Re: [scifinoir2] Get to know G.I. Joe
The are expensive?
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In a message dated 8/30/2008 3:25:02 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Gymfig: Why do you have to be so insulting to people on this list? (and not just on social and political issues) You think this is about the rest of us not accepting your difference of opinion. Tracy I have not be insulting. I enjoy it when Keith writes a response. He does have alot to say. It can be a little frustraing when he give a long answer to a short question. When I first answered his question, I was joking. He is never lost for words. Every answer has been that there is some kind of personality flaw or I hate men or black men. Why can't a black woman or a person dislike Obama without being called racist or anti man. Why is ever Hillary supporter anti man. It is these Democratic tatics that annoy me. Everythig is not racist or anti man. Every post that I have posted since then has be in jest. No fuss no harm no foul. People take to too seriously. You seem to see yourself as the lone enlightened, critical thinker, and the rest of us as monolithic, brainless followers. No I don't. I am not an Obama fan. When in fact, we simply cannot accept the sweeping generalizations you hurl us, putting words in our mouths, thoughts in our heads, all the while not bothering to hide your contempt you seem to have for us. However it is okay to it too me? I know some pretty impressive conservative heavyweights who I relish having a political debate with. I might not agree with you, but I always walk away having learned something. Unlike you, they know how to discuss and debate with ease without all the contempt and insults. Thanks for the compliment You seem to think you are showcasing your knowledge and intellectual expertise, but in my opinion, you sometimes reveal insecurities and on occasion, lack of knowledge about facts on subject you speak about with such authority. I may not know everything however I am not insecure. Ironically, to me, when you think you are looking your strongest, you look your most vulnerable. Often when I am angriest at you, soon after, I feel the most empathy for you. I really you do not want my empathy. It would probably anger you, so I shake it off. Weird huh? No Until you learn how debate without showing contempt or lack of knowledge of about the subject you are debating, you will , in my opinion, continue to come across sounding like an internet troll who likes to insult people to purposefully stir up trouble and antagonize people on lists. You do this on almost every subject we discuss. You can find a conflict where I would not normally think there is on.I know you see that as a positive attribute, but I would hazard a guess that those of us who have been exposed to it these many years do not see it in such a positive light. Thanks I’d like to think I’m wrong, but after several years, with very few people on this list that you have not insulted or attacked, I’m beginning to doubt it. Since we are such inferiors, as you seem compelled to constantly remind us, if you do not fit the definition of a troll who likes to antagonize people on the list for sport, I sometimes wonder why you would want to regularly connect with people you think so little of. There is nothing I can do if you and other think so little of me. I enjoy reading posts and asking questions. To think that I am nothing more than an insecure troll says alot of myself. Thank you for your honesty. I have no doubt you will now proceed to enlighten us, in you uniquely “ eloquent” way. Tracey – as usual, when it comes to you bewildered and a little sad at the negativity you have again brought to the list. **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
Re: [scifinoir2] Sorry folks
In a message dated 8/29/2008 3:14:21 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: A voting system. In AMERICA. None of the 'issues matter. It's all about who did the best marketing job. Which does not make him the best man for the job or will make him a great president. **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
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In a message dated 8/29/2008 7:30:17 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Keith, a dear friend of mine once said, You are what you post. That statement is so true. Gymfig: open minded pragmatic critical thinker Follow own path Everybody else Quick to judgment Follows latest trends **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: OT: Wow--Hillary Moves for Barak by Acclamation
In a message dated 8/29/2008 8:45:54 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: So its the devil you know I seeMs. McCain Understandable.supported I just think its sad. good luck to you and your elephant. It is not my elephant. I just don't like donkeys who continue to make an a** out of people by scare tactics. Or may it is their own doing? **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
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In a message dated 8/29/2008 10:06:02 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: And you don't expect a knee jerk reaction from black folks about supporting McCain? I know my people. Black people are monolithic. Hmm... Nice to see that you are trying to use your head and who is quick to judge again... If the shoe. woman in the mirror.. I used to think being different was cool, then I realized I was being a tool. and that is my not so quick judgment Gymfig Sense of Humor The rest of the list NONE **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: OT: Wow--Hillary Moves for Barak by Acclamation
I am not a republican. I am a democrat. If I hear that the republicans are going to put blacks back into slavery I am going to scare. If I hear that if McCain wins it is due to racist America. I am going to scream. If I hear that the republicans are trying to revoke the Voting Rights act, I am going to scream. Scare Tatics **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
Re: [scifinoir2] Sorry folks
In a message dated 8/29/2008 10:15:50 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Gymfig: Priceless. *evil grin* **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: OT: Wow--Hillary Moves for Barak by Acclamation
In a message dated 8/29/2008 10:23:12 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Liberal media says that.not the demos damn those liberals... Black folks say that too. Black folks should be upset with the liberal media for making them look like bug eye fools. Liberals are the bread and butter of the Democratic Party. **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
Re: [scifinoir2] Something for the chicks
What movies are coming out today? There was an Enterprise marathon today? I hate Enterprise. **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
Re: [scifinoir2] OT: Wow--Hillary Moves for Barak by Acclamation
In a message dated 8/28/2008 12:27:07 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: You really, really need to check your facts. Clyburn was on the fence for months. Clyburn was not a Clinton supporter. Neither was Pelosi or Brazile. All of this fence sitting was a farce. Like many blacks in this country (me included) he was leaning toward Hillary Clinton. But Obama's success, with whites coupled with the Clinton's increasingly hostile and dirty tactics, I don't understand why it is so wrong to attafck your opponet. She was his rival. What were they supposed to do, have a duel? Jeez Louise. She was a white woman attacking a black man. I guess that was the problem. made him lean toward Obama. I watched Clyburn in a live interview say that he called Bill Clinton personally to tell him he was going with Obama, and Clinton cussed at him. I heard Richardson say Clinton went off on him. Hell, Teddy Kennedy said the Clintons went off on him too. John Lewis here in Atlanta called to tell them, and he too said it didn't go well. I liked and like Bill and Hillary, but they did this to themselves. You call Clyburn a dog, but it was the Clintons who acted like brutes, cursing and threatening and attacking people for having the temerity to back someone else. Tonight at the DNC, Clyburn said he liked the Clintons, still likes the Clintons. I have no problem with them, he said.He then said he still felt some of their comments could have been interpreted as racist, but that he still had no enduring problem with them. Clybrun warned the Clintons that they should fall in line unless she and her supporters were going to lose their seat. How is that the posture of an angry dog? And I'm really, really confused. What did Obama do to Hillary? How can you in the same night attack Obama and men for a sexist plot against Hillary, then say she came out swinging and he was meek. I never said that she was meek. She is a woman. Vilified for be a hard core bithc. Something that men don't like. She lost this fight, and you are saying you'll never vote for him. No I will not. You are Black right? Yes Then tell me how a respectful Black man like Obama who speaks with nothing but respect for women is worse than McCain, who called his wife the c-word in public? He said that he did not. Tell me how you have contempt for Obama who has an intelligent, educated wife who I believe will bring more respect to the First Lady, while going with don't-say-too-much Cindy McCain? I do not vote for first lady. You're entitled to your opinion, that's the American way. But if I could understand it as something other than an odd hatred of Obama, or men, or Black men-- LOL not this ish again. I am not a bitter lesbian. or all three--that'd be nice. If you think a white multi-millionaire like john McCain who supported a senseless invasion that will cost us trillions is better for you than a Black man who understands the struggles of being both Black and not wealthy, that's your right. That black man has not proven he undestands the sturggle of people. He cars about the corporations that put him there. I'm tired, mad at myself for staying up this late and doing this instead of writing or job searching. Me too. It is the same fight when this topic comes up. But I say again--and finally--you seem to have a lot of hostility. Oh oh. Angry bitchlesbian Hillary support. Keith we both agreed las time that I was not hostile. I've read all your posts, and they seem to have a common theme of hatred for men, Lesbian aler. Lesbian alert!!! hatred for Black men, 40 plus cant find a man and over weight. All the brothers date outside their race! LOL! and contempt for Black people who dare say the world's not fair to them. The world is not fair. Especially to blacks who are moderates or republicans. i just don't get it Liberals never do. **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
Re: [scifinoir2] OT: Wow--Hillary Moves for Barak by Acclamation
In a message dated 8/28/2008 12:11:57 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: You tend to get personal with people, Gymfig. Why is that? I disagree with you, but I don't get personal and LOsay stuff like nothing is ever humble with you. Keith are a very in depth writher and at times wordy. I know that everytine that see your posts you have something to say. It was not a personal attack. You have often joked about it yourself. That's insulting. You don't know me on the level to say I'm never humble. I think Tracey and Martin and many people in this group--with whom I've had civil discussions--would tell you i'm not arrogant, self-righteous, or intractable in my opinions. I never said that. Keith my family came from humber beginnings too. My fahter had to work and suppor the family. My mother and aunt had law and education degress. But I'm not a dunce, have opinions, and just beause I disagree with you, please don't say stuff like that. I never calle dyou stupid or other names. How dare you make such stuff up. I don't want to say this, but you honestly strike me as someone who dislikes Black people, and Black men in particular. How long are you going to use this agument. I wont vote for a black man or black wman. I criticize popular black political thought. I do not see racism everywhere. Where do you get your viewpoints. I notice that you speak with contempt-not disagreement, but contempt--whenever racism is mentioned. At times there is no racism. Rather than agree that racism still exists, and then say something like but it isn't our only problem (which all of us would agree on) you put down all Black people as seeking to be victims. It is true. I have issue with the afrocentric way of thinking. But you always take the truth of racism--even when it's only one part of a much more complex discussion--and rake us over the coals for that. Like what. Why I enjoy the white Green Latern over the Black one? Keith I have not yelled at you, denoucned men at all. Also, what is your deal with men? I've noticed over and over and over that you seize on stuff and start this women can't make it work because of men talk. Where have I said that. You are taking small conversatons and framing them into I hate men. Frankly, you cry sexism way more than anyone in this group has ever cried racism. It's like this thing with Obama. You keep saying he's just a man, and that Hillary as a woman never had a chance. There are people who will not vote for a woman as president of the US. No matter how hard you try, it will nto happen. Hillary had negative. Bill had alot of negative. At the end of the day, Biden was a working class, Catholic conservative codewords for safe white male. The same working class Dems that would never vote for Obam because he is black and vote for Hillary because she was white and was conservative. The boys club has only gotten darker. You find all these examples of how sexism keeps women down. You diminish the accomplishment of a man of color as nothing, as if only a woman president would have any meaning. I nevver said what Obama did was nothing.You are greasping for insult. The primaries are over. A woman president would have great meaning in this world. I know what her problems were. Yet despite all this, despite the obvious and rampant racism, Obama and his wife never made a huge deal of it. Did they discuss it? Of course they did not make a fuss. It would have looke bad and would not have worked in this change theme. Whatever happened to you in life to make you self-hating, man-bashing, and self-pitying, I'm sorry for it. Keith I was trying to be nice. You talk to damn much to get your point across. I am not bitter nor mean nor man hating nor vile. Hillary lost. I will support McCain. These are my people too. I will question some of our beliefs in order to move foward. I iwll not tow the line just because non one wants to saks themselves these qustions. These are not hard questions. They are just to make us think. Hillary got a clue--it's time you did too. Good Night **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
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I just finished watching CSPAN. They had a pundit talking about Obamas plan. Obama will not scale back NAFTA. His plan to tax small business will hurt not help. He plans to spend. He does not plan on lowering the national debt. He will not reform programs. I don't see why he is such an economic power hours. **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
Re: [scifinoir2] OT: Wow--Hillary Moves for Barak by Acclamation
