[wdvltalk] RE: CSS boxes etc
Joseph Now who uses ems for site sizing and what problems are most important? That's the elastic design I was referring to. A column of, say, 36em is fixed to that measurement. No amount of browser resizing is going to change the width of that column. However, changing the text display size via your browser will modify just how big an EM is in terms of pixels, which will in turn change the width of your column. Therefore, the problems you're going to encounter is if you create a nice, comfortable design using EMs as measurements, be careful you don't end up causing horizontal scrollbars when a user wants a tiny browser window but huge text (36em at IE 6's Largest setting equates to 768px according to the Elastic Design article at ALA). but if I must use boxes... Boxes is a design metaphor so try not to get hung up on the concept being a literal my web pages look like a load of boxes (although early pure XHTML+CSS designs were very very boxy indeed, not always a good thing). Similarly, do table-based designs look like grids of tabular data? We've already cited the CSS Zen Garden as a beautiful example of what you can acheive with this approach, and a number of the designs there are very fluid, rounded, organic structures - not a visible box in sight. I would suggest that before you start thinking about redesigns and moving towards this wonderful approach, have a play around and experiment with the sources we've all provided and just get a feel for it. Once you know what you can do, what is within your grasp and confidence/experience level then you can start applying that to your work. As you say, it does require a change in design thinking, and also a shift in conceptualising how to code your sites, but however daunting it may be it's well worth it. Enjoy! MOU The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] RE: CSS boxes etc
Joesph: I get you now...those really annoying scrolly boxes that always try to stay at the same place on your screen regardless of how often you scroll! Ignore them - they're Javascript based and, although the concept behind them is a good one (also I think it's a workaround until our favourite Microsoft browser supports the CSS position:fixed for anything other than background images), the implementation is truly abysmal. If these are the things that's had you concerned about usability I'm glad to say it's not going to be an issue for your venture into tableless design at this stage. If you got any problems at all, you know where we are! MOU The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] RE: CSS boxes etc
Cheryl, Ah! That makes sense. But,no, I never included the flash ads; on my dial-up nothing much downloaded before I packed them off. So one last question pre seeing if I can take on the learning curve: is there a consensus on what is the most usual size of browser view that people actually see? Joseph Ah, those are usually done with javascript and not just CSS. Especially if you see them on IE because IE only supports position fixed for background. The first started appearing a couple of years ago and are intended to keep some object always in view, usually a menu. Not many people use them now. They were a fad for awhile. If someone wants to use one it should be in its own column so it doesn't obscure text. Or do you mean the Flash ads? Yahoo is notorious for using them. One of the benefits to using Firefox, Mozilla or Opera is that those floating flash ads don't float. Cheryl D. Wise Certified Professional Web Developer MS-MVP-FrontPage www.wiserways.com mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 713.353.0139 Office The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] RE: CSS boxes etc
MOU, Thanks. With Cheryl and you in accord on this I know it's right ;-). Now I have to just blend this with php/mysql and the redesign should be a doddle... Joseph Joesph: I get you now...those really annoying scrolly boxes that always try to stay at the same place on your screen regardless of how often you scroll! Ignore them - they're Javascript based and, although the concept behind them is a good one (also I think it's a workaround until our favourite Microsoft browser supports the CSS position:fixed for anything other than background images), the implementation is truly abysmal. If these are the things that's had you concerned about usability I'm glad to say it's not going to be an issue for your venture into tableless design at this stage. If you got any problems at all, you know where we are! MOU . The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM . To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%% To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with. The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] RE: CSS boxes etc
Joseph: is there a consensus on what is the most usual size of browser view that people actually see? Not too sure what you mean by this. If you're referring to common or most used screen resolutions then I have two answers for you: * If you're planning on working to a fixed size design (i.e. like A List Apart or Macromedia) then try to stick to widths that will fit comfortably to 800x600. * If you do this properly then you don't need to worry about user's screen resolutions because a properly designed fluid layout will adapt. Note that this is the theory lol so still test at a number of resolutions and browser sizes to see how well the fluid design adapts. MOU The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] Re: CSS boxes etc
Joe wrote: Might a good starting point for my education be a couple of urls where you consider this is well done and a good advertisement for the technique? http://www.csszengarden.com nuff said. - Stephen The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] RE: CSS boxes etc
-Original Message- From: Joseph Harris [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, September 13, 2004 7:44 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [wdvltalk] CSS boxes etc With Cascade DTP I have just been experimenting with absolute positioning. My impression is that this forces a very rigid approach to design and layout. And I have not felt there is comfortable surfing with the floats I have viewed. If I am missing the point how, with the latest css (oft-praised on wdvl talk), can I achieve the flow and adaptability of tables - which I find a much more comfortable viewing experience? Intertwined in this, I suppose, is the question: just because it can be done, should it?I hope this is a sensible question; I have my dunce's cap ready if not. Joseph Harris West Civ offers a fine set of basic courses. Their technique is to offer free online versions on a rotating basis. Currently they are offering CSS Level 1, the introductory course. It's in week 5 now but you can also get to Week 4 and frankly the expense is minor for the entire course. Have a look at: http://www.westciv.com/courses/free/index.html Also for the box model, Big John and Holly have a fine mini tutorial at: http://www.positioniseverything.net/articles/float-theory.html Their site is excellent for explaining some of the special features found only in IE. drew The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] RE: CSS boxes etc
Their site is excellent for explaining some of the special features found only in IE. How politically correct of you drew :P MOU The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] RE: CSS boxes etc
