date:20050623

-Before enlightenment, the world we perceive is of, by and for the 
ego. Everything is seen and translated in terms of this point, this 
sense of me(the ego). 
After enlightenment is acheived one steps out of identifying with 
this point, this sense of me(the ego). 
  One is no longer indentified with a point, this tiny sense of me
(the ego), but becomes identified with the origin of any point in 
pure awareness, the Absolute.
One can become aware of any point,any side of any issue; no longer 
guided by a single perspective(ego based), totally limiting view...
So, the next step is allowing the pure consciousness to flow within 
itself to the point, then to the next point, all point guided now, 
not by ego, but by pure intelligence. Any problem is seen as just 
energy, which needs balance and recieves balance spontaneously, from 
point to point. 
In other words, an enlightened person, detatched perceives from the 
state of being, and in that silence, brings forth the opposite 
energy to perfectly balance, thereby always, percieving the Unity, 
in diversity; as being established in pure consiousness, silence, 
always provides the Unifying factor, always...


-- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, claudiouk [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 Many thanks for all the responses, not sure how to address them 
all.. 
 They helped me think more about the question and hopefully some 
 resolution is taking place somewhere in my brain
 
 58385... Irmeli Mattsson
 
  I cannot understand how this kind of theoretical, intellectual 
 speculation can help a person to evolve... If you have a rigid 
 preconceived idea, you are less open for the
 unexpected, which a new stage will be. 
 
 MMY often emphasized the importance of understanding along with 
 direct experience, for one's evolution. I agree that imitating a 
 state of consciousness from some cultural transmission is 
pointless, 
 but theoretical discussions can hopefully reduce confusion and be 
 inspiring and motivating. I imagine that direct experience would 
 override and automatically stretch any limiting  preconceptions.
 
  Every thought and every experience regardless of how .. 
 transcendental it feels, when perceived in and through a physical 
 body and nervous system, is always in the relative. We can only 
talk 
 about the absolute, we cannot experience it.
 
 In MMY's schema, this is the point to infinity bit, only you're 
 saying that any and all experience is relative. But the Knower is 
 Absolute so from the infinity to point perspective why are we 
stuck 
 with the relative experience associated with THIS point body and 
not 
 others, given that the Knower inhabits other bodies 
simultaneously. 
 
 58396 ... Rory Goff
 
 Brahman or Wholeness resides AS fully in the manifest,
 relative point as in the unmanifest, absolute Ocean. No
 difference. A natural progression from this would seem to be the
 realization that one's Wholeness is potentially as free to be ANY
 point-self as to be one's habitual point-self:
 
 Yes Infinity (= Wholeness = Unmanifest/Absolute = Self) is 
 omnipresent at every Point (= manifest, relative = self). So why 
is 
 the consciosness/Knower remain linked to the habitual point self 
if 
 it is free to be ANY point-self ?
 
 58405...  jim_flanegin 
 
  The Self is distinctly free from any sense of personal 
 identification.It is perceived by the original 'point' body, but 
is 
 not actually connected to it.It is odd because it feels like 
me, 
 but try as I might I can't locate the attachment point, through 
 thought or the senses.
 
 Yes  identification dissolves when going from point to infinity.
 
  Though I am unsure about the next step- how the perception of 
the 
 Self begins to extend to everything else 'out there'. 
Conceptually, 
 yes, but experientially, not yet constant.
 
 This infinity to pointS is the tricky bit. I myself can't speak 
from 
 experience, but am interested in it conceptually (as part of some 
 understanding of the possibilities of higher states of 
 consciousness). Not sure for instance how it relates to Unity.
 
 58408 ... Llundrub
 
  This is the problem, identifying with the body as if it's a 
point. 
 The body is infinite. The self is absolute, not infinite. A point 
of 
 identification is the absolute identifying with some snapshot of 
the 
 infinite. There are no points. There are merely snapshots.
 
 I like MMY's spacial schema point to infinity = relative to 
 Absolute. You seem to prefer a temporal model based on snapshots. 
 Both space and time are involved in the relative. And yes a point 
is 
 equivalent to a snapshot of the infinite. 
 
  All beings are linked, even in the snapshot.
 
 That is true even from our unenlightened consciousness. But we 
 experience ourselves as separate points/snapshots - even, it 
seems, 
 in the Absolute to Relative/Infinity to Point situation.
 
 When you are speaking of a point body, what's your point? Which 
 point? And even in that point are more points.

[FairfieldLife] Re: infinity to PointS (was the relative)

---Also, in rising to GC the inner knower begins to feel expanding 
love, or whatever you want to call it; but a feeling of flow from 
infinity inside to any point outside. This relates to omniscience in 
that the flow of this inner field of awareness, spontaneously, knows 
or is drawn to the particular point of interest. 
Really in any situation of lack; it is lack of love, lack of 
passion, and now, when pure consiousness is established, and all ego 
based fear dissolved, there's nothing left to do, but watch the 
absolute move...


 In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Robert Gimbel [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 -Before enlightenment, the world we perceive is of, by and for 
the 
 ego. Everything is seen and translated in terms of this point, 
this 
 sense of me(the ego). 
 After enlightenment is acheived one steps out of identifying with 
 this point, this sense of me(the ego). 
   One is no longer indentified with a point, this tiny sense of me
 (the ego), but becomes identified with the origin of any point in 
 pure awareness, the Absolute.
 One can become aware of any point,any side of any issue; no longer 
 guided by a single perspective(ego based), totally limiting view...
 So, the next step is allowing the pure consciousness to flow 
within 
 itself to the point, then to the next point, all point guided now, 
 not by ego, but by pure intelligence. Any problem is seen as 
just 
 energy, which needs balance and recieves balance spontaneously, 
from 
 point to point. 
 In other words, an enlightened person, detatched perceives from 
the 
 state of being, and in that silence, brings forth the opposite 
 energy to perfectly balance, thereby always, percieving the Unity, 
 in diversity; as being established in pure consiousness, silence, 
 always provides the Unifying factor, always...
 
 
 -- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, claudiouk [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
  Many thanks for all the responses, not sure how to address them 
 all.. 
  They helped me think more about the question and hopefully some 
  resolution is taking place somewhere in my brain
  
  58385... Irmeli Mattsson
  
   I cannot understand how this kind of theoretical, 
intellectual 
  speculation can help a person to evolve... If you have a rigid 
  preconceived idea, you are less open for the
  unexpected, which a new stage will be. 
  
  MMY often emphasized the importance of understanding along with 
  direct experience, for one's evolution. I agree that imitating 
a 
  state of consciousness from some cultural transmission is 
 pointless, 
  but theoretical discussions can hopefully reduce confusion and 
be 
  inspiring and motivating. I imagine that direct experience would 
  override and automatically stretch any limiting  preconceptions.
  
   Every thought and every experience regardless of how .. 
  transcendental it feels, when perceived in and through a 
physical 
  body and nervous system, is always in the relative. We can only 
 talk 
  about the absolute, we cannot experience it.
  
  In MMY's schema, this is the point to infinity bit, only 
you're 
  saying that any and all experience is relative. But the Knower 
is 
  Absolute so from the infinity to point perspective why are we 
 stuck 
  with the relative experience associated with THIS point body and 
 not 
  others, given that the Knower inhabits other bodies 
 simultaneously. 
  
  58396 ... Rory Goff
  
  Brahman or Wholeness resides AS fully in the manifest,
  relative point as in the unmanifest, absolute Ocean. No
  difference. A natural progression from this would seem to be the
  realization that one's Wholeness is potentially as free to be ANY
  point-self as to be one's habitual point-self:
  
  Yes Infinity (= Wholeness = Unmanifest/Absolute = Self) is 
  omnipresent at every Point (= manifest, relative = self). So why 
 is 
  the consciosness/Knower remain linked to the habitual point self 
 if 
  it is free to be ANY point-self ?
  
  58405...  jim_flanegin 
  
   The Self is distinctly free from any sense of personal 
  identification.It is perceived by the original 'point' body, but 
 is 
  not actually connected to it.It is odd because it feels like 
 me, 
  but try as I might I can't locate the attachment point, through 
  thought or the senses.
  
  Yes  identification dissolves when going from point to infinity.
  
   Though I am unsure about the next step- how the perception of 
 the 
  Self begins to extend to everything else 'out there'. 
 Conceptually, 
  yes, but experientially, not yet constant.
  
  This infinity to pointS is the tricky bit. I myself can't speak 
 from 
  experience, but am interested in it conceptually (as part of 
some 
  understanding of the possibilities of higher states of 
  consciousness). Not sure for instance how it relates to Unity.
  
  58408 ... Llundrub
  
   This is the problem, identifying with the body as if it's a 
 point. 
  The body is infinite. The self is absolute, not infinite. A 
point 
 of

[FairfieldLife] TM grad school?

Yesterday I was exchanging emails with a friend who
studies at Naropa, the school established in Boulder
by Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche.  He was telling me of
the general excitement of having a visiting Buddhist
scholar who was an expert in a certain class of 
Tibetan spiritual texts.

The difference between these texts and most of the
others is that this set are written for those who
are already beginning to experience enlightenment.
The general tone that my friend was trying to con-
vey via email is that in their tradition, what MMY
refers to as CC is considered on a par with getting
a Bachelor's degree.  It's a nice starting point, but
now the real work begins, in grad school.

So these texts (still in Tibetan, untranslated so far)
present advice for those beginning to experience CC 
on a daily basis.  According to my friend, they contain 
teachings on how to better understand what is happening
and interpret it, but, more important, they discuss all
of the possible pitfalls that are still in front of the
seeker at this point.  For example, he described a talk
in which the visiting lama discussed all the things 
that you're going to think you can get away with now
that you have realized the first stages of enlighten-
ment.  The teacher's message?  You can't.  Not only 
will they hinder your further progress, they can make
the realization itself go away.

So this has me wondering whether any counterpart of this
type of knowledge and teaching has appeared in the TM
movement.  While I was around, certainly no TM teacher
had ever been trained in how to talk to someone who was
having enlightenment experiences.  Has this changed?  
Does anyone know whether there are a group of teachers
who *have* been taught how to teach those who are having
such experiences?

If the answer is No, and no one knows of such a group,
doesn't that raise the question of Why?

To me it could imply that because of the basic dogma that 
enlightenment, once realized, is permanent and self-
sustaining in that the enlightened being can do no 
wrong, no need for such teachings is perceived.

Or it could imply that, even though Maharishi is clearly 
on his way out, incarnation-wise he perceives no immed-
iate need for such teachings, or has nothing along these 
lines *to* teach.

What do people think?  I'm certainly interested to hear
if such teachings *are* available, or even theoretically
available in the materials left to the posterity of
the TM movement.

Unc







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Re: [FairfieldLife] TM grad school?






So this has me wondering whether any counterpart of thistype of 
knowledge and teaching has appeared in the TMmovement. While I was 
around, certainly no TM teacherhad ever been trained in how to talk to 
someone who washaving enlightenment experiences. Has this 
changed? Does anyone know whether there are a group of teacherswho 
*have* been taught how to teach those who are havingsuch experiences?

---On the basis of the 
vagaries you just put to print I would suggest that this set of instructions 
doesn't exist in the Tibetan either except insofar as in your mind. 


If you are so sure that such a 
thing exists then you need to supply us credulous dopes with at least a partial 
list of titles of the teadhings so that we may ascertain for ourselve if such 
teachings were ever committed to print. 

My disbelief comes as a result 
of positing that there is such a thing or its equivalent as CC in the 
Vajrayana. For instance, the real analogy in the Vajrayana for 
enlightenment would be ascertaining the Trikaya which would be much more like 
Vedic Cognition. And this would be really just the start of clear experience of 
shunyata. 

The only real thing I can think 
which might be like what you mention was always freely available in the 
Madhiyatmikavatara, and that is the description of the bhumis. 


Of course in the Guhyagarbha 
there are a further five bhumis pertaining to Dzogchen that are not considered 
in the Mahayana. 

Does your friend suggest some 
other levels perhaps beyond these? 

I laugh at your naivete. I see 
now why you were a TM teacher, because you'll accept any fodder and sell it as 
high powered gasoline for Ferraris.


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[FairfieldLife] Re: TM grad school?

So its really a case of My karma ran over your dogma?

Or perhaps My dogma is higher octane than yours?

Yee-ha.


--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Llundrub [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 
 
 So this has me wondering whether any counterpart of this
 type of knowledge and teaching has appeared in the TM
 movement.  While I was around, certainly no TM teacher
 had ever been trained in how to talk to someone who was
 having enlightenment experiences.  Has this changed?  
 Does anyone know whether there are a group of teachers
 who *have* been taught how to teach those who are having
 such experiences?
 
 ---On the basis of the vagaries you just put to print I would 
suggest that this set of instructions doesn't exist in the Tibetan 
either except insofar as in your mind.  
 
 If you are so sure that such a thing exists then you need to supply 
us credulous dopes with at least a partial list of titles of the 
teadhings so that we may ascertain for ourselve if such teachings 
were ever committed to print. 
 
 My disbelief comes as a result of positing that there is such a 
thing or its equivalent as CC in the Vajrayana.  For instance, the 
real analogy in the Vajrayana for enlightenment would be ascertaining 
the Trikaya which would be much more like Vedic Cognition. And this 
would be really just the start of clear experience of shunyata. 
 
 The only real thing I can think which might be like what you 
mention was always freely available in the Madhiyatmikavatara, and 
that is the description of the bhumis.  
 
 Of course in the Guhyagarbha there are a further five bhumis 
pertaining to Dzogchen that are not considered in the Mahayana.  
 
 Does your friend suggest some other levels perhaps beyond these?  
 
 I laugh at your naivete. I see now why you were a TM teacher, 
because you'll accept any fodder and sell it as high powered gasoline 
for Ferraris.




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[FairfieldLife] Water into wine






I had a brainstorm. I figured out what this saying 
really means. It's what Maharishi and all spiritual teachers have done. They all 
are selling one's divinity. Making something out of nothing. Turning water into 
wine. 


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[FairfieldLife] Re: TM grad school?

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Llundrub [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 
Unc:
 So this has me wondering whether any counterpart of this
 type of knowledge and teaching has appeared in the TM
 movement.  While I was around, certainly no TM teacher
 had ever been trained in how to talk to someone who was
 having enlightenment experiences.  Has this changed?  
 Does anyone know whether there are a group of teachers
 who *have* been taught how to teach those who are having
 such experiences?
 
 ---On the basis of the vagaries you just put to print I would 
 suggest that this set of instructions doesn't exist in the Tibetan 
 either except insofar as in your mind.  
 
 If you are so sure that such a thing exists then you need to 
 supply us credulous dopes with at least a partial list of titles 
 of the teadhings so that we may ascertain for ourselve if such 
 teachings were ever committed to print. 

With all due respect, I don't need to do anything.  :-)

My knowledge of such things comes primarily from my friend
at Naropa.  The latest visiting Kempo is from a Tibetan
monastery in Bhutan.  I will try to find out the particulars
for you.  The teachings he gave there in Boulder, on his one-
day stop, were in Tibetan, translated on the fly by exper-
ienced translators there.

I *have* heard such teachings discussed among other Tibetan
groups in Santa Fe, similarly oral.  To be honest, they
were primarily discussed there in the Santa Fe sanghas as
a curiosity, because no one had need of them.  :-)

 My disbelief comes as a result of positing that there is such 
 a thing or its equivalent as CC in the Vajrayana.  

