Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community Participation

2007-02-27 Thread Alan DuBoff
On Friday 02 February 2007 10:42 am, John Plocher wrote: Alan DuBoff wrote: On Wednesday 31 January 2007 09:34 am, Stephen Harpster wrote: We're wondering if this would increase participation. However, I wanted to offer a suggestion on how you could help I would like to see a virtual

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community Participation

2007-02-27 Thread Alan DuBoff
On Friday 02 February 2007 01:27 pm, James Dickens wrote: On 2/2/07, Alan DuBoff [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I would like to see a virtual user group, where all the participants might connect with RealPlayer10 to get a live video of the meeting, which could be anything from a presentation,

Re: So-called mindless rules (was Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings))

2007-02-19 Thread Laszlo (Laca) Peter
On Sun, 2007-02-18 at 21:04 +, Peter Tribble wrote: On 2/5/07, Laszlo (Laca) Peter [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Another library from the GNOME community is libxml2, which is now used all over Solaris. I'm currently working on updating it in Solaris 10 to a version that is 2 years newer.

Re: So-called mindless rules (was Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings))

2007-02-18 Thread Peter Tribble
On 2/5/07, Laszlo (Laca) Peter [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Another library from the GNOME community is libxml2, which is now used all over Solaris. I'm currently working on updating it in Solaris 10 to a version that is 2 years newer. The diff is 10+ lines (not counting the Makefile changes)

[osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-02-08 Thread UNIX admin
No, that's reasonably priced. Now the issue will be finding somewhere to put it. I may not have a datacenter for my system, but space is still an issue :P Indeed, in today's computing environment, two most precious resources are space and energy consumption. A close running third is noise

[osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-02-08 Thread UNIX admin
More of us getting stuck into the gaps that hinder the spread of OpenSolaris, working either as independent OpenSolaris developers or as an integral part of a Sun project team. I'd like to think that one day I can make a living as an OpenSolaris developer. ...or a(n) (Open)Solaris

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-02-08 Thread Bonnie Corwin
Just FYI, there is a list of the bite-sized bugs: http://opensolaris.org/os/bug_reports/oss_bite_size I have added link to this page to http://opensolaris.org/os/bug_reports and we'll get a link on http://bugs.opensolaris.org as soon as we can. Bonnie Ben Rockwood wrote: While that would be

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-02-08 Thread Ben Rockwood
Thank you Bonnie. :) benr. Bonnie Corwin wrote: Just FYI, there is a list of the bite-sized bugs: http://opensolaris.org/os/bug_reports/oss_bite_size I have added link to this page to http://opensolaris.org/os/bug_reports and we'll get a link on http://bugs.opensolaris.org as soon as we

[osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-02-07 Thread UNIX admin
On 31-Jan-07, at 9:37 PM, Jim Grisanzio wrote: Some have been considering a bug bounty program, so yes, I think we ought to consider specific programs to engage more people in more ways and then call attention to their contributions. Fantastic! :) I honestly think that'd be

[osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-02-07 Thread UNIX admin
IBM is also embracing it on their blade centers, and are a reseller of Solaris. Maybe so -- I can't comment on that, but I can say that IBM is badmouthing Solaris every chance they get. They even have a magazine that features IBM solutions on Linux, and lots of articles are specifically

[osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-02-07 Thread UNIX admin
The testing process is also difficult at best at the moment since you need to test for x86 and SPARC, and let's face it, most folks have an x86 box, not a SPARC box. Used SPARC hardware is dirt cheap nowdays. I just got me 2 x SunFire V100 for $200 USD apiece, and they're both practically

[osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-02-07 Thread Shawn Walker
The testing process is also difficult at best at the moment since you need to test for x86 and SPARC, and let's face it, most folks have an x86 box, not a SPARC box. Used SPARC hardware is dirt cheap nowdays. I just got me 2 x SunFire V100 for $200 USD apiece, and they're both

[osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-06 Thread Richard Nekus
-ok there you are, i was lookin' for this post, Hi All, I have a few (3) Questions at the bottom, for you opensolaris developers, et all. But, first of all, thanks for OpenSolaris ! it works great (now, to get Mplayer, and DVD:Rip goin' :) yup, its now workin'... betiful. mmm, The