In a message dated 8/28/2008 9:57:33 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Gymfig, I must be crazy for continuing this, but I do want to clear up one thing. Sayinig you have a problem with men is *not* saying you're lesbian, crazy, or a bit***. It's responses like that that confuse me. I love women, I respect women, and I am saddened at the gender battles I see in this country, especially with Black people. What I've seen from you is a hair trigger whenever men in power comes up, an immediate, loud repudiation of men--or at least Black men--out of proportion to what's said. When we discuss Obama, you say He's another man, big deal.So what' if he's black? which is disrespectul to the *kind* of man he is, and to Black people. It is not disrespectful at all. People may be happy that he is runnig for president. However at the end of the day he is still human. He is still a politician. He needs the same corporate money he says he despsies. He went to Wrights chuch becaue it introduced him to the right people. It iwas not a sould seac hig decision He did what others have done in the past. He is no different than anybody else. I don't see him as great figure in terms of accomplishments. I think Colin Powell is a great man. He is not a celebrity. There is a huge difference between Powell and Obama. I know that they respect one another. I would take Powell any day over Obama. Two goverenors of California were actos. They have a built in fan base. People complained about Bush and his expereince that was brought by his Daddy. Well Obam has not even finished his first term. Why should he be seen as different than Bush? Some people say that Clinton should be a supreme corut judge. Shouldn't you be a judge before you sit on the bench? Obvisouly that is not the case any more. He is just a man that gives great speeches. This election saddens to. It shows that the POTUS is just a figurehead. The real power is by lobbyists and coporations. They run this country. I am not a fan of Clitnon or McCain in terms of experiene. I take McCain any day. Race has nothing to do with my dislike of hom. You seem to paint all men in power with this huge brush of keeping women down, You are mistaken II really feel you are bringing some prejudices to these discussions. I've looked back over many of my posts, and nothing in them can be interpreted as calling you what you said. Maybe you know a lot of men who seem to think in this twisted way, but I'm not one of them. As a black woman I see sexism and racism all the time. My race means that I will be lazy. My gender meas that I can not do the work. You are a black man. Sure you face problems. You don't have people who say that you have a smaller brain and can't handle high pressured situations. Not as a man. You don't have the problem of being emotional and seen as a negative. You don't have the problem with memebers of your group that don't think that women should NEVER be near the top. Any black person that say that blacks should not be leaders is is as racist. You don't have the burden of being told to sacrifice for the sake of the race. You don't have to worry if your outward apprearence is more important than your accomplishments. You don't have to worry that if you focus on your group then that will tear the family structure apart and will destroy men. No I don't hate men I dont hate black men. The fact that you continue with this kind of conclusion speaks volumes. This is the kind of sexims I hate. **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
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In a message dated 8/28/2008 10:42:09 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Hey Gym, I was listening to the comedy stylings of a local conservative pundit this morning (he is the classic liberal who got mugged and became a Republican). His talking point was about how there will be higher energy prices in an Obama Administration. Oh really? Didn't energy prices DOUBLE during the Bush Administration Obama did not want to drill untll the public thought it was okay. The demand for oil went up because China was hoarding for the Olympics and a greater need for oil. The same can be said about India. **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: OT: Wow--Hillary Moves for Barak by Acclamation
In a message dated 8/28/2008 10:16:23 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I actually understand where Gymfig is coming from. He has a lot of valid points...some factual some questionable...but solid nonetheless. Whoa! I am a SHE. I love gymnastics and figure skating. Gymfig Here is the kicker Both sides are full of bull hockey. It is often better to bet with the side that you know will keep status quo than to hope for better and get nothing. Do all of you remember the Clintons quorum on race relations in America and how much it did for us? Yeah...squat. Okay What Gymfig doesn't seem to realize is this 1. Neither Republicans or Democrats truly care about issues that don't affect themDemocrats half step in their programs and ideas..but Republicans all but flat out say that they don't care. 2. McCain is more of the same. He has different ideas sure, but the same approach. ITS NOT HIS IDEAS GYM...ITS HIS STYLE.. Two salesmen lie. One has a great smile and bats his eyelashes. He smells good and dresses sharply. The other flat out lies to your face. I would be angrier with the smooth talker than the one that flat out lies. I would also be angry with myself because I allowed the smooth talker to get to me. 3. Emcee Cain will do a good dance now and then screw us laterhe is a bit of a tool DJ Barry can really dance. He dances his behind off. Once you find out that you have been played you don't care. You respect him and his game. You still go back and get played again and again. You are in love with this guy. Then you are in debt. You have lost your home. He has taken all of your money and given to his cousin who then plays you again. You feel stupid for giving him props. I also see Obama as a new product. I will call it Pop a Rock. Everybody swears how great it is. Everybody wants something new. Nobody knows why but they like it. Sales are through the roof. If you don't like Pop A. Rock then you are not cool. When you taste Pop a Rock it doesn't taste any different from any other drink. You get cavities. You might even get sick. You hear that Pop a Rock was not tested thoroughly by the FDA. You don't care, you like it. Pop A. Rock starts to expand into the clothing, movies, music business. It is here to stay and will change the industry forever. It surpasses Coke and Pepsi at one point. It is the American Dream. Entertainment Tonight asks how long can Pop A. Rock last. Rumors start to swirl around that Pop A. Rock has had trouble in the past. The makers try and say that people are jealous. Then people start to get bored with it. Pop a Rock starts another campaign to boost its image. It adds Gravel Juice. Gravel Juice is boring but projections say it compliments Pop A. Rock. It works for a while. It did not get the big boost the makers expected. The makers say that time will tell They lower their expectations to save face. Sales of Pop A. Rock merchandise. The makes of Lemon and Lime Pop put out that Pop A Rock is all hype. It does not taste good. Pop A Rock has lost some of its fizz. I will not try Pop a Rock or Gravel. I know that it is just hype. If I HAD to choose between Pop a Rock and Lemon Lime Pop I would choose the Lemon Lime pop. I never tried the Lemon Lime pop. I know that I will problably initaally hate it. I can grow to live it. I know that I don't want to get caught up in the Pop A Roc hype. If I really had to, I would choose neither. If someone told me that my choice will determine if Pop A Rock stays or goes, I will choose the Lemon Lime Pop. I am tired of all fo the blow up hype. **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
Re: [scifinoir2] OT: Wow--Hillary Moves for Barak by Acclamation
In a message dated 8/28/2008 12:49:05 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Not once, in one single of my posts did I deny that women have it hard. I acknowledged that. What I said was that Black people have it hard, women have it hard, both have it hard, so why are some women using the gender issue to say they have it harder, to say Barack Obama won an unfair contest? That's what Hillary and her people did, that's what you keep doing. If the system is sexist, rail against it, but quit punishing that man for it, a man who respects women from everything I can see. Why does every Hillary supporter have to be anti man? This is something I don't get. I don't like Obama. That is why I went to Hillary. Now I have to choose between McCain and Obama. I still don't like Obama. That leaves McCain. I can criticize Obama just like I can criticize McCain. This is the same kind of reasoning that was used against Hillary during the primaries. If you don't like Obama then you must have issues of race or gender. You that said I have issues. Not me. McCain won Saddleback. All the Obama supporters I know could not spin that. They admitted Obama had faults. Obama has a tendency to make a statement. He then has to call another news conference to clarify his statement. Just say what you feel and get over it. McCain is not perfect. I find that annoying. Obama's inner circle always seems to keep him protected. They won't let him go out on his on. And then, going to McCain? Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face. How does putting down a Black man in favor of a white man help your cause as a woman? Putting him down? It is called criticism. Everyone has to go through it. I guess a candidate who calls his wife the c-word (and it was heard and confirmed by his own retainers off the record) is better for women's advancement than a young Brother who reveres his mother, grandmother, wife, sister, and daughters? I am worried about his policies not how he treats his family. I said, and I repeat this: why did this turn into a men vs. women battle when it should have turned into how can we fix all the -ism's discussion. Everytime Clinton comes up you have a what' s wrong with Gymfig and black people response. You are guilty of the same pity-me attitude you accuse me of. I criticize Hillary--a lady I supported at first--because she took real problems and reduced them to hammers to use in a win-at-any-cost campaign. She used people to cry sexism, she used racism to try to forge ahead. I never denied sexism exists, but I decry her saying it's worse than racism, and the way she and her sycophants then attacked Obama for it. You're doing the same thing, and I tell you, in me you've really alienated a Black man who gets it far more than you might think. Okay As a woman you definitely deal with some burdens I don't deal with. As a man, I deal with some you don't deal with, such as being seen as a physical threat just by hauling my 6' frame onto an elevator with a white woman. We both suffer,Gymfig. I've watched my wife deal with racist, sexist white guys on her job; she's watched me deal with racist people on mine. Never once in two decades have we had an argument where she says you don't get my pain, you have it easier. She comes to me for advice and support, and vice versa. We help each other work through those problems. But rest assured, if either of us started directing anger at the other, blaming the other for some perceived advantage, it wouldn't be tolerated. I have told her yeah, I can see you have battles I don't have as a man. But you know what, it's still *my* battle because she's my woman, and my battles are hers because I'm her man. My wife doesn't have it harder than me: we as a Black couple have it ha rder than whites, and we as Black people have it harder. As long as people like you attack folk like me and Barak and other Black men who are actually trying to make things better, you splinter us. I realize that you don't get me, and I'm really saddened and disgusted that it's so easy for a Sister to attack a Brother who's trying to understand things. So I am supposed to support the brothers no matter what? I don't care about color, I care about content. You are the living example of why Black men and women can't get along, you're the woman who hits back at a man who's holding his hand out to help, the one who says You have it better 'cause you're a man, you don't get my pain. You push me away because you want to stay wrapped in a cocoon of self-pity. You are a danger to the future of Black men and women finally healing all the hurts we've done to each other, but I won't be a party to that foolishness. I could care less about black male and female relationships when it comes to politics. That Bros. before Hoe does not work. This election is not about black people. I am
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: OT: Wow--Hillary Moves for Barak by Acclamation
In a message dated 8/28/2008 12:11:36 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Often the real divider between some Blacks and Republicans is the racism, the lack of empathy for what we go through, and a self-righteousness that rubs that by your own bootstraps in people's faces. Do you think that need for empathy is what is keeping black back. **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
Re: [scifinoir2] OT: Wow--Hillary Moves for Barak by Acclamation
In a message dated 8/28/2008 10:04:02 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Tired or not but everything is racist. You cant tell whites to get their act together if they own the act, the actors and the stage. So what are you going to do? Whites are not going anywhere. Hispanics are the majority minority. Republicans 'care about Hispanic issues because Hispanics don't always vote Democratic. They know how to make people more for their vote. Blacks will always be Democrat according to this line of reason. Both parties will stop paying attention to you. Republicans won't waste time. Democrats will take you for granted. Its and unfair battle of perception and we are always on the losing end. John McCain can give 2 flying cucumbers about the black community. They are not his contingent...so any comments of the like simply looks like a cheap swipe...which it would be. I respect McCain and realize many points he makes and policy ideas are more solid thank my man B. But as they say on the streets... DONT GET IT TWISTED! McCain is thirsty for the seat. I am more concerned more about what he will let happen and not what he will do. I a concerned about Obama. He wants it too. So did Hillary. You have to what something to get it. If not, why run? You can complain about Liberals all you want, but a step in the right direction is something we should applaud. In the words of the rap group M.O.P In order to survive the game, know the game... You can't play the game when you don't play both side. The game gets older after a while. **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: OT: Wow--Hillary Moves for Barak by Acclamation
In a message dated 8/28/2008 7:33:25 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Finally, what kind of face does America want to show to the rest of the world? Is this a young, vibrant country with new ideas or an old, wizened country (with short arms)? This is not a man I want as president of the United States. Obama is America. Hype, fluff and nothing to offer. **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
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In a message dated 8/27/2008 8:28:37 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Why isn't the mainstream media talking about speeches from Dennis Kucinich and Montana governor Brian Schweitzer. They got bigger reactions than Ed Rendell and Mark Warner. Becuase both of them are nuts. Especially Kucinich. **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: OT: Who Are You Watching to Cover the DNC?