That was my mapping, trying to relate what my friend was
writing to me into TM-speak.

 For instance, the real analogy in the Vajrayana for enlightenment
 would be ascertaining the Trikaya which would be much more like 
 Vedic Cognition. And this would be really just the start of clear 
 experience of shunyata. 
 
 The only real thing I can think which might be like what you 
 mention was always freely available in the Madhiyatmikavatara, 
 and that is the description of the bhumis.  

It is possible.  Everything I have heard about such teachings
as my friend described in the past has been unfortunately 
second-hand.
 
 Of course in the Guhyagarbha there are a further five bhumis 
 pertaining to Dzogchen that are not considered in the Mahayana.  

This Kempo is from the Dzogchen tradition.

 Does your friend suggest some other levels perhaps beyond these?

He was remarkably unforthcoming on details.  I'll see if I 
can get him to be less so.  :-)

 I laugh at your naivete. I see now why you were a TM teacher, 
 because you'll accept any fodder and sell it as high powered 
 gasoline for Ferraris.

Just as I laugh at your consistent assumption that just
because you personally haven't run into something, it
doesn't exist.  :-)

Unc







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[FairfieldLife] Re: TM grad school?

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Llundrub [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
  
 Unc:
  So this has me wondering whether any counterpart of this
  type of knowledge and teaching has appeared in the TM
  movement.  While I was around, certainly no TM teacher
  had ever been trained in how to talk to someone who was
  having enlightenment experiences.  Has this changed?  
  Does anyone know whether there are a group of teachers
  who *have* been taught how to teach those who are having
  such experiences?
  
  ---On the basis of the vagaries you just put to print I would 
  suggest that this set of instructions doesn't exist in the 
Tibetan 
  either except insofar as in your mind.  
  
  If you are so sure that such a thing exists then you need to 
  supply us credulous dopes with at least a partial list of titles 
  of the teadhings so that we may ascertain for ourselve if such 
  teachings were ever committed to print. 
 
 With all due respect, I don't need to do anything.  :-)
 
 My knowledge of such things comes primarily from my friend
 at Naropa.  The latest visiting Kempo is from a Tibetan
 monastery in Bhutan.  I will try to find out the particulars
 for you.  The teachings he gave there in Boulder, on his one-
 day stop, were in Tibetan, translated on the fly by exper-
 ienced translators there.
 
 I *have* heard such teachings discussed among other Tibetan
 groups in Santa Fe, similarly oral.  To be honest, they
 were primarily discussed there in the Santa Fe sanghas as
 a curiosity, because no one had need of them.  :-)
 
  My disbelief comes as a result of positing that there is such 
  a thing or its equivalent as CC in the Vajrayana.  
 
 That was my mapping, trying to relate what my friend was
 writing to me into TM-speak.
 
  For instance, the real analogy in the Vajrayana for enlightenment
  would be ascertaining the Trikaya which would be much more like 
  Vedic Cognition. And this would be really just the start of clear 
  experience of shunyata. 
  
  The only real thing I can think which might be like what you 
  mention was always freely available in the Madhiyatmikavatara, 
  and that is the description of the bhumis.  
 
 It is possible.  Everything I have heard about such teachings
 as my friend described in the past has been unfortunately 
 second-hand.
  
  Of course in the Guhyagarbha there are a further five bhumis 
  pertaining to Dzogchen that are not considered in the Mahayana.  
 
 This Kempo is from the Dzogchen tradition.
 
  Does your friend suggest some other levels perhaps beyond these?
 
 He was remarkably unforthcoming on details.  I'll see if I 
 can get him to be less so.  :-)
 
  I laugh at your naivete. I see now why you were a TM teacher, 
  because you'll accept any fodder and sell it as high powered 
  gasoline for Ferraris.
 
 Just as I laugh at your consistent assumption that just
 because you personally haven't run into something, it
 doesn't exist.  :-)
 

well, since I am everything, this makes sense...




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[FairfieldLife] Re: TM grad school?

 So this has me wondering whether any counterpart of this
 type of knowledge and teaching has appeared in the TM
 movement.  While I was around, certainly no TM teacher
 had ever been trained in how to talk to someone who was
 having enlightenment experiences.  Has this changed?  
 Does anyone know whether there are a group of teachers
 who *have* been taught how to teach those who are having
 such experiences?

Just to clarify, what I'm wondering about is *not*
the kind of intellectual teaching that seeks to 
define or categorize or bag the different exper-
iences of enlightenment -- What 'state' am I 
experiencing? -- that sorta thing.  There is a 
great deal of that in the TMO, and in other traditions.

What I'm more interested in is a more day-to-day, prag-
matic type of teaching, along the lines of What do I
*do* with these experiences, *whatever* they are?

When you think about it, it is not likely that the 
second type of teaching is going to come up very much
in organizations that promote the dogma that enlight-
enment, once realized, can never be lost, and that
the actions of the enlightened are, by definition,
perfect and free from the possibility of error.
But not all spiritual organizations and traditions
believe this; some believe the opposite, that such
realizations *can* be lost.

At Naropa, such questions probably come up a lot 
because of Trungpa's personal history.  We are talk-
ing, after all, about a man who was a recognized,
certified tulku from a respected lineage, who at
one point in his life stopped wearing his robes, 
forsook all of his vows, and essentially drank and
screwed himself to death.  His most senior student,
who reportedly had been having a bunch of pretty
high experiences himself, caused a *huge* scandal
in the spiritual world by refusing to deal with the
realities of having AIDS, and knowingly giving the
disease to a number of other people.  So the students
of such a tradition are naturally going to be more
open to the possibility that such actions may be an
indicator that some, if not all, of the realization
of higher states of consciousness might have slipped
away, or been driven away by non-dharmic actions.

Everything I've heard from the Naropa discussions 
has been from my friend, who is a *remarkably* un-
intellectual fellow, interested only in pragmatic
Buddhism.  He describes the things he's learned to
me in *purely* pragmatic terms.  The discussions of
such pragmatic teachings I heard in the Santa Fe
Tibetan communities centered on topics like:

* Ok, I'm starting to have early enlightenment exper-
iences.  (paraphrasing in TM-speak)  I'm consistently
witnessing sleep and dreaming and activity, and the
transcendent is an ever-present reality for me.  So
before all this happened, I had this set of practices
(A, B,  C) that I performed without fail every day.
Do I still need to *do* A, B, and C, now that the
goal of each of those practices is present at all
times?

* Another such discussion had to do with drugs.  In a
number of Tantric traditions in the East, holy men,
some of them theoretically enlightened, smoke a lot
of hash.  So the question comes up, If I'm starting
to have these early enlightenment experiences myself,
can I do these kinds of things safely?

* By far the most interesting of such discussions I
have heard personally had to do with how to deal with
one's *students* if one is starting to have enlight-
enment experiences.  The dangers to the teacher
were disccussed in some detail.  The students will try
to put you on a pedestal, and make you special.  They
will project their own assumptions onto you and expect
you to live up to (or, more accurately, live down to)
them.  How do you deal with this stuff?

So my question to the larger group of TMers and former
TMers here is, have you ever heard such teachings in
the TM context?

Unc







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Re: [FairfieldLife] TM grad school?

2005-06-23 Thread Peter Sutphen



--- TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 snip
 

 
 So this has me wondering whether any counterpart of
 this
 type of knowledge and teaching has appeared in the
 TM
 movement.  While I was around, certainly no TM
 teacher
 had ever been trained in how to talk to someone who
 was
 having enlightenment experiences.  Has this changed?
  
 Does anyone know whether there are a group of
 teachers
 who *have* been taught how to teach those who are
 having
 such experiences?
 
 If the answer is No, and no one knows of such a
 group,
 doesn't that raise the question of Why?
 
 To me it could imply that because of the basic dogma
 that 
 enlightenment, once realized, is permanent and
 self-
 sustaining in that the enlightened being can do no
 
 wrong, no need for such teachings is perceived.
 
 Or it could imply that, even though Maharishi is
 clearly 
 on his way out, incarnation-wise he perceives no
 immed-
 iate need for such teachings, or has nothing along
 these 
 lines *to* teach.
 
 What do people think?  I'm certainly interested to
 hear
 if such teachings *are* available, or even
 theoretically
 available in the materials left to the posterity
 of
 the TM movement.
 
 Unc

There appears to be two very popular grad schools for
TMers. These are the University of Sri Sri Ravi
Shankar and Amma State University. Others have also
attended Gangaji AM, and Karunamayi Teachers College.
There are other grad schools too, but I haven't heard
about them.




 
 
 
 
 
 
 
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Yahoo! Sports 
Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football 
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Re: [FairfieldLife] TM grad school?


On Jun 23, 2005, at 3:54 AM, TurquoiseB wrote:

 To me it could imply that because of the basic dogma that
 enlightenment, once realized, is permanent and self-
 sustaining in that the enlightened being can do no
 wrong, no need for such teachings is perceived.

If you dye the cloth and lay it in the sun, let it fade, die it again, 
lay it in the sun, die it again, etc. it will make the color more 
lasting.

But if you stop dying the cloth and leave it lie in the sun, the colors 
will fade.

Mental meditation methods will not ultimately dissolve the kleshas or 
the samskaras at the root. That's why the Shankaracharya trad. teaches 
these styles of meditation will only give temporary results.

 Or it could imply that, even though Maharishi is clearly
 on his way out, incarnation-wise he perceives no immed-
 iate need for such teachings, or has nothing along these
 lines *to* teach.

It possible his dharma was just to open the largest group possible to a 
simple meditation method--kind of an intro to meditation.


 What do people think?  I'm certainly interested to hear
 if such teachings *are* available, or even theoretically
 available in the materials left to the posterity of
 the TM movement.

IME they are not available, but neither are many of the other important 
methods or techniques which are important to realization and the 
removal of obstacles in the path.



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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: TM grad school?


On Jun 23, 2005, at 5:47 AM, TurquoiseB wrote:

 He was remarkably unforthcoming on details.  I'll see if I
 can get him to be less so.  :-)

The name of the text in TIbetan would be helpful. There are numerous 
such texts as you describe, if not hundreds.



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[FairfieldLife] Re: TM grad school?

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 On Jun 23, 2005, at 5:47 AM, TurquoiseB wrote:
 
  He was remarkably unforthcoming on details.  I'll see if I
  can get him to be less so.  :-)
 
 The name of the text in TIbetan would be helpful. There are numerous 
 such texts as you describe, if not hundreds.

My friend (also an ex-TM teacher) is one of the *least*
intellectual human beings on the planet.  There are
days when I'm not sure he remembers his own name, much
less the name of this particular teaching, if it has
one.  But I'll ask.  :-)

Unc






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[FairfieldLife] FW: Jupiter Beeja Mantra

2005-06-23 Thread Rick Archer

Title: FW: Jupiter Beeja Mantra





Thursday is Jupiters day. In Sanskrit he is called Guru or Brihaspati. He is the teacher to the gods, devaguru. This mantra will be good in jupiter cycles and negative Jupiter transits or on your birthday each year if your rising sign is Sagittarius (Dhanu) or Pisces (meena).

Guru Beeja Mantra  to be repeated 16,000 times. This is a Brahma mantra

Om Hreem Shreem Sthreem Aim Glaum Grahaatipataayai BrihaspataayaiBreem Thah Aim Thah

There are no dipthongs in sanskrit so the TH sound is made by sound each letter separately TA and HA but each sound of it is short and quick so it sounds a bit like a T with a burst of air after it.



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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

  Right. I am of course not referring to the TM itself, but to the
  explanation that is given especially at the second day checking, 
 that
  is stress release, and thought being an expression of it. The idea
  that stresses, for example emotional are restored in the body and 
 upon
  release are giving rise to thought activity. The idea that the 
 thought
  will be not necessarily exact, but could respond by association. 
 That
  there is a mixture, i.e. a cluster of stress released. That there 
 is a
  cycle.
 
 But this is exactly what the samskaras are in the Yogic tradition. 
 Ever occur to you that maybe Hubbard was familiar with THAT?

Hubbard modelled his Dianetics after Psychtherapy. He surely was aware
of Samskaras, but in Indian thought samkaras are usually not being rid
of by just making them conscious. This is typically Freud. You become
conscious of something hiding in the unconscious and get rid of it
thereby. You don't find this in the indian Samskar theory. Similarely
in TM the stresses are being released when the thought arises. I am
not aware that in indian theory the arising of thought is seen as
getting rid of Samkaras. I am not saying that it cannot work. I am
just saying that I am not aware of such a source. I don't think that
it's bad  to get inspired and influenced by other contemporary
movements. But personaly I wouldn't be too rigit about this
thought=stressrelease theory. It's helpful, but its also a trap. You
get rid of Samskaras in TM. But it's not one to one with the thoughts
arising IMO. you have to distinguish of a theory being helpful to keep
a certain process going - as an explanation, to not resist thoughts or
force oneself, and it being *literally* true. An elephant has two
kinds of teeth, two to show and two to chew.
 
  Its not the same, but you feel that he modelled it after the
  auditing model of Dianetics.




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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, t3rinity [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 An elephant has two
 kinds of teeth, two to show and two to chew.

Elephants are sure getting their fifteen minutes of
fame here lately.  :-)







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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, t3rinity [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 
   Right. I am of course not referring to the TM itself, but to the
   explanation that is given especially at the second day 
checking, 
  that
   is stress release, and thought being an expression of it. The 
idea
   that stresses, for example emotional are restored in the body 
and 
  upon
   release are giving rise to thought activity. The idea that the 
  thought
   will be not necessarily exact, but could respond by 
association. 
  That
   there is a mixture, i.e. a cluster of stress released. That 
there 
  is a
   cycle.
  
  But this is exactly what the samskaras are in the Yogic 
tradition. 
  Ever occur to you that maybe Hubbard was familiar with THAT?
 
 Hubbard modelled his Dianetics after Psychtherapy. He surely was 
aware
 of Samskaras, but in Indian thought samkaras are usually not being 
rid
 of by just making them conscious. This is typically Freud. You 
become
 conscious of something hiding in the unconscious and get rid of it
 thereby. You don't find this in the indian Samskar theory. 
Similarely
 in TM the stresses are being released when the thought arises. I am
 not aware that in indian theory the arising of thought is seen as
 getting rid of Samkaras. I am not saying that it cannot work. I am
 just saying that I am not aware of such a source. I don't think that
 it's bad  to get inspired and influenced by other contemporary
 movements. But personaly I wouldn't be too rigit about this
 thought=stressrelease theory. It's helpful, but its also a trap. You
 get rid of Samskaras in TM. But it's not one to one with the 
thoughts
 arising IMO.

MMY never said it was. In fact, in the SCI tapes, he said exactly the 
opposite: that you cannot assume a 1 to 1 relationship.


 you have to distinguish of a theory being helpful to keep
 a certain process going - as an explanation, to not resist thoughts 
or
 force oneself, and it being *literally* true. An elephant has two
 kinds of teeth, two to show and two to chew.
  
   Its not the same, but you feel that he modelled it after the
   auditing model of Dianetics.





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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: TM grad school?

I wonder if this is the teaching he attended?:

http://www.rinpoche.com/karthar05.htm

It appears the teaching text may be Showing the Path to Liberation.



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[FairfieldLife] Re: TM grad school?

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 I wonder if this is the teaching he attended?:
 
 http://www.rinpoche.com/karthar05.htm
 
 It appears the teaching text may be Showing the Path to Liberation.

