At 11:45 AM 11/10/00 -0500, you wrote:
>Well, let's look at that. In the '96 election, 14,000 or so ballots were
>discarded as "spoiled" because of precisely the same problem. Given the
>voter turnout in that election, 19,000 discards in this election is really
>not different than that of '96.
di
At 11:01 AM 11/10/00 -0500, Bob Hayden wrote:
>After considering all the issues raised on the lists regarding the
>election, I think the best solution would be a revote in every state
>of the union -- but with NEW CANDIDATES!-)
maybe reverse the tickets ... flip flop presidential candidates with
one of the commentators said that a reason for that design was for making
it easier to read ... for elderly voters who might have vision problems ...
i don't see any validity to that ... if anything, the butterfly design
would make it more visually confusing
almost all ballots around the count
At 03:51 PM 11/9/00 -0500, Reg Jordan wrote:
>Did it cost Gore votes? Doesn't matter. Incompetence is not a defense.
on what basis can you conclude that the 19,000 invalidated ballots were due
to incompetence ... this seems to be your supposition ...
what if you saw a table that showed that th
i think if you look at the graphs down the page at the url shown below ...
>http://madison.hss.cmu.edu/palm-beach.pdf
it is pretty hard to argue that the data for buchanan this year is similar
to what it was in 1996 against dole ...
other counties showed even more votes for buchanan back then
the people claim that since it had been publicized in the newspaper trial
printing of the ballot ... that it was assumed that al gore, who IS listed
second on the left ... that his vote would be the second hole ... so, it
seems like many just like automatons ... punched the second hole ... whic
might i ask why one group has n=160 and the other only n=15?
At 05:44 PM 11/6/00 +, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>Hi all,
>
>I have a little problem on how to handle the following:
>
======
dennis roberts, penn state university
in my stat class today, we were talking a bit about penn state's bad luck
(of course, good luck for iowa!)in the second overtime last saturday ...
here is my take on overtimes
I DON'T LIKE THEM ... here is why
football by definition is a game that is 60 minutes d
FAX (717)291-4387
>Lancaster, PA 17604-3003
> "I'd rather be blowing glass."
>
>
>
>
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>Instructions for joining and leaving this list and remarks about
this is the third in our series of short www assignments for extra credit
in the edpsy 400 class
due on ... wednesday november 22 ... day before thanksgiving
holiday
using any or all of the following search engines,
http://www.google.com
http://www.directhit.com
http://www.alltheweb.com
i
could be of value to some
http://freeservices.uni.cc/
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Instructions for joining and leaving this list and remarks about
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http://jse.stat.ncsu.edu/
==
don't forget to look at all that is available online for doing analysis ...
http://members.aol.com/johnp71/javastat.html
check out specific routines or ... click on the jump to free software ...
some works with macs
=
Instructio
a colleague of mine and i spent about 2 hours walking around the psu campus
sunday ... beautiful day ... between us, took about 170 digital pictures
... all in the same venues ... some inside and most outside ...
i have a sony mavica and he an hp ... and both had our settings on the BEST
quali
try this page from my website ... the first link has many downloadable
MINITAB files ...
and leads to other data set sites
http://roberts.ed.psu.edu/users/droberts/datasets.htm
At 01:58 PM 10/25/00 +, Frank E Harrell Jr wrote:
>I need to write up a case study of ordinary least squares
>mult
while this may be the case ... in general ... for some decisions we make
... we would not even allow this level of snickering to suggest to us that
something is afoul ... whereas for others ... it would not bother us (or
should not) if the chances were larger ...
it all depends ...
