[Texascavers] cave blogs
Here is a blog on show caves. http://blog.showcaves.com There are over a hundred postings on this site. And here are just a few of the postings there: http://blog.showcaves.com/?m=200801 http://blog.showcaves.com/?m=200710 http://blog.showcaves.com/?m=200712 http://blog.showcaves.com/?cat=5 - Visit our website: http://texascavers.com To unsubscribe, e-mail: texascavers-unsubscr...@texascavers.com For additional commands, e-mail: texascavers-h...@texascavers.com
[Texascavers] a new cave blog
I have tried this before, but I will try again. I am starting a cave blog on a Yahoo site. Go to Yahoo 360 http://360.yahoo.com/ ( You may need a Yahoo account - I don't know ) and go down to the middle of the page where the search bar is. ( The word "Go" is in a Yellow box ) type Texas Caver That may pull up a lot of non-related stuff. If so, and go down to the middle of the page where the search bar is. ( The word "search" is in a blue box ) type Texas Caver It should pull up the link for the blog site. At the moment, I don't know anything about blogging or the Yahoo site. If you can help me improve this blog, please feel free to tell me how. David Locklear - Visit our website: http://texascavers.com To unsubscribe, e-mail: texascavers-unsubscr...@texascavers.com For additional commands, e-mail: texascavers-h...@texascavers.com
RE: [Texascavers] Fw: Fw:Scanned & Re-scanned pics [CAVE RELATED]
Bill, This is a frequent problem with pics that are scanned at a low dpi. The minimum should be 300 dpi and they should be saved as TIFFs. TIFF is a lossless, high quality format; JPEG, on the other hand, can lose pixels every time you reproduce it. Rescanning a bad scan just adds insult to injury. You continue to lose pixels and once gone, you can't put them back. That's why you can't turn a good 72 dpi web picture into a dazzling 300 dpi print. When you do the enlarging on the 72 dpi print all you do is enlarge the pixels. That's what makes them fuzzy. Anyone who is good with a photo program such as PhotoShop can make them into really decent pics by adjusting the contrast and other settings, cloning damaged portions of the photos, etc. If the person who scanned them will rescan them at 300 dpi and put them on a disk, I'm sure someone with PhotoShop can improve them for you. Just remember: Never work on the original. Save a copy and work on that. If you mess up the copy either don't save the changes or dump it and make another copy of the original to work on. I've taken high quality scans of damaged tintypes of family members and been able to restore them electronically to the point it's hard to realize how damaged they were. The secret is getting a good, high-quality scan in the first place.Louise From: caver@caver.netTo: texascavers@texascavers.comCC: nmca...@caver.net; pbss@caver.netDate: Sat, 12 Jan 2008 17:08:38 -0600Subject: [Texascavers] Fw: Fw:Scanned & Re-scanned pics [CAVE RELATED] All, These are some very poor quality black and white pictures that were scanned, printed and mailed to me and I re-scanned them. They were taken by either Jack Burch and or Roger Hostenback or maybe others in the mid year 1956 at Secret Cave aka Mayfield Cave which is better known today as Caverns of Sonora... Roger sent them to me as he is a long time friend of my parents, I had no idea he caved and recently found out we had something beside Amateur Radio in common. He also mined Guano out of New Cave ( Slaughter Canyon Cave) in 1955 on the weekends... Enjoy and I wish they were better quality Bill - Original Message - From: Bill Bentley To: Carl Kunath Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2008 5:00 PM Subject: Fw:Scanned & Re-scanned pics - Original Message - From: Bill Bentley To: Bill Bentley Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2008 4:48 PM http://www.caver.net/images/image1-sonora56.jpg http://www.caver.net/images/image2-sonora56.jpg http://www.caver.net/images/image3-sonora56.jpg http://www.caver.net/images/image4-sonora56.jpg http://www.caver.net/images/image5-sonora56.jpg http://www.caver.net/images/image6-sonora56.jpg
[Texascavers] A really Off Topic Post - This one's on caving
Folks, This is to announce that we have a work and fun weekend scheduled for the Deep and Punkin property this weekend. It will start on Friday, January 18 and will go through Monday, January 21 (MLK day). If you are interested, there will be a Carta Valley MLK Day parade which you may either participate in or observe from the circular drive at the cabin. We will be forming up and pouring some concrete for footers for the back cabin porch (bring your hoe - yes, I meant hoe), denailing some boards which we'll use at the property (denailing is excellent therapy so bring a hammer and or crow bar). We'll have trips into Deep and Punkin caves and also a trip leader training event. Saturday and Sunday nights will be dedicated to general sloth and gluttony with conversations on religion, evolution, the pending oil crisis, asteroid ELE's, hybrid cars, and cattle futures in Carta Valley. For this event, we're trying to regulate buffoonery to day light hours only (got that Cradit). Please note that the fourth gate on the road has been replaced with an electronic swing gate with a combination pad. If you want to go, you'll need to know the combination. This gate was installed compliments of Jerry Atkinson (thank you Jerry). All cavers and friends are welcome - experience or not. Please RSVP with me by Thursday for more details, directions, and gate combos. Thanks, Geary Schindel 210-326-1576 cell
Re: [Texascavers] A really Off Topic Post - This one's on caving
Looking for shared transport to event. Internet access is uncertain at present. Please call. 512-592-9938 or if it has STILL not switched over - 972-814-2465 Armchair caver blowhard who never actually participates - WaVy On Jan 14, 2008 8:14 AM, Geary Schindel wrote: > Folks, > > > > This is to announce that we have a work and fun weekend scheduled for the > Deep and Punkin property this weekend. It will start on Friday, January 18 > and will go through Monday, January 21 (MLK day). If you are interested, > there will be a Carta Valley MLK Day parade which you may either participate > in or observe from the circular drive at the cabin. > > > > We will be forming up and pouring some concrete for footers for the back > cabin porch (bring your hoe – yes, I meant hoe), denailing some boards which > we'll use at the property (denailing is excellent therapy so bring a hammer > and or crow bar). We'll have trips into Deep and Punkin caves and also a > trip leader training event. Saturday and Sunday nights will be dedicated to > general sloth and gluttony with conversations on religion, evolution, the > pending oil crisis, asteroid ELE's, hybrid cars, and cattle futures in Carta > Valley. For this event, we're trying to regulate buffoonery to day light > hours only (got that Cradit). > > > > Please note that the fourth gate on the road has been replaced with an > electronic swing gate with a combination pad. If you want to go, you'll > need to know the combination. This gate was installed compliments of Jerry > Atkinson (thank you Jerry). > > > > All cavers and friends are welcome – experience or not. Please RSVP with > me by Thursday for more details, directions, and gate combos. > > > > Thanks, > > > > Geary Schindel > > 210-326-1576 cell > > >
[ot_caving] Contact Info
I'm trying to contact Justin Shaw. Please help. -WaVy
[Texascavers] Lousie; heres my answer to your question
I think I finally understand. Plastic bags and global warming are off topic, Describing why they are off topic is on topic. If I disagree with you it is off topic. If I agree with you, it is on topic. If you agree with me, it is really really on topic. And poking fun at inconsistencies is really really really off topic. And as ever Do as I say, not as I do, is the Golden Rule thanks all. Nancy
[NMCAVER] Southwestern Cavers
Tomorrow, Jan 15, is the deadline for articles for the Jan-Feb issue of the Southwestern cavers. If you've done anything cave related since the winter tech, tell us about it! Carol ___ NMCAVER mailing list nmca...@caver.net http://caver.net/mailman/listinfo/nmcaver_caver.net
[Texascavers] Bexar Grotto Meeting Tonight
