[newbie] managed to freeze the system!
In the console I issued the following command: jrxvt The process id returned and after that I am unable to do anything except move the cursor. No windows respond. No mouse buttons respond. Before I force a restart - any suggestions? doug Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Recommended office suites?
Well, I've been living here in Japan for the past 18 years now and I find companies here more capitalistic and less regulated then in the U.S. Everything you buy here is strictly let the buyer beware. There is no such thing at all like money back guarantee like in stores in the U.S. And things are pretty unregulated as far as business goes. I remember some years ago I wanted to import modems into Japan so I contacted JETRO, the Japan External Trade Organization, asking how do I arrange for an import license. They said there was no such thing. If I wanted to import, go ahead. In the U.S. you have to have business licenses to open up a small store or business. No such thing here. I ran an Internet cafe here in Tokyo for three years with no regulation hassles at all. As far as maintaining social equality goes, tell that to women who have traditionally been more discriminated against here. When I worked at Fujitsu, women - even the programmers - were expected to come in 15 minutes before the men to tidy things up and start the coffee and tea going. (Fujitsu, by the way, is a great company and one of the more progressive in Japan, with a high percentage of female managers these days.) While the salary discrepencies that exist in the U.S. are not as severe in Japan (and maybe that is what you meant by maintaining social equality), unemployment is at a high right now and the lifetime employment system is falling by the wayside. In addition, the population is aging quickly and the health insurance system is about bankrupt. Lots of problems facing Japan right now. I could go on forever... doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Saturday, December 29, 2001): My view is more like that espoused in Europe and Asia. Take Japan, for example. To the Japanese, your views would be totally alien. In the past fifty years, they have undergone more rapid economic transformation than any other nation, while _maintaining_ social equality. They have done this by making everyone and everything accountable for the welfare of the nation. In the same period, social equality has markedly fallen in Anglo-American capitalist states. No nation has ever moved from an 'underdeveloped' to a 'developed' state by using Anglo-American economic principles (which you seem to embrace). Indeed, most nations that have adopted such methods have gone backward. While your views may be 'alien' to the Japanese (or to many other peoples), it doesn't necessarily mean they are 'wrong', just 'different'. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Recommended office suites?
Amazing how things can digress! Soon we'll throw in religion and whale hunting. :-) doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Saturday, December 29, 2001): I could go on forever... You could, but we're not talking about office suites anymore :) Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Open Source (was Re: [newbie] Recommended office suites? Now OT)
If software were free how could the employees of the software company be paid to begin with? I'm sorry, but by this logic you could say, Instead of spending all that money on a down payment and mortgage, think of all the money I could save by just moving into the first house I see. doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Thursday, December 27, 2001): True, but there is also another side to the story. What about the end users, who will _save_ money by using free software. Corporations spend massive amounts of money on buggy, insecure software. If the software was free, all this money could be saved, and the employees could be paid more (or more could be hired). I am not rabidly against charging for software, but in many cases free software can make a lot of sense. If a company chose to write a decent OS (BeOS and OS/2 come to mind) with decent software, I would consider using them. Microsoft on the other hand does not compete on quality, it competes on marketing and lock-in. On Thu, 27 Dec 2001 10:57:25 +0900, Doug Lerner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On a day-to-day basis, if you want to have a working economy, where people can support themselves then, for sure, it makes more sense to compensate labor and effort which can be attributed. In other words, pay the programmers who create programs. The compensation to society for providing the environment is paid in taxes. doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Thursday, December 27, 2001): Doug Lerner wrote: There is a huge difference between an idea and an instance of putting the idea to use. And which is more valuable, or more worthy of being compensated (for)? Randy Kramer Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com -- Sridhar Dhanapalan I've always liked penguins, and when I was in Canberra a few years ago we went to the local zoo with Andrew Tridgell (of samba fame). There they had a ferocious penguin that bit me and infected me with a little known disease called penguinitis. Penguinitis makes you stay awake at nights just thinking about penguins and feeling great love towards them. So when Linux needed a mascot, the first thing that came into my mind was this picture of the majestic penguin, and the rest is history. -- Linus Torvalds Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Using Japanese?
Thanks. I'll try that. Why i18n? I would have never thought of looking there for languages! doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Friday, December 28, 2001): Doug Lerner wrote: I was hping to do Japanese reading and writing without installing a Japanese OS interface. Every time somebody suggests something like that I always think, Do they also suggest installing a French OS if they want to read and write email in French? :-) I didn't see anything in the installation about additional languages. Certainly nothing came up during the recommended install. Is there a way of running the installer again and adding stuff to the existing installation? Thanks, Doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Thursday, December 27, 2001): Doug Lerner wrote: Is there something analagous to the Japanese Language Toolkit in MacOS that I can install so that I can read and write Japanese? Thanks, Doug Lerner, Tokyo H well since you have one partition open where win2k was, try searching on Two Mandrake at www.mandrakeforum.com and set up a second mandrake system and choose to _install_ in Japanese. Also, the install usually permits additional languages--there is no specific kit, just additional languages that may be chosen. Civileme Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Yes of course. Drop in the install CD and when it comes to class of install, select Expert mode and Update instead of install. It will fuss and cluck til it discovers it has no packages to update then offer you categorical and individual package selection--look at the i18n files for linux and kde and you will find Japanese. BTW, as the worst ergonomics in the whole installer, the individual packages selection screen has a little symbol at the bottom of the window that looks like recycling with only two blue arrows instead of three green ones--this toggles from the useless tree list to the flat list of packages. Use it. Civileme Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Open Source (was Re: [newbie] Recommended office suites? Now OT)
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Thursday, December 27, 2001): On Thu, 27 Dec 2001 21:33:06 +0900, Doug Lerner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If software were free how could the employees of the software company be paid to begin with? I am not arguing that all software should be free. I am simply stating that in some cases I believe that the free software model is better. Let the market decide. Most free software is developed outside of corporations, and much of it is developed simply as a hobby by the coders (not as a revenue earner). I'm sorry, but by this logic you could say, Instead of spending all that money on a down payment and mortgage, think of all the money I could save by just moving into the first house I see. Ummm... no. The free software model requires a different way of thinking in order to be properly comprehended. It doesn't work as the capitalist model does, and you will never understand it properly if you persist in viewing it in that way. I am not saying that it is incompatible with the capitalist model -- it is simply different. Indeed, companies like Mandrakesoft and Red Hat have proven that they _are_ compatible. Well, I would say the verdict is still out on that. As both Mandrake and Red Hat will admit, neither have made profit for their investors yet. Both companies you mention are trading stock in their companies. Presumably the people who buy their stock want to make money on it at some point. And the employees too. I bet key staff have stock options and want to see the value of the stock rise. You can't so easily violate conservation of money. :-) doug Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Using Japanese?
That did seem to install the Japanese system! I am able to get as far now as entering hiragana, but the conversion mode does not seem to be working. I will see what I can find out about this and post again. doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Friday, December 28, 2001): Yes of course. Drop in the install CD and when it comes to class of install, select Expert mode and Update instead of install. It will fuss and cluck til it discovers it has no packages to update then offer you categorical and individual package selection--look at the i18n files for linux and kde and you will find Japanese. BTW, as the worst ergonomics in the whole installer, the individual packages selection screen has a little symbol at the bottom of the window that looks like recycling with only two blue arrows instead of three green ones--this toggles from the useless tree list to the flat list of packages. Use it. Civileme Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Using Japanese?
