Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
On Friday 24 May 2002 12:18 am, civileme opened a general hailing frequency and transmitted to all open stations: Well, Brian it was all over the internet news, including the Register, August 1999. And you can still find the story at www.cryptonym.com where they exvaluated the security danger from it as nothing abnormal, since the only reason the NSA would want such a key is to save a little time. and ashcroft is actively fighting to get a backdoor put into rsa encryption. check what the aclu has to say about tech sometime. -- Give me ambiguity or give me something else. dang it! I like ashcroft, but that really knots my shorts! Mark Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
Brian Koppe wrote: Lyvim Xaphir wrote: snip Ummm, Miark, in august 1999, cryptonym corporation was examining a Service pack release of NT4 from which microsoft had inadvertantly forgotten to strip the data tags. Civileme snip Since the NSA is able to spy on citizens by virtue of the NSA backdoor so thoughtfully provided by M$, would this not be an excellent reason for the government to maintain an ongoing business relationship with M$? snip LX Do either of you have sources to back this up? Thanks Brian Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Well, Brian it was all over the internet news, including the Register, August 1999. And you can still find the story at www.cryptonym.com where they exvaluated the security danger from it as nothing abnormal, since the only reason the NSA would want such a key is to save a little time. Civileme Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
On Friday 24 May 2002 12:18 am, civileme opened a general hailing frequency and transmitted to all open stations: Well, Brian it was all over the internet news, including the Register, August 1999. And you can still find the story at www.cryptonym.com where they exvaluated the security danger from it as nothing abnormal, since the only reason the NSA would want such a key is to save a little time. and ashcroft is actively fighting to get a backdoor put into rsa encryption. check what the aclu has to say about tech sometime. -- Give me ambiguity or give me something else. shane Profile at: http://dmoz.org/profiles/shen.html Proud to be a DMOZ editor since 10-98 Mandrake Users Club Member http://www.linux-mandrake.com/en/club/ Registered linux user #101606 http://counter.li.org/ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
RE: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
the url to cryptonym intentionally left blank. Security is an pet area of interest to me, where have you gotten the info on what Ashcroft is doing? -Original Message- From: shane [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 7:38 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$ On Friday 24 May 2002 12:18 am, civileme opened a general hailing frequency and transmitted to all open stations: Well, Brian it was all over the internet news, including the Register, August 1999. And you can still find the story at www.cryptonym.com where they exvaluated the security danger from it as nothing abnormal, since the only reason the NSA would want such a key is to save a little time. and ashcroft is actively fighting to get a backdoor put into rsa encryption. check what the aclu has to say about tech sometime. -- Give me ambiguity or give me something else. shane Profile at: http://dmoz.org/profiles/shen.html Proud to be a DMOZ editor since 10-98 Mandrake Users Club Member http://www.linux-mandrake.com/en/club/ Registered linux user #101606 @ http://counter.li.org/ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
On Friday 24 May 2002 10:44 am, Schwenk, Jeanie opened a general hailing frequency and transmitted to all open stations: the url to cryptonym intentionally left blank. Security is an pet area of interest to me, where have you gotten the info on what Ashcroft is doing? there was a bit on the aclu website, under cyber-liberties. right now i mostly see censorship stuff there though. if i recall he hadn't actually introd a bill or anything, just speaches to congress. again if i recall it was along with a senetor judd greg, and was early october. what i do not know is if the we can force your isp to give us everything they know bill went through. amazing how they skip stuff that matters in the news the patriot act and usa act were they? i imagine the backdoor (they called it key escrow i think) would be step 2. sorry i didn't save more of it. -- Computers are like air conditioners they stop working properly if you open windows. shane Profile at: http://dmoz.org/profiles/shen.html Proud to be a DMOZ editor since 10-98 Mandrake Users Club Member http://www.linux-mandrake.com/en/club/ Registered linux user #101606 http://counter.li.org/ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
Lyvim Xaphir wrote: snip Ummm, Miark, in august 1999, cryptonym corporation was examining a Service pack release of NT4 from which microsoft had inadvertantly forgotten to strip the data tags. Civileme snip Since the NSA is able to spy on citizens by virtue of the NSA backdoor so thoughtfully provided by M$, would this not be an excellent reason for the government to maintain an ongoing business relationship with M$? snip LX Do either of you have sources to back this up? Thanks Brian Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
On Saturday 18 May 2002 02:07 am, you wrote: On Fri, 2002-05-17 at 20:50, Carroll Grigsby wrote: Actually, Derek, it's worse than that. From what I've been reading at www.theregister.co.uk, it seems that the UK government is setting up their web sites so that you will not be able to access them unless you are using MicroSoft products. AFAIK, that is not a requirement here. Yet. (Question: Do the UK versions of MS software packages carry Royal Appointment logos like the ones on Bass Ale?) In light of the foregoing discussions on this thread, I hereby nominate that Peruvian senator to be Supreme High Mucky Muck of the Whole World. He's the first politician to show an in-depth understanding of what MS is trying to do. Seconds? -- cmg You've got a wholehearted second here, Dr Grigsby. Wonder what the climate is like in Peru? This may not be totally tongue in cheek. LX Well, for one thing, in much of Peru, the climate is oxygen-deficient as a result of the surplus of altitude. Lake Titicaca is at something like 12,500 feet above sea level. Certainly a great place for archeologists, but probably not much for Linux programmers. (Long-time smokers need not apply). I've been watching a series on Cablevision by an NCSU professor of archeology about the Inca civilization and all of the history that came before them. It's truly amazing stuff. I am not only fascinated by the history and accomplishments of the people, but also his explanations of how archeologists do what they do. (Hmmm... maybe he might be able to unravel all of this stuff on my desk.) -- cmg Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