FYI, The program will be: The Soudan Mine and Mars by E. Calvin Alexander, Jr., Ph.D. Dr. Alexander will discuss the evidence of the presence of liquids and the possible presence of microbial life on Mars using the Suadan Mine in northern Minnesota as an anolog. Dr. Alexander will also discuss some of the surface features that can now be viewed with the Martian orbiters including travertine dams and large collapse features to support his discussion. Dr. Alexander is a long long time caver as well as karst geochemist and planetary geologist. He has done extensive work on the karst of Minnesota as well as worked on the geochemistry of lunar samples. He is a professor with the Department of Geology and Geophysics at the University of Minnesota. Folks, I've seen this talk and it's a real crowd pleaser. Where: Bexar Grotto Meeting Chesters Hamburgers 281 North and Mecca Drive Hollywood Park - San Antonio When: Tonight, January 14, 2007 7:00 PM Thanks, Geary Schindel - Visit our website: http://texascavers.com To unsubscribe, e-mail: texascavers-unsubscr...@texascavers.com For additional commands, e-mail: texascavers-h...@texascavers.com
RE: [Texascavers] Thoughts on OT postings
George, I understand your point and as a newbie I, myself, was guilty of a certain amount of this (although I now try to respond directly rather than to the whole list most of the time). However, I would like to know what you consider cave related. I would think certain topics under global warming would be directly cave related; I asked about truck tents one time because I always camped when I went caving and wanted some information on best tents; I just responded to the posting on the Sonora pics because I thought I could offer some suggestions on how to make better prints (based on 20 years of desktop publishing). So could you please clarify for me what you do and don't consider cave related. These topics seem to run their courses over a short period of time, but I do think that some of them--especially the ones concerning religion and politics (guilty)--should be answered off list to the person directly. This last one on religion was started innocently enough by the mention of a journal article. I guess we need a little more direction on what is and what isn't pertinent. Oh yes, and plastic bags, when they were new and cavers were still using carbide, we used them all the time to carry our spent carbide out of the cave environment. Louise From: gveni@warpdriveonline.comTo: texascavers@texascavers.comDate: Sun, 13 Jan 2008 16:34:33 -0700Subject: Re: [Texascavers] Thoughts on OT postings Kara, Possibly it was my message that made you feel “bullied.” That wasn’t my intent. My basic message was that the listserver has rules. If we subscribe, we have an obligation to follow them. To ignore them is disrespectful at best. Like you, I value socializing with cavers about non-caving issues. But that isn’t what TexasCavers.com was set up for. Yes, plastic bags, global warming, etc., do affect cavers and everyone else on the planet, but those topics are not about caving; they are not cave-related. Go to www.texascavers.com and you’ll see it asks that postings be cave-related. Several times over the years people have suggested that a listserver be set up for cavers who want to socialize on line about non-caving items. I think that is an excellent idea and encourage someone to do it. And people who want to socialize can then do so freely without spamming those signed up for cave-related discussions. George -Original Message-From: Kara Savvas [mailto:misskarabi...@yahoo.com] Sent: Sunday, January 13, 2008 2:57 PMTo: George NincehelserCc: texascavers@texascavers.comSubject: Re: [Texascavers] Thoughts on OT postings I have to agree with Mr. Nincehelser. The discussions I enjoy the most in life, that are most likely to propel my interest in something worthwhile, do not cling to the Safe and the Known and the Agreed Upon. And they often include, in my own opinion, lots of Annoying and Ridiculous and Controversy and even Tangents, most especially when they involve other cavers!! (Haven't you noticed that?) Thank goodness I can use my ability to excuse myself from a conversation when it takes an unproductive turn. Thank goodness life isn't moderated to the point of constant comfort and familiarity.Sometimes respectfulness is challenging. I'm glad I've had more than two chances to get it right. I'm not saying that's a blank check for disrespect, I'm just saying that being good at it is a learning process, and I trust that most of us are trying to get there. In the meantime, and this is also a challenge for even the best of us - try not to take stuff too personally, especially when it comes from a bunch of yahoos on the Internet. (that's a joke, folks. We're all yahoos, get it? Ha ha. Oh come on, If you can't laugh at yourself) Educational journals are made up of completely topic oriented, educational articles from experts and experienced members of the field. Communities are made up of humans - angry, helpful, unprofessional, experienced, opinionated, curious, learned, mistaken, giving, uninformed, kind, supportive, different, smart, annoying. I don't ever feel a bond to the educational and caving journals I receive at home. They have never delivered soup to me when I was sick, or offered me comfort, or shared my joys in life, even if we don't regularly 'get along'. And Frankly, evolution, plastic bags, and global warming are completely relevant in this forum, as they have an impact on us as cavers, scientists, on caves themselves, and as people who enjoy the natural world and want to know more about it, and want that kind of education available to future generations. I appreciate the people who don't shy away from talking about it. No one has a monopoly on knowing what's relevant and important, and no one should. Hopefully, the desire to strive for respectfulness is the only thing we should all agree on. I guess if this really is the end of OT (which, from the looks of the last 9 out of 12 posts, thank goodness it isn't) it
Re: [Texascavers] Thoughts on OT postings
I'll throw out my two cents on this, and by no means do I think its the only way to do things, just my opinion as a list user :) Re-read http://texascavers.com/about.html I didn't come up with these, I inherited them as list owner from Mr. Bentley, but they give suggestions. Evolution talk in particular could be sideways skewed to include biology, cave-biology and eco-biology, but that, in my opinion, is stretching things a bit. We, as adults, know that evolution is a touchy matter for many people, particularly people that are religious. Politics, religion and sex are three main topics that are best to be kept to websites and listserves that are dedicated to them, again, in my opinion :) Charles, just a plain ole subscriber and member On 1/14/08, Louise Power wrote: > > George, I understand your point and as a newbie I, myself, was guilty of > a certain amount of this (although I now try to respond directly rather than > to the whole list most of the time). However, I would like to know what you > consider cave related. I would think certain topics under global warming > would be directly cave related; I asked about truck tents one time because I > always camped when I went caving and wanted some information on best tents; > I just responded to the posting on the Sonora pics because I thought I could > offer some suggestions on how to make better prints (based on 20 years of > desktop publishing). So could you please clarify for me what you do and > don't consider cave related. These topics seem to run their courses over a > short period of time, but I do think that some of them--especially the ones > concerning religion and politics (guilty)--should be answered off list to > the person directly. This last one on religion was started innocently enough > by the mention of a journal article. I guess we need a little more direction > on what is and what isn't pertinent. > > Oh yes, and plastic bags, when they were new and cavers were still using > carbide, we used them all the time to carry our spent carbide out of the > cave environment. > > Louise > >
RE: [Texascavers] Thoughts on OT postings
