Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

On 26/05/2010, at 3:42 PM, Andrew Scott wrote: > 1995/1996 Was not the height of the .COM bubble, in fact the .Com was not a > twinkle in anyone's eyes. > > It was 1995 when firmware contacted our company, took us along to a > confernce/luncheon and gave us a pack full of ColdFusion stuff. And

RE: [cfaussie] Re: CFUG Melbourne May 2010. REMINDER, POSTPONED TO NEXT WEEK

We are located at 255 Bourke Street. Which is kinda in the Mall. As the mall starts half way down that block. The building is on the corner of Bourke & Swanston But the entrance is on the south side of Bourke, east of Swanston opposite the Telstra T-Life store I will put a sign on the door, but

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

and, you'll be able to apply for the JB job and get free music as well. i went to CEbit yesterday. i noticed lots of the banners had the "microsoft certified" logo on them. one or two tux-the-penguins. only one adobe A, and none of the CF or FL product logos. there were hundreds of stands, hu

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

And free trips maybe :) > So your saying if I move to .NET I’ll get more free lunches. > > Now I finally understand why JB HI FI moved. > > Regards > Dale Fraser > > http://dale.fraser.id.au > http://cfmldocs.com > http://learncf.com > http://flexcf.com > > From: cfaussie@googlegroups.com

[cfaussie] Re: CFUG Melbourne May 2010. REMINDER, POSTPONED TO NEXT WEEK

Hi Peter, Could yourself or Dale give some sort of direction of which entrance/ door to use to get into the office? Ta, Chong On May 20, 10:13 am, Peter Robertson wrote: > If you're attending the CFUG in Melbourne this month, please don't > roll up tonight, we've postponed to next week to accom

RE: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

So your saying if I move to .NET I'll get more free lunches. Now I finally understand why JB HI FI moved. Regards Dale Fraser http://dale.fraser.id.au http://cfmldocs.com http://learncf.com http://flexcf.com From: cfaussie@googlegroups.com [mailto:cfaus..

RE: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

To really get the correct answer here, I think we need Scott Barnes to comment. Regards Dale Fraser http://dale.fraser.id.au http://cfmldocs.com http://learncf.com http://flexcf.com -Original Message- From: cfaussie@googlegroups.com [mailto:cfaus...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Kym Kov

[cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

I can back that, at my first job, MS used to call us to ask if "everything was ok" and chit chat about upcoming stuff with our IT- centric managers, and regularly sent invites to launch of new products built on MS tech. AND it was at a large private school, so our licenses were all a fraction of th

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

On 26/05/2010 15:14, Mark Mandel wrote: What are other companies out there doing? I.e. have people had experience with MS knocking on their door? Or any other platform? Anyone know first hand? (I'm still waiting for the PHP evangelists to come knocking). I've missed all the fun as I was busy

RE: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

I am both. Adobe Bronze Partner and a reseller through Express Data _ From: Kai Koenig [mailto:k...@koeni.de] Sent: Wednesday, 26 May 2010 3:42 PM To: cfaussie@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet Yes, because that's how the model works in this region. P

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

1995/1996 Was not the height of the .COM bubble, in fact the .Com was not a twinkle in anyone's eyes. It was 1995 when firmware contacted our company, took us along to a confernce/luncheon and gave us a pack full of ColdFusion stuff. And next thing we began coding ColdFusion from that point onward

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

Yes, because that's how the model works in this region. Pacific (and maybe whole AsiaPac) is a distribution-based supply chain, i.e. resellers always interact with a distributor (unless for some specific enterprise products in some very high volume transactions) - like it or not. It's pretty muc

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

MSFT is doing a lot for .NET and Silverlight in NZ - pre-sales events from vendors, technical seminars for 2 hrs where folks on the CIO/CTO level are invited and attend etc, they invite you to free training events local and even oversees - and that's how you get a company to jump on a technology

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

On Wed, May 26, 2010 at 3:29 PM, Dawesi wrote: > The problem lies in the mother ship. Adobe don't even use CF in their > example web apps on roadshow, they use PHP... so no wonder no eyes are > seeing CF anymore. Heck it's not even on the main part of the trial > download page, even though there'

[cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

sharepoint is one of the MS products taking out ColdFusion apps. I've seen it in some of the positions I've seen. On May 26, 3:14 pm, Mark Mandel wrote: > What are other companies out there doing? I.e. have people had experience > with MS knocking on their door? Or any other platform? Anyone kno

[cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

On May 26, 1:42 pm, Mark Mandel wrote: > So, to be clear - you would like to see a designated person for representing > CF in the ANZ region? Much like Adobe has evangelists in US and EU? > > (and I would love to see this as well) > > Even if their job was CF AND something else (I actually found

RE: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

I initially wanted to become a partner on some level so that i could actively be a reseller of CF server licenses as there are not many who do it in australia and none in melbourne. I had to jump through hoops just to be able to do that and they still wouldnt let me do it direct with adobe, i had

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

What are other companies out there doing? I.e. have people had experience with MS knocking on their door? Or any other platform? Anyone know first hand? (I'm still waiting for the PHP evangelists to come knocking). Mark On Wed, May 26, 2010 at 3:02 PM, KC Kuok wrote: > @Eliseo & Mike > > Yeah

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

Andrew, this is what Adobe have _already_ done for CF in the last year in Australia. Australia represents 2% of the global market. If you look at what Adobe are doing for CF in Australia in terms of sponsorships, speakers, UG catering funding etc we are very, very well supported. All that rema

[cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

@Eliseo & Mike Yeah I track jobs about once a week to see how the market is travelling, TBH in australia it does not seem that it is improving or disappearing, its just stagnant atm, it is definitely not experiencing this explosive growth of CF jobs/dev chart that gets thrown about the past 2 year

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

Technical skills, it's a commercial program (i.e. one pays a membership fee depending on level), access to levels is restricted by turnover, sales, decision on how influencing an individual/company is and much more. Benefits: logo, access to pre-sales resources from Adobe, free NFR licenses for

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

That's the problem Coding in CF makes you so efficient you've got all this time to spend on mailing lists. Your managers end up thinking you're slacking off all day. On 26/05/10 2:48 PM, Chad Renando wrote: It is now obvious to me why Cold Fusion is not thriving. All the CF developers are

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

It is now obvious to me why Cold Fusion is not thriving. All the CF developers are too busy talking on uer groups rather than programming. Chad who is now getting back to work On Wed, May 26, 2010 at 2:42 PM, Mark Mandel wrote: > Out of curiosity - what's the benefit / requirements for being a

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

Out of curiosity - what's the benefit / requirements for being a partner? Mark On Wed, May 26, 2010 at 2:40 PM, Steve Onnis wrote: > I am now an Adobe partner, have been since last year and i have never > received a phone call or anything from anyone at Adobe. I get the odd bulk > marketing em

RE: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

I am now an Adobe partner, have been since last year and i have never received a phone call or anything from anyone at Adobe. I get the odd bulk marketing email but thats about it _ From: Mark Mandel [mailto:mark.man...@gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, 26 May 2010 2:33 PM To: cfaussie@googleg

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

Peter, i think your suggestion of amalgamating the user groups in Melbourne is one worth considering. I believe that convincing someone to take on a new technology is more effective when you've got both the technology owner (their partners or evagelists) coming from top down as well as bottom-

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

Hah... thanks but no thanks. I really enjoy working for myself, and I think my wife would kill me if I travelled as much as most evangelists do. Mark On Wed, May 26, 2010 at 2:17 PM, Dale Fraser wrote: > I like the idea of having a dedicated CF evangelist for ANZ. > > > > The purpose of this

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

My 2c I ended up in a CF role after taking on a job to develop and maintain a website for a sport that I love. I came from a Java background and in some regards although I now have a "dream job" of sorts I feel like I've shot myself in the foot in terms of future employment prospects. In

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

That is an interesting question, I have no idea how many Adobe Partners there are that do CF work in the ANZ community. Is the role of an Adobe partner to be fostering CF growth? The ones I've come into contact with, tend to get involved in the community very often (Daemon, Rocketboots, Gruden...

