Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
Well, I have to laugh, I just spent some time setting up a dual 200MHz Pentium Pro machine (lovely old Tyan m/b and 1Gb of ram!), hooked up to an old Apple 15AV monitor, and loaded with netBSD. Is this the future for Apple fans? :-) John On Jun 5, 2005, at 8:09 PM, John Niven wrote: I just heard that Apple will switch to Intel CPU's for future products. Mac OS - OSX - Linux 68K - PPC - x86 The future is for geeks John -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
John Niven wrote: Well, I have to laugh, I just spent some time setting up a dual 200MHz Pentium Pro machine (lovely old Tyan m/b and 1Gb of ram!), hooked up to an old Apple 15AV monitor, and loaded with netBSD. Is this the future for Apple fans? Its the present except the nice mac screens are bigger and the OS has more bells and whistles. Do they make NetBSD for alpha? -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
Yes they do; http://www.netbsd.org/Ports/alpha/ On 30 Jun 2005, at 11:51, Darren wrote: John Niven wrote: Well, I have to laugh, I just spent some time setting up a dual 200MHz Pentium Pro machine (lovely old Tyan m/b and 1Gb of ram!), hooked up to an old Apple 15AV monitor, and loaded with netBSD. Is this the future for Apple fans? Its the present except the nice mac screens are bigger and the OS has more bells and whistles. Do they make NetBSD for alpha? -- André Skarzynski email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://homepage.mac.com/andresk/ -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
Andre Skarzynski wrote: Yes they do; http://www.netbsd.org/Ports/alpha/ :) excellent, thank you both for the idea and link. -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Best said reference yet [Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???]
On 25 Jun 2005, at 06:48, NODEraser wrote: I wonder if Sonnet got the chips for its upgrade cards from IBM, or if they made their own? My Sonnet G4 in my BW is not made by Sonnet - I think it's copyright stamped as Motorola but that means it could be either a Moto or an IBM. I've never popped the sink off my 9600s Sonnet G3 chip but from other people's experiences most of them seem to be IBMs. -- Mark Benson AIM - SilValleyPirate MSN - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit FlatPackMacs online: http://fpm.68kmac.com Visit my Homepage: http://homepage.mac.com/markbenson Introducing Macintosh Classic II - pick one out on your way past the trash! -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
OT: Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
This is a veritable Essay and most of it's off topic so read it at your peril... On 24 Jun 2005, at 09:56, Darren wrote: Pretty much sums it up for me, I dont understand how you compare a MacOS on Mac hardware and Windoze on every piece o crap hardware thats ever been invented. Most pc users have never flashed their mobo bio's for example, a Mac on the other hand does whats needed at each update. Not really a viable option for M$ is it, really? I'm not complaining about the hardware, my personal PC hardware has always been of the highest quality I can afford and has seldom been at fault. I just don't find the Windows interface intuitive. It's as simple as that. We paid for 10.4 server to replace OS9 and AppleshareIP in our x- platform office, 1 day it lasted. All sorts of problems running MYOB which we have used since the Colour Classic was new, problems networking with both the imacs and pc. And you think that's never happened to anyone upgrading a Windows or Linux network? Were you still using the Old World version of MYOB that you had when the Color Classic was new? ?If so whoever expected that to work with OS X needs their head examined. Things move on. Technology occasionally advances to a point where, despite a lot of swearing and blustering, you have to change systems. The reason it hit your office so hard is that on the Mac it hasn't happened since the introduction of System 7. Apple don't up and change the whole rule book every 5 years like Microsoft. People in Windows offices get hit by this little darling of an issue every 5-7 years. Think yourself lucky this is the first time it's happened since you installed MYOB back in 1993! Also servers and networks are an entirely different matter here. They are a law unto themselves. I was purely discussing the client OS side and usability. If you want to pull server OSs apart then OS X server is still way behind in terms of features. It doesn't have the hardcore security of Linux or the feature-rich out of the box status of Windows Server. It's good but it's got a long way to go. I like *using* XP even on this 6 year old ex celeron 600. ;) this board was a good buy, it's come a long way so deserves to still be used for email and surfing and mac emulation - well not Pear, thats for the 3.6 that doesn't go online to often. I rarely use Windows without swearing at it at least once because it does something I didn't want it to. It's not just that I'm used to a Mac because I use a Windows machine more on an hours/day basis than a Mac. It's simply that me and Windows don't compute. Moving from AmigaOS to Mac was a hard, to move again to the pc was complete chaos for me, in the end I stopped trying to compare everthing else to what I was used to, once I'd done that I could finally understand Nix. :) and enjoy what was in front of me for its good and bad points. Odd you should mention Amiga OS. I've used OS 3.1 and 3.9 on my 2 Amiga 1200s and find them quite enlightening (despite the fact I'm currently all fingers and thumbs on an Amiga but I'm still learning!). It's a good OS. You could stack up your pennies and buy an AmigaONE ;o) A MacOS on intel will not loose its soul it will still be different in a mac sort of way, it will still come in a cutting edge box and take a different approach to the way you work on your computer. Personally I'd like to see it try to cover everything XP-pro does in the way of hardware but no one does that do they? :) No, not even Windows XP Pro ;o) P4 3.6, it will be a while before Pentium D gets to 3.6, dual cores +intel=heat if developers are getting 3.6 boxes now it narrows your choices down a bit. Yes but 2 cores means it's (almost) twice as fast so the question is begged that if Apple take advantage of the computational power of Dual-Core Intel CPUs then do they need to be 3.6GHz? Alot changes in 2 years. Mac users are very adaptable, I'm sure to be reading a whole different lot of Windows bashing in three years time, I trust that wont change. ;) I'd like to see OS wars on a even playing field, if that doesn't happen I'll side with Jeff on this one. I just voice what I find unsatisfactory. If that involves bashing an OS then I'll go there. For what it's worth I have voiced plenty of displeasure with OS X over the 4 years I've been using it. I just believe that, on the client side at least, OS X is somewhat more developed. All OSs have bugs and missives, and I have the patience of a saint, but not all of them constantly annoy me, as Windows has done for the past 13 years consistently. I bet even St. Peter would mutter something and get out a roll of duct tape if one of those clouds at the gates of heaven kept dripping on him for 13 years... -- Mark Benson AIM - SilValleyPirate MSN - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit FlatPackMacs online: http://fpm.68kmac.com Visit my Homepage:
Re: Best said reference yet [Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???]
Even back then, making silicon is both technically challenging and VERY expensive. John On Jun 24, 2005, at 10:48 PM, NODEraser wrote: I wonder if Sonnet got the chips for its upgrade cards from IBM, or if they made their own? -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
On 24 Jun 2005, at 05:18, NODEraser wrote: I started using Macs and PCs at about the same time (1990 or so), and have continued to use both over the years. I don't find either OS particularly difficult to use or navigate, but perhaps it's just because I have grown with them. I work on a PC everyday at work and use a Mac at home all the time. There are just some things, a lot of which I mentioned, that just bite when they keep happening every day and you know there is a better alternative but can't get to it (bosses are totally anti-Mac). I don't have a problem using Windows, I've been using it since 1992, and have used every version bar Me (for which I should be truly thankful - I went with 2000 :o) ). I know Windows inside out for the most part. I just don't think it's as intuitive to use on an 'everyday' basis as Mac OS X. OpenOffice has many things to work out before it can become a serious competitor with Microsoft Office. It's still really buggy, and there are some semi-important things (in my opinion) that you just can't do, like only print a selected page(s) from a spreadsheet. I know Excel 2000 can't do that either and it's annoying as hell. Also they nee d a Preview pane in the File - Open dialog so you can see what you are opening without having to open it. If you're interested try version 1.94 BETA. It's a lot better than 1.1.4 and seems to work OK despite being a beta. The biggest issue I have with OO is that it's slow as hell cause a lot of it is written in Java. -- Mark Benson AIM - SilValleyPirate MSN - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit FlatPackMacs online: http://fpm.68kmac.com Visit my Homepage: http://homepage.mac.com/markbenson Never send a human to do a machine's job. -The Matrix -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Best said reference yet [Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???]
On 24 Jun 2005, at 05:13, NODEraser wrote: Approximately when did IBM start making PPC processors? I thought the first PPCs were Motorola... As far as I know either IBM started the PowerPC design in the 80's or it was a joint IBM/Moto project from the start. Either way IBM have always had at least shared copyright over elements of the PPC design. The only one they don't own rights to is the G4 (75xx) design which was Motorola's own project. Motorola have now pulled out of the PPC project altogether, and I wouldn't be surprised if they handed exclusive rights to their stuff to IBM (that's not confirmed anywhere BTW, it's pure conjecture). I believe IBM own the rights to the G3. That means they may also own the 603. As that piccy of Dana's showed (thanks gal :o) ) IBM also produced 601s (I have exactly the same chip on my 7100/80 board) under their copyright. 604s I'm not sure about, I think IBM produced them under license from Motorola, same with G4s. I think IBM made little to no G4s though. A lot of ifs and buts and maybes there, but suffice to say IBM have been in PPCs as long as they've been around. -- Mark Benson AIM - SilValleyPirate MSN - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit FlatPackMacs online: http://fpm.68kmac.com Visit my Homepage: http://homepage.mac.com/markbenson Introducing Macintosh Classic II - pick one out on your way past the trash! -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Best said reference yet [Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???]
On 24 Jun 2005, at 05:13, NODEraser wrote: Approximately when did IBM start making PPC processors? I thought the first PPCs were Motorola... What would we do without Wikipedia ;o) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PowerPC It appears that it was an IBM project from the start. -- Mark Benson AIM - SilValleyPirate MSN - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit FlatPackMacs online: http://fpm.68kmac.com Visit my Homepage: http://homepage.mac.com/markbenson Never send a human to do a machine's job. -The Matrix -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Best said reference yet [Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???]
Worth mentioning when it comes to who owns what part of the PowerPC arch, and what can be done with it -- Straight from IBM's page: http://www-128.ibm.com/developerworks/power/newto/#3 the architecture specifies an instruction set architecture (ISA) that allows anyone to design and fabricate PowerPC-compatible processors, and source code for software modules developed in support of PowerPC is freely available. PowerPC is an open standard, and anyone can start making PowerPC chips They then link to a licensing page that mentions licensing for the PPC 4xx cores - which may be the only models that IBM both own copyright to AND also license out for others to use - but doesn't necessarily mean they are the ONLY powerpc chips that can be made by anybody else. dana -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Best said reference yet [Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???]