-Original Message- From: Ross Clutterbuck [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, September 14, 2004 8:58 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [wdvltalk] RE: CSS boxes etc Their site is excellent for explaining some of the special features found only in IE. How politically correct of you drew :P MOU == Rudy has referred to me as a reactionary and now I'm politically correct. Does that make me bi-polar? drew The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] RE: CSS boxes etc
Joseph, Also google for css columns. That will help you get a foundational understanding of how css does layouts. I try to shy away from absolute positioning as much as I can. Check out: http://www.simplebits.com He has some wonderful CSS designs and tutorials (although many are advanced). Here is the exact link to his CSS section: http://www.simplebits.com/notebook/css/index.html Purchase TopStyle3 Pro. I cannot say enough about how this program has helped me. It will give you instruction on what certain CSS elements are and help you keep syntactically correct. Take a lot of code apart. This is my best way of learning. I'm like the apprentice brain surgeon: I touch a brain lobe and then see what part of the body twitched! :) Hope that helped, Will Professional Graphics Artist Certified Web Designer (BCIP) Stewart and Company -- www.stewartandcompany.net [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- W: 304.550.2687 Rt. 1 Box 364 Buffalo, WV 25033 -Original Message- From: Joseph Harris [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, September 13, 2004 7:44 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [wdvltalk] CSS boxes etc With Cascade DTP I have just been experimenting with absolute positioning. My impression is that this forces a very rigid approach to design and layout. And I have not felt there is comfortable surfing with the floats I have viewed. If I am missing the point how, with the latest css (oft-praised on wdvl talk), can I achieve the flow and adaptability of tables - which I find a much more comfortable viewing experience? Intertwined in this, I suppose, is the question: just because it can be done, should it?I hope this is a sensible question; I have my dunce's cap ready if not. Joseph Harris The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] RE: CSS boxes etc
drew, MOU and Stephen, I am following through on the urls and will further build my understanding; zengarden and happycog are excellent sites. I don't argue with that at all. Positioniseverything offers great clarity. I have no trouble with the principles of css/box/float, nor the site control it offers - particularly for the larger sites. While, as a limited web designer, I like any of these techniques which make that side of life easier I am also a site owner concerned with my surfer's experience. It is here that I see problems. I use my own surfing as a test and a sort of metaphor for my visitors. Now, whatever size of screen a surfer has his/her viewing experience is affected by the size of browser as she/he uses it. On the fixed box sites a browser smaller than the designed size needs scrolling (not such a problem in all honesty) but may also mean important design aspects cannot do their 'one second hypnosis' job, and it looks inflexible which is not a good image on the flexible net. Floats have another difficulty. Many surfers will have no problem with an ever changing text and box shaping as scrolling is done. But, not only for old codgers like me, too much visual disturbance creates actual discomfort. In fact I increasing limit my television watching because the excess use of flashing, quick refocussing, idiiotically close close-ups, crossing of people and objects between the subject and the camera, fast sweeps and ever-shortening takes (to name but a few coke-induced ideas). Like everybody else I sit much closer to the monitor than to a TV screen. Oh so many of the floats I have seen move around with scrolling, or change shape and/or position as the page downloads (maybe not only a box problem, but encouraged by the technique). So I am not just asking for adivce and help on how to go about it (I am already sold on css itself) but for a part of the discussion MOU referred to: can I make this new (to me anyway) method as flexible in different sized bowsers as I can make tables (visually comfortable is what I mean) without suffering a fluidity that ageing and imperfect eyes will find uncomfortable? At the moment I am planning to stay with tables for my redesign (if I ever get it done!!!) but I could still be convinced that I shouldn't; but it is viewr experience I am concerned with. Sorry to go on at length, but I think this is an important aspect. Joseph Harris From: Joseph Harris Subject: [wdvltalk] CSS boxes etc With Cascade DTP I have just been experimenting with absolute positioning. My impression is that this forces a very rigid approach to design and layout. And I have not felt there is comfortable surfing with the floats I have viewed. If I am missing the point how, with the latest css (oft-praised on wdvl talk), can I achieve the flow and adaptability of tables - which I find a much more comfortable viewing experience? Intertwined in this, I suppose, is the question: just because it can be done, should it?I hope this is a sensible question; I have my dunce's cap ready if not. Joseph Harris West Civ offers a fine set of basic courses. Their technique is to offer free online versions on a rotating basis. Currently they are offering CSS Level 1, the introductory course. It's in week 5 now but you can also get to Week 4 and frankly the expense is minor for the entire course. Have a look at: http://www.westciv.com/courses/free/index.html Also for the box model, Big John and Holly have a fine mini tutorial at: http://www.positioniseverything.net/articles/float-theory.html Their site is excellent for explaining some of the special features found only in IE. drew . The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM . To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%% To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with. The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version:
[wdvltalk] RE: CSS boxes etc
See my replies inline. On Tue, 14 Sep 2004 09:34:11 -0400, William Stewart [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Joseph, Also google for css columns. That will help you get a foundational understanding of how css does layouts. I try to shy away from absolute positioning as much as I can. Oh... Absolute Positioning's not so bad. In fact it's *very* powerful. Especially when you start mixing absolute and relative positioning. Not so good as far as subject matter for beginners though. Check out: http://www.simplebits.com He has some wonderful CSS designs and tutorials (although many are advanced). Here is the exact link to his CSS section: http://www.simplebits.com/notebook/css/index.html Purchase TopStyle3 Pro. I cannot say enough about how this program has helped me. It will give you instruction on what certain CSS elements are and help you keep syntactically correct. You know, I didn't think about it, but Will is absolutely correct on this one. TopStyle (even the free lite version if you have to [be assured the Pro upgrade has functionality out the wazoo and it's only $40us]) has been the key to my attaining a thorough understanding of CSS. Can't reccomend it enough. Take a lot of code apart. This is my best way of learning. I'm like the apprentice brain surgeon: I touch a brain lobe and then see what part of the body twitched! :) To aid in doing this... Make the switch to FireFox. For two reasons: [1] Web Developers Toolbar [2] EditCss sidebar The Web Developers Toolbar will help you immensely with CSS Layout. The ability to easily turn on and off borders on block level elements in and of itself (Outline Outline Block Level Elements) will save you /tons/ of time. Not to mention the bevy of other goodies it boasts... EditCss! Even though the Web Developers Toolbar has this functionality built into it, this is the way to go! All I do is hit ctrl + 8 and I've got *all* of the CSS (inline, embedded, linked) ready to edit in a handy sidebar that slides out from the right. Make changes and watch there effects in real time. So bad ass! Plus, it's all free. hth, Stephen [1] http://www.chrispederick.com/work/firefox/webdeveloper/ [2] http://editcss.mozdev.org/ The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] RE: CSS boxes etc
