Re: [IceHorses] Tosca - short question/long answer
I guess I'd like to ask Nancy what she sees in these videos. Well - there's a question I have been pondering myself. And my answer really doesn't have much to do with the photos. Tosca seems to have about the range of gaits that Hunter has, which works really well for what I do. We purchased two mares. Tosca, who tends to be a bit lazy, was purchased for Stephanie to use as a therapy horse. She would mainly be led at the walk with a shifting load on her back. Tosca took one look at Stepanie and recognized her job - on the ground. Yrsa was an impulse purchase. I took one look at her sweet little face, wanted Tosca to travel with a friend, just wanted her to bring her home. She seems more energetic, gaits at liberty and melts my heart. I don't care what she is good (or not good at). What concerns me is that Tosca can be a little grumpy - bucked when we put Stephanie up on her. She uses her ears very expressively. She really sat down on the cross ties when a cat jumped out in front of her and then threw herself sideways into a bucket which rolled over and clattered around. Her reaction was not at all out of line, but it is out of line for Stephanie.. So ... what I'm thinking is that we might switch or at least let both mares try out the therapy horse role. Tosca is 13.3 and very sturdy. She could easily carry me. The laziness might go away with fitness or a saddle that fits her better. Yrsa is smaller, sweeter, calmer, but doesn't have a bond with Stephanie. I'm open to suggestions. What I was hoping for was a quiet lead line horse for a disabled rider and a nice trail horse for a crazed endurance rider. That's a joke, but I know it's the perception some have of endurance. I was actually thinking slow limited distance, that's 25 miles over a six hour period. I also like a horse that is well enough trained to do some arena work when the trails are too wet to use. Nancy
[IceHorses] Re: Whisper Personality Profile/Robyn
--- susan cooper [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Robyn, Attached are 3 pics of Whisper I just took. Robyn, did you get a chance to look at these pics? Susan in NV Nevermore Ranch http://users.oasisol.com/nevermore/ Disclaimer CAUTION: DO NOT DRIVE WITH HOT COFFEE IN YOUR LAP Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page. http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
RE: [IceHorses] O/T - Seniors faclitiy was Does this match?
--- Robyn Hood [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It should never be a punishment but can be a great security space if used correctly and depending on the dog. Our dogs used to love their crates. It was also the safe zone. If they were in trouble for any reason, if they got to their crate, they were safe and could not be touched or scolded when they were in there. They also got fed in their crates. Susan in NV Nevermore Ranch http://users.oasisol.com/nevermore/ Disclaimer CAUTION: DO NOT DRIVE WITH HOT COFFEE IN YOUR LAP Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
Re: [IceHorses] bad hair day
On Dec 26, 2007 9:35 PM, Bia [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: looks like a good hair day to me... Bia LOL--poor Gat was so patient while I braided her thick mane. I knew it was, in her opinion, a bad hair day cuz when I took them out she looked so relieved! V
RE: [IceHorses] Re: Tosca - what gaits?
as well as a second (same) video that has some notes on it (this site takes a few seconds to connect). I guess I'd like to ask Nancy what she sees in these videos, as relates to her expectation for Tosca's future job(s)? I realize - and appreciate - that you (Nancy) commented on this only being her 18th ride.She looks good to me, but I wondered about your take on her progress under saddle. Did you have preconceptions about what gaits she might do? I'm particularly interested in your thoughts since, like me, you have a mixed bag of three-gaited and soft-gaited horse experience...and also, of course, because we start some young horses here. Karen Thomas, NC No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.17.9/1198 - Release Date: 12/26/2007 5:26 PM
[IceHorses] Re: horse article
but as my autistic friend would say anybody who thinks thats good riding needs their eyeballs fixed. Janice-- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] Goofing off
On Dec 27, 2007 7:47 AM, Denise Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: No, they don't usually ride this way but got into the kid mode and before I knew it, Dakota was doing his thng. Cute. These would be cute Xmas cards. They grow up so quick that you probably can't use them next year. -- Anna Southern Ohio
[IceHorses] Re: horse article
the photo caption says the tolt is a very comfortable gait for the rider. ZIt should say maybe it puts them in a reclining trance. i am on a roll, i'm sorry. My tooth hurts so bad it is making me mean! Janice -- yipie tie yie yo
RE: [IceHorses] potty training for Wanda
Hi Anna I bought Puppy's First Steps by the Faculty of the Cummings Schoold of Vet. Med at Tufts University. The book is totally positive reinforcement based and is the first book that I've read that said that it's okay to let the puppy or dog sleep with you. Sounds like a book I'd like and one I am not familiar with. I know the Sirius and Karen Pryor book which are also good. Sushi, the Pom also slept with us - with his little crate on the bed at first so I would hear if he asked to go out. He is 7 months old and definitely prefers to potty outside. I think with little dogs the most important aspect is to take them outside often and regularly. Robyn Icelandic Horse Farm Robyn Hood Phil Pretty Vernon BC Canada www.icefarm.com
Re: [IceHorses] Goofing off
No, they don't usually ride this way but got into the kid mode and before I knew it, Dakota was doing his thng Hey..what a great way to ride, one keeps an eye on the trail when going forward. And for those times you need to back up, you have a talking rear view mirror. HA! Cute kids. Raven Lucy Molly, the Girl Doggies Huginn Dixie Chick, the Back Behind the Barn Ponies Maggie Rose, the cat who makes me sneeze Respect ALL Earthlings. We are all animals of this planet. We are all creatures.