I got the feeling that the thing my friend described
was more of an unexpected drop in teaching by a 
Kempo who was traveling, and who happened to be in
the Boulder area for other reasons.  I know that it
wasn't on the normal Naropa schedule.  I'll try to ask
him, but he sometimes goes for days or weeks at a 
time without checking his email.

Unc






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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: TM grad school?






  If you are so sure that such a thing exists then you need 
to  supply us credulous dopes with at least a partial list of titles 
 of the teadhings so that we may ascertain for ourselve if such  
teachings were ever committed to print. With all due respect, I don't 
"need" to do anything. :-)


---So you never need too go 
to the restroom?
Or must due respect preceed that 
act before you respond as well ;)


My knowledge of such things comes primarily from my friendat 
Naropa. The latest visiting Kempo is from a Tibetanmonastery in 
Bhutan. I will try to find out the particularsfor you. The 
teachings he gave there in Boulder, on his one-day stop, were in Tibetan, 
translated "on the fly" by exper-ienced translators there.


--Strange we're discussing 
'needed' things, and you raise 'the fly.'
I *have* heard such teachings discussed among other 
Tibetangroups in Santa Fe, similarly oral. To be honest, theywere 
primarily discussed there in the Santa Fe sanghas asa curiosity, because no 
one had need of them. :-)


---My frend who is always 
wiser than myself is who raised the question to me about your friend. I bet my 
friend can beat your friend up. But she doesn't like getting into pissing 
matches.
 My disbelief comes as a result of positing that there is such 
 a thing or its equivalent as CC in the Vajrayana. That 
was my "mapping," trying to relate what my friend waswriting to me into 
TM-speak.


Oh I'm sorry, I didn't 
get it. 
 For instance, the real analogy in the Vajrayana for 
enlightenment would be ascertaining the Trikaya which would be much more 
like  Vedic Cognition. And this would be really just the start of clear 
 experience of shunyata.   The only real thing I can 
think which might be like what you  mention was always freely available 
in the Madhiyatmikavatara,  and that is the description of the 
bhumis. It is possible. Everything I have heard about such 
teachingsas my friend described in the past has been unfortunately 
second-hand.


---My teachings were first 
hand, and then second head. That was fortunate. On my palms.
 Of course in the Guhyagarbha there are a further five bhumis 
 pertaining to Dzogchen that are not considered in the Mahayana. 
This Kempo is from the Dzogchen tradition.


Khenpo Lopon? It's a 
small world.
 Does your friend suggest some other levels perhaps beyond 
these?He was remarkably unforthcoming on details. I'll see if I 
can get him to be less so. :-)


My friend came, but much 
later.
 I laugh at your naivete. I see now why you were a TM teacher, 
 because you'll accept any fodder and sell it as high powered  
gasoline for Ferraris.Just as I laugh at your consistent assumption that 
justbecause you personally haven't run into something, itdoesn't 
exist. :-)


He who laughs last 
laughs loudest. That's my last assumption that you'll ever have. 
:):)
pUncTo subscribe, send a 
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click 'Join This Group!' 



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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, t3rinity [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

You become
 conscious of something hiding in the unconscious and get rid of it
 thereby. You don't find this in the indian Samskar theory. 

Can you describe the Indian Samskar theory?

Jeff





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[FairfieldLife] Re: TM grad school?

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Llundrub [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 ---My frend who is always wiser than myself is who raised the 
question to me about your friend. I bet my friend can beat your friend 
up. But she doesn't like getting into pissing matches.

Your friend could *definitely* beat my friend up.  
Sweet guy, but a blissninny factor 'way over the top
of the scale.  He manages somehow to live his life
without working and without paying for much of anything,
including the courses he takes at Naropa, and has done
so successfully for decades now, so I cut him a lot of 
slack just for his level of personal power.  But in a
down-and-dirty match with your female friend, he'd be
toast.  :-)

Unc






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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: TM grad school?






If he was toast she would butter him up.


- Original Message - 
From: TurquoiseB 
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 

Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2005 8:48 AM
Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: TM "grad school?"
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, 
"Llundrub" [EMAIL PROTECTED]... wrote: 
---My frend who is always wiser than myself is who raised the question 
to me about your friend. I bet my friend can beat your friend up. But she 
doesn't like getting into pissing matches.Your friend could *definitely* 
beat my friend up. Sweet guy, but a blissninny factor 'way over the 
topof the scale. He manages somehow to live his lifewithout 
working and without paying for much of anything,including the courses he 
takes at Naropa, and has doneso successfully for decades now, so I cut him a 
lot of slack just for his level of personal power. But in 
adown-and-dirty match with your female friend, he'd betoast. 
:-)UncTo subscribe, send a message 
to:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/and 
click 'Join This Group!' 



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Re: [FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)





Can you describe the Indian Samskar 
theory?Jeff---I think different times of the day have 
different melodies.


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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Llundrub [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 Can you describe the Indian Samskar theory?
 
 Jeff
 
 
 
 ---I think different times of the day have different melodies.

Like Merry Melodies?





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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jeff Fischer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Llundrub [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
  
  Can you describe the Indian Samskar theory?
  
  Jeff
  
  
  
  ---I think different times of the day have different melodies.
 
 Like Merry Melodies?

Loony Tunes, in this context...




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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: infinity to PointS (was the relative)

2005-06-23 Thread Peter Sutphen

No one's been doing their asanas regularly! Very nice
post. The flow of consciousness as overwhelming love
to a point in the relative. The stitching of the
relative into the Absolute.

--- Robert Gimbel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 ---Also, in rising to GC the inner knower begins to
 feel expanding 
 love, or whatever you want to call it; but a feeling
 of flow from 
 infinity inside to any point outside. This relates
 to omniscience in 
 that the flow of this inner field of awareness,
 spontaneously, knows 
 or is drawn to the particular point of interest. 
 Really in any situation of lack; it is lack of love,
 lack of 
 passion, and now, when pure consiousness is
 established, and all ego 
 based fear dissolved, there's nothing left to do,
 but watch the 
 absolute move...
 
 
  In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Robert Gimbel
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
  -Before enlightenment, the world we perceive is
 of, by and for 
 the 
  ego. Everything is seen and translated in terms of
 this point, 
 this 
  sense of me(the ego). 
  After enlightenment is acheived one steps out of
 identifying with 
  this point, this sense of me(the ego). 
One is no longer indentified with a point, this
 tiny sense of me
  (the ego), but becomes identified with the origin
 of any point in 
  pure awareness, the Absolute.
  One can become aware of any point,any side of any
 issue; no longer 
  guided by a single perspective(ego based), totally
 limiting view...
  So, the next step is allowing the pure
 consciousness to flow 
 within 
  itself to the point, then to the next point, all
 point guided now, 
  not by ego, but by pure intelligence. Any
 problem is seen as 
 just 
  energy, which needs balance and recieves balance
 spontaneously, 
 from 
  point to point. 
  In other words, an enlightened person, detatched
 perceives from 
 the 
  state of being, and in that silence, brings forth
 the opposite 
  energy to perfectly balance, thereby always,
 percieving the Unity, 
  in diversity; as being established in pure
 consiousness, silence, 
  always provides the Unifying factor, always...
  
  
  -- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, claudiouk
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote:
   Many thanks for all the responses, not sure how
 to address them 
  all.. 
   They helped me think more about the question and
 hopefully some 
   resolution is taking place somewhere in my
 brain
   
   58385... Irmeli Mattsson
   
I cannot understand how this kind of
 theoretical, 
 intellectual 
   speculation can help a person to evolve... If
 you have a rigid 
   preconceived idea, you are less open for the
   unexpected, which a new stage will be. 
   
   MMY often emphasized the importance of
 understanding along with 
   direct experience, for one's evolution. I agree
 that imitating 
 a 
   state of consciousness from some cultural
 transmission is 
  pointless, 
   but theoretical discussions can hopefully reduce
 confusion and 
 be 
   inspiring and motivating. I imagine that direct
 experience would 
   override and automatically stretch any limiting 
 preconceptions.
   
Every thought and every experience regardless
 of how .. 
   transcendental it feels, when perceived in and
 through a 
 physical 
   body and nervous system, is always in the
 relative. We can only 
  talk 
   about the absolute, we cannot experience it.
   
   In MMY's schema, this is the point to infinity
 bit, only 
 you're 
   saying that any and all experience is relative.
 But the Knower 
 is 
   Absolute so from the infinity to point
 perspective why are we 
  stuck 
   with the relative experience associated with
 THIS point body and 
  not 
   others, given that the Knower inhabits other
 bodies 
  simultaneously. 
   
   58396 ... Rory Goff
   
   Brahman or Wholeness resides AS fully in the
 manifest,
   relative point as in the unmanifest, absolute
 Ocean. No
   difference. A natural progression from this
 would seem to be the
   realization that one's Wholeness is potentially
 as free to be ANY
   point-self as to be one's habitual point-self:
   
   Yes Infinity (= Wholeness = Unmanifest/Absolute
 = Self) is 
   omnipresent at every Point (= manifest, relative
 = self). So why 
  is 
   the consciosness/Knower remain linked to the
 habitual point self 
  if 
   it is free to be ANY point-self ?
   
   58405...  jim_flanegin 
   
The Self is distinctly free from any sense of
 personal 
   identification.It is perceived by the original
 'point' body, but 
  is 
   not actually connected to it.It is odd
 because it feels like 
  me, 
   but try as I might I can't locate the attachment
 point, through 
   thought or the senses.
   
   Yes  identification dissolves when going from
 point to infinity.
   
Though I am unsure about the next step- how
 the perception of 
  the 
   Self begins to extend to everything else 'out
 there'. 
  Conceptually, 
   yes, but experientially, not yet constant.
   
   This infinity to pointS is the tricky bit.

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: infinity to PointS (was the relative)






Sounds like the sperm flow chart to me.



- Original Message - 
From: Peter 
Sutphen 
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 

Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2005 9:35 AM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: infinity to PointS (was the 
relative)
No one's been doing their asanas regularly! Very 
nicepost. The flow of consciousness as overwhelming loveto a point in 
the relative. The "stitching" of therelative into the Absolute.--- 
Robert Gimbel [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote: ---Also, in rising to GC the inner knower begins to 
feel expanding  love, or whatever you want to call it; but a 
feeling of flow from  infinity inside to any point outside. This 
relates to omniscience in  that the flow of this inner field of 
awareness, spontaneously, knows  or is drawn to the particular 
point of interest.  Really in any situation of lack; it is lack of 
love, lack of  passion, and now, when pure consiousness 
is established, and all ego  based fear dissolved, there's 
nothing left to do, but "watch" the  absolute "move"... 
  In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Robert 
Gimbel" [EMAIL PROTECTED]  wrote:  -Before 
enlightenment, the world we perceive is "of, by and for  the 
  ego. Everything is seen and translated in terms of this 
point,  this   sense of me(the ego).   After 
enlightenment is acheived one steps out of identifying with  
 this point, this sense of me(the ego).   One is no 
longer indentified with a point, this tiny sense of me  (the 
ego), but becomes identified with the origin of any point in  
 pure awareness, the Absolute.  One can become aware of any 
point,any side of any issue; no longer   guided by a single 
perspective(ego based), totally limiting view...  So, the 
next step is allowing the pure consciousness to "flow  within 
  itself to the point, then to the next point, all point 
guided now,   not by ego, but by pure intelligence. Any 
"problem" is seen as  just   energy, which needs balance and 
recieves balance spontaneously,  from   point to 
point.   In other words, an enlightened person, detatched 
perceives from  the   state of being, and in that silence, 
brings forth the opposite   energy to perfectly balance, 
thereby always, percieving the Unity,   in diversity; as 
being established in pure consiousness, silence,   always 
provides the Unifying factor, always...  
-- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "claudiouk" [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote:   Many thanks for all the responses, not 
sure how to address them   all..They 
helped me think more about the question and hopefully some   
 resolution is taking place somewhere in my brain  
58385... Irmeli Mattsson 
  "I cannot understand how this kind of theoretical,  
intellectualspeculation can help a person to evolve... 
If you have a rigidpreconceived idea, you are less 
open for the   unexpected, which a new stage will be. " 
 MMY often emphasized the importance of 
understanding along withdirect experience, for one's 
evolution. I agree that "imitating"  astate 
of consciousness from some cultural transmission is   
pointless,but theoretical discussions can hopefully 
reduce confusion and  beinspiring and 
motivating. I imagine that direct experience would
override and automatically stretch any limiting  preconceptions. 
  "Every thought and every experience 
regardless of how ..transcendental it feels, when 
perceived in and through a  physicalbody and 
nervous system, is always in the relative. We can only   
talkabout the absolute, we cannot experience it." 
 In MMY's schema, this is the "point to 
infinity" bit, only  you'resaying that any 
and all experience is relative. But the Knower  is   
 Absolute so from the "infinity to point" perspective why are we 
  stuckwith the relative experience associated 
with THIS point body and   notothers, 
given that the Knower inhabits other bodies   
simultaneously.   58396 ... Rory 
Goff  "Brahman" or Wholeness resides AS 
fully in the "manifest,   relative" point as in the 
"unmanifest, absolute" Ocean. No   difference. A natural 
progression from this would seem to be the   realization 
that one's Wholeness is potentially as free to be ANY   
point-self as to be one's habitual point-self:" 
 Yes Infinity (= Wholeness = Unmanifest/Absolute = Self) is  
  omnipresent at every Point (= manifest, relative = self). So 
why   isthe consciosness/Knower remain linked to 
the habitual point self   ifit is free 
to be ANY point-self ?  58405... 
jim_flanegin"The Self is distinctly 
free from any sense of personalidentification.It is 
perceived by the original 'point' body, but   is  
  not actually connected to it.It is odd because it feels 
like   me,but try as I might I can't locate the 
attachment point, throughthought or the 
senses."  Yes identification dissolves 
when going from point to infinity.  
 "Though I am unsure about the next step- how the

[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

2005-06-23 Thread authfriend

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, t3rinity [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
snip
 Hubbard modelled his Dianetics after Psychtherapy. He surely was 
 aware of Samskaras, but in Indian thought samkaras are usually
 not being rid of by just making them conscious. This is typically 
 Freud. You become conscious of something hiding in the unconscious
 and get rid of it thereby. You don't find this in the indian 
 Samskar theory. Similarely in TM the stresses are being released
 when the thought arises.

What I remember being told is that the
content of thoughts that arise likely have
nothing at all to do with the content of
the stresses being released.  E.g., you
transcend, and a stress implanted by a
teacher yelling at you when you were a kid
because you were late to class unwinds, but
the thought that arises as a result has to
do with what you're going to have for dinner
that night.

As I understood this, the *energy* released
by the dissolution of the samskara--the energy
that was holding it in place--more or less
randomly kicks some current concern and
activates it as a thought.

Most of my thoughts during meditation are very
mundane, not at all concerned with past stresses,
even when my meditation is very deep.  So either
I'm not releasing much in the way of past 
samskaras, or the ones I'm releasing don't go
through my mind in the form of thoughts; what
goes through my mind are, so to speak,
surrogates activated by the released energy.

 I am
 not aware that in indian theory the arising of thought is seen as
 getting rid of Samkaras.

According to the explanation I outlined,
the arising of thoughts would be a byproduct
of getting rid of samskaras, if that makes
any difference.