/me whipes the sweat from his brow. Okay... On Tue, 14 Sep 2004 16:10:38 +0100, Joseph Harris [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: drew, MOU and Stephen, snip/ Now, whatever size of screen a surfer has his/her viewing experience is affected by the size of browser as she/he uses it. On the fixed box sites a browser smaller than the designed size needs scrolling (not such a problem in all honesty) but may also mean important design aspects cannot do their 'one second hypnosis' job, and it looks inflexible which is not a good image on the flexible net. Everything you just said is as true of table-based layouts as CSS based layouts. It's pretty simple really... if you set your width to high, people will have to scroll. snip/ Oh so many of the floats I have seen move around with scrolling, or change shape and/or position as the page downloads (maybe not only a box problem, but encouraged by the technique). I think you're unclear on what a float is. Maybe it's an issue of terminology, but it sounds like you're talking more about the liquid width layouts than floats. So, first a definition: quote src=http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-CSS2/visuren.html#floats; 9.5 Floats A float is a box that is shifted to the left or right on the current line. The most interesting characteristic of a float (or floated or floating box) is that content may flow along its side (or be prohibited from doing so by the 'clear' property)... /quote I will presume you mean liquid layouts (correct me if I'm wrong). Again, what you've said of liquid CSS layouts is just as true of liquid table based layouts. The premise is the same. You have a portion of the screen which stretches to fit the available area. Content reflow is going to behave precisely the same regardless. In fact here's a demo page: http://mechavox.com/sandbox/squishy.html So I am not just asking for adivce and help on how to go about it (I am already sold on css itself) but for a part of the discussion MOU referred to: can I make this new (to me anyway) method as flexible in different sized bowsers as I can make tables (visually comfortable is what I mean) without suffering a fluidity that ageing and imperfect eyes will find uncomfortable? Well, I can't speak on the matter of what is and is not easy on the eyes, but I can say with much certainty that you may not only find as much flexibility, but much more with CSS layouts. Here's a good example: http://www.csszengarden.com/?cssfile=/063/063.csspage=0 Try changing your font size on that page. At the moment I am planning to stay with tables for my redesign (if I ever get it done!!!) but I could still be convinced that I shouldn't; but it is viewr experience I am concerned with. In respect to viewer experience: By laying out with CSS, you allow more viewers to experience your site. A semantically coded, valid site, with separated presentation goes a long way to being accessible by default. This means more user agents (PDA's, cell phones, braille and screen readers, web-enabled toilets, etc.) can get your content in an easily digested format. That, to me, *is* good viewer experience. Sorry to go on at length, but I think this is an important aspect. So do I :) Here's another tidbit for your thinking cap. You've got one customer that's (arguably) more important than any other. And it's blind. The web spider. It likes to have high content-to-markup ratio's. An easy way to achieve that is by having all of your presentation separated out into a single external file that the spider doesn't care about... your css. Add to that, semantically appropriate markup that gives spiders hints as to which pieces of text in a page should be considered important and you'll be well on your way to good search engine placement. okay, I'm done. someone put the soap box away for me. I need a smoke. - Stephen The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] RE: CSS boxes etc
To add to Stephen's description of what a float is the closes HTML analogy is align. Basically allows text wrapping. Another site to look at for CSS layouts but this time featuring current live sites is http://cssvault.com/ Cheryl D. Wise Certified Professional Web Developer MS-MVP-FrontPage www.wiserways.com mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 713.353.0139 Office -Original Message- From: Stephen Caudill Oh so many of the floats I have seen move around with scrolling, or change shape and/or position as the page downloads (maybe not only a box problem, but encouraged by the technique). I think you're unclear on what a float is. Maybe it's an issue of terminology, but it sounds like you're talking more about the liquid width layouts than floats. So, first a definition: quote src=http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-CSS2/visuren.html#floats; 9.5 Floats A float is a box that is shifted to the left or right on the current line. The most interesting characteristic of a float (or floated or floating box) is that content may flow along its side (or be prohibited from doing so by the 'clear' property)... /quote I will presume you mean liquid layouts (correct me if I'm wrong). Again, what you've said of liquid CSS layouts is just as true of liquid table based layouts. The premise is the same. You have a portion of the screen which stretches to fit the available area. Content reflow is going to behave precisely the same regardless. In fact here's a demo page: http://mechavox.com/sandbox/squishy.html So I am not just asking for adivce and help on how to go about it (I am already sold on css itself) but for a part of the discussion MOU referred to: can I make this new (to me anyway) method as flexible in different sized bowsers as I can make tables (visually comfortable is what I mean) without suffering a fluidity that ageing and imperfect eyes will find uncomfortable? Well, I can't speak on the matter of what is and is not easy on the eyes, but I can say with much certainty that you may not only find as much flexibility, but much more with CSS layouts. Here's a good example: http://www.csszengarden.com/?cssfile=/063/063.csspage=0 Try changing your font size on that page. At the moment I am planning to stay with tables for my redesign (if I ever get it done!!!) but I could still be convinced that I shouldn't; but it is viewr experience I am concerned with. In respect to viewer experience: By laying out with CSS, you allow more viewers to experience your site. A semantically coded, valid site, with separated presentation goes a long way to being accessible by default. This means more user agents (PDA's, cell phones, braille and screen readers, web-enabled toilets, etc.) can get your content in an easily digested format. That, to me, *is* good viewer experience. Sorry to go on at length, but I think this is an important aspect. So do I :) Here's another tidbit for your thinking cap. You've got one customer that's (arguably) more important than any other. And it's blind. The web spider. It likes to have high content-to-markup ratio's. An easy way to achieve that is by having all of your presentation separated out into a single external file that the spider doesn't care about... your css. Add to that, semantically appropriate markup that gives spiders hints as to which pieces of text in a page should be considered important and you'll be well on your way to good search engine placement. okay, I'm done. someone put the soap box away for me. I need a smoke. The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] RE: CSS boxes etc