--- Dana Sibera [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 24/06/2005, at 2:13 PM, NODEraser wrote: Approximately when did IBM start making PPC processors? I thought the first PPCs were Motorola... A very long time: http://www.danaquarium.com/gallery/beige/ppc601?full=1 Motorola has never had the chip fab capacity to meet demand, so they contracted out to IBM to use their chip fabrication facilities. It will be total Fandemonium! August (Fri) 5th, (Sat) 6th (Sun) 7th, 2005 http://www.fandemonium.org __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Best said reference yet [Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???]
--- Mark Benson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: clip A lot of ifs and buts and maybes there, but suffice to say IBM have been in PPCs as long as they've been around. IBM has been in RISC CPUs since the beginning of the concept. Look up the IBM/RT series of computers. The first RT CPU design was built with discrete components on a circuit board to get the design working, then it was translated into an IC chip. Just think of trying that with something like a G5 or P4 or Athlon 64-FX CPU. ;) It will be total Fandemonium! August (Fri) 5th, (Sat) 6th (Sun) 7th, 2005 http://www.fandemonium.org __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
NODEraser wrote: I started using Macs and PCs at about the same time (1990 or so), and have continued to use both over the years. I don't find either OS particularly difficult to use or navigate, but perhaps it's just because I have grown with them. Pretty much sums it up for me, I dont understand how you compare a MacOS on Mac hardware and Windoze on every piece o crap hardware thats ever been invented. Most pc users have never flashed their mobo bio's for example, a Mac on the other hand does whats needed at each update. Not really a viable option for M$ is it, really? As a linux user who relies on open source goodness, Linus is not the be all desktop nor should it be touted, it keeps getting better and has a way to go yet. You can't beat the price and no one is sorry that no companies where bought to to add function to the OS. OpenOffice has many things to work out before it can become a serious competitor with Microsoft Office. It's still really buggy, and there are some semi-important things (in my opinion) that you just can't do, like only print a selected page(s) from a spreadsheet. Little to far OT from the old nanny. :) It's free, if there's a problem join the development crew or the forum. We paid for 10.4 server to replace OS9 and AppleshareIP in our x-platform office, 1 day it lasted. All sorts of problems running MYOB which we have used since the Colour Classic was new, problems networking with both the imacs and pc. Installed by the Mac tech at the local over priced mac dealer we are back running OS9 and ASIP6.1.3 (there's another joke, ASIP6.1.3) with a rain check on a OS that will work on our server and do the freaken job. In OSX's defence linux can't do the job either and only fixes half the problems. Now please Mark what large holes are you talking about? I like looking at OSX, its like a Fisher-Price toy for kids. I like *using* XP even on this 6 year old ex celeron 600. ;) this board was a good buy, it's come a long way so deserves to still be used for email and surfing and mac emulation - well not Pear, thats for the 3.6 that doesn't go online to often. Moving from AmigaOS to Mac was a hard, to move again to the pc was complete chaos for me, in the end I stopped trying to compare everthing else to what I was used to, once I'd done that I could finally understand Nix. :) and enjoy what was in front of me for its good and bad points. A MacOS on intel will not loose its soul it will still be different in a mac sort of way, it will still come in a cutting edge box and take a different approach to the way you work on your computer. Personally I'd like to see it try to cover everything XP-pro does in the way of hardware but no one does that do they? :) P4 3.6, it will be a while before Pentium D gets to 3.6, dual cores+intel=heat if developers are getting 3.6 boxes now it narrows your choices down a bit. Alot changes in 2 years. Mac users are very adaptable, I'm sure to be reading a whole different lot of Windows bashing in three years time, I trust that wont change. ;) I'd like to see OS wars on a even playing field, if that doesn't happen I'll side with Jeff on this one. For what little its worth there's a nice story about M$ buying G5 macs to run emulation of the X-box 360 for developement on either Znet or Cnet - come's around goes around in this case? Is the x-box the only computer M$ has made? I call it a computer as you can run serval nix distros, downloads found on most public ftp servers along with a couple of emulators that I know of. Gregg? Well normally...Cheers. -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Best said reference yet [Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???]
--- Dana Sibera [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: clip They then link to a licensing page that mentions licensing for the PPC 4xx cores - which may be the only models that IBM both own copyright to AND also license out for others to use - but doesn't necessarily mean they are the ONLY powerpc chips that can be made by anybody else. Sooo, Intel/AMD/VIA/SiS/whomever, could, if they wanted, say thankyewverymuchIBM and start producing PPC CPUs? Nifty. It will be total Fandemonium! August (Fri) 5th, (Sat) 6th (Sun) 7th, 2005 http://www.fandemonium.org __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
--- Darren [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: clip For what little its worth there's a nice story about M$ buying G5 macs to run emulation of the X-box 360 for developement on either Znet or Cnet - come's around goes around in this case? clip Gregg? Well normally...Cheers. Huh? Wah? I was sleeping there. X-Box? For cripe's sake I only just recently bought a SEGA Dreamcast... Don't talk to me about no X-Box... ;) It will be total Fandemonium! August (Fri) 5th, (Sat) 6th (Sun) 7th, 2005 http://www.fandemonium.org __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
Gregg Eshelman wrote: Huh? Wah? I was sleeping there. X-Box? For cripe's sake I only just recently bought a SEGA Dreamcast... Don't talk to me about no X-Box... ;) My last was the N64 for $25, a couple of good emulators for both mac and pc getting about for that one , I should see a x-box sometime soon for around the same price. Got to love progress when your not hating it. Sega lost me with the MegaDrive and cd-rom expansion. My spelling is very worse than normal tonight. :) cheers -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Best said reference yet [Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???]
I wonder if Sonnet got the chips for its upgrade cards from IBM, or if they made their own? On 6/24/05, Gregg Eshelman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- Dana Sibera [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: clip They then link to a licensing page that mentions licensing for the PPC 4xx cores - which may be the only models that IBM both own copyright to AND also license out for others to use - but doesn't necessarily mean they are the ONLY powerpc chips that can be made by anybody else. Sooo, Intel/AMD/VIA/SiS/whomever, could, if they wanted, say thankyewverymuchIBM and start producing PPC CPUs? Nifty. It will be total Fandemonium! August (Fri) 5th, (Sat) 6th (Sun) 7th, 2005 http://www.fandemonium.org __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Best said reference yet [Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???]
On 22 Jun 2005, at 04:06, Dylan McDermond wrote: The best bet is the future Pentium M derivatives Current rumoring suggests Pentium M for mobile and small form factor machines (read Mac mini, Powerbook, iBook) and Pentium D Dual Core CPUs where the G5 is currently (iMac and PowerMac). If they can tune OS X and their Pro Apps to get the most out of the Pentium D it'll be a good computer. The reason the higher-end machines will not be out next year is because the Pentium D has only just been unveiled and Apple and Intel still need time to co-develop the new architecture to hone it to the sorts of levels that the PowerMac G5 is at. Anyone who thinks Apple will mod stock PC boards to work as Macs doesn't know Apple. They will want boards done to their own spec. They quite possibly will use some other Intel components, the laptops for example will likely have built-in Centrino mobile technology for wireless rather than AE (that means Apple laptops will finally have WiFi built-in as standard, as current Intel based PC laptops tend to). They may also use part or all of the Intel motherboard chipset. The boards however will be custom layouts. One thing I also think Apple may well do is either solder down the CPUs, or alternatively use a non-PC standard socket pattern for the CPU. That said however they have, for all their protestations, not been totally adverse to CPU upgrades in the past. You never know we may in the future be able to upgrade the CPUs on our Macs with off-the-shelf stock from an PC vendor. How cool is that! Dell already have a Pentium D PC out but *that* operating system isn't in the slightest optimised for EM64T *OR* Dual Core so it's pretty much a waste of money in the Windows world, at least for now. Re: the reference that was originally quoted, that reference refers completely to Intel's Itanium IA64 architecture, which is a dead duck. Intel have developed EM64T which is easy to support alongside AMD's AMD64 line, and so I believe the IA64 line will be phased out within 18 months in favour of a line of high-end EM64T chips, maybe with inbuilt IA64 legacy translation. Either way Apple are not using IA64. I am not even totally sure IA64 is x86 compatible. Also I'd like to point out to those that were muttering about Intel making PowerPC CPUs that IBM own all the patents to PowerPC and POWER technology. Apple can't just walk up to Intel and ask to make PPCs - the designs are not Apple's to hand out. It simply would not be possible. IBM and Intel might co-operate (begrudgingly) in the low- end Server market but they are both producing chips and thus are rivals in CPU terms. It'd be like Apple giving Microsoft the keys to OS X... Either way that rumor is dead as the line is confirmed to be x86. -- Mark Benson AIM - SilValleyPirate MSN - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit FlatPackMacs online: http://fpm.68kmac.com Visit my Homepage: http://homepage.mac.com/markbenson Introducing Macintosh Classic II - pick one out on your way past the trash! -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
On 20 Jun 2005, at 15:02, Marco van de Voort wrote: I'm no real mac'er, but I'd say it is the software/hardware integration. The OS is decent, but not vastly superior IMHO Not vastly superior to what exactly? OS X 10.4 blows large holes in XP in several areas. It also has large advantages over desktop Linux. O'course that's only my opinion but it is shared by most industry experts. and neither is the hardware. Here I agree. If there is something to it, it is the combination of both. If I thought I could run Windows apps and games through it I'd run it on my PC as well. I love OS X. Yes Apple hardware is nice too and I wouldn't necessarily stop buying the hardware. Half of the PC OS problems are due to the infinite amount of hardware it has to run on. Actually I have very few hardware problems with XP. It's come on massively since the days of Windows 98 and balky drivers. All the problems I have with Windows relate to a lack of intuitive interface and missing features (or at the very least inferior versions of them) that I use constantly in Mac OS X. Also the quality of software just isn't there for Windows. Only the big-guns in design etc. (most of which started out on the Mac - like Adobe) make relatively good PC Apps. Most others simply wouldn't cut it in the Mac community. The only really good free stuff I have found for the PC is from Mozilla. I also hate the taskbar in Windows, it's a disaster of clutter and confusion compared tot the dock. Anyhoo. That's just me, or is it? Everyone in my office constantly complains about things on their PCs and most if it is problems arising from Windows being hard to use or badly thought out. Also teaching people to use MS Apps like Word or Excel in Windows is a nightmare. The interface is just so hard to understand. First you have a menu bar from which you can do everything. Then you have button bars in the same place (which causes confusion). Then you have som buttons down the side... and some at the bottom of the screen (by default). And for everyone who is currently preaching OpenOffice as the way out of MS oppression think again, it might be free but it's just as bas as MS Office to use. OK I'm done... :o) -- Mark Benson AIM - SilValleyPirate MSN - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit FlatPackMacs online: http://fpm.68kmac.com Visit my Homepage: http://homepage.mac.com/markbenson Never send a human to do a machine's job. -The Matrix -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Best said reference yet [Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???]
