Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

On May 22, 2007, at 12:24 PM, Phil Pennock wrote: On 2007-05-22 at 06:01 -0500, Peter da Silva wrote: BTDTGT"cd ~/src/nvi; make; sudo sh -c 'make install; vi=`which vi`; rm $vi; ln -s /usr/local/bin/vi $vi'" You do realise that sooner or later a Linux wannabe distribution is going to ship

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

On 2007-05-22 at 06:01 -0500, Peter da Silva wrote: > BTDTGT"cd ~/src/nvi; make; sudo sh -c 'make install; vi=`which vi`; rm $vi; > ln -s /usr/local/bin/vi $vi'" You do realise that sooner or later a Linux wannabe distribution is going to ship without vi by default, so that you'll just have cre

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

David Cantrell writes: > On Mon, May 21, 2007 at 08:18:56AM -0700, Sean O'Rourke wrote: >> David Cantrell writes: >> > The big problem with emacs is that it looks like that most unhelpful of >> > "help" systems, GNU info. >> Meh, I personally prefer it to a wad of randomly-structured HTML, > > B

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

On Mon, May 21, 2007 at 04:20:52PM +0200, Abigail wrote: > What I hate about every Linux distro I've used is that when I type > 'vi file', I get an editor that isn't vi. It's usually vim. I guess > that's a great editor for some, and I don't mind it being there. > But don't call it vi. It isn't.

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

On Mon, May 21, 2007 at 08:18:56AM -0700, Sean O'Rourke wrote: > David Cantrell writes: > > The big problem with emacs is that it looks like that most unhelpful of > > "help" systems, GNU info. > Meh, I personally prefer it to a wad of randomly-structured HTML, Bet you'd rather have a nice manpag

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

On May 22, 2007, at 2:04 AM, jrod...@hate.spamportal.net wrote: vim in compatable mode is not, I believe, 100% compatible, but so close you will probably not ever encounter a failed expectation. Har Bloody Har.

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

"vim -C -u NONE" should skip past just about any initialisation that has been inflicted upon you. Alias/function 'vi' to use that and I'm sure you'll still grumble but at least you'll be productive whilst grumbling about what you had to do in order to be productive. ;^) BTDTGT"cd ~/src/nvi; m

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

On Tue, 22 May 2007, jrod...@hate.spamportal.net wrote: > > vim in compatable mode is not, I believe, 100% compatible, but so close > you will probably not ever encounter a failed expectation. vim ships in > compatible mode by default. It's undo behaviour is still different to Berkeley vi. Tony.

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

On May 21, 2007, at 11:16 AM, A. Pagaltzis wrote: * Sean O'Rourke [2007-05-21 17:25]: David Cantrell writes: The big problem with emacs is that it looks like that most unhelpful of "help" systems, GNU info. Meh, I personally prefer it to a wad of randomly-structured HTML, My ideal looks

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

On 5/22/07, jrod...@hate.spamportal.net wrote: vim in compatable mode is not, I believe, 100% compatible, but so close you will probably not ever encounter a failed expectation. vim ships in compatible mode by default. That's why I was surprised that Abigail couldn't treat the vim as a stock

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

On Mon, May 21, 2007 at 06:21:53PM -0700, Phil Pennock wrote: > On 2007-05-21 at 21:41 +0200, Abigail wrote: > > On Mon, May 21, 2007 at 06:42:14PM +0100, Tony Finch wrote: > > > Are you actually getting Joy's vi or is it Bostic's nvi? My point was, like ircds, there is no mainline vi, and has not

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

On 2007-05-21 at 21:41 +0200, Abigail wrote: > On Mon, May 21, 2007 at 06:42:14PM +0100, Tony Finch wrote: > > Are you actually getting Joy's vi or is it Bostic's nvi? The latter is in > > many ways less hateful than the former (or at least the version shipped by > > Sun), e.g. because of infinite

