Another nice way to contribute to DOS, not exactly FreeDOS is to write
in the DOS wiki, pmwiki http://www.drdos.org.
Or you write to the FreeDOS wiki,
http://apps.sourceforge.net/mediawiki/freedos/index.php?title=Main_Page.
If you feel you needed to search or try error a lot before you got
On Monday 30 March 2009 03:28, Michael Reichenbach wrote:
Eric Auer schrieb:
snip
This makes me think... *Imagine* *someone* would claim there is MS-DOS'
s source code copy pasted into FreeDOS's source code.
What could you do? You would need to stop using FreeDOS as it *probable*
contains
Jim wrote:
Also: IMHO, Arachne should not be a file manager or email client. I
think the most progress could be made by simplifying the code, and
putting the focus on the web browser.
The browser is in core.exe, filemanager in wwwman.exe and insight.exe
(formerly mailman.exe) handles
On Sunday 29 March 2009 04:23, usul wrote:
I am not ready to write driver code, yet.
My main an interest is in designing writing a gui/desktop,
and in writing libraries that can be shared and used by command line
application as well as gui.
Well, before re-inventing the wheel, take a look at
Hi Usul,
I agree, the FreeDOS installer is currently a bit annoying, you must
click and wait a dozens of time. Would be better first to choose all
packets or to click just go ahead and install everything...
I would prefer everything which can install in a fast and safe way
as one of the
Hi Michael,
I thought nothing usable besides the io.sys,
sort.exe and sys.com sources from DOS 3.3 had turned up...
No, even MS-DOS 6.0.
Also source for xcopy and so on.
I said *usable*, as in compilable.
I haven't tested to compile as I am to lazy to setup a build
environment, the
Eric Auer schrieb:
Hi Michael,
I thought nothing usable besides the io.sys,
sort.exe and sys.com sources from DOS 3.3 had turned up...
No, even MS-DOS 6.0.
Also source for xcopy and so on.
I said *usable*, as in compilable.
I haven't tested to compile as I am to lazy to setup a build
By the way I also think Arachne is one of the DOS flagship projects.
Unfortunately there are some very basic things which makes this software
less useful and afaik there is currently no one continuing the
development of this project.
1) no SSL support
- latest DOSLynx implemented it
2) Linux
Hi Michael,
Why on earth would you want to compile 17 year old stolen
source code if you can just steal the pre-compiled Windows
of your flatmate today? ;-) Or for example download MS DOS
from a warez page etc etc. Not my taste, of course... ;-).
Well, compiling makes indeed no point until
Hi Michael,
By the way I also think Arachne is one of the DOS flagship projects.
I agree.
1) no SSL support
- latest DOSLynx implemented it
I believe there are also eLinks based projects with SSL for DOS?
2) Linux port
- From Arachne v1.93 there is also a Linux port.
- Unfortunately
On Sun, 29 Mar 2009, Eric Auer wrote:
Hi Michael,
snips here and there
1) no SSL support
- latest DOSLynx implemented it
I believe there are also eLinks based projects with SSL for DOS?
Dunno if the elinks port does SSL, I haven't tried that aspect.
4) compiler
- still dependent to
Eric Auer schrieb:
Hi Michael,
Why on earth would you want to compile 17 year old stolen
source code if you can just steal the pre-compiled Windows
of your flatmate today? ;-) Or for example download MS DOS
from a warez page etc etc. Not my taste, of course... ;-).
Well, compiling makes
Eric Auer schrieb:
- As I think xswap will not work in native Linux
You will not need any of that if you simply compile Arachne
with a 32bit compiler in the first place.
Why it can't be also simple compiled on DOS with 32 bit compiler?
6) graphics backend
- Dr WebSpyder and Lineo
On Sun, 29 Mar 2009, Michael Reichenbach wrote:
It's still questionable if it's illegal.
...only in one way: one could take the code, describe it in gory detail,
then have someone else write new code from the description without having
seen the code, that would be (I think) legal, and it's
Hi Michael,
FreeDOS developer stolen ms-dos source code and now in prison?
That not, but for example China DOS seems to be a
rip of Win98 DOS so they often have to change their
homepage and I never saw them in a commercial product.