In a message dated 8/27/2008 8:52:26 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I thought Kucinich was dead on in his criticism of the pharmaceutical industry and their influence on modern health care was spot on and most of the folks in the hall did as well. The man may be kooky but his speech was very, very good. Schweitzer was a great hype man. LOL He shoul put the blame on the Demorats who get money from that company. I doubt that the audience will realized that. **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
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In a message dated 8/27/2008 3:53:09 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Gymfig, not nearly as nutty as the Numbers 1 2 men in the Guv'mint right now... Nutt that he can not get elected. **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: OT: Who Are You Watching to Cover the DNC?
In a message dated 8/27/2008 4:20:13 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: The only reason that Kucinich isn't still in the running is because he's not photogenic enough. He is a ugly and has crazy views about the government. Nobody will vote for him. Just like no one will vote for Ron Paul. **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
Re: [scifinoir2] OT: Wow--Hillary Moves for Barak by Acclamation
In a message dated 8/27/2008 6:29:21 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I admit that I, too, am flabbergasted by this, Keith. Maybe she's picked up something along the road in the past few weeks. It is all for show. She want those keep h Senate seat and move on up. It is all politics. The Party does not want to lose all of those angry black voters. **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: OT: Who Are You Watching to Cover the DNC?
In a message dated 8/27/2008 7:24:36 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I agree. I look at some of the so-called establishment leaders, and they're some combination of racist, ignorant, criminal, stupid, clueless, elitist (the old fashioned definition, i.e. filthy rich), closet gays who condemn homosexuality on Sunday, bribe takers and givers-- And Obama picked one as his VP **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
Re: [scifinoir2] OT: Wow--Hillary Moves for Barak by Acclamation
In a message dated 8/27/2008 7:22:16 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: . If Barak can hold his tongue at some of the nastiness and racism she leveled his way-- That is how he got the nomination. while he never used the admittedly existent sexism that exists against her--then it's the least she and Bill can do. **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
Re: [scifinoir2] OT: Wow--Hillary Moves for Barak by Acclamation
In a message dated 8/27/2008 7:21:13 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: used against Obama. It's less about even supporting Obama and more about the tricks they used. And I've heard a lot of Blacks saying that if she didn't do everythig in her power to make up for that, if Obama lost, they'd hold her and Bill responsible. Right or wrong, that's the way it is. And as time's gone on, they've realized it's not just Blacks, but many younger whites who don't have a sense of history and loyalty with the Clintons. If Hillary runs in four years or tries to run in even eight years, for newer generations she and Bill will be a part of history. And how would they like part of that historic legacy to be that's the lady who helped shoot down the first serious Black presi dential candidate. and she's old too. All those whites who toke african american studies course and have half black kids always get offended and act as if they understand. At the end of the day, being the first black means nothing to me. It is all liberal potlics that seems to end up hurtig blacks in the end. **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
Re: [scifinoir2] OT: Wow--Hillary Moves for Barak by Acclamation
In a message dated 8/27/2008 7:39:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: That's my thoughts exactly. What I saw Clintion was in a no-win situation. It has now dawn on her that thanks to her primary actions she either has to help Obama win the election-even if it means she'll never have a decent shot of running for president. Or killing her political career, and her chance of holding her senate seat by either doing nothing, or harming Obama's chance of winning it. So she had to hit one out of the park. But now she has to make sure that Obama wins the nod or many will blame his loss on her and endure the backlash. Which will probally end her senate career. This is what I am tired of . I am tired of the Everything is racist. Poor Obama. I saw him in the debates with Hillary. He was horrible. However black peole were crying racism. I saw him at Saddleback. McCain was great. You can't blame that on racism. Minoriites have been force feed that nothing is there fault. It is all the racist system. Now you have all of these so called white liberals who feel proud they are not racist like their parents. We can all be stupid toghet. Give me a break. Take teen pregnacy. It used to be a black problem:. Now it is a white problem and is acceptable. You have all of these dolllars going in to stop it in the black community. However it is ballooning in the white community. When will Obama tell whites to get their act together. He won't . He will say that peopel must work together to stop problems. It will be accpetable becuse he is a Bill Cosby type of person. John McCain says the same thing and he is labeled a racist. This has NOT helped. People need to sop looking at race and look at the problem. **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
Re: [scifinoir2] OT: Wow--Hillary Moves for Barak by Acclamation
In a message dated 8/27/2008 8:29:55 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: But, despite what they're doing now, Bill and Hillary have shown that they're too prideful and self-absorbed to ever be second fiddle. Obama said the same thing **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: OT: Who Are You Watching to Cover the DNC?
In a message dated 8/27/2008 8:26:20 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: well, I like Biden. Not my best, favorite choice, but I'm cool with him. His work with Civil and women's rights has been good, and I like much of his foreign policy attitude. not perfect, but he'll do He is a safe white man that allows racist to fel comfotabe to vote for a black man. **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
Re: [scifinoir2] OT: Wow--Hillary Moves for Barak by Acclamation
In a message dated 8/27/2008 8:40:42 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Well, you're entitled to that opinion for sure. Speaking as a liberal, I'm heartened by a return to more liberal thinking. If it means we can look at people as people, instead of using sexual orientation and ethnicity as scare tactics, I'm all for it. If we can respect anyone whether they're Christian, Muslim, Jew, or atheist, then color me liberal. If we can return to a world where we talk with other nations and make decisions with them rather than try to push them around, then sign me up. And I get that just throwing a Black face in office isn't in and of itself enough. After all, two of the worst, most destructive people in recent history--Clarence Thomas and Condie Rice-are Black. But symbols are powerful.Taking a step is powerful. Opening a door is powerful. And putting a man --or woman, someday--of color in the highest office in the land is a powerful symbol. It will change us in ways we don't even comprehend right now. It won't be the Second Coming, but it will move us forward as a nation, a people, if only a little bit. Just as you and I benefited from our parents and grandparents being the first on a job, the first in a neighborhood, the first in a church, the first to vote, then we'll all benefit from the right man being the first to take the leadership of this country. In my humble opinion. Keith, Notihing is ever humble with you. I live in a traditional blue state. However they baneed gay marriege. Tehre are alot of blue states out there that don't like gay marriage. You live in a Hollywood world. A word were it is black or white. Either or. If you are against this, then you are racist. If you are for this, then you are okay. I am against illegal immigration. I am against having more Asians come over here. I think that a lack of rules is the problem in our society. Howeve I am not an Evangelical Christian. I despise them by the way. I am not to found of Christianity but I don't believe it should be vilified while other religons are celebrated. I don't think that IR are well help race relations. Actually I am not worried about race relations. I am worried about myself. I think that blaks spend way to much time worried about race and not about themselves as individuals. I think tthat they are too scared to be individuals. This country is not ready for a woman president. As long as this country focuses on race, a woman president will not happen. Therefore it will not happen. Unless the woman is non white or married to a non whte man. Bros before Hoes Mammy Nutcracker Bitch White Bitch These are terms that are acceptable acros racial and gender lines. It will not change with Obama. This country is moving forwad. However groups have to face responsibility. They chose not too because the media says it is not their fault. Slavery is the problem. Immigration. Racist white men are al the problem. Government programs are the solution. How can you be a progressive when you are told that nothing is ever your fault. You don't have to take the blame. The meida vilifies any person of color who does not fall into the victim hood category especially african americans. Obama is an excpetion. He is not a typical black person. He works hard. He is an immigrant. He does not have the stain of slavery. How can you be proud of that? Blacks have allowed liberals to feed them self doubt for too long. Yes Obama is exceptional. However why has it take us so long to believe it. That was not Bush, it was ourselves. **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
Re: [scifinoir2] OT: Wow--Hillary Moves for Barak by Acclamation
In a message dated 8/27/2008 8:50:54 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: You're missing a huge thing here. It was Hillary who said on the record that she was the candidate of the hardworking, blue collar, Midwestern folks, who everyone--everyone--knew to be white voters. So if Obama tsaid that he was getting the liberal white and black votes would you have been happy. It was Bill who reached back and said Well you know, Jesse Jackson won South Carolina too, It was true. Obama won in a place with alot of blacks. and opened that door of not-so-subtle racism. And I have to say, I don't see anyone teaching Blacks that all our problems are due to racism, that we don't have to have responsibility for ourselves. Everything seems to be due to racism on this list. Watch tv and movies. Read book after book after book about the effects of slaver. I'm successful by most standards, I've worked hard to get where I am, my parents taught me to fight and scrap and improve myself. But they also taught me that racism is real, and to fight it when I see it. And it *does* still exist in this country. Just as Blacks can't spend all time blaming racism, we'd be incautious to pretend it doesn't exist. True As for Obama going after whites and telling them to get their act together, i can't really speak to that yet. I know he's angered many by his lecturing Black men to get it together, He should have gone after black women. Because it takes two make a baby and birth control is an option. He would have upset whtie women. The black man jab was to make sure that white men would vote for him. by not addressing racism overtly (something which has apparently alienated Tavis Smiley). I'm not yet sure where I stand on this. I know that he can't obtain the White House speaking the way you and I do. It sucks, but if this stupid nation is still questioning Michelle because she made the completely understandable statement that she was really proud of America, if they deem not wearing a flag pin a sign of treason, then I think they'd never put a Black man in office who tells it fully like it is. It makes me somewhat ill to even say this, but he does have to walk a fine line here. Has he gone too far? He needs to convince whites. That is why he picked a WHITE MALE in Biden. He needs to reassure white America where he stand.s He has the black vote lockeed up. Look at the way AA treated that woman on CNN last night. Again with the mammy images. I don't know, not sure, but I'm willing to give him a chance. I'd rather have a careful Black man like Obama who at least *acknowledges* that America is racist, than a sellout like Clarence Thomas w ho pretends it isn't, or a clueless codger like McCain who has about as much in common with me and my life as I do with a ant. **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
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In a message dated 8/27/2008 8:56:18 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Maybe, but he never resorted to the nasty, name-calling, baiting, disparaging, disrespectful tactics the Clintons did. No he had his rotweiler Clyburn and other blacks do it. He had those who hated Hilary do it. When Hillary was belittling him as nothing but a one-speech guy, who was respectfully disagreeing with her. when she shot nasty and really angry comments at him during their debates, Please I watched those debates. She did not let him get away with anything. She cam out swinging. He never fought back. He played the meek nice guy care. If the moderater talked about his problems, people felt sorry for him. *gag* he acted with calm and class and made his point, firmly. And I believe that had he lost, he'd have been out there doing his level best to help the Clintons win, despite how they treated him. What did Hillary and Bill do at first? Acted like poor losers, dropped out of sight, Bill going so far as to leave the country rather than be asked to campaign for Obama. They're getting their stuff together now, but it took a while. I say this as someone who liked Hillary long past the point when many men and women hated her, who defended many of her deeds as just tough politics, who sat in indecision for long moments in the booth here in Atlanta before finally casting my vote for Obama. I don't have a problem with her as a woman or anything like that. I just have a problem with the way they let their campaign against Obama degenerate. They messed up big, and everyone seems to realize that, them included. That is why I am voting McCain. There is nothing Hilary can not and say to make me vote for that man. She had it in her grasp and she lost it. **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: OT: Who Are You Watching to Cover the DNC?