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-05 Thread Josh Hurst
On 2/5/07, James C. McPherson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Josh Hurst wrote: On 2/2/07, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: And how far have the star or ksh projects progressed? The last one appears to be in serious trouble now because Sun has to complain about every little detail and

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-05 Thread James C. McPherson
Josh Hurst wrote: On 2/5/07, James C. McPherson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: ... Ok Josh, how about you provide detail on which of those rules Sun is suddenly pushing forward, and why they are mindless. If they truly are mindless then it would be really good for other people to find out why. Few

yet more ksh93 FUD [Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)]

2007-02-05 Thread James Carlson
Josh Hurst writes: Few examples: Why is it required to remove .so and lint libraries? We're currently discussing it. The issue is that the libraries in question are _NOT_ documented, and are not guaranteed any sort of stability to those building separate applications. As they're not

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-05 Thread Alan Coopersmith
Josh Hurst wrote: Few examples: Why is it required to remove .so and lint libraries? You don't do that for X11 even when the API is not public. What private API's does X11 provide .so lint libraries for? I can't think of any. Why is is necessary to demand the removal of diff files from the

So-called mindless rules (was Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings))

2007-02-05 Thread John Plocher
Josh Hurst wrote: Why is it required to remove .so and lint libraries? You don't do that for X11 even when the API is not public. Please see the architectural policy on libraries at http://www.opensolaris.org/os/community/arc/policies/libraries/ In particular, note W2 and W3 in that document.

Re: So-called mindless rules (was Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings))

2007-02-05 Thread Rich Teer
On Mon, 5 Feb 2007, John Plocher wrote: JDS doesn't grok Gnome session files from Linux. Blame this directly on GNOME - their config file formats have been wildly unstable between versions, making it difficult to reuse them across versions. IMHO, GNOME was not designed to work in an

Re: So-called mindless rules (was Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings))

2007-02-05 Thread Laszlo (Laca) Peter
On Mon, 2007-02-05 at 09:24 -0800, John Plocher wrote: Josh Hurst wrote: JDS doesn't grok Gnome session files from Linux. Blame this directly on GNOME - their config file formats have been wildly unstable between versions, making it difficult to reuse them across versions. That's right.

Re: So-called mindless rules (was Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings))

2007-02-05 Thread Laszlo (Laca) Peter
On Mon, 2007-02-05 at 10:04 -0800, Rich Teer wrote: In fact, one might argue that had the GNOME project adopted some of Sun's mindless rules (aka, sound engineering practices), issues like this probably wouldn't have arisen in the first place. Broad-ranging breakages and everything needing

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-04 Thread Josh Hurst
On 2/2/07, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: And how far have the star or ksh projects progressed? The last one appears to be in serious trouble now because Sun has to complain about every little detail and the star project makes either zero progress or no progress announcements. The

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-04 Thread James C. McPherson
Josh Hurst wrote: On 2/2/07, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: And how far have the star or ksh projects progressed? The last one appears to be in serious trouble now because Sun has to complain about every little detail and the star project makes either zero progress or no progress

[osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-03 Thread UNIX admin
Well duh..! As a community project one of the measures of success is definitely community participation and how big it is. Not exactly. Success of a platform is measured by the availability of software for that platform. Even the most advanced platform in the world is useless if there is no

[osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-03 Thread UNIX admin
1) Community participation has remained very low. To date greater than 90% (very unscientific and conservative estimate) of OpenSolaris changes are driven by Sun's business interests and they come from Sun employees. (Look at commits, look at general development direction - nothing there for

[osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-03 Thread De Togni Giacomo
[i]In closing, if we want to attract programming talent and expertise, we should more closely work with, and even help the BSD community, even if we have to put on hold what we're doing on Solaris. Eventually the two communities might jump in for each other, and both communities would benefit.