Approximately when did IBM start making PPC processors? I thought the first PPCs were Motorola... On 6/23/05, Mark Benson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 22 Jun 2005, at 04:06, Dylan McDermond wrote: The best bet is the future Pentium M derivatives Current rumoring suggests Pentium M for mobile and small form factor machines (read Mac mini, Powerbook, iBook) and Pentium D Dual Core CPUs where the G5 is currently (iMac and PowerMac). If they can tune OS X and their Pro Apps to get the most out of the Pentium D it'll be a good computer. The reason the higher-end machines will not be out next year is because the Pentium D has only just been unveiled and Apple and Intel still need time to co-develop the new architecture to hone it to the sorts of levels that the PowerMac G5 is at. Anyone who thinks Apple will mod stock PC boards to work as Macs doesn't know Apple. They will want boards done to their own spec. They quite possibly will use some other Intel components, the laptops for example will likely have built-in Centrino mobile technology for wireless rather than AE (that means Apple laptops will finally have WiFi built-in as standard, as current Intel based PC laptops tend to). They may also use part or all of the Intel motherboard chipset. The boards however will be custom layouts. One thing I also think Apple may well do is either solder down the CPUs, or alternatively use a non-PC standard socket pattern for the CPU. That said however they have, for all their protestations, not been totally adverse to CPU upgrades in the past. You never know we may in the future be able to upgrade the CPUs on our Macs with off-the-shelf stock from an PC vendor. How cool is that! Dell already have a Pentium D PC out but *that* operating system isn't in the slightest optimised for EM64T *OR* Dual Core so it's pretty much a waste of money in the Windows world, at least for now. Re: the reference that was originally quoted, that reference refers completely to Intel's Itanium IA64 architecture, which is a dead duck. Intel have developed EM64T which is easy to support alongside AMD's AMD64 line, and so I believe the IA64 line will be phased out within 18 months in favour of a line of high-end EM64T chips, maybe with inbuilt IA64 legacy translation. Either way Apple are not using IA64. I am not even totally sure IA64 is x86 compatible. Also I'd like to point out to those that were muttering about Intel making PowerPC CPUs that IBM own all the patents to PowerPC and POWER technology. Apple can't just walk up to Intel and ask to make PPCs - the designs are not Apple's to hand out. It simply would not be possible. IBM and Intel might co-operate (begrudgingly) in the low- end Server market but they are both producing chips and thus are rivals in CPU terms. It'd be like Apple giving Microsoft the keys to OS X... Either way that rumor is dead as the line is confirmed to be x86. -- Mark Benson AIM - SilValleyPirate MSN - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit FlatPackMacs online: http://fpm.68kmac.com Visit my Homepage: http://homepage.mac.com/markbenson Introducing Macintosh Classic II - pick one out on your way past the trash! -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
I started using Macs and PCs at about the same time (1990 or so), and have continued to use both over the years. I don't find either OS particularly difficult to use or navigate, but perhaps it's just because I have grown with them. OpenOffice has many things to work out before it can become a serious competitor with Microsoft Office. It's still really buggy, and there are some semi-important things (in my opinion) that you just can't do, like only print a selected page(s) from a spreadsheet. On 6/23/05, Mark Benson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 20 Jun 2005, at 15:02, Marco van de Voort wrote: I'm no real mac'er, but I'd say it is the software/hardware integration. The OS is decent, but not vastly superior IMHO Not vastly superior to what exactly? OS X 10.4 blows large holes in XP in several areas. It also has large advantages over desktop Linux. O'course that's only my opinion but it is shared by most industry experts. and neither is the hardware. Here I agree. If there is something to it, it is the combination of both. If I thought I could run Windows apps and games through it I'd run it on my PC as well. I love OS X. Yes Apple hardware is nice too and I wouldn't necessarily stop buying the hardware. Half of the PC OS problems are due to the infinite amount of hardware it has to run on. Actually I have very few hardware problems with XP. It's come on massively since the days of Windows 98 and balky drivers. All the problems I have with Windows relate to a lack of intuitive interface and missing features (or at the very least inferior versions of them) that I use constantly in Mac OS X. Also the quality of software just isn't there for Windows. Only the big-guns in design etc. (most of which started out on the Mac - like Adobe) make relatively good PC Apps. Most others simply wouldn't cut it in the Mac community. The only really good free stuff I have found for the PC is from Mozilla. I also hate the taskbar in Windows, it's a disaster of clutter and confusion compared tot the dock. Anyhoo. That's just me, or is it? Everyone in my office constantly complains about things on their PCs and most if it is problems arising from Windows being hard to use or badly thought out. Also teaching people to use MS Apps like Word or Excel in Windows is a nightmare. The interface is just so hard to understand. First you have a menu bar from which you can do everything. Then you have button bars in the same place (which causes confusion). Then you have som buttons down the side... and some at the bottom of the screen (by default). And for everyone who is currently preaching OpenOffice as the way out of MS oppression think again, it might be free but it's just as bas as MS Office to use. OK I'm done... :o) -- Mark Benson AIM - SilValleyPirate MSN - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit FlatPackMacs online: http://fpm.68kmac.com Visit my Homepage: http://homepage.mac.com/markbenson Never send a human to do a machine's job. -The Matrix -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Best said reference yet [Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???]
On 24/06/2005, at 2:13 PM, NODEraser wrote: Approximately when did IBM start making PPC processors? I thought the first PPCs were Motorola... A very long time: http://www.danaquarium.com/gallery/beige/ppc601?full=1 dana -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Best said reference yet [Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???]
On Jun 20, 2005, at 1:20 PM, Pat wrote: I have been looking on intel site for the particular p4 that apple would be using, but searching even for just the word apple yields little. I was curious to know which particular pentium4 apple uses or will use. I have built several pentium 4 systems, one with dual processors, so spent a bit of time reading the intel specs for the 865PE and 875PE chipsets in the 478 pin config. Does anyone know what name the apple intel chip will go by, assuming it is a pentium4 ? Links are welcome. The best bet is the future Pentium M derivitives - Dylan -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
On Tue, Jun 07, 2005 at 09:21:16AM -0400, Ray Fryer wrote: At the outset, to change to Intel chips would indeed remove the thing that makes a Mac a Mac. And in doing so would kill Mac's following once and for all. I don't know. You have a different mind set now with OS X. Personally, I think what makes a Mac a Mac is the operating system. Fundamentally, we have always shared hardware with the PC. I'm no real mac'er, but I'd say it is the software/hardware integration. The OS is decent, but not vastly superior IMHO, and neither is the hardware. If there is something to it, it is the combination of both. Half of the PC OS problems are due to the infinite amount of hardware it has to run on. -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: FW: Best said reference yet [Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???]
I have been looking on intel site for the particular p4 that apple would be using, but searching even for just the word apple yields little. I was curious to know which particular pentium4 apple uses or will use. I have built several pentium 4 systems, one with dual processors, so spent a bit of time reading the intel specs for the 865PE and 875PE chipsets in the 478 pin config. Does anyone know what name the apple intel chip will go by, assuming it is a pentium4 ? Links are welcome. Cheers, Pat Gregg Eshelman wrote: --- NODEraser [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Just because Intel will be manufacturing the chips doesn't mean that future Macs will be running Pentium 4's. If Apple gives them specs for a PPC, they'll make it. They won't be running PPC. The devlopment systems Apple is shipping out soon have P4's and Apple's been doing in-house x86 buils of the full OSX since day 1. There's no reason they're going to use some chip other than the P4 or one substantially like it. If they were, all this other work and shipping development systems with a P4 would be wasted. Some of those software companies are definately going to be optimizing code for the P4. It'd be rather dumb for Apple to then drop theif first production Macs with Intel CPUs on the scene with IA64 chips or anything so different from the P4. -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Time to Talk Classic Macs - HyperCard (was [Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???] )
Steve wrote: Time to talk a little bit about Classic Macs, what do you say? I am trying to (1) locate HyperCard 1.25 or 2.0 to run on my System 7.5.5 and (2) locate the HyperMover stack as well. Since I am in the midst of wrestling with TCP/IP on the MacTV, and I don't want that to hold up my HyperCard needs, I was wondering if anyone that has the above would be willing to burn a CD with the stuff - I'd pay appropriately. We have 1.0.1, 1.2.5 and 2.4.1 which will work on os6.0.5 and later, currently running under 9.2 as they all do here, you require OS7.0 and higher to use OSA with the applescript extention, to use video you require 7.5 and QT 1.6.1 (haven't tried this under 7.1) . Button tasks require 7.0 with QT and applescript installed. You also have colour and speech via the 1.3 extention (this is taken from the 2.3 What's new). I dont use it often as I'd rather use Squeak for x-platform goodness. Sqeak is well worth the look for a x-platform hypercard like app and runs on just about everything. We seem to have a german version of 1.2.1 also, dont remember where that came from. ;) http://mirror.apple.com/Mirrors/Apple_Software_Updates/US/Apple_II/HyperCard_IIGS_1.1/ for hypermover? Start a *new* thread regarding the tcp/ip problems on the mactv. I use classic networking and a static address for networked 68k machines (Miami copes ok regardless). I use the DynaPort SCSI/LinkT adaptor for the ethernet challenged, the software installs a icon into mactpc's CP, static addressing is the only real option under mactcp (no luck with the sys6 drivers crashing during reboot but that maybe a ram problem). Reseting the hub/switch has helped in the past here as has setting the correct local host address. MacTPC can be fun to config with some hardware. -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
--- J.S. Garrison [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: clip Nevermore anything as new and different as the Mac? Can't say I'd like living with that. The only things in a Mac since the BW G3 that aren't directly from the PC parts bin are the CPU, firewire ports, whatever magic that flips the bytes between big and little endian as they go to and fro from the PCI bus, and the fancy case designs. Since the OS hasn't had a big chunk stashed in physical ROM, that's no longer a part of the computer itself. (Which is why PearPC doesn't need a ROM image to run OSX.) The rest of the important bits, PCI, IDE, USB, AGP and a few other alphabet soup items weren't invented at Apple. Macintosh hardware has been a PC in a plastic case with a different CPU for years. So Apple's finally decided to toss the last piece that could be pointed to and claim Not a PC!. What're you gonna do about it? NOT buy one and thus help your favorite computer company lose money? It will be total Fandemonium! August (Fri) 5th, (Sat) 6th (Sun) 7th, 2005 http://www.fandemonium.org __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Best said reference yet [Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???]