Re: [IceHorses] potty training for Wanda
I've popped her new little bed in her 'crate' and Sophie has put herself to bed. The door has been wide open for 1/2 and hour now and she's sound asleep in there. She must think it's her safe spot now...that and another safe spot would be clutched in any number of human arms during the day. She's fairly well socialized at this point. I bought Puppy's First Steps by the Faculty of the Cummings Schoold of Vet. Med at Tufts University. The book is totally positive reinforcement based and is the first book that I've read that said that it's okay to let the puppy or dog sleep with you. There is not necessarily step by step info, but more a general training methods and how to use crates. I found the book very informative and useful. I like how it talks about letting puppies play bite so that they learn bite inhibition verses 'teach them who's boss right from the start'. -- Anna Southern Ohio
[IceHorses] horse article
In this months Horse Illus., the one with the icelandic article in it, it also has an article on how to deal with problem horses. Did anyone see that?? I didn't think it was a very good article. The photo where she stops a horse from a sudden bolt by grabbing mane with one hand and then jerking the other rein hard and high is an absolute 100% gurantee for rearing. been there done it got the tee shirt. also it says in one picture she is seated perfectly and if the horse bucks again she will be able to ride it out. HA. thats a good one! also in the icelandic article, I dont want to step on toes or hurt peoples feelings and I am SURE the person riding the icey is some sort of goddess who walks on water in the icelandic community, but I dont know who she is and dont care, she is riding that icey in horrible HORRIBLE form. and I aint even that great a judge of riding form. But I can see she isnt with the horse in any way shape or form. Just my negative .02 Cents worth since i have a toothache and the flu AND have to be at work today yii Janice -- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] O/T - Seniors faclitiy was Does this match?
i just bought my dogs for christmas, each one, a new polar fleece blankie for their crates. 4.99 at walmart. Snowflakes on navy blue. I dont even wash them. I just let them get so nasty they are about to disintegrate and throw away and get new ones. also I garage sale and go to the goodwill and get old faded and stained but clean crocheted blankets for them for their crates. I have plain black wire crates but my daughter has a fancy one that looks like bamboo with a fancy sheepskin mattress in it and a battery operated fan. Janice-- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] Horsey Christmas gift?
Virgina, That is a very nice heartfelt gift for him to do for his soul partner... How special is that??? Reminds me of when Dan bought me Jewel as my Engagement Present 10 years ago... The Soul of a Horse ~ I like to Dream BIG ~ Together we can take this book to the top of the Best Sellers list... thesoulofahorse.com/Pre-Order-Reviews.htm
Re: [IceHorses] Horse Illustrated
The January 2008 Horse Illustrated issue features the Icelandic Horse. Too bad that some of the photos used were of performance horses with what appears to be weighted boots. In fact all photos under saddle were of performance horses. Oh...also noted in the article they rarely spook. I think it would have been better PR to show trail horses, driving horses, etc in the article. Someone from Horse Illustrated contacted me a few months before the issue came out... looking for people to advertise along with the article. I don't have anything to sell, so no need to advertise, but I mentioned that they might want to get input for the article from someone other than the USIHC. I think the type of articles that we generally see in the horse magazines about Icelandics end up to be negative for the breed and the sellers. Judy http://icehorses.net http://clickryder.com
RE: [IceHorses] horse article
also in the icelandic article, I dont want to step on toes or hurt peoples feelings and I am SURE the person riding the icey is some sort of goddess who walks on water in the icelandic community, but I don't know who she is and dont care, she is riding that icey in horrible HORRIBLE form. and I aint even that great a judge of riding form. But I can see she isnt with the horse in any way shape or form. Just my negative .02 Cents worth since i have a toothache and the flu AND have to be at work today yii My teeth are fine and I don't have the flu but those were the exact thoughts I had when I saw that article. That's a sad way for our breed to be presented to the world. I don't normally read Horse Illustrated because I think their choice of articles leaves a lot to be desired, but I picked that copy up to see what they wrote about Icelandics. I was rather ashamed. Hope you're better soon, Janice! Karen Thomas, NC No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.17.9/1198 - Release Date: 12/26/2007 5:26 PM
Re: [IceHorses] Horsey Christmas gift?
