RE: (313) technology
as always Tristan you really do have a nice way with words :)Thanks man! and thanks for all that came and made it a great nite! We will be back on a Fri/Sat in another 3 months so look out.. Cheers Ian -Original Message- From: Phonopsia [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 26 June 2003 03:48 To: 313 Subject: (313) technology Ian Cheshire AKA Kube 72's party tonight was nice! The 1965 sunlamp lights on parts the dancefloor were a bit too Piccadilly Circus for the headz, but all else was great. Chris Finke played a load of acid (including Maurice's 'This is Acid'), a bit of uptempo house and even Altered States (which always rocks me). Ian played a broad selection of deeper and harder uptempo techno while tagteaming with Taurus. I sort of wish he had a chance to go off on his own, but he has an uncanny way of 'claiming' the mix as soon as he goes on, so it didn't feel disjointed in any way. Ian is an immense presence on the turntables. I can't wait to see him again, and if his tour stops through your villa I highly recommend you pay him a visit. He can really do some damage. Tristan === Text/Mixes: http://www.phonopsia.co.uk Music: http://www.mp313.com Contact: [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.489 / Virus Database: 288 - Release Date: 10/06/03 --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.489 / Virus Database: 288 - Release Date: 10/06/03
RE: (313) Technology Nite
if you can makle I'll get me coat ;0) -Original Message- From: ian cheshire [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 05 June 2003 23:29 To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: (313) Technology Nite Hi all UK 313ers, if you can makle this it would be nice to see you all again after the Bleep43 party on Sat :0) www.technologylondon.co.uk Cheers Ian --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.476 / Virus Database: 273 - Release Date: 24/04/03 --- Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.476 / Virus Database: 273 - Release Date: 24/04/03 --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.476 / Virus Database: 273 - Release Date: 24/04/03
RE: [313] technology vs. art
CONGRADULATIONS! you just made me feel stupid. didn't Mr. Kasparov beat the computer in the second round, or is that just a myth? if technology is art, then why are people shelling out tons of cash for a painting by a monkey??? the way i look at it is, ahhmmm, one persons trash is another persons treasure. there is no sense arguing what art is, because some one out there thinks that the george forman grill is a work of art (especailly them new colored ones that look like an iMac). It is all in the eye of the beholder. peace out jeff -Original Message- From: Mike Taylor [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, November 02, 2001 11:22 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: [313] technology vs. art Hello, Admirers of the human brain were disappointed when for the first timea computer beat a human (chess champion Gary Kasparov). But the largeand powerful machine can do nothing else - well, this is an interesting concept. Deep Blue was IBM's chess project that defeated Kasparov in 1997. The way Deep Blue was set up was to use a thing called a recursive algorithm which is a fancy term for a set of rules that considers every potential permutation in a given situation. Furthermore, it also used an algorithm that considered whether a particular branch of decisions were worth considering. Even though electrical circuits sent information at the speed of light, rather than the app. 670mph that our actual neural impulses travel at, there are still a limited number of clock cycles that Deep Blue had available at its disposal for each turn. The interesting issue that this raises is that a human has so much less raw processing power for a recursive process that it uses pattern recognition from previous experience to play the game, whereas Deep Blue actually considered every aspect of the game at that moment in real time. So who was really thinking? Kasparov using the stored processing cycles of memory through pattern recognition, or Deep Blue with a recursive algorithm working the process on the spot? Furthermore, Why would the admirers of the human brain be disappointed? The best AI research is based on concepts found in the best processor that natural evolution could come up with. Deep Blue, and all other AI works on the principles of the human mind. I think what people find disturbing is that perhaps we are not the End All-Be All center of the universe, but just another rung in the evolutionary ladder. Guess what people, Homo Sapiens only have a century or two left until we become a memory. We have had creativity and technology locked down for a couple hundred millennia, but that time will come to an end in less than 2 decades. it's programmed to examinemillions of possible moves methodically and at great speed,calculating without any 'feeling' for what might be good or exciting.Even the smartest of today's computers are pretty dumb. they are based on the same concepts our minds are based on. The difference is that computers still do not have the raw processing power and memory that we do. Give the computer another 20 years and we will see how smart humans really are. But, as Marvin Minsky said, Deep Blue might have beat Gary Kasparov, but Deep Blue still wouldn't know that it should come in from the rain. The machine, the program, explores all the options, all of them exhaustively, without any insight, and then picks the one that's best in that investigation, computers have not yet to demonstrate true artificial intelligence. what is intelligence? What is insight? What is consciousness? I think they are emergent properties of the computing system we keep in our noggins. You consider what Marvin Minsky had to say about the human mind in Society Of Mind, he basically stated that we are just a large collection of _Very_ simple processes that synergistically form into what we consider consciousness. We are just a vast hierarchal arrangement of relatively dumb neural-nets. The difference is that the section of that hierarchy that we consider ourselves(the conscious mind) really does not have access to the very bottom end of the hierarchy of our minds. Think about what it takes to pick up a ball. There is the physical end, using each finger, using your elbow, your shoulder, your waist... then there is the perceptual end, looking at the ball, organizing all the information from the senses into a coherent mental framework that the mind can use to make evaluations of its situation in the external world. If you think about it, that is a massively complex project. yes a 2 year old can do this, but how complex is that toddlers mind? Every aspect of the process of picking up that ball that I just described can be sub-divided into a thousand smaller sub processes, which can again be sub-divided. Do
RE: [313] technology vs. art
humans are slow and briliant, machines are stupid and fast, together they can achieve great things... Albert Einstein (well... it's not exactly that way, but that's the point :P) CONGRADULATIONS! you just made me feel stupid. didn't Mr. Kasparov beat the computer in the second round, or is that just a myth? if technology is art, then why are people shelling out tons of cash for a painting by a monkey??? the way i look at it is, ahhmmm, one persons trash is another persons treasure. there is no sense arguing what art is, because some one out there thinks that the george forman grill is a work of art (especailly them new colored ones that look like an iMac). It is all in - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[313] Way OT Re: [313] technology vs. art
From the people I have spoken with who have them, the sound quality is about the same as a telephone call. It is a bit tinny, but the technology can only improve. When Direct Neural Interfaces enter the market, then you will see a sharp increase in the quality of these products. One of the benefits of having an aging population in the west is that there is going to be a massive amount of funding for projects like this. The idea of imparting hearing through the electrical stimulation of the nerves between the hearing canal and the brain still blows my mind. Again, the choice between profound deafness and a tinny sound seems an easy choice to me. The more I think about it, the only possible worse form of sense disability would be the lack of touch. And technically, your question about music access is already available. With current Cochlear technology and a wireless data connection, you could literally access your entire digital music collection, pull a song out of the aether, and listen to it through your implants. In 10 years it will be likely that you will not actually own a physical music collection(unless you are a specialist vinyl collector), and you will be able to access it anywhere in a metropolitan area via a wireless citywide LAN. In 25 years you will probably have cochlear implants or a decendant of the concept just as a matter of convienience. Why carry a cell phone or a MP3 player when you can just stream everything into your implant. News, Sports, Weather, anything you need will be available directly through neuro-implants. Anyway, Tristan, after the beating anyone involved with dance music has given their ears over the years, I imagine anything will sound better than our regular hearing in 2025. I will be 48, and you will be 51 I believe. ;) Take care, Mike From: Phonopsia [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mike Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] CC: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: [313] technology vs. art Date: Sat, 03 Nov 2001 09:37:40 -0500 - Original Message - From: Mike Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org Sent: Saturday, November 03, 2001 2:22 AM Subject: Re: [313] technology vs. art Do you want to die of a heart attack when you can have a replacement grown, or have a mechanical one installed? Do you want to be deaf when you can have cochlear implants(which are on the market today)? Will techno sound better through cochlear implants, and is there any way we can download music to them? Tristan -- http://ampcast.com/phonopsia - Music http://phonopsia.tripod.com - Mixes, pics, thought, travelogue info http://www.metatrackstudios.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] - email FrogboyMCI - AOL Instant Messenger _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [313] technology vs. art
a table so they're mixed into a big pile. Now, pick out allthe green objects, followed by red, blue and so on. Then sort thepiles into different objects. Pretty easy, wasn't it? it would not be very hard for 1000 1.4 ghz athlons working simultaneously with a years worth of training neural-nets through an evolutionary development algorithm either. It took about 4 billion years for the hominids to show up through natural evolution. It has been less than 2 centuries since Babbage started developing the Analytical Engine. Computer processing power doubles every 18 months, we have been standing still for about 200,000 years. We might still have the edge, but only for another 20 years or so. If you've got a very young brother or sister who's only three years old, they'd probably be able to do it, too. But the most sophisticated computers have trouble completing this task. There are so many requirements that need to be explained for visual recognition to work with artificial intelligence. Technology affects the way we think about everything from the environment and nuclear weapons to ethnicity, working conditions andimmigration, Its a cultural and historical framework that has profoundly shaped how we live and think of ourselves, our notions ofright and wrong, whats possible and impossible. It affects us in ways we cant even begin to articulate. I think that when computers manage to make social interaction with humans, they would be like a super pet. That would be one thing thatwould be very exciting. give them time, they will pass the Turing Test. They will be a hell of a lot more interesting than that Sony Robot Dog... :) who really counts more nowadays THE MAN or THE MACHINE what is the difference? Anybody who owns a pair of reading glasses is a Cyborg by the true definition of the word. I think this whole man-machine thing is a total false dialectic. We are our technology, and our technology is us. We are only going to become more interconnected with technology, and who could blame us? Do you want to die of a heart attack when you can have a replacement grown, or