 I am not saying that it cannot work. I am
 just saying that I am not aware of such a source. I don't think that
 it's bad  to get inspired and influenced by other contemporary
 movements. But personaly I wouldn't be too rigit about this
 thought=stressrelease theory. It's helpful, but its also a trap. You
 get rid of Samskaras in TM. But it's not one to one with the 
 thoughts arising IMO. you have to distinguish of a theory being 
 helpful to keep a certain process going - as an explanation, to
 not resist thoughts or force oneself, and it being *literally* 
 true. An elephant has two kinds of teeth, two to show and two to 
 chew.

This explanation also has the effect of making it
easier to take thoughts as they come rather than
being tempted to examine them to discover what
stresses are being released.





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[FairfieldLife] TM Watch Out - Brain Respiration







Korean spiritual leader's brain respiration movement is 
catching on locally 
Saturday, July 17, 2004
SEATTLE POST-INTELLIGENCER STAFFWhen we heard 
that there was a sold-out Brain Respiration Festival today in Seattle, naturally 
our curiosity was piqued.Brain respiration? Say what?New 
mind-body trends seem to pop up all the time, and this one already has spawned 
seven centers in the Puget Sound area with an impassioned following. Another two 
will open soon.About 1,000 people are attending the one-day Brain 
Respiration Festival at Meany Hall on the University of Washington campus. 
Schools in Las Vegas, the Los Angeles area and Florida are using brain 
respiration techniques in the classroom. The movement has its own quarterly 
magazine, body  brain. Developed by Korean spiritual leader Ilchi 
Lee, brain respiration is a "system of brain-based meditation techniques and 
physical exercises that seek to awaken the deepest potential of the human 
brain." His message might be summed up best by one of his sayings: "Change your 
brain and you can change your life."Lee says that with his training, a 
person can decrease stress, use more of the brain than the standard 10 percent 
and learn to discard negative, hard-wired emotions and habits.Adherents 
say this isn't just another fad. They say the proof is the people who leave 
healthier and happier after practicing it."Everything that has to do 
with human health, including creativity and enlightenment, has to do with the 
human brain. It's not an overstatement to say that the human brain is life 
itself," Lee said via a translator.Lee, 53, also modernized Dahnhak, an 
ancient Korean mind-body-spirit tradition of optimizing one's energy, or ki. 
Most of the places where both practices are taught call themselves "yoga" 
centers, though there's no downward dog and the techniques are often very 
different from Hatha yoga. Complementary practices, Dahnhak and brain 
respiration aren't easily defined. They combine elements of religion, self-help, 
meditation, healing and Eastern philosophy and medicine with martial arts 
movements, stretching, tai chi, specialized breathing, visualization and more. 
Other techniques include tapping or thumping parts of the body to release 
"stagnant" energy, self-massage and even occasional dancing to disco. 
The ultimate goal of brain respiration and Dahnhak, said Lee, is to 
develop a "power brain" that is creative, peaceful and 
productive.Certainly, there is plenty of research showing that exercise 
and cognitive stimulation help keep a brain "young."But Lee isn't 
concerned that there's no proof positive of his theories and training. "There's 
a lot of facts and truth out there that science can't verify yet," said Lee, who 
is now based in Sedona, Ariz. "It's science's job to catch up."Lee and 
his Web site say that the University of California at Irvine's Center for Brain 
Aging and Dementia is studying his methodology. Not so, they say. An assistant 
to the director there, Dr. Carl Cotman, adds, "We do not endorse him. At 
all."Lee said he began developing his training about 25 years ago when 
he did 21-day solitary retreats. He started testing whether his theories 
and methods would help others, first working with one person in a park. Now, an 
estimated million people practice Dahnhak and brain respiration, most in Korea. 
To doubters, he likes to say that it was only a few hundred years ago 
that humankind thought the sun revolved around the Earth. Studying 
Dahnhak and brain respiration isn't cheap. Students are encouraged to come three 
times a week and employees say the cost works out to $8 to $15 per class. A 
three-month membership with unlimited classes costs $390. But they say many can 
practice at home after about a year of study, and there are books and videos for 
those who don't go to the centers. They also sell products that 
supposedly help energy flow, such as necklaces and bracelets, and a $90 "power 
brain," a "portable brain energizer," in the form of a spongy, yellow noggin 
that vibrates and fits in one's palm. Participants wear martial 
arts-style uniforms. They emphasize etiquette, bowing and greeting each other in 
Korean, often with hugs. "We just teach and let people experience. At 
first, we just transfer cosmic energy to people," said Geum Hwa, the regional 
manager for Dahn centers in the Puget Sound area. "But after you learn how to, 
you can create your own energy."Most find out about the training through 
fliers or word-of-mouth. Many who come through the door have depression, stress 
or loneliness, Hwa said. A new student first has an "aura picture" taken, and 
gets an "energy checkup" before an individualized training plan is 
created.Janice Marshall was shopping at a PCC store when the Dahn center 
in Kirkland caught her eye. She decided to try it for a month. "I had a lot 
going on. I was really depressed. My sister had died within the past year. And 
my favorite cat in the world

[FairfieldLife] 'Karl Rove's/ Mantra-Divide and Rule...'









Karl Rove- master of the old principle "Divide and Rule".

Master at framing any topic in terms of "Conservative and Liberal".

How destructive this is for our country for our children to learn and inherit.

Are we all really allthat black and white.

Or just sleep walking;

Easily manipulated by fear and divisiveness?

R. Gimbel Seattle, WA.
		Yahoo! Sports 
Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football





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[FairfieldLife] Maharishi Vedic Scholars/pandits

2005-06-23 Thread Rick Archer

Dear Friends,

I wanted to let everyone know who has been supporting the Vedic Scholar
project this past year that the Vedic Scholars will be coming immediately!
And even more Vedic Scholars will follow as more accommodations become
available. Some of the Pandits will also be traveling in groups of 15 to
every Peace Palace as they are built around the country. They will perform
Vedic recitations daily in specially constructed Yagya Mandaps.

From Vedic India, they will come to Maharishi Vedic City in Vedic
America--and soon to every region of the country. Every Peace Palace city
will become Vedic--Vedic New York, Vedic Washington, etc. With this gift
from Vedic India, America will rise to invincibility.

You have really produced something great. The United States and the world
would not be the same today if you had not supported the construction of
this Vastu campus that will allow the Pandits to come and live properly in
America.

The 100,000 square foot campus was completed on budget in nine months in
time to host the 328 Governors on the first Governor Recertification Course
in April. The campus is also now hosting the first Teacher Training Course
to be held in North America in seven years.

Now we move into the operational phase of supporting the Vedic Scholars
while they are here. As you remember, the cost for each Vedic Scholar is
$450 per month. We also wanted to have 2 months in advance to cover their
air fare and other setup costs.

Many had pledged to support the Pandits once they were on their way, and we
spent and borrowed to complete the campus assuming that those pledges would
come in when we needed them.

Now would be a good time to fulfill those pledges or give more than you had
planned. Please go to http://globalcountryofworldpeace.org/contribute/to
make your contribution by credit card or automatic bank withdrawal. Or send
a check to Global Country of World Peace, 1973 Grand Drive, Maharishi Vedic
City, IA 52556.

If you have already been supporting the Vedic Scholars and wish to increase
your contribution you may do so by submitting a new contribution
https://vediccity.securesites.com/contribute/contribution.cgi for the
additional amount at the Maharishi Vedic City web site.

Your support is vitally needed! Let's give the Vedic Scholars a very warm
welcome, and make sure that they have all that they need.

Congratulations. You had the foresight and the confidence to support this
project that will help America rise to invincibility and create permanent
world peace. Very well done.

Jai Guru Dev.

Raja Wynne
Raja of Vedic America,
Mayor of Maharishi Vedic City, and
President of the Global Country of World Peace,
the U.S. based 501(c)(3) non-profit organization





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[FairfieldLife] Re: 'Karl Rove's/ Mantra-Divide and Rule...'

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Robert Gimbel 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Karl Rove - master of the old principle Divide and Rule.
   
 Master at framing any topic in terms of Conservative and Liberal.
  
 How destructive this is for our country for our children to 
 learn and inherit.

Not a problem.  The plan doesn't involve them being
around to inherit anything, as indicated by this
article today.  At least now we all know what the
phrase No Child Left Behind really meant in the
minds of the administration.  No child left behind 
in the US who could potentially be recruited and 
sent off to die in one of America's wars.  Emphasis 
below (***) mine.   - Unc


Pentagon Launches Massive Database To Help Recruiting Efforts 

The Pentagon has begun working with a private company 
to create a massive database of high school and college 
students to help identify students as young as 16 to 
target for military recruiting. 

This according to the Washington Post. The database 
includes an array of personal information including birth 
dates, Social Security numbers, e-mail addresses, grade 
point averages, ethnicity and what subjects the students 
are studying. 

The Pentagon has hired the Massachusetts-based company 
BeNow to run the database apparently in an effort to 
circumvent laws that restrict the government's right to 
collect or hold citizen information. ***The database 
will include data given over by schools under the No 
Child Left Behind Act*** as well as information 
collected from commercial data brokers. 

According to the Washington Post, the system also gives 
the Pentagon the right -- without notifying the students 
-- to share the data for numerous uses outside the 
military, including with law enforcement, state tax 
authorities and Congress. A Pentagon spokesperson 
defended the database saying, This program is important 
because it helps bolster the effectiveness of all the 
services' recruiting and retention efforts. 

The new database is being created at a time when the 
Armed Forces is struggling to meet its recruiting goals. 
The Army has missed its monthly recruiting goals every 
month so far this year. But Chris Jay Hoofnagle of EPIC 
-- the Electronic Privacy Information Center --criticized 
the system as a audacious plan to target-market kids, 
as young as 16, for military solicitation. EPIC described 
the database as a unprecedented foray of the government 
into direct marketing techniques previously only performed 
by the private sector. The privacy watchdog group also 
criticized the program because it does not allow students 
to opt-out of being in the massive database although they 
can opt-out of being solicited for recruitment.






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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, t3rinity [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
 snip
  Hubbard modelled his Dianetics after Psychtherapy. He surely was 
  aware of Samskaras, but in Indian thought samkaras are usually
  not being rid of by just making them conscious. This is typically 
  Freud. You become conscious of something hiding in the unconscious
  and get rid of it thereby. You don't find this in the indian 
  Samskar theory. Similarely in TM the stresses are being released
  when the thought arises.
 
 What I remember being told is that the
 content of thoughts that arise likely have
 nothing at all to do with the content of
 the stresses being released. 

That's only half true. I just looked it up, I still have the notes:
let's say the stress was created through an overwhelming feeling of
joy. When the stress is getting released you will re-experience the
joy, but you will attribute it to something in your immediate
environment.Let's say you expect a friend to come, and you will
associate the *feeling* with the present event. But the feeling will
be reminescent of the stress being released according to 2nd day
checking. Incidentally I came across the same kind of explanation on
the site explaining auditing. They even illustrated it, showing a
motorbike you see, and then indicate how it triggers a stress created
by a motorbike accident. Of course in the TM the whole re-experiencing
is somewhat diluted due to the fact that there could be clusters of
stress being simultaneausly released (but that is also said by Scn,
they actually adress whole clusters of engrams AFAIK), and be the fact
that they could be partially released, e.g. a big shock could be
slowely released giving rise to a feeling of anxiety only, but over a
period of time.

 E.g., you
 transcend, and a stress implanted by a
 teacher yelling at you when you were a kid
 because you were late to class unwinds, but
 the thought that arises as a result has to
 do with what you're going to have for dinner
 that night.

I disagree. The event is not remembered, but the feelings will be the
same. Just you pick up something from your environment to justify that
feeling. You pick the appropriate association.


 As I understood this, the *energy* released
 by the dissolution of the samskara--the energy
 that was holding it in place--more or less
 randomly kicks some current concern and
 activates it as a thought.

Yes. But the type of energy is relived.
 
 Most of my thoughts during meditation are very
 mundane, not at all concerned with past stresses,

You won't think of the past.

 even when my meditation is very deep.  So either
 I'm not releasing much in the way of past 
 samskaras, or the ones I'm releasing don't go
 through my mind in the form of thoughts; what
 goes through my mind are, so to speak,
 surrogates activated by the released energy.

Yes, but that is not unspecific. It is specific in its type of
emotion, but its also diluted.
 
  I am
  not aware that in indian theory the arising of thought is seen as
  getting rid of Samkaras.
 
 According to the explanation I outlined,
 the arising of thoughts would be a byproduct
 of getting rid of samskaras, if that makes
 any difference.

Yes, understood. But in Indian terms, getting rid of Samskaras
wouldn't necessitate reliving the energy of it. In Indian and I guess
Buddhist terms, Samskaras are desires or latent impressions giving
rise to the desire to reincarnate. Purifying oneself of these desires
or impressions wouldn't necessitate living through it, not even
emotionally or energetically.

  I am not saying that it cannot work. I am
  just saying that I am not aware of such a source. I don't think
that
  it's bad  to get inspired and influenced by other contemporary
  movements. But personaly I wouldn't be too rigit about this
  thought=stressrelease theory. It's helpful, but its also a trap.
You
  get rid of Samskaras in TM. But it's not one to one with the 
  thoughts arising IMO. you have to distinguish of a theory being 
  helpful to keep a certain process going - as an explanation, to
  not resist thoughts or force oneself, and it being *literally* 
  true. An elephant has two kinds of teeth, two to show and two to 
  chew.
 
 This explanation also has the effect of making it
 easier to take thoughts as they come rather than
 being tempted to examine them to discover what
 stresses are being released.

The explanation is phantastic. Thats the upside. The downside is, that
if you believe in it, you are hooked up to a kind of cypernetic model
of having to do something, and unless you do it, i.e. release stresses
one by one, you can't get enlightened. Yet the truth is you can get
enlightened in one stroke - immediate enlightenment, if you have the
sudden insight, and disassoziate from your desire mind and ego. The
explanation model has a purpose, one amongst many is to keep you going
to meditate even if you don't

Re: [FairfieldLife] 'Karl Rove's/ Mantra-Divide and Rule...'

2005-06-23 Thread Bhairitu

Robert Gimbel wrote:

Karl Rove - master of the old principle Divide and Rule.
  
Master at framing any topic in terms of Conservative and Liberal.
 
 How destructive this is for our country for our children to learn and inherit.
 
Are we all really all that black and white.
 
Or just sleep walking; 
 
Easily manipulated by fear and divisiveness?
 
R. Gimbel  Seattle, WA.

  

I'm sure you've read Naomi Klien's Baghdad Year Zero:
http://www.harpers.org/BaghdadYearZero.html

and Frontline's Private Warrior's:
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/warriors/

Both give a pretty good idea of what these NeoCon nuts are up to.  I 
keep telling people they aren't failing at the economy, they want it to 
break so we'll all be poor and at their mercy (God forbid).   We need to 
get a lot more activist and not just hope that we can vote them out in 
some future election if we still have them.

- Bhairitu




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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, t3rinity [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
[...]
 Yes, understood. But in Indian terms, getting rid of Samskaras
 wouldn't necessitate reliving the energy of it. In Indian and I guess
 Buddhist terms, Samskaras are desires or latent impressions giving
 rise to the desire to reincarnate. Purifying oneself of these desires
 or impressions wouldn't necessitate living through it, not even
 emotionally or energetically.

MMY was specifically talking about stress-release during TM. I don't 
know that he ever claimed that the same process would apply during some 
other kind of enlightenment-promoting thing.

BTW, when did Hubbard start talking about things in terms of stress? 
Hans Selye didn't coin the word until relatively recently.




