*Exactly what is "NORMAL"? is being a white, straight male Republican "Christian" the standard for normal? * ** *Illnesses and being different are normal. *
On 10/5/10, Mark <[email protected]> wrote: > > Oh, but they are weaknesses....... show me ONE that is a strength or that > makes you NORMAL. It is a weakness in fact and by definition. > > On Tue, Oct 5, 2010 at 7:51 AM, Tommy News <[email protected]> wrote: > >> *No Mark. You are misinformed.* >> ** >> *Depression is not a weakness, it is a mental illness.* >> ** >> *Ilnesses are not weaknesses. >> * >> >> On 10/4/10, Mark <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> *****Depression is something more that a purely "psychological" >>> condition... it's "social", too.**** >>> >>> Please explain which disease or weakness of the Psyche is not effected by >>> ALL outside influences.... Depression is a weakness... if you want protected >>> because you have it... wear a sign... do not expect different or special >>> treatment by anyone unless you inform them all. >>> >>> Again, to drive him over the edge he must have been doing something that >>> he found so personally, morally or socially repugnant/unacceptable... for >>> whatever reason and this is and was his OWN problem. >>> >>> As to candid cameraman... prosecute him.... but NOT for the boys suicide >>> (read the definition). >>> >>> On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 9:16 AM, nominal9 <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>>> Depression is something more that a purely "psychological" >>>> condition... it's "social", too. This young person suicide victim was >>>> doing well enough until he was harassed (at least twice, apparently) >>>> by his room-mate. The "victim" was definitely the "recipient" of the >>>> act of being video-recorded in his sex acts (without his knowledge or >>>> consent, against his will) anfd then having those video-recordings >>>> broadcast to the public. This is a two part question of "psychology" >>>> the psychology of the room-mate (as agent/patient) who performed the >>>> act and the the psychology of the Victim (as patient/recipient) >>>> first.. turned (as agent patient) into the performer of his own act of >>>> suicide. >>>> >>>> ROOM-MATE >>>> I hate homos / want them dead....I tolerate homos / they can live >>>> C(BAD)..........R(BAD).... >>>> I hate homos / they can live..........I tolerate homos / want them >>>> dead >>>> >>>> VICTIM >>>> love oneself / live.... hate oneself / suicide >>>> C(GOOD).......R(GOOD).... >>>> love oneself / suicide... hate oneself / live >>>> >>>> ROOM-MATE >>>> Harass / Peep&Shame......Respect / Honor Privacy >>>> C(BAD)....R(BAD).... >>>> Harass / Honor Privacy......Respect / Peep&Shame >>>> >>>> VICTIM >>>> hate oneself / suicide......love oneself / live >>>> C(BAD) .......R(BAD)...... >>>> hateoneself / live............love oneself / suicide >>>> >>>> Basically, the VICTIM, after the "motivated act" of the ROOMMATE took >>>> on the Sentiment (hate) and the intent (public shame) of the act that >>>> was performed against him and acted as the ROOM-MATE "wanted" him >>>> to.... he was "impresssionable", or appalled by the "cruelty" of >>>> someone who could have (should have) been a "friend' (strictly that) >>>> and decided to give the ROOM-MATE what he desired...... personally, my >>>> moral compass (and sense of justice) tells me that he should have >>>> killed the ROOM-MATE, instead. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Oct 1, 7:53 pm, Mark <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> > Tommy, No. >>>> > >>>> > Depression and or the propensity for it definitely varies person to >>>> person >>>> > with EVERYONE being different and having their own limits. Only those >>>> with >>>> > one foot on the ledge can be shoved over. >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> >>>> > On Fri, Oct 1, 2010 at 5:30 PM, Tommy News <[email protected]> >>>> wrote: >>>> > > *Your twisted pretzel logic does not pass muster.* >>>> > > ** >>>> > > *You fail to see that depression is often triggered by the acts of >>>> others, >>>> > > such as bullies and abusive homophobic taunters.* >>>> > > ** >>>> > > *Suicide is caused by many factors.* >>>> > >>>> > > *Hatred, bullies, and bigotry are also caused by many factors.* >>>> > >>>> >>>> > > On 10/1/10, Jonathan Ashley <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> > >>>> > >> *SUICIDE*, n. [L. suicidium; se and coedo, to slay.] >>>> > >> 1. Self-murder; the act of designedly destroying one's own life. >>>> > >>>> > >> By definition, one cannot cause someone else to commit >>>> "self-murder." If >>>> > >> someone else can be factually proven to be at fault, then that >>>> individual >>>> > >> would be guilty of murder. >>>> > >>>> > >> Has the individual who took the video been arrested for murder? If >>>> not, >>>> > >> you are jousting at windmills. >>>> > >>>> > >> On 10/1/2010 1:08 PM, Tommy News wrote: >>>> > >>>> > >> *Ignorant homophobes like you cause these suicides.