On Fri, 2002-05-17 at 20:50, Carroll Grigsby wrote: Actually, Derek, it's worse than that. From what I've been reading at www.theregister.co.uk, it seems that the UK government is setting up their web sites so that you will not be able to access them unless you are using MicroSoft products. AFAIK, that is not a requirement here. Yet. (Question: Do the UK versions of MS software packages carry Royal Appointment logos like the ones on Bass Ale?) In light of the foregoing discussions on this thread, I hereby nominate that Peruvian senator to be Supreme High Mucky Muck of the Whole World. He's the first politician to show an in-depth understanding of what MS is trying to do. Seconds? -- cmg You've got a wholehearted second here, Dr Grigsby. Wonder what the climate is like in Peru? This may not be totally tongue in cheek. LX -- °°° Kernel 2.4.8-26mdk Mandrake Linux 8.1 Enlightenment 0.16.5Evolution 1.02 Registered Linux User #268899 http://counter.li.org/ °°° Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
On Fri, 2002-05-17 at 16:47, Kaj Haulrich wrote: Lyvim, I can assure you that the danish government is no better, if that can comfort you. It is owned by Micro$oft. However, let's not get too depressed. By and by things seems to develop : In France there's a strong movement towards open-source, i.e. the french government has proposed just that to the European Union. We'll see In Germany, the parliament (Bundestag) recently moved from Bonn to Berlin. The new building (in fact : the old one) needed an IT-system, so the parliament initiated a feasability-study : Micro$oft / Open Source. We'll see... In Norway (who somehow always seems a little smarter than Denmark) Linux has a good stronghold : think of Qt (TrollTech) and Opera. Both are commercial companies that Micro$oft hasn't been able to crush. Yet ...? And don't forget : corporations mightier than any nation-state use Linux (Shell, BP, General Motors, Toyota etc.. etc...). Cheers ! Kaj Haulrich Denmark Very heartening, Kaj; your presence is needed here. :) Thanks for the other perspective; I have got so many channels of information coming in here regarding the IT-politico scene that I get overburdened with it sometimes; I'll try to lessen that tendency. One thing that helped in that regard today was going to see Star Wars Episode 2 with my brother. Man, what a blast! I have to say...better than Spidey. The icing on the cake was the Matrix Reloaded preview. L8R! :) LX -- °°° Kernel 2.4.8-26mdk Mandrake Linux 8.1 Enlightenment 0.16.5Evolution 1.02 Registered Linux User #268899 http://counter.li.org/ °°° Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
On Fri, 2002-05-17 at 21:17, Sridhar Dhanapalan wrote: Tony has been sucking up to Microsoft for a while now. The last time Bill Gates visited, he was treated like royalty, and Tony was even at the product launch of Office XP as part of his election campaign. Apparently, the gateway.gov.uk site, which is part of the e-government initiative to put all government services online, is fully _owned_ by Microsoft, intellectual property and all. When it was first set up, all users of 'alternative' (read: non-IE) browsers were locked out, and it took heavy complaining to change it. After the site was set up, MS released an advertisement featuring the government people behind the project (including an MP or two), who said things like I will always use Microsoft. Not that the Australian government is much better. Prime Minister John Howard bent over backwards to meet with Bill Gates the last time he was here, yet he totally ignored Scott McNealy and Larry Ellison when they visited. -- Sridhar Dhanapalan Very interesting information. Depressing, but interesting. Thanks, Srid! LX -- °°° Kernel 2.4.8-26mdk Mandrake Linux 8.1 Enlightenment 0.16.5Evolution 1.02 Registered Linux User #268899 http://counter.li.org/ °°° Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
On Thu, 2002-05-16 at 20:20, FemmeFatale wrote: Lyvim Xaphir wrote: The government taxes the individuals, while it's buddy MicroSh*t provides a spy conduit by which the government can track individuals that don't like the taxes, while MicroSh*t taxes the individuals, while the government provides unofficial protection for Microshaft. It's a sweetheart deal, boys. HTH, LX : Don't necessarily agree with you however before you criticize your gov't anymore take a look at this and the Hacker link at the end of the article: http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/05/15/eveningnews/main509140.shtml -- Femme Good Decisions You boss Made: Aw, Femmeyou do care, after all. ;) (sniff..) LX -- °°° Kernel 2.4.8-26mdk Mandrake Linux 8.1 Enlightenment 0.16.5Evolution 1.02 Registered Linux User #268899 http://counter.li.org/ °°° Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
RE: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
Lets be honest here, pollies rairly do anything thats not designed to make them look good in the majorities eyes.. sad statement of fact, but nontheless true.. Billybob gates is world known and as far as the pollies known, in a good way. (after all, what do pollies know?) as the one of the 'true' success stories of this century.. so they think it makes good sense to be seen rubbing sholders with him.. (I'd be worried about catching something :-) sad but true.. since open source tends to have lots of people who are known within for great things, they are none known as well as billy by the general public,, even linus himself wouldn't be as well known by a good majority.. but he 'might' get a pm visit if he dropped in.. just because he has much more public profile then say 'larry wall' or one of the other legends. But, if Microsnot start losing polularity or the are publically condemned and prosecuted by the US government (successfully) is possible that billys popularity might change to something else.. I read that its quiet possibly that M$'s tactics with stock option could end up seriously damaging the US economy.. if that happens, (and it probably won't because the government would help them out mostly to keep it quiet as it reveals alot about their own stupidity for allowing it to go on for so long.)as well as the economy probs themself.. but IF it happens, being seen with gatey might be a death knoll for a pollie wouldn't that be great??? just a rave :-) regards Frank -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Lyvim Xaphir Sent: Saturday, 18 May 2002 2:19 PM To: NewbieMandrake-List Subject: Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$ On Fri, 2002-05-17 at 21:17, Sridhar Dhanapalan wrote: Tony has been sucking up to Microsoft for a while now. The last time Bill Gates visited, he was treated like royalty, and Tony was even at the product launch of Office XP as part of his election campaign. Apparently, the gateway.gov.uk site, which is part of the e-government initiative to put all government services online, is fully _owned_ by Microsoft, intellectual property and all. When it was first set up, all users of 'alternative' (read: non-IE) browsers were locked out, and it took heavy complaining to change it. After the site was set up, MS released an advertisement featuring the government people behind the project (including an MP or two), who said things like I will always use Microsoft. Not that the Australian government is much better. Prime Minister John Howard bent over backwards to meet with Bill Gates the last time he was here, yet he totally ignored Scott McNealy and Larry Ellison when they visited. -- Sridhar Dhanapalan Very interesting information. Depressing, but interesting. Thanks, Srid! LX -- °°° Kernel 2.4.8-26mdk Mandrake Linux 8.1 Enlightenment 0.16.5Evolution 1.02 Registered Linux User #268899 http://counter.li.org/ °°° __ Do You Yahoo!? LAUNCH - Your Yahoo! Music Experience http://launch.yahoo.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
