*No, you are wrong.* ** *Matthew Shepard's murder was not about drugs, it was a homophobic anti-gay hate crime.* *I have read and written about it extensively and I am certain that you are wrong.* ** *You clearly believe the false claims of the two convicted criminal murderers who are behind bars serving life sentences for this brutal* *and horrific hate crime and will say anything to get off.**
I suggest you read "The Last Days of Matthew Shepard" here in the archives of this group which I co-own and run. * http://groups.yahoo.com/group/MatthewShepardPrideandTolerance/ On 10/5/10, Keith In Tampa <[email protected]> wrote: > > Tom, > > This isn't about, "I Say" versus, "You Say". The story of Matthew Shepard > has been well documented by CBS, ABC, and a host of other news sources. > Most of them have not really broadcast the story, because it messes up the > politically correct, "progressive Gay Militant Agenda's" story, but > documented it is. Shepard was a drug user, who got caught up in a drug > deal gone bad. Had nothing to do with his, "Gayness"....Had nothing to do > with him being bullied; It had nothing to do with Shepard being offered a > ride home. > > Sometimes, the truth hurts, and in this case, it blows away your > Politically Correct, Progressive Militant Gay Agenda: > > http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/2373889/posts > > > http://voices.washingtonpost.com/sleuth/2009/04/virginia_foxx_mathew_shepards.html > > http://abcnews.go.com/2020/story?id=277685&page=1 > > > http://newsbusters.org/blogs/brad-wilmouth/2009/04/30/abc-debunks-matthew-shepard-murder-no-hate-crime-msnbc-savages-republ > > On Tue, Oct 5, 2010 at 3:31 PM, Tommy News <[email protected]> wrote: > >> *This post is so filled with false statements that it would send a lie >> detector off the charts.* >> ** >> *I suggest you read more about the murder of Matthew Shepard.* >> *It was not a drug deal, as you falsely claim. Shepard only had five >> dollars on him, and no drugs. He was not a drug user, as the two murderers >> were.* >> *Shepard was offered a ride home from the bar, then was kidnapped, >> robbed, bullied, pistol whipped, had his skull fractured, was tied to a >> fence and left to die in the cold because he was gay and was perceived >> by McKinney and Henderson be an easy target, at their own admission in the >> trial.* >> ** >> *The convicted murderer Aaron McKinney lied in prison to get off with >> a chance at parole. and to claim it was not a hate crime, which it clearly >> was. You are spouting off the lies of the convicted murderers, and may I ask >> why you believe their false statements above the factual evidence? * >> ** >> *You are assuming other things as well. When have I ever said that I was >> gay or bi or straight? Never! * >> ** >> *Keith, you are misguided and mistaken. * >> ** >> *In addition, to repeat yet again, Democrats are not Marxists, >> Socialists, or Communists. No, they are not. >> * >> >> On 10/5/10, Keith In Tampa <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> Hello Nominal, >>> >>> Yes. >>> >>> This is not to say that there are probably millions of individuals who >>> are Gay, that don't fall into the "Militant Gay Agenda" category; but look >>> at Tom, and all of the articles that he cuts and pastes. Take a gander >>> at the web sites that are spreading vicious hateful lies, (and as you just >>> admitted, the story continues to unfold). Take a look at how Matthew >>> Shepard was made into a poster child for "hate crimes" and the whole story >>> was premised on a lie. >>> >>> Does Tom speak for the majority of, or the minority of Gays in the >>> United States? I dunno the answer to that. I do know that there are a >>> lot of those with the "militant Gay Agenda" syndrome. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Tue, Oct 5, 2010 at 2:04 PM, nominal9 <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>>> Hi Keith.... >>>> >>>> I agree that the situation here is still being uncovered and >>>> speculation may well be premature.....However, I ask you to consider >>>> your own "Gay Agenda" claim.....Do you think that it is fair to lump >>>> anyone's personal individual situation into a broad, generalised >>>> classification such as a "group" Gay Agenda political context?.... >>>> >>>> On Oct 5, 1:13 pm, Keith In Tampa <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> > Hey Nominal, >>>> > >>>> > I am not exactly sure what your point is. Maybe I am missing Mark's >>>> too, >>>> > so feel free to chime in and correct me if I am mistaken. >>>> > >>>> > Let's