Re: [UC] that was the week that was
KAREN ALLEN wrote: That's great news! It was interesting to see the public response to John's predicament. Support for John was overwhelming, not just on the list, but in the larger community. It showed just how valued and loved John actually was. And this whole thing shows why Jannie Blackwell is so revered by her supporters: she'll go to the wall for them. She fought for John tooth and nail, and when that didn't work out, she got him a job. That's loyalty. It's situations like this that test the meaning of character, friendship, and loyalty. The test is not who's willing to stand with you when you're on top. It's who's willing to stand with you when you're in trouble that counts, and on that score University City passed the test with flying colors. The week that was was a good week indeed! http://tinyurl.com/2psrow .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Where is John Fenton?
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: and BTW...I have never heard crow eaten by so many with less noise. when it's quiet, the deer come out: http://tinyurl.com/yohf7z [lots of questions still in the air...] .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] update: squatters released, others sought/muggings ... not funny
Frank wrote: Please send me your list of appropriate subjects for humor. I'd hate to offend someone in the future. haha. see now that's funny. your asking what's appropriate. because you obviously know how soon after a local murder to post jokes about it, and how often in a day to post jokes about it, and how long to persist posting jokes it, and you'll know when to stop. and not only that, but you seem to know all this -- without asking -- in tandem with several others onlist doing exactly the same thing. it's easy to turn this into a question about what's funny or what's appropriate, but perhaps it's about something else. I don't know yet what that is, but I think, as you suspect, it's related to how people behave in groups, where they locate themselves in the context of a larger group. .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
[UC] that was the week that was
this week's front page headline in the uc review: PENN'S FIRST THURSDAY MEETING SUFFERS A TAKEOVER... LONGSTANDING COMMUNITY FRUSTRATION IS VENTED here's the story's final sentence: Wendell did not respond to any of the many attempts the UC Review has made to reach him for comment on the meeting. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - and below the fold: WHERE IS JOHN FENTON? and that story ends with: According to UCD spolesperson Lori Klein Brennan, as of Tuesday, June 19th there have been no new developments in the investigation, which is being conducted solely by Wendell and certain board members. John Fenton has yet to get in touch with the UCD. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - so: - fenton's not speaking to ucd, - wendell's not speaking to uc review fortunately, a third headline on the front page: ACTIVISTS CONVENE TO PROPOSE CHANGES FOR UNIVERSITY CITY DISTRICT The next meeting will be conducted on Wednesday, June 20th, 6PM [that's tonight!] at the Walnut West Library Community Room, 40th and Walnut Street. This is Planning Meeting #2 and will last an hour and a half. The scheduled agenda is on Community Stakeholders and the UCD planning meeting. All are invited. .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] 49th Locust event
Kyle Cassidy wrote: I heard a chopper thumping around all morning, I'm betting this guy was part of a fast-rope team from Blackwater who was about to evict some non-paying tennants in a morning no-knock raid when he slipped on a loose bottle of pinot grigio left in the helo from a party the night before and tumbled from the door of the Apache to his death on the roof, 70 feet below. In any event, no one has provided any evidence to the contrary. Mike VanHelder wrote: And where was John Fenton while all this was going on, hm? Answer me that if you can, powers-that-be! Has anyone seen him and Dick Cheney in the same place at the same time? Well? Ross Bender wrote: Look, chowderhead, don't you find it just a *teensy* bit suspicious that on the EXACT SAME DAY the Inky publishes its glowing UCD Report Card, some dude gets tossed off the roof (or beaten to death, whatever the internal inquiry will show) right WITHIN the boundaries of the new Cleaner and Safer UCD??? Coincidence, synchronicity, or conspiracy, take your choice, but as far as I'm concerned it was NO ACCIDENT. Brian Siano wrote: He's right. This man was murdered ON PURPOSE. And SOMEONE'S RESPONSIBLE. a man died. You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Press release or Wendell statement?
UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN writes: I think what sharreiff was getting at, above, is that there are ways for an organization to behave responsibly, publicly, as an organization, and when it doesn't, the person in charge is most responsible, ultimately responsible. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So, Ray, what would you have done, to behave responsibly? I'm not asking you what you think Lewis did or didn't do; I'm asking, what would YOU have done? Specifically, that is - answering I would have behaved responsibly won't give us any practical suggestions. well, for starters, I would have published both ucd statements (what we've been calling press releases) on ucd's website, as ucd publications (what other available ucd published venues would logically do? they're between issues of their newsletter, right?) I pointed this out earlier, with the first press release: ucd must make its statements publicly available, must own them, outright and wholly, and not merely rely on having them read aloud at different times at different community meetings or being quoted in whole or in part--or ignored entirely--by news editors, or being published as direct quotations given during a conversation. I guess that's what I mean by behaving responsibly: taking responsibility, taking ownership. right now we have a situation where ucd appears not to be communicating while in fact it is allowing its statements to be selectively made public. they have confused publicity with advertising -- while mishandling both. I'll stop there for now. (I'm not being paid to do someone else's job! ;-)) - - - - meanwhile, you haven't answered: when did you provide your quotes for tony's article, and at the time did you know about ucd's second press release? the article where tony wrote: The investigation is slow in part because Fenton is not cooperating. UCD has made numerous documented attempts to contact John Fenton asking him to respond to the matter under investigation. Our calls and letters have gone unanswered, Wendell explained later. .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Reality check
Bill Sanderson wrote: How many people here--including Al Krigman--would expect an employer to publicly discuss an issue with an employee that might have serious consequences for both? Sure--the employee has been asked not to comment publicly. Sure, the consequences should he do so are likely to be the obvious. How is this different from any other employer any of us have worked for? ok bill, I'll take a stab at it. first, I believe you may be misreading what some of the concerns are. it's not that people expect an employer to publicly discuss an issue with an employee, or even that there are aspects of the process that are confidential. it's that ucd has allowed for some of this to be public (in arenas it can't control), and for some of this not to be made public (in arenas it can control) [and see sharreiff's post for examples]. it's that ucd is conducting an investigation of itself by itself (rather than by a neutral 3rd party). it's that ucd has yet to publicly own the two statements it has released publicly. and so the whole situation becomes 'trial-by-newspaper' / 'appeal by petition', and in the process ucd unwittingly puts itself on trial. people feel entitled to keep asking questions and taking sides so long as ucd gives the appearance that it is not communicating directly while allowing certain statements to be selectively released in public. second, penn has had several examples in recent years of its own employees, students, administrators and faculty involved in crimes, scandals, wrongdoings. to get an idea of how a non-profit, public-image-is-paramount institution handles situations like these, look at their coverage in penn publications, look at how the situations are handled by third parties, look at how all this is publicly available. it's embarrassing, to be sure, and not a little messy, and damned inconvenient -- but you can be sure penn doesn't send someone around to select neighborhood meetings reading statements that don't appear in its own publications (print/online), nor does penn drop statements to obscure philly rags as if they were real-time conversations, and you can be sure penn expects that readers and writers of the penn gazette, the dp, and the chronicle of higher education will weigh in, online and off. for example. .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Press release or Wendell statement?
UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN wrote: haha you really haven't the foggiest idea what we've been talking about, do you? Anthony West wrote: Other than the paranoid part, no, I don't, Ray. I see no evidence posted on this thread, or any other you've chimed in on lately, that anyone else understands what you're talking about, to yourself in public. Who else is engaging you in conversation on list? At least I've tried. I'm not trying to rag on you and refute you, just give you a kindly heads-up, as when someone reminds me: Psst! XYZ, Tony. see, you've not tried to engage in conversation with me, but rather with arguing with me. and when you argue that what prevents a letter to the editor from appearing on www.phillyrecord.com is an environmentalist's concern about trees, well then I think you not only lose your argument but you lose everyone else reading. btw playing the paranoid card is not conversation, either; it's arguing. :-) .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Press release or Wendell statement?
Ross Bender wrote: While I enjoy the surrealistic air, paranoid ambiance, and Rashomon-like fog of this UC Village listserve, Tony West is as far as I know the only professional journalist contributing to this list. That's why I was gratified to see his immediate summary of the events at the First Thursday meeting, filed directly to this list, and even more to read his articulate piece in the Philadelphia Public Record. I'm very much looking forward to his series of articles on other neighborhoods and other UCD-like entities. I expect it will give some valuable perspective on similar situations throughout the city, and in the process shed light on our own local tempest in a teapot. fade-in to computer screen, the faint sound of rain gradually rising to that of a tapping keyboard THE ARTICLE YOU ARE ABOUT TO READ IS THE FIRST IN AN EXCITING NEW 'NOT-NEWSWORTHY-ENOUGH' SERIES. IT BEGINS, THRILLINGLY ENOUGH, AS A BIASED REPORT OF WHAT HAPPENED AT MALCOLM X PARK AND WHAT HAPPENED AT THE FIRST THURSDAY MEETING. THEN, ARTFULLY WRAPPING ITSELF IN AN ATTEMPTED APPEARANCE OF NON-BIAS, IT STUDIOUSLY QUOTES TWO OPPOSING NEIGHBORHOOD STAKEHOLDERS WHO SEEM TO BE WEIGHING IN EQUALLY ABOUT UCD AND SPECIAL SERVICE DISTRICTS. OVER THIS APPARENT NEUTRALITY YOU'LL THEN DISCOVER THAT UCD'S 2ND PRESS RELEASE -- MADE PUBLIC FOR THE VERY FIRST TIME! -- WAS THREADING ITSELF IN AND TYING THINGS UP IN A PRETTY LITTLE BOW. AH! A GIFT! BUT WAIT -- A GIFT FOR WHOM? AT WHOSE EXPENSE? cue cheesy soap opera organ music WHAT WILL ARRIVE NEXT IN THIS 'NOT-NEWSWORTHY-ENOUGH' SERIES? A HARD-HITTING LOOK AT COMMUNITY ASSOCIATIONS? THEIR RELATIONSHIPS WITH SPECIAL SERVICE DISTRICTS? A THIRD PRESS RELEASE, COMPLIMENTS OF UCD? STAY TUNED, AS OUR INTREPID REPORTER AND TRUSTY FOCP BOARD MEMBER CONTINUES TO KEEP HIMSELF FROM BEING PERSONALLY INVOLVED! pan out to gothic mansion, flashing lightning, etc. .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Press release or Wendell statement?
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Generally the question is : “Why is Lewis Wendell more responsible?  Well..the answer is if it was a Board decision to suspend John then I guess we would have all known about it from the meeting held by our community representatives on the UCD Board. Let's see: you're running an organization, Sharrieff, and one day you read in the paper that someone has accused one of your employees, a very popular one, of doing something improper. You have no advance notice; everybody else who reads the paper finds out at the same time you do, and they all start calling and second guessing and making conflicting demands. So you ask the employee, hey, what happened?, and you don't get any answer. Instead, his powerful friends start badmouthing YOU! What do you do? (but wait, are you saying that's how it actually happened? according to ucd? how do we know? is it the full story? for example, has wendell asked the other ucd employees who were also involved with the malcolm x park incident? how would we know? because ucd would tell us or because you would tell us? etc. etc.) yes, the situation is difficult, but wendell is ultimately responsible. ucd's existence as a non-profit, its credibility, its relationship with the community, with blackwell, with penn, the justification for a nid -- these and more are all at stake. responsible leadership is crucial. what, indeed, do you do? for example, was releasing a 2nd press release about fenton in the form of a quotation he knew/didn't know would be publicized in tony's article the best way for wendell to behave responsibly? to use your words: let's see... you work at an organization, and one day you read in the paper that someone, your employer, has accused you of doing something improper... I think what sharreiff was getting at, above, is that there are ways for an organization to behave responsibly, publicly, as an organization, and when it doesn't, the person in charge is most responsible, ultimately responsible. .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Press release or Wendell statement?