* >>>> > >>>> >>>> > >> On 10/1/10, Mark <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> > >>>> > >>> No Tommy, it is not. The urge to destroy oneself is as ancient as >>>> life >>>> > >>> itself. There are so very many reasons people do this to >>>> themselves, both >>>> > >>> real and unreal reasons. There is however ONE reason ALL suicides >>>> do >>>> > >>> this.... they are too weak to cope and that, Sir, is a personal >>>> problem. It >>>> > >>> is NOT societal, and NOT something that can be legislated that >>>> causes me to >>>> > >>> lose the freedom to ask if someone is Gay or Lesbian (for whatever >>>> reason) >>>> > >>> or to call someone a flaming Queen if they are acting like one. >>>> > >>>> >>>> > >>> On Fri, Oct 1, 2010 at 1:05 PM, Tommy News <[email protected]> >>>> wrote: >>>> > >>>> > >>>> *Markie, Markie, Markie.* >>>> > >>>> ** >>>> > >>>> *Your ugly negativity and snarky spin is most perverse.* >>>> > >>>> *One suicide is one too many.* >>>> > >>>> > >>>> *No man is an island* >>>> > >>>> > >>>> No man is an island entire of itself; every man >>>> > >>>> is a piece of the continent, a part of the main; >>>> > >>>> if a clod be washed away by the sea, Europe >>>> > >>>> is the less, as well as if a promontory were, as >>>> > >>>> well as any manner of thy friends or of thine >>>> > >>>> own were; any man's death diminishes me, >>>> > >>>> because I am involved in mankind. >>>> > >>>> And therefore never send to know for whom >>>> > >>>> the bell tolls; it tolls for thee. >>>> > >>>> > >>>> -John Donne >>>> > >>>> >>>> > >>>> On 10/1/10, Mark <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> > >>>> > >>>>> Tommy, Tommy, Tommy, >>>> > >>>> > >>>>> He must have had a really poor self image... short of that >>>> nothing >>>> > >>>>> could "Make" him commit suicide. Suicide IS against the law, >>>> isn't it ?? >>>> > >>>> > >>>>> So you are basically saying "Mommy, Mommy, he made me do it !!" >>>> > >>>> > >>>>> Not much of a defense when prejudice of one kind or another >>>> exists in >>>> > >>>>> EVERY walk of life. >>>> > >>>> >>>> > >>>>> On Fri, Oct 1, 2010 at 10:33 AM, Tommy News < >>>> [email protected]>wrote: >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>> *This is not one isolated incident. The problem of homophobia >>>> is >>>> > >>>>>> societal and must be eradicated. * >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>> *This week , I heard about 3 – THREE – other young gay men >>>> murdered >>>> > >>>>>> by homophobia in America.* >>>> > >>>> >>>> > >>>>>> >>>> http://www.queerty.com/shock-gay-texas-13-year-old-asher-brown-shoots. >>>> .. >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>> >>>> http://www.lgbtqnation.com/2010/09/gay-teen-dies-after-10-days-on-lif. >>>> .. >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>> >>>> http://abcnews.go.com/US/victim-secret-dorm-sex-tape-commits-suicide/.<http://abcnews.go.com/US/victim-secret-dorm-sex-tape-commits-suicide/> >>>> .. >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>> On 10/1/10, nominal9 <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>>> I think the issue here is that someone shot and distributed >>>> the >>>> > >>>>>>> images >>>> > >>>>>>> against the suicide victim's will.... >>>> > >>>>>>> Plus, the victim was relatively young... eighteen....Gay or >>>> not.... >>>> > >>>>>>> that's a lot for a young person to handle..... >>>> > >>>>>>> nominal9 >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>>> On Oct 1, 12:09 pm, Mark <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> > >>>>>>> > *Just exactly what was he ashamed of ??? Being gay ?? How do >>>> you >>>> > >>>>>>> know ?? >>>> > >>>>>>> > He's certainly not talking.* >>>> > >>>>>>> > * >>>> > >>>>>>> > * >>>> > >>>>>>> > *Further, if one is going to do or be involved in something >>>> that >>>> > >>>>>>> they find >>>> > >>>>>>> > THAT shameful maybe they should rethink their own position >>>> first >>>> > >>>>>>> rather than >>>> > >>>>>>> > legislate an entire populace for a personal error.* >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>>> > On Fri, Oct 1, 2010 at 9:50 AM, Tommy News < >>>> [email protected]> >>>> > >>>>>>> wrote: >>>> > >>>>>>> > > *Your twisted pretzel logic is, as usual, illogical.* >>>> > >>>>>>> > > ** >>>> > >>>>>>> > > *This talented young man would still be alive if it were >>>> not for >>>> > >>>>>>> the >>>> > >>>>>>> > > horrible shame he felt after this secret video was posted >>>> on the >>>> > >>>>>>> internet by >>>> > >>>>>>> > > his straight roomate.