On 2005-06-10 7:32, NODEraser wrote: Just because Intel will be manufacturing the chips doesn't mean that future Macs will be running Pentium 4's. If Apple gives them specs for a PPC, they'll make it. If Intel will be making a PPC chip for Apple, why are they shipping x86 development systems? No, they're switching to Intel x86 chips. Intel already confirmed that. Most likely, Pentium D's and Pentium M's. ,xtG .tsooJ -- Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups -- Joost van de Griek http://www.jvdg.net/ -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
On 2005-06-10 8:43, Gregg Eshelman wrote: The only things in a Mac since the BW G3 that aren't directly from the PC parts bin are the CPU, firewire ports, whatever magic that flips the bytes between big and little endian as they go to and fro from the PCI bus, and the fancy case designs. Since the OS hasn't had a big chunk stashed in physical ROM, that's no longer a part of the computer itself. (Which is why PearPC doesn't need a ROM image to run OSX.) The rest of the important bits, PCI, IDE, USB, AGP and a few other alphabet soup items weren't invented at Apple. Macintosh hardware has been a PC in a plastic case with a different CPU for years. So Apple's finally decided to toss the last piece that could be pointed to and claim Not a PC!. That is total hogwash. Apple designs everything in a (PPC) Mac, the system controllers, memory controllers, you name it. Just because it has IDE, PCI , AGP and USB buses, doesn't mean it's a PC with a PPC processor. ,xtG .tsooJ -- John was addicted to placebos until I sent him to a homeless shelter for a week and told him it was a rehab clinic. -- Joost van de Griek http://www.jvdg.net/ -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: FW: Best said reference yet [Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???]
--- NODEraser [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Just because Intel will be manufacturing the chips doesn't mean that future Macs will be running Pentium 4's. If Apple gives them specs for a PPC, they'll make it. They won't be running PPC. The devlopment systems Apple is shipping out soon have P4's and Apple's been doing in-house x86 buils of the full OSX since day 1. There's no reason they're going to use some chip other than the P4 or one substantially like it. If they were, all this other work and shipping development systems with a P4 would be wasted. Some of those software companies are definately going to be optimizing code for the P4. It'd be rather dumb for Apple to then drop theif first production Macs with Intel CPUs on the scene with IA64 chips or anything so different from the P4. It will be total Fandemonium! August (Fri) 5th, (Sat) 6th (Sun) 7th, 2005 http://www.fandemonium.org __ Discover Yahoo! Have fun online with music videos, cool games, IM and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/online.html -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Time to Talk Classic Macs - HyperCard (was [Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???] )
Time to talk a little bit about Classic Macs, what do you say? I am trying to (1) locate HyperCard 1.25 or 2.0 to run on my System 7.5.5 and (2) locate the HyperMover stack as well. Since I am in the midst of wrestling with TCP/IP on the MacTV, and I don't want that to hold up my HyperCard needs, I was wondering if anyone that has the above would be willing to burn a CD with the stuff - I'd pay appropriately. Thanks. -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Time to Talk Classic Macs - HyperCard (was [Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???] )
I have most of Hypercard , unfortunatly I'm missing the Installer 2 disk. If anyone can be of help please let me know as well. Thanks, Ben Steve wrote: Time to talk a little bit about Classic Macs, what do you say? I am trying to (1) locate HyperCard 1.25 or 2.0 to run on my System 7.5.5 and (2) locate the HyperMover stack as well. Since I am in the midst of wrestling with TCP/IP on the MacTV, and I don't want that to hold up my HyperCard needs, I was wondering if anyone that has the above would be willing to burn a CD with the stuff - I'd pay appropriately. Thanks. -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
FW: Best said reference yet [Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???]
Hi, Here is an interesting piece a friend forwarded to me. Very scary... -- Forwarded Message From: Ernst du Toit [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Thu, 09 Jun 2005 13:41:47 +1200 To: Andre Skarzynski [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Best said reference yet History repeats again: http://projects.csail.mit.edu/gsb/archives/old/gsb-archive/gsb2001-06-29.htm l --et -- End of Forwarded Message -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
On 6/7/05, J.S. Garrison [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I can't believe so much is being made here of what amounts to an unsubstantiated rumor. WHAT? The Apple CEO announced it in his keynote at the annual developers' conference! What more do you want, him to come and tell you personally? A handwritten letter? -- Liam Proven Home: http://welcome.to/liamsweb * Blog: http://lproven.livejournal.com AOL, Yahoo UK: liamproven * ICQ: 73187508 * MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: FW: Best said reference yet [Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???]
On 6/9/05, Andre Skarzynski [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, Here is an interesting piece a friend forwarded to me. Very scary... Facinating! That's a parallel I just drew in a discussion on CIX... -- Liam Proven Home: http://welcome.to/liamsweb * Blog: http://lproven.livejournal.com AOL, Yahoo UK: liamproven * ICQ: 73187508 * MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: FW: Best said reference yet [Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???]
--- Andre Skarzynski [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, Here is an interesting piece a friend forwarded to me. Very scary... There's a STRONG argument for managing the Apple/IBM/Motorola alliance. If the problem is IBM's financial shuffling, then what kind of money does it take to buy out the chip-making division? Can supposedly cash-rich Apple do this? Dunno. I'll have my Compacts, my Modulars and G3/G4 Macs, and the memories. To not have any different computing products will be one of the saddest transitions I will ever have had to make. Then Intel, like Microsoft will hold monopolies on how we compute. When this list and the others in it's stable were in financial danger of disappearing, we coughed up money to keep it going. Wonder if all the Mac people were to buy stock in Apple if the capital gained would be enough to make that buy? Jeff G Facere Compositio Ex Congeries __ Discover Yahoo! Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/mobile.html -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
--- Liam Proven [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 6/7/05, J.S. Garrison [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I can't believe so much is being made here of what amounts to an unsubstantiated rumor. WHAT? The Apple CEO announced it in his keynote at the annual developers' conference! What more do you want, him to come and tell you personally? A handwritten letter? -- Liam Proven ~~~ I was a geek from the first Pong Game. If I thought it would reattach his brain back to the reality stream, I'd DEMAND IT in gold leaf filigree. Jeff G Facere Compositio Ex Congeries __ Discover Yahoo! Have fun online with music videos, cool games, IM and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/online.html -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
--- Gregg Eshelman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: That should drastically expand the available hardware options for Macintosh. ~ It's like looking at a Bentley and knowing it's really a Chrysler. Or seeing a Sterling and realizing it's a Honda. It's a sinking, false, tasteless feeling. It's the removal of choice. Microsoft kills MacOS. Intel kills AMD and absorbs VIA. Where'd the choices go? eBay and your local classifieds. Nevermore anything as new and different as the Mac? Can't say I'd like living with that. JEff G Facere Compositio Ex Congeries __ Discover Yahoo! Find restaurants, movies, travel and more fun for the weekend. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/weekend.html -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
On 6/9/05, J.S. Garrison [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I was a geek from the first Pong Game. If I thought it would reattach his brain back to the reality stream, I'd DEMAND IT in gold leaf filigree. :¬) Well, I guess I can relate to that. I can see both sides. If they pull this off, Apple could take a big chunk of MS' market and change the computing world. I rate this as unlikely. Or it might just continue on as it is, in a profitable, successful but small niche. I rate this moderately likely. Or it might blow it completely, destroy the Mac market and either get acquired or become just the company that makes iPods. Also, I think, moderately likely. Time will tell. A few months ago, I thought POWER PowerPC had a chance of becoming a significant platform, taking market share off x86, with IBM, Sun maybe bringing Solaris, Apple, XBox Playstation3. Plus fun minority platforms like AmigaOne and Pegasos. Now... no chance. Apple was the high-profile sponsor. When it goes, PPC is dead in the water. -- Liam Proven Home: http://welcome.to/liamsweb * Blog: http://lproven.livejournal.com AOL, Yahoo UK: liamproven * ICQ: 73187508 * MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
On 6/9/05, J.S. Garrison [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It's like looking at a Bentley and knowing it's really a Chrysler. Or seeing a Sterling and realizing it's a Honda. I don't know what a Stirling is, but I think I know what you mean. Microsoft kills MacOS. Might happen. Intel kills AMD Might happen. and absorbs VIA. Er. Why? Where'd the choices go? eBay and your local classifieds. Nevermore anything as new and different as the Mac? Can't say I'd like living with that. Oh, something new will come along. There is real innovation and diversity in cellphones, mostly outside the USA. They are morphing and merging with PDAs and hand-held games consoles and digital stills cameras video cameras and MP3 players and GPS units and who knows what else to become fascinating little devices. In a few years, I think they'll make a lot of laptops irrelevant, just as laptops are currently making desktops irrelevant. Meanwhile, at the Big Iron end of things, the Itanium is going down like the (T)Itanic (as The Register calls it). It will suck down a lot of companies with it - it will destroy SGI and much of HP and others. Intel will live, it's rich. Linux will kill proprietary Unix, slowly but surely. Sun, already dragged down by SPARC, IBM's remnant server division now it's sold off the PC divison to Lenovo, some other bits of HP and so on. There'll be another round of acquisition and consolidation. Big names will disappear. But new companies will appear and prosper, like saplings in the forest clearing left by the fall of a giant. It will be interesting! -- Liam Proven Home: http://welcome.to/liamsweb * Blog: http://lproven.livejournal.com AOL, Yahoo UK: liamproven * ICQ: 73187508 * MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: FW: Best said reference yet [Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???]
--- Liam Proven [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 6/9/05, Andre Skarzynski [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, Here is an interesting piece a friend forwarded to me. Very scary... Facinating! That's a parallel I just drew in a discussion on CIX... Interesting. But short of something drastically custom in the CPU, I don't see how Apple can keep hackers from having that OSX version running on generic PCs very soon after it's release. It will be total Fandemonium! August (Fri) 5th, (Sat) 6th (Sun) 7th, 2005 http://www.fandemonium.org __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: FW: Best said reference yet [Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???]