Louise, I think all that is required is common sense and not any strict authoritarian edicts. The rules say "cave related" so, for example: Plastic bags: Discussing new uses in caving is cave related. Discussing their molecular structure and mileage if converted to oil isn't. Global warming: Is it or is it not happening and what are the general implications isn't cave related. Discussing what effects it might have on caves or what the climate record from research in caves shows about past climates is cave related. Of course, with some topics like this where strong opinions may lurk, it is important to keep the tone reasonable and non-flammable. Hybrid cars: Their mileage and value in general isn't cave related. If a hybrid off-road vehicle is built that is suitable for caving, then a review of its caving performance is appropriate. We just need to ask ourselves if what we want to post is related to caves and caving. It should be pretty simple. If it is, post on TexasCavers.com. If not, then post it to o...@texascavers.com (after subscribing at ot-subscr...@texascavers.com). George From: Louise Power [mailto:power_lou...@hotmail.com] Sent: Monday, January 14, 2008 11:11 AM To: George Veni; texascavers@texascavers.com Subject: RE: [Texascavers] Thoughts on OT postings George, I understand your point and as a newbie I, myself, was guilty of a certain amount of this (although I now try to respond directly rather than to the whole list most of the time). However, I would like to know what you consider cave related. I would think certain topics under global warming would be directly cave related; I asked about truck tents one time because I always camped when I went caving and wanted some information on best tents; I just responded to the posting on the Sonora pics because I thought I could offer some suggestions on how to make better prints (based on 20 years of desktop publishing). So could you please clarify for me what you do and don't consider cave related. These topics seem to run their courses over a short period of time, but I do think that some of them--especially the ones concerning religion and politics (guilty)--should be answered off list to the person directly. This last one on religion was started innocently enough by the mention of a journal article. I guess we need a little more direction on what is and what isn't pertinent. Oh yes, and plastic bags, when they were new and cavers were still using carbide, we used them all the time to carry our spent carbide out of the cave environment. Louise
Re: [Texascavers] Thoughts on OT postings
Just my two cents...probably won't matter too much except to me. :-)
I was an active caver awhile back...not so active in the past several years due
to family & career constraints.
What I enjoy about cavetex is the radically dynamic nature of the conversations
I read on the list.
What makes this listserv so cool is depth & breadth of the knowledge base of
its members...the OT discussions are, frankly, interesting & entertaining &
occasionally informative.
It would be a shame to stop the ALL OT discussions...they are generally the
most actively participated in discussions on the forum.
The delete button works very well for me when I choose to skip a post here &
there.
In conclusion, isn't this forum as much about cavers as it is caves?
Scott Nicholson
Broker/Waterboy
The Discovery Team
(512) 94-SCOTT {947-2688}
Keller Williams Realty
- Original Message
From: George Veni
To: texascavers@texascavers.com
Sent: Monday, January 14, 2008 4:01:54 PM
Subject: RE: [Texascavers] Thoughts on OT postings
Louise,
I think all that is required is common sense and not any strict authoritarian
edicts. The rules say “cave related” so, for example:
Plastic bags: Discussing new uses in caving is cave related. Discussing their
molecular structure and mileage if converted to oil isn’t.
Global warming: Is it or is it not happening and what are the general
implications isn’t cave related. Discussing what effects it might have on caves
or what the climate record from research in caves shows about past climates is
cave related. Of course, with some topics like this where strong opinions may
lurk, it is important to keep the tone reasonable and non-flammable.
Hybrid cars: Their mileage and value in general isn’t cave related. If a hybrid
off-road vehicle is built that is suitable for caving, then a review of its
caving performance is appropriate.
We just need to ask ourselves if what we want to post is related to caves and
caving. It should be pretty simple. If it is, post on TexasCavers.com. If not,
then post it to o...@texascavers.com (after subscribing at
ot-subscr...@texascavers.com).
George
From: Louise Power [mailto:power_lou...@hotmail.com]
Sent: Monday, January 14, 2008 11:11 AM
To: George Veni; texascavers@texascavers.com
Subject: RE: [Texascavers] Thoughts on OT postings
George, I understand your point and as a newbie I, myself, was guilty of a
certain amount of this (although I now try to respond directly rather than to
the whole list most of the time). However, I would like to know what you
consider cave related. I would think certain topics under global warming would
be directly cave related; I asked about truck tents one time because I always
camped when I went caving and wanted some information on best tents; I just
responded to the posting on the Sonora pics because I thought I could offer
some suggestions on how to make better prints (based on 20 years of desktop
publishing). So could you please clarify for me what you do and don't consider
cave related. These topics seem to run their courses over a short period of
time, but I do think that some of them--especially the ones concerning religion
and politics (guilty)--should be answered off list to the person directly. This
last one on religion was started
innocently enough by the mention of a journal article. I guess we need a
little more direction on what is and what isn't pertinent.
Oh yes, and plastic bags, when they were new and cavers were still using
carbide, we used them all the time to carry our spent carbide out of the cave
environment.
Louise
RE: [Texascavers] Thoughts on OT postings
Scott,
This will be my last post on the matter. I've commented far more than I
wanted to.
I agree that there have been some interesting OT conversations, but now that
a list has been set up for them, those who enjoy them can subscribe and
send/get them, as well as the regular texascaver.com messages. Those who
don't enjoy them can simply stick with texascavers.com. It seems a very
simple and effective solution to not stifle OT discussions but place them
where they will be appreciated and not where they are viewed by many as
spam.. To subscribe, just send a note to ot-subscr...@texascavers.com.
George
From: Scott Nicholson [mailto:csnichol...@sbcglobal.net]
Sent: Monday, January 14, 2008 6:39 PM
To: George Veni; texascavers@texascavers.com
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] Thoughts on OT postings
Just my two cents...probably won't matter too much except to me. :-)
I was an active caver awhile back...not so active in the past several years
due to family & career constraints.
What I enjoy about cavetex is the radically dynamic nature of the
conversations I read on the list.
What makes this listserv so cool is depth & breadth of the knowledge base of
its members...the OT discussions are, frankly, interesting & entertaining &
occasionally informative.
It would be a shame to stop the ALL OT discussions...they are generally the
most actively participated in discussions on the forum.
The delete button works very well for me when I choose to skip a post here &
there.
In conclusion, isn't this forum as much about cavers as it is caves?
Scott Nicholson
Broker/Waterboy
The Discovery Team
(512) 94-SCOTT {947-2688}
Keller Williams Realty
- Original Message
From: George Veni
To: texascavers@texascavers.com
Sent: Monday, January 14, 2008 4:01:54 PM
Subject: RE: [Texascavers] Thoughts on OT postings
Louise,
I think all that is required is common sense and not any strict
authoritarian edicts. The rules say "cave related" so, for example:
Plastic bags: Discussing new uses in caving is cave related. Discussing
their molecular structure and mileage if converted to oil isn't.