How mnemonic. :-) doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Thursday, December 27, 2001): i18n = internationalization (i + 18 letters + n) At 09:15 01/12/28 +0900, you wrote: Thanks. I'll try that. Why i18n? I would have never thought of looking there for languages! doug Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Open Source (was Re: [newbie] Recommended office suites? Now OT)
Whether a pot is the result of thousands of years of accumulated knowledge about ceramics shouldn't matter. Somebody has to still decide to put forth the labor required to make an instance of the pot. After he or she does so it is the maker's thing to profit from. doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Wednesday, December 26, 2001): Doug Lerner wrote: A little common sense can apply here. Certainly there are some examples that are obvious. For example, the letter a is obviously public domain. But C code that actually does something useful and was created with the effort of a developer - that is obviously different, isn't it? Dirt anybody can find in the ground. It doesn't mean that a beautiful clay pot that somebody creates then belongs to everybody, does it? OK, I'm getting way off topic here, so feel free to tell me to shut up. The problem, IMHO, is philosophical, and lies in the concept of property itself. Societies based on a more-or-less Western, more-or-less capitalist, more-or-less industrial model tend to regard prototypical property as manufactured exchangable physical objects. Intellectual property is a metaphorical extension of that notion, so we own an idea in the same way that we own a pot. One reaction, popular in Free Software circles, is to say that this analogy is false - you can own a pot but you can't own an idea. I believe this reaction is also based on false premises. If what makes a pot yours is your labour (as Locke claimed) then the labour you have put into a computer program should also make it yours - more so, in fact, since it does not rely on appropriation of common property (the dirt Doug mentions). Or does it? Ideas come from other ideas which are common property in much the same way as dirt is. A pot cannot be _wholly_ someone's property because it contains common property, not only in the form of dirt (or rather clay, which is not as common or worthless) but also in terms of ideas accumulated over thousands of years of ceramics. All this goes to show that property as an absolute concept is unworkable. A society _may_ choose to give certain people exclusive use of certain objects or ideas, and to give them the right to exchange these things, but only if this works for the benefit of all concerned. Ownership is no more than a convenient fiction. Robin Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Open Source (was Re: [newbie] Recommended office suites? Now OT)
On a day-to-day basis, if you want to have a working economy, where people can support themselves then, for sure, it makes more sense to compensate labor and effort which can be attributed. In other words, pay the programmers who create programs. The compensation to society for providing the environment is paid in taxes. doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Thursday, December 27, 2001): Doug Lerner wrote: There is a huge difference between an idea and an instance of putting the idea to use. And which is more valuable, or more worthy of being compensated (for)? Randy Kramer Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Recommended office suites?
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Thursday, December 27, 2001): Tom Brinkman wrote: On Tuesday 25 December 2001 07:17 pm, Doug Lerner wrote: What do people think about free vs commercial software in general? I myself don't object to commercial software. In fact, I work for a company that makes very high-quality commercial software with a great, loyal customer base. Surely there is nothing wrong with paying to have software supported and updated? doug Well the analogy of the clay pot may not be good at all. Consider this-- I make a clay pot, and I fire it and I go to a lawyer and show him the product and get him to draft a patent so that no one else can glaze clay pots or decorate them in any way without paying me royalties. I file the patent and use the proceeds from my clay pots to threaten to keep anyone else who fires clay pots in court for years of ruinous spending battling my army of lawyers unless they pay me ransom for protection against lawsuit. I believe that patent law requires more than just something new. It has to be something that is not obvious too. Let me ask the opposite question. Suppose a drug company takes hundreds of millions of dollars from thousands of investors and uses the money for research and creates a drug that improves the daily lives of millions of people. Do the people who invested in the enterprise deserve to profit from this? Or should anybody be allowed to come along and make generic copies of the drug without bothering to invest in time and effort to do the research? The problem does not rest with Intellectual property but with application which has definitely become a reductio ad absurdem. Non-productive drones feast off the efforts of the workers, the software writers, and squelch creativity. This is the reality and it is why anything I write is GPL. Civileme Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Windows partition won't load anymore
Actually, since I need to run Windows rarely, what I think I'll do is delete the second partition containing Win 2000 and use it for Linux. Is that easy to accomplish? Then I'll just run Windows when I need it under Virtual PC on my Mac. doug Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Windows partition won't load anymore
There is nothing wrong with being nice about it and including a warning, is there? It seems like something that might happen fairly often. doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Thursday, December 27, 2001): On Wed, 26 Dec 2001 08:12:52 -0800 (PST) Ken Nowack [EMAIL PROTECTED] studiouisly spake these words to ponder: No, the issue is that win2k/NT *has* to be on the first partition on the drive or it won't load. _thats_ been a known issue with NT forever. Most familiar with NT already know this so it's really a non-issue. However, those never having dealt with NT before and being new to Win2K very well might not know this and would likely run into this difficulty. So, I wouldn't think it would be the responsibility if the Mandrake documentation people/process to advise or inform folks that there will be problems _if_ windows isn't, in this situation, the first OS on the drive. This is a matter of knowing your current OS and it's needs and compatability issues _before_ making major changes to the existing system. -- daRcmaTTeR - If at first you don't succeed do what your wife told you to do the first time! Registered Linux User 182496 Mandrake 8.1 - 12:05pm up 10 days, 3:54, 2 users, load average: 0.09, 0.19, 0.33 Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Windows partition won't load anymore
Is there a way of removing the Windows partition and then just adding the reclaimed space to the already existing /home partition? doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Thursday, December 27, 2001): Doug Lerner wrote: Actually, since I need to run Windows rarely, what I think I'll do is delete the second partition containing Win 2000 and use it for Linux. Is that easy to accomplish? Then I'll just run Windows when I need it under Virtual PC on my Mac. doug Sounds like a plan ;-) Yep, just go to control center And choose HardwareMountPoints which will bring up diskdrake click on the winpartition, click on unmount if ti is mounted. Change the type to linux native or to XFS or whatever you prefer like ext3 or JFS or Reiser... then click format to make it whatever, then select a mount point --whatever you want to name it If for example you decide you want a separate partition for the /home directory, just make the mount point /spare and mount it then exit. then run cp -a /home/* /spare and then bring up diskdrake again, unmount /spare, change the mount point to /home and exit without mounting it still as root in a terminal rm -r /home -f mount /home will destroy the old home directory and reclaim the space and then make the new /home directory available. Civileme Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
[newbie] Using Japanese?
Is there something analagous to the Japanese Language Toolkit in MacOS that I can install so that I can read and write Japanese? Thanks, Doug Lerner, Tokyo Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Using Japanese?
I was hping to do Japanese reading and writing without installing a Japanese OS interface. Every time somebody suggests something like that I always think, Do they also suggest installing a French OS if they want to read and write email in French? :-) I didn't see anything in the installation about additional languages. Certainly nothing came up during the recommended install. Is there a way of running the installer again and adding stuff to the existing installation? Thanks, Doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Thursday, December 27, 2001): Doug Lerner wrote: Is there something analagous to the Japanese Language Toolkit in MacOS that I can install so that I can read and write Japanese? Thanks, Doug Lerner, Tokyo H well since you have one partition open where win2k was, try searching on Two Mandrake at www.mandrakeforum.com and set up a second mandrake system and choose to _install_ in Japanese. Also, the install usually permits additional languages--there is no specific kit, just additional languages that may be chosen. Civileme Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Using Japanese?
