes his whole life. We were discussing the demise of Mercedes workmanship and I said to him Mercedes sure isn't what it once was. His reply? It never was Hmmm. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Quality
Statistical Process Control (SPC) is an old system that no-one who understands quality systems uses anymore. SPC was used to measure quality of a product line. The problem was twofold. First, it was too little, too late - we were measuring defect rates instead or doing something about them. Then, we usually set up SPC at the wrong points in the process. These days, Engineers take the more proactive approach of continuous improvement. Some call the practice Six Sigma, the Japanese call it khizan but the Japanese auto makers, the German Automakers and the US Automakers all take the same basic approach to improve quality. Thanks, Tom Hargrave www.kegkits.com 256-656-1924 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Peter Frederick Sent: Sunday, January 14, 2007 12:37 PM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Quality The difference between US and Japanese manufacturing is that the Japanese USE statistical process control, the vast majority of US manufactures do lots of statistics and call it SPC -- there is a difference! Don't know about the Germans, but I believe they tend more toward producing good parts than the US tendency to fish the good parts out from the junk. Peter ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] SDL idle shudder
The SDL has electronic idle control, adjusted from the knob by the brake booster. Hans Neureiter wrote: I think the idle should be ~ 800. There is an adjustment at the IP, towards the block. Kinda close quarters, but it's doable. I used a deep socket to loosen the counter nut. Turn the slotted bolt to change the idle speed. IIRC, CW is more, CCW is less RPM. On 1/16/07, Luther [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The SDL's idle runs about 550-600 at it's lowest point and it likes to shudder after dropping from a higher RPM. How do I go about setting this to the correct speed? TIA all, -- Luther KB5QHUAlma, Ark '87 300SDL (271,xxx mi) head case? '83 300SD (242 kmi) for sale '82 300CD (163 kmi) '82 300D (74 kmi) getting donor engine '85 300D (280,176) parts car ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK (2x) 91 300D 2.5 Turbo, 90 420SEL, 89 560SEL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE 5.0 Euro, 84 190D 2.2, 81 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, 72 250C, 69 250 http://www.striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Driving safety while covered with ice
LarryT wrote: I think most truck offenses are expected to be caught at Weigh Stations - I suspect the CB/CellPhone communications network keep the 18 wheelers informed of the locations of radar - they know when to go fast and they know when to slow down. Yeah, and like any industry there's a certain percentage of scofflaws. At one of the properties my company owns we had a sign in the parking lot that said, NO SEMI PARKING, NO U-TURNS. It's gone now. A semi hit it while making a U-turn. If you want to make time get behind a 18 wheeler who is moving at your comfortable speed and stay there - safely back far enough for comfort -- but that's an old trick. Course, I'm old so it works for me - ;-) I like to follow them in stop-and-go traffic. They're good at figuring out the average speed traffic is moving and going constantly at that speed, instead of constantly stopping and starting.
Re: [MBZ] Heavy lifting
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: www.boeing.com/news/releases/2007/q1/070116d_pr.html When they were test-flying that airplane earlier late last year, I had a what the heck is that? moment when I was driving on I-5 and saw it sitting at Boeing Field. A couple weeks later I was sitting in a restaurant in Tukwila and saw it fly overhead. It looks like a 747 with a glandular disorder.
Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Quality
Tom Hargrave wrote: I'm sure that today's Mercedes are more reliable (better quality) than those manufactured in the 90's and those manufactured in the 90's are more reliable (better quality) than those manufactured in the 80's, etc, etc. A lot of the complaints seem to be in the fit and finish category. Interior pieces falling off, paint flaking off, etc. Those things don't make a car unreliable, but they do really hurt its image. It seems like when a car maker wants to cut costs, the interior is the first place they go. GM's current cars, for example, drive pretty nicely but they have the interior materials of a much cheaper vehicle.
Re: [MBZ] OT Passat Jetta in the cold
Hey Randy, I wish you could have seen me laugh when I read that, then I realized you were serious. ;) Anyway you and I disagree on lots but you've still got a pretty car. -Curt Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 10:20:04 -0600 From: R A Bennell [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT Passat Jetta in the cold To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Saw another one last night on the way home. On the back of a flatbed, being hauled away - nice Audi. Don't think the fuel is an issue anymore. Gas stations have been required to upgrade tanks to prevent leakage so not near as much water in the tanks as there once was. Also think suppliers add things in the winter to prevent freezeup. Can remember giving my 77 Mercury a regular dose of methyl hydrate with each fill to prevent freezing gas lines but have not put any in vehicles in many years. Became concerned that it might hurt something in fuel injected vehicles. I think that for cold weather it is hard to beat good old north american vehicles - especially trucks. Randy in Winnipeg where it is still cold - supposed to improve a bit tomorrow - We won't tell. Get more on shows you hate to love (and love to hate): Yahoo! TV's Guilty Pleasures list. From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Wed Jan 17 01:33:27 2007 Received: from bee.hiwaay.net ([216.180.54.11]) by server8.arterytc8.net with esmtps (TLSv1:DES-CBC3-SHA:168) (Exim 4.52) id 1H6zg7-0007fU-DT for mercedes@okiebenz.com; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 01:33:27 + Received: from tomrmkj2yanjy9 ([216.180.87.249]) by bee.hiwaay.net (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0H1Sjbi1152314 for mercedes@okiebenz.com; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:28:48 -0600 (CST) From: Tom Hargrave [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'Mercedes Discussion List' mercedes@okiebenz.com Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:28:41 -0600 Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 In-Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thread-Index: Acc51aalaBhhGbuAS8mNZFrMCDyaMAAAKZqg X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus Subject: Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Quality X-BeenThere: mercedes@okiebenz.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9.cp1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com List-Id: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes_okiebenz.com.okiebenz.com List-Unsubscribe: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Archive: /pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com List-Post: mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com List-Help: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Subscribe: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 01:33:28 - I can't argue against the fit finish comments. But my 1959 220S has a wooden dash REAL wood trim around the windows. I bet Mercedes buyers had a fit when the fin bodies came out... And I remember when the square line (114/115 body) came out. Everyone was outraged at the shorter grill the inferior quality of the interior! It just wasn't a Mercedes anymore! Now we collect these rave about the quality Mercedes craftsmanship, don't we? Thanks, Tom Hargrave www.kegkits.com 256-656-1924 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of David Brodbeck Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 7:18 PM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Quality Tom Hargrave wrote: I'm sure that today's Mercedes are more reliable (better quality) than those manufactured in the 90's and those manufactured in the 90's are more reliable (better quality) than those manufactured in the 80's, etc, etc. A lot of the complaints seem to be in the fit and finish category. Interior pieces falling off, paint flaking off, etc. Those things don't make a car unreliable, but they do really hurt its image. It seems like when a car maker wants to cut costs, the interior is the first place they go. GM's current cars, for example, drive pretty nicely but they have the interior materials of a much cheaper vehicle. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Quality vs Toyota
Don't forget those who never left the States, got the GI bill, went to college, paid the bright youngsters to do their homework, cried over having to take the tests, graduated (barely), and expected to be handed a high paying job (never got it), and are now filling the halls of the VA hospitals getting free medical care. I figure we way over paid for that. I have no problem with those how saw combat - we can't do enogh for them. But to do the same for everyone who ended up in the armed service? May his noodly appendage do a little more than touch! On 1/16/07, Redghost [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At least those who were able to succeed on government largesse in our generation with GI Bill, had to dodge bullets or maybe put lives on the line. I figure the gummint got off easy on that debt. And some even brought home a tri star when returning from deployment. -- OK Don, KD5NRO Norman, OK Even if you're on the right track, you'll get run over if you just sit there. Will Rogers '90 300D, '87 300SDL, '81 240D, '78 450SLC, '97 Ply Grand Voyager
Re: [MBZ] Driving safety while covered with ice
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA - in Oklahoma??? Mass transit is I-35, bumper-to-bumper with single occupant cars commuting to work! On 1/15/07, andrew strasfogel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Kaleb, it's far too dangerous to drive when it's icy like this. We don't want anything to happen to you - pls. take mass transit. ;) -- OK Don, KD5NRO Norman, OK Even if you're on the right track, you'll get run over if you just sit there. Will Rogers '90 300D, '87 300SDL, '81 240D, '78 450SLC, '97 Ply Grand Voyager
Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Quality
I remember (barely) a Road and Track article on the115 - I think it was in 1975 when the 300D 617 came out, where they described the car as the most over-engineered 1955 Chevy ever. And I remember when the square line (114/115 body) came out. Everyone was outraged at the shorter grill the inferior quality of the interior! It just wasn't a Mercedes anymore! Now we collect these rave about the quality Mercedes craftsmanship, don't we? -- OK Don, KD5NRO Norman, OK Even if you're on the right track, you'll get run over if you just sit there. Will Rogers '90 300D, '87 300SDL, '81 240D, '78 450SLC, '97 Ply Grand Voyager
[MBZ] 124 floor heat
Can anyone give me an idea where the floor heat vacuum pod lives under the dash of a 124? I've got heat out the side vents and defroster but nothing going to the floor. I'm assuming that the pod for the heat flaps to the floor is bad. Can I get to this without removing the dash. I've fixed a 123 from the side panels. Is the 124 set up the same way? It's too darn cold to drive without floor heat. A hot torso and frostbit legs just doesn't get it. Ralph W. '83 300CD '82 300TD (2 parts wagons) '90 300D '01 E320 Wagon '87 300TD From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Wed Jan 17 02:14:23 2007 Received: from vms048pub.verizon.net ([206.46.252.48]) by server8.arterytc8.net with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1H70Jj-RT-3v for mercedes@okiebenz.com; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 02:14:23 + Received: from WFlaptop ([141.150.235.227]) by vms048.mailsrvcs.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTPA id [EMAIL PROTECTED] for mercedes@okiebenz.com; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:09:36 -0600 (CST) Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 21:06:52 -0500 From: Werner Fehlauer [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Message-id: [EMAIL PROTECTED] MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=original Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: [EMAIL PROTECTED] X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus Subject: Re: [MBZ] front lug bolts 300SDL X-BeenThere: mercedes@okiebenz.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9.cp1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com List-Id: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes_okiebenz.com.okiebenz.com List-Unsubscribe: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Archive: /pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com List-Post: mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com List-Help: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Subscribe: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 02:14:23 - Tom - I can't see how the slight over torque and over stretch on a lubed thread can be anywhere near as destructive as greatly exceeding the bolt and thread strength with 2x or 3x torque levels. Werner - Original Message - From: Tom Hargrave [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'Mercedes Discussion List' mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 7:47 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] front lug bolts 300SDL Dave, It's not that they'll fall off, they won't. It's that the grease reduces friction actually causes you to over torque the bolts or nuts, causing the bolts or studs to over stretch. This weakens them. Thanks, Tom Hargrave www.kegkits.com 256-656-1924 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of dave walton Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 7:54 AM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] front lug bolts 300SDL I've been greasing the lug nuts/bolts on all my cars for the last 40 years. Haven't had one fall off yet. I use anti-seize now because it is more politically correct that lithium grease. Same idea though. I do check that they are snug now and then. -Dave Walton
Re: [MBZ] 124 floor heat
Ralph, Fortunately these pods are among the easier ones to replace. Early 87's have two pods (a bit of a PITA to RR because of the pressed on lock washers) and early models have a single pod which unclips easily. They're accessible after removing the climate control unit. -Aaron 1987 300D On 1/16/07, Ralph W [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Can anyone give me an idea where the floor heat vacuum pod lives under the dash of a 124? I've got heat out the side vents and defroster but nothing going to the floor. I'm assuming that the pod for the heat flaps to the floor is bad. Can I get to this without removing the dash. I've fixed a 123 from the side panels. Is the 124 set up the same way? It's too darn cold to drive without floor heat. A hot torso and frostbit legs just doesn't get it.