In a message dated 8/27/2008 8:58:45 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: come, on. No true racist is going to vote for Obama just because his number two is a white guy. Biden will help bring in those on the fence who doubt Obama's experience and foreign policy knowledge, and yes, he will comfort some whites. But bring in racists? Not gonna happen Yes he will. A white man is safe. No one is going to vote for a Black man and a woman. No matter what her race is. You need a white man. Richardson is horrible but America wll not vote for a hispanc and a black. Biden will help him because he comes from a working class, Catholic family. He screams white male. There is no secret. **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
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In a message dated 8/27/2008 11:16:59 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Refresh my memory - how does McCain's position on abortion stop teenage pregnancy? How do you defend McCain's intent to continue the disastrous policies that have emptied our treasury and dangerously eroded our stature in The world? How does McCain's intent to continue tax cuts for the rich, which have shamelessly widened the gap between rich and poor in this country, help the fifty percent of black people who have yet to participate in the American dream? How can you rail against rich, white elitists and then turn around and vote for the richest, whitest elitist? I believe that abortion should not be used as a form of birth control. I believe that teens should be taught abstinence. I don't believe that McCain will continue the same policies that George Bush has laid out. He is not Bush. IT was the cuts, reforms and tax cuts that helped the economy. I rail against rich white elitists. They are present in both parties. Those in the Democratic party hide behind race, gender and are social programs that hurt America. They hide behind the same special interest groups and lobbyist that Republicans share. It is easy the condemn the Republicans but not the Democrats. America will not be free unless all groups are stop. Something a Washington outsider cannot and will not do. **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
Re: [scifinoir2] Stargate Atlantis Cancelled
NBC is destroying the Sci Fi channel. **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
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In a message dated 8/20/2008 9:45:00 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: As many of you know, Lawrence Fishburne is joining CSI when William Petersen leaves this season. What you may not know is that Fishburne is not replacing Petersen's character on the CSI totem pole. In other words, Fishburne will pay the cost but will not be the boss. Fishburne, whose character is a college professor and former pathologist, will join the CSI team in an ENTRY-level position. WTF? ~rave! Okay? **It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv000547)
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: OT: Who Knew? A Black Man on US Olympic Swim Team
There are blacks in diving and swimming. They come from other sports. Black Americans have participated in softball rowing etc. It is a sad state of black America that we are responsible for a lot of our problems. Racism has nothing to do with it. What ever obstacle that is placed in your way, you fight back. That is an ideal that all humans can work towards. You need to stop worry about past present and future grievances and work hard. I like the Olympics it shows how people from small countries can or hard and do well. **Looking for a car that's sporty, fun and fits in your budget? Read reviews on AOL Autos. (http://autos.aol.com/cars-Volkswagen-Jetta-2009/expert-review?ncid=aolaut000307 )
[scifinoir2] Sci Fi Channel News Eureka and Doctor Who
This Sunday there will be a Eureka min marathon starting at 9 am. There will also be a mini marathon on Tuesday *according to sci fi.com. Eureka starts again on Tuesday at 9/8c. Don't forget the last two episodes of season of Doctor Who. **Get fantasy football with free live scoring. Sign up for FanHouse Fantasy Football today. (http://www.fanhouse.com/fantasyaffair?ncid=aolspr000520) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] ...and Jeremiah Marathon on SciFi
It seems like a good show. Why was it canceled? **Get the scoop on last night's hottest shows and the live music scene in your area - Check out TourTracker.com! (http://www.tourtracker.com?NCID=aolmus0005000112) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] ...and Jeremiah Marathon on SciFi
In a message dated 7/11/2008 12:19:44 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Which show, Jeremiah **Get the scoop on last night's hottest shows and the live music scene in your area - Check out TourTracker.com! (http://www.tourtracker.com?NCID=aolmus0005000112) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] ...and Jeremiah Marathon on SciFi
In a message dated 7/10/2008 8:13:54 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Wow, talk about good stuff: Burn Notice on USA, and SciFi Channel's running a block of Jeremiah shows. Those are always good to revisit What was the premise of the show? **Get the scoop on last night's hottest shows and the live music scene in your area - Check out TourTracker.com! (http://www.tourtracker.com?NCID=aolmus0005000112) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] Twilight Zone Marathon
In a message dated 7/3/2008 7:10:08 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Thanks for the reminder, Gymfig. Almost missed it, for waiting for the unemployment numbers. No problem. Burn Notice is on USA **Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used cars. (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut000507) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] Iron Man
In a message dated 7/2/2008 4:56:06 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I am finally going to see Iron Man. Leaving in 30 minutes. Super excited Bosco Enjoy I have not seen it yet. **Get the scoop on last night's hottest shows and the live music scene in your area - Check out TourTracker.com! (www.tourtracker.com ?NCID=aolmus0005000112) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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Twilight Zone marathon tarts tomorrow **Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used cars. (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut000507) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] Doctor Who - Forests of the Dead
In a message dated 6/30/2008 10:48:11 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: * **semi spoiler alert *** \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ It is maddening to realize what television can get away with that written SF cannot. River Song whispers a word in the doctor's ear and later in the episode he says you know my real name. There's only one reason why I would tell someone my real name No explanation! I found the commentary on youtube and when we get to that point, Tennant and the others are laughing about the time traveler's wife, but then he says...you didn't really put an explanation in the script. And, Moffet I guess, laughs and says that he liked leaving that element of mystery out there. He had no real explanation. My writing workshop buddies didn't mind ambiguity, but if the author did not know herself, they raised a bloody scream. Mind you, I loved the episode. I loved the episode too. How can Rive be in his future when he meets her in the present? **Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used cars. (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut000507) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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In a message dated 6/17/2008 9:29:28 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: The world of sci-fi and fantasy movies has lost one of its most important contributors. AMEN **Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used cars. (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut000507) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: SPOILERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!RE: [scifinoir2] Re: 'Battlestar Galactica,' We Har...
I thought I was watching the Sopranos ending. **Vote for your city's best dining and nightlife. City's Best 2008. (http://citysbest.aol.com?ncid=aolacg0005000102) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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In a message dated 6/9/2008 5:12:38 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Edwards Ran for President after one term as Senator and lost to Kerry. Does not fit your insulting race-baiting rhetoric, but it is true. If you deny it you live on a different planet than the rest of us Obama has not finished his first term. I doubt a first term white senator or govenor would be handle with kid gloves if they had decided to run for office. Even Clinton knew she had to get a term under her belf before running for office. **Vote for your city's best dining and nightlife. City's Best 2008. (http://citysbest.aol.com?ncid=aolacg0005000102) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: FW: Open Letter to Certain White Women Threatening to Wi...
I don't ridicule black men. Black face the same kind of treatment like anyone else. I often take special consideration when it comes to racial issues. I understand that there are cultural differences. Sometimes it is not racial. **Vote for your city's best dining and nightlife. City's Best 2008. (http://citysbest.aol.com?ncid=aolacg0005000102) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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In a message dated 6/10/2008 3:34:06 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Edwards did not finish his first term So I was wrong. Edwards still did not get the nomination. He was a young guy with good hair. So why should Obama get different treatment? He is black. You don't touch that. **Vote for your city's best dining and nightlife. City's Best 2008. (http://citysbest.aol.com?ncid=aolacg0005000102) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: FW: Open Letter to Certain White Women Threatening to Wi...
In a message dated 6/10/2008 3:35:45 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: For you it is all about race (specifically putting down Black men) I don't believe that if you criticize black men or the actions of any black man, it makes you racist. A person should be able to say that they disagree with someone without being labeled a racist. That is what King died for. **Vote for your city's best dining and nightlife. City's Best 2008. (http://citysbest.aol.com?ncid=aolacg0005000102) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: FW: Open Letter to Certain White Women Threatening to Wi...
In a message dated 6/10/2008 5:00:24 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: John Edwards is 55 Years old. Barack Obama is 46. Even 4 years ago Edwards was not a young guy with good hair. Edwards was protrayed as some young short happy go lucky guy with good hair. It does not matter if he was 70. Edwards lost the nomination because he was coupled with the lamest candidate the Democratic party could find. And you KNOW this. No, he lost because the media made him into some fight for the poor hawkish but rich tiral lawyer with a tragic but uplifting story. His image did not change in the primary. If Edwards was better off without Kerry he would have least won a race. What's with you and race/politics? You get emotional and then go completely off track -- often. We always end up at the same place when you join a conversation regarding race. Then you act like you're beeing ganged up on, but in reality folks (the same folks) are just correcting you, because you say stuff like this. Stuff like what. I do get off track at time. However I do not get off track when it comes to certian race issues. Stuff that's just WRONG. Why do you keep doing this? Like what?? I guess I should ask why *I* keep doing this. I don't even know. **Vote for your city's best dining and nightlife. City's Best 2008. (http://citysbest.aol.com?ncid=aolacg0005000102) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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In a message dated 6/10/2008 4:48:09 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Nobody is saying you are racist. It has been suggested that you are a but hateriffic where Obama is concerned, and it could be concluded that it is because he is a Black male. King's message was to be judge on the content of our character. It was not that any black woman or woman disagrees with a black man, it must me some deep seated black male hate. **Vote for your city's best dining and nightlife. City's Best 2008. (http://citysbest.aol.com?ncid=aolacg0005000102) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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In a message dated 6/10/2008 6:28:59 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: What King is not on your hit list too? I'm surprised. I guess that is a good thingt Not really. I think that King was a white woman loving communist hack that wanted to undermine the US government. At the same time he exploited poor black America for his own ego. I think that he used the black kids marching just to drum up emotional support. It worked. His teachings have undermined black progress and set black American back. **Vote for your city's best dining and nightlife. City's Best 2008. (http://citysbest.aol.com?ncid=aolacg0005000102) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: FW: Open Letter to Certain White Women Threatening to We...
