[MBZ] I think I found the source: rear axle knock

[Max Dillon via Mercedes]

https://youtu.be/7ZEMTHaHEeE

Pushing up/down on the axle stub at the differential I can make a deep knock, 
like the bearing on the side of the diff is bad.  Light knock doing the same on 
the half axle shaft.  389k miles, I think I need a "new" used differential.
-- 
Max Dillon
Charleston SC
'87 300TD
'95 E300
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Re: [MBZ] I think somebody literally crapped in the car

[Floyd Thursby via Mercedes]

Testimony to the speed and sportiness of this car, faint of heart and 
bowel need not ride in this car


--FT


On 9/24/18 12:14 PM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes wrote:

Check out what I found on Facebook Marketplace.
https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/533044293811860/


Sent from my iPhone

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--
--FT


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[MBZ] I think somebody literally crapped in the car

[Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes]

Check out what I found on Facebook Marketplace.
https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/533044293811860/


Sent from my iPhone

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Re: [MBZ] I think Jaime needs this

[Jaime Kopchinski via Mercedes]

Oh man thats rusty... at least the price isn't too unreasonable.

On Sat, Jan 20, 2018 at 8:34 PM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> 62 Mercedes Benz 220se coupe
>
> https://stlouis.craigslist.org/cto/d/62-mercedes-benz-
> 220se-coupe/6466431880.html
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
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-- 
Jaime Kopchinski
http://www.jaimekop.com/
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Re: [MBZ] I think Jaime needs this

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

If it's a complete car, might be worth it for parts.

On Sat, Jan 20, 2018 at 8:34 PM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> 62 Mercedes Benz 220se coupe
>
> https://stlouis.craigslist.org/cto/d/62-mercedes-benz-
> 220se-coupe/6466431880.html
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
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[MBZ] I think Jaime needs this

[Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes]

62 Mercedes Benz 220se coupe

https://stlouis.craigslist.org/cto/d/62-mercedes-benz-220se-coupe/6466431880.html


Sent from my iPhone

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Re: [MBZ] I think it failed

[Jim Cathey via Mercedes]

Happens all the time!

-- Jim
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[MBZ] I think it failed

[clay monroe via Mercedes]

Thermostat might be dead/ open.  I took Allen for a drive on the freeway and 
temp gauge was sitting between cold  and almost not cold anymore (40-80) at 
70mph after 20 minutes.  Never got warmer.  Cabin temp was not that great, and 
when I got home, the top hose was mushy and warm, the lower hose was pretty 
cool.

Time to get a fresh thermostat?



clay 

1974 450sl -  Frosch - Two tone green
1986 SDL - Polei
1982 300 SD - Allen

retired models-
2002 s430 - Victor, a Stately & well tailored crap
1976 300D - Blei Vanst - it looks silvery
1972 220D - Gump - She was green, simple and ran
1995 E300D - Gave her life to save me against a Dame in a SUV
POS 1987 SDL - Beware Nigerian Scammers








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Re: [MBZ] I think I need this

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

Nor are we...

On Thu, Aug 17, 2017 at 9:52 AM, Rich Thomas via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> But I'm not entirely sure why
>
> https://truckyeah.jalopnik.com/the-top-speed-of-a-mercedes-
> unimogs-super-crawler-gear-1797869370
>
> --R
>
>
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[MBZ] I think I need this

[Rich Thomas via Mercedes]

But I'm not entirely sure why

https://truckyeah.jalopnik.com/the-top-speed-of-a-mercedes-unimogs-super-crawler-gear-1797869370

--R


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Re: [MBZ] I think . . .

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

That's correct, and it remains to be seen just how much ticket splitting
people do in the key senate and house races.

On Thu, Oct 20, 2016 at 10:01 AM, Donald Snook via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Well, yes.  We have checks and balances.  That is why I believe this year
> the "down ballot"  races are so important.  If you don't like the choices
> at the top, voters can still have their say about who will be in place to
> curb in the next president.
>
> Don Snook
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Mountain Man [mailto:maontin@gmail.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, October 19, 2016 8:14 PM
> To: Mercedes Discussion List <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
> Subject: Re: [MBZ] I think . . .
>
> Donald wrote:
> > I'm scared as hell about this election with either Donald OR Hillary
> winning...
>
> Certainly it is that type of fear that is tempered in the structure of the
> governance specified in the Constitution?  This governance does not operate
> with one man in the presidency.  There are two houses of congress and the
> SCOTUS.  This year, the jazz is totally boring.
> Neither Donald OR Hillary will be a leader... about similar to 43 and
> Barack HNIC.  Things move slowly... on purpose.  Correct?
> mao
>
>
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Re: [MBZ] I think . . .

[Donald Snook via Mercedes]

Well, yes.  We have checks and balances.  That is why I believe this year the 
"down ballot"  races are so important.  If you don't like the choices at the 
top, voters can still have their say about who will be in place to curb in the 
next president. 

Don Snook 

-Original Message-
From: Mountain Man [mailto:maontin@gmail.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, October 19, 2016 8:14 PM
To: Mercedes Discussion List <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
Subject: Re: [MBZ] I think . . .

Donald wrote:
> I'm scared as hell about this election with either Donald OR Hillary 
> winning...

Certainly it is that type of fear that is tempered in the structure of the 
governance specified in the Constitution?  This governance does not operate 
with one man in the presidency.  There are two houses of congress and the 
SCOTUS.  This year, the jazz is totally boring.
Neither Donald OR Hillary will be a leader... about similar to 43 and Barack 
HNIC.  Things move slowly... on purpose.  Correct?
mao


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Re: [MBZ] I think . . .

[Mountain Man via Mercedes]

Donald wrote:
> I'm scared as hell about this election with either Donald OR Hillary 
> winning...

Certainly it is that type of fear that is tempered in the structure of
the governance specified in the Constitution?  This governance does
not operate with one man in the presidency.  There are two houses of
congress and the SCOTUS.  This year, the jazz is totally boring.
Neither Donald OR Hillary will be a leader... about similar to 43 and
Barack HNIC.  Things move slowly... on purpose.  Correct?
mao

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Re: [MBZ] I think . . .

[Donald Snook via Mercedes]

I have been avoiding this topic because I am so upset this year over our 
choices.  I know everybody says that every election, but this year it is clear 
these are the worst candidates we have ever had. 

One thing that has helped me sleep at night is that the election will not be 
decided in Kansas.  Or Mississippi, or Idaho, or California, or Illinois, or 
Massachusetts, or Texas, or New York.  Whether we like it or not, the way our 
system is set up and the demographics/population, this election will be decided 
in Ohio, Pennsylvania, Florida, Virginia, Wisconsin and a very few others.  
Those are the states where voters need to educate themselves and voting public 
doesn't usually like to put any work into deciding their vote.   But, I can't 
really throw any stones.  I'm scared as hell about this election with either 
Donald OR Hillary winning and for the most part I have very little say in who 
it will be.   

All of this is why I think the MOST IMPORTANT thing to do is to make sure you 
are voting in all the other races!   Each of us has a say in who our state and 
local representatives will be! 


Donald H. Snook 
Snook Law LLC 
5020 E. Central Ave Suite A 
Wichita, Kansas 67208
T: 316-512-5608
E: d...@snooklawllc.com 

This confidential message may be subject to the attorney-client privilege or 
protected by the attorney work-product doctrine. If you have received this 
message in error, please delete it and notify me.



-Original Message-
From: Dwight Giles [mailto:dwight.gi...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, October 19, 2016 4:56 PM
To: Mercedes Discussion List <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
Subject: Re: [MBZ] I think . . .

I agree. Thank you for raising this Randy.

Dwight Giles Jr.
1982 300CD
1990 300D
Wickford RI

On Oct 19, 2016 4:27 PM, "Randy Bennell via Mercedes" <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
wrote:

> that we need to ban discussion of the election and politics in general
>
> although I do realize that there would then be almost no traffic on 
> the list.
>
>
> RB
>
>
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Re: [MBZ] I think . . .

[Dwight Giles via Mercedes]

Maybe you ought to do that.

Dwight Giles Jr.
1982 300CD
1990 300D
Wickford RI

On Oct 19, 2016 4:53 PM, "G Mann via Mercedes" 
wrote:

> Damn... that would make me retreat to my "safe zone area" and make an
> appointment with my "trigger point counselor".
>
> Although... I must say, I've always enjoyed the "group therapy sessions"
> held here 3 times each year...
>
> Here's a video of one of the latest ones..
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZecNFzEqQY
>
> On Wed, Oct 19, 2016 at 1:27 PM, Randy Bennell via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>
> > that we need to ban discussion of the election and politics in general
> >
> > although I do realize that there would then be almost no traffic on the
> > list.
> >
> >
> > RB
> >
> >
> > ___
> > http://www.okiebenz.com
> >
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> >
> > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> >
> >
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Re: [MBZ] I think . . .

[Dwight Giles via Mercedes]

I agree. Thank you for raising this Randy.

Dwight Giles Jr.
1982 300CD
1990 300D
Wickford RI

On Oct 19, 2016 4:27 PM, "Randy Bennell via Mercedes" 
wrote:

> that we need to ban discussion of the election and politics in general
>
> although I do realize that there would then be almost no traffic on the
> list.
>
>
> RB
>
>
> ___
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>
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>
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>
>
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Re: [MBZ] I think . . .

[G Mann via Mercedes]

Damn... that would make me retreat to my "safe zone area" and make an
appointment with my "trigger point counselor".

Although... I must say, I've always enjoyed the "group therapy sessions"
held here 3 times each year...

Here's a video of one of the latest ones..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZecNFzEqQY

On Wed, Oct 19, 2016 at 1:27 PM, Randy Bennell via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> that we need to ban discussion of the election and politics in general
>
> although I do realize that there would then be almost no traffic on the
> list.
>
>
> RB
>
>
> ___
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>
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Re: [MBZ] I think . . .

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

You got that right.

Hey Randy - my former partner (Canadian) was convinced - despite my
protestations - the moon landing was an elaborately staged hoax
(conspiracy).  Is this a generally accepted conspiracy theory in
Canada?  Or was she just unbelievably stubborn?