Hmm... I just read the Japanese freewnn page, and the Japanese install instructions. Two comments: * The page hasn't been updated in over two years. Is that project even active anymore? * The installation instructions end with And that is how you install the server part. Then you need to set the clients to use wnn. I'll post instructions on how to do that in a few days. But that is it. :-) doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Thursday, December 27, 2001): hi all. i'm also trying to figure out how to get japanese working on my system. the main freewnn site is at: http://www.freewnn.org/ (in japanese), but they have an english page at: http://web.kyoto-inet.or.jp/people/tomoko-y/biwa/root/wnn_e.html here are some other links that i've collected, but have yet to really go through and try: http://home.nyc.rr.com/computertaijutsu/jpninpt.html http://freekde.org/article.php?sid=5mode=nestedorder=0 http://www.asahi-net.or.jp/~wp7s-mrn/slack80.html (japanese; says slackware, but could apply to any distribution, i think) if one of you has time to try and gets it to work, please let us know! :) hope the above links help... all the best. p.s.i will try to read through the japanese dox. i've lived and worked in japan for the past 6 years at a japanese systems integration firm, and passed level 2 of the jetro business japanese exam. (currently in hometown of philly though). :) At 14:17 01/12/27 -0500, you wrote: On Thu, 27 Dec 2001 15:01:18 +0900 Doug Lerner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Is there something analagous to the Japanese Language Toolkit in MacOS that I can install so that I can read and write Japanese? Thanks, Doug Lerner, Tokyo yes there is, its called FreeWNN and i think its somewhere in the 2nd or 3rd CD (the japanese locales is in the 3rd CD). how to make it work, i still do not know. there is no accompanying docu for the rpm and the website is in japanese. im still trying to figure it out as my nihongo is not that good ( i just took JLPT level 4 and i dont know if ill pass ;-). you will also need a terminal that is unicode-aware and the installation CD has kterm but it sucks. there was an article in the mandrakeforum.com related to this but i havent really read it yet. if you have made any success ill be grateful if you could give me some pointers even if privately. domo arigato gozaimasu. -- Programming, an artform that fights back. === Anuerin G. Diaz Design Engineer 25/F Equitable-PCI Tower ADB Ave. cor. Poveda St., Ortigas Center, Pasig City, Philippines 1605 Tel no: (632) 6383070 loc 75 === Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Using Japanese?
I did find this page. A lot of steps, but maybe I'll give it a try: http://www.math.wisc.edu/~stefanss/japanese/index.html doug Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] A bit dangerous
I would actually like to figure out how make Windows *bootable* again. It doesn't seem to boot even if I choose the Windows option from the startup screen. doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Tuesday, December 25, 2001): YEs, time for a forum article This time, I thought, HOWTO make windows unbootable Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Recommended office suites?
I installed the Java runtime environment and it was easy to do and works fine. And now the Konqueror browser runs Applets too (better than IE 5.1 under OS X does, I might add, which is the only OS X browser so far to support Java). But why doesn't Mandrake Linux install the Java runtime environment to start with? Surely everybody wants to use it, right? doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Tuesday, December 25, 2001): Doug ; Try Star Office 6.0 Beta (it's a Beta but very stable!) at www.sun.com or better yet, try Openoffice at www.openoffice.org get the 641b version for Linux and/or Windows. Includes full compatibility for MS Office XP ! and it's totally FREE ! In Either case, make sure that you get a Java Runtime Environment package running before you install the office suite. You'll want j2re - 1.3.1 for either Windows or Linux. Get that at www.java.sun.com We've been using it at the office for months without a problem on 37 PC's. Lanman P.S. Merry Christmas ! On Monday 24 December 2001 12:22 pm, you wrote: What office suites do people recommend? I need to be compatible with Microsoft Office to at least *some* extent for: Spreadsheets Word Processing PowerPoint Presentations What do people think of Hancom Office at http://www.hancom.com. That package looks unbelievable for $49! How about the office stuff that is included with KDE? Kpresenter does not seem to be PowerPoint compatible, right? doug Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Recommended office suites?
What does openoffice want to know during installation about the Java runtime environment. I can't figure it out... doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Tuesday, December 25, 2001): Doug ; Try Star Office 6.0 Beta (it's a Beta but very stable!) at www.sun.com or better yet, try Openoffice at www.openoffice.org get the 641b version for Linux and/or Windows. Includes full compatibility for MS Office XP ! and it's totally FREE ! In Either case, make sure that you get a Java Runtime Environment package running before you install the office suite. You'll want j2re - 1.3.1 for either Windows or Linux. Get that at www.java.sun.com We've been using it at the office for months without a problem on 37 PC's. Lanman P.S. Merry Christmas ! On Monday 24 December 2001 12:22 pm, you wrote: What office suites do people recommend? I need to be compatible with Microsoft Office to at least *some* extent for: Spreadsheets Word Processing PowerPoint Presentations What do people think of Hancom Office at http://www.hancom.com. That package looks unbelievable for $49! How about the office stuff that is included with KDE? Kpresenter does not seem to be PowerPoint compatible, right? doug Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Recommended office suites?
Maybe if they make an exception for Netscape, another good exception would be Java... doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Tuesday, December 25, 2001): MandrakeSoft has a policy of not supplying closed-source software. In the download edition, the only exception to this rule (out of necessity) is Netscape 4. On Tue, 25 Dec 2001 18:44:09 +0900, Doug Lerner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I installed the Java runtime environment and it was easy to do and works fine. And now the Konqueror browser runs Applets too (better than IE 5.1 under OS X does, I might add, which is the only OS X browser so far to support Java). But why doesn't Mandrake Linux install the Java runtime environment to start with? Surely everybody wants to use it, right? doug -- Sridhar Dhanapalan Technically, Windows is an 'operating system,' which means that it supplies your computer with the basic commands that it needs to suddenly, with no warning whatsoever, stop operating. -- Dave Barry Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Recommended office suites?
What do people think about free vs commercial software in general? I myself don't object to commercial software. In fact, I work for a company that makes very high-quality commercial software with a great, loyal customer base. Surely there is nothing wrong with paying to have software supported and updated? doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Wednesday, December 26, 2001): MAndrakesoft is committed to free software. All the Mandrake Tools are licensed under the GNU GEneral Public License and source is available. Find another major distro that does that! Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Windows partition won't load anymore
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Wednesday, December 26, 2001): You are addressing a windows issue Win2K has its own bootloader, which will boot various windows versions. While we mormally have no problem with this, it seems to break down once a non-windows partition has been encountered in the chain. In other words, if you want it to work, dump linux, reinstall w2k to that first partition, copy over your data, then install Mandrake in the second position. This will work handily. Civileme I *strongly* suggest this be given as a warning in the installer! doug Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Open Source (was Re: [newbie] Recommended office suites? Now OT)
This is an interesting discussion. I agree with some of your points, but am not convinced by others. For example, if a company hires a dozen programmers and they spend a year creating and tweaking and debugging code, even if you think the company has no right to the *idea* (I am not convinced of that though), surely they have the right to the code itself, if they so choose? Otherwise somebody could just repackage it with much less effort and no development costs and make profit on the other company's investments. As far as $100 for an upgrade being expensive or not - I guess it depends on what the upgrade is... doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Wednesday, December 26, 2001): On Tuesday 25 December 2001 19:17, you wrote: What do people think about free vs commercial software in general? I myself don't object to commercial software. In fact, I work for a company that makes very high-quality commercial software with a great, loyal customer base. Surely there is nothing wrong with paying to have software supported and updated? doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Wednesday, December 26, 2001): MAndrakesoft is committed to free software. All the Mandrake Tools are licensed under the GNU GEneral Public License and source is available. Find another major distro that does that! Nothing wrong with it until it becomes the only game in town, or you have to update at an exorbitant fee every other year. With the open source programs you can see what's going on under the hood, tinker with it , fix it, or if your like me, break it. And you don't have to pay to reinstall it. The argument has always been that you can't make money with free software. What is software? It is a string of letters and symbols that in effect write a formula for a machine to operate from. I submit that folks have been making a comfortable living by selling their services using the formulas necessary to make air conditioning work, heating systems, internal combustion engines and on and on. All these things are based on public domain mathematics and formulas, but they are packaged and sold to people who want the benefits but don't have the time, knowledge or skills, or all three to make use of the formulas in a useful or productive manner. Intellectual content is ludicrous because, what the mind of one man can concieve of another can too. Case in point Edison and Tesla. Money and deciet won out. The more intelegent person was Tesla IMHO, but the formulas for the electron flows that were developed are used world wide and are free, and a lot of people make a living using them. Closed source is fine because it gives an edge to someone as a starter, but patent laws and copyright laws need to change, because the closed source community is willing to sue at the drop of a hat when someone comes out with a program or process that looks even remotely like what they do even though the thoughts behind the new process may be totally original to the individual presenting them. So you get a multimillion dollar company suing Joe Schmo and guess who will win, the money every time. You've stolen my property! Bah Humbug, ideas are no man's property. MandrakeSoft and some of the others are making a pretty fair run at making money on freesoftware because they are packaging it and presenting it in a manner that someone like me can relate to and finds useful, and they are not charging make me and my company officers filthy rich prices. $100 for an upgrade! Fixing something that should never have been broken in the first place! Thievery I call it. This is my own opinion and totally unsolicited by anyone, : ) -- Dennis M. registered linux user # 180842 Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
[newbie] Windows won't start - any suggestions?