In a message dated 6/10/2008 6:38:47 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: do not like the sweeping negative generalizations she has made about Black men. You talk about these generalizations. What are they? Obama' s stromg pomt with whites is that he is biracial. His african father and white Kansas mother is the ultimate immigrant story. His theme of a post racial society has resonated with alot of people. Yes Obama sees himself as a black man.However poll after poll suggest that he is seen as biracail by whites. Yes he has and will be called a N. You can not ignore he has a white mother and was raised by white grandparents. That is why Obama had to denounced Wright and Pfleger. I don't know if Obama agrees with Wright and Pleger. Maybe hie does. He could not afford to have those two in his corner. They were hurting his campaign with whites who saw a black man surrounded by those who hated whites. He had to drop them. To point this out does not mean you are racist, or hate Obama, or hate balck men. Now, she is arguing that he is the poster boy for all that she sees is wrong with Black men Tracy I have asked both of you to give me examples where I hate black men? I have asked you to show me post wehre I have stated, I HATE BLACK MEN. I think you are confusing me with some posters on BlackVoices/.com Now there is a place were you can hate black men. **Vote for your city's best dining and nightlife. City's Best 2008. (http://citysbest.aol.com?ncid=aolacg0005000102) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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In a message dated 6/10/2008 6:59:04 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Disagreeing with us has nothing to do with the perception that you have some issues with Black men. Again, From what posts do you reference that I hate black men? **Vote for your city's best dining and nightlife. City's Best 2008. (http://citysbest.aol.com?ncid=aolacg0005000102) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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In a message dated 6/10/2008 6:57:07 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Has Hillary ever done anything wrong in your eyes? Yes If so, could you tell us what it is? Some of her commets that were made and how she ran her campaign. She should have kept quiet Also, why do you embrace her playing the gender card? Pointing out sexism should not be seen as playing the card. I did not care for the far far far views of some of her female supports. Why do you not condemn it yet accuse Obama playing the race card, when he did not allow people to notify the press about Obama supporters being chased by dogs and treated to a steady stream of racist invective and well as having offices vandalized with race baiting slogans? Actually that was in the press. It did not make masintream news. I heard about what happened to some of his foot soldiers who went to neighborhoods where they were not wanted. Seriously I am not surprised that it happened. There are some nast people in this world. There are also those who would rather vote for a N*** than vote for a b*. **Vote for your city's best dining and nightlife. City's Best 2008. (http://citysbest.aol.com?ncid=aolacg0005000102) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: FW: Open Letter to Certain White Women Threatening to Wi...
I think pointing out the race card came from his supporters. His fairy tale speech, attack on Wright was an attack on the black church, Bill Clinton as the first black president, Bill Clitnon is a racist because he put black men in prision ( gang members that were destroying black communities) the darkening of his picture,Jesse Jackson comments, MLK comments, his heritage, white people are not voting for him in Ohio. White people who vote for him were educated, whites that voted for Hillary were gun touting, xenophobic, low imcome religous Bush loving zealonts. Every little attack on him was by that cold evil white Afrimative Action getting fake Repulican b. Did it ever occur to you that the Republicans could have had a hand in it. I was watching a documentary on how campaigns ofent attacked themelves so that iw ould seem that someone wlse was doing it. Poor Obama could not fight back because it would be seen as the big black man hurting the poor precious spoiled tear jerking lying white woman. As for talking about his campaign, it wouod have hurt his post racial america campaign. It wouod have hurt his post Jesse Jackson message. His supposrters were brave people who did not complain about racism. Dont blame Clinton on that. **Vote for your city's best dining and nightlife. City's Best 2008. (http://citysbest.aol.com?ncid=aolacg0005000102) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: FW: Open Letter to Certain White Women Threatening to Wi...
In a message dated 6/10/2008 8:31:00 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: The question was why you condemned Obama for using the race card, but not Hillary for saying that sexism caused her to loose the race, inspite of numbers that prove the contrary. I do not believe that sexism was the only reason that she lost the race. I believe that there were times that his supporters used race Is America ready for a Black President' to their advantage. I believe that some of the claims about sexism are true. I believe that Obamas post racial message did not allow for some of his supporters to speak about their racial beliefs. ** I do not understand why you and other continue to bring up I hate black men. I don't know why you or others keep bringing this up. It has nothing to do with my views on Obama and sexism in this campaign. **Vote for your city's best dining and nightlife. City's Best 2008. (http://citysbest.aol.com?ncid=aolacg0005000102) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: FW: Open Letter to Certain White Women Threatening to Wi...
In a message dated 6/9/2008 1:56:31 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: This election is causing a war between three factions of American feminism: Feminists of color, the older feminists and the newer feminist. The newer feminists and feminists of color (in general) see this old style approach as harmful to the overall cause. I think the movement will be wounded and I think some of Hillary's actions and the establishment feminist's movement support is going to bite us in the ass in the workplace. Women in power do not complain, whine, cry, expect special rules to be applied to them or ride on the success of their spouses. Now that perception has been given new life. Thanks Hillary! The media asked black women if they were going to vote for a white woman over a black man. Black women were angry. Black women were proud of Michelle and proud of Obama for choosing a dark skin black woman. They chose Obama. Remember the anger of Anderson Cooper and the black female vote? You can't blame Hilary for that. Some black women enjoyed in calling Stephanie Tubbs -Johnson Shelia Jackson Lee Maya Agelou Whoopi Goldberg and Megan Williams mammies. These were all older generation black women who wanted to be counted as women. It is sad considering because mammy is an ugly stereotype of black women. I was on a lot of progressive websites and black websites. I saw white liberals using these words towards these women. I know some of the black people on these sites. They joined in the name calling. I never saw a black person stand up and say it was offensives. If you were a black female pundit, your blackness was important. Your gender was never acknowledge. It only became a problem when criticizing Hillary. Black females did not stand up and say. I am also a woman. You can blame Obama supporters for that. If Hilary was tough, she was a bitch. If she was nice, then she was weak. People were looking for reason to hate her. She was too old, too frumpy, too ugly, to cold, to calculating. She was just too much. I don't have problems with older feminists. Older feminist had to fight for everything. They worked hard so that the younger generation could say that shaking your behind and being a stripper is empowering. The older generation is not responsible for problems you have at work today. They are responsible for you being at work in the first place. Actually it is the younger generation that has messed up with the way they have raised themselves and their daughters. Yes, I am a younger generation woman. You cannot blame this all on Hillary. **Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch Cooking with Tyler Florence on AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/tyler-florence?video=4?NCID=aolfod000302) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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What anti black male talk? I want to know what anti black male talk? You do have more experience with white male recruiters, My experience with white males is that it is the new generation of women who are at fault. John Edwards ran as Vice President. He was slammed by Dick Cheney at the debates. Edwards came off as a rich pretty boy with good hair who care for the poor. Nobody care for his message. I am not sure if he won any state. He did well in Iowa. However the race came down to history. A black man and a (white) woman. The media had made its choice. Richardson a Hispanic man and governor with diplomat experience was not even in the running. Hispanics do not have the political power or history in this country. According to the media, it was not their time. **Vote for your city's best dining and nightlife. City's Best 2008. (http://citysbest.aol.com?ncid=aolacg0005000102) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: FW: Open Letter to Certain White Women Threatening to Wi...
In a message dated 6/9/2008 4:17:14 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: There are two main reasons why we're not complaining about Vice President Edwards today: 1. Karl Rove and his remarkably accurate understanding of the fear life of Americans. 2. Who in the hell is John Kerry Edwards did not have command of the debate. He did not have command of the issues. John Kerry did not fight. He let someone whodid not have any military experience mow him down. Disagreeing with Obama doesn't make someone racist or anti black male. **Vote for your city's best dining and nightlife. City's Best 2008. (http://citysbest.aol.com?ncid=aolacg0005000102) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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In a message dated 6/8/2008 3:07:57 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Because black people are so clearly the other in this society, we must choose sides, not just to play the game but to maintain our sanity. It has also cost our sanity. Blacks say that they want to be treated as individuals and at times blame others for group think. It has helped us and hurt us. Take this election. Most blacks always vote for the Democrats. Pundits know that blacks will not vote for McCain. Obama has the black vote on lock down. Blacks booed McCain when he was at the MLK celebration. Tavis Smiley was called traitor, gay, loser, etc., when he said that blacks should not vote only for Obama. I know of black people who don't like Obama but are too scared to say so. They are afraid to be harassed. Those black leaders who are friends of Clinton are being threatened. Whites spilt their vote along gender, religious, and economic lines. Whites are seen individuals. So do Latinos. That is why It is important that politicians court non black groups. During the latter stages of the primary Black pundits complained that they are not being courted by Republicans. Why should Republicans court them after this bloodbath of white woman Vs black man? I suggest Barack Obama, raised primarily by his white mother and his white grandparents, is not a post-racial candidate as he is often portrayed. I suggest Barack Obama was a deeply conflicted young man until he made the only choice available to him: he declared himself a black man. Did you ever wonder if it was a political move? Blacks were wary of him because he was biracial. Whites see him as biracial. Blacks see him as black. It is easy to see him as black man because he looks like a light skin black man. If he looked like his white mother it would be difficult to sell. He chose a dark-skinned black woman and had children who will have no choice but to declare themselves black. Of course. Look what happened to Harold Ford when it was rumored that he was with a white woman. Black women on the Internet were cruel. Black women were happy that he chose a dark skin black woman Vs a light skin black woman. I suggest actress Hale Barry, raised primarily by her white mother, did not become self-actualized until she made the only choice Available to her: she declared herself a black woman. She is now has a child fathered by a white man, a child who will have no choice but to declare herself black even though her complexion and genetic Math would suggest otherwise. More and more children are not choosing the one drop rule label. I personally don't see someone who resembles their non black parent as black. I suggest Ms. Berry would not be the first black woman to win the Academy Award if she had not chose her team, and thereby her allegiance, when she did. True. There were black women who had a problem with her being called a role model for black women because she is biracial. They have problems with her and black men. Funny all that changed when she had a baby by a white man. She became a black woman. Although my son has two black parents and he is darker complexioned than both of us, I sent him to primarily white schools so he would get the best education possible. My son would gravitate toward playing and socializing with the white kids because he had more in common with Them socially, economically and academically. He came home At summer's end sporting an Angela Davis afro, a Malcolm X goatee and wearing a Richard Prior Kiss My Happy Black A$$ T-shirt. LOL! Nowadays, unfortunately, for most young black people, it takes getting knocked off your ass unto your ass to declare our most basic and profound allegiance. True Some black people change allegiances because of blacks. **Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch Cooking with Tyler Florence on AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/tyler-florence?video=4?NCID=aolfod000302) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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In a message dated 6/8/2008 12:01:34 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Further, your assertion that I have no loyalty to black people. I have no loyalty to women. is one of the most self-hating things I have ever read. No it is not. I do not have loyalty to any group but myself. I don't always agree that every incident is racial motivated. I don't believer that every incident is sexist. Being a black woman on the outsides does not determine who I am on the inside. Obama was a post racial America. A post racial America is not just whites helping non whites. Non whites should be free to help whites without feeling guilty if they don't help member of their group. Women thought Oprah should have helped Hillary because she was a woman. Well, that did not happen. Oprah also had Bush on her show. She did not have Kerry on. Oprah does what is in Oprah best interest and what she perceived to be right. Yes, Oprah is still a woman. She will face sexism. She still makes money off of women. In the end she helped a man and herself. **Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch Cooking with Tyler Florence on AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/tyler-florence?video=4?NCID=aolfod000302) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] Just Once (Was:Re: FW: Open Letter to Certain White Women Th...