Global warming: Is it or is it not happening and what are the general
implications isn't cave related. Discussing what effects it might have on
caves or what the climate record from research in caves shows about past
climates is cave related. Of course, with some topics like this where strong
opinions may lurk, it is important to keep the tone reasonable and
non-flammable.
Hybrid cars: Their mileage and value in general isn't cave related. If a
hybrid off-road vehicle is built that is suitable for caving, then a review
of its caving performance is appropriate.
We just need to ask ourselves if what we want to post is related to caves
and caving. It should be pretty simple. If it is, post on TexasCavers.com
[ot_caving] a Texas cave blog
I have tried this before, but I will try again. I am starting a cave blog on a Yahoo site. Go to Yahoo 360 http://360.yahoo.com/ ( You may need a Yahoo account - I don't know ) and go down to the middle of the page where the search bar is. ( The word "Go" is in a Yellow box ) type Texas Caver That may pull up a lot of non-related stuff. If so, and go down to the middle of the page where the search bar is. ( The word "search" is in a blue box ) type Texas Caver It should pull up the link for the blog site. At the moment, I don't know anything about blogging or the Yahoo site. If you can help me improve this blog, please feel free to tell me how. David Locklear - Give this to a friend: ot-subscr...@texascavers.com To unsubscribe, e-mail: ot-unsubscr...@texascavers.com For additional commands, e-mail: ot-h...@texascavers.com
Re: [ot_caving] a Texas cave blog
http://360.yahoo.com/profile-5_RNwxg1erAi872DBDvnj4.c5c_D8Q--?cq=1 That is the easier link to David's Blog. Go David! I keep a blog, but I'm not very good at writting in a consistent manner, and I'm not terribly satisfied with some of the layout on my blog. You can check my blog out at http://www.butterflypalacedispatch.blogspot.com/ I used the google system to set mine up, even though I have a yahoo account. I found the dashboard (the control panel) to be quite intuitive. the thing about a good blog is that is has to be updated with small bits very often, like daily. And passages that are too long winded tend to lose people. A blog is a place where on-topic really works to its advantage. Just my opinions as a daily blog reader. Some of the best ones I have found are http://wilwheaton.typepad.com/ yes, that's wesley crusher, all growed up http://www.sweet-juniper.com/ a blog of parenthood. Although, I think these people were paid to start the blog, like journalists, I don't think they are paid now. There are a few more blogs if you'd like examples to the leftside of mine, in a list. I think a caver blog would be really awesome, and benefit the community. Therefore, I think this post is actually very on-topic. It's just part of the journey to get there. Caving is often MUCH more about the journey than the destination. I need to post my trip log from our 4 day paddle of the Rio Guayalejo over Thanksgiving... it took us 3 days just to get into Mexico!! haha. soon. enjoy! Kara - Original Message From: David Locklear To: o...@texascavers.com Sent: Monday, January 14, 2008 11:03:18 AM Subject: [ot_caving] a Texas cave blog I have tried this before, but I will try again. I am starting a cave blog on a Yahoo site. Go to Yahoo 360 http://360.yahoo.com/ ( You may need a Yahoo account - I don't know ) and go down to the middle of the page where the search bar is. ( The word "Go" is in a Yellow box ) type Texas Caver That may pull up a lot of non-related stuff. If so, and go down to the middle of the page where the search bar is. ( The word "search" is in a blue box ) type Texas Caver It should pull up the link for the blog site. At the moment, I don't know anything about blogging or the Yahoo site. If you can help me improve this blog, please feel free to tell me how. David Locklear - Give this to a friend: ot-subscr...@texascavers.com To unsubscribe, e-mail: ot-unsubscr...@texascavers.com For additional commands, e-mail: ot-h...@texascavers.com Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ - Give this to a friend: ot-subscr...@texascavers.com To unsubscribe, e-mail: ot-unsubscr...@texascavers.com For additional commands, e-mail: ot-h...@texascavers.com
[Texascavers] Re: OT Off topic time, all the time. Oh yeah, we talk about caves, too.
Please join in a lively discussion at o...@texascavers.com. If it is important
to you, a caver, it is worthwhile to talk about. Like Caving, we're about the
Journey, not the destination. Respect is key, so is participation. While I fear
the divisive nature of this approach, I'm willing to give it a shot. There are
better things to talk about, which most of us probably agree, (but never all of
us) so let's get on with it. Please exercise your delete command with the list,
o...@texascavers.com... where, should you need to, deleting rants from flamers
is your prerogative, and renders flamers irrelevant, not subject matter.
Now run along and play with your silly off-topic friends
Kara
ot-subscr...@texascavers.com to subscribe
- Original Message
From: George Veni
To: texascavers@texascavers.com
Sent: Monday, January 14, 2008 8:09:50 PM
Subject: RE: [Texascavers] Thoughts on OT postings
Scott,
This will be my last post on the matter. I’ve commented far more than I wanted
to.
I agree that there have been some interesting OT conversations, but now that a
list has been set up for them, those who enjoy them can subscribe and send/get
them, as well as the regular texascaver.com messages. Those who don’t enjoy
them can simply stick with texascavers.com. It seems a very simple and
effective solution to not stifle OT discussions but place them where they will
be appreciated and not where they are viewed by many as spam.. To subscribe,
just send a note to ot-subscr...@texascavers.com.
George
From: Scott Nicholson [mailto:csnichol...@sbcglobal.net]
Sent: Monday, January 14, 2008 6:39 PM
To: George Veni; texascavers@texascavers.com
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] Thoughts on OT postings
Just my two cents...probably won't matter too much except to me. :-)
I was an active caver awhile back...not so active in the past several years due
to family & career constraints.
What I enjoy about cavetex is the radically dynamic nature of the conversations
I read on the list.
What makes this listserv so cool is depth & breadth of the knowledge base of
its members...the OT discussions are, frankly, interesting & entertaining &
occasionally informative.
It would be a shame to stop the ALL OT discussions...they are generally the
most actively participated in discussions on the forum.
The delete button works very well for me when I choose to skip a post here &
there.
In conclusion, isn't this forum as much about cavers as it is caves?
Scott Nicholson
Broker/Waterboy
The Discovery Team
(512) 94-SCOTT {947-2688}
Keller Williams Realty
- Original Message
From: George Veni
To: texascavers@texascavers.com
Sent: Monday, January 14, 2008 4:01:54 PM
Subject: RE: [Texascavers] Thoughts on OT postings
Louise,
I think all that is required is common sense and not any strict authoritarian
edicts. The rules say “cave related” so, for example:
Plastic bags: Discussing new uses in caving is cave related. Discussing their
molecular structure and mileage if converted to oil isn’t.
Global warming: Is it or is it not happening and what are the general
implications isn’t cave related. Discussing what effects it might have on caves
or what the climate record from research in caves shows about past climates is
cave related. Of course, with some topics like this where strong opinions may
lurk, it is important to keep the tone reasonable and non-flammable.
Hybrid cars: Their mileage and value in general isn’t cave related. If a hybrid
off-road vehicle is built that is suitable for caving, then a review of its
caving performance is appropriate.