Anthony West wrote: My company would be delighted to discuss with your company the sorts of services we could provide each other for free. You, as representative of the University of Pennsylvania, and I, as representative of the Philadelphia Public Record, together could forge a new era of cooperation and partnership between our two institutions, which together can do so much to encapsulate the civic vision of University City and the Delaware Valley region as a whole. Until we have concluded those discussions, however, anything you want to say in the Public Record in the form of a paid advertisement you may have, at the rate of $16 / column inch. We do not sell on-line ads separately from newsprint ads. If you want the on-line ad, there's a $2 service charge on top of your newsprint ad. Sorry, those are our rules. If you want us to create special on-line posting services for you for a fee, discuss them with me off-line. If you wish to tell the editor how to edit his paper, I will be glad to offer you one free hour during which you, Ray Rorke, can edit my publication. Yes, you are the lucky winner! Only one condition: first, I get to come to your office and muck around with all its computers for one free hour. No fair making backups, either! haha you really haven't the foggiest idea what we've been talking about, do you? .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: Fwd: [UC] Press release or Wendell statement?
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Bigger question, for me, is the inappropriateness of a reporter being involved personally in a story he's covering. the ucd/malcolm x park incident of may 11-12 wasn't mentioned in the philly public record prior to tony's june 14 story, was it? .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Press release or Wendell statement?
Doc Baldy wrote: Didn't Tony also get Liz's quote later? Isn't it common for journalists to question speakers after a meeting to get clarification and comments? It seems to me that what's important is that more information has been released in an effort to clarify the situation. Unfortunately that information seems to be getting lost in the continued dissection of exactly how the information came to light. did either liz or melani know they would be quoted in an article about blackwell when they spoke with tony? did either of them know of ucd's 2nd press release when they spoke with tony? do either liz or melani agree with being portrayed in the article as the polar ends of the 'controversies' over ucd? will liz's clarification ever appear in philly public record (online)? blah blah etc. etc. good thing we can get feedback, right here online! .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: Fwd: [UC] Press release or Wendell statement?
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Bigger question, for me, is the inappropriateness of a reporter being involved personally in a story he's covering. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN asked: the ucd/malcolm x park incident of may 11-12 wasn't mentioned in the philly public record prior to tony's june 14 story, was it? Anthony West wrote: No. Not newsworthy enough, from our perspective. thanks. that helps clarify what I was asking paul about: now that we know the article you wrote was the first mention you or your paper made about the ucd incident since it happened a month ago (rather than an ongoing story you or your paper were covering), paul's question becomes one about the appropriateness of yourself, as a reporter, being personally involved in the article you wrote. (for example, was your involvement with uclist over this incident as a reporter? as focp board member?) [do I have that right, paul?] and the question becomes more interesting, when we consider what you mean by 'newsworthy': in your article, was the news of the ucd incident a pretext for your writing about special service districts, or was writing about special service districts a pretext for your presenting, as a publicist, ucd's 2nd press release about the ucd incident? or--? .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Press release or Wendell statement?
Anthony West wrote: To answer: will liz's clarification ever appear in philly public record (online)? blah blah etc. etc. No. Publisher's deep love of trees, etc., plus intention to move on to next story. You can, however, purchase advertising space to carry their clarification if you wish. That will overcome publisher's environmentalist sentiments. $16/column inch. really? see, I was asking about philly public record (online). how do trees and column inches figure into it? have you seen this page: http://www.phillyrecord.com/2007/0614/letters.html liz's clarifications could easily appear there, no trees would be destroyed: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] like I say: good thing we can get feedback, right here online! As long as the feeder-backer feels like it. [true, and that's feedback, too! ;-)] .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: Fwd: [UC] Press release or Wendell statement?
UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN wrote: and the question becomes more interesting, when we consider what you mean by 'newsworthy': in your article, was the news of the ucd incident a pretext for your writing about special service districts, or was writing about special service districts a pretext for your presenting, as a publicist, ucd's 2nd press release about the ucd incident? or--? Anthony West wrote: I gotta disagree with you on this one, Ray. The question becomes less interesting. see, now you've gone and made it even more interesting! ;-) .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Notes from Planning Committee Meeting Re: UCD 6-13-07
S. Sharrieff Ali wrote: *Notes from Planning Committee Meeting Re: UCD* * * this is big. I mean, no matter what happens, how things shape up, it's terrific that something public like this even exists. huge. gotta run, more later (thinking of possibilities...) .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] This is from Tony West (he's temporarily off-line)
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: ** *This is from Tony West (he's temporarily off-line)* *I am switching both hardware and ISP at home, so I can't post to UC-list at this time. Could you be kind enough to post the following for me?* [UC] Blackwell vs Penn List readers may find this story interesting. Go to http://www.phillyrecord.com/. -- Tony West wait, al, did you receive the above message by email? (?) wading through, slowly... .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Notes from Planning Committee Meeting Re: UCD 6-13-07
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Did the media do anything at all, or should we assume that they didn't find it newsworthy? this week's ucity review mentioned the thursday meeting in a small column that begins at the bottom of the front page: [manually re-typing this, 'scuse the typos]: From the Editor: Last Thursday, June 7th, the University of Pennsylvania Office of City and Community Relations held the last First Thursday Meeting of the season at the 40th Street branch of the Free Library. The major topic of the meeting scheduled was to be on Healthy in Philadelphia, but instead took quite a different course. The meeting rapidly turned into a public airing of the dissatisfaction Councilwoman Jannie Blackwell -- who spoke at the meeting -- and much of the community represented at the meeting felt concerning the alledged mismanagement of a variety of issues by the University City District and the University of Pennsylvania. Unfortunately, the story that was scheduled to run was not available at press time and will be published in next week's 6/20/07 University City Review. Also, much has been circulated over the internet, and even by word of mouth about the University City Review hosting or moderating a public forum on these issues. While it is true that we offered our services at the meeting in this regard, as an objective party, it is also true that we will only participate once all responsible parties have come together in agreement about the purpose, structure, ground rules and venue of such a meeting. --RC - - - - - - - ucity review hasn't mentioned anything else about the fenton incident since their original may 23 article about it the summer dp hasn't mentioned anything about the incident since their original may 24 article the daily news article that appeared june 1 after its original article may 16 shifted the focus away from ucd and onto blackwell. all in all, it's odd, how the official story is on hold, yet we're given, meanwhile, sifted morsels of information in timed bits... .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Notes from Planning Committee Meeting Re: UCD 6-13-07
Kyle Cassidy wrote: in the letter from the editor it says the article which was scheduled to run was not available at press time -- which could mean that in light of a new press release, the article was being rewritten. or it could mean something else. you could call the UC review and ask them. the whole thing's odd... why doesn't either of the press releases appear on ucd's website along with all of its other press releases? how did al receive a message from tony when tony was unable to email uclist? will liz write a clarifying letter to the editor of philly record to explain publicly how she was (mis)quoted in tony's article? why did melani need permission to post the second press release when it was already quoted verbatim in tony's article, posted one hour previously by al? will ross finally get the notice he deserves the next time he writes horrible horrible things about penn without telling us that he's employed by penn? will john fenton ever be able to speak for himself? is he toast? will the other ucd employees who helped him that day be contacted by ucd? are they toast? which local newspaper will give us the Real story? how will we know it's true? when will the next round of First Thursday Meetings resume? did al and melani actually apologize to one another today? etc. etc. I officially declare june 14 as BIZZARO DAY on uclist! .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Notes from Planning Committee Meeting Re: UCD 6-13-07
Anthony West wrote: I sent him an email from work and asked him to help (or perhaps I should say ehlp) by posting it for me. A courtesy to a listmate. I am in the process of switching ISPs and I have not the slightest idea what is happening to me at this minute, technically. A friend seems to have jiggered my computer so that I can now post to the list again. We'll see! thanks! al wrote that you were offline, that's what seemed odd. would something like this help you in future? to post to uclist no matter where you're using a computer?: http://webmail.dca.net/ No local newspaper will ever give you the Real story because the Real story, life, is always evolving and is always experienced in partial perspectives. In order to get a glimpse of what is true, you'll need to apply common sense to what you read or hear. Alas, this is not something you can download, Ray. thanks. but you can appreciate how odd it is when a news story containing a quoted press release is posted onlist, and someone else posts that very same press release an hour later onlist with the explanation that it doesn't seem to have been picked up by the media! BIZZARO DAY IS JUNE 14 .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Notes from Planning Committee Meeting Re: UCD 6-13-07
Anthony West wrote: Notice the subtle, artful recasting of news media as part of a paranoid explanatory scheme. That different unrelated media outlets write different stories, at different times, with different pieces of information, is described as odd, when in fact it's normal and inevitable. The official story (UCD's public statements), which has been reprinted verbatim in many outlets, is falsely described as on hold. Sifted morsels of information in timed bits implies a Hidden Hand -- a malign, controlling central intelligence -- which lies at the core of every delusional system. In fact, five different media outlets have published stories about the issue, all of whom are inherently jealous rivals of each other. No one agent wields significant power over all five of them. Masterminding media coverage on a story like thisis like herding cats; any real Hidden Hand would be chewing its knuckles after a week of it Not in Ray's world, though. I'd advise readers always to keep an eye peeled for paranoid explanations of anything. They'll give you a quick and emotionally satisfying handle on just about anything. They are almost invariably wrong, however. nothing paranoid about this at all. here's where we stand: ucity review hasn't mentioned anything else about the fenton incident since their original may 23 article about it the summer dp hasn't mentioned anything about the incident since their original may 24 article the daily news article hasn't mentioned anything about the incident since their revised june 1 article shifted the focus of their may 16 article away from ucd and onto blackwell. no media outlet has published stories about the issue since june 1 except philadelphia public record (yours, with ucd's latest press release) neither of the press releases appear on ucd's website along with all of ucd's other press releases, so there has been no way to tell, publicly, what the 'official story' is, where or when the 'official story' has been printed 'verbatim'. BIZZARO DAY IS JUNE 14 .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Reality check
KAREN ALLEN wrote: I thought John Fenton was under a gag order. If that's the case, he's not in a position to refute anything. open questions: are the other ucd employees that were involved with the malcolm x park incident also under gag orders? also, is it true that marty and glenn bryan were removed from ucd's board? when? were any reasons given why? and, is the full text of wendell's statement available publicly? when he read it at last thursday's meeting, did he just happen to have a copy with him, or had he been planning on reading it? .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Glassblowers ?