I mentioned that Obama will change how wee see race. I metioned that some whites will not tolerate the same racial divisions of old. This article speas volumes. _http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/08/weekinreview/08mabry.html?_r=1hp=oref=slo ginpagewanted=print_ (http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/08/weekinreview/08mabry.html?_r=1hp=oref=sloginpagewanted=print) June 8, 2008 Color Test Where Whites Draw the Line By MARCUS MABRY How black is too black? Millions of African-Americans celebrated _Barack Obama_ (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/people/o/barack_obama/index.html?inline=nyt-per ) ’s historic victory, seeing in it a reflection — sudden and shocking — of their own expanded horizons. But whether Mr. Obama captures the White House in November will depend on how he is seen by white Americans. Indeed, some people argue that one of the reasons Mr. Obama was able to defeat Senator _Hillary Rodham Clinton_ (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/people/c/hillary_rodham_clinton/index.html?inline=nyt-per) was that a large number of white voters saw him as “postracial.” In other words, Mr. Obama was black, but not too black. But where is the line? Does it change over time? And if it is definable, then how black can Mr. Obama be before he alienates white voters? Or, to pose the question more cynically, how black do the Republicans have to make him to win? Social observers say a common hallmark of African-Americans who have achieved the greatest success, whether in business, entertainment or politics — _Oprah Winfrey_ (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/people/w/oprah_winfrey/index.html?inline=nyt-per) , _Magic Johnson_ (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/people/j/earvin_johnson/index.html?inline=nyt-per) and Mr. Obama — is that they do not convey a sense of black grievance. Clearly, Mr. Obama understands this. Until his former pastor, the Rev. _Jeremiah Wright_ (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/people/w/jeremiah_a_wright_jr/index.html?inline=nyt-per) , forced race into the political debate, Mr. Obama rarely dwelt on it. He gave his groundbreaking speech on race only in response to the Wright controversy. Indeed, after he effectively won the Democratic nomination on Tuesday, he left it to the media to point out the racial accomplishment, and the relative he thanked most emotively was the woman who raised him: his white grandmother. There is a reason for this. Race is one of the most contentious issues in American society, and, as with many contentious issues, Americans like to choose the middle path between perceived extremes. “In many ways, Obama is an ideal middle way person — he is just as white as he is black,” said _Alan Wolfe_ (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/people/w/alan_wolfe/index.htm l?inline=nyt-per) , a political science professor at _Boston College_ (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/organizations/b/boston_college/in dex.html?inline=nyt-org) . John McWhorter, who is a senior fellow at the Manhattan Institute, put it more bluntly: “White people are weary of the kinds of black people who are dedicated to indicting whites as racists. So, to be ‘too black’ is to carry an air about you that whites have something to answer for.” That was the root of Mr. Obama’s Jeremiah Wright problem. Mr. Wright spewed exactly the kind of angry racial repudiation that many whites associate with black leaders. _Orlando Patterson_ (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/people/p/orlando_patterson/index.html?inline=nyt-per) , a professor of sociology at Harvard, argues that the one arena where black grievance is acceptable is in music, particularly in hip-hop, where an estimated 70 percent of listeners are white. But the generation exposed to hip-hop, mostly under 40, are part of what Mr. Patterson calls a growing “ecumenical” American culture that is unselfconsciously multiracial. This Obama Generation came of age in the post-civil-rights age when color, though still relevant, had less impact on what one read, listened to or watched. It was the common crucible of popular culture, he said, that forged a truly American identity, rather than the “salad bowl” analogy cherished by diversity advocates. Mr. Obama’s campaign so de-emphasized race that for most of the 17-month nomination contest much of the news media became obsessed with the question of whether he was “black enough” to win black votes. Most African-American Democrats were for Hillary Clinton early on, until voters in Iowa proved to them that whites would support a black candidate. Congressman Jesse Jackson Jr. said that Mr. Obama, unlike the immediate successors of _Martin Luther King Jr._ (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/people/k/martin_luther_jr_king/index.html?inline=nyt-per) , understood the importance of language and the need
Re: [scifinoir2] Just Once (Was:Re: FW: Open Letter to Certain White Women Th...
In a message dated 6/8/2008 4:13:23 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: You make some good points. What is your take on my contention that white people don't have to proclaim their allegiance because they are on the only team that matters in America? I agree that whites do not have to declare an allegience. I am sure at times there are whites wo have be ridiculed when they decided to speak up for no white people. They have been called some colorful words. I am also sure that whites have to choose when they belong to a particular group such as religion, gender, sexual identity, marriage etc. I mean, you note one drop rule but you ignore the lunacy of it - that one drop of black blood somehow taints a person's whiteness. I understnad that rule. It has helped blacks achieve many goals that would have never been allowed. The one drop rule has helpe ease people into diveristy. Except for the taint of their tint both Barrack Obama and Halle Berry would well within their rights to proclaim themselves white the way Jews have done for centuries but simply changing Lifshitz to Lauren (I SO wish Ralph had kept his surname cause the notion of Lifshitz for Men cologne tickles the hell outta me!). I did not know that. My contention is that the only way a black people can compete on an equal standing with white people is when being black is as valued as much as being white - not when the notion of blackness has been eradicated like a bad virus. True equality happens when I bring as much to the table as they do. Great Points **Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch Cooking with Tyler Florence on AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/tyler-florence?video=4?NCID=aolfod000302) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: FW: Open Letter to Certain White Women Threatening to Wi...
In a message dated 6/8/2008 5:55:30 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I was planning to stay out of this but am I the only one here who thinks that this action would harm the feminist cause big time. As if IMO Clinton and her supporters actions have all but shattered the feminist faction big time. Highlighting the major splits between the white and eithinic factions of the movement. And in numerously was increasing the woman hatting feelings-especially among ethinics over this campaign. I think the woman hatting ( white woman) hating feeling were already there. Look at what happened in Massachusetts between a black man and white woman. The emphasis on voting for a woman whose husband was the first black president and an actural black president existed. You can thank Toni Morrison for that. She endorsed Obama for that reason. The medai made a big deal out of black females. Who are they going to vote for. A woman or a black man. Where does their loyalty lie. I kid you not that was am article title. Anderso Cooper made a big deal out of it. The ont that as a man( Obama had some advantages that females will not have. Even if he was a black man) Blacks were offended but it is true. Obama was treatd differently than a white man who could have been just as charismatic. Blacks may think that lesss qualified whites always get the job. There are whites that feel that less qualified non whties are there just to show diversity. **Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch Cooking with Tyler Florence on AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/tyler-florence?video=4?NCID=aolfod000302) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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In a message dated 6/7/2008 1:22:56 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Are there women, white or otherwise, really threatening to vote for a pig like Mccain because Obama is sexist? Can we offer them some hemlock? B A woman ran for vice president. Many people were uncomfortable with the idea. They thought a man with a woman vice presidnet was weak. Albright and Rice were seen as female dogs. Yes black men did not like rice because she was a woman. A woman has to be tought and gentle. A man does not hve that problem. Black men have their own issues. However they are still men. They are still part of the old boys network. The sma people who want the first lad to be quiet. Are the same people who do not want a first husband. Eliazbeth Edwards, Theresa Kerry, Hillary Clinton have all be paitned female dogs and told to shut up. Michell Obama will understand that soo enough. ( Not evrtything is racial). When Clinton cried, she was seen as not one fo the boys. She could not handle the pressue. I know of black men who did not like Condi Rice or because she was seen as a on emtional dog. Time Wise is an white guilt idiot. If you don't vote for Obama then you are a racist. If you don't support everything that Obama says, then you are a racist. Race guilt is far more senstive than gender guilt. You can tell a woman to quit complaing if she wants to become presidnet. You can not tell a black perosn that without becalled a racist. There are those who are Obama fans because they don't want a white person is office. There are those who are voting for Obama because they don't like white women. There are those who juthink a woman should be president. (alot of those are women) There are those that just don't like Clitnon. White people and everybody else can vote for anyone they damn well plese. You can't keep on laying the race guilt trip over people. As for switching their vote, so what. Blacks have said that they would switch their vote if Clinton became the presidential nominee. Obama supporters in general said that they would do that. you don't win these people back by shaming them. **Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch Cooking with Tyler Florence on AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/tyler-florence?video=4?NCID=aolfod000302) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] FW: Open Letter to Certain White Women Threatening to Withho...
In a message dated 6/7/2008 1:54:47 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: That doesn't really answer my question. Are there women, white or otherwise, really threatening to vote for a pig like Mccain because Obama is sexist? Can we offer them some hemlock? When have I ever answered a question directly. No you can not offer them hemlock. They are going to do what ever they want. **Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch Cooking with Tyler Florence on AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/tyler-florence?video=4?NCID=aolfod000302) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] Some thoughts on acting
I like Tennant. I just don't like it when he clinches and bares his teeth when he is supposed to get angry. It seems like overacting. I saw it again in a scene in the Harry POter movie. I do enjoy him as an actor. **Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch Cooking with Tyler Florence on AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/tyler-florence?video=4?NCID=aolfod000302) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] FW: Open Letter to Certain White Women Threatening to Withho...