We just need to ask ourselves if what we want to post is related to caves and
caving. It should be pretty simple. If it is, post on TexasCavers.com. If not,
then post it to o...@texascavers.com (after subscribing at
ot-subscr...@texascavers.com).
George
From: Louise Power [mailto:power_lou...@hotmail.com]
Sent: Monday, January 14, 2008 11:11 AM
To: George Veni; texascavers@texascavers.com
Subject: RE: [Texascavers] Thoughts on OT postings
George, I understand your point and as a newbie I, myself, was guilty of a
certain amount of this (although I now try to respond directly rather than to
the whole list most of the time). However, I would like to know what you
consider cave related. I would think certain topics under global warming would
be directly cave related; I asked about truck tents one time because I always
camped when I went caving and wanted some information on best tents; I just
responded to the posting on the Sonora pics because I thought I could offer
some suggestions on how to make better prints (based on 20 years of desktop
publishing). So could you please clarify for me what you do and don't consider
cave related. These topics seem to run their courses over a short period of
time, but I do think that some of them--especially the ones concerning religion
and politics (guilty)--should be answered
[ot_caving] George, I'm on both lists!
I'm on both because I really like caves, and I really like Cavers and their conversation is lively and interesting. I don't agree with a lot of them , and I don't believe a lot of them, but I like listening to'em and reading'em. I hope Gil comes over here. I learned some interesting train stuff from his posts. David Caudle 100' from a TAG cave, in a house heated by cave water. - Give this to a friend: ot-subscr...@texascavers.com To unsubscribe, e-mail: ot-unsubscr...@texascavers.com For additional commands, e-mail: ot-h...@texascavers.com
[Texascavers] photos from the January CBSP weekend
Hey Texas cavers, For those of you interested or even having been there, here are my pictures from last weekend at Colorado Bend State Park: http://lostgravity.smugmug.com/gallery/4160640 Cheers, David - Visit our website: http://texascavers.com To unsubscribe, e-mail: texascavers-unsubscr...@texascavers.com For additional commands, e-mail: texascavers-h...@texascavers.com
[Texascavers] new AMCS CDs
I will have at the UT Grotto meeting Wednesday night for their first public sale two new CDs available from the Association for Mexican Cave Studies. These CDs contain PDFs made from page scans of things that were previously available on paper but are out of print or selling slowly at the higher paper prices. The CDs are $3 each. AMCS Activities Newsletters 1-10, covering the period 1975-1979. Approximately 400 pages. Paper copies totaled $54. AMCS Reprints 4 and 5, Carlos Lazcano's books "Las Cavernas de Cerro Grande" and "Las Cavernas de la Sierra Gorda. Total 538 pages. Paper copies totaled $55. I'll also have a few copies of Carl Kunath's "50 Years of Texas Caving" for $50 cash or check (written to Carl Kunath). This will be the last meeting I'll take copies of that to except on specific request, because they're heavy to haul around. -- Bill Mixon -- You may "reply" to the address this message came from, but for long-term use, save: Personal: bmi...@alumni.uchicago.edu AMCS: edi...@amcs-pubs.org or sa...@amcs-pubs.org - Visit our website: http://texascavers.com To unsubscribe, e-mail: texascavers-unsubscr...@texascavers.com For additional commands, e-mail: texascavers-h...@texascavers.com
wow!
Wow, we are up to 17 people already, and forgive me, but I didn't think we'd get over 10 in here! I actually had someone send the owner (ot-ow...@texascavers.com) an email asking to subscribe. Now forgive me, but how are the instructions wrong? Did I type them badly? Are they confusing to someone? Is there a way I can make the instructions for joining this list easier? I know, probably bad of me, sarcastic and just plain ole wrong. But this is the OT forum, and I gotta vent here a minute :) It's pretty simple, right? Charles
Re: [ot_caving] wow!
>Now forgive me, but how are the instructions wrong? Well, Charles, though I think we've been here before, there are no instructions for how to get _digested_ OT, though there's a way to UNsubsribe from a digested membership. Should I have subscribed to < ot-digest-subscr...@texascavers.com >? Since I am in here already, will you please switch me to digested? Digests are the *only* way to get OT -- you can cherry-pick, and not have to even scroll past the drivel you don't want to read! Alex -- Alex Sproul, NSS 8086 NSS IT Committee
[ot_caving] caver mommyhood
So, I'm going to have a baby late this summer. I am personally very excited about that... but as a caver, I'm starting to have fears. I'm starting to worry that I'm going to lose ground on whatever skills I have, and because I do plan to breastfeed for an extended time, that I will really miss out on some caving. How do I get back into it? How do I make sure I don't get too far out of it? Has anyone else had this experience, and jumped back in? Any advice? Kara Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping - Give this to a friend: ot-subscr...@texascavers.com To unsubscribe, e-mail: ot-unsubscr...@texascavers.com For additional commands, e-mail: ot-h...@texascavers.com
Re: [ot_caving] anyone else here yet?
We have a total of 5 subscribers so far, I'm really surprised David isn't here yet :) On 1/13/08, Kara Savvas wrote: > I'm here... anyone else? Let's get this party started. > > Tell me something off topic :-) > > Here's one - a poll - > Does anyone try to use or regularly use canvas or reusable bags when grocery > shopping? > > I do, but forget them at home occasionally. The checkers don't usually know > what to make of it. If you're interested in trying to do this more, we should > talk about it, I have some tips. > > By the way, I'm feeling better - getting over it, and the baby is fine. I'm > going to put in an appearance at work tomorrow for a few hours. Looking > forward to interacting with the world again. > > take care, > Kara > > > > > Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page. > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > - > Give this to a friend: ot-subscr...@texascavers.com > To unsubscribe, e-mail: ot-unsubscr...@texascavers.com > For additional commands, e-mail: ot-h...@texascavers.com > >
[ot_caving] [OT] Re: anyone else here yet?
So this is where all the cool people are. Simon -- Forwarded message -- From: Kara Savvas To: o...@texascavers.com List-Post: texascavers@texascavers.com Date: Sun, 13 Jan 2008 20:54:42 -0800 (PST) Subject: anyone else here yet? I'm here... anyone else? Let's get this party started. Tell me something off topic :-) Here's one - a poll - Does anyone try to use or regularly use canvas or reusable bags when grocery shopping? I do, but forget them at home occasionally. The checkers don't usually know what to make of it. If you're interested in trying to do this more, we should talk about it, I have some tips. By the way, I'm feeling better - getting over it, and the baby is fine. I'm going to put in an appearance at work tomorrow for a few hours. Looking forward to interacting with the world again. take care, Kara - Give this to a friend: ot-subscr...@texascavers.com To unsubscribe, e-mail: ot-unsubscr...@texascavers.com For additional commands, e-mail: ot-h...@texascavers.com
Re: [ot_caving] [OT] Re: anyone else here yet?
You are late kid! Whats up Doc?
Re: [ot_caving] [OT] Re: anyone else here yet?