John Desmond wrote: Salutations, gentlefolk, A friend of mine has 400 pounds of silica - 8 50-pound sacks - sitting on his front porch in Yeadon, and is willing to give it away to anyone who'll give it a good home (He and I can haul it to wherever, though help therewith will be welcomed.) Note - this ain't 'sand', comes labeled with 'don't breath the dust' health warnings. your friend might want to contact the arts league (4226 spruce http://www.ucartsleague.org/) -- silica is an ingredient used in making pottery glazes, kiln washes, etc., and if it's the right type of silica it might find a happy home at the pottery studio there. .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] FS: Casablanca ceiling fan
Cheryl Shipman wrote: Can we all please remember Crossroads Music, which was at Calvary Center before Curio (not that anyone is making comparisons.) Ross will remind you if you forget as that's where he developed his undying love for Tuvan Throat Singers. yes, it's well known calvary center was a community hub. richard kirk reminded us of that when he wrote to our local newspaper telling us how much we owe to ucd. As far as I know, Andrew Zitcer has no involvement with Crossroads, although he's a sweet guy. it's too bad his personality isn't mentioned in the city paper piece he wrote. the only thing that article attached to his byline was Andrew Zitcer is an urban planner and arts advocate. -- nothing about his association with calvary, nothing about his job with penn's facilities and real estate services as cultural asset manager... .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Out of the Ivory Tower and Into the Streets
Ross Bender wrote: What really bugs me about her razzamatazz is the fact that while I've lived here 22 years as of June 2, I didn't notice any sudden magical transformation when she blew into town. As other long and longer-term residents have been witnessing on this list, this has always been a pretty fine place to live, and lots of people have made it that way. A million-dollar flackette waving her wand and puffing herself apparently has made a big impression on some gullible folks, but I just don't see it that way. KAREN ALLEN wrote: Penn/UCD badmouths this neighborhood to this day. Penn still markets itself by exaggerating how they singlehandedly waived their magic wand and turned this post industrial wasteland of ten years ago into the heaven-on-earth we see now. And now, as Ross pointed out, they've even wrote a book about it. UCD still implies that without them, all that we now see is a mere mirage that will disappear as if someone pulled the plug on the TV. As if the neighborhood was a mere abandoned shell, or worse, were full of residents who were too lazy, or stupid, or both, to do anything about the horrible conditions without the all-knowing Penn there to ride in and rescue everyone. And as if the same economic changes were not happening in places that did not have Penn's beneficence bestowed upon them. amen and amen. the whole premise of 'out of the ivory tower and into the streets' is that there's a 'crisis' on the streets. but it seems that those in the ivory tower who get to name and solve this 'crisis' don't really get out of the ivory tower: http://www.upenn.edu/penniur/about_mission.shtml btw the other week at clark park I spotted a used condom, right under a farmers market table. what those farmers must think of us! .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Romance is not dead in the hood!
Karen Heenan wrote: Been there, done that. I've always had people picking roses off my front fence, though last summer I had a first -- a young man rang my doorbell at around 7:00 p.m., asking if I would cut a few roses for him. Apparently he was late for his (first) date and wanted to try to make up for his lateness by giving her flowers. At least he asked. Kyle Cassidy wrote: Walking up to my house I discovered a young man standing in my front yard, ripping the last of the roses from my rose bush and handing them down to a young lady on the sidewalk. Would you like a pair of scissors? I asked. No thanks, he said, We've got them all. Young love! for kyle, karen -- and anyone else who likes roses: http://tinyurl.com/melev my compliments, .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] FS: Casablanca ceiling fan
Ross Bender wrote: I hustled Amy out onto the sidewalk and lit my Gaulois. OK kid. There's a new synagogue in town called Kol Tzedek. amy probably already knows this. kol tzadek's that place at calvary center, where curio theater also lives. (remember calvary? the place that richard kirk wrote about in the newspaper? telling us how much we owe to ucd for making calvary a community hub?) anyway, looks like kol tzadek's the synagog at calvary that andrew zitcer helped found. (remember andrew zitcer? the penn real estate\culture asset manager? who wrote the piece in the city paper http://tinyurl.com/ypez5j denying that university city was a marketing scheme?) well, turns out zitcer's also a poet. here's one of his poems, maybe it fits in with your whole casablanca theme: What a century for hands! What usury! I hate, (I realize) all forms of trade One must...enter politics, be saved. I could reel it off-- I have the whole thing by heart. Up late nothing! Nothing of the logic of madness-- the madness that gets locked up Go to it, demon! Go to the palm fronds. Go to the wind in 'em. What, is he doing it? One or two-more? No, now I am cursed, I'm in trouble I hate my country! Better to sleep it off on the beach, dead drunk like a carrot-toter, like a dirty rat. http://www.writing.upenn.edu/~wh/zitcermindofwinter.html - - - - - - - .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Funding special services (Was: which bad thing?)
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ray, I'd really appreciate it if you can give us an example of all or some of the above, with an explanation of how each has affected the neighborhood. hi melani. excellent question -- and you know what? I think it would be much more useful and illuminating if your question was opened up to the list, and so I'll leave the mic open and allow others to provide examples and explanations, if they can. [extra credit for anyone who can provide the figures for ucd's current budget.] [extra extra credit for anyone who can provide the figures for ucd's proposed budget as a bid.] [extra extra extra credit for anyone who can provide a melody and guitar tabs for the lyrics of our new ucd song. maybe something like this:] C F Em Dm | CF Em Dm U C D! GET OUT ON THE STREET C F Em Dm | CF EmDm U C D! WE NEED A CLEAN SWEEP G C GET OUT OF OUR STORES AND OUR PARKS G C GET OUT OF OUR HOUSES AND YARDS G GET OUT OF OUR GARDENS C AND OUT OF OUR MARKETS F G C C GET BACK ON THE STREET AND GO SWEEP .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Out of the Ivory Tower and Into the Streets
Ross Bender wrote: So now Judy is enshrined as a goddess, who rode the winged horse Market Forces into our nasty ghetto hood and and built capacity back into a severely distressed inner-city neighborhood. Makes me wanna hurl chunks. this is kind of old news. the apotheosis of judy; the manifest destiny of universities as they rise from self-defined excellence to eminence to pre-eminence and beyond; their self-congratulatory legacy predicating even further expansion into and control of cities by universities (which behave more and more like governments and businesses without ever developing the concomitant mechanisms that ensure real public responsibility or accountability); the establishment of university institutes to legitimize, institutionalize, and program this self-defined relationship between the university and the city -- it's the Greatest Story Ever Told, and now it's on the road. back in march 2004, just months before her departure in june 2004, president judith rodin delivered an address, 'the university and the city'. this was the address in which she famously said clark park was drug-infested. in this address she also announced the formation of a penn urban research institute: http://www.upenn.edu/almanac/v50/n27/rodin.html excerpt: Now, let me take you back to the real-world crisis, and how we intervened. To make the neighborhood cleaner and safer, we strengthened our Division of Public Safety by hiring more police officers and investing in state-of-the-art technology. We also opened a new police station further west beyond campus, co-locating it with the Philadelphia police precinct substation and the special-services district that we took the lead in launching. We did this to signal Penn's commitment to the safety of our students and our neighbors. At the same time, this newly created University City special-services district, which you all know as the UCD, employed both safety ambassadors who walked the streets and supported campus and city police, and trash collectors who supplemented city units and helped remove graffiti. These were welfare-to-work participants, thus contributing to another social action goal. In addition, we partnered with neighborhood residents, the electricians' union, and the local electric company to install fixtures to uniformly light the sidewalks of 1,200 neighborhood properties. Not only did these efforts create a brighter and cleaner neighborhood, which attracted more and more foot traffic, but by requiring whole blocks, rather than individual homeowners, to commit, we encouraged a revival of community associations, block by block. This, in turn, led to greening projects--such as the planting of 450 trees and 10,000 spring bulbs and the creation of four public and three children's gardens--which set the stage for the dramatic transformation of Clark Park from a dangerous drug-infested space into a thriving recreational venue for children and the locale for a weekly farmer's market. Along with making University City cleaner and safer, Penn had a huge initial impact on housing, which itself had become a clean and safe issue. We began by acquiring twenty abandoned properties in strategic spots throughout the neighborhood, rehabbed them, and sold them to the public. We weren't seeking a profit on these homes. Rather, we were seeking to build capacity by stabilizing blocks and promoting home ownership. We also stepped up our efforts to encourage more Penn affiliates to move into the neighborhood. But to make the neighborhood more attractive to residents, students, and visitors alike, we needed to provide retail and cultural amenities and engineer radical improvements in the public schools. Here is where we really rolled the dice. We resolved to plan and build a public school, and we chose to undertake two large-scale mixed-use retail development projects in hopes that major anchors would bring other shops, restaurants, theaters, private investment, and private development to University City. [...] All told, scores of new shops that run the gamut are opening throughout the neighborhood. And a commercial corridor given up for dead now bustles with art galleries, performance spaces, and an international restaurant row that reflects the dynamic cultural diversity of University City. Thousands of people--from the Penn community, from the neighborhood, from all over the region--are flocking to shops, restaurants, and cultural venues that came into being as a direct result of Penn's decision to redevelop a dying commercial core into a thriving, productive asset. - - - - - - - .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity
Re: [UC] Funding special services (Was: which bad thing?)
Ross Bender wrote: Ray, those are some truly earthshatteringly lousy lyrics. I admit I'm no songwriter or chant-meister. that's why I share with you folks. feel free to re-write! .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Funding special services (Was: which bad thing?)
Anthony West wrote: Hi, Guy. I find all this negativism annoying too, especially when it is accompanied by a complete lack of practical thinking. I think your idea is great, and thinking about it with some good business heads could be very beneficial for University City Remember, though, about the proposed NID: it was intended to extend UCD's current services (let's call them John Fenton as a kind of discussion shorthand). The original John Fenton was to continue being funded by UCD's current major backers -- Penn, Drexel, large real estate firms. If we are talking about a service entity that does roughly what UCD does, it's going to cost something like what UCD now costs. That cost is currently derived from millions of dollars from major donors. So let us be terribly clear: see, this kind of shorthand is misleading. it leaves out the fact that ucd claims to do more than just 'john fenton' services. ucd also: markets us, brands us, kicks businesses out and installs others, programs our entertainments, occupies our public spaces, populates our public buildings, puts their agendas into our neighborhood associations, steps between our relationship with our elected governing mechanisms, etc. etc. UCD! GET OUT ON THE STREET! UCD! WE NEED A CLEAN SWEEP! GET OUT OF OUR STORES AND OUR PARKS! GET OUT OF OUR HOUSES AND YARDS! GET OUT OF OUR GARDENS AND OUT OF OUR MARKETS GET BACK ON THE STREET AND GO SWEEP! UCD! GET OUT ON THE STREET! UCD! YOU NEED A CLEAN SWEEP! GET OUT OF OUR CHURCHES, GET OFF 0F OUR STOOPS! GET OUT OF OUR DINERS AND VOTING BOOTHS! GET OUT OF OUR POCKETS GET OFF OF THE DOCKETS GET BACK ON THE STREET AND GO SWEEP! UCD! GET OUT ON THE STREET! UCD! WE'D LIKE A CLEAN SWEEP! GET OUT OF OUR PLANS, GET OFF OF OUR WALLS! GET OUT OF OUR SPRINGS AND OUR FALLS! GET OUT OF OUR FACES GET OUT OF OUR PAPERS GET BACK ON THE STREET AND GO SWEEP! UCD! GET OUT ON THE STREET! UCD! WE NEED A CLEAN SWEEP! .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] which bad thing?
