Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
You were knocking on booty - Original Message From: shempmcgurk [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Sunday, October 29, 2006 4:26:26 AMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues" [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: We also knocked the most booty.Pleae elaborate...(and I'm a little slow...what does "knocked the most booty" mean exactly?) --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "llundrub" llundrub@ wrote: so maybe the second most populous year ;) - Original Message - From: "curtisdeltablues" curtisdeltablues@ To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, October 28, 2006 7:40 PM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "llundrub" llundrub@ wrote: My class at MIU was the largest first year class ever - year of 83. How many were in your class?I think we had 350 in the freshman class of'75. - Original Message -From: "new.morning" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, October 28, 2006 11:45 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona"--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig" sparaig@ wrote: perhaps because New Morning never saw it and chooses not to assumethat hearsay is true? My suggested phase I was mid 60s to early 70s --71 or so. I had agreat time in that era of the TMO. Most people I know did. Some peoplemaking comments were in grade or high school during that period,AFAIR, and had no direct experience of that era. If some feel theyknow that era better, by reading reports by some of (mostly) adifferent era, then what can I say. My primary point was that the TMO, from my observation, went throughvarious phases. If some dispute that on their experience, fine. Thosespeaking on no experience for mid 60s-early 70s are just blowing hotair, IMO. And while I saw some odd things in that period, it was mostlypositive. And as I suggested in my spec piece, things changed in72-77 or so -- more bureaucratic. Still, many had a great time. 77+ --it got quite odd. I left. Others stayed on, and on and on, even giventhe weirdness. If they weren't having a good time, and did not likethe org, I am puzzled why they didn't leave.To subscribe, send a message to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/and click 'Join This Group!'Yahoo! Groups Links To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links To subscribe, send a message to:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links* To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/* Your email settings:Individual Email | Traditional* To change settings online go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join(Yahoo! ID required)* To change settings via email:mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]* To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED]* Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
Does anyone know where Leone Maitre is ? - Original Message From: shempmcgurk [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Sunday, October 29, 2006 4:07:29 AMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "llundrub" [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My class at MIU was the largest first year class ever - year of 83.Really?More than the 360 first yearers in Fall, '75? - Original Message - From: "new.morning" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, October 28, 2006 11:45 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona"--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig" sparaig@ wrote: perhaps because New Morning never saw it and chooses not to assume that hearsay is true? My suggested phase I was mid 60s to early 70s --71 or so. I had a great time in that era of the TMO. Most people I know did. Some people making comments were in grade or high school during that period, AFAIR, and had no direct experience of that era. If some feel they know that era better, by reading reports by some of (mostly) a different era, then what can I say. My primary point was that the TMO, from my observation, went through various phases. If some dispute that on their experience, fine. Those speaking on no experience for mid 60s-early 70s are just blowing hot air, IMO. And while I saw some odd things in that period, it was mostly positive. And as I suggested in my spec piece, things changed in 72-77 or so -- more bureaucratic. Still, many had a great time. 77+ -- it got quite odd. I left. Others stayed on, and on and on, even given the weirdness. If they weren't having a good time, and did not like the org, I am puzzled why they didn't leave. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links To subscribe, send a message to:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links* To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/* Your email settings:Individual Email | Traditional* To change settings online go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join(Yahoo! ID required)* To change settings via email:mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]* To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED]* Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
And why were u knocking the beauty? was the beauty smelly, was the beauty bad? Why were you knocking it? - Original Message From: curtisdeltablues [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Sunday, October 29, 2006 2:51:58 AMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" We also knocked the most booty.--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "llundrub" [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: so maybe the second most populous year ;) - Original Message - From: "curtisdeltablues" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, October 28, 2006 7:40 PM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona"--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "llundrub" llundrub@ wrote: My class at MIU was the largest first year class ever - year of 83. How many were in your class?I think we had 350 in the freshman class of'75. - Original Message - From: "new.morning" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, October 28, 2006 11:45 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig" sparaig@ wrote: perhaps because New Morning never saw it and chooses not to assume that hearsay is true? My suggested phase I was mid 60s to early 70s --71 or so. I had a great time in that era of the TMO. Most people I know did. Somepeople making comments were in grade or high school during that period, AFAIR, and had no direct experience of that era. If some feel they know that era better, by reading reports by some of (mostly) a different era, then what can I say. My primary point was that the TMO, from my observation, wentthrough various phases. If some dispute that on their experience, fine.Those speaking on no experience for mid 60s-early 70s are justblowing hot air, IMO. And while I saw some odd things in that period, it was mostly positive. And as I suggested in my spec piece, things changed in 72-77 or so -- more bureaucratic. Still, many had a great time.77+ -- it got quite odd. I left. Others stayed on, and on and on, evengiven the weirdness. If they weren't having a good time, and didnot like the org, I am puzzled why they didn't leave. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups LinksTo subscribe, send a message to:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links* To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/* Your email settings:Individual Email | Traditional* To change settings online go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join(Yahoo! ID required)* To change settings via email:mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]* To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED]* Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
but there were many who spoke like they had this sexual relationship with him, they were in love fantasies of marriage and so forth. - Original Message From: Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: "FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com" FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Sunday, October 29, 2006 1:41:01 AMSubject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona"on 10/28/06 10:17 PM, Louis McKenzie at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So are ou saying that he was having sex with women? At MIU in 76 there was a girl who swore she had sex with.Care to finish that thought? __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
OK so now I think I understand you tapped the beauty. Wow! was that fun tapping the beauty? In the old days people didn't tap the beauty, was this done instead of sex? - Original Message From: curtisdeltablues [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Sunday, October 29, 2006 11:21:37 AMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Louis McKenzie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: And why were u knocking the beauty?was the beauty smelly, was thebeauty bad?Why were you knocking it?I guess "tapped" would have been a better word choice!Make moresense now?Our class tapped the most booty. - Original Message From: curtisdeltablues [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, October 29, 2006 2:51:58 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and theTMO's "Persona" We also knocked the most booty. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "llundrub" llundrub@ wrote: so maybe the second most populous year ;) - Original Message - From: "curtisdeltablues" curtisdeltablues@ To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, October 28, 2006 7:40 PM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "llundrub" llundrub@ wrote: My class at MIU was the largest first year class ever - year of 83. How many were in your class?I think we had 350 in the freshmanclass of'75. - Original Message -From: "new.morning" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, October 28, 2006 11:45 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and theTMO's "Persona"--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig" sparaig@ wrote: perhaps because New Morning never saw it and chooses not toassumethat hearsay is true? My suggested phase I was mid 60s to early 70s --71 or so. I had agreat time in that era of the TMO. Most people I know did. Some peoplemaking comments were in grade or high school during that period,AFAIR, and had no direct experience of that era. If some feeltheyknow that era better, by reading reports by some of (mostly) a different era, then what can I say. My primary point was that the TMO, from my observation, went throughvarious phases. If some dispute that on their experience, fine. Thosespeaking on no experience for mid 60s-early 70s are just blowing hotair, IMO. And while I saw some odd things in that period, it was mostlypositive. And as I suggested in my spec piece, thingschanged in72-77 or so -- more bureaucratic. Still, many had a great time. 77+ --it got quite odd. I left. Others stayed on, and on and on, even giventhe weirdness. If they weren't having a good time, and did not like the org, I am puzzled why they didn't leave.To subscribe, send a message to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/and click 'Join This Group!'Yahoo! Groups Links To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups LinksTo subscribe, send a message to:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links* To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/* Your email settings:Individual Email | Traditional* To change settings online go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join(Yahoo! ID required)* To change settings via email:mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]* To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED]* Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
Title: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona on 10/29/06 4:54 AM, Louis McKenzie at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: but there were many who spoke like they had this sexual relationship with him, they were in love fantasies of marriage and so forth. But some actually did. It wasnt a fantasy. I was just wondering if you had found another one. __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
I must say I didn't have a hell of a lot of sex at MIU or UCSD well I met my first wife at MIU( caused a big stir, they were right I was wrong) We divorced while I was at UCSD. But I think I actually only had two girlfriends at MIU the whole time and they were brief.. Sex wasn't my objective.. - Original Message From: authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Sunday, October 29, 2006 12:18:24 PMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues" [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend" jstein@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Louis McKenzie ltm457@ wrote: And why were u knocking the beauty?was the beauty smelly, was the beauty bad?Why were you knocking it?No, no, "booty," as in plunder, prize, the spoils of conquest; "knock" as in knock down, conquer, take for oneself. Actually it was a play on "knocking boots" or sex, but I subbed "booty", hip hop for butt. It cannot be twisted into a putdown on women. Some women like this activity as much as men Judy.Now am I gunna have to explain "tapped" so you don't accuse me of something foul or do you just want to turn on your radio sometime and give it a listen?The exact meaning of the slang is unimportant.I was commenting more on the triumphalist toneand the score-keeping, the emphasis on sex rather than on relationships, which, IMHO, isn'tgreat for either men or women.It's one thing when you're young and foolish and don't know any better--I had more than my shareof casual sex when I was that age, believe me--butquite another when you're still bragging about itdecades later as if you never got beyond it.To subscribe, send a message to:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links* To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/* Your email settings:Individual Email | Traditional* To change settings online go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join(Yahoo! ID required)* To change settings via email:mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]* To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED]* Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
I know tapped as in putting a hole in a well and getting water. Tapped. Or as in dance, did u dance on the beauty booty? Or did you take your hand and actually tap on it tap tap tap kinda thing how exactly do you mean tap. Are you sadistic? - Original Message From: curtisdeltablues [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Sunday, October 29, 2006 12:00:31 PMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend" [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Louis McKenzie ltm457@ wrote: And why were u knocking the beauty?was the beauty smelly, was the beauty bad?Why were you knocking it? No, no, "booty," as in plunder, prize, the spoils of conquest; "knock" as in knock down, conquer, take for oneself.Actually it was a play on "knocking boots" or sex, but I subbed"booty", hip hop for butt. It cannot be twisted into a putdown onwomen. Some women like this activity as much as men Judy.Now am Igunna have to explain "tapped" so you don't accuse me of somethingfoul or do you just want to turn on your radio sometime and give it alisten?- Original Message From: curtisdeltablues curtisdeltablues@ To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, October 29, 2006 2:51:58 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" We also knocked the most booty. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "llundrub" llundrub@ wrote: so maybe the second most populous year ;) - Original Message -From: "curtisdeltablues" curtisdeltablues@ To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, October 28, 2006 7:40 PM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's"Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "llundrub" llundrub@ wrote: My class at MIU was the largest first year class ever - year of 83. How many were in your class?I think we had 350 in the freshman classof'75. - Original Message - From: "new.morning" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, October 28, 2006 11:45 AMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's"Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig" sparaig@ wrote: perhaps because New Morning never saw it and chooses not to assume that hearsay is true? My suggested phase I was mid 60s to early 70s --71 or so. I had a great time in that era of the TMO. Most people I know did. Some people making comments were in grade or high school during that period, AFAIR, and had no direct experience of that era. If some feel they know that era better, by reading reports by some of (mostly) a different era, then what can I say. My primary point was that the TMO, from my observation, went through various phases. If some dispute that on their experience, fine. Those speaking on no experience for mid 60s-early 70s are just blowing hot air, IMO. And while I saw some odd things in that period, it was mostly positive. And as I suggested in my spec piece, things changed in 72-77 or so -- more bureaucratic. Still, many had a great time. 77+ -- it got quite odd. I left. Others stayed on, and on and on, even given the weirdness. If they weren't having a good time, and did not like the org, I am puzzled why they didn't leave. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links To subscribe, send a message to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/and click 'Join This Group!'Yahoo! Groups Links To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED]Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links To subscribe, send a message to:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links* To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/* Your email settings:Individual Email | Traditional* To change settings online go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join(Yahoo! ID required)* To change settings via email:mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]* To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED]* Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