While FreeDOS is used for things like mainboard CDs,
Hi,
- As I think xswap will not work in native Linux
You will not need any of that if you simply compile Arachne
with a 32bit compiler in the first place.
Why it can't be also simple compiled on DOS with 32 bit compiler?
That is what I meant - port Arachne to GNU C / DJGPP and
then you
Hi Usul / Adam,
I am very interested in helping. If you have any tasks that
you need done, even if it is unglamorous. I'll take it. :)
We have a page about this:
www.freedos.org/jhall/2009/01/29/you-can-help.html
- package updated packages for FDUPDATE and FDPKG and installer
Work in
Eric Auer schrieb:
It's still questionable if it's illegal.
How can we finally prove that it's illegal or not?
By reading any law book you can probably find out
that company secrets are not open for free use ;-)
Even if it was somebody else who leaked them first.
On law book there are
You're starting to sound more and more like a troll with each post you
write:
On Sun, 29 Mar 2009, Michael Reichenbach wrote:
Also again, why do you believe FreeDOS is free of MS-DOS's intellectual
property? That's impossible as you implemented a pretty compatible
operating system.
Remember
Hi Michael,
Again, theft = original is lost and in hands of thief only.
Yeah I agree that stealing copies is something different
from stealing the original but if stealing copies was
legal then nobody could sell anything that can be copied
which would be a very strange situation if you ask me.
Hi all,
wouldn't be better porting dillo for freedos?
imho, the main bottleneck is the gui part that should be re written
http://www.dillo.org/
See Ya,
Geraldo
Sapere Aude
Non ducor, duco
São Paulo, Brasil, -3gmt
site: http://exdev.sf.net/
msn: geraldo_boca_at_hotmail.com
skype: geraldo-netto
Michael wrote:
Arachne has GPL license so you can force WebSpyder/Lineo to
make their Arachne modifications public.
No, them have purchased a proprietary license from the copyright holders
(original developers). GPL doesn't surrender rights. It's dual licensing
like with Qt.
Hi guys,
EA:
Thanks for the warning :-)). Luckily most of the FreeDOS
kernel is written in C... One of the things that make it
complicated is that it sometimes has to follow long chains
of things calling each other because it is documented that
MS DOS does it the same way, so for
- I am not sure whenever Udo Kuhnt's version uses 16 or 32 bit DPMI but
it I think it's 16.
The difference isn't that big, anyway. Default code operation size
changes, but this doesn't require changes to the actual code (even in .ASM
source files) if the assembler or compiler supports both
Hi, at the risk of making this thread long...
If your priority is not to break the law, buy MS-DOS (and/or Win4.x)
install disks plus license and use (or DEBUG) these legally ;-)
You know that open source has advantages, for example FreeDOS
runs on more modern hardware and is actively
Hi Christian,
Well, decent MS-DOS kernels plus command interpreters
also have LBA, FAT32 and DOSLFN support.
That is Windows 98 DOS... Better kernel but fewer apps...
And if you buy it, you get a Windows that you do not
need if you only wanted DOS as unwanted extra... ;-).
Is it? I'm still
Blair has been working on alternative C libraries, for
example for almost-drop-in-LFN (long file name) support
or for making compiled apps smaller by compiling with a
smaller C library. I have the impression that this could
use some careful proofreading to improve stability...
Yeah I spent a
- 32 bit DPMI would be better.
Not necessarily. Some applications even run dual-mode (RM or 16-bit PM) so
even 16-bit has it's advantages. The 64 KiB code segment limit is the only
real disadvantage. (Or are code segments with 16-bit default operation
size not actually limited to 64 KiB?)
I
What could you do? You would need to stop using FreeDOS as it *probable*
contains illegal stuff. On the other hand you have *no way* to confirm
whenever it's the truth or not.
Was MS-DOS even written in C? if not, at least the parts written in C
(most) could never have been copied and pasted.
I used to organize all the system files in a system directory. and
the apps in an app directory under C: instead of under the system
directory.
C:\FDOS all the command programs here
C:\Apps all the applications under here grouped in directories like
games, develop, utility etc.