At 10:36 A
At 12:25 AM 10/23/00 -1000, Daniel Blaine wrote:
> I'm not sure what you mean by a "no brainer" since I've
> "interpreted your interpretations" to suggest that concepts in
> and around parameter estimation and hypothesis testing are not
> easy ones for our students
anyone who likes fall colors might enjoy some of these pics ... if you want
to use them in any way ... fine by me
http://community.webshots.com/album/6003455WVyPzlswHT
http://community.webshots.com/album/6003696MOlRFapcVS
=
In
don ... no wonder students go bananas in statistics ... if we "sink" to
this level of discussion about a formula ... a formula that really has so
little utility ... how much time do we spend on the really important ones?
i would submit that for most intro courses ... where correlation is
discu
here are some figures on how much "trash" accumulates at a number of big 10
football stadiums for home football games ...
penn state generates about 40 tons ... and at ohio state, which has a
stadium and fan turnout about the same as penn state, the figure is about
16/17 tons ...
i have NO id
int biserial is zero and testing the null that two means are identical,
>and they are amazed.
why do you have to insert the term ... point biserial here? would this be
true if i just used the term ... pearson product-moment correlation?
========
re you saying that i have misrepresented the coin flipping example? take
one coin ... flip ... observe outcome ... flip same coin again ... observe
outcome .. etc?
At 06:26 PM 10/21/00 -0500, Bill Jefferys wrote:
>At 12:56 PM -0500 10/20/00, dennis roberts wrote:
>>randomly independent even
SAGES are available at
> http://jse.stat.ncsu.edu/
>=====
==
dennis roberts, penn state university
educational psychology, 8148632401
http://roberts.ed.psu.edu/users/droberts/drober~1.htm
=
Instructions for join
randomly independent events have the p value being the multiplication of
each event's p value ... so ... p for getting a head in a good coin is
.5 ... 2 in a row = .25 ... etc.
here is a table up to 10 in a row of the same side
Row numheads pvalue
1 1 0.50
2
what is interesting to me in our discussions of p values ... .05 for
example is ... we have failed (generally that is) to put this one piece of
information in the context of the total environment of the investigation or
study ... we have blown totally out of proportion ... THIS one "fact" to
a
At 04:57 PM 10/19/00 +0100, David Hardman wrote:
>Actually, it often strikes me as curious that so many
>people continue to report results as p < .05, when they
>could in fact report the actual value.
though true, and generally this is what we do ... that is, give the exact p
values ... the re
At 01:52 PM 10/19/00 +, Jerry Dallal wrote:
>"Karl L. Wuensch" wrote:
> >
> > The origins of the silly .05 criterion of statistical significance are
> > discussed in the article:
>
>I disagree with the characterization. If it were silly, it would
>not have persisted for 75 years and be so wid
as a general strategy ... you apply both models to the observed data ...
look at the (squared) residuals of the fits to the real data points ... and
see which model produces the smaller amount of squared error ...
sometimes this is rather obvious if you look at the data ... for example,
what i
>This has got to be one of the funniest things I have read on a stats
>newsgroup. I'm sure its not really meant to be funny, but the thought
>of truckloads upon truckload of rats arriving to satisfy power
>requirements puts a highly amusing spin on the whole thing. :)
>I am stifling an insane cac
At 05:38 PM 10/17/00 -0700, David Heiser wrote:
>The 5% is a historical arifact, the result of statistics being invented
>before electronic computers were invented.
an artifact is some anomaly of the data ... but, how could 5% be considered
an artifact DUE to the lack of electronic computers?
is less than that magical cutoff ... even if the study seems
sound ... then it is not worthy of the time of day?
==========
dennis roberts, penn state university
educational psychology, 8148632401
http://roberts.ed.psu.edu/users/drob
one nice full issue of a journal about this general topic of hull
hypothesis testing that i came across recently is:
Research in the Schools, Vol 5, Number 2, Fall 1998 ...
you could contact jim mclean at ... jmclean@ etsu.edu ... and inquire about
obtaining a copy
we are in the process of co
minitab (like most products) comes in a sealed box with shrinkwrap on it
... now, INside the box are manuals (the one i got anyway) and the SEALED
cd ...
now, there is nothing on the outside SHRUNKWRAPPED box ... that states the
"use" conditions ... it appears only on the SEALED cd wrapper ..
robert ... i disagree ... now, if minitab will reimburse him for NOT
selling them ... that is a different story ... but, if they won't AND he
has not USED the project ... i see nothing to prevent him from obtaining a
return on his investment ...
the mistake he made was to "advertise" them ...
we memorize defintions of terms don't we? most feel that is helpful ... so,
same thing applies to many formulas too ... and, if one uses then enough
... they usually CAN'T help but memorize them ...