Re: [MBZ] 124 floor heat
They're behind the radio. They can be replaced through the hole if you take it out, IIRC. At the worst you might have to remove the ashtray and climate control panel as well. Nowhere near as hard as taking out the dash! Alex Chamberlain '87 300D Turbo '93 Isuzu Trooper On 1/16/07, Ralph W [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Can anyone give me an idea where the floor heat vacuum pod lives under the dash of a 124? I've got heat out the side vents and defroster but nothing going to the floor. I'm assuming that the pod for the heat flaps to the floor is bad. Can I get to this without removing the dash. I've fixed a 123 from the side panels. Is the 124 set up the same way? It's too darn cold to drive without floor heat. A hot torso and frostbit legs just doesn't get it. Ralph W. '83 300CD '82 300TD (2 parts wagons) '90 300D '01 E320 Wagon '87 300TD ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Quality
Don, Yep, that was the introduction of the 3 liter, 5 cylinder engine in the 115 square line body. I'm sure you noticed that a 300D is exactly 25% larger than a 240D engine? Mercedes took a 240D engine, grafted another cylinder onto the back, re-clocked the crank and the 300D was born. I even had an argument with a friend about the engine. He stated that it could not be a 5 cylinder engine because you can't balance an engine with a odd number of cylinders I responded with and how many cylinders does your lawnmower have and is that an even or odd number. Thanks, Tom Hargrave www.kegkits.com 256-656-1924 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of OK Don Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 8:01 PM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Quality I remember (barely) a Road and Track article on the115 - I think it was in 1975 when the 300D 617 came out, where they described the car as the most over-engineered 1955 Chevy ever. And I remember when the square line (114/115 body) came out. Everyone was outraged at the shorter grill the inferior quality of the interior! It just wasn't a Mercedes anymore! Now we collect these rave about the quality Mercedes craftsmanship, don't we? -- OK Don, KD5NRO Norman, OK Even if you're on the right track, you'll get run over if you just sit there. Will Rogers '90 300D, '87 300SDL, '81 240D, '78 450SLC, '97 Ply Grand Voyager ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Twisting lug bolts
I have in my 190D the best lug wrench I've ever used. I found it in a BMW at the wrecking yard. Its the old crank type. When I discovered it I took it over to and old Reneaut half buried in the mud, dug around until I found a wheel and with one swift kick managed to remove the rustiest lug nut I've ever seen. Got the lug wrench, a jack and 5 working Bosch glow plugs for my 300TD for a '91 Ford Tempo... -Curt Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 16:58:18 -0500 From: Allan Streib [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] Twisting lug bolts To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Leave those cheesy OE lug wrenchs in the tool roll. Had occasion to need the lug wrench on the road a couple of weeks ago. To my astonishment, the tool roll was still sealed in the plastic bag from the factory. On a 24 year old car! I had never even looked for the tools before. Allan -- 1983 300D 1966 230 - Any questions? Get answers on any topic at Yahoo! Answers. Try it now. From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Wed Jan 17 02:22:38 2007 Received: from pop-scotia.atl.sa.earthlink.net ([207.69.195.65]) by server8.arterytc8.net with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1H70Ri-jp-51 for mercedes@okiebenz.com; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 02:22:38 + Received: from dialup-4.224.39.127.dial1.cincinnati1.level3.net ([4.224.39.127]) by pop-scotia.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1H70NI-00029E-00 for mercedes@okiebenz.com; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 21:18:05 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v622) In-Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] References: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Peter Frederick [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:05:53 -0600 To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.622) X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus Subject: Re: [MBZ] 124 floor heat X-BeenThere: mercedes@okiebenz.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9.cp1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com List-Id: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes_okiebenz.com.okiebenz.com List-Unsubscribe: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Archive: /pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com List-Post: mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com List-Help: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Subscribe: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 02:22:38 - Console (radio, ACC pusbutton unit, console cover) has to come out to get to it. It's on the front side of the heater box, I don't think you can change it with the console in place. You can change all but the servo inside the heater box with the console and underside dash covers off, it's worth it. Peter
Re: [MBZ] front lug bolts 300SDL
I guess neither of us will ever know for sure which is more damaging. I just know that both practices lead to over torqued lug nuts or bolts. I can tell you that stretch bolts, like head bolts flywheel bolts can be easily damaged by over torquing. Also, you can measure their length to determine of they can be re-used. Too long you toss them, not because of the length but because the steel is fatigued and no longer works like a spring when the bolt is torqued. Thanks, Tom Hargrave www.kegkits.com 256-656-1924 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Werner Fehlauer Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 8:07 PM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] front lug bolts 300SDL Tom - I can't see how the slight over torque and over stretch on a lubed thread can be anywhere near as destructive as greatly exceeding the bolt and thread strength with 2x or 3x torque levels. Werner - Original Message - From: Tom Hargrave [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'Mercedes Discussion List' mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 7:47 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] front lug bolts 300SDL Dave, It's not that they'll fall off, they won't. It's that the grease reduces friction actually causes you to over torque the bolts or nuts, causing the bolts or studs to over stretch. This weakens them. Thanks, Tom Hargrave www.kegkits.com 256-656-1924 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of dave walton Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 7:54 AM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] front lug bolts 300SDL I've been greasing the lug nuts/bolts on all my cars for the last 40 years. Haven't had one fall off yet. I use anti-seize now because it is more politically correct that lithium grease. Same idea though. I do check that they are snug now and then. -Dave Walton ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] The big test
So tonight the temp is predicted to hit a low of -9F. I KNOW my 190D will start at that temp, or rather I expect it will, it starts perfectly well at 11F which is the coldest I've ever had opportunity to try it at. Be that as it may last weekend at the hardware store I noticed a $6 Christmas light timer. I've always wanted to have the block heater on my car come on automagically so I grabbed it. Tonight I've wired it up, at 4:30am tomorrow it should click on so at 7am when I'm ready to leave my car should start as if it were a warm June day. Thats the idea anyway. 2.5 hours is probably way more time than is actually needed for the engine to be reasonably warm but with my luck the cold will make the foolish thing keep slow time and I'll actually only get 5 minutes of heat before its time to go... I'm not really worried about the car being able to start you know. I'm not even interested in how keeping the engine warm will reduce startup wear (although it probably will). No indeed I'm more interested in the fact that pre-warming the engine should significantly cut down on the amount of driving I have to endure before the heat comes on. My wife is a bit miffed that we've spent $180,000 on a house so I have somewhere to plug in my car. -Curt In case you didn't get it from the last line I was attempting humor here. Of course my brand of humor does tend to be a bit dry... - Cheap Talk? Check out Yahoo! Messenger's low PC-to-Phone call rates. From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Wed Jan 17 02:34:13 2007 Received: from ug-out-1314.google.com ([66.249.92.173]) by server8.arterytc8.net with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1H70cu-00016F-TC for mercedes@okiebenz.com; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 02:34:13 + Received: by ug-out-1314.google.com with SMTP id s2so1725339uge for mercedes@okiebenz.com; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 18:29:34 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.82.138.6 with SMTP id l6mr1411611bud.1169000974001; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 18:29:34 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.82.118.1 with HTTP; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 18:29:33 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:29:33 -0600 From: OK Don [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com In-Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus Subject: Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Quality X-BeenThere: mercedes@okiebenz.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9.cp1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com List-Id: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes_okiebenz.com.okiebenz.com List-Unsubscribe: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Archive: /pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com List-Post: mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com List-Help: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Subscribe: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 02:34:13 - Your friend was way off base - 360/5 = 72 degrees - very do-able. Then there are the aircraft radial engines - 5 cyl, 7 cyl (I have many hours behind one of those), 9 cyl, etc. Now that I think about it, I don't know of any even cylindered radial engines (excluding Wankels, that I don't know anything about at all). I even had an argument with a friend about the engine. He stated that it could not be a 5 cylinder engine because you can't balance an engine with a odd number of cylinders I responded with and how many cylinders does your lawnmower have and is that an even or odd number. Thanks, Tom Hargrave -- OK Don, KD5NRO Norman, OK Even if you're on the right track, you'll get run over if you just sit there. Will Rogers '90 300D, '87 300SDL, '81 240D, '78 450SLC, '97 Ply Grand Voyager
Re: [MBZ] The big test
It'll start unless the fuel is gelled. Peter
Re: [MBZ] The big test
Don't forget that you now get to buy and used lawnmowers, tillers, trimmers, snow blowers, all sorts of other power tools. And don't forget that you now get to replace hot water heaters, roofs, paint the trim, pay property taxes, and all the other blessings of home ownership! My wife is a bit miffed that we've spent $180,000 on a house so I have somewhere to plug in my car. -Curt In case you didn't get it from the last line I was attempting humor here. Of course my brand of humor does tend to be a bit dry... -- OK Don, KD5NRO Norman, OK Even if you're on the right track, you'll get run over if you just sit there. Will Rogers '90 300D, '87 300SDL, '81 240D, '78 450SLC, '97 Ply Grand Voyager
Re: [MBZ] The big test
14F was about the lowest my 300D would start unassisted. By the way, you'll do better keeping a charger on the battery. Batteries start really loosing capacity at those temps a charger will help keep it warm. Back when I lived in the frigid North (western NY State), we used to buy plug-in heat pads that would sit in the battery tray, under the battery. The pad would keep the battery warm enough to start the car regardless of the temperature. I wonder if they are still available. Thanks, Tom Hargrave www.kegkits.com 256-656-1924 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Curt Raymond Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 8:26 PM To: Diesel List Subject: [MBZ] The big test So tonight the temp is predicted to hit a low of -9F. I KNOW my 190D will start at that temp, or rather I expect it will, it starts perfectly well at 11F which is the coldest I've ever had opportunity to try it at. Be that as it may last weekend at the hardware store I noticed a $6 Christmas light timer. I've always wanted to have the block heater on my car come on automagically so I grabbed it. Tonight I've wired it up, at 4:30am tomorrow it should click on so at 7am when I'm ready to leave my car should start as if it were a warm June day. Thats the idea anyway. 2.5 hours is probably way more time than is actually needed for the engine to be reasonably warm but with my luck the cold will make the foolish thing keep slow time and I'll actually only get 5 minutes of heat before its time to go... I'm not really worried about the car being able to start you know. I'm not even interested in how keeping the engine warm will reduce startup wear (although it probably will). No indeed I'm more interested in the fact that pre-warming the engine should significantly cut down on the amount of driving I have to endure before the heat comes on. My wife is a bit miffed that we've spent $180,000 on a house so I have somewhere to plug in my car. -Curt In case you didn't get it from the last line I was attempting humor here. Of course my brand of humor does tend to be a bit dry... - Cheap Talk? Check out Yahoo! Messenger's low PC-to-Phone call rates. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] 87 Mercedes Benz Turbo - $800
http://columbus.craigslist.org/car/263637591.html Rick Knoble '85 300 CD '87 190 DT From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Wed Jan 17 02:55:29 2007 Received: from eastrmmtao04.cox.net ([68.230.240.35]) by server8.arterytc8.net with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1H70xO-0001lr-R3 for mercedes@okiebenz.com; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 02:55:29 + Received: from eastrmimpo01.cox.net ([68.1.16.119]) by eastrmmtao04.cox.net (InterMail vM.6.01.06.03 201-2131-130-104-20060516) with ESMTP id [EMAIL PROTECTED] for mercedes@okiebenz.com; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 21:50:44 -0500 Received: from 57QCVB1 ([70.172.209.18]) by eastrmimpo01.cox.net with bizsmtp id C2pG1W01K0QMj3a000; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 21:49:17 -0500 From: Dwight E. Giles, Jr [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'Mercedes Discussion List' mercedes@okiebenz.com Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 21:52:07 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 In-Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 Thread-Index: Acc53xQJU2utUzJsT0+WuHaKX/6tYQAAs6wg Message-Id: [EMAIL PROTECTED] X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus Subject: Re: [MBZ] The big test X-BeenThere: mercedes@okiebenz.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9.cp1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com List-Id: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes_okiebenz.com.okiebenz.com List-Unsubscribe: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Archive: /pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com List-Post: mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com List-Help: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Subscribe: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 02:55:29 - Curt Good luck starting. I am hoping for your temperatures here one of these days to see if my 300D will start at below zero F without plugging it in. I like your humour-like a good wine-dry and subtle. Dwight Dwight E. Giles, Jr. 1979 240D-250K + miles 1990 300D 2.5t 135K miles Wickford, RI -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Curt Raymond Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 9:26 PM To: Diesel List Subject: [MBZ] The big test My wife is a bit miffed that we've spent $180,000 on a house so I have somewhere to plug in my car. -Curt In case you didn't get it from the last line I was attempting humor here. Of course my brand of humor does tend to be a bit dry... - Cheap Talk? Check out Yahoo! Messenger's low PC-to-Phone call rates. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] The big test
I wonder if they [battery heater] are still available. They are. The Frankenheap's preheater system includes a battery charger, more for warming up the battery than for putting any charge on it. -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Twisting lug bolts
I have in my 190D the best lug wrench I've ever used. It's the old crank type. Our 250C has a crank-type stock lug wrench, clips into both clips on the rear trunk wall. It's what I use to change the tires on _every_ MB we have, at least at home! Wish I had more of them. The Frankenheap, complete with mating clips, doesn't have one of those. And the new factory replacement only has the one bend in it, not two. Takes two to get a good stomp on the thing, just like a motorcycle kick-starter. -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Quality vs Toyota
Clay, if you ever run across an ill that you cannot blame on minorities, please immediately post that information to the list. It would be very informative. Most problems can be blamed on a minority. Fortunately, good people still outnumber the f***ing idiots, but I wonder for how much longer? -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] 124 floor heat
Is there anything tricky about removing the console and ACC cover. I just don't want to screw up the wood. I have to pull the seats to do the seat upgrade anyway so I should have great access to the console. Ralph W. '83 300CD '82 300TD (2 parts wagons) '90 300D '01 E320 Wagon '87 300TD - Original Message - From: Peter Frederick [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 9:05 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] 124 floor heat Console (radio, ACC pusbutton unit, console cover) has to come out to get to it. It's on the front side of the heater box, I don't think you can change it with the console in place. You can change all but the servo inside the heater box with the console and underside dash covers off, it's worth it. Peter ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Quality
tom, i couldn't agree with this one statement (below) any less: So, who owns Mercedes quality? It's all of the subs who manufacture parts for them. i'm responsible for any assy i offer for sale (as Mercedes should be with their assemblies), no matter who made the components. it's ultimately the responsibility of Mercedes to make sure that the components they buy and use are up to their specifications; of course if they're not spec'd properly, that's their fault too. cheers! e Tom Hargrave wrote: Rusty, I can understand that statement I'm sure you can too. Mercedes are not built with Mercedes parts, they never have been. Just look under the hood inside cabin and start counting all of the parts labeled bosch, beher, becker, etc. Do the same with a Mercedes manufactured in the 70's and you will see the same mix of manufacturers. All of the wheel bearings on my early 70's Mercedes were made in Japan. And guess what? These same manufactures build parts for Volvo, BMW, Porsche, SAAB VW! So, who owns Mercedes quality? It's all of the subs who manufacture parts for them. And except for some of the inferior junk sold at the discount auto stores, the quality of auto parts, from engine controllers to radiators has been trending up for years. I've been around long enough to remember the days when you did not dare take a car with more than 60,000 miles on the clock on the open road for fear of a breakdown. But by the time the mid-80's models were rolling off the assembly lines, every good vehicle was going past 100,000 miles. Now, you see cars going 200,000 or more miles without major problems and no-one who understands cars seems to care what miles are on a car as long as it's in good shape. I'm sure that today's Mercedes are more reliable (better quality) than those manufactured in the 90's and those manufactured in the 90's are more reliable (better quality) than those manufactured in the 80's, etc, etc. Thanks, Tom Hargrave www.kegkits.com 256-656-1924 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Rusty Cullens Sent: Monday, January 15, 2007 9:14 AM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Quality Ok, all this talk of mercedes quality has me going. I must tell a true story of the last time I was in Germany. I was meeting with a very large Exporter of MB parts and during a break I was speaking with a 80 year old German fella that had been with Mercedes his whole life. We were discussing the demise of Mercedes workmanship and I said to him Mercedes sure isn't what it once was. His reply? It never was Hmmm.