If you move
Hi Adam,
As Eric put it, NASM is considered more free than JWASM.
as you probably can see there are also rather questionable sentences to find
in this mailing-list. Freedom, Democracy, Justice, Fairness, ... are
commonly regarded as positive terms and because of this they are also favorite
Hi !
If you are more interrested in low level stuff you can work with Eric Auer on
the FreeDOS kernel. There is few bugs to fix and few feature to add - mainly
implement the COUNTRY.SYS (functions about national support). You don't have to
write it from scratch as it is already present in
usul schrieb:
You could put toghether FreeDOS 1.1...
most programs have new versions that are ok, but what is mostly needed
is put all of it toghether, test new versions, fix a few things and
This sounds like a good task for me to start. And I am most certainly willing.
Would this be
A (or more then one) virtualizer is a good source for initial developing
and testing, often an emulator is even more picky about how you
implement. DOSBox is good for DOS games but many utilities refuse to
work.
You can boot a real DOS (f.e. FreeDOS) disk image inside DOSBox which
makes
On Sat, 28 Mar 2009, Christian Masloch wrote:
A (or more then one) virtualizer is a good source for initial developing
and testing, often an emulator is even more picky about how you
implement. DOSBox is good for DOS games but many utilities refuse to
work.
You can boot a real DOS (f.e.
As Eric put it, NASM is considered more free than JWASM.
as you probably can see there are also rather questionable sentences
to find
in this mailing-list. Freedom, Democracy, Justice, Fairness, ...
are
commonly regarded as positive terms and because of this they are also
favorite
If you want to learn about (16-bit) DOS kernel stuff, first get the RBIL
(Ralf Brown's Interrupt List) and the source of DOS-C (mostly C) and
Udo's
Enhanced DR-DOS kernel (Assembly). (You might as well get the old RxDOS
7.1.5 Assembly sources but oh well.)
...and the sources for MS-DOS
Christian Masloch schrieb:
If you want to learn about (16-bit) DOS kernel stuff, first get the RBIL
(Ralf Brown's Interrupt List) and the source of DOS-C (mostly C) and
Udo's
Enhanced DR-DOS kernel (Assembly). (You might as well get the old RxDOS
7.1.5 Assembly sources but oh well.)
...and
Japheth,
Politics of any sort are this way. It is always extremes that shout
the loudest. In my opinion is aways in the middle the answer always is
in the middle, the middle rarely if ever has an advocate. :P
I like open source and free software. More the spirit of the law
though then the law
I am not ready to write driver code, yet.
My main an interest is in designing writing a gui/desktop,
and in writing libraries that can be shared and used by command line
application as well as gui.
But I also have an interest device and similar programming.
I think FreeDos relies alot on closed
fdpkg requires c:\FDOS?
how do you maintain a working existing environment
along side the beta one even following the existing
structure and using c:\FDOSBETA or something acceptable.
perhaps fdpkg could be modified to use a database to store where the
packages are came from etc.
Is there a open
It's okay if you know vaguely about the internals of something, but when
you write an imitation of it, chuck all that code aside and try to write
yours along different lines. For example, if the original was written to
conserve memory usage, go for speed instead, or go for generality. The
code
On Sat, 28 Mar 2009, usul wrote:
perhaps fdpkg could be modified to use a database to store where the
packages are came from etc.
Is there a open source database that can be used in an dos
application, if none exist a flat file could be used as well.
I randomly wonder if it's possible to
fdpkg requires c:\FDOS?
how do you maintain a working existing environment
along side the beta one even following the existing
structure and using c:\FDOSBETA or something acceptable.
No, it doesn't require this directory name. The directory name is read
from the DOSDIR environment
So, do you want to accuse me of the not-so-positive intention to say
that JWASM has indeed disadvantages?
No, this was generally spoken. I don't know your intentions.
Of course _I_ think that NASM is better.
Yes, I know. And I think that the more free-advantage of Nasm, which you and
The question whether Masm or Nasm has a larger community or is more
widely
used is indeed somewhat interesting, but it's interesting because it's a
common propaganda item which nicely shows that people tend to believe
what
they want to believe.
It's also interesting because JWASM and
Dev Team,
I am very nearly completed on the setup of freedos. all I need now is the
network card, its in the mail. :)
But I can copy floppy by floppy if I have to :)
I am very interested in helping. If you have any tasks that you need done,
even if it is unglamorous.