On Dec 26, 2007 10:54 PM, Cherie Mascis [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Heartfelt gifts from people you love are the most special. I agree! Hubby is selling our house that he loves and never wanted to sell, so that I could have my house with land for the horsesmoving and changing his lifestyle for me is a huge, heartfelt gift. I can only hope that he'll be as happy there as I will be. V
Re: [IceHorses] Re: horse article
here is the pic. for godssakes. she shoulda had a seat belt on. That's a really, really unfortunate picture with a stiff, braced rider and a horse that looks like it's actually trotting rather than tolting (though it's hard to see as it's very small - for some reason my picture viewer is playing up). The other photo with the male rider looks much better though. Mic Mic (Michelle) Rushen --- Solva Icelandic Horses and DeMeulenkamp Sweet Itch Rugs: www.solva-icelandics.co.uk --- Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes
RE: [IceHorses] horse article
In this months Horse Illus., the one with the icelandic article in it, it also has an article on how to deal with problem horses. Did anyone see that?? I didn't think it was a very good article. The photo where she stops a horse from a sudden bolt by grabbing mane with one hand and then jerking the other rein hard and high is an absolute 100% gurantee for rearing. been there done it got the tee shirt. also it says in one picture she is seated perfectly and if the horse bucks again she will be able to ride it out. HA. thats a good one! I agree, that was a HORRIBLE article. Riding out a buck...sheesh. How about getting off the horse and figuring out what's wrong? The good thing about the magazine is that they are running a Parelli series...although I haven't gotten around to reading that one yet. For all I know, even the Parelli article may be taken out of context. The REALLY surprising thing to me was in the middle of the ride-it-out/whatever-it-was-called article, there is an inset about a body worker in NC. I was absolutely stunned to see that they had slapped his story right smack in the middle of the ride-it-out article, an article where I thought all the pictures looked like Don't photos. The body worker is Greg Wilder, who lives near Southern Pines. The man is absolutely a genius if you ask me. I give him most of the credit for helping me find the root cause of Loftur's problems. Dr. Tom Daniel of Southern Pines Equine Hospital recommended Greg to me, because they often work together. (The vets at Virginia Tech recommended Dr. Daniel to me to follow-up with Gracie's acupuncture.) Dr. Daniel practices traditional western veterinary medicine as well as being certified to practice acupuncture. Greg has worked with several of my horses, in consultation with Dr. Daniel...it was they who suggested that we treat Tivar for ulcers. So, three problem horses and that team is batting 1000 in my book - one horse required an alternative medicine treatment, one required a traditional method treatment, and with Tivar, the treatment was pretty traditional, but with a forward-thinking knowledge of symptoms only recently shown in studies. So...why on earth did they put the Greg snippet inside that horrible article? Poor guy. Karen Thomas, NC No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.17.9/1198 - Release Date: 12/26/2007 5:26 PM
Re: [IceHorses] horse article
That's a sad way for our breed to be presented to the world. I don't normally read Horse Illustrated because I think their choice of articles leaves a lot to be desired, but I picked that copy up to see what they wrote about Icelandics. I was rather ashamed. Maybe writing to the USIHC and Horse Illustrated would be a good idea, to let them know. The USIHC represents only a handful of people. Bernie, being geographically so removed from the rest of us, and only in touch with other members of USIHC not being on the icehorses list, probably has no idea what the majority of North American Icelandic Horse owners does or how they feel. Maybe someone should let Bernie know. Judy http://icehorses.net http://clickryder.com
Re: [IceHorses] Tosca - short question/long answer
i wish you had a horse like my jas... he will pony ride ridiculous unbalanced children all day very happily. if one slipped way to the side he would simply stop. I let a downs syndrome girl ride him one day in the arena, she kept laughing and slapping his withers and would suddenly with no warning throw herself forward and clasp her arms tight around his neck and just laugh and choke him and I would just look at him with total wonder cause he had such a soft glow in his eyes. He had known from when he was being tacked up, when she was brushing him and suddenly stopped and started kissing him all over his belly, he whirled around and looked at her like what the... and suddenly relaxed, licked and chewed, like oh, she's a baby of some kind and from then on he tolerated all her strange sudden moves. My fox would be good at this too. My Tivar, altho he likes children and likes them to pet him, does not like strangers on his back at all. Nasi or stonewall, forget it, they are babies themselves. Janice-- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] Re: horse article
On 12/27/07, Mic Rushen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: here is the pic. for godssakes. she shoulda had a seat belt on. That's a really, really unfortunate picture with a stiff, braced rider and a horse that looks like it's actually trotting rather than tolting yes i thought so too. Maybe the USIHC should get together a press packet like many organizations have, a collection of facts and photos and contact names of people and photos that represent the breed well. I have noticed in the TWHBEA brochure, the new one, there is not ONE pic of a big lick horse with LOTS of pics of ordinary trail riders riding well gaiting gorgeous horses natural shod and in every day attire. So i wonder if at one of their meetings they might have discussed this same thing, how they want to be perceived by the public, their IMAGE so to speak... because they very obviously are wanting to change their image. in their breed magazine The Voice, you now see a section in every issue about trail riding and versatility events etc and profiles of horses that are accomplished in areas other than performance showing. So maybe USIHC needs to do that, to take an honest appraisal, maybe do a questionnaire or poll of members to see how they would like to see the breed represented in media. Janice -- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] Re: horse article
here is the pic. What gait is that horse doing? Judy http://icehorses.net http://clickryder.com
Re: [IceHorses] Tosca - short question/long answer