Re: [MBZ] 87 Mercedes Benz Turbo - $800
Boy it sure would be nice to have a donor car available when working on the new wagon! Kaleb, come get this thing before I do something stupid. Ralph W. '83 300CD '82 300TD (2 parts wagons) '90 300D '01 E320 Wagon '87 300TD - Original Message - From: Rick Knoble [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List Mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 9:38 PM Subject: [MBZ] 87 Mercedes Benz Turbo - $800 http://columbus.craigslist.org/car/263637591.html Rick Knoble '85 300 CD '87 190 DT ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] Quick change
http://www.youtube.com/v/RB-wUgnyGv0 From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Wed Jan 17 03:29:35 2007 Received: from wsip-24-249-104-140.ks.ks.cox.net ([24.249.104.140] helo=mtsqhexc1.mtsqh.com) by server8.arterytc8.net with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1H71UV-0002i2-LQ for Mercedes@okiebenz.com; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 03:29:35 + Content-Class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6603.0 Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 21:23:26 -0600 Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Re: [MBZ] Update on OT Cadillac Parts Thread-Index: Acc55tqbnWOlSAUIQD+cuItMAWWX7Q== From: Donald Snook [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes@okiebenz.com X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.9.cp1 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Update on OT Cadillac Parts X-BeenThere: mercedes@okiebenz.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9.cp1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com List-Id: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes_okiebenz.com.okiebenz.com List-Unsubscribe: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Archive: /pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com List-Post: mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com List-Help: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Subscribe: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 03:29:35 - Chris K wrote:=20 =20 I like your brother.=20 =20 Yea, me too. He has strange tastes in cars, but he is a car guy. He loves 1970's era Cadillacs and knows a tremendous about them.=20 =20 Donald H. Snook 1990 300SEL 134K
Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Quality
Well, there is a big difference between a single crank journal and 5 -- there are some vibration problems with 5 cylinder engines that had to be worked out first, mostly longitudinal rather than radial. I don't know of any even cylinder number radials either -- mostly nines. Longitudinal engines almost always have even numbers, they are much easier to balance, sixes in particular. Lawn mower engines aren't all that balanced, and the hp output is so low the resultant vibration isn't much of a problem. A single cylinder 50 hp motor has to weigh a ton or so to keep it from dancing under load, and that's with a huge flywheel. Peter
Re: [MBZ] Update on OT Cadillac Parts
I like Caddy's too, but I'm fond of the 1964 model year. Thanks, Tom Hargrave www.kegkits.com 256-656-1924 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Donald Snook Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 9:23 PM To: Mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Update on OT Cadillac Parts Chris K wrote: I like your brother. Yea, me too. He has strange tastes in cars, but he is a car guy. He loves 1970's era Cadillacs and knows a tremendous about them. Donald H. Snook 1990 300SEL 134K ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] 124 floor heat
Fairly easy. Pull the carpet in the console at the rear to reveal the retaining screw for the wood trim around the shifter. Remove screw and pull the rear of the wood trim up -- it has a pair of hooks that hold it in place on the front. These disengage when the rear is high enough. Mirror switch fader unplug from the sockets and stay in the trim, so it's a bit tight. Open ash tray and remove it. Take out the two screws in the bottom and remove housing. Under the lower edge of the upper wood trim are two screws. Remove them and unhook the upper trim. The ACC pushbutton unit is held in by a pair of screws in the corners. but I'm thinking there is a trim panel too -- several more screws, anyway. Pull it out and unplug the two cables off the bottom. Radio is held in by a pair of clips on the bottom at the outside lower edge -- I think you can pull them down with a screwdriver, but someone will have to chime in here, I don't remember. Radio pulls out once unclipped (with faceplate on) -- unplug the harness and antenna. You can also pull the faceplate with a hook behind the cassette door -- pull straight out on the upper left side were the connector is. You can then push down the latches from the front to pull the radio. You should be able to get to the floor servo. In fact, you may be able to leave the shifter trim in place. The wood trim is laid on aluminum sheet, it won't break easily, although one can pull the retainer screw clip off the rear of the shifter trim it it's stuck to the console -- mine was. The console itself requires removing the switch bar, which is tricky (I think it goes back into the dash, but be careful, you have to flex it a bit and the clips are brittle), then remove the screws by the driver's and passengers feet (one on each side) and the two 10 mm nuts up under the dash. Unclip the carpet from the plastic -- two places on each side where a tab fits into a slot and hooks over. Remove the large retaining screw at the rear under where the carpet was and lift the rear up and unhook the two studs at dash and remove. Not hard, but a PITA. Peter
[MBZ] Number of cylinders
There are ways that engineers have worked out to minimize vibrations on odd-number cylinder engines. Such as the 3 cylinder Smart and GM engines, 5 cylinder German and Scandinavian cars; 7 cylinder low speed marine and medium speed V-18 locomotive (ALCO) engines. Even V-6s present some interesting vibration issues. Werner - Original Message - From: Peter Frederick [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 10:21 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Quality Well, there is a big difference between a single crank journal and 5 -- there are some vibration problems with 5 cylinder engines that had to be worked out first, mostly longitudinal rather than radial. I don't know of any even cylinder number radials either -- mostly nines. Longitudinal engines almost always have even numbers, they are much easier to balance, sixes in particular. Lawn mower engines aren't all that balanced, and the hp output is so low the resultant vibration isn't much of a problem. A single cylinder 50 hp motor has to weigh a ton or so to keep it from dancing under load, and that's with a huge flywheel. Peter
[MBZ] OT - VA medical care
OK Don - IMO, you're treading on some soft ground when you question the rights of patients in VA hospitals. Remember the old saying they also serve who wait? There were a lot of veterans of WW2, Korea, RVN, or later conflicts that were either fortunate not to be shot at, or were assigned to duties that kept them safer. It wasn't always their own call as to where they served, but they all contributed to the effort, and have a right to share in what meager benefits that our forgetful citizens have allowed. All veterans had their personal lives interrupted, careers changed, and some were injured, maimed, or killed. I don't think we are wise enough to say who qualifies for medical care. Werner, WB2BRB - Original Message - From: OK Don [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 8:44 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Quality vs Toyota Don't forget those who never left the States, got the GI bill, went to college, paid the bright youngsters to do their homework, cried over having to take the tests, graduated (barely), and expected to be handed a high paying job (never got it), and are now filling the halls of the VA hospitals getting free medical care. I figure we way over paid for that. I have no problem with those how saw combat - we can't do enogh for them. But to do the same for everyone who ended up in the armed service? May his noodly appendage do a little more than touch! On 1/16/07, Redghost [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At least those who were able to succeed on government largesse in our generation with GI Bill, had to dodge bullets or maybe put lives on the line. I figure the gummint got off easy on that debt. And some even brought home a tri star when returning from deployment. -- OK Don, KD5NRO Norman, OK
Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Quality
Peter Frederick wrote: Lawn mower engines aren't all that balanced, and the hp output is so low the resultant vibration isn't much of a problem. A single cylinder 50 hp motor has to weigh a ton or so to keep it from dancing under load, and that's with a huge flywheel. I remember seeing a self-launching sailplane that used a 2-cycle, one-cylinder engine. To reduce vibration, it had a large *external* balance shaft.
Re: [MBZ] front lug bolts 300SDL
Tom Hargrave wrote: I guess neither of us will ever know for sure which is more damaging. I just know that both practices lead to over torqued lug nuts or bolts. Given the choice between using anti-seize and having them slightly over-torqued, and not using anti-seize and not being able to get them off later, I'll take the anti-seize.
Re: [MBZ] 124 floor heat
And remember to have the radio code handy, as when the power is removed, it will become inop until you re-enter the correct code! Werner - Original Message - From: Peter Frederick [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 10:33 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] 124 floor heat Fairly easy. Pull the carpet in the console at the rear to reveal the retaining screw for the wood trim around the shifter. Remove screw and pull the rear of the wood trim up -- it has a pair of hooks that hold it in place on the front. These disengage when the rear is high enough. Mirror switch fader unplug from the sockets and stay in the trim, so it's a bit tight. Open ash tray and remove it. Take out the two screws in the bottom and remove housing. Under the lower edge of the upper wood trim are two screws. Remove them and unhook the upper trim. The ACC pushbutton unit is held in by a pair of screws in the corners. but I'm thinking there is a trim panel too -- several more screws, anyway. Pull it out and unplug the two cables off the bottom. Radio is held in by a pair of clips on the bottom at the outside lower edge -- I think you can pull them down with a screwdriver, but someone will have to chime in here, I don't remember. Radio pulls out once unclipped (with faceplate on) -- unplug the harness and antenna. You can also pull the faceplate with a hook behind the cassette door -- pull straight out on the upper left side were the connector is. You can then push down the latches from the front to pull the radio. You should be able to get to the floor servo. In fact, you may be able to leave the shifter trim in place. The wood trim is laid on aluminum sheet, it won't break easily, although one can pull the retainer screw clip off the rear of the shifter trim it it's stuck to the console -- mine was. The console itself requires removing the switch bar, which is tricky (I think it goes back into the dash, but be careful, you have to flex it a bit and the clips are brittle), then remove the screws by the driver's and passengers feet (one on each side) and the two 10 mm nuts up under the dash. Unclip the carpet from the plastic -- two places on each side where a tab fits into a slot and hooks over. Remove the large retaining screw at the rear under where the carpet was and lift the rear up and unhook the two studs at dash and remove. Not hard, but a PITA. Peter
[MBZ] Number of Cylinders WAS Re: Mercedes Quality
and how many cylinders does your lawnmower have and is that an even or odd number. That's a great one, Tom! My little single cylinder 2 stroke 20% nitromethane burnin' beast of an RC monstertruck was revving at nearly 3RPM without blowing apart! Unlike many full size vehicles on the icy/snowy roads today, the truck did very well and had little difficulty going in the direction I steered it. Kevin in Hillsboro, OR 1983 300SD 265K miles, Ursula
Re: [MBZ] 124 floor heat
No radio code problems if the key is off when the radio is removed and the alarm is not set. I didn't have any need to use it when I did my TE. I did on my sister's Volvo though, maybe I got lucky. Peter
Re: [MBZ] Number of Cylinders WAS Re: Mercedes Quality
Yeah, the 1/4 stroke makes a difference! Don't try that with a John Deere 2 cylinder. Peter
Re: [MBZ] The big test
My wife is a bit miffed that we've spent $180,000 on a house so I have somewhere to plug in my car. Funny indeed! I want another house with an oversized 3 car garage to fit the 300SD with enough room to work on it as well as room enough for the Dodge pickup and our recumbent tandem bike. A nice workbench for working on car parts and, of course, the little RC cars as well would be ideal. It's gonna be just a BIT more than $180K though! Kevin in Hillsboro, OR 1983 300SD 265K miles, Ursula who's started reliably without a block heater down to 15F which is as cold as it's gotten here
Re: [MBZ] Number of cylinders
odd-number cylinder engines. Such as the 3 cylinder Smart and GM engines, 5 cylinder German and Scandinavian cars; 7 cylinder low speed marine and medium speed V-18 locomotive (ALCO) engines. Near as I can tell, 18 is an even number! :-) I used to think it mattered a lot, but I think less so now. Nothing particularly special about an I-6, two jugs moving in tandem, three sets of 'em. Just that there's always two overlapping flames going on somewhere in the bunch, and the torque is always applied through the same crank angles. (Unless my mental movie is haywire again.) -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] 124 floor heat
Is there anything tricky about removing the console and ACC cover. If it's anything like the 126, there are a number of now-brittle plastic clips in and on the console and its guts. Be careful to find and release them and you'll be OK. -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] The big test
Have you seen those pulley operated hanging devices for bicycles in garages? Gets them up at ceiling level. MIght be good for a recumbent. Brian Kevin wrote: I want another house with an oversized 3 car garage to fit the 300SD with enough room to work on it as well as room enough for the Dodge pickup and our recumbent tandem bike.