I'll take it. :)
Not sure
Hi,
I am not a part of the dev team but a pretty active user and I have
dozens of ideas to implement in C(++) for DOS...
To awake your continued interest on what you might work in the future it
might help to let you do things you are personally interested in.
It would help if you tell us what
Hi,
It would help if you tell us what is your interest in DOS and/or what
you are using it most for. (recovery, backup, hardware testing,
benchmark, web browsing, gaming, music player, server or whatever)
My main interest is programming and a challenge. Occasionally play some old
games
Hi theMouse,
if you are willing to help, I have one suggestion that will make you
very knowledgeable of FreeDOS:
You could put toghether FreeDOS 1.1...
most programs have new versions that are ok, but what is mostly needed
is put all of it toghether, test new versions, fix a few things and
Hi Adam,
My main interest is programming and a challenge. Occasionally play some
old
games
that I miss. Bards Tale etc.
Check out Commander Keen ;-)
Interested in the Kernel and Assembly programming.
If you want to learn something about the DOS kernel and Assembly language
I could
Alain M. schrieb:
most programs have new versions that are ok, but what is mostly needed
is put all of it toghether, test new versions, fix a few things and
probably modify a little the installer.
I agree, the FreeDOS installer is currently a bit annoying, you must
click and wait a dozens of
You can look at drdos.org, see
http://www.unet.univie.ac.at/~a0503736/php/drdoswiki/index.php?n=Main.Development
for a nice overview about DOS development in general with many links.
There are some pretty cool gui toolskits for DOS.
Christian Masloch schrieb:
If you want to learn about (16-bit) DOS kernel stuff, first get the RBIL
(Ralf Brown's Interrupt List) and the source of DOS-C (mostly C) and Udo's
Enhanced DR-DOS kernel (Assembly). (You might as well get the old RxDOS
7.1.5 Assembly sources but oh well.)
On Sat, 28 Mar 2009, Michael Reichenbach wrote:
Christian Masloch schrieb:
If you want to learn about (16-bit) DOS kernel stuff, first get the RBIL
(Ralf Brown's Interrupt List) and the source of DOS-C (mostly C) and Udo's
Enhanced DR-DOS kernel (Assembly). (You might as well get the old
lyricalnanoha schrieb:
On Sat, 28 Mar 2009, Michael Reichenbach wrote:
Christian Masloch schrieb:
If you want to learn about (16-bit) DOS kernel stuff, first get the RBIL
(Ralf Brown's Interrupt List) and the source of DOS-C (mostly C) and Udo's
Enhanced DR-DOS kernel (Assembly). (You
On Sat, 28 Mar 2009, Michael Reichenbach wrote:
lyricalnanoha schrieb:
On Sat, 28 Mar 2009, Michael Reichenbach wrote:
Christian Masloch schrieb:
If you want to learn about (16-bit) DOS kernel stuff, first get the RBIL
(Ralf Brown's Interrupt List) and the source of DOS-C (mostly C) and
lyricalnanoha schrieb:
On Sat, 28 Mar 2009, Michael Reichenbach wrote:
lyricalnanoha schrieb:
On Sat, 28 Mar 2009, Michael Reichenbach wrote:
Christian Masloch schrieb:
If you want to learn about (16-bit) DOS kernel stuff, first get the RBIL
(Ralf Brown's Interrupt List) and the source
Thanks everyone.
Very helpful!
I have ordered Some books :)
FreeDOS Kernel; An MS-DOS Emulator for Platform Independence and
Embedded Systems Development
Undocumented DOS: A Programmer's Guide to Reserved MS-DOS Functions
and Data Structures/Book and Disk (Andrew Schulman Programming)
I agree, the FreeDOS installer is currently a bit annoying, you must
click and wait a dozens of time. Would be better first to choose all
packets or to click just go ahead and install everything without bugging
around.
-mr
Part that I hated most was that I had to keep clicking.
Yes I would
You could put toghether FreeDOS 1.1...
most programs have new versions that are ok, but what is mostly needed
is put all of it toghether, test new versions, fix a few things and
This sounds like a good task for me to start. And I am most certainly willing.
Would this be pulling together the
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