I think I said this before that two women were in the girls bathroom in Student Union and one was telling all to the other. - Original Message From: Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: "FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com" FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Sunday, October 29, 2006 11:08:36 AMSubject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona"on 10/29/06 4:54 AM, Louis McKenzie at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: but there were many who spoke like they had this sexual relationship with him, they were in love fantasies of marriage and so forth.But some actually did. It wasn’t a fantasy. I was just wondering if you had found another one. __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
Once in Brasil while speaking to queen marcia in regard to king tk I said Ele esta chegando aqui soh em busca de bucetaOH BOY! What i said was that the guy was simply coming here behind sex as in slang he is just out for pussy. WOW! did she go nuts. I think we have spoken 4 times at most since then. In Brasil they dont talk about sex or use sexual expressions they way we do. Maybe here it is the same? - Original Message From: curtisdeltablues [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Sunday, October 29, 2006 2:12:42 PMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" Judy: "You were wrong in your first impression of what Iwrote--that I was accusing you of putting downwomen--and I haven't seen you admit that."Judy from an earlier post: "No, no, "booty," as in plunder, prize, thespoils of conquest; "knock" as in knock down, conquer,take for oneself."Me: Yeah, I don't know how I would have interpreted this as a putdownon me for having a bad attitude about women.It might have been thewords you used and their meaning.As far as my own malicious digs back at you, you are right.We have ashitty communication dynamic and I take responsibility for my part of it.--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend" [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues" curtisdeltablues@ wrote: Judy: It's one thing when you're young and foolish anddon't know any better--I had more than my share of casual sex when I was that age, believe me--but quite another when you're still bragging about it decades later as if you never got beyond it. Me: There was no triumphalist tone Judy. Oh, nonsense, of course there was. You made it all up.All my "boot knocking" at MIU was in the context of relationships, I was never into casual sex since relationship sex is much better for me. You made up a put down, and having been called on it, you are attempting to continue your farce.You were wrong about the words and what I meant, and even after that is proven to you, you hold on to your malicious agenda.It was a throwaway line for people with a sense of humor, only you would try to twist it into a putdown of me. You mean, the way you tried to twist what I wrote to start with into a slam at you for putting down women?Not to mention your insinuation that I don't enjoy sex much.You aren't exactly in a position to be self-righteous about "malicious agendas." I'm not sure how you have "proved" anything to me. You've made a claim about what you actually meant. Our class at MIU was mostly just out of high school, normal college kids.We were not exposed to the celibacy weirdness that came later. So we had normal relationships and had sex like normal college kids. The later classes of MIU got the "sex is bad" message so they were conflicted about having sex, even in the context of committed relationships.So my class had the most sex because we had not yet bee messed up my movement superstitions about sex as losing magic energy.So your point was a made-up put down, and you can't admit you were wrong like a decent person You were wrong in your first impression of what I wrote--that I was accusing you of putting down women--and I haven't seen you admit that. And I haven't had a *chance* to admit I was wrong about what *I* actually meant until this post.I'm happy to take your claim in the post I'm responding to at face value and acknowledge that I misunderstood what you were getting at. I guess I was misled by some of your previous remarks, and those of a couple of the other men here, which have seemed to me to put a premium on sex for its own sake.That isn't what you were doing in this post.I should have commented on those earlier ones rather than waiting until this post.To subscribe, send a message to:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links* To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/* Your email settings:Individual Email | Traditional* To change settings online go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join(Yahoo! ID required)* To change settings via email:mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]* To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED]* Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
Title: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona on 10/29/06 9:56 AM, Louis McKenzie at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think I said this before that two women were in the girls bathroom in Student Union and one was telling all to the other. And then one of the girls told you, I presume. - Original Message From: Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, October 29, 2006 11:08:36 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona on 10/29/06 4:54 AM, Louis McKenzie at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: but there were many who spoke like they had this sexual relationship with him, they were in love fantasies of marriage and so forth. But some actually did. It wasnt a fantasy. I was just wondering if you had found another one. __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
I dont remember the name of the one talking she stayed at MIU a long time after. and she was talking to someone I still consider a freind so no names - Original Message From: Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: "FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com" FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Sunday, October 29, 2006 8:19:52 PMSubject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona"on 10/29/06 9:56 AM, Louis McKenzie at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think I said this before that two women were in the girls bathroom in Student Union and one was telling all to the other. And then one of the girls told you, I presume. - Original Message From: Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: "FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com" FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Sunday, October 29, 2006 11:08:36 AMSubject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona"on 10/29/06 4:54 AM, Louis McKenzie at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: but there were many who spoke like they had this sexual relationship with him, they were in love fantasies of marriage and so forth.But some actually did. It wasn’t a fantasy. I was just wondering if you had found another one. __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
On Oct 27, 2006, at 1:41 PM, jim_flanegin wrote:--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Oct 27, 2006, at 10:40 AM, TurquoiseB wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Louis McKenzie ltm457@ wrote: He knew what it was supposed to do. He maybe did not know that mechanics of how it would go. Just a question -- do you (or, for that matter, does *anyone* here) actually believe that Patanjali's technique involved thinking "relationship of body and akasha...lightness of cotton fiber" in ANY language, much less English? It *astounds* me that people still believe that what Maharishi sold to them is what Patanjali had in mind. And of course I had posted a while back the comments of Tat Whale Baba's successor who stated that it had to be done in Sanskrit. Levitation actually involves two sutras, not one, and a mastery of a certain form of prana, which is very dangerous without very close personal instruction. Hopping actually is another siddhi, the bhuchari siddhi, the siddhi of hopping like a frog... I suppose it comes down to whether I believe your interpretation of what Tat Whale Baba's successor said, and how you interpret the TM- Sidhis sutras vs. how Maharishi has brought them out. Given my own results and assuming myself to be quite an ordinary person, and therefore not prone to extraordinary spiritual results, I have to say that Maharishi's TM-Siddhis program works exactly as advertised; ridding the nervous system of deep stresses and preparing the practitioner for Self Realization. If what you are raising are academic quibbles over the program, I agree that there may be some insignificant distinctions noted. However, these are of no consequence practically. I practiced the full TM-Siddhis program for about 13 years, twice a day. I think the point is, despite the fact many of us had great experiences with our programs, myself included, there is no one who has full perfection of all of them.And of course the question that raises is "why not?". __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
On Oct 27, 2006, at 1:46 PM, jim_flanegin wrote:Geez, really hard to say. Rather I think it is a case of trying to explain the enigma that Maharishi appears to be to so many, in a not very positive way. I do get the sense that Vaj indulges in a far amount of Maharishi and TM bashing 'off camera'. No, it was merely a counterpoint, an "all possibilities" POV to New Morn's rosy romanticism and the rose-colors glasses he seems to wear much of the time.For example, how do you ignore that the era of good times of New Morn's first phase also corresponded to his Spiritual Incest phase? I don't know, but it received not a mention. Bizarre. __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
On Oct 27, 2006, at 3:37 PM, shempmcgurk wrote:--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: TurquoiseB wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Louis McKenzie ltm457@ wrote: I believe that Maharishi used what had the same meaning of the intended to sutra. However I also believe he had an idea of the most that could be acheived with the technique. I believe he will at some point introduce the second technique as he puts it when the environment is ready. Many people have hopped with this technique, I have only heard of a few incidents of hovering If that happens, do you think it will happen as a result of the technique that Maharishi teaches? I ask because, like a few others I've heard of, you are on record here as having hopped before you got the TM siddhi technique that supposedly "caused" it. I think that puts you in an interesting position from which to comment on the efficacy or non-efficacy of the technique. I hopped the first day after receiving it, but to this day don't know whether the technique itself did anything to "cause" that or whether it was self- suggestion on my part. So I'm honestly interested in your answer. I hopped prior to getting the flying sutra too. Probably about 3 months in advance and it happened at the same time with a bunch of folks in my area. The interesting thing was that everyone who was hopping spontaneously had been reading the Swami Muktananda books. ...and you don't even have to READ the Muktananda books...just take one gander at that photograph of Muktananda's guru, Nityananda, that he puts at the beginning of every one of his books (the one with the brushed in halo) and, at least for me, that's enough to affect me. Every time I look into Nityananda's eyes in that photo I have a weird experience. I too had some major improvement in my program after contact with their tradition. The most noticeable improvement came after I had met Nityananda and the Mahamandaleshwari he was studying with--an old friend of Baba's. One day I just heard a command shouted: "sit!". I immediately went into asana, my back arched, and a white hot beam of light rose into my heart, split into two cobalt blue energies down my arms which joined in front. After that I began transcending, at first, for ten minutes at a time. __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
On Oct 27, 2006, at 12:40 PM, Louis McKenzie wrote:I am new here I would like to see this site. No Louis it was not a site, it was a casual post made here by Rick at the beginning of October and recently commented on again about the Srivistava mafia as seen by some former major donors and how they feared for their lives while in India.Jai Guru Dev. __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
Yes, puris! Sounds right. Great little things, but a bit more labor-intensive than I can manage right now. We love homemade pizza too, and thanks for the tip about baking--have to save that. I agree food is a great ice-breaker, probably with anyone from any culture. Sal On Oct 27, 2006, at 3:06 PM, curtisdeltablues wrote: Sal, I think you are talking about Puris right? I don't mess with deep fried stuff much myself. I am usually only cooking for one or two so it is too much trouble. I make flat breads on a nice thick pizza stone, that makes a huge difference for all breads including pizzas. I recently went to NYC to see how they make pizzas in the last few remaining coal ovens, Grimaldi's in Brooklyn is one. Coal cooks at 800 degrees compared to about 600 for a wood oven. They get a char on the bread and I was chasing that flavor in my own oven. I figured out how to do it in my gas oven. I put the pizza stone on the bottom of the oven and crank it up to broil to pre-heat for almost an hour, Then I cook the thinly rolled pizza for about 5 minutes. After that I put it under the broiler to broil the top for another 3 minutes. I swear it is as good as any pizza in NYC's coal ovens! I spend some time here in DC talking to traditional cooks about how they make their foods. I find that it is the best way to start a conversation with people from other cultures. Lately I am chasing traditional Ethiopian Injera bread made from Tev, millet flour. Most Ethiopians here don't even bother to make it, they just buy it. I have to talk to the grandmothers to get the good tips! Food obsessions is the luxury of having no kids. I'm sure when yours get a little older you will be back at the rolling pin! --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Curtis, Yeah, great place. I first started going there with a couple of friends when the food at CNL was crummy (pretty often) and that was a wonderful change...and it was also, of course, OTP, making it even more enjoyable. :) Those were the days. That's great that you got to know the family and learned some cooking techniques. At one point I was pretty good at making that puffy type of Indian bread (can't think of the name right now) but quit because I figured kids and hot oil didn't mix too well. Now we get take-out but at some point I hope to get back to making it myself, as I love Indian cooking too. Sal On Oct 26, 2006, at 10:47 PM, curtisdeltablues wrote: Sal, That's great that you remember Parus. It was run by a South Indian woman and her two daughters. Very homey and simple. She taught me how to toast the coriander seeds and coconut for Sambar, and how to let the Idli batter ferment properly to get that great sourness. I can equal her Idlis and Sambar from her help, but not her Dosas. I think you really need a griddle to make them right. She was really sweet to me and spent a lot of time teaching me her cooking methods. I was much more into getting the details down then her two daughters! Since it was an easy walk from the center it must have been a movement mecca for all the years it was in business. I went there first in 1983 when I first met you at the CNL. I know one daughter got married and had a baby after college, and the other was in college the last time I talked with her. I'm guessing it closed in the mid 90's. Since South Indian style is my favorite by a long shot, I am always trying any place that serves South Indian food, but none are as charming and delicious as that place. It attracted a great mix of people, a funky crowd. I made some Besan Dhoklas and coconut chutney tonight, so it really made me think of Parus and her kindness. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine salsunshine@ wrote: On Oct 26, 2006, at 9:21 PM, curtisdeltablues wrote: Was the South Indian restaurant Parus on T street opened when you were there? She taught me to make Idli and dosa and Sambar. It is gone now, but I loved that place. Curtis, I'm pretty sure that was the place I was trying to think of, where I used to go with a couple of friends. Was it a small place, just a few tables, self-serve, on some little side-street off Dupont Circle? If so, I loved that place too. When did it close? Sal To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
On Oct 28, 2006, at 12:28 PM, sparaig wrote:--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think the point is, despite the fact many of us had great experiences with our programs, myself included, there is no one who has full perfection of all of them. And of course the question that raises is "why not?". Because no-one in the world has, atleast not in many generations? loud buzzer sound. Oh, sorry Spare Rag. __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
On Oct 28, 2006, at 12:29 PM, sparaig wrote:--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Oct 27, 2006, at 1:46 PM, jim_flanegin wrote: Geez, really hard to say. Rather I think it is a case of trying to explain the enigma that Maharishi appears to be to so many, in a not very positive way. I do get the sense that Vaj indulges in a far amount of Maharishi and TM bashing 'off camera'. No, it was merely a counterpoint, an "all possibilities" POV to New Morn's rosy romanticism and the rose-colors glasses he seems to wear much of the time. For example, how do you ignore that the era of good times of New Morn's first phase also corresponded to his Spiritual Incest phase? I don't know, but it received not a mention. Bizarre. perhaps because New Morning never saw it and chooses not to assume that hearsay is true? Exactly the point: if you were never a member of the inner circle where all this was going on, you probably wouldn't have. __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