review: >>>> > >>>> > This kid that we are referencing, killed himself. Committed suicide. >>>> > Personally, I would classify that as some kind of mental illness. It >>>> had >>>> > nothing to do with anyone else killing him, the kid decided to take >>>> his own >>>> > life. >>>> > >>>> > The facts are just now coming out about this matter....Turns out that >>>> maybe >>>> > this had nothing to do with the roommate surrepticiously filming and >>>> then, >>>> > purportedly putting the film on the web. There are a number of links >>>> on the >>>> > web now, but the bottom line, is that it appears that Tyler Clementi >>>> wasn't >>>> > all that upset with his roommate. >>>> > >>>> > The point being, is that once again, we have a militant Gay Agenda, >>>> > attempting to write a narrative that is both untruthful and >>>> misleading. >>>> > >>>> > There was no bullying (at least documented) of Tyler Clementi. Much >>>> like >>>> > the Matthew Shepard story, where Shepard was purportedly killed >>>> because of >>>> > his sexual orientation, it turned out that Shepard was killed because >>>> he was >>>> > in a drug deal that went bad. >>>> > >>>> > Likewise, it appears that Mr. Clementi's suicide was caused by >>>> something >>>> > other than the alleged "Bullying". >>>> > >>>> > It's just a little lie...... >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> >>>> > On Tue, Oct 5, 2010 at 12:28 PM, nominal9 <[email protected]> >>>> wrote: >>>> > > Mark.... this "weakness" claim of yours is a"fiction".... doesn't >>>> > > comport with human experience. Take the example of "growing up"... >>>> > > from birth to relative maturity. At what point does a baby or a >>>> child >>>> > > lose his/her emotional "weakness"....? Is a baby who is physically >>>> or >>>> > > mentally abused by "grown-ups" (depraved ones, let's say).... >>>> > > emotionally weak... for crying or trying to escape? If not a "baby" >>>> > > then at what point in an abusive continuum does a "youngster" >>>> develop >>>> > > into emotional "maturity" and therefor no longer has a right to >>>> claim >>>> > > victimization from an abuser.... twelve, thirteen, eighteen, twenty- >>>> > > one... thirty-five... fifty? >>>> > > You seem to have this John Wayne tough-guy movie fiction working in >>>> > > your head.....Maybe you should talk to some honest-to-goodness, >>>> real- >>>> > > life stand-up people.... and stop depending on romanticized >>>> "gung-ho" >>>> > > pablum for your assumptions into something you probably have never >>>> > > experienced, yourself.... >>>> > > Sounds like tough talk on my part.... but, frankly, tell me if and >>>> > > when you have had experience in this regard, yourself... you know... >>>> > > standing up to very aggressive or assertive people, who struck >>>> > > understandable and "doable" fear into you.... >>>> > >>>> > > On Oct 5, 10:07 am, Mark <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> > > > Oh, but they are weaknesses....... show me ONE that is a strength >>>> or that >>>> > > > makes you NORMAL. It is a weakness in fact and by definition. >>>> > >>>> > > > On Tue, Oct 5, 2010 at 7:51 AM, Tommy News <[email protected]> >>>> wrote: >>>> > > > > *No Mark. You are misinformed.* >>>> > > > > ** >>>> > > > > *Depression is not a weakness, it is a mental illness.* >>>> > > > > ** >>>> > > > > *Ilnesses are not weaknesses. >>>> > > > > * >>>> > >>>> > > > > On 10/4/10, Mark <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> > >>>> > > > >> *****Depression is something more that a purely "psychological" >>>> > > > >> condition... it's "social", too.**** >>>> > >>>> > > > >> Please explain which disease or weakness of the Psyche is not >>>> effected >>>> > > by >>>> > > > >> ALL outside influences.... Depression is a weakness... if you >>>> want >>>> > > protected >>>> > > > >> because you have it... wear a sign... do not expect different >>>> or >>>> > > special >>>> > > > >> treatment by anyone unless you inform them all. >>>> > >>>> > > > >> Again, to drive him over the edge he must have been doing >>>> something >>>> > > that >>>> > > > >> he found so personally, morally or socially >>>> repugnant/unacceptable... >>>> > > for >>>> > > > >> whatever reason and this is and was his OWN problem. >>>> > >>>> > > > >> As to candid cameraman... prosecute him.... but NOT for the >>>> boys >>>> > > suicide >>>> > > > >> (read the definition). >>>> > >>>> > > > >> On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 9:16 AM, nominal9 <[email protected]> >>>> wrote: >>>> > >>>> > > > >>> Depression