This is my lilo.conf. I am not familiar with lilo. Does anybody see anything I might try before trying the more radical idea of starting over with both Windows and Linux? boot=/dev/hda map=/boot/map install=/boot/boot.b vga=normal default=linux keytable=/boot/jp106.klt lba32 prompt timeout=50 message=/boot/message menu-scheme=wb:bw:wb:bw image=/boot/vmlinuz label=linux root=/dev/hda5 append= devfs=mount read-only image=/boot/vmlinuz label=failsafe root=/dev/hda5 append= devfs=mount failsafe read-only other=/dev/hda2 label=windows table=/dev/hda Thanks, doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Tuesday, December 25, 2001): On Tuesday 25 December 2001 04:07 am, you wrote: I would actually like to figure out how make Windows *bootable* again. It doesn't seem to boot even if I choose the Windows option from the startup screen. Maybe, post your lilo.conf Also explain which drine/partition windows is on. We might see something, else its difficult to help Gerald Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Re[2]: Off topic? How things are going with Linux...
None at all? :-) doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Tuesday, December 25, 2001): Doug Lerner, Mandrake-group: Invest your $ on Apple, and your endevour/project will die under the Apple-boot. Do you know any linux hacker who works on apples ? None. [EMAIL PROTECTED] [oe§Eªnº - ï¨T®iª - NØsT?¨] Tuesday, December 25, 2001, 1:38:27 [Islas Canarias, GMT]. Doug Lerner [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió [25/12/2001, 1:18]: DL Some people say a lot of Linux people are leaving Linux for DL OS X. Have you heard anything about that? I use OS X in my DL daily work, and it is nice, but I am also interested in Linux DL for (1) less dependency on one company (Apple) and (2) cost DL (you can have lots of machines relatively inexpensively) and DL also Linux seems faster than either Windows or OS X. DL Of course the polished application base of both Mac and DL Windows is still better. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Windows won't start - any suggestions?
Hi, No - I didn't do anything special. I started out with two partitions on my hard drive. The first one contained Windows 98 and the second contained Windows 2000. I decided to keep the Win 2000 partition so I clicked on the first partition, deleted it and then pressed auto- allocate. When I did that the Mandrake installer allocated Linux partitions to the area left by the first partition. If the Installer had said something like Warning: if you want to keep Windows make sure to keep it in the first partition I would have kept the Windows 98 and deleted the Windows 2000 partition. doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Wednesday, December 26, 2001): hi, just curious, did you do something special with the way you partitioned your harddisk? your linux boot image points out to hda5 which is the first logical partition but your windows entry points out to hda2. i know that this is normal on some circumstances especially if the disk is a product of Ghost or something similar but here in the office 9 windows pc broke down due to some problem with Ghost. as i have said, this is just to satisfy my curiosity and no help is included ;-) ciao! Doug Lerner wrote: This is my lilo.conf. I am not familiar with lilo. Does anybody see anything I might try before trying the more radical idea of starting over with both Windows and Linux? boot=/dev/hda map=/boot/map install=/boot/boot.b vga=normal default=linux keytable=/boot/jp106.klt lba32 prompt timeout=50 message=/boot/message menu-scheme=wb:bw:wb:bw image=/boot/vmlinuz label=linux root=/dev/hda5 append= devfs=mount read-only image=/boot/vmlinuz label=failsafe root=/dev/hda5 append= devfs=mount failsafe read-only other=/dev/hda2 label=windows table=/dev/hda Thanks, doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Tuesday, December 25, 2001): On Tuesday 25 December 2001 04:07 am, you wrote: I would actually like to figure out how make Windows *bootable* again. It doesn't seem to boot even if I choose the Windows option from the startup screen. Maybe, post your lilo.conf Also explain which drine/partition windows is on. We might see something, else its difficult to help Gerald Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com -- Programming, an artform that fights back. = Anuerin G. Diaz Design Engineer Millennium Software, Incorporated 25/F Equitable-PCI Tower ADB Avenue cor. Poveda St. Ortigas Center, Pasig City Tel# 638-3070 loc. 72 Fax# 638-3079 = Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Windows partition won't load anymore
Well, obviously everybody in the world except for me knew that Windows will not run from the 2nd partition. I will just re-install. The Windows installation is new anyway and I have no real data that is lost. I *do* think a warning in the installer would be a good idea though! doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Wednesday, December 26, 2001): On Monday 24 December 2001 09:28, you wrote: Hmmm... Mandrake Linux 8.1 is working fine, but if I restart the machine and choose windows at the startup screen, my Windows 2000 parition won't load. Any suggestions as to what I might try? Thanks, Doug Lerner, Tokyo I had that happen a couple of times (once with NT4.0 and once with W2K). The following assumes that your W2K partition is the first one on your harddrive, and that what probably happened is that lilo was written to the drive's mbr and overwrote the winders bootloader, and that although lilo picked up on the windows installation the windows installation is refusing to boot from anything but it's own loader. If you've installed W2K on the second partition, then it ain't gonna work, Winblows loader wants to be on the first partition. Linux has no such preferences, and lilo will work from any partition. My solution has been to use the NT bootloader to load lilo, which I install on the first partiton of my linux installation. I can't be sure that is what has happened to you, but if it is, it's recoverable, but an extreme hassle involving re-installing Win from the install disks to recover the mbr, after installing lilo on the first partition dedicated to linux (NOT on a partition before W2K), and after making absolutely certain that the linux boot disk works! If you determine that is the problem, the instructions for using the NT (W2K is the same) bootloader are here: http://morse.colorado.edu/itplab/ipv6/dualboot.html And, this method is less than optimal if you use reiserfs, because if reiser goes down its journaling filesystem will recover linux, but you'll have to go through the process of redirecting the winders loader to lilo again. I don't know about ext3, but to be safe you might want to use ext2. e. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Recommended office suites?