have a mechanical one installed? Do you want to be deaf when you can have cochlear implants(which are on the market today)? Do you want to be wheelchair bound when you can have mechanical legs? It might see weird to us in the same way TV and the Telephone seemed weird to our great-grandparents. But in 50 years it will be as normal as a heart-bypass operation or anti-biotics. Our machines will be thinking, that is one thing you can count on. To answer that unless a machine thinks: THE MAN, or rather HUMAN. And no, we have no technology in my country but we still make some gorgeous ART, that people still envies us 'till today. And yes, there will be machine art. In a couple decades it will be indistinguishable from human art. The central driving force in the universe will always be soul(will). Our machines will have soul one day, one day our machines will be indistinguishable from ourselves. the bottom line is: Technology is Art. Take care, mt From: laura gavoor [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: [313] technology vs. art Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2001 18:19:13 In the very same mindset -Jimi Hendrix re-wired and re-thought how to record his music so he could get his guitar to sound like the music that was in his head. -Similarly the Detroit boyz took traditional gear and re-wired/re-thought it to develop the early tech soundz that kick-started (more or less) a musical revolution. Let's pose this as a question cuz I'm interested in peeps thoughts: A. Will ever-elevating recording technology equally elevate imagination or have the opposite effect...or both?? B. If bothhow then does one gage or distinguish true musicianship and talent from creativity/imagination/uniqueness in composition?? I know this is a chicken / egg paradoxical type question, but as an older soul I'm finding less imagination in the place of technological brilliancewho really counts more nowadays THE MAN or THE MACHINE I imagine that facile people will always make relatively facile music and conversely us weirdo complicated folks will forever push the envelope to express human ponderings and intricacies in ways that have heretofore never been expressed. What do you all tink??? From: Rusty Blasco [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: [313] technology vs. art Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2001 08:32:36 -0500 Regarding technology (no matter the level of intricacy), here's what my trumpet professor told me about musicianship. After listening to me labor painfully through a difficult passage in a piece of music, he would stop me (probably for the sake of his sensitive ears) and make me aware of the trumpet. While holding it up, turning it, and knocking on the bell, the man explained to me that the trumpet is merely a thing
Re: [313] technology vs. art
- Original Message - From: Mike Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org Sent: Saturday, November 03, 2001 2:22 AM Subject: Re: [313] technology vs. art Do you want to die of a heart attack when you can have a replacement grown, or have a mechanical one installed? Do you want to be deaf when you can have cochlear implants(which are on the market today)? Will techno sound better through cochlear implants, and is there any way we can download music to them? Tristan -- http://ampcast.com/phonopsia - Music http://phonopsia.tripod.com - Mixes, pics, thought, travelogue info http://www.metatrackstudios.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] - email FrogboyMCI - AOL Instant Messenger - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [313] technology vs. art
Speak of the devilits already startin'. The Humanoid Robot: ASIMO http://world.honda.com/ASIMO/ Glyph xx xx wrote: The picture of changes: The art of the demonstration The time of untruth and the space of events Idea of the name and the unconscious of personality System of the body and the energy of age Quality of air and the ignorance of order Process of work and the logic of the number Profession of force and error and mistake Feeling of reality and the habit of communication Closeness of the poles and the image of the archetype Shape of the line and the imprecision of drawing Type of the screen black-white and colour Background of presentation and the repetition of the presentation Abnormality of voice and the script of sound Essence of language and the skill of speaking Point of motion and the genesis of folklore Theory of origin and the origin of theory Cause of effect and the abstraction of the abstract Admirers of the human brain were disappointed when for the first time a computer beat a human (chess champion Gary Kasparov). But the large and powerful machine can do nothing else - it's programmed to examine millions of possible moves methodically and at great speed, calculating without any 'feeling' for what might be good or exciting. Even the smartest of today's computers are pretty dumb. The machine, the program, explores all the options, all of them exhaustively, without any insight, and then picks the one that's best in that investigation, computers have not yet to demonstrate true artificial intelligence. This experiment will show you have a far superior brain to a computer. All you need is a bag of coloured sweets (such as M Ms), some coloured pens and pencils, and some coloured beads. Spread all these things out a table so they're mixed into a big pile. Now, pick out all the green objects, followed by red, blue and so on. Then sort the piles into different objects. Pretty easy, wasn't it? If you've got a very young brother or sister who's only three years old, they'd probably be able to do it, too. But the most sophisticated computers have trouble completing this task. There are so many requirements that need to be explained for visual recognition to work with artificial intelligence. Technology affects the way we think about everything from the environment and nuclear weapons to ethnicity, working conditions and immigration, It#8217;s a cultural and historical framework that has profoundly shaped how we live and think of ourselves, our notions of right and wrong, what#8217;s possible and impossible. It affects us in ways we can#8217;t even begin to articulate. I think that when computers manage to make social interaction with humans, they would be like a super pet. That would be one thing that would be very exciting. who really counts more nowadays THE MAN or THE MACHINE To answer that unless a machine thinks: THE MAN, or rather HUMAN. And no, we have no technology in my country but we still make some gorgeous ART, that people still envies us 'till today. From: laura gavoor [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: [313] technology vs. art Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2001 18:19:13 In the very same mindset -Jimi Hendrix re-wired and re-thought how to record his music so he could get his guitar to sound like the music that was in his head. -Similarly the Detroit boyz took traditional gear and re-wired/re-thought it to develop the early tech soundz that kick-started (more or less) a musical revolution. Let's pose this as a question cuz I'm interested in peeps thoughts: A. Will ever-elevating recording technology equally elevate imagination or have the opposite effect...or both?? B. If bothhow then does one gage or distinguish true musicianship and talent from creativity/imagination/uniqueness in composition?? I know this is a chicken / egg paradoxical type question, but as an older soul I'm finding less imagination in the place of technological brilliancewho really counts more nowadays THE MAN or THE MACHINE I imagine that facile people will always make relatively facile music and conversely us weirdo complicated folks will forever push the envelope to express human ponderings and intricacies in ways that have heretofore never been expressed. What do you all tink??? From: Rusty Blasco [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: [313] technology vs. art Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2001 08:32:36 -0500 Regarding technology (no matter the level of intricacy), here's what my trumpet professor told me about musicianship. After listening to me labor painfully through a difficult passage in a piece of music, he would stop me (probably for the sake of his sensitive ears) and make me aware of the trumpet. While holding it up, turning it, and knocking on the bell, the man explained to me that the trumpet is merely a thing of brass, incapable
Re: [313] technology vs. art
Oh yeah, they've been working on that for a while. I just watched the show on PBS last night in fact that featured this little (and I do mean little) guy. It was about robots and humans, very interesting and entertaining. Wish I video taped it. Carl Craig would be very interested in this as I've heard he's fascinated by the point where human and android/robot merge. MEK From: Glyph1001 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: [313] technology vs. art Date: Thu, 01 Nov 2001 03:33:56 -0500 Speak of the devilits already startin'. The Humanoid Robot: ASIMO http://world.honda.com/ASIMO/ Glyph xx xx wrote: The picture of changes: The art of the demonstration The time of untruth and the space of events Idea of the name and the unconscious of personality System of the body and the energy of age Quality of air and the ignorance of order Process of work and the logic of the number Profession of force and error and mistake Feeling of reality and the habit of communication Closeness of the poles and the image of the archetype Shape of the line and the imprecision of drawing Type of the screen black-white and colour Background of presentation and the repetition of the presentation Abnormality of voice and the script of sound Essence of language and the skill of speaking Point of motion and the genesis of folklore Theory of origin and the origin of theory Cause of effect and the abstraction of the abstract Admirers of the human brain were disappointed when for the first time a computer beat a human (chess champion Gary Kasparov). But the large and powerful machine can do nothing else - it's programmed to examine millions of possible moves methodically and at great speed, calculating without any 'feeling' for what might be good or exciting. Even the smartest of today's computers are pretty dumb. The machine, the program, explores all the options, all of them exhaustively, without any insight, and then picks the one that's best in that investigation, computers have not yet to demonstrate true artificial intelligence. This experiment will show you have a far superior brain to a computer. All you need is a bag of coloured sweets (such as M Ms), some coloured pens and pencils, and some coloured beads. Spread all these things out a table so they're mixed into a big pile. Now, pick out all the green objects, followed by red, blue and so on. Then sort the piles into different objects. Pretty easy, wasn't it? If you've got a very young brother or sister who's only three years old, they'd probably be able to do it, too. But the most sophisticated computers have trouble completing this task. There are so many requirements that need to be explained for visual recognition to work with artificial intelligence. Technology affects the way we think about everything from the environment and nuclear weapons to ethnicity, working conditions and immigration, Its a cultural and historical framework that has profoundly shaped how we live and think of ourselves, our notions of right and wrong, whats possible and impossible. It affects us in ways we cant even begin to articulate. I think that when computers manage to make social interaction with humans, they would be like a super pet. That would be one thing that would be very exciting. who really counts more nowadays THE MAN or THE MACHINE To answer that unless a machine thinks: THE MAN, or rather HUMAN. And no, we have no technology in my country but we still make some gorgeous ART, that people still envies us 'till today. From: laura gavoor [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: [313] technology vs. art Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2001 18:19:13 In the very same mindset -Jimi Hendrix re-wired and re-thought how to record his music so he could get his guitar to sound like the music that was in his head. -Similarly the Detroit boyz took traditional gear and re-wired/re-thought it to develop the early tech soundz that kick-started (more or less) a musical revolution. Let's pose this as a question cuz I'm interested in peeps thoughts: A. Will ever-elevating recording technology equally elevate imagination or have the opposite effect...or both?? B. If bothhow then does one gage or distinguish true musicianship and talent from creativity/imagination/uniqueness in composition?? I know this is a chicken / egg paradoxical type question, but as an older soul I'm finding less imagination in the place of technological brilliancewho really counts more nowadays THE MAN or THE MACHINE I imagine that facile people will always make relatively facile music and conversely us weirdo complicated folks will forever push the envelope to express human ponderings and intricacies in ways that have heretofore never been expressed. What do you all tink??? From: Rusty Blasco [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: [313] technology vs. art Date: Wed, 31