Well Guys what does one get from MMY Bashing. Is there some thrill in it? Figure if you have time to MMY bash that means you are not doing all you can do to benefit from any of the things anyway. So maybe there is a nother consciousness at hand. In the world especially US there are many people who are born cryers. If they dont see where they are getting their satisfaction they cry fraud. I had a good friend he built a company that sold water purification multilevel. The US Gov. too him and his compnay down because some people who jumped in jumped in with all they had plus in order to get RICH. WHen they found things weren't quite like they were told they decided to sue. Basically there are many people like me who have read the GITA a zillion times because MMY said that each time you read chapter 2 it brings you closer to CC. Nice line of Bullshit. But maybe it was not complete BS. The thing is TM has value meditation is valuable. So maybe there is more to do. Well look at all the more that has come about in the last 30 years. maybe it is better to take the value and do what you need to do than to sit around wasting time complaining???= Nothing better to do??? OH BOY! - Original Message From: sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Saturday, October 28, 2006 2:29:32 PMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Vaj vajranatha@ ... wrote: On Oct 27, 2006, at 1:46 PM, jim_flanegin wrote: Geez, really hard to say. Rather I think it is a case of trying to explain the enigma that Maharishi appears to be to so many, in a not very positive way. I do get the sense that Vaj indulges in a far amount of Maharishi and TM bashing 'off camera'. No, it was merely a counterpoint, an "all possibilities" POV to New Morn's rosy romanticism and the rose-colors glasses he seems to wear much of the time. For example, how do you ignore that the era of good times of New Morn's first phase also corresponded to his Spiritual Incest phase? I don't know, but it received not a mention. Bizarre.perhaps because New Morning never saw it and chooses not to assume that hearsay is true? __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
I love GURU MAI I met Muktananda in 1980 before he died. I Liked him but I was a Maharishi boy so no turning coats. We got his darshan and he kept us near him this was in Santa Monica. I guess he died in 1982 I actually went to the Syda yoga center to do Arti the day he died. Anywas when I met BABA I met Malti. To this day I have a passion for her. I kept meditating because for me TM worked and she never has held that against me. but she is tough. Great Darshan but she is very down to earth and very present. A great business woman. I respect that and it makes me see that all of this airy fairy stuff that we put on them has nothing to do with enlightenment. - Original Message From: jim_flanegin [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Saturday, October 28, 2006 2:38:38 PMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Vaj vajranatha@ ... wrote: On Oct 27, 2006, at 3:37 PM, shempmcgurk wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote: TurquoiseB wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Louis McKenzie ltm457@ wrote: I believe that Maharishi used what had the same meaning of the intended to sutra. However I also believe he had an idea of the most that could be acheived with the technique. I believe he will at some point introduce the second technique as he puts it when the environment is ready. Many people have hopped with this technique, I have only heard of a few incidents of hovering If that happens, do you think it will happen as a result of the technique that Maharishi teaches? I ask because, like a few others I've heard of, you are on record here as having hopped before you got the TM siddhi technique that supposedly "caused" it. I think that puts you in an interesting position from which to comment on the efficacy or non-efficacy of the technique. I hopped the first day after receiving it, but to this day don't know whether the technique itself did anything to "cause" that or whether it was self- suggestion on my part. So I'm honestly interested in your answer. I hopped prior to getting the flying sutra too. Probably about 3 months in advance and it happened at the same time with a bunch of folks in my area. The interesting thing was that everyone who was hopping spontaneously had been reading the Swami Muktananda books....and you don't even have to READ the Muktananda books...just take one gander at that photograph of Muktananda's guru, Nityananda, that he puts at the beginning of every one of his books (the one with the brushed in halo) and, at least for me, that's enough to affect me. Every time I look into Nityananda's eyes in that photo I have a weird experience. I too had some major improvement in my program after contact with their tradition. The most noticeable improvement came after I had met Nityananda and the Mahamandaleshwari he was studying with--an old friend of Baba's. One day I just heard a command shouted: "sit!". I immediately went into asana, my back arched, and a white hot beam of light rose into my heart, split into two cobalt blue energies down my arms which joined in front. After that I began transcending, at first, for ten minutes at a time.Sounds great! __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
I dont know what that is. SO what why waste thoughts on that? I have found that I can take the same energy and use to create something.. - Original Message From: Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Saturday, October 28, 2006 2:51:52 PMSubject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" On Oct 28, 2006, at 12:28 PM, sparaig wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] .. wrote: I think the point is, despite the fact many of us had great experiences with our programs, myself included, there is no one who has full perfection of all of them. And of course the question that raises is "why not?". Because no-one in the world has, atleast not in many generations? loud buzzer sound. Oh, sorry Spare Rag. __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
That was not my experience with Bill Gouldd. I got in and sold all of the products I wanted to sell. I learned a lot from him and he has helped me in other business efforts. - Original Message From: jim_flanegin [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Saturday, October 28, 2006 3:45:02 PMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Louis McKenzie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well Guys what does one get from MMY Bashing. Is there some thrill in it? Figure if you have time to MMY bash that means you are not doing all you can do to benefit from any of the things anyway. So maybe there is a nother consciousness at hand. In the world especially US there are many people who are born cryers. If they dont see where they are getting their satisfaction they cry fraud. I had a good friend he built a company that sold water purification multilevel. The US Gov. too him and his compnay down because some people who jumped in jumped in with all they had plus in order to get RICH. WHen they found things weren't quite like they were told they decided to sue. If you are talking about Equinox and Bill Gouldd, the reason people sued was he created what is known as a pyramid scheme- those early in make all the money. The purpose of the business becomes not selling products but getting more and more people to contribute money at the bottom of the pyramid for the benefit of the people at the top. Mathematically this model is not sustainable, and can only be sustained by fraudulent and unethical practices. Basically there are many people like me who have read the GITA a zillion times because MMY said that each time you read chapter 2 it brings you closer to CC.snip Yes, the value in reading the Gita is it aligns your thinking with Maharishi's. If that is desirable, then the Gita does a very good job of this. I still open mine up sometimes and read for a minute, just for a mini-tune up. It cleans the active mind momentarily. __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
of their head just got blown off SO! Or that Inner light works. Once I had my car stollen in NYC I was at Trevor's house. WHile meditating during program it appreared where the car was. We went looking and voila there was the car. Trev was shocked. The SIDHIS work. THe only thing that may not work is me. If I am working the program works. - Original Message From: jim_flanegin [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Saturday, October 28, 2006 2:36:24 PMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Vaj vajranatha@ ... wrote: On Oct 27, 2006, at 1:41 PM, jim_flanegin wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Vaj vajranatha@ wrote:On Oct 27, 2006, at 10:40 AM, TurquoiseB wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Louis McKenzie ltm457@ wrote:He knew what it was supposed to do. He maybe did not know that mechanics of how it would go.Just a question -- do you (or, for that matter, does *anyone* here) actually believe that Patanjali's technique involved thinking "relationship of body and akasha...lightness of cotton fiber" in ANY language, much less English? It *astounds* me that people still believe that what Maharishi sold to them is what Patanjali had in mind. And of course I had posted a while back the comments of Tat Whale Baba's successor who stated that it had to be done in Sanskrit. Levitation actually involves two sutras, not one, and a mastery of a certain form of prana, which is very dangerous without very close personal instruction. Hopping actually is another siddhi, the bhuchari siddhi, the siddhi of hopping like a frog... I suppose it comes down to whether I believe your interpretation of what Tat Whale Baba's successor said, and how you interpret the TM- Sidhis sutras vs. how Maharishi has brought them out. Given my own results and assuming myself to be quite an ordinary person, and therefore not prone to extraordinary spiritual results, I have to say that Maharishi's TM-Siddhis program works exactly as advertised; ridding the nervous system of deep stresses and preparing the practitioner for Self Realization. If what you are raising are academic quibbles over the program, I agree that there may be some insignificant distinctions noted. However, these are of no consequence practically. I practiced the full TM-Siddhis program for about 13 years, twice a day. I think the point is, despite the fact many of us had great experiences with our programs, myself included, there is no one who has full perfection of all of them. And of course the question that raises is "why not?".That is to me an academic distinction. It IS a valid question, but the whole point is Self realization, not perfection of the Sidhis. And I am not just equivocating. If I hadn't experienced what I have, I'd probably be concerned with the boundaries of the Sidhis as well. But I did, so I'm not. It really isn't all that important whether or not we have perfected the Sidhis. The important thing is using the TM-Sidhis program to eliminate stress, to prepare ourselves for Self realization. __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
He is just teaching - Original Message From: jim_flanegin [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Saturday, October 28, 2006 4:36:57 PMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Louis McKenzie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: That was not my experience with Bill Gouldd. I got in and sold all of the products I wanted to sell. I learned a lot from him and he has helped me in other business efforts. Is he currently fronting other businesses that you know of? If so, can you list them please? __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
Jai Guru Dev. DO you know that to bring 45 pundits to the US right now is not easy. Visas and clearences. THis should be a time of great change. I hope all of you are prepared to ride the wave. - Original Message From: jim_flanegin [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Saturday, October 28, 2006 4:19:44 PMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Louis McKenzie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I love GURU MAI I met Muktananda in 1980 before he died. I Liked him but I was a Maharishi boy so no turning coats. We got his darshan and he kept us near him this was in Santa Monica. I guess he died in 1982 I actually went to the Syda yoga center to do Arti the day he died. Anywas when I met BABA I met Malti. To this day I have a passion for her. I kept meditating because for me TM worked and she never has held that against me. but she is tough. Great Darshan but she is very down to earth and very present. A great business woman. I respect that and it makes me see that all of this airy fairy stuff that we put on them has nothing to do with enlightenment. Exactly. Enlightenment is all about not just talking the talk, but walking the walk too. __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
Yes they sell support tools and he does trainings. - Original Message From: Alex Stanley [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Saturday, October 28, 2006 5:17:32 PMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, "jim_flanegin" [EMAIL PROTECTED] . wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Louis McKenzie ltm457@ wrote: That was not my experience with Bill Gouldd. I got in and sold all of the products I wanted to sell. I learned a lot from him and he has helped me in other business efforts. Is he currently fronting other businesses that you know of? If so, can you list them please?I sniffed around on The Google, and this was all I could come up with:http://www.agmsreps .com/main/ home.html __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
YES well fun is good but when fun becomes a full time job then it is questionable. - Original Message From: curtisdeltablues [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Saturday, October 28, 2006 5:28:51 PMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" Louis,I've given some thought to this since I've been posting here. It maybe that the terms "bashing MMY" and "crying" are just labels thatdon't really match what people are doing here. For a person likemyself who was very gung ho MMY for 15 year and now. as Borat wouldsay, "not so much", articulating my perspective on my movementexperience is wholly positive for me. I can't think of any posters here who represent only one simplisticperspective on MMY. Since MMY is so frail, and reminds me a littletoo much of my own aging father, I tend to cut him more slack thesedays. But it is still open season on the Rajas! Goofing on thatpompous silliness is a too much fun to miss.I do know that everybody has their own line they draw on beingcritical of MMY or TMO. Finding that line for yourself is one of themost positive perks of posting here. --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Louis McKenzie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well Guys what does one get from MMY Bashing. Is there some thrillin it? Figure if you have time to MMY bash that means you are not doing allyou can do to benefit from any of the things anyway. So maybe thereis a nother consciousness at hand. In the world especially US thereare many people who are born cryers. If they dont see where they aregetting their satisfaction they cry fraud. I had a good friend he built a company that sold water purificationmultilevel. The US Gov. too him and his compnay down because somepeople who jumped in jumped in with all they had plus in order to getRICH. WHen they found things weren't quite like they were told theydecided to sue. Basically there are many people like me who have read the GITA azillion times because MMY said that each time you read chapter 2 itbrings you closer to CC. Nice line of Bullshit. But maybe it was not complete BS. The thing is TM has valuemeditation is valuable. So maybe there is more to do. Well look atall the more that has come about in the last 30 years. maybe it isbetter to take the value and do what you need to do than to sit aroundwasting time complaining? ??= Nothing better to do??? OH BOY! - Original Message From: sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com Sent: Saturday, October 28, 2006 2:29:32 PM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and theTMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Vaj vajranatha@ ... wrote: On Oct 27, 2006, at 1:46 PM, jim_flanegin wrote: Geez, really hard to say. Rather I think it is a case of trying to explain the enigma that Maharishi appears to be to so many, in a not very positive way. I do get the sense that Vaj indulges in a far amount of Maharishi and TM bashing 'off camera'. No, it was merely a counterpoint, an "all possibilities" POV to New Morn's rosy romanticism and the rose-colors glasses he seems to wear much of the time.For example, how do you ignore that the era of good times of New Morn's first phase also corresponded to his Spiritual Incest phase? I don't know, but it received not a mention. Bizarre. perhaps because New Morning never saw it and chooses not to assumethat hearsay is true? __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
My class at MIU was the largest first year class ever - year of 83. - Original Message - From: new.morning [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, October 28, 2006 11:45 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: perhaps because New Morning never saw it and chooses not to assume that hearsay is true? My suggested phase I was mid 60s to early 70s --71 or so. I had a great time in that era of the TMO. Most people I know did. Some people making comments were in grade or high school during that period, AFAIR, and had no direct experience of that era. If some feel they know that era better, by reading reports by some of (mostly) a different era, then what can I say. My primary point was that the TMO, from my observation, went through various phases. If some dispute that on their experience, fine. Those speaking on no experience for mid 60s-early 70s are just blowing hot air, IMO. And while I saw some odd things in that period, it was mostly positive. And as I suggested in my spec piece, things changed in 72-77 or so -- more bureaucratic. Still, many had a great time. 77+ -- it got quite odd. I left. Others stayed on, and on and on, even given the weirdness. If they weren't having a good time, and did not like the org, I am puzzled why they didn't leave. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
