[FairfieldLife] Re: Rand Paul shoots himself in the foot
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozg...@... wrote: authfriend wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote: snip Let's see high quality jobs like working on dirty oil rigs? You got something against getting dirty? Every work on a car? Or how about crawling under a wheat truck in the dusty farm country to lube the truck? Grease and oil aren't much fun to work with. Electric cars are much cleaner. Ahem. I'd say you were somewhat out of touch. Check out this video of the factory in which they build the world's fastest supercar: http://www.vidly.net/video-Inside-the-mclaren-factory.html Jeez, talk about elitism! They're well-paid jobs, many of them highly skilled. I don't care how much it pays it is still a dirty job. Not necessarily. See above. How clean is your *desk* as you work? Or your hard disk when you've finished? My experience is that the cleanliness of the mind creates the cleanliness of the workspace, not vice- versa. The cleanest, most pristine, and by far the most uplifting workspace I've ever been in was in West L.A., at a nursery. The owners grew bonsai, in the way that their ancestors for six or seven generations had grown bonsai. They had trees there that were several hundred years old and cost mid-five-figures. One could not find a speck of dirt other than in the pots in their environment.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Ravi Guru's mad delusional behavior revealed.
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, ditzyklanmail carc...@... wrote: After reading quite a few posts here at Fairfield, I have to admit, the Turquoise jewel does make some sense and even with the sometimes rude awakening, he seems like a nice person. Anyways, was the Ravi poster, actually Turquoise in disguise? Just wondering as I whistle. Now you've done it...the TurquoiseB haters will be on *your* ass now. :-) For the record, Ravi wasn't me. Unlike, say, many of the participants in the BATGAP forum, I don't need to surround myself with clones of myself to serve as foils or Yes men to what I say. Count yerself lucky...what would this forum be like if there were more than one of me here? :-) From: TurquoiseB no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Fri, 21 May, 2010 1:09:54 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Ravi Guru's mad delusional behavior revealed. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, yifuxero yifuxero@ wrote: thx, excellent points! I don't have time to go into this topic at length; but basically in answer to question posed in the Bible Who is your Brother's Keeper;...if Brother/Sister ends only two doors down, I take issue with that. A certain Buddhist perspective (which I groked from various Teachers) is that I am responsible for everything and everybody in the universe. Therefore I personally am responsible for Ravi. otoh, if you prefer not to take such responsibility, that's ok with me. ... then the questions you posed: first, praying (I usually pray/ chant in conjunction with various Deities/Yidams such as Kali, Kwan Yin, etc)...IS DOING something. The enery circulates in the inner planes. The energy of pujas, Yagyas, prayers, etc; eventually manifests physically. By doing something I assume you mean on the physical plane of existence. That's a very limited pov. My point is that among many long-term spiritual seekers, it's the POV they consider last, or never consider at all. They've been told for so many decades that their mere Woo Woo is *enough* to resolve situations they find unpleasant, so that is the only solution they think of, or try. In this particular case, *Ravi's* fantasies all revolve around how powerful he is, how much he is affecting those who interact with him, how just *by* interacting with them these people *who are criticizing him and/or laughing at him* have become his disciples, his students, and how he is in charge, controlling the situation, always winning. In other words, he is essentially the *end product* of this belief system. Have we not seen the *same* belief system around here before? True, not expressed in such a socio- pathic manner, but I'm thinkin' Déja Mu. I *understand* the points Bhairitu made about Ravi just being Indian, and to some extent they are valid, and IMO have exacerbated the situation. Anyone who believes that having been born Brahmin makes him better or more evolved than anyone else is IMO already several miles down the road to madness, even before you throw a little runaway shakti into the mix. Someone with the kinds of 'tudes about *women* that he has expressed here *grew up with them*; they didn't happen overnight as the result of an awakening of any kind. But still, the overall *act* strikes me as familiar, and a little disturbingly so. Part of the TM dogma, ferchissakes, has always been the low-vibeness of having to act on the level of action to resolve a situation. We're talking about an organization that charges its followers *money* to pray for them to gods and goddesses so that they won't *have* to act themselves (TM Yagyas). And we're talking about an organization in which this 'tude (reluctance to get involved and act physically) has led to at least one murder (Levi Butler). I don't think it's out of line to point out stuff like this. I was *not* trying to slam you personally for your suggestion. I was merely rapping about parallels I see in the suggestion to points of dogma I see as less than completely healthy. Relying on prayer or meditation to invoke the good graces of the gods, or to add a little more collective energy or Woo Woo into the mix strikes me as something one does when in a drought and hoping for rain or when hoping for something tenuous and theoretical like world peace. I find it less impressive and practical when the wolf is at the door, or when someone's family might really need protecting. That's all. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, yifuxero yifuxero@ wrote: pray for him in the traditional sense. The combined Shakti and good-will may steer him in the right direction, whatever that may be. Why does this strike me as exactly the same kind of advice that got Ravi *into* this
[FairfieldLife] Re: Conversation with Mr. Chivukula
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, lurkernomore20002000 steve.sun...@... wrote: I had a conversation with Ravi this evening. I wish him the best in his endeavours. His awakening is such that it seems he is embarking on a new career, that of Raviguru. This is nothing other than what he has been saying of course, but I wanted to hear it straight from him. I remained skeptical that he was really leaving behind family and work life. But this seems to be the case. Pretty much, the answer to any question distlled down to, this is the divine working through Ravi. So, what else is there to say. Ex: Ravi, it sounds like you are going to live the life of wandering mendicant Answer: Yes, the divine will work through Ravi, and let him know what plan the divine has Or something to this effect. Bottom Line: I believe Ravi believes that his awakening will bestow upon him the credibiliy to assume the role of a guru to many seekers. And I think that because he has great saturation with American culture, with all it's nuances that he is uniquely fashioned for this role. This is my report. As counterpart, based on my recent skims of the BATGAP forum, t'would seem that many there felt something off about Ravi, from Day One. The only person who in my reading of the posts seemed impressed by him, and *still* seems to believe that there is not only nothing wrong with him but that he really *is* experiencing a profound awakening was -- wait for it -- Jim Flanegin. Those who have read every post over there can correct me if they feel my skim reading is inaccurate; it very well could be. Some expressed downright concern for Ravi, while Jim pooh-poohed their concerns. And these are people who are *conditioned* to see enlight- enment where others see merely confusion and solipsism. While I thank you for your report, based on my experience of seeing people have a minor awakening and set them- selves up as gurus without the wherewithall to be one, I'm predicting Ravi's eventual suicide. That seems to be what *happens* to such people. When their fantasies of who they really are and how they should be really treated by people around them don't work out, they take the I'll show them route and leave them -- and the world that just doesn't understand how special they are -- behind. I'm not *hoping* for such an outcome, but I for one would not be surprised by it. And if it happens, I think I can safely predict Jim coming up with a hearty It's all good about *that*, too.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Conversation with Mr. Chivukula - Minor, Important Adjustment
you didnt think it best to advise him to seek the help of a mental health professional? --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, lurkernomore20002000 steve.sun...@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, lurkernomore20002000 steve.sundur@ wrote: I had a conversation with Ravi this evening. I wish him the best in his endeavours. His awakening is such that it seems he is embarking on a new career, that of Raviguru. This is nothing other than what he has been saying of course, but I wanted to hear it straight from him. I remained skeptical that he was really leaving behind family and work life. But this seems to be the case. Pretty much, the answer to any question distlled down to, this is the divine working through Ravi. So, what else is there to say. Ex: Ravi, it sounds like you are going to live the life of wandering mendicant Answer: Yes, the divine will work through Ravi, and let him know what plan the divine has Or something to this effect. Bottom Line: I believe Ravi believes that his awakening will bestow upon him the credibiliy to assume the role of a guru to many seekers. And I think he feels that because he has great saturation with American culture, with all it's nuances that he is uniquely fashioned for this role. This is my report.
[FairfieldLife] So I'm enlightened...what happens next?
More musings on the Ravi Incident, and what we can learn about the general pitfalls of the spiritual path from it. Personally, I think cartoonist Gahan Wilson answered the question in my Subject line the best: [[Nothing+happens+next_comic.jpg]] Nothing happens next. You're just enlightened, that's all. BFD. There is no payoff, no what should happen. As far as I can tell, life goes on pretty much as it did before, with the universe reacting to your enlightenment with a mighty yawn and a quiet, Big Fuckin' Deal...you were *expecting* something? One of the things I've noticed in my travels in and around the spiritual smorgasbord, however, is that people *are* expecting something. And that that something is sometimes both unrealistic and dangerous, both for the newly awakened and for those around them. Take Ravi. Given his upbringing, now that he's had a minor awakening that he interprets as major, he can conceive of only *one* something that he expects -- that he should become a guru and have others relate to him *as* a guru and receive his moksha or darshan or Wonderful Woo Woo. I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that this is not exactly the most realistic expectation I've ever heard. But is it *out of the ordinary*? Look back on some of the other newly awakened in and around just the TM movement, and what they seemed to expect. Robin Carlsson. Andy Rhymer. Good track record for the enlightened deserving stuff there, right? Think back on some who have graced FFL in the past, claiming enlightenment. Many of them seemed to have expectations as to how they should be received, as well, and beat feet when they found those expectations not met. I think that the problem is far more basic than many are touching on in their comments on the Ravi Thang. I don't think that the problem centers on the fairly obvious fact that some *individuals* who claim enlightenment don't deserve to be respected as gurus. I think that the problem lies in the belief that ANYONE, ANYWHERE, ANYTIME deserves to be respected as a guru, merely on the basis of what they say about their supposed awakening or state of consciousness. Their subjective experience holds no value for me. Or for the world, until they demonstrate otherwise with their actions. Whoever they are, whatever tradition they come from, whatever they or others say about their supposed subjective achievements, they don't get my respect or my notice as someone out of the ordinary until their everyday actions fall into the realm of the extraordinary. Am I alone here in feeling this way?