Re: [313] technology vs. art
What is interesting is this, the name- ASIMO - Asimov as in Isaac... the guy who wrote I, Robot in which Asimov created the Three Laws of Robotics which is a Ten Commandments, as such, of robot behaviour (thou shalt not cause harm to the creators ie. humans, etc.) I know that ASIMO is supposed to stand to Advanced Step in Innovative Mobility but the coincidence is startling. MEK From: Glyph1001 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: [313] technology vs. art Date: Thu, 01 Nov 2001 03:33:56 -0500 Speak of the devilits already startin'. The Humanoid Robot: ASIMO http://world.honda.com/ASIMO/ Glyph xx xx wrote: The picture of changes: The art of the demonstration The time of untruth and the space of events Idea of the name and the unconscious of personality System of the body and the energy of age Quality of air and the ignorance of order Process of work and the logic of the number Profession of force and error and mistake Feeling of reality and the habit of communication Closeness of the poles and the image of the archetype Shape of the line and the imprecision of drawing Type of the screen black-white and colour Background of presentation and the repetition of the presentation Abnormality of voice and the script of sound Essence of language and the skill of speaking Point of motion and the genesis of folklore Theory of origin and the origin of theory Cause of effect and the abstraction of the abstract Admirers of the human brain were disappointed when for the first time a computer beat a human (chess champion Gary Kasparov). But the large and powerful machine can do nothing else - it's programmed to examine millions of possible moves methodically and at great speed, calculating without any 'feeling' for what might be good or exciting. Even the smartest of today's computers are pretty dumb. The machine, the program, explores all the options, all of them exhaustively, without any insight, and then picks the one that's best in that investigation, computers have not yet to demonstrate true artificial intelligence. This experiment will show you have a far superior brain to a computer. All you need is a bag of coloured sweets (such as M Ms), some coloured pens and pencils, and some coloured beads. Spread all these things out a table so they're mixed into a big pile. Now, pick out all the green objects, followed by red, blue and so on. Then sort the piles into different objects. Pretty easy, wasn't it? If you've got a very young brother or sister who's only three years old, they'd probably be able to do it, too. But the most sophisticated computers have trouble completing this task. There are so many requirements that need to be explained for visual recognition to work with artificial intelligence. Technology affects the way we think about everything from the environment and nuclear weapons to ethnicity, working conditions and immigration, Its a cultural and historical framework that has profoundly shaped how we live and think of ourselves, our notions of right and wrong, whats possible and impossible. It affects us in ways we cant even begin to articulate. I think that when computers manage to make social interaction with humans, they would be like a super pet. That would be one thing that would be very exciting. who really counts more nowadays THE MAN or THE MACHINE To answer that unless a machine thinks: THE MAN, or rather HUMAN. And no, we have no technology in my country but we still make some gorgeous ART, that people still envies us 'till today. From: laura gavoor [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: [313] technology vs. art Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2001 18:19:13 In the very same mindset -Jimi Hendrix re-wired and re-thought how to record his music so he could get his guitar to sound like the music that was in his head. -Similarly the Detroit boyz took traditional gear and re-wired/re-thought it to develop the early tech soundz that kick-started (more or less) a musical revolution. Let's pose this as a question cuz I'm interested in peeps thoughts: A. Will ever-elevating recording technology equally elevate imagination or have the opposite effect...or both?? B. If bothhow then does one gage or distinguish true musicianship and talent from creativity/imagination/uniqueness in composition?? I know this is a chicken / egg paradoxical type question, but as an older soul I'm finding less imagination in the place of technological brilliancewho really counts more nowadays THE MAN or THE MACHINE I imagine that facile people will always make relatively facile music and conversely us weirdo complicated folks will forever push the envelope to express human ponderings and intricacies in ways that have heretofore never been expressed. What do you all tink??? From: Rusty Blasco [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: [313] technology vs. art
Re: [313] technology vs. art
The picture of changes: The art of the demonstration The time of untruth and the space of events Idea of the name and the unconscious of personality System of the body and the energy of age Quality of air and the ignorance of order Process of work and the logic of the number Profession of force and error and mistake Feeling of reality and the habit of communication Closeness of the poles and the image of the archetype Shape of the line and the imprecision of drawing Type of the screen black-white and colour Background of presentation and the repetition of the presentation Abnormality of voice and the script of sound Essence of language and the skill of speaking Point of motion and the genesis of folklore Theory of origin and the origin of theory Cause of effect and the abstraction of the abstract Admirers of the human brain were disappointed when for the first time a computer beat a human (chess champion Gary Kasparov). But the large and powerful machine can do nothing else - it's programmed to examine millions of possible moves methodically and at great speed, calculating without any 'feeling' for what might be good or exciting. Even the smartest of today's computers are pretty dumb. The machine, the program, explores all the options, all of them exhaustively, without any insight, and then picks the one that's best in that investigation, computers have not yet to demonstrate true artificial intelligence. This experiment will show you have a far superior brain to a computer. All you need is a bag of coloured sweets (such as M Ms), some coloured pens and pencils, and some coloured beads. Spread all these things out a table so they're mixed into a big pile. Now, pick out all the green objects, followed by red, blue and so on. Then sort the piles into different objects. Pretty easy, wasn't it? If you've got a very young brother or sister who's only three years old, they'd probably be able to do it, too. But the most sophisticated computers have trouble completing this task. There are so many requirements that need to be explained for visual recognition to work with artificial intelligence. Technology affects the way we think about everything from the environment and nuclear weapons to ethnicity, working conditions and immigration, It#8217;s a cultural and historical framework that has profoundly shaped how we live and think of ourselves, our notions of right and wrong, what#8217;s possible and impossible. It affects us in ways we can#8217;t even begin to articulate. I think that when computers manage to make social interaction with humans, they would be like a super pet. That would be one thing that would be very exciting. who really counts more nowadays THE MAN or THE MACHINE To answer that unless a machine thinks: THE MAN, or rather HUMAN. And no, we have no technology in my country but we still make some gorgeous ART, that people still envies us 'till today. From: laura gavoor [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: [313] technology vs. art Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2001 18:19:13 In the very same mindset -Jimi Hendrix re-wired and re-thought how to record his music so he could get his guitar to sound like the music that was in his head. -Similarly the Detroit boyz took traditional gear and re-wired/re-thought it to develop the early tech soundz that kick-started (more or less) a musical revolution. Let's pose this as a question cuz I'm interested in peeps thoughts: A. Will ever-elevating recording technology equally elevate imagination or have the opposite effect...or both?? B. If bothhow then does one gage or distinguish true musicianship and talent from creativity/imagination/uniqueness in composition?? I know this is a chicken / egg paradoxical type question, but as an older soul I'm finding less imagination in the place of technological brilliancewho really counts more nowadays THE MAN or THE MACHINE I imagine that facile people will always make relatively facile music and conversely us weirdo complicated folks will forever push the envelope to express human ponderings and intricacies in ways that have heretofore never been expressed. What do you all tink??? From: Rusty Blasco [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: [313] technology vs. art Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2001 08:32:36 -0500 Regarding technology (no matter the level of intricacy), here's what my trumpet professor told me about musicianship. After listening to me labor painfully through a difficult passage in a piece of music, he would stop me (probably for the sake of his sensitive ears) and make me aware of the trumpet. While holding it up, turning it, and knocking on the bell, the man explained to me that the trumpet is merely a thing of brass, incapable of producing music without assistance (in this case, the air of a human's pursed and buzzing lips). The music is in your head, he stated, pointing
Re: [313] technology vs. art
Ken Ishii flipped the on/off switch on his Korg repeatedly until it started making weird noises... then he used it that way to make Jelly Tones From: James Bucknell [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: laura gavoor [EMAIL PROTECTED] CC: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: [313] technology vs. art Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2001 13:27:23 -0500 you're finding less imagination? 'acid trax' was made by pulling the baterries out of the 303 and slamming them back in quickly when they couldn't work out how to program it. james www.jbucknell.com laura gavoor [EMAIL PROTECTED] on 10/31/2001 01:19:13 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], 313@hyperreal.org cc:(bcc: James Bucknell/Magazines/Hearst) Subject: Re: [313] technology vs. art In the very same mindset -Jimi Hendrix re-wired and re-thought how to record his music so he could get his guitar to sound like the music that was in his head. -Similarly the Detroit boyz took traditional gear and re-wired/re-thought it to develop the early tech soundz that kick-started (more or less) a musical revolution. Let's pose this as a question cuz I'm interested in peeps thoughts: A. Will ever-elevating recording technology equally elevate imagination or have the opposite effect...or both?? B. If bothhow then does one gage or distinguish true musicianship and talent from creativity/imagination/uniqueness in composition?? I know this is a chicken / egg paradoxical type question, but as an older soul I'm finding less imagination in the place of technological brilliancewho really counts more nowadays THE MAN or THE MACHINE I imagine that facile people will always make relatively facile music and conversely us weirdo complicated folks will forever push the envelope to express human ponderings and intricacies in ways that have heretofore never been expressed. What do you all tink??? From: Rusty Blasco [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: [313] technology vs. art Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2001 08:32:36 -0500 Regarding technology (no matter the level of intricacy), here's what my trumpet professor told me about musicianship. After listening to me labor painfully through a difficult passage in a piece of music, he would stop me (probably for the sake of his sensitive ears) and make me aware of the trumpet. While holding it up, turning it, and knocking on the bell, the man explained to me that the trumpet is merely a thing of brass, incapable of producing music without assistance (in this case, the air of a human's pursed and buzzing lips). The music is in your head, he stated, pointing to his noggin. If you can't hear it, and performed flawlessly, in your own mind, than you can't expect it to come out of the instrument. Maybe this will offer some much needed elucidation. Rusty _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [313] technology vs. art