People here are wayyy past MMY bashing. MMY could aspire to live up to some of the theories. - Original Message - From: Louis McKenzie To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, October 28, 2006 12:10 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" Well Guys what does one get from MMY Bashing. Is there some thrill in it? Figure if you have time to MMY bash that means you are not doing all you can do to benefit from any of the things anyway. So maybe there is a nother consciousness at hand. In the world especially US there are many people who are born cryers. If they dont see where they are getting their satisfaction they cry fraud. I had a good friend he built a company that sold water purification multilevel. The US Gov. too him and his compnay down because some people who jumped in jumped in with all they had plus in order to get RICH. WHen they found things weren't quite like they were told they decided to sue. Basically there are many people like me who have read the GITA a zillion times because MMY said that each time you read chapter 2 it brings you closer to CC. Nice line of Bullshit. But maybe it was not complete BS. The thing is TM has value meditation is valuable. So maybe there is more to do. Well look at all the more that has come about in the last 30 years. maybe it is better to take the value and do what you need to do than to sit around wasting time complaining???= Nothing better to do??? OH BOY! - Original Message From: sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Saturday, October 28, 2006 2:29:32 PMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Vaj vajranatha@ ... wrote: On Oct 27, 2006, at 1:46 PM, jim_flanegin wrote: Geez, really hard to say. Rather I think it is a case of trying to explain the enigma that Maharishi appears to be to so many, in a not very positive way. I do get the sense that Vaj indulges in a far amount of Maharishi and TM bashing 'off camera'. No, it was merely a counterpoint, an "all possibilities" POV to New Morn's rosy romanticism and the rose-colors glasses he seems to wear much of the time. For example, how do you ignore that the era of good times of New Morn's first phase also corresponded to his Spiritual Incest phase? I don't know, but it received not a mention. Bizarre.perhaps because New Morning never saw it and chooses not to assume that hearsay is true? __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
Sometimes I thought Bill Gouldd was off the wall. SOmetimes I thought he was an enlightened master. He could rap. His products were life supporting and helpful. But Like all Billionaires there is always a lot of opinion about them. In the survival for the fittest world one must learn from ALL. Then you create Value. When you just look for reasons then there will always be reasons. AMWAY is a much greater pyramid rip off than Equinox could ever be. No one took all of Jay Vanandle's money nor Rich Devoos. Multilevel marketing can all be considered pyramid. the problem was that some people took to lying and cheating to be big shots. THat only happened in Equinox. If they did what they did with Bill Gouldd to all multilevel companies then ok but they have not. If they thought it would have the right effect George Bush would take down Maharishi. Instead they think it better to ignore him. Lets see what happens when all of the pundits are here. I believe it is only to to his great compassion that he has decided to bring them at this time. If he was thinking as he can think, he would have waited until George BUsh was completely finished before doing anything that could ever change things during his tenure. Bill Gouldd had a big mouth sometimes and he didn't seem to care who heard. I love Bill Gouldd and Maharishi as businessmen because they started with very little and built up. If I could have 1/100 of the business savy that Maharishi has had to have or Bill Gouldd then I would be excited Bill Gouldd's Millionaire's Workshop of November 1998 was worth every penny. I had the tapes I used them over and over and over. In Brasil I have been able to use a lot of the information from the workshop. The idea these guys have created money for themselves and education and enlightenment for the world. Bill Gouldd has a line of health products I found to be very good. I used to love the rain forroest shampoo. I gave my aunt who lives in New Jersey near exon a water filter for he water. Learning to do cold recruiting was big stuff. it takes a lot to do that. Getting past the blockages of our own mind. Thank God we did not have to do cold recruiting in the TM system. But we did do intro lectures. - Original Message From: jim_flanegin [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Saturday, October 28, 2006 5:54:51 PMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, "Alex Stanley" j_alexander_ [EMAIL PROTECTED] .. wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, "jim_flanegin" jflanegi@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Louis McKenzie ltm457@ wrote: That was not my experience with Bill Gouldd. I got in and sold all of the products I wanted to sell. I learned a lot from him and he has helped me in other business efforts. Is he currently fronting other businesses that you know of? If so, can you list them please? I sniffed around on The Google, and this was all I could come up with: http://www.agmsreps .com/main/ home.htmlThat is what I saw on The Google also... __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
Well it sure is good to be reconnecting with people I have not seen in forever. I have had to talk about a lot of the stuff that we discuss here in so many different way outside. It is nice to discuss stuff with like minds. allows for understanding...however one thing I did learn from Bob mandel LRT fame is blame and shame smell the same... - Original Message From: Marek Reavis [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Saturday, October 28, 2006 7:13:31 PMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" Comment below:**--- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, "curtisdeltablues"curtisdeltablues@ ... wrote: Louis, I've given some thought to this since I've been posting here. It may be that the terms "bashing MMY" and "crying" are just labels that don't really match what people are doing here. For a person like myself who was very gung ho MMY for 15 year and now. as Borat would say, "not so much", articulating my perspective on my movement experience is wholly positive for me. I can't think of any posters here who represent only one simplistic perspective on MMY. Since MMY is so frail, and reminds me a little too much of my own aging father, I tend to cut him more slack these days. But it is still open season on the Rajas! Goofing on that pompous silliness is a too much fun to miss. I do know that everybody has their own line they draw on being critical of MMY or TMO. Finding that line for yourself is one of the most positive perks of posting here. **Snip to end**This really resonates with my feelings re FFL. For myself (and forevery poster here, I would expect), the time within and relation tothe TMO represents a fundamental (and pivotal) portion of my lifeexperience. Having the opportunity to articulate it (and hear itarticulated by others) within a community that can actually relate toall the nuances and subtlies that are involved is very helpful. Atits best, FFL is very powerful satsang. __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
I am not a rah rah type never have been. I have been known to make jokes like. I wonder how a person like Maharishi goes to the bathroom. Does he get it all out in one fell swoop or does he have a hard time. Having lived in the west so long does he still use his left hand or is he now ambidextrous. I have been known for this kinds of humor. Also I always distinguish between what is the movement and what is Maharishi but to put Maharishi down been known to do that too. Especially in regard to his treatement of another favored Guru type. THen I got to see things from another perspective. - Original Message From: shempmcgurk [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Saturday, October 28, 2006 7:31:27 PMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Louis McKenzie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well Guys what does one get from MMY Bashing. Is there some thrill in it? No, release of stress.It's also an affirmation of MMY's own teaching. TM is supposed to be a cult or a guru/disciple path or a bakti path.Indeed, I contend that those who make it such are off the program.Having said that, I hope I myself do not come across on this forum as too much of an MMY-basher because that's not my intention. I've been doing TM twice a day for the better part of 33 years and think it's the best thing since sliced bread. But I think it's much more healthy for both my own psychology and the health of the TMO when well-deserved and much-needed introspection and critical analysis of the TMO and MMY's policies and decisions are actually talked about, discussed, and debated.I actually think that this forum may be the only such venue for this around (amt is too full of other discussions) . Indeed, I consider it a good work on Rick's part (a "mitzvah" if you will) for starting this group. Figure if you have time to MMY bash that means you are not doing all you can do to benefit from any of the things anyway. So maybe there is a nother consciousness at hand. In the world especially US there are many people who are born cryers. If they dont see where they are getting their satisfaction they cry fraud. I had a good friend he built a company that sold water purification multilevel. The US Gov. too him and his compnay down because some people who jumped in jumped in with all they had plus in order to get RICH. WHen they found things weren't quite like they were told they decided to sue. Basically there are many people like me who have read the GITA a zillion times because MMY said that each time you read chapter 2 it brings you closer to CC. Nice line of Bullshit. But maybe it was not complete BS. The thing is TM has value meditation is valuable. So maybe there is more to do. Well look at all the more that has come about in the last 30 years. maybe it is better to take the value and do what you need to do than to sit around wasting time complaining? ??= Nothing better to do??? OH BOY! - Original Message From: sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com Sent: Saturday, October 28, 2006 2:29:32 PM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Vaj vajranatha@ ... wrote: On Oct 27, 2006, at 1:46 PM, jim_flanegin wrote: Geez, really hard to say. Rather I think it is a case of trying to explain the enigma that Maharishi appears to be to so many, in a not very positive way. I do get the sense that Vaj indulges in a far amount of Maharishi and TM bashing 'off camera'. No, it was merely a counterpoint, an "all possibilities" POV to New Morn's rosy romanticism and the rose-colors glasses he seems to wear much of the time.For example, how do you ignore that the era of good times of New Morn's first phase also corresponded to his Spiritual Incest phase? I don't know, but it received not a mention. Bizarre. perhaps because New Morning never saw it and chooses not to assume that hearsay is true? __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
So are ou saying that he was having sex with women? At MIU in 76 there was a girl who swore she had sex with. - Original Message From: new.morning [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Saturday, October 28, 2006 11:10:40 PMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Oct 28, 2006, at 12:29 PM, sparaig wrote:perhaps because New Morning never saw it and chooses not to assume that hearsay is true? Exactly the point: if you were never a member of the inner circle where all this was going on, you probably wouldn't have.What great secret things were happing mid 60's to 71, what I termedphase I, that I didn't see because I was not a skin boy? (And ofcourse being a skin boy, for the most part, was hardly inner circle --as far as managing the movement.) There seems to be some "blob labeling" in some minds, like "TMO wasBAD" -- which appars to greatly confuses some "delicate minds".Badspecifically how? And when? Some issues, their "badness" and dates:1) Taking money across boarders without paying taxes. The firstincidences Rick reports were early 72. At earliest last few months of71. One of the Weiners caught crossing border with too much cash.Importance: -- not a biggie in my view. That was common practice in70's for busineses and individuals. Some laws are are simple bad lawsand are not adhered to much and much enforced. But I saw this fisrthand in May of 72. And told stories with wink and nod by the persondoing the transfer. So i was maybe 4 months behind the curve perhaps.2) Sexual dalliances: occurance -- at least with Jennifer at end of 71or beginning of 72 in Mallorca II.Not that big deal, IMO. Did notchange my view of MMY or TM or TMO much. Did change my view on"M-group" precursor to purusha. I heard specific stories in 77 or sofrom a close friend who talked directly with someone who flew aroundthe country interviewing women about it. It was much more concretethan rumor. Further solidified with skin boy e-mails of late. I knowor have been around most of the corresponders of those e-mails andhave a feel for thier personality types. I find some of the talk a bitof good-old boy one-upmanship chatter. And some hints at smoking gunstuff (pun perhaps). Jennifer (and Linda too i believe) have said theskin boys got it wrong. Or at least not the full and real story. Sodoes MMY wear silk and have clay feet. Of course. Does that effect mypractice of TM, my experiences in TMO 67-71?Emphatically no.3) Organizationa blacklisting (for seeing other teachers, readingbooks etc.) I saw none of this 67-71. Even for years after this, manypeople had extensive libraries of stuff. No black listing of anyfriends or acquaintances of mine in 67-71. Even for years later. I hada number of esoteric books open on display in my room at MIU SantaBarbara and FF Even 76-77 I finally read Autobiography of a Yogi on mysix-month course! It was openly passed around, along with lots ofother books, tapes of 1008 names of mother divine, open selling ofruraksha and deer skins, etc. Such never affected any applications tocourses. It was never an issue.4) Organizational broken promises and uncompassionate actions: I neversaw anything 67-71. TMO let people learn of what they could afford. Iknow. I used to collect money on weekendsat a major center. Jerryand company, from what I saw and experienced, went out of their way tomake things right -- in many things. Even through 77 I saw this. When ATR was taken away in 78 I think, that was a BIG broken promise.Things were changing. But this was 6 years after my rosy "phase I".Into phase III, which i characterizer as much darker and harsher days.I forget, what are the other reasons the TMO was BAD (to the bone) inthose days (Phase I 67-71. Even Phase II 72-76)So during the Phase I that I experienced as an upbeat time in the TMO,none of the four big bad things, above, even occurred (give or take amonth or two). Its pretty funny that people who had not even been initiated in thatera (AFAIR) feel they KNOW what that era was like, and that KNOWpeople who actually lived it are deluded. All because some eventshappened (and probably not as they think they happened) some yearslater. They can't even keep their timelines straight.That said, while the TMO did not have Big BAD things above, happeningmuch or at all 67-71, it was a time of growth, of youthful initiativesand planning, and a lot of inexperience and sometimes incompetence.Frustrating at times. But not some grand master plot of doom. To subscribe, send a message to:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links* To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/* Your email settings:Individual Email | Traditional* To change settings online go
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
Title: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona on 10/28/06 10:17 PM, Louis McKenzie at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So are ou saying that he was having sex with women? At MIU in 76 there was a girl who swore she had sex with. Care to finish that thought? __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
so maybe the second most populous year ;) - Original Message - From: curtisdeltablues [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, October 28, 2006 7:40 PM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, llundrub [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My class at MIU was the largest first year class ever - year of 83. How many were in your class? I think we had 350 in the freshman class of'75. - Original Message - From: new.morning [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, October 28, 2006 11:45 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig sparaig@ wrote: perhaps because New Morning never saw it and chooses not to assume that hearsay is true? My suggested phase I was mid 60s to early 70s --71 or so. I had a great time in that era of the TMO. Most people I know did. Some people making comments were in grade or high school during that period, AFAIR, and had no direct experience of that era. If some feel they know that era better, by reading reports by some of (mostly) a different era, then what can I say. My primary point was that the TMO, from my observation, went through various phases. If some dispute that on their experience, fine. Those speaking on no experience for mid 60s-early 70s are just blowing hot air, IMO. And while I saw some odd things in that period, it was mostly positive. And as I suggested in my spec piece, things changed in 72-77 or so -- more bureaucratic. Still, many had a great time. 77+ -- it got quite odd. I left. Others stayed on, and on and on, even given the weirdness. If they weren't having a good time, and did not like the org, I am puzzled why they didn't leave. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
On Oct 26, 2006, at 7:13 PM, jim_flanegin wrote:--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Of course the only things that would be necessary to account for that viewpoint could be as simple as a few attachments or misapprehensions in what was actually going on, behind the scenes. For example you could be simply attached to a romantic image of the wonderful experiences you had and the wonderful adventures you experienced. It could also be that the duplicitous, two-faced Hindu Donald Trump of Sweetness was hidden from you--the circular-talking, hypnotic meanderings and coached wiseness on one side with the hidden ruthless corporate dictator-CEO who praises those who bring money to him and shun, degrade or humiliate (or expel) those who cannot be pawns in the grander scheme of sublime avariciousness. One man's garbage is another man's gold. In mining the gold, the dross you discard is much larger than the gold. I took the gold I found and have no regrets. __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