[FairfieldLife] Fwd: Don't Miss Key Quiet Zone meeting Sunday 7:45 p.m. at the Library
From: bblackm...@natel.net Meet and hear Quiet Zone consultant Andy Mielke. He and his company SRF have done 25 quiet zones! Hear about the plan. See the plan. Ask questions about the plan. Show your support for our Fairfield Quiet Zone. It's time to get this done, but your help and support is still needed. Please pass this invitation along to anyone who would be interested. Thanks, Your Quiet Zone CommitteeBEGIN:VCARD VERSION:2.1 N:Blackmore;Bill FN:Bill Blackmore ORG:Element Power TEL;HOME;VOICE:641-919-1118 TEL;HOME;FAX:1-866-403-8325 ADR;HOME:;;412 N. Court St.;Fairfield;IA;52556 LABEL;HOME;ENCODING=QUOTED-PRINTABLE:412 N. Court St.=0D=0AFairfield, IA 52556 EMAIL;PREF;INTERNET:bblackm...@natel.net REV:20100522T003928Z END:VCARD
[FairfieldLife] Re: Spirit a priori
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutphen@ wrote: No need to reduce other paths to Transcendental Meditation. This a habit that Maharishi had that, IMHO, cultivated arrogance and separation from others not doing what we did. The TM/ TM-Sidhi program offers a great sadhana or spiritual practice, but it failed to address necessary critical behaviors while on the path towards Realization. This failure to cultivate these values led to the profound dysfunction of the TMO and ultimately to its failure (failure is a relative term here. The TMO and MMY can also be seen as very successful in other contexts). TM is not the gold standard of spiritual practices. It simply is one of many bodies of yogic practices that contributes to increasing sattva in the body/mind. I don't believe there is a gold standard in any objective sense. Also, I would like to apologize ahead of time for my reasonable tone. I will get shrill and irrational if that is more appropriate. That's old school. That's our Dr. Pete. And didn't even send it from his blackberry. Dear Pete, that is quite true as caveat to what was said. Part of the local interest in that definition about Ammachi is that it is so essentially 'transcendental' like the Transcendental Meditation's. Read it and she evidently is an ally in the war on ignorance. Yet, here in Fairfield the dome administrative policy is still Don't ask, don't tell when it comes to visiting ally saints and Ammachi in particular. Visiting Ammachi will git you pulled from the dome denied a badge still. But on the other hand if you are male, a healer, dress more as a Westerner saying the same things, doing subtle energy work and teaching spiritual techniques to help with the subtle psycho-spiritual things that you are talking about then the TM movement will now endorse you as a healer, and let your visitors as well as supporters be in the domes meditating. The irony is stunning also given their earnestness in getting better dome numbers. -Buck in FF Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Spirit a priori Amritanandamayi teaches a spiritual path that consists of understanding the scriptures in the Vedas, the Upanishads, and the Bhagavad Gita. Amma advocates meditation, karma yoga, and devotional service. According to Amma, the cultivation of blissful consciousness reveals the non-dual, transcendental absolute, leading to 'jivanmukti' - fully realized while yet living. Cool that reads as, Transcendental Meditation. There is one Truth that shines through all of creation. Rivers and mountains, plants and animals, the sun, the moon and the stars, you and I â all are expressions of this one Reality. - Amma This reads sounding like a 'Unified Field' Chart. Yes, that is succinct. She's a transcendentalist. To subscribe, send a message to: fairfieldlife-subscr...@yahoogroups.com Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!'Yahoo! Groups Links   fairfieldlife-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.com
[FairfieldLife] Re: Raviguru at the Gas Pump
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_re...@... wrote: My advice, Rick, is to not allow this guy back on FFL. I dunno... he fits in well with the rough'n'tumble atmosphere around here. To the degree that the FFL guidelines are actually enforced, there's nothing against making a huge ugly spectacle of oneself. If anything, he needs to be kicked off the batgap yahoo group, where the rules of conduct supposedly don't allow the kind of shit slinging he's doing over there. Like this recent gem: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/BuddhaAtTheGasPump/message/4774 How dare you talk about my beloved and woman like that. You look like a retarded bitch ! I see that Rick has removed his interview with Ravi from batgap.com, which I think is a very wise decision.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Conversation with Mr. Chivukula - Minor, Important Adjustment
Well, you can imagine that it was pretty lopsided conversation with one party doing most of the talking, and the other party doing most of the listeneing. My main advice to him was that if he calls himself a simple brahman, to live the life of a simple brahman. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shukra69 shukr...@... wrote: you didnt think it best to advise him to seek the help of a mental health professional? --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, lurkernomore20002000 steve.sundur@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, lurkernomore20002000 steve.sundur@ wrote: I had a conversation with Ravi this evening. I wish him the best in his endeavours. His awakening is such that it seems he is embarking on a new career, that of Raviguru. This is nothing other than what he has been saying of course, but I wanted to hear it straight from him. I remained skeptical that he was really leaving behind family and work life. But this seems to be the case. Pretty much, the answer to any question distlled down to, this is the divine working through Ravi. So, what else is there to say. Ex: Ravi, it sounds like you are going to live the life of wandering mendicant Answer: Yes, the divine will work through Ravi, and let him know what plan the divine has Or something to this effect. Bottom Line: I believe Ravi believes that his awakening will bestow upon him the credibiliy to assume the role of a guru to many seekers. And I think he feels that because he has great saturation with American culture, with all it's nuances that he is uniquely fashioned for this role. This is my report.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Ravi Guru's mad delusional behavior revealed.
Yes, Turq. --- On Sat, 5/22/10, TurquoiseB no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: From: TurquoiseB no_re...@yahoogroups.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Ravi Guru's mad delusional behavior revealed. To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Date: Saturday, May 22, 2010, 3:10 AM --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, ditzyklanmail carc...@... wrote: After reading quite a few posts here at Fairfield, I have to admit, the Turquoise jewel does make some sense and even with the sometimes rude awakening, he seems like a nice person. Anyways, was the Ravi poster, actually Turquoise in disguise? Just wondering as I whistle. Now you've done it...the TurquoiseB haters will be on *your* ass now. :-) For the record, Ravi wasn't me. Unlike, say, many of the participants in the BATGAP forum, I don't need to surround myself with clones of myself to serve as foils or Yes men to what I say. Count yerself lucky...what would this forum be like if there were more than one of me here? :-) From: TurquoiseB no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Fri, 21 May, 2010 1:09:54 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Ravi Guru's mad delusional behavior revealed. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, yifuxero yifuxero@ wrote: thx, excellent points! I don't have time to go into this topic at length; but basically in answer to question posed in the Bible Who is your Brother's Keeper;...if Brother/Sister ends only two doors down, I take issue with that. A certain Buddhist perspective (which I groked from various Teachers) is that I am responsible for everything and everybody in the universe. Therefore I personally am responsible for Ravi. otoh, if you prefer not to take such responsibility, that's ok with me. ... then the questions you posed: first, praying (I usually pray/ chant in conjunction with various Deities/Yidams such as Kali, Kwan Yin, etc)...IS DOING something. The enery circulates in the inner planes. The energy of pujas, Yagyas, prayers, etc; eventually manifests physically. By doing something I assume you mean on the physical plane of existence. That's a very limited pov. My point is that among many long-term spiritual seekers, it's the POV they consider last, or never consider at all. They've been told for so many decades that their mere Woo Woo is *enough* to resolve situations they find unpleasant, so that is the only solution they think of, or try. In this particular case, *Ravi's* fantasies all revolve around how powerful he is, how much he is affecting those who interact with him, how just *by* interacting with them these people *who are criticizing him and/or laughing at him* have become his disciples, his students, and how he is in charge, controlling the situation, always winning. In other words, he is essentially the *end product* of this belief system. Have we not seen the *same* belief system around here before? True, not expressed in such a socio- pathic manner, but I'm thinkin' Déja Mu. I *understand* the points Bhairitu made about Ravi just being Indian, and to some extent they are valid, and IMO have exacerbated the situation. Anyone who believes that having been born Brahmin makes him better or more evolved than anyone else is IMO already several miles down the road to madness, even before you throw a little runaway shakti into the mix. Someone with the kinds of 'tudes about *women* that he has expressed here *grew up with them*; they didn't happen overnight as the result of an awakening of any kind. But still, the overall *act* strikes me as familiar, and a little disturbingly so. Part of the TM dogma, ferchissakes, has always been the low-vibeness of having to act on the level of action to resolve a situation. We're talking about an organization that charges its followers *money* to pray for them to gods and goddesses so that they won't *have* to act themselves (TM Yagyas). And we're talking about an organization in which this 'tude (reluctance to get involved and act physically) has led to at least one murder (Levi Butler). I don't think it's out of line to point out stuff like this. I was *not* trying to slam you personally for your suggestion. I was merely rapping about parallels I see in the suggestion to points of dogma I see as less than completely healthy. Relying on prayer or meditation to invoke the good graces of the gods, or to add a little more collective energy or Woo Woo into the mix strikes me as something one does when in a drought and hoping for rain or when hoping for something tenuous and theoretical like world peace. I find it less impressive and practical when the wolf is at the door, or when someone's family might really need protecting.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Spirit a priori
Buck said, But on the other hand if you are male, a healer, dress more as a Westerner saying the same things, doing subtle energy work and teaching spiritual techniques to help with the subtle psycho-spiritual things that you are talking about then the TM movement will now endorse you as a healer, and let your visitors as well as supporters be in the domes meditating. The irony is stunning also given their earnestness in getting better dome numbers. Wow! Is that true? Very strange. I would see relative healers as more of a threat to pull people off the path towards actual Realization than a traditional Satguru (Ammachi, Sri Sri, etc.). But if the goal is dome numbers, then being path-pulled is secondary perhaps. Buck, you seem like quite the reasonable chap. Are you in Fairfield, dome attending, etc? In good standing, so to speak? --- On Sat, 5/22/10, Buck dhamiltony...@yahoo.com wrote: From: Buck dhamiltony...@yahoo.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Spirit a priori To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Date: Saturday, May 22, 2010, 7:58 AM --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutphen@ wrote: No need to reduce other paths to Transcendental Meditation. This a habit that Maharishi had that, IMHO, cultivated arrogance and separation from others not doing what we did. The TM/ TM-Sidhi program offers a great sadhana or spiritual practice, but it failed to address necessary critical behaviors while on the path towards Realization. This failure to cultivate these values led to the profound dysfunction of the TMO and ultimately to its failure (failure is a relative term here. The TMO and MMY can also be seen as very successful in other contexts). TM is not the gold standard of spiritual practices. It simply is one of many bodies of yogic practices that contributes to increasing sattva in the body/mind. I don't believe there is a gold standard in any objective sense. Also, I would like to apologize ahead of time for my reasonable tone. I will get shrill and irrational if that is more appropriate. That's old school. That's our Dr. Pete. And didn't even send it from his blackberry. Dear Pete, that is quite true as caveat to what was said. Part of the local interest in that definition about Ammachi is that it is so essentially 'transcendental' like the Transcendental Meditation's. Read it and she evidently is an ally in the war on ignorance. Yet, here in Fairfield the dome administrative policy is still Don't ask, don't tell when it comes to visiting ally saints and Ammachi in particular. Visiting Ammachi will git you pulled from the dome denied a badge still. But on the other hand if you are male, a healer, dress more as a Westerner saying the same things, doing subtle energy work and teaching spiritual techniques to help with the subtle psycho-spiritual things that you are talking about then the TM movement will now endorse you as a healer, and let your visitors as well as supporters be in the domes meditating. The irony is stunning also given their earnestness in getting better dome numbers. -Buck in FF Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Spirit a priori Amritanandamayi teaches a spiritual path that consists of understanding the scriptures in the Vedas, the Upanishads, and the Bhagavad Gita. Amma advocates meditation, karma yoga, and devotional service. According to Amma, the cultivation of blissful consciousness reveals the non-dual, transcendental absolute, leading to 'jivanmukti' - fully realized while yet living. Cool that reads as, Transcendental Meditation. There is one Truth that shines through all of creation. Rivers and mountains, plants and animals, the sun, the moon and the stars, you and I †all are expressions of this one Reality. - Amma This reads sounding like a 'Unified Field' Chart. Yes, that is succinct. She's a transcendentalist. To subscribe, send a message to: fairfieldlife-subscr...@yahoogroups.com Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!'Yahoo! Groups Links   fairfieldlife-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.com To subscribe, send a message to: fairfieldlife-subscr...@yahoogroups.com Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!'Yahoo! Groups Links fairfieldlife-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.com
Re: [FairfieldLife] So I'm enlightened...what happens next?