A very interesting take on it, Civil-san. I myself hope for a good mix. The company I work for is quite decent, provides EXCELLENT support for the specialized software we sell and our customers love us and become friends. But it is expensive because it just takes a lot of time to upkeep and develop new features for, and it is not a mass-market item. So it remains proprietary. Actually, it is sort of a proprietary/open mix because the add-on scripts we provide are all open source. doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Wednesday, December 26, 2001): Doug Lerner wrote: What do people think about free vs commercial software in general? I myself don't object to commercial software. In fact, I work for a company that makes very high-quality commercial software with a great, loyal customer base. Surely there is nothing wrong with paying to have software supported and updated? doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Wednesday, December 26, 2001): MAndrakesoft is committed to free software. All the Mandrake Tools are licensed under the GNU GEneral Public License and source is available. Well, commercial software for a specific purpose is OK. We are attempting to prove that alternative business models that do not restrict technical information _are_ viable. The linux distros that follow heavily commercial models are SuSE with a proprietary installer, Caldera with per-seat licensing, and to a much smaller extent, RedHat. Debian is pretty much GPL, as is Connectiva, and I have no idea about Slackware, As for my own feeling. I could be working for more money somewhere else as a developer or system administrator. I am with Mandrakesoft instead because I think technical information belongs to the human race as a whole. There is too much potential for a corporation to keep something secret, or to buy out developments and restrict them because current technology hasn't been milked dry yet. I personally know of an engine with two moving parts, no pollution, constant torque from 0 to 1rpm, and 40 km/l kerosene and virtually no pollution. It was bought by a major manufactutrer and promptly disappeared. There are disease cures that are unprofitable to produce and so are squelched, as well. Somewhere, technically savvy people needed to take a stand and show that profit motive is not necessarily related to progress... That people also work for love of the art and an inner sense of accomplishment. As to the actions of Microsoft and its predatory practices, I find them the worst example of what is motivated by profit, something obscene and reprehensible. Civileme Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Windows partition won't load anymore
Actually, that is not true. It is not in the documentation. When I was installing I followed along with the documentation. The step in question is at: http://www.linux-mandrake.com/en/doc/81/en/user.html/ formatpartitions.html That section does not include a single word about being careful of Windows partitions. Again, I do think it is important to include (in both the documentation and the installer) at least one warning line like: Warning: Windows partitions must be in the first partition in order to boot from Linux. doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Wednesday, December 26, 2001): On Wed, 26 Dec 2001 12:50:43 +0900 Doug Lerner [EMAIL PROTECTED] studiouisly spake these words to ponder: Well, obviously everybody in the world except for me knew that Windows will not run from the 2nd partition. I will just re-install. The Windows installation is new anyway and I have no real data that is lost. I *do* think a warning in the installer would be a good idea though! it's *in* the *documentation* that you must *read* -- daRcmaTTeR - If at first you don't succeed do what your wife told you to do the first time! Registered Linux User 182496 Mandrake 8.1 - 11:05pm up 9 days, 14:54, 1 user, load average: 0.02, 0.09, 0.08 Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Off topic? How things are going with Linux...
Well, like I said it was just one thing I heard in one report. I don't know or even think it is true, if for no other reason than sheer cost! doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Wednesday, December 26, 2001): On Tue, 25 Dec 2001 10:18:12 +0900 Doug Lerner [EMAIL PROTECTED] studiouisly spake these words to ponder: Some people say a lot of Linux people are leaving Linux for OS X. Have you heard anything about that? I use OS X in my daily work, and it is nice, but I am also interested in Linux for (1) less dependency on one company (Apple) and (2) cost (you can have lots of machines relatively inexpensively) and also Linux seems faster than either Windows or OS X. Of course the polished application base of both Mac and Windows is still better. doug thats the most disgusting, vile fabrication I've ever heard. what on earth would ever cause a Linux developer to want to do something So haneously atrocious? the very thought is just plain gross! -- daRcmaTTeR - If at first you don't succeed do what your wife told you to do the first time! Registered Linux User 182496 Mandrake 8.1 - 11:05pm up 9 days, 14:54, 1 user, load average: 0.02, 0.09, 0.08 Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Install Prob: An error occurred wheninstallingpackages (followup...)
Don't you think it sounds more like an error in the Perl installer though - like a missing file reference? doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Monday, December 24, 2001): On Sun, 2001-12-23 at 19:28, Doug Lerner wrote: Followup: After unchecking the Office package option it seemed to proceed. But then the same error occurred again later on. Does the installation of packages actually work? doug Original post: While running the installer (boot floppy, CD-ROM local drive), I get an error at the step where I select and install packages. After selecting packages, the estimating time screen comes up and then an error comes up: An error occurred invalid file '' pkgs::package File() called from /usr/bin/perl-install/pkgs.pm:1331 pkgs::install() called from /usr/bin/per-install/install_steps.pm:371 [a bunch of more lines along this vein...] install2:main() called from /usr/bin/runinstall2:29 Then an [ok] button appears. After clicking that I am back at the package selection screen. What should I do to proceed? Thanks, Doug Lerner, Tokyo This suggests a hardware problem. If it is happening on one system and not another, then check the CD drives. If it happens on many systems, it is likely the burner. Other culprits are memory (make a floppy from /images/memtest-x86.bin just the way you would make a boot floppy then boot from it for a really thorough memory chack) and sometimes the receiving hard disk (most notably WD drives run at more than 33MHz). Windows will not show these problems, particularly the memory problem since it occupies the lower and only a little of the upper section of memory and rarely when a leak occurs, the rest of the memory and linux occupies all the memory it can, because the designers are of the belief that ubused memory is wasted. Civileme =_1009168129-11608-1339 Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Unable to install: Kernel Panic
The spec sheet for the HP Pavilion 2000 says the video is an integrated graphic controller, so I guess that is something on board. When does the initializing ram disk process take place? Unfortunately a different CD reader is not an option. I don't think it will boot, for example, from an external USB CD-RW. doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Monday, December 24, 2001): does if motherboard have on-board video? try specifying say 8 megs less ram. do you get to the point of initializing ram disk? maybe a different cd reader is the answer? On Sunday 23 December 2001 22:55, you wrote: This is a re-post because I have new information now: I am able to run the installer on my old Mint Pentium 133MHz 96MB machine. So the ISO-image I downloaded and the CD-ROM I burned are not the problem. Any ideas? Is my HP just incompatible? (;_;) Thanks! p.s. The installer looks much nicer than the RedHat installer. :-) Original note: Hi. I just downloaded the install ISO image for Mandrake 8.1 and burned a CD-ROM from it. Then I restarted my computer and the Mandrake installation program started up. I pressed Enter and after a bunch of lines on the screen the process stopped with the following error message: 0Kernel panic: Attempted to kill init! I tried this again, pressing F1 instead of Enter and choosing various other installations, such as vgalo. But they all resulted in the same error. Does this mean my hardware is just not supported? It is an HP (Hewlett-Packard) Pavilion 2000, Celeron 400 MHz, 192 MB RAM. Thanks, Doug Lerner, Tokyo Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Install Prob: An error occurred wheninstallingpackages (followup...)