Sridhar wrote Tony has been sucking up to Microsoft for a while now. The last time Bill Gates visited, he was treated like royalty, and Tony was even at the product launch of Office XP as part of his election campaign. Apparently, the gateway.gov.uk site, which is part of the e-government initiative to put all government services online, is fully _owned_ by Microsoft, intellectual property and all. When it was first set up, all users of 'alternative' (read: non-IE) browsers were locked out, and it took heavy complaining to change it. After the site was set up, MS released an advertisement featuring the government people behind the project (including an MP or two), who said things like I will always use Microsoft. The Liberal Democrats now have my vote. Sir Robin Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
On Sat, 18 May 2002, Sridhar Dhanapalan wrote: Not that the Australian government is much better. Prime Minister John Howard bent over backwards to meet with Bill Gates the last time he was here, yet he totally ignored Scott McNealy and Larry Ellison when they visited. What part of Australia are you from, Sridhar? I'm going to be visiting a friend in Queensland sometime around Aug/Sept/Oct... - peace, Rog Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
On Sat, 18 May 2002 17:29:51 -0400 (EDT), Roger Sherman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What part of Australia are you from, Sridhar? I'm going to be visiting a friend in Queensland sometime around Aug/Sept/Oct... I'm in Sydney, New South Wales. Not exactly very close to Queensland: about 1000Km to the border. -- Sridhar Dhanapalan I actually think that Linux with the stuff that is going on in 3D, desktops, etc., has a chance to become the first real user-friendly UNIX. -- Linus Torvalds Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
On Thursday 16 May 2002 22:02, Kaj Haulrich wrote: /snip Lyvim, what makes you think the American government is so special ? Or for that matter, Microsoft? Sure, it's a big unscrupulous corporation, but is it doing anything much worse than most other multinationals? The strength of feeling against MS (which I generally go along with) may be because the majority of computer professionals and enthusiasts lead comparitively sheltered lives (e.g. we went to school instead of working in a field or a sweatshop). Sir Robin -- No discipline is ever necessary to force attendance upon lectures which are really worth the attending. - Adam Smith Robin Turner IDMYO, Bilkent Universitesi Ankara 06533 Turkey http://www.bilkent.edu.tr/~robin Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Friday 17 May 2002 8:54 am, Robin Turner wrote: On Thursday 16 May 2002 10:32, Miark wrote: Shane and I were talking about M$ products and the government. I thought y'all might be interested too. First, the Peruvian government is putting through a bill that would eliminate closed, proprietary software (M$ software) from government computers. The General Manager of M$ in Peru wrote a public complaint, and a congressman wrote a response. I was most interested in what he said about security: Miark - do you have a link for this? This is probably the definitive source, with translations, commentary etc. http://www.gnu.org.pe/preyres.html Alastair - -- Alastair Scott (London, United Kingdom) http://www.unmetered.org.uk/ -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.0.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org iD8DBQE85L+pCv59vFiSU4YRAs+bAJ9CR/ST0TQHBJT+CY7sZoDGj9ti3QCdHnOd yYtgUDGEbLoOHeHuVzSANw8= =zFH1 -END PGP SIGNATURE- Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
Do you have any idea how much it costs for the right to put the Microsoft logo on a box? Bill Gates is a clever thief. Ever hear of MS- DOS? That wasn't Gates' brainchild, it was IBM's. Only because they forgot to secure their rights to it. When I first started with computers oh so many moons ago, J-DOS was the thing., Command-line based, completely incompatable with MS-DOS, and it eventually died out. And I mean like 8086-era. Like, early to mid 80's. Iceburgh69 --- Or for that matter, Microsoft? Sure, it's a big unscrupulous corporation, but is it doing anything much worse than most other multinationals? The strength of feeling against MS (which I generally go along with) may be because the majority of computer professionals and enthusiasts lead comparitively sheltered lives (e.g. we went to school instead of working in a field or a sweatshop). Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
Ever hear of MS- DOS? That wasn't Gates' brainchild, it was IBM's. Only because they forgot to secure their rights to it. Know of any sources to support this? Thanks Brian Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
On Friday 17 May 2002 06:37 am, you wrote: On Friday 17 May 2002 06:24 am, Brian Koppe wrote: Ever hear of MS- DOS? That wasn't Gates' brainchild, it was IBM's. Only because they forgot to secure their rights to it. Know of any sources to support this? The history of MS-DOS is surprisingly long. It started off as QDOS (Quick and Dirty Operating System) which was developed by Seattle Computer Products to run on IBM's new PC. http://www.houlden.f9.co.uk/msdos/dosversions.htm But for a quirk of fate, the original PC operating system could have been GEM (DOS), and the world would have been so much better off for it. ;-) -- /\ DarkLord \/ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
Didn't Gates also use a lot of CMP and Unix stuff as well? (ah well, take whatever is out there, use it for your own - I guess a leopard can't change its spots after all! grin) Sorry, gotta correct myself here...that was supposed to be CPM. ;-) -- /\ DarkLord \/ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
Robin, Check out http://www.gnu.org.pe/preyres.html Man, I'm reading through the response letter again. If I didn't hate M$ so much, I'd feel sorry for them because Nunez has utterly cut Microshaft to pieces!! It's a slaughter! It's so beautiful, it brings a tear to these old man's eyes. Miark On Fri, 2002-05-17 at 01:54, Robin Turner wrote: On Thursday 16 May 2002 10:32, Miark wrote: Shane and I were talking about M$ products and the government. I thought y'all might be interested too. First, the Peruvian government is putting through a bill that would eliminate closed, proprietary software (M$ software) from government computers. The General Manager of M$ in Peru wrote a public complaint, and a congressman wrote a response. I was most interested in what he said about security: Miark - do you have a link for this? Thanks, Robin -- No discipline is ever necessary to force attendance upon lectures which are really worth the attending. - Adam Smith Robin Turner IDMYO, Bilkent Universitesi Ankara 06533 Turkey http://www.bilkent.edu.tr/~robin Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