Tracy It seems that any black person that is a republican is viewed with mistrust. Colin Powell was admired because he was an immigrant, was well spoken and intelligent worked hard and was Joint Chief of Staff. I knew of blacks who did not like him and called him a hi yella n* Uncle Tom. This was long before Bush II. There were black men and women who did not like Rice because she was a woman, was not soft, or curvy. She was portrayed as a buck tooth hag with bad hair. She had been called a black lesbian b who wanted to keep the black man down. This had nothing to do with their association with the Iraq war. From day one it was a running joke to poetry them as slaves on a Bush/Regan plantation. I don't think it helps race equality to pull the race card. However saying that makes you a self hating republican racist. It is funny that women have to prove that they are equal to men. However non whites can complain about every single perceived insult without any accountability difference of opinion. Blacks say that the Democratic Party takes them for granted. Why shouldn't they? Blacks make the republican party seems as the evil white Christian plantation empire. Why should they extend a hand of friendship to blacks? When Hillary is admired by republicans, Obama supporters said that it proves that she is a closet republican. Just go to any liberal website. When Obama is admired by Republicans, it shows that he has crossover appeal and is smart. I find that disgusting. I don't hate black men. I am quite the opposite. I love them. I grew up not liking those black feminists that really hated black men. Alice Walker, Bell Hooks I understood why black men hated The Color Purple. I never understood why black women spoke so nastily about black males in groups and in magazines. At the same time, black men are not born helpless victims. Black men can be sexist. They can be par of the old boys network: Remember when black men complained that a white woman would be elected president before them. They are wrong. I doubt black men can say that they are lower than white women right now. As you said, not everything is sexist. Well, not everything is racial. That is the biggest problem with this society. The constant claims of racism diminish the accomplishments of Obama and those that have fought for a raceless society. **Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch Cooking with Tyler Florence on AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/tyler-florence?video=4?NCID=aolfod000302) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
1212899372
Tracy These are not ghetto blacks. These are blacks that are professionals that are libera/moderate/republican in their viewpoints. I don't have issues with black men. I don't think that anyone that votes for Clinton has issues with black men. It is really insulting racist, sexist talking point. I have grown up around black men. I have much more respect than people like to admit. I have told that I hang around black men too much because I don't see the black female perspective. That does not mean I have to defend black men when they do wrong or have a difference of opinion. It does not mean that I have to vote for a black man. These so called horrible people are everyday people. If you sit down and talk to them you began to realize their viewpoints. You would be surprised how people really think if you allow them talk. There are those that pride themselves on being open minded but harbor some ill willed thoughts. Ferro is not my gal. However Obama is given a free ride because of his race. I believe that one of McCain's advisors quit because he did not want to attack Obama because it would come across as racial. I don't know many white men who would be president with only half a term in the Senate. It would not fly with white America. It would not fly with a woman. It is too sensitive to talk about qualifications with a black man. I don't think that we can claim that she is a closet Republican. Obama came up with peace with Palestine. He wanted to talk to our enemies. As a typically politician he has said that the nuclear option is on the table for Iran. He is a friend of Israel. Hid grandfather and Jewish friends made him understand Jews. He will talk tough to terrorists. He is flip flopper. He has no backbone and will say anything for votes. He is not new or exciting. There will not be any changes in the US foreign policy. He also condemn Carter. The enemy of Israel and condemned Hamas. US foreign policy will not change under him. I don't understand why it is so hard to understand. No, American president can hate Israel and love the Arabs. It will NEVER happen. They will not be elected. I do see myself as saying nasty things. If it is blunt, so be it. I don't see a woman becoming president anytime soon. Color will always trump gender. I doubt the country will elect a woman unless she is not white. I am not a white woman nor do I see myself as a mammy. However I can understand how some feel. A lot of them don't see themselves as white women. They are just women. Barak is a black man. He has a color and gender advantage over them. It is like electing a black woman. You get two for the price of one. I don't see it as privilege but frustration. White men don't like them because they are women. Non whites can't stand them because they are white. I told a group of white women that Hillary was their only chance of getting elected. As white woman no group wants them. I don't see many men of color supporting a white woman for the high-test office in the land. Especially when they can elect a man and a non white man. The women got upset. I don't no why. Everyone has gotten on the white women are evil bandwagon. If Rice would have run at least she could have been protected by her skin color. She is a double minority. Hillary is gone. However black men act as if they still lost. I still see Obama supporters calling Clinton racist and sexist names. This hatred has nothing to do with what the Clinton said. It is just pure and simple hate. **Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch Cooking with Tyler Florence on AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/tyler-florence?video=4?NCID=aolfod000302) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] OT: Joy and Anger on This Momentous Day
In a message dated 6/3/2008 11:00:53 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: This is an historic moment we should all celebrate, regardless of color, gender, or political leanings. We are witness to something that has not happened in all the centuries of the Republic. Whatever else you think or feel or look forward to, take a moment, just a moment, and really think about the power of this time. This is a time all our ancestors--those who cried and died and suffered and prayed and looked to Heaven--prayed for, a time when someone who looked like them could stand for the highest office in the land. I hope they're all looking down and smiling. I doubt it would be so historic if she had won the nomination. Color trumps gender in terms of emotion. It would not seen as monumental or emotional for the country. She is still white. Maybe that is why her supporters are ticked off. A man of a different color is still a man. Oh well, on to November **Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch Cooking with Tyler Florence on AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/tyler-florence?video=4?NCID=aolfod000302) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: OT:Top reasons Clinton should not get on dream ticket
In a message dated 5/20/2008 6:52:50 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: This is the same stubborn attitude that got us mired in Viet Nam and Iraq. Talking to insurgents that are not even recognize by the Iraq government will not help the situation. You can not be held hostage by someone who wants to fill his fathers;s shoes. Who are They? Iseal has and American Jewish groups have forced Obama to do a 180 on his views on the Isreal states. Jimmy Carter, the greatest ex-president ever, is an intelligent and moral man. Jimmy Carters was not very good as a President. As president he made intelligent and moral decisions. He was undermined by a not-so-liberal media, a facile political opportunist named Ronald Reagan and the on-going stupidity of the American people. Of coursee nothing is ever his fault. He knew that the Shah was trouble but toasted him in Iran. First he praises him, then abandons him. 444 days / Rising inflation and unemployment did not help him. Last time I checked, there was a surplus when Bush took office. Clintons the evil racist man did not. Lat time eI checked Democrats were spending money like crazy. Last time I checked the Democrats did not have the votes to bring the troops home. Lat time I checked Democrats still allowed jobs to go overseas. My history book fails to note that the concept of eminent domain was fashioned during the Clinton Administration. Further, the liberal judges who sided with them were put on the bench by those noted liberals Reagan and Bush. True. It was the evil conservative judges that voted against it. Obama is sitting on a quarter billion dollar campaign fund raised ten to one hundred dollars at a time. How does that make him beholden to Corporate America? You don't get that kind of money from little kids empyting their piggy banks.. _http://www.alternet.org/election08/72079/_ (http://www.alternet.org/election08/72079/) **Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod000301) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: OT:Top reasons Clinton should not get on dream ticket
In a message dated 5/20/2008 8:20:41 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Gymfig, the Republicans don't want intelligent people. Just ones smart enough to press the touch-screen option next to their candidates' names. They're afraid of all of us pointy-headed liberals... So once again. If you vote for Obama you are intelligent. If yoy vote for Clinton or the Republcians you are stupid. **Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod000301) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
1211307645
In a message dated 5/20/2008 9:47:58 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: He is beholden to corporate America, as they contributed to his campaign and will continue to do so. But he is more beholden to the people and less beholden to those in power than any other successful politician in recent history. However, the key to getting what we want from him is to use that power and I fear people do not yet know how to do it. You must be talking about Blacks. Every group has asked What are you goint to do for me? Latinos, Asian, Arabs, coporate America, white women, white men, Working class whites, jews,the Military, Nasa etc. Blacks are th only group that has given him their support without any question. Please don't talk abut how Clinton threw it away. Please don't tell me he is not running for president of black America. When evver Blacks question him, they are called sellouts or are jealous. As long blacck gave Obama 90% of their vote hed can tell them to repsect the verdict and don't riot. As long as black voted overwhelming democratic, he does not have to go to Memphis and talk abou MLK. As along as blacks refuse to use their over their political spower as a small hiccup he does nto have to worry about appearing more black. IThe only pwoer blacks still have is the race card. Whites are racist. Whites have to talk about race. Obama has used our money as well has the big ticket player's money to build an infrastructure to bring about true change.. What change? Will he change the way politicans do business? No. He will just His grassroots network. He has trained people to change the system, connected disparate people with their common interests, showed them how to coalesce their money and enabled people to take leadership roles in his campaign so they can flex their activist muscle. Seems like politics as usual. I don't see change, I just see a Jesus Christ type figure using disapointed people to get into office. Additionally, his plan involves working to assist down ticket candidates on the local level. He also periodically hints that if he is president, you will have to make him make the changes you want. Just last week he launched the grassroots civil rights fellowship and set up a massive civil rights voting program that threatens to make the republicans a fringe group. Same democratic/NACCP shell game that most black preachers having been pushing every election year. He has laid the groundwork for a nationwide grassroots takeover of government agenda. How? He uses the same soundbites that the media has talked about . He can not overtly tell us what to do with it or it will be shut down before it is empowered. There is some sign that people are using it. I hope we figure it out and take advantage of it It really sounds like some hippie cult that does not understand the realities of life. **Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod000301) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: OT:Top reasons Clinton should not get on dream ticket
In a message dated 5/20/2008 9:49:29 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Please do not go out into public saying things like this. Iraq HAD a government. We KILLED them. We may have gone to war for the wrong reasons but I am sure that the Shiites and Saudia Arabia are not missing them that much. **Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod000301) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: OT:Top reasons Clinton should not get on dream ticket
You are right Tracey. Obama is gaining among Clinton votes. The Gallup poll suggest as much. I also feel that he may even win KY. I have to agree that Obam ran a more effective campaign. I do NOT agree that anyone that votes for Clinto is a uneducated inforative hick **Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod000301) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: OT:Top reasons Clinton should not get on dream ticket
In a message dated 5/19/2008 4:49:01 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Yours is an interesting prospective. One shared by 94% of the electorate in West Virginia (one of our more progessive states). It is also interesting to me that, nationally, the 50% of white democrats that support Obama is the 50% that can read and write and count to ten without taking off their shoes. Hillary must be proud to be the candidate of the uninformed and the uneducated. ~rave! So Clinton voters are uneducated hicks while Obama suupports are uneducated integrationist liberals. Who is the racist? . Clinton is a politician. Obama got upset with Wright because he called Obama a politician. No wonder there are those that don't like him. Maybe it is the same people that don't want to sit down with people who need terrorism so they don't have to answer to their people on why they have not fixed their own country's problems, have illegal immigration, have more H1-B cheap labor, have their income taxed to no in, think NASA should be funded, contnue our place in Iraq. Obama tolds blacks in NY to respect the verdict of Sean Bell and not riot. Can you imagine Clinton saying that? Can you imagine any white person saying that? Clinton said it was wrong. Obama held his finger up to Jena 6 to see which way the wind blew. If they are so similar in viewpoints, why is it okay for blacks to vote for a black man but wrong for whites to vote for a white person or a white woman? I have always been a moderate Democrat. I really don't want a world apologist in teh White House. **Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod000301) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
1211240330
In a message dated 5/19/2008 6:24:23 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Amen to that! And she will have no problem blowing up innocent people with her testicular fortitude As opposed to a man that cannot find his when it comes to issues of his former mentor, other black leaders and the Palestinians? **Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod000301) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
1211253741