On Wed, Oct 19, 2016 at 4:27 PM, Randy Bennell via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> that we need to ban discussion of the election and politics in general
>
> although I do realize that there would then be almost no traffic on the
> list.
>
>
> RB
>
>
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>
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>
>
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[MBZ] I think . . .

[Randy Bennell via Mercedes]

that we need to ban discussion of the election and politics in general

although I do realize that there would then be almost no traffic on the 
list.



RB


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Re: [MBZ] I *Think* I Bought a Car

[Dan Penoff]

It comes down to two things:

1.) Setting limits. It's always easy to think, Just another couple hundred 
dollars and I can have this!  That approach often ends up poorly.  While I 
certainly understand that reaching beyond expectations for a one-time deal or 
something that far exceeds what I was really looking for is a possibility, I 
try to stick to my guns when I set a price limit.  Doing otherwise is a 
decision you're going to deal with every time you see the car and get behind 
the wheel.  I don't care for that kind of angst, thank you.

2.) The willingness to walk away.  Just as we spoke about this recently with 
someone's car purchase (Rich?) the willingness to walk away is a strong 
incentive for the motivated seller. Will the Goodfellows guy come back and 
meet my price? Maybe. Knowing we were within $300 dollars has got to be a 
motivation for him, especially if he's serious about selling. If so, he'll call 
me back. If not, I know where I stand and am comfortable in my decision as to 
the value of the car (to me.). If I decide to relent later I now know his 
price, if he's willing to sell at that point.

There's a really good book on negotiating that I read some years back. I was 
also sent to the course the author still teaches, I believe.  It's called, 
Negotiate to Close by Alex Karras.  Lots of really good information that can 
be applied to many different situations.

Dan

Sent from my iPad

 On Apr 3, 2015, at 10:48 AM, Andrew Strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com wrote:
 
 Reminds me of the old adage espoused by cool college dudes when dating
 coeds:  Treat 'em mean, keep 'em keen.
 
 On Fri, Apr 3, 2015 at 5:39 AM, Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com wrote:
 
 Beats me.
 
 He called and left me a voice mail yesterday afternoon. I started
 listening to it and only heard fair and $5800. At that point I shut off
 the phone, as there was nothing else for me to hear as far as I'm concerned.
 
 I'm sort of meh about this car, mainly due to the model year (1996) and
 it being at the very top end of my budget.  He's had it for sale for at
 least a month if not more, and I'm the only person who has shown an
 interest according to him. That should be a tell right there about the
 asking price, and I'm pretty sure he knows it.
 
 I'm taking Curly's approach and not being in a hurry. I'll find the right
 car eventually.  If I end up with the S320 from the diplomatic guy in
 Sarasota I'll be happy.  He gets back on the 9th, which is this coming
 Thursday.  If not, there will be others, I'm sure.
 
 Dan
 
 Sent from my iPad
 
 On Apr 2, 2015, at 10:19 PM, Mitch Haley mi...@mitchellhaley.com
 wrote:
 
 Dan Penoff wrote:
 
 the recent repair bill from eurotech-automotive.com in Spring Hill
 Fla. (352) 597-2660 will be included for your records..Tom
 I'm assuming that's a Yes?
 
 It's not a definitive statement, but it sounds like a continued argument
 for applying the bill to the price of the car...
 
 Mitch.
 
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Re: [MBZ] I *Think* I Bought a Car

[Andrew Strasfogel]

Reminds me of the old adage espoused by cool college dudes when dating
coeds:  Treat 'em mean, keep 'em keen.

On Fri, Apr 3, 2015 at 5:39 AM, Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com wrote:

 Beats me.

 He called and left me a voice mail yesterday afternoon. I started
 listening to it and only heard fair and $5800. At that point I shut off
 the phone, as there was nothing else for me to hear as far as I'm concerned.

 I'm sort of meh about this car, mainly due to the model year (1996) and
 it being at the very top end of my budget.  He's had it for sale for at
 least a month if not more, and I'm the only person who has shown an
 interest according to him. That should be a tell right there about the
 asking price, and I'm pretty sure he knows it.

 I'm taking Curly's approach and not being in a hurry. I'll find the right
 car eventually.  If I end up with the S320 from the diplomatic guy in
 Sarasota I'll be happy.  He gets back on the 9th, which is this coming
 Thursday.  If not, there will be others, I'm sure.

 Dan

 Sent from my iPad

  On Apr 2, 2015, at 10:19 PM, Mitch Haley mi...@mitchellhaley.com
 wrote:
 
  Dan Penoff wrote:
 
  the recent repair bill from eurotech-automotive.com in Spring Hill
 Fla. (352) 597-2660 will be included for your records..Tom
  I'm assuming that's a Yes?
 
  It's not a definitive statement, but it sounds like a continued argument
 for applying the bill to the price of the car...
 
  Mitch.
 
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Re: [MBZ] I *Think* I Bought a Car

[Dan Penoff]

Beats me.

He called and left me a voice mail yesterday afternoon. I started listening to 
it and only heard fair and $5800. At that point I shut off the phone, as 
there was nothing else for me to hear as far as I'm concerned.

I'm sort of meh about this car, mainly due to the model year (1996) and it 
being at the very top end of my budget.  He's had it for sale for at least a 
month if not more, and I'm the only person who has shown an interest according 
to him. That should be a tell right there about the asking price, and I'm 
pretty sure he knows it.

I'm taking Curly's approach and not being in a hurry. I'll find the right car 
eventually.  If I end up with the S320 from the diplomatic guy in Sarasota I'll 
be happy.  He gets back on the 9th, which is this coming Thursday.  If not, 
there will be others, I'm sure.

Dan

Sent from my iPad

 On Apr 2, 2015, at 10:19 PM, Mitch Haley mi...@mitchellhaley.com wrote:
 
 Dan Penoff wrote:
 
 the recent repair bill from eurotech-automotive.com in Spring Hill Fla. 
 (352) 597-2660 will be included for your records..Tom
 I'm assuming that's a Yes?
 
 It's not a definitive statement, but it sounds like a continued argument for 
 applying the bill to the price of the car...
 
 Mitch.
 
 ___
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 To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
 http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
 

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Re: [MBZ] I *Think* I Bought a Car

[Dan Penoff]

That was my point in #1.  There are rare occasions where it makes sense to have 
some leeway.

Dan

Sent from my iPad

 On Apr 3, 2015, at 11:33 AM, Andrew Strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com wrote:
 
 OTOH, if you're searching for a very rare/hard to find model - or even a
 pretty color (also rare) that makes your pulse race - you may need to bend
 the rules a bit.
 
 On Fri, Apr 3, 2015 at 11:13 AM, Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com wrote:
 
 It comes down to two things:
 
 1.) Setting limits. It's always easy to think, Just another couple
 hundred dollars and I can have this!  That approach often ends up poorly.
 While I certainly understand that reaching beyond expectations for a
 one-time deal or something that far exceeds what I was really looking for
 is a possibility, I try to stick to my guns when I set a price limit.
 Doing otherwise is a decision you're going to deal with every time you see
 the car and get behind the wheel.  I don't care for that kind of angst,
 thank you.

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Re: [MBZ] I *Think* I Bought a Car

[Andrew Strasfogel]

OTOH, if you're searching for a very rare/hard to find model - or even a
pretty color (also rare) that makes your pulse race - you may need to bend
the rules a bit.

On Fri, Apr 3, 2015 at 11:13 AM, Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com wrote:

 It comes down to two things:

 1.) Setting limits. It's always easy to think, Just another couple
 hundred dollars and I can have this!  That approach often ends up poorly.
 While I certainly understand that reaching beyond expectations for a
 one-time deal or something that far exceeds what I was really looking for
 is a possibility, I try to stick to my guns when I set a price limit.
 Doing otherwise is a decision you're going to deal with every time you see
 the car and get behind the wheel.  I don't care for that kind of angst,
 thank you.

 2.) The willingness to walk away.  Just as we spoke about this recently
 with someone's car purchase (Rich?) the willingness to walk away is a
 strong incentive for the motivated seller. Will the Goodfellows guy come
 back and meet my price? Maybe. Knowing we were within $300 dollars has got
 to be a motivation for him, especially if he's serious about selling. If
 so, he'll call me back. If not, I know where I stand and am comfortable in
 my decision as to the value of the car (to me.). If I decide to relent
 later I now know his price, if he's willing to sell at that point.

 There's a really good book on negotiating that I read some years back. I
 was also sent to the course the author still teaches, I believe.  It's
 called, Negotiate to Close by Alex Karras.  Lots of really good
 information that can be applied to many different situations.

 Dan

 Sent from my iPad

  On Apr 3, 2015, at 10:48 AM, Andrew Strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com
 wrote:
 
  Reminds me of the old adage espoused by cool college dudes when dating
  coeds:  Treat 'em mean, keep 'em keen.
 
  On Fri, Apr 3, 2015 at 5:39 AM, Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com wrote:
 
  Beats me.
 
  He called and left me a voice mail yesterday afternoon. I started
  listening to it and only heard fair and $5800. At that point I shut
 off
  the phone, as there was nothing else for me to hear as far as I'm
 concerned.
 
  I'm sort of meh about this car, mainly due to the model year (1996)
 and
  it being at the very top end of my budget.  He's had it for sale for at
  least a month if not more, and I'm the only person who has shown an
  interest according to him. That should be a tell right there about the
  asking price, and I'm pretty sure he knows it.
 
  I'm taking Curly's approach and not being in a hurry. I'll find the
 right
  car eventually.  If I end up with the S320 from the diplomatic guy in
  Sarasota I'll be happy.  He gets back on the 9th, which is this coming
  Thursday.  If not, there will be others, I'm sure.
 
  Dan
 
  Sent from my iPad
 
  On Apr 2, 2015, at 10:19 PM, Mitch Haley mi...@mitchellhaley.com
  wrote:
 
  Dan Penoff wrote:
 
  the recent repair bill from eurotech-automotive.com in Spring Hill
  Fla. (352) 597-2660 will be included for your records..Tom
  I'm assuming that's a Yes?
 