Anthony West wrote: Let us frame it as a true dichotomy instead. why even insist on a dichotomy? I've just finished reading a bunch of posts by various people on this list who have come up with a variety of responses about 'where to go from here,' and it sure doesn't look like options need to be mutually exclusive. here's what I've got so far, a quick scrape from posts made on the list since the morning's announcement: - - - - - - - - Community members raised three motions, all of which passed with scarcely a dissenting voice. (glenn:) We, at the first Thursday meeting, insist that UCD make full disclosures of policies and processes to facilitate transparency and accountability appropriate for a special services district. Freda made the motion to retain John Fenton. Sharrieff made the motion to facilitate a community forum about this issue so that the community might ask all questions directly to UCD. The UC-Review has volunteered to moderate the community meeting with a suggested location of Rosenberger Hall. It would be wise for representatives of the Board of UCD to participate as well as the trustees committees of the institutions represented. 20 people signed to participate in a committee to organize the meeting. I certainly hope that stakeholders in the UCD, both institutional and individual will attend and that there can be some productive feedback. If the major share holders of a special service district really want community engagement, in the future; we must be included in honest and transparent processes and the organization must have accountable and competent leadership. So, UCD: what's wrong with agreeing that Fenton had made a mistake, and letting him get back to his excellent work a bit wiser? How do we thank John Fenton? Can his job and reputation be saved? Should we save his job? lose UCD? settle for what we get (and thus deserve)? How do we prevent the further co opting of UC by Politics, Penn? Do we support any person or initiative at UCD? I think the shareholders and we resident stakeholders would be better served if they got rid of the existing Board and Executive staff and rehired John to focus on the street cleaning. One possible outcome could be, hypothetically, for all parties who can't imagine life without John Fenton to create a corporation, the University City Clean-n-Safe Co., and to pool the money they would otherwise have given to UCD into this new organization. http://www.uta.edu/faculty/mputnam/SPCH3309/Notes/EthicalTheories.html a link to an interesting piece from the University of Texas on corporate ethics and corporate governance. Much of it is relevant to the issue current in UC on UCD The problem now is who really coordinates the UCD and to whom is it answerable. - - - - - - - - - UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Blackwell calls to save Fenton's job
S. Sharrieff Ali wrote: The motion carried and was without opposition to have a community meeting organized by concerned community residents. I made the motion and volunteered to make sure the meeting happened. 20 people signed to participate in a committee to organize the meeting. ... The idea was not to rely on the UCD or Penn to organize a meeting. ... The UC-Review has volunteered to moderate the community meeting with a suggested location of Rosenberger Hall. It would be wise for representatives of the Board of UCD to participate as well as the trustees committees of the institutions represented. sharrieff, here's an initial contribution to the proposed community meeting, developed openly here onlist [and still open to revision]. a set of responsibilities for us and ucd: - - - - - - - - - - - 1: ucd is primarily accountable to us, the public, not to ucd - - - - - - - - - - - 2: ucd's performance/actions should be evaluated/investigated/monitored on an ongoing basis by an agency independent of ucd - - - - - - - - - - - 3: we should develop the means whereby ucd communications are public, timely and proactive - - - - - - - - - - - 4: ucd's boundaries should be clearly defined and maintained - - - - - - - - - - - 5: ucd should remain scrupulously neutral in public questions/disputes/contests, not taking sides or even appearing to take sides. - - - - - - - - - - - 6: ucd officers/staff should not serve on the boards of neighborhood organizations. - - - - - - - - - - - 7: regular public forums should be held to generate a set of principles, best practices, etc. that would examine and improve ucd as a public service organization. - - - - - - - - - - - 8. ucd should use its resources to facilitate/broker compromise among competing neighborhood stakeholders rather than using resources to implement solutions for one type of stakeholder. ie, win/win not win/lose [example: ucd brokers Trees/HelpWithPropertyTaxes rather than takes sides in Trees/NoTrees on kyle's block. ucd becomes uniquely positioned as an agent for equality rather than an agent for divisiveness.] - - - - - - - - - - - .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] which bad thing?
Anthony West wrote: Foes of UCD will understandably rejoice in the clear public rebuke issued it by Councilwoman Jannie Blackwell today. But those who believe UCD made a mistake face a challenge of their own: decide which action to highlight for blame and which to forgive. Those who would fault UCD for potentially engaging in political activity, thereby running afoul of its 501 requirements, necessarily require an internal investigation that is both thorough and discreet. They cannot demand prompt, swift disclosure of anything until an investigation is finished, nor can they expect any investigation of importance to be wrapped up in a few weeks. Those who would fault UCD for relieving John Fenton of his duties and not wrapping up this investigation swiftly must, then, accept that no 501 issue of substance arose worthy of investigation. I don't have an opinion as to the rights of the case. I do know that complex issues -- on the one hand political, on the other hand legal -- surround either judgement. And I am always leery of people who give out free legal advice for problems they know only other people must pay for, if their advice turns out to be wrong. I am leery of any of us framing this as a false dichotomy, as 'which bad thing?' let's be more constructive, shall we? please let's let things breathe a little more before jumping to frame a set of choices, a set of blames. there may be more (or less!) than the ones you propose. .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. -- Tony West __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: Debunking the hysteria RE: [UC] Question for tech people
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Glenn, I was also the victim of one of these anonymous posts which seems to have a related writer. Back on April 2nd, the following email appeared on the PFSNI listserv. I thought it was on the purple list also, but I can't find that in my old emails. That writer was called [EMAIL PROTECTED] It's especially interesting to me that both are AOL users, and both make this vague reference to politics in their names. A coincidence? A copy cat now with [EMAIL PROTECTED] Does anybody know how to figure this out? the writer was not [EMAIL PROTECTED] the writer was [EMAIL PROTECTED] birdofparadise52 wrote TO [EMAIL PROTECTED] birdofparadise52's message to committeeperson was then posted to ucity list 2 apr 07 by [EMAIL PROTECTED] - - - - - besides all this, I think glenn was treated quite badly onlist last evening, and it was chilling to witness the accusations, the speculations, the pilings-on, the cheerings from the sidelines (and yes, the silences) -- as well as the ease, the speed and the sheer malice of it all. people may want to excuse themselves by citing their inexperience with online 'hi-tech stuff', but there's no excuse for this kind of behavior, online or in person. .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: Debunking the hysteria RE: [UC] Question for tech people
UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Glenn, I was also the victim of one of these anonymous posts which seems to have a related writer. Back on April 2nd, the following email appeared on the PFSNI listserv. I thought it was on the purple list also, but I can't find that in my old emails. That writer was called [EMAIL PROTECTED] It's especially interesting to me that both are AOL users, and both make this vague reference to politics in their names. A coincidence? A copy cat now with [EMAIL PROTECTED] Does anybody know how to figure this out? the writer was not [EMAIL PROTECTED] the writer was [EMAIL PROTECTED] birdofparadise52 wrote TO [EMAIL PROTECTED] birdofparadise52's message to committeeperson was then posted to ucity list 2 apr 07 by [EMAIL PROTECTED] sorry, this got cut off -- birdofparadise52's message to committeeperson was then posted to pfsni list 2 apr 07 by committeeperson. contact pfsni list's moderator [brian spooner?] about who's subscribed to that list (pfsni subscribers can't automatically subscribe as one can with uclist) __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: FRAUDULENT POST (Was: [UC] First Thursday Meeting will have an update on the UCD investigation)
Anthony West wrote: Spokespersons for the Community Relations Office of Penn (which runs First Thursday meetings), for the University City District, and for Councilwoman Blackwell's office all categorically deny that any update on the UCD's investigation will be prepared or presented at the upcoming First Thursday meeting. The anonymous post below is false and should be presumed to have fraudulent and deceitful intent. The major focus of the agenda, which has been mailed to all association organizers, is on health care issues, said Glenn Bryant, director of the Community Relations Office. now look what you've done. you've gone and validated one of the intentions of committeeman7's post. .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: Community reps on the UCD board [was: Re: [UC] The UCD answer]
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: sorry, resorting to ad hominem here isn't helpful. No attack of any sort was intended here. I believe you when you say it wasn't intended -- but that's why it may be hard to realize when it's being used. it's in the part you snipped (your assumptions about me, as the basis for your advice). it's no big deal (I'm not upset or anything) but it's just not helpful. what's being discussed here is not how I can get in touch with an organization so that I can like ucd more, but rather how we can continue a direct conversation where you've asked us to accept ucd's role wrt dock street but not provided details about that role. .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] The UCD answer
Glenn wrote: Ray, I'm not sure the term strawman fallacy is well understood. This strategy is so often used and rarely challenged on the listserv. I want to share the explanation of the term. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man A straw man argument is an informal fallacy based on misrepresentation of an opponent's position. To set up a straw man or set up a straw-man argument is to create a position that is easy to refute, then attribute that position to the opponent. A straw-man argument can be a successful rhetorical technique (that is, it may succeed in persuading people) but it is in fact a misleading fallacy, because the opponent's actual argument has not been refuted. By the way, your list to date is right on target. We just need an organization that is actually interested in community engagement, transparency, and accountability. thanks for the definitions. in spite of all the distractions I'm not losing sight of what I think is our best idea yet (yes, hatched collaboratively, right here, onlist!): a public forum that could work, inclusively and transparently, to improve ucd -- a public forum just like the ones that're improving clark park and 40th street right now. onward... btw, any news in this week's ucity review about the fenton/malcolm x park incident? .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] The UCD answer
Kyle Cassidy wrote: just my two cents. thanks, kyle. a lot of issues raised in what you've written, but I think the heart of it is right here, in this pair of thoughts: To get my trees, UCD and UC Green had to take the side of some neighbors over others. and My revision would be: UCD should be committed to making the district a better place to live for the people who live in the district. in a nutshell, the above contradiction is what I think is problematic with ucd, with our relationship with ucd. I think it's what we could all work on, together, to resolve. but first we have to be more aware of it. .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Headers from the original First Thursday post
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Glenn--'fess up! (hint--search headers below on glenn This header is from the First Thursday post, the following one is from Glenn's post immediately preceding that one, just chosen at random. For those who didn't search the two strings, both the [EMAIL PROTECTED] email and the [EMAIL PROTECTED] email say they come from: glennsdesktop Very interesting, Bill. I don't think all these headers mean that glenn was the author of the committeeman7 post. I think y'all need to learn more about headers. also, I just checked and found that [EMAIL PROTECTED] is subscribed to the list. .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: FRAUDULENT POST (Was: [UC] First Thursday Meeting will have an update on the UCD investigation)
Anthony West wrote: Ah, Ray. So you know the intentions of committeeman7's post. We must take it, then, you are involved at least to some degree in this fraud; how else would you know the intentions of the con artist? haha I didn't think I'd have to spell it out because I thought it was clear to any reader that one of the intentions of the committeeman7's post was to show us just how well ucd was handling its communication with the community about the fenton/malcolm x park incident. ie, NOT. which you then made crystal clear with your 'spokespersons ... categorically deny that any update on the UCD's investigation will be prepared or presented at the upcoming First Thursday meeting.' I'm wondering now if [EMAIL PROTECTED] and [EMAIL PROTECTED] are the same genius. ps, welcome to the internets. :-) .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: Offlist - Re: FRAUDULENT POST (Was: [UC] First Thursday Meeting
Anthony West wrote: It is very clear on this listserve who these people are. Ray has admitted being connected to this forger. And Glenn has a long-established MO of faking stuff on the internet to further one of his favorite scenarios: storming someone else's public meeting and disrupting it with angry, delusional speeches. It's all taken place many times before. CRYING. .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Headers from the original First Thursday post
Ross Bender wrote: UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: also, I just checked and found that [EMAIL PROTECTED] is subscribed to the list. Of course, doofus. Otherwise he/she/it couldn't send mail to the list. What's your point? it was an fyi. the point is that it adds to the picture, all the extra steps that glenn would have to go through in order to post as someone else. don't be mad at me! .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] The UCD answer
Frank wrote: You're still not making sense. In the theoretical example *you* (not Ray) originally used, the decision about what content to teach was made by the agency, not by UCD. UCD's support would theoretically be forthcoming no matter what content was chosen. Any public complaint would have to be directed to the agency in question since UCD would be content-neutral. I'm going to repeat what I said before: You seem to be mired in traditional method of communication and to believe that they are the *only* way things work. Seriously, you use the word must more than anyone I can remember. You make pronouncements about the way things are which completely disregard different methods of communication than the ones, if I can presume, you work best in. Important decisions *do* get made without all of the parties involved talking face to face. I am reminded particularly of my involvement in Provincetown Community Television and the Provincetown Cable Advisory Board. Most of our negotiations, even controversial ones, with both Comcast and Outer Cape Television happened through email. The parties involved were just too geographically separate to be in the same place at the same time very often. I didn't know much when I started with them but I learned and eventually taught at our Community Television Station. yes, you get it. what I meant by ucd being neutral and not taking sides. in the example I cited, ucd took sides once the zoning question became a dispute among neighbors; gail fisher, as a ucd staffer, posted on phillyblog to support one side [apparently online communications ARE useful, SOME of the time :-)] this was all documented here, onlist, months ago. I pointed out at the time that ucd should have stepped aside once the zoning question became a dispute among neighbors before the zoning board, because ucd is not a stakeholder in the same way that the competing neighbors are. in response, melani pointed out that since ucd helped with getting dock street at the firehouse, we shouldn't expect ucd to be neutral. but when I asked her for particulars about how and when ucd helped dock street get installed at the firehouse, she did not answer [again, online communications are useful, some of the time :-)]. what I don't understand in all this is the expectation that we can have it both ways. we're supposed to accept how 'involved' ucd is in our public lives, but at the same time we're not supposed to look too closely, to ask too many questions. .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] The UCD answer