[MBZ] OT House Build Quality
Okay, I know there's been a lot of OT lately (which I think keeps things fun), but I want to draw upon the knowledge our discriminating collective: As new-build houses go, how can one tell if a house is built with quality as opposed to corner-cutting cheapness? I know that new techniques are being used, such as a few pieces of plywood bonded together to make a 2 x 4. Is stuff like that okay, and what else is there to look out for? Brian
Re: [MBZ] 124 floor heat
Sorry about that Ralph! I knew about the pod being bad and thought it was a bear to do so didn't bother with it. If I'd known I wouldn't have had cold feet all the time...live and learn Jeff Zedic London
Re: [MBZ] Number of cylinders
I wonder how VW has done it with te engine I saw in a Passat the other day. It's a V5! Yes, I read t twice just to be sure! Big badge on the back saying V5we also have a golf station wagon here. Never seen one of those before! Jeff Zedic London Enjoying the new cars
Re: [MBZ] OT: volvo transmission
A couple of days ago I saw a six door Volvo 760 series. Well, it lokked like the 740/760 series. Looked factory too! Jeff Zedic London
Re: [MBZ] front lug bolts 300SDL
That's good to know. Easy enough to measure now and then. Might as well do it right. I ran into the same thing with head bolts and rod connecting bolts. Thanks -Dave Walton On 1/16/07, Tom Hargrave [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dave, It's not that they'll fall off, they won't. It's that the grease reduces friction actually causes you to over torque the bolts or nuts, causing the bolts or studs to over stretch. This weakens them. Thanks, Tom Hargrave www.kegkits.com 256-656-1924 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of dave walton Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 7:54 AM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] front lug bolts 300SDL I've been greasing the lug nuts/bolts on all my cars for the last 40 years. Haven't had one fall off yet. I use anti-seize now because it is more politically correct that lithium grease. Same idea though. I do check that they are snug now and then. -Dave Walton On 1/16/07, Trampas [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have broken and drilled a few in my time. My car still has long bolts, but I use anti-seize, yea, yea complain all you want but I have never broken a bolt that I installed. Trampas -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of John W. Reames III Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 5:28 AM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] front lug bolts 300SDL On Mon, 15 Jan 2007, Werner Fehlauer wrote: And I suspect the bolts can stand a lot of abuse, because I've never had one fail, even after I've undone a severely over-tightened one and then re-torqued it properly. The M-B bolts would probably withstand 150-200 lb-ft and still not fail, IMO. I've got to test this; I twisted the end off of a 1/2x3/8 husky adapter trying to remove lug bolts that this happened to. A week of PB blaster and a lot of prayer, and I will reconvene next weekend. I felt the bolt start to twist, and saw the head kick sideways in the hole a little. I ordered new shorty bolts. -j. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] The big test
pulley operated hanging devices for bicycles in garages? My parents have some to hang their bikes, and they aren't even at head level since their garage has a 12' ceiling! Our garage ceiling is only 9' or so, not high enough to hang this one without it being in the way. It's built using two bikes fitted together side by side with a special kit comprised of bars, cables and turnbuckles to keep things tight. The front handlebars steer in tandem via a tie rod and a piece mounted to each stem. It's far more comfortable than a standard bike, and much safer too. A slightly used demo model cost me $300 more than the 300SD! Kevin in Hillsboro, OR 1983 300SD 265K miles, Ursula
Re: [MBZ] Number of cylinders
Yes, VW does make a V5 engine, an earlier 2.3L 10v and a later 2.5L 20V DOHC version. Here's everything you ever wanted to know about the V5 engine configuration. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/V5_engine Kevin in Hillsboro, OR 1983 300SD 265K miles, Ursula
[MBZ] Cold Weather
Well, I've finally found that point where as Marshall describes it: Everything must be perfect for cold weather starting. I started yesterday morning at like 15F without issue. This morning it was about 5F. At that point, I have now experienced what cold weather starting is in my 83' 300D. It DID start, but it took some effort. I think I may be able to start quicker next time. NORMALLY, if it's like 20F or lower I'll let it glow for around 10-15 seconds longer than the light says, hold the pedal to the floor and crank until it starts at which point I let off the fuel proportionately as it starts speeding up to keep it at a fast idle. It won't idle on it's own for a minute or two. HOWEVER... Apparently when it gets down around 5F, I need to let OFF the fuel... My startup went like this: Glow light went off around 15 seconds. I started cranking around 25 seconds with the fuel to the floor. cranked for maybe 5-10 seconds (rather slowly) and it started to make some sounds of combustion, then started dying out again. I let it crank for maybe another 5 seconds. Decided to press my luck and try for another glow cycle. I think I let it go for like 30 seconds this time. Tried cranking again with the pedal floored and again it slighty sounded like it was going to start, then started dying again. So I took my foot off the fuel and after a couple seconds it started coming to life. It was about half running with the starter still helping for a few seconds while I tried to feed in just enough fuel to keep it running. I'm just hoping I got enough charge back in the battery on my 15 minute trip to work with the defrosters and headlights and what not on. This would NOT have been possible with an iffy battery for sure. I couldn't believe that even this new one had that sort of power in it. (and yes I have M1 15w-50 in there). So, at this point I guess I'll plan on using the block heater if it's supposed to go into single digits. and see if I can notice a difference (cause I didn't notice a difference at around 20F). The other potential problem is that for some reason when temps around somewhere below around 20F my wipers turn into EXTREMELY slow or maybe even stop. It did it the other day, but then it's been fine this week, but this morning they did need my help to actually make it back to rest. Levi
[MBZ] 1972 220D
Anyone interested in an Automatic 220D 199K miles, only 48K on a Mercedes rebuilt engine. Car is in very good shape. All service records, no major rust one family since new. Email me at work only [EMAIL PROTECTED] for all details (not going to answer any questions in this forum please) Budget price on car is $2,500. Car has had a full mechanical inspection by an MB independent shop. Car located in Southern AL, but is drivable anywhere and would be a great daily driver. Car has a block heater. Not a Katrina car. Fine example of a 615, early 115 chassis. yes all HVAC fans work. Regards Tom Scordato
Re: [MBZ] OT - VA medical care
Don - I recognize the direction you seemed to be going with your comment, mainly [I think] that there are many people who have easier / better lives due to government programs - not just legal/illegal immigrants. My wife worked at a VA and many of the patients did have conditions that were entirely unrelated to any military service they might have done, but that promise is part of the pay. On this one I have to agree pretty strongly with Werner. My son worked as a diesel mechanic in Pakistan [his most dangerous assignment], Kyrgyzstan, Iraq and Kuwait, his wife did the same in Qatar. All this in 5 years of marriage. He was only shot at while trying to deploy in Pakistan, but while his assignments were pretty safe his separation from his wife [nearly half of their life together] was just as real, and the importance of what he did for the effort was just as real [ask anyone deployed in a fighting unit who ever had their vehicle breakdown]. Of all people I am sure you do not have bad feelings about the military, but I believe you got into some unintended areas here. I'm almost tempted to tell how warm it has been here while you have been shoveling snow and scraping ice. BillR Jacksonville FL 1981 300SD 284k miles -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Werner Fehlauer Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 11:10 PM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: [MBZ] OT - VA medical care OK Don - IMO, you're treading on some soft ground when you question the rights of patients in VA hospitals. Remember the old saying they also serve who wait? There were a lot of veterans of WW2, Korea, RVN, or later conflicts that were either fortunate not to be shot at, or were assigned to duties that kept them safer. It wasn't always their own call as to where they served, but they all contributed to the effort, and have a right to share in what meager benefits that our forgetful citizens have allowed. All veterans had their personal lives interrupted, careers changed, and some were injured, maimed, or killed. I don't think we are wise enough to say who qualifies for medical care. Werner, WB2BRB - Original Message - From: OK Don [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 8:44 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Quality vs Toyota Don't forget those who never left the States, got the GI bill, went to college, paid the bright youngsters to do their homework, cried over having to take the tests, graduated (barely), and expected to be handed a high paying job (never got it), and are now filling the halls of the VA hospitals getting free medical care. I figure we way over paid for that. I have no problem with those how saw combat - we can't do enogh for them. But to do the same for everyone who ended up in the armed service? May his noodly appendage do a little more than touch! On 1/16/07, Redghost [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At least those who were able to succeed on government largesse in our generation with GI Bill, had to dodge bullets or maybe put lives on the line. I figure the gummint got off easy on that debt. And some even brought home a tri star when returning from deployment. -- OK Don, KD5NRO Norman, OK ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] The big test
kevin kraly wrote: Funny indeed! I want another house with an oversized 3 car garage to fit the 300SD with enough room to work on it as well as room enough for the Dodge pickup and our recumbent tandem bike. A nice workbench for working on car parts and, of course, the little RC cars as well would be ideal. It's gonna be just a BIT more than $180K though! I looked at a foreclosure yesterday. One acre, fairly new 36x24 garage with insulation and furnace, two carpeted rooms in the corner of the garage, one with a big bench. Also comes with a small 2 bedroom house and a storage shed. Freddie Mac wants $40k for it. House is old, but doesn't look bad from the outside. I've got to get the keybox combo and go back today.
[MBZ] [OT] P/M/W (was Mercedes Quality vs Toyota)
Not much longer; in America we are engaging in a selective breeding campaign; we espouse abstinence and waiting, so those few good people do that, resulting in fewer kids. The less-than good folks (ie the self-centered idiots to whom nothing in this world applies (except entitlement programs)) go ahead and have lots of kids (this would be a litter, right?) (whether it is to further their entitlements or just because they dont care)... so the idiots are out-reproducing the non-idiots. Couple that with the ongoing campaign to repeal the laws of natural selection (courtesy of all the lawsuits and safety warnings as a result of injuries caused by failure to utilize common sense...) Anyhow, Y'all can smell what I'm stepping in. -j. -- John Reames 1985 300d (223K Gerta) 1991 Cherokee (149K the fishbowl) 1999 E300Dt (140K Hans) (the leaky one) 1999 E300Dt (106K Frantz) (the squeaky one) -- Original message -- From: Jim Cathey [EMAIL PROTECTED] Most problems can be blamed on a minority. Fortunately, good people still outnumber the f***ing idiots, but I wonder for how much longer? -- Jim From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Wed Jan 17 12:43:28 2007 Received: from mailout2.parasun.com ([204.174.16.202]) by server8.arterytc8.net with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1H7A8W-lt-ID for mercedes@okiebenz.com; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 12:43:28 + Received: from rrcs-24-39-222-124.nys.biz.rr.com ([24.39.222.124] helo=user4ykwxvt62x) by mailout2.parasun.com with smtp (Exim 4.54) id 1H7A3z-00065d-I6 for mercedes@okiebenz.com; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 04:38:48 -0800 Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: Mike Canfield [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com References: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 07:38:15 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus Subject: Re: [MBZ] Cold Weather X-BeenThere: mercedes@okiebenz.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9.cp1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com List-Id: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes_okiebenz.com.okiebenz.com List-Unsubscribe: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Archive: /pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com List-Post: mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com List-Help: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Subscribe: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 12:43:28 - Hi Levi, The wonderful cold has finally come to visit usMy diesel van absolutely refused to start this AM.Even with the block heater on all night. I am wondering if the block heater quit in the night as I couldn't hear it running and I usually can...Was too cold to mess with it until I get the batteries charged back upToni let it crank until they were dead as a stone.GGGRR One of her coworkers came and picked her upGuess I'll have to fire up the old M37 to go get her from work.Hope the old flathead will go with straight 30W oil in her.. MAN, IT'S COLD OUT!! Mike - Original Message - From: Levi Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 6:09 AM Subject: [MBZ] Cold Weather Well, I've finally found that point where as Marshall describes it: Everything must be perfect for cold weather starting. I started yesterday morning at like 15F without issue. This morning it was about 5F. At that point, I have now experienced what cold weather starting is in my 83' 300D. It DID start, but it took some effort. I think I may be able to start quicker next time. NORMALLY, if it's like 20F or lower I'll let it glow for around 10-15 seconds longer than the light says, hold the pedal to the floor and crank until it starts at which point I let off the fuel proportionately as it starts speeding up to keep it at a fast idle. It won't idle on it's own for a minute or two. HOWEVER... Apparently when it gets down around 5F, I need to let OFF the fuel... My startup went like this: Glow light went off around 15 seconds. I started cranking around 25 seconds with the fuel to the floor. cranked for maybe 5-10 seconds (rather slowly) and it started to make some sounds of combustion, then started dying out again. I let it crank for maybe another 5 seconds. Decided to press my luck and try for another glow cycle. I think I let it go for like 30 seconds this time. Tried cranking again with the pedal floored and again it slighty sounded like it was going to start, then started dying again. So I
Re: [MBZ] Cold Weather
It was a balmy 20F here this morning (okay so it is the coldest that it has been so far this winter, most of it was above 50 so far) but Hans started up quite easily without any extra glow cycles and without plugging in. (Of course I was cold as *^*^* until it warmed up) BTW, whats the lifetime on the plastic screw-on 2 bar radiator caps (A la W210) -j -- John Reames 1985 300d (223K Gerta) 1991 Cherokee (149K the fishbowl) 1999 E300Dt (140K Hans) (the leaky one) 1999 E300Dt (106K Frantz) (the squeaky one) -- Original message -- From: Mike Canfield [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi Levi, The wonderful cold has finally come to visit usMy diesel van absolutely refused to start this AM.Even with the block heater on all night. I am wondering if the block heater quit in the night as I couldn't hear it running and I usually can...Was too cold to mess with it until I get the batteries charged back upToni let it crank until they were dead as a stone.GGGRR One of her coworkers came and picked her upGuess I'll have to fire up the old M37 to go get her from work.Hope the old flathead will go with straight 30W oil in her.. MAN, IT'S COLD OUT!! Mike From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Wed Jan 17 12:59:35 2007 Received: from ug-out-1314.google.com ([66.249.92.174]) by server8.arterytc8.net with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1H7AO6-00016s-On for mercedes@okiebenz.com; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 12:59:35 + Received: by ug-out-1314.google.com with SMTP id s2so1829946uge for mercedes@okiebenz.com; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 04:54:52 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.82.114.3 with SMTP id m3mr1515229buc.1169038486934; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 04:54:46 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.82.189.16 with HTTP; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 04:54:46 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 06:54:46 -0600 From: Hans Neureiter [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com In-Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] MIME-Version: 1.0 References: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.9.cp1 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Number of cylinders X-BeenThere: mercedes@okiebenz.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9.cp1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com List-Id: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes_okiebenz.com.okiebenz.com List-Unsubscribe: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Archive: /pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com List-Post: mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com List-Help: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Subscribe: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 12:59:35 - www.autozine.org/technical_school/engine/tech_engine_packaging.htm On 1/17/07, kevin kraly [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Yes, VW does make a V5 engine, an earlier 2.3L 10v and a later 2.5L 20V DOHC version. Here's everything you ever wanted to know about the V5 engine configuration. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/V5_engine Kevin in Hillsboro, OR 1983 300SD 265K miles, Ursula ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- Hans Neureiter, Houston, TX '82 300SD, '95 E300D
Re: [MBZ] [OT] P/M/W (was Mercedes Quality vs Toyota)
On 1/17/07, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Not much longer; in America we are engaging in a selective breeding campaign; we espouse abstinence and waiting, so those few good people do that, resulting in fewer kids. The less-than good folks (ie the self-centered idiots to whom nothing in this world applies (except entitlement programs)) go ahead and have lots of kids (this would be a litter, right?) (whether it is to further their entitlements or just because they dont care)... so the idiots are out-reproducing the non-idiots. Couple that with the ongoing campaign to repeal the laws of natural selection (courtesy of all the lawsuits and safety warnings as a result of injuries caused by failure to utilize common sense...) You need to see a movie called Idiocracy. It's about just that problem. Fairly hilarious in places, but very literally brain dead in others. -- Knowledge is power... Power Corrupts. Study hard... Be Evil.