Will, I saw this after I had sent out my earlier reply. I have Top Style Lite (from a much earlier recommendation by Cheryl) and I agree it is a great help. And thanks Cheryl for the further link. I clicked back to my own (tables) site to check I was talking (and writing) sense and I find that some pages re-adjust to more or less fit a smaller browser window and some don't - or do so to a lesser degree!! My skills (and time to hone them) are by necessity limited, so I'm not too ashamed of that, but my object is a site which offers a good experience however the browser window is. I have taken on board Stephen's further highly informative and helpful remarks. Now I have (since I have noted boxes) understood that there are great similarities in appearance between tables and boxes; and previously that css cleans up the html (the added SE positioning value I had not registered before, though). I will download and see how I get on with Stephen's Firefox advice. The mobile boxes I have seen which I have been describing (inadequately) are not the ones that fill a width, but those that float so that if the browser is scrolled a section (usually with transparency but not always) bounces around at the top ot side or bottom of the window, often obscuring some part of the main text; the movement can be uncomfortable. I am starting to understand this is not what I had thought, but what is that? Thanks again for all the comments, teachers. Joseph (who thought he had a good gripe) Joseph, Also google for css columns. That will help you get a foundational understanding of how css does layouts. I try to shy away from absolute positioning as much as I can. Check out: http://www.simplebits.com He has some wonderful CSS designs and tutorials (although many are advanced). Here is the exact link to his CSS section: http://www.simplebits.com/notebook/css/index.html Purchase TopStyle3 Pro. I cannot say enough about how this program has helped me. It will give you instruction on what certain CSS elements are and help you keep syntactically correct. Take a lot of code apart. This is my best way of learning. I'm like the apprentice brain surgeon: I touch a brain lobe and then see what part of the body twitched! :) Hope that helped, Will Professional Graphics Artist Certified Web Designer (BCIP) Stewart and Company -- www.stewartandcompany.net [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- W: 304.550.2687 Rt. 1 Box 364 Buffalo, WV 25033 -Original Message- From: Joseph Harris [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, September 13, 2004 7:44 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [wdvltalk] CSS boxes etc With Cascade DTP I have just been experimenting with absolute positioning. My impression is that this forces a very rigid approach to design and layout. And I have not felt there is comfortable surfing with the floats I have viewed. If I am missing the point how, with the latest css (oft-praised on wdvl talk), can I achieve the flow and adaptability of tables - which I find a much more comfortable viewing experience? Intertwined in this, I suppose, is the question: just because it can be done, should it?I hope this is a sensible question; I have my dunce's cap ready if not. Joseph Harris . The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM . To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%% To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with. The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] RE: CSS boxes etc
Joseph Just a little thing. Don't confuse floats with fluid as they're different things. All the behaviour you seem to be referring to is fluid design, whereby the layout of a page flows with the sizing of the browser. Note however that it's not really common user practice to constantly size your browser - users will have their preferences on how big they want their browser window and what text size they want and generally leave it at that. Fluid design will ensure that your design work will flow accordingly and fit to what canvas it's been provided with with the beneift of rejigging itself should the user resize. But fixed sized design is also perfectly valid: A List Apart, Happy Cog and Macromedia sites all look mighty fine with their fixed-width, centered display area design. Enjoy yourself on this one Joseph - it's a big scary world at first but you'll come to love it... MOU The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] RE: CSS boxes etc
Just to follow up... I had meant to mention earlier that there are quite a few /benefits/ to fixed width layouts. While you noted they seem inflexible, until we get a bit better CSS support from IE (namely min-width and max-width, which will enable us to blend fluid and fixed width layouts a bit more freely), they're actually a boon to usability: http://psychology.wichita.edu/surl/usabilitynews/3S/layout.htm http://www.humanfactors.com/downloads/feb03.asp The basics of it being that shorter lines are easier for people to read. I'm not dyslexic, but it's still sometimes easy for me to lose my place in the midst of reading lengthy texts with longish lines... I can only imagine how crapulent that must be for people with genuine disabilities (even relatively minor ones like dyslexia). I'm fairly sure the 'mobile boxes' you're refferring to are actually DHTML (JS, CSS and HTML) layers which are being positioned relative to the viewport. Interestingly enough, this is a really just a hack for the CSS2 property 'position:fixed', which does the same thing in browsers that support it, but without the annoying bumping around you describe. - Stephen On Tue, 14 Sep 2004 22:44:57 +0100, Joseph Harris [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Will, I saw this after I had sent out my earlier reply. I have Top Style Lite (from a much earlier recommendation by Cheryl) and I agree it is a great help. And thanks Cheryl for the further link. I clicked back to my own (tables) site to check I was talking (and writing) sense and I find that some pages re-adjust to more or less fit a smaller browser window and some don't - or do so to a lesser degree!! My skills (and time to hone them) are by necessity limited, so I'm not too ashamed of that, but my object is a site which offers a good experience however the browser window is. I have taken on board Stephen's further highly informative and helpful remarks. Now I have (since I have noted boxes) understood that there are great similarities in appearance between tables and boxes; and previously that css cleans up the html (the added SE positioning value I had not registered before, though). I will download and see how I get on with Stephen's Firefox advice. The mobile boxes I have seen which I have been describing (inadequately) are not the ones that fill a width, but those that float so that if the browser is scrolled a section (usually with transparency but not always) bounces around at the top ot side or bottom of the window, often obscuring some part of the main text; the movement can be uncomfortable. I am starting to understand this is not what I had thought, but what is that? Thanks again for all the comments, teachers. Joseph (who thought he had a good gripe) The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] Re: CSS boxes etc