What concerns me is that Tosca can be a little grumpy - bucked when we put Stephanie up on her. Hi Nancy... I haven't been following all the posts lately (having been run over by Christmas, extra ER shifts and building a new house - egads) but How long have these two mares been under saddle? What was their previous experience/jobs? What I have been doing with my Drifa is Parelli - and our group does 'play days' - we play all the games, but over, under, through all kinds of obstacles. We try and make the obstacles as easy to as difficult/scary as we can so that the horse can start out at very easy and gradually, as they gain confidence and skills, they are challenged more. So - at first they follow (rider on the ground), at a comfortable distance, someone pulling a bag of rattling cans, gradually learning to get closer and closer. A more advanced horse is ridden up to the bag of moving, rattling cans, bareback and bridleless; and at some point the horses start to pull the bag behind them. We have a pole with wide strips of plastic hanging down. At first we just play the games close to it - maybe some circling, yoyo (backing towards and away from it), sideways up to it; then advance and retreat through it, then the games through it, then with a rider There are lots of websites (and Judy has links to some) that show different obstacles to make and play with, so you don't have to come up with these on your own. It's amazing what can be done with PVC pipe and glue ;-) The key is to gradually play with new experiences without ever overwhelming the horse, or losing it's trust and confidence and to support the horse through all these new experiences so he learns to trust his human. And teaching the horse to be soft and 'follow a feel' - so, for instance, when the horse spooks and feels the halter tightening, he will have learned to 'give' to that feel, not fight it. The learning process can be helped along with a clicker (although I do not use one because my left arm/hand is funky). There is a Clicker expo in LA in January or February (google Karen Pryor clicker training). For the horse who will be the disabled rider's mount ... practice doing all of the things that a disabled rider would do - but with a physicaly more able person, and in very, very tiny increments - so that when the horse does the right thing (hold still when a human stumbles up against her, for instance) the horse gets a reward (or several - a treat, a release, a scratch) For this you would start with a person stumbling at a safe distance, reward the horse for holding still, and gradually work the person up to the horse as the horse figured out the game and the appropriate response. And you would do this for as many wierd things as you could come up with. After awhile, the horses figure out the deal and start generalizing and things go a lot faster. At first it is usually a lot of repetition. Maybe you have done all this? But if Tosca was grumpy when Steph was on her - bucking - are you sure that Tosca wasn't just unused to the feel of an uncoordinated rider? and frightened/nervous about it? She may have been getting a lot of conflicting signals all at once and was overwhelmed and confused. Being spooked hard by a running cat is a rookie mistake and she can learn a new response. anyhow - I hope this makes sense. Penny
Re: [IceHorses] horse article
So...why on earth did they put the Greg snippet inside that horrible article? Maybe in the very big universal infinite intelligence picture, it was not an accident. The horses ridden like that probably have ulcers, so it's a clue to listen to them and get them fixed. Judy http://icehorses.net http://clickryder.com
Re: [IceHorses] Tosca - short question/long answer
Maybe you have done all this? But if Tosca was grumpy when Steph was on her - bucking - are you sure that Tosca wasn't just unused to the feel of an uncoordinated rider? and frightened/nervous about it? She may have been getting a lot of conflicting signals all at once and was overwhelmed and confused.
Re: [IceHorses] Tosca - short question/long answer
Maybe you have done all this? But if Tosca was grumpy when Steph was on her - bucking - are you sure that Tosca wasn't just unused to the feel of an uncoordinated rider? and frightened/nervous about it? She may have been getting a lot of conflicting signals all at once and was overwhelmed and confused. Thanks Penny. Very good advice indeed. We have not done all of that, but have done some of the things you suggested and have plans for implementing some of the others. The bucking came about because I put Stephanie on bareback with a vaulting surcingle. Her hip flexors are so tight that she can't spread her legs around the barrel of a horse so she slid way back over Tosca's loin. We popped Stephanie off - she had a side-walker at each knee and put each of the side-walkers up instead. Tosca bucked each time one of them slid back beyond her comfort level, but with the better riders on her, I could correct her and continue on. We will need to find an appropriate saddle for Steph. Tosca will be five in May and had had about 18 rides over about nine months, so she's very green. Yrsa is not started. She will be four next May. She has been led all over and ground driven and I have sat on her. She's been bathed. hauled, clipped, saddled and blanketed. All non-events. I'll start her just like I started Tosca when she turns four. Nancy
Re: [IceHorses] Tosca - short question/long answer
Nancy, it sounds like Tosca needs some approach and retreat, have the rider move back, then forward before she reacts, watching for relaxation before moving the rider back further... Funny story, Dan and I went looking for a mule for Tatum to ride, about 9 years ago... it was winter, we went up North, took the trailer with... I had found Molly the mule on the internet... anyway...we go there and Molly was a little smaller then I wanted, but very sturdy.. Dan rode her around bareback, she was perfect... but, when he went to slide off her rear, she flipped around so fast he landed in a heap, right below where he was sitting.. it was really FUNNY for all of us, but him... We bought her anyway... well... since I knew that was a problem, I told the kids they needed to wait before they rode double until she got to know us better... Tatum asked why, I told her...well, she spent so much time on her back... playing with that area, first with her hands, then with her toes, then with her bottom, that it did not take long before Molly was carrying 3 kids around all the time... so, don't give up hope, Respectful, approach and retreat can really help her get over feeling like a Mountain Lion has grabbed her by the Loins... Debbie in SE MN -- The Soul of a Horse ~ Together we can send this book to the top of the Best Sellers list... thesoulofahorse.com/Pre-Order-Reviews.htm
FW: [IceHorses] O/T - Seniors faclitiy was Does this match?
Hi Janice, That's actually my mother not my granny. I was the second last born so she was 40 when I was born so in lots of cases she could be my granny. Confusing photo because the photo says Grandma-Valur as I had done this for her grandchildren Robyn Icelandic Horse Farm Robyn Hood Phil Pretty Vernon BC Canada www.icefarm.com
RE: [IceHorses] O/T - Seniors faclitiy was Does this match?