Re: [MBZ] The Big Test
On Jan 16, 2007, at 8:34 PM, Curt wrote: Of course my brand of humor does tend to be a bit dry... Ayuh. Dan Weeks Originally from Maine Freelance Writer and Photographer 515/279-4825 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Dan Weeks Freelance Writer and Photographer 515/279-4825 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [MBZ] OT House Build Quality
Brian - Part of trying to answer would be knowing if you are looking over an already constructed home or starting to build one and want to make sure they are doing things correctly. The problem areas for me in homes have been electrical: - do you want dual lines to ceiling fans to control fan / light from the switch; adequate plugs / breaker box; build in a generator matrix so you can easily use it [input box for the generator and a list of which switches to have on/off]. I had a house that had all the electrical outlets mounted flush with the joists [idiot subcontractor]. Drywall application left all of them with 3/4 of play on plug in. I have seen phone lines pulled so tight they would not stay on. These things need such constant supervision that the only way to make sure most is done correctly is to spend all day every day at the site, or hire someone to do that [I know, that's what a contractor is supposed to do]. As for the soundness of a house you are buying I have used inspection companies on every purchase. $700 for the last one, but we got a through list of everything about the house, so few surprises. Otherwise check on quality of the finish carpentry, check to make sure the roof has the proper clips to keep it on during whatever big blows you have in your area. If you are doing a shop / garage area you might want to have it constructed as a shell so you can do the design yourself. Just the start ... I'm sure there are others with shop specific advice and more experience than I have. BillR Jacksonville FL -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Zoltan Finks Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 4:35 AM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: [MBZ] OT House Build Quality Okay, I know there's been a lot of OT lately (which I think keeps things fun), but I want to draw upon the knowledge our discriminating collective: As new-build houses go, how can one tell if a house is built with quality as opposed to corner-cutting cheapness? I know that new techniques are being used, such as a few pieces of plywood bonded together to make a 2 x 4. Is stuff like that okay, and what else is there to look out for? Brian ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] The big test
With a good battery and everything in perfect order my 240D would start at -10F. The 190D starts easier at 10F than the 240D did so I expect it'll be able to start at even colder minimum temps. -Curt Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:37:27 -0600 From: Tom Hargrave [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] The big test To: 'Mercedes Discussion List' mercedes@okiebenz.com Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii 14F was about the lowest my 300D would start unassisted. By the way, you'll do better keeping a charger on the battery. Batteries start really loosing capacity at those temps a charger will help keep it warm. Back when I lived in the frigid North (western NY State), we used to buy plug-in heat pads that would sit in the battery tray, under the battery. The pad would keep the battery warm enough to start the car regardless of the temperature. I wonder if they are still available. Thanks, Tom Hargrave www.kegkits.com 256-656-1924 - Looking for earth-friendly autos? Browse Top Cars by Green Rating at Yahoo! Autos' Green Center. From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Wed Jan 17 13:55:58 2007 Received: from web32812.mail.mud.yahoo.com ([68.142.206.42]) by server8.arterytc8.net with smtp (Exim 4.52) id 1H7BGg-0002aR-3P for mercedes@okiebenz.com; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 13:55:58 + Received: (qmail 17227 invoked by uid 60001); 17 Jan 2007 13:51:17 - Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] X-YMail-OSG: ietxpeQVM1no_EXGj9g9TeDGyUY6ix07eU25wSCuNdLaKlNhEXPeX4R9O919koR0I0.TTjsQm1DHtTXQHDuUYpplEYE8jjJ38SjORGG9RrxOUABSqE56dSnWj5mpqAAE3729_OnKiYVWkhw- Received: from [198.51.119.130] by web32812.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 05:51:16 PST Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 05:51:16 -0800 (PST) From: Curt Raymond [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Diesel List mercedes@okiebenz.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.9.cp1 Subject: Re: [MBZ] The big test X-BeenThere: mercedes@okiebenz.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9.cp1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com List-Id: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes_okiebenz.com.okiebenz.com List-Unsubscribe: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Archive: /pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com List-Post: mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com List-Help: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Subscribe: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 13:55:58 - Started just like it was July. I didn't even give it a full glow cycle as I was curious to see what it would do. The temp needle was climbing almost before I got out of the driveway. I had heat in less than a mile and had to turn down the blower about 10 minutes before I usually do. I'd like to see some snow... So far this car handles really well on the ice. Fred Moir gave me 3 wheels that I'd intended to mount snow tires on but they're still in the trunk where we put them when I picked 'em up. The extra weight seems (so far) to be plenty. Of course the first year I drove the 240D it was fine in the snow. The second year I had it I was all over the road so I bought snows for all 4 wheels and drove it that way for 2 more years... -Curt Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 21:52:07 -0500 From: Dwight E. Giles, Jr [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] The big test To: 'Mercedes Discussion List' mercedes@okiebenz.com Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Curt Good luck starting. I am hoping for your temperatures here one of these days to see if my 300D will start at below zero F without plugging it in. I like your humour-like a good wine-dry and subtle. Dwight Dwight E. Giles, Jr. 1979 240D-250K + miles 1990 300D 2.5t 135K miles Wickford, RI - Don't get soaked. Take a quick peak at the forecast with theYahoo! Search weather shortcut. From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Wed Jan 17 14:03:11 2007 Received: from wr-out-0506.google.com ([64.233.184.224]) by server8.arterytc8.net with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1H7BNe-0002oE-Mr for mercedes@okiebenz.com; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 14:03:11 + Received: by wr-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id 69so1851707wri for mercedes@okiebenz.com; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 05:58:34 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.90.113.18 with SMTP id l18mr6101559agc.1169042314039; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 05:58:34 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.90.87.9 with HTTP; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 05:58:33 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 08:58:33 -0500 From: andrew strasfogel [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com In-Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] MIME-Version: 1.0 References: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [MBZ] OT - VA medical care
You are both correct - I did overstep the bounds. I apologize. -- OK Don, KD5NRO Norman, OK Even if you're on the right track, you'll get run over if you just sit there. Will Rogers '90 300D, '87 300SDL, '81 240D, '78 450SLC, '97 Ply Grand Voyager
Re: [MBZ] Governer question
In a message dated 1/15/2007 10:21:35 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Since the air intake is essentially wide open on a diesel (vac governors excluded, but have the same effect), something has to control engine speed. The governor combines the engine speed with the accelerator position to determine fuel delivery. As engine speed drops for any given pedal position, the governor weights will drive inwards under the influence of the return springs and rack return spring to rotate the sleeves in the IP to give more fuel delivery. Yes, it does indeed work like a speed control, although it won't change the accelerator position -- the accelerator linkage will over-ride the governor towards more or less fuel. The main effect of the governor is idle and low speed operation, where lots of fuel is needed to get moving, but a large change is speed is not desired. It will also help to maintain speed on the highway, within rather small limits. Needless to say, this isn't quite a simple as that (although not a complex as the gasoline injection pumps!), but what you will get with new bushings is better speed and throttle control -- the engine will not hunt for speed, for instance, and won't lag or run on when you either press down or lift up the accelerator. Peter, If we are talking pre computer controlled Mercedes diesels, such as the 617 turbo diesel, you are totally wrong! The governer does not have any function between idle and full rpm. The only things that control engine speed are the load, and the position of the fuel rack. Jim Friesen Phoenix AZ 79 300SD, 264 K miles 98 ML 320, 147 K miles
Re: [MBZ] OT House Build Quality
Okay, I know there's been a lot of OT lately (which I think keeps things fun), but I want to draw upon the knowledge our discriminating collective: As new-build houses go, how can one tell if a house is built with quality as opposed to corner-cutting cheapness? I know that new techniques are being used, such as a few pieces of plywood bonded together to make a 2 x 4. Is stuff like that okay, and what else is there to look out for? Brian Brian- My take? There have been too many latest and greatest wood laminates that have come and gone, mostly after owners find that they fall apart and/or spontaneously combust. Build quality is typically so bad today that new houses with critical failures such as roof leaks are more the norm than the exception. Across the road from where I am theres a new collection of McMansions. Cost ranges from the cheapie at $800k for the poor folk to the model at 1.2million. On the inside you can see how out of plumb the walls are thanks in part to the wallpaper selected. Occasional creaks in the floor, bad trim work, sloppy paint most everywhere. On the outside, wavy siding with gaps in the corners and in the j-channel near windows. Hope you like the $2.00 Home Depot special lights out back! Oh, and in that model you get a kitchen with cheap looking formica counters. All the doors are plastic- the kind that start warping in 5-10 years or so. CanNOT get wood as an upgrade. This model has an unfinished basement where a non-trained eye can see short cuts all over the place And the crowning achievement? The vista out the cathedral-ceilinged living room is the cooling towers of a nuclear plant 8 miles away. Sorry for the tangent- BUT the point (and there is a point) is that with engineered lumbar trusses this and most other houses now use, water leaks (or poor ventilation) can create spaces with sufficient moisture that these beams will loose integrity- depending on how much moisture and how much time. The products may be based on good theory, but there are so many things that MUST be done correctly as part of installation that are not likely to that the odds of long term success are not good. Finally, in talking to people who do permits in our township there are already problems. The oldest of these houses are 18 months old. I'm confident that our old and creaky 200 year old house will be here in another 40-50 years when these houses across the way are being torn down. Tony Wirtel 1805 farmhouse (decrepit by modern standards), 85 300sd (just plain decrepit), 92 300e (decent)
Re: [MBZ] Number of cylinders
kevin kraly [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Yes, VW does make a V5 engine, an earlier 2.3L 10v and a later 2.5L 20V DOHC version. They also make a W 12. Basically two V6 blocks over one crank. Allan -- 1983 300D 1966 230
Re: [MBZ] The big test
Yes-so did my 300D 2.5-it was 10F and no hint of winter. I am assuming I will never have to uncoil the block heater plug. Almost disappointing as starting the 240D is more exciting and involves manly skills like tweaking the cold idle, double glow, etc. How cold was it in N. MA this AM? Dwight Curt Raymond [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Started just like it was July. Dwight E. Giles, Jr. 1979 240D-250K + miles 1990 300D 2.5t 135K miles Wickford, RI - Don't get soaked. Take a quick peak at the forecast with theYahoo! Search weather shortcut. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- Dwight E. Giles, Jr. Bissell Cove Quahog Auto Salvage Co. Wickford, RI
Re: [MBZ] Number of cylinders
Yes, 18 is an even number, but a V-18 engine has 9 cylinders on each side! (similar to a V-6, with 3 on a side, also not as balanced as an I-6) Werner - Original Message - From: Jim Cathey [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 12:35 AM Subject: Re: [MBZ] Number of cylinders odd-number cylinder engines. Such as the 3 cylinder Smart and GM engines, 5 cylinder German and Scandinavian cars; 7 cylinder low speed marine and medium speed V-18 locomotive (ALCO) engines. Near as I can tell, 18 is an even number! :-) I used to think it mattered a lot, but I think less so now. Nothing particularly special about an I-6, two jugs moving in tandem, three sets of 'em. Just that there's always two overlapping flames going on somewhere in the bunch, and the torque is always applied through the same crank angles. (Unless my mental movie is haywire again.) -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] 124 floor heat