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ray, each community association has a representative on the board of the UCD. There is one for Spruce Hill and one for Walnut Hill, both covering areas near your apartment. If you don't like what the UCD is doing, go to the community associations and ask them to exercise better oversight. sorry, resorting to ad hominem here isn't helpful. this isn't about me or what you assume about me. it's about you or any of us being able to say when and how ucd helped dock street get installed at the firehouse -- regardless of how we like what ucd is doing, regardless of what neighborhood association we ask. .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] The UCD answer
Kyle Cassidy wrote: I understand your position and I think very often UCD does stay out of the fray. But in the particular case of Dock Street I believe it goes back to your point of whom is UCD beholden to -- and as Sharrieff pointed out, UCD is beholden to the people who pay it's bills -- at the moment, that is not all the people of west philly. They're still a private entity until/unless the NID passes, in which case they'd be answerable to our citycouncil person. In the meantime, the people who are funding UCD have made it clear that getting businesses on Baltimore avenue is a priorty and they have created a special pool of money to do just that -- get businesses to open up along Baltimore Avenue. So with a clear mandate from the people who are funding them, and popular support among the people in the neighborhood (I recall someone from the zoning board saying the amount of community support for that particular business getting their variance was unprecidented in sheer size), they went ahead and sided with Dock Street over the Hickman Temple day care (which is my understanding, would have not been a public day care, but rather one for the church only). If two neighbors were arguing over what color their semi-detatched should be painted, I expect that UCD would not get involved or if there were a rich debate about the borders of the Catchman zone, I'd likewise expect them not to pick a side, but in this instance, I think they acted properly in accordance with the wishes of their funders. (Who include, to some small extent, me, since I've sent them money and I'm happy with their position on Dock Street). thanks kyle. (and thanks for not resorting to ad hominem.) consider this: if a majority of folks in the hood were pro-Nutter, and these same folks also happened to be contributing money to ucd, that would not make it right for ucd to publicly endorse Nutter, to encourage voters to vote for Nutter. the choice for Nutter or not is a public choice, a public process among equal stakeholders. that's why in my example I took care to say 'public questions/disputes', why I said ucd should have been neutral once the zoning question became a public dispute among neighbors before the zoning board. so, how would you revise this: - - - - - - - idea #5: ucd should remain scrupulously neutral in public questions/disputes/contests, not taking sides or even appearing to take sides. - - - - - - - .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Delay and old news tactic
Bill Sanderson wrote: You're right, I guess. They had an incident which involved personnel policies--did an employee do the right (or the wrong) thing. No organization I've ever run into is going to handle such a thing in public--would you expect there to be broad neighborhood publicity if this were you, and your employer? yes, penn does handle this kind of thing -- look at the amy gutmann holloween incident. it broke out on someone's blog (not the newspapers), spread throughout the media, and penn very quickly issued a statement and posted it on their website. it was the right thing to do, the responsible thing to do. Presumably, at some point, John Fenton's employment status will change--he'll go back to work, or otherwise. Whether anyone will announce that to the world, I don't know, but I don't expect to see it emblazoned on any headlines. see, that's just it: all we've heard thus far (publicly) is headlines. meanwhile some in the neighborhood have heard wendell deliver a statement at a meeting, and the daily news has shifted the 'story' (removing/distancing fenton and magnifying blackwell) while not publishing ucd's full official statement... up next: more headlines?... .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] The UCD answer
Anthony West wrote: Ray proposed that UCD not take sides in public questions/disputes/contests, not taking sides or even appearing to take sides. Therefore, Ray is saying, UCD could only support projects with which there was universal contentment in this community. And since it only takes one person with a keyboard to manufacture a public question/dispute/contest, in an area with more than 50,000 residents (at least on UC-list), this proposal is the kind of pipe dream that flourishes in unrealistic internet communities. I repeat: this standard is absurd, an impossible test to meet for any one of the hundreds of organizations that operate in some sort of public-private interface throughout Philadelphia. Any governmental authority you might approach to put a chop on your regulatory proposals, will recognize this in a flash and tune you out. Anybody who wants to consider developing a regulatory network for UCD needs to acquire a grounding of knowledge and common sense about how actual agencies and actual regulators work. It will require real study and real interaction with real people in the real world. Pounding out an ever-expanding wishlist of single-issue edicts to a single-case agency one doesn't really know anything about, is a childish exercise in imaginary self-importance. Ray can do this if he wants. He can hold his conversation with nobody, in public, if he wants. and here you're back to arguing, this time with strawman and ad hominem! but instead of dismissing all this talk of 'standards' and 'regulatory networks' and 'universal contentment' which you've brought to the discussion as argument, let's instead see how it could be incorporated productively into our thinking... - - - - - idea #7: regular public forums should be held to generate a set of principles, best practices, etc. that would examine and improve ucd as a public service organization -- in the same way that regular public forums are held with the intention to improve public entities like 40th street, clark park, baltimore ave, etc. - - - - - I think we're on to something here. good stuff! keep it coming! .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] The UCD answer
Anthony West wrote: So to set a standard of universal contentment as the benchmark for any non-profit's legitimacy is absurd, an impossible test to meet. Frank wrote: Umm...Who said *that?* If I missed something, please explain it to me. thanks for the reality check. meanwhile, tony's claims that ucd's performance and accountability are delegated to city council 'for the most part,' (along with his queries about ucd's 'reporting requirements' and requests for 'revising') demonstrate nicely why any of us would want to develop and articulate a set of public responsibilities for ucd. good stuff! let's continue: - - - - - - - - - idea #6: ucd officers/staff should not serve on the boards of neighborhood organizations. - - - - - - - - - .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Delay and old news tactic
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Some of us don’t believe an open-ended internal investigation which UCD claims, is actually occurring Maybe Melani, to whom UCD apparently still responds, can get a progress report. If so, it'll show that the above is wrong. If not, or if she doesn't even try, well... pinochle, anyone? .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. ftr, no follow-up in this week's uc review, nor in this week's dp __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Delay and old news tactic
Wilma de Soto wrote: Today, The Philadelphia Daily News had a mention about Jannie Blackwell and the UCD scandal at Black Oak Park (now called Malcolm X Park), in their “Clout” section. Nothing really new to report, but it won’t be long now since the hounds have grappled on to it. I am sorry for her AND John Fenton. fenton should be back on the job any day now, right? (hasn't it been 2 weeks?) anyway, here's the daily news article: http://tinyurl.com/2dodqk and here's what's new: the may 16 article said: It was bizarre, he [Walker] said. All of a sudden I found myself working for the Tom Knox campaign and wondering, 'How did I get here?' The director of UCD's cleanup effort is John Fenton, who Walker heard was close to City Councilwoman Jannie Blackwell. Blackwell supported Knox. and now the june 1 article says: It was bizarre, Walker told us. All of a sudden I found myself working for the Tom Knox campaign and wondering, 'How did I get here?' Well, he got there courtesy of Councilwoman Jannie Blackwell, who'd endorsed Knox for mayor. hahaha .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] The UCD answer
Anthony West wrote: I'm not interested in having an I think conversation that is not grounded in what is observations. I'll rephrase my responses for you as follows FACT 1. Nobody on UC-list (aside from the likes of Melani) is willing to name a class they belong to, that can contribute to the costs of UCD, thereby making it accountable to them. That is the most powerful way forward, if you wish to pursue it. FACT 2. Lawful oversight alone does not appear to meet your needs, since you already have it yet are not satisfied. FACT 3. Public, timely and proactive communications require the judgement of a responsible arbiter. In every agency I can think of, this arbiter is purely an internal function. External judges of communications hold little sway anywhere and play a small role at best in managing day-to-day information releases. FACT 4. All people to whom UCD is accountable, and almost all people to whom it isn't, are grateful for any help it has given to improve Malcolm X Park, so there is no problem in this quarter. well, you've removed the invective and ad hominem [bravo], but you're still arguing. you're asserting unsupported opinions and speculation as fact. when asked to tell us everything you know, that means just that: what you know, not what you think you know. [my teacher was a wise one, he was!] here, I'll show you what I mean, how we can develop a set of ideas about ucd's/our responsibilities, based on what we know, not on what we think we know: idea: ucd is primarily accountable to us, the public, not to ucd facts: ucd services affect the public. ucd's services are not limited to those who fund ucd. ucd management is accountable in part to the state of pennsylvania based on its 501c3 status. - - - - - - - - - - - idea: ucd's performance/actions should be evaluated/investigated/monitored on an ongoing basis by an agency independent of ucd facts: we did not know about the malcolm x park incident until a student told a newspaper. none of us will know the outcome except via ucd's internal investigation. ucd's ongoing performance is currently evaluated by ucd, not by any agency independent of ucd. - - - - - - - - - - - idea: we should develop the means whereby ucd communications are public, timely and proactive facts: this incident is over 2 weeks old now and there is no official statement or reference to it on ucd's website. meanwhile, some members of one neighborhood group have heard lewis wendell read a statement at one of their meetings, and a local newspaper editor has quoted what may only be a portion of the official statement. - - - - - - - - - - - idea: ucd's boundaries should be clearly defined and maintained facts: ucd's description of its boundaries and services currently does not include language that describes when or where its services extend beyond its boundaries. - - - - - - - - - - - and here's a new idea to add to the list of responsibilities: idea: ucd should remain scrupulously neutral in public questions/disputes/contests, not taking sides or even appearing to take sides. facts: ucd took sides when neighbors were in opposition over the zoning for the firehouse. candidate andy toy appeared publicly at a ucd-sponsored party for the firehouse. ucd is alleged to have used resources and manpower in connection with a mayorial candidate at malcolm x park. according to the malcolm x park website, john fenton is on the board of the mantua community improvement committee. - - - - - - - - - - - .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] The UCD answer
Anthony West wrote: Ray, Are you saying, then, he advised you to answer a direct question when courteously posed by others, in the course of a conversation? That's a wise recommendation on his part. You should abide by it in every post you write. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN wrote: my high school english teacher had a good piece of advice for us, when we asked how to answer his essay questions that had no right or wrong answer: 'tell me everything you know', he said. I'm saying that we can all contribute what we know. whether it's about car break-ins, missing cats, or a list of public responsibilities for ucd. and we can contribute without name-calling, without beating each other up, or without claiming that I'm right and you're wrong. there's no set outcome, but it's bound to be more than what we started with. .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] The UCD answer
Bill Sanderson wrote: I stand corrected. Thanks--this was not what I'd thought it was--given that the folks in question were students, and doing the public service for a Penn-associated agency. I don't think that it changes my feelings about the incident that is the base of this long drawn out set of exchanges, though. the thing to consider in all this is that we do not know, publicly (at least, from the reports of the daily news, the dp, the ucity review) whether the students committed an infraction as students on penn's campus (the rooster/library theory) or as 'citizens' in university city district (the loud party in the neighborhood theory). but in either case, the university city district becomes a zone in which persons committing minor infractions can be heard and sentenced by a special court created jointly by ccd and municipal court, and offenders serve out their sentences by performing services for ucd/ccd. how much of all this has the whiff of governance, of conflict of interest, I leave others to judge! .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] The UCD answer
Bill Sanderson wrote: I disagree. The term as Glenn used it implies the involvement of a governmental body-the court system. This wasn't the case here. The initial press report used imprecise language, which led to confusion on this issue. We now know that there was no such court system involvement, so implying otherwise is misleading. Yeah, so the student was being coerced by an authority to which he or his parents or somebody had spent a good many thousands of bucks to have him tutored, into doing community service, probably because of that cow in the library, or on the roof of the engineering building or wherever. At least it wasn't a rooster in Clark Park! this program is described on ucd's website, on center city district's website and on penn's website [see below]. the court involved is the philadelphia community court, a special court created jointly by the philadelphia municipal court and center city district. it's located at 1401 arch street. this court, not penn, hears the cases and hands out sentences to offenders (students and non-students). these sentences are for offenses that occur in university city district and the 3rd, 6th, 9th, 17th, and 23rd police districts in center city. http://www.ucityphila.org/ucd_programs/public_safety/community_court http://www.centercityphila.org/programs/community_court.aspx http://www.upenn.edu/almanac/v48/n34/Com-Relations.html .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. http://www.politicsforum.org/images/flame_warriors/flame_63.php You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Clean? The SEPTA Concourses? You must be joking! [Was: An example of the potential for abuse
