Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

Ian, Slow going here. Writing is tough, and clear writing is tough indeed. I have the monad ranks ready for review. Make what changes you like. I will move on to dyads presently. You will see that I have changed the tags and added several categories. Henry On 1/22/2014 8:43 AM, Ian

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

Thanks for that Murray, I had not seen the Mathematica flash animations before. Also, your example of physically representing the array functions is close to the core of my understanding of J programming. Not that I need physical manifestations but that I think of the arrays and vectors as phys

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

The Mathematica animations look promising as a tool for J - more incentive for me to learn HTML5. On Fri, Jan 24, 2014 at 2:23 AM, Ian Clark wrote: > Firefox is a pretty popular browser. Indeed it's popul-IST. Chrome and > Safari are tools of empire. If Firefox performance gets fixed, I'd say g

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

Firefox is a pretty popular browser. Indeed it's popul-IST. Chrome and Safari are tools of empire. If Firefox performance gets fixed, I'd say go ahead. Otherwise isn't it a bit of a show-stopper? To be bold, or realistic? That is the question. Meanwhile, vanilla links to your YouTube vids will se

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

Thanks Ian, I loaded up Firefox and had a slightly different experience. The animation box was far too big and clicking the red dot did start the animation after a fashion, but in a scrambled way. If you find a particular animation that you want, it looks as if we could do it for Safari and Chr

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

@Bob Right! -- at long last I can see what I'm supposed to, using either Chrome or Safari. The demos look good, technically. With Firefox (26.0 / up-to-date, Shockwave Flash 11.9.900.170, running on MBA under Mavericks, or iMac under Snow Leopard) I just see two big empty black-framed squares wit

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

The word “animations” in connection with J jogged my memory of some evening entertainments held at APL conferences years ago. On a couple of occasions, a quizmaster (Roy Sykes?) recruited two teams of APL programmers from the audience. Each team’s members stood in a row, with the members holding

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

@Ian I agree with you that the links that are used as a reference to the flash video for Moinmoin do not allow the viewer access to an in-place experience, and this motivated a proof of concept in svg. I know you are busy, but I have moved the svg to the top of the page where it should be easil

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

...having said that, I've just come across: http://www.jsoftware.com/jwiki/HelpOnMoinWikiSyntax#Comments IMO this would provide a way to show/hide Rank info on the portal page at the click of a button. Would someone care to try it out on the Vocabulary/NuVocWithRank page? On Thu, Jan 23, 2014 at

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

> One of the things I really like about the old J dictionary is that the page titles have the > symbolic and English forms of the terms: e.g., "-: Halve - Match", so that > when I have dozens of tabs open on the dictionary I can use those to choose a page > using the tab-choosing mechanism in my

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

> @Ian - Good. Just thinking, we will want different text for verbs like + that do not > produce results of varying shape, vs ones like i. or $ that do. @Henry - I imagine so. In spite of what I said about leaving the heading structure of Vocabulary/RankInfo alone, can I rely on you to extend the

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

@Bob Yes I thought the animations were appealing when they first appeared. No feedback yet on whether they actually help people? -- I'll have to rely on you and others to collect that info from genuine novices. Sorry - your sample page doesn't work on my Mac. What I noticed recently was that wher

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

On 01/22/14 11:36, Brian Schott wrote: Peter, I like your idea a lot. Going even further, but with tongue well in cheek -- but not trying to undermine your idea, how about putting y arguments beside monadic verbs, x and y arguments around dyadic verbs, u or m arguments beside adverbs, and u or

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

@Ian - Good. Just thinking, we will want different text for verbs like + that do not produce results of varying shape, vs ones like i. or $ that do. Henry Rich On 1/22/2014 11:23 AM, Ian Clark wrote: @Henry - I think I'll wait and see what you do with RankInfo before I start my bulk update.