Peter - YMMV, as they say, but on the '90 300D here, changing out a battery slowly (took time to clean out under the tray), I needed the code to get the radio working again. Thankfully, my dealer service writer and I are on good terms, so he looked it up in the MBUSA database, and gave it to me over the phone. The car was in the garage, hadn't been run in a while, and not locked (alarm not set), and when the battery power was restored, the nasty word CODE appeared on the front panel of the radio. Werner - Original Message - From: Peter Frederick [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 11:30 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] 124 floor heat No radio code problems if the key is off when the radio is removed and the alarm is not set. I didn't have any need to use it when I did my TE. I did on my sister's Volvo though, maybe I got lucky. Peter
Re: [MBZ] OT House Build Quality
with engineered lumbar trusses this and most other houses now use, water leaks (or poor ventilation) can create spaces with sufficient moisture that these beams will loose integrity- depending on how much moisture and how much time. True also of wood, but it takes a lot longer! In theory you notice the puddling or whatever and can correct the leak before it does real damage. Water kills houses, pure and simple. The choice of materials sets the schedule, 'Sauder' houses just won't last. When I had my 6-car garage extension added I specified plywood, not OSB. Cost more, but I wanted the extension to look like it had always been there, and OSB was not in use in the 70's. Also, the house, for all its flaws, is holding up well. Nothing wrong with construction quality, though it was 'inexpensive'. (I spoke with the original owner, as she's from whom I bought the house.) Even in the Wood Pavilion I used plywood roof sheathing, not OSB. I used 'blows', figuring that even as rejects they'd probably hold up longer over time than OSB would. Also, plywood is a bad enough stylistic match to the otherwise all-pole rustic construction, OSB would have been too disgusting. (Lap or TG sheathing was just too impractical.) I'm confident that our old and creaky 200 year old house will be here in another 40-50 years when these houses across the way are being torn down. Unless they zone or e-d you to death. -- Jim
[MBZ] What do you know -- Snow tires do work
Some of you remember a few weeks ago I asked about snow tires on my 126. My Indy told me they would not work very well and I thought that was BS. Well, you all agreed. A lot of the mid west is dealing with the recent storm and here in Wichita, we are not exception. We didn't get any ice only sleet. The sleet piled up and it wasn't difficult to get around. Then, a slight slaw occurred and the sleet turned into a solid chunk of frozen stuff. Its not ice, but it is nearly as slick. Anyway, I drove my 126 for the first time through the frozen stuff with the new snow tires and it did great! No problem at all. Just plowed right through it. By the way, I almost forgot what it is like to wonder if your Diesel benz will start. I may have crappy mileage and have to deal with other issues of maintenance associated with gas cars, but I don't have to worry about my gasser 126 starting. I do like that. Donald H. Snook 1990 300SEL 134K
Re: [MBZ] Governer question
If we are talking pre computer controlled Mercedes diesels, such as the 617 turbo diesel, you are totally wrong! The governor does not have any function between idle and full rpm. The only things that control engine speed are the load, and the position of the fuel rack. I disagree. It's possible to build diesel governors that have throttle responses anywhere from gasser acceleration models to pure tractor-like fixed RPM settings. The relative strength of the two springs that couple the throttle rod and the governor to the fuel rack determine this. The governor in the 200D Frankenheap is very tractor-like, it pretty much accelerates all-out (ha!) to the rpm corresponding to the throttle pedal position. You could probably get a pretty tolerable cruise control with just a throttle lock. And this from a vacuum governor. Just MHO, no actual diesel mechanics were harmed during the forming of this opinion. -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] The big test
I looked at a foreclosure yesterday. One acre, fairly new 36x24 garage with insulation and furnace, two carpeted rooms in the corner of the garage, one with a big bench. Also comes with a small 2 bedroom house and a storage shed. Freddie Mac wants $40k for it. House is old, but doesn't look bad from the outside. I've got to get the keybox combo and go back today. Sounds promising. 24x36 is a nice 3-car size, into which you can usually jam two more toy cars sideways at the front if you don't cram it too full of other crap. We have four in our 3-car garage right now. The 450 SL (for sale!) lurks off the front of the 250C and 200D parking. The poor 190D, 300D, and 300CD have to live outside right now. We've also been toying with the idea of selling the 300D. (The infamous Chicken Wagon.) -- Jim
[MBZ] E320 CDI
I drove behind an E320CDI yesterday. It looks small. How does its size compare to a 124? Wilton 91 350SDL, 87 300Dand
Re: [MBZ] Cold Weather
HOWEVER... Apparently when it gets down around 5F, I need to let OFF the fuel... My startup went like this: Glow light went off around 15 seconds. I started cranking around 25 seconds with the fuel to the floor. cranked for maybe 5-10 seconds (rather slowly) and it started to make some sounds of combustion, then started dying out again. I let it crank for maybe another 5 seconds. Decided to press my luck and try for another glow cycle. I think I let it go for like 30 seconds this time. Tried cranking again with the pedal floored and again it slighty sounded like it was going to start, then started dying again. So I took my foot off the fuel and after a couple seconds it started coming to life. It was about half running with the starter still helping for a few seconds while I tried to feed in just enough fuel to keep it running. I continue to be impressed with the 200D's cold-starting ability. It must have _very_ good compression. Even at its worst it has started very easily in comparison. I'm sure the POS battery is its weakest link right now. There's no doubt the car has a no-start temperature, and that we've been pretty close to it here lately, but so far, so good... This car exhibits none of the coughing and puking of the SDL when cold-starting, and that car lives in a semi-warm garage. (It probably has air-leaky IP seals.) Of course, at home I use the block heater a lot. No sense making it any harder than I have to to start. I'm just hoping I got enough charge back in the battery on my 15 minute trip to work with the defrosters and headlights and what not on. 'Enough'? Perhaps, but certainly you didn't get a full charge back in in only that time. Not with what it sounds like you took out. Get in some longer drives, or invest in a small battery charger for occasional overnight refreshment. -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Cold Weather
Yeah, It's supposed to be closer to 25F this afternoon and I'm hoping to get out before dark so hoping I won't need the headlights, rear defroster nor as much for starting. I'll plug in the block heater so tomorrow's single digits hopefully won't be as bad, and if nothing else it gets a nice 45 minute charge about 4 times a week. The 15 minute drives are probably about 10 times a week, but normally they're not this cold and it's enough to get the temp up to 80C. Levi On 1/17/07, Jim Cathey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: HOWEVER... Apparently when it gets down around 5F, I need to let OFF the fuel... My startup went like this: Glow light went off around 15 seconds. I started cranking around 25 seconds with the fuel to the floor. cranked for maybe 5-10 seconds (rather slowly) and it started to make some sounds of combustion, then started dying out again. I let it crank for maybe another 5 seconds. Decided to press my luck and try for another glow cycle. I think I let it go for like 30 seconds this time. Tried cranking again with the pedal floored and again it slighty sounded like it was going to start, then started dying again. So I took my foot off the fuel and after a couple seconds it started coming to life. It was about half running with the starter still helping for a few seconds while I tried to feed in just enough fuel to keep it running. I continue to be impressed with the 200D's cold-starting ability. It must have _very_ good compression. Even at its worst it has started very easily in comparison. I'm sure the POS battery is its weakest link right now. There's no doubt the car has a no-start temperature, and that we've been pretty close to it here lately, but so far, so good... This car exhibits none of the coughing and puking of the SDL when cold-starting, and that car lives in a semi-warm garage. (It probably has air-leaky IP seals.) Of course, at home I use the block heater a lot. No sense making it any harder than I have to to start. I'm just hoping I got enough charge back in the battery on my 15 minute trip to work with the defrosters and headlights and what not on. 'Enough'? Perhaps, but certainly you didn't get a full charge back in in only that time. Not with what it sounds like you took out. Get in some longer drives, or invest in a small battery charger for occasional overnight refreshment. -- Jim ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT House Build Quality
Give up. I don't think it has as much to do with the quality of material as it does with the quality of the workmanship. You will NEVER get a well-constructed house unless YOU supervise EVERY aspect of the build. Every builder I know hires teams of illegal aliens to do the construction. I do not think any of them know how to use a square or level. When I was a teenager, I worked for a builder who demanded quality work. If a wall was not within 1/8 inch of being square and plumb, he made you tear it out and rebuild it on your own time. I have NOT seen such quality work since. Tom Potter -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Zoltan Finks Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 3:35 AM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: [MBZ] OT House Build Quality Okay, I know there's been a lot of OT lately (which I think keeps things fun), but I want to draw upon the knowledge our discriminating collective: As new-build houses go, how can one tell if a house is built with quality as opposed to corner-cutting cheapness? I know that new techniques are being used, such as a few pieces of plywood bonded together to make a 2 x 4. Is stuff like that okay, and what else is there to look out for? Brian ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] 124 floor heat
I need to do the same in my 87 300TD. Wondering if I can RR like Peter described (I've had the replacement pods for a long time) or whether I'm going to have to do something more difficult to get the failed one(s) out. ...Kevin p.s. Kaleb - do you have a W123 heater blower motor you'd sell? Aaron Lam said: Ralph, Fortunately these pods are among the easier ones to replace. Early 87's have two pods (a bit of a PITA to RR because of the pressed on lock washers) and early models have a single pod which unclips easily. They're accessible after removing the climate control unit. -Aaron 1987 300D On 1/16/07, Ralph W [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Can anyone give me an idea where the floor heat vacuum pod lives under the dash of a 124? I've got heat out the side vents and defroster but nothing going to the floor. I'm assuming that the pod for the heat flaps to the floor is bad. Can I get to this without removing the dash. I've fixed a 123 from the side panels. Is the 124 set up the same way? It's too darn cold to drive without floor heat. A hot torso and frostbit legs just doesn't get it. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- Thank God for Microsoft -- Linus Torvalds
Re: [MBZ] OT House Building