Nothing happens next. You're just enlightened, that's all. BFD Exactly! Only the most mind-popping, world-wrenching event that will ever happen to you. In fact, it will be the last thing you ever do because afterwards you will be dead. --- On Sat, 5/22/10, TurquoiseB no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: From: TurquoiseB no_re...@yahoogroups.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] So I'm enlightened...what happens next? To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Date: Saturday, May 22, 2010, 6:36 AM More musings on the Ravi Incident, and what we can learn about the general pitfalls of the spiritual path from it. Personally, I think cartoonist Gahan Wilson answered the question in my Subject line the best: Nothing happens next. You're just enlightened, that's all. BFD. There is no payoff, no what should happen. As far as I can tell, life goes on pretty much as it did before, with the universe reacting to your enlightenment with a mighty yawn and a quiet, Big Fuckin' Deal...you were *expecting* something? One of the things I've noticed in my travels in and around the spiritual smorgasbord, however, is that people *are* expecting something. And that that something is sometimes both unrealistic and dangerous, both for the newly awakened and for those around them. Take Ravi. Given his upbringing, now that he's had a minor awakening that he interprets as major, he can conceive of only *one* something that he expects -- that he should become a guru and have others relate to him *as* a guru and receive his moksha or darshan or Wonderful Woo Woo. I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that this is not exactly the most realistic expectation I've ever heard. But is it *out of the ordinary*? Look back on some of the other newly awakened in and around just the TM movement, and what they seemed to expect. Robin Carlsson. Andy Rhymer. Good track record for the enlightened deserving stuff there, right? Think back on some who have graced FFL in the past, claiming enlightenment. Many of them seemed to have expectations as to how they should be received, as well, and beat feet when they found those expectations not met. I think that the problem is far more basic than many are touching on in their comments on the Ravi Thang. I don't think that the problem centers on the fairly obvious fact that some *individuals* who claim enlightenment don't deserve to be respected as gurus. I think that the problem lies in the belief that ANYONE, ANYWHERE, ANYTIME deserves to be respected as a guru, merely on the basis of what they say about their supposed awakening or state of consciousness. Their subjective experience holds no value for me. Or for the world, until they demonstrate otherwise with their actions. Whoever they are, whatever tradition they come from, whatever they or others say about their supposed subjective achievements, they don't get my respect or my notice as someone out of the ordinary until their everyday actions fall into the realm of the extraordinary. Am I alone here in feeling this way?
Re: [FairfieldLife] Dharma Jim's Conversion Ceremony
Is Bevan aware of this? --- On Sat, 5/22/10, Yifu Xero yifux...@yahoo.com wrote: From: Yifu Xero yifux...@yahoo.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] Dharma Jim's Conversion Ceremony To: fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com Date: Saturday, May 22, 2010, 12:02 AM http://nichirenscoffeehouse.net/temples/Myokakuji/SJ2002.html
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Spirit a priori
Hey, I don't have a blackberry. I've evolved to an iPhone. Om Tat Sat. --- On Fri, 5/21/10, lurkernomore20002000 steve.sun...@sbcglobal.net wrote: From: lurkernomore20002000 steve.sun...@sbcglobal.net Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Spirit a priori To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Date: Friday, May 21, 2010, 11:17 PM --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutp...@... wrote: No need to reduce other paths to Transcendental Meditation. This a habit that Maharishi had that, IMHO, cultivated arrogance and separation from others not doing what we did. The TM/ TM-Sidhi program offers a great sadhana or spiritual practice, but it failed to address necessary critical behaviors while on the path towards Realization. This failure to cultivate these values led to the profound dysfunction of the TMO and ultimately to its failure (failure is a relative term here. The TMO and MMY can also be seen as very successful in other contexts). TM is not the gold standard of spiritual practices. It simply is one of many bodies of yogic practices that contributes to increasing sattva in the body/mind. I don't believe there is a gold standard in any objective sense. Also, I would like to apologize ahead of time for my reasonable tone. I will get shrill and irrational if that is more appropriate. That's old school. That's our Dr. Pete. And didn't even send it from his blackberry. --- On Fri, 5/21/10, Buck dhamiltony...@... wrote: From: Buck dhamiltony...@... Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Spirit a priori To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Date: Friday, May 21, 2010, 9:10 PM Amritanandamayi teaches a spiritual path that consists of understanding the scriptures in the Vedas, the Upanishads, and the Bhagavad Gita. Amma advocates meditation, karma yoga, and devotional service. According to Amma, the cultivation of blissful consciousness reveals the non-dual, transcendental absolute, leading to 'jivanmukti' - fully realized while yet living. Cool that reads as, Transcendental Meditation. There is one Truth that shines through all of creation. Rivers and mountains, plants and animals, the sun, the moon and the stars, you and I †all are expressions of this one Reality. - Amma This reads sounding like a 'Unified Field' Chart. Yes, that is succinct. She's a transcendentalist. To subscribe, send a message to: fairfieldlife-subscr...@yahoogroups.com Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!'Yahoo! Groups Links   fairfieldlife-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.com
[FairfieldLife] Re: Ravi Guru's mad delusional behavior revealed.
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutp...@... wrote: Yes, Turq. Dude, you just screwed up my perfect record... :-) --- On Sat, 5/22/10, TurquoiseB no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: For the record, ... I don't need to surround myself with clones of myself to serve as foils or Yes men to what I say.
RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: Spirit a priori
From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:fairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Peter Sent: Saturday, May 22, 2010 7:19 AM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Spirit a priori Buck said, But on the other hand if you are male, a healer, dress more as a Westerner saying the same things, doing subtle energy work and teaching spiritual techniques to help with the subtle psycho-spiritual things that you are talking about then the TM movement will now endorse you as a healer, and let your visitors as well as supporters be in the domes meditating. The irony is stunning also given their earnestness in getting better dome numbers. Wow! Is that true? Very strange. I would see relative healers as more of a threat to pull people off the path towards actual Realization than a traditional Satguru (Ammachi, Sri Sri, etc.). But if the goal is dome numbers, then being path-pulled is secondary perhaps. Buck, you seem like quite the reasonable chap. I'll speak for him in case he doesn't: Are you in Fairfield, Yes. dome attending, etc? no. In good standing, so to speak? No.
[FairfieldLife] Don't judge him until you've read it all...
That is the title of the #1 link on Digg, and I echo the author's sentiment. Read this tale of woe all the way through...you'll be happy you did... http://imgur.com/YWd0i.jpg
[FairfieldLife] Google compares Apple to 'Big Brother' from iconic 1984 ad
If you think that grudges between people get gnarly around Fairfield Life, you should see what happens in Real Life: http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/10/05/21/google_compares_apple_to_big_brother_from_iconic_1984_ad.html
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Ravi Guru's mad delusional behavior revealed.
; ) From: authfriend jst...@panix.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Fri, 21 May, 2010 9:26:17 PM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Ravi Guru's mad delusional behavior revealed. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, ditzyklanmail carc...@... wrote: After reading quite a few posts here at Fairfield, I have to admit, the Turquoise jewel does make some sense ROTFL! and even with the sometimes rude awakening, he seems like a nice person. Well, you've just done a nice job inoculating yourself against his viciousness. Smart move.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Seize BP
The Congress granted BP and Big Oil the license to commit environmental and economic crimes when it enacted the limitations on liability in the Oil Pollution Act of 1990... This is an obvious overstatement. From what I've read, the U.S. Congress passed the Oil Pollution Act in 1990 with unanimous support of Democrats and Republicans - so your congressional leaders obviously did NOT intend to license oil companies to commit environment and economic crimes. What was missing was the will to wield that authority. Before we run off and pass more laws and regulations, let's get the facts. Let's also work on summoning the collective will to be more effective at oversight and prevention... 'The BP Oil Spill: Where Do We Go From Here?' By Richard Crespin Forbes, May 21, 2010 http://tinyurl.com/254dz7n Oil Polution Act of 1990: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oil_Pollution_Act_of_1990
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Ravi Guru's mad delusional behavior revealed.
Au contraire! Blowing a bit of Holy Smoke at ya! With your uncanny gabfest ability... I still think you are also Ravi. When Ravi disappeared your posts went on reading about what type of cell phone is the better, etc. Pulled your hand from the cookie jar, but still got caught? From: TurquoiseB no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sat, 22 May, 2010 2:10:33 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Ravi Guru's mad delusional behavior revealed. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, ditzyklanmail carc...@... wrote: After reading quite a few posts here at Fairfield, I have to admit, the Turquoise jewel does make some sense and even with the sometimes rude awakening, he seems like a nice person. Anyways, was the Ravi poster, actually Turquoise in disguise? Just wondering as I whistle. Now you've done it...the TurquoiseB haters will be on *your* ass now. :-) For the record, Ravi wasn't me. Unlike, say, many of the participants in the BATGAP forum, I don't need to surround myself with clones of myself to serve as foils or Yes men to what I say. Count yerself lucky...what would this forum be like if there were more than one of me here? :-) From: TurquoiseB no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Fri, 21 May, 2010 1:09:54 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Ravi Guru's mad delusional behavior revealed. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, yifuxero yifuxero@ wrote: thx, excellent points! I don't have time to go into this topic at length; but basically in answer to question posed in the Bible Who is your Brother's Keeper;...if Brother/Sister ends only two doors down, I take issue with that. A certain Buddhist perspective (which I groked from various Teachers) is that I am responsible for everything and everybody in the universe. Therefore I personally am responsible for Ravi. otoh, if you prefer not to take such responsibility, that's ok with me. ... then the questions you posed: first, praying (I usually pray/ chant in conjunction with various Deities/Yidams such as Kali, Kwan Yin, etc)...IS DOING something. The enery circulates in the inner planes. The energy of pujas, Yagyas, prayers, etc; eventually manifests physically. By doing something I assume you mean on the physical plane of existence. That's a very limited pov. My point is that among many long-term spiritual seekers, it's the POV they consider last, or never consider at all. They've been told for so many decades that their mere Woo Woo is *enough* to resolve situations they find unpleasant, so that is the only solution they think of, or try. In this particular case, *Ravi's* fantasies all revolve around how powerful he is, how much he is affecting those who interact with him, how just *by* interacting with them these people *who are criticizing him and/or laughing at him* have become his disciples, his students, and how he is in charge, controlling the situation, always winning. In other words, he is essentially the *end product* of this belief system. Have we not seen the *same* belief system around here before? True, not expressed in such a socio- pathic manner, but I'm thinkin' Déja Mu. I *understand* the points Bhairitu made about Ravi just being Indian, and to some extent they are valid, and IMO have exacerbated the situation. Anyone who believes that having been born Brahmin makes him better or more evolved than anyone else is IMO already several miles down the road to madness, even before you throw a little runaway shakti into the mix. Someone with the kinds of 'tudes about *women* that he has expressed here *grew up with them*; they didn't happen overnight as the result of an awakening of any kind. But still, the overall *act* strikes me as familiar, and a little disturbingly so. Part of the TM dogma, ferchissakes, has always been the low-vibeness of having to act on the level of action to resolve a situation. We're talking about an organization that charges its followers *money* to pray for them to gods and goddesses so that they won't *have* to act themselves (TM Yagyas). And we're talking about an organization in which this 'tude (reluctance to get involved and act physically) has led to at least one murder (Levi Butler). I don't think it's out of line to point out stuff like this. I was *not* trying to slam you personally for your suggestion. I was merely rapping about parallels I see in the suggestion to points of dogma I see as less than completely healthy. Relying on prayer or meditation to invoke the good graces of the gods, or to add a little more collective energy or Woo Woo into the mix strikes me as something one does when in a drought and hoping for rain or when hoping for something tenuous and theoretical like world peace. I find it less
[FairfieldLife] Re: Ravi Guru's mad delusional behavior revealed.