I like to eliminate the simplest possibilities first. :-) Since the Perl error message said missing file it seemed reasonable to ask if, perhaps, there simply was a missing file. Trying another CD drive is not really possible. My computer needs to boot from the internal one. It won't boot from an external USB drive. Also, that drive successfully installed Redhat Linux this morning on the same computer, so I really do think it is reasonable not to suspect the drive first, don't you? How do I check the md5sums? doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Monday, December 24, 2001): On Monday 24 December 2001 07:31 am, you wrote: Don't you think it sounds more like an error in the Perl installer though - like a missing file reference? doug No, unless you have a bad download or burn. Try redownloading from different mirror, check the md5sums, and reburn it slow on quality medium. If worse comes to worse, try another cd drive. All this has been suggested I think, but you seem to have missed it. You need to eliminate this doubt first. -s Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Unable to install: Kernel Panic
My computer has 192 MB of RAM, so I'll subtract 11MB from that and try linux mem=181M and see what happens! pause to try Ooooh! It is working! That is, the installer is loading! Great advice, Civileme! I will try the installer program now and will report back on the results. Thank you! Doug Lerner, Tokyo [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Monday, December 24, 2001): On Mon, 2001-12-24 at 04:35, Doug Lerner wrote: The spec sheet for the HP Pavilion 2000 says the video is an integrated graphic controller, so I guess that is something on board. When does the initializing ram disk process take place? Unfortunately a different CD reader is not an option. I don't think it will boot, for example, from an external USB CD-RW. doug OK I have seen something like this before with the eboxit. ZTry this: F1 at splash screen linux mem=53M at the input prompt, or if you have 128M of memory then linux mem=117M It appears that this has shared video memory and ther BIOS may be handing the linux kernel a bad memory map so that the screen writing is overwriting the kernel stack. Civileme Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
[newbie] A bit dangerous?
I am installing Mandrake 8.1 now on my HP Pavilion. I still don't know if it will be successful or not, but the installer seems to be happily installing all the packages. I started with two partitions on my hard drive: one for Windows 98 and one for Windows 2000. I decided I could get along with just the Windows 2000 partition and so at the partitioning stage I clicked on the Windows 98 partition, selected delete and then auto-allocate. Auto-allocate used the deleted Windows 98 partition and created linux, home and swap partitions instead. Then it went on to select and install packages, which it is doing now. All this without any warnings at all! You would think that before an entire partition was deleted you would get warnings like This will delete all the data on this entire partition. Are you sure you want to do this? But there was none of that. I was surprised. I would recommend inserting such a warning step into the procedure. doug Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Unable to install: Kernel Panic
Wow! It worked! After getting this piece of critical advice from you Civileme, the installer worked just fine! It is true that in under 30 minutes you can install a working system. Really great points: * Mandrake Linux found with no fuss at all my sort of non-standard USB ethernet connection. Internet connectivity, which is usually a hassle, was no trouble at all. * Even my Japanese keyboard's mapping (usually another hassle) was fine right from the start. * Same with the network time synchronization. So I have to say after using it for 10 minutes I am pleased. The KDE initialization dialog has a problem though. Apparently Mandrake Linux would like to collect info from people, but the keyboard does not seem to work in any of those initialization forms. I just had to cancel out of them. After that the keyboard worked. I don't know why it doesn't work on the older Mint machine (other email I posted). Thanks again everybody for all your suggestions and help! Doug Lerner, Tokyo p.s. Now on to figure out how to use Japanese on the system... [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Monday, December 24, 2001): On Mon, 2001-12-24 at 04:35, Doug Lerner wrote: The spec sheet for the HP Pavilion 2000 says the video is an integrated graphic controller, so I guess that is something on board. When does the initializing ram disk process take place? Unfortunately a different CD reader is not an option. I don't think it will boot, for example, from an external USB CD-RW. doug OK I have seen something like this before with the eboxit. ZTry this: F1 at splash screen linux mem=53M at the input prompt, or if you have 128M of memory then linux mem=117M It appears that this has shared video memory and ther BIOS may be handing the linux kernel a bad memory map so that the screen writing is overwriting the kernel stack. Civileme Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
[newbie] Windows partition won't load anymore
Hmmm... Mandrake Linux 8.1 is working fine, but if I restart the machine and choose windows at the startup screen, my Windows 2000 parition won't load. Any suggestions as to what I might try? Thanks, Doug Lerner, Tokyo Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Windows partition won't load anymore
I went to Control Center Boot Boot Config, but Windows was already there. Clicking on Modify for that entry didn't really seem to indicate anything wrong - it was still specified as being on the second partition, which is where it is... doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Tuesday, December 25, 2001): On Monday 24 December 2001 12:28, you wrote: Hmmm... Mandrake Linux 8.1 is working fine, but if I restart the machine and choose windows at the startup screen, my Windows 2000 parition won't load. Any suggestions as to what I might try? Thanks, Doug Lerner, Tokyo I think you just need to give the lilo a little more help. Go into the Mandrake Control Center, (icon on the KDE Desktop or the start button K configurationotherMandrake Control Center. Give your root password, Then click on the + sign on Boot then boot config. Check the screen over to familiarize yourself with what is there, and then click on the box in the upper right that says configure. It will pop up a screen with the boot loader choice you saw at install, click ok, then in the next screen click on add and you will have a choice of linux or windows, choosing windows takes you into the setup screen for your windows stuff and from there it should be self explanatory. HTH -- Dennis M. registered linux user # 180842 Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Off topic? How things are going with Linux...
Some people say a lot of Linux people are leaving Linux for OS X. Have you heard anything about that? I use OS X in my daily work, and it is nice, but I am also interested in Linux for (1) less dependency on one company (Apple) and (2) cost (you can have lots of machines relatively inexpensively) and also Linux seems faster than either Windows or OS X. Of course the polished application base of both Mac and Windows is still better. doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Tuesday, December 25, 2001): On Monday 24 December 2001 12:47, you wrote: On Monday 24 December 2001 11:13 am, you wrote: Now that I found a nice OS and a nice group of people to talk about technical issues in Mandrake Linux I am wondering - how is the market share of Linux coming along? Growing? Is OS X having good/bad effects on Linux? doug Well, it took a nose dive a while back, but it bounced back up to bout where it was when it was first offered. But I kinda expect it to start going up now. Didn't you hear about the ibm deal? -s Actually the market share is increasing and I expect it to hit a critical mass and really take off, but for now it seems to be encroaching more on the unix shares than the Microsoft or Apple shares. Time will tell, especially with the M$ fee structure and the way the software is making a lot of folks unhappy. Just my $.02, -- Dennis M. registered linux user # 180842 Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Recommended office suites?
Thanks, Lanman. I will try that out. And thanks for the hint about the Java Runtime Environment. I tried to access a web page in Konqueror that had an applet on it and was surprised to see that Java was not part of the standard install. It would be nice if it was! (One less stumbling block for people.) doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Tuesday, December 25, 2001): Doug ; Try Star Office 6.0 Beta (it's a Beta but very stable!) at www.sun.com or better yet, try Openoffice at www.openoffice.org get the 641b version for Linux and/or Windows. Includes full compatibility for MS Office XP ! and it's totally FREE ! In Either case, make sure that you get a Java Runtime Environment package running before you install the office suite. You'll want j2re - 1.3.1 for either Windows or Linux. Get that at www.java.sun.com We've been using it at the office for months without a problem on 37 PC's. Lanman P.S. Merry Christmas ! On Monday 24 December 2001 12:22 pm, you wrote: What office suites do people recommend? I need to be compatible with Microsoft Office to at least *some* extent for: Spreadsheets Word Processing PowerPoint Presentations What do people think of Hancom Office at http://www.hancom.com. That package looks unbelievable for $49! How about the office stuff that is included with KDE? Kpresenter does not seem to be PowerPoint compatible, right? doug Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Recommended office suites?