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

Somewhere on Shadow Earth, at Mon, May 21, 2007 at 06:08:57PM +, H.Merijn Brand wrote: > > Are you actually getting Joy's vi or is it Bostic's nvi? The latter is in > > Neither probably, as all the major vendors think they can do better. Both > AIX and HP-UX ship with a `real' vi, but don't t

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

On Mon, 21 May 2007 18:42:14 +0100, Tony Finch wrote: > On Mon, 21 May 2007, H.Merijn Brand wrote: > > > > So untrue. Following up on Abigail's hate, there have been numerous > > times in the recent month that I typed 'ex -v' just to NOT get into > > some vi clone like gvim or vim. > > Are you a

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

On Mon, 21 May 2007 18:42:14 +0100, Tony Finch wrote: > On Mon, 21 May 2007, H.Merijn Brand wrote: > > > > So untrue. Following up on Abigail's hate, there have been numerous > > times in the recent month that I typed 'ex -v' just to NOT get into > > some vi clone like gvim or vim. > > Are you a

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

On Mon, May 21, 2007 at 06:42:14PM +0100, Tony Finch wrote: > On Mon, 21 May 2007, H.Merijn Brand wrote: > > > > So untrue. Following up on Abigail's hate, there have been numerous > > times in the recent month that I typed 'ex -v' just to NOT get into > > some vi clone like gvim or vim. > > Are y

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

On Mon, 21 May 2007, H.Merijn Brand wrote: > > So untrue. Following up on Abigail's hate, there have been numerous > times in the recent month that I typed 'ex -v' just to NOT get into > some vi clone like gvim or vim. Are you actually getting Joy's vi or is it Bostic's nvi? The latter is in many

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

On Mon, 21 May 2007 10:06:49 -0700, jrod...@hate.spamportal.net wrote: > > What I hate about every Linux distro I've used is that when I type > > 'vi file', I get an editor that isn't vi. > > There is no vi. vi is dead. There are only vi compatables. So untrue. Following up on Abigail's hate, t

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

> What I hate about every Linux distro I've used is that when I type > 'vi file', I get an editor that isn't vi. There is no vi. vi is dead. There are only vi compatables. Long live vim.

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

On Mon, 21 May 2007 18:16:50 +0200, "A. Pagaltzis" wrote: > * Sean O'Rourke [2007-05-21 17:25]: > > David Cantrell writes: > > > The big problem with emacs is that it looks like that most > > > unhelpful of "help" systems, GNU info. > > > > Meh, I personally prefer it to a wad of randomly-stru

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

* Sean O'Rourke [2007-05-21 17:25]: > David Cantrell writes: > > The big problem with emacs is that it looks like that most > > unhelpful of "help" systems, GNU info. > > Meh, I personally prefer it to a wad of randomly-structured > HTML, My ideal looks like this: * Manpage with usage/synopsis

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

David Cantrell writes: > The big problem with emacs is that it looks like that most unhelpful of > "help" systems, GNU info. Meh, I personally prefer it to a wad of randomly-structured HTML, though I agree that the standalone Info reader is a polyp of evil. In any case, it sure beats either a PD

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

On Mon, May 21, 2007 at 04:28:11PM +0200, Philip Newton wrote: > On 5/21/07, Abigail wrote: > >What I hate about every Linux distro I've used is that when I type > >'vi file', I get an editor that isn't vi. It's usually vim. I guess > >that's a great editor for some, and I don't mind it being ther

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

On 5/21/07, Abigail wrote: What I hate about every Linux distro I've used is that when I type 'vi file', I get an editor that isn't vi. It's usually vim. I guess that's a great editor for some, and I don't mind it being there. But don't call it vi. It isn't. Real Unixes have vi. Linux doesn't.