Hi Janice, That's actually my mother not my granny. I was the second last born so she was 40 when I was born so in lots of cases she could be my granny. Icelandic Horse Farm Robyn Hood Phil Pretty Vernon BC Canada www.icefarm.com
RE: [IceHorses] Tosca - short question/long answer
i wish you had a horse like my jas... he will pony ride ridiculous unbalanced children all day very happily. I think Jaspar is a lot like my Big Mac was - a very gentle, old-soul kind of horse. But, even Jaspar and Mac weren't born with a world of experience - while their good natures and patience might have been born in them, they still had to gain some life experience along the way to become what they are/were. Nancy, is this a decision you have to make now? Or is this something you can proceed with as you're going, and make decisions as the girls present their answers to you? I obviously haven't seen either Tosca or Yrsa, but they both sound lovely - just young. I tend to agree with Penny's assessments of Tosca's reactions to date - how did she say it - rookie mistakes? If she's only on her 18th ride now, it seems to me that she's doing great - whether she's suitable for Stephanie is another issue that I obviously can't discuss without seeing them together... I hear people debate if a particular horse (or even a particular breed) is suitable for being a kid's horse, and that often strikes me as the wrong question. While some horses (Mac, Jaspar, and several Icelandic's I've known) seem born to be gentle with special-needs beings, those horses still need several things to be really suitable for tiny kids or for handicapped adults or children. The first thing is obviously having been born with the right temperament for the job, but they also need 2) maturity, 3) training, and 4) experience. Number 2 will come - youth is, unfortunately, curable, as I'm sure most of us have realized. I think you can take care of numbers 3 and 4. So, I'd think what is left is the first two - do you think they (either or both) have the right in-born temperament, and will they also have the maturity in time to be useful for Stephanie's teen years? I have no idea - from what you've said, I certainly wouldn't give up on either of them, but I'm sure you can see it more clearly than we can. How does Stephanie feel about waiting? Is she losing patience? Can she get involved with the groundwork of either horse now, while waiting for their riding skills to come along? I guess I don't see how we can provide any answers for you, but I'm sure the list is willing to help you formulate some questions you need to address. Karen Thomas, NC No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.17.9/1198 - Release Date: 12/26/2007 5:26 PM
RE: [IceHorses] Re: horse article
here is the pic. What gait is that horse doing? I think it's one of those un-named gaits that happen when a horse is forced into a frame. Again, with the horse being black, I can't tell which legs are paired in motion, but it's not a rack/tolt, it's not a trot, so it's something undefined in the middle. It's obviously not a running walk - no horse could possibly run-walk with that death-grip on his head - but it's not a foxtrot either. I don't see any point in trying to name a gait where so much is not right from the horse's perspective. What struck me so strongly about that picture when I first saw it is how gawd-awfully stiff that rider is. I don't think I've ever seen a more braced set of shoulders and arms. Since horses mirror their rider's bodies, no wonder that horse doesn't appear to be gaiting comfortably. It looks like some Thewell Pony cartoon - not like anything any credible rider would do on purpose. AND...someone obviously had to provide these pictures for the magazine, and/or had to approve their use, right? I've gotten so tired over the years of hearing people describe pictures WE (on this list) select as bad moments in time. Well, duh, if that is a BMOT then why the heck did it get selected/approved for publication? I have an idea why - because that's exactly the way I was told to sit (leaning back, staring off into the sky) at the Icelander-led clinic I attended. Karen Thomas [EMAIL PROTECTED] No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.17.9/1198 - Release Date: 12/26/2007 5:26 PM
RE: [IceHorses] horse article
Maybe in the very big universal infinite intelligence picture, it was not an accident. The horses ridden like that probably have ulcers, so it's a clue to listen to them and get them fixed. Maybe - all I'd thought of prior to your comment was that it certainly was ironic that Greg has helped me with three rehabs, two of them Icelandics, when those pictures of Icelandic's were in the same issue. By the way, for those of you who don't have the magazine, January 2008 Horse Illustrated, page 58, here is one quote. Wilder starts by looking at the horse's history and asking if veterinary issues have been ruled out. He does that and I appreciate it. I arranged to meet him at the vet clinic with Tivar that one time, and he did a full body check-out and massage...and told me his back was about as good as any he sees. Because of his history of bucking, and because Tivar's OBVIOUS pissiness about Greg invading his space - especially around his belly - he immediately said Tivar need to see a VET, because Tivar's problems were out of his specialty. He was with us when Dr. Daniel came over to check Tivar, and that's when ulcer treatment came up...Bingo. He could have easily continued to take my money for his services, but he didn't. That was the only time he ever saw Tivar. He saw Loftur multiple times, and still sees him occasionally for follow-up. Another quote: Frequent neck and back problems in horses that are held artificially into a false 'frame' is another common problem Wilder sees. 'A horse's neck muscles just aren't able to withstand this sort of constant pressure', Wilder says. 'When a horse is pulled into a frame, instead of being ridden from behind into self-carriage, physical problems almost always result. Wilder views bucking, rearing and bolting as all-inclusive evasions. 'The horse is so pressured that he feels he has no where else to go,' he explains. Greg didn't talk to me much the first time I took Loftur to him - the first time I ever met him. He listened to what I told him, but he was mostly focused on Loftur and his reactions. He told me later when I first called for an appointment that he assumed I was just another Icelandic owner who had ridden their horse with a too-tight, incorrectly placed saddle in a hell-bent-for-leather way. Ouch. That was his impression of the breed. He's a NC native, but lived in one of the western states for several years - can't remember which state, but Loftur wasn't the first Icelandic he worked on... The article about him goes on to say, But these issues are often caused by a combination of issues. 'Take a sensitive back, for example - this isn't something an owner or rider can fix in a day. Adjusting the saddle ad a shoeing revision may help, but the answer often lies in retraining coordination patterns, by using someone such as myself, or by re-evaluating the training program. The horse might need correct long-and-low warm-up work every day, or he might need to do just long-and-low work for a certain period of time, until the compromised muscles are strengthened and he can go back to regular work. Karen Thomas [EMAIL PROTECTED] No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.17.9/1198 - Release Date: 12/26/2007 5:26 PM