At 18:19 31/10/2001 +, laura gavoor wrote: Let's pose this as a question cuz I'm interested in peeps thoughts: A. Will ever-elevating recording technology equally elevate imagination or have the opposite effect...or both?? B. If bothhow then does one gage or distinguish true musicianship and talent from creativity/imagination/uniqueness in composition?? People had this same argument when word processors and then software on computers were coming into form. I don't see a sudden emergence of new Hemmingways, but I also don't see a dead spot in literature. It's just different tools with the times. -- fix.er \'fik-s*r\ n : one that fixes : as : one that intervenes to enable a person to circumvent the law or obtain a political favor : one that adjusts matters or disputes by negotiation - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [313] technology vs. art
| -Original Message- | From: laura gavoor [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] | Sent: Wednesday, October 31, 2001 6:19 PM | | A. Will ever-elevating recording technology equally elevate | imagination or have the opposite effect...or both?? Both, I reckon. The leap of imagination that was Acid Trax back in the day is much easier for people to achieve now. Some would say that elevating recording technology cheapens that sort of imagination, but it actually doesn't - it just raises the stakes. Easier to express imagination at a more basic or easy level, but harder to produce something so imaginative it stands out from the burgeoning crowd of Pierre-clones... | B. If bothhow then does one gage or distinguish true | musicianship and talent from creativity/imagination/ | uniqueness in composition?? Musicianship is a bit of an odd term; a lot of the music discussed on this list isn't the product of musicianship as such, more the creativity/imagination/uniqueness you mention. People who are skilled at musicianship will be as easy to spot as always, but (and I might be being a bit heretical here) the role of the pure musician (ie, no composing, just playing) will continue to become more like that of the calligrapher today. On the other hand, new forms of musicianship come with new instruments. Turntablists, for example, or the way some producers can rock a 303 live on stage while others can't. Bernie Worrell and Marvin Gaye's synth playing, working on the sound at the same time as on the melody. I can imagine some amazing futuristic instruments which could usher in a new age for musicianship... But you're right, boring people will continue to make boring music, weird people will go on making weird stuff, and so on... the cycle of life continues... and no old technology ever gets uninvented (apart from Body Rap...). Brendan - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [313] technology vs. art
In the very same mindset -Jimi Hendrix re-wired and re-thought how to record his music so he could get his guitar to sound like the music that was in his head. -Similarly the Detroit boyz took traditional gear and re-wired/re-thought it to develop the early tech soundz that kick-started (more or less) a musical revolution. Let's pose this as a question cuz I'm interested in peeps thoughts: A. Will ever-elevating recording technology equally elevate imagination or have the opposite effect...or both?? B. If bothhow then does one gage or distinguish true musicianship and talent from creativity/imagination/uniqueness in composition?? I know this is a chicken / egg paradoxical type question, but as an older soul I'm finding less imagination in the place of technological brilliancewho really counts more nowadays THE MAN or THE MACHINE I imagine that facile people will always make relatively facile music and conversely us weirdo complicated folks will forever push the envelope to express human ponderings and intricacies in ways that have heretofore never been expressed. What do you all tink??? From: Rusty Blasco [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: [313] technology vs. art Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2001 08:32:36 -0500 Regarding technology (no matter the level of intricacy), here's what my trumpet professor told me about musicianship. After listening to me labor painfully through a difficult passage in a piece of music, he would stop me (probably for the sake of his sensitive ears) and make me aware of the trumpet. While holding it up, turning it, and knocking on the bell, the man explained to me that the trumpet is merely a thing of brass, incapable of producing music without assistance (in this case, the air of a human's pursed and buzzing lips). The music is in your head, he stated, pointing to his noggin. If you can't hear it, and performed flawlessly, in your own mind, than you can't expect it to come out of the instrument. Maybe this will offer some much needed elucidation. Rusty _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [313] technology vs. art
you're finding less imagination? 'acid trax' was made by pulling the baterries out of the 303 and slamming them back in quickly when they couldn't work out how to program it. james www.jbucknell.com laura gavoor [EMAIL PROTECTED] on 10/31/2001 01:19:13 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], 313@hyperreal.org cc:(bcc: James Bucknell/Magazines/Hearst) Subject: Re: [313] technology vs. art In the very same mindset -Jimi Hendrix re-wired and re-thought how to record his music so he could get his guitar to sound like the music that was in his head. -Similarly the Detroit boyz took traditional gear and re-wired/re-thought it to develop the early tech soundz that kick-started (more or less) a musical revolution. Let's pose this as a question cuz I'm interested in peeps thoughts: A. Will ever-elevating recording technology equally elevate imagination or have the opposite effect...or both?? B. If bothhow then does one gage or distinguish true musicianship and talent from creativity/imagination/uniqueness in composition?? I know this is a chicken / egg paradoxical type question, but as an older soul I'm finding less imagination in the place of technological brilliancewho really counts more nowadays THE MAN or THE MACHINE I imagine that facile people will always make relatively facile music and conversely us weirdo complicated folks will forever push the envelope to express human ponderings and intricacies in ways that have heretofore never been expressed. What do you all tink??? From: Rusty Blasco [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: [313] technology vs. art Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2001 08:32:36 -0500 Regarding technology (no matter the level of intricacy), here's what my trumpet professor told me about musicianship. After listening to me labor painfully through a difficult passage in a piece of music, he would stop me (probably for the sake of his sensitive ears) and make me aware of the trumpet. While holding it up, turning it, and knocking on the bell, the man explained to me that the trumpet is merely a thing of brass, incapable of producing music without assistance (in this case, the air of a human's pursed and buzzing lips). The music is in your head, he stated, pointing to his noggin. If you can't hear it, and performed flawlessly, in your own mind, than you can't expect it to come out of the instrument. Maybe this will offer some much needed elucidation. Rusty _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [313] technology vs. art
A. Will ever-elevating recording technology equally elevate imagination or have the opposite effect...or both?? time is the ultimate deciding factor...i'm sure when groups like tangerine dream started using these machines it sounded like degeneration, but then again you have a resurgence of this ambient style in the early 90's which sounds like a degeneration from what they produced...what we see so far is that the production values have increased, but the content lacks originality...it takes a long time to develop your talent at making your music sound like it does in your head...and it's going to get harder because it takes a great deal more knowledge to know what your'e dealing with inside all this new technology...at some point though...a wunderkind will emerge...then everyone will imitate that for a while... B. If bothhow then does one gage or distinguish true musicianship and talent from creativity/imagination/uniqueness in composition?? it's rare that you have all of these qualities rolled up into one...i mean no one like jimi has come around in a long time...prince is a good guitar player, but he's no hendrix...but some of his early compositions are very unique though...anyway, i just hope that people are still looking for any of these qualities over time as opposed to how it looks like it's goingthat is image and sales is all that matters until the machine starts operating on it's own the man is still the most important...i think the lack of creativity is a product of our society...we're over saturated...we've burned our selves out... simply b - Original Message - From: laura gavoor [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 313@hyperreal.org Sent: Wednesday, October 31, 2001 6:19 PM Subject: Re: [313] technology vs. art In the very same mindset -Jimi Hendrix re-wired and re-thought how to record his music so he could get his guitar to sound like the music that was in his head. -Similarly the Detroit boyz took traditional gear and re-wired/re-thought it to develop the early tech soundz that kick-started (more or less) a musical revolution. Let's pose this as a question cuz I'm interested in peeps thoughts: A. Will ever-elevating recording technology equally elevate imagination or have the opposite effect...or both?? B. If bothhow then does one gage or distinguish true musicianship and talent from creativity/imagination/uniqueness in composition?? I know this is a chicken / egg paradoxical type question, but as an older soul I'm finding less imagination in the place of technological brilliancewho really counts more nowadays THE MAN or THE MACHINE I imagine that facile people will always make relatively facile music and conversely us weirdo complicated folks will forever push the envelope to express human ponderings and intricacies in ways that have heretofore never been expressed. What do you all tink??? From: Rusty Blasco [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: [313] technology vs. art Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2001 08:32:36 -0500 Regarding technology (no matter the level of intricacy), here's what my trumpet professor told me about musicianship. After listening to me labor painfully through a difficult passage in a piece of music, he would stop me (probably for the sake of his sensitive ears) and make me aware of the trumpet. While holding it up, turning it, and knocking on the bell, the man explained to me that the trumpet is merely a thing of brass, incapable of producing music without assistance (in this case, the air of a human's pursed and buzzing lips). The music is in your head, he stated, pointing to his noggin. If you can't hear it, and performed flawlessly, in your own mind, than you can't expect it to come out of the instrument. Maybe this will offer some much needed elucidation. Rusty _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [313] technology