Thanks, Steven. Well, everybody seems quite psyched abotu OpenOffice and StarOffice. I will give those a try. Nobody seems to mention Hancom Office. Has anybody tried them? Of course free is nice, but I am not a fanatic about not purchasing software - particularly if it is nice. I think the success of Linux will depend on people being able to support themselves by developing it, and developing applications for it. Of course I am speaking as somebody who works for a company that makes software that runs on Linux, Mac and Windows. :-) doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Tuesday, December 25, 2001): On Tue, Dec 25, 2001 at 02:22:58AM +0900, Doug Lerner wrote: What office suites do people recommend? I need to be compatible with Microsoft Office to at least *some* extent for: Spreadsheets Word Processing PowerPoint Presentations What do people think of Hancom Office at http://www.hancom.com. That package looks unbelievable for $49! How about the office stuff that is included with KDE? Kpresenter does not seem to be PowerPoint compatible, right? Doug, congrats on the successful install. I've used MacOS for years and also use MacOS X. However I've been drifting away from Apple the last few years as I don't particularly like their way of doing things. As far as I'm concerned they're not much different than M$ and would love to be in M$ position marketwise. Properietary OS'es suck wind! Anyway, in terms of office suites for Linux there are several. Abisuite, KOffice, OpenOffice and StarOffice. The latter two are from Sun and IMHO both put M$ Office in it's place and...the price is damn good - free. I installed the latest OpenOffice binary this past weekend. I'm impressed - I've been using StarOffice v 5.x previously. In case you haven't heard of it, let me introduce you to www.freshmeat.net Linux's version of VersionTracker. To find the apps I mentioned, go there and use the search facility. Merry Christmas! -- Cheers, Stephen Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] A bit dangerous?
Not really. But then again Mac OS 9 does the same thing. You can click on any partition on the Desktop and then choose Initialize from the Special Menu and without a single word or warning the partition is initialized! doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Tuesday, December 25, 2001): On Tue, 25 Dec 2001, Doug Lerner wrote: Maybe a warning dialog first like: This will delete your entire partition and all your data will be lost. OK? Call me crazy, but if I accidently hit the wrong button I would like at least one chance to take something like that back. :-) I think you actually still can at that point - just so long as you haven't actually hit Done. And when you do this, you get a pop-up saying that it's going to write new partitioning scheme to disk. So, there you go. Feel a little more secure now? ;-) doug [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Tuesday, December 25, 2001): On Monday 24 December 2001 16:58, you wrote: I started with two partitions on my hard drive: one for Windows 98 and one for Windows 2000. I decided I could get along with just the Windows 2000 partition and so at the partitioning stage I clicked on the Windows 98 partition, selected delete and then auto-allocate. What exactly do you expect will happen when you select an option called delete? Maybe ... that that particular partition will be deleted? -- Michel Clasquin, D Litt et Phil (Unisa) [EMAIL PROTECTED]/unisa.ac.za http://www.geocities.com/clasqm This message was posted from a Microsoft-free PC f u cn rd ths, u cn gt a gd jb n nx dmnstrtn Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Unable to install: Kernel Panic
Hi. Thanks for the reply. I believe the ISO is good, and the CD-ROM was verified after the burn. Have you heard of other HP Pavilion 2000's running Mandrake Linux? It isn't on the Mandrake hardware list. Any other suggestions? Thanks! Doug Lerner, Tokyo [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Monday, December 24, 2001): On Saturday 22 December 2001 20:47, you wrote: Hi. I just downloaded the install ISO image for Mandrake 8.1 and burned a CD-ROM from it. Then I restarted my computer and the Mandrake installation program started up. I pressed Enter and after a bunch of lines on the screen the process stopped with the following error message: 0Kernel panic: Attempted to kill init! I tried this again, pressing F1 instead of Enter and choosing various other installations, such as vgalo. But they all resulted in the same error. Does this mean my hardware is just not supported? It is an HP (Hewlett-Packard) Pavilion 2000, Celeron 400 MHz, 192 MB RAM. Thanks, Doug Lerner, Tokyo Should not be a problem. From what I have seen on the mail list. Are you sure you have a clean download of the iso's by using checksums? It sounds like the install CD is not good. If you burn a new one, burn it at a slow speed like 2x. HTH -- Dennis M. registered linux user # 180842 Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Unable to install: Kernel Panic
I tried the 'linux nobiospn' option also, and it is the same problem: Kernel panic! Attempted to kill init!. It seems the process starts up and goes through more than a screen of startup stuff, then it freezes there. I am going to try and install it on an ancient Mint Pentium 200MHz computer I have here with 92MB RAM and see if that works. If it does it will confirm that the CD-ROM is ok and that there is some incompatibility with Mandrake Linux on my HP. This HP is a real cheap system ($389 new at Yodobashi Camera) and is sort of a minimal system: 400MHz Celeron, 4GB HD, 192MB RAM and a USB network connection. doug p.s. Aside: In order to install on the old Mint I first have to install a Redhat Linux I have here because the Mint doesn't boot from a CD-ROM and I happen to have a Redhat boot floppy lying around. And my HP, which also has Windows installed, doesn't include a floppy. So I am creating a Redhat Linux system first just to create a boot floppy for Mandrake! [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Monday, December 24, 2001): On Sunday 23 December 2001 18:01, you wrote: Hi. Thanks for the reply. I believe the ISO is good, and the CD-ROM was verified after the burn. Have you heard of other HP Pavilion 2000's running Mandrake Linux? It isn't on the Mandrake hardware list. Any other suggestions? Thanks! Doug Lerner, Tokyo [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Monday, December 24, 2001): On Saturday 22 December 2001 20:47, you wrote: Hi. I just downloaded the install ISO image for Mandrake 8.1 and burned a CD-ROM from it. Then I restarted my computer and the Mandrake installation program started up. I pressed Enter and after a bunch of lines on the screen the process stopped with the following error message: 0Kernel panic: Attempted to kill init! I tried this again, pressing F1 instead of Enter and choosing various other installations, such as vgalo. But they all resulted in the same error. Does this mean my hardware is just not supported? It is an HP (Hewlett-Packard) Pavilion 2000, Celeron 400 MHz, 192 MB RAM. Thanks, Doug Lerner, Tokyo Should not be a problem. From what I have seen on the mail list. Are you sure you have a clean download of the iso's by using checksums? It sounds like the install CD is not good. If you burn a new one, burn it at a slow speed like 2x. HTH No, I have not seen any complaints about the HP pavillion either, which is what leads me to believe that it should be ok. Also HP seems to support linux insofar as printers and other periferals are concerned. Drivers are available for their printers and cameras so unless they have a really weird bunch of hardware you should be ok. Have you turned the plugnplay off in the bios? Not familiar with the bios in a HP but if there is a line that says Plug and Play OS - yes or no try it with no or off. HTH -- Dennis M. registered linux user # 180842 Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
[newbie] Unable to install: Kernel Panic
This is a re-post because I have new information now: I am able to run the installer on my old Mint Pentium 133MHz 96MB machine. So the ISO-image I downloaded and the CD-ROM I burned are not the problem. Any ideas? Is my HP just incompatible? (;_;) Thanks! p.s. The installer looks much nicer than the RedHat installer. :-) Original note: Hi. I just downloaded the install ISO image for Mandrake 8.1 and burned a CD-ROM from it. Then I restarted my computer and the Mandrake installation program started up. I pressed Enter and after a bunch of lines on the screen the process stopped with the following error message: 0Kernel panic: Attempted to kill init! I tried this again, pressing F1 instead of Enter and choosing various other installations, such as vgalo. But they all resulted in the same error. Does this mean my hardware is just not supported? It is an HP (Hewlett-Packard) Pavilion 2000, Celeron 400 MHz, 192 MB RAM. Thanks, Doug Lerner, Tokyo Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
[newbie] Install Prob: An error occurred when installing packages
While running the installer (boot floppy, CD-ROM local drive), I get an error at the step where I select and install packages. After selecting packages, the estimating time screen comes up and then an error comes up: An error occurred invalid file '' pkgs::package File() called from /usr/bin/perl-install/pkgs.pm:1331 pkgs::install() called from /usr/bin/per-install/install_steps.pm:371 [a bunch of more lines along this vein...] install2:main() called from /usr/bin/runinstall2:29 Then an [ok] button appears. After clicking that I am back at the package selection screen. What should I do to proceed? Thanks, Doug Lerner, Tokyo Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
[newbie] Install Prob: An error occurred when installing packages(followup...)