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

I have looked at the page(s) and it(they) look(s) good. I am often away from the internet when I have time to read things like these. What I am getting at is a question if this is available offline like an addon similarly to the J Dictionary? - Björn Helgason gsm:6985532 skype:gosiminn On 20.1.2

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

I can put a link on the SIGAPL page to it. On Wed, Jan 22, 2014 at 3:17 PM, Fraser Jackson wrote: > Ian and all others involved deserve our thanks for their work developing > this, but how would beginners find out about it? > > Can a reference be added to the front page on the Wiki, perhaps as t

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

Ian and all others involved deserve our thanks for their work developing this, but how would beginners find out about it? Can a reference be added to the front page on the Wiki, perhaps as the first item under guides? There are areas where with some tidying and consistency it can be improved,

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

Peter, I like your idea a lot. Going even further, but with tongue well in cheek -- but not trying to undermine your idea, how about putting y arguments beside monadic verbs, x and y arguments around dyadic verbs, u or m arguments beside adverbs, and u or m and v or n arguments around conjunction

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

On 01/22/14 05:43, Ian Clark wrote: Re Rank Information on Nuvoc portal page: I've implemented something which I hope fits the bill for now, until someone can come up with a technically satisfying alternative. Initially the Nuvoc page comes up as-is, but a prominent link lets you see an alternat

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

Paul and Bob, I think tooltips do exactly what you like -- hide things ... -- but as far as I can tell, no one knows how to implement tooltips on our jwiki. If or when that is possible, I believe it would be an improvement to include the rank information there. -- (B=) --

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

First off, Ian you've have done fantastic work on this. Road building is vital to development - and your roads are safe, well marked and take us to the places we want to discover. Well done. Second, I agree with Paul about hiding things until people are interested. When I have decided that I

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

I like the idea of hiding things until people are interested. I'll add that I'm used to the link being on the reason, not the command. See this page *hiding* details of verb ranks — --- See bottom

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

@Henry - I think I'll wait and see what you do with RankInfo before I start my bulk update. The devil is in the detail. On Wed, Jan 22, 2014 at 2:31 PM, Henry Rich wrote: > @Ian - I will start on the RankInfo page. It will point to some pages TBD > that discuss agreement, fill, and rank in det

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

Ian, As you've mentioned "beautiful", I'll hazard a formatting suggestion. Might the rank indications be given their own column? Seeing them (even if empty) lined up this way (now the names too!) would make the whole picture much clearer, at least to my eyes. In any event, thanks for your contr

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

@Ian - I will start on the RankInfo page. It will point to some pages TBD that discuss agreement, fill, and rank in detail. I suggest that the dyadic 1 _ rank title be changed from Rank Infinity... to Rank 1,Infinity... Also I think additional entries are needed for those modifiers that tak

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

Re Rank Information on Nuvoc portal page: I've implemented something which I hope fits the bill for now, until someone can come up with a technically satisfying alternative. Initially the Nuvoc page comes up as-is, but a prominent link lets you see an alternative page with ranks shown for every re

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

I agree, tool tips would be a pain for people using a tablet. For other people, it would probably take a bit before discovering them, and linking a description in words in a tooltip to a page explaining it would probably be a pain. I don't know enough about moinmoin but would it be an idea to prov

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

I can concur- -the difference between *@* and*@:* is important in some cases because of rank (which I don't really grasp-- possibly because of age related senility, it takes me a bit linger to catch on to such things. The problem with the vocabulary and the dictionary references is that the exa

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

ch henryhr...@nc.rr.com to: programm...@jsoftware.com date: 21 January 2014 16:23 subject: Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released >I agree with Brian that the ranks on the NuVoc main page are distracting. >But I love what Ian did on the verb page for = . That seems just right: it >de

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

to: Programming forum date: 21 January 2014 15:20 subject: Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released Why are we considering tooltips and popups... what task do they support? ...what's their advantage here? Why can't the target page be its own "popup"? -- from: greg hei

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

d. One can mouse over (or pen by) objects and a popup window changes > w/o affecting the viewed main page. > > greg > ~krsnadas.org > > -- > > from: Ian Clark earthspo...@gmail.com > to: Programming forum > date: 21 January 2014 15:20 > subject: Re: [Jprogramming] The

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

s not drastically changed. One can mouse >over (or pen by) objects and a popup window changes w/o affecting the viewed >main page. greg ~krsnadas.org -- from: Ian Clark earthspo...@gmail.com to: Programming forum date: 21 January 2014 15:20 subject: Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Di

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

t; > >It could also be configurable - not just ranks but other info on > underlying tokens. > > greg > ~krsnadas.org > > -- > > from: Ian Clark earthspo...@gmail.com > to: Programming forum > date: 21 January 2014 15:00 > subject: Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessib