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

Is it a case that there are not enough Adobe Partners? Do they need better support? I'm not sure since I'm not part of the partner programme. Maybe I've got the wrong end of the stick but we seem to be talking about Adobe and developers. Ross On 26/05/2010, at 4:01 PM, Mark Mandel wrot

RE: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

I like the idea of having a dedicated CF evangelist for ANZ. The purpose of this would be to 1. Talk to existing customers 2. Talk to companies big and small using other technologies 3. Demonstrate at conferences 4. Attend User Groups and CAMPS 5. Take CTO's of companies who use C

[cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

While "I" appreciate all those items - sincerely. It seems like a case of preaching to the converted to me. The people that attend the user groups and conferences are already Adobe technology users. >From an Adobe revenue point of view - I understand that it makes sense to keep me happy - so that

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

Mark, I'm with you, and personally I don't want to dwell on what Adobe have or haven't done in the past. I also think we need to understand that CF is not a lead product for Adobe, (no matter how much we love it), and that's just the way it is. So, if we as CF developers want the world to be better

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

Whatever Adobe are doing to promote CF in Australia it is not as much as Firmware used to do. Firmware, a tiny company compared to Adobe, with comparatively minuscule resources ran CF seminars and demonstrations which attendees like me who knew nothing of CF were blown away by the ease of deve

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

But as far as I understand, we have those people who do come to our shores and promote CF to customers directly... or maybe you would like them to be more aggressive about visiting current/previous/potential customers when they are in town? Let's also not forget Adobe has a thimbel of the evangeli

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

Mark, it would be a start and there certainly needs to be a local presence. On Wed, May 26, 2010 at 1:52 PM, Mark Mandel wrote: > So this is what I see Adobe doing locally: > (and this is just my perspective) > >1. Setting up designated CF resellers in the ANZ region. >2. Supporting and

RE: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

Hi guys, Why don't we start Google Wave document to write an Open Letter to Adobe from ANZ CF developers? There we can discuss what is missing (in terms of communication with Adobe, hosting issues and problems, better CF learning and education, as well as promotions and conferences for busi

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

I am not sure it should be just one person, have a look at those like Terry and Adam, Ben etc who fly to the UK to promote it. Forget about just the trade shows, Adobe really needs to book in with the bigger boys and say hey you might know about us, but did you know we are just as good if not bette

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

So this is what I see Adobe doing locally: (and this is just my perspective) 1. Setting up designated CF resellers in the ANZ region. 2. Supporting and sponsoring multiple conferences in ANZ that provide CF content. 3. Sending CF evangelist and engineers to multiple events in ANZ (I th

RE: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

Thats why Adobe have a marketing department with people who apparently know marketing? or do we need to be doing their jobs for them now also? _ From: Mark Mandel [mailto:mark.man...@gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, 26 May 2010 1:45 PM To: cfaussie@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [cfaussie] Re:

RE: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

I agree with the Hosting point you made though there are a number of hosting companies that do CF hosting that know what they are doing such as myself (NovaHost), and FastHit to name a couple. The issue of being competitive is not an issue of CF, but more an issue of the high cost of setting up an

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

If your aim is to solve an issue, one of the easiest ways to do that is to offer some suggestions to how to fix it, don't you think? On Wed, May 26, 2010 at 1:33 PM, Steve Onnis wrote: > Why should we be telling them what we want done? This is a marketing and > sales problem and to be quite fr

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

Mike, I don't know where you've been looking but there have been jobs a plenty here in Sydney as based from the number of Seek ads I've seen come through... Granted they are not "pure" CF roles, but they are roles nonetheless. Eliseo On Wed, May 26, 2010 at 1:11 PM, Mike Kear wrote: > It's a par

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

So, to be clear - you would like to see a designated person for representing CF in the ANZ region? Much like Adobe has evangelists in US and EU? (and I would love to see this as well) Even if their job was CF AND something else (I actually found out a little while back that Terry Ryan is actually