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Krigman Al, you're really stretching things again here! haha and you know what? I can't stop saying wendell lewis now. I mean, all this is making me think twice about it, and now I can't remember which is right, lewis wendell or wendell lewis. I have a dentist with first names as his name and surname, and the same thing happens -- I can never remember whether he's e g- or g- e. .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Tom Fenton on ABC News
Frank wrote to Tony West: Is your dislike for Ray so strong that you have to resort to this? Must you respond to his every sentence with the opposite opinion? Why respond at all? Which brings me to your earlier question about how some online communities deal with trolls. We have ignored them. It works. So does creating a moderated environment but, given the nature of this list, I don't think it is appropriate here. I'm sure we would have some disagreements about what constitutes a troll. has everyone seen this famous chart? internet personality types: http://www.politicsforum.org/images/flame_warriors/ it's fun recognizing who's who. also might be fun for each of us to identify ourself... .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. hahaha definitely PHILOSOPHER and KUNG-FU MASTER: http://www.politicsforum.org/images/flame_warriors/flame_16.php http://www.politicsforum.org/images/flame_warriors/flame_21.php You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] The UCD answer
Glenn wrote: For us to have one shred of respect for Wendell Lewis and the UCD board, they must immediately release the details of their written protocol or policy for the use of these community service prisoners. glenn, the only thing on ucd's website I could find about this 'policy' is here: http://www.ucityphila.org/ucd_programs/public_safety/community_court and as far as I can tell, it doesn't mention anything about ucd doing work connected with political stuff or elections or candidates, and as far as I can tell the work they have performed under this program since 2002 (the list at the bottom) is all within ucd's boundaries, while malcolm x park is not. ps-- I think if al has it right (that fenton is being held [so far] as a 'scapegoat' and that his rapped knuckles becomes the thing that satisfies everyone that the issue's been addressed) -- it may leave ucd the organization from taking responsibility or changing itself, and leave us with little reason to do more than simply react. that's why on the list I've been focusing on developing a set of responsibilities -- for ucd and us -- that we'd expect, publicly, of a service organization and of ourselves, allegations or not. regardless of the outcome, I see this incident as a terrific opportunity to get people to think about this, because it's a situation unlike the usual premise, which is that ucd is unquestionably all-good and ineluctably all-beneficial, a self-defined and self-congratulatory entity acting for the good of all -- all of which makes it difficult to define any rigorous system of public checks/balances (ie, responsibilities). and so far I've been trying to assemble, by way of conversation, a set of ideas: 1. ucd is primarily accountable to us (us as sharreiff defined), not to ucd 2. ucd's performance/actions should be evaluated/investigated/monitored on an ongoing basis by an agency independent of ucd [ie, none of us would have known about this if it weren't for the students, and none of us will know the outcome except via ucd's investigation.] and I'd like to suggest we add: 3. we should develop the means whereby ucd communications are public, timely and proactive (ie, not with just some of our neighborhood organizations, or only via news editors/reporters, or as a delayed reaction -- all of which can create a situation where people in the neighborhood have different access to partial information, or a situation where rumors and speculation develop, putting the entire neighborhood in a bad light, publicly.) 4. ucd's boundaries should be clearly defined and maintained (ie, it should be clear to everyone inside and outside the boundaries where ucd performs services, where they do not. it should not be a 'moving' boundary, determined by individuals on an ad hoc basis ['one block further east today, 3 blocks further west next week, 18 blocks further on alternate fridays, but only for barbeques, and only if no other blocks within the boundaries need sweeping' etc.]) any other suggestions? feel free to revise, add, etc. .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Knox/Blackwell article in City Paper
John Ellingsworth wrote: http://www.citypaper.net/articles/2007/05/17/knoxs-landing also in the dp: http://tinyurl.com/27da9p .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Tom Fenton on ABC News
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: does anyone know how/where/when this official statement will be made public? The UCReview did carry it in the article. It was one paragraph near the end. yes, I saw that, but do we know if that was the whole statement? the uc review mentions the statement, and then says: 'in it, Wendell states that... What Wendell Lewis and the $74,000 flackette are doing is proving the point made by the opponents of the NID, that the proposed organization will not operate in the open. this incident is certainly showing us something about what ucd's responsibilities are, what our responsibilites are. it seems that everyone involved in this incident has had an opportunity to speak publicly -- wendell, the students walker and doto, blackwell, knox -- everyone except john fenton. .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. the uc review also says that, according to the student luke walker, ucd employees were also used to help set up the event, not just the 2 penn students. it was one of the students who broke the story to the daily news last week. __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Tom Fenton on ABC News
Kyle Cassidy wrote: They probably just don't want to draw attention to it. 99% of the people in this neighborhood, I'll bet, have zero idea that this is happening. I think any PR flackette, whether trying to scrape by on $74,000 a year or not, would advise don't make a lot of noise about this, wait till the investigation's over, keep emptying trash cans and sweeping the streets. you've just described exactly what a pr professional SHOULDN'T do. think about it. (next time you're at the green line, sipping your double shot latte -- while thumbing the local rags, browsing the online blogs, eavesdropping on the rumors buzzing over at the next table...) :-\ .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Tom Fenton on ABC News
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: /So what would Laserbeam PR do if you'd been hired by UCD to deal with this?/ You know, I asked this question a couple of days ago, and Krigman Al suggested that we withhold our judgment. Since then, everybody's been rushing to judge. This listserv is impossible to satisfy. I suspect that the UCD has come to the conclusion that it isn't worth trying. So, Ray, tell us what you'd do? hi melani. it was kyle who just said what ucd's pr flackette should do. are you judging me or kyle by not challenging kyle about that? Kyle Cassidy wrote: They probably just don't want to draw attention to it. 99% of the people in this neighborhood, I'll bet, have zero idea that this is happening. I think any PR flackette, whether trying to scrape by on $74,000 a year or not, would advise don't make a lot of noise about this, wait till the investigation's over, keep emptying trash cans and sweeping the streets. - - - - I think your earlier question about 'where do we go from here' is a good one, because an incident like this brings to the forefront all those questions and issues of accountability, oversight, transparency, process, etc. that we've often previously discussed onlist wrt ucd. and I've already offered my opinion about this incident: this incident is certainly showing us something about what ucd's responsibilities are, what our responsibilites are. I'll certainly share ideas onlist with people about what those responsibilities are, what we expect, etc. -- so long as we're sharing and not arguing. deal? I'll begin: 1. ucd is primarily accountable to us, not to ucd. .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Tom Fenton on ABC News
Ray wrote: I'll certainly share ideas onlist with people about what those responsibilities are, what we expect, etc. -- so long as we're sharing and not arguing. deal? I'll begin: 1. ucd is primarily accountable to us, not to ucd. Anthony West wrote: Deal. That is a very attractive idea indeed. The only way that could possibly come into being in real life, though, is if UCD becomes primarily, or significantly, funded by us. Do you have any suggestions on how that might be arranged, Ray? I'm not demanding final, flawless blueprints ... just a general line of inquiry that could be pursued and developed. If you can share any sort of answer with us, I'll be most grateful. so let's continue: 1. ucd is primarily accountable to (insert whom), not to ucd. .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Tom Fenton on ABC News
Anthony West wrote: So let's continue, Ray. Can you please (insert whom), for starters? If you want UCD to be more accountable to (whom) than it now is, how might you define (whom) and how would (who) pay money to UCD, so that it might be held more accountable to them? This is necessary question if we are to talk about accountability. Name some names, for instance. I began with the idea that ucd is primarily accountable to us, not to itself. you put the word 'us' in quotes, and now you want to know who/what this 'us' is. so do I. so let's give others a chance to contribute. all we have thus far is that ucd is primarily accountable to some entity other than itself. I'll add a second idea, to explore this idea of accountability: 2. ucd's performance/activities should be evaluated/investigated by an independent agency (insert whom) __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Tom Fenton on ABC News
Anthony West wrote: In all fairness, to distinguish UCD from us implies that UCD is not a part of us. If by us you mean readers of this listserve, then a few days ago you noted some UCD workers are part of us. Surely that's not what you're wishing to say now, though. So define an us that is not UCD, that UCD can respond to, especially if that us assumes some financial responsibility for UCD. I can think of possible usses, but I won't name them, no matter how theoretically, because I don't want the heat. That's why I invited you to do the initial round of naming, Ray. If no one steps forward to define such an us for us, then, sadly, I don't see how it can ever proceed to Points 2, 3 ... x. Who will bell the cat? as the old fable goes. In that case, this attractive inquiry would be better set aside, I fear. earlier today, sharrieff stepped forward and offered one definition of 'us': UCD management is accountable to it's Board of Directors. UCD management by mission is accountable in part to those it services through geographic boundaries, it's relationships of support (which would include ALL the local politicians), and individuals who donate money to supplement the on-going institutional support. UCD management is accountable in part to the State of Pennsylvania based on it's 501-C3 status. If sustained funding were to happen through a local assessment, then, in that case the UCD management would be accountable to the public interest based on that assessment and still would be accountable to a Board of Directors representative of that interest. anyone care to take it from there? and let's calm down about taking the heat. this is an open conversation, remember, not an argument. .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. [catching up...] You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Tom Fenton on ABC News
Kyle Cassidy wrote: I think Sharrif already answered that very well. UCD's accountable to the people who are paying for it to exist. It's a private entity. In order for it to be beholden to the people who live in the area bounded by the UCD it would have to be funded by the public. Until that time, they can do whatever they feel like as long as their funders are happy and don't stop sending checks. This does bring up an interesting point though, if the NID had passed, UCD would be beholden to Jannie Blackwell, who is the elected representative of the people who live in the area bounded by the UCD. I'll just add: ucd states on their website precisely where their boundaries are, and that's where everyone funding ucd expects them to be servicing. and that's where ucd claims all its credit, it's where ucd draws its statistics to write up its report cards, etc. this incident involved taking workers away from servicing an area within the ucd boundaries to an area outside the ucd boundaries. workers that included ucd staff as well as 2 penn students. melani in her defense/support of ucd has often insisted onlist that ucd doesn't service the penn campus, that ucd is for US in the neighborhood, etc... and it's been pointed out by ucd themselves that they can't adequately cover the district as defined without much more $$ etc., so this question of being 'beholden to the people who live in the area bounded by the ucd' is an important one, and goes beyond simply those who currently write the checks. we (all of us in the neighborhood) are necessarily stakeholders, are necessarily implicated in whatever ucd does. by ucd's own admission. and contrary to what you might think, our stakeholder relationship with ucd becomes even more pronounced under a nid, and this incident speaks volumes about what we might expect if ucd was a nid. the whole issue of nid boundaries becomes even more crucial -- for justifying a nid, for defining how much $$ folks are assessed, for defining who benefits and how much. we could use this incident to think more thoughtfully about the premise that ucd exists to service US, that they're responsible to US, and how this US is served, allegations or not. .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] UC Review Graffiti Contest
Turner,Kathleen wrote: To change the subject for awhile . . . Quite an idea the UC Review had with their Graffiti Watch feature -- best tag of the week gets a photo on the front page. I can see this being a BIG disincentive to the neighborhood graffiti artists. Cornbread rides again? Ross Bender wrote: What you say above makes absolutely no sense at all to me, so I got the latest copy of the UC Rag from the bottom of the parrot's cage, wiped it off, and read the feature. The feature, of course, says exactly what you say it says. Best tag of the week will be rewarded with a front page photo. It also asks the readers to send in locations. No doubt the local artists will be breathlessly awaiting each week's issue, vying with each other to see who gets the coveted prize. Personally, I think if they offered a monetary award, say a Benjamin, or even a pizza, it would be a better incentive. hahaha here's my entry: http://tinyurl.com/2cu6aw [walnut street bridge, near the class of 1923 skating rink] .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. WHERE'S MY PIZZA You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Tom Fenton on ABC News
Frank wrote: Best part: This was not a Knox rally. This was a community rally. I asked nobody to do anything for a Knox rally. I asked them to do it for a community fair in the park where we had a church rally, said Blackwell. and then: I'm telling the head of the UCD Board and anybody concerned, if you have a problem with my politics, come to me. I make my decisions about who I endorse, said Blackwell. Wow. Contradictory as well as arrogant. Community service workers shouldn't be working for a church either, as far as I'm concerned. S. Sharrieff Ali wrote: John Fenton is now Tom Fenton and Lewis Wendell we all know is now Wendell Lewis according to Al. The story was broadcast on Action News Channel 6 tonight at 11PM. The Community Service Program in the University City District has been suspended, and one of the top administrators placed on administrative leave pending an internal investigation. A spokesman for the Knox campaign says they had no knowledge that students doing community service were allegedly used to set up for the appearance. The spokesman added they would have been totally against it if they had known. http://abclocal.go.com/wpvi/story?section=politicsid=5328900 is malcolm x park within the ucd district boundaries? .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Tom Fenton on ABC News
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Add this to the story in today's University City Review in which Wendel Lewis said that all media contacts have to go through UCD's spokesperson, Lori Klein Brennan [aka the $74,000 flackette]... Brennan declined to go into detail but instead sent over a copy of UCD's official statement. does anyone know how/where/when this official statement will be made public? .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. waiting to see how the dp reports this... You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] John Fenton Got Suspended!