Hi Joseph The question you ask is a mighty discussion all to itself! There are so many things to say, from beginner stuff all the way to super-advanced, I just don't know where to start. Best do some reading first I think. Hunt around http://www.alistapart.com for articles on CSS design (but you'll need to look at the earlier stuff to get the theory and starting material - try Flexible Layouts with CSS Positioning http://www.alistapart.com/articles/flexiblelayouts/ to throw you in at the deep end!! Might not mean a lot but the theory might be useful - it's probably an intermediate document). Also there's a great load of stuff on WHY to do it (specifically the articles Better Living Through XHTML http://www.alistapart.com/articles/betterliving/ and To Hell With Bad Browsers http://www.alistapart.com/articles/tohell/) Try the CSS intro at http://www.w3schools.com/css/ And some books off the top of my head: Jeffrey Zeldman's Designing With Web Standards, Eric Meyer's Eric Meyer on CSS and W3 Schools are advertising Designing WIthout Tables Using CSS by Dan Shafer. Just generally Google around I guess for things like tableless design, css positioning and web standards to see what you can dig up. Once you start reading you'll (hopefully) see why we always moan about table-based design in contemporary web development and want to ditch them forever. I can dig out a ton more stuff once you get going. MOU *dreams of a web where table-based design was killed by having Netscape 4.x's corpse rammed down its throat* The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] Re: CSS boxes etc
MOU, Thanks for the prompt and thorough response. It will take me a while to fit in your suggestions, though I note your enthusiasm! Might a good starting point for my education be a couple of urls where you consider this is well done and a good advertisement for the technique? Again many thanks, Joseph Hi Joseph The question you ask is a mighty discussion all to itself! There are so many things to say, from beginner stuff all the way to super-advanced, I just don't know where to start. Best do some reading first I think. Hunt around http://www.alistapart.com for articles on CSS design (but you'll need to look at the earlier stuff to get the theory and starting material - try Flexible Layouts with CSS Positioning http://www.alistapart.com/articles/flexiblelayouts/ to throw you in at the deep end!! Might not mean a lot but the theory might be useful - it's probably an intermediate document). Also there's a great load of stuff on WHY to do it (specifically the articles Better Living Through XHTML http://www.alistapart.com/articles/betterliving/ and To Hell With Bad Browsers http://www.alistapart.com/articles/tohell/) Try the CSS intro at http://www.w3schools.com/css/ And some books off the top of my head: Jeffrey Zeldman's Designing With Web Standards, Eric Meyer's Eric Meyer on CSS and W3 Schools are advertising Designing WIthout Tables Using CSS by Dan Shafer. Just generally Google around I guess for things like tableless design, css positioning and web standards to see what you can dig up. Once you start reading you'll (hopefully) see why we always moan about table-based design in contemporary web development and want to ditch them forever. I can dig out a ton more stuff once you get going. MOU *dreams of a web where table-based design was killed by having Netscape 4.x's corpse rammed down its throat* The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] RE: CSS woes
Must be something in your code putting the right most column owe the body
border. Another approach would he to make the body background color black
with padding: 0 10 px; (or whatever width you want the border) then put
white in the div backgrounds or a contains div.
DIV.menuon only sets the fort for text not links. It is overwritten by:
A:hover {
FONT-WEIGHT: normal;
COLOR: #cb4d1a;
TEXT-DECORATION: underline
}
You need a contextual selector:
DIV.menuon A:hover {
FONT-WEIGHT: normal;
COLOR: #cb4d1a;
TEXT-DECORATION: underline
}
I'm surprised it works in your version of Foxfire. I'm running the latest
build (installed this week) and it doesn't work There any differently than
in IE 6 and Mozila.
Cheryl D. Wise
Certified Professional Web Developer
MS-MVP-FrontPage
www.wiserways.com
mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
713.353.0139 Office
-Original Message-
From: William Stewart
Could you take a look at my link again:
http://www.stewartandcompany.net/clients/calebco/layout.php
Problem 1:
I followed your suggestions to validate and give the body the border, but
the border still will not run all the way down the page like I want.
As you can see, it stops after 150px or so.
Problem 2:
I want the link to be bold whenever the mouse is over the div. It works
with Firefox but not with IE. The instructions to be bold on the mouseover
is at div.menuon.
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[wdvltalk] Re: CSS center
Can you post more code or a link? Riva Riva Portman, MCIWD Certified Webdesigner Star Quality Designs www.starqualitydesigns.com The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] Re: CSS center
text-align: center is really only supposed to apply to text and it
works in IE only because IE doesn't interpret it properly.
The CORRECT way to do it is:
body {
text-align: center;
} /* for IE */
div#container {
margin: 0 auto;
text-align: left;
} /* for standards-compliant browsers */
html
body
div id=container
/div
/body
/html
The margin setting means 0 for top and bottom, and auto margins for
left and right, which throws the div into the center.
William Stewart wrote:
Hello everyone,
I am working on a site that has a fixed-width design aligned in the
middle (horizontally) of the screen. I am doing this tableless and in
XHTML 1.0 Transitional - that's always a recipe for long nights trying
to get it to work.
Herein, lieth the problem. To center the design in the middle of the
screen, I would normally do align=center with the container div. The
problem is, that perfectly wonderful property attribute is now
deprecated in XHTML 1.0 Transitional. I came up with a solution that
works in IE, but is does not in the Mozilla/Netscape/Firefox family:
body {
text-align: center;
}
div.main {
text-align: left;
}
Of course, the text goes in the div and everything is beautiful in IE
although the other browsers align it left still. I fixed it in M/N/F by
using center to envelop everything, but it will make all the text
centered if there is no style sheet loaded.
Is there another solution that I am not thinking about?
--
::
Howard Cheng
http://www.howcheng.com/
Wise-cracking quote goes here.
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[wdvltalk] Re: CSS center
On Fri, 6 Aug 2004 11:37:13 -0400, William Stewart [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Is there another solution that I am not thinking about?