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, ditzyklanmail carc...@... wrote: Au contraire! Blowing a bit of Holy Smoke at ya! With your uncanny gabfest ability... I still think you are also Ravi. Nonsense. I am Spartacus.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Ravi Guru's mad delusional behavior revealed.
On May 22, 2010, at 10:04 AM, TurquoiseB wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, ditzyklanmail carc...@... wrote: Au contraire! Blowing a bit of Holy Smoke at ya! With your uncanny gabfest ability... I still think you are also Ravi. Nonsense. I am Spartacus. I am woman, hear me roar... Sal
[FairfieldLife] Re: Ravi Guru's mad delusional behavior revealed.
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine salsunsh...@... wrote: On May 22, 2010, at 10:04 AM, TurquoiseB wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, ditzyklanmail carc108@ wrote: Au contraire! Blowing a bit of Holy Smoke at ya! With your uncanny gabfest ability... I still think you are also Ravi. Nonsense. I am Spartacus. I am woman, hear me roar... I thought that 'Spartacus' had a more UC feel to it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hFbCS4a14J4 but hey!, roaring women are neat, too. :-)
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Rand Paul shoots himself in the foot
TurquoiseB wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozg...@... wrote: authfriend wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote: snip Let's see high quality jobs like working on dirty oil rigs? You got something against getting dirty? Every work on a car? Or how about crawling under a wheat truck in the dusty farm country to lube the truck? Grease and oil aren't much fun to work with. Electric cars are much cleaner. Ahem. I'd say you were somewhat out of touch. Check out this video of the factory in which they build the world's fastest supercar: http://www.vidly.net/video-Inside-the-mclaren-factory.html Certainly a car for the masses. I see them parked all the time at Walmart and in the employee spots at Burger King. I hear Judy loves hers. We elitists and classists wouldn't be caught dead in one though. They won't even let us on to the country club parking lot driving one.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Ravi Guru's mad delusional behavior revealed.
I think Dr. Pete came back after he saw all the hands shoot up after I asked my question the other day. TurquoiseB wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutp...@... wrote: Yes, Turq. Dude, you just screwed up my perfect record... :-) --- On Sat, 5/22/10, TurquoiseB no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: For the record, ... I don't need to surround myself with clones of myself to serve as foils or Yes men to what I say.
[FairfieldLife] Ravi's in the hospital
From: Ravi Chivukula [mailto:chivukula.r...@gmail.com] Sent: Saturday, May 22, 2010 9:53 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Raviguru at the Gas Pump I checked in myself at Psychiatric Service- 1706 East Elm Street, Jefferson City, MO - (573) 751-8017. Since I know exactly what my problem is I can help the doctors treat me better. Pray for me. Love - Ravi.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Rand Paul shoots himself in the foot
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozg...@... wrote: snip Ahem. I'd say you were somewhat out of touch. Check out this video of the factory in which they build the world's fastest supercar: http://www.vidly.net/video-Inside-the-mclaren-factory.html Certainly a car for the masses. I see them parked all the time at Walmart and in the employee spots at Burger King. I hear Judy loves hers. Nope, sorry, don't own a car. Wouldn't have one in the house. ;-)
[FairfieldLife] Re: Ravi's in the hospital
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer r...@... wrote: From: Ravi Chivukula [mailto:chivukula.r...@...] Sent: Saturday, May 22, 2010 9:53 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Raviguru at the Gas Pump I checked in myself at Psychiatric Serviceâ- 1706 East Elm Street, Jefferson City, MOâ - (573) 751-8017â. Since I know exactly what my problem is I can help the doctors treat me better. Pray for me. Love - Ravi. Very happy to hear that, Rick. Thanks for keeping us informed.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Seize BP
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, WillyTex willy...@... wrote: The Congress granted BP and Big Oil the license to commit environmental and economic crimes when it enacted the limitations on liability in the Oil Pollution Act of 1990... This is an obvious overstatement. From what I've read, the U.S. Congress passed the Oil Pollution Act in 1990 with unanimous support of Democrats and Republicans - so your congressional leaders obviously did NOT intend to license oil companies to commit environment and economic crimes. Just as obviously, the oil companies have a strangle hold on Congress. They have army of lobbyist working 24/7 whose sole purpose is to make sure regulations always have plenty of loopholes. What was missing was the will to wield that authority. Before we run off and pass more laws and regulations, let's get the facts. Let's also work on summoning the collective will to be more effective at oversight and prevention... Sure...by all means have more studies. Meanwhile, BP hasn't done anything to actually CLEAN the mess. They have only used poisonous dispersants they get with sweetheart deals from cronies, just so we don't SEE the mess. From hay to hair and absorbents to Kevin Costner's oil separators, BP has ignored using environmentally safe cleaning methods. From top hat to top kill, BP has delayed doing anything to plug the leak permanently. My bet is they won't EVER clean the mess nor will they pay one cent to the thousands of PEOPLE who have lost their businesses. They will suck up every last drop of oil possible, the environment be damned. If Bush can sign an executive order seizing the assets of anti-war protesters, Obama could sure as hell grab BP by the nuts and seize their assets. He's good at righteous anger but his response has been tepid at best. http://www.projectcensored.org/top-stories/articles/5-seizing-war-protesters-assets/ http://www.heatingoil.com/blog/bp-turns-to-kevin-costner-for-help-with-oil-spill-cleanup521/ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k5SxX2EntEo 'The BP Oil Spill: Where Do We Go From Here?' By Richard Crespin Forbes, May 21, 2010 http://tinyurl.com/254dz7n Oil Polution Act of 1990: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oil_Pollution_Act_of_1990
[FairfieldLife] Re: Ravi's in the hospital
Thank goodness. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer r...@... wrote: From: Ravi Chivukula [mailto:chivukula.r...@...] Sent: Saturday, May 22, 2010 9:53 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Raviguru at the Gas Pump I checked in myself at Psychiatric Serviceâ- 1706 East Elm Street, Jefferson City, MOâ - (573) 751-8017â. Since I know exactly what my problem is I can help the doctors treat me better. Pray for me. Love - Ravi.
RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: Ravi's in the hospital
From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:fairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of authfriend Sent: Saturday, May 22, 2010 12:29 PM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Ravi's in the hospital Thank goodness. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife%40yahoogroups.com , Rick Archer r...@... wrote: From: Ravi Chivukula [mailto:chivukula.r...@...] Sent: Saturday, May 22, 2010 9:53 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Raviguru at the Gas Pump I checked in myself at Psychiatric Service‎- 1706 East Elm Street, Jefferson City, MO‎ - (573) 751-8017‎. Since I know exactly what my problem is I can help the doctors treat me better. Pray for me. Love - Ravi. But they haven't taken his computer away. He's still sending out lots of weird emails.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Seize BP
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, raunchydog raunchy...@... wrote: snip From top hat to top kill, BP has delayed doing anything to plug the leak permanently. Gotta jump on this again. The *only* thing that can be done to plug the leak permanently is the relief well, which they're drilling as fast as they can. All the other measures are stopgaps, attempts to lessen or hopefully temporarily choke off the flow until they can get the relief well done. One reason the stopgap measures are taking so long is that if they aren't done *right*, they pose extreme danger to the people implementing them on the surface. Nobody wants those ships to go up in flames like the rig. If the measures are not done with extreme care, they also risk destroying the wellhead, in which case the uncontrolled flow of oil will make what's coming out now look like a puny trickle. My bet is they won't EVER clean the mess nor will they pay one cent to the thousands of PEOPLE who have lost their businesses. They're required by law to do both. They will suck up every last drop of oil possible, the environment be damned. Again, it is NOT the case that BP is dragging its feet in the hope of getting more oil from this well. This well is no more. It has ceased to be. It has expired and gone to meet its maker. It is an ex-well.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Ravi's in the hospital
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer r...@... wrote: snip But they haven't taken his computer away. He's still sending out lots of weird emails. Any clue what prompted him to go to the hospital?
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Ravi Guru's mad delusional behavior revealed.
Like this one? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rvUgSXwRg0A From: TurquoiseB no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sat, 22 May, 2010 10:23:25 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Ravi Guru's mad delusional behavior revealed. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine salsunsh...@... wrote: On May 22, 2010, at 10:04 AM, TurquoiseB wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, ditzyklanmail carc108@ wrote: Au contraire! Blowing a bit of Holy Smoke at ya! With your uncanny gabfest ability... I still think you are also Ravi. Nonsense. I am Spartacus. I am woman, hear me roar... I thought that 'Spartacus' had a more UC feel to it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hFbCS4a14J4 but hey!, roaring women are neat, too. :-)
[FairfieldLife] Re: Seize BP
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, raunchydog raunchy...@... wrote: snip Just as obviously, the oil companies have a strangle hold on Congress. Bob Herbert had a great analogy in his column today: No one knows how much of BP's runaway oil will contaminate the gulf coast's marshes and lakes and bayous and canals, destroying wildlife and fauna and ruining the hopes and dreams of countless human families. What is known is that whatever oil gets in will be next to impossible to get out. It gets into the soil and the water and the plant life and can't be scraped off the way you might be able to scrape the oil off of a beach. It permeates and undermines the ecosystem in much the same way that big corporations have permeated and undermined our political system, with similarly devastating results. http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/22/opinion/22herbert.html?ref=opinion
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Ravi Guru's mad delusional behavior revealed.