is something more that a purely "psychological" >>>> > > > >>> condition... it's "social", too. This young person suicide >>>> victim was >>>> > > > >>> doing well enough until he was harassed (at least twice, >>>> apparently) >>>> > > > >>> by his room-mate. The "victim" was definitely the "recipient" >>>> of the >>>> > > > >>> act of being video-recorded in his sex acts (without his >>>> knowledge or >>>> > > > >>> consent, against his will) anfd then having those >>>> video-recordings >>>> > > > >>> broadcast to the public. This is a two part question of >>>> "psychology" >>>> > > > >>> the psychology of the room-mate (as agent/patient) who >>>> performed the >>>> > > > >>> act and the the psychology of the Victim (as >>>> patient/recipient) >>>> > > > >>> first.. turned (as agent patient) into the performer of his >>>> own act >>>> > > of >>>> > > > >>> suicide. >>>> > >>>> > > > >>> ROOM-MATE >>>> > > > >>> I hate homos / want them dead....I tolerate homos / they can >>>> live >>>> > > > >>> C(BAD)..........R(BAD).... >>>> > > > >>> I hate homos / they can live..........I tolerate homos / want >>>> them >>>> > > > >>> dead >>>> > >>>> > > > >>> VICTIM >>>> > > > >>> love oneself / live.... hate oneself / suicide >>>> > > > >>> C(GOOD).......R(GOOD).... >>>> > > > >>> love oneself / suicide... hate oneself / live >>>> > >>>> > > > >>> ROOM-MATE >>>> > > > >>> Harass / Peep&Shame......Respect / Honor Privacy >>>> > > > >>> C(BAD)....R(BAD).... >>>> > > > >>> Harass / Honor Privacy......Respect / Peep&Shame >>>> > >>>> > > > >>> VICTIM >>>> > > > >>> hate oneself / suicide......love oneself / live >>>> > > > >>> C(BAD) .......R(BAD)...... >>>> > > > >>> hateoneself / live............love oneself / suicide >>>> > >>>> > > > >>> Basically, the VICTIM, after the "motivated act" of the >>>> ROOMMATE took >>>> > > > >>> on the Sentiment (hate) and the intent (public shame) of the >>>> act that >>>> > > > >>> was performed against him and acted as the ROOM-MATE "wanted" >>>> him >>>> > > > >>> to.... he was "impresssionable", or appalled by the "cruelty" >>>> of >>>> > > > >>> someone who could have (should have) been a "friend' (strictly >>>> that) >>>> > > > >>> and decided to give the ROOM-MATE what he desired...... >>>> personally, >>>> > > my >>>> > > > >>> moral compass (and sense of justice) tells me that he should >>>> have >>>> > > > >>> killed the ROOM-MATE, instead. >>>> > >>>> > > > >>> On Oct 1, 7:53 pm, Mark <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> > > > >>> > Tommy, No. >>>> > >>>> > > > >>> > Depression and or the propensity for it definitely varies >>>> person to >>>> > > > >>> person >>>> > > > >>> > with EVERYONE being different and having their own limits. >>>> Only >>>> > > those >>>> > > > >>> with >>>> > > > >>> > one foot on the ledge can be shoved over. >>>> > >>>> > > > >>> > On Fri, Oct 1, 2010 at 5:30 PM, Tommy News < >>>> [email protected]> >>>> > > > >>> wrote: >>>> > > > >>> > > *Your twisted pretzel logic does not pass muster.* >>>> > > > >>> > > ** >>>> > > > >>> > > *You fail to see that depression is often triggered by the >>>> acts >>>> > > of >>>> > > > >>> others, >>>> > > > >>> > > such as bullies and abusive homophobic taunters.* >>>> > > > >>> > > ** >>>> > > > >>> > > *Suicide is caused by many factors.* >>>> > >>>> > > > >>> > > *Hatred, bullies, and bigotry are also caused by many >>>> factors.* >>>> > >>>> > > > >>> > > On 10/1/10, Jonathan Ashley <[email protected] >>>> > >>>> > > wrote: >>>> > >>>> > > > >>> > >> *SUICIDE*, n. [L. suicidium; se and coedo, to slay.] >>>> > > > >>> > >> 1. Self-murder; the act of designedly destroying one's >>>> own life. >>>> > >>>> > > > >>> > >> By definition, one cannot cause someone else to commit >>>> > > > >>> "self-murder." If >>>> > > > >>> > >> someone else can be factually proven to be at fault, then >>>> that >>>> > > > >>> individual >>>> > > > >>> > >> would be guilty of murder. >>>> > >>>> > > > >>> > >> Has the individual who took the video been arrested for >>>> murder? >>>> > > If >>>> > > > >>> not, >>>> > > > >>> > >> you are jousting at windmills. >>>> > >>>> > > > >>> > >> On 10/1/2010 1:08 PM, Tommy News wrote: >>>> > >>>> > > > >>> > >> *Ignorant homophobes like you cause these suicides.