...
work on Mars. The investor claims to have evaluated Perl vs. C years ago,
to have witnessed that every single hit on the webserver under mod_perl
causes a CPU usage spike that isn't seen with C, and that under heavy load
]- this seems to me like non-compiled script, module or
On Fri, 2001-12-14 at 14:27, Thomas Moore wrote:
I spoke to the technical lead at Yahoo who said mod_perl will not scale as
well as c++ when you get to their level of traffic, but for a large
Isn't that coming from a company using Python?
I see that most of their URLs include a tell-tale .py.
On Mon, Dec 17, 2001 at 10:32:58AM -0600, Matthew Kennedy wrote:
On Fri, 2001-12-14 at 14:27, Thomas Moore wrote:
I spoke to the technical lead at Yahoo who said mod_perl will not scale as
well as c++ when you get to their level of traffic, but for a large
Isn't that coming from a company
On Fri, 14 Dec 2001, Jeff Yoak wrote:
All,
I wasn't sure what volume of response to expect when I originally
wrote. Thank you all for the comments that you all are making. They are
helping. Given that the response is fairly high, I'm waiting for stuff to
roll in rather than
While this advocacy thread is hot, please remember my request to send me
your success stories so we have more material others can use to prove
their point to their investors, bosses, girlfriends, moms :)
I've received only three new stories since my request (I didn't put them
online yet, they
and
find all the hot spots show it to the customer and go here it works.
marc
- Original Message -
From: Matt Sergeant [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Jeff Yoak [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Saturday, December 15, 2001 3:24 AM
Subject: Re: mod_perl vs. C for high performance Apache
Hi All,
Recently I did a substantial project for a client in using
mod_perl. That client is happy with the work, but an investor with their
company is very angry because of what a horrible choice mod_perl is for
high-load web applications compared with Apache modules and even CGI
http://www.perl.com/pub/a/2001/10/17/etoys.html
Yea, mod_perl really sucks ; )
I have even worked on poorly architectured and coded sites which still
performed fairly well.
Recently I did a substantial project for a client in using
mod_perl. That client is happy with the work, but an
On Fri, Dec 14, 2001 at 12:12:09PM -0800, Jeff Yoak wrote:
Hi All,
Recently I did a substantial project for a client in using
mod_perl. That client is happy with the work, but an investor with their
company is very angry because of what a horrible choice mod_perl is for
Investors suck like that. I have had to fight many of these battles.
The first thing to do is find out specifically _why_ the investor thinks
that so you can counter their claims. Trying to counter vague notions of
'terrible' is impossible. The opponent has to commit to an opinion
before you
Jeff Yoak [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Hi All,
Recently I did a substantial project for a client in using
mod_perl. That client is happy with the work, but an
investor with their company is very angry because of what a
horrible choice mod_perl is for
fast. (faster than Amazon.com)
-tom
-Original Message-
From: Jeff Yoak [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Friday, December 14, 2001 12:12 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: mod_perl vs. C for high performance Apache modules
Hi All,
Recently I did a substantial project for a client
I spoke to the technical lead at Yahoo who said mod_perl will not scale as
well as c++ when you get to their level of traffic, but for a large
ecommerce site mod_perl is fine.
Scalability has less to do with language/execution environment than
which database you are using. Path length is
I spoke to the technical lead at Yahoo who said mod_perl will not scale as
well as c++ when you get to their level of traffic, but for a large
ecommerce site mod_perl is fine.
According to something I once read by David Filo, Yahoo also had to tweak
the FreeBSD code because they had trouble
Perrin Harkins [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
I spoke to the technical lead at Yahoo who said mod_perl will not scale as
well as c++ when you get to their level of traffic, but for a large
ecommerce site mod_perl is fine.
According to something I once read by David Filo, Yahoo also had to
At 09:15 PM 12/14/2001 +0100, Thomas Eibner wrote:
The key to mod_perl development is speed, there are numerous testimonials
from users implementing a lot of work in a very short time with mod_perl.
Ask the clients investor wheter he wants to pay for having everything you
did rewritten as an
At 03:12 PM 12/14/01, Jeff Yoak wrote:
Recently I did a substantial project for a client in using
mod_perl. That client is happy with the work, but an investor with
their company is very angry because of what a horrible choice
mod_perl is for high-load web applications compared
On Fri, 14 Dec 2001, Thomas Moore wrote:
I spoke to the technical lead at Yahoo who said mod_perl will not scale as
well as c++ when you get to their level of traffic, but for a large
ecommerce site mod_perl is fine.