Thanks for the huge non sequitur...it was essentially a yes or no question. Either you could also see the aforementioned scenario as a possibility or you could not. I'll take your response as a no, no further response necessary. But to answer a few of your questions: I generally do not talk in detail about personal matters on public lists, despite the fact I have talked about some details here and there; I may in the future, as I choose, when I choose, to the extent I can, share my experiences. I never said I don't believe in karma, but I also reserve the right to not believe in karma or a causal path vs. a path that is beyond cause and effect. As I believe I indicated, the observations were not my own, but from what has been shared with a close member of M's inner circle. I guess you two would need to talk, but I'm guessing the chances of that are remote. Don't get me wrong, I had many wonderful times in the TMO and have made numerous lifelong friends: I took the gold and left the dross. But it is what it is and was what it was. On Oct 26, 2006, at 7:34 PM, new.morning wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Of course the only things that would be necessary to account for that viewpoint could be as simple as a few attachments or misapprehensions in what was actually going on, behind the scenes. For example you could be simply attached to a romantic image of the wonderful experiences you had and the wonderful adventures you experienced. It could also be that the duplicitous, two-faced Hindu Donald Trump of Sweetness was hidden from you--the circular-talking, hypnotic meanderings and coached wiseness on one side with the hidden ruthless corporate dictator-CEO who praises those who bring money to him and shun, degrade or humiliate (or expel) those who cannot be pawns in the grander scheme of sublime avariciousness. Or it could simply be a straight forward account of my personal experience in the TMO without your projections and fantasies. And funny you don't believe in karma. Is that a foreign or renounced concept in your special brands of buddhism and tantra? sentimental attachments snipped To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
One thing is if we go back to where we learned of Karma which basically does not mean what he make it up to be. For example the word Karma means action. We make it up to be what goes around comes around. But the word means action what is the nature of action that is key. We live in a reverberating universe and as we know as long as we are under the effect of the Gunas we are bound by the laws of Karma. Then what happens if we go beyond the gunas? What happens if we transcend Karma? The do we choose or are we always chosing? - Original Message From: authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Friday, October 27, 2006 10:54:02 AMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, "curtisdeltablues" curtisdeltablues@ ... wrote: Well it seems to my unenlightened brain that if a lesson is being taught then the experience of the causality would be necessary. Babies who are born in suffering before they die don't have any ability to learn anything.Not that they're conscious of at the time. It is not a simple "as you sow so shall you reap" philosophy, it requires a whole set of beliefs about what happens after we die.True, or simply trust that it's all working outas it should. The causality we experience in life is not just simply being extended in the karmic theory. It is part of a massive presumption about how the universe operates. But as I said, I understand that people can use such beliefs for good in their live. I am not against other people believing it. I just don't see any reason for me to believe it myself. I believe that we live in a random universe with no inherent justice, and it is up to man to do his best to impose justice when he can.But the same would be the case--up to humanbeans to impose justice when they can--if the universe was ruled by karma.Some people are more comfortable with the ideaof a random universe; others are more comfortablewith the idea that there is an all-encompassingorder to it--whatever gets you through the night.The thing is, belief in karma doesn't have anypractical implications in terms of how onebehaves, because it would be far too complex forthe human brain to figure out. You do the bestyou can within your limitations.In the natural world animals are eating each other alive, so I don't put any faith in any natural law being capable of the level of kindness and justice a good man can achieve in the world.Why would natural law not apply to human beingsas well as animals? Suffering in nature is at too high a pitch for me to have confidence that any mechanism is fairly metting out justice in this world.You're assuming, though, that the human idea ofjustice conforms to the universe's idea of justice.That may not be the case. Karma may work differently,for instance, for creatures that have free willversus for those that don't.Karma is not something that is obvious to me from my observations of the environment. It is a belief is dependant on lots of other beliefs that requires some effort and study to acquire.Sure. And those who find the idea of a randomuniverse disturbing may be motivated to exploreother possibilities to find one that enablesthem to live their lives with greater equanimity.That's really the only practical effect of sucha belief--or of the belief in randomness, forthat matter. We can't know for sure either way(perhaps unless we're enlightened) . __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
this donald Trump style you speak of would that be like knowing that people could never fly really fly or levitate with the flying technique given in the training. Knowing that the first phase technique would only allow a person to bounce, Is that what you mean? - Original Message From: Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Friday, October 27, 2006 9:27:39 AMSubject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" On Oct 26, 2006, at 7:13 PM, jim_flanegin wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] .. wrote: Of course the only things that would be necessary to account for that viewpoint could be as simple as a few attachments or misapprehensions in what was actually going on, behind the scenes. For example you could be simply attached to a romantic image of the wonderful experiences you had and the wonderful adventures you experienced. It could also be that the duplicitous, two-faced Hindu Donald Trump of Sweetness was hidden from you--the circular-talking, hypnotic meanderings and coached wiseness on one side with the hidden ruthless corporate dictator-CEO who praises those who bring money to him and shun, degrade or humiliate (or expel) those who cannot be pawns in the grander scheme of sublime avariciousness. One man's garbage is another man's gold. In mining the gold, the dross you discard is much larger than the gold. I took the gold I found and have no regrets. __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
The meanest thing was introducing the subtle craving for sidhis into the silence of ones own nature. The opposite is the recommended way. - Original Message - From: Louis McKenzie To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, October 27, 2006 8:34 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" this donald Trump style you speak of would that be like knowing that people could never fly really fly or levitate with the flying technique given in the training. Knowing that the first phase technique would only allow a person to bounce, Is that what you mean? - Original Message From: Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Friday, October 27, 2006 9:27:39 AMSubject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" On Oct 26, 2006, at 7:13 PM, jim_flanegin wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] .. wrote: Of course the only things that would be necessary to account for that viewpoint could be as simple as a few attachments or misapprehensions in what was actually going on, behind the scenes. For example you could be simply attached to a romantic image of the wonderful experiences you had and the wonderful adventures you experienced. It could also be that the duplicitous, two-faced Hindu Donald Trump of Sweetness was hidden from you--the circular-talking, hypnotic meanderings and coached wiseness on one side with the hidden ruthless corporate dictator-CEO who praises those who bring money to him and shun, degrade or humiliate (or expel) those who cannot be pawns in the grander scheme of sublime avariciousness. One man's garbage is another man's gold. In mining the gold, the dross you discard is much larger than the gold. I took the gold I found and have no regrets. __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
Recently a friend Bill Gouldd was stripped of his empire. Some would think he was stripped because he was a crook others because he was doing something that was not allowed. The gov said that he was responsible for each and every person in his group. So any mishap was his responsibility and therefore if it was due to his ppolicy or no he had to pay for the error. In His mind he was making monumental change educating people about their health and environment as well as making millioniares. He believed he had to remain focused on the big picture and not get caught in the little traps. I believe Maharishi has thought the same way. - Original Message From: markmeredith2002 [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Friday, October 27, 2006 10:18:19 AMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, "curtisdeltablues"curtisdeltablues@ ... wrote: Nice details on the early days. I was 16 in 1974 when I got involved, just a kid. My teacher came from the days you remember. The tone changed through the years as you describe. But I don't view myself as a victim of the movement. Pointing out its flaws or dirty tricks doesn't make me a victim. How I respond would. I chose all my movement participation and had lots of fun. It was a mixed bag. But when I was in it, I was all in baby! I enjoyed the intensity.Not being able to see the flaws or dirty tricks is being a victim ofthe mov't, and perhaps running onto stages screaming about keeping thetmo away from your children is also being a victim. I think that MMY's ideas about of collective consciousness is different from karma theory, but I could be wrong. I haven't thought about this stuff in detail in so many years. Maybe it is just a version of it. I understand your point better from your explanation of how you view it. I think of karma theory as a devise to maintain the caste system in India. It seems like a convenient way to keep people from acting up in lower castes and to blame people for their own birth defects. I find it far from a comforting explanation of events. I choose to believe in randomness over intended malice from the universe. I guess we all have to face this very fundamental philosophical question "why does shit happen?" for ourselves.Great paragraph. I think that the men in power used the theory ofkarma to help prop up their completely secular power grap, the castesystem, though the karma concept can still survive independently after you see through and dump the caste concept. I like yourrandomness over malice idea. I think the evolution of individualityand all the social systems that go with it in human civilization is agood evolutionary thing, but I also think that spiritual peoplesometimes need to get over themselves and realize that the laws ofnature aren't interested in fitting into their self centered beliefsystems about themselves. __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Louis McKenzie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: WHen I learned to meditiate I was 17. 1974. I learned to meditate in June of 74 and was asked to leave my parents home in October. My initiator and the many teachers in New York city became my safe haven if it was not for them I do not know where I would have ended up. If it's any comfort now, Louis, many of us had similar experiences. The Movement was definitely a safe harbor in difficult family situations. Sal To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
No regrets from me. The reason was that I quit my after school job so I could study so I could prepare for college. My dad wanted me to work. I refused and quit. Then I smacked my baby sister. Nature knew that I had to leave. I had went on a residence course in Livingston Manner and tried to stay there and finish HS. Did not work so Bob Kory introduced me to MIU. I fell in love with the catalogue and used that to pull myself through the fire of New York city. Most scariest moment; walking in the bario east village bowry street area and seeing homeless guys formerly called bums walking with giant sores on their feet. Having moved to a men's shelter with .30 in my pocket I was very afraid at 17. - Original Message From: Sal Sunshine [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Friday, October 27, 2006 11:52:56 AMSubject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Louis McKenzie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: WHen I learned to meditiate I was 17. 1974. I learned to meditate in June of 74 and was asked to leave my parents home in October. My initiator and the many teachers in New York city became my safe haven if it was not for them I do not know where I would have ended up.If it's any comfort now, Louis, many of us had similar experiences. The Movement was definitely a safe harbor in difficult family situations.Sal __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
He knew what it was supposed to do. He maybe did not know that mechanics of how it would go. But he had people like SriSri formerly known as punditji to experiment on. Also the 6 month course people who wanted to live in Switzerland. What I said was not my opinion. - Original Message From: TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Friday, October 27, 2006 11:50:07 AMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Louis McKenzie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: this donald Trump style you speak of would that be like knowing that people could never fly really fly or levitate with the flying technique given in the training. Knowing that the first phase technique would only allow a person to bounce, Is that what you mean?It could also mean having no earthly idea what themade-up flying technique would do, just having a cashcrunch and knowing that people would pay for it no matter what it was just because he said to, and being willing to use them as guinea pigs. *Paying* guinea pigs.I don't really know that this is true, but based onall the stories I heard of the early siddhis courses,that's the conclusion I've come to. - Original Message From: Vaj vajranatha@ ... To: FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com Sent: Friday, October 27, 2006 9:27:39 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and theTMO's "Persona" On Oct 26, 2006, at 7:13 PM, jim_flanegin wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Vaj vajranatha@ .. wrote: Of course the only things that would be necessary to account for that viewpoint could be as simple as a few attachments or misapprehensions in what was actually going on, behind the scenes. For example you could be simply attached to a romantic image of the wonderful experiences you had and the wonderful adventures you experienced.It could also be that the duplicitous, two-faced Hindu Donald Trump of Sweetness was hidden from you--the circular-talking, hypnotic meanderings and coached wiseness on one side with the hidden ruthless corporate dictator-CEO who praises those who bring money to him and shun, degrade or humiliate (or expel) those who cannot be pawns in the grander scheme of sublime avariciousness. One man's garbage is another man's gold. In mining the gold, the dross you discard is much larger than the gold. I took the gold I found and have no regrets. __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