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-03 Thread Frank Van Der Linden
UNIX admin wrote: We do need more people, but not the Linux hacker kind. All those would want to do is muck with Solaris so that it looks, works and behaves like Linux. Unfortunately, Linux suffers from serious lack of engineering and quality control because everything is implemented ad-hoc

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-03 Thread Christopher Mahan
What I am about to say is fairly brutal, so if you're already upset, don't read further. --- UNIX admin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Please understand that one of the reasons Solaris is superior to just about any other operating system out there is because Sun engineering has implemented

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-03 Thread Frank Van Der Linden
Christopher Mahan wrote: What I am about to say is fairly brutal, so if you're already upset, don't read further. You make some dramatic statements. However, I think some of them are off somewhat. I wholeheartedly agree that open source needs to be embraced, and quickly and aggressively. I

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-03 Thread Christopher Mahan
Added bonus: http://www.iowaconsumercase.org/010807/PLEX_7264.pdf via /. (http://slashdot.org/articles/07/02/03/1524250.shtml) read the last line. --- Christopher Mahan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What I am about to say is fairly brutal, so if you're already upset, don't read further.

[osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-03 Thread S Destika
If you'd like to do driver development for Solaris, what's stopping you from going to docs.sun.com and looking up the driver development guide? I am frustrated to say that people repeatedly miss the point. To remind - Those drivers were written long back ago (before OpenSolaris) by single

[osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-03 Thread UNIX admin
I am frustrated to say that people repeatedly miss the point. To remind - Those drivers were written long back ago (before OpenSolaris) by single person for his own cause and he was kind enough to make them available. Incorrect. Those drivers (by Murayama-san) are still in development, and

[osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-03 Thread UNIX admin
That's what has happened with Linux - it is good enough and does what people want it to do and it is free. Why do I need to wait for years just to make it run on my hardware when Linux runs on it today and if it doesn't run the way I like it - I can just fix it up and propagate those

[osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-03 Thread S Destika
Also, Linux fails miserably in large enterprise deployments, because the thing is simply not designed for server farms with thousands of systems on them. That's why your local ATM, or your bank or even your insurance will never be powered by Linux and why they will always either be run on

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-03 Thread Ignacio Marambio Catán
On 2/3/07, UNIX admin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I am frustrated to say that people repeatedly miss the point. To remind - Those drivers were written long back ago (before OpenSolaris) by single person for his own cause and he was kind enough to make them available. Incorrect. Those drivers

[osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-03 Thread S Destika
Yeah I can do that if I feel like doing it but that is not the point. Point is to make OpenSolaris a place where people can easily contribute their changes. Why would I need to discuss that sort of thing (making and propagating my own changes) on this list? What happens when number of

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-03 Thread Ignacio Marambio Catán
On 2/3/07, S Destika [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Yeah I can do that if I feel like doing it but that is not the point. Point is to make OpenSolaris a place where people can easily contribute their changes. Why would I need to discuss that sort of thing (making and propagating my own changes) on

[osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-03 Thread UNIX admin
Wow thats a bunch of crazy statements right there - you have insurmountable amount of ignorance here. ATM machines run Linux (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banrisul - they replaced MS-DOS here so your statement couldn't be more funnier!) . Plenty of banks running Linux successfully - do a

[osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-02 Thread Richard L. Hamilton
[...] That's true too and Alan I _really_ appreciate that you are the only Sun employee to admit that. But I think the reality is that OpenSolaris has made no progress whatsoever and when I say that I will not ignore defining and quantifying it - So let us see what was the prime objective

[osol-discuss] Re: Community Participation

2007-02-02 Thread Alan DuBoff
On Wednesday 31 January 2007 09:34 am, Stephen Harpster wrote: We're wondering if this would increase participation. You mentioned this previously and several folks made comments about the participation of the community, probably more than we'll need for a long time(even mine;-)

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-02 Thread Stephen Harpster
That's true too and Alan I _really_ appreciate that you are the only Sun employee to admit that. But I think the reality is that OpenSolaris has made no progress whatsoever and when I say that I will not ignore defining and quantifying it - So let us see what was the prime objective of

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-02 Thread Josh Hurst
On 2/2/07, Joerg Schilling [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Josh Hurst [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 2/2/07, Stephen Harpster [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If you want it to go faster, then participate. Many of us are waiting that the first community project integrates. We'd like to see that