yep, it was woody's party. took place on an unbelievably cold night in minneapolis. At 9:51 AM -0700 10/22/01, FC3 Richards wrote: wasn't that party thrown by woody mcbride? i have heard numerous times that party was one of the best in the MW...kinda makes we wanna live in the old times... -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, October 20, 2001 9:59 PM To:Cyclone Wehner; 313 Detroit Subject: Re: [313] technology he is dropping is own version of Get Ur Freak On but it's still cool nonetheless. his supposed lack of humor is a common misconception, it seems. he once opened a set in minneapolis with the entirety of Stairway To Heaven - and i mean the whole damn song. the party was called Stairway To Headphones, hence the song. rich went on typically late in the evening, i think right after josh wink. so picture several hours of techno interrrupted by a very long Led Zeppelin song. damn that was funny. people had no idea what to do. At 7:26 PM +1000 10/19/01, Cyclone Wehner wrote: Well dude is dropping Missy Elliott into his sets too now, I read in Jockey Slut. Guess this means I get a reprieve from techno purists who scoff at my RB CDs now. Thanks Rich! ;) Now I dare Richie to drop Jay-Z or Bubba Sparxxx. ;) all i have to say is who else has ventured out into the land of experimantation like hawtin has on the closer to the edit CD?? - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [313] technology
DJxDJ = Daniel Miller (Mute) + Seth Hodder (NovaMute). Great DEMF set...it started slow, but REALLY hit a groove once it built up. I think a lot of people drifted off before it kicked in and missed a good thing. When the set started I was standing with Carlos S...when I saw him later he said he nearly left early, but it dropped into a very nice place when he'd almost reached the top of the ramp and he turned back. I thought that it - along with Todd Sines' set - were a few of the highlights of this year's fest. jeff ps although it has nothing to do with anything above, I was also really impressed with Sharif's set before Monolake at Detroit Contemporary last summer. I think you are referring to Mute Records founder Daniel Miller. I believe it is Daniel Miller and a partner whose name escapes me, - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [313] technology (fwd)
-- Forwarded message -- Date: Fri, 19 Oct 2001 22:37:15 -0700 From: MARC DOUGLAS CHRISTENSEN [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Kent williams [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: [313] technology Kent- would you forward my reply to the list? my last several posts haven't gone through. thanks, -marc the inestimable Kent williams [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well real Detroit techno was over before it started in some respects. Kind of like the Velvet Underground -- by the time anyone paid attention it was long since gone. mostly true -- by the time it drew critical attention -- hell, even by the time of the music institute, the youth scene -- the under-21 scene that was the audience for the sound --- had changed so much that an affinity for techno (or progressive house, or whatever) seemed almost a throwback. but Techno stopped being 'TECHNO' when it spread beyond a very exclusive scene that only really involved a few hundred people in and around Detroit. CORRECTION: Given that techno wasn't applied to the sound until '88, when it was applied specifically in order to market the sound abroad, you *should* say that Techno only *began* being techno by turning away from the scene that produced it. (it used to be known as a whole raft of things, but the most common i remember from high school circa '83-'87 was detroit house) as for the few hundred people estimate -- it's higher, but certainly not arguably larger than 20,000, unless you add in Chicago's scene and its audience for Detroit product. And even my highball figure of 20,000 (over seven years of adversity, with the sound trapped in two midwestern cities) certainly can't compare to the DEMF attendance. history, folks, history. -marc PS I've got to get off web-based terminal emulation programs. my emails *never* make it to the list! l - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [313] technology
wasn't that party thrown by woody mcbride? i have heard numerous times that party was one of the best in the MW...kinda makes we wanna live in the old times... -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, October 20, 2001 9:59 PM To: Cyclone Wehner; 313 Detroit Subject: Re: [313] technology he is dropping is own version of Get Ur Freak On but it's still cool nonetheless. his supposed lack of humor is a common misconception, it seems. he once opened a set in minneapolis with the entirety of Stairway To Heaven - and i mean the whole damn song. the party was called Stairway To Headphones, hence the song. rich went on typically late in the evening, i think right after josh wink. so picture several hours of techno interrrupted by a very long Led Zeppelin song. damn that was funny. people had no idea what to do. At 7:26 PM +1000 10/19/01, Cyclone Wehner wrote: Well dude is dropping Missy Elliott into his sets too now, I read in Jockey Slut. Guess this means I get a reprieve from techno purists who scoff at my RB CDs now. Thanks Rich! ;) Now I dare Richie to drop Jay-Z or Bubba Sparxxx. ;) all i have to say is who else has ventured out into the land of experimantation like hawtin has on the closer to the edit CD?? - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [313] technology
If I remember correctly Stairway to Headphones is a release by Wink and McBride on the Head in the Clouds label. It was also released on a 2 x 12 of remixes of Basketball Heroes called BasketBall Heroes vs. Stairway to Headphones on McBride's Communique label. So the party by the same name would probably have been thrown by McBride. I vaguely remember hearing about it as I was living in Cleveland at the time (around 95, I think). But I don't remember hearing anything about the party back then. At 09:51 AM 10/22/2001 -0700, FC3 Richards wrote: wasn't that party thrown by woody mcbride? i have heard numerous times that party was one of the best in the MW...kinda makes we wanna live in the old times... -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, October 20, 2001 9:59 PM To: Cyclone Wehner; 313 Detroit Subject: Re: [313] technology he is dropping is own version of Get Ur Freak On but it's still cool nonetheless. his supposed lack of humor is a common misconception, it seems. he once opened a set in minneapolis with the entirety of Stairway To Heaven - and i mean the whole damn song. the party was called Stairway To Headphones, hence the song. rich went on typically late in the evening, i think right after josh wink. so picture several hours of techno interrrupted by a very long Led Zeppelin song. damn that was funny. people had no idea what to do. At 7:26 PM +1000 10/19/01, Cyclone Wehner wrote: Well dude is dropping Missy Elliott into his sets too now, I read in Jockey Slut. Guess this means I get a reprieve from techno purists who scoff at my RB CDs now. Thanks Rich! ;) Now I dare Richie to drop Jay-Z or Bubba Sparxxx. ;) all i have to say is who else has ventured out into the land of experimantation like hawtin has on the closer to the edit CD?? - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [313] technology
Wow ... I wasn't trying to read all that into the definitions. Just putting the fragile nature of such terms in perspective, now that a decade's gone by. Techno = Detroit Techno only holding for two years (88-90) seems like so little time now. -d At 11:43 PM -0500 10/19/01, Kent williams wrote: On Fri, 19 Oct 2001, Dan Sicko wrote: Trance in its roots was a marketing tool to identify techno with melody That's a real shame that the definition of techno had degraded that quickly in the early 90s, don't you think? Well real Detroit techno was over before it started in some respects. Kind of like the Velvet Underground -- by the time anyone paid attention it was long since gone. Later on it was seminal in influencing a later generation. The people nowadays that call what they do techno, and more particular Detroit techno are influenced and informed by the originators, but Techno stopped being 'TECHNO' when it spread beyond a very exclusive scene that only really involved a few hundred people in and around Detroit. Which isn't to say that good music in the dance idiom stopped in 1990 -- it's just not the same thing. There's a global dance culture that has as much to do with fashion and pills as it does with music, and thousands of people producing music on every continent, each with their own agenda. About trance: I've seen a couple of trance DJs that I really liked, and it was because they have taste and seek out interesting things outside the mainstream. The real problem with trance is the same problem with things like filter house, drum and bass, and two step: Specific, limited production tricks and rhythms, that a producer should use once or twice and then try something new, become codified and serve as the basis of a thousand slight variations, all inferior to the original. That there's a market for all that cheap repetition says something about the utilitarian nature of dance music -- DJs always want something new and slamming, but it can't be so new they lose their audience. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [313] technology
Hey Jeff, I think you are referring to Mute Records founder Daniel Miller. I believe it is Daniel Miller and a partner whose name escapes me, at the DEMF they were playing a set that consisted of deconstructed songs from the Mute catalogue. I have an .mpg interview with Liz Copeland on a cdr around here somewhere, I will dig it in the next couple days. Take care, Mike - Original Message - From: FC3 Richards [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 313@hyperreal.org Sent: Friday, October 19, 2001 5:31 AM Subject: [313] technology all i have to say is who else has ventured out into the land of experimantation like hawtin has on the closer to the edit CD?? i don't know of anyone, but there could be somebody. besides, he is doing what he wants, and i am sure he wouldn't do it if it didn't make him happy. its like the consumed album. he decided to put that album out instead of finishing what became the BC album. he put out what he was feeling, and you CAN NOT knock him for that. on a similar note, i have heard of a NovaMute(?) DJ who put sets together using more than 2 turntables and it is entirely constructed of lockgrooves and loops. it might not be the same as the Edit concept, but none the less, it is bold. and who thought lock grooves were the greatest thing in the world when they came out? i garuntee you everyone that loves them now didn't love them then... not expecting happy responses jeff - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [313] technology
he is dropping is own version of Get Ur Freak On but it's still cool nonetheless. his supposed lack of humor is a common misconception, it seems. he once opened a set in minneapolis with the entirety of Stairway To Heaven - and i mean the whole damn song. the party was called Stairway To Headphones, hence the song. rich went on typically late in the evening, i think right after josh wink. so picture several hours of techno interrrupted by a very long Led Zeppelin song. damn that was funny. people had no idea what to do. At 7:26 PM +1000 10/19/01, Cyclone Wehner wrote: Well dude is dropping Missy Elliott into his sets too now, I read in Jockey Slut. Guess this means I get a reprieve from techno purists who scoff at my RB CDs now. Thanks Rich! ;) Now I dare Richie to drop Jay-Z or Bubba Sparxxx. ;) all i have to say is who else has ventured out into the land of experimantation like hawtin has on the closer to the edit CD?? - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [313] technology
maybe i'm still getting it all wrong - but is it still cool to diss comeone because they drop a particularly (allegedly), 'uncool' track in an otherwise groovy set? i didn't think it mattered if it was pulled off. if it was good - it was good. no? peace. hanta (: Original message from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] he is dropping is own version of Get Ur Freak On but it's still cool nonetheless. his supposed lack of humor is a common misconception, it seems. he once opened a set in minneapolis with the entirety of Stairway To Heaven - and i mean the whole damn song. the party was called Stairway To Headphones, hence the song. rich went on typically late in the evening, i think right after josh wink. so picture several hours of techno interrrupted by a very long Led Zeppelin song. damn that was funny. people had no idea what to do. At 7:26 PM +1000 10/19/01, Cyclone Wehner wrote: Well dude is dropping Missy Elliott into his sets too now, I read in Jockey Slut. Guess this means I get a reprieve from techno purists who scoff at my RB CDs now. Thanks Rich! ;) Now I dare Richie to drop Jay-Z or Bubba Sparxxx. ;) all i have to say is who else has ventured out into the land of experimantation like hawtin has on the closer to the edit CD?? - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] . __ Get your free Australian email account at http://www.start.com.au - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [313] technology