Like this one? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rvUgSXwRg0A From: TurquoiseB no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sat, 22 May, 2010 10:23:25 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Ravi Guru's mad delusional behavior revealed. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine salsunsh...@... wrote: On May 22, 2010, at 10:04 AM, TurquoiseB wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, ditzyklanmail carc108@ wrote: Au contraire! Blowing a bit of Holy Smoke at ya! With your uncanny gabfest ability... I still think you are also Ravi. Nonsense. I am Spartacus. I am woman, hear me roar... I thought that 'Spartacus' had a more UC feel to it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hFbCS4a14J4 but hey!, roaring women are neat, too. :-)
[FairfieldLife] Re: Ravi's in the hospital
Rick, i had a friend who turned himself in at a psychiatric hospital and they do take away your cell phone etc i tried to call the hospital, but they are on message mode for the weekend so ??? best to pray for him if anyone is so inclined --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer r...@... wrote: From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:fairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of authfriend Sent: Saturday, May 22, 2010 12:29 PM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Ravi's in the hospital Thank goodness. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife%40yahoogroups.com , Rick Archer rick@ wrote: From: Ravi Chivukula [mailto:chivukula.r...@] Sent: Saturday, May 22, 2010 9:53 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Raviguru at the Gas Pump I checked in myself at Psychiatric Serviceââ¬Å½- 1706 East Elm Street, Jefferson City, MOââ¬Å½ - (573) 751-8017ââ¬Å½. Since I know exactly what my problem is I can help the doctors treat me better. Pray for me. Love - Ravi. But they haven't taken his computer away. He's still sending out lots of weird emails.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Ravi's in the hospital
authfriend wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer r...@... wrote: snip But they haven't taken his computer away. He's still sending out lots of weird emails. Any clue what prompted him to go to the hospital? A professional visit? Sounds like he is an tech for a database company and maybe working on the hospital database (and in the meantime having fun pulling people's legs here with his tweets).
[FairfieldLife] Praying fo Ravi !
interesting approach to praying for others or for any undesirable situation Ho'oponopono ~ wisdom from land of Aloha I am sorry, Please forgive me, I Thank you and I Love You ! How to practice Ho'oponopono http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ac5SGwRPv0o http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ac5SGwRPv0o my comment on following video: I'm not sure how much is possible with this, but the hypotheses are worthwhile to consider and practice, if you want, it's simple enough. The spiritual principles are consistent with other universal teachings, especially something called Divine Apology[ Pratikraman ] by Indian Jain teacher Dada Bhagawan, and obviously, Christ's teaching on forgiveness and Love. Ho'oponopono Explained how Dr Hew Len was able to cure criminally insane patients at Hawaii State Hospital by working on himself : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wSfbkG97H7Q http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wSfbkG97H7Q some sites with articles and brief extracts below: ( concerning these sites, I follow the guideline take what is useful and leave the rest ) http://www.hooponopono.org/ http://www.hooponopono.org/ When we are willing to take 100% responsibility and let go, what is right and perfect unfolds. http://www.idreamcatcher.com/hooponopono/ http://www.idreamcatcher.com/hooponopono/ When Dr. Hew Len was asked how exactly did he manage to heal violent patients without actually seeing each of them in person, his answer was: I did not heal them. I healed part of myself that created them. To me that was the most fundamental revelation to date. That phrase alone explains the most important presumption of Ho'oponopono: You are 100% responsible for everything. Everything and everywhere! And it means, not only your personal failures and your personal successes, but also if someone somewhere did something and you became aware of that you are 100% responsible for that also. However, Ho'oponopono is not your free ticket to guilt trip. Being 100% responsible is not the same as feeling infinitely guilty for the world's miseries. It's a profound reminder of your creative powers and a gentle welcome to return back to your inner nature. . This is achieved by a constant cleaning process. by letting go of subconscious [processed] programs that run your life without your conscious participation. Ho'oponopono consists of simply repeating the following phrase many times throughout the day: I Love You, Please forgive me, I am sorry, Thank you ! No need to feel anything special, imagine anything, or otherwise to complicate this process; you just say it as Dr. Hew Len says. http://www.idreamcatcher.com/hooponopono/ http://www.idreamcatcher.com/hooponopono/ The wonder of the updated Ho'oponopono process is that you get to meet yourself anew each moment, and you get to appreciate more and more with each application of the process the renewing miracle of LOVE. Interesting hypotheses to contemplate on : 1. The physical universe is an actualization of my thoughts. 2. If my thoughts are cancerous, they create a cancerous physical reality. 3. If my thoughts are perfect, they create a physical reality brimming with LOVE. 4. I am 100% responsible for having created my physical universe the way it is. 5. I am 100% responsible for correcting the cancerous thoughts that create a diseased reality. 6. There is no such thing as out there. Everything exists within me as thoughts in my mind. also, on this site happens to be a story of Lester Levenson http://www.idreamcatcher.com/lester-levenson/ http://www.idreamcatcher.com/lester-levenson/ posting this link for the inspirational value of the story, NOT promoting either the Abundance Course nor the Release Technique, both of which I know little about; thanks for understanding.
[FairfieldLife] And though the holes were rather small...
a day in the life - Jeff Beck http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3uwvBizKAwc
RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: Ravi's in the hospital
From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:fairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of authfriend Sent: Saturday, May 22, 2010 12:46 PM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Ravi's in the hospital --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife%40yahoogroups.com , Rick Archer r...@... wrote: snip But they haven't taken his computer away. He's still sending out lots of weird emails. Any clue what prompted him to go to the hospital? As I understand it, lurkernomore called Ravi in Boston, the Ravi flew to St. Louis in the hope of meeting Lurk, then he checked himself into a local hospital. But he's still posting emails and YouTube videos.
[FairfieldLife] Wanna Smartphone?
But didn't want the monthly fees? No this isn't spam but a news item about telecoms starting to offer prepaid service plans for smartphone. Until now those plans were limited to Dumbphones. The downside is you have to buy the phone up front as it isn't subsidized as it is with the two-year contract plans. But if you aren't a phone person like me but might like to see what is the chat is on FFL etc while traveling or maybe at 3 AM without going to your computer this might be the thing for you: http://news.cnet.com/8301-30686_3-20005349-266.html
[FairfieldLife] [Fwd: Re: Ravi's in the hospital]
Like I said Original Message Subject:Re: Ravi's in the hospital Date: Sat, 22 May 2010 11:58:51 -0700 From: Ravi Chivukula chivukula.r...@gmail.com To: noozg...@sbcglobal.net References: ht957s+2...@egroups.com 4bf82266.9010...@sbcglobal.net My hats off to you !!! You hit the nail on its head, I was just having fun promoting my Amma on the list. You can forward it to the list if you would like. On Sat, May 22, 2010 at 11:28 AM, Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net wrote: authfriend wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com FairfieldLife%40yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer r...@... wrote: snip But they haven't taken his computer away. He's still sending out lots of weird emails. Any clue what prompted him to go to the hospital? A professional visit? Sounds like he is an tech for a database company and maybe working on the hospital database (and in the meantime having fun pulling people's legs here with his tweets).
[FairfieldLife] Re: Ravi Guru's mad delusional behavior revealed.
Jim always bitched about his awakening. You hassled him and booted him out of this forum. Maybe he is happy to get his daily dose of ' MoonShine dope ' at BATGAP.?? --- On Sat, 5/22/10, TurquoiseB no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Ravi Guru's mad delusional behavior revealed. Date: Saturday, May 22, 2010, 12:10 AM Now you've done it...the TurquoiseB haters will be on *your* ass now. :-) For the record, Ravi wasn't me. Unlike, say, many of the participants in the BATGAP forum, I don't need to surround myself with clones of myself to serve as foils or Yes men to what I say. Count yerself lucky...what would this forum be like if there were more than one of me here? :-)
[FairfieldLife] Review of David Wants To Fly from Macleans (Canada)
Flying yogis and #64258;ying millions Acolyte David Lynch isn't happy with this exposé of Transcendental Meditation by Brian D. Johnson on Wednesday, May 19, 2010 12:40pm - 36 Comments He was the original guru pop star. Made famous by the Beatles in the 1960s, Maharishi Mahesh Yogi was the godfather of the Transcendental Meditation movement, known as TM. He inspired such acolytes as author Deepak Chopra and filmmaker David Lynch, and remained TM's figurehead until his death in 2008 at the age of 94. The Maharishi was once dubbed the giggling guru. But now it appears he may have been giggling all the way to the bank. David Wants to Fly, a new documentary shown last week at Toronto's Hot Docs festival, offers compelling evidence that the Maharishi's empire of enlightenment is more devoted to shaking down its followers and amassing wealth than transcending the material world. The David of David Wants to Fly refers to the film's director, a cheeky 32-year-old German named David Sieveking, and to the dubious feat of yogic flying or levitation. It could also refer to David Lynch, who has emerged as TM's most prominent spokesman and is the prime target of Sieveking's obsessive investigation. Sieveking embarked on his documentary as an avid Lynch fan dying to meet the genius behind Blue Velvet and Twin Peaks. But by the time he'd completed his film, five years later, it had turned into an exposé. Sieveking told Maclean's that Lynch threatened to sue him and tried to block the film's Berlin premiere. No wonder. It depicts TM as a secretive hierarchy with overtones of Scientology, and portrays Lynch as its Tom Cruise. Sieveking, who makes himself a character in the documentarya neurotic man on a missionis like a cross between a young Werner Herzog and a skinny Michael Moore. He first travels to America to interview Lynch as a star-struck fan, then becomes an eager student of TM. As his odyssey takes him from Manhattan to the headwaters of the Ganges, he never loses faith in the power of meditation, but he becomes deeply skeptical about TM's well-heeled leadership. He learns that its rajas pay $1 million for their exalted rank. At a groundbreaking ceremony for a TM university in Switzerland, we see Lynch introduce Raja Emanuel, TM's King of Germany, who wears a gold crown and offers a provocative pledge: I'm a good German who wants to make Germany invincible. Jeers erupt from the crowd and a voice yells, That's what Adolf Hitler wanted! Emanuel replies: Unfortunately, he couldn't do it. He didn't have the right technique. Trying to quell the catcalls, Lynch leaps to the raja's defence, and hails him as a great human being. Sieveking interviews several TM defectors, including Colorado publisher Earl Kaplan, who donated over US$150 million toward the construction of a vast meditation centre in India, where 24-7 shifts of 10,000 yogic flyers would create world peace. Visiting the project site, Sieveking finds an abandoned, half-built ghost town. And he shows footage of yogic flying, which looks more like cross-legged yogic hopping. We also meet the Maharishi's former personal assistant, who says, He'd use people and discard them when they ran out of money. And although the guru preached celibacy, the ex-aide says one of his jobs was to bring women to the Maharishi's room for sex. Another ex-disciple, Judith Bourque, reminisces about her torrid love affair with the Maharishi, which ended when he found another young woman. Rumours of the guru's sybaritic lifestyle have been rampant ever since the Beatles heard that he had hit on Mia Farrow in the late '60s. His behaviour provoked John Lennon to write a derisive song called Maharishi, which George Harrison persuaded him to retitle Sexy Sadie (What have you done? You made a fool of everyone). The film shows Paul McCartney and Ringo Starr rallying to support TM at Lynch's star-studded 2009 TM benefit. John Lennon, says Sieveking, would be rolling in his grave. As for the analogy between TM and Scientology, the director acknowledges certain parallels, but considers TM less rigidyou can't be a moderate Scientologist. Sieveking says he became paranoid after the German raja threatened to destroy his film career. Yet Lynch is still a guru for me as a filmmaker, he maintains, just not as a spiritual figure. I wanted to be his friend. It's tough for me, because now he sees me as an enemy. But Sieveking may have found a new guru. Apparently Michael Moore, that documentary raja, is anxious to see his film. Tags: David Lynch