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

That's amazing... if they're really giving it away free at last. I recommended as such in my review of Mathematica for Vector: http://archive.vector.org.uk/trad/v224/v224-IAN/clark.htm (see para "What I didn't like") On Tue, Jan 21, 2014 at 9:02 PM, Murray Eisenberg wrote: > I hope the J communi

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

g issues) it would not be >distracting. >It could also be configurable - not just ranks but other info on underlying >tokens. greg ~krsnadas.org -- from: Ian Clark earthspo...@gmail.com to: Programming forum date: 21 January 2014 15:00 subject: Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Diction

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

I hope the J community doesn’t get its hopes too high about J on Raspberry Pi: the programming language underlying Mathematica, along with Mathematica itself, is now available free on that platform (although I have no idea how slow it is there). At 21 Jan 2014 06:37:08 +, Ian Clark wrote:

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

@Brian - you speak for me too. I think Oleg's scheme is the easiest mod *of that page* that can be done, but it's not so pretty. I'd thought of a parallel page, which you could make appear with a click and back again. My preference is for Henry's proposal, which I've mashed-up in: http://www.jsoft

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

Ian, I see what you have done there: added the verb ranks to their names. I like it except that it is butt ugly relative to the original clean page. That may not be a reason to not add the info, but I sort of wonder, especially if this page is to "sell" J to new users. Does anyone know how to put

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

@John -- thank you. No excuses not to learn J...? Ha-ha, if-only. Plugging away at it to get it done, the burgeoning Raspberry Pi community was very much in my mind. We can kid ourselves J documentation is as good as netizen volunteers can get it. But when you contemplate an actual audience, you k

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

@Joe - You're very welcome. It's feedback from newcomers c/f yourself that provides the impetus to persist with something on this scale. Us oldies can begin to stop seeing the need for it. On Mon, Jan 20, 2014 at 5:16 PM, Joe Bogner wrote: > Thank you Ian and others! I have been using NuVoc on

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

@Devon - You're most welcome. Which "old one" do you mean? I've never seen an entry for "single quote" on any table with this layout, not even http://jsoftware.com/help/dictionary/vocabul.htm Offhand I would say that belonged to additional documentation we might have, for number-formats (eg 1r2 1

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

@Brian -- maybe it doesn't need a tooltip...? It's not to hard to add the rank info to the table itself, in the way Oleg suggests. I've temporarily modified http://www.jsoftware.com/jwiki/NuVoc to show how. On Tue, Jan 21, 2014 at 5:39 AM, Ian Clark wrote: > I can't see how that tooltip is cre

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

I can't see how that tooltip is created either. It seems to be builtin to the utility: <> Oleg made an attempt at a rank table... http://www.jsoftware.com/jwiki/Essays/Rank%20Table ...would a link to that be enough for now? On Mon, Jan 20, 2014 at 6:44 PM, Brian Schott wrote: > I am replying to

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

@Henry -- Thanks for offering your class of students for making the finally-agreed changes. I appreciate the offer. But there's the beginnings of a system growing in my mind, and I'd like to handle it all myself. On Tue, Jan 21, 2014 at 4:08 AM, Ian Clark wrote: > Here's my impression of Henry'

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

Here's my impression of Henry's proposal: http://www.jsoftware.com/jwiki/Voctest/eq_iac2 ...and I've drafted target pages for the links. Henry originally proposed putting the rank tag "inside the parentheses that give the English name for the primitive" ...Here's what I think he means: http://www.

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

On Mon, Jan 20, 2014 at 10:47 AM, Ian Clark wrote: > But I think that's advanced information for a beginner, and best seen by > clicking through to the J Dic via the "See Also". ... > Can we hear the authoritative voice of a genuine beginner about this? As a voice of a beginner (6 months in),

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

I am replying to my own post because I want my original specification to be included, even though I like Henry's suggestion, also. Henry's suggestion will change each verb page of NuVoc, and mine is directed solely to the first page. I think tool-tip information on the first page would mostly help

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

Ian - thanks for all your work on this - it looks very good! I will be using it in my talk tomorrow. While looking it over - and comparing it to the old one - I notice that there is no entry anywhere for the single quote. I know it's basic punctuation and perhaps does not warrant an entry but it

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

Very nice. I like the color coding on the main table. With NuVoc people are running out of excuses when it comes to learning J. Of course the real barriers have always been cultural and personal. We either don't want to learn, for various reasons, or we are lazy sobs and cannot stick to a regime.