======
dennis roberts,
n why try to make them learn or
perform better? there is no incentive to do this ... however, if we forget
about ability ... then our goal is to help them learn as much as they can ...
======
dennis roberts, penn state university
derek ... here is a question that you need to answer:
if it is not required AND is not a prerequisite to any other course AND we
know that most students HATE statistics (via not liking math) ...
WHO WILL TAKE THIS COURSE???
will all your effort go for naught?
IF all you are hoping to do is to
0 -0500, Michael Granaas wrote:
>
>Ok, I'll play. Please keep in mind that these thoughts are still rough
>and are put forward in that form.
==========
dennis roberts, penn state university
educational psychology, 8148632401
http://ro
ble to understand
> the discussions.
==========
dennis roberts, penn state university
educational psychology, 8148632401
http://roberts.ed.psu.edu/users/droberts/drober~1.htm
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At 07:00 AM 9/28/00 -0700, Jenny Goodspeed wrote:
> I have a question regarding the creation of an
> overall scale from several likert-type items.
>
> I have a group of items that I'd like to sum to
> create the scale. Results of a factor analysis show
> that the items load high on one fac
a few links i spotted ... hope these help ... could have listed more but,
here is enough to shake a stick at!!
http://www.spss.com/datamine/
http://www.spss.com/datamine/techniques.htm
http://www.dci.com/events/datamin1/
http://www.dci.com/events/datamin2/
http://www.cs.bham.ac.uk/~anp/TheData
found the data ... entered it ... here is some stuff on it
===
Row X1 Y1 X2 Y2 X3 Y3 X4 Y4
1 108.04 10 9.14 107.46 86.58
2 86.95 8 8.14 86.77 85.76
3 137.58 13 8.74
i pass this along for information ... i have been working with
e-academy.com ... a bit ... to try to get my students to consider this
option ... for their minitab use
==
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Instructions for joining and leaving this list an
have a look ... sorry about the last empty message
=
Hi Dennis,
As of Thursday, Sept 14, e-academy.com has become the official download
site of the Minitab 13 30-day trial demo. Anyone accessing the demo from
Minitab.com, who indicates an academic/work status of "student", or
"University
but, this is why we don't use one item on a test ... we use not only
multiple items on tests but, multiple tests ...
this is why we don't use one course in college to decide whether we
graduate a student or not ... we use 40/50 courses ...
that's why we don't let someone graduate (in theory of c
i am sure most have seen ... http://www.ilstu.edu/~gcramsey/Gallery.html
if not, it's worth a trip!
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ined as
>gospel by most of the expounders.
the reason you won't see this in books is because, as i have said before
... this statement makes no sense
and it sure won't help the person who originally posted the question about
a book recommendation ...
======
i would say that what bob has indicated below is BIAS ... not consistency
...
At 12:18 PM 9/6/00 -0300, Robert J. MacG. Dawson wrote:
> More seriously, using the sample median as a robust estimator of the
>population mean is consistent if the population is symmetric, but
>inconsistent
Anderson wrote:
>
>
> Greetings!
======
dennis roberts, penn state university
educational psychology, 8148632401
http://roberts.ed.psu.edu/users/droberts/dro
here is one clue do you think that the difference in ability between
someone with an IQ of 100 compared to someone with an IQ of 110 ... has the
same meaning as the difference between a person with an IQ of 140 ... and
one with a 150?