Yep. The proper method is to align the containing block by using the
margin attribute. Like so:
#container{
width:600px;
margin:0 auto;
}
The container must have a declared width and it's left and right
margins should be set to auto... the only other caveat is to make
sure that IE isn't rendering in quirks mode.
- Stephen
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[wdvltalk] Re: CSS center
Thanks Howard and Stephen! As always, you came through. Will Professional Graphics Artist Certified Web Designer (BCIP) Stewart and Company -- www.stewartandcompany.net [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- W: 304.550.2687 Rt. 1 Box 364 Buffalo, WV 25033 The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] Re: CSS center
Depends on the version of IE and the doctype. IE 6 in standards mode (full
valid doctype of HTML 4.01 Strict or XHTML) will use margin-auto but in any
event unless your content is constrained by a container inside div#container
it will expand to fill the space so there will be no margins.
Personally I don't bother with the first part. People using earlier browsers
can get it left aligned so I go with the simpler code:
#container {width: 740px; margin: 0 auto;}
Cheryl D. Wise
Certified Professional Web Developer
MS-MVP-FrontPage
www.wiserways.com
mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
713.353.0139 Office
-Original Message-
From: Howard Cheng
text-align: center is really only supposed to apply to text and it works
in IE only because IE doesn't interpret it properly.
The CORRECT way to do it is:
body {
text-align: center;
} /* for IE */
div#container {
margin: 0 auto;
text-align: left;
} /* for standards-compliant browsers */
html
body
div id=container
/div
/body
/html
The margin setting means 0 for top and bottom, and auto margins for left
and right, which throws the div into the center.
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[wdvltalk] Re: CSS center
Whoops!! That should've been margin-left: -370px; I knew I'd mess it up lol MOU The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] Re: css quandaries
Rita,
The good news is that the page validates as transitional xhtml.
You have a class: .email{float:right;}. If it floats it needs width,
explicit or implicit. Relying on the absolute position of ppsalogo.gif to
push the email address over can have unpredictable results -- just what
you have. Give it a width and then be sure to clear it before starting the
#paperbox or you may still get undpredictable results. Once you do that
the email addy should be visible on IE.
I haven't downloaded the site or tested this fix but I know float requires
width and you don't have it.
It's interesting that the mac seems to truncate the length of the
containing boxes while IE and Opera provide the full length. Or is that
where you cut the gif?
drew
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[wdvltalk] Re: css quandaries
First off, you have an OPEN / CLOSE brace issue in your #contentbox. try fixing that first hAt 5/22/2004 11:41 AM, you wrote: Hi. I'm trying to build a site using xhtml and css and i'm relatively new at this, not to mention that the layout is especially challenging. Here's my situation: if you look at http://www.crisafidesign.com/ppsa/onmac.html you will see what I see on my mac (classic using IE 5.1). As you can well see, the page (http://www.crisafidesign.com/ppsa/intro.shtml) does not work at all in explorer pc. I recognize that there may be z-index issues, etc., but I think the other errors are where I have screwed up parent/child positioning issues. Does anyone, taking a look at the style sheet (http://www.crisafidesign.com/ppsa/css/intpagestyles.css) see anything glaring?? I would appreciate any help I can get as that once I get this resolved I should be able to procede with the rest of the site. Another question, I adapted a javascript/css combo for the expandable menus that I got from gazingus.org. There's a commented out browser detect that supposedly tells Opera to return I'm too tired if it encounters this script. http://www.crisafidesign.com/ppsa/js/menuExpandable.js The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] Re: css quandaries
your have here as missing, what font tag?
Download TOP STYLE LITE and check your CSS work for error
#bigbox {
20px;
voice-family: \}\;
At 5/22/2004 11:41 AM, you wrote:
Hi. I'm trying to build a site using xhtml and css and i'm relatively new
at this, not to mention that the layout is especially challenging.
Here's my situation:
if you look at http://www.crisafidesign.com/ppsa/onmac.html you will see
what I see on my mac (classic using IE 5.1). As you can well see, the page
(http://www.crisafidesign.com/ppsa/intro.shtml) does not work at all in
explorer pc. I recognize that there may be z-index issues, etc., but I
think the other errors are where I have screwed up parent/child
positioning issues. Does anyone, taking a look at the style sheet
(http://www.crisafidesign.com/ppsa/css/intpagestyles.css) see anything
glaring??
I would appreciate any help I can get as that once I get this resolved I
should be able to procede with the rest of the site.
Another question, I adapted a javascript/css combo for the expandable
menus that I got from gazingus.org. There's a commented out browser detect
that supposedly tells Opera to return I'm too tired if it encounters
this script.
