*Additionally, the murderers, Aaron McKinney, and Russell Henderson, were drug users looking for drug money and were also also a homophobes who chose to kidnap, rob, torture, bully, and beat Shepard because he was well dressed, small of stature, and gay. * ** *Matthew Shepard was not a drug user. * *In one sense, it really doesn't matter whether Matthew's murder was a robbery gone bad or the act of two bigots. Three lives were ruined.*
On 10/5/10, Tommy News <[email protected]> wrote: > > *No, you are wrong.* > ** > *Matthew Shepard's murder was not about drugs, it was a homophobic > anti-gay hate crime.* > *I have read and written about it extensively and I am certain that you > are wrong.* > ** > *You clearly believe the false claims of the two convicted criminal > murderers who are behind bars serving life sentences for this brutal* *and > horrific hate crime and will say anything to get off.** > > I suggest you read "The Last Days of Matthew Shepard" here in the archives > of this group which I co-own and run. * > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/MatthewShepardPrideandTolerance/ > > On 10/5/10, Keith In Tampa <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> Tom, >> >> This isn't about, "I Say" versus, "You Say". The story of Matthew >> Shepard has been well documented by CBS, ABC, and a host of other news >> sources. Most of them have not really broadcast the story, because it >> messes up the politically correct, "progressive Gay Militant Agenda's" >> story, but documented it is. Shepard was a drug user, who got caught up in >> a drug deal gone bad. Had nothing to do with his, "Gayness"....Had nothing >> to do with him being bullied; It had nothing to do with Shepard being >> offered a ride home. >> >> Sometimes, the truth hurts, and in this case, it blows away your >> Politically Correct, Progressive Militant Gay Agenda: >> >> http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/2373889/posts >> >> >> http://voices.washingtonpost.com/sleuth/2009/04/virginia_foxx_mathew_shepards.html >> >> http://abcnews.go.com/2020/story?id=277685&page=1 >> >> >> http://newsbusters.org/blogs/brad-wilmouth/2009/04/30/abc-debunks-matthew-shepard-murder-no-hate-crime-msnbc-savages-republ >> >> On Tue, Oct 5, 2010 at 3:31 PM, Tommy News <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> *This post is so filled with false statements that it would send a lie >>> detector off the charts.* >>> ** >>> *I suggest you read more about the murder of Matthew Shepard.* >>> *It was not a drug deal, as you falsely claim. Shepard only had five >>> dollars on him, and no drugs. He was not a drug user, as the two murderers >>> were.* >>> *Shepard was offered a ride home from the bar, then was kidnapped, >>> robbed, bullied, pistol whipped, had his skull fractured, was tied to a >>> fence and left to die in the cold because he was gay and was perceived >>> by McKinney and Henderson be an easy target, at their own admission in the >>> trial.* >>> ** >>> *The convicted murderer Aaron McKinney lied in prison to get off with >>> a chance at parole. and to claim it was not a hate crime, which it clearly >>> was. You are spouting off the lies of the convicted murderers, and may I ask >>> why you believe their false statements above the factual evidence? * >>> ** >>> *You are assuming other things as well. When have I ever said that I was >>> gay or bi or straight? Never! * >>> ** >>> *Keith, you are misguided and mistaken. * >>> ** >>> *In addition, to repeat yet again, Democrats are not Marxists, >>> Socialists, or Communists. No, they are not. >>> * >>> >>> On 10/5/10, Keith In Tampa <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>>> Hello Nominal, >>>> >>>> Yes. >>>> >>>> This is not to say that there are probably millions of individuals who >>>> are Gay, that don't fall into the "Militant Gay Agenda" category; but look >>>> at Tom, and all of the articles that he cuts and pastes. Take a gander >>>> at the web sites that are spreading vicious hateful lies, (and as you just >>>> admitted, the story continues to unfold). Take a look at how Matthew >>>> Shepard was made into a poster child for "hate crimes" and the whole story >>>> was premised on a lie. >>>> >>>> Does Tom speak for the majority of, or the minority of Gays in the >>>> United States? I dunno the answer to that. I do know that there are >>>> a lot of those with the "militant Gay Agenda" syndrome. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Tue, Oct 5, 2010 at 2:04 PM, nominal9 <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hi Keith.... >>>>> >>>>> I agree that the situation here is still being uncovered and >>>>> speculation may well be premature.....However, I ask you to consider >>>>> your own "Gay Agenda" claim.....Do you think that it is fair to lump >>>>> anyone's personal individual situation into a broad, generalised >>>>> classification such as a "group" Gay Agenda political context?.... >>>>> >>>>> On Oct 5, 1:13 pm, Keith In Tampa <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> > Hey Nominal, >>>>> > >>>>> > I am not exactly sure what your point is. Maybe I am missing Mark's >>>>> too, >>>>> > so feel free to chime in and correct me if I am mistaken. >>>>> > >>>>> > Let's review: >>>>> > >>>>> > This kid that we are referencing, killed himself. Committed suicide. >>>>> > Personally, I would classify that as some kind of mental illness. It >>>>> had >>>>> > nothing to do with anyone else killing him, the kid decided to take >>>>> his own >>>>> > life. >>>>> > >>>>> > The facts are just now coming out about this matter....Turns out that >>>>> maybe >>>>> > this had nothing to do with the roommate surrepticiously filming and >>>>> then, >>>>> > purportedly putting the film on the web. There are a number of links >>>>> on the >>>>> > web now, but the bottom line, is that it appears that Tyler Clementi >>>>> wasn't >>>>> > all that upset with his roommate. >>>>> > >>>>> > The point being, is that once again, we have a militant Gay Agenda, >>>>> > attempting to write a narrative that is both untruthful and >>>>> misleading. >>>>> > >>>>> > There was no bullying (at least documented) of Tyler Clementi. >>>>> Much like >>>>> > the Matthew Shepard story, where Shepard was purportedly killed >>>>> because of >>>>> > his sexual orientation, it turned out that Shepard was killed because >>>>> he was >>>>> > in a drug deal that went bad. >>>>> > >>>>> > Likewise, it appears that Mr. Clementi's suicide was caused by >>>>> something >>>>> > other than the alleged "Bullying". >>>>> > >>>>> > It's just a little lie...... >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> >>>>> > On Tue, Oct 5, 2010 at 12:28 PM, nominal9 <[email protected]> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> > > Mark.... this "weakness" claim of yours is a"fiction".... doesn't >>>>> > > comport with human experience. Take the example of "growing up"... >>>>> > > from birth to relative maturity. At what point does a baby or a >>>>> child >>>>> > > lose his/her emotional "weakness"....? Is a baby who is physically >>>>> or >>>>> > > mentally abused by "grown-ups" (depraved ones, let's say).... >>>>> > > emotionally weak... for crying or trying to escape? If not a "baby" >>>>> > > then at what point in an abusive continuum does a "youngster" >>>>> develop >>>>> > > into emotional "maturity" and therefor no longer has a right to >>>>> claim >>>>> > > victimization from an abuser.... twelve, thirteen, eighteen, >>>>> twenty- >>>>> > > one... thirty-five... fifty? >>>>> > > You seem to have this John Wayne tough-guy movie fiction working in >>>>> > > your head.....Maybe you should talk to some honest-to-goodness, >>>>> real- >>>>> > > life stand-up people.... and stop depending on romanticized >>>>> "gung-ho" >>>>> > > pablum for your assumptions into something you probably have never >>>>> > > experienced, yourself.... >>>>> > > Sounds like tough talk on my part.... but, frankly, tell me if and >>>>> > > when you have had experience in this regard, yourself... you >>>>> know... >>>>> > > standing up to very aggressive or assertive people, who struck >>>>> > > understandable and "doable" fear into you.... >>>>> > >>>>> > > On Oct 5, 10:07 am, Mark <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> > > > Oh, but they are weaknesses....... show me ONE that is a strength >>>>> or that >>>>> > > > makes you NORMAL. It is a weakness in fact and by definition. >>>>> > >>>>> > > > On Tue, Oct 5, 2010 at 7:51 AM, Tommy News <[email protected]> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> > > > > *No Mark. You are misinformed.* >>>>> > > > > ** >>>>> > > > > *Depression is not a weakness, it is a mental illness.* >>>>> > > > > ** >>>>> > > > > *Ilnesses are not weaknesses. >>>>> > > > > * >>>>> > >>>>> > > > > On 10/4/10, Mark <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >> *****Depression is something more that a purely >>>>> "psychological" >>>>> > > > >> condition... it's "social", too.**** >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >> Please explain which disease or weakness of the Psyche is not >>>>> effected >>>>> > > by >>>>> > > > >> ALL outside influences.... Depression is a weakness... if you >>>>> want >>>>> > > protected >>>>> > > > >> because you have it... wear a sign... do not expect different >>>>> or >>>>> > > special >>>>> > > > >> treatment by anyone unless you inform them all. >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >> Again, to drive him over the edge he must have been doing >>>>> something >>>>> > > that >>>>> > > > >> he found so personally, morally or socially >>>>> repugnant/unacceptable... >>>>> > > for >>>>> > > > >> whatever reason and this is and was his OWN problem. >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >> As to candid cameraman... prosecute him.... but NOT for the >>>>> boys >>>>> > > suicide >>>>> > > > >> (read the definition). >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >> On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 9:16 AM, nominal9 <[email protected]> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >>> Depression is something more that a purely "psychological" >>>>> > > > >>> condition... it's "social", too. This