I always believed Richie has humour, his Plastikman persona showed that, I just know that Richie said in an interview I read in Jockey Slut (?) that he was never into hip-hop, so I am intrigued and happy to see how the divide between techno/house/electronic music and 'urban music' is closing. I think this is a good thing, esp in the US. A song like Green Velvet's La La Land could so easily cross over to the same kids into Missy, Eminem, et al. I think it will be through these kind of exchanges that kids in the US discover Detroit and Chicago music. One of the more open minded techno heads in Melbourne is starting an RB club and making music al la The Neptunes. I see this as good for techno, hip-hop and RB. All fluidity is good. he is dropping is own version of Get Ur Freak On but it's still cool nonetheless. his supposed lack of humor is a common misconception, it seems. he once opened a set in minneapolis with the entirety of Stairway To Heaven - and i mean the whole damn song. the party was called Stairway To Headphones, hence the song. rich went on typically late in the evening, i think right after josh wink. so picture several hours of techno interrrupted by a very long Led Zeppelin song. damn that was funny. people had no idea what to do. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [313] technology
it wasn't a dis... i like that song, personally. was just pointing out that the version he's got in his computer is not the version you'll hear on the radio or anywhere else. At 3:16 PM +1000 10/21/01, hunter baby wrote: maybe i'm still getting it all wrong - but is it still cool to diss comeone because they drop a particularly (allegedly), 'uncool' track in an otherwise groovy set? i didn't think it mattered if it was pulled off. if it was good - it was good. no? peace. hanta (: Original message from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] he is dropping is own version of Get Ur Freak On but it's still cool nonetheless. his supposed lack of humor is a common misconception, it seems. he once opened a set in minneapolis with the entirety of Stairway To Heaven - and i mean the whole damn song. the party was called Stairway To Headphones, hence the song. rich went on typically late in the evening, i think right after josh wink. so picture several hours of techno interrrupted by a very long Led Zeppelin song. damn that was funny. people had no idea what to do. At 7:26 PM +1000 10/19/01, Cyclone Wehner wrote: Well dude is dropping Missy Elliott into his sets too now, I read in Jockey Slut. Guess this means I get a reprieve from techno purists who scoff at my RB CDs now. Thanks Rich! ;) Now I dare Richie to drop Jay-Z or Bubba Sparxxx. ;) all i have to say is who else has ventured out into the land of experimantation like hawtin has on the closer to the edit CD?? - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] . __ Get your free Australian email account at http://www.start.com.au -- - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [313] technology
Trance in its roots was a marketing tool to identify techno with melody That's a real shame that the definition of techno had degraded that quickly in the early 90s, don't you think? -d - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [313] technology
- Original Message - From: Dan Sicko [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Phonopsia [EMAIL PROTECTED]; M. Todd Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org Sent: Friday, October 19, 2001 11:11 PM Subject: Re: [313] technology Trance in its roots was a marketing tool to identify techno with melody That's a real shame that the definition of techno had degraded that quickly in the early 90s, don't you think? -d Point taken. How could I put it better??? That trance was a marketing tool used by the uninititated to distinguish ethereal techno from rave and from harder Detroit/Berlin techno??? I mean - obviously the distinction becomes blurred because the point is that there was no consistency in the application of the label. I'm not trying to reinstitute the co-option of all melodic techno of that era under the guise of trance. Rather, I'm trying to point out that a CD buying audience was more likely to be introduced to techno at the time b/c that's what was compiled most often, and it was marketed as trance in a hodgepodge. Like the afforementioned 69 and Dark Comedy tracks, Balil, Sun Electric, Thomas Fehlmann, etc. All of it was (mis)labeled trance, at least in some corners, and we can only disregard that label with the benefit of hindsight. But maybe the point is that none of us outsiders knew what trance was in '93? I didn't intend to diminish the existant melodic techno of that era. If it wasn't for In Order to Dance Vol. V, I may not have ever discovered techno and that it is in fact a techno compilation, then often filed under trance. The only pointer I had to techno through domestic channels was the NovaMute repress of the techno sound of Berlin. The Pow-Wow Trance Waveform Transmissions didn't clear things up for me any... My first taste of techno in 1990 came from the Belgian This is the New Beat compilations, and I was later told through 313 that they were rip-offs. I'm trying to point out the co-option and how most people don't jump into techno at purity ground-zero. In the early-mid 90s, communication channels were not so established as they are today, and more people lived in isolation from the hotbeds of innovation. You consumed what you could find, and what you were fed was trance - even if wasn't in actuality. Of course, this is the 90's newcomer's dialogue, not the early initaites, who had found what they were looking for already and can easilly dismiss the rest. Tristan -- http://ampcast.com/phonopsia - Music http://phonopsia.tripod.com - Mixes, pics, thought, travelogue info http://www.metatrackstudios.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] - email FrogboyMCI - AOL Instant Messenger - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [313] technology
and i wanna hear how experimental and techno your spinning happy hard core is... -Original Message- From: DJ Entropy [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, October 19, 2001 2:52 AM To: Cyclone Wehner; 313 Detroit Subject: RE: [313] technology ---Original Message--- all i have to say is who else has ventured out into the land of experimantation like hawtin has on the closer to the edit CD?? Link anywhere? I wanna hear just how experimental hawtin suppossedly is. heh. Ian Scott aka DJ Entropy [EMAIL PROTECTED] (bhpc, cheesestep recordings, n.e. hardcore, raverporn.net, boston) http://www.djentropy.comhttp://www.ne-hardcore.com Upcoming gigs: http://www.warblevx.net/djentropy/upcominggigs.html N.E. Hardcore Radio: Mondays 7pm-10pm http://64.152.82.192:21062 Back To The Future info: http://www.thenewsamplerevolution.com There is no ONE right way to live - Daniel Quinn Educate the narrow minds, they see what they want to see. Educate the narrow minds, they feel what they want to feel. - Narra Mine - Genacide II - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [313] technology
---Original Message--- From: FC3 Richards [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] and i wanna hear how experimental and techno your spinning happy hard core is... Well, considering I barely spin happy hardcore, here: http://www.warblevx.net/djentropy/sets/DJ_Entropy_-_Live_At_Infernal_Bass_(M anchesterNH)_3-10-01.mp3 http://www.warblevx.net/djentropy/sets/NEHardcoreRadio-7-30-01-DJEntropy.mp3 http://www.warblevx.net/djentropy/sets/DJ_Entropy_-_Live_At_Higher_(Lexingto nKY)_2-2-01.mp3 Ian Scott aka DJ Entropy [EMAIL PROTECTED] (bhpc, cheesestep recordings, n.e. hardcore, raverporn.net, boston) http://www.djentropy.comhttp://www.ne-hardcore.com Upcoming gigs: http://www.warblevx.net/djentropy/upcominggigs.html N.E. Hardcore Radio: Mondays 7pm-10pm http://64.152.82.192:21062 Back To The Future info: http://www.thenewsamplerevolution.com There is no ONE right way to live - Daniel Quinn Keep it classical! - Rich Warchild Educate the narrow minds, they see what they want to see. Educate the narrow minds, they feel what they want to feel. - Narra Mine - Genacide II -Original Message- From:DJ Entropy [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent:Friday, October 19, 2001 2:52 AM To: Cyclone Wehner; 313 Detroit Subject: RE: [313] technology ---Original Message--- all i have to say is who else has ventured out into the land of experimantation like hawtin has on the closer to the edit CD?? Link anywhere? I wanna hear just how experimental hawtin suppossedly is. heh. Ian Scott aka DJ Entropy [EMAIL PROTECTED] (bhpc, cheesestep recordings, n.e. hardcore, raverporn.net, boston) http://www.djentropy.comhttp://www.ne-hardcore.com Upcoming gigs: http://www.warblevx.net/djentropy/upcominggigs.html N.E. Hardcore Radio: Mondays 7pm-10pm http://64.152.82.192:21062 Back To The Future info: http://www.thenewsamplerevolution.com There is no ONE right way to live - Daniel Quinn Educate the narrow minds, they see what they want to see. Educate the narrow minds, they feel what they want to feel. - Narra Mine - Genacide II - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [313] technology
On Fri, 19 Oct 2001, Dan Sicko wrote: Trance in its roots was a marketing tool to identify techno with melody That's a real shame that the definition of techno had degraded that quickly in the early 90s, don't you think? Well real Detroit techno was over before it started in some respects. Kind of like the Velvet Underground -- by the time anyone paid attention it was long since gone. Later on it was seminal in influencing a later generation. The people nowadays that call what they do techno, and more particular Detroit techno are influenced and informed by the originators, but Techno stopped being 'TECHNO' when it spread beyond a very exclusive scene that only really involved a few hundred people in and around Detroit. Which isn't to say that good music in the dance idiom stopped in 1990 -- it's just not the same thing. There's a global dance culture that has as much to do with fashion and pills as it does with music, and thousands of people producing music on every continent, each with their own agenda. About trance: I've seen a couple of trance DJs that I really liked, and it was because they have taste and seek out interesting things outside the mainstream. The real problem with trance is the same problem with things like filter house, drum and bass, and two step: Specific, limited production tricks and rhythms, that a producer should use once or twice and then try something new, become codified and serve as the basis of a thousand slight variations, all inferior to the original. That there's a market for all that cheap repetition says something about the utilitarian nature of dance music -- DJs always want something new and slamming, but it can't be so new they lose their audience. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [313] technology
Kent- would you forward my reply to the list? my last several posts haven't gone through. thanks, -marc the inestimable Kent williams [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well real Detroit techno was over before it started in some respects. Kind of like the Velvet Underground -- by the time anyone paid attention it was long since gone. mostly true -- by the time it drew critical attention -- hell, even by the time of the music institute, the youth scene -- the under-21 scene that was the audience for the sound --- had changed so much that an affinity for techno (or progressive house, or whatever) seemed almost a throwback. but Techno stopped being 'TECHNO' when it spread beyond a very exclusive scene that only really involved a few hundred people in and around Detroit. CORRECTION: Given that techno wasn't applied to the sound until '88, when it was applied specifically in order to market the sound abroad, you *should* say that Techno only *began* being techno by turning away from the scene that produced it. (it used to be known as a whole raft of things, but the most common i remember from high school circa '83-'87 was detroit house) as for the few hundred people estimate -- it's higher, but certainly not arguably larger than 20,000, unless you add in Chicago's scene and its audience for Detroit product. And even my highball figure of 20,000 (over seven years of adversity, with the sound trapped in two midwestern cities) certainly can't compare to the DEMF attendance. history, folks, history. -marc PS I've got to get off web-based terminal emulation programs. my emails *never* make it to the list! l - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [313] technology