Re: [IceHorses] Tosca - short question/long answer
Nancy, is this a decision you have to make now? No, it is not and the plan is to just continue with the training of both mares, enjoying the process and the ponies and seeing where we end up. The actual fact is that we have the extremely phlegmatic Twist who is as close to bomb proof as a horse will ever get and is looking for a job. And Stephanie is so consumed with her school work and crafting that I suspect she likes the fact of owning Tosca and riding some horse from time to time, but she is never begging Please, please, may I go out and ride? She is a very smart girl who hass learned to accept how physically challenging life is for her and how long it takes her to accomplish tasks that you and I do without thinking. This group is a world of help and support to us and I am very grateful for the depth of experience and kind advice. Nancy
Re: [IceHorses] Re: horse article
In the old hunter/jumper days we would refer to getting behind your horse. That rider isn't even in the same county. Nancy
RE: [IceHorses] Tosca - short question/long answer
No, it is not and the plan is to just continue with the training of both mares, enjoying the process and the ponies and seeing where we end up. The actual fact is that we have the extremely phlegmatic Twist who is as close to bomb proof as a horse will ever get and is looking for a job. You know, Nancy, sometimes when I don't what to do about one of my horses...well, if I can't find the right answer, usually if I wait, the answer will find me. Case in point would be Tivar. I'm not really sure why I wanted to take him on as a project when he was giving Ann problems two years ago. Then, bam, just weeks after he came here to live, Janice found out that Svertla and Stali were starving in FL, and she and I went in together (her doing the hard part) to get them out of that awful home...then Stali died so tragically, and Tivar responded SO well to the ulcer treatment, and to our restarting him under saddle in a no-pressure environment. That wasn't the answer I expected, but it the right answer for Tivar I think. He's obviously happy as a clam with Janice, sharing her adventures, blossoming at her farm. The timing on that situation was just too odd - I think it was supposed to be. Years ago, I bought my beloved Sundance to be a dependable horse that Emily's little friends could ride - and then I fell in love with him, and he became my personal buddy, my first true equine soul-mate. Things don't always go as we expect - sometimes they go better than we expect. I have all faith that your answers will find you. Bless you for not rushing into a decision, but taking things as they come. Karen Thomas, NC No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.17.9/1198 - Release Date: 12/26/2007 5:26 PM
RE: [IceHorses] Whisper Personality Profile/Robyn
Hi Susan, Hi Susan, The pictures were fine. I just spoke with Linda and her first words were that Whisper looked like a really sweet horse. Looking at her mouth you notice that mouth is a little short and her lower lip looks a bit thick (this can be very deceiving in the winter with the extra hair and the length of mouth can really change depending on the situation. When horses are tense or concerned about things some horse's mouths will get shorter and tighter than usual - just like people). It can indicate that when she is confused that she will have a tendency to get a bit inflexible - can be mental and physical. Also looking at the eyes it looks like she can get worry lines (little triangles about her eye) - with this type of horse they can be emotional and if you get upset with them when they are concerned they get worse. Linda said it also looks as though her nostrils were slightly narrow and one looked different from the other in these photos. She has a soft open eye and I think she is concerned about other horses around her when she is ridden because she doesn't have the choice to get away. Linda suggested doing leg exercises with her (I have to turn a few things into pdf's to send them to you) especially back legs. The leg exercises and the tail work will help release some of the tension in her rear end which would be increasing her concern when other horses are behind her. Janice made some good observations from the photos. There are many kinds of ground exercises you can do with horse, and I think you have been doing some, but ground work alone does not help release tension and fear and it is not just about training the horse. We find it more helpful if you can release tension and stress which helps horses change behavior so you don't just have to repeat the same thing every time before you ride. The personality analysis that Linda has done for years first came from a book that Professor Berry wrote many moons ago and Linda really started looking at horses faces. Most people that have been around a lot of horses for a long time may get a 'sense' of horses from their faces. In the 60' Linda and her first husband, Wentworth Tellington, had a research farm with about 3000 members. They did a survey of their members gathering information about 100's of horses and what the owners noticed about certain characteristics. In the 70's Linda had her own personality read from the Institute of Physiogamy (sp?) in San Francisco and she was really surprised at how accurate the feedback about her own tendencies were - they took 72 measurements on her face and gave her a tape. It wasn't about making judgments about good or bad just tendencies. Many sales people take courses to help them get a sense about how best to give information when selling something - depending on certain facial characteristics. I can't remember them now but have a book about it - things like certain people respond better to just being given straight information about something and other people do better being sold something on the golf course - if you know what I mean. The personality analysis for horses can be really interesting and helpful to people. It is not to say that one characteristic always means the same thing nor that you can't work with it. It is combinations of characteristics that make up the whole picture. For instance, if you have a horse with a small eye, small nostril and ears that don't move very much - it is generally a horse that had not been given a lot of input and may seem not very smart. However, if you can give those horses input that they can understand - and that is where groundwork can really help - you will actually see the eyes open more as well as the nostrils and that the