young person suicide >>>>> victim was >>>>> > > > >>> doing well enough until he was harassed (at least twice, >>>>> apparently) >>>>> > > > >>> by his room-mate. The "victim" was definitely the "recipient" >>>>> of the >>>>> > > > >>> act of being video-recorded in his sex acts (without his >>>>> knowledge or >>>>> > > > >>> consent, against his will) anfd then having those >>>>> video-recordings >>>>> > > > >>> broadcast to the public. This is a two part question of >>>>> "psychology" >>>>> > > > >>> the psychology of the room-mate (as agent/patient) who >>>>> performed the >>>>> > > > >>> act and the the psychology of the Victim (as >>>>> patient/recipient) >>>>> > > > >>> first.. turned (as agent patient) into the performer of his >>>>> own act >>>>> > > of >>>>> > > > >>> suicide. >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >>> ROOM-MATE >>>>> > > > >>> I hate homos / want them dead....I tolerate homos / they can >>>>> live >>>>> > > > >>> C(BAD)..........R(BAD).... >>>>> > > > >>> I hate homos / they can live..........I tolerate homos / want >>>>> them >>>>> > > > >>> dead >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >>> VICTIM >>>>> > > > >>> love oneself / live.... hate oneself / suicide >>>>> > > > >>> C(GOOD).......R(GOOD).... >>>>> > > > >>> love oneself / suicide... hate oneself / live >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >>> ROOM-MATE >>>>> > > > >>> Harass / Peep&Shame......Respect / Honor Privacy >>>>> > > > >>> C(BAD)....R(BAD).... >>>>> > > > >>> Harass / Honor Privacy......Respect / Peep&Shame >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >>> VICTIM >>>>> > > > >>> hate oneself / suicide......love oneself / live >>>>> > > > >>> C(BAD) .......R(BAD)...... >>>>> > > > >>> hateoneself / live............love oneself / suicide >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >>> Basically, the VICTIM, after the "motivated act" of the >>>>> ROOMMATE took >>>>> > > > >>> on the Sentiment (hate) and the intent (public shame) of the >>>>> act that >>>>> > > > >>> was performed against him and acted as the ROOM-MATE "wanted" >>>>> him >>>>> > > > >>> to.... he was "impresssionable", or appalled by the "cruelty" >>>>> of >>>>> > > > >>> someone who could have (should have) been a "friend' >>>>> (strictly that) >>>>> > > > >>> and decided to give the ROOM-MATE what he desired...... >>>>> personally, >>>>> > > my >>>>> > > > >>> moral compass (and sense of justice) tells me that he should >>>>> have >>>>> > > > >>> killed the ROOM-MATE, instead. >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >>> On Oct 1, 7:53 pm, Mark <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> > > > >>> > Tommy, No. >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >>> > Depression and or the propensity for it definitely varies >>>>> person to >>>>> > > > >>> person >>>>> > > > >>> > with EVERYONE being different and having their own limits. >>>>> Only >>>>> > > those >>>>> > > > >>> with >>>>> > > > >>> > one foot on the ledge can be shoved over. >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >>> > On Fri, Oct 1, 2010 at 5:30 PM, Tommy News < >>>>> [email protected]> >>>>> > > > >>> wrote: >>>>> > > > >>> > > *Your twisted pretzel logic does not pass muster.* >>>>> > > > >>> > > ** >>>>> > > > >>> > > *You fail to see that depression is often triggered by >>>>> the acts >>>>> > > of >>>>> > > > >>> others, >>>>> > > > >>> > > such as bullies and abusive homophobic taunters.* >>>>> > > > >>> > > ** >>>>> > > > >>> > > *Suicide is caused by many factors.* >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >>> > > *Hatred, bullies, and bigotry are also caused by many >>>>> factors.* >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >>> > > On 10/1/10, Jonathan Ashley < >>>>> [email protected]> >>>>> > > wrote: >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >>> > >> *SUICIDE*, n. [L. suicidium; se and coedo, to slay.] >>>>> > > > >>> > >> 1. Self-murder; the act of designedly destroying one's >>>>> own life. >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >>> > >> By definition, one cannot cause someone else to commit >>>>> > > > >>> "self-murder." If >>>>> > > > >>> > >> someone else can be factually proven to be at fault, >>>>> then that >>>>> > > > >>> individual >>>>> > > > >>> > >> would be guilty of murder. >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >>> > >> Has the individual who took the video been arrested for >>>>> murder? >>>>> > > If >>>>> > > > >>> not, >>>>> > > > >>> > >> you are jousting at windmills. >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >>> > >> On 10/1/2010 1:08 PM, Tommy News wrote: >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >>> > >> *Ignorant homophobes like you cause these suicides.