* >>>> > >>>> > > > >>> > >> On 10/1/10, Mark <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> > >>>> > > > >>> > >>> No Tommy, it is not. The urge to destroy oneself is as >>>> ancient >>>> > > as >>>> > > > >>> life >>>> > > > >>> > >>> itself. There are so very many reasons people do this to >>>> > > > >>> themselves, both >>>> > > > >>> > >>> real and unreal reasons. There is however ONE reason ALL >>>> > > suicides >>>> > > > >>> do >>>> > > > >>> > >>> this.... they are too weak to cope and that, Sir, is a >>>> personal >>>> > > > >>> problem. It >>>> > > > >>> > >>> is NOT societal, and NOT something that can be >>>> legislated that >>>> > > > >>> causes me to >>>> > > > >>> > >>> lose the freedom to ask if someone is Gay or Lesbian >>>> (for >>>> > > whatever >>>> > > > >>> reason) >>>> > > > >>> > >>> or to call someone a flaming Queen if they are acting >>>> like one. >>>> > >>>> > > > >>> > >>> On Fri, Oct 1, 2010 at 1:05 PM, Tommy News < >>>> > > [email protected]> >>>> > > > >>> wrote: >>>> > >>>> > > > >>> > >>>> *Markie, Markie, Markie.* >>>> > > > >>> > >>>> ** >>>> > > > >>> > >>>> *Your ugly negativity and snarky spin is most >>>> perverse.* >>>> > > > >>> > >>>> *One suicide is one too many.* >>>> > >>>> > > > >>> > >>>> *No man is an island* >>>> > >>>> > > > >>> > >>>> No man is an island entire of itself; every man >>>> > > > >>> > >>>> is a piece of the continent, a part of the main; >>>> > > > >>> > >>>> if a clod be washed away by the sea, Europe >>>> > > > >>> > >>>> is the less, as well as if a promontory were, as >>>> > > > >>> > >>>> well as any manner of thy friends or of thine >>>> > > > >>> > >>>> own were; any man's death diminishes me, >>>> > > > >>> > >>>> because I am involved in mankind. >>>> > > > >>> > >>>> And therefore never send to know for whom >>>> > > > >>> > >>>> the bell tolls; it tolls for thee. >>>> > >>>> > > > >>> > >>>> -John Donne >>>> > >>>> > > > >>> > >>>> On 10/1/10, Mark <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> > >>>> > > > >>> > >>>>> Tommy, Tommy, Tommy, >>>> > >>>> > > > >>> > >>>>> He must have had a really poor self image... short of >>>> that >>>> > > > >>> nothing >>>> > > > >>> > >>>>> could "Make" him commit suicide. Suicide IS against >>>> the law, >>>> > > > >>> isn't it ?? >>>> > >>>> > > > >>> > >>>>> So you are basically saying "Mommy, Mommy, he made me >>>> do it >>>> > > !!" >>>> > >>>> > > > >>> > >>>>> Not much of a defense when prejudice of one kind or >>>> another >>>> > > > >>> exists in >>>> > > > >>> > >>>>> EVERY walk of life. >>>> > >>>> > > > >>> > >>>>> On Fri, Oct 1, 2010 at 10:33 AM, Tommy News < >>>> > > > >>> [email protected]>wrote: >>>> > >>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> *This is not one isolated incident. The problem of >>>> > > homophobia >>>> > > > >>> is >>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> societal and must be eradicated. * >>>> > >>>> > > > >>> > >>>>>> *This week , I heard about 3 – >>>> > >>>> >>>> > ... >>>> > >>>> > read more »- Hide quoted text - >>>> > >>>> > - Show quoted text - >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. >>>> For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum >>>> >>>> * Visit our other community at >>>> http://www.PoliticalForum.com/<http://www.politicalforum.com/> >>>> * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. >>>> * Read the latest breaking news, and more. >>>> >>> >>> -- >>> Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. >>> For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum >>> >>> * Visit our other community at >>> http://www.PoliticalForum.com/<http://www.politicalforum.com/> >>> * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. >>> * Read the latest breaking news, and more. >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Together, we can change the world, one mind at a time. >> Have a great day, >> Tommy >> >> -- >> >> Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. >> For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum >> >> * Visit our other community at >> http://www.PoliticalForum.com/<http://www.politicalforum.com/> >> * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. >> * Read the latest breaking news, and more. >> > > -- > Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. > For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum > > * Visit our other community at > http://www.PoliticalForum.com/<http://www.politicalforum.com/> > * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. > * Read the latest breaking news, and more. > -- Together, we can change the world, one mind at a time. Have a great day, Tommy -- Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum * Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/ * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. * Read the latest breaking news, and more.