ears become more aware of things. Dished faced horses have a tendency to be more reactive than a straight faced horse. It is said that the Bedouins sold their dish faced horses overseas and kept the straight faced horses for their own. Maybe the dish in the face changes how they see things, just like a bulge between the eyes can indicate more reactivity. It is not about expecting these things but rather understanding them and knowing that you may have to work with these horses in a different way - and have them end up fine. Linda's first book about TTEAM published in 1985 was based on evaluating the personality of 6 different horses at Reken that were then worked with by a group of 8 amateur horse people (Christine Schwartz was one of those people and she brought with her a very difficult Standardbred mare) for 3-4 weeks each. The horses were all considered to be challenging and it was their last hope. Ursula Bruns (founder of Reken and author of many books) wasn't sure that the TTEAM method was teachable because Linda had used the basis of her Feldenkrais training to develop the work and wanted to test it with this group of horses. The change in the horses' behavior was dramatic and they also
Re: [IceHorses] Tosca - short question/long answer
yes, lots to consider. I dont even think Jaspar would be a good little kids horse. he would be a great lead line pony ride horse, but any time I have let someone ride him who was real inexperienced and took a real passenger non-riding role, he just immediately went oh, I'm free and walked over and started grazing and when they would pull and kick and scold he'd plod a few steps and start eating again. He can spot a pushover a mile away :) He can also spot a horse expert a mile away I have a friend who is real real authoritative with horses, no non sense, wont put up with anything, she is the master, her horse is her minion and slave, that type. She wanted to ride jaspar one time so I said yes. She got on him and he pretended he didnt know what it meant when she clucked for him to go. I dont know how he pegged her for an a-hole even before she picked up the reins but man, he amazed me in his sudden balking behavior. When she got strict and lashed the reins on his shoulder and kicked and said come on, lets go, he immediately started walking backwards, like he was pretending he thought that was what she wanted all the time, backed into some dense bushes and just kept backing until her whole back and shoulders were just crammed in the bushes. I was just amazed. I looked at him and said Jas! and he just stared ahead chewing his cud like i think this is the kind of horse she deserves. Janice Janice -- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] Re: horse article / USIHC
TWH...now see a section in every issue about trail riding and versatility events etc and profiles of horses that are accomplished in areas other than performance showing. So maybe USIHC needs to do that, to take an honest appraisal, maybe do a questionnaire or poll of members to see how they would like to see the breed represented in media. I think the USIHC is way out of touch with the majority of Icelandic Horse owners. Look at how large and active our list is, yet none of them are involved but only in their small group. Judy http://icehorses.net http://clickryder.com
Re: [IceHorses] Re: horse article
AND...someone obviously had to provide these pictures for the magazine, and/or had to approve their use, right? Who is the author of the article? Is she an icelandic horse owner? Or who did she get her info from? Judy http://icehorses.net http://clickryder.com
[IceHorses] follow this link
I'm not certain if this has been discussed yet. There is a bill that needs commenting on in Washington. It seems we need to pass it to keep our horses welcome on trails on public land. We need to look into this. In the meantime, check this out: http://www.washingtonwatch.com/bills/show/110_SN_2283.html Gail
Re: [IceHorses] Whisper Personality Profile/Robyn
She has a soft open eye Thanks for doing this, Robyn. It's all very interesting and informative! Judy http://icehorses.net http://clickryder.com
RE: [IceHorses] Re: horse article
Who is the author of the article? Is she an icelandic horse owner? Or who did she get her info from? I just checked, and this is funny. Her name is Audrey Pavia, and the article credit says she is a free-lance writer and author of Horses for Dummies. I swear, I didn't make that up! I have no idea where she got her information, but it says she's based in Southern California. There is a sidebar article on Laura Benson, if that gives anyone a clue. Karen Thomas [EMAIL PROTECTED] No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.17.9/1198 - Release Date: 12/26/2007 5:26 PM
RE: [IceHorses] Re: horse article
In the old hunter/jumper days we would refer to getting behind your horse. That rider isn't even in the same county. HA! I know that phrase. I admit that I've gotten behind my horse a few times, either with an unexpected canter depart, or going over a jump...but just because I did it, doesn't make it right. I sure wouldn't want one of those pictures of me in a national magazine. Karen Thomas [EMAIL PROTECTED] No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.17.9/1198 - Release Date: 12/26/2007 5:26 PM
RE: [IceHorses] Tosca - short question/long answer
yes, lots to consider. I dont even think Jaspar would be a good little kids horse. he would be a great lead line pony ride horse, but any time I have let someone ride him who was real inexperienced and took a real passenger non-riding role, he just immediately went oh, I'm free and walked over and started grazing and when they would pull and kick and scold he'd plod a few steps and start eating again. He can spot a pushover a mile away :) Here's the other side of that story, one about our Mac, who reminded me of your Jaspar. We paid to lease Mac for a month before we bought him, and that was a very cold December. Still I was determined to ride him every opportunity I could before I wrote the check. Every night we'd go down to the barn to see him, and it would be in the teens - very cold for NC in December. The guy who owned him would be at the barn taking care of his other horses. The boarding barn was an old chicken house, at least 200 feet long, and we'd ride up and down the barn aisle. At one end of the barn, there was a stack of hay. About every second trip down, Mac, knowing he had total novices aboard, would refuse to make the turn, and would stroll out into the hay stack and have a snack. Finally, the owner looked up and said, would you like some advice. Yes, sure, please, how do we stop this? Cary was aboard at the moment, and he told him to get down, and he motioned for Emily (eight at the time) to come over. He looked at her and said, I want you to ride Mac up and down the barn aisle, and don't you let him go to the hay stack. Ok? She just nodded, climbed up on big old Mac...and he never, ever - not once - went to the haystack with her. The owner had seen her riding in her lessons, and I guess he knew she was a positive thinker - a totally confident rider. That was just mortifying to Cary and me, to be out-ridden by our eight-year old kid. Moral of the story - you must define kid before you decide if any given horse is a suitable kid's horse. At eight, Emily could outride a lot of adults, including yours truly. Karen Thomas [EMAIL PROTECTED] No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.17.9/1198 - Release Date: 12/26/2007 5:26 PM