Funny you say that I have a new son age 18 months. He likes my altars and my computer. the moment I leave the computer he tries to get on. However he has broken my laptop, two pairs of glasses and two cellphones. I tap his hands sometimes but then it makes me more sad then him. I want him to love these things but I cant afford his learning process at this time. So we learn a little about cause and effect. - Original Message From: curtisdeltablues [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Friday, October 27, 2006 12:09:03 PMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" Judy: "You're assuming, though, that the human idea ofjustice conforms to the universe's idea of justice.That may not be the case. Karma may work differently,for instance, for creatures that have free willversus for those that don't."Me: Right, I am assuming that any standard of morality needs toconnect with my sense of what is moral for it to have any meaning forme. A moral position that allows for willfully imposing suffering istoo far from my own standards to be useful to me. It goes back toHume's paradox. God can't be moral, omnipotent and omniscient at oncewith the reality of suffering in the world. I think you are proposinga variation in which our sense of morality is dismissed as limited,but that redefinition takes away what I value in the concept of morality.I think that karmic theory was created at a time when Mosaic stylejustice was in vogue on earth. Our standards and values have evolvedsince then. For example if a child is behaving cruelly, I am prettysure being cruel to him or putting him in painful situations is notgoing to open his heart in compassion to others. We have evolveddifferent techniques since the old style "beat his ass" retributionstyle teaching. But karmic theory seems stuck in the dark ages of ourpast when we thought of things in those simplistic terms. If someoneis cruel, give him a life as a leper, that will straighten him out!--- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Louis McKenzie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: One thing is if we go back to where we learned of Karma whichbasically does not mean what he make it up to be. For example theword Karma means action. We make it up to be what goes around comesaround. But the word means action what is the nature of action thatis key. We live in a reverberating universe and as we know as long as we areunder the effect of the Gunas we are bound by the laws of Karma. Then what happens if we go beyond the gunas? What happens if wetranscend Karma? The do we choose or are we always chosing? - Original Message From: authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com Sent: Friday, October 27, 2006 10:54:02 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and theTMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, "curtisdeltablues" curtisdeltablues@ ... wrote: Well it seems to my unenlightened brain that if a lesson is being taught then the experience of the causality would be necessary. Babies who are born in suffering before they die don't have any ability to learn anything. Not that they're conscious of at the time. It is not a simple "as you sow so shall you reap" philosophy, it requires a whole set of beliefs about what happens after we die. True, or simply trust that it's all working out as it should. The causality we experience in life is not just simply being extended in the karmic theory. It is part of a massive presumption about how the universe operates.But as I said, I understand that people can use such beliefs for good in their live. I am not against other people believing it. I just don't see any reason for me to believe it myself.I believe that we live in a random universe with no inherent justice, and it is up to man to do his best to impose justice when he can. But the same would be the case--up to human beans to impose justice when they can--if the universe was ruled by karma. Some people are more comfortable with the idea of a random universe; others are more comfortable with the idea that there is an all-encompassing order to it--whatever gets you through the night. The thing is, belief in karma doesn't have any practical implications in terms of how one behaves, because it would be far too complex for the human brain to figure out. You do the best you can within your limitations. In the natural world animals are eating each other alive, so I don't put any faith in any natural law being capable of the level of kindness and justice a good man can achieve in the world. Why would natural law not apply to human beings as well as animals? Suffering in nature is at too high a pitch for me to have confidence that any mechanism is fairly metting out justice in this world. You're assuming, though, that the human idea of justice conforms to the universe
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
I dont think so but along those lines anyway. What I remember most was when we got the sidhis. I had been waiting so long. Had gone through so much to be on the course and all. I was already doing what was considered flying but not official. When I heard the first sutra I was shocked. I felt this was the biggest rip. Yet I thought if Maharishi said do it might as well try it. I saw then how silly we americans were if he gave a sutra that wasom namaha jiji jiji and said this was the magic mantra that would make us fly there would probably have been people floating through the air. Yet because it was just some words in english I thought I had been duped. - Original Message From: TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Friday, October 27, 2006 12:40:55 PMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Louis McKenzie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: He knew what it was supposed to do. He maybe did not know that mechanics of how it would go. Just a question -- do you (or, for that matter,does *anyone* here) actually believe that Patanjali'stechnique involved thinking "relationship of body andakasha...lightness of cotton fiber" in ANY language, much less English?It *astounds* me that people still believe that whatMaharishi sold to them is what Patanjali had in mind. - Original Message From: TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] s.com To: FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com Sent: Friday, October 27, 2006 11:50:07 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and theTMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Louis McKenzie ltm457@ wrote: this donald Trump style you speak of would that be like knowing that people could never fly really fly or levitate with the flying technique given in the training. Knowing that the first phase technique would only allow a person to bounce, Is that what you mean? It could also mean having no earthly idea what the made-up flying technique would do, just having a cash crunch and knowing that people would pay for it no matter what it was just because he said to, and being willing to use them as guinea pigs. *Paying* guinea pigs. I don't really know that this is true, but based on all the stories I heard of the early siddhis courses, that's the conclusion I've come to.- Original Message From: Vaj vajranatha@ ... To: FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com Sent: Friday, October 27, 2006 9:27:39 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona"On Oct 26, 2006, at 7:13 PM, jim_flanegin wrote:--- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Vaj vajranatha@ .. wrote:Of course the only things that would be necessary to account for that viewpoint could be as simple as a few attachments or misapprehensions in what was actually going on, behind the scenes. For example you could be simply attached to a romantic image of the wonderful experiences you had and the wonderful adventures you experienced. It could also be that the duplicitous, two-faced Hindu Donald Trump of Sweetness was hidden from you--the circular-talking, hypnotic meanderings and coached wiseness on one side with the hidden ruthless corporate dictator-CEO who praises those who bring money to him and shun, degrade or humiliate (or expel) those who cannot be pawns in the grander scheme of sublime avariciousness. One man's garbage is another man's gold. In mining the gold, the dross you discard is much larger than the gold. I took the gold I found and have no regrets. __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
On Oct 27, 2006, at 10:40 AM, TurquoiseB wrote:--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Louis McKenzie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: He knew what it was supposed to do. He maybe did not know that mechanics of how it would go. Just a question -- do you (or, for that matter, does *anyone* here) actually believe that Patanjali's technique involved thinking "relationship of body and akasha...lightness of cotton fiber" in ANY language, much less English? It *astounds* me that people still believe that what Maharishi sold to them is what Patanjali had in mind. And of course I had posted a while back the comments of Tat Whale Baba's successor who stated that it had to be done in Sanskrit. Levitation actually involves two sutras, not one, and a mastery of a certain form of prana, which is very dangerous without very close personal instruction. Hopping actually is another siddhi, the bhuchari siddhi, the siddhi of hopping like a frog... __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
No I was referring to the fact that numerous people in M's inner circle have commented on the dual nature of the man: on one side sweet talking guru in front of the cameras and then ruthlessly different behind the scenes. In other words, to some it seemed like the guru presentation was just an act.On Oct 27, 2006, at 9:34 AM, Louis McKenzie wrote:this donald Trump style you speak of would that be like knowing that people could never fly really fly or levitate with the flying technique given in the training. Knowing that the first phase technique would only allow a person to bounce, Is that what you mean? __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
Curtis, Yeah, great place. I first started going there with a couple of friends when the food at CNL was crummy (pretty often) and that was a wonderful change...and it was also, of course, OTP, making it even more enjoyable. :) Those were the days. That's great that you got to know the family and learned some cooking techniques. At one point I was pretty good at making that puffy type of Indian bread (can't think of the name right now) but quit because I figured kids and hot oil didn't mix too well. Now we get take-out but at some point I hope to get back to making it myself, as I love Indian cooking too. Sal On Oct 26, 2006, at 10:47 PM, curtisdeltablues wrote: Sal, That's great that you remember Parus. It was run by a South Indian woman and her two daughters. Very homey and simple. She taught me how to toast the coriander seeds and coconut for Sambar, and how to let the Idli batter ferment properly to get that great sourness. I can equal her Idlis and Sambar from her help, but not her Dosas. I think you really need a griddle to make them right. She was really sweet to me and spent a lot of time teaching me her cooking methods. I was much more into getting the details down then her two daughters! Since it was an easy walk from the center it must have been a movement mecca for all the years it was in business. I went there first in 1983 when I first met you at the CNL. I know one daughter got married and had a baby after college, and the other was in college the last time I talked with her. I'm guessing it closed in the mid 90's. Since South Indian style is my favorite by a long shot, I am always trying any place that serves South Indian food, but none are as charming and delicious as that place. It attracted a great mix of people, a funky crowd. I made some Besan Dhoklas and coconut chutney tonight, so it really made me think of Parus and her kindness. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Oct 26, 2006, at 9:21 PM, curtisdeltablues wrote: Was the South Indian restaurant Parus on T street opened when you were there? She taught me to make Idli and dosa and Sambar. It is gone now, but I loved that place. Curtis, I'm pretty sure that was the place I was trying to think of, where I used to go with a couple of friends. Was it a small place, just a few tables, self-serve, on some little side-street off Dupont Circle? If so, I loved that place too. When did it close? Sal To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
Once I gave an envelope to Swami Satchitananda. In the envelope was a check. He accepted the envelope. I was to drive him to the newark airport.Great honor. He motions to me with his finger I go over to hima dn he asks "What is it?" I said it was a check. He said, " Thank you." THen he leans over to me again and asks " Is it good?" I thought Oh Boy this guy is good. I appreciated his down to earthness. WHy do we think that a Guru should not be a good business man? Maharishi's down to earthness has been something that I have had a lot of respect for. - Original Message From: Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Friday, October 27, 2006 1:02:43 PMSubject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" No I was referring to the fact that numerous people in M's inner circle have commented on the dual nature of the man: on one side sweet talking guru in front of the cameras and then ruthlessly different behind the scenes. In other words, to some it seemed like the guru presentation was just an act. On Oct 27, 2006, at 9:34 AM, Louis McKenzie wrote: this donald Trump style you speak of would that be like knowing that people could never fly really fly or levitate with the flying technique given in the training. Knowing that the first phase technique would only allow a person to bounce, Is that what you mean? __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
Yes that is what I learned in 77. The sanskrit part I dont know he had a lot of problems with the public on the mantras so he created another way. That worked but as you said he saved the other sutra for a later date. - Original Message From: Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Friday, October 27, 2006 1:05:43 PMSubject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" On Oct 27, 2006, at 10:40 AM, TurquoiseB wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Louis McKenzie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: He knew what it was supposed to do. He maybe did not know that mechanics of how it would go. Just a question -- do you (or, for that matter, does *anyone* here) actually believe that Patanjali's technique involved thinking "relationship of body and akasha...lightness of cotton fiber" in ANY language, much less English? It *astounds* me that people still believe that what Maharishi sold to them is what Patanjali had in mind. And of course I had posted a while back the comments of Tat Whale Baba'ssuccessor who stated that it had to be done in Sanskrit. Levitation actually involves two sutras, not one, and a mastery of a certain form of prana, which is very dangerous without very close personal instruction. Hopping actually is another siddhi, the bhuchari siddhi, the siddhi of hopping like a frog... __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
On Oct 27, 2006, at 11:18 AM, Louis McKenzie wrote:Once I gave an envelope to Swami Satchitananda. In the envelope was a check. He accepted the envelope. I was to drive him to the newark airport. Great honor. He motions to me with his finger I go over to hima dn he asks "What is it?" I said it was a check. He said, " Thank you." THen he leans over to me again and asks " Is it good?" I thought Oh Boy this guy is good. I appreciated his down to earthness. WHy do we think that a Guru should not be a good business man? Maharishi's down to earthness has been something that I have had a lot of respect for. If he was a good businessman I suspect it wouldn't have the problem he does going to certain countries. Did you miss the post on the Indian mafia his business there has created? I suspect the type of behavior we're talking about here is not the type most of us were ever privy to. __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
Ass U Me When we Ass U Me the biggest part of the problem is that we think we understand what we are seeing. Lets imagine that with all of the intellectual training we have obtained we do not know a damn thing about what we think we see. Then lets go a step further and say that this idea of what goes around comes around, as you sow so shall yee reap is not and was not about any kind of judgement or premise of what is right and what is wrong. Then imagine that the universe that we live in is not associated with dogma of anykind. Then imagine that cause and effect is as simple as a boomerang. When you threw the boomerang how many times did you look to see if you were throwing it right before letting it go? Did you say some special words before releasing it? Was that needed? Is this boomerang limited to actions on the gross level or can it respond to even the subtlest impulse? If it is responsive even to the most sublest impulse, is there various forms of bommerang or one form? If there is various forms then are all boomerangs created in this moment or are some antique? Are there various styles of boomerang or only one style? We have learned that there are ways to redirect the boomerang before it hits. We have also learned that there are ways to prepare ourselves for the boomerang when it hits so it is not as bad as it could be.. That said what happens if the whole concept of the boomerang was just something that someone made up? Suppose it has to do with the creative principal. The idea that our thoughts and impulses are what creates any type of outcome. Then would it be also true that group thought may be as powerful as individual thought or more? Suppose that group thought said that diseases would be created like palgues and these plagues had to happen in order for the Return of the Christ? Do you think that this thought might be manifested in various forms? So then imagine that you know nothing about the spritual existence before entering the physical world. So we do not know who was what or who was where? We assume that an African person today was an african person yesterday. We assume that a brother and sister father and mother must have been related before. ASS U ME = KNOW NOTHING. We do not know the journey of another soul so it is rediculous for us to assume. We can only deal with what is on our plate or not. Once I was walking in New York times square near 42nd street. There were so many people living on the streets. I saw them as poor and helpless then I looked again and saw them as sadhu. If a sadhu is doing what he needs to do why not these other people? Are they sadhus i questioned. Then another day around the same time. A homeless man comes up to me and says Louis! We are so proud of you, you are doing so well. He hugs me. I almost fell through the ground but I did not resist because I knew I never told this guy my name. He looked like a bum but.. I would have seen him one way, his reality was something else. This happened several times. So I wrote a book about being courageous enough to step out of one's comfort zone enough to be without anything not even ,10 and rasing what ever amount you needed. These people were masters at this. Who are we anyway and how do we know who is the master and what form it should look like. So based upon this maybe we need to rethink these terms. If Satya Sai baba was born as a Baby with Aids would we think it was some Karmic Accident? how do we know if the aids baby is or is not just that an avatar? First step to seeing God realizing that as long as I think I know what God looks like I will be sure that I will miss it. - Original Message From: new.morning [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Friday, October 27, 2006 1:10:22 PMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, "curtisdeltablues"curtisdeltablues@ ... wrote: Me: Right, I am assuming that any standard of morality needs to connect with my sense of what is moral for it to have any meaning for me. A moral position that allows for willfully imposing suffering is too far from my own standards to be useful to me. Do you consider the laws of thermodynamics to be a moral position? Iassume not. Then why do you cast the "theory" of cause and effect as amoral position? All of science is based on causal factors creating apredicable effect. Why would any sane person take that as a standardof morality? Perhaps you are also making the mistake, IMO, of assuming humansshould pretend they should be the judge, jury and executioner of thelaws of cause and effect. To do so makes no sense to me. Its likesaying, "the glass is wobbling on the edge of the counter. Let it fallon the floor. That is its karma. So it is written, so it be done. Tohelp prevent this or to clean up the mess is against karma, aga