http://www.crisafidesign.com/ppsa/js/menuExpandable.js
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[wdvltalk] Re: css not acting
Then here is a conundrum for you (in the plural). The css would not work correctly in td, but does so in font. Since I do this only now and again I am probably missing something, and I will learn more. But is there perhaps an imediate reason for this problem? Also. alas, in triumphing I set updisaster!:-/ ;~( I changed something without saving a copy first, and I have a fresh, major, undefined, and blanks instead of content!!!. It must wait a couple of days. In fact I might put what I have in another folder, and start right from the beginning again to see if I now understand enought to get it right as I go. Is that a good idea? Joseph Cheryl wrote: When I first started reading your post I was thinking my husband had been too generous with the scotch. A font tag in a post from you, fortunately I continued to read and as the rest of the message scrolled up my faith was restored. ;-} Tim: I gotta admit, I was thinking the same thing. [rudy?!? Using font??? LOL] It got better. FWIW, putting the style in the TD tag works well in Netcape 4 browsers (one of the few things that does work for tables). It's a clean way of using the same CSS for NN4 and most other browsers rather than having to specify an NN4-only stylesheet. Tim . The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM . To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%% To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with. The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] Re: css not acting
When you can send a url so we can see what else might be affecting the display. Cheryl D. Wise Certified Professional Web Developer MS-MVP-FrontPage www.wiserways.com mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 713.353.0139 Office -Original Message- From: Smile-Poet Then here is a conundrum for you (in the plural). The css would not work correctly in td, but does so in font. Since I do this only now and again I am probably missing something, and I will learn more. But is there perhaps an imediate reason for this problem? Also. alas, in triumphing I set updisaster!:-/ ;~( I changed something without saving a copy first, and I have a fresh, major, undefined, and blanks instead of content!!!. It must wait a couple of days. In fact I might put what I have in another folder, and start right from the beginning again to see if I now understand enought to get it right as I go. Is that a good idea? The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] Re: css not acting
Css behaves slightly differently in tables. Special set of sub rules. Post your code for the disaster. It's very possible you've forgotten to close a } or a somewhere that causes the blank. A url even to a blank page would do it since we could look at the source. drew -Original Message- From: Smile-Poet [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, April 23, 2004 1:27 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [wdvltalk] Re: css not acting Then here is a conundrum for you (in the plural). The css would not work correctly in td, but does so in font. Since I do this only now and again I am probably missing something, and I will learn more. But is there perhaps an imediate reason for this problem? Also. alas, in triumphing I set updisaster!:-/ ;~( I changed something without saving a copy first, and I have a fresh, major, undefined, and blanks instead of content!!!. It must wait a couple of days. In fact I might put what I have in another folder, and start right from the beginning again to see if I now understand enought to get it right as I go. Is that a good idea? Joseph Cheryl wrote: When I first started reading your post I was thinking my husband had been too generous with the scotch. A font tag in a post from you, fortunately I continued to read and as the rest of the message scrolled up my faith was restored. ;-} Tim: I gotta admit, I was thinking the same thing. [rudy?!? Using font??? LOL] It got better. FWIW, putting the style in the TD tag works well in Netcape 4 browsers (one of the few things that does work for tables). It's a clean way of using the same CSS for NN4 and most other browsers rather than having to specify an NN4-only stylesheet. Tim . The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM . To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%% To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with. * The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM * To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%% To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with. The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] Re: css not acting
OK Andrew, here it is - I think. This is sessions.php. Errors on other
files complain on an undefined _SESSION.With this the content in the
main area does not come up. It was messing with this file that caused the
problem.
Previous errors were about login and admin_access, but the script more or
less worked, and it was a matter either of seeing if the variables should be
set, or just changing error reporting (which I thought I had already done!).
There's a lot of gubbins with things I have tried. Note -- one or two
lines have turned and look as though they're not commented, but all that
should be are.
? php
/* set the session name to WebsiteID */
//$previous_name = session_name(WebsiteID);
//echo The previous session name was $previous_namep;
session_start();
session_name('MyPHPSite');
header(Cache-control: private); //fix for IE
// Use $HTTP_SESSION_VARS with PHP 4.0.6 or less
function login_check(){
if($_SESSION['login'] != TRUE){
myheader(Login Required);
include $_SERVER['DOCUMENT_ROOT'].
'/html/forms/login_form.html';
// include_once($_SERVER['DOCUMENT_ROOT'].
// '/html/forms/login_form.html');
footer();
exit();
}
}
// function admin_check(){
// if($_SESSION['admin_access']){
//myheader(Access Denied!);
// echo CENTERThis area is restricted .
//to website administrators!;
// }
function admin_check() {
// if (isset($_SESSION['admin_access']))
if ($_SESSION['admin_access'] == '1')
return true;
return false;
footer();
exit();
}
?
Css behaves slightly differently in tables. Special set of sub rules.
Post your code for the disaster. It's very possible you've forgotten to
close a } or a somewhere that causes the blank. A url even to a blank
page
would do it since we could look at the source.
drew
-Original Message-
From: Smile-Poet [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, April 23, 2004 1:27 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [wdvltalk] Re: css not acting
Then here is a conundrum for you (in the plural). The css would not
work
correctly in td, but does so in font. Since I do this only now and
again I am probably missing something, and I will learn more. But is
there
perhaps an imediate reason for this problem?
Also. alas, in triumphing I set updisaster!:-/ ;~( I changed
something without saving a copy first, and I have a fresh, major,
undefined,
and blanks instead of content!!!.
It must wait a couple of days. In fact I might put what I have in
another
folder, and start right from the beginning again to see if I now
understand
enought to get it right as I go. Is that a good idea?
Joseph
Cheryl wrote:
When I first started reading your post I was thinking my husband had
been too generous with the scotch. A font tag in a post from you,
fortunately I continued to read and as the rest of the message scrolled
up my faith was restored. ;-}
Tim:
I gotta admit, I was thinking the same thing. [rudy?!? Using font???
LOL] It got better.
FWIW, putting the style in the TD tag works well in Netcape 4 browsers
(one of the few things that does work for tables). It's a clean way of
using the same CSS for NN4 and most other browsers rather than having to
specify an NN4-only stylesheet.