At 12:00 PM 8/25/00 -0400, William Levine wrote:
>Hell
given that is beginning fall semester at penn state (whatever happened to
starting after labo(U)r day?) , this is just a reminder about ...
i run a list called introstat-l (don burrill and others have been very
helpful contributors) ... that has been operational since last february ...
that is
in some cases ... chi square test statistics require using ONLY 1 tail ...
of the relevant chi square distribution ... but some cases require using a
two tailed approach ...
same can be said of F test statistics ...
can we say that about t test statistics? ( i am not talking the case where
th
this crossed my electronic desk ...
===
>How The Government Works
>
>Once upon a time the government had a vast scrap yard in the middle of a
>desert.
>Congress said someone may steal from it at night; so they created a
>night watchman,
>GS-4 position and hired a person for
ere at my university, the Student Learning Centre (SLC) provides
>additional maths and statistics tuition for those struggling with
>first year courses. (They teach many other things as well.)
>
==========
dennis roberts, penn state univ
At 02:22 PM 8/22/00 -0500, Herman Rubin wrote:
>No geographer would take the heights of mountains and
>convert them to a probability scale.
i beg to differ ... for, it is not totally an uninteresting question that
someone might ask ... for all mountains ... what is the p value for
selecting a
and to anticipate (THE MOST LIKELY) consequences of the
proposed action in
>> > ...(AS MANY CONTEXTS AND SETTINGS AS YOU CAN)
>>
i am sure that my rewording can be improved but ... the general drift of it
makes more sense
At 03:27 PM 8/21/00 +, Jerry Dallal wro
hat are "all states" of nature?
==========
dennis roberts, penn state university
educational psychology, 8148632401
http://roberts.ed.psu.edu/users/droberts/drober~1.htm
=
At 02:01 PM 8/18/00 -0400, Chris Chiu wrote:
>Dear colleagues:
>
>Restated Objective: To generate random numbers with a specified mean and
>variance so that the numbers fall between 1 and 6.
any numbers or only discrete integers?
perhaps you could discuss a bit why you need this ... or want thi
http://www.salary.com/
interesting site
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in minitab, you can create a discrete distribution ... say ... numbers from
1 to 10 ... and then assign p values (adding to 1 of course) to each ...
and THEN sample from that population distribution ...
At 11:33 PM 8/17/00 -0500, Gordon D. Pusch wrote:
>Your big problem will be deciding how to
this is indeed a strange request for 2 reasons:
1. a mean of 3.5 surely is not an integer, right?
2. with a limited range and only about 6 DISCRETE values ... then it
certainly is NOT a normal distribution
but, i did a simulation in minitab below ...
MTB > rand 1000 c1;
SUBC> norm 3 1.
MTB >
unfortunately, most books are not clear on everything ... hopefully, the
book will deal with basic issues and concepts reasonably well
ask students the following:
say you were at the race track and ... you have picked your favorite horse
for race #7 ...
1. how many minutes do you think it wil
if you have X bar .. that IS the point estimate OF mu ... (it is one value)
if you have calculated some confidence interval ... then that is the
INTERVAL estimate of mu ... (this is a range of values within which ... you
hope that mu falls ... )
to build the CI ... you start with a point estim
well this indeed is interesting ... i now know what we can talk about for
the first ENTIRE week of a basic stat class ...
histograms and bar charts
1. a compilation of all the definitions thereof (including greek roots)
2. discussion of whether a "histogram" can be used for depicting a discrete
1. i find interesting the obvious that ... while students seem to fear
statistics primarily because it contains "math" ... and they dislike math
... since they think math is so OBjective and exact ... while the fact of
the matter is that there are wide variations ( ... our discussion of bar
ch
At 11:24 PM 8/13/00 -0400, Alexander Bogomolny wrote:
>Well, the reference to the dictionary consisted of two parts.