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-02 Thread Casper . Dik
On 2/2/07, Stephen Harpster [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If you want it to go faster, then participate. Many of us are waiting that the first community project integrates. We'd like to see that Opensolaris.org is really an Open organisation where community projects can succeed. So far you lack a

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-02 Thread Casper . Dik
And how far have the star or ksh projects progressed? The last one appears to be in serious trouble now because Sun has to complain about every little detail and the star project makes either zero progress or no progress announcements. The only problem in the ksh93 project is people who are not

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-02 Thread Christopher Mahan
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I see no problem; it's progressing as we expected. As they say, you may like sausages, but you may not want to see them made. Maybe we want to know what's in the sausage. Chris Mahan 818.943.1850 cell [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-02 Thread Casper . Dik
Yeah, everyone wants organic sausages. Dump the E-number stuff. But then, for some of these we don't know yet how ... when talking about the Solaris sausage. I guess you fell hook, line and sinker for the E-numbers are (dangerous) chemicals ploy. Most of them are ordinary checmicals you'll

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community Participation

2007-02-02 Thread John Plocher
Alan DuBoff wrote: On Wednesday 31 January 2007 09:34 am, Stephen Harpster wrote: We're wondering if this would increase participation. However, I wanted to offer a suggestion on how you could help I would like to see a virtual user group, where all the participants might connect with

[osol-discuss] Re: Community Participation

2007-02-02 Thread Stephen Harpster
U.. we already have that. GNOME Meeting went in build 53, and the USB webcam support just went in last week -- or the week before. Alan DuBoff wrote: On Wednesday 31 January 2007 09:34 am, Stephen Harpster wrote: We're wondering if this would increase participation. You

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-02 Thread James Carlson
William James writes: Really? Most in the community don't share this opinion. Ben, David, Jesup, Tobias, Bruno, Markus and I are betting right now whether the ksh93 integration will succeed or not. Bets are 6:1 that it'll fail (I try to be optimistic but I am alone with this opinion). At

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-02 Thread Frank Hofmann
On Fri, 2 Feb 2007, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Yeah, everyone wants organic sausages. Dump the E-number stuff. But then, for some of these we don't know yet how ... when talking about the Solaris sausage. I guess you fell hook, line and sinker for the E-numbers are (dangerous) chemicals ploy.

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community Participation

2007-02-02 Thread Alan DuBoff
On Friday 02 February 2007 10:46 am, Stephen Harpster wrote: U.. we already have that. GNOME Meeting went in build 53, and the USB webcam support just went in last week -- or the week before. I'm fine with using any software that will allow us to collaborate, but RealPlayer works

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-02 Thread Joerg Schilling
Josh Hurst [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 2/2/07, Joerg Schilling [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Josh Hurst [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 2/2/07, Stephen Harpster [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If you want it to go faster, then participate. Many of us are waiting that the first community project

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community Participation

2007-02-02 Thread Alan DuBoff
On Friday 02 February 2007 11:34 am, Stephen Harpster wrote: What help do you need? Just ask on the desktop community. I'm not exactly sure, but we need some type of software to multiplex the clients so we can have xxx number, for one thing. Some software might handle that by default, and

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-02 Thread Alan DuBoff
NOTE: send an email to Derek Cicero to have your email changed. On Thursday 01 February 2007 06:36 pm, S Destika wrote: It depends on how you define progress. I agree that most Sun folks feel they have made good progress but like marketing folks they conveniently ignore defining and

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community Participation

2007-02-02 Thread James Dickens
On 2/2/07, Alan DuBoff [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Wednesday 31 January 2007 09:34 am, Stephen Harpster wrote: We're wondering if this would increase participation. You mentioned this previously and several folks made comments about the participation of the community, probably more than we'll

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-02-01 Thread Christopher Mahan
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What I mean was --Works in x86 32bit but not in 64bit, and not in Sparc --Works with Bash but not ksh --Works with single core but not dual or even 8 cores --Works with cli but crashes X Window etc. None of these are considered acceptable at Sun.