On Friday 17 May 2002 07:20 am, Lyvim Xaphir wrote: On Thu, 2002-05-16 at 15:02, Kaj Haulrich wrote: Lyvim, what makes you think the American government is so special ? Kaj Haulrich Denmark There's no intimation here that this is an isolated case, Kaj. I just don't have any comprehensive data on other government's right or wrong doings. LX Lyvim, I can assure you that the danish government is no better, if that can comfort you. It is owned by Micro$oft. However, let's not get too depressed. By and by things seems to develop : In France there's a strong movement towards open-source, i.e. the french government has proposed just that to the European Union. We'll see In Germany, the parliament (Bundestag) recently moved from Bonn to Berlin. The new building (in fact : the old one) needed an IT-system, so the parliament initiated a feasability-study : Micro$oft / Open Source. We'll see... In Norway (who somehow always seems a little smarter than Denmark) Linux has a good stronghold : think of Qt (TrollTech) and Opera. Both are commercial companies that Micro$oft hasn't been able to crush. Yet ...? And don't forget : corporations mightier than any nation-state use Linux (Shell, BP, General Motors, Toyota etc.. etc...). Cheers ! Kaj Haulrich Denmark Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
On Friday 17 May 2002 21:47, you wrote: On Friday 17 May 2002 07:20 am, Lyvim Xaphir wrote: On Thu, 2002-05-16 at 15:02, Kaj Haulrich wrote: Lyvim, what makes you think the American government is so special ? Kaj Haulrich Denmark There's no intimation here that this is an isolated case, Kaj. I just don't have any comprehensive data on other government's right or wrong doings. LX Lyvim, I can assure you that the danish government is no better, if that can comfort you. It is owned by Micro$oft. However, let's not get too depressed. By and by things seems to develop : In France there's a strong movement towards open-source, i.e. the french government has proposed just that to the European Union. We'll see In Germany, the parliament (Bundestag) recently moved from Bonn to Berlin. The new building (in fact : the old one) needed an IT-system, so the parliament initiated a feasability-study : Micro$oft / Open Source. We'll see... In Norway (who somehow always seems a little smarter than Denmark) Linux has a good stronghold : think of Qt (TrollTech) and Opera. Both are commercial companies that Micro$oft hasn't been able to crush. Yet ...? And don't forget : corporations mightier than any nation-state use Linux (Shell, BP, General Motors, Toyota etc.. etc...). Cheers ! Kaj Haulrich Denmark , Correct me if I'm wrong BUT isn't my Government (especially Phoney Blair) toadying up to Gates after the offer of assistance of subsidised computers with M$ as the OS in British schools??? Hadn't ever linked the two till following this thread... Hold my hand someone, I'm scared. -- Derek Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
On Friday 17 May 2002 06:48 pm, you wrote: On Friday 17 May 2002 21:47, you wrote: On Friday 17 May 2002 07:20 am, Lyvim Xaphir wrote: On Thu, 2002-05-16 at 15:02, Kaj Haulrich wrote: Lyvim, what makes you think the American government is so special ? Kaj Haulrich Denmark There's no intimation here that this is an isolated case, Kaj. I just don't have any comprehensive data on other government's right or wrong doings. LX Lyvim, I can assure you that the danish government is no better, if that can comfort you. It is owned by Micro$oft. However, let's not get too depressed. By and by things seems to develop : In France there's a strong movement towards open-source, i.e. the french government has proposed just that to the European Union. We'll see In Germany, the parliament (Bundestag) recently moved from Bonn to Berlin. The new building (in fact : the old one) needed an IT-system, so the parliament initiated a feasability-study : Micro$oft / Open Source. We'll see... In Norway (who somehow always seems a little smarter than Denmark) Linux has a good stronghold : think of Qt (TrollTech) and Opera. Both are commercial companies that Micro$oft hasn't been able to crush. Yet ...? And don't forget : corporations mightier than any nation-state use Linux (Shell, BP, General Motors, Toyota etc.. etc...). Cheers ! Kaj Haulrich Denmark , Correct me if I'm wrong BUT isn't my Government (especially Phoney Blair) toadying up to Gates after the offer of assistance of subsidised computers with M$ as the OS in British schools??? Hadn't ever linked the two till following this thread... Hold my hand someone, I'm scared. Actually, Derek, it's worse than that. From what I've been reading at www.theregister.co.uk, it seems that the UK government is setting up their web sites so that you will not be able to access them unless you are using MicroSoft products. AFAIK, that is not a requirement here. Yet. (Question: Do the UK versions of MS software packages carry Royal Appointment logos like the ones on Bass Ale?) In light of the foregoing discussions on this thread, I hereby nominate that Peruvian senator to be Supreme High Mucky Muck of the Whole World. He's the first politician to show an in-depth understanding of what MS is trying to do. Seconds? -- cmg Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
On Fri, 17 May 2002 23:48:39 +0100, Derek Byram [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Friday 17 May 2002 21:47, you wrote: On Friday 17 May 2002 07:20 am, Lyvim Xaphir wrote: On Thu, 2002-05-16 at 15:02, Kaj Haulrich wrote: Lyvim, what makes you think the American government is so special ? Kaj Haulrich Denmark There's no intimation here that this is an isolated case, Kaj. I just don't have any comprehensive data on other government's right or wrong doings. LX Lyvim, I can assure you that the danish government is no better, if that can comfort you. It is owned by Micro$oft. However, let's not get too depressed. By and by things seems to develop : In France there's a strong movement towards open-source, i.e. the french government has proposed just that to the European Union. We'll see In Germany, the parliament (Bundestag) recently moved from Bonn to Berlin. The new building (in fact : the old one) needed an IT-system, so the parliament initiated a feasability-study : Micro$oft / Open Source. We'll see... In Norway (who somehow always seems a little smarter than Denmark) Linux has a good stronghold : think of Qt (TrollTech) and Opera. Both are commercial companies that Micro$oft hasn't been able to crush. Yet ...? And don't forget : corporations mightier than any nation-state use Linux (Shell, BP, General Motors, Toyota etc.. etc...). Cheers ! Kaj Haulrich Denmark , Correct me if I'm wrong BUT isn't my Government (especially Phoney Blair) toadying up to Gates after the offer of assistance of subsidised computers with M$ as the OS in British schools??? Hadn't ever linked the two till following this thread... Hold my hand someone, I'm scared. Tony has been sucking up to Microsoft for a while now. The last time Bill Gates visited, he was treated like royalty, and Tony was even at the product launch of Office XP as part of his election campaign. Apparently, the gateway.gov.uk site, which is part of the e-government initiative to put all government services online, is fully _owned_ by Microsoft, intellectual property and all. When it was first set up, all users of 'alternative' (read: non-IE) browsers were locked out, and it took heavy complaining to change it. After the site was set up, MS released an advertisement featuring the government people behind the project (including an MP or two), who said things like I will always use Microsoft. Not that the Australian government is much better. Prime Minister John Howard bent over backwards to meet with Bill Gates the last time he was here, yet he totally ignored Scott McNealy and Larry Ellison when they visited. -- Sridhar Dhanapalan The idea that Bill Gates has appeared like a knight in shining armour to lead all customers out of a mire of technological chaos neatly ignores the fact that it was he who, by peddling second-rate technology, led them into it in the first place. -- Douglas Adams Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