Whew, I went back to work today and it took a lot out of me. (Thanks, Don, I know there are lots of folks who would have helped if they could) I don't really think the new angle on texascavers is going to work they shiny new way people think it will... I think squashing all the interesting bits is actually quite a disservice to the caving community, and I also don't think it will be enforced very well, just complained about a lot, and eventually get back to the way it was. I also have doubts in the viability of a split list, but participation is Key, and that's why I'm writting right now. I fear this approach is not very ... unifying, and quite dividing, but our behavior can temper that. But those are my dissapointments with it, and I'm not going to waste a lot of time Kevetching. I still really appreciate what Charles did for us. I consider this more of a Caver Lifestyle Forum. I don't see it as a place to totally rip loose, or insult anyone not in my club, but that gets moderated naturally. For example, the way you responded to the creationist thread, Don, makes it really tempting for me to just delete what you write before I read it. With all due respect, the intolerance for that behavior, no matter who you aimed it at, whack or not, stressed or not, was well placed. The biggest problem with the internet is that people can be reduced to 0's and 1's... you have to go the extra mile to remember there are real people behind all the words and glowing screens, just like you - and remember that your actions on the internet are still real, and effect the way people will feel about you for real. In my opinion, when it comes to the internet, there are just different and more personal-responsibility type of ways of not tolerating something like the delete key. People become irrelevant through flame wars, not subject matter. Well anyway, I want to make it fun to be here, and productive. Earlier, I had asked if anyone was using fabric bags when they go shopping, a sort of poll. I think maybe I asked before there were too many people here. Please speak up! Even if you don't. Sometimes I wonder if doing it really even helps anything... I started with one little bag that folds up small and fits in my purse, so I have it ready whenever I use it. Then I went to a conference and all the gift bags were fabric shopping bags, so I scored a collection of great bags really fast for free. I like not collecting crappy plastic bags, although I still have quite a number. I don't always remember to have the bags with me when I hit the store. so what do you think? anyone one else giving it a try? Thoughts? Kara - Original Message From: Don Cooper To: Simon Newton Cc: "Savaas, Kara" Sent: Monday, January 14, 2008 4:00:17 PM Subject: Re: [ot_caving] [OT] Re: anyone else here yet? Less Fuddy! And much much less Duddy! Kara- I am very glad you are all doing well. Had I been two hundred miles closer - you know I would have brought soup and juice. It occured to me through the 'controversy' - that your post asking for help was completely off topic and 'against the rules' having "nothing to do with caves or caving". That in itself is proof that this listserver has done far more than just its stated purpose. Though I might have stepped out of line by calling names at creationists (stressing out over the move process - I just had to let off a little steam at what I consider MOST absurd) - the negative feedback I got really makes me aware of intolerance of some in 'the community' and I'm very thankful that Charles saw to it to create a sidestep solution - sliding that platform out from under 'The Authoritative' of us. Oh - and on that topic again. About the re-usable bags. I have a sewing machine. I really ought to make some! I have only one of them - I got from years and years ago - and for the longest time its been in my trunk as a holder for monster jumper cables. -WaVy On Jan 14, 2008 3:42 PM, Simon Newton wrote: So this is where all the cool people are. Simon -- Forwarded message -- From: Kara Savvas To: o...@texascavers.com List-Post: texascavers@texascavers.com Date: Sun, 13 Jan 2008 20:54:42 -0800 (PST) Subject: anyone else here yet? I'm here... anyone else? Let's get this party started. Tell me something off topic :-) Here's one - a poll - Does anyone try to use or regularly use canvas or reusable bags when grocery shopping? I do, but forget them at home occasionally. The checkers don't usually know what to make of it. If you're interested in trying to do this more, we should talk about it, I have some tips. By the way, I'm feeling better - getting over it, and the baby is fine. I'm going to put in an appearance at work tomorrow for a few hours. Looking forward to interacting with the world again. take care, Kara - Give this to a friend: ot-sub
Re: [ot_caving] [OT] Re: anyone else here yet?
Sorry Kara, and to answer the poll, I do not, it's a hassle and I know its no excuse, but it's not "convenient" which is what most people have problems with. I do ask for no sack when I'm picking things up most of the time, because its usually 1 or 2 items. Charles On 1/14/08, Kara Savvas wrote: > > Whew, I went back to work today and it took a lot out of me. (Thanks, Don, I > know there are lots of folks who would have helped if they could) > > I don't really think the new angle on texascavers is going to work they > shiny new way people think it will... I think squashing all the interesting > bits is actually quite a disservice to the caving community, and I also > don't think it will be enforced very well, just complained about a lot, and > eventually get back to the way it was. I also have doubts in the viability > of a split list, but participation is Key, and that's why I'm writting > right now. I fear this approach is not very ... unifying, and quite > dividing, but our behavior can temper that. But those are my dissapointments > with it, and I'm not going to waste a lot of time Kevetching. I still really > appreciate what Charles did for us. > > I consider this more of a Caver Lifestyle Forum. I don't see it as a place > to totally rip loose, or insult anyone not in my club, but that gets > moderated naturally. For example, the way you responded to the creationist > thread, Don, makes it really tempting for me to just delete what you write > before I read it. With all due respect, the intolerance for that behavior, > no matter who you aimed it at, whack or not, stressed or not, was well > placed. The biggest problem with the internet is that people can be reduced > to 0's and 1's... you have to go the extra mile to remember there are real > people behind all the words and glowing screens, just like you - and > remember that your actions on the internet are still real, and effect the > way people will feel about you for real. In my opinion, when it comes to the > internet, there are just different and more personal-responsibility type of > ways of not tolerating something like the delete key. People become > irrelevant through flame wars, not subject matter. > > Well anyway, I want to make it fun to be here, and productive. Earlier, I > had asked if anyone was using fabric bags when they go shopping, a sort of > poll. I think maybe I asked before there were too many people here. Please > speak up! Even if you don't. Sometimes I wonder if doing it really even > helps anything... > > I started with one little bag that folds up small and fits in my purse, so I > have it ready whenever I use it. Then I went to a conference and all the > gift bags were fabric shopping bags, so I scored a collection of great bags > really fast for free. I like not collecting crappy plastic bags, although I > still have quite a number. I don't always remember to have the bags with me > when I hit the store. > > so what do you think? anyone one else giving it a try? Thoughts? > > Kara > > > - Original Message > From: Don Cooper > To: Simon Newton > Cc: "Savaas, Kara" > Sent: Monday, January 14, 2008 4:00:17 PM > Subject: Re: [ot_caving] [OT] Re: anyone else here yet? > > Less Fuddy! And much much less Duddy! > > Kara- > > I am very glad you are all doing well. Had I been two hundred miles closer > - you know I would have brought soup and juice. > > It occured to me through the 'controversy' - that your post asking for help > was completely off topic and 'against the rules' having "nothing to do with > caves or caving". That in itself is proof that this listserver has done far > more than just its stated purpose. Though I might have stepped out of line > by calling names at creationists (stressing out over the move process - I > just had to let off a little steam at what I consider MOST absurd) - the > negative feedback I got really makes me aware of intolerance of some in 'the > community' and I'm very thankful that Charles saw to it to create a sidestep > solution - sliding that platform out from under 'The Authoritative' of us. > > Oh - and on that topic again. About the re-usable bags. I have a sewing > machine. I really ought to make some! I have only one of them - I got from > years and years ago - and for the longest time its been in my trunk as a > holder for monster jumper cables. > > -WaVy > > > > On Jan 14, 2008 3:42 PM, Simon Newton wrote: > > > So this is where all the cool people are. > > > > Simon > > > > -- Forwarded message -- > > From: Kara Savvas > > To: o...@texascavers.com > > Date: Sun, 13 Jan 2008 20:54:42 -0800 (PST) > > Subject: anyone else here yet? > > I'm here... anyone else? Let's get this party started. > > > > Tell me something off topic :-) > > > > Here's one - a poll - > > Does anyone try to use or regularly use canvas or reusable bags when > > grocery shopping? > > > > I do, but forget them at home occasionally. The checkers don't usually > >
Re: [ot_caving] [OT] Re: anyone else here yet?