Well, Yahoo is _extremely_ atypical. And they do a lot of stuff that
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On Fri, Dec 14, 2001 at 12:12:09PM -0800, Jeff Yoak wrote:
Recently I did a substantial project for a client in using
mod_perl. That client is happy with the work, but an investor with their
company is very angry because of what a
I dont think its your responsibility anymore. If the investor had a
preference he should have stated it BEFORE work began. If your client
did not keep him informed then your client has that burden to bear.
You did your job, the client likes what you did, it works. Let them
fight the political
Mod_perl doesn't suck, and it certainly doesn't have a huge hit on the
CPU. (of course it all depends what you're doing, but for the most part
it's small)
Having used many high level web development environments, from C to
Java to TCL and perl, I find mod_perl at the top end of the scalability
On Fri, Dec 14, 2001 at 12:58:51PM -0800, Jeff Yoak wrote:
At 09:15 PM 12/14/2001 +0100, Thomas Eibner wrote:
The key to mod_perl development is speed, there are numerous testimonials
from users implementing a lot of work in a very short time with mod_perl.
Ask the clients investor wheter he
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On Fri, Dec 14, 2001 at 12:58:51PM -0800, Jeff Yoak wrote:
This is something different. The investor is in a related business, and
has developed substantially similar software for years. And it is really
good. What's worse is that my normal,
Hi there,
On Fri, 14 Dec 2001, Jeff Yoak wrote:
This is something different. [big snip]
Indeed it is. It's a refreshingly honest appraisal of what might,
in hindsight, have been easily avoided mistakes.
And nobody ever did anything without making a few.
Thanks.
73,
Ged.
PS: Are any of
At 03:58 PM 12/14/2001, Jeff Yoak wrote:
At 09:15 PM 12/14/2001 +0100, Thomas Eibner wrote:
The key to mod_perl development is speed, there are numerous testimonials
from users implementing a lot of work in a very short time with mod_perl.
Ask the clients investor wheter he wants to pay for
So I'm trying to show that mod_perl doesn't suck, and that it is, in fact,
a reasonable choice. Though within these limits it is still reasonable to
point out the development cycle, emotionally it is the least compelling
form of argument, because the investor has a hard time removing from
to that, then all you're dealing with is a temper tantrum.
---Wes Sheldahl
( father of four young'uns )
Jeff Yoak [EMAIL PROTECTED] on 12/14/2001 03:58:51 PM
To: Thomas Eibner [EMAIL PROTECTED]
cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (bcc: Wesley
Sheldahl/Lex/Lexmark)
Subject: Re: mod_perl vs. C for high
All,
I wasn't sure what volume of response to expect when I originally
wrote. Thank you all for the comments that you all are making. They are
helping. Given that the response is fairly high, I'm waiting for stuff to
roll in rather than replying to each of you. Don't think it is
Dave Hodgkinson wrote on Fri, Dec 14 2001 (20:54:22 +):
Perrin Harkins [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
According to something I once read by David Filo, Yahoo also had to tweak
the FreeBSD code because they had trouble scaling *TCP/IP*! I would say
their experience is not typical.
Toni Andjelkovic [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
2.x linux kernels too.
that was an issue with 2.0.x, since 2.2.x
you can do it with
That was what I meant...decimal point in the wrong place... :-)
--
David Hodgkinson, Wizard for Hirehttp://www.davehodgkinson.com
Editor-in-chief, The
On Fri, 14 Dec 2001, Thomas Moore wrote:
I spoke to the technical lead at Yahoo who said mod_perl
will not scale as well as c++ when you get to their
level of traffic, but for a large ecommerce site
mod_perl is fine.
the old memory is cheap rationalization doesn't go over
very well at that
-- Jeff Yoak [EMAIL PROTECTED] on 12/14/01 12:58:51 -0800
This is something different. The investor is in a related business, and has
developed substantially similar software for years. And it is really good.
What's worse is that my normal, biggest argument isn't compelling in this
case,
So I'm trying to show that mod_perl doesn't suck, and that it is, in
fact, a reasonable choice.
I think one of the selling points for mod_perl is its extensibility:
modules can be written in C. Depending on the C code you have access
to, a good solution might be to try to wrap it into
The original poster talked about C++ CGI programs. I have been using
mod_perl since 0.7x days and I can tell you there is no way a fork+exec
CGI program no matter what language its written in will come anywhere
close to a perl handler written against the mod_perl Apache API in
execution speed
solution.
IMHO,
Jimi
- Original Message -
From: Perrin Harkins [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Thomas Eibner [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Jeff Yoak [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, December 14, 2001 3:32 PM
Subject: Re: mod_perl vs. C for high performance Apache modules
So I'm trying
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