On Friday 17 May 2002 17:50, Carroll Grigsby opened a general hailing frequency and transmitted to all open stations: Actually, Derek, it's worse than that. From what I've been reading at www.theregister.co.uk, it seems that the UK government is setting up their web sites so that you will not be able to access them unless you are using MicroSoft products. AFAIK, that is not a requirement here. Yet. (Question: Do the UK versions of MS software packages carry Royal Appointment logos like the ones on Bass Ale?) you will need passport i am sure. since MS just signed up all their passport users for spam lists, i am sure we are all happy to hear that -- Linux, cause i reboot less often than windows users reinstall. shane Profile at: http://dmoz.org/profiles/shen.html Proud to be a DMOZ editor since 10-98 Mandrake Users Club Member http://www.linux-mandrake.com/en/club/ Registered linux user #101606 http://counter.li.org/ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
On Thu, 16 May 2002, FemmeFatale wrote: Lyvim Xaphir wrote: The government taxes the individuals, while it's buddy MicroSh*t provides a spy conduit by which the government can track individuals that don't like the taxes, while MicroSh*t taxes the individuals, while the government provides unofficial protection for Microshaft. It's a sweetheart deal, boys. HTH, LX : Don't necessarily agree with you however before you criticize your gov't anymore take a look at this and the Hacker link at the end of the article: http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/05/15/eveningnews/main509140.shtml Femme... that is truely scary. makes you wonder just where they are. I don't whether to be feel secure or violated, ya know? -- daRcmaTTeR -- Registered Linux User #186492 Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
On Saturday 18 May 2002 02:26, you wrote: On Friday 17 May 2002 17:50, Carroll Grigsby opened a general hailing frequency and transmitted to all open stations: Actually, Derek, it's worse than that. From what I've been reading at www.theregister.co.uk, it seems that the UK government is setting up their web sites so that you will not be able to access them unless you are using MicroSoft products. AFAIK, that is not a requirement here. Yet. (Question: Do the UK versions of MS software packages carry Royal Appointment logos like the ones on Bass Ale?) you will need passport i am sure. since MS just signed up all their passport users for spam lists, i am sure we are all happy to hear that Yes indeed ;-) I have learned a lot from this thread and others on this list, believe me. I'd never fully understood the implications from just reading The Register which I have linked on my homepage and is read daily. This thread (and others) has increased my understading of the insidious behaviour of M$ leading me to believe matters are far worse than I originally estimated some while back. I noticed that on the XP installed on this dual boot system I was continually berated with a request to sign up for the passport thingy??? without knowing the full reasons behind it. I spend the majority or my time now in Mandrake-Linux and am all the more pleased to be doing so, expanding my knowledge of things both technical and just downright provacative/interesting on what must be one of the most entertaining and informative and helpful lists there is. -- Derek Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
On Friday 17 May 2002 20:05, Derek Byram opened a general hailing frequency and transmitted to all open stations: I have learned a lot from this thread and others on this list, believe me. I'd never fully understood the implications from just reading The Register which I have linked on my homepage and is read daily. This thread (and others) has increased my understading of the insidious behaviour of M$ leading me to believe matters are far worse than I originally estimated some while back. don't you wish the judge in the MS case in the state was on this list? i know i do -- Vini, vidi, Linux. I came, I saw, I got a real OS. shane Profile at: http://dmoz.org/profiles/shen.html Proud to be a DMOZ editor since 10-98 Mandrake Users Club Member http://www.linux-mandrake.com/en/club/ Registered linux user #101606 http://counter.li.org/ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
Lol!! Shane, that sig is classic. Keep up the good work. :) On Fri, 2002-05-17 at 21:26, shane wrote: On Friday 17 May 2002 17:50, Carroll Grigsby opened a general hailing frequency and transmitted to all open stations: Actually, Derek, it's worse than that. From what I've been reading at www.theregister.co.uk, it seems that the UK government is setting up their web sites so that you will not be able to access them unless you are using MicroSoft products. AFAIK, that is not a requirement here. Yet. (Question: Do the UK versions of MS software packages carry Royal Appointment logos like the ones on Bass Ale?) you will need passport i am sure. since MS just signed up all their passport users for spam lists, i am sure we are all happy to hear that -- Linux, cause i reboot less often than windows users reinstall. shane L8r, LX -- °°° Kernel 2.4.8-26mdk Mandrake Linux 8.1 Enlightenment 0.16.5Evolution 1.02 Registered Linux User #268899 http://counter.li.org/ °°° Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
[newbie] OT: National security and M$
Shane and I were talking about M$ products and the government. I thought y'all might be interested too. First, the Peruvian government is putting through a bill that would eliminate closed, proprietary software (M$ software) from government computers. The General Manager of M$ in Peru wrote a public complaint, and a congressman wrote a response. I was most interested in what he said about security: To guarantee national security or the security of the State, it is indispensable to be able to rely on systems without elements which allow control from a distance or the undesired transmission of information to third parties. Systems with source code freely accessible to the public are required to allow their inspection by the State itself, by the citizens, and by a large number of independent experts throughout the world. Our proposal brings further security, since the knowledge of the source code will eliminate the growing number of programs with spy code. In the same way, our proposal strengthens the security of the citizens, both in their role as legitimate owners of information managed by the state, and in their role as consumers. In this second case, by allowing the growth of a widespread availability of free software not containing spy