Followup: After unchecking the Office package option it seemed to proceed. But then the same error occurred again later on. Does the installation of packages actually work? doug Original post: While running the installer (boot floppy, CD-ROM local drive), I get an error at the step where I select and install packages. After selecting packages, the estimating time screen comes up and then an error comes up: An error occurred invalid file '' pkgs::package File() called from /usr/bin/perl-install/pkgs.pm:1331 pkgs::install() called from /usr/bin/per-install/install_steps.pm:371 [a bunch of more lines along this vein...] install2:main() called from /usr/bin/runinstall2:29 Then an [ok] button appears. After clicking that I am back at the package selection screen. What should I do to proceed? Thanks, Doug Lerner, Tokyo Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
[newbie] Does the installer really work?
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Monday, December 24, 2001): I tried the 'linux nobiospn' option also, and it is the same problem: Kernel panic! Attempted to kill init!. It seems the process starts up and goes through more than a screen of startup stuff, then it freezes there. I am going to try and install it on an ancient Mint Pentium 200MHz computer I have here with 92MB RAM and see if that works. If it does it will confirm that the CD-ROM is ok and that there is some incompatibility with Mandrake Linux on my HP. This HP is a real cheap system ($389 new at Yodobashi Camera) and is sort of a minimal system: 400MHz Celeron, 4GB HD, 192MB RAM and a USB network connection. doug p.s. Aside: In order to install on the old Mint I first have to install a Redhat Linux I have here because the Mint doesn't boot from a CD-ROM and I happen to have a Redhat boot floppy lying around. And my HP, which also has Windows installed, doesn't include a floppy. So I am creating a Redhat Linux system first just to create a boot floppy for Mandrake! [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Monday, December 24, 2001): On Sunday 23 December 2001 18:01, you wrote: Hi. Thanks for the reply. I believe the ISO is good, and the CD-ROM was verified after the burn. Have you heard of other HP Pavilion 2000's running Mandrake Linux? It isn't on the Mandrake hardware list. Any other suggestions? Thanks! Doug Lerner, Tokyo [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Monday, December 24, 2001): On Saturday 22 December 2001 20:47, you wrote: Hi. I just downloaded the install ISO image for Mandrake 8.1 and burned a CD-ROM from it. Then I restarted my computer and the Mandrake installation program started up. I pressed Enter and after a bunch of lines on the screen the process stopped with the following error message: 0Kernel panic: Attempted to kill init! I tried this again, pressing F1 instead of Enter and choosing various other installations, such as vgalo. But they all resulted in the same error. Does this mean my hardware is just not supported? It is an HP (Hewlett-Packard) Pavilion 2000, Celeron 400 MHz, 192 MB RAM. Thanks, Doug Lerner, Tokyo Should not be a problem. From what I have seen on the mail list. Are you sure you have a clean download of the iso's by using checksums? It sounds like the install CD is not good. If you burn a new one, burn it at a slow speed like 2x. HTH No, I have not seen any complaints about the HP pavillion either, which is what leads me to believe that it should be ok. Also HP seems to support linux insofar as printers and other periferals are concerned. Drivers are available for their printers and cameras so unless they have a really weird bunch of hardware you should be ok. Have you turned the plugnplay off in the bios? Not familiar with the bios in a HP but if there is a line that says Plug and Play OS - yes or no try it with no or off. HTH -- Dennis M. registered linux user # 180842 Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Unable to install: Kernel Panic
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Monday, December 24, 2001): On Sun, 2001-12-23 at 14:01, Doug Lerner wrote: Hi. Thanks for the reply. I believe the ISO is good, and the CD-ROM was verified after the burn. Have you heard of other HP Pavilion 2000's running Mandrake Linux? It isn't on the Mandrake hardware list. Any other suggestions? Thanks! Doug Lerner, Tokyo [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Monday, December 24, 2001): On Saturday 22 December 2001 20:47, you wrote: Hi. I just downloaded the install ISO image for Mandrake 8.1 and burned a CD-ROM from it. Then I restarted my computer and the Mandrake installation program started up. I pressed Enter and after a bunch of lines on the screen the process stopped with the following error message: 0Kernel panic: Attempted to kill init! I tried this again, pressing F1 instead of Enter and choosing various other installations, such as vgalo. But they all resulted in the same error. Does this mean my hardware is just not supported? It is an HP (Hewlett-Packard) Pavilion 2000, Celeron 400 MHz, 192 MB RAM. Thanks, Doug Lerner, Tokyo Should not be a problem. From what I have seen on the mail list. Are you sure you have a clean download of the iso's by using checksums? It sounds like the install CD is not good. If you burn a new one, burn it at a slow speed like 2x. HTH -- Dennis M. registered linux user # 180842 Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com The Pavilion will run it just fine. ...But you might try F1 at the splash screen and 'linux noauto' without the quotes at the input prompt. If that doesn't work, boot from CD#2 and use an alternate install image. AFAIK, the Pavilions all run ... HP is one of the vendors offering Mandrake bundled with some of its models. Besides, you missed the point of their questioning the CD--it isn't a burn error necessarily, it may be that your CD drive has worn sleeve bearings causing enough eccentricity to misread burned CD-Rs (CDRWs are five or more times as sensitive to this), but if you did not verify that the md5sum of the images you received matched the md5sum at the site that sent it, you may have had a transmission problem. These are more common than we like, but then the mirrors are not on Mandrake servers buyt rather generously volunteered by others. Civileme Thannks for your reply! As you probably saw in my followup notes, the CD- ROM does appear to be fine. That is, at least it boots and runs the Installer program on one other Intel machine I had lying around here. So the problem in booting up and running the installer does not appear to be the CD-ROM. I will try the linux noauto option. pause to try Same kernel panic: attempted to kill init! error. I guess I need to download CD#2 and try that. After I confirm that it works I will buy a complete package. Thanks for your help, Doug Lerner, Tokyo Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
[newbie] Unable to install: Kernel Panic
Hi. I just downloaded the install ISO image for Mandrake 8.1 and burned a CD-ROM from it. Then I restarted my computer and the Mandrake installation program started up. I pressed Enter and after a bunch of lines on the screen the process stopped with the following error message: 0Kernel panic: Attempted to kill init! I tried this again, pressing F1 instead of Enter and choosing various other installations, such as vgalo. But they all resulted in the same error. Does this mean my hardware is just not supported? It is an HP (Hewlett-Packard) Pavilion 2000, Celeron 400 MHz, 192 MB RAM. Thanks, Doug Lerner, Tokyo Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