I totally understand. I think that is most people's objection. I wonder what would make it more convenient? A change in the way we think, or if there is actually something physical that would make it more convenient. My biggest pet peeve is that they just put one or two items in each bag! If I do end up at the store without my fabric bags, I ask them to stuff those babies full! kara - Original Message From: Charles Goldsmith To: Kara Savvas Cc: o...@texascavers.com Sent: Monday, January 14, 2008 9:31:55 PM Subject: Re: [ot_caving] [OT] Re: anyone else here yet? Sorry Kara, and to answer the poll, I do not, it's a hassle and I know its no excuse, but it's not "convenient" which is what most people have problems with. I do ask for no sack when I'm picking things up most of the time, because its usually 1 or 2 items. Charles On 1/14/08, Kara Savvas wrote: > > Whew, I went back to work today and it took a lot out of me. (Thanks, Don, I > know there are lots of folks who would have helped if they could) > > I don't really think the new angle on texascavers is going to work they > shiny new way people think it will... I think squashing all the interesting > bits is actually quite a disservice to the caving community, and I also > don't think it will be enforced very well, just complained about a lot, and > eventually get back to the way it was. I also have doubts in the viability > of a split list, but participation is Key, and that's why I'm writting > right now. I fear this approach is not very ... unifying, and quite > dividing, but our behavior can temper that. But those are my dissapointments > with it, and I'm not going to waste a lot of time Kevetching. I still really > appreciate what Charles did for us. > > I consider this more of a Caver Lifestyle Forum. I don't see it as a place > to totally rip loose, or insult anyone not in my club, but that gets > moderated naturally. For example, the way you responded to the creationist > thread, Don, makes it really tempting for me to just delete what you write > before I read it. With all due respect, the intolerance for that behavior, > no matter who you aimed it at, whack or not, stressed or not, was well > placed. The biggest problem with the internet is that people can be reduced > to 0's and 1's... you have to go the extra mile to remember there are real > people behind all the words and glowing screens, just like you - and > remember that your actions on the internet are still real, and effect the > way people will feel about you for real. In my opinion, when it comes to the > internet, there are just different and more personal-responsibility type of > ways of not tolerating something like the delete key. People become > irrelevant through flame wars, not subject matter. > > Well anyway, I want to make it fun to be here, and productive. Earlier, I > had asked if anyone was using fabric bags when they go shopping, a sort of > poll. I think maybe I asked before there were too many people here. Please > speak up! Even if you don't. Sometimes I wonder if doing it really even > helps anything... > > I started with one little bag that folds up small and fits in my purse, so I > have it ready whenever I use it. Then I went to a conference and all the > gift bags were fabric shopping bags, so I scored a collection of great bags > really fast for free. I like not collecting crappy plastic bags, although I > still have quite a number. I don't always remember to have the bags with me > when I hit the store. > > so what do you think? anyone one else giving it a try? Thoughts? > > Kara > > > - Original Message > From: Don Cooper > To: Simon Newton > Cc: "Savaas, Kara" > Sent: Monday, January 14, 2008 4:00:17 PM > Subject: Re: [ot_caving] [OT] Re: anyone else here yet? > > Less Fuddy! And much much less Duddy! > > Kara- > > I am very glad you are all doing well. Had I been two hundred miles closer > - you know I would have brought soup and juice. > > It occured to me through the 'controversy' - that your post asking for help > was completely off topic and 'against the rules' having "nothing to do with > caves or caving". That in itself is proof that this listserver has done far > more than just its stated purpose. Though I might have stepped out of line > by calling names at creationists (stressing out over the move process - I > just had to let off a little steam at what I consider MOST absurd) - the > negative feedback I got really makes me aware of intolerance of some in 'the > community' and I'm very thankful that Charles saw to it to create a sidestep > solution - sliding that platform out from under 'The Authoritative' of us. > > Oh - and on that topic again. About the re-usable bags. I have a sewing > machine. I really ought to make some! I have only one of them - I got from > years and years ago - and for the longest time its been in my trunk as a > holder for monster jumper cables. > > -WaVy > > > > On Jan 14
Re: [ot_caving] [OT] Re: anyone else here yet?
I think the supermarkets should offer you an eco-friendly solution, they make tons off of us, they should help the environment by offering an alternative, even if its a few $0.01 more... I know IKEA offers eco friendly bags for less than a $. On 1/14/08, Kara Savvas wrote: > I totally understand. I think that is most people's objection. I wonder what > would make it more convenient? A change in the way we think, or if there is > actually something physical that would make it more convenient. > > My biggest pet peeve is that they just put one or two items in each bag! If I > do end up at the store without my fabric bags, I ask them to stuff those > babies full! > > kara > > - Original Message > From: Charles Goldsmith > To: Kara Savvas > Cc: o...@texascavers.com > Sent: Monday, January 14, 2008 9:31:55 PM > Subject: Re: [ot_caving] [OT] Re: anyone else here yet? > > Sorry Kara, and to answer the poll, I do not, it's a hassle and I know > its no excuse, but it's not "convenient" which is what most people > have problems with. I do ask for no sack when I'm picking things up > most of the time, because its usually 1 or 2 items. > > Charles > > On 1/14/08, Kara Savvas wrote: > > > > Whew, I went back to work today and it took a lot out of me. (Thanks, Don, I > > know there are lots of folks who would have helped if they could) > > > > I don't really think the new angle on texascavers is going to work they > > shiny new way people think it will... I think squashing all the interesting > > bits is actually quite a disservice to the caving community, and I also > > don't think it will be enforced very well, just complained about a lot, and > > eventually get back to the way it was. I also have doubts in the viability > > of a split list, but participation is Key, and that's why I'm writting > > right now. I fear this approach is not very ... unifying, and quite > > dividing, but our behavior can temper that. But those are my dissapointments > > with it, and I'm not going to waste a lot of time Kevetching. I still really > > appreciate what Charles did for us. > > > > I consider this more of a Caver Lifestyle Forum. I don't see it as a place > > to totally rip loose, or insult anyone not in my club, but that gets > > moderated naturally. For example, the way you responded to the creationist > > thread, Don, makes it really tempting for me to just delete what you write > > before I read it. With all due respect, the intolerance for that behavior, > > no matter who you aimed it at, whack or not, stressed or not, was well > > placed. The biggest problem with the internet is that people can be reduced > > to 0's and 1's... you have to go the extra mile to remember there are real > > people behind all the words and glowing screens, just like you - and > > remember that your actions on the internet are still real, and effect the > > way people will feel about you for real. In my opinion, when it comes to the > > internet, there are just different and more personal-responsibility type of > > ways of not tolerating something like the delete key. People become > > irrelevant through flame wars, not subject matter. > > > > Well anyway, I want to make it fun to be here, and productive. Earlier, I > > had asked if anyone was using fabric bags when they go shopping, a sort of > > poll. I think maybe I asked before there were too many people here. Please > > speak up! Even if you don't. Sometimes I wonder if doing it really even > > helps anything... > > > > I started with one little bag that folds up small and fits in my purse, so I > > have it ready whenever I use it. Then I went to a conference and all the > > gift bags were fabric shopping bags, so I scored a collection of great bags > > really fast for free. I like not collecting crappy plastic bags, although I > > still have quite a number. I don't always remember to have the bags with me > > when I hit the store. > > > > so what do you think? anyone one else giving it a try? Thoughts? > > > > Kara > > > > > > - Original Message > > From: Don Cooper > > To: Simon Newton > > Cc: "Savaas, Kara" > > Sent: Monday, January 14, 2008 4:00:17 PM > > Subject: Re: [ot_caving] [OT] Re: anyone else here yet? > > > > Less Fuddy! And much much less Duddy! > > > > Kara- > > > > I am very glad you are all doing well. Had I been two hundred miles closer > > - you know I would have brought soup and juice. > > > > It occured to me through the 'controversy' - that your post asking for help > > was completely off topic and 'against the rules' having "nothing to do with > > caves or caving". That in itself is proof that this listserver has done far > > more than just its stated purpose. Though I might have stepped out of line > > by calling names at creationists (stressing out over the move process - I > > just had to let off a little steam at what I consider MOST absurd) - the > > negative feedback I got really makes me aware of intolerance of some i
Re: [ot_caving] [OT] Re: anyone else here yet?