[FairfieldLife] Re: Conversation with Mr. Chivukula
Jim always had a perverse rationale about such events and situations. Remember, Jim also wanted the same Reverence and exalted GuruStatus as Ravi. I also wouldn't be surprised at all, if Jim said It's all good if Ravi met with a disaster. --- On Sat, 5/22/10, TurquoiseB no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Conversation with Mr. Chivukula Date: Saturday, May 22, 2010, 12:24 AM As counterpart, based on my recent skims of the BATGAP forum, t'would seem that many there felt something off about Ravi, from Day One. The only person who in my reading of the posts seemed impressed by him, and *still* seems to believe that there is not only nothing wrong with him but that he really *is* experiencing a profound awakening was -- wait for it -- Jim Flanegin. Those who have read every post over there can correct me if they feel my skim reading is inaccurate; it very well could be. Some expressed downright concern for Ravi, while Jim pooh-poohed their concerns. And these are people who are *conditioned* to see enlight- enment where others see merely confusion and solipsism. While I thank you for your report, based on my experience of seeing people have a minor awakening and set them- selves up as gurus without the wherewithall to be one, I'm predicting Ravi's eventual suicide. That seems to be what *happens* to such people. When their fantasies of who they really are and how they should be really treated by people around them don't work out, they take the I'll show them route and leave them -- and the world that just doesn't understand how special they are -- behind. I'm not *hoping* for such an outcome, but I for one would not be surprised by it. And if it happens, I think I can safely predict Jim coming up with a hearty It's all good about *that*, too.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Ravi's in the hospital
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer r...@... wrote: From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:fairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of authfriend Sent: Saturday, May 22, 2010 12:46 PM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Ravi's in the hospital --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife%40yahoogroups.com , Rick Archer rick@ wrote: snip But they haven't taken his computer away. He's still sending out lots of weird emails. Any clue what prompted him to go to the hospital? As I understand it, lurkernomore called Ravi in Boston, the Ravi flew to St. Louis in the hope of meeting Lurk, then he checked himself into a local hospital. But he's still posting emails and YouTube videos. Maybe things have changed, but when an extended family member was in the psych hospital for a bit about 5 years ago, no computer use allowed, tv and video games and books were fine, limited phone calls from a pay phone only. This protected patients from further harming relationships with family, coworkers, whatever, when they are manic or psychotic or depressed. Real damage can be done and it can be hard to undo in some cases - like coming on sexually to someone totally uninterested in or related to you. It also means that they can participate in group sessions and disconnect from some of the tensions of their outside life. But who knows, times are different in just 5 years.
[FairfieldLife] high spiritual energy videos
besides Amma and Her Swamis bhajans, these are some of my favorites; whatever one thinks of Haidakhan Babji( 1970-1984 ), His devotees produced some of the highest purest spiritual vibes; enjoy [;;)] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nneu0g9A0kQ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nneu0g9A0kQ Krishna Das( one of the best devotional singers; an American) sings Hanuman Chalisa; pics of Haidakhan Babji enjoy and feel the energy vibes ~ heal the soul ~ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=djGw6oFEAkY http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=djGw6oFEAkY Babaji's High Priest ~ purest man on earth http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_2WLWtj2MXE http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_2WLWtj2MXE Muniraji Maharaj ~ most peaceful man on earth http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E5s159PY02s http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E5s159PY02s Anandamayi Ma was very popular and powerful Divine Mother( 1896-1982) sings Jaya Jaya Ma includes her aphorisms http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bpQ6NKiby-o http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bpQ6NKiby-o Babaji's aphorisms on unity of all http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xTgU4l0dnGU http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xTgU4l0dnGU http://www.youtube.com/user/kozmobile#p/a/f/1/DI6OEKiaPms http://www.youtube.com/user/kozmobile#p/a/f/1/DI6OEKiaPms
[FairfieldLife] Re: Conversation with Mr. Chivukula
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jason jedi_sp...@... wrote: Jim always had a perverse rationale about such events and situations. Remember, Jim also wanted the same Reverence and exalted GuruStatus as Ravi. I also wouldn't be surprised at all, if Jim said It's all good if Ravi met with a disaster. --- On Sat, 5/22/10, TurquoiseB no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Conversation with Mr. Chivukula Date: Saturday, May 22, 2010, 12:24 AM As counterpart, based on my recent skims of the BATGAP forum, t'would seem that many there felt something off about Ravi, from Day One. The only person who in my reading of the posts seemed impressed by him, and *still* seems to believe that there is not only nothing wrong with him but that he really *is* experiencing a profound awakening was -- wait for it -- Jim Flanegin. Those who have read every post over there can correct me if they feel my skim reading is inaccurate; it very well could be. Some expressed downright concern for Ravi, while Jim pooh-poohed their concerns. And these are people who are *conditioned* to see enlight- enment where others see merely confusion and solipsism. While I thank you for your report, based on my experience of seeing people have a minor awakening and set them- selves up as gurus without the wherewithall to be one, I'm predicting Ravi's eventual suicide. That seems to be what *happens* to such people. When their fantasies of who they really are and how they should be really treated by people around them don't work out, they take the I'll show them route and leave them -- and the world that just doesn't understand how special they are -- behind. I'm not *hoping* for such an outcome, but I for one would not be surprised by it. And if it happens, I think I can safely predict Jim coming up with a hearty It's all good about *that*, too. But if Ravi is plain old seriously manic, and then gets good treatment and maintains it, then all this guru stuff will seem wild to him, too. In fact, if he gets well, he will understand why he felt that way but also recognize that it was totally unreal and part of the illness. He will hope that people can forget or forgive his wildness and wish that he had not broadcast his instability so far and wide. He won't be insisting on being a guru anymore and he won't feel like one, either, dull as that may be. Let's hope he gets good treatment .
RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: Conversation with Mr. Chivukula
From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:fairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of wayback71 Sent: Saturday, May 22, 2010 4:30 PM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Conversation with Mr. Chivukula But if Ravi is plain old seriously manic, and then gets good treatment and maintains it, then all this guru stuff will seem wild to him, too. In fact, if he gets well, he will understand why he felt that way but also recognize that it was totally unreal and part of the illness. He will hope that people can forget or forgive his wildness and wish that he had not broadcast his instability so far and wide. He won't be insisting on being a guru anymore and he won't feel like one, either, dull as that may be. Let's hope he gets good treatment . That's what I was thinking. But it turns out Ravi isn't in a hospital in Missouri. He's still in Massachusetts and was BSing everyone about the hospital.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Conversation with Mr. Chivukula
i got a nice email from him just now; seems like Amma is Blessing him and Guiding him back to health; lets keep praying hoping intending, whatever your way is, that that is the case amarnath http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RVr6TIIlOQU http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RVr6TIIlOQU --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer r...@... wrote: From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:fairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of wayback71 Sent: Saturday, May 22, 2010 4:30 PM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Conversation with Mr. Chivukula But if Ravi is plain old seriously manic, and then gets good treatment and maintains it, then all this guru stuff will seem wild to him, too. In fact, if he gets well, he will understand why he felt that way but also recognize that it was totally unreal and part of the illness. He will hope that people can forget or forgive his wildness and wish that he had not broadcast his instability so far and wide. He won't be insisting on being a guru anymore and he won't feel like one, either, dull as that may be. Let's hope he gets good treatment . That's what I was thinking. But it turns out Ravi isn't in a hospital in Missouri. He's still in Massachusetts and was BSing everyone about the hospital.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Conversation with Mr. Chivukula
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer r...@... wrote: From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:fairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of wayback71 Sent: Saturday, May 22, 2010 4:30 PM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Conversation with Mr. Chivukula But if Ravi is plain old seriously manic, and then gets good treatment and maintains it, then all this guru stuff will seem wild to him, too. In fact, if he gets well, he will understand why he felt that way but also recognize that it was totally unreal and part of the illness. He will hope that people can forget or forgive his wildness and wish that he had not broadcast his instability so far and wide. He won't be insisting on being a guru anymore and he won't feel like one, either, dull as that may be. Let's hope he gets good treatment . That's what I was thinking. But it turns out Ravi isn't in a hospital in Missouri. He's still in Massachusetts and was BSing everyone about the hospital. oh. that kind of puts a damper on the whole treatment idea
[FairfieldLife] Re: Conversation with Mr. Chivukula
Yep, you wonder just how much of the whole story is bullshit and what isn't. Could it be some kind of over-the-top weird devotional to Amma? A very poor advertisement if so. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wayback71 waybac...@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer rick@ wrote: From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:fairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of wayback71 Sent: Saturday, May 22, 2010 4:30 PM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Conversation with Mr. Chivukula But if Ravi is plain old seriously manic, and then gets good treatment and maintains it, then all this guru stuff will seem wild to him, too. In fact, if he gets well, he will understand why he felt that way but also recognize that it was totally unreal and part of the illness. He will hope that people can forget or forgive his wildness and wish that he had not broadcast his instability so far and wide. He won't be insisting on being a guru anymore and he won't feel like one, either, dull as that may be. Let's hope he gets good treatment . That's what I was thinking. But it turns out Ravi isn't in a hospital in Missouri. He's still in Massachusetts and was BSing everyone about the hospital. oh. that kind of puts a damper on the whole treatment idea
[FairfieldLife] Post Count
Fairfield Life Post Counter === Start Date (UTC): Sat May 22 00:00:00 2010 End Date (UTC): Sat May 29 00:00:00 2010 80 messages as of (UTC) Sun May 23 00:02:48 2010 10 TurquoiseB no_re...@yahoogroups.com 9 authfriend jst...@panix.com 8 Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net 7 Peter drpetersutp...@yahoo.com 5 lurkernomore20002000 steve.sun...@sbcglobal.net 5 ditzyklanmail carc...@yahoo.co.in 5 anatol_zinc anatol_z...@yahoo.com 5 Rick Archer r...@searchsummit.com 3 wayback71 waybac...@yahoo.com 3 WillyTex willy...@yahoo.com 2 shukra69 shukr...@yahoo.ca 2 raunchydog raunchy...@yahoo.com 2 Yifu Xero yifux...@yahoo.com 2 Mike Dixon mdixon.6...@yahoo.com 2 Joe geezerfr...@yahoo.com 2 Jason jedi_sp...@yahoo.com 2 Buck dhamiltony...@yahoo.com 2 do.rflex do.rf...@yahoo.com 1 merlin vedamer...@yahoo.de 1 Sal Sunshine salsunsh...@lisco.com 1 Dick Mays dickm...@lisco.com 1 Alex Stanley j_alexander_stan...@yahoo.com Posters: 22 Saturday Morning 00:00 UTC Rollover Times = Daylight Saving Time (Summer): US Friday evening: PDT 5 PM - MDT 6 PM - CDT 7 PM - EDT 8 PM Europe Saturday: BST 1 AM CEST 2 AM EEST 3 AM Standard Time (Winter): US Friday evening: PST 4 PM - MST 5 PM - CST 6 PM - EST 7 PM Europe Saturday: GMT 12 AM CET 1 AM EET 2 AM For more information on Time Zones: www.worldtimezone.com
RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: Conversation with Mr. Chivukula
From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:fairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Joe Sent: Saturday, May 22, 2010 7:03 PM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Conversation with Mr. Chivukula Yep, you wonder just how much of the whole story is bullshit and what isn't. Could it be some kind of over-the-top weird devotional to Amma? A very poor advertisement if so. Hardly one she would appreciate. Many of his posts, including in the Amma chat, proclaim his independence from her and his new status as guru in his own right.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Spirit a priori