code able to put at risk privacy and individual freedoms. Well said. And if that wasn't enough to stricken M$ crap, check this out (in case you didn't already read it in Shane's sig): Microsoft has knowingly and willfully concealed information regarding security flaws in computer software from the [National Security Agency] out of fear that revealing such flaws would reduce the number of copies of its products that would be purchased by the government... I have raised this issue internally with Microsoft, and in return have been the subject of both bribes and threats. -ED CURRY, Computer Security Specialist, in a letter to Defense Secretary William Coen In other words, M$ risked national security for the love of money. How unbelievably vile! Just look at how much M$ cares about the security of the 260+ million inhabitants of its home country. I didn't think I could hate M$ as much as I do right now. Anyway, I really hope the US government starts taking notice of how other governments are separating themselves from the evil that is Microsoft. Miark Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
AW: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
brian : how are you going to puplish that paper ? i realy would like to read it ! and i'm sure it will be a good one , so if you don't mind if i could translate it to german adi --- ... XP , while X stands for cra -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Im Auftrag von Brian Koppe Gesendet: Donnerstag, 16. Mai 2002 10:46 An: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Betreff: Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$ WOW. I'm actually writing a research paper on M$ right now. If you know and could tell me your sources for these things it would be GREATLY appreciated Thanks! Brian Miark wrote: Shane and I were talking about M$ products and the government. I thought y'all might be interested too. First, the Peruvian government is putting through a bill that would eliminate closed, proprietary software (M$ software) from government computers. The General Manager of M$ in Peru wrote a public complaint, and a congressman wrote a response. I was most interested in what he said about security: To guarantee national security or the security of the State, it is indispensable to be able to rely on systems without elements which allow control from a distance or the undesired transmission of information to third parties. Systems with source code freely accessible to the public are required to allow their inspection by the State itself, by the citizens, and by a large number of independent experts throughout the world. Our proposal brings further security, since the knowledge of the source code will eliminate the growing number of programs with spy code. In the same way, our proposal strengthens the security of the citizens, both in their role as legitimate owners of information managed by the state, and in their role as consumers. In this second case, by allowing the growth of a widespread availability of free software not containing spy code able to put at risk privacy and individual freedoms. Well said. And if that wasn't enough to stricken M$ crap, check this out (in case you didn't already read it in Shane's sig): Microsoft has knowingly and willfully concealed information regarding security flaws in computer software from the [National Security Agency] out of fear that revealing such flaws would reduce the number of copies of its products that would be purchased by the government... I have raised this issue internally with Microsoft, and in return have been the subject of both bribes and threats. -ED CURRY, Computer Security Specialist, in a letter to Defense Secretary William Coen In other words, M$ risked national security for the love of money. How unbelievably vile! Just look at how much M$ cares about the security of the 260+ million inhabitants of its home country. I didn't think I could hate M$ as much as I do right now. Anyway, I really hope the US government starts taking notice of how other governments are separating themselves from the evil that is Microsoft. Miark --- - Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
WOW. I'm actually writing a research paper on M$ right now. If you know and could tell me your sources for these things it would be GREATLY appreciated Thanks! Brian Miark wrote: Shane and I were talking about M$ products and the government. I thought y'all might be interested too. First, the Peruvian government is putting through a bill that would eliminate closed, proprietary software (M$ software) from government computers. The General Manager of M$ in Peru wrote a public complaint, and a congressman wrote a response. I was most interested in what he said about security: To guarantee national security or the security of the State, it is indispensable to be able to rely on systems without elements which allow control from a distance or the undesired transmission of information to third parties. Systems with source code freely accessible to the public are required to allow their inspection by the State itself, by the citizens, and by a large number of independent experts throughout the world. Our proposal brings further security, since the knowledge of the source code will eliminate the growing number of programs with spy code. In the same way, our proposal strengthens the security of the citizens, both in their role as legitimate owners of information managed by the state, and in their role as consumers. In this second case, by allowing the growth of a widespread availability of free software not containing spy code able to put at risk privacy and individual freedoms. Well said. And if that wasn't enough to stricken M$ crap, check this out (in case you didn't already read it in Shane's sig): Microsoft has knowingly and willfully concealed information regarding security flaws in computer software from the [National Security Agency] out of fear that revealing such flaws would reduce the number of copies of its products that would be purchased by the government... I have raised this issue internally with Microsoft, and in return have been the subject of both bribes and threats. -ED CURRY, Computer Security Specialist, in a letter to Defense Secretary William Coen In other words, M$ risked national security for the love of money. How unbelievably vile! Just look at how much M$ cares about the security of the 260+ million inhabitants of its home country. I didn't think I could hate M$ as much as I do right now. Anyway, I really hope the US government starts taking notice of how other governments are separating themselves from the evil that is Microsoft. Miark Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