KAREN ALLEN wrote: UCD suspended John Fenton over that allegation about the political posters. I first heard it as a rumor, but it was confirmed when I asked Lewis Wendell about it when I saw him tonight at a community meeting. Lewis read a prepared statement that said in effect that an unnamed employee was suspended for two weeks with pay while UCD investigates an allegation arising from a media report. Lewis read the statement in response to my direct question about whether John had been suspended, and he did not deny that the unnamed employee was in fact John. John has a wife and two kids, and he's worked too hard and built up too much good will to lose his job over something like this. sad news. any indication that fenton would actually lose his job if the allegation proves true? any indication if someone besides ucd will investigate the allegation? is this story a legal matter, or about campaign ethics, or what? how is ucd accountable in situations like this? in general? .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] The Public Square
Ross Bender wrote: Nice pix. But I fail to understand how the new Das Deutschman Essenhaus und Brew Pub is going to solve my problem and, if I understand what you're saying, make me less gauche. Your logic, if you can call it logic, is, as always, rather opaque, convoluted and breathless. Expatiate, dude. haha don't give me that mennonite rube bit. DUDE! .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. lifelong coddled ivy-leaguer who knows every farmer's trick in the book You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] 5/22 - Tuesday 1 PM : URGENT : Save the Mural from the Philadelphia Historic Commission
Elizabeth F Campion wrote: Urgent : Support is needed. -- The best summary, and a good read, with illustrations, was by Thom Nichols. It was the cover story of the May 16th Weekly Press. Click Here: Check out Weekly Press thom nickels, and the link (for now) is at http://www.philly1.com/ from reading the article, sounds like process is important to people. even across the river. .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. wishing philly review and uc review would get a better online jawn You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] John Fenton Got Suspended!
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: When I was appreciating him for so quickly solving the problem with the missing sewer covers on a Saturday afternoon a couple of weeks ago, nobody jumped in to add their personal thanks to him. Ray noted then that John is on the listserv, almost as if it were an accusation, as if John *should* have taken care of the sewer covers on the weekend without anyone asking him to do it. sorry melani, I think you misunderstood, let me clarify. when you told everyone on the list to contact john fenton, and gave his ucd email address, I merely pointed out as an fyi that he was already subscribed to this list, 24/7, with that email address. it was for future reference -- because before that you had pointed out how it might be difficult to reach him by that email 'on saturdays, after hours.' ie, an email is not like a phone call, but more like a postcard. something to keep in mind. .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] John Fenton Got Suspended!
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I don't think the listserv writers ARE withholding judgement (read summaries below), [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: sad news./ just to clarify, by sad news I meant the sad news that lewis wendell had made the announcement, that ucd had to suspend one of its own employees and was investigating allegations. I wasn't passing judgement on johon fenton's innocence or guilt; I even pointed out how we don't even know if the allegation is true. .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Schemers on the Schuylkill - and other undocumented Penn Staffers
S. Sharrieff Ali wrote: Quite frankly Ray, I thought some of the same things after reading it. No photos, examples of the stickers in question or photos of the Welcome to University City bridge etc. The writer didn't interview members of the community to get opinions. well, I wouldn't have expected the author to have photos of the painted bridge. he was focused on those little stickers, how righteously indignant they sounded, how they themselves were a hypocrisy, being themselves a marketing scheme. in fact, zitcer thought that the authors of the stickers failed to see the forest for the trees. and it's also not likely that zitcer would have interviewed anyone from the community for opinions, even though he wondered why the stickers were made. as he puts it, he's well-educated, gainfully employed and safe while some of his neighbors aren't. also, he assures us, he isn't kept awake at night thinking about what to call the neighborhood (which we can believe, especially after he's taken the trouble to write all this for the city paper). the main thing, though, is that zitcer himself already had his own marketing scheme to promote, not anyone else's: The marketing campaign we need to conduct is one in which we demand and work for better schools, better transit, more effective government and safer, cleaner streets. and with marketing like that, who needs photo evidence or corroborating community opinions? .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. is the synagogue that zitcer helped found in west philly the same one now at calvary? http://www.upenn.edu/pennnews/current/2006/033006/staff.html __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] ad hominem answer to Paul
Brian Siano wrote: Glenn wrote: It showed how FOCP can ban anyone whom the leaders perceive as a threat to their power or ask questions like evil Ray. Consider this, if the leaders of FOCP rely on nothing more than the ad hominem machine on a PUBLIC listserv, why would they be trusted to be fair when allowing people to speak or participate in CLOSED community discussions? We have to stop pretending. Further evidence of the FOCP's prevention of community participation: http://www.clarkpark.info/ParkA.htm Come and see more at our General Membership Meeting on Wednesday, July 18th: so here we have glenn and focp talking past one another again. you're bad! no, we're good, YOU'RE bad! now see that's what makes YOU bad, calling me bad! yeah? well too bad you're bad, it's a good thing we're good! well good for you but you're still bad! etc etc etc let's summarize: once upon a time, focp was good, glenn was good, park users were good. then ucd stepped in. and then suddenly the park was bad, park users were bad, glenn was bad and the so were the new focp folks pushing folks like glenn out. and now that glenn is out, the bad folks running focp look good, involving the good park users in ucd's good agenda for the good park, but glenn still looks bad. the end. .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. it's not that glenn is bad, it's that he looks bad. it's not that focp is good, it's that they look good. __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Schemers on the Schuylkill - and other undocumented Penn Staffers
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The first hint of something specious is this guy is writing commentary about neocolonial UCD on a word processor for an old world journalism rag, instead of secluded in a design studio reading spatial news listservs, playing urban simulator/junior policy analyst games, or evaluating high value urban systems integration scenarios for big bucks clients. Nothing like Penn justifying its branding efforts using its own hack, without full disclosure. And, much shame on this local rag, City Paper, for failing to perform due diligence, when publishing commentary. what struck me odd about the article was how it seemed so 'second hand' -- as if the author didn't actually encounter any of the stickers himself, and was only retelling a selection of opinions that had already been aired here. for one thing, he gets the words of the stickers wrong (they don't say university city is just a marketing scheme, they say university city is a marketing scheme). and we've all read how similar his speculations were to ones made here a while ago. and where does one even see these stickers anymore? they all seem to be gone. the article reads like belated 'damage control' or post spin, as though it was placed, for the record, rather than written as a spontaneous timely reaction to something actually ongoing and visible, and which readers could respond to. it feels more like an old skool, top-down pr approach to community engagement, not like any of our current interactive/online horizontal models of exchange. in the absense of any local gazebo [ROSS!], we'd do well to look more closely into our available public squares -- where they're located, whose participation means sharing, whose participation means controlling. meanwhile, we'll be dealing with stickers and big painted bridges, with listservs and pr machines, with public parks and not-so-public park groups... .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. does anyone know who actually painted the bridge? who asked for it? who designed it? who approved it? who paid for it? until we do, it's just as anonymous as the stickers. and after all, it's our identity that's at stake. You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Schemers on the Schuylkill
Ross Bender wrote: Must be, dude. The Penn Culture Czar. I know how badly you wanted that position, but hey, you can't always get what you want. What I love about Penn-funded Rotunda is that they just had Free Mumia night and lots of rebel music. Contradictions within contradictions within conundrums. how is it a conundrum? participation in the public square isn't the same as ownership of the public square. DUDE! .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Converting wma to mp3
B Andersen wrote: Anyone have a suggestion for a freeware program that will convert wma to mp3? itunes .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Thanks for the emails, but really, all is well!
Glenn wrote: Ray, I'm glad you brought this up on the list. Even though you haven't let out your anger about this, you get real ad hominem attacks aimed at you by Tony frequently. I believe this double standard has become completely accepted here in what Craig called the UCD culture. yeah, plenty others here see this, too. .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Plumbing stolen
Bill Sanderson wrote: I've got a cast iron radiator sitting on my porch now. I won't miss it much,, but I'd rather choose the disposition myself. Any neighbor interested in a claw-foot tub in reasonably good condition, or the radiator, send me email? on a related note -- apparently, someone with a serious basket fetish has been donating to the second mile center -- check it out! .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. cobalt glass old skool phonepole insulators __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Schemers on the Schuylkill
Amara Rockar wrote: The mailing sticker rises again to be rehashed in the pages of CP http://www.citypaper.net/articles/2007/05/17/schemers-on-the-schuylkill yes, the article does sound like a rehash -- it actually repeats the very same speculations that were aired here on this list (the speculation about how the stickers are in reaction to a 40 year old marketing scheme, the speculation about how they must be the work of young activists who live in a kind of self-imposed temporary poverty.) still, it always cracks me up watching the lengths some will go to in order to explain away those little stickers! meanwhile, marketing is marketing, branding is branding, and some quiet little truth of the stickers' message has now been amplified, ironically, in giant painted letters above the walnut street bridge: a penn-branded message that links Penn with a tagline welcome to university city. as the author says, 'university city' IS a marketing scheme -- but he doesn't seem to appreciate that it's happening now, at the same time the stickers are appearing and ucd has claimed the leading role in developing, managing and expanding the university city brand. most of the article is spent trying to explain how the stickers are in pointless reaction to a 40-year old marketing scheme, to inevitable urban changes happening in many cities decades ago... but then again, the article is entitled, 'schemers on the schuylkill'... perhaps after all someone at city paper wants to remind us that we *should* be looking at that painted bridge, so close to the schuylkill? :-) .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. btw, does anyone know if the author of the cp article is the same andrew zitcer interviewed here?: http://www.upenn.edu/pennnews/current/2006/033006/staff.html You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Thanks for the emails, but really, all is well!