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-02-01 Thread Darren J Moffat
Christopher Mahan wrote: What I mean was --Works in x86 32bit but not in 64bit, and not in Sparc You broke my laptop it runs 64 bit and you broke my NFS server it is SPARC. In specific cases this one might actually be okay if it is functionality that only applies to x86 in 32bit and there

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-02-01 Thread Christoph Hellwig
On Wed, Jan 31, 2007 at 09:09:20PM +0100, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Oh, and when did kprobes and ReiserFS integrate? In Opensolaris? Not at all. In Linux which is probably offtopic here it's 2004 (kprobes) and 2001 (reiserfs). ___

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-02-01 Thread Frank Hofmann
On Thu, 1 Feb 2007, Christoph Hellwig wrote: On Wed, Jan 31, 2007 at 09:09:20PM +0100, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Oh, and when did kprobes and ReiserFS integrate? In Opensolaris? Not at all. In Linux which is probably offtopic here it's 2004 (kprobes) and 2001 (reiserfs). How about lkcd

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-02-01 Thread James Carlson
Christopher Mahan writes: Could performance regression be acceptable if there is, let's say, tangible development potential? For example: a tool is reimplemented in Python to allow very competent python devs to take it to the next level? Sure. You just need to be explicit about what you're

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-02-01 Thread Christopher Mahan
--- Darren J Moffat [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Christopher Mahan wrote: What I mean was --Works in x86 32bit but not in 64bit, and not in Sparc You broke my laptop it runs 64 bit and you broke my NFS server it is SPARC. In specific cases this one might actually be okay if it is

[osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-02-01 Thread Ben Rockwood
While that would be handy, we already have a good program in place, its just buried. I refer to Bite Sized Bugs. I've pointed to this problem before: how do you find them? Bugs are (were) flagged in the database but finding a list of these is difficult or impossible. I've suggested in the

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-02-01 Thread Ian Collins
Ben Rockwood wrote: While that would be handy, we already have a good program in place, its just buried. I refer to Bite Sized Bugs. I've pointed to this problem before: how do you find them? Bugs are (were) flagged in the database but finding a list of these is difficult or impossible.

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-02-01 Thread Rich Teer
On Thu, 1 Feb 2007, Ben Rockwood wrote: The idea here is that if someone sits down on a Saturday afternoon and wants a challenge they pull up the list, pull one that looks tasty and start working on a solution. Its got to be super easy for people to get started this way. FWIW, I think

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-02-01 Thread Peter Tribble
On 2/1/07, Ben Rockwood [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: While that would be handy, we already have a good program in place, its just buried. I refer to Bite Sized Bugs. ... The idea here is that if someone sits down on a Saturday afternoon and wants a challenge they pull up the list, pull one

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-02-01 Thread James Carlson
Peter Tribble writes: I think we need to advertise what projects or communities need help at any point in time, and for each community or project to identify key issues where extra hands would make a difference. At the moment it's very difficult even for those of us who've been involved with

[osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-01 Thread S Destika
[b]Do not reply to me - I read this forum. My email ID is INVALID. Thank you.[/b] James C. McPherson wrote: Hi Erast, I *really* do not understand why you appear to be so concerned about how large or extensive the OpenSolaris community actually is. Yes, the number of those who

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-01 Thread Casper . Dik
[b]Do not reply to me - I read this forum. My email ID is INVALID. Thank you.[/b] How nice of you. S Destika [EMAIL PROTECTED] I was about to send a repy but now I won't. Casper ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-01 Thread James C. McPherson
S Destika wrote: [b]Do not reply to me - I read this forum. My email ID is INVALID. Thank you.[/b] James C. McPherson wrote: Hi Erast, I *really* do not understand why you appear to be so concerned about how large or extensive the OpenSolaris community actually is. Yes, the number of

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-01 Thread James C. McPherson
S Destika wrote: [b]Do not reply to me - I read this forum. My email ID is INVALID. Thank you.[/b] If you cannot be bothered setting up a valid email address for the mailing lists then perhaps you're not really interested in being part of the community. James C. McPherson -- Solaris kernel

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-01 Thread Alan DuBoff
On Thursday 01 February 2007 02:37 pm, James C. McPherson wrote: S Destika wrote: [b]Do not reply to me - I read this forum. My email ID is INVALID. Thank you.[/b] If you cannot be bothered setting up a valid email address for the mailing lists then perhaps you're not really interested in

[osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-01 Thread S Destika
[b] To all - Please fix the forum s/w to allow me to change my email ID and I promise I will do it next moment - please STOP complaining about it. I believe it should be fixed the right way - which benefits all - by fixing the forum software.[/b] It's kind of interesting seeing a substantial

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-01 Thread Stephen Lau
disregard my previous post - I didn't realise that you were having issues changing it. email me your new email address and i'll update your account. cheers, steve On Thu, Feb 01, 2007 at 06:36:03PM -0800, S Destika wrote: [b] To all - Please fix the forum s/w to allow me to change my email ID

[osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-01 Thread De Togni Giacomo
I could accept every line of your post,but please don't forget that GPL is not freedom,its a little great community's extortion to a single developer.The choice to release modified source code should be a logical step without impositions because its more *convenient* for me and for open

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-02-01 Thread Jim Grisanzio
Peter Tribble wrote On 02/02/07 05:23,: On 2/1/07, *Ben Rockwood* [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: While that would be handy, we already have a good program in place, its just buried. I refer to Bite Sized Bugs. ... The idea here is that if someone sits down

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-02-01 Thread Jim Grisanzio
James Carlson wrote On 02/02/07 05:34,: Peter Tribble writes: I think we need to advertise what projects or communities need help at any point in time, and for each community or project to identify key issues where extra hands would make a difference. At the moment it's very difficult even

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation (was GPLv3 ravings)

2007-02-01 Thread Jim Grisanzio
S Destika wrote On 02/02/07 07:22,: [b]Do not reply to me - I read this forum. My email ID is INVALID. Thank you.[/b] James C. McPherson wrote: Hi Erast, I *really* do not understand why you appear to be so concerned about how large or extensive the OpenSolaris community actually

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-01-31 Thread Jim Grisanzio
Alan Coopersmith wrote On 01/31/07 16:45,: Jim Grisanzio wrote: Also, I just checked the Jive discussion forums. Since opening 20 months ago, the project's lists/forums have generated 10,114,589 total views, 7,218,833 unique visitors, 21,033 threads, and 81,874 messages. and how many

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-01-31 Thread Frank Hofmann
On Wed, 31 Jan 2007, Ian Collins wrote: Shawn Walker wrote: I think the barriers to contribution are currently the biggest discouragement. Integration of even the smallest changes can take a very long time. That's put me off as well, it adds cost (from the developer's perspective). It

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-01-31 Thread Robert Milkowski
Hello Shawn, Wednesday, January 31, 2007, 4:01:33 AM, you wrote: SW I think the barriers to contribution are currently the biggest SW discouragement. Integration of even the smallest changes can take a very long time. Not that you get code integration in Linux world instantaneously especially

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-01-31 Thread Darren J Moffat
Shawn Walker wrote: I think the barriers to contribution are currently the biggest discouragement. Integration of even the smallest changes can take a very long time. and how is this any different to getting fixes into the one true Linux kernel tar ball ? How many people actually have

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-01-31 Thread Casper . Dik
Shawn Walker wrote: I think the barriers to contribution are currently the biggest discouragement. Integration of ev en the smallest changes can take a very long time. and how is this any different to getting fixes into the one true Linux kernel tar ball ? How many people actually have

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-01-31 Thread Richard Lowe
Darren J Moffat wrote: Shawn Walker wrote: I think the barriers to contribution are currently the biggest discouragement. Integration of even the smallest changes can take a very long time. and how is this any different to getting fixes into the one true Linux kernel tar ball ? How many

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-01-31 Thread Stephen Harpster
All of those things are being worked on now. Shawn Walker wrote: I think the barriers to contribution are currently the biggest discouragement. Integration of even the smallest changes can take a very long time. Oh, and before I forget, the bug reporting system being out of sync with

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-01-31 Thread Stephen Harpster
I'm the first to agree that the transition to Mercurial, getting the source outside Sun's firewall, is going slower than I want. And now there are problems with the automounter. Sigh. It's not that we don't want to fix this. There are just a lot of technical issues. The best thing you can

