In this case, for column protection, we want full 'obstruction'. NFPA 13 (2013) Sections 12.12.2.2.4.1(5), 16.1.4.1(2), 17.1.4.1(2), and 18.2.1(1) all give very nearly identical prescriptions of how to protect these structural components in that they are 'pointed toward one side' of the column. To me, this means orientating the nozzle/sprinkler such that its discharge direction is perpendicular to the orientation of the column surface being protected. For a sidewall protecting a vertical column, this is horizontal.
Fireproofing of rack and other support structures in a refinery setting are generally not done above 35-40 ft above the top level at which F&C liquids may pool as indicated in API RP 2030 Section 7.3.5. Since flame height is not expected to impinge structure that high, dedicated fire protection above this point is not merited or normally required. NFPA 15 provides guidance on what is to be directly wetted in exposure-type of fire protection in Section 7.4.3.4* and Figure 7.4.3.1 of the 2012 edition. Nozzles/sprinklers are generally installed very close to the column to minimized wasted overspray. This is very similar to the rationale used in NFPA 13. NFPA 409 prescribes similar protection for roof-supporting structural steel columns in hangars. Ryan L. Hinson, PE*, SET** \ Burns & McDonnell Senior Fire Protection Engineer O 952-656-3662 \ M 320-250-5404 \ F 952-229-2923 [email protected] \ burnsmcd.com 8201 Norman Center Drive, Suite 300 \ Bloomington, MN 55437 *Registered in: MN & TX **NICET IV - Water-Based Systems Layout -----Original Message----- From: Sprinklerforum [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Travis Mack, SET Sent: Monday, July 06, 2015 4:11 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: Column Protection The sprinklers at the roof will help to cool the structure. My understanding the 15' sprinkler is to help prevent buckling of the column. Travis Mack, SET MFP Design, LLC 2508 E Lodgepole Drive Gilbert, AZ 85298 480-505-9271 fax: 866-430-6107 email:[email protected] http://www.mfpdesign.com https://www.facebook.com/pages/MFP-Design-LLC/92218417692 Send large files to us via: https://www.hightail.com/u/MFPDesign On 7/6/2015 2:09 PM, Kenneth Berman wrote: > What cools a fifty foot column above fifteen feet? Codes don't say > install horizontal, vertical, up, down. In Tennessee gravity pulls the water > down. > I'm cooling twenty nine feet of column to prevent collapse. > > On Mon, Jul 6, 2015 at 3:55 PM, John Denhardt > <[email protected]> > wrote: > >> Agree - I never seen one pointed up. >> >> John >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Sprinklerforum [mailto: >> [email protected]] On Behalf Of Travis >> Mack, SET >> Sent: Monday, July 06, 2015 5:00 PM >> To: [email protected] >> Subject: Re: Column Protection >> >> Where does it say the sidewall is pointed up? I have only seen these >> installed in the horizontal position for this application. >> >> Any steel columns shall be protected by 1-hour fireproofing or a >> sidewall sprinkler directed to one side of the column at the top or >> at the 15 ft (4.6 m) level, whichever is lower. Flow from these >> sprinklers shall be permitted to be omitted from the sprinkler system >> demand for hydraulic calculations. >> >> >> Travis Mack, SET >> MFP Design, LLC >> 2508 E Lodgepole Drive >> Gilbert, AZ 85298 >> 480-505-9271 >> fax: 866-430-6107 >> email:[email protected] >> >> http://www.mfpdesign.com >> https://www.facebook.com/pages/MFP-Design-LLC/92218417692 >> Send large files to us via: https://www.hightail.com/u/MFPDesign >> >> On 7/6/2015 1:57 PM, Kenneth Berman wrote: >>> You're all missing an important point, the horizontal sidewall is >>> pointed upwards. A vertical sidewall, upwards, is incorrect. The >>> horizontal sidewall cools the column from fifteen feet upwards, and >>> the water >> returned >>> by gravity cools the column below fifteen feet. >>> >>> On Mon, Jul 6, 2015 at 2:50 PM, Parsley Consulting < >>> [email protected]> wrote: >>> >>>> Rocci, >>>> I'd echo Travis and Mark's comments. When all else fails, >>>> point to 12.12.2.2.4.1, 16.1.4.1, 17.1.4.1, or 18.2.1 (whichever is >>>> appropriate) >> and >>>> ask him, politely of course, how he's reaching the conclusion that >>>> the sidewall sprinkler must be vertical. >>>> In short, ask him to "prove it." >>>> *Ken Wagoner, SET >>>> *Parsley Consulting*** >>>> *350 West 9th Avenue, Suite 206 >>>> *Escondido, California 92025 >>>> *****Phone 760-745-6181* >>>> Visit our website <http://www.parsleyconsulting.com/> *** >>>> >>>> >>>> On 07/06/2015 11:20 AM, Rocci Cetani 3 wrote: >>>> >>>>> I have a FM questioning the use of horizontal sidewall sprinklers >>>>> (he thinks it should be a vertical sidewall) with no heat >>>>> collectors @ 15' >> AFF...NFPA >>>>> 13 2013 17.1.4.1 only states a sidewall sprinkler pointed in the >>>>> direction of the column @ 15' AFF. Any suggestions? >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Rocci Cetani III, CET >>>>> >>>>> Lead Designer >>>>> >>>>> Water-Based Fire Protections Systems Layout, Nicet Level III >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Northern California Fire Protection Services Inc. >>>>> >>>>> 16840 Joleen Way Bldg. A >>>>> >>>>> Morgan Hill, CA 93037 >>>>> >>>>> P-(408) 776-1580 EXT.111 >>>>> >>>>> F-(408) 776-1590 >>>>> >>>>> C- (408) 595-3906 >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> [email protected] >>>>> >>>>> www.norcalfire.com <http://www.norcalfire.com/> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This message and any document accompanying >>>>> it >> may >>>>> contain confidential information >>>>> >>>>> belonging to the sender. The information is intended only for the >>>>> use >> of >>>>> individual or entity named above. If you are not the intended >> recipient, >>>>> or >>>>> the employee or agent responsible to deliver this message to the >> intended >>>>> recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying or >> taking >>>>> of >>>>> any action in reliance on the contents of this information is >>>>> strictly prohibited. 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