* >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >>> > >> On 10/1/10, Mark <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >>> > >>> No Tommy, it is not. The urge to destroy oneself is as >>>>> ancient >>>>> > > as >>>>> > > > >>> life >>>>> > > > >>> > >>> itself. There are so very many reasons people do this >>>>> to >>>>> > > > >>> themselves, both >>>>> > > > >>> > >>> real and unreal reasons. There is however ONE reason >>>>> ALL >>>>> > > suicides >>>>> > > > >>> do >>>>> > > > >>> > >>> this.... they are too weak to cope and that, Sir, is a >>>>> personal >>>>> > > > >>> problem. It >>>>> > > > >>> > >>> is NOT societal, and NOT something that can be >>>>> legislated that >>>>> > > > >>> causes me to >>>>> > > > >>> > >>> lose the freedom to ask if someone is Gay or Lesbian >>>>> (for >>>>> > > whatever >>>>> > > > >>> reason) >>>>> > > > >>> > >>> or to call someone a flaming Queen if they are acting >>>>> like one. >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >>> > >>> On Fri, Oct 1, 2010 at 1:05 PM, Tommy News < >>>>> > > [email protected]> >>>>> > > > >>> wrote: >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >>> > >>>> *Markie, Markie, Markie.* >>>>> > > > >>> > >>>> ** >>>>> > > > >>> > >>>> *Your ugly negativity and snarky spin is most >>>>> perverse.* >>>>> > > > >>> > >>>> *One suicide is one too many.* >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >>> > >>>> *No man is an island* >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >>> > >>>> No man is an island entire of itself; every man >>>>> > > > >>> > >>>> is a piece of the continent, a part of the main; >>>>> > > > >>> > >>>> if a clod be washed away by the sea, Europe >>>>> > > > >>> > >>>> is the less, as well as if a promontory were, as >>>>> > > > >>> > >>>> well as any manner of thy friends or of thine >>>>> > > > >>> > >>>> own were; any man's death diminishes me, >>>>> > > > >>> > >>>> because I am involved in mankind. >>>>> > > > >>> > >>>> And therefore never send to know for whom >>>>> > > > >>> > >>>> the bell tolls; it tolls for thee. >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >>> > >>>> -John Donne >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >>> > >>>> On 10/1/10, Mark <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>> Tommy, Tommy, Tommy, >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>> He must have had a really poor self image... short of >>>>> that >>>>> > > > >>> nothing >>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>> could "Make" him commit suicide. Suicide IS against >>>>> the law, >>>>> > > > >>> isn't it ?? >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>> So you are basically saying "Mommy, Mommy, he made me >>>>> do it >>>>> > > !!" >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>> Not much of a defense when prejudice of one kind or >>>>> another >>>>> > > > >>> exists in >>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>> EVERY walk of life. >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>> On Fri, Oct 1, 2010 at 10:33 AM, Tommy News < >>>>> > > > >>> [email protected]>wrote: >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> *This is not one isolated incident. The problem of >>>>> > > homophobia >>>>> > > > >>> is >>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> societal and must be eradicated. * >>>>> > >>>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> *This week , I heard about 3 – >>>>> > >>>>> >>>>> > ... >>>>> > >>>>> > read more »- Hide quoted text - >>>>> > >>>>> > - Show quoted text - >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. >>>>> For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum >>>>> >>>>> * Visit our other community at >>>>> http://www.PoliticalForum.com/<http://www.politicalforum.com/> >>>>> * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. >>>>> * Read the latest breaking news, and more. >>>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. >>>> For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum >>>> >>>> * Visit our other community at >>>> http://www.PoliticalForum.com/<http://www.politicalforum.com/> >>>> * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. >>>> * Read the latest breaking news, and more. >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Together, we can change the world, one mind at a time. >>> Have a great day, >>> Tommy >>> >>> -- >>> >>> Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. >>> For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum >>> >>> * Visit our other community at >>> http://www.PoliticalForum.com/<http://www.politicalforum.com/> >>> * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. >>> * Read the latest breaking news, and more. >>> >> >> -- >> Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. >> For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum >> >> * Visit our other community at >> http://www.PoliticalForum.com/<http://www.politicalforum.com/> >> * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. >> * Read the latest breaking news, and more. >> > > > > -- > Together, we can change the world, one mind at a time. > Have a great day, > Tommy > -- Together, we can change the world, one mind at a time. Have a great day, Tommy -- Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum * Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/ * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. * Read the latest breaking news, and more.