Just because Intel will be manufacturing the chips doesn't mean that future Macs will be running Pentium 4's. If Apple gives them specs for a PPC, they'll make it. On 6/9/05, Gregg Eshelman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- Liam Proven [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 6/9/05, Andre Skarzynski [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, Here is an interesting piece a friend forwarded to me. Very scary... Facinating! That's a parallel I just drew in a discussion on CIX... Interesting. But short of something drastically custom in the CPU, I don't see how Apple can keep hackers from having that OSX version running on generic PCs very soon after it's release. It will be total Fandemonium! August (Fri) 5th, (Sat) 6th (Sun) 7th, 2005 http://www.fandemonium.org __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
On 2005-06-08 3:31, Terry Mathews wrote: Meh, x86 processor alone != PC. I'm sure Apple will make their platform so that normal computers cannot run Mac OS X. Replacing the standard (and outdated, inadequate, and user-unfriendly) BIOS with OpenFirmware will go a long way towards that. There will be no Open Firmware in these Intel Macs. Look at the Microsoft Xbox - it's basically an x86 computer, but because it has an odd memory map and no PC BIOS, it does not run Windows; But they *will* run Windows. ,xtG .tsooJ -- If a mute swears, does his mother wash his hands with soap? -- Joost van de Griek http://www.jvdg.net/ -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
On 08/06/2005, at 1:04 AM, Joost van de Griek wrote: On 2005-06-08 3:31, Terry Mathews wrote: Meh, x86 processor alone != PC. I'm sure Apple will make their platform so that normal computers cannot run Mac OS X. Replacing the standard (and outdated, inadequate, and user-unfriendly) BIOS with Open-Firmware will go a long way towards that. There will be no Open Firmware in these Intel Macs. Look at the Microsoft Xbox - it's basically an x86 computer, but because it has an odd memory map and no PC BIOS, it does not run Windows; But they *will* run Windows. Actually there are currently ia64 boards that are Open-Firmware, I don't have one but I would imagine the development x86 Macs that were released to developers are pretty mush so plain PC. They probably boot similar to FreeBSD, in that they unmap the PC BIOS and replace it with Forth based boot loader. I would imagine the actual production Macs will be OF ia64 systems. The boxes they are providing developers know I primarily to get the code working on x86, hence why Apple wants them back and not in the general market -- []-[]-[] |[]-[]-[] |[EMAIL PROTECTED];- -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
Actually there are currently ia64 boards that are Open-Firmware, I don't have one but I would imagine the development x86 Macs that were released to developers are pretty mush so plain PC. They probably boot similar to FreeBSD, in that they unmap the PC BIOS and replace it with Forth based boot loader. I would imagine the actual production Macs will be OF ia64 systems. The boxes they are providing developers know I primarily to get the code working on x86, hence why Apple wants them back and not in the general market Despite all that, the developer documentation that Apple released specifically says that the new platform will use a BIOS, not Open Firmware. Anand on http://anandtech.com covers some of this (http:// anandtech.com/tradeshows/showdoc.aspx?i=2439). You can also download the documents for yourself and read them if you want. I breezed over them just to get an overview. As I said before this wil be VERY, VERY, VERY good for the Apple platform. Are you aware that the 128MB ATI 9200 Mac Edition costs $125+? The same card for a PC can be purchased for $39.99 at Newegg THAT is why BIOS based motherboards will be better than OpenFirmware. The chip makers should only need to produce one BIOS that will be compatible on any x86 platform when Apple starts using the new motherboards. Todd -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
Now all Macs are Vintage Macs. Wow, that really sums it up, doesn't it? I guess we're all orphans now. Rob -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
Nate [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: NeXT was a niche player at best and their OS ran on a very limited range of PCs and peripherals that they did not produce, and SGI never ported IRIX to x86 (big mistake - x86 SGIs only run Win2k). This is a very different situation, and I am cautiously optimistic. Mistake? No way. IRIX isn't (wasn't) SGI's selling point, it is (was) their exotic and extremely powerful (graphics) hardware. On 2005-06-08 16:59, Michael Hackett wrote: These are good points. I forgot that SGI was running NT on their x86 boxes. No wonder none of their loyal users switched. :-) They weren't supposed to. The Visual Workstations were intended to tap into the growing NT market of the time. ,xtG .tsooJ -- When someone asks if you're a god, say yes. -- Joost van de Griek http://www.jvdg.net/ -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
Thinking about this some more, doesn't the newest Xbox use PowerPC chips? I understand that the CPU in a game machine is secondary to the video driving circuitry, but still, that means that the next-generation Microsoft Xbox team is using G5's or something. -Original Message- From: Vintage Macs [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Joost van de Griek Sent: Wednesday, June 08, 2005 3:05 AM To: Vintage Macs Subject: Re: Oh my... Intel CPU's??? On 2005-06-08 3:31, Terry Mathews wrote: Meh, x86 processor alone != PC. I'm sure Apple will make their platform so that normal computers cannot run Mac OS X. Replacing the standard (and outdated, inadequate, and user-unfriendly) BIOS with OpenFirmware will go a long way towards that. There will be no Open Firmware in these Intel Macs. Look at the Microsoft Xbox - it's basically an x86 computer, but because it has an odd memory map and no PC BIOS, it does not run Windows; But they *will* run Windows. ,xtG .tsooJ -- If a mute swears, does his mother wash his hands with soap? -- Joost van de Griek http://www.jvdg.net/ -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
Check this out. Remember when I mentioned my wish for Apple to use the AlphaAXP when DEC died? Matt Lafleur Apple's move to Intel designed chips caught me by surprise a much as anyone. I was certain that Apple would use Intel to build PowerPC chips in the same way Apple moved AltiVec to IBM designs. The move to Intel designs for laptops designs make sense as the M series are a superior design to desktop Pentiums (NetBurst, heat, hide design problems with clock speed, yada yada) The move to Intel for desktop machines seems foolish on it face until you look at the time frame for their integration into the high-end Macs. High-end Macs migrate to Intel LAST at the end of two years. What is happening in 2 years at Intel? That appears to be the timeframe for the release of a chip designed by a very NON-Intel design team. Specifically, the old DEC Alpha team. If anyone remembers DEC Alpha's they were the fastest processors available in the 90's. Consistently outperforming everything. 64-bit, multiprocessor from day one with a very elegant, efficient design. DEC was, unfortunately, a foundering company with a very 70's management style and vision. As a result a superior chip design lost in the market place. Compaq knew even less than DEC so the design team jumped ship. HP was even more clueless. For several years now Peter Bannon and his old Alpha design team (over 300 of them) have been working on Intel's next generation 64-bit designs. Their first design for Intel, not-polluted by previous Intel in-house missteps, is planned for a 2007 release. Interesting timing is it not. Here is some background: * Intel's Tanglewood pumped full of DEC Alpha goodness http://www.theregister.co.uk/2003/07/10/intels_tanglewood_pumped_full/ * Intel Appoints New Fellow http://www.intel.com/pressroom/archive/releases/20030702corp.htm * Mister Tanglewood tapped as Intel Fellow http://www.theregister.co.uk/2003/07/02/mister_tanglewood_tapped_as_intel/ * Intel's 64-bit Man Appointed 'Fellow' Status http://boston.internet.com/news/article.php/2231171 Apple's high end machines may be running on an Intel CPU but it may be unlike any other Intel cpu seen before. Designed by a team that has been producing elegant, efficient designs (two words not used to describe Intel designs) a more than a decade before IBM had a 64-bit desktop design. -Original Message- From: Vintage Macs [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Joost van de Griek Sent: Wednesday, June 08, 2005 3:05 AM To: Vintage Macs Subject: Re: Oh my... Intel CPU's??? [snip] -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
--- rednight [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: clip I would imagine the actual production Macs will be OF ia64 systems. The boxes they are providing developers know I primarily to get the code working on x86, hence why Apple wants them back and not in the general market The development systems are Pentium 4. While code could be written abd compiled for IA64 on a P4, it couldn't be run on it. At least not without a CPU emulator. Emulating a more complex CPU would be possible, but extremely slow. Another thing against Apple using IA64 is cost. An Itanium Mac would cost even more than the G5, unless Apple suddenly becoming the largest consumer of the IA64 CPU could bring down its cost per chip. What I wonder is what Apple will use for the chipset? Using a custom chipset would be one way to keep OSX from running on other PCs, but Apple's announcements said that Windows wouldn't be prevented from running on the Mac. S, that'd mean the hardware would have to at least work with Windows generic hardware drivers. It will be total Fandemonium! August (Fri) 5th, (Sat) 6th (Sun) 7th, 2005 http://www.fandemonium.org __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
No no.. The Xenon (the XBox processor) is a multicore chip. Each core is not nearly as smart as the G5 (it looks dumber than a 601), but it can run 6 threads. It is just another way to use chip real-estate - instead of building a supersmart CPU they build 6 dumb ones and hope running six threads at once makes up for the individual stupidity. I would love to see it on a desktop workstation running Linux or in a blade server, but I suspect Microsoft will suck-up all of IBM's production. Steve wrote: Thinking about this some more, doesn't the newest Xbox use PowerPC chips? I understand that the CPU in a game machine is secondary to the video driving circuitry, but still, that means that the next-generation Microsoft Xbox team is using G5's or something. -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
--- Steve [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thinking about this some more, doesn't the newest Xbox use PowerPC chips? I understand that the CPU in a game machine is secondary to the video driving circuitry, but still, that means that the next-generation Microsoft Xbox team is using G5's or something. Another place the PPC is used is in every TiVo digital video recorder. It's similar to the 603/604 but doesn't have an FPU. A TiVo is similar to an Amiga where the CPU is there as a director for other specialized chips that handle the video and audio tasks. Also interesting is TiVo runs a customized PowerPC Linux. It will be total Fandemonium! August (Fri) 5th, (Sat) 6th (Sun) 7th, 2005 http://www.fandemonium.org __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
Thinking about it, he has done this before. when NeXT computer stopped making hardware and NeXTSTEP became Openstep, they switched also from motorola to intel (or from black hardware to white.. ) before, NeXTSTEP could run on 4 different platforms, NeXT hardware (motorola black hardware), Sun supersparcs, HP 9000 series and intel pc's so the knoledge to make cross-platform software was in their hands. and when apple took over NeXT (actually Apple sold itself to NeXT... :-) you saw Openstep develop into Mac OS X, running on just one platform (but don't forget DARWIN) so the knoledge is there they must be testing intel hardware now for years, so there must be a Mac OSX around for intel... -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