| -Original Message- | From: Dan Sicko [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] | Sent: 20 October 2001 04:11 | | Trance in its roots was a marketing tool to identify techno with melody | | That's a real shame that the definition of techno had degraded that | quickly in the early 90s, don't you think? In the UK and Europe at least, the 2 Unlimited Effect (with their techno techno techno techno! chorus) had an inestimably damaging impact on the definition of techno. In fact, the word was a laughing stock among anyone but the initiates. Everyone had to go to great lengths here to distance themselves from 2 Unlimited, and would refer themselves to fans of intelligent techno, idm, ambient techno, ambient trance but never techno itself. I think that nowadays there is a high awareness among lay people of what techno is and how it differs from trance, house and the like. But even in the mid-1990s, you couldn't define your favourite music as techno at all without people laughing and singing you the 2 Unlimited chorus again - techno techno techno techno! Brendan - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [313] technology
here`s my 2 cents. my defenition of techno (when people ask me what i spin thats what i answer) is music with some sort of feeling. innovative and kool. i know that as a genere TECHNO was created in detroit. i love detroit - but i think good music (or techno) is created in many other places. defenitions are bad! as for trance i have mixed emotions about this genere since in my country most of the people who like elektronic music are into trance (goa, psy, or progressive). many of my friends are dj who spin this music. the early stuff were great lots of emotion but in a weird way their scene is more like drum`n`bass no more new innovation. the progressive music for me is just rubbish with no soul. A - Original Message - From: Kent williams [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Dan Sicko [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: Phonopsia [EMAIL PROTECTED]; M. Todd Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 313@hyperreal.org Sent: Saturday, October 20, 2001 6:43 AM Subject: Re: [313] technology On Fri, 19 Oct 2001, Dan Sicko wrote: Trance in its roots was a marketing tool to identify techno with melody That's a real shame that the definition of techno had degraded that quickly in the early 90s, don't you think? Well real Detroit techno was over before it started in some respects. Kind of like the Velvet Underground -- by the time anyone paid attention it was long since gone. Later on it was seminal in influencing a later generation. The people nowadays that call what they do techno, and more particular Detroit techno are influenced and informed by the originators, but Techno stopped being 'TECHNO' when it spread beyond a very exclusive scene that only really involved a few hundred people in and around Detroit. Which isn't to say that good music in the dance idiom stopped in 1990 -- it's just not the same thing. There's a global dance culture that has as much to do with fashion and pills as it does with music, and thousands of people producing music on every continent, each with their own agenda. About trance: I've seen a couple of trance DJs that I really liked, and it was because they have taste and seek out interesting things outside the mainstream. The real problem with trance is the same problem with things like filter house, drum and bass, and two step: Specific, limited production tricks and rhythms, that a producer should use once or twice and then try something new, become codified and serve as the basis of a thousand slight variations, all inferior to the original. That there's a market for all that cheap repetition says something about the utilitarian nature of dance music -- DJs always want something new and slamming, but it can't be so new they lose their audience. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [313] technology
Well dude is dropping Missy Elliott into his sets too now, I read in Jockey Slut. Guess this means I get a reprieve from techno purists who scoff at my RB CDs now. Thanks Rich! ;) Now I dare Richie to drop Jay-Z or Bubba Sparxxx. ;) all i have to say is who else has ventured out into the land of experimantation like hawtin has on the closer to the edit CD?? - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [313] technology
---Original Message--- all i have to say is who else has ventured out into the land of experimantation like hawtin has on the closer to the edit CD?? Link anywhere? I wanna hear just how experimental hawtin suppossedly is. heh. Ian Scott aka DJ Entropy [EMAIL PROTECTED] (bhpc, cheesestep recordings, n.e. hardcore, raverporn.net, boston) http://www.djentropy.comhttp://www.ne-hardcore.com Upcoming gigs: http://www.warblevx.net/djentropy/upcominggigs.html N.E. Hardcore Radio: Mondays 7pm-10pm http://64.152.82.192:21062 Back To The Future info: http://www.thenewsamplerevolution.com There is no ONE right way to live - Daniel Quinn Educate the narrow minds, they see what they want to see. Educate the narrow minds, they feel what they want to feel. - Narra Mine - Genacide II - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [313] technology
i bought a tape from my local record store a few years back that just said richie hawtin on it with a neat minimal-looking front... supposedly it was a live set from somewhere. i've since given away the tape so i can't be sure what the info on it said unless it magically re-appears somehow... long story short: THAT SH*T WAS TRANCE AS F**K!!! On Fri, 19 Oct 2001, DJ Entropy wrote: +---Original Message--- + +all i have to say is who else has ventured out into the land of +experimantation like hawtin has on the closer to the edit CD?? + +Link anywhere? + +I wanna hear just how experimental hawtin suppossedly is. + +heh. + +Ian Scott aka DJ Entropy [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://hyperreal.org/~chad - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [313] technology
all i have to say is who else has ventured out into the land of experimantation like hawtin has on the closer to the edit CD?? This idea goes far back in time with the album close to the edit (whithout the r) released in 1985 by ? My memory is not so good ... I forgot who made this album. Greats, Maarten PS: I don´t like lockgrooves and I never will. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [313] technology
I purchased that exact tape from a rekkid store somewhere. That was most certainly *not* hawtin. Just a quick way for someone to make a buck. If you want to hear some of his more recent sets, download morpheus and type in hawtin jim http://www.assasins.net - Original Message - From: chad m sponholz [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: DJ Entropy [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: Cyclone Wehner [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 313 Detroit 313@hyperreal.org Sent: Friday, October 19, 2001 7:08 AM Subject: RE: [313] technology i bought a tape from my local record store a few years back that just said richie hawtin on it with a neat minimal-looking front... supposedly it was a live set from somewhere. i've since given away the tape so i can't be sure what the info on it said unless it magically re-appears somehow... long story short: THAT SH*T WAS TRANCE AS F**K!!! On Fri, 19 Oct 2001, DJ Entropy wrote: +---Original Message--- + +all i have to say is who else has ventured out into the land of +experimantation like hawtin has on the closer to the edit CD?? + +Link anywhere? + +I wanna hear just how experimental hawtin suppossedly is. + +heh. + +Ian Scott aka DJ Entropy [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://hyperreal.org/~chad - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [313] technology
I have a Hawtin mix from 1994-1995 and it definitely is more trancey, he throws in some FUSE and spastik, but the music is certainly trance. However that was an era where techno and trance were one and the same. Cheers todd - Original Message - From: deliverator [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: chad m sponholz [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org Sent: Friday, October 19, 2001 5:42 AM Subject: Re: [313] technology I purchased that exact tape from a rekkid store somewhere. That was most certainly *not* hawtin. Just a quick way for someone to make a buck. If you want to hear some of his more recent sets, download morpheus and type in hawtin jim http://www.assasins.net - Original Message - From: chad m sponholz [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: DJ Entropy [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: Cyclone Wehner [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 313 Detroit 313@hyperreal.org Sent: Friday, October 19, 2001 7:08 AM Subject: RE: [313] technology i bought a tape from my local record store a few years back that just said richie hawtin on it with a neat minimal-looking front... supposedly it was a live set from somewhere. i've since given away the tape so i can't be sure what the info on it said unless it magically re-appears somehow... long story short: THAT SH*T WAS TRANCE AS F**K!!! On Fri, 19 Oct 2001, DJ Entropy wrote: +---Original Message--- + +all i have to say is who else has ventured out into the land of +experimantation like hawtin has on the closer to the edit CD?? + +Link anywhere? + +I wanna hear just how experimental hawtin suppossedly is. + +heh. + +Ian Scott aka DJ Entropy [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://hyperreal.org/~chad - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [313] technology
That's a VERY important qualification. Back then, LOTS of things were called trance. I have some excellent old Subsonic trance volumes which are full of Reel by Real, Dark Comedy, 69, etc., etc, tracks. What falls into the trance bin these days is another animal altogether - imo anyway. Even much old ambient was called 'trance' in the early-mid 90s. jeff At 01:00 PM 10/19/2001, M. Todd Smith wrote: I have a Hawtin mix from 1994-1995 and it definitely is more trancey, he throws in some FUSE and spastik, but the music is certainly trance. However that was an era where techno and trance were one and the same. Cheers todd - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [313] technology
And if you'd played Star Dancer in a trance club back then people would have gone ballistic - the two were definitely linked up until when Sven Vath and the Frankfurt trancey people started to become more prominent, and subsequently the goa trance sound hit at around the same time techno was discovering its minimal side. A complete schism has occurred since then! Brendan | -Original Message- | From: Mxyzptlk [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] | Sent: 19 October 2001 17:15 | To: M. Todd Smith; Detroits Finest List | Subject: Re: [313] technology | | | That's a VERY important qualification. Back then, LOTS of things were | called trance. I have some excellent old Subsonic trance | volumes which | are full of Reel by Real, Dark Comedy, 69, etc., etc, tracks. What falls | into the trance bin these days is another animal altogether - | imo anyway. | Even much old ambient was called 'trance' in the early-mid 90s. | |jeff | | | At 01:00 PM 10/19/2001, M. Todd Smith wrote: | I have a Hawtin mix from 1994-1995 and it definitely is more trancey, he | throws in some FUSE and spastik, but the music is certainly | trance. However | that was an era where techno and trance were one and the same. | | Cheers | todd | | | | - | To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] | For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] | - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [313] technology