>The second is in fact inessential. The point is that the bars
>in a histogram are not automatically assumed to have equal
>widths.
once a scale is determined, it has units ... in
603-471-7128
>
>
>
>=
>Instructions for joining and leaving this list and remarks about
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TECTED]
>private e-mail to the k12.ed.math moderator: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>newsgroup website: http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/
>newsgroup charter: http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/charter.html
>
>
>=========
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d remarks about
>the problem of INAPPROPRIATE MESSAGES are available at
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de
At 10:16 AM 8/11/00 -0400, David C. Howell wrote:
>I agree with Bruce Weaver on this. Traditionally we do not worry about
>familywise error rates for simple effects, but instead evaluate each at
>alpha = .05.
>Dave Howell
of course, the broader issue is why .05? this totally ignores whether type
=
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it is very difficult to set a "price" on a course ... between and within
institutions ... especially even within an institution since, workloads
vary and job responsibilities vary ...
it would indeed be an interesting accounting exercise for an institution to
implement ... trying to figure out
all of this discussion re: t test and normality and when it makes a
difference and when it does not ... plus all the other assumptions made in
all kinds of tests with similar sometimes/sometimes not problems ...
just reinforces the fact that we need to be real skeptical about p values
...
At 09:59 AM 8/4/00 -0400, Bob Hayden wrote:
>- Forwarded message from Peter Lewycky -
>
>I've yet to meet an (adult) respondent who did not know his mother's
>maiden name and her birthdate. :)
>
>- End of forwarded message from Peter Lewycky -
>
>We must meet sometime!-)
can i co
ble at
> http://jse.stat.ncsu.edu/
>=
==========
dennis roberts, penn state university
educational psychology, 8148632401
http://roberts.ed.psu.edu/users/droberts/droberts.htm
=
Instructions for joinin
the internet movie database is a great site where reviews and info about
movies can be found
http://us.imdb.com/
one movie i looked at was mystery, alaska ... found at
http://us.imdb.com/Title?0134618
now, if you scroll down a bit and click on VOTE HERE ... you see the kinds
of charts they u
this summer, for my course, i have offered some bonus points for those who
would do some weekly websurfing activities ... as a way of encouraging them
to look around and see what is available ... out there in cyberspace ...
they have to do some searching each week ... for 6 weeks ... so they wo
At 07:32 AM 7/13/00 -0400, Paige Miller wrote:
>How exactly do you generalize the results from a "sample" of people who
>elect to respond to an opinion question, for example at http://cnn.com,
>to a larger population?
this is precisely the problem ... since, there is essentially NO control
ove
the main problem of course ... with online surveys ... or, with any other
'kind of convenient' surveys ... is to whom do you generalize the results?
the notion is simple in inference ... our sample is meant to tell us
something about THE population that we want to generalize the findings TO
bu
mentioned the
same thing ... or never mentioned any particular thing ... this does not
really tell me anything of import about the overall population ...
it is the inference where the problem lies ... and what we can say about
the population FROM the sample ... that is of concern ...
=====
the web page at
>http://jse.stat.ncsu.edu/
>===
==========
Dennis Roberts, EdPsy, Penn State University
208 Cedar Bldg., University Park PA 16802
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED], AC 814-863-2401, FAX 814-863-1002
WWW: http:
.andrews.edu/~calkins/math/webtexts/stat02.htm#CONVEN
http://www.ssc.msu.edu/~sw/webcrse/sw830/701/u04/mesa07a.htm
http://www.oandp.org/jpo/73/73105.htm
etc. etc.
==
Dennis Roberts, EdPsy, Penn State University
208 Cedar Bldg., University
ing debate ... and, does have implications for how doctoral
education is conceptualized and how it is operationally handled in the future
thanks for your input
======
Dennis Roberts, EdPsy, Penn State University
208 Cedar Bldg., University Par
bout the
>problem of inappropriate messages and information about how to
>unsubscribe, please see the web page at
>http://jse.stat.ncsu.edu/
>===
==
Denni
complicated model ...
does not add to the clarity of the prediction problem ... but, that is just
my opinion
At 07:14 PM 6/30/00 -0400, Bob Hayden wrote:
>
>Tom Moore asked...