On Tuesday, June 07, 2005, at 08:57AM, simon [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thinking about it, he has done this before. when NeXT computer stopped making hardware and NeXTSTEP became Openstep, they switched also from motorola to intel (or from black hardware to white.. ) before, NeXTSTEP could run on 4 different platforms, NeXT hardware (motorola black hardware), Sun supersparcs, HP 9000 series and intel pc's so the knoledge to make cross-platform software was in their hands. So Intel compatibility was already there. It always has been. I suspect Steve Jobs may even have planned to use Intel at Apple long before now, but couldn't get the deal straight with Intel, or was encouraged by PPC development to stick with PPC. and when apple took over NeXT (actually Apple sold itself to NeXT... :-) you saw Openstep develop into Mac OS X, running on just one platform (but don't forget DARWIN) so the knoledge is there they must be testing intel hardware now for years, so there must be a Mac OSX around for intel... There has been a Mac OS X for Intel as long there has been Mac OS X. What is more is goes back further. The Rhapsody project, which was Apple's development of OpenSTEP, was Dual Platform and ran on Intel PCs (with limited hardware support) and PPC Macs alike. The project continued publicly as a dual platform development right up until OS X Server 1.0 (note that's not 10.x) when it went Mac only. From there I suspect the Intel development went inside Apple but continued in parallel with the Mac PPC development. I sat down after the Keynote and had a long hard think about all this and realised it all makes rather a lot of sense, really. Suspiciously so, in fact. Steve Jobs purportedly vetoed the move to Intel in 2000 sighting too much disruption to developers. That reason was they were still on OS 9 at the time and no structure was in place for the move. All the time we have been lapping up OS X on PPC hardware, they have been developing the transitive systems necessary to make PPC and Intel software cooperate on one machine with an Intel CPU. -- Mark Benson http://homepage.mac.com/markbenson -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
At the outset, to change to Intel chips would indeed remove the thing that makes a Mac a Mac. And in doing so would kill Mac's following once and for all. I don't know. You have a different mind set now with OS X. Personally, I think what makes a Mac a Mac is the operating system. Fundamentally, we have always shared hardware with the PC. You have to give INTEL credit for developing the 086 to what it is now. I have always wondered if APPLE will migrate towards the same idea that MS has always done which is liscensing. And which we all know has been extremely successful. But who knows. Time will tell. -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
On Mon, 6 Jun 2005 19:58:17 -0700 dr7zyq [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The rumor was started by Steve Job's announcement, and, as I understand it, has to do with the fact that Intel is leading the industry in low power cpu's, allowing maximum time between charges on laptop computers This is the part that shocks me. When did Intel take the x86 from the biggest power hog in the industry to the low power range? Last I saw, PPC was better by a factor of 3, and Transmeta and ARM were light years ahead of everyone. (Granted, the last two have different architectures and are not in the same league speedwise.) I also don't get why anyone but a very tiny minority need a laptop faster than a G4. In fact, all of the Intel laptops I looked at recently that had reasonably battery life (5 hours) were all in the 1-MHz range. That would indicate that, even with Intel, you have to give up some processing power to get long battery life. Oh well, I guess -- being the geek I am -- I just get frustrated when the better technology (PPC) loses. It's funny, though, that Apple -- who represents this position in the commercial OS area -- would be involved this time. And a last point: Seems to me that both NeXT and SGI made similar moves and it didn't work out well for either. Big gamble. Big gamble. -M -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
I think that Intel has always lagged somewhere in the back of the CPU pack when it came to innovation, power consumption, and pricing (for current CPUs). But the theory/promise of RISC couldn't beat the reality of Intel's CISC push. Intel has consistently thrown $ after $ to make CISC as fast as RISC, and the other RISC vendors just couldn't keep up with Intel's raw manufacturing capability. The Sparc, the AlphaAXP, the PowerPC, the MiPS all smoked anything Intel could make at any point in history, but Intel compensates with business practices over technical ones, and then their chips are cheaper and good enough, and the market follows. I personally would have liked to see Apple snap up the AlphaAXP platform from Compaq. Apple could have stayed RISC (AXP was also 64-bit years before PowerPC was) and had the fastest CPU platform on the planet. However, I recently read that there is an Intel CPU reference platform that supports hardware DRM. Apple could make vPods and set-top boxes based on the Mini (not to mention desktops/notebooks) that satisfy the MPAA, and make $ for Apple the same way iPods have done with audio. Now, for something classic-Mac-related. I have a Dayna ethernet adapter that connects to the SCSI port on my MacTV (running 7.5.5). What do I need to do to get it to pick up a DHCP address and access an FTP server on my (TCP/IP-only) LAN? Thanks. -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
- Original Message - From: Steve [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Vintage Macs vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com Sent: Tuesday, June 07, 2005 10:44 AM Subject: Re: Oh my... Intel CPU's??? I think that Intel has always lagged somewhere in the back of the CPU pack when it came to innovation, power consumption, and pricing (for current CPUs). But the theory/promise of RISC couldn't beat the reality of Intel's CISC push. Intel has consistently thrown $ after $ to make CISC as fast as RISC, and the other RISC vendors just couldn't keep up with Intel's raw manufacturing capability. The Sparc, the AlphaAXP, the PowerPC, the MiPS all smoked anything Intel could make at any point in history, but Intel compensates with business practices over technical ones, and then their chips are cheaper and good enough, and the market follows. I personally would have liked to see Apple snap up the AlphaAXP platform from Compaq. Apple could have stayed RISC (AXP was also 64-bit years before PowerPC was) and had the fastest CPU platform on the planet. However, I recently read that there is an Intel CPU reference platform that supports hardware DRM. Apple could make vPods and set-top boxes based on the Mini (not to mention desktops/notebooks) that satisfy the MPAA, and make $ for Apple the same way iPods have done with audio. Now, for something classic-Mac-related. I have a Dayna ethernet adapter that connects to the SCSI port on my MacTV (running 7.5.5). What do I need to do to get it to pick up a DHCP address and access an FTP server on my (TCP/IP-only) LAN? Thanks. x86 has been RISC since the Pentium Pro came out in the early 90's (RISC core with hardware to convert CISC instructions). Sure allot of chips smoked the x86 for a brief period of time, but nothing beat it for very long and none could compete on price. I think what makes a Mac a Mac is the tightly integrated OS used. My favorite Macs are of course the 68k ones, back when Apple spent allot of effort on hardware design and not just marketing. 68K's had a decent GUI, hardware was PnP, Nubus was faster then ISA, ram could be expanded much more then x86 machines, A/V was common, built in SCSI, ADB worked well, serial ports screamed, networking built in, etc. The latest Macs are x86 clones with a PPC G5 put in to be different.. well that had to go to. -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
Ray Fryer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have always wondered if APPLE will migrate towards the same idea that MS has always done which is liscensing. And which we all know has been extremely successful. But who knows. Time will tell. You read my mind! We do know from the Apple Clone Wars that Apple previously released their operating system to licencing. The problem was that clones started to sell cheaper and sometimes with better cross-platform options as far as third-party accessories (i.e. they accepted PC keyboards and mice). Apple raised their rates until nobody could afford to licence Mac OS anymore. What's with this 'processor emulation with no speed loss' business? Doesn't anyone think those high-end science clusters Apple sold to Universities will bog down? Joe __ Switch to Netscape Internet Service. As low as $9.95 a month -- Sign up today at http://isp.netscape.com/register Netscape. Just the Net You Need. New! Netscape Toolbar for Internet Explorer Search from anywhere on the Web and block those annoying pop-ups. Download now at http://channels.netscape.com/ns/search/install.jsp -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
On Tue, 7 Jun 2005 10:55:08 -0400 Powermac [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think what makes a Mac a Mac is the tightly integrated OS used. My favorite Macs are of course the 68k ones, back when Apple spent allot of effort on hardware design and not just marketing. 68K's had a decent GUI, hardware was PnP, Nubus was faster then ISA, ram could be expanded much more then x86 machines, A/V was common, built in SCSI, ADB worked well, serial ports screamed, networking built in, etc. The latest Macs are x86 clones with a PPC G5 put in to be different.. well that had to go to. I have to agree with you there. Apple's elder Macs were much better built than the competition back then, but they were quite a bit more expensive. Apple closed the price gap (and even undercut name-brand Wintel companies in some cases) but moving to commodity hardware. Of late, it seems their main differentiating factor was the cases (which, don't get me wrong, I think are very important, although I can't say I've liked any of the larger ones). At this point, everything is written in high-level languages, and can be easily ported. The hardware is virtually the same, and the OS is easily ported. You're right --- why not change? -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
On Tue, 07 Jun 2005 10:44:04 -0400 Steve [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Now, for something classic-Mac-related. I have a Dayna ethernet adapter that connects to the SCSI port on my MacTV (running 7.5.5). What do I need to do to get it to pick up a DHCP address and access an FTP server on my (TCP/IP-only) LAN? Does the Ethernet adapter show up in the Network/TCPIP control panel? (Are you running Classic Networking or Open Transport?) Have you got the Dayna software installed? I had one of these running on a IIci, I think under 7.5.5, but I seem to recall there was a problem with installation under OT. My memory is fuzzy, but I think I had to install with Classic Networking, and then switch to OT afterwards. But if you're just running Classic, there's no problem. Can't remember if there is any issue with DHCP, unless it's not a feature of Classic. I've always stuck with OT on 7.5 and later, and I use static IPs. If it's just DHCP that's the problem, you could probably assign a single or block of static addresses on the router. -- Michael -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
--- Powermac [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think what makes a Mac a Mac is the tightly integrated OS used. My favorite Macs are of course the 68k ones, back when Apple spent allot of effort on hardware design and not just marketing. 68K's had a decent GUI, hardware was PnP, Nubus was faster then ISA, ram could be expanded much more then x86 machines, A/V was common, built in SCSI, ADB worked well, serial ports screamed, networking built in, etc. The latest Macs are x86 clones with a PPC G5 put in to be different.. well that had to go to. ~~~ I can't see anyone successfully marketing a pricey PC that runs Mac OS X, which is what we'll wind up with when Mac goes Intel. What a Mac is was the machines from the Plus to the G4 pre-OS X. The Sixes to the Nines. Astonishing GUI. Useability. Right software, written so well it fits right in today. Set up a Classic or a Quadra. You get a sense that the programmers really were interested in quality in the OSes and programs. Mac is/was NOT Windows. Mac is MacOS. Different. Artistic. Graphic. Easy. Sigh. I guess not anymore. That really will make the older Macs and their accessories and softwares worth more. When this tree falls in the forest, EVERYONE will hear it. Jeff G Facere Compositio Ex Congeries __ Discover Yahoo! Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/mobile.html -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