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thanks to Liz, Glenn and others for emails over the weekend concerning Liz's chiding about, and Glenn's parody of, my arrest story. I was as surprised as anyone else to see both their original posts, and their turnarounds. I am very much in favor of civility on the listserv. I too am in favor of civility on the listserv and have previously pointed out that ad hominem has no place in public discourse or rational debate. still, ad hominem hasn't gone away, and now we get to see yet another form of it: hand-picking which ad hominem messages are scolded and which ad hominem messages are allowed. YOU GO, AD HOMINEM! .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Penngemony takes over another soul...
Joe Clarke wrote: Sometimes when we attribute too much power to an entity, we succeed in giving it credit for manipulating everything. That's ideological thinking: seeing everything in terms of either for or against Penn interest. I don't think that they are that powerful. I'm no fan of Penn and have worked for them and with them - that is certain departments - but do not think that they engineer our elections. you raise some interesting questions. given that you don't think penn is that powerful, and that they don't engineer our elections, where would you draw the line, the line in our civic lives here in philly, where penn's power and influence aren't promoting penn's interests? at what level in city government/urban planning/business development etc. would you say penn's power and influence stops, ceases to have any effect? what are the mechanisms in place that provide a public check, or accountability, for penn's power? [open question] .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. where was that line drawn, say, when jannie blackwell and andy toy showed up at ucd's party for dock street, after ucd took sides in the re-zoning of the firehouse? You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Newspaper Endorsements ... Pay-To Say
S. Sharrieff Ali wrote: Newspapers should not support candidates, they should report the news and remain unbiased. So if the newspapers are advertising based, then how much do they charge for an endorsement? amazingly enough, penn dems and the dp endorse nutter: http://tinyurl.com/2bbplm http://tinyurl.com/yum6je .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Newspaper Endorsements ... Pay-To Say
Amara Rockar wrote: I think the goal of impartially is a noble one and something journalists should strive for. Does everyone always succeed? Nope. Some don't even try. But I think that writers serve their readers best when trying to cut through the spin, not creating spin of their own. haha-- I think writers serve their readers best when they dish out the news as straight up spin http://tinyurl.com/346smt http://tinyurl.com/33wzw4 .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Stop and Frisk
Joe Clarke wrote: I would have liked Michael Nutter to respond to his critics in the debate at WHYY that the primary rights to_ life, liberty_ and the pursuit of happiness are denied when your kids can't play in the street and where criminal (versus martial) law rules the neighborhood. yes, I thought that was a crucial moment that got lost in that debate -- poor marty m-c, trying to keep some sense of order among all those gents talking over one another! but, more importantly, what did that show us about the candidates, who cared less about the principles at stake and more about the winning sound bite? I, too, was disappointed in nutter at that moment, for failing to address the principle at stake (but maybe for reasons different than yours?) you concluded: Individual rights do not arise out of a vacuum, but are the privilege and product of a of a sane, responsive and just society that recognizes the legitimate limits of individual political rights against the complex and diverse demands of the greater good, which has the protection of everyone's rights to these same privileges. I think framing the question as 'individual' 'political' rights vs 'societal' 'greater good' rights is misleading. an individual's right to equality under the law is fundamental and needs protection -- precisely because we ARE a group, a society, that creates and applies these laws. it's like what al is always quoting (ben franklin?): those who would sacrifice liberty for security deserve neither or something like that. also, something glenn said in an earlier post rocked: I would say our society forms policies driven by anger and too many of us have lost commitment to principals, which were supposedly treasured in our American myth. We have gotten so utilitarian that we've also lost our compassion. I would say that we have gotten so consumerist that we've lost our citizenship. ends justify means, outcomes trump process, competition beats cooperation... over and over again we (and our leaders) fail to ensure that those with the most access to power (however you want to define that) have the most responsibility to those who have the least. and that's a concept far older, and deeper, and universal, it seems to me, than franklin or monarchs, than the church of england or the u.s. bill of rights. and it seems to me our not respecting that concept is what gets us into our present difficulties in the first place. anyway, I've been seeing a lot of bob brady signs out and about. what do people here think of him? [I have no opinion] .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: Fwd: [UC] Explaining Sub prime lending : Kudos to my colleagues, competition, local Lenders and PENN
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I disagree that we have dodged the fallout from subprime lending tactics by lenders. I agree. I think everyone ends up getting bumped -- by the same dominos we said were moving our collective lots along when things were falling the other way, right? .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Graffiti? Not so much.
Lewis Mellman wrote: On a related monkey warfare note: some jerk is defacing the above-mentioned bumper stickers. She is slicing them diagonally so that two new bumper stickers, better than the old one, are created. One reads, This is University City and the other West Philly is a marketing ploy. Some people think they're so clever. haha -- apparently, she hasn't thought this through http://tinyurl.com/3xata8 .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. yes, it's the csx railway: http://tinyurl.com/39j77f __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] sewer closed, for now
Lewis Mellman wrote: Subscribed to does not imply monitors, so it's a good idea to directly contact someone if you want to maximize the chance that they receive vital information. I'd be impressed if anyone can find time to read every reply to every post on the LipServ, even not including Liz's. The thought that some of y'all can actually read every post boggles my mind. -Lew (easily impressed and boggled) well, the good news is that john has assured me by email that he does indeed monitor the list for safety and security issues. and if you think about it, lew (since you were cc'd as well), a subscriber in john's position couldn't very well do but just that! :-) .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] the _new_ new voice of the anti-gentrification movement
Kyle Cassidy wrote: Some of you may have noticed that the rhetoric has been ratcheted up a notch and someone has spraypainted F**K Penn! Rich Boys Go Home! on the back of the Supreme and a couple of houses on Walnut street, signing it unholy wolves -- Someone on Phillyblog found out the taggers have a myspace page: http://www.myspace.com/unholywolvesrip Thats viral marketing. apparently, some roving bands of anti-marketing ne'er-do-wells have responded in kind, with painted graffiti on the csx railway: http://tinyurl.com/2cu6aw .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] important question about free speech rally
Mike V. wrote: Well, in case the irony was lost on you, you made a spelling error while accusing someone else of being dim. you know what this town needs? a child in a well. http://www.theonion.com/content/node/34040 What This Town Needs Is A Child In A Well By Janet Casey It seems like every house in this town has a fence, every door a lock. Our next-door neighbors have become strangers. We've lost touch with our friends. Our community's streets are safer than ever, but its residents have become isolated. We desperately need something to strengthen the common bonds that have weakened over time. If you ask me, what this town needs is a child in a well [cont'd] .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Bob Brady Supported by Bored Carpenters - Political Ads OK?
to reduce gun violence. We are overdue for these and, truth be told, we are far behind other cities in having such programs in place. Our current NIH-funded studies of gun violence in Philadelphia are specifically designed to test the competing effects of many of the environmental factors I just mentioned. Stay tuned for our first research papers and reports to the City of Philadelphia in the next several months. Originally published April 26, 2007. .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Bag Snatchers, Bottom Smackers
Kyle Cassidy wrote: I don't know if this means that I get out a lot more than Ray or if I'm just a better story teller it might just mean that any of us can dial the stories up or down however we like: ie, not quite scary enough for anyone to actually move out or take responsibility, but just scary enough to feed the notion that we need ucd. :-) .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] plethora of smashed car windows this morning
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Sounds more like some frat boys running amuck to me. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At 45th Walnut? I seriously doubt it. Or, was that remark some attempt at humor that goes over the heads of us curmudgeons? I bet it was one of them rapscalliony trustifarians who go around using words like plethora and amuck and carmudgeon but won't admit it. http://tinyurl.com/2qngho .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Bag Snatchers, Bottom Smackers
Kyle Cassidy wrote: i saw a car driving up walnut street at about 44th honk at a guy in a red jacket crossing the street then, as the car drove past, the driver stuck his (or her) arm out and smacked the guy on the posterior at about 35mph. dude in the red sweater seemed really suprised. Kyle Cassidy wrote: I was just walking along Farragut street and noticed a bunch of Bob Brady for Mayor signs affixed to trees along the street -- with three inch drywall screws. Kyle Cassidy wrote: One winter about five years ago I was walking down Walnut at about 12th when a sheet of ice that probably weighed fifty pounds fell from one of those 13 story center city skyscrapers and smashed onto the sidewalk about 15 feet in front of me Kyle Cassidy wrote: I took a walk over to Liz Campion's house this morning and in the ten or so blocks that seperate our houses, I saw six smashed out car windows. this evening I was passing by the green line cafe and I saw a middle aged couple stirring their extra shot mocha macchiatos. glaring over their bifocals and pursing their lips, they were. .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Trees on 4500 Walnut Street (brushes with death)
S. Sharrieff Ali wrote: I had an incident a few years ago with a neighbor’s tree he cemented around the base, the tree later fell and destroyed my fence! Anthony West wrote: One day I was was walking along Baltimore Avenue in Clark Park when -- wham! I turned around and saw a huge tree branch from an ageing London plane, as thick as a human body, had crashed down on the sidewalk. Kyle Cassidy wrote: One winter about five years ago I was walking down Walnut at about 12th when a sheet of ice that probably weighed fifty pounds fell from one of those 13 story center city skyscrapers and smashed onto the sidewalk Margie Politzer wrote: Hello, Can anyone recommend a carpenter to build a roof deck? :-) .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. __ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email __ You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
Re: [UC] Trees on 4500 Walnut Street
Mike VanHelder wrote: I think it far more likely that the guys that did the sidewalk simply chopped through all of the tree roots on that side of the tree, thus destabilizing them and making them helpless to resist the high winds of the storm. This theory is supported by the fact that when the trees fell, the roots that came up out of the ground on that side showed signs of cutting, not tearing or snapping. Also, the workers were seen by several local residents cutting through the trees, and when one raised a stability concern, the (presumed) foreman just shrugged it off. yes, I heard this same explanation. a contributing factor may also be that this type of pear tree (bradford pear?) can get 'top-heavy' -- all their branches tend to grow out from a single point on the trunk (like an upside down broom) unless judiciously pruned... you can see what I mean in kyle's photo: http://www.asc.upenn.edu/usr/cassidy/pix/2007/2007%2D04%2D16%2Dtrees/2.html I've seen these same trees become split down the middle after a summer storm... here's more info about these trees, why they're popular in urban settings but also why they're risky: http://www.scnps.org/articles/pears.html http://www.emmitsburg.net/gardens/articles/frederick/2002/bradford_pears.htm http://www.aces.edu/dept/extcomm/newspaper/may10b01.html .. UNIVERSITY*CITOYEN [aka laserbeam®] [aka ray] SERIAL LIAR. CALL FOR RATES. still, I am fond of these pear trees, because they blossom right around my birthday... You are receiving this because you are subscribed to the list named UnivCity. To unsubscribe or for archive information, see http://www.purple.com/list.html.