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

On Fri, May 18, 2007 at 08:40:03AM +0200, Philip Newton wrote: > On 5/18/07, Tony Finch wrote: > >On Thu, 17 May 2007, Zach White wrote: > >> > >> -Zach (Who's still upset that there's no way he can use nvi's multi-level > >>undo model when stuck in vim) > > > >Oh you can, except the key b

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

On Fri, May 18, 2007 at 07:35:46PM +0300, Yossi Kreinin wrote: > Sean O'Rourke wrote: > >I like Emacs [yay carefully selective quoting!] > What are you talking about? XEmacs has an excellent online GUI help system! The big problem with emacs is that it looks like that most unhelpful of "help" sys

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

On Fri, 18 May 2007 19:35:46 +0300, Yossi Kreinin wrote: > Sean O'Rourke wrote: > > > > I like Emacs's solution to this (on a terminal): the user will > > eventually type backspace, which pops up a huge, dense, and > > ultimately useless meta-help screen. > > > > What are you talking about? XE

Re: [offlist] Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

A. Pagaltzis skribis 2007-05-18 23:43 (+0200): > > Can I get a copy of your vimrc? :) > sure, attached. Thanks, this'll be helpful for building my own. -- korajn salutojn, juerd waalboer: perl hacker convolution: ict solutions and consultancy

Re: [offlist] Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

* A. Pagaltzis [2007-05-18 23:43]: > sure, attached. Hmm, actually, it’s a bit of a mess. It doesn’t have enough conditionals to work without errors on a Vim 5, but it does have *some* conditionals to test for a Vim 5. Here’s another copy where I’ve made up my mind. Thanks for providing the kick

Re: [offlist] Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

Hi Juerd, * Juerd Waalboer [2007-05-18 18:15]: > Can I get a copy of your vimrc? :) sure, attached. I’ve been wanting to HTMLify it and update the copy at , but as with so many things, I’ve not gotten around to it yet. Regards, -- Aristotle Paga

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

Vim is Useful Out Of The Box. What a concept. The only options I use in nvi are ":se ai", and I don't *need* that. I used to go with "sm" as well, but I seem to have quit expecting it. I haven't found the options that make "vim" non-hateful for me, so after installing nvi on panther I delete

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

On May 18, 2007, at 9:59 AM, Sean O'Rourke wrote: Of course, the best is ed The competition to "ed" was TECO and SOS, and not even the real TECO, and there was NO WAY you could run any kind of real Emacs on a PDP-11 (what did RMS care? If you don't have 36 bits you're not playing with a full

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

Sean O'Rourke wrote: I like Emacs's solution to this (on a terminal): the user will eventually type backspace, which pops up a huge, dense, and ultimately useless meta-help screen. What are you talking about? XEmacs has an excellent online GUI help system! You go to a menu, and up pops an ex

[offlist] Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

Hi Aristotle, Can I get a copy of your vimrc? :) Thanks, -- korajn salutojn, juerd waalboer: perl hacker convolution: ict solutions and consultancy

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

* Yossi Kreinin [2007-05-18 16:50]: > A. Pagaltzis wrote: > >A virginal vim is almost as good as my customised one as far > >as I'm concerned: a quick `:set nocp ai nu acd | syn on` and > >I'm off to the races. Those are all of the customisations that > >affect me constantly, the rest of my vimrc

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

Yossi Kreinin writes: > Now comes the critical moment. The newbie is very annoyed, since it's > probably the first encounter with a program that refuses to > terminate. I like Emacs's solution to this (on a terminal): the user will eventually type backspace, which pops up a huge, dense, and ultim

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

A. Pagaltzis wrote: A virginal vim is almost as good as my customised one as far as I'm concerned: a quick `:set nocp ai nu acd | syn on` and I'm off to the races. Those are all of the customisations that affect me constantly, the rest of my vimrc is gravy. I do like to delete characters with

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

* Yossi Kreinin [2007-05-18 15:50]: > few humans can survive the dysfunctional default settings of a > highly extensible program). A virginal vim is almost as good as my customised one as far as I'm concerned: a quick `:set nocp ai nu acd | syn on` and I'm off to the races. Those are all of the c

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

Peter da Silva wrote: (and before the Emacs people get all excited... kids today, don't remember Gosling versus Lucid vs RMSmacs) Well, as long as both emacs and xemacs are installed everywhere, it's sort of unforgettable. Especially as long as their configuration files are incompatible,