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutp...@... wrote: No need to reduce other paths to Transcendental Meditation. This a habit that Maharishi had that, IMHO, cultivated arrogance and separation from others not doing what we did. The TM/ TM-Sidhi program offers a great sadhana or spiritual practice, but it failed to address necessary critical behaviors while on the path towards Realization. This failure to cultivate these values led to the profound dysfunction of the TMO and ultimately to its failure (failure is a relative term here. The TMO and MMY can also be seen as very successful in other contexts). TM is not the gold standard of spiritual practices. It simply is one of many bodies of yogic practices that contributes to increasing sattva in the body/mind. I don't believe there is a gold standard in any objective sense.  Also, I would like to apologize ahead of time for my reasonable tone. I will get shrill and irrational if that is more appropriate. Pete, actually you'd like this. What I notice is that as an old and practicing spiritual group here (decades) mostly we've had to take care of ourselves over the years the way you are talking. Sometimes something more than what is in the TM checking notes may be helpful. That got done by folks here in relationships with some of the different saints who have come through and also some of the spiritually talented folks here locally embedded. Often a careful reading of the back page of the Weekly Reader and the 'schedule of events' inside can find you the services of those folks locally. The bigger promotional healers like Trivedi or John Douglas are visitors that way who have been helpful. But locally there are some folks who have been quite helpful too to even the highest echelons of campus and TM movement people as they have needed some help spiritually along the way. Looking in on Fairfield the Weekly Reader is a good window to see in through. Unfortunately it does not work on the web. The hardcopy is quite good every week (published on Thursdays) for mapping out the spiritual practice community here. There are a lot of good people who work at it and are having fine experiences, thank you. So, it is not like it is not happening. TM is great as a starting point and then there is spiritual discipline and discernment with what you do with it. There actually has been a lot of experience of that here. That aspect is part of the back story. It is an active spiritual practice place and not monolithic at all. You'd like it. Jai Adi Shankara, =Buck in FF
[FairfieldLife] Re: Conversation with Mr. Chivukula
Yes...now that you mention it, there was that one post from him saying he would eat Amma for lunch and Maharishi for dinner, or words to that effect. But you know, the whole episode brings up a topic that has long fascinated me; and that is the very fine line that separates so-called enlightenment from borderline behavioral disorders such as paranoid schizophrenia. I'm open to the possibility that enlightenment is just a stamp of authenticity on certain behavioral disorders. When I spent time around MMY I certainly saw behaviors that would have sent most folks in for some mental retread time. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer r...@... wrote: From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:fairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Joe Sent: Saturday, May 22, 2010 7:03 PM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Conversation with Mr. Chivukula Yep, you wonder just how much of the whole story is bullshit and what isn't. Could it be some kind of over-the-top weird devotional to Amma? A very poor advertisement if so. Hardly one she would appreciate. Many of his posts, including in the Amma chat, proclaim his independence from her and his new status as guru in his own right.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Spirit a priori
I always have a desire to go back there. I was a MIU student from '74 to '78; then Purusha for a year there and finally TSR from '83 to '89. Things seem very different now. --- On Sat, 5/22/10, Buck dhamiltony...@yahoo.com wrote: From: Buck dhamiltony...@yahoo.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Spirit a priori To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Date: Saturday, May 22, 2010, 8:33 PM --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutp...@... wrote: No need to reduce other paths to Transcendental Meditation. This a habit that Maharishi had that, IMHO, cultivated arrogance and separation from others not doing what we did. The TM/ TM-Sidhi program offers a great sadhana or spiritual practice, but it failed to address necessary critical behaviors while on the path towards Realization. This failure to cultivate these values led to the profound dysfunction of the TMO and ultimately to its failure (failure is a relative term here. The TMO and MMY can also be seen as very successful in other contexts). TM is not the gold standard of spiritual practices. It simply is one of many bodies of yogic practices that contributes to increasing sattva in the body/mind. I don't believe there is a gold standard in any objective sense.  Also, I would like to apologize ahead of time for my reasonable tone. I will get shrill and irrational if that is more appropriate. Pete, actually you'd like this. What I notice is that as an old and practicing spiritual group here (decades) mostly we've had to take care of ourselves over the years the way you are talking. Sometimes something more than what is in the TM checking notes may be helpful. That got done by folks here in relationships with some of the different saints who have come through and also some of the spiritually talented folks here locally embedded. Often a careful reading of the back page of the Weekly Reader and the 'schedule of events' inside can find you the services of those folks locally. The bigger promotional healers like Trivedi or John Douglas are visitors that way who have been helpful. But locally there are some folks who have been quite helpful too to even the highest echelons of campus and TM movement people as they have needed some help spiritually along the way. Looking in on Fairfield the Weekly Reader is a good window to see in through. Unfortunately it does not work on the web. The hardcopy is quite good every week (published on Thursdays) for mapping out the spiritual practice community here. There are a lot of good people who work at it and are having fine experiences, thank you. So, it is not like it is not happening. TM is great as a starting point and then there is spiritual discipline and discernment with what you do with it. There actually has been a lot of experience of that here. That aspect is part of the back story. It is an active spiritual practice place and not monolithic at all. You'd like it. Jai Adi Shankara, =Buck in FF To subscribe, send a message to: fairfieldlife-subscr...@yahoogroups.com Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!'Yahoo! Groups Links fairfieldlife-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.com
[FairfieldLife] Re: Conversation with Mr. Chivukula
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer r...@... wrote: From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:fairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Joe Sent: Saturday, May 22, 2010 7:03 PM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Conversation with Mr. Chivukula Yep, you wonder just how much of the whole story is bullshit and what isn't. Could it be some kind of over-the-top weird devotional to Amma? A very poor advertisement if so. Rick: Hardly one she would appreciate. Many of his posts, including in the Amma chat, proclaim his independence from her and his new status as guru in his own right. in an earlier post authfriend make this observation: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jst...@... wrote: Something to bear in mind is that certain kinds of psychosis can generate mystical experiences on their own. Ravi's plight may or may not have anything directly to do with Amma's shakti. If he's bipolar, as some of us suspect, this would likely have happened anyway. I could be very wrong, but I doubt he's just fragile. I'd be willing to bet he's been struggling with it for years and has refused to get treatment. Manic episodes are usually temporary, and the person can appear quite normal in between. But if they're not treated, the episodes tend to get progressively worse. Authfriend makes some excellent points above and most likely more or less correct concerning Ravi's situation. And it would be good if someone in a position to do so could help him get treatment.
RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: Spirit a priori
From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:fairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Peter Sent: Saturday, May 22, 2010 7:40 PM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Spirit a priori I always have a desire to go back there. I was a MIU student from '74 to '78; then Purusha for a year there and finally TSR from '83 to '89. Things seem very different now. Come and visit some time, Pete. Allegiant Air has ridiculously cheap flights between here and Florida.
RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: Conversation with Mr. Chivukula
From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:fairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of anatol_zinc Sent: Saturday, May 22, 2010 7:42 PM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Conversation with Mr. Chivukula Authfriend makes some excellent points above and most likely more or less correct concerning Ravi's situation. And it would be good if someone in a position to do so could help him get treatment. Family and friends are probably trying to get him some, but as long as he thinks he's superior to everyone else, it's unlikely they'll be able to. Unless he gets so bad that he can be forced into treatment. Dr. Pete could tell us how bad that has to be.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Conversation with Mr. Chivukula
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anatol_zinc anatol_z...@... wrote: snip in an earlier post authfriend make this observation: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote: Something to bear in mind is that certain kinds of psychosis can generate mystical experiences on their own. Ravi's plight may or may not have anything directly to do with Amma's shakti. If he's bipolar, as some of us suspect, this would likely have happened anyway. I could be very wrong, but I doubt he's just fragile. I'd be willing to bet he's been struggling with it for years and has refused to get treatment. Manic episodes are usually temporary, and the person can appear quite normal in between. But if they're not treated, the episodes tend to get progressively worse. Authfriend makes some excellent points above and most likely more or less correct concerning Ravi's situation. Bear in mind that Peter has said he thinks it's paranoid schizophrenia, not bipolar disorder, and he's the professional.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Conversation with Mr. Chivukula
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Joe geezerfr...@... wrote: snip But you know, the whole episode brings up a topic that has long fascinated me; and that is the very fine line that separates so-called enlightenment from borderline behavioral disorders such as paranoid schizophrenia. Paranoid schizophrenia is a psychosis, not a borderline behavioral disorder. Still can be a fine line, though.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Dome Meditation Numbers
I have heard some things which suggest that the plan is to focus more resources on getting the numbers nearer to 2500 over the next year and that is what the message of financial restraint to MUM was about, more money may go towards subsidies for new IA participants or additional Pundits ie why subsidise foreign students who then dont choose to contribute to coherence makes more sense to recruit the truly motivated http://invincibleamerica.org/tallies.html May be so. Would be nice to see the actual financial numbers. MUM is ongoing though. The administrative policy is to starve MUM to feed the domes? They have had ongoing troubles getting the meditation attendance numbers they would like to have. More than half the total daily tally numbers shown includes the pundit boys. That leaves some few hundreds of meditators otherwise. Students, faculty, staff, MUM MSAE, town ru's, paid IA people. Particularly in their relationship with town ru's or the larger old meditating TM movement, their administrative problem might not even be with resource. Bevan by MUM http://invincibleamerica.org/ John Hagelin by the Institute http://istpp.org/news/2009_05_ia_assembly.html Well-meaning meditators: http://goldendome.org/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Conversation with Mr. Chivukula
Right, my wife is a licensed behavioral therapist, not me, so my terms might not be quite right. However, I really do wonder about this fine line. Could it be that enlightenment is nothing more than sanctioned and approved paranoid schizophrenia? If so, did we pay a lot of money and spend a lot of time rounding in hopes of programming ourselves into a permanent state of paranoid schizophrenia? --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jst...@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Joe geezerfreak@ wrote: snip But you know, the whole episode brings up a topic that has long fascinated me; and that is the very fine line that separates so-called enlightenment from borderline behavioral disorders such as paranoid schizophrenia. Paranoid schizophrenia is a psychosis, not a borderline behavioral disorder. Still can be a fine line, though.
RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: Spirit a priori
Thanks for the link, Rick --- On Sat, 5/22/10, Rick Archer r...@searchsummit.com wrote: From: Rick Archer r...@searchsummit.com Subject: RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: Spirit a priori To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Date: Saturday, May 22, 2010, 9:51 PM From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:fairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Peter Sent: Saturday, May 22, 2010 7:40 PM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Spirit a priori I always have a desire to go back there. I was a MIU student from '74 to '78; then Purusha for a year there and finally TSR from '83 to '89. Things seem very different now. Come and visit some time, Pete. Allegiant Air has ridiculously cheap flights between here and Florida.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Spirit a priori
I always have a desire to go back there. I was a MIU student from '74 to '78; then Purusha for a year there and finally TSR from '83 to '89. Things seem very different now. Come and visit some time, Pete. Allegiant Air has ridiculously cheap flights between here and Florida. Pete, also call ahead to campus and apply to get in the dome for meditation. Meditating in the domes on campus is impressive and should be part of a visit. Of course Rick and I would not be able to join you there, we're meditators banished from the domes. Is also possible to rent small guest houses on campus now. -Buck in FF
[FairfieldLife] Re: Conversation with Mr. Chivukula
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Joe geezerfr...@... wrote: Right, my wife is a licensed behavioral therapist, not me, so my terms might not be quite right. However, I really do wonder about this fine line. Could it be that enlightenment is nothing more than sanctioned and approved paranoid schizophrenia? If so, did we pay a lot of money and spend a lot of time rounding in hopes of programming ourselves into a permanent state of paranoid schizophrenia? Naah. Although if one were predisposed to it, I suspect it could be triggered by long rounding. On the other hand, it would probably develop at some point anyway. (Check with Peter on that--he's the professional.) But when you say sanctioned and approved, that gets to an important issue--to what degree is what we call mental illness simply a different way of experiencing and responding to the world? To what degree is the dysfunction of individuals diagnosed with mental illness simply a matter of this difference in experience and response? Are people who experience the world differently but who function very well the ones we think of as enlightened? Should people who are perfectly happy wth the way they experience the world, even if it's starkly different from the way most people do, even if it appears dysfunctional, be considered mentally ill? Or are they mentally ill only if they're in distress? It gets all tangled up with philosophy and semantics and a person's subjective experience versus how the person appears to others. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Joe geezerfreak@ wrote: snip But you know, the whole episode brings up a topic that has long fascinated me; and that is the very fine line that separates so-called enlightenment from borderline behavioral disorders such as paranoid schizophrenia. Paranoid schizophrenia is a psychosis, not a borderline behavioral disorder. Still can be a fine line, though.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Ultimate hailstorm
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozg...@... wrote: authfriend wrote: At least, one *hopes* it's the ultimate hailstorm! Unbelievable. http://news.yahoo.com/video/us-15749625/hail-storm-hits-oklahoma-19917666;_ylt=AqGdZBKrxkoRpDGo9haKo1uz174F;_ylu=X3oDMTE3dTVmdmJ1BHBvcwMxBHNlYwNtb3N0LXBvcHVsYXIEc2xrA2hhaWxzdG9ybWhpdA-- http://tinyurl.com/27ys24s Looks impressive hitting a pool of water but we really can't tell the size of the stones. Er, yes, you can. Look at the ones on the ground. Many of them are as big as softballs.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Spirit a priori
Buck, you seem like quite the reasonable chap. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer r...@... wrote: I'll speak for him in case he doesn't: Are you in Fairfield, Yes. dome attending, etc? no. In good standing, so to speak? No. Yep, like Rick.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Spirit a priori
Pardon my asking, but how can someone get kicked out of the domes and not be in good standing? From: Buck dhamiltony...@yahoo.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sat, 22 May, 2010 10:29:10 PM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Spirit a priori Buck, you seem like quite the reasonable chap. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer r...@... wrote: I'll speak for him in case he doesn't: Are you in Fairfield, Yes. dome attending, etc? no. In good standing, so to speak? No. Yep, like Rick.
RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: Spirit a priori
From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:fairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of ditzyklanmail Sent: Saturday, May 22, 2010 10:44 PM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Spirit a priori Pardon my asking, but how can someone get kicked out of the domes and not be in good standing? In my case it was for being involved with Amma. Not sure what Buck's crime was.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Conversation with Mr. Chivukula
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wayback71 waybac...@... wrote: But if Ravi is plain old seriously manic, and then gets good treatment and maintains it, then all this guru stuff will seem wild to him, too. In fact, if he gets well, he will understand why he felt that way but also recognize that it was totally unreal and part of the illness. He will hope that people can forget or forgive his wildness and wish that he had not broadcast his instability so far and wide. He won't be insisting on being a guru anymore and he won't feel like one, either, dull as that may be. Let's hope he gets good treatment . Which is precisely why treatment will be so difficult, even if he willingly undergoes it. I for one do not believe a word of him checking himself into a mental health care facility. There is a case to be made here for an Indian guy, tired of the responsibilities of wife and children, trying to find an acceptable way of dumping them. In his culture, one of those ways is to declare yourself enlightened. If you do, you now get judged by an entirely different set of standards than anyone else. You get to not only dump your wife and kids without being considered an irrespon- sible asshole for doing so, you get *praised* for doing so, because you're now following your inner voice and dedicating yourself to gurudom and spreading the light. I'm not sure what exactly *is* going on here in the Ravi Incident. All I'm sure of is that the *myth* of enlight- enment and what it means plays a big part in it. Rick -- and he's still never told us how he came to hear about Ravi and choose him for one of his interviews -- gave him a platform from which to announce his awakening. Rick's -- and others' -- first impulse was to *defend* his supposed normal enlightened status rather than be concerned, which they almost certainly would have been given anyone else spouting such craziness. The *secondary* impulse we've been seeing here, in my opinion, is a bout of protect the guru, with any responsibility being not only shifted away from Amma and her organization, but taking it as an opportunity to write bhaktied-out love poems for her. And now Ravi's interview has quietly been disappeared from the list, so as not to somehow cast questions upon the other interviews, and on the whole concept of ordinary enlightenment. I'm pointing these things out because no one else is. I think this whole Ravi thing is very, very sad. But I think that what it's bringing out in some of the believers in enlightenment as the highest goal at the end of the highest path is in ways sadder. Where is the point at which people sit back and say, Now wait a minute...if *this* guy could convince so many of his supposed 'enlightenment,' how many *others* in the long history of spirituality have done exactly the same thing? Could they *all* have been nothing but charismatic manic depressives? A critical view of such things is not IMO out of line. It provides a *balance* between unthinking belief and unthinking dismissal. I still believe that such a thing as enlightenment exists. But I don't believe that it either 1) confers any innate instant respectability as a guru on those claiming it, or 2) is important enough to pay very much attention to. Those who feel that #2 is wrong and that it *should* be paid attention to as the remarkable achievement it is seen to be the ones getting their buttons pushed in all of this. Just as if Ravi got help and was able to see that much of his raving was *just* raving and not something holy, anyone watching that happen from the sidelines would see the same thing. And a lot of people have IMO so much *invested* in the traditional descriptions of enlightenment and what it means that they don't want that to happen. Just my opinion...
[FairfieldLife] Re: Conversation with Mr. Chivukula
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer r...@... wrote: On Behalf Of Joe Yep, you wonder just how much of the whole story is bullshit and what isn't. Could it be some kind of over-the-top weird devotional to Amma? A very poor advertisement if so. Hardly one she would appreciate. Why? Really. I don't think you quite understand the import of what you are saying, Rick. Are you really suggesting that it's *right* for a guru to *keep* their students devoted to them? Many of his posts, including in the Amma chat, proclaim his independence from her and his new status as guru in his own right. As did Maharishi, rejecting and divorcing himself from essentially the entire tradition he had been part of, which would never have allowed him to be a teacher. Seems to me that there is a bit of a double standard going on here...
[FairfieldLife] Re: Conversation with Mr. Chivukula
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Joe geezerfr...@... wrote: Yes...now that you mention it, there was that one post from him saying he would eat Amma for lunch and Maharishi for dinner, or words to that effect. But you know, the whole episode brings up a topic that has long fascinated me; and that is the very fine line that separates so-called enlightenment from borderline behavioral disorders such as paranoid schizophrenia. I'm open to the possibility that enlightenment is just a stamp of authenticity on certain behavioral disorders. When I spent time around MMY I certainly saw behaviors that would have sent most folks in for some mental retread time. Bingo. That is *exactly* the point I've been trying to make. The much larger issue here is the seeming inability of many people to perceive the claim of enlightenment as in the same ballpark as any other claim made by any other crazy person. *It's all going on in their heads*. ALL of it. But for some people, because they have invested so much of their belief and so much money and so many years of their lives *into* believing that enlightenment is the highest goal, they have to divorce their reaction to Ravi as a fairly obvious crazy person from having any wider implications, and resist taking a critical look at the claims of *other* persons who have made similarly solisistic statements and similar claims in the past. How many of *them* (people revered in the past or the present as enlightened gurus) walked away from the responsibilities of wife and family and got *praised* for it, not badrapped? How many of *them* became as dismissive of those who didn't revere them as Ravi has, and treated them the way he does? How many of *them* had a similar inability to appreciate anyone else's point of view than their own, and consider it valid? My point is that people seem to be stopping at the surface of this whole tempest in a pisspot, and not looking beneath the surface at its implications. I'm merely looking at them, and bringing them up for consideration. Not that I think any of these things will actually be considered. In my experience, the allegiance to a long-held set of beliefs is almost always stronger than the allegiance to reality. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer rick@ wrote: From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:fairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Joe Sent: Saturday, May 22, 2010 7:03 PM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Conversation with Mr. Chivukula Yep, you wonder just how much of the whole story is bullshit and what isn't. Could it be some kind of over-the-top weird devotional to Amma? A very poor advertisement if so. Hardly one she would appreciate. Many of his posts, including in the Amma chat, proclaim his independence from her and his new status as guru in his own right.