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
I am new here I would like to see this site. - Original Message From: Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Friday, October 27, 2006 1:46:05 PMSubject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" On Oct 27, 2006, at 11:18 AM, Louis McKenzie wrote: Once I gave an envelope to Swami Satchitananda. In the envelope was a check. He accepted the envelope. I was to drive him to the newark airport.Great honor. He motions to me with his finger I go over to hima dn he asks "What is it?" I said it was a check. He said, " Thank you." THen he leans over to me again and asks " Is it good?" I thought Oh Boy this guy is good. I appreciated his down to earthness. WHy do we think that a Guru should not be a good business man? Maharishi's down to earthness has been something that I have had a lot of respect for. If he was a good businessman I suspect it wouldn't have the problem he does going to certain countries. Did you miss the post on the Indian mafia his business there has created? I suspect the type of behavior we're talking about here is not the type most of us were ever privy to. __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
I believe that Maharishi used what had the same meaning of the intended to sutra. However I also believe he had an idea of the most that could be acheived with the technique. I believe he will at some point introduce the second technique as he puts it when the environment is ready. Many people have hopped with this technique, I have only heard of a few incidents of hovering - Original Message From: sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Friday, October 27, 2006 2:46:07 PMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Vaj vajranatha@ ... wrote: On Oct 27, 2006, at 10:40 AM, TurquoiseB wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Louis McKenzie ltm457@ wrote:He knew what it was supposed to do. He maybe did not know that mechanics of how it would go.Just a question -- do you (or, for that matter, does *anyone* here) actually believe that Patanjali's technique involved thinking "relationship of body and akasha...lightness of cotton fiber" in ANY language, much less English? It *astounds* me that people still believe that what Maharishi sold to them is what Patanjali had in mind. And of course I had posted a while back the comments of Tat Whale Baba's successor who stated that it had to be done in Sanskrit. Levitation actually involves two sutras, not one, and a mastery of a certain form of prana, which is very dangerous without very close personal instruction. Hopping actually is another siddhi, the bhuchari siddhi, the siddhi of hopping like a frog...Asthe Yogattva Upanishad makes oh-so-clear (NOT). __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
TurquoiseB wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Louis McKenzie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I believe that Maharishi used what had the same meaning of the intended to sutra. However I also believe he had an idea of the most that could be acheived with the technique. I believe he will at some point introduce the second technique as he puts it when the environment is ready. Many people have hopped with this technique, I have only heard of a few incidents of hovering If that happens, do you think it will happen as a result of the technique that Maharishi teaches? I ask because, like a few others I've heard of, you are on record here as having hopped before you got the TM siddhi technique that supposedly caused it. I think that puts you in an interesting position from which to comment on the efficacy or non-efficacy of the technique. I hopped the first day after receiving it, but to this day don't know whether the technique itself did anything to cause that or whether it was self- suggestion on my part. So I'm honestly interested in your answer. I hopped prior to getting the flying sutra too. Probably about 3 months in advance and it happened at the same time with a bunch of folks in my area. The interesting thing was that everyone who was hopping spontaneously had been reading the Swami Muktananda books. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
I once asked David Orme Johnson how it could be that a person could actually fly without the technique. He explained that some people were that sensitive to the environment that if there was a particular energy in the atmosphere they would pick up on the wave and go with it. Well so on the one hand I was flying without the technique, but on the other hand it was because people were practicing the technique. When we finally got the technique even though I was the first to fly. I was told it did not count because I was already doing so. I used the sutra and had a result. Interesting thing. One day my 18month old son was bouncing he likes to bounce comes up to me and says; akasha I may have said the word once to him. in 18 months. The technique that Maharishi gave us worked. All of them worked. However I doubt that enough people had the full effect yet. I have flown in centers in many states and many countries a few people in each center fly and a small percentage actually do the tfull program anymore. I wish if I had gone on Purusha because it would have been interesting. ALL of what Maharishi gave worked for me. somethings I over did like listening to Sama Veda for hours while I slept but I never had a negative experience except what I have stated and of course some sutras were stronger for me than others but they all worked. I have no complaint about the techniques.I dont know that I need to fly everyday. At nearly 50 I find meditation twice a day some breathing and some excercise is enough. - Original Message From: TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Friday, October 27, 2006 3:42:26 PMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Louis McKenzie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I believe that Maharishi used what had the same meaning of the intended to sutra. However I also believe he had an idea of the most that could be acheived with the technique. I believe he will at some point introduce the second technique as he puts it when the environment is ready. Many people have hopped with this technique, I have only heard of a few incidents of hovering If that happens, do you think it will happen as a result of the technique that Maharishi teaches?I ask because, like a few others I've heard of, youare on record here as having hopped before you gotthe TM siddhi technique that supposedly "caused" it.I think that puts you in an interesting position fromwhich to comment on the efficacy or non-efficacy ofthe technique. I hopped the first day after receiving it, but to this day don't know whether the technique itself didanything to "cause" that or whether it was self-suggestion on my part. So I'm honestly interestedin your answer. __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
I once heard these guys having a discussion at MIU one was telling the other why he could not be having good experiences, and why he should be having better experiences. It went something like this. You are a mood maker pretending to have these experiences because you could not possibly have better experiences than me. You are never on the program. You are off the wall. The other replied Maharishi is never on program either. - Original Message From: jim_flanegin [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Friday, October 27, 2006 3:46:15 PMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, new.morning [EMAIL PROTECTED] . wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, "jim_flanegin" jflanegi@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, new.morning no_reply@ wrote: And what was your personal experience interacting with MMY, Vaj? Seeing MMY behind the scenes? My experience with the latter was not that he was ruthlesslydifferent behind the scenes. He was often kind, supportive, sweet and funny behind the scenes. What I noticed, in addition, he was more focussed. More intense sometimes. More to the point. Others may have seen other things. Rick did you see a black and white difference in MMY's behavior, as depicted by Vaj*, on camera and behind the scenes? Did you ever see akind, supportive, sweet and funny man behind the scenes? *based on second hand accounts apparently, and not personal experience, --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Vaj vajranatha@ wrote: No I was referring to the fact that numerous people in M's inner circle have commented on the dual nature of the man: on one side sweet talking guru in front of the cameras and then ruthlessly different behind the scenes. In other words, to some it seemed like the guru presentation was just an act. I think what Vaj is suggesting is that Maharishi's motives were not to end suffering in the world as he has stated, but rather grub for power and money above all, by manipulating those who have money, that Maharishi is a corrupt and false guru. To each his own. In his comments, perhaps Vaj is indicating, consciously or not, what he would do if in a substantive teaching position.Geez, really hard to say. Rather I think it is a case of trying to explain the enigma that Maharishi appears to be to so many, in a not very positive way. I do get the sense that Vaj indulges in a far amount of Maharishi and TM bashing 'off camera'. __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
do you (or, for that matter,does *anyone* here) actually believe that Patanjali'stechnique involved thinking "relationship of body andakasha...lightness of cotton fiber" in ANY language, much less English?It *astounds* me that people still believe that whatMaharishi sold to them is what Patanjali had in mind. That's all a question of whether one thinks MMY understood the technique. However, recitation is often the way the Vedas were used and the sutra is as said. So it's not hard to assume that fixation of awareness on this thought can produce that benefit. In Sri Vidya however which is where the TM mantras come from, the sidhis are the Bhupura or outer walls of the mandala and not the inner truth at all. MMY all comes down to whether one thinks the Vedas can be literally interpreted and used or whether they are more a dead art of the Dark Ages. Only those who consider themselves yogis are fit to judge. __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
Johnny Gray and Billy Clayton felt the same I guess. I really like Gurumai but I have never practiced any technique taught by them Also I have never had any experience from reading any of his books. If there are any reporters here please get this clear I have not had any sidhi experience from any book other than Maharishi's or Maharishis tapes or teaching..This tradition has meant a lot to me. The only Guru, other than Maharishithat I ever surrendered to in any way was one who grew up in this tradition. - Original Message From: shempmcgurk [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Friday, October 27, 2006 5:37:14 PMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] . wrote: TurquoiseB wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Louis McKenzie ltm457@ wrote:I believe that Maharishi used what had the same meaning of the intended to sutra. However I also believe he had an idea of the most that could be acheived with the technique. I believe he will at some point introduce the second technique as he puts it when the environment is ready.Many people have hopped with this technique, I have only heard of a few incidents of hovering If that happens, do you think it will happen as a result of the technique that Maharishi teaches? I ask because, like a few others I've heard of, you are on record here as having hopped before you got the TM siddhi technique that supposedly "caused" it. I think that puts you in an interesting position from which to comment on the efficacy or non-efficacy of the technique.I hopped the first day after receiving it, but to this day don't know whether the technique itself did anything to "cause" that or whether it was self- suggestion on my part. So I'm honestly interested in your answer. I hopped prior to getting the flying sutra too. Probably about 3 months in advance and it happened at the same time with a bunch of folks in my area. The interesting thing was that everyone who was hopping spontaneously had been reading the Swami Muktananda booksand you don't even have to READ the Muktananda books...just take one gander at that photograph of Muktananda's guru, Nityananda, that he puts at the beginning of every one of his books (the one with the brushed in halo) and, at least for me, that's enough to affect me. Every time I look into Nityananda's eyes in that photo I have a weird experience. __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
I have stopped understanding Hindu guru worship as there seems to never be any goal with them. They never give the mahavakya. - Original Message - From: Louis McKenzie To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, October 27, 2006 3:50 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" Johnny Gray and Billy Clayton felt the same I guess. I really like Gurumai but I have never practiced any technique taught by them Also I have never had any experience from reading any of his books. If there are any reporters here please get this clear I have not had any sidhi experience from any book other than Maharishi's or Maharishis tapes or teaching..This tradition has meant a lot to me. The only Guru, other than Maharishithat I ever surrendered to in any way was one who grew up in this tradition. - Original Message From: shempmcgurk [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Friday, October 27, 2006 5:37:14 PMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] . wrote: TurquoiseB wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Louis McKenzie ltm457@ wrote:I believe that Maharishi used what had the same meaning of the intended to sutra. However I also believe he had an idea of the most that could be acheived with the technique. I believe he will at some point introduce the second technique as he puts it when the environment is ready.Many people have hopped with this technique, I have only heard of a few incidents of hovering If that happens, do you think it will happen as a result of the technique that Maharishi teaches? I ask because, like a few others I've heard of, you are on record here as having hopped before you got the TM siddhi technique that supposedly "caused" it. I think that puts you in an interesting position from which to comment on the efficacy or non-efficacy of the technique.I hopped the first day after receiving it, but to this day don't know whether the technique itself did anything to "cause" that or whether it was self- suggestion on my part. So I'm honestly interested in your answer. I hopped prior to getting the flying sutra too. Probably about 3 months in advance and it happened at the same time with a bunch of folks in my area. The interesting thing was that everyone who was hopping spontaneously had been reading the Swami Muktananda booksand you don't even have to READ the Muktananda books...just take one gander at that photograph of Muktananda's guru, Nityananda, that he puts at the beginning of every one of his books (the one with the brushed in halo) and, at least for me, that's enough to affect me. Every time I look into Nityananda's eyes in that photo I have a weird experience. __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
He has a keyboard, he has cellphones, I let him mess with my altar because I think God understands so he takes Shiva's picture and kisses it. He chants Gayatri mantra and he chants Om. But he just like breaking things. Today he broke a knecklace of mine. If I tell him no Daddy doesn't like it when you do that. He smiles and does it anyway. If I tap his hand he cries a little and then the first opportunity goes back to do the same things again. He likes a lot of my attention so if I am working at the computer he get jealous. So he does something for attention. I play with him a lot watch discovery kids go for walks you name it. Not sure what to do yet. - Original Message From: authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Friday, October 27, 2006 1:04:04 PMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Louis McKenzie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Funny you say that I have a new son age 18 months. He likes my altars and my computer. the moment I leave the computer he tries to get on. However he has broken my laptop, two pairs of glasses and two cellphones. I tap his hands sometimes but then it makes me more sad then him. I want him to love these things but I cant afford his learning process at this time. So we learn a little about cause and effect.Could you get him, maybe, a toy cellphone, or a reallycheap used one? At this age, he'd be perfectly happywith that, even if it doesn't actually "work." He'smore interested in pressing the buttons. You might alsoget him a cheap keyboard of his own and let him pound awayat it, "just like Daddy." And get him a pair of unbreakablespecs of his own too, or take the lenses out of an oldpair of yours. (He might poke his eye accidentally withan earpiece, though, or break the frames leaving sharpedges, so maybe that isn't such a hot idea! But maybeyou could let him wear a lenseless pair once in a whileunder very close supervision. ) __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