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

Peter da Silva wrote: > nvi kicks vim's pasty white butt. :) > > (and before the Emacs people get all excited... kids today, don't > remember Gosling versus Lucid vs RMSmacs) I'm dating myself here by remembering those, I guess... Can't remember using gmacs, though, but Lucid, yes. > >

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

nvi kicks vim's pasty white butt. :) (and before the Emacs people get all excited... kids today, don't remember Gosling versus Lucid vs RMSmacs)

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

On 5/18/07, Tony Finch wrote: On Thu, 17 May 2007, Zach White wrote: > > -Zach (Who's still upset that there's no way he can use nvi's multi-level >undo model when stuck in vim) Oh you can, except the key bindings are helpfully different. In proper^Wnvi, to undo multiple times you type

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

On Thu, 17 May 2007, Zach White wrote: > > -Zach (Who's still upset that there's no way he can use nvi's multi-level >undo model when stuck in vim) Oh you can, except the key bindings are helpfully different. In proper^Wnvi, to undo multiple times you type u (just like to do anything m

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

On 2007-05-17 at 20:38 +, Zach White wrote: > I can't stand color syntax highlighting, myself. Every time I try to use > it I get distracted by the changing colors every time I open or close some > quoting method. And don't get me started on the problems when the file-type > auto-detection fail

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

* Zach White [2007-05-17 22:45]: > -Zach (Who's still upset that there's no way he can use nvi's >multi-level undo model when stuck in vim) Vim 7 keeps all undo points around and you can go to any of them at any time, including going forward to a different thread of changes than the one y

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

Somewhere on Shadow Earth, at Thu, May 17, 2007 at 12:48:01PM -0700, Robert G. Werner wrote: > Of course, I hate how Vim helpfully brings up the help screen on my > laptop when I hit f1 instdead of escape but that is a hardware hate. That pain, I can help you with. Add the following two lines t

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

On Thu, May 17, 2007 at 01:24:38PM -0700, Sean O'Rourke wrote: > Of course, this is irrelevant in the real world. It continues to > amaze me how many students I see in the lab using vi without > ":set syntax=on" or Emacs without "(blink-cursor-mode -1)", > having not even tried to reduce the pain.

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

jrod...@hate.spamportal.net writes: > Right like a turing complete scripting language that only > exists inside the one editor and nowhere else, has terrible > syntax and clunky usage. You see, the beauty of a Turing-complete scripting language is that it transmutes software hate into self-loathin

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

On Thu, May 17, 2007 at 12:23:07PM -0700, Sean O'Rourke wrote: > "Jarkko Hietaniemi" writes: > > > On 5/17/07, David Cantrell wrote: > >> I had to use strace, awk, md5sum and diff. To configure an editor. > > > > Serves vi(m) users right. > > Yeah, your editor should focus on being an Editor.

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

Sean O'Rourke wrote: "Jarkko Hietaniemi" writes: On 5/17/07, David Cantrell wrote: I had to use strace, awk, md5sum and diff. To configure an editor. Serves vi(m) users right. Yeah, your editor should focus on being an Editor. Anything else, like being an Editor Configurer, is just bloa

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

"Jarkko Hietaniemi" writes: > On 5/17/07, David Cantrell wrote: >> I had to use strace, awk, md5sum and diff. To configure an editor. > > Serves vi(m) users right. Yeah, your editor should focus on being an Editor. Anything else, like being an Editor Configurer, is just bloat. After all, Uni

Re: vim, and the configuration thereof

On 5/17/07, David Cantrell wrote: I, like all RIGHT and PROPER people, use a vi-derivative for my coding, as only tests, paedos, and smokers use emacs. Specifically, I'm using vim 7.0. I recently intsalled a shiny new Debian Etch on my desktop at work. After a little fiddling with my ~

vim, and the configuration thereof

I, like all RIGHT and PROPER people, use a vi-derivative for my coding, as only tests, paedos, and smokers use emacs. Specifically, I'm using vim 7.0. I recently intsalled a shiny new Debian Etch on my desktop at work. After a little fiddling with my ~/.vimrc it does exactly what I want w