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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jeff Fischer
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, t3rinity [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
 
 You become
  conscious of something hiding in the unconscious and get rid of it
  thereby. You don't find this in the indian Samskar theory. 
 
 Can you describe the Indian Samskar theory?

Impressions (contact of the senses with objects) create desires, and
these desires create action, action creates karma. Karma creates
rebirth, rebirth creates again new impressions and desires, thus
keeping the circle alive. According to Buddhism and Hinduism you have
to break this cycle of samsara somehow. Various activities are
prescribed, like insight into the nature of desires, their rejection
or recognition, also e.g. in the yoga-sutras a staged approach whereby
negative samskaras are substituted by positive ones, like spiritual
desires. The experience of God in Savikalpa Samadhi will eradicate all
other desires of lesser tastes, finally you have to get rid of only
one desire, in transcending the personal form of God (i.e. Nirvikalpa
Samadhi).


samskara: Impression. The imprint or traces left in the mind after
an experience, whether in this or previous lives. Root impressions,
especially from profound events, which mold character and guide
actions. Also denotes ceremonial purification: one of a number of
religious ceremonies performed at psychological moments through the
Hindu's life, such as first-feeding, marriage, etc., and various
ceremonies performed to restore something to its original purity.
http://www.himalayanacademy.com/resources/books/virtue/SVGlossary.html

samskAra - (activator) Habitual movement of the mind. Every action
lays down a deposit in the mind, which conditions the mind and leads
on to a new activity, thus keeping the doer enmeshed in the world of
change.
http://www.bindu.freeserve.co.uk/yoga/definitions.htm





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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, t3rinity [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
[...]
 The explanation is phantastic. Thats the upside. The downside is, that
 if you believe in it, you are hooked up to a kind of cypernetic model
 of having to do something, and unless you do it, i.e. release stresses
 one by one, you can't get enlightened. Yet the truth is you can get
 enlightened in one stroke - immediate enlightenment, if you have the
 sudden insight, and disassoziate from your desire mind and ego. The
 explanation model has a purpose, one amongst many is to keep you going
 to meditate even if you don't experience much, as you think the effect
 of stress-release is accumulative. But it's also limiting yourself,
 and is just one more conditioning, like everything else.

Is it?





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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, t3rinity [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 
   Right. I am of course not referring to the TM itself, but to the
   explanation that is given especially at the second day 
checking, 
  that
   is stress release, and thought being an expression of it. The 
idea
   that stresses, for example emotional are restored in the body 
and 
  upon
   release are giving rise to thought activity. The idea that the 
  thought
   will be not necessarily exact, but could respond by 
association. 
  That
   there is a mixture, i.e. a cluster of stress released. That 
there 
  is a
   cycle.
  
  But this is exactly what the samskaras are in the Yogic 
tradition. 
  Ever occur to you that maybe Hubbard was familiar with THAT?
 
 Hubbard modelled his Dianetics after Psychtherapy. He surely was 
aware
 of Samskaras, but in Indian thought samkaras are usually not being 
rid
 of by just making them conscious. This is typically Freud. You 
become
 conscious of something hiding in the unconscious and get rid of it
 thereby. You don't find this in the indian Samskar theory. 
Similarely
 in TM the stresses are being released when the thought arises. I am
 not aware that in indian theory the arising of thought is seen as
 getting rid of Samkaras. I am not saying that it cannot work. I am
 just saying that I am not aware of such a source.


MMY never said that anyway. He said that  stress is repaired during 
the inward stroke of TM, and that thoughts arise as part of the 
activity of repair. If there was no repair to be made (no samskaras 
left), no repair activity occur. The mental experience of the repair-
activity during TM is mental activity of some kind.




 I don't think that
 it's bad  to get inspired and influenced by other contemporary
 movements. But personaly I wouldn't be too rigit about this
 thought=stressrelease theory. It's helpful, but its also a trap. You
 get rid of Samskaras in TM. But it's not one to one with the 
thoughts
 arising IMO. you have to distinguish of a theory being helpful to 
keep
 a certain process going - as an explanation, to not resist thoughts 
or
 force oneself, and it being *literally* true. An elephant has two
 kinds of teeth, two to show and two to chew.
  

I don't see why it can't be literally true, given the proper 
refinement of definitions in response to physiological research.


   Its not the same, but you feel that he modelled it after the
   auditing model of Dianetics.




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Re: [FairfieldLife] THE MOST INSPIRING TRUE STORY OF OUR TIME (was: TM University in South Africa)






It must really be the most inspiring true 
story of our time it must be it really really must be, because people have 
copy/pasted it over one hundred times now. 


- Original Message - 
From: interesting_fun_guy 
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 

Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2005 12:01 PM
Subject: [FairfieldLife] THE MOST INSPIRING TRUE STORY OF OUR TIME 
(was: TM University in South Africa)
From a TMer:THE 
MOST INSPIRING TRUE STORY OF OUR TIMEA few weeks ago, Dr. Taddy Blecher 
visited his favorite place: Jefferson County, Iowa. Voted 
South Africa's best speaker, Taddy has met with presidents (like Bill 
Clinton) of many countries, and inspired a large donation to his school from 
finance guru Suze Orman. A leading business magazine: "Blecher is 
35, going on 15. He is animated and entertaining, and in an interview, 
is more interested in helping his interviewer to improve his or her life 
than talking about himself."Journalists describe Blecher as a grown-up 
Harry Potter, because he seems to live an enchanted life. "Blecher 
exudes positive energy and childlike innocence, but under that exterior lies 
one of the most intelligent minds the world has ever seen."Taddy's 
talk (here condensed) at M.S.A.Emoved many to tears:South Africa, 
1995: Infighting, crime are rampant. The Rand is falling. 
The stock market is nowhere. Intelligentsia rent rather than own -- so 
they can exit quickly. Everyone talks of emigrating to Australia, 
America... Dr. Taddy Blecher will move to Iowa. Everything's 
packed. Two weeks before Taddy's exit, Maharishi calls South Africa, 
says "no TMers should leave this nation." Maharishi feels South Africa 
faces a real disaster, and needs to form a superradiance group.That 
night, sleepless in Soweto, Taddy decides to stay. He joins two 
Transcendental Meditation teachers in non-profit "C.I.D.A." (teaches the 
T. M. program to the poor). His parents: "Are you nuts? We 
spent all this money to get you four degrees, and you're throwing it 
away!"Taddy goes to Alexandra. Twenty people live in one 
house. Cardboard shacks. No shoes or adequate clothing. 
He visits the shockingly run-down, chaotic schools. One depressed 
headmaster learns what TM is, says: "Are you crazy? Nobody in our 
school does anything anyway, and you want to institutionalize it! 
You want to build it into the timetable that they do nothing. I'm 
not doing that in MY school."This headmaster eventually learns TM 
himself...in an attempt to end terrible headaches. He loves it, as do 
his teachers who learn TM also. Soon, nine thousand students 
learn TM. The whole area changes. Pass rates go up by 25% in the 
TM schools. (TM is the only new element.) In control schools 
(12,000 students) pass rates drop one percent. Suicides stop 
completely. (One school had eight recent suicides.) Vandalism, 
violence deeply drop. After the students learn, it is "night and day, 
the change in this place."Alexandra had been highly stressed. 
The world's most dangerous road was in Alexandra. No sane people 
traveled London Road. To keep himself safe, Taddy bought an 
outlandishly purple car. Taddy: "After a few years teaching TM, we 
drove around the township. The love, the positivity... London 
Road completely lost its reputation. Crime fell over eighty 
percent. No one knew why. "South Africa won the All-Africa 
Games, and put them in Alexandra. Unthinkable, until there was all 
this coherence."This had been an area even police avoided. Until 
WE went in. After we taught TM there for two years, the police felt 
safe, so police were everywhere."In the beginning -- no 
police. When you needed them, you could find none. Two years 
later, police are everywhere...talking about how they made the township safe 
-- they 'brought down crime.' We were like 'Yeah, sure.'"We 
would not make that mistake again. Before we started our city 
university, we told the mayor what would happen in his city. Now, 
every time we see him, we say, 'we told you so.'"We taught nine 
thousand kids. They came out of grade twelve...so pumped up. 
But, unable to afford to go to University, they ended up not getting good 
jobs."Unemployment is forty percent in South Africa. Apartheid 
structured this by taking math out of schools. Millions of blacks had 
no math, no science. This 'education' was cruel."Taddy and 
four friends decided to create South Africa's first FREE university. 
Knowing nothing of how to start a university, they talked to professors at 
other universities, who said you need mucho money."Fifty CEOs of 
companies slammed their doors on us. It was the most insane idea they 
had ever heard. We had no books, no computers, no teachers, no 
buildings."An old saying: 'Just begin to weave, and God will provide the 
thread.' "You don't have any thread. You just have 
a desire deep inside your heart. You have a feeling in every cell of 
your body: this is what you have to do. So you just start. Just 
out of

[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
[...]
 MMY never said that anyway. He said that  stress is repaired during 
 the inward stroke of TM, and that thoughts arise as part of the 
 activity of repair. If there was no repair to be made (no samskaras 
 left), no repair activity occur. The mental experience of the repair-
 activity during TM is mental activity of some kind.
 
 
Actually, that rest is gained during the inward stroke and at some 
point, repair activities are activated, which is the outward stroke, 
perceived as mental activity.




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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

2005-06-23 Thread authfriend

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, t3rinity [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 wrote:
snip
  What I remember being told is that the
  content of thoughts that arise likely have
  nothing at all to do with the content of
  the stresses being released. 
 
 That's only half true. I just looked it up, I still have the notes:
 let's say the stress was created through an overwhelming feeling of
 joy. When the stress is getting released you will re-experience the
 joy, but you will attribute it to something in your immediate
 environment.Let's say you expect a friend to come, and you will
 associate the *feeling* with the present event. But the feeling will
 be reminescent of the stress being released according to 2nd day
 checking.

I remember we were told it *might* pick up the
feeling, but it might not.  This would have been
in 1975; I wonder if it was changed since your
TTC.

snip
 Yes, understood. But in Indian terms, getting rid of Samskaras
 wouldn't necessitate reliving the energy of it. In Indian and I 
guess
 Buddhist terms, Samskaras are desires or latent impressions giving
 rise to the desire to reincarnate. Purifying oneself of these 
desires
 or impressions wouldn't necessitate living through it, not even
 emotionally or energetically.

Well, but that's pretty much what I remember
being told in the TM context.

snip
  This explanation also has the effect of making it
  easier to take thoughts as they come rather than
  being tempted to examine them to discover what
  stresses are being released.
 
 The explanation is phantastic. Thats the upside. The downside is, 
 that if you believe in it, you are hooked up to a kind of 
 cypernetic model of having to do something, and unless you do it, 
 i.e. release stresses one by one, you can't get enlightened. Yet 
 the truth is you can get enlightened in one stroke - immediate 
 enlightenment, if you have the sudden insight, and disassoziate 
 from your desire mind and ego.

Not sure what you mean by phantastic, but I
don't see how the TM model precludes instant
enlightenment.  I never thought it did.  There's
more than one way to skin a cat.





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[FairfieldLife] Signs of renunciation?

2005-06-23 Thread Premanand Paul Mason

'A holy man, Swami Vishnuddhananda, was living in the Himalayas. The 
Maharaja of Tehri, then a Himalayan state, was greatly devoted to him. 
One day he asked the Mahatma, Master, what are the indications of a 
person who has renounced the world?
The Mahatma kicked him out of his cottage saying, Get out. Carrying 
all the dirt of the world on you as you do, you have no business to ask 
questions about the indications of a renunciate.
The Maharaja went out, but stayed outside the cottage the whole night. 
At three o'clock in the  morning the Mahatma chanced to come out and 
asked, Who is sitting there?
The one whom you kicked out, said the Maharaja.
Do you see the signs of the renunciate now? said the Mahatma. He is 
entirely fearless, so that he can kick out even a Maharaja.'
- From 'Birth and Death' - His Holiness Shantanand Saraswati




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Re: [FairfieldLife] Signs of renunciation?

Excellent Story, Thanks...Premanand Paul Mason [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
'A holy man, Swami Vishnuddhananda, was living in the Himalayas. The Maharaja of Tehri, then a Himalayan state, was greatly devoted to him. One day he asked the Mahatma, "Master, what are the indications of a person who has renounced the world?"The Mahatma kicked him out of his cottage saying, "Get out. Carrying all the dirt of the world on you as you do, you have no business to ask questions about the indications of a renunciate."The Maharaja went out, but stayed outside the cottage the whole night. At three o'clock in the morning the Mahatma chanced to come out and asked, "Who is sitting there?""The one whom you kicked out," said the Maharaja."Do you see the signs of the renunciate now?" said the Mahatma. "He is entirely fearless, so that he can kick out even a Maharaja."'- From 'Birth and Death' - His Holiness Shantanand
SaraswatiTo subscribe, send a message to:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/and click 'Join This Group!' __Do You Yahoo!?Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 BTW, when did Hubbard start talking about things in terms of stress? 
 Hans Selye didn't coin the word until relatively recently.

Hubbard talked about things in terms of survival, not stress.

Jeff




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[FairfieldLife] Here is an example of grace:

2005-06-23 Thread Premanand Paul Mason

'There was a handicapped man who could not move and had to depend 
upon the charity of others. People were annoyed by his begging and 
ridiculed him. Once a holy man came by and this poor man sought his 
advice. The holy man made sure that his advice would be fully and 
truthfully followed. He took that man under a tree and placed him as 
comfortably as possible and instructed him not to accept any charity 
for three consecutive days.
The villagers saw this holy man settling him under a tree. They 
became curious and asked the handicapped man if they could help. But 
he refused all help. Even when they insisted he refused, obeying the 
holy man from respect. This reliance on the Self made him strong and 
his face lit. Within these three days the villagers became aware of 
his inner force because all his worries and frustrations had totally 
disappeared. This made the ultimate change and they looked after the 
man, and the man looked into the grace of the Self. He was provided 
with all that a holy man would need, and he provided all that the 
villagers needed to turn inward. The company of a Realised Man is 
good enough to change the course of a wretched life into a holy life. 
The advice that I need nothing transformed the situation.'

from 'Birth and Death' - Shankaracharya Shantanand Saraswati, a 
disciple of Shankaracharya Brahmanand Saraswati.

Books by Shantanand Ji ('Birth and Death', 'Good Company', 'The Man 
who wanted to meet God', 'Prayer'  'The Orange Book' are all 
available. They can be ordered on-line from the Study Society 
http://www.studysociety.net/




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[FairfieldLife] Re: THE MOST INSPIRING TRUE STORY OF OUR TIME

2005-06-23 Thread uns_tressor

 
 - Original Message - 
 From: interesting_fun_guy 
 THE MOST INSPIRING TRUE STORY OF OUR TIME
 
 A few weeks ago, Dr. Taddy Blecher visitedetc ...Etc 

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Llundrub [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 It must really be the most inspiring true story of our 
 time it must be it really really must be, because people 
 have copy/pasted it over one hundred times now.  

A wonderful observation from our New Orleans correspondent, 
but it comes (presumably in HTML) in half inch lettering
with quarter inch line spacing. I expect it works wonderfully 
on whatever our beloved Llundrub is smoking...
Uns.





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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
.Let's say you expect a friend to come, and you will
  associate the *feeling* with the present event. But the feeling
will
  be reminescent of the stress being released according to 2nd day
  checking.
 