  It's not a definitive statement, but it sounds like a continued
 argument
  for applying the bill to the price of the car...
 
  Mitch.
 
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Re: [MBZ] I *Think* I Bought a Car

[Mitch Haley]

Dan Penoff wrote:


the recent repair bill from eurotech-automotive.com in Spring Hill Fla. (352) 
597-2660 will be included for your records..Tom

I'm assuming that's a Yes?



It's not a definitive statement, but it sounds like a continued argument for 
applying the bill to the price of the car...


Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] I *Think* I Bought a Car

[Dan Penoff]

This guy is like someone out of Goodfellows.

Dan


 On Apr 2, 2015, at 8:35 AM, dsereta...@yahoo.com wrote:
 
 The heat fried their brains?:)
 
 Sent from my iPhone
 
 On Apr 2, 2015, at 8:33 AM, Kaleb C. Striplin ka...@striplin.net wrote:
 
 People in Florida are weirdos 
 
 Sent from my iPhone
 
 On Apr 2, 2015, at 6:08 AM, Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com wrote:
 
 Strange, very strange...
 
 I sent an email to the owner of the 1996 S320 I looked at last weekend:
 
 http://tampa.craigslist.org/hdo/cto/4947867972.html
 
 I thanked him for his time, told him what a nice car he had, then proceeded 
 to lay out why spending $2500+ on a car for maintenance doesn't increase 
 the value substantially. Then I made him an offer of $5500 and told him I 
 would understand if he couldn't accept it.
 
 So late last night he replies to my email:
 
 the recent repair bill from eurotech-automotive.com in Spring Hill Fla. 
 (352) 597-2660 will be included for your records..Tom
 
 I'm assuming that's a Yes?
 
 Confused Dan
 
 
 Sent from my iPad
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Re: [MBZ] I *Think* I Bought a Car

[Dan Penoff]

I'll say.

Dan


 On Apr 2, 2015, at 8:33 AM, Kaleb C. Striplin ka...@striplin.net wrote:
 
 People in Florida are weirdos 
 
 Sent from my iPhone
 
 On Apr 2, 2015, at 6:08 AM, Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com wrote:
 
 Strange, very strange...
 
 I sent an email to the owner of the 1996 S320 I looked at last weekend:
 
 http://tampa.craigslist.org/hdo/cto/4947867972.html
 
 I thanked him for his time, told him what a nice car he had, then proceeded 
 to lay out why spending $2500+ on a car for maintenance doesn't increase the 
 value substantially. Then I made him an offer of $5500 and told him I would 
 understand if he couldn't accept it.
 
 So late last night he replies to my email:
 
 the recent repair bill from eurotech-automotive.com in Spring Hill Fla. 
 (352) 597-2660 will be included for your records..Tom
 
 I'm assuming that's a Yes?
 
 Confused Dan
 
 
 Sent from my iPad
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[MBZ] I *Think* I Bought a Car

[Dan Penoff]

Strange, very strange...

I sent an email to the owner of the 1996 S320 I looked at last weekend:

http://tampa.craigslist.org/hdo/cto/4947867972.html

I thanked him for his time, told him what a nice car he had, then proceeded to 
lay out why spending $2500+ on a car for maintenance doesn't increase the value 
substantially. Then I made him an offer of $5500 and told him I would 
understand if he couldn't accept it.

So late last night he replies to my email:

the recent repair bill from eurotech-automotive.com in Spring Hill Fla. (352) 
597-2660 will be included for your records..Tom

I'm assuming that's a Yes?

Confused Dan
 

Sent from my iPad
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Re: [MBZ] I *Think* I Bought a Car

[Kaleb C. Striplin]

People in Florida are weirdos 

Sent from my iPhone

 On Apr 2, 2015, at 6:08 AM, Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com wrote:
 
 Strange, very strange...
 
 I sent an email to the owner of the 1996 S320 I looked at last weekend:
 
 http://tampa.craigslist.org/hdo/cto/4947867972.html
 
 I thanked him for his time, told him what a nice car he had, then proceeded 
 to lay out why spending $2500+ on a car for maintenance doesn't increase the 
 value substantially. Then I made him an offer of $5500 and told him I would 
 understand if he couldn't accept it.
 
 So late last night he replies to my email:
 
 the recent repair bill from eurotech-automotive.com in Spring Hill Fla. 
 (352) 597-2660 will be included for your records..Tom
 
 I'm assuming that's a Yes?
 
 Confused Dan
 
 
 Sent from my iPad
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Re: [MBZ] I *Think* I Bought a Car

[dseretakis]

The heat fried their brains?:)

Sent from my iPhone

 On Apr 2, 2015, at 8:33 AM, Kaleb C. Striplin ka...@striplin.net wrote:
 
 People in Florida are weirdos 
 
 Sent from my iPhone
 
 On Apr 2, 2015, at 6:08 AM, Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com wrote:
 
 Strange, very strange...
 
 I sent an email to the owner of the 1996 S320 I looked at last weekend:
 
 http://tampa.craigslist.org/hdo/cto/4947867972.html
 
 I thanked him for his time, told him what a nice car he had, then proceeded 
 to lay out why spending $2500+ on a car for maintenance doesn't increase the 
 value substantially. Then I made him an offer of $5500 and told him I would 
 understand if he couldn't accept it.
 
 So late last night he replies to my email:
 
 the recent repair bill from eurotech-automotive.com in Spring Hill Fla. 
 (352) 597-2660 will be included for your records..Tom
 
 I'm assuming that's a Yes?
 
 Confused Dan
 
 
 Sent from my iPad
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Re: [MBZ] I *Think* I Bought a Car

[Dan Penoff]

Heh. They weren't in it when I saw the car. I was a little disappointed.  He 
had a set of the clear all weather ones in it.

Dan

Sent from my iPad

 On Apr 2, 2015, at 11:03 AM, Rich Thomas 
 richthomas79td...@constructivity.net wrote:
 
 Make sure he leaves the floor mats in
 
 --R
 

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Re: [MBZ] I *Think* I Bought a Car

[Rich Thomas]

Make sure he leaves the floor mats in

--R



On 4/2/15 7:08 AM, Dan Penoff wrote:

Strange, very strange...

I sent an email to the owner of the 1996 S320 I looked at last weekend:

http://tampa.craigslist.org/hdo/cto/4947867972.html

I thanked him for his time, told him what a nice car he had, then proceeded to 
lay out why spending $2500+ on a car for maintenance doesn't increase the value 
substantially. Then I made him an offer of $5500 and told him I would 
understand if he couldn't accept it.

So late last night he replies to my email:

the recent repair bill from eurotech-automotive.com in Spring Hill Fla. (352) 
597-2660 will be included for your records..Tom

I'm assuming that's a Yes?

Confused Dan
  


Sent from my iPad
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Re: [MBZ] I *Think* I Bought a Car

[Rich Thomas]

$500 deduction right there.  You wanna roll like a goomba you gotta have 
the mats


--R



On 4/2/15 11:10 AM, Dan Penoff wrote:

Heh. They weren't in it when I saw the car. I was a little disappointed.  He 
had a set of the clear all weather ones in it.

Dan

Sent from my iPad


On Apr 2, 2015, at 11:03 AM, Rich Thomas richthomas79td...@constructivity.net 
wrote:

Make sure he leaves the floor mats in

--R


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Re: [MBZ] I *Think* I Bought a Car

[Rick Knoble]

‎Kaleb C. Striplin ka...@striplin.net wrote:
 
 People in Florida are weirdos 


Germany or Florida? 

Rick 
Sent from my BlackBerry Z10

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Re: [MBZ] I *Think* I Bought a Car

[Dan Penoff]

Are we playing that game now?

Dan

Sent from my iPad

 On Apr 2, 2015, at 9:19 AM, Rick Knoble rickkno...@hotmail.com wrote:
 
 ‎Kaleb C. Striplin ka...@striplin.net wrote:
  
 People in Florida are weirdos 
 
 
 Germany or Florida? 
 
 Rick 
 Sent from my BlackBerry Z10
 
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Re: [MBZ] I *Think* I Bought a Car

[WILTON]

Great!  'Hope it goes well.

Wilton

- Original Message - 
From: Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com

To: Okie Benz mercedes@okiebenz.com
Sent: Thursday, April 02, 2015 7:08 AM
Subject: [MBZ] I *Think* I Bought a Car



Strange, very strange...

I sent an email to the owner of the 1996 S320 I looked at last weekend:

http://tampa.craigslist.org/hdo/cto/4947867972.html

I thanked him for his time, told him what a nice car he had, then 
proceeded to lay out why spending $2500+ on a car for maintenance doesn't 
increase the value substantially. Then I made him an offer of $5500 and 
told him I would understand if he couldn't accept it.


So late last night he replies to my email:

the recent repair bill from eurotech-automotive.com in Spring Hill Fla. 
(352) 597-2660 will be included for your records..Tom


I'm assuming that's a Yes?

Confused Dan


Sent from my iPad
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Re: [MBZ] I *Think* I Bought a Car

[Andrew Strasfogel]

Did you ever ask what it would take to make the car 100 percent
mechanically and cosmetically perfect?

On Thu, Apr 2, 2015 at 11:26 AM, Rich Thomas 
richthomas79td...@constructivity.net wrote:

 $500 deduction right there.  You wanna roll like a goomba you gotta have
 the mats

 --R




 On 4/2/15 11:10 AM, Dan Penoff wrote:

 Heh. They weren't in it when I saw the car. I was a little disappointed.
 He had a set of the clear all weather ones in it.

 Dan

 Sent from my iPad

  On Apr 2, 2015, at 11:03 AM, Rich Thomas richthomas79TD300@
 constructivity.net wrote:

 Make sure he leaves the floor mats in

 --R

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Re: [MBZ] I *Think* I Bought a Car

[Andrew Strasfogel]

Just don't end up with TWO cars if each party accepts your offer.