There is a local guy who has been building new houses on my street the last couple of years (tears down the old 1kft2 cottages and puts up 3.4kft2 new ones). He is a stickler on all the details. I have spent time with him on site, and have myself done interior trim, restoration, rebuilding, etc. on new and older houses. All the contractors use guest workers and he watches them like a hawk, and makes sure it is done right. When I have worked with these guys I have been a PITA too, but get good results. Foundation and frame are the keys -- if the foundation is not level, square, solid nothing else will be. The frame needs to be level, plumb, square as do all interior frames, doors, windows, etc. (and properly dimensioned). Every night you go around with the plan, a tape, and a level and make sure the day's work was done properly. If not, next morning Jose gets to redo it (they do learn quickly as they are paid by the job). You also check the lumber that is delivered, make sure it is good stuff. Make the vendor take it back if not good, give you credit or replacement. [Materials is a cut-throat business, lots of competition, do not let them off easily. Get to know your sales guy and make him perform.] OSB is OK for sheathing but ply is better. Decking should be TG ply, glued and nailed or screwed (this adds some work and cost but will insure the floor is tight and does not squeak). Check rough stairs closely (glue on these too). Make sure the walls are straight, no warps, twists, bows, etc. -- this raises hell with cabinets, doors, tile, trim, etc. After the house is closed in then you watch the electricians and plumbers closely. A master should check all the work that the guest workers do, and you check him. If it is not right, it gets redone to spec (you would be surprised how many of the trades are smarter than the architects or the owner or builder). Pay close attention to where outlets and switches are and what wires run where. It is hard to fix once the sheetrock is up. The rest of it is fairly easy. On bathrooms go with cement board, not greenboard (sheetrock) if codes allows it. Might cost a little bit more, but it will last forever. Thinset for tiles, not adhesive. Check the trim guys to make sure their joints are tight and fit right. Painters can make up for some but the work should be good to begin with. Check installed door frames for good door fit (uniform gaps). Use quality hardware in your cabinets if you have site-built cabs. Most cabinets today are expensive and cheaply made though they might look nice. Site-built stuff is a similar cost and should be better if you get a good carpenter (here the guest workers seem to do well, I think there is some pride in craftsmanship). Here is where you want to focus. Choke on the cost and go with stone or dense plastic for countertops, use quality fixtures and sinks and appliances. These will have the highest payback when you go to sell, and will last well. You will enjoy them. Quality materials costs add only a small fraction to the total cost, and will last much longer than cheap stuff. Get to know your buidling inspector. He can be a total PITA and your best friend too. DO NOT go cheap on stuff. If you can't do it right and well, don't do it at all. Expect your budget to have some overruns. If you are buying an already-built house, you're on your own. I would find some that are a couple years old by the same builder, go look at them and talk to the owners. Also find some that are currently under construction and check them closely. Don't fall in love with how the house looks. Paint and stuff can cover up a lot of faults. One other thing - if you are building on your own, you might look into hiring a construction manager rather than a builder, and doing your own general contracting and bill paying. The CM can ride herd while you deal with GM issues. Around us there are some of these guys who are school teachers, they get off work at 3:30-4 or so, go to the job site and kick around an hour or two, stop by in the morning. I talked to one, he charges $25k as his fee (on a say $250-350k construction cost) and guarantees the work. Being a GM can be a pain, but you can also save a lot ($75-100k on a $500k house). Your costs will of course vary by your situation, but these are some guidelines. You also need to have the job scheduled well, trades and materials lined up -- time is money. I see my buddy get a house from teardown to move-in in 4 months, while others on the street are still half done with guys coming and going randomly and not a lot happening. --R Potter, Tom E wrote: Give up. I don't think it has as much to do with the quality of material as it does with the quality of the workmanship. You will NEVER get a well-constructed house unless YOU supervise EVERY aspect of the build. Every builder I know hires teams of illegal
[MBZ] foreclosure was Re: The big test
I looked at a foreclosure yesterday. One acre, fairly new 36x24 garage with insulation and furnace, two carpeted rooms in the corner of the garage, one with a big bench. Also comes with a small 2 bedroom house and a storage shed. Freddie Mac wants $40k for it. House is old, but doesn't look bad from the outside. I've got to get the keybox combo and go back today. What's the unemployment rate in MI now-a-days? Around 10-12%? There may be more of them there foreclosures soon... Rick Knoble '85 300 CD '87 190 DT
[MBZ] V8 Table
Of course this would have to be a Benz block, perhaps with the head and cam gear, and polished up well, but I am sure the wifey would appreciate the art and technology and craftsmanship involved, and would want to have it displayed prominently in the living areas of the house. Just make sure to suggest that she uses M1 to polish it (then run fast). http://www.flickr.com/photos/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/sets/72157594484820721/detail/ --R (wife gone for a few days, her birthday in 10 days, thinking, thinking)
Re: [MBZ] The big test
Speaking of garages, today (my birthday) brings me back to a fantasy I have had for some time: to purchase a lift for my garage. It would have to be 110 volts and SAFE, preferably idiot proof so my sig. other would (grudgingly) approve. Here is one that meets my criteria and doesn't even need to be bolted down: *http://tinyurl.com/2b7alt* On 1/17/07, Jim Cathey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I looked at a foreclosure yesterday. One acre, fairly new 36x24 garage with insulation and furnace, two carpeted rooms in the corner of the garage, one with a big bench. Also comes with a small 2 bedroom house and a storage shed. Freddie Mac wants $40k for it. House is old, but doesn't look bad from the outside. I've got to get the keybox combo and go back today. Sounds promising. 24x36 is a nice 3-car size, into which you can usually jam two more toy cars sideways at the front if you don't cram it too full of other crap. We have four in our 3-car garage right now. The 450 SL (for sale!) lurks off the front of the 250C and 200D parking. The poor 190D, 300D, and 300CD have to live outside right now. We've also been toying with the idea of selling the 300D. (The infamous Chicken Wagon.) -- Jim ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Cold Weather
Hey guys, as a practical matter, and because I'm a weather nut, please identify WHERE you live when discussing the cold temperatures. Andrew 24 degrees F. this AM, going into the high 30s. On 1/17/07, Levi Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Yeah, It's supposed to be closer to 25F this afternoon and I'm hoping to get out before dark so hoping I won't need the headlights, rear defroster nor as much for starting. I'll plug in the block heater so tomorrow's single digits hopefully won't be as bad, and if nothing else it gets a nice 45 minute charge about 4 times a week. The 15 minute drives are probably about 10 times a week, but normally they're not this cold and it's enough to get the temp up to 80C. Levi On 1/17/07, Jim Cathey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: HOWEVER... Apparently when it gets down around 5F, I need to let OFF the fuel... My startup went like this: Glow light went off around 15 seconds. I started cranking around 25 seconds with the fuel to the floor. cranked for maybe 5-10 seconds (rather slowly) and it started to make some sounds of combustion, then started dying out again. I let it crank for maybe another 5 seconds. Decided to press my luck and try for another glow cycle. I think I let it go for like 30 seconds this time. Tried cranking again with the pedal floored and again it slighty sounded like it was going to start, then started dying again. So I took my foot off the fuel and after a couple seconds it started coming to life. It was about half running with the starter still helping for a few seconds while I tried to feed in just enough fuel to keep it running. I continue to be impressed with the 200D's cold-starting ability. It must have _very_ good compression. Even at its worst it has started very easily in comparison. I'm sure the POS battery is its weakest link right now. There's no doubt the car has a no-start temperature, and that we've been pretty close to it here lately, but so far, so good... This car exhibits none of the coughing and puking of the SDL when cold-starting, and that car lives in a semi-warm garage. (It probably has air-leaky IP seals.) Of course, at home I use the block heater a lot. No sense making it any harder than I have to to start. I'm just hoping I got enough charge back in the battery on my 15 minute trip to work with the defrosters and headlights and what not on. 'Enough'? Perhaps, but certainly you didn't get a full charge back in in only that time. Not with what it sounds like you took out. Get in some longer drives, or invest in a small battery charger for occasional overnight refreshment. -- Jim ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Cold Weather
Good point-my 10F was in southern RI. Dwight andrew strasfogel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hey guys, as a practical matter, and because I'm a weather nut, please identify WHERE you live when discussing the cold temperatures. Andrew 24 degrees F. this AM, going into the high 30s. On 1/17/07, Levi Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Yeah, It's supposed to be closer to 25F this afternoon and I'm hoping to get out before dark so hoping I won't need the headlights, rear defroster nor as much for starting. I'll plug in the block heater so tomorrow's single digits hopefully won't be as bad, and if nothing else it gets a nice 45 minute charge about 4 times a week. The 15 minute drives are probably about 10 times a week, but normally they're not this cold and it's enough to get the temp up to 80C. Levi On 1/17/07, Jim Cathey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: HOWEVER... Apparently when it gets down around 5F, I need to let OFF the fuel... My startup went like this: Glow light went off around 15 seconds. I started cranking around 25 seconds with the fuel to the floor. cranked for maybe 5-10 seconds (rather slowly) and it started to make some sounds of combustion, then started dying out again. I let it crank for maybe another 5 seconds. Decided to press my luck and try for another glow cycle. I think I let it go for like 30 seconds this time. Tried cranking again with the pedal floored and again it slighty sounded like it was going to start, then started dying again. So I took my foot off the fuel and after a couple seconds it started coming to life. It was about half running with the starter still helping for a few seconds while I tried to feed in just enough fuel to keep it running. I continue to be impressed with the 200D's cold-starting ability. It must have _very_ good compression. Even at its worst it has started very easily in comparison. I'm sure the POS battery is its weakest link right now. There's no doubt the car has a no-start temperature, and that we've been pretty close to it here lately, but so far, so good... This car exhibits none of the coughing and puking of the SDL when cold-starting, and that car lives in a semi-warm garage. (It probably has air-leaky IP seals.) Of course, at home I use the block heater a lot. No sense making it any harder than I have to to start. I'm just hoping I got enough charge back in the battery on my 15 minute trip to work with the defrosters and headlights and what not on. 'Enough'? Perhaps, but certainly you didn't get a full charge back in in only that time. Not with what it sounds like you took out. Get in some longer drives, or invest in a small battery charger for occasional overnight refreshment. -- Jim ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- Dwight E. Giles, Jr. Bissell Cove Quahog Auto Salvage Co. Wickford, RI
Re: [MBZ] Cold Weather
14843 I couldn't help but notice that you didn't include your location. (: Levi On 1/17/07, andrew strasfogel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hey guys, as a practical matter, and because I'm a weather nut, please identify WHERE you live when discussing the cold temperatures. Andrew 24 degrees F. this AM, going into the high 30s. On 1/17/07, Levi Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Yeah, It's supposed to be closer to 25F this afternoon and I'm hoping to get out before dark so hoping I won't need the headlights, rear defroster nor as much for starting. I'll plug in the block heater so tomorrow's single digits hopefully won't be as bad, and if nothing else it gets a nice 45 minute charge about 4 times a week. The 15 minute drives are probably about 10 times a week, but normally they're not this cold and it's enough to get the temp up to 80C. Levi On 1/17/07, Jim Cathey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: HOWEVER... Apparently when it gets down around 5F, I need to let OFF the fuel... My startup went like this: Glow light went off around 15 seconds. I started cranking around 25 seconds with the fuel to the floor. cranked for maybe 5-10 seconds (rather slowly) and it started to make some sounds of combustion, then started dying out again. I let it crank for maybe another 5 seconds. Decided to press my luck and try for another glow cycle. I think I let it go for like 30 seconds this time. Tried cranking again with the pedal floored and again it slighty sounded like it was going to start, then started dying again. So I took my foot off the fuel and after a couple seconds it started coming to life. It was about half running with the starter still helping for a few seconds while I tried to feed in just enough fuel to keep it running. I continue to be impressed with the 200D's cold-starting ability. It must have _very_ good compression. Even at its worst it has started very easily in comparison. I'm sure the POS battery is its weakest link right now. There's no doubt the car has a no-start temperature, and that we've been pretty close to it here lately, but so far, so good... This car exhibits none of the coughing and puking of the SDL when cold-starting, and that car lives in a semi-warm garage. (It probably has air-leaky IP seals.) Of course, at home I use the block heater a lot. No sense making it any harder than I have to to start. I'm just hoping I got enough charge back in the battery on my 15 minute trip to work with the defrosters and headlights and what not on. 'Enough'? Perhaps, but certainly you didn't get a full charge back in in only that time. Not with what it sounds like you took out. Get in some longer drives, or invest in a small battery charger for occasional overnight refreshment. -- Jim ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] OT: VW Passat
Thanks for everyones help, You guys rock. Turns out it was just a bad plug ( I hope ) . Check engine light was reset. Drove it about 30 miles at both high and slow speeds. If there is still a problem, generally how long will it take for the check engine light to come back on? Thanks again. Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more.