Absolutely! Kara, you are clearly feeling a lot better! Glad to see it! I agree that this splitting of the list is silly and divisive and doomed to failure, but in the meantime, I don't want to miss any of the juicy bits! In case any of you Tejanos haven't noticed (I started to say 'have your heads so far up, you can't see' but that wouldn't be PC...), you have THE largest, busiest, most vibrant and entertaining caver mail-list in the country. You know it's good if the internationally renowned Sr. Sleaze Weasel has joined up and become a regular contributor. (And what, pray tell, could be more OT than *that*??) I very much look forward to my daily dose, I mean digest, of Texas tripe, all the way up here in VA. I'm a member of every caver list I know of, and texascavers is my fave. Why? Because it's always so full of irreverent humor, witticisms, strange factoids, and tall tales from the likes of Gil 'Oztotl' Ediger, Sleaze, and the DirtDoc, not to mention SpeleoSteele, WaV, and others, and certainly to mention the inimitable David Locklear. Sure, all the lists have a Rule Numero Uno that says all posts have to be caving related. Some of them actually enforce that. The VAR list has ONLY posts directly related to caving, and I get one, maybe two digests a week, each with one message in them. Bo-ring! TAG-Net is always extolling the virtues of it's 5,000-word trip reports, which put me straight to sleep. Bo- ring!! And they have actually excommunicating cavers for not playing by the rules! I love TAG, and I love Texas, but I don't cave there very often, so mostly I scroll past the cave talk, looking for the interesting stuff. I think Rule Numero Uno was misprinted -- it meant to say '"caver-related"... After all, cavers are all one big happy family, and we all care about each other, and what each other are doing and thinking. All that stuff should be fair game on the list, so long as everybody uses a modicum of common sense and tact. Oh well, I guess we're now off to see who has more fun, the list with the latest trip to Airmans, or the list with tales by Sleaze and Gil and Locklear, and other interesting stuff thought of/up/about BY cavers, and therefore inherently cave(r) related. Alex -- Alex Sproul, NSS 8086 NSS IT Committee - Give this to a friend: ot-subscr...@texascavers.com To unsubscribe, e-mail: ot-unsubscr...@texascavers.com For additional commands, e-mail: ot-h...@texascavers.com
[ot_caving] Thank you for attending!
To all and any of you who have subscribed, willingly - to recieve off topic, tangental and near-cave and caver related "spam" I salute you. Here is a place where people have no authority to tell me what I can or cannot say. (as long as I say it politely) This is what freedom of speech is really about. In a caver-supported environment, a free exchange of ideas. Brilliant. If it isnt even about caves or caving - it's alright. I really have to appreciate Charles Goldsmith for going above and beyond. And as long as I'm talking about free exchange. I even have a possible theory of support for "creationists" - but people who adhere to the bible will not like it. It's not about aliens. It's not about the bible. The sun might be the intellegent "being" that planned it all. Hmmm... Imagine a huge, magnetically active entity. -WaVy
Re: [ot_caving] Thank you for attending!
You're quite welcome Don, anything I can do to help :) Charles On 1/14/08, Don Cooper wrote: > > To all and any of you who have subscribed, willingly - to recieve off > topic, tangental and near-cave and caver related "spam" I salute you. > Here is a place where people have no authority to tell me what I can or > cannot say. (as long as I say it politely) > This is what freedom of speech is really about. In a caver-supported > environment, a free exchange of ideas. > Brilliant. If it isnt even about caves or caving - it's alright. I > really have to appreciate Charles Goldsmith for going above and beyond. > And as long as I'm talking about free exchange. > > I even have a possible theory of support for "creationists" - but people > who adhere to the bible will not like it. > It's not about aliens. It's not about the bible. The sun might be the > intellegent "being" that planned it all. > Hmmm... Imagine a huge, magnetically active entity. > > -WaVy >
[ot_caving] Re: Thank you for attending!
Can we keep this offtopic list well offtopic? This message was too on topic for this list. It's annoying to wade through all the on topic emails to find the off topic gems. :-) Simon - returning to lurk mode > -- Forwarded message -- > From: "Don Cooper" > To: o...@texascavers.com > Date: Mon, 14 Jan 2008 15:04:49 -0600 > Subject: Thank you for attending! > To all and any of you who have subscribed, willingly - to recieve off topic, > tangental and near-cave and caver related "spam" I salute you. > Here is a place where people have no authority to tell me what I can or > cannot say. (as long as I say it politely) > This is what freedom of speech is really about. In a caver-supported > environment, a free exchange of ideas. > Brilliant. If it isnt even about caves or caving - it's alright. I really > have to appreciate Charles Goldsmith for going above and beyond. > And as long as I'm talking about free exchange. > > I even have a possible theory of support for "creationists" - but people who > adhere to the bible will not like it. > It's not about aliens. It's not about the bible. The sun might be the > intellegent "being" that planned it all. > Hmmm... Imagine a huge, magnetically active entity. > > -WaVy > - Give this to a friend: ot-subscr...@texascavers.com To unsubscribe, e-mail: ot-unsubscr...@texascavers.com For additional commands, e-mail: ot-h...@texascavers.com