 I remember we were told it *might* pick up the
 feeling, but it might not.  

At your initiation, 2nd day checking? I must tell you that whatever
you are being told is paraphrased. The teacher uses his own words. My
notes say: (translated from german): 'The quality of the stress
determines the quality of thought.' 

Then it gives the example I just had given, of the joy causing a
stress in the past, and how the mind picks up the feeling and
associates it with the coming of a friend. Whatever it associates it
with is not important, obviously, it's arbitrary.

My course was in July 1977, Avoriaz. I have been to an update 1981,
redoing all the tests. There was no change.

 This would have been
 in 1975; I wonder if it was changed since your
 TTC.
 
 snip
  Yes, understood. But in Indian terms, getting rid of Samskaras
  wouldn't necessitate reliving the energy of it. In Indian and I 
 guess
  Buddhist terms, Samskaras are desires or latent impressions giving
  rise to the desire to reincarnate. Purifying oneself of these 
 desires
  or impressions wouldn't necessitate living through it, not even
  emotionally or energetically.
 
 Well, but that's pretty much what I remember
 being told in the TM context.

You mean that you don't have to live through it? Yes and no. Obviously
the feelings you have are not stressed in TM. The problem here is that
TM (like scientology) assumes that the stresses are located
physically. Thats not the same with the samskara theory. Therefore it
assumes that you have to release them one by one, resulting in an
appropriate experience. You sort of will experience them on their way
out. I don't know if this can be said of Samskaras, I think not.

 Not sure what you mean by phantastic,

I mean it positive. It serves its purpose towards our attitude towards
thoughts in meditation. It gives you motivation to continue and a
sense of progress, even if you have no special experiences. Thats
positive, as perseverance in practise is looked upon as essential in
all traditions.

  but I
 don't see how the TM model precludes instant
 enlightenment.  

I didn't say it precludes instant enlightenment. I'd rather say it
excludes it. TM people will not easily accept that it is possible to
get enlightened, simply by making an innner recognition. The idea is
always you have to release all the stresses one by one, and unless you
do that you can't be enlightened.

 I never thought it did.  There's
 more than one way to skin a cat.

Of course. There are different ways and they aren't mutually exclusive
either.




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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, t3rinity [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 samskara: Impression. The imprint or traces left in the mind 
after
 an experience, whether in this or previous lives. Root impressions,
 especially from profound events, which mold character and guide
 actions. 

t3rinity,
Thank you.  I was interested in your discussion of this.  Sanskaras 
would be equivalent (more or less) with engrams (time of pain and 
some degree of unconsciousness) in Dianetics; at least the heavier 
imprints.  In Dianetics, one would not have to relive all such 
imprints to become Clear.  The collapse of the Reactive Bank (that 
portion of the mind that works on a totally stimulus-response basis) 
can occur rather quickly - like even in a session or two, although 
that would be rare.

If TM dissolves such imprints, one would experience, IMO, the emotion 
that is contained there (eg. anger, fear, apathy).  The difference is 
that in Dianetics, one relives the experience, reexperiencing the 
emotion but in continuing to relive it, comes up the emotional tone 
scale until he is cheerful about it.  At this point the reactive 
effect of that imprint is gone.  One then operates more under one's 
own volitional control.

According to Dianetics, when something in your environment is similar 
to information stored in the engram, the emotion, unconsciousness or 
pain will be restimulated and will be to some degree reexperienced 
(dramatized).  As this is usually on the sub conscious level, one 
picks out something in the current environment to blame the 
unwanted feelings on.  This is similar to Judy's idea (or MMY's) that 
as the stress is released in TM, one will have a thought that 
reflects the quality of that imprint, rather than the actual 
content of the stress being released.  

Thanks again for your explanation.

Jeff




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[FairfieldLife] Re: infinity to PointS (was the relative)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rory Goff [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, claudiouk [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
  Yes Infinity (= Wholeness = Unmanifest/Absolute = Self) is 
  omnipresent at every Point (= manifest, relative = self). So why 
is 
  the consciosness/Knower remain linked to the habitual point self 
if 
  it is free to be ANY point-self ?
 
 It is all point-selves of oneself, and one can (to whatever 
degree) 
 emerge from the Ocean to experience any specific wave one 
attends 
 to. However, generally it would seem that habit keeps one focussed 
 more or less in the original bodymind if there is no particular 
 need/desire at any given moment to experience/heal other point-
selves 
 or aspects of oneself.

I had to read this many times to understand it:

the first time, I understood it intuitively, perhaps the *sound* and 
construction of it was balanced.

the second time I tried to interpret it in terms of some imagined  
nebulous 'higher state of consciousness'/hidden meaning, and it made 
no sense to me.

the third time, I read it as a simple person, potentially in 
need: 'we keep to ourselves unless we have a need to interact with 
someone else. When we interact with someone else to fulfill our 
need, we will experience them just to the degree that we must, in 
order to fulfill our need.'

the fourth time, I read what was written in terms of unobstructed 
flow of pure consciousness, eliminating the imaginary boundaries 
between the Ocean and the waves, between I and them.

I conclude by enjoying the simplicity of it all, wondering why I 
have once again used a bulldozer to remove a toothpick, and delight 
in the absurdity of it all!

Thank you!




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[FairfieldLife] Re: THE MOST INSPIRING TRUE STORY OF OUR TIME (was: TM University in South Africa)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Llundrub [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 It must really be the most inspiring true story of our time it must 
be it really really must be, because people have copy/pasted it over 
one hundred times now.  

Llun,  Thanks for not erasing it on your post.  I wanted to read it 
again.





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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jeff Fischer 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, t3rinity [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 
  samskara: Impression. The imprint or traces left in the mind 
 after
  an experience, whether in this or previous lives. Root 
impressions,
  especially from profound events, which mold character and guide
  actions. 
 
 t3rinity,
 Thank you.  I was interested in your discussion of this.  
Sanskaras 
 would be equivalent (more or less) with engrams (time of pain and 
 some degree of unconsciousness) in Dianetics; at least 
the heavier 
 imprints.  In Dianetics, one would not have to relive all such 
 imprints to become Clear.  The collapse of the Reactive Bank 
(that 
 portion of the mind that works on a totally stimulus-response 
basis) 
 can occur rather quickly - like even in a session or two, although 
 that would be rare.
 
 If TM dissolves such imprints, one would experience, IMO, the 
emotion 
 that is contained there (eg. anger, fear, apathy).  The difference 
is 
 that in Dianetics, one relives the experience, reexperiencing the 
 emotion but in continuing to relive it, comes up the 
emotional tone 
 scale until he is cheerful about it.  At this point 
the reactive 
 effect of that imprint is gone.  One then operates more under 
one's 
 own volitional control.
 
 According to Dianetics, when something in your environment is 
similar 
 to information stored in the engram, the emotion, unconsciousness 
or 
 pain will be restimulated and will be to some degree reexperienced 
 (dramatized).  As this is usually on the sub conscious level, one 
 picks out something in the current environment to blame the 
 unwanted feelings on.  This is similar to Judy's idea (or MMY's) 
that 
 as the stress is released in TM, one will have a thought that 
 reflects the quality of that imprint, rather than the actual 
 content of the stress being released.  
 
 Thanks again for your explanation.
 
 Jeff

and thanks Jeff, for yours. I enjoy hearing about the Dianetics 
stuff because specific terminology aside, it is a wonderful 
explanation of the psycho-dynamics we engage in with ourselves, 
seeing thoughts and experience in slow mo.




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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Similarely
  in TM the stresses are being released when the thought arises. I
am
  not aware that in indian theory the arising of thought is seen as
  getting rid of Samkaras. I am not saying that it cannot work. I am
  just saying that I am not aware of such a source.
 
 
 MMY never said that anyway. He said that  stress is repaired during 
 the inward stroke of TM, and that thoughts arise as part of the 
 activity of repair.

Yes, of course, Lawson I am familiar with the theory. I did not say
that the arising of thought is the cause of stress release - but
according to TM theory it is an inevitable result of it. That's not
said anywhere in the Indian Samskar theory AFAIK.

You probably mean to point out that in psychotherapy and I think Scn
the re-experiencing of the stress is essential to its dissolution. You
are right when you say this is different in TM. While in TM the
thought is not the cause of stress-release, it still is its inevitable
result. Thus TM differs with PT and Scn. But it still retains some
feature of it, not as cause but as result - you experience the coming
out. I am not aware that this is the same in Yogic theory. Its the
idea of catharsis. Its western. There is purification in Indian yogic
systems, but it doesn't mean there that you have to go through some
aspect of the same experience, neither as cause nor as a result. At
least I am not aware of any such theory. Which doesn't make it false
of course. Just because you choose to apply the term 'Samskara' to
stresses. I don't know if the movement does so. If it does so, anyway
its connecting modern western theories with ancient indian ones. There
can't be doubt about that.


 If there was no repair to be made (no samskaras 
 left), no repair activity occur. The mental experience of the
repair-
 activity during TM is mental activity of some kind.

IOW its the cause. Here in TM theory stress-release is the cause. In
indian theory the samskaras themselves, (and not their release) would
be the cause of any desire or thought activity.

  I don't think that
  it's bad  to get inspired and influenced by other contemporary
  movements. But personaly I wouldn't be too rigit about this
  thought=stressrelease theory. It's helpful, but its also a trap.
You
  get rid of Samskaras in TM. But it's not one to one with the 
 thoughts
  arising IMO. you have to distinguish of a theory being helpful to 
 keep
  a certain process going - as an explanation, to not resist
thoughts 
 or
  force oneself, and it being *literally* true. An elephant has two
  kinds of teeth, two to show and two to chew.
   
 
 I don't see why it can't be literally true, given the proper 
 refinement of definitions in response to physiological research.

Scientific research doesn't speak of samskaras for one thing. It
doesn't speak of enlightenment either. So the idea, that you sort of
have a basket, full of stresses and resistences which you just have to
empty in order to be enlightened is not a scientific one. You always
make the mistake of imaginig some future research and then making
conclusions from there.




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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, t3rinity [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 My
 notes say: (translated from german): 'The quality of the stress
 determines the quality of thought.' 
 
 Then it gives the example I just had given, of the joy causing a
 stress in the past, and how the mind picks up the feeling and
 associates it with the coming of a friend. Whatever it associates it
 with is not important, obviously, it's arbitrary.
 
 My course was in July 1977, Avoriaz. 

I was at the same Avoriaz course and I remember it as you state here.
Do you remember a German guy named Norbert from that course?  It's 
the only German name I remember from the course, although I do 
remember spending an evening with several Germans who were telling me 
that Hitler (as this is not an argument I hope this won't degrade 
my story) was very spiritual in the beginning - People coming up to 
him and giving him flowers, etc.  They were very forceful in there 
arguments, but it was too much for me to buy.

 TM (like scientology) assumes that the stresses are located
 physically. Thats not the same with the samskara theory. 

In Scientology, the stresses (engrams) are not located physically.
When one dramatizes the earlier event, one will reexperience the 
physical pain associated with it.  Got your head chopped in the 
French Revolution (like my dear wife)?  Dramatization of extreme neck 
discomfort until that incident is run out.

Jeff




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[FairfieldLife] Re1: OnWard Christian Soldiers

2005-06-23 Thread Jason Daniel






 -Original Message-From: WLeed3 [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Wed, 22 Jun 2005 19:22:01 -0400Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: OnWard Christian Soldiers

 Thanks for your email re what you  hte no9te says is the talmund . It is NOT so, these are commentaries on the talmud ANOT the talmund which as you know is the 1 st. 5 Booksw of the old testiment. that is the talmund. I checked 5 references 2 are wholy incorrect  one is a possible mis translation of Mamondies work while another 2 are not found in the text or reference cite. thus very poor scholarship. I decided after this most cusory research to stop there  alert you to its un scholarly mature  bias. ... are you still employed there I am now in Buffalo  will NOt soon return there.

From: anonymousff" [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: OnWard Christian Soldiers

 Islamic hateful anti-Semitic lies. what's new.
 http://www.missionislam.com/nwo/talmud.htm

Hari Om,
ThankYou very much for alerting me about the Error-filled nature of the Web-Site. My understanding of Judaism is very little.

With, Jai Guru Dev,

 Jason

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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, t3rinity [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 wrote:
 .Let's say you expect a friend to come, and you will
   associate the *feeling* with the present event. But the feeling
 will
   be reminescent of the stress being released according to 2nd day
   checking.
  
  I remember we were told it *might* pick up the
  feeling, but it might not.  
 
 At your initiation, 2nd day checking? I must tell you that whatever
 you are being told is paraphrased. The teacher uses his own words. 
My
 notes say: (translated from german): 'The quality of the stress
 determines the quality of thought.' 
 
 Then it gives the example I just had given, of the joy causing a
 stress in the past, and how the mind picks up the feeling and
 associates it with the coming of a friend. Whatever it associates it
 with is not important, obviously, it's arbitrary.
 
 My course was in July 1977, Avoriaz. I have been to an update 1981,
 redoing all the tests. There was no change.
 
  This would have been
  in 1975; I wonder if it was changed since your
  TTC.
  
  snip
   Yes, understood. But in Indian terms, getting rid of Samskaras
   wouldn't necessitate reliving the energy of it. In Indian and I 
  guess
   Buddhist terms, Samskaras are desires or latent impressions 
giving
   rise to the desire to reincarnate. Purifying oneself of these 
  desires
   or impressions wouldn't necessitate living through it, not even
   emotionally or energetically.
  
  Well, but that's pretty much what I remember
  being told in the TM context.
 
 You mean that you don't have to live through it? Yes and no. 
Obviously
 the feelings you have are not stressed in TM. The problem here is 
that
 TM (like scientology) assumes that the stresses are located
 physically. Thats not the same with the samskara theory. Therefore 
it
 assumes that you have to release them one by one, resulting in an
 appropriate experience.

My recollection is that more than one stress can be associated with 
more than one thought/feeling/etc.

 You sort of will experience them on their way
 out. I don't know if this can be said of Samskaras, I think not.
 

MMY came up with the theory to explain stress release during the 
rest of TM. Some other enlightenment program may or may not involve 
stress release, eh?

  Not sure what you mean by phantastic,
 
 I mean it positive. It serves its purpose towards our attitude 
towards
 thoughts in meditation. It gives you motivation to continue and a
 sense of progress, even if you have no special experiences. Thats
 positive, as perseverance in practise is looked upon as essential in
 all traditions.
 
   but I
  don't see how the TM model precludes instant
  enlightenment.  
 
 I didn't say it precludes instant enlightenment. I'd rather say it
 excludes it. TM people will not easily accept that it is possible to
 get enlightened, simply by making an innner recognition. The idea is
 always you have to release all the stresses one by one, and unless 
you
 do that you can't be enlightened.
 
  I never thought it did.  There's
  more than one way to skin a cat.
 
 Of course. There are different ways and they aren't mutually 
exclusive
 either.





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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jeff Fischer
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 In Dianetics, one would not have to relive all such 
 imprints to become Clear.  The collapse of the Reactive Bank
(that 
 portion of the mind that works on a totally stimulus-response
basis) 
 can occur rather quickly - like even in a session or two, although 
 that would be rare.

Interesting. Thank you for the correction. makes a lot of sense.

 If TM dissolves such imprints, one would experience, IMO, the
emotion 
 that is contained there (eg. anger, fear, apathy).  The difference
is 
 that in Dianetics, one relives the experience, reexperiencing the 
 emotion but in continuing to relive it, comes up the emotional
tone 
 scale until he is cheerful about it.  