Miark wrote: Shane and I were talking about M$ products and the government. I thought y'all might be interested too. First, the Peruvian government is putting through a bill that would eliminate closed, proprietary software (M$ software) from government computers. The General Manager of M$ in Peru wrote a public complaint, and a congressman wrote a response. I was most interested in what he said about security: To guarantee national security or the security of the State, it is indispensable to be able to rely on systems without elements which allow control from a distance or the undesired transmission of information to third parties. Systems with source code freely accessible to the public are required to allow their inspection by the State itself, by the citizens, and by a large number of independent experts throughout the world. Our proposal brings further security, since the knowledge of the source code will eliminate the growing number of programs with spy code. In the same way, our proposal strengthens the security of the citizens, both in their role as legitimate owners of information managed by the state, and in their role as consumers. In this second case, by allowing the growth of a widespread availability of free software not containing spy code able to put at risk privacy and individual freedoms. Well said. And if that wasn't enough to stricken M$ crap, check this out (in case you didn't already read it in Shane's sig): Microsoft has knowingly and willfully concealed information regarding security flaws in computer software from the [National Security Agency] out of fear that revealing such flaws would reduce the number of copies of its products that would be purchased by the government... I have raised this issue internally with Microsoft, and in return have been the subject of both bribes and threats. -ED CURRY, Computer Security Specialist, in a letter to Defense Secretary William Coen In other words, M$ risked national security for the love of money. How unbelievably vile! Just look at how much M$ cares about the security of the 260+ million inhabitants of its home country. I didn't think I could hate M$ as much as I do right now. Anyway, I really hope the US government starts taking notice of how other governments are separating themselves from the evil that is Microsoft. Miark Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Ummm, Miark, in august 1999, cryptonym corporation was examining a Service pack release of NT4 from which microsoft had inadvertantly forgotten to strip the data tags. Microsoft has (or had) in Win9x and WinNT cruyptographic keys for cryptographic services and no services would work without passing the appropriate key. This was to comply with export restrictions at the time (128 bit encryption was considered a weapon). Ummm no wrong, the backup key or what everyone had been led to believe was the back-up key was clearly and unequivocally labelled in the tag NSAKey Rapid denals were issued by NSA and microsoft that the key was used by the NSA though such a key did have the potential of allowing the installation of security (spy) software on the system without the user's knowledge. A little later a third, undocumented and definitely untagged key was discovered. A program was issued to overwrite the second key which had the side effect that exported versions could enable 128 bit encryption by installing their own keys. Civileme Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
On Thursday 16 May 2002 05:12 am, you wrote: Miark wrote: Shane and I were talking about M$ products and the government. I thought y'all might be interested too. Didn't the German armed forces (?) also drop Windog because somebody was using it to spy on them? Seems like I saw that a while back on LinuxToday or some place like that... -- /\ DarkLord \/ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
On Thursday 16 May 2002 01:46, Brian Koppe opened a general hailing frequency and transmitted to all open stations: WOW. I'm actually writing a research paper on M$ right now. If you know and could tell me your sources for these things it would be GREATLY appreciated the vast majority of my stuff comes from somewhere in http://dmoz.org/Society/Issues/Business/Allegedly_Unethical_Firms/Microsoft/ and though only some of those pages give their sources, there is a fair amount. also if you find a really good quote, search for a large part of the quote in google, actually putting the search term in quotes. you can often find sources that way. another good one is trustworthycomputing.com though it is only a redirect to a google search it is rather interesting. if you happen to publish the paper on the web, please submit it to the dmoz.or url above so i can include it for the rest of the worl to see.. -- Doing my part to piss off the religious right. shane Profile at: http://dmoz.org/profiles/shen.html Proud to be a DMOZ editor since 10-98 Mandrake Users Club Member http://www.linux-mandrake.com/en/club/ Registered linux user #101606 http://counter.li.org/ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
Brian: Here's a link to an English translation of the letter from the Peruvian senator to the head of MS in Peru: http://www.gnu.org.pe/resmseng.html About the only thing that he didn't say was, and the horse you rode in on. Good stuff. This is a guy I'd like to vote for. -- cmg On Thursday 16 May 2002 04:46 am, you wrote: WOW. I'm actually writing a research paper on M$ right now. If you know and could tell me your sources for these things it would be GREATLY appreciated Thanks! Brian Miark wrote: Shane and I were talking about M$ products and the government. I thought y'all might be interested too. First, the Peruvian government is putting through a bill that would eliminate closed, proprietary software (M$ software) from government computers. The General Manager of M$ in Peru wrote a public complaint, and a congressman wrote a response. I was most interested in what he said about security: To guarantee national security or the security of the State, it is indispensable to be able to rely on systems without elements which allow control from a distance or the undesired transmission of information to third parties. Systems with source code freely accessible to the public are required to allow their inspection by the State itself, by the citizens, and by a large number of independent experts throughout the world. Our proposal brings further security, since the knowledge of the source code will eliminate the growing number of programs with spy code. In the same way, our proposal strengthens the security of the citizens, both in their role as legitimate owners of information managed by the state, and in their role as consumers. In this second case, by allowing the growth of a widespread availability of free software not containing spy code able to put at risk privacy and individual freedoms. Well said. And if that wasn't enough to stricken M$ crap, check this out (in case you didn't already read it in Shane's sig): Microsoft has knowingly and willfully concealed information regarding security flaws in computer software from the [National Security Agency] out of fear that revealing such flaws would reduce the number of copies of its products that would be purchased by the government... I have raised this issue internally with Microsoft, and in return have been the subject of both bribes and threats. -ED CURRY, Computer Security Specialist, in a letter to Defense Secretary William Coen In other words, M$ risked national security for the love of money. How unbelievably vile! Just look at how much M$ cares about the security of the 260+ million inhabitants of its home country. I didn't think I could hate M$ as much as I do right now. Anyway, I really hope the US government starts taking notice of how other governments are separating themselves from the evil that is Microsoft. Miark Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