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

I'd like to know what (if anything) Adobe are currently doing to market ColdFusion in this region.Last time i asked this, people (including you, Mark) jumped down my throat and called me a whinger. But i did also notice that no one said anything along the lines of "you're mistaken Mike, Adob

RE: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

Part of the issue for me has always been hosting. Don't get me wrong, I know there ARE hosts in Australia but I have found it difficult to find competitive and reliable ColdFusion hosting with comparable service levels, including staff that know ColdFusion really well and can support it adequately

RE: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

Why should we be telling them what we want done? This is a marketing and sales problem and to be quite frank M$ is kicking their bums. _ From: Mark Mandel [mailto:mark.man...@gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, 26 May 2010 1:25 PM To: cfaussie@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

How you ask Mark? Well it is a good question to ask, but Firmware was out in peoples faces giving business/companies packs. They held events for businesses to come along and see the product in action. You could invite friends along in the industry, they put on a small supper and gave away door pri

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

On Wed, May 26, 2010 at 1:15 PM, Andrew Scott wrote: > but until Adobe come in and push like firmware used to do and promote the > product it will not be a serious contender here in Australia. > Again, I'll ask the question - HOW? I honestly have no idea how firmware used to push it, I started C

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

mySpace On Wed, May 26, 2010 at 1:15 PM, Andrew Myers wrote: > On the Java Posse podcast recently they were trying to think of big sites > made in .NET and they all drew a blank. > > In a later episode stackoverflow.com was put forward as probably the best > example they could give of a large s

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

So its a slow and painful death for Australia. Seriously, when you do a search for ColdFusion on seek there are a few jobs listed but not one of them is a pure ColdFusion job. Been like this for many years, question is how do we change it? We need Adobes help here as the user groups are doing all

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

On the Java Posse podcast recently they were trying to think of big sites made in .NET and they all drew a blank. In a later episode stackoverflow.com was put forward as probably the best example they could give of a large site done in .NET. So it left me wondering just where .NET is really

RE: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

Isnt it a learning issue though? Why is Adobe not pushing to get CF included in university curiculums? If people are not exposed and taught it how can you find developers to use it? Which poses the question, how many people who learn say .Net at uni would come out of uni and switch languages when l

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

It's a paradox - the recruiters say coldfusion developers are really hard to find, yet there have been only handful of coldfusion contracts/permanent jobs advertised in the last year or so in Sydney. If we are in such demand, how come they arent looking for us by advertising? In Sydney in the

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

I hate to ask this question... but... If it's been said for 8 years, but there are still CF jobs and developers in Australia, then that's a long time for all the jobs to dissapear. Although, I don't disagree, it is tough to find CF developers in Australia. On Wed, May 26, 2010 at 1:02 PM, Andrew

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

Oh boy, I think I have been saying that for like 8+ years now. Its the market, people are finding it hard to fill ColdFusion roles. So the only thing left is to move the product over to a more feasible language with a pool of developers that they can resource from. Until that changes for ColdFusi

RE: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

I see it all the time. Lots of recruitment agencies see CF as a legacy or redundant development platform and I guess that is a result of demand and corporate retention of the platform. I really think Adobe needs to do something about it. They need to advertise and get out there promoting the platf

Re: [cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

I say something similar other times when this comes up, but I like seeing letters appear on the screen when I hit the keys, so will go again. I love developing resources, working with them to realise their full potential. Really freakishly love it. Trying to find those resources in a scarce labou

[cfaussie] Re: JB-HI Moving to dotnet

Another jobs suggests: "To apply, you will need to have strong, current software development skills (ASP.Net), hands on experience in legacy maintenance & migration environments, enjoy an agile development cycle and possess a thorough understanding of, and plenty of experience with, .NET framework

[cfaussie] NEW Melbourne Flex User Group

We are officially up and running for the new Melbourne Flex User Group. The group is all established and the old one has been removed. I am also looking to have someone help me in a Co / Manager capacity. There are advantages to running a User Group including software entitlements and stron