I guess in not being overshadowed by the experience, i.e. just being
the witness?

 At this point the reactive 
 effect of that imprint is gone.  One then operates more under one's 
 own volitional control.
 
 According to Dianetics, when something in your environment is
similar 
 to information stored in the engram, the emotion, unconsciousness
or 
 pain will be restimulated and will be to some degree reexperienced 
 (dramatized).  As this is usually on the sub conscious level, one 
 picks out something in the current environment to blame the 
 unwanted feelings on.  This is similar to Judy's idea (or MMY's)
that 
 as the stress is released in TM, one will have a thought that 
 reflects the quality of that imprint, rather than the actual 
 content of the stress being released.  

Thank you too, Jeff, this is what I was trying to say. I think now
everybody can see the similarities of both explanations. Now the
question is: whos was first? My guess is that scientology was first,
and MMY used that model, adapting it for his own purpose of Mantra
Meditation. It didn't change the meditation, but it changed how we see
it, and how we see our own progress. It's one of the puzzles showing
how MMY was trying to rid TM from its own religious heritage, or
rather transport it into a new terminology. IMO the 2nd day checking
explanation plus the prep lecture are the backbone of the TM ideology.




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Re: [FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)






Samsaras are anything that revolves like a wheel 
lifting one up and then casting one down. All of life is like this. All 
our emotions are like this. You cannot dig out hatred because it is a natural 
emotion. You cannot dig out any emotion, or get rid of anything because if 
you're alive then you will be pulled up at times and thrust down at other times. 
Therefore the only way to make life free from this is to just get with it and 
not worry about it. The first step is to not be so attached and adverse that one 
creates shock upon being lifted or cast. By acceptance one can experience less 
aftershocks from the original experience. 

It is proven that quick administering of a pain killer 
during pain makes a wound heal faster because of rebound shock from the pain 
itself. So also life in general. A quick antidote timely administered lessens 
the shocks of samsara. This was the whole point of self pulse diagnosis 
for those who remember. 

The next way is by providing mind training to 
understand the nature of the wheel. Understanding brings wisdom and 
lessens the shocks as well. 

Then furthermore one must understand the wheel itself 
and come to love it for what it is. This bhakti further lessens the wheel when 
it rolls over you. 

Finally one must add some new treads and maybe hip 20 
inch chrome revolviing hubs and flash that bling. Then the wheel is a statement 
of joy, bounce bounce. 

Of course if one wants to get off the wheel it's as 
simple as knowing the unchanging nature of oneself as the pure consciousness and 
knowing it beyond a doubt so that when one dies they have no desire again for 
diversity, because after death so they say, the thoughts are more powerful not 
having to go through all sorts of manifestation and so what one desires then one 
gets really fast-like. Desire for dick leads to being a woman, and desire for 
twat leads to being a man, again, yet again. Although lines are getting a 
bit more confused. After all one gets a twat like Ann Coulter and then what, 
they decide they hate pussy after all and choose the dick instead and then 
ah never mind

So that's why tempering the mind with the bliss of the 
absolute is so important when in the body. So that after the body the mind is 
safe.

It's not like one gets rid of samasaras, until the 
final moments of liberation when they become sealed by the very deities who have 
been having them in ones mind stream. When you start seeing the deva then that 
means your mind stream has become of the nature of the upholding clear light of 
awareness enough to see the very sources of the pulls which bind one. Until one 
has sealed the various mandala of experience with the very deities which are the 
purified forms of things as they are one will still be under the wheel. Unless 
one has great control and can just say no in the bardo. But that ain't' gonna 
happen because in the bardo moreso than in real life your own karma will tempt 
you more than ever before. 

Ta

Dedicated too those chickens who fucked up in the bardo 
and are fast becoming fajitas. May they be liberated this time 
around.


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[FairfieldLife] The Bush Formula Revealed...






It has become evident what the "Bush Formula is: basically based in 'Divide and Rule'.

Bush was quoted as saying on Fox news(6/22) that Mr. Bush in his autobiography said that, 

"For big change to occur, you need a big crisis, says President Bush"

For this Karl Rove defines: "conservative or liberal values" , and sets one against the other; in order to 'divide' the nation...

Then Mr. Bush"inherits" a create a "Crisis" onwhich he perpetually refers;

So, first and second define liberal and conservative to divide, and then, thirdly somehow "shock and awe" the population, on TV, to scare the pants out of them, creating a crisis...

It did make for grand TV in CNN and such, although that attitude now, does seem to be weakening, due to pictures of the horror of war...

As Mr. Lincoln also said, " You can fool some of the people some of the time; But not all of the people all of the time"...

Robert Gimbel Seattle, WA.

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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: THE MOST INSPIRING TRUE STORY OF OUR TIME (was: TM University in South Africa)






The best jokes are told over and over. The greatest 
patches of bullshit build institutions around themselves because they can't be 
hidden.


- Original Message - 
From: Jeff 
Fischer 
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 

Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2005 1:22 PM
Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: THE MOST INSPIRING TRUE STORY OF OUR 
TIME (was: TM University in South Africa)
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, 
"Llundrub" [EMAIL PROTECTED]... wrote: 
It must really be the most inspiring true story of our time it must be it 
really really must be, because people have copy/pasted it over one hundred 
times now. Llun, Thanks for not erasing it on your 
post. I wanted to read it again.To 
subscribe, send a message to:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Or 
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click 'Join This Group!' 



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[FairfieldLife] Supreme Court rules cities may seize private homes


A divided Supreme Court ruled Thursday that local governments may seize
people's homes and businesses against their will for private development
in a decision anxiously awaited in communities where economic growth  
often
is at war with individual property rights.

The 5-4 ruling - assailed by dissenting Justice Sandra Day O'Connor as
handing 'disproportionate influence and power' to the well-heeled in
America - was a defeat for Connecticut residents whose homes are slated
for destruction to make room for an office complex. They had argued that
cities have no right to take their land except for projects with a clear
public use, such as roads or schools, or to revitalize blighted areas.

As a result, cities now have wide power to bulldoze residences for
projects such as shopping malls and hotel complexes in order to generate
tax revenue.

Full story at:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050623/ap_on_go_su_co/ 
scotus_seizing_property;_ylt=AlbnB1cctDhK0N9qvqSYiu2s0NUE; 
_ylu=X3oDMTA3b2NibDltBHNlYwM3MTY-



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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, t3rinity [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 I guess in not being overshadowed by the experience, i.e. just being
 the witness?
 
 In a sense, yes.  A goal of Scientology is to be stably exterior 
which would be the equivalent of witnessing 24/7.  As you continue to 
go over the experience you go up the tone scale (EG below)

   Enthusiasm
   Cheerful
   Boredom
   Antagonism
   Anger
   Fear
   Grief
   Apathy

As you go up the scale, you are gradiently becoming more exterior 
to the event until you are looking at it (witnessing) instead of 
being in it.  That's how the auditor knows when you're done with it.

Jeff




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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

  The problem here is  that
  TM (like scientology) assumes that the stresses are located
  physically. Thats not the same with the samskara theory.
Therefore 
 it
  assumes that you have to release them one by one, resulting in an
  appropriate experience.
 
 My recollection is that more than one stress can be associated with 
 more than one thought/feeling/etc.

More than one with more than one? This could be one to one ;-) You
mean one stress could be associated/release through many thoughts, and
by the very same thoughts, other different stresses could be released
as well? Makes a smoke screen ;-) Well, whatever, it doesn't change
the essentials of it, that is quality of stress releases = quality of
thought experienced. Thats the equation, ther is no way around it.
 
  You sort of will experience them on their way
  out. I don't know if this can be said of Samskaras, I think not.
  
 
 MMY came up with the theory to explain stress release during the 
 rest of TM. Some other enlightenment program may or may not involve 
 stress release, eh?

Sorry, it was you who defined stresses as Samskaras. All indian
enlightenment programs are about ridding oneself from Samskaras. Or do
you mean there are stresses that are Samskaras and some that aren't?
Which way, Lawson?




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[FairfieldLife] Is it Paradoxical.??

2005-06-23 Thread Jason Daniel






Hari Om,
 I do not understand, why should Swami Muktananda take out his flacid penis and put it into his devotee's Pussy.??

 I can understand the logic if his Cock was erect. Why should he repeat to himself, "No sex" "No sex".??

 Someone in this groupquoted Maharishi thatifone hassome personality kinks and one attains CC, he is struck with that kink.??

With, Jai Guru Dev,

 Jason

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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

Like it.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Llundrub [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Samsaras are anything that revolves like a wheel lifting one up and
then casting one down.  All of life is like this. All our emotions are
like this. You cannot dig out hatred because it is a natural emotion.
You cannot dig out any emotion, or get rid of anything because if
you're alive then you will be pulled up at times and thrust down at
other times. Therefore the only way to make life free from this is to
just get with it and not worry about it. The first step is to not be
so attached and adverse that one creates shock upon being lifted or
cast. By acceptance one can experience less aftershocks from the
original experience.  

Minor point here: you are aware of a slight difference in spelling
Samsara and Samskara? Yes I'm sure you are.




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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jeff Fischer
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, t3rinity [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  
  I guess in not being overshadowed by the experience, i.e. just being
  the witness?
  
  In a sense, yes.  A goal of Scientology is to be stably exterior 
 which would be the equivalent of witnessing 24/7.  As you continue to 
 go over the experience you go up the tone scale (EG below)
 
Enthusiasm
Cheerful
Boredom
Antagonism
Anger
Fear
Grief
Apathy
 
 As you go up the scale, you are gradiently becoming more exterior 
 to the event until you are looking at it (witnessing) instead of 
 being in it.  That's how the auditor knows when you're done with it.

Interesting. Would be something like 'steps of progress, through
fulfillment of desire' in TM.




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[FairfieldLife] Re: Re1: OnWard Christian Soldiers

2005-06-23 Thread authfriend

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jason Daniel [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

   -Original Message-
 From: WLeed3 [EMAIL PROTECTED]  
 To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Wed, 22 Jun 2005 19:22:01 -0400
 Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: OnWard Christian Soldiers

   Thanks for your email  re what you  hte no9te says is the
 talmund . It is NOT so, these are commentaries on the talmud ANOT 
 the talmund which as you know is the 1 st. 5 Booksw of the old 
 testiment. that is the talmund.

The first five books of the Hebrew Scriptures (the
Old Testament) are the Torah (or Tanakh), NOT the
Talmud.

The Talmud comprises the Mishnah, a record of
oral rabbinical discussions on the practical
application of the Torah (written down around 200
A.D.), and the Gemarra, which is later commentary
on the Mishnah.

snip  
 From: anonymousff [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
 Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: OnWard Christian Soldiers

   Islamic hateful anti-Semitic lies. what's new.

   http://www.missionislam.com/nwo/talmud.htm

  Hari Om,
 ThankYou very much for alerting me about the Error-
 filled nature of the Web-Site. My understanding of Judaism is very 
 little.

Note the correction to WLeed3's post above.

Anonymousff is correct.  This is a hate site, not
a source of information about Judaism (though it's
a good source of information about the haters who
put it up).

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Is it Paradoxical.??

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jason Daniel [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
  
  Hari Om,
  I do not understand, why should Swami Muktananda take
out his flacid penis and put it into his devotee's Pussy.??

Because its written in the Rig Veda.




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Re: [FairfieldLife] Is it Paradoxical.??






Well, Muktinanda proves one thing. He gave great 
shaktipat. 


- Original Message - 
From: Jason Daniel 

To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 

Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2005 2:10 PM
Subject: [FairfieldLife] Is it Paradoxical.??



Hari 
Om,
 I do not understand, why should Swami 
Muktananda take out his flacid penis and put it into his devotee's 
Pussy.??

 I can 
understand the logic if his Cock was erect. Why should he repeat to himself, 
"No sex" "No 
sex".??

 Someone 
in this groupquoted Maharishi 
thatifone hassome personality kinks and one attains CC, he is 
struck with that kink.??

With, 
Jai Guru Dev,

 
Jason

--


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[FairfieldLife] Interesting allusion to Rgveda in the Giitaa?

2005-06-23 Thread cardemaister

XIII 13 (12?)

jñeyam yat tat pravakSyaami
yaj jñaatvaa'mRtam ashnute
anaadimat paraM brahma
*na sat tan naasad ucyate* (na; sat; tat; na; asat; ucyate)

Ramanand Prasad's translation:

I shall fully describe the object of knowledge, knowing which one 
attains immortality. The beginningless Supreme Brahman is said to be 
neither Sat nor Asat. (See also 9.19) (13.12)

Svami Prabhupaada's translation (somewhat biased, IMO):

I shall now explain the knowable, knowing which you will taste the 
eternal. This is beginningless, and it is subordinate to Me. It is 
called Brahman, the spirit, and it lies beyond the cause and effect 
of this material world.


Rgveda X 129, 1 (first line)

naasadaasinno sadaasiittadaaniim
(without sandhi:
na; asat; aasiit; na_u; sat; aasiit; tadaaniim)

A.A.Macdonell's translation:

There was not the non-existent 
nor the existent then.(before tha Big Bang thang?)

If anyone's interested I might try to explain
why Svami's translation is IMO somewhat biased.






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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

 - Original Message - 
 From: t3rinity 
 To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
 Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2005 2:13 PM
 Subject: [FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing 
techniques)
 
 
 Like it.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Llundrub [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Oh shit, aren't you the guy who hates everything I say? Now what am 
I gonna do?

especially if he loves to hate everything you say...






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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jim_flanegin [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 and thanks Jeff, for yours. I enjoy hearing about the Dianetics 
 stuff because specific terminology aside, it is a wonderful 
 explanation of the psycho-dynamics we engage in with ourselves, 
 seeing thoughts and experience in slow mo.

My thanks as well.  You explain Scientology very clearly
and with feeling.  The feeling comes through.

Unc






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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 
 My thanks as well.  You explain Scientology very clearly
 and with feeling.  The feeling comes through.
 
 Unc

Aw shucks, Unc




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[FairfieldLife] Re: infinity to PointS (was the relative)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rory Goff [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jim_flanegin 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
  I had to read this many times to understand it:
  
  the first time, I understood it intuitively, perhaps the *sound* 
 and construction of it was balanced.
  
  the second time I tried to interpret it in terms of some 
imagined  
  nebulous 'higher state of consciousness'/hidden meaning, and it 
 made no sense to me.
  
  the third time, I read it as a simple person, potentially in 
  need: 'we keep to ourselves unless we have a need to interact 
with 
  someone else. When we interact with someone else to fulfill our 
  need, we will experience them just to the degree that we must, 
in 
  order to fulfill our need.'
  
  the fourth time, I read what was written in terms of 
unobstructed 
  flow of pure consciousness, eliminating the imaginary boundaries 
  between the Ocean and the waves, between I and them.
  
  I conclude by enjoying the simplicity of it all, wondering why I 
  have once again used a bulldozer to remove a toothpick, and 
 delight 
  in the absurdity of it all!
  
  Thank you!
 
 LOL Thanks, Jim. I was wondering why that point-self gobbledygook 
 came out the way it did. You really made a very nice cake out of 
my 
 pile of pig-dung! Always nice to be appreciated from every angle! 
 Yours always, :-) :-) :-D

pile of pig-dung? Which way is the wind blowing in Fairfield?





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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jeff Fischer
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, t3rinity [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  My
  notes say: (translated from german): 'The quality of the stress
  determines the quality of thought.' 
  