got really confused trying to hack through the thicket of the above paragraph. Took me a couple of readings to realize you had swallowed the Republican propaganda about Obama being soft on terrorism because he actually wanted to talk to lawfully elected leaders. Truly remarkable anyone would believe anything the Republicans have to say in light of how badly they have mangled the economy and America' stature in the world. Talking to Hama is not an option Talking to Hezzbolah is not an option Obama had to back pedel because he got in trouble with the Isreal and Jewish groups. What makes you think that they will allow him to get away with that? Jimmy Carter tried to talk. He allowed the hostages to be taken. He was weak. He was a punk. Going to speak to Hamas and Isreal make him look stupid. The raising taxes boogie man is equally amusing. Of course, the Republicans don't raise taxes - they lower them, mouth pious platitudes and continue to spend like drunken sailors. Kind of like those Democrats who control the Congress t Your grandchildren's grandchildren will be saddled with paying off the Bush/Cheney deficit. Something that Clinton did not do. I guess Bill was not that bad. I already know what the Clintons did in office. Everytime the going got hard - they cut bait and ran. The Clintons had a chance to stock the Federal judiciary with moderate democrats and instead let the Republicans stonewall them until Bush became president. What did Bush do? Stock the Federal judiciary with conservative republicans. These judges serve for life. I don't have a problem with him. They have made decisions that I don'thave a problem with. Even the liberal judges have sided with them. It was the liberal judegs that said it was okay for the goverment to take your property for public use. I don't know how Obama will perform in office - but at least he will arrive in office unbeholden to anyone but the millions of average, hardworking Americans who financed his campaign. He will have to pay back Corporate America. They put him in office. He will also have to pay off the oil companies. They can destroy him. Gymfig **Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod000301) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] Fox Unveils New SF Strategy
In a message dated 5/16/2008 4:17:26 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I had hopes for it. And then I realized that it was a Fox show. :( True LOL! **Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod000301) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
1211165298
In a message dated 5/18/2008 10:03:34 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: The second reason? Hillary's ambition. This lady wants to be Prez, and everything from her veiled racist strategy (I get hard-working, white voters) to the other dirty tricks show she'd work behind the scenes to undermine Obama. I think-and I believe Obama thinks--that she'd be plotting against him all the time she's grinning in his face. She's in her 60's now, think she wants to wait *eight* years and try again? No way in hell. And trying to be a VP who then steps out and challenges your Prez in the next election, how damaging would that be? Has that ever been done, a VP challenging his sitting Prez for the nomination? Talk about a mess. I can't see Obama wanting to deal with that potential hazard. What makes you think Obama is going to get two terms? Obama does not have support among Regan democrats. He does not have support among a lot of whites. What is so racist about that? He does have 90% of the black vote. (Blacks always have voted demarcate. By falling for the Obama's run is a fairy tale myth: He got all of the vote) White people are the majority and they are splitting the vote. Latinos are the largest minority and vote republican or have voted for her. It is not racist that she points that out. It is also not racist if you do not vote for Obama. I admire her ambition and not being quiet. She brings in people that WILL NOT vote for him and will either vote for Mccain or not vote at all. Dick Cheney was running the White House. He made Bush look electable. The VP needs to be strong if the Pres cannot not run the country. It is not Hillary's fault she was running for POTUS. People act as if she is was wrong for running against Obama. He is not entitled to be sheltered from scrutiny just because he is both black and a man. She is his opponent. What is she supposed to do? **Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod000301) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] New Member Saying Hi
Yes!!! A news start!! dont' believe what people say about me!!! LOL! Gytmfig **Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod000301) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] Fox Unveils New SF Strategy
So New Amsterdam is cancelled? How sad. **Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod000301) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] Fox Unveils New SF Strategy
In a message dated 5/16/2008 4:17:26 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I had hopes for it. I enjoyed it. I hate it when show don't last. I still can't remember that SF show that was on CBS a couple of years ago that was on Tuesday or Friday nights. **Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod000301) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[scifinoir2] Was the Last Cylon Just revealed????
Anybody Watching? I never thought of that person What do you think **Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod000301) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] Was the Last Cylon Just revealed????
In a message dated 5/16/2008 9:55:31 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I'm watching, but I don't think so. I'm sticking with the Admiral for my choice. It makes sense with what deanna said! **Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod000301) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] Was the Last Cylon Just revealed????
In a message dated 5/16/2008 10:13:58 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Can't remember what D'Anna said. Also can't remember what I had for lunch, so... Seriously, I sense a big-a$$ game of three-card monte going on here, trying to draw eyes away from the big pic. I said the Admiral end of S2, and I'm sticking with it. She saw the fifth cylon and said sorry. Why would she say sorry to the Admiral? This episode made sense. It does not make sense for the Admiral. I thought it was Dee. **Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod000301) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] Was the Last Cylon Just revealed????
In a message dated 5/16/2008 10:26:21 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Oh, *that* line. No, no reason for that. But I still stick to my assessment that they're snowing us. Remember when they were supposedly going to reveal the faces of the Final Five in one season finale, even going so far as to put a pic of five people in white robes in the opera house online. That turned out to be nothing more than five cast members at random, nothing more than a stunt. But alot of things are coming true. It has too be. **Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod000301) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] OT:Nothing wrong with depicting Obama as a monkey
In a message dated 5/15/2008 7:30:27 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: As I've said time and again, any descendants of General Sherman are welcome to re-enact his March to the Sea... It's truly a blessing to be so favored in the world that you can be oblivious of offenses you render on others. Weell add blacks to that, because I have been on alot of black websites. They think Obama looks like Curious George too. There are not blacks on KKK websitess or blacksthateObamaandlovewhites.com. they don't see anything wrong witih it. Yes they support Obama too. **Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod000301) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Are their any left wing military sci-fi writers?
What defines a left-wing sci fi writer? It is okay for the aliens to invade and kill us? It is okay for the underclass to steal the magic crystal and destroy the ruling class? It terms of real life application: Americans must allow illegal and anyone they want into this country? Americans must apologize and sit down with our enemies? Americans are evil and need to apologize to every non white group and be open to homosexuality? What is defines a writer as left wing?? **Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod000301) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Are their any left wing military sci-fi writers?
In a message dated 5/15/2008 11:30:49 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I probably be more clear on this one but it's basically doing the type of stuff you see our military doing now. namely all liberal's are bad, all Conservatives are good. The good guys always strike first (even if there's no reason to), stuff like That. Things like that. -GTW I thought that was right wing sci fi? What is left wing sci fi? Isn't that liberals are good, and conservatives are bad. Helo who was in a relationship with a Cylon did not allow them to be used as test subjects to destroy the Cylons was justified. If that is left wing sci fi then I don't like it. I hate the sci fi on American shows because it is so predictable. We must interfere in other cultures because it is wrong to sacrifice the princess. The scientist who allowed the military to die because they wanted research is right. **Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod000301) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] OT: Black is finally in fashion at Vogue
I don't see what the big deal is. If you look at black magazines, there is a certian look You will not see many models that have dark skin or have braids. I don't seem to understand why people point the fingers at whites. **Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod000301) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: OT: Black is finally in fashion at Vogue
In a message dated 5/14/2008 9:34:00 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I really, really, REALLY want to comment on this, but I can't think of a really, really, REALLY nice way to do it. Hold that thought. ~(no)rave! Let me explain. I am a client pushing a perfume. I want people to feel that they are a fairy princess. I want a model that can be made up as a fairy princess. People associate princess with youth, thinness, long flowing hair. Not many white women are going to get the part. There are some black models that I would consider. I would not just want someone that looks white. I want someone that looks like an believalbe Elvis princess. If you look at black print ads, you see the same thing. We see woman with certain looks. I never see someone that has braids or dreads in an ad when they are pushing the all together upper middle class sista. I have seen women with beautiful locs but they look a certain way. It does not mean that a black woman should not have braids. It just means that certain images resonate better with the public. Roshumba Williams had the ability to change. She could be any kind of woman. Is their prejudice? Yes, Is it wrong. Yes, However it seems that entertainment pushes a look that everyone is used too. I see ads were the dark skin black woman with natural hair is used as the one that stand out. She is edgy. I hate that it seems that is the only way that dark skin black woman get work. Tracy I don't know anything about the fashion industry. You do. I was not trying to insult you on any level. I have seen your pics and you are a very beautiful woman. When you look at modeling or entertainment you understand the look that people want. **Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod000301) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] OT: Black is finally in fashion at Vogue
In a message dated 5/14/2008 10:05:43 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Good question. The answer is: Vogue has a larger circulation than Vibe. And so, if you're going to be the official documentation of fashion culture, having nothing but white people in your photo essays is Completely inaccurate. The fact is that until somebody Black, Brown, or Asian rocks your design, it's not hot. Vibe does not cater to everyone. They cater the hip hop and RB population. The urban market. That is very limiting. Vogue markets itself as the magazine for the beautiful upscale put together woman. It can add more non white models. However it is not going to add models that look as if they just stared in a hip hop video. It does not matter the color of the model it is the image that you portray. Just look at the models in Ebony and Essence. They have a certain look. It has changed over the years. You will still not see a lot of models with braids in there either. **Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod000301) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] The Electric Company Returns
It is going to do as well as \the Zoom remake. Just bring back the old shows. Sesame Street, Mr. Rogers Neighborhood, The Electric Company 3-2-1 Contact and Zoom. *sigh* Those were the days. **Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod000301) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [scifinoir2] OT: Black is finally in fashion at Vogue
In a message dated 5/14/2008 11:05:14 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: 1. The Hip Hop and RB Popoulation is a multi-billion dollar, multicultural market with a median age of around 30. The Hip Hop and RB population includes people who are in the market for yachts as well as people who are comparing health insurance providers for their families. How man jewish, homosexual, asian, hispanic, native american, arab, white, surburban hip hop rapers and RB singers do you know that are the top of the charts? 2. This is not a magazine for the beautiful upscale put together woman. It is a series of historical documents that will be part of many other documents that people in the future wil look back upon and judge us with. How do I know this? When I look at pictures of Vogue, I don't see women in apple bottom jeans or blue jean mini skirts. Vogue Magazine, and any magazine with a high ciurculation, has two responsibilities: one to its advertisers, and two to be accurate. In the case of Fashion magazines, in the 21st Century, there is no excuse. People still buy the magazine. Unless whites start complaining it is not gong to happen. Non whites will still buy the product even if there isn't any non white person presented. If General Motors and Proctor Gamble can have ethnic peopole in THEIR ads, and they are selling stuff people actually USE, then surely these fashion brands can knock it off. You are seeling a look / image. You are not selling a look with GE. You are selling a product. They don't care what you look like, as long as you buy it. You see ads with a light skin black woman and a dark skin black man. Blakcs will STILL buy it. The editorial staffs of these magazine must first make their magazine more reflective of the fantasy they are trying to sell. White women wish they had Halle Berry's body just as much as they wish they had Heidi Klum's. Thandie Newton looks great in Gucci. Alek Wek and Oluchi Onweagba have bodies that illustrate a designer's new dress just as well as Nadine Wolfbeisser or Victoria Wallace -- if not better! It's easy to dismiss this as it's just fashion -- believe me I understand -- but in many cases, it's not. It's culture. It's history. I don't think that white women wish to have a black woman's body. That is a myth. There are different body types that can sell. You don't have to use a black face to sell the body type. You can use a white woman that has fuller breasts or hips. You don't need a black face. It is funny, Kim Kardashian has a fuller body. The perception is that she gets alot of attention from black men and women. I can hire her for work without having to hire an actually black woman. **Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod000301) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