[IceHorses] OT Horse Rescues
In case any of you are looking for a last minute tax deduction, I just got a mailer from my favorite non profit horse rescue group. Last Chance Corral www.lastchancecorral.org 5350 Pomeroy Road, Athens, OH 45701. It is run by Victoria Goss. In this day and age when Presidents of charities are making tons of money and only small amounts actually going to the needy, there is no question that she is giving everything plus some. I have been to her facility several times. Its about 1.5 hours from my house. The foal barn which is attached to her little cabin is way nicer than her living quarters. Her foal barn is heated and warm, the cabin is heated only by a wood stove. Most of her first floor is basically the office and storage area for the foal supplies In the early months of the year she rescues newborn foals that are meant to be destroyed. They are only born so that a mare will be available to nurse the valuable racing foals and the mother can then go back to be rebred at the stallions farm as live cover is required by the jockey club for all racehorses. Last year she rescued 207 from the breeding farms in KY. Some of these poor babies are born prematurely because the delivery is induced so that they will have an available nursemare. They don't even let the babies get a meal or two to get colostrum. Sometimes they offer to sell her some on top of what she pays them for the foals. She has an incredible survival rate and only lost 6 babies last year. The care of these foals is very labor intensive. The rest of the year she gets OTTB to be retrained and resold and also goes to the killer auctions, buys some horses and ponies that have potential, trains them and sells them. This helps raise funds so she can save more horses. There is a hay shortage in southern Ohio due to the drought and hay will be much more expensive. Instead of buying toys for the needy kids, like I usually do for Xmas, I took all that money plus my usual amount and sent it to Last Chance Corral so that she can buy more hay. Any ways, I always wonder about which charities to donate to and this is one I know is a good one. Her charity has been around a long time and has won several awards for worthwhile charity. -- Anna Southern Ohio
Re: [IceHorses] follow this link
. It seems we need to pass it to keep our horses welcome on trails on public land. We need to look into this. In the meantime, check this out: http://www.washingtonwatch.com/bills/show/110_SN_2283.html Already sent my letter to my congressman. -- Anna Southern Ohio
[IceHorses] Warning
You might not ever want to hitch a ride the doctor with me. Yesterday I took our 32 year old Amazin to his avian vet for a routine nail and beak trim. He had a heart attack and died. Very tough to watch. Very empty living room. Today, I took my 91 year old father in for a routine blood draw. He did better than Rocky, but got admitted direct to the hospital with an irregular heartbeat. When I got home, Bruce told me he thought that in the future, he would drive himself, thank you. Nancy
Re: [IceHorses] Warning
--- Nancy Sturm [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You might not ever want to hitch a ride to the doctor with me. I'm sorry, Nancy. I'm sure your father will do OK. At 91, he is allowed to have an irregular heartbeat. And if they come back and say he is new diabetic and he loves sweets, tell the DR. to cram it But I agree with your hubby - I'll drive myself!;-) Susan in NV Nevermore Ranch http://users.oasisol.com/nevermore/ Disclaimer CAUTION: DO NOT DRIVE WITH HOT COFFEE IN YOUR LAP Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
[IceHorses] Petition to help horses mules and donkeys neglected in Colorado
From Tori: Hi Judy, on Christmas Eve we helped haul a couple of emaciated mares from this place to safety, there are already 700+ signatures here but the remaining neglected animals at this place could use as much help as necessary http://www.petitiononline.com/AArescue/petition.html feel free to crosspost Tori http://www.accountservicesinc.net/SRR/Welcome.html
RE: [IceHorses] Warning
NANCY! I am so sorry! I don't know about your father's irregular heartbeat, but unless Rocky was already diagnosed with heart disease, there was nothing on Earth you could've done to prevent that. Heck, it could've happened one day when you came home from the grocery store My thoughts are with you. Going to hug Charlie and Tinker now. Mary
Re: [IceHorses] Warning
Oh Nancy...I am so sad for your great loss. How long did you have
Rocky? I would like to see some photos. {{{ HUGS }}} Sending bright
healing light to your Dad.
Back in 1998, Wizard's dam Star was very sick. After trying to treat
Star for a few weeks with my local Vet, I finally took her to the U of
MN Vet Hospital. This was on a Monday morning. While trying to load
Star into the trailer my little Sheltie dog Freeway had a stroke. So I
ended up also taking Freeway to the U of MN with me, so she could be
checked out. We were at the U of MN...for about 10 hours. Star was
admitted, Freeway and I went home. When I got home, I went to check on
Baby Jo, my 8 year old house bunny and found her deadby my chair.
I just lost it!! I remember walking out to the back 40, to where Dan
was out baling hay. When I got near the tractor, I just fell apart, I
sat there in a row of hay, just cried while my hubby hugged me and
told me that maybe I should just go back into the house as he didn't
want to be jinxed by mewhile baling hay. BTW...Star crossed the
rainbow bridge a few days later. She was such a good girl, the best
mama to Wizard.
Raven
Lucy Molly, the Girl Doggies
Huginn Dixie Chick, the Back Behind the Barn Ponies
Maggie Rose, the cat who makes me sneeze
Respect ALL Earthlings. We are all animals of this planet. We are all creatures.
Re: [IceHorses] Warning
On 27/12/2007, Nancy Sturm [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You might not ever want to hitch a ride the doctor with me. Well Nancy, some days are just like that. It's best to not dwell on it, and just move on. However, I'm sensing by your humorous take on it, that you deal with these things well.. I'm sorry for your loss of Amazin, and your worry over your father. Wanda where we have a tiny potty trained girlI'm starting not to worry when she gets out of my sight...
RE: [IceHorses] Wine, Full Moon, Nose Rings / Tattoos
just haven't had the timemakes me sad. Makes me hungry. Lorraine Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping
Re: [IceHorses] Warning
Nancy, You and your family are in my prayers. Bernadette