  Then it gives the example I just had given, of the joy causing a
  stress in the past, and how the mind picks up the feeling and
  associates it with the coming of a friend. Whatever it associates it
  with is not important, obviously, it's arbitrary.
  
  My course was in July 1977, Avoriaz. 
 
 I was at the same Avoriaz course and I remember it as you state here.
 Do you remember a German guy named Norbert from that course?  

Yes, Norbert Weiss from cologne. He was quite a character. He went to
International later, and did some Sidha-land activity in Macau. He was
quite close to MMY at one point, but was also frequently outgoing at
that time. When the Purusha project came along, he wanted to join it,
bt MMY explained to him that it wasn't necessary for him. He went back
to Cologne and then I lost contact.

 It's 
 the only German name I remember from the course, although I do 
 remember spending an evening with several Germans who were telling me 
 that Hitler (as this is not an argument I hope this won't degrade 
 my story) was very spiritual in the beginning - People coming up to 
 him and giving him flowers, etc.  

Yes this was Norbert.  He was a big fan of an initiator who imagined
himself having been  Ernst Röhm, chief of the SA who was executed by
Hitler later on.

 They were very forceful in there 
 arguments, but it was too much for me to buy.

Sure. He had all these weird theories. But he was very forceful, sort
of a leader type. We were friends and hanging out a lot together. We
were also at phase one together. We laughed a lot together. We also
had one TM teacher we both adored, who was essential for our initial
TM experience. He first was in Cologne and then went to Nuremberg
where I am from.

  TM (like scientology) assumes that the stresses are located
  physically. Thats not the same with the samskara theory. 
 
 In Scientology, the stresses (engrams) are not located physically.
 When one dramatizes the earlier event, one will reexperience the 
 physical pain associated with it.  Got your head chopped in the 
 French Revolution (like my dear wife)?  Dramatization of extreme neck 
 discomfort until that incident is run out.

I see, thank you.




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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jeff Fischer 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 In Scientology, the stresses (engrams) are not located physically.
 When one dramatizes the earlier event, one will reexperience the 
 physical pain associated with it.  Got your head chopped in the 
 French Revolution (like my dear wife)?  Dramatization of extreme 
neck 
 discomfort until that incident is run out.

One reason I'm here doing research for a historical
novel about the Cathars is that I have memories of
having been there, done that.  Some of the memories
have to do with being on the losing end of a disa-
greement with the Inquisition, and winding up in
the torture chambers of the Papal Palace in Avignon.

I think I'm gonna pass on auditing for a while...I've
got all the drama in my life I can handle...  :-)

Unc






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Maharishi Vedic Scholars/pandits

2005-06-23 Thread Alex Stanley

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  Dear Friends,
  
  I wanted to let everyone know who has been supporting the Vedic 
  Scholar project this past year that the Vedic Scholars will be 
  coming immediately!
 
 All I can say is that I certainly hope so.  And I 
 honestly hope that it has exactly the effect on
 planet Earth that Maharishi predicts.  But I'm
 tellin' you...if Vedic America talks the way that 
 Raja Wynne does, I'm on the first consumer 
 spaceflight offa this rock.  :-)

You could probably save a lot of money by catching the next flight
from a submerged Russian submarine in the Barents Sea.

Alex




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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jeff Fischer 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, t3rinity [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
  
  I guess in not being overshadowed by the experience, i.e. just 
  being the witness?
 
  In a sense, yes.  A goal of Scientology is to be stably exterior 
 which would be the equivalent of witnessing 24/7.  As you continue 
 to go over the experience you go up the tone scale (EG below)
 
Enthusiasm
Cheerful
Boredom
Antagonism
Anger
Fear
Grief
Apathy
 
 As you go up the scale, you are gradiently becoming more exterior 
 to the event until you are looking at it (witnessing) instead of 
 being in it.  That's how the auditor knows when you're done with 
 it.

Very nicely said.  You're good at this, Jeff.  Do you
get a chance to perform auditing yourself, or other-
wise teach within the organization?

Unc







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Is it Paradoxical.??

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Llundrub [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Well, Muktinanda proves one thing. He gave great shaktipat. 

Now that's funny, Llun. 

And I'm down with this.  I've always had kind of a 
giggly reaction to that word, shaktipat.  It always
sounded to me like the name of some Newage Tantric 
Massage technique.  :-)

Unc






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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jeff Fischer 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
  
  My thanks as well.  You explain Scientology very clearly
  and with feeling.  The feeling comes through.
 
 Aw shucks, Unc

I'm just saying it because IMO it's good to get 
feedback on that sorta thing from time to time.
Being able to express one's dharma in writing in
a way that reaches people intellectually is one 
thing.  Being able to express one's dharma in 
writing in a way that enables the reader to
*feel* that dharma is something else.  You have
that something else.

Unc







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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, t3rinity [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Llundrub [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
  Oh shit, aren't you the guy who hates everything I say? Now what am
 I gonna do?
 
 Nothing.

And with style.  Makes all the difference.  :-)








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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

2005-06-23 Thread lurkernomore20002000

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, t3rinity [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
snip

  Do you remember a German guy named Norbert from that course?  
 
 Yes, Norbert Weiss from cologne. He was quite a character

Do you know Walter Schemper.  Was on Vittel TTC around '75 or'76.  
Blondish Hair, Blue Eyes.  Very German, or maybe he was Austrian.  
Kinda of a star among the German contingent on that course.

lurk





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Is it Paradoxical.??

2005-06-23 Thread lurkernomore20002000

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Llundrub [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
  Well, Muktinanda proves one thing. He gave great shaktipat. 
 
 Now that's funny, Llun. 
 
 And I'm down with this.  I've always had kind of a 
 giggly reaction to that word, shaktipat.  It always
 sounded to me like the name of some Newage Tantric 
 Massage technique.  :-)
 
 Unc

Okay, while we're at it.  I've been lurking a little at alt.med.  
Doesn't Willytex sound like a carpet fiber from Dupont?

lurk




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[FairfieldLife] Re: Is it Paradoxical.??

  And I'm down with this.  I've always had kind of a 
  giggly reaction to that word, shaktipat.  It always
  sounded to me like the name of some Newage Tantric 
  Massage technique.  :-)
 
 Okay, while we're at it.  I've been lurking a little at alt.med.  
 Doesn't Willytex sound like a carpet fiber from Dupont?

I love the guy during the rare times when I can get
him to talk about something he really likes, like
ZZ Top, but I have to admit that some of his posts
sound like he's been *smoking* carpet fibers from
Dupont.  :-)

Unc






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Supreme Court rules cities may seize private homes

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 A divided Supreme Court ruled Thursday that local governments may 
seize
 people's homes and businesses against their will for private 
development
 in a decision anxiously awaited in communities where economic 
growth  
 often
 is at war with individual property rights.
 
snip 
As a result, cities now have wide power to bulldoze residences for
 projects such as shopping malls and hotel complexes in order to 
generate
 tax revenue.
 
Yep, I'm noticing too that oil has hit $60 bbl., Bush is calling for 
more nuclear plants, and the Iraq war and mideast tension is 
escalating, just this week!?

seems like those in power are grabbing for more and more, a tipping 
point is being reached. A fascinating drama- too close to call. 




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[FairfieldLife] Re: infinity to PointS (was the relative)

2005-06-23 Thread claudiouk

Both of these descriptions, which seem to be based on personal 
experiences, are very inspiring and reassuring. There is certainly an 
element there of non-attachment to the ego-point and a genuine 
sensitivity to other point-selves, whether or not the transcendental 
Knower in these examples can actually view the world as if from 
inside other person's nervous system, but that was just a theoretical 
interest. 

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Robert Gimbel 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 ---Also, in rising to GC the inner knower begins to feel expanding 
 love, or whatever you want to call it; but a feeling of flow from 
 infinity inside to any point outside. This relates to omniscience 
in 
 that the flow of this inner field of awareness, spontaneously, 
knows 
 or is drawn to the particular point of interest. 
 Really in any situation of lack; it is lack of love, lack of 
 passion, and now, when pure consiousness is established, and all 
ego 
 based fear dissolved, there's nothing left to do, but watch the 
 absolute move...
 
 
  In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Robert Gimbel 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
  -Before enlightenment, the world we perceive is of, by and for 
 the 
  ego. Everything is seen and translated in terms of this point, 
 this 
  sense of me(the ego). 
  After enlightenment is acheived one steps out of identifying with 
  this point, this sense of me(the ego). 
One is no longer indentified with a point, this tiny sense of me
  (the ego), but becomes identified with the origin of any point in 
  pure awareness, the Absolute.
  One can become aware of any point,any side of any issue; no 
longer 
  guided by a single perspective(ego based), totally limiting 
view...
  So, the next step is allowing the pure consciousness to flow 
 within 
  itself to the point, then to the next point, all point guided 
now, 
  not by ego, but by pure intelligence. Any problem is seen as 
 just 
  energy, which needs balance and recieves balance spontaneously, 
 from 
  point to point. 
  In other words, an enlightened person, detatched perceives from 
 the 
  state of being, and in that silence, brings forth the opposite 
  energy to perfectly balance, thereby always, percieving the 
Unity, 
  in diversity; as being established in pure consiousness, silence, 
  always provides the Unifying factor, always...
  
  





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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, t3rinity [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 He first was in Cologne and then went to Nuremberg
 where I am from.

Thanks for the update.  Your English is incredibly gut.
I studied German in gymnasium (FisCher) but all I really rememeber is 
Noch zwei, bitte when I wanted to order bier for my friend and I.  I 
was in Switzerland (mein unkle has lived there about 40 years), 
Germany and Italy in Jan '72.  I got a horrible chest cold in Munchen 
(how do you make the : roll over?) and my friend and I went to a 
spa.  The sauna was coed with some beautiful, naked women.  I 
got overheated and wanted to leave but my friend couldn't bear to 
miss it (Irishman, of course).  They had just built the subway there 
for the upcoming Olympics.  Being from New York, I couldn't believe 
how CLEAN it was.
It didn't look real.  The gravel was pristine, I kept staring at it 
through the glass like it was a museum.

The subways were different, as you were supposed to get a ticket 
date/time stamped when you went in, but as no one seemed to be 
checking, we started to ride for free.  On our last trip I had one 
last valid ticket and used it, but my friend didn't.  On the ride we 
befriended a Turkish guy who spoke some English.  As we were leaving 
he spotted a guy checking tickets.  He was a real old guy with what 
looked like a WWII uniform.  We tried to slip through but he grabbed 
my friend and me and the Turkish guy were pulling on one arm while 
the subway guard was screaming in German, tugging on the other.
Finally, we broke him free and ran like hell.  God, it makes me laugh.

In Dusseldorf (need another rolling :), we went to a party and the 
host, when informed we were Americans said, Well, How the Hell are 
ya'll in the best Texas drawl I'd ever heard.  Turns out he'd been 
an exchange student in some small Texas town.  One day he was walking 
down the street with a 6 pack of beer in a bag and a Texas Ranger 
stopped him:  What ya'll got in the bag, boy?  He got hauled in as 
he was underage to drink.  He had a bunch of German ID's in his 
wallet.  He pulled them out and said Officer, my father is the 
diplomatic attache to the German representative to the United Nations
and showed him the German ID's.  I just tell you this as it appears 
you want to arrest me and as I have shown you I have Diplomatic 
Immunity, I just don't want you to get in any trouble. 
Well the guy looks at the ID's and looks at the kid who's keeping a 
straight face like a champ.  Uh, well, OK he said.  Get out of 
here.  But what about my beer? the kid asks.  Oh, hell just take 
the beer and GET THE HELL OUT OF HEEH.  Always wished I could have 
balls like that.

Jeff





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[FairfieldLife] Karl Rove/Cunning Master of Division...'










Karl Rove is a master of the old principle "Divide and Conquer".

He's a master at framing any topic in terms of "Conservative and Liberal".

Think of how numb we are, that every issue is defined red or blue?

Are we all really that black and white?

Or just sleep walking;

Easily manipulated by fear and divisiveness?

R. Gimbel Seattle, WA.__Do You Yahoo!?Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com 


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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Very nicely said.  You're good at this, Jeff.  Do you
 get a chance to perform auditing yourself, or other-
 wise teach within the organization?
 
 Unc

Thanks.  Yes, I'm an auditor and lecturer.  I deal mostly with people 
for whom it is all brand new.

Jeff




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Re: [FairfieldLife] Interesting allusion to Rgveda in the Giitaa?

2005-06-23 Thread WLeed3






Yes no reply elucidate far more thanks re the thought of you  
the Gita.


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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

  Very nicely said.  You're good at this, Jeff.  Do you
  get a chance to perform auditing yourself, or other-
  wise teach within the organization?
 
 Thanks.  Yes, I'm an auditor and lecturer.  I deal mostly with 
people 
 for whom it is all brand new.

Cool.  Back in the TM world, I used to like doing intro
lectures.  I wound up giving a lot of advanced lectures
at centers and residence courses, but to be honest the
best thing I liked about them was not the prepared spiel
but the QA.  I liked that process of being thrown a 
question I had no canned answer for, and having an answer
come out anyway, distilled from 20 different things I'd
heard in 20 different situations but had never pulled
together before, and intuiting that it was an *OK* 
answser.  Real magic.

Unc






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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Re1: OnWard Christian Soldiers

2005-06-23 Thread WLeed3






Yes a definite hate cite. Probably an Islamic one . I am sorry to say 
or suggest.


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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 
 I'm just saying it because IMO it's good to get 
 feedback on that sorta thing from time to time.
 Being able to express one's dharma in writing in
 a way that reaches people intellectually is one 
 thing.  Being able to express one's dharma in 
 writing in a way that enables the reader to
 *feel* that dharma is something else.  You have
 that something else.
 
 Unc

Nice of you to say.  At times that intensity has gotten me in to 
trouble, but I do feel passionately about helping others.  
Scientology has helped me to see the other guys point of view better 
and grant him beingness.  

When I first got in to TM I was such a zealot that my friends would 
start to roll their eyes whenever I came around.  I finally got it 
and stopped taliking about it.  Yet, after a full year of consciously 
not mentioning one word about TM to my family, I overheard my mother 
tell a friend on the phone Yeah, that's ALL Jeff ever talks about:  
TM!  So maybe what you say is right.  I exude whatever I believe in.

Jeff :-) 





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Is it Paradoxical.??

 
 Okay, while we're at it.  I've been lurking a little at alt.med.  
 Doesn't Willytex sound like a carpet fiber from Dupont?
 
 lurk

Yeah.  Or Willie Nelson's kid.  Or guitar.




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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jeff Fischer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 When I first got in to TM I was such a zealot that my friends would 
 start to roll their eyes whenever I came around.  I finally got it 
 and stopped taliking about it.  Yet, after a full year of consciously 
 not mentioning one word about TM to my family, I overheard my mother 
 tell a friend on the phone Yeah, that's ALL Jeff ever talks about:  
 TM!  So maybe what you say is right.  I exude whatever I believe in.

There's an old New Yorker cartoon that I loved.
It's at a typical NY cocktail party, two people
in the foreground are talking to each other.  
Across the room is a guy with a kind of beatific
smile on his face and no one around him.  One of
the guys in the foreground is saying to the other,
Avoid that guy.  He's just read a book that 
changed his life.  :-)

Unc






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[FairfieldLife] A Sense of Sangha (was Re: balancing techniques)