On Thu, 2002-05-16 at 05:12, civileme wrote: Ummm, Miark, in august 1999, cryptonym corporation was examining a Service pack release of NT4 from which microsoft had inadvertantly forgotten to strip the data tags. Microsoft has (or had) in Win9x and WinNT cruyptographic keys for cryptographic services and no services would work without passing the appropriate key. This was to comply with export restrictions at the time (128 bit encryption was considered a weapon). Ummm no wrong, the backup key or what everyone had been led to believe was the back-up key was clearly and unequivocally labelled in the tag NSAKey Rapid denals were issued by NSA and microsoft that the key was used by the NSA though such a key did have the potential of allowing the installation of security (spy) software on the system without the user's knowledge. A little later a third, undocumented and definitely untagged key was discovered. A program was issued to overwrite the second key which had the side effect that exported versions could enable 128 bit encryption by installing their own keys. Civileme Here's another YAWN (yet another wooden nickel) to add to what Civ added to what Miark stated. Since the NSA is able to spy on citizens by virtue of the NSA backdoor so thoughtfully provided by M$, would this not be an excellent reason for the government to maintain an ongoing business relationship with M$? Perhaps the Government would even be so thoughtful as to provide some extra consideration in court by bumping good judges from the bench in favor of more controllable personnell; Kotar-Kelly, perhaps. Maybe the liberals don't give a fig about the military and the NSA; however the republicans weigh towards them extensively; and that to my thinking is a powerful motive to grease MicroShaft out the Antitrust a-hole relatively unscathed. Quite sickening. So while the Peruvian Government does the right thing, the corrupt American government violates it's own Antitrust laws by giving M$ a carte blanc to rape and pillage the public with the M$ Tax. We are all, after all, nothing but tax fodder to the government employees, anyway. Since M$ imposes their own tax on businesses and individuals, why then should they not be buds? Two bloodsucking vampiric parasites walking along together conducting legal crime; birds of a feather flock together, right? The government taxes the individuals, while it's buddy MicroSh*t provides a spy conduit by which the government can track individuals that don't like the taxes, while MicroSh*t taxes the individuals, while the government provides unofficial protection for Microshaft. It's a sweetheart deal, boys. HTH, LX : -- °°° Kernel 2.4.8-26mdk Mandrake Linux 8.1 Enlightenment 0.16.5Evolution 1.02 Registered Linux User #268899 http://counter.li.org/ °°° Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
On Thu, 2002-05-16 at 10:34, Carroll Grigsby wrote: Brian: Here's a link to an English translation of the letter from the Peruvian senator to the head of MS in Peru: http://www.gnu.org.pe/resmseng.html About the only thing that he didn't say was, and the horse you rode in on. Good stuff. This is a guy I'd like to vote for. -- cmg What's the cost of living in Peru?? ;) LX -- °°° Kernel 2.4.8-26mdk Mandrake Linux 8.1 Enlightenment 0.16.5Evolution 1.02 Registered Linux User #268899 http://counter.li.org/ °°° Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
On Thursday 16 May 2002 07:52, Lyvim Xaphir opened a general hailing frequency and transmitted to all open stations: Since the NSA is able to spy on citizens by virtue of the NSA backdoor so thoughtfully provided by M$, would this not be an excellent reason for the government to maintain an ongoing business relationship with M$? it is rather interesting that all the time they were in court together you never heard and we will now stop buying software from known criminals and go open source. interestingly gartner just recommended MS go open source to fix their security. -- It is no measure of your health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society. shane Profile at: http://dmoz.org/profiles/shen.html Proud to be a DMOZ editor since 10-98 Mandrake Users Club Member http://www.linux-mandrake.com/en/club/ Registered linux user #101606 http://counter.li.org/ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
On Thursday 16 May 2002 04:52 pm, Lyvim Xaphir wrote: snip So while the Peruvian Government does the right thing, the corrupt American government violates it's own Antitrust laws by giving M$ a carte blanc to rape and pillage the public with the M$ Tax. We are all, after all, nothing but tax fodder to the government employees, anyway. Since M$ imposes their own tax on businesses and individuals, why then should they not be buds? Two bloodsucking vampiric parasites walking along together conducting legal crime; birds of a feather flock together, right? The government taxes the individuals, while it's buddy MicroSh*t provides a spy conduit by which the government can track individuals that don't like the taxes, while MicroSh*t taxes the individuals, while the government provides unofficial protection for Microshaft. It's a sweetheart deal, boys. HTH, LX /snip Lyvim, what makes you think the American government is so special ? Kaj Haulrich Denmark Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
On Thursday 16 May 2002 12:02, Kaj Haulrich opened a general hailing frequency and transmitted to all open stations: Lyvim, what makes you think the American government is so special ? timing is everything http://www.theregus.com/content/6/24966.html -- If you set a man by a fire, you keep him warm all day, but set a man on fire and you keep him warm the rest of his life. Terry Pratchett shane Profile at: http://dmoz.org/profiles/shen.html Proud to be a DMOZ editor since 10-98 Mandrake Users Club Member http://www.linux-mandrake.com/en/club/ Registered linux user #101606 http://counter.li.org/ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
On Thu, 2002-05-16 at 15:02, Kaj Haulrich wrote: Lyvim, what makes you think the American government is so special ? Kaj Haulrich Denmark There's no intimation here that this is an isolated case, Kaj. I just don't have any comprehensive data on other government's right or wrong doings. LX -- °°° Kernel 2.4.8-26mdk Mandrake Linux 8.1 Enlightenment 0.16.5Evolution 1.02 Registered Linux User #268899 http://counter.li.org/ °°° Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: National security and M$
On Thu, 2002-05-16 at 05:12, civileme wrote: Ummm, Miark, in august 1999, cryptonym corporation was examining a Service pack release of NT4 from which microsoft had inadvertantly forgotten to strip the data tags. Microsoft has (or had) in Win9x and WinNT cruyptographic keys for cryptographic services and no services would work without passing the appropriate key. This was to comply with export restrictions at the time (128 bit encryption was considered a weapon). This is when I took serious interest in Linux. I was just plain tired of having to update and then still not know if there was a backdoor for the NSA or MS or whoever. I realize computer security is an ongoing practice regardless of OS, but I sure feel safer with Linux than I did with Windows. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