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

Thank you Ian and others! I have been using NuVoc on a near daily basis since I first found out about it a few months back. I often either start or end up at the current J Dictionary. Having NuVoc has been incredibly helpful with additional examples and having similar things said different ways as

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

If all the change ends up requiring is an edit to every valence of every verb, adding a string to the Wiki page, that's certainly feasible. I might even be able to dragoon a class of students into doing it. The key thing is to work out the design. Agreed that the numbers 0 0 0 are baffling t

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

@Henry - I'm warming to your idea. The standard triple-Ranks as returned by b.0 is not appropriate. 'Cos monad and dyad are documented independently. A suffix to the header: "operates on individual atoms" has the advantage of being self-explanatory. Like Wikipedia tags, it could be clickable to p

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

@Henry -- your argument did occur to me, just after I pressed the send button... I think I agree with what you say, pivoted heavily on the word "painlessly". If I'd been brutally honest with myself I'd have admitted that I'd been working out how to implement Brian's suggestion and seen it would h

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

Agreed that the important thing for NuVoc is to give the beginner what they need, in a form that they can understand without having to follow a trail. But asking a genuine beginner whether they need to see the ranks is like asking a congressman a question about economics, and just as likely to

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

Thanks Henry. You've made it crystal clear for me. On Mon, Jan 20, 2014 at 3:47 PM, Henry Rich wrote: > 0 1:} y > > is the u} form of }, executing u to get the indexes to be modified. > > 0 1:} y will be the same as > 0 (1)} y > > Henry Rich > > > On 1/20/2014 10:32 AM, Ian Clark wrote: > >>

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

0 1:} y is the u} form of }, executing u to get the indexes to be modified. 0 1:} y will be the same as 0 (1)} y Henry Rich On 1/20/2014 10:32 AM, Ian Clark wrote: Thanks, Brian, for answering Bo for me. Bo's question made me scratch my head. I did zeroco so long ago I've forgotten what I

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

@Brian - Thanks for your appreciation. It's encouraging. Throughout I've had the niggling feeling that the J Dic was hard to improve on, and I was adding little or no value. Unlike the J Dic, NuVoc doesn't show the Rank(s) of a verb. The original idea was for it to do so. But I think that's advanc

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

Thanks, Brian, for answering Bo for me. Bo's question made me scratch my head. I did zeroco so long ago I've forgotten what I was thinking at the time. 0 1} i.6 |rank error | 0 1}i.6 0 1:} i.6 0 0 2 3 4 5 So the example is genuine: it works. But why??? I tried covering 1: to see just

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

Thanks Martin, yes tht was a typo (now fixed). @Everyone If you have update rights to the wiki then please fix any typos yourself. This is your wiki too, and not my walled garden. If you pm me to notify me you've altered a page, I'll be grateful. But there's really no need to ask my permission.

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

Bo, Amend is an adverb that can take either a noun or a verb as its immediate argument. The reason the first example fails is that when 0 1 is used, amend takes the 0 and the 1 as its argument, not just the intended 1, because the parser does not know to separate out the two numbers. But when 1: i

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

Thank you very much indeed for this beautiful piece of work. As someone who uses J only occasionally (on a very simple level) I tend to forget things (despite taking notes) and have to dig in ever so often again. This looks a great resource easing that first step. In the same context I've ver

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

Thanks for the http://www.jsoftware.com/jwiki/Vocabulary/zeroco . I have trouble in understanding the example 0 1} i.6 NB. Try to amend 1{i.6 to zero |rank error | 0 1}i.6 0 1:} i.6 0 0 2 3 4 5 Is there a typo in the comment? ('{' versus '}') I thought that 0 1:} is a fork, but is

Re: [Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

Ian, That is amazing. Thank you for that great resource. I don't know if I dare ask the following, but, here goes. Is there any way to add a feature -- I think it's called a tool-tip -- to the main page which would show the rank of each verb when someone hovers over the primitive? If so, would ot

[Jprogramming] The Accessible Dictionary released

Thank you everyone for your help in finishing this (and other) pages: http://www.jsoftware.com/jwiki/Vocabulary/hcapdot This completes NuVoc, the "Accessible Dictionary" the J community started over 2 years ago. Though I've no doubt individual pages can be improved. Comments about this are invited