And, for your viewing pleasure, some links documenting Star Trek, the System 7 port to Intel's 486. :) http://www.macdevcenter.com/pub/a/mac/2002/05/10/cocoa_history_two.html http://www.macobserver.com/columns/thisweek/2004/20041211.shtml The original jump to Intel was shelved in favor of Copeland. http://www.encyclopedia-online.info/Star_Trek_project On 6/7/05, J.S. Garrison [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- Powermac [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think what makes a Mac a Mac is the tightly integrated OS used. My favorite Macs are of course the 68k ones, back when Apple spent allot of effort on hardware design and not just marketing. 68K's had a decent GUI, hardware was PnP, Nubus was faster then ISA, ram could be expanded much more then x86 machines, A/V was common, built in SCSI, ADB worked well, serial ports screamed, networking built in, etc. The latest Macs are x86 clones with a PPC G5 put in to be different.. well that had to go to. ~~~ I can't see anyone successfully marketing a pricey PC that runs Mac OS X, which is what we'll wind up with when Mac goes Intel. What a Mac is was the machines from the Plus to the G4 pre-OS X. The Sixes to the Nines. Astonishing GUI. Useability. Right software, written so well it fits right in today. Set up a Classic or a Quadra. You get a sense that the programmers really were interested in quality in the OSes and programs. Mac is/was NOT Windows. Mac is MacOS. Different. Artistic. Graphic. Easy. Sigh. I guess not anymore. That really will make the older Macs and their accessories and softwares worth more. When this tree falls in the forest, EVERYONE will hear it. Jeff G Facere Compositio Ex Congeries __ Discover Yahoo! Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/mobile.html -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
Don't be so pessimistic. The CPU under the hood is of little importance to most users. I didn't think that way until I realized I have been using Linux on both x86s and PPCs and it is completely the same. MacOS X can run on x86s just fine, as long as they are fast enough. There will be fat binaries for some time, for PPC software to run on x86. Since all OS calls are the same, the only emulation that's needed is for the application code itself. I think this will work. And, of course, by 2007, we will have G5 owners coming to this list ;-) J.S. Garrison wrote: I can't see anyone successfully marketing a pricey PC that runs Mac OS X, which is what we'll wind up with when Mac goes Intel. What a Mac is was the machines from the Plus to the G4 pre-OS X. The Sixes to the Nines. Astonishing GUI. Useability. Right software, written so well it fits right in today. Set up a Classic or a Quadra. You get a sense that the programmers really were interested in quality in the OSes and programs. Mac is/was NOT Windows. Mac is MacOS. Different. Artistic. Graphic. Easy. Sigh. I guess not anymore. That really will make the older Macs and their accessories and softwares worth more. When this tree falls in the forest, EVERYONE will hear it. Jeff G Facere Compositio Ex Congeries __ Discover Yahoo! Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/mobile.html -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
--- Liam Proven [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well, nope. It's happened. See macworld.com or macnn.com or slashdot.org or macslash.org for details. The Mac is switching to Intel. The only pieces of Macintosh hardware left that weren't already intel or other PC company designs were the CPU (and even most of those were produced by IBM) and the 1394 Firewire ports. It's completely the opposite of how Spider Robinson had Apple's future in Lady Slings the Booze with the Macintosh Five from 2010 sporting a holographic screen and IBM only saved from bankruptcy by supplying the power switches for the previous model of Mac. (The Five no longer required a power switch...) It will be total Fandemonium! August (Fri) 5th, (Sat) 6th (Sun) 7th, 2005 http://www.fandemonium.org __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
On Tue, 7 Jun 2005, Michael Hackett wrote: This is the part that shocks me. When did Intel take the x86 from the biggest power hog in the industry to the low power range? Last I saw, PPC was better by a factor of 3, and Transmeta and ARM were light years ahead of everyone. (Granted, the last two have different architectures and are not in the same league speedwise.) The Pentium 4 is the end of the line for the 'Netburst' architecture, from here on out it is Intel's design team in Israel that will be making the next big archicture, because they designed the Pentium M, and look at this: http://www.tomshardware.com/cpu/20050525/pentium4-21.html With the help of a simple socket adapter card and a BIOS upgrade, certain mainboards using Intel's 865/875 chipsets can be upgraded to use a Pentium M instead of a Pentium 4. Such a system offers up-to-date performance paired with low power requirements. Additionally, we were able to raise the FSB from 133 to 160 MHz without any trouble at all. The result was that our 2.13GHz Pentium M 770 ended up running at 2.56 GHz! At this clock speed, our two year old platform was able to beat the processor heavyweights Athlon 64 FX and Intel Pentium 4 Extreme Edition in all 3D games! I also don't get why anyone but a very tiny minority need a laptop faster than a G4. I have a friend who's a professional graphics artist and is completely hampered by his 1Ghz G4 PowerBook when it comes to working with large Illustrator files, and has been waiting and waiting for a G5 PowerBook, and is now going to just wait until next year. In fact, all of the Intel laptops I looked at recently that had reasonably battery life (5 hours) were all in the 1-MHz range. That would indicate that, even with Intel, you have to give up some processing power to get long battery life. Pentium M has very good power consumption/heat generation relative to performance. Oh well, I guess -- being the geek I am -- I just get frustrated when the better technology (PPC) loses. It's funny, though, that Apple -- who represents this position in the commercial OS area -- would be involved this time. Motorola was a lousy partner, and IBM, probably thanks to the PowerPC being the heart of every next-generation console, has turned out to be a lousy partner as well (Microsoft, Sony, and Nintendo are all more important customers than Apple now). Apple needs a partner who is being pushed by a real competitor (AMD) as well as other CPU sourcing options (AMD). And a last point: Seems to me that both NeXT and SGI made similar moves and it didn't work out well for either. Big gamble. Big gamble. NeXT was a niche player at best and their OS ran on a very limited range of PCs and peripherals that they did not produce, and SGI never ported IRIX to x86 (big mistake - x86 SGIs only run Win2k). This is a very different situation, and I am cautiously optimistic. - Nate -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
--- J.S. Garrison [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I can't believe so much is being made here of what amounts to an unsubstantiated rumor. It is official. Steve Jobs made the announcement himself at the latest WWDC. It will be total Fandemonium! August (Fri) 5th, (Sat) 6th (Sun) 7th, 2005 http://www.fandemonium.org __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
Meh, x86 processor alone != PC. I'm sure Apple will make their platform so that normal computers cannot run Mac OS X. Replacing the standard (and outdated, inadequate, and user-unfriendly) BIOS with OpenFirmware will go a long way towards that. Look at the Microsoft Xbox - it's basically an x86 computer, but because it has an odd memory map and no PC BIOS, it does not run Windows; and, you still cannot run Xbox games on a PC, even if you have an identical graphics card (GeForce3) and plenty of RAM and a faster processor... Terry Mathews I can't see anyone successfully marketing a pricey PC that runs Mac OS X, which is what we'll wind up with when Mac goes Intel. -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
--- dr7zyq [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The rumor was started by Steve Job's announcement, and, as I understand it, has to do with the fact that Intel is leading the industry in low power cpu's, Definately not for desktop CPUs. AMD's Socket 939 64bit CPUs have a maximum heat output of 33 watts under full load and when throttled back can drop as low as 3 watts. (No comparison to the older Socket 940 CPUs that were a shorter lived flash in the pan than the Socket 423 first generation P4.) http://www.tomshardware.com/cpu/20041221/cpu_charts-07.html A 3.2Ghz Socket 775 puts out up to 115 watts of heat. http://www.tomshardware.com/cpu/20041220/cpu_charts-23.html Also of note on Socket 775 is the pinless contact design. Wo. Just like the old LCC package 80286 CPUs, except there's 775 of them. What's old is new again, eh? It will be total Fandemonium! August (Fri) 5th, (Sat) 6th (Sun) 7th, 2005 http://www.fandemonium.org __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
--- Liam Proven [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 6/7/05, Jennifer Worgan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: might that not increase the value of vintage Macs - the only ones left that can run with the software Good question, especially considering this list's title. It might do but mainly I expect little effect. As far as new machines go, it will lose Apple some sales (from deserting PowerPC loyalists - but I don't know where they'll go) and it will gain some (from ignorant buyers who see a standard chip or just more GHz). Overall, will it succeed? Don't know. Biug gamble, though. Biggest I've ever seen, I think. I think Jobs saw the Apple was about to fall off the tree because IBM and Motorola have had problems increasing the clock speed of every version of the PowerPC since the G3 while AMD and Intel have zipped ahead, easily transitioning to new materials and fabrication techniques every time their current designs hit thier Mhz barrier. With Intel producing 4ghz CPUs, no amount of advertising hype or synthetic benchmark tests is going to convince (or actually proove) that the PowerPC CPU really is faster. If IBM and Motorola could somehow produce at least a 3Ghz CPU, with room for the design to scale to at least 5Ghz, within the next 2~3 months, then Jobs might reconsider the switch. It's not likely to happen. It will be total Fandemonium! August (Fri) 5th, (Sat) 6th (Sun) 7th, 2005 http://www.fandemonium.org __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
--- Ricardo L. A. Bánffy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: clip And, of course, by 2007, we will have G5 owners coming to this list ;-) To paraphrase a line from Demolition Man... Now all Macs are Vintage Macs. It will be total Fandemonium! August (Fri) 5th, (Sat) 6th (Sun) 7th, 2005 http://www.fandemonium.org __ Discover Yahoo! Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/stayintouch.html -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
--- Terry Mathews [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Meh, x86 processor alone != PC. I'm sure Apple will make their platform so that normal computers cannot run Mac OS X. Replacing the standard (and outdated, inadequate, and user-unfriendly) BIOS with OpenFirmware will go a long way towards that. Apple will really have to do domething drastic, like putting a large chunk of code back into physical chips, to prevent OSX from running on any garden variety PC. The PearPC emulator is less than 2 megabytes and it runs OSX without needing any Apple code other than what's on an OSX CD-ROM. It will be total Fandemonium! August (Fri) 5th, (Sat) 6th (Sun) 7th, 2005 http://www.fandemonium.org __ Discover Yahoo! Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/stayintouch.html -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
--- Todd Russell clip Actually, the developer document they released for building universal binaries states that Intel Macs WILL use a BIOS and not Open Firmware. Trust me, this will be good for those of us who like to upgrade our video cards without having to pay 4 times the amount of a PC equivalent AGP card. ;) That should drastically expand the available hardware options for Macintosh. It will be total Fandemonium! August (Fri) 5th, (Sat) 6th (Sun) 7th, 2005 http://www.fandemonium.org __ Discover Yahoo! Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/stayintouch.html -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
Maybe it's just me, but I actually would love the ability to run Mac OSX on an Intel (Or in my case, an AMD) desktop.. I'd love to do a dual-boot on my desktop of OSX and WinXP Pro. Not to mention I think it would actually do them well. Intel/AMD-compatible hardware is far more prevalent, yet MacOS is usually a much easier OS to use, especially for the inexperienced. An x86-compatible version of MacOSX would probably sell rather well, I would think. But maybe it's just me. Chris McFadden -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