>
>- Forwarded message from Thomas L. Moore -
=====
stall itself in the directory of your
choice. If you have any problem in installing it, contact me at
[EMAIL PROTECTED] .
My homepage (from where you can download) is :
http://scribers.midwest.net/wgmiller
======
Dennis Roberts, EdPsy, Penn State
pursuing ... they develop skills to handle these projects ... and they
do good work ...
> DAHeiser
>
>P.S. My response tonight was assisted by some "Black Butte Porter" from the
>Deschutes Brewery, Bend Ore. Its really good stuff.
maybe to get you into a better perspective
list might quarrel with a bit ...
==========
Dennis Roberts, EdPsy, Penn State University
208 Cedar Bldg., University Park PA 16802
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED], AC 814-863-2401, FAX 814-863-1002
WWW: http://roberts.ed.psu.e
about $104,000!!!)
At 02:08 PM 6/29/00 +, Jerry Dallal wrote:
>tony685 wrote:
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> > I'm looking for a high-quality statistical analysis package with
> > 'many' capabilities and whose price is < $1500. Any opinions?
> > Tha
==
Dennis Roberts, EdPsy, Penn State University
208 Cedar Bldg., University Park PA 16802
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED], AC 814-863-2401, FAX 814-863-1002
WWW: http://roberts.ed.psu.edu/users/droberts/drober~1.htm
;castigation for my strategy but here goes
==========
dennis roberts, penn state university
educational psychology, 8148632401
http://roberts.ed.psu.edu/users/drobe
sages because the postmaster has no
>way of controlling them, and excessive complaints will result in
>termination of the list.
>
>For information about this list, including information about the
>problem of inappropriate messages and information about how to
>unsubscribe, please s
e WORK in paper document form, simply lift the
document and drag the WORK to your trash can.
Send this message to all your friends in your address book. If
you do not have anyone in your address book, then the
WORK virus has already corrupted your life!
Dennis Roberts, EdPsy, Penn State University
priate messages and information about how to
>unsubscribe, please see the web page at
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>=======
==
dennis roberts, penn state university
educational psychology, 8148632401
http://roberts.ed.psu.edu/users/droberts/droberts.htm
=
another is .08 ... and another is .99 ... to call all
about 1 seems not quite fair either
the best rule of a thumb variety or not is ... take them all with a grain
of salt
using statistics ... and understanding what each might provide (ie, what IS
the mean anyway) .. are not the same ..
DO NOT COMPLAIN TO
>THE POSTMASTER about these messages because the postmaster has no
>way of controlling them, and excessive complaints will result in
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>
>For information about this list, including information about the
>problem of inappropriate messages a
i found this ... name your technique
http://ubmail.ubalt.edu/~harsham/stat-data/opre330.htm
Dennis Roberts, EdPsy, Penn State University
208 Cedar Bldg., University Park PA 16802
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED], AC 814-863-2401, FAX 814-863-1002
WWW: http://roberts.ed.psu.edu/users/droberts/drober~1
rolling them, and excessive complaints will result in
>termination of the list.
>
>For information about this list, including information about the
>problem of inappropriate messages and information about how to
>unsubscribe, please see the web page at
>http://jse.stat.ncsu.edu/
&g
e most?
and, if there is not an answer to this ... tell me that too
==
dennis roberts, penn state university
educational psychology, 8148632401
http://roberts.ed.psu.edu/users/droberts/drober
long as you KNOW they are turned on!
Dennis Roberts, EdPsy, Penn State University
208 Cedar Bldg., University Park PA 16802
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED], AC 814-863-2401, FAX 814-863-1002
WWW: http://roberts.ed.psu.edu/users/droberts/drober~1.htm
FRAMES: http://roberts.ed.psu.edu/users/droberts
.
Dennis Roberts, EdPsy, Penn State University
208 Cedar Bldg., University Park PA 16802
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED], AC 814-863-2401, FAX 814-863-1002
WWW: http://roberts.ed.psu.edu/users/droberts/drober~1.htm
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