Re: [MBZ] Cold Weather
Good eye LeviI'm in Montour Falls, NY..Just over the hill, well actually over a few hills, from LeviDon't own a thermometer.It was cold. Mike - Original Message - From: Levi Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 12:18 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] Cold Weather 14843 I couldn't help but notice that you didn't include your location. (: Levi On 1/17/07, andrew strasfogel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hey guys, as a practical matter, and because I'm a weather nut, please identify WHERE you live when discussing the cold temperatures. Andrew 24 degrees F. this AM, going into the high 30s. On 1/17/07, Levi Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Yeah, It's supposed to be closer to 25F this afternoon and I'm hoping to get out before dark so hoping I won't need the headlights, rear defroster nor as much for starting. I'll plug in the block heater so tomorrow's single digits hopefully won't be as bad, and if nothing else it gets a nice 45 minute charge about 4 times a week. The 15 minute drives are probably about 10 times a week, but normally they're not this cold and it's enough to get the temp up to 80C. Levi On 1/17/07, Jim Cathey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: HOWEVER... Apparently when it gets down around 5F, I need to let OFF the fuel... My startup went like this: Glow light went off around 15 seconds. I started cranking around 25 seconds with the fuel to the floor. cranked for maybe 5-10 seconds (rather slowly) and it started to make some sounds of combustion, then started dying out again. I let it crank for maybe another 5 seconds. Decided to press my luck and try for another glow cycle. I think I let it go for like 30 seconds this time. Tried cranking again with the pedal floored and again it slighty sounded like it was going to start, then started dying again. So I took my foot off the fuel and after a couple seconds it started coming to life. It was about half running with the starter still helping for a few seconds while I tried to feed in just enough fuel to keep it running. I continue to be impressed with the 200D's cold-starting ability. It must have _very_ good compression. Even at its worst it has started very easily in comparison. I'm sure the POS battery is its weakest link right now. There's no doubt the car has a no-start temperature, and that we've been pretty close to it here lately, but so far, so good... This car exhibits none of the coughing and puking of the SDL when cold-starting, and that car lives in a semi-warm garage. (It probably has air-leaky IP seals.) Of course, at home I use the block heater a lot. No sense making it any harder than I have to to start. I'm just hoping I got enough charge back in the battery on my 15 minute trip to work with the defrosters and headlights and what not on. 'Enough'? Perhaps, but certainly you didn't get a full charge back in in only that time. Not with what it sounds like you took out. Get in some longer drives, or invest in a small battery charger for occasional overnight refreshment. -- Jim ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Cold Weather
uh, like you didn't? ;-) cheers! e high 30s last night, expecting 40s in Berkeley, CA... andrew strasfogel wrote: Hey guys, as a practical matter, and because I'm a weather nut, please identify WHERE you live when discussing the cold temperatures. Andrew 24 degrees F. this AM, going into the high 30s. [snippage]
Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Digest, Vol 14, Issue 105
0.0F when I got out of bed this morning. Supposed to be warmer tomorrow morning, like single digits. I was thinking I'd maybe not run the block heater and see how the car would start. Then I got thinking about the longer time spent in the car without heat... Lessee, the block heater is on for like 2.5 hours. It draws less than 4 amps. Thats squatski, its costing me a couple cents a day. I'll plug 'er in... -Curt Message: 1 Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 9:29:22 -0500 From: Subject: Re: [MBZ] The big test To: Mercedes Discussion List Cc: Curt Raymond Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Yes-so did my 300D 2.5-it was 10F and no hint of winter. I am assuming I will never have to uncoil the block heater plug. Almost disappointing as starting the 240D is more exciting and involves manly skills like tweaking the cold idle, double glow, etc. How cold was it in N. MA this AM? Dwight Curt Raymond wrote: Started just like it was July. Dwight E. Giles, Jr. 1979 240D-250K + miles 1990 300D 2.5t 135K miles Wickford, RI - Access over 1 million songs - Yahoo! Music Unlimited. From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Wed Jan 17 18:56:34 2007 Received: from alnrmhc14.comcast.net ([204.127.225.94]) by server8.arterytc8.net with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1H7Fxa-0008Fv-CO for mercedes@okiebenz.com; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 18:56:34 + Received: from [192.168.0.2] (c-24-18-178-168.hsd1.wa.comcast.net[24.18.178.168]) by comcast.net (alnrmhc14) with SMTP id 20070117185151b1400rpdqte; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 18:51:51 + Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v624) In-Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] References: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Redghost [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 10:52:40 -0800 To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.624) X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT House Build Quality X-BeenThere: mercedes@okiebenz.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9.cp1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com List-Id: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes_okiebenz.com.okiebenz.com List-Unsubscribe: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Archive: /pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com List-Post: mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com List-Help: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Subscribe: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 18:56:35 - I actually only purchase pre owned homes of a certain vintage. But the wife's side goes for new construction, so I check what garbage they are getting for their pennies. Look at the trim work. If it is real wood, miter cut angles, that speaks volumes about the quality of materials used. Most times the trim is but nailed, paper wrapped saw dust. Cheap construction also like T1-11 siding. Excess caulk usage on nail holes/seams speaks to the low value home. Pergo type flooring - look like wood, wears like paper. I guess if it looks and feels cheap, you are correct. Sturdy products speak of more care in the building. I really hate the particle board siding or sheet products being used anywhere but for interior remodel. Homes get popped up around here with that junk, get rained on, and the wood just sucks the water into the sheet. A few years later, there is de-lamination and mold. My $0.02, YMMV On Jan 17, 2007, at 1:35 AM, Zoltan Finks wrote: Okay, I know there's been a lot of OT lately (which I think keeps things fun), but I want to draw upon the knowledge our discriminating collective: As new-build houses go, how can one tell if a house is built with quality as opposed to corner-cutting cheapness? I know that new techniques are being used, such as a few pieces of plywood bonded together to make a 2 x 4. Is stuff like that okay, and what else is there to look out for? Brian ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- Clay Seattle Bioburner 1972 220D - Gump 1995 E300D - Cleo 1987 300SDL - POS - DOA The FSM would drive a Diesel Benz
Re: [MBZ] [OT] P/M/W (was Mercedes Quality vs Toyota)
I say allow them to drive any decrepit excuse for a car they want with no need for inspections. Up the strength of recreation narcotics to near lethal levels. Crank up the toxins in smokes, as well as over saturate the prepared food with fats and chemicals. Decrease spending on public education, reduce sports programs at schools, remove arts programs for children, and remove incentives for quality teachers to hang around. In a generation or so, the less desirable who breed might begin to be self terminating. Then we can use the bloated carcasses for rendering into biofuels for our old Diesel cars. On Jan 17, 2007, at 4:34 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Not much longer; in America we are engaging in a selective breeding campaign; we espouse abstinence and waiting, so those few good people do that, resulting in fewer kids. The less-than good folks (ie the self-centered idiots to whom nothing in this world applies (except entitlement programs)) go ahead and have lots of kids (this would be a litter, right?) (whether it is to further their entitlements or just because they dont care)... so the idiots are out-reproducing the non-idiots. Couple that with the ongoing campaign to repeal the laws of natural selection (courtesy of all the lawsuits and safety warnings as a result of injuries caused by failure to utilize common sense...) Anyhow, Y'all can smell what I'm stepping in. -j. -- John Reames 1985 300d (223K Gerta) 1991 Cherokee (149K the fishbowl) 1999 E300Dt (140K Hans) (the leaky one) 1999 E300Dt (106K Frantz) (the squeaky one) -- Original message -- From: Jim Cathey [EMAIL PROTECTED] Most problems can be blamed on a minority. Fortunately, good people still outnumber the f***ing idiots, but I wonder for how much longer? -- Jim ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- Clay Seattle Bioburner 1972 220D - Gump 1995 E300D - Cleo 1987 300SDL - POS - DOA The FSM would drive a Diesel Benz
Re: [MBZ] Governer question
And the governor is linked to the fuel rack and accelerator linkage with springs It does indeed have a function, just like the vac governor in older models. You don't notice the effect except that you get fairly strong acceleration with minor movements of the pedal, then rapid reduction in acceleration as speed changes. I would be very tiring to drive a diesel without a governor, it would ALWAYS be speeding up or slowing down slightly. Check out the linkage diagrams in the MB engine manuals. Peter -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Jan 17, 2007 9:11 AM To: mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Governer question In a message dated 1/15/2007 10:21:35 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Since the air intake is essentially wide open on a diesel (vac governors excluded, but have the same effect), something has to control engine speed. The governor combines the engine speed with the accelerator position to determine fuel delivery. As engine speed drops for any given pedal position, the governor weights will drive inwards under the influence of the return springs and rack return spring to rotate the sleeves in the IP to give more fuel delivery. Yes, it does indeed work like a speed control, although it won't change the accelerator position -- the accelerator linkage will over-ride the governor towards more or less fuel. The main effect of the governor is idle and low speed operation, where lots of fuel is needed to get moving, but a large change is speed is not desired. It will also help to maintain speed on the highway, within rather small limits. Needless to say, this isn't quite a simple as that (although not a complex as the gasoline injection pumps!), but what you will get with new bushings is better speed and throttle control -- the engine will not hunt for speed, for instance, and won't lag or run on when you either press down or lift up the accelerator. Peter, If we are talking pre computer controlled Mercedes diesels, such as the 617 turbo diesel, you are totally wrong! The governer does not have any function between idle and full rpm. The only things that control engine speed are the load, and the position of the fuel rack. Jim Friesen Phoenix AZ 79 300SD, 264 K miles 98 ML 320, 147 K miles ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] Heater Monovalve questions
I am freezing my butt off driving my car. I have no heat and I believe several folks on the list agreed it was the monovalve, but I just want to make sure. I am not getting any heat out the vents, but after long enough, I will get some (although not much) heat from the defrost vents. This is true regardless of which button on the control I push. Is this the monovalve? Donald H. Snook 1990 300SEL 134K
[MBZ] Anyone need a huge Diesel truck
Ebay item # 260077088356 no affiliation http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/CREW-CAB-DUALLY-ALL-POWER-6-5-LITER-TURBO -DIESEL_W0QQitemZ260077088356QQihZ016QQcategoryZ90970QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewIte m Donald H. Snook 1990 300SEL 134K
Re: [MBZ] OT - VA medical care
Werner wrote:you're treading on some soft ground when you question the rights of patients in VA hospitals. Remember the old saying they also serve who wait? I agree with you Werner - in fact, I believe the % of those who actually see combat is around 20% (or it was during WW2) with the remaining 80% preforming support duties to keep them fighting. Also, regardless of who gets shot at or not, they *all* suffer from very low pay (many enlisted men with families survive only because they qualify for food stamps) - and an incessant training schedule. They are working 24./7 for the most part - and when they get called overseas they may be there for a long time without time off. Only those who's injury/illness/disease can be attributed to their time in service can be treated in a VA hospital. If anyone ever wants to do something for those who keep us free I suggest you visit some of those in the VA - it will break your heart and you will likely be the only one visiting many of the patients. Then there are patients whose family shows up on the day his monthly check arrives then are not seen again until next month. My wife worked as a RN at our local VA hospital - in the long term care floor and on the spinal care unit where some have help breathing with a sigh button - the button is pressed ocasionally and the machine sighs for the patient - something that's needed once in a while although those of us healthy enough to do it for ourselves seldom notice it. She was burned out after 2 years and had to take time off before finding work elsewhere --- Anyone receiving health care in a VA hospital isn't very lucky. Larry T (67 MGB, 74 911, 78 240D, 91 300D) www.youroil.net for Oil Analysis and Weber Parts Test Results http://members.rennlist.com/oil PORSCHE POSTERS! youroil.net Weber Carb Info http://members.rennlist.com/webercarbs Porsche Road Test http://members.rennlist.com/roadtest/ . - Original Message - From: Werner Fehlauer [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 11:10 PM Subject: [MBZ] OT - VA medical care OK Don - IMO, you're treading on some soft ground when you question the rights of patients in VA hospitals. Remember the old saying they also serve who wait? There were a lot of veterans of WW2, Korea, RVN, or later conflicts that were either fortunate not to be shot at, or were assigned to duties that kept them safer. It wasn't always their own call as to where they served, but they all contributed to the effort, and have a right to share in what meager benefits that our forgetful citizens have allowed. All veterans had their personal lives interrupted, careers changed, and some were injured, maimed, or killed. I don't think we are wise enough to say who qualifies for medical care. Werner, WB2BRB - Original Message - From: OK Don [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 8:44 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Quality vs Toyota Don't forget those who never left the States, got the GI bill, went to college, paid the bright youngsters to do their homework, cried over having to take the tests, graduated (barely), and expected to be handed a high paying job (never got it), and are now filling the halls of the VA hospitals getting free medical care. I figure we way over paid for that. I have no problem with those how saw combat - we can't do enogh for them. But to do the same for everyone who ended up in the armed service? May his noodly appendage do a little more than touch! On 1/16/07, Redghost [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At least those who were able to succeed on government largesse in our generation with GI Bill, had to dodge bullets or maybe put lives on the line. I figure the gummint got off easy on that debt. And some even brought home a tri star when returning from deployment. -- OK Don, KD5NRO Norman, OK ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.410 / Virus Database: 268.16.13/632 - Release Date: 1/16/2007
Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Quality vs Toyota
You wrote:I suspect there are too many under-qualified people being allowed into colleges. I read somewhere recently that something like 75% of Freshmen had to take remedial English, Math and other courses before they could proceed with college level classes - the material offered in HS is inefficient. And the students are not aware of the level of effort reqired in college - well, the way college used to be., I wish I could find it again - a while back I saw an 8th grade proficiency exam from 1908 or so - I graduated HS in 1968 and most of those questions were way over my head I'm sorry to say. Larry T (67 MGB, 74 911, 78 240D, 91 300D) www.youroil.net for Oil Analysis and Weber Parts Test Results http://members.rennlist.com/oil PORSCHE POSTERS! youroil.net Weber Carb Info http://members.rennlist.com/webercarbs Porsche Road Test http://members.rennlist.com/roadtest/ . - Original Message - From: Redghost [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 3:44 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Quality vs Toyota On the issue of quantity of humanities v. engineering graduates, I suspect there are too many under-qualified people being allowed into colleges. When you actually had to pay for the education, you had a better quality student entering. Now any idiot that can claim some affiliation with a minority group supported by an entitlement program gets a free education. If these people were employed in manufacturing jobs, maybe the quality would go up, because the more qualified would be educated either on the job, or through a business degree. On Jan 14, 2007, at 12:06 PM, LarryT wrote: you wrote:most of my current managers (in a materials supply industry) have degrees in Liberal Arts Hmmm, I wonder if that is because of the low # of engineering/scientist our colleges are turning out? Along with a high # of Liberal Arts degrees forcing a glut on the market - so a company that is looking for a Bachelors degree holder must accept whatever comse in the door? While the US still leads the world in most areas I gotta wonder how long we can keep that position while putting square pegs into round holes? Those managers can do an amazing amount of damage to morale and the product. Larry T (67 MGB, 74 911, 78 240D, 91 300D) www.youroil.net for Oil Analysis and Weber Parts Test Results http://members.rennlist.com/oil PORSCHE POSTERS! youroil.net Weber Carb Info http://members.rennlist.com/webercarbs Porsche Road Test http://members.rennlist.com/roadtest/ . - Original Message - From: Peter Frederick [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Sunday, January 14, 2007 12:33 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Quality vs Toyota The US plants have American managers. If they are like the ones I have currently at my current job (major US company as a contractor), they can turn any set of parts into junk. The notion that if you know how to do it you are prohibited from managing it seems to be universal in the US -- the only thing that counts is daily cash savings. Actual knowledge appears to disqualify one to manage anything -- most of my current managers (in a materials supply industry) have degrees in Liberal Arts. Naturally, you get lousy product as a result. Peter ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.410 / Virus Database: 268.16.10/625 - Release Date: 1/13/2007 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- Clay Seattle Bioburner 1972 220D - Gump 1995 E300D - Cleo 1987 300SDL - POS - DOA The FSM would drive a Diesel Benz ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.410 / Virus Database: 268.16.12/631 - Release Date: 1/16/2007