* >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>>> > > On 10/1/10, dick thompson <[email protected]> >>>> wrote: >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>>> > >> I guess every time a gay guy comits suicide it is always >>>> a >>>> > >>>>>>> societal >>>> > >>>>>>> > >> homophobia, never anything else. And every time anyone >>>> kids a >>>> > >>>>>>> gay guy then >>>> > >>>>>>> > >> it is homophobia, never anything else. The people who >>>> filmed >>>> > >>>>>>> him should >>>> > >>>>>>> > >> pay for this big time but your thoughts on exactly why he >>>> took >>>> > >>>>>>> his own life >>>> > >>>>>>> > >> are open to question. People do things for reasons >>>> other than >>>> > >>>>>>> homophobia, >>>> > >>>>>>> > >> you know. The world does not revolve for the reasons >>>> you think >>>> > >>>>>>> it does and >>>> > >>>>>>> > >> the world does not sit there waiting for Tommy News do >>>> determine >>>> > >>>>>>> if it was >>>> > >>>>>>> > >> homophobia or not. You seem to think that if a gay guy >>>> does >>>> > >>>>>>> not get a job >>>> > >>>>>>> > >> he applied for it has to be because of homophobia, not >>>> that >>>> > >>>>>>> someone better >>>> > >>>>>>> > >> applied also. >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>>> > >> On 10/01/2010 11:19 AM, Tommy News wrote: >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>>> > >> *Do you think Tyler Clementi would have taken his own >>>> life if >>>> > >>>>>>> he had >>>> > >>>>>>> > >> been filmed in a private romantic encounter with a girl?* >>>> > >>>>>>> > >> *Think about why he took his life, why he did it. * >>>> > >>>>>>> > >> * In addition, Think about why his straight roommate >>>> secretly >>>> > >>>>>>> filmed the >>>> > >>>>>>> > >> encounter and broadcast it on the Internet. >>>> > >>>>>>> > >> * >>>> > >>>>>>> > >> *The problem is societal homophobia, which causes deep >>>> shame, >>>> > >>>>>>> ridicule, >>>> > >>>>>>> > >> harm, and persecution of gays.* >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>>> > >> *Think, I know you can!* >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>>> > >> On 10/1/10, THE ANNOINTED ONE <[email protected]> >>>> wrote: >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> Tommy, >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> One may first want to ask exactly what was so >>>> embarrassing and >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> repugnant on the tape that the young man was willing to >>>> take >>>> > >>>>>>> his own >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> life and why it was so to him. >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> That which made him jump came from within his own mind. >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> Since when is it governments job to legislate fortitude >>>> and >>>> > >>>>>>> love of >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> ones self ??? >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> On Sep 30, 6:23 pm, Tommy News <[email protected]> >>>> wrote: >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > *Take Action: Send A No More Suicides Letter to >>>> President >>>> > >>>>>>> Obama and >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> Congress >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > * >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > *Tell them to introduce and pass The American Equality >>>> Bill, >>>> > >>>>>>> to amend >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> the >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > Civil Rights Act of 1964 to include sexual orientation >>>> and >>>> > >>>>>>> gender >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> identity.* >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > ** >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > < >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>>> >>>> http://parenting.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/09/30/suicide-and-the-internet/ >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > Tyler Clementi Jumped off the George Washington Bridge >>>> in New >>>> > >>>>>>> York >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> after his >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > same-sex romantic encounter was secretly filmed and >>>> posted on >>>> > >>>>>>> the >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> internet >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > by his college roomate. At least three other youths >>>> have >>>> > >>>>>>> killed >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> themselves >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > due to homophobic bullying. Stop The Hate! >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > From our friend Tif: >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > -- THE LETTER BELOW WAS WRITTEN by Jonathan W, of >>>> Brooklyn, >>>> > >>>>>>> NY and >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> really >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > captures the heart of the matter it seems. >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > Please SEND IT as a comment to the White House at: >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> >http://www.whitehouse.gov/contact >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > ... >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > And LET THEM HEAR US SAY: >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > *** Mr. President PLEASE SPEAK OUT LOUDLY about >>>> homophobia, >>>> > >>>>>>> school >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> bullying >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > and equal civil rights for LGBTQ people -- no more >>>> suicide >>>> > >>>>>>> letters. *** >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > To President Obama, >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > All of us are horrified by the tragedy of Tyler >>>> Clementi, the >>>> > >>>>>>> young man >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> who >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > committed suicide after his sexual encounter with >>>> another man >>>> > >>>>>>> was >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> posted on >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > the internet. We share anger and disgust at the 2 >>>> students >>>> > >>>>>>> accused of >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> this >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > despicable act. But if our outrage stops there, we >>>> will be >>>> > >>>>>>> doing a >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> grave >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > disservice to the millions of young gay men and women >>>> in this >>>> > >>>>>>> country >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> who >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > live with shame and fear everyday and who have a 4 >>>> times >>>> > >>>>>>> greater risk >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> of >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > suicide than their straight counterparts. >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > Most people would be embarrassed and angered at having >>>> their >>>> > >>>>>>> private >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> sexual >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > acts secretly recorded and posted on the internet, but >>>> it >>>> > >>>>>>> seems >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> unlikely >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > that Mr. Clementi would have been driven to suicide if >>>> this >>>> > >>>>>>> had been a >>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > heterosexual encounter. A young heterosexual man would >>>> not >>>> > >>>> >>>> > ... >>>> > >>>> > read more »- Hide quoted text - >>>> > >>>> > - Show quoted text - >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. >>>> For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum >>>> >>>> * Visit our other community at >>>> http://www.PoliticalForum.com/<http://www.politicalforum.com/> >>>> * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. >>>> * Read the latest breaking news, and more. >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Mark M. Kahle H. >>> >>> -- >>> Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. >>> For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum >>> >>> * Visit our other community at >>> http://www.PoliticalForum.com/<http://www.politicalforum.com/> >>> * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. >>> * Read the latest breaking news, and more. >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Together, we can change the world, one mind at a time. >> Have a great day, >> Tommy >> >> -- >> >> Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. >> For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum >> >> * Visit our other community at >> http://www.PoliticalForum.com/<http://www.politicalforum.com/> >> * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. >> * Read the latest breaking news, and more. >> > > > > -- > Mark M. Kahle H. > > -- > Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. > For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum > > * Visit our other community at > http://www.PoliticalForum.com/<http://www.politicalforum.com/> > * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. > * Read the latest breaking news, and more. > -- Together, we can change the world, one mind at a time. Have a great day, Tommy -- Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum * Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/ * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. * Read the latest breaking news, and more.