I personally think Sven Vath and the boys at Harthouseand EyeQ kept the techno-trance schism at bay for some time Sven Vath's 1995 'Touch Themes', which is remixes of Vath's 'Harlequin' 'Robot' 'Ballet Dancer' is very much still techno. Speedy J's first two LP's are very trancey in nature, but still firmly rooted in techno. Goa did make a big impact though and made the music much easier to pigeon hole into categories in the latter years. Now progressive is borrowing largely from tech-house. In fact many techno producers are starting to show up on trance/progressive labels (Selway uggh Smith on Hooj? Rino Cerrone on Saw? Carl Finlow on Bedrock?) Back to work todd - Original Message - From: Brendan Nelson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Org 313@hyperreal.org Sent: Friday, October 19, 2001 8:54 AM Subject: RE: [313] technology And if you'd played Star Dancer in a trance club back then people would have gone ballistic - the two were definitely linked up until when Sven Vath and the Frankfurt trancey people started to become more prominent, and subsequently the goa trance sound hit at around the same time techno was discovering its minimal side. A complete schism has occurred since then! Brendan | -Original Message- | From: Mxyzptlk [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] | Sent: 19 October 2001 17:15 | To: M. Todd Smith; Detroits Finest List | Subject: Re: [313] technology | | | That's a VERY important qualification. Back then, LOTS of things were | called trance. I have some excellent old Subsonic trance | volumes which | are full of Reel by Real, Dark Comedy, 69, etc., etc, tracks. What falls | into the trance bin these days is another animal altogether - | imo anyway. | Even much old ambient was called 'trance' in the early-mid 90s. | |jeff | | | At 01:00 PM 10/19/2001, M. Todd Smith wrote: | I have a Hawtin mix from 1994-1995 and it definitely is more trancey, he | throws in some FUSE and spastik, but the music is certainly | trance. However | that was an era where techno and trance were one and the same. | | Cheers | todd | | | | - | To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] | For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] | - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [313] technology
Vath's 'Harlequin' 'Robot' 'Ballet Dancer' now, there's a record I never thought I'd see mentioned on the list. :) I think the last trance cut that did anything for me was Balil's Nort Route. -d - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [313] technology
Wasn't that 'The Art of Noise'? -Original Message- From: Maarten Baute [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, October 19, 2001 4:40 AM To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: [313] technology all i have to say is who else has ventured out into the land of experimantation like hawtin has on the closer to the edit CD?? This idea goes far back in time with the album close to the edit (whithout the r) released in 1985 by ? My memory is not so good ... I forgot who made this album. Greats, Maarten PS: I don´t like lockgrooves and I never will. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [313] technology
Wasn't that 'The Art of Noise'? that´s it !!! thanks for the reminder Greets, Maarten - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: (313) technology eastern tour
Wow, this shit's gonna be bigger than Episode 1! It's great to see an event like this taking place, it's obviously taken some time, effort and cash to prepare, I'm sure it was hard work! Can't wait for the British leg of the tour(which is when, by the way?) A little curious as to the line, can't work out if like the mercury music award, the crew members selected are those needing the most spotlight (exc. S.K) or they're just the crew who sorted the whole event out! Looking forward to an interesting evening/night/experience, WorkZ --FYI-- For immediate release: Detroit to rule the eastern hemisphere. Technology Eastern Tour-Europe October 1999 02.10.99 - 30.10.99 It isnt much of a surprise that a production as large as this is coming from a City known for its world class manufacture of a product that has been in the making for nearly twenty years: Detroit Techno. This tour, featuring some of Detroits premier pure techno artists, is setting out to cross the Atlantic and take over the continent. The line-up is as hardcore as the production team making this event happenTechnology Productions embodies its roots as an electronic militia. Technology is a Detroit-based production company that has organized over eighty events throughout America. The team has assembled some of Detroits favorite artists over the past five years for a Detroit-styled show. The mission is to bring a complete tour package to Europe that is the first of its kind. This is a unique opportunity for club and event promoters. Overall the troop is representing both the old and new school sounds of Detroit with this powerful and diverse lineup. There is no question that this is one of the largest undertakings to come out of Detroit in 99. As the tour prepares for infiltration, the anticipation is astounding. Tune in and witness a spectacle that will have the worlds attention. Look for daily tour updates and a complete tour date event list on the (313) based on-line store theplayground.com. The tour kicks off October 2 in Ravensburg, Germany and ends October 30th in Denmark at Club Vega. Performers: Suburban Knight (Live) - Underground Resistance, Detroit USA Gi Gi Galaxy aka Mole People - Teknotika Records, Detroit USA Locutus - Bipolar Records, Pure Plastic, Detroit USA Punisher (Live) - Matrix, Seismic Records, Detroit USA Twonz - Hijacked Records, Detroit USA Auxiliary Performances: Jerohm - Freelectronics - Rotation, Belgium Tao - Freelectronics - Reload, Belgium Channel 3 (Live VJ) - Eyes and Ears Media, Detroit USA Tour Sponsors: Technology Detroit Street Productions madeindetroit.com theplayground.com motormouthmagazine.com *for explicit details contact Technology @ 313. 967. 9488 or Detroit Street Productions @ 313. 964. 3879 ARTIST BIO'S: SUBURBAN KNIGHT a.k.a. James Pennington Underground Resistance, Transmat Suburban Knights production career started in 87 as the co-producer of Inner Citys Big Fun and Good Life after beginning his DJ career in 83. He went on to release on Transmat in 89 where he brought to life his Suburban Knight moniker with the release of The Art of Stalking. He then joined the Underground Resistance camp to release Nocturbulis Behavior in 90, the By Night EP in 95, and a track for the Interstellar Fugitives album. Suburban Knight has played at nearly every major club and event around the world. He has recently toured Japan as well as filling multiple guest slots at Tresor, Berlin; Fuse, Belgium; Lost, London; and many others. His DJ set paints an elaborate picture of the many different styles of music that make up the past, present, and future of techno funk. His live performances are very rare. A chance to see him perform live is something that is not likely to happen twice in ones lifetime. Suburban Knights contributions to music have helped to mold our modern-day concept of Detroit techno. GiGi GALAXY a.k.a Gary Martin Teknotika records, Mole People GiGi Galaxy is the owner of Teknotika records. He founded the label in 94 and has since gone on to release over 20 records and a compilation c.d. He also has 3 records on his sub-label Mole People. In addition to his own projects he has done 3 records and 1 c.d. for Eye Q records and a variety of remixes for the likes of Gus Gus, Aquarhythms, and Der Dritte Raum. Garys busy DJ and live performance schedule complements his career as a producer. He has performed at a variety of major clubs and events in America and Europe; some of which include Tribal Gathering, the Hardwax anniversary party, and club spots in Copenhagen, Scotland, and the Netherlands. His DJ set is best described as sexy tech-house, and his live pa is truly amazing. He has a well-rounded portfolio that makes him a powerful force in techno and house. LOCUTUS a.k.a Wes Herche Bipolar records, Pure Plastic records Locutus is one of the new faces of techno in Detroit. He
Re: (313) technology eastern tour
Wow, this shit's gonna be bigger than Episode 1! It's great to see an event like this taking place, it's obviously taken some time, effort and cash to prepare, I'm sure it was hard work! Can't wait for the British leg of the tour(which is when, by the way?) A little curious as to the line, can't work out if like the mercury music award, the crew members selected are those needing the most spotlight (exc. S.K) or they're just the crew who sorted the whole event out! Looking forward to an interesting evening/night/experience, WorkZ --FYI-- For immediate release: Detroit to rule the eastern hemisphere. Technology Eastern Tour-Europe October 1999 02.10.99 - 30.10.99 It isnt much of a surprise that a production as large as this is coming from a City known for its world class manufacture of a product that has been in the making for nearly twenty years: Detroit Techno. This tour, featuring some of Detroits premier pure techno artists, is setting out to cross the Atlantic and take over the continent. The line-up is as hardcore as the production team making this event happenTechnology Productions embodies its roots as an electronic militia. Technology is a Detroit-based production company that has organized over eighty events throughout America. The team has assembled some of Detroits favorite artists over the past five years for a Detroit-styled show. The mission is to bring a complete tour package to Europe that is the first of its kind. This is a unique opportunity for club and event promoters. Overall the troop is representing both the old and new school sounds of Detroit with this powerful and diverse lineup. There is no question that this is one of the largest undertakings to come out of Detroit in 99. As the tour prepares for infiltration, the anticipation is astounding. Tune in and witness a spectacle that will have the worlds attention. Look for daily tour updates and a complete tour date event list on the (313) based on-line store theplayground.com. The tour kicks off October 2 in Ravensburg, Germany and ends October 30th in Denmark at Club Vega. Performers: Suburban Knight (Live) - Underground Resistance, Detroit USA Gi Gi Galaxy aka Mole People - Teknotika Records, Detroit USA Locutus - Bipolar Records, Pure Plastic, Detroit USA Punisher (Live) - Matrix, Seismic Records, Detroit USA Twonz - Hijacked Records, Detroit USA Auxiliary Performances: Jerohm - Freelectronics - Rotation, Belgium Tao - Freelectronics - Reload, Belgium Channel 3 (Live VJ) - Eyes and Ears Media, Detroit USA Tour Sponsors: Technology Detroit Street Productions madeindetroit.com theplayground.com motormouthmagazine.com *for explicit details contact Technology @ 313. 967. 9488 or Detroit Street Productions @ 313. 964. 3879 ARTIST BIO'S: SUBURBAN KNIGHT a.k.a. James Pennington Underground Resistance, Transmat Suburban Knights production career started in 87 as the co-producer of Inner Citys Big Fun and Good Life after beginning his DJ career in 83. He went on to release on Transmat in 89 where he brought to life his Suburban Knight moniker with the release of The Art of Stalking. He then joined the Underground Resistance camp to release Nocturbulis Behavior in 90, the By Night EP in 95, and a track for the Interstellar Fugitives album. Suburban Knight has played at nearly every major club and event around the world. He has recently toured Japan as well as filling multiple guest slots at Tresor, Berlin; Fuse, Belgium; Lost, London; and many others. His DJ set paints an elaborate picture of the many different styles of music that make up the past, present, and future of techno funk. His live performances are very rare. A chance to see him perform live is something that is not likely to happen twice in ones lifetime. Suburban Knights contributions to music have helped to mold our modern-day concept of Detroit techno. GiGi GALAXY a.k.a Gary Martin Teknotika records, Mole People GiGi Galaxy is the owner of Teknotika records. He founded the label in 94 and has since gone on to release over 20 records and a compilation c.d. He also has 3 records on his sub-label Mole People. In addition to his own projects he has done 3 records and 1 c.d. for Eye Q records and a variety of remixes for the likes of Gus Gus, Aquarhythms, and Der Dritte Raum. Garys busy DJ and live performance schedule complements his career as a producer. He has performed at a variety of major clubs and events in America and Europe; some of which include Tribal Gathering, the Hardwax anniversary party, and club spots in Copenhagen, Scotland, and the Netherlands. His DJ set is best described as sexy tech-house, and his live pa is truly amazing. He has a well-rounded portfolio that makes him a powerful force in techno and house. LOCUTUS a.k.a Wes Herche Bipolar records, Pure Plastic records Locutus is one of the new faces of techno in Detroit. He