On Jun 5, 2005, at 10:36 PM, Kyle DePasquale wrote: Wouldn't such a major architecture change cause most of the programs currently written for mac to not function at all? If that's the case, then switching to an x86 architecture *could* ruin apple. My guess is that they're not changing architectures, but that they're just going to have intel produce PPC chips, or something that is fairly compatible. Here's the most plausible possibility I've read so far. http://www.wired.com/news/mac/0,2125,67749,00.html?tw=wn_tophead_1 Still, it causes us some consternation. I guess we'll find out tomorrow. I think they just are in talks because of they want to use the chips for some mobile gadget, not mainstream mac lines. -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
On 6/6/05, Marco van de Voort [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think they just are in talks because of they want to use the chips for some mobile gadget, not mainstream mac lines. On 6/6/05, Kyle DePasquale [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Wouldn't such a major architecture change cause most of the programs currently written for mac to not function at all? If that's the case, then switching to an x86 architecture *could* ruin apple. My guess is that they're not changing architectures, but that they're just going to have intel produce PPC chips, or something that is fairly compatible. Well, nope. It's happened. See macworld.com or macnn.com or slashdot.org or macslash.org for details. The Mac is switching to Intel. I am amazed. It's the end of an era. Every major computing platform in the world will run on the same architecture. And it's the oldest and arguably the worst. CISC has won. One ISA to rule them all, one ISA to find them; one ISA to bring them all and in the darkness bind them. -- Liam Proven Home: http://welcome.to/liamsweb * Blog: http://lproven.livejournal.com AOL, Yahoo UK: liamproven * ICQ: 73187508 * MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
might that not increase the value of vintage Macs - the only ones left that can run with the software or has an extinction event occured from which the fallout may take time to see but long in effect? where are the young, enterprizing ones setting out to take advantage of the price drops in the chips made by the other guys who will eagerly seek a new consumer? will they launch a line of cherries? or sour grapes? or maybe pomegranetes? where are those knowledgeable experienced one who were discarded by Apple? are they organizing to launch a line that will skyrocket to success on the fuel of Apple's errors? - Original Message - From: Liam Proven [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Vintage Macs vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com Sent: Monday, June 06, 2005 1:31 PM Subject: Re: Oh my... Intel CPU's??? On 6/6/05, Marco van de Voort [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think they just are in talks because of they want to use the chips for some mobile gadget, not mainstream mac lines. On 6/6/05, Kyle DePasquale [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Wouldn't such a major architecture change cause most of the programs currently written for mac to not function at all? If that's the case, then switching to an x86 architecture *could* ruin apple. My guess is that they're not changing architectures, but that they're just going to have intel produce PPC chips, or something that is fairly compatible. Well, nope. It's happened. See macworld.com or macnn.com or slashdot.org or macslash.org for details. The Mac is switching to Intel. I am amazed. It's the end of an era. Every major computing platform in the world will run on the same architecture. And it's the oldest and arguably the worst. CISC has won. One ISA to rule them all, one ISA to find them; one ISA to bring them all and in the darkness bind them. -- Liam Proven Home: http://welcome.to/liamsweb * Blog: http://lproven.livejournal.com AOL, Yahoo UK: liamproven * ICQ: 73187508 * MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
--- Liam Proven [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I am amazed. It's the end of an era. Every major computing platform in the world will run on the same architecture. And it's the oldest and arguably the worst. CISC has won. One ISA to rule them all, one ISA to find them; one ISA to bring them all and in the darkness bind them. -- Liam Proven I can't believe so much is being made here of what amounts to an unsubstantiated rumor. At the outset, to change to Intel chips would indeed remove the thing that makes a Mac a Mac. And in doing so would kill Mac's following once and for all. Perhaps the REAL purpose for the starting of said rumor? Jeff G Facere Compositio Ex Congeries __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
At 7:47 PM -0700 6/6/05, J.S. Garrison wrote: I can't believe so much is being made here of what amounts to an unsubstantiated rumor. It's pretty $##!@^ substantiated. Steve Jobs said so at WWDC today. At the outset, to change to Intel chips would indeed remove the thing that makes a Mac a Mac. And in doing so would kill Mac's following once and for all. Perhaps the REAL purpose for the starting of said rumor? Jeff G Facere Compositio Ex Congeries __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com -- Allan Hunter [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://home.earthlink.net/~ahunter -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
--- Allan Hunter [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At 7:47 PM -0700 6/6/05, J.S. Garrison wrote: I can't believe so much is being made here of what amounts to an unsubstantiated rumor. It's pretty $##!@^ substantiated. Steve Jobs said so at WWDC today. ~~~ Welp. You'll not see me buying a new Mac at anytime ever. Start planning the funeral. Jeff G Facere Compositio Ex Congeries __ Discover Yahoo! Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/stayintouch.html -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
The rumor was started by Steve Job's announcement, and, as I understand it, has to do with the fact that Intel is leading the industry in low power cpu's, allowing maximum time between charges on laptop computers, which are the industry's biggest sellers right now. With the best operating system and a competitive time between charges (TBC -- okay, I made that abbreviation up), Apple can continue to compete; otherwise, it becomes the left behind. NPR had an in depth discussion of the subject tonight on All Things Considered. David - Original Message - From: J.S. Garrison [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Vintage Macs vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com Sent: Monday, June 06, 2005 7:47 PM Subject: Re: Oh my... Intel CPU's??? --- Liam Proven [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I am amazed. It's the end of an era. Every major computing platform in the world will run on the same architecture. And it's the oldest and arguably the worst. CISC has won. One ISA to rule them all, one ISA to find them; one ISA to bring them all and in the darkness bind them. -- Liam Proven I can't believe so much is being made here of what amounts to an unsubstantiated rumor. At the outset, to change to Intel chips would indeed remove the thing that makes a Mac a Mac. And in doing so would kill Mac's following once and for all. Perhaps the REAL purpose for the starting of said rumor? Jeff G Facere Compositio Ex Congeries __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
On 6/7/05, Jennifer Worgan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: might that not increase the value of vintage Macs - the only ones left that can run with the software Good question, especially considering this list's title. It might do but mainly I expect little effect. As far as new machines go, it will lose Apple some sales (from deserting PowerPC loyalists - but I don't know where they'll go) and it will gain some (from ignorant buyers who see a standard chip or just more GHz). Overall, will it succeed? Don't know. Biug gamble, though. Biggest I've ever seen, I think. or has an extinction event occured from which the fallout may take time to see but long in effect? Might be. Ask me again in 3-4yr! :¬) where are the young, enterprizing ones setting out to take advantage of the price drops in the chips made by the other guys who will eagerly seek a new consumer? will they launch a line of cherries? or sour grapes? or maybe pomegranetes? where are those knowledgeable experienced one who were discarded by Apple? are they organizing to launch a line that will skyrocket to success on the fuel of Apple's errors? No idea at all. I fear for anyone else using PowerPC, though - I think they're doomed now. Pegasos, AmigaOne, Tera - and maybe, longterm, IBM itself. -- Liam Proven Home: http://welcome.to/liamsweb * Blog: http://lproven.livejournal.com AOL, Yahoo UK: liamproven * ICQ: 73187508 * MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
So, is Intel just going to manufacture the chips, or will they have an active part in developing their architecture? Sounds like you're already planning Apple's funeral. I think the only way that Apple will die out, is if everyone jumps ship when they make the conversion to Intel chips. Although, looking at some of the messages in this thread, that very well could happen. Oh, well. I think pretty much everyone will be running some flavor of Linux in 5-10 years, regardless of the CPU they're running it on. On 6/6/05, dr7zyq [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The rumor was started by Steve Job's announcement, and, as I understand it, has to do with the fact that Intel is leading the industry in low power cpu's, allowing maximum time between charges on laptop computers, which are the industry's biggest sellers right now. With the best operating system and a competitive time between charges (TBC -- okay, I made that abbreviation up), Apple can continue to compete; otherwise, it becomes the left behind. NPR had an in depth discussion of the subject tonight on All Things Considered. David - Original Message - From: J.S. Garrison [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Vintage Macs vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com Sent: Monday, June 06, 2005 7:47 PM Subject: Re: Oh my... Intel CPU's??? --- Liam Proven [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I am amazed. It's the end of an era. Every major computing platform in the world will run on the same architecture. And it's the oldest and arguably the worst. CISC has won. One ISA to rule them all, one ISA to find them; one ISA to bring them all and in the darkness bind them. -- Liam Proven I can't believe so much is being made here of what amounts to an unsubstantiated rumor. At the outset, to change to Intel chips would indeed remove the thing that makes a Mac a Mac. And in doing so would kill Mac's following once and for all. Perhaps the REAL purpose for the starting of said rumor? Jeff G Facere Compositio Ex Congeries __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
Well, since AMD is really starting to hurt Intel in the PC processor market, I guess they have to look for another customer base... On 6/5/05, John Niven [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I just heard that Apple will switch to Intel CPU's for future products. Mac OS - OSX - Linux 68K - PPC - x86 The future is for geeks John -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
Wouldn't such a major architecture change cause most of the programs currently written for mac to not function at all? If that's the case, then switching to an x86 architecture *could* ruin apple. My guess is that they're not changing architectures, but that they're just going to have intel produce PPC chips, or something that is fairly compatible. Just my predictions - Kyle On Jun 5, 2005, at 8:09 PM, John Niven wrote: I just heard that Apple will switch to Intel CPU's for future products. Mac OS - OSX - Linux 68K - PPC - x86 The future is for geeks John -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
Re: Oh my....... Intel CPU's???
On Jun 5, 2005, at 10:36 PM, Kyle DePasquale wrote: Wouldn't such a major architecture change cause most of the programs currently written for mac to not function at all? If that's the case, then switching to an x86 architecture *could* ruin apple. My guess is that they're not changing architectures, but that they're just going to have intel produce PPC chips, or something that is fairly compatible. Here's the most plausible possibility I've read so far. http://www.wired.com/news/mac/0,2125,67749,00.html?tw=wn_tophead_1 Still, it causes us some consternation. I guess we'll find out tomorrow. Keith Johnson -- Vintage Macs is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Enter To Win A | -- Canon PowerShot Digital Cameras start at $299 | Free iBook! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html Vintage Macs list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/vintagemacs.shtml -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:vintage.macs@mail.maclaunch.com To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/vintage.macs%40mail.maclaunch.com/ iPod Accessories for Less at 1-800-iPOD.COM Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal www.1800ipod.com