Tim
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[wdvltalk] Re: css not acting
Cheryl, It's a local machine activity, so I can't, unfortunately. Now that I am well on the way to producing a look that I like I am trying to make sure the script (those parts I will use as the basis of the site) work well, and that I understand enough to develop it. Then I will go on the host server and build it bit by bit. I am looking at three, maybe four, main sections with memberships to at least two, plus fora of some sort. I have a very ambitious idea to offer a 'build your own book' from a database of poems, jokes and so on, and the idea gets more persistent. The other areas will be of matters I know something of which relate vaguely. My puzzzle at the moment is to find the central theme! I am also keen to develop Directories; I have had a family friendly humour one for a long time, and with this machine have the power to work on them. Pity there are only 30 hours in the day. Joseph When you can send a url so we can see what else might be affecting the display. Cheryl D. Wise Certified Professional Web Developer MS-MVP-FrontPage www.wiserways.com mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 713.353.0139 Office -Original Message- From: Smile-Poet Then here is a conundrum for you (in the plural). The css would not work correctly in td, but does so in font. Since I do this only now and again I am probably missing something, and I will learn more. But is there perhaps an imediate reason for this problem? Also. alas, in triumphing I set updisaster!:-/ ;~( I changed something without saving a copy first, and I have a fresh, major, undefined, and blanks instead of content!!!. It must wait a couple of days. In fact I might put what I have in another folder, and start right from the beginning again to see if I now understand enought to get it right as I go. Is that a good idea? The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] RE: CSS text doesn't look consistent
Have you looked to see what size the browser uses for its default? When I've been testing sometimes I forget to return the browser to medium and get quite a shock when I was testing something that turned out to have a fixed px/pt size and later open it to a site that uses relative sizing. Suddenly the text is huge or microscopic. Cheryl D. Wise Certified Professional Web Developer MS-MVP-FrontPage www.wiserways.com mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 713.353.0139 Office -Original Message- From: David Prowak I've got a site I built that has links on the left hand side that are coded as font-size: x-small in the CSS. http://www.felicegc.com/ I've had a complaint that from some PCs the text looks smaller, while on another PC it looks to be the default size. What could be causing this? (Both PCs are using IE 6. Also, it looks fine on IE 5.5) The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] Re: CSS text doesn't look consistent
David Prowak wrote:
Hi,
I've got a site I built that has links on the left
hand side that are coded as
font-size: x-small
in the CSS.
http://www.felicegc.com/
I've had a complaint that from some PCs the text looks
smaller, while on another PC it looks to be the
default size.
What could be causing this? (Both PCs are using IE 6.
Also, it looks fine on IE 5.5)
Thanks,
Dave
Right away I noticed one of your css classes is incorrect:
.navTable {
color : #66;
font-weight : bold;
; font-size: x-small
}
You have a semi-colon in front of the font-size. It should be:
.navTable { color: #66;
font-weight: bold;
font-size: x-small; (this ; is optional on the last one)
}
I think that x-small and smaller font sizes are just too difficult
for many people to read. The text is small using 800x600, but at
1024x768 the text is too small to read comfortably.
Just my .02
Jan
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[wdvltalk] Re: CSS text doesn't look consistent
AT 1164 by 868, it looks fine. Al At 3/23/2004 06:59 PM, you wrote: Hi, I've got a site I built that has links on the left hand side that are coded as font-size: x-small in the CSS. http://www.felicegc.com/ I've had a complaint that from some PCs the text looks smaller, while on another PC it looks to be the default size. What could be cau The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] RE: CSS text doesn't look consistent
I thought the IE default size was smaller, not medium? Al At 3/23/2004 08:21 PM, you wrote: Have you looked to see what size the browser uses for its default? When I've been testing sometimes I forget to return the browser to medium and get quite a shock when I was testing something that turned out to have a fixed px/pt size and later open it to a site that uses relative sizing. Suddenly the text is huge or microscopic. Cheryl D. Wise Certified Professional Web Developer MS-MVP-FrontPage www.wiserways.com mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 713.353.0139 Office -Original Message- From: David Prowak I've got a site I built that has links on the left hand side that are coded as font-size: x-small in the CSS. http://www.felicegc.com/ I've had a complaint that from some PCs the text looks smaller, while on another PC it looks to be the default size. What could be causing this? (Both PCs are using IE 6. Also, it looks fine on IE 5.5) The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%% To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with. The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] RE: CSS text doesn't look consistent
Medium is the default in IE and all other browsers. However the physical size of medium varies from browser to browser with Netscape/Mozilla usually being smaller than IE. Cheryl D. Wise Certified Professional Web Developer MS-MVP-FrontPage www.wiserways.com mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 713.353.0139 Office -Original Message- From: Tucson-WebDesign - Al Guevara I thought the IE default size was smaller, not medium? The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] Re: css/JavaScript reveal tables
Thanks Todd have moved it to another place which doesn't add messy javascript url- http://www.mycgiserver.com/~yousaf/developer/testforweb.htm Again, if anyone has any comments or suggestions to make these css/javascript reveal tables better or more accessible then I would be greatful - minimun spec ie5+ nn6+ - but would to be compatibile with more browsers. thanks again mt The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] RE: css/JavaScript reveal tables
Matthew, It looks like the geocities code is broken. It fails here: script language=javascriptgeovisit();/script - Todd -Original Message- From: matthew taylor [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, March 08, 2004 5:38 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [wdvltalk] css/JavaScript reveal tables hello To save space on some pages I am working on I am trying to make a simple menu allows you to display information in a box on the right. - I am also trying to use as much of the same js and css as possible for revealing information in a table (select an item in the lefthand column and more information appears in the right) I would like this to work in as many browsers as possible but ie5+ and nn6+ are my minimum spec. It kind of works in these at the moment but can anyone make any suggestions or recommendations to make this better, or more accessible. it does not work in opera becuse of the use of innerHTML I have put an example here with all css and javascript in the one page: http://www.geocities.com/mrmjct2002/ Thanks mt _ It's fast, it's easy and it's free. Get MSN Messenger today! http://www.msn.co.uk/messenger * The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM * To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%% To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with. The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] RE: CSS? Div vs. ID
While one or two class= isn't a big deal if you end up putting a class on every item on the page it gets almost as cluttered as a page using a bunch of font tags and bloats file size back up. that's called classitis ;o) The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] RE: CSS? Div vs. ID
Use IDs to structure your site. Then use contextual selectors to avoid having to put a class in every item in that section you want different from the default. For example you could use: a.nav:link a.nav:visited a.nav:active a.nav: hover And in every link in your navigation section you have to type in a href= class= for each link but if you use: #nav a:link #nav a:visited #nav a:active #nav a:hover All you need is one div to enclose the area you want the nav definitions to apply to and you are finished. div id=nav a href= /div While one or two class= isn't a big deal if you end up putting a class on every item on the page it gets almost as cluttered as a page using a bunch of font tags and bloats