even coincidence.I might make jokes about all kinds of things but never would I put mantras on the internet. I believe these are the kind of people who took over the movement. So I have not been involved with the new movement at all. As I said I believe there was a lot of constipated people invovled. But as I head toward the big 50 I still hold Maharishi as a great inspiration. In 2002 I lived in Helsinki. When it was time to come back to Brasil, I did not know if I would be able to do so because I did not have money. Yet I had a life I had started in Brasil. I went to New Jersey. I stayed two weeks. It was nice to see my family, I loved New York as always, but after about two weeks I decided it was time to return to Brasil. When I arrived in Rio I had 5.00 in my pocket. People thought I was nuts. I thought of Maharishi. Now is 2006..Jai Guru Dev I am very grateful to have been able to participate in something that would change the face of the world. By the way the name of Madonna's Guru Mother Mera. - Original Message From: curtisdeltablues [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Thursday, October 26, 2006 9:02:33 PMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" Nice details on the early days. I was 16 in 1974 when I got involved,just a kid. My teacher came from the days you remember. The tonechanged through the years as you describe. But I don't view myself asa victim of the movement. Pointing out its flaws or dirty tricksdoesn't make me a victim. How I respond would. I chose all mymovement participation and had lots of fun. It was a mixed bag. Butwhen I was in it, I was all in baby! I enjoyed the intensity.I think that MMY's ideas about of collective consciousness isdifferent from karma theory, but I could be wrong. I haven't thoughtabout this stuff in detail in so many years. Maybe it is just aversion of it. I understand your point better from your explanationof how you view it. I think of karma theory as a devise to maintainthe caste system in India. It seems like a convenient way to keeppeople from acting up in lower castes and to blame people for theirown birth defects. I find it far from a comforting explanation ofevents. I choose to believe in randomness over intended malice fromthe universe. I guess we all have to face this very fundamentalphilosophical question "why does shit happen?" for ourselves.--- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, new.morning [EMAIL PROTECTED] . wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, "curtisdeltablues" curtisdeltablues@ wrote: I enjoyed the trip down memory lane of movement history. It seems to me that blaming the people under the heads of the movement in the organization for how it runs, is buying into one of MMY's more cockamamie ideas about "deservability" . Well, deservability is another name for that "cockamamie" thing called karma. Hardly a MMY concept or creation. Like I said at the beginning, the piece is premised on karma. If you reject the mechanics of karma as being real, you reject the model I suggest (but am not necessarily sold on.) Another explanation might be that MMY is just not a very pleasant guy and runs the group the way he wants it. Sure, there are lots of possible explanations. And they are not necessarily mutually exclusive. And my experience is that from 67-72, MYY was a very nice guy. Very accessable, and giving. 73-77, pretty nice guy with some quirks. So that fits the karma model. He reflected, and gave out what people needed. As the TMO population changed, so did his reaction and management of it. The sign of any good manager. (and what they needed was also their karma.) He attracts the kind of person who enjoys having the power that goes along with phrases that begin with "MMY wants..." That was pretty much post my era. Apparently, that power thing attracted you. :) Again, your point, IMO, supports the model I suggest. A different type of TMer emerged in 77+ and they had lesser and lower motives, "spirit" and karma than those preceeding them. And they got to dwell on and exercise their pettiness, and got what comes with that -- a petty and rigid organization. This group displays the same kind of unkind and often idiotic behavior that is common among power brokers in any group, like Congressmen or Senators. So mix in some well intentioned people who are controlled by the more ruthless in power, Again, the ruthless and pettiness you describe were dominant post my leaving the TMO full time in 77. Some trends of it 75-77, but not dominant in my view, on my watch. And the new breed, the new kids on the block, emerging in 75-77+ created a new group population, group consciousness perhaps, that as a whole created and deserved, and even needed, a petty ruthless, uncompassionate organization. (per the model, again I am not necessarily buying totally into this rather ca
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
WHo are you? I got to MIU March 6th 1976 for the spring quarter. The last time I saw Jerry was in Pacific Palisades I still consider Jerry as friend and I do not understand exactly what went on but I Louis have never felt one negative thing from him. As a person Steve Druker was a nice guy distant but ok. But as an administrator he did not really understand the MIU student. My Opinion.1977-78 was the closest I ever got to working directly for Maharishi. I worked for Lenny but I also got to work for Shirley McNeil head of TMC. I had a phone in my room, when I got calls from Vessy Creighton on the phone WOW!... I did not have a problem with the new regime Until I fell from grace. I asked a white middle classed woman who floated to MIU to marry me. She went and told the whole school. OH BOY! Then they seemed to know everything from there so when I cam back to MIU in 79 things had changed. - Original Message From: new.morning [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Thursday, October 26, 2006 10:56:32 PMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Louis McKenzie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: When I learned to meditiate I was 17. 1974. I learned to meditatein June of 74 and was asked to leave my parents home in October. Myinitiator and the many teachers in New York city became my safe havenif it was not for them I do not know where I would have ended up. Naybe you have heard these names Robert Kory, Bill Duke, CamileMarcus, Jay Marcus, Larry Gelber, Emily Quintana, Ana Zavala, RosePhillips David Carter Brenda Carter these are the ones I easily remember. I knew some in passing. I knew the governor teams that arrived in 77on on LI and Westchester/ Mt kisco much better. Making sure that I meditated twice a day, making sure that I ate. Making MIU so important that I did not mis a day of school. Seeing Maharishi in Madison Square garden meditating with him,seeing Jerry Jarvitz JarvisJerry was my initiator. meditating with him. All of these things helped me. When Iarrived at MIU I knew I wanted to be there but I did not know what toexpect. I thought I would be in silence the whole four years. I wasinto yoga Iyengar yoga. I was into learning vedica Astrology and Iwould wake the pod up every morning to the sounds of my chanting OM.What year did you arrive? I was a bit of a shock to MIU. Because I was the same age aseveryone but different. SO they started working on me. First of allI was suprised to see other African American Students. Nujemi she wasa big problem for trying to be in silence. I was working in thefactory where my father had worked for 8 years so I had enough to buymy one way ticket. Mistake I bought it to Demoine. As luck wouldhave it I spotted a woman on the plane who looked like she was goingto MIU. She rented a car and she drove me to MIU. She was going tothe wedding of Keith and Samantha. Soon I was working for Keith. In my mind I imagined that I was108. Only I was not rich and did not get to be physically as closeto MMY. However I got to know all of the big wigs of the movementearly. Of course there were my favorites Like Charlie, Tom headly,Jenkins he taught me about being a diplomat. Mony Guild. When theseguys took you under their wing it was big stuff. Yes, things could be quite supportive in those days. Then I met Morris Schindler. THUMBS HALF WAY DOWN. Yet I used mytime working in SOuth Falsberg New York to advance my personalevolution. I imagined that in order to be put in charge of a placelike south falsberg one would have to be enlightened. So I never hadsex with one of the women there. There were women living there onstaff people coming on ATR and then the governors. OH MAN! So muchgod walking around and I never jumped in the water one time. I was afraid. Anyway I met John Konhaus and Sarah. Whenever I wasbeing abused I would pray while I did whatever I had to do. So once Igot a special job. John had me make him fresh apple juice every day.I was the only one who could handle his food. For me that was suchan honor. I prayed over his food everyday. Also I served theirtable the top execs just as if I was serving the big M. I fell inlove with Daksha, I got passed Rendy's shell. I got to know thedecision makers. Wehn Larry Domash was President of MIU he was president in nameonly. The real President was Lenny Goldberg. He ran the school dayto day.. Larry came one in a while. Steve Druker was a nut case. Iliked Steve but he was nuts he once said that they could tell studentsanything and they would do it as long as it was told in the right way.That was not a good thing for me to hear. ALmost started on of thefirst real riots at MIU. Not my experience with Steve -- over several years. But you had adifferent experience, perhaps over a longer time with him. Susan Humphrey was really a very beautiful woman.The grand cook of Fuiggi. She was quite sweet. I for a long time only sa
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
- Original Message From: new.morning [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Friday, October 27, 2006 12:09:18 AMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Louis McKenzie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: WHo are you? From names and timelines, i am pretty sure we did not meet or crosspaths. The only Louises (is that the plural of louis) were LouisWiess, Louis Gosnick, and Louis Dysan. As different from each other asany three people could be. Anyone know all three? I dont think I know any of them. I knew Lewis Blake I got to MIU March 6th 1976 for the spring quarter. I was gone by then. Off to teach TM in a third world country. The last time I saw Jerry was in Pacific Palisades I still considerJerry as friend and I do not understand exactly what went on but ILouis have never felt one negative thing from him. I always had positive experiences with and from Jerry's management. Hewas the epitome of the day-to-day TMO I saw and was referring to inthe mid 60-s to early 70's. I think he was just part of the old guard and had to go. 1977-78 was the closest I ever got to working directly forMaharishi. I worked for Lenny but I also got to work for ShirleyMcNeil head of TMC. Did you know Muwea (sp) and Yvonne, probably still TAs at MIU when youwere there? Yvonne's daughter, Ananda, who i remember as a toddler atMIU, had her own TV talk show in 200 or so. Only lasted a season ortwo. But I occaionally see her doing a correspondent thing oncelebrity type TV news shows. SOme of my Favored people. Saraswatti is in a movie. I came back to MIU in 79 things had changed. I was gone from the TMO by then. Only observing it from afar. And somequite cliquey, "us vs them", "we are the elite" stuff in the field. Itwas not for me. Things had changed. Within the TMO and amongstteachers in the field. IMO. This was the beginning of the third phase I was referring to. Adifferent group remained, With different karma -- from my speculation.They got a different TMO. Seemingly far more rigid, secretive, elite,prissy, hard-handed, rule bound than anything I ever lived first handfrom the inside of it. Whether thats their karma -- what they deserved and needed -- or theywere simply victims of a blue-meany organization, is subject todifferent opinions, as you can see. :) __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
On Oct 26, 2006, at 9:21 PM, curtisdeltablues wrote: Was the South Indian restaurant Parus on T street opened when you were there? She taught me to make Idli and dosa and Sambar. It is gone now, but I loved that place. Curtis, I'm pretty sure that was the place I was trying to think of, where I used to go with a couple of friends. Was it a small place, just a few tables, self-serve, on some little side-street off Dupont Circle? If so, I loved that place too. When did it close? Sal To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
I have been in that center also. I have done program there actually bought my first Amrit there. I have a friend from that center. Herb. In reference to Karma I once read a book called Raising the Curtain. In this book there was a man born with Leapracy.He was a master who had come to earth to assist in the healing of the disease. Maybe baby souls that come to earth and are born with AIds maybe they are angels too. - Original Message From: curtisdeltablues [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Friday, October 27, 2006 12:21:02 AMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" My teacher was Joe Smith from Philly. John Y and I are from the samecenter in PA. He was an SCI teacher when I started and I was sure hewas in CC! Were you at the center on Leroy Pl? What a great oldhouse that was. I lived there in 1984 for a year. It must be worthan outrageous amount these days, it is in a great part of town. Wasthe South Indian restaurant Parus on T street opened when you werethere? She taught me to make Idli and dosa and Sambar. It is gonenow, but I loved that place.I am in total agreement about the value of taking personalresponsibility with what we make of the circumstances of our lives. If you were born without legs then it really doesn't matter if it waskarmic payback or just a random genetic mistake, you have to dig deepand learn to walk on prosthetics. ( I just saw a show with a vet whoselegs were blown off in Iraq and he had that valuable attitude and wasmaking his life work) In my own life I figure that my life is 10%what happens to me and 90% what I do with it. Of course I was notborn in Africa with HIV, so I can overcome most of my life'schallenges with determination and effort.I don't see how making a person be born with HIV would be a moralpayback for anything in the context of any morality I can relate to. I guess that is why some say karma is unfathomable. To me it justsounds more similar than different than my own view that random stuffhappens and our job is to keep track of the stuff we can do somethingabout. I do believe there are true victims in the world like kidsborn with problems. But it is unknowable what the reasons are in bothmy view and the karmic model so I don't find much added value.I also believe that beliefs can be useful without any reference totheir accuracy. I don't doubt that some people use the karmic modelto empower themselves. When the monkeys start throwing their shit, weall have to duck just the same! Nice rap.--- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, new.morning [EMAIL PROTECTED] . wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, "curtisdeltablues" curtisdeltablues@ wrote: Nice details on the early days. I was 16 in 1974 when I got involved, just a kid. I was 17. In 1967. Was your teacher from DC? If so, who? I lived at the DC center for several months in 72. If you came around a couple of years earlier, I might have initiated you.My teacher came from the days you remember. The tone changed through the years as you describe. But I don't view myself as a victim of the movement. Pointing out its flaws or dirty tricks doesn't make me a victim. How I respond would. Yes. I was having some fun with you on the victim part. But I keyed off your points about "not blaming the follower" which I may have misunderstood. The view "You are blaming the victim again" is a often used retort when people are discussing the dark side, in latter years, of the TMO. In my piece, I was exploring looking at it from a different angle. That some people got screwed by the TMO, many had great experiences. And the TMO was bright and shining in one decade and dark and dank in another. Could different peoples' different karma explains such? Perhaps. Is casting all the blame on the TMO, without recognizing different people have different karma, a deep view? Probably not. IMO. I chose all my movement participation and had lots of fun. It was a mixed bag. But when I was in it, I was all in baby! I enjoyed the intensity. I think that MMY's ideas about of collective consciousness is different from karma theory, but I could be wrong. Well I was responding to your claim MMY made up the "cockamanie concept of 'desrvability' ". I equated deservability to karma. Collective consciouness was not a part of the convo. However, since you raised it now, collective consciousness, again hardly a MMY "conceptual invention", seems to have significant karmic roots. If you are saying you have trouble as to how ME "cleanses" individual and group karma -- thats a reasonable concern. But the current course, if big enough, and long enough, could provide the data for some good research on it. (finally!) I haven't thought about this stuff in detail in so many years. Maybe it is just a version of it. I understand your point better from your explanation of how you view
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's Persona
Very limited perspective. Not all people who come back are returning due to Karma some come back in choice. for a higher purpose. Considering that each being chooses the circumstance best suited for the purpose of their return. - Original Message From: bob_brigante [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.comSent: Friday, October 27, 2006 1:20:34 AMSubject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A theory of Karma, TMOers, and the TMO's "Persona" I don't see how making a person be born with HIV would be a moral payback for anything in the context of any morality I can relate to. I guess that is why some say karma is unfathomable. ***Nobody else, God or anybody, makes anybody be born with bad karma (or good karma, for that matter) -- the karma one generates is strictly one's own responsibility. The whole principle is simple, and Westerners have been exposed to it from an early age: "whatsoever a man sows, that shall he also reap." This is about as simple a principle as there is: if you generate waves of happiness in your surroundings, you will get happy karma back; if you generate waves of unhappiness, you'll get unhappy things happening to you. Don't want to believe it? Fine, but it's a very obvious feature of the environment which has been commented upon by many religious teachers. Sure, being born with AIDS seems very rough, but haven't you watched films depicting the many brutal things people do to other people? If there is any justice in the universe, then those wrongdoers get to suffer just like they made others suffer. Not only is it a matter of justice, bad karma is more important as a stick to encourage people to stop wrongdoing and get on the path of evolution -- nobody will ever cease to be, so it's important that they learn how to live without making others suffer. __._,_.___ To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe __,_._,___