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-01-31 Thread Richard Lowe
Stephen Harpster wrote: I'm the first to agree that the transition to Mercurial, getting the source outside Sun's firewall, is going slower than I want. And now there are problems with the automounter. Sigh. It's not that we don't want to fix this. There are just a lot of technical

[osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-01-31 Thread Shawn Walker
On Tuesday 30 January 2007 08:37 pm, Artem Kachitchkine wrote: Do the community contributors feel at home here? I don't think so. I see Sun's process as being very intimidating. While many of the other open source communities are bold, they're somehow more welcoming. I see OpenSolaris

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-01-31 Thread Josh Hurst
On 1/31/07, S Destika [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree with some of your post, but the rest is simply untrue. There are plenty of design and implementation discussions. There have been plenty of good and bad words exchanged as well about particular features, etc. There have been

Re: Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-01-31 Thread Josh Hurst
On 1/31/07, Stephen Harpster [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm the first to agree that the transition to Mercurial, getting the source outside Sun's firewall, is going slower than I want. How do you want to stimulate the growth of the Opensolaris community? That may be more important right now.

Re: Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-01-31 Thread Christopher Mahan
Please forgive the newbiness. Can Open Solaris be built entirely from source? Josh Hurst [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 1/31/07, Stephen Harpster wrote: I'm the first to agree that the transition to Mercurial, getting the source outside Sun's firewall, is going slower than I want. How do

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-01-31 Thread Glynn Foster
Hey, Josh Hurst wrote: On 1/31/07, Stephen Harpster [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm the first to agree that the transition to Mercurial, getting the source outside Sun's firewall, is going slower than I want. How do you want to stimulate the growth of the Opensolaris community? That may be

Re: Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-01-31 Thread Christopher Mahan
--- Josh Hurst [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 1/31/07, Christopher Mahan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Please forgive the newbiness. Can Open Solaris be built entirely from source? Ask in opensolaris-code@opensolaris.org for details. The answer is yes except some closed binary parts which

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-01-31 Thread Josh Hurst
On 1/31/07, Glynn Foster [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hey, Josh Hurst wrote: On 1/31/07, Stephen Harpster [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm the first to agree that the transition to Mercurial, getting the source outside Sun's firewall, is going slower than I want. How do you want to stimulate the

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-01-31 Thread Glynn Foster
Hey, Josh Hurst wrote: You could make it a community phenomenon quite like Linux if you would allow people to participate without waiting months to see the submitted patches integrated. It sucks when a five line patch for a very dumb bug is queued and no one cares. It sucks when projects like

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-01-31 Thread Tom Haynes
Josh Hurst wrote: You could make it a community phenomenon quite like Linux if you would allow people to participate without waiting months to see the submitted patches integrated. It sucks when a five line patch for a very dumb bug is queued and no one cares. It sucks when projects like the

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-01-31 Thread Casper . Dik
You could make it a community phenomenon quite like Linux if you would allow people to participate without waiting months to see the submitted patches integrated. It sucks when a five line patch for a very dumb bug is queued and no one cares. It sucks when projects like the ksh93 integration need

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-01-31 Thread Richard Lowe
Tom Haynes wrote: Josh Hurst wrote: You could make it a community phenomenon quite like Linux if you would allow people to participate without waiting months to see the submitted patches integrated. It sucks when a five line patch for a very dumb bug is queued and no one cares. It sucks when

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-01-31 Thread Alan Burlison
Josh Hurst wrote: You could make it a community phenomenon quite like Linux if you would allow people to participate without waiting months to see the submitted patches integrated. It sucks when a five line patch for a very dumb bug is queued and no one cares. It sucks when projects like the

Re: Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-01-31 Thread James Carlson
Christopher Mahan writes: How hard would it be to reimplement the binary parts? Are there patent issues? Those who know the issues usually can't talk about them in any detail. That's actually a good thing, as it leaves you untainted to take on one of those helpful tasks. ;-} In general,

Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Community participation

2007-01-31 Thread John Sonnenschein
On 31-Jan-07, at 11:31 AM, Christopher Mahan wrote: --- Josh Hurst [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 1/31/07, Christopher Mahan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Please forgive the newbiness. Can Open Solaris be built entirely from source? Ask in opensolaris-code@opensolaris.org for details. The

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