On Thu, Apr 2, 2015 at 1:23 PM, Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com wrote:

 Not necessary. He was in the process of doing it

 Got an email from him. He wants to compromise at $5800.

 I told him thanks, but no, I don't negotiate, I offer what I think is fair
 and what the car is worth to me.  Not totally true, as I would negotiate if
 I thought the car was worth it, but I don't.

 We'll see.

 I still have the former State Department guy in Sarasota coming back on
 the 9th.  Ironically, the way things seem to be going I may very well end
 up with that car. Not a bad thing, but if I hadn't waffled on it to begin
 with I would have been driving it for the last three weeks...

 Dan

 Sent from my iPad

  On Apr 2, 2015, at 1:02 PM, Andrew Strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com
 wrote:
 
  Did you ever ask what it would take to make the car 100 percent
  mechanically and cosmetically perfect?
 
  On Thu, Apr 2, 2015 at 11:26 AM, Rich Thomas 
  richthomas79td...@constructivity.net wrote:
 
  $500 deduction right there.  You wanna roll like a goomba you gotta have
  the mats
 
  --R
 
 
 
 
  On 4/2/15 11:10 AM, Dan Penoff wrote:
 
  Heh. They weren't in it when I saw the car. I was a little
 disappointed.
  He had a set of the clear all weather ones in it.
 
  Dan
 
  Sent from my iPad
 
  On Apr 2, 2015, at 11:03 AM, Rich Thomas richthomas79TD300@
  constructivity.net wrote:
 
  Make sure he leaves the floor mats in
 
  --R
 
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Re: [MBZ] I *Think* I Bought a Car

[Dan Penoff]

Not necessary. He was in the process of doing it

Got an email from him. He wants to compromise at $5800.

I told him thanks, but no, I don't negotiate, I offer what I think is fair and 
what the car is worth to me.  Not totally true, as I would negotiate if I 
thought the car was worth it, but I don't.

We'll see.

I still have the former State Department guy in Sarasota coming back on the 
9th.  Ironically, the way things seem to be going I may very well end up with 
that car. Not a bad thing, but if I hadn't waffled on it to begin with I would 
have been driving it for the last three weeks...

Dan

Sent from my iPad

 On Apr 2, 2015, at 1:02 PM, Andrew Strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com wrote:
 
 Did you ever ask what it would take to make the car 100 percent
 mechanically and cosmetically perfect?
 
 On Thu, Apr 2, 2015 at 11:26 AM, Rich Thomas 
 richthomas79td...@constructivity.net wrote:
 
 $500 deduction right there.  You wanna roll like a goomba you gotta have
 the mats
 
 --R
 
 
 
 
 On 4/2/15 11:10 AM, Dan Penoff wrote:
 
 Heh. They weren't in it when I saw the car. I was a little disappointed.
 He had a set of the clear all weather ones in it.
 
 Dan
 
 Sent from my iPad
 
 On Apr 2, 2015, at 11:03 AM, Rich Thomas richthomas79TD300@
 constructivity.net wrote:
 
 Make sure he leaves the floor mats in
 
 --R
 
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Re: [MBZ] I *Think* I Bought a Car

[Dan Penoff]

I turned him down, so I'm off the hook with the Goodfellows guy.  Unless, of 
course, he makes me an offer I can't refuse.

Dan

Sent from my iPad

 On Apr 2, 2015, at 1:26 PM, Andrew Strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com wrote:
 
 Just don't end up with TWO cars if each party accepts your offer.
 
 

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Re: [MBZ] I think curt or somebody needs this

[clay]

Local crawlers are pretty stuck on the 617 NA.  It has enough power to get them 
where they want, no turbo to mess things up, and easy to fit.  The only guys 
using a VW diesel are in the suzuki Samurai.  That is a really good match of HP 
to weight.

clay

On Oct 5, 2013, at 2:05 PM, Curt Raymond wrote:

 Interesting idea, poor implementation. Besides in many places it'll never be 
 legal to have that old an engine in that new a truck. Not here for sure.
 
 Actually now that I've crossed to the dark side I see everything in terms of 
 a VW diesel. You can build one of the 90HP engines up to 150HP pretty easily 
 with a chip, bigger injectors and a bigger IP and maybe intercooler. The 
 engine is so small and light you don't face the issues there that you do with 
 an MB diesel and you keep your power to weight ratio much more positive. 
 Theres a guy thats done a CJ7 that came out real nice. I think after my Jetta 
 rusts out thats my plan, find a CJ, put a kevlar tub (lighter than steel, 
 stronger than fiberglass) on it and the VW diesel in with some minor power 
 mods. 31 tires, 5spd trans, lockers front and rear. A moderately powerful 
 4wd with decent offroad capability that I can actually afford fuel for.
 
 Speaking of which I commuted with the Jetta this past week, 560 miles or so. 
 I fueled up twice, once because I had to once because we're on vacation and I 
 wanted it full. First tank was 48mpg, second was 52mpg. I think 55mpg should 
 be achievable, that first tank I was flogging the car to see how it would 
 hold up (well, in part because its a fun car to drive) the second I slowed 
 down and tried not to go over 75mph.
 
 -Curt
 
 Date: Fri, 4 Oct 2013 20:04:28 -0500
 From: Kaleb C. Striplin kaleb.strip...@drivedominion.com
 To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
 Subject: [MBZ] I think curt or somebody needs this
 Message-ID: 2a224bb2-a150-4810-920d-857127a5b...@drivedominion.com
 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
 
 
 http://joplin.craigslist.org/cto/4109030244.html
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Re: [MBZ] I think curt or somebody needs this

[Fmiser]

 Mitch wrote:
 
 Kaleb C. Striplin wrote:
  http://joplin.craigslist.org/cto/4109030244.html
 
 I take it they don't smog test 1997 vehicles in MO?

Emission testing is only in and around St. Louis and Kansas City
and last I checked for cars newer than 1969.  The rest of the state
has only safety inspections every two years.

--  Philip

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Re: [MBZ] I think curt or somebody needs this

[tom savage]

 Emission testing is only in and around St. Louis and Kansas City
 and last I checked for cars newer than 1969.  The rest of the state
 has only safety inspections every two years.


As of a few years ago, only the St Louis area and only 1996 and newer
vehicles (1997 and up for diesels). It is just an OBD-II flash so only a
worry for the sort of folks who accept a check engine light as normal.

In other words, it is the bare minimum required by the Clean Air Act as a
nonattainment area.

Tom
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Re: [MBZ] I think curt or somebody needs this

[Curt Raymond]

Interesting idea, poor implementation. Besides in many places it'll never be 
legal to have that old an engine in that new a truck. Not here for sure.

Actually now that I've crossed to the dark side I see everything in terms of a 
VW diesel. You can build one of the 90HP engines up to 150HP pretty easily with 
a chip, bigger injectors and a bigger IP and maybe intercooler. The engine is 
so small and light you don't face the issues there that you do with an MB 
diesel and you keep your power to weight ratio much more positive. Theres a guy 
thats done a CJ7 that came out real nice. I think after my Jetta rusts out 
thats my plan, find a CJ, put a kevlar tub (lighter than steel, stronger than 
fiberglass) on it and the VW diesel in with some minor power mods. 31 tires, 
5spd trans, lockers front and rear. A moderately powerful 4wd with decent 
offroad capability that I can actually afford fuel for.

Speaking of which I commuted with the Jetta this past week, 560 miles or so. I 
fueled up twice, once because I had to once because we're on vacation and I 
wanted it full. First tank was 48mpg, second was 52mpg. I think 55mpg should be 
achievable, that first tank I was flogging the car to see how it would hold up 
(well, in part because its a fun car to drive) the second I slowed down and 
tried not to go over 75mph.

-Curt

Date: Fri, 4 Oct 2013 20:04:28 -0500
From: Kaleb C. Striplin kaleb.strip...@drivedominion.com
To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Subject: [MBZ] I think curt or somebody needs this
Message-ID: 2a224bb2-a150-4810-920d-857127a5b...@drivedominion.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii


http://joplin.craigslist.org/cto/4109030244.html
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Re: [MBZ] I think curt or somebody needs this

[WILTON]

ATTABOY!

Wilt

- Original Message - 
From: Curt Raymond curtlud...@yahoo.com

To: Diesel List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Sent: Saturday, October 05, 2013 5:05 PM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] I think curt or somebody needs this


Interesting idea, poor implementation. Besides in many places it'll never 
be legal to have that old an engine in that new a truck. Not here for 
sure.


Actually now that I've crossed to the dark side I see everything in terms 
of a VW diesel. You can build one of the 90HP engines up to 150HP pretty 
easily with a chip, bigger injectors and a bigger IP and maybe 
intercooler. The engine is so small and light you don't face the issues 
there that you do with an MB diesel and you keep your power to weight 
ratio much more positive. Theres a guy thats done a CJ7 that came out real 
nice. I think after my Jetta rusts out thats my plan, find a CJ, put a 
kevlar tub (lighter than steel, stronger than fiberglass) on it and the VW 
diesel in with some minor power mods. 31 tires, 5spd trans, lockers front 
and rear. A moderately powerful 4wd with decent offroad capability that I 
can actually afford fuel for.


Speaking of which I commuted with the Jetta this past week, 560 miles or 
so. I fueled up twice, once because I had to once because we're on 
vacation and I wanted it full. First tank was 48mpg, second was 52mpg. I 
think 55mpg should be achievable, that first tank I was flogging the car 
to see how it would hold up (well, in part because its a fun car to drive) 
the second I slowed down and tried not to go over 75mph.


-Curt

Date: Fri, 4 Oct 2013 20:04:28 -0500
From: Kaleb C. Striplin kaleb.strip...@drivedominion.com
To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Subject: [MBZ] I think curt or somebody needs this
Message-ID: 2a224bb2-a150-4810-920d-857127a5b...@drivedominion.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii


http://joplin.craigslist.org/cto/4109030244.html
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[MBZ] I think curt or somebody needs this

[Kaleb C. Striplin]

http://joplin.craigslist.org/cto/4109030244.html


Sent from my iPhone

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Re: [MBZ] I think curt or somebody needs this

[Mitch Haley]

Kaleb C. Striplin wrote:

http://joplin.craigslist.org/cto/4109030244.html


I take it they don't smog test 1997 vehicles in MO?

Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] I think curt or somebody needs this

[Kaleb C. Striplin]

Uh no

Sent from my iPhone

On Oct 4, 2013, at 9:42 PM, Mitch Haley m...@voyager.net wrote:

 Kaleb C. Striplin wrote:
 http://joplin.craigslist.org/cto/4109030244.html
 
 I take it they don't smog test 1997 vehicles in MO?
 
 Mitch.
 
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Re: [MBZ] I think I need this

[Rich Thomas]

On their facebook posting the other day

--R

On 6/30/13 6:56 PM, Jaime Kopchinski wrote:

Did you make this up or did they really write that somewhere?!

Jaime



On Sun, Jun 30, 2013 at 10:27 AM, Rich Thomas 
richthomas79td...@constructivity.net wrote:


  If it can't pick up a GPS signal, the all-new S-Class can
  actually determine where it is based in part on the sun's
  position in the sky. Now that's a bright idea.

  Learn more in our S-Class app: http://shout.lt/h1hs


--R

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Re: [MBZ] I think I need this

[Tim Crone]

On Sun, Jun 30, 2013 at 11:19 AM, Mitch Haley m...@voyager.net wrote:

 WILTON wrote:

 OK, I saw the key two words the second time I read it - in part.  Sun
 can give you only ONE line of positions (LOP) - a huge circle on the
 earth; ya gotta know about where ya are for this info to be any good, i. e.
 - dead reckoning (RD), for example - projecting info from last known
 position to reckon/guess present position.  Using old info plus sun LOP,
 you can reckon/guess a most probable position MPP - lot better than
 nothing and is neat, anyway - handheld astrotracker.  Now, if it could
 track stars --. ;)


 Well, if you know the time, date, and position of the sun...
 I can imagine the car knowing the time and date to some fraction of a
 second, but would it know the angle of the sun well enough to locate itself
 within 200 miles or so?


When you lose your GPS signal, you:
 - know where you are right now, including time, trajectory, and speed
 - know where the sun is, including which direction it is
 - know what time it is and where the sun is headed relative to your exact
location

Seems like it would be trivial to calculate, from light monitoring, which
direction the car is turning; you still know speed and time, so it seems
like it would be fairly simple to calculate a reasonably accurate course.

That said I've never lost GPS when I was in a place where the sun was
visible.

Best,
Tim
no LORAN in cars?
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Re: [MBZ] I think I need this

[Tim Crone]

On Mon, Jul 1, 2013 at 10:52 AM, Tim Crone bb...@crone.us wrote:


 Seems like it would be trivial to calculate, from light monitoring, which
 direction the car is turning; you still know speed and time, so it seems
 like it would be fairly simple to calculate a reasonably accurate course.


And -that- said, why not just use a compass and gyroscope?  You've got
initial location, speed, direction, seems like you could figure out
elevation changes.  Of course if you always know where you are then the GPS
is just a check anyway. :)

Best,
-Tim
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Re: [MBZ] I think I need this

[Mitch Haley]

Tim Crone wrote:


That said I've never lost GPS when I was in a place where the sun was
visible.


Bingo! GPS and sun position are both line of sight.

Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] I think I need this

[Jaime Kopchinski]

You caught the biggest issue here, Tim... if you have visible sun, you
almost certainly have visibility to at least a few GPS satellites.

But generally, in car navigation uses three things for positioning:  GPS,
Wheel speed, and a gyroscope.  Between these there, positioning is very
accurate even in challenging situations like in tunnels, inner city, etc.
Even without GPS signal, a well calibrated system will keep its position
very well for a long time.

This is one huge advantage over the PND dash-top units that rely only on
GPS.

Jaime



On Mon, Jul 1, 2013 at 10:52 AM, Tim Crone bb...@crone.us wrote:

 On Sun, Jun 30, 2013 at 11:19 AM, Mitch Haley m...@voyager.net wrote:

  WILTON wrote:
 
  OK, I saw the key two words the second time I read it - in part.  Sun
  can give you only ONE line of positions (LOP) - a huge circle on the
  earth; ya gotta know about where ya are for this info to be any good,
 i. e.
  - dead reckoning (RD), for example - projecting info from last known
  position to reckon/guess present position.  Using old info plus sun LOP,
  you can reckon/guess a most probable position MPP - lot better than
  nothing and is neat, anyway - handheld astrotracker.  Now, if it could
  track stars --. ;)
 
 
  Well, if you know the time, date, and position of the sun...
  I can imagine the car knowing the time and date to some fraction of a
  second, but would it know the angle of the sun well enough to locate
 itself
  within 200 miles or so?


 When you lose your GPS signal, you:
  - know where you are right now, including time, trajectory, and speed
  - know where the sun is, including which direction it is
  - know what time it is and where the sun is headed relative to your exact
 location

 Seems like it would be trivial to calculate, from light monitoring, which
 direction the car is turning; you still know speed and time, so it seems
 like it would be fairly simple to calculate a reasonably accurate course.

 That said I've never lost GPS when I was in a place where the sun was
 visible.

 Best,
 Tim
 no LORAN in cars?
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-- 
Jaime Kopchinski
http://www.jaimekop.com/
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Re: [MBZ] I think I need this

[Rich Thomas]

I always know where I am, sometimes just not in relation to some other place

--R  (wherever you go, there you are!)

On 7/1/13 11:06 AM, Jaime Kopchinski wrote:

You caught the biggest issue here, Tim... if you have visible sun, you
almost certainly have visibility to at least a few GPS satellites.

But generally, in car navigation uses three things for positioning:  GPS,
Wheel speed, and a gyroscope.  Between these there, positioning is very
accurate even in challenging situations like in tunnels, inner city, etc.
Even without GPS signal, a well calibrated system will keep its position
very well for a long time.

This is one huge advantage over the PND dash-top units that rely only on
GPS.

Jaime



On Mon, Jul 1, 2013 at 10:52 AM, Tim Crone bb...@crone.us wrote:


On Sun, Jun 30, 2013 at 11:19 AM, Mitch Haley m...@voyager.net wrote:


WILTON wrote:


OK, I saw the key two words the second time I read it - in part.  Sun
can give you only ONE line of positions (LOP) - a huge circle on the
earth; ya gotta know about where ya are for this info to be any good,

i. e.

- dead reckoning (RD), for example - projecting info from last known
position to reckon/guess present position.  Using old info plus sun LOP,
you can reckon/guess a most probable position MPP - lot better than
nothing and is neat, anyway - handheld astrotracker.  Now, if it could
track stars --. ;)


Well, if you know the time, date, and position of the sun...
I can imagine the car knowing the time and date to some fraction of a
second, but would it know the angle of the sun well enough to locate

itself

within 200 miles or so?


When you lose your GPS signal, you:
  - know where you are right now, including time, trajectory, and speed
  - know where the sun is, including which direction it is
  - know what time it is and where the sun is headed relative to your exact
location

Seems like it would be trivial to calculate, from light monitoring, which
direction the car is turning; you still know speed and time, so it seems
like it would be fairly simple to calculate a reasonably accurate course.

That said I've never lost GPS when I was in a place where the sun was
visible.

Best,
Tim
no LORAN in cars?
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Re: [MBZ] I think I need this

[Jim Cathey]

--R  (wherever you go, there you are!)


No, no, no, don't tug on that!

-- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] I think I need this

[Alex Chamberlain]

On Mon, Jul 1, 2013 at 8:35 AM, Jim Cathey j...@windwireless.net wrote:

 --R  (wherever you go, there you are!)


 No, no, no, don't tug on that!


You never know what it might be attached to...
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Re: [MBZ] I think I need this

[WILTON]

That's right; that's good DR'ing - ded reckoning; gives you Probable 
Position (PP); add a sun line to it and you get a Most Probable Position 
(MP - a little better than just DR), but still not a Fix (known position). 
Cross a sun line with a bearing from another object of known location (star 
or earth-bound object) and one can get a Fix (know position).  Course, in an 
earth-bound vehicle, one can usually look out the window at a known 
object/address and get a Fix - sometimes not possible if ya don't recognize 
what you're seeing.   ;)


Wilton

- Original Message - 
From: Tim Crone bb...@crone.us

To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Sent: Monday, July 01, 2013 10:52 AM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] I think I need this



On Sun, Jun 30, 2013 at 11:19 AM, Mitch Haley m...@voyager.net wrote:


WILTON wrote:


OK, I saw the key two words the second time I read it - in part.  Sun
can give you only ONE line of positions (LOP) - a huge circle on the
earth; ya gotta know about where ya are for this info to be any good, i. 
e.

- dead reckoning (RD), for example - projecting info from last known
position to reckon/guess present position.  Using old info plus sun LOP,
you can reckon/guess a most probable position MPP - lot better than
nothing and is neat, anyway - handheld astrotracker.  Now, if it could
track stars --. ;)



Well, if you know the time, date, and position of the sun...
I can imagine the car knowing the time and date to some fraction of a
second, but would it know the angle of the sun well enough to locate 
itself

within 200 miles or so?



When you lose your GPS signal, you:
- know where you are right now, including time, trajectory, and speed
- know where the sun is, including which direction it is
- know what time it is and where the sun is headed relative to your exact
location

Seems like it would be trivial to calculate, from light monitoring, which
direction the car is turning; you still know speed and time, so it seems
like it would be fairly simple to calculate a reasonably accurate course.

That said I've never lost GPS when I was in a place where the sun was
visible.

Best,
Tim
no LORAN in cars?
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Re: [MBZ] I think I need this

[WILTON]

Yep; gyro makes course a little more accurate.

Wilton

- Original Message - 
From: Tim Crone bb...@crone.us

To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Sent: Monday, July 01, 2013 10:56 AM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] I think I need this



On Mon, Jul 1, 2013 at 10:52 AM, Tim Crone bb...@crone.us wrote:



Seems like it would be trivial to calculate, from light monitoring, which
direction the car is turning; you still know speed and time, so it seems
like it would be fairly simple to calculate a reasonably accurate course.



And -that- said, why not just use a compass and gyroscope?  You've got
initial location, speed, direction, seems like you could figure out
elevation changes.  Of course if you always know where you are then the 
GPS

is just a check anyway. :)

Best,
-Tim
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Re: [MBZ] I think I need this

[Alex Chamberlain]

On Mon, Jul 1, 2013 at 9:13 AM, WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com wrote:

 Course, in an earth-bound vehicle, one can usually look out the window at
 a known object/address and get a Fix - sometimes not possible if ya don't
 recognize what you're seeing.   ;)


Hence the fun of http://geoguessr.com/ ...

Alex
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Re: [MBZ] I think I need this

[Craig]

On Mon, 1 Jul 2013 11:06:47 -0400 Jaime Kopchinski jaime...@gmail.com
wrote:

 You caught the biggest issue here, Tim... if you have visible sun, you
 almost certainly have visibility to at least a few GPS satellites.
 
 But generally, in car navigation uses three things for positioning:
 GPS, Wheel speed, and a gyroscope.  Between these there, positioning is
 very accurate even in challenging situations like in tunnels, inner
 city, etc. Even without GPS signal, a well calibrated system will keep
 its position very well for a long time.
 
 This is one huge advantage over the PND dash-top units that rely only on
 GPS.

PND?


Craig

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Re: [MBZ] I think I need this

[OK Don]

PND = Personal Navigation Device?

OK Don, whose PND in the Cessna brought us from 120 miles out to ringt over
the center of the home runway - we were impressed, given that it is one of
the least expensive available.
On Mon, Jul 1, 2013 at 1:28 PM, Craig diese...@pisquared.net wrote:


 
  This is one huge advantage over the PND dash-top units that rely only on
  GPS.

 PND?

 Craig



-- 
OK Don
2013 F150, 19 mpg
2012 Passat TDI DSG, 45 mpg
1957 C182A, 12 mpg - but at 150 mph!
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[MBZ] I think I need this

[Rich Thomas]

 If it can't pick up a GPS signal, the all-new S-Class can
 actually determine where it is based in part on the sun's
 position in the sky. Now that's a bright idea.

 Learn more in our S-Class app: http://shout.lt/h1hs


--R

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Re: [MBZ] I think I need this

[WILTON]

OK, I saw the key two words the second time I read it - in part.  Sun can 
give you only ONE line of positions (LOP) - a huge circle on the earth; ya 
gotta know about where ya are for this info to be any good, i. e. - dead 
reckoning (RD), for example - projecting info from last known position to 
reckon/guess present position.  Using old info plus sun LOP, you can 
reckon/guess a most probable position MPP - lot better than nothing and is 
neat, anyway - handheld astrotracker.  Now, if it could track stars --. 
;)


Wilton

- Original Message - 
From: Rich Thomas richthomas79td...@constructivity.net

To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013 10:27 AM
Subject: [MBZ] I think I need this




 If it can't pick up a GPS signal, the all-new S-Class can
 actually determine where it is based in part on the sun's
 position in the sky. Now that's a bright idea.

 Learn more in our S-Class app: http://shout.lt/h1hs


--R

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Re: [MBZ] I think I need this

[WILTON]

Well, I MEANT dead reckoning (DR).  It really comes from deduction 
reckoning and should be ded reckoning,  but everybody calls it dead, 
and, of course, it nearly is with all of the equipment these days carrying a 
running fix.  ;)


Wilton

- Original Message - 
From: WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com

To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013 11:05 AM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] I think I need this


OK, I saw the key two words the second time I read it - in part.  Sun 
can give you only ONE line of positions (LOP) - a huge circle on the 
earth; ya gotta know about where ya are for this info to be any good, i. 
e. - dead reckoning (RD), for example - projecting info from last known 
position to reckon/guess present position.  Using old info plus sun LOP, 
you can reckon/guess a most probable position MPP - lot better than 
nothing and is neat, anyway - handheld astrotracker.  Now, if it could 
track stars --. ;)


Wilton

- Original Message - 
From: Rich Thomas richthomas79td...@constructivity.net

To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013 10:27 AM
Subject: [MBZ] I think I need this




 If it can't pick up a GPS signal, the all-new S-Class can
 actually determine where it is based in part on the sun's
 position in the sky. Now that's a bright idea.

 Learn more in our S-Class app: http://shout.lt/h1hs


--R

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Re: [MBZ] I think I need this

[WILTON]

'Can't get site to open.  'Wonder if I can find the app?

Wilton

- Original Message - 
From: Rich Thomas richthomas79td...@constructivity.net

To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013 10:27 AM
Subject: [MBZ] I think I need this




 If it can't pick up a GPS signal, the all-new S-Class can
 actually determine where it is based in part on the sun's
 position in the sky. Now that's a bright idea.

 Learn more in our S-Class app: http://shout.lt/h1hs


--R

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Re: [MBZ] I think I need this

[Mitch Haley]

WILTON wrote:
OK, I saw the key two words the second time I read it - in part.  Sun 
can give you only ONE line of positions (LOP) - a huge circle on the 
earth; ya gotta know about where ya are for this info to be any good, i. 
e. - dead reckoning (RD), for example - projecting info from last known 
position to reckon/guess present position.  Using old info plus sun LOP, 
you can reckon/guess a most probable position MPP - lot better than 
nothing and is neat, anyway - handheld astrotracker.  Now, if it could 
track stars --. ;)


Well, if you know the time, date, and position of the sun...
I can imagine the car knowing the time and date to some fraction of a second, 
but would it know the angle of the sun well enough to locate itself within 200 
miles or so?


Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] I think I need this

[WILTON]

Just downloaded sun surveyor lite (free), one of 22 apps -others up to $20, 
etc.  Shows position of sun based on PP (present position).  Easy for it to 
do inverse based on possible position - info since last fix (known 
position).


Wilton

- Original Message - 
From: WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com

To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013 11:11 AM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] I think I need this


Well, I MEANT dead reckoning (DR).  It really comes from deduction 
reckoning and should be ded reckoning,  but everybody calls it dead, 
and, of course, it nearly is with all of the equipment these days carrying 
a running fix.  ;)


Wilton

- Original Message - 
From: WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com

To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013 11:05 AM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] I think I need this


OK, I saw the key two words the second time I read it - in part.  Sun 
can give you only ONE line of positions (LOP) - a huge circle on the 
earth; ya gotta know about where ya are for this info to be any good, i. 
e. - dead reckoning (RD), for example - projecting info from last known 
position to reckon/guess present position.  Using old info plus sun LOP, 
you can reckon/guess a most probable position MPP - lot better than 
nothing and is neat, anyway - handheld astrotracker.  Now, if it could 
track stars --. ;)


Wilton

- Original Message - 
From: Rich Thomas richthomas79td...@constructivity.net

To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013 10:27 AM
Subject: [MBZ] I think I need this




 If it can't pick up a GPS signal, the all-new S-Class can
 actually determine where it is based in part on the sun's
 position in the sky. Now that's a bright idea.

 Learn more in our S-Class app: http://shout.lt/h1hs


--R

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Re: [MBZ] I think I need this

[WILTON]

Yes.

Wilton

- Original Message - 
From: Mitch Haley m...@voyager.net

To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013 11:19 AM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] I think I need this



WILTON wrote:
OK, I saw the key two words the second time I read it - in part.  Sun 
can give you only ONE line of positions (LOP) - a huge circle on the 
earth; ya gotta know about where ya are for this info to be any good, i. 
e. - dead reckoning (RD), for example - projecting info from last known 
position to reckon/guess present position.  Using old info plus sun LOP, 
you can reckon/guess a most probable position MPP - lot better than 
nothing and is neat, anyway - handheld astrotracker.  Now, if it could 
track stars --. ;)


Well, if you know the time, date, and position of the sun...
I can imagine the car knowing the time and date to some fraction of a 
second, but would it know the angle of the sun well enough to locate 
itself within 200 miles or so?


Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] I think I need this

[Jaime Kopchinski]

Um... no.


On Sun, Jun 30, 2013 at 10:27 AM, Rich Thomas 
richthomas79td...@constructivity.net wrote:


  If it can't pick up a GPS signal, the all-new S-Class can
  actually determine where it is based in part on the sun's
  position in the sky. Now that's a bright idea.

  Learn more in our S-Class app: http://shout.lt/h1hs


 --R

 __**_
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 For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com
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 http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

 To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
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-- 
Jaime Kopchinski
http://www.jaimekop.com/
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Re: [MBZ] I think I need this

[Jaime Kopchinski]

Did you make this up or did they really write that somewhere?!

Jaime



On Sun, Jun 30, 2013 at 10:27 AM, Rich Thomas 
richthomas79td...@constructivity.net wrote:


  If it can't pick up a GPS signal, the all-new S-Class can
  actually determine where it is based in part on the sun's
  position in the sky. Now that's a bright idea.

  Learn more in our S-Class app: http://shout.lt/h1hs


 --R

 __**_
 http://www.okiebenz.com
 For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com
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 http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

 To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
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-- 
Jaime Kopchinski
http://www.jaimekop.com/
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Re: [MBZ] I think its the end

[Curt Raymond]

The thing everybody seems to not want to address is the coolant boiling out of 
the radiator neck...

I put both thermostats in a pan of water, they both begin opening around 165F 
(the old one maybe slightly sooner) and are fully open at 180F. If they're 
busted its in some manner that I can't see.

-Curt

Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2013 20:03:48 -0400
From: Mitch Haley m...@voyager.net
To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Subject: Re: [MBZ] I think its the end
Message-ID: 51be5264.9020...@voyager.net
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed

Curt, is there any chance the t-stat, if new, is defective, or if old, got 
fooked when you blew your head gasket?

Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] I think its the end

[Curt Raymond]

That would account for the overheat but not for the coolant bubbling out of the 
radiator.

I think Kevin's theory about a crack somewhere in the block (we went over the 
head carefully) is the mostly likely answer.

-Curt

Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2013 21:53:35 -0400
From: Mitch Haley m...@voyager.net
To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Subject: Re: [MBZ] I think its the end
Message-ID: 51be6c1f.5070...@voyager.net
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed

Does the water pump still have fins on the impeller?

Mitch.


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Re: [MBZ] I think its the end

[Dieselhead]

The thing everybody seems to not want to address is the coolant 
boiling out of the radiator neck...


I put both thermostats in a pan of water, they both begin opening 
around 165F (the old one maybe slightly sooner) and are fully open 
at 180F. If they're busted its in some manner that I can't see.


-Curt



Did the coolant boil out after burping and with a good cap on tight?


There was a thread some years ago with Herr Doktor where he advised 
us all to check our pressure caps and replace every other year on PM 
principle.  I don't know the fizzicks, or thmodynamics, but he 
assured us a mercedes (at least 123 or newer) with a faulty or loose 
radiator/coolant bottle cap will overheat.


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Re: [MBZ] I think its the end

[Craig]

On Sun, 16 Jun 2013 23:13:05 -0500 Benz Hogs benz-n-h...@gulseth.net
wrote:

 Find the bumpiest road you can and drive there with full heat running. 
 Stop periodically and refill the expansion tank every so often.  The 
 water pump and aux pumps will pump the system  full.

You are thinking OM60x, Curt has an OM616.


 Alternately, park the front wheels on ramps and fill through the top 
 radiator hose with the defrost running until it runs out of the
 radiator.

Now that will apply to a 240D.


Craig

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Re: [MBZ] I think its the end

[Michael Canfield]

Not always.  My 123 300d has been running just fine for near a year with a
crack in the seam of the coolant reservoir so it really holds no pressure
at all but does not overheat.

Mike
On Jun 17, 2013 10:20 AM, Dieselhead 126die...@gmail.com wrote:

 The thing everybody seems to not want to address is the coolant boiling
 out of the radiator neck...

 I put both thermostats in a pan of water, they both begin opening around
 165F (the old one maybe slightly sooner) and are fully open at 180F. If
 they're busted its in some manner that I can't see.

 -Curt



 Did the coolant boil out after burping and with a good cap on tight?


 There was a thread some years ago with Herr Doktor where he advised us all
 to check our pressure caps and replace every other year on PM principle.  I
 don't know the fizzicks, or thmodynamics, but he assured us a mercedes (at
 least 123 or newer) with a faulty or loose radiator/coolant bottle cap will
 overheat.

 __**_
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Re: [MBZ] I think its the end

[Curt Raymond]

Okay guys this madness has to end, none of you are apparently actually reading 
anything I write, you've all gotten hung up on the radiator cap.

Lets review the facts:

#1. '78 240D, no expansion tank, no aux pump.

#2. As soon as the car is started coolant starts bubbling out of the hood due 
to bubbles of gas pushing in there. When the car is shut off there is always 
one more big bubble of gas which will push around a cup of coolant off.

#3. The car overheats sitting running in the driveway. While I appreciate 
Luther's story it doesn't relate, the car should not overheat sitting in the 
driveway with the radiator cap off, if it did that would mean there couldn't 
possibly be enough cooling capacity to go on the highway ever.

#4. I drove 5,000 miles (most of it on the highway) with the radiator cap loose 
and the car didn't overheat.

#5. The car will push coolant past the radiator cap and still overheat.

#6. There is no cabin heat when running.

I would submit at this point that you can knock it off about the radiator cap, 
the radiator cap will not save this engine...

-Curt

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Re: [MBZ] I think its the end

[Curt Raymond]

I wonder if our failure to communicate is the difference between a 61x engine 
like my 616 and a 60x engine.

Everybody who has offered up tales of woe from a bad or loose pressure cap has 
talked about a 60x engine. I wonder if that engine has water passages that only 
get accessed with pressure.

Certainly when I put the new radiator in my 240D last fall I could run it up to 
temp with no radiator cap.

You guys do see me writing RADIATOR CAP right? Its in the radiator, right 
smack in the middle, there is no overflow bottle. Excess coolant goes out on 
the ground.

-Curt

Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2013 10:24:24 -0400
From: Michael Canfield slozuk...@gmail.com
To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Subject: Re: [MBZ] I think its the end
Message-ID:
CALHJ_1BNYV37_2DErg=wcuqgc2pu5qowx0pc_guznblq4jc...@mail.gmail.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

Not always.  My 123 300d has been running just fine for near a year with a
crack in the seam of the coolant reservoir so it really holds no pressure
at all but does not overheat.

Mike

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Re: [MBZ] I think its the end

[WILTON]

Talk of radiator caps reminds me:  Nearly 30 years ago, I had taken my 
still-nearly-new '80 240D (purchased new in Nov '79) into local stealer's 
for some minor repair or PM one morning; about mid-afternoon I stopped by to 
check on it and noticed that it was in shop, with hood up.  I walked back 
there to speak to tech about it, etc.  As I approached the car, I noticed 
that the radiator cap was OLD and rusty - not the nearly new, shiny one that 
was on it when I left the car that morning.  I asked tech what had happened 
to my radiator cap.  Tech seemed as surprised as I was - supposedly had not 
noticed.  Some sorry etc., had switched an OLD rusty one with my nearly new 
one!!!  Of course, I had to buy a new one - crapped-upon again.


Wilton

- Original Message - 
From: Dieselhead 126die...@gmail.com

To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Sent: Monday, June 17, 2013 10:15 AM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] I think its the end


The thing everybody seems to not want to address is the coolant boiling 
out of the radiator neck...


I put both thermostats in a pan of water, they both begin opening around 
165F (the old one maybe slightly sooner) and are fully open at 180F. If 
they're busted its in some manner that I can't see.


-Curt



Did the coolant boil out after burping and with a good cap on tight?


There was a thread some years ago with Herr Doktor where he advised us all 
to check our pressure caps and replace every other year on PM principle. 
I don't know the fizzicks, or thmodynamics, but he assured us a mercedes 
(at least 123 or newer) with a faulty or loose radiator/coolant bottle cap 
will overheat.


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Re: [MBZ] I think its the end

[Rich Thomas]

No, this is where you pitch a major fit, in particular in earshot of 
those browsing the showroom.


--R


On 6/17/13 10:58 AM, WILTON wrote:
Some sorry etc., had switched an OLD rusty one with my nearly new 
one!!!  Of course, I had to buy a new one - crapped-upon again. 



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Re: [MBZ] I think its the end

[Mitch Haley]

Curt Raymond wrote:


#6. There is no cabin heat when running.


Now that would seem to point to a circulatory problem.

Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] I think its the end

[Michael Canfield]

Excuse me but I have been arguing that the cap is not the issue and that
you have an issue with cylinder pressure escaping through a crack into the
cooling system.

Everyone should read ALL of the posts before making a guess.

Mike
On Jun 17, 2013 10:46 AM, Curt Raymond curtlud...@yahoo.com wrote:

 Okay guys this madness has to end, none of you are apparently actually
 reading anything I write, you've all gotten hung up on the radiator cap.

 Lets review the facts:

 #1. '78 240D, no expansion tank, no aux pump.

 #2. As soon as the car is started coolant starts bubbling out of the hood
 due to bubbles of gas pushing in there. When the car is shut off there is
 always one more big bubble of gas which will push around a cup of coolant
 off.

 #3. The car overheats sitting running in the driveway. While I appreciate
 Luther's story it doesn't relate, the car should not overheat sitting in
 the driveway with the radiator cap off, if it did that would mean there
 couldn't possibly be enough cooling capacity to go on the highway ever.

 #4. I drove 5,000 miles (most of it on the highway) with the radiator cap
 loose and the car didn't overheat.

 #5. The car will push coolant past the radiator cap and still overheat.

 #6. There is no cabin heat when running.

 I would submit at this point that you can knock it off about the radiator
 cap, the radiator cap will not save this engine...

 -Curt

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Re: [MBZ] I think its the end

[Craig]

On Mon, 17 Jun 2013 11:03:51 -0400 Mitch Haley m...@voyager.net wrote:

 Curt Raymond wrote:
 
  #6. There is no cabin heat when running.
 
 Now that would seem to point to a circulatory problem.

That's my thought, too.


Craig

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Re: [MBZ] I think its the end

[Craig]

On Mon, 17 Jun 2013 09:19:53 -0600 Craig diese...@pisquared.net wrote:

 On Mon, 17 Jun 2013 11:03:51 -0400 Mitch Haley m...@voyager.net wrote:
 
  Curt Raymond wrote:
  
   #6. There is no cabin heat when running.
  
  Now that would seem to point to a circulatory problem.
 
 That's my thought, too.


Although on further consideration,

 #2. As soon as the car is started coolant starts bubbling out of the
  hood due to bubbles of gas pushing in there. When the car is shut off
  there is always one more big bubble of gas which will push around a
  cup of coolant off,

seems to say that it doesn't require any time to get up to temperature
before the coolant starts bubbling out. This would indicate a crack
somewhere, independent of whether the cooling system is air-free and the
heater cores are filled with water.


Craig

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Re: [MBZ] I think its the end

[Mitch Haley]

Rich Thomas wrote:
No, this is where you pitch a major fit, in particular in earshot of 
those browsing the showroom.


What? I paid you bastards $20k for a four cylinder economy car, and you want me 
to buy a new radiator cap to replace the one that was stolen in your shop?


Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] I think its the end

[Mitch Haley]

Craig wrote:


#2. As soon as the car is started coolant starts bubbling out of the
 hood due to bubbles of gas pushing in there. When the car is shut off
 there is always one more big bubble of gas which will push around a
 cup of coolant off,


seems to say that it doesn't require any time to get up to temperature
before the coolant starts bubbling out. This would indicate a crack
somewhere, independent of whether the cooling system is air-free and the
heater cores are filled with water.


Air in a liquid cooling circuit would be a circulatory problem, right?

Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] I think its the end

[M. Mitchell Marmel]

In some circles, it's called an embolism.  :)


On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 10:43 AM, Mitch Haley m...@voyager.net wrote:


 Air in a liquid cooling circuit would be a circulatory problem, right?

 Mitch.


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Re: [MBZ] I think its the end

[Dwight Giles]

Curt,
Woud it be worth a leakdown test before you declare it DOA?
Dwight


On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 11:42 AM, Mitch Haley m...@voyager.net wrote:

 Rich Thomas wrote:

 No, this is where you pitch a major fit, in particular in earshot of
 those browsing the showroom.


 What? I paid you bastards $20k for a four cylinder economy car, and you
 want me to buy a new radiator cap to replace the one that was stolen in
 your shop?

 Mitch.


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Re: [MBZ] I think its the end

[Curt Raymond]

I would tend to agree. I did replace a heater hose so it would stand to reason 
that the heater system is empty but why can't I get the air out? I left it up 
on ramps for half a day, every time I start it the coolant comes splashing out. 
At first I just thought it was burping but it can't continue to be burping for 
the amount of time I've had it running, where would the air come from?

If you can come up with a theory that involves a failed water pump somehow 
forcing air into the system which would burp out the coolant I'll continue 
troubleshooting...

-Curt

Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2013 11:03:51 -0400
From: Mitch Haley m...@voyager.net
To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Subject: Re: [MBZ] I think its the end
Message-ID: 51bf2557.8090...@voyager.net
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed

Curt Raymond wrote:

 #6. There is no cabin heat when running.

Now that would seem to point to a circulatory problem.

Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] I think its the end

[Michael Canfield]

Curt,
  Put a pressure tester from FLAPS loan a tool on it.  Do not pump it up.
Turn over engine.  If guage goes up you have cylinder pressure in cooling
system.  That is where the air comes from.

Mike
On Jun 17, 2013 12:29 PM, Curt Raymond curtlud...@yahoo.com wrote:

 I would tend to agree. I did replace a heater hose so it would stand to
 reason that the heater system is empty but why can't I get the air out? I
 left it up on ramps for half a day, every time I start it the coolant comes
 splashing out. At first I just thought it was burping but it can't continue
 to be burping for the amount of time I've had it running, where would the
 air come from?

 If you can come up with a theory that involves a failed water pump somehow
 forcing air into the system which would burp out the coolant I'll continue
 troubleshooting...

 -Curt

 Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2013 11:03:51 -0400
 From: Mitch Haley m...@voyager.net
 To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] I think its the end
 Message-ID: 51bf2557.8090...@voyager.net
 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed

 Curt Raymond wrote:

  #6. There is no cabin heat when running.

 Now that would seem to point to a circulatory problem.

 Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] I think its the end

[Mountain Man]

Is this the 616 with 40mm rad hose that you replaced last week instead
of paying the stealer for OE hose?  Buy the china hose to see if it
works, then buy the OE hose to make it work properly?
Cauldron sounds at startup and no cabin heat - that can't be.  I doubt
head compromise or water passage blockage - except at some gasket
point, i.e. perhaps head gasket has water passage that is blocked and
is passing combustion gas to the cooling system?  Can you get the
off-gas tested for combustion gas?  Combustion gas would certainly
heat the coolant.
mao

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Re: [MBZ] I think its the end

[Mitch Haley]

Mountain Man wrote:

Is this the 616 with 40mm rad hose that you replaced last week instead
of paying the stealer for OE hose?  Buy the china hose to see if it
works, then buy the OE hose to make it work properly?
Cauldron sounds at startup and no cabin heat - that can't be.  I doubt
head compromise or water passage blockage - except at some gasket
point, i.e. perhaps head gasket has water passage that is blocked and
is passing combustion gas to the cooling system?  Can you get the
off-gas tested for combustion gas?  Combustion gas would certainly
heat the coolant.


It's the car that recently had a weekend head gasket party in its honor.
Partygoers were disappointed at not being able to find the break in the old head 
gasket IIRC.


Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] I think its the end

[Randy Bennell]

Not all of us.

I suggested a crack somewhere,  on Friday afternoon.

Should be able to pressurize the system and look for a leak.
If combustion pressures are causing fluid to blow out of the system, 
then one would think it must be in the upper reaches of the cylinder 
wall or the head? More likely the head?
Heat causes the crack to open more maybe which is why it blows out 
coolant when it is hot?


Can one pressurize the system and look for coolant to appear in one or 
more of the cylinders?



Randy who is rambling no doubt

On 17/06/2013 9:46 AM, Curt Raymond wrote:

Okay guys this madness has to end, none of you are apparently actually reading 
anything I write, you've all gotten hung up on the radiator cap.

Lets review the facts:

#1. '78 240D, no expansion tank, no aux pump.

#2. As soon as the car is started coolant starts bubbling out of the hood due 
to bubbles of gas pushing in there. When the car is shut off there is always 
one more big bubble of gas which will push around a cup of coolant off.

#3. The car overheats sitting running in the driveway. While I appreciate 
Luther's story it doesn't relate, the car should not overheat sitting in the 
driveway with the radiator cap off, if it did that would mean there couldn't 
possibly be enough cooling capacity to go on the highway ever.

#4. I drove 5,000 miles (most of it on the highway) with the radiator cap loose 
and the car didn't overheat.

#5. The car will push coolant past the radiator cap and still overheat.

#6. There is no cabin heat when running.

I would submit at this point that you can knock it off about the radiator cap, 
the radiator cap will not save this engine...

-Curt

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Re: [MBZ] I think its the end

[Randy Bennell]

Anything is possible.
Bypass the heater core by connecting the heater hoses together?
Put some clear plastic hose on temporarily so you can see if there is flow?

Randy

On 17/06/2013 11:29 AM, Curt Raymond wrote:

I would tend to agree. I did replace a heater hose so it would stand to reason 
that the heater system is empty but why can't I get the air out? I left it up 
on ramps for half a day, every time I start it the coolant comes splashing out. 
At first I just thought it was burping but it can't continue to be burping for 
the amount of time I've had it running, where would the air come from?

If you can come up with a theory that involves a failed water pump somehow 
forcing air into the system which would burp out the coolant I'll continue 
troubleshooting...

-Curt

Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2013 11:03:51 -0400
From: Mitch Haley m...@voyager.net
To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Subject: Re: [MBZ] I think its the end
Message-ID: 51bf2557.8090...@voyager.net
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed

Curt Raymond wrote:


#6. There is no cabin heat when running.

Now that would seem to point to a circulatory problem.

Mitch.





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Re: [MBZ] I think its the end

[Mountain Man]

Randy wrote:
 Anything is possible.
 Bypass the heater core by connecting the heater hoses together?
 Put some clear plastic hose on temporarily so you can see if there is flow?


I like that suggestion.
I imagine it to be some circulation problem in the engine system, not
in the ancillary systems of cabin heat, etc.
I bet if all things are isolated from the engine, the cauldron will
probably remain.
mao

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Re: [MBZ] I think its the end

[Scott Ritchey]

Have you tried one of those radiator pressure testers that screws on in
place of the radiator cap?  You can usually borrow them for free from FLAPS.
When I had several old cars I found that tool so useful that I bought one.  

It's hard to tell what's happening with the engine hot and running.  But
with a still engine, you can pump it up and often see or hear leaks that are
masked with the engine running.

Scott

-Original Message-
From: Mercedes [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of
dsereta...@yahoo.com
Sent: Sunday, June 16, 2013 6:57 PM
To: Mercedes Discussion List
Subject: Re: [MBZ] I think its the end

Since your headgasket was not obviously blown when we took it out, I
wonder if your problem doesn't lie elsewhere? But where?

Sent from my iPhone

On Jun 16, 2013, at 5:12 PM, Curt Raymond curtlud...@yahoo.com wrote:




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Re: [MBZ] I think its the end

[Rick Knoble]

On Jun 17, 2013, at 11:33 AM, Michael Canfield slozuk...@gmail.com wrote:

 Curt,
  Put a pressure tester from FLAPS loan a tool on it.  Do not pump it up.
 Turn over engine.  If guage goes up you have cylinder pressure in cooling
 system.  That is where the air comes from.


That is a great idea. 

Rick
Sent from my iPhone

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Re: [MBZ] I think its the end

[Randy Bennell]

Get condom and stretch over the rad filler.
If it inflates, when you crank it, there is air.
Might want to close off the overflow too.

Randy

On 17/06/2013 4:31 PM, Rick Knoble wrote:

On Jun 17, 2013, at 11:33 AM, Michael Canfield slozuk...@gmail.com wrote:


Curt,
  Put a pressure tester from FLAPS loan a tool on it.  Do not pump it up.
Turn over engine.  If guage goes up you have cylinder pressure in cooling
system.  That is where the air comes from.


That is a great idea.

Rick
Sent from my iPhone





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Re: [MBZ] I think its the end

[Jim Cathey]

I had to put the head on the Hercules (genset engine) three times
before it stopped leaking.  Apparently it's not as easy as it looks.

-- Jim



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Re: [MBZ] I think its the end

[Dieselhead]

I suggested that several days ago.


On Jun 17, 2013, at 11:33 AM, Michael Canfield slozuk...@gmail.com wrote:


 Curt,
  Put a pressure tester from FLAPS loan a tool on it.  Do not pump it up.
 Turn over engine.  If guage goes up you have cylinder pressure in cooling
 system.  That is where the air comes from.



That is a great idea.

Rick
Sent from my iPhone


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Re: [MBZ] I think its the end

[Rick Knoble]

On Jun 15, 2013, at 11:32 PM, Fmiser fmi...@gmail.com wrote:

 Curt's problem is that it's getting too hot.  The non-tight cap in
 immaterial


I call bs. I had a coolant leak on the fuel heater for my 190dt. I thought 
gee, I'll loosen the coolant cap. That will relieve the pressure in the system 
and the coolant won't leak out as fast. I thought wrong. I was merrily 
motoring down the expressway when I thought to look down at the temp gauge. It 
was pegged. I blew the head gasket. Try it sometime. The pressure cap is a 
pressure cap for a reason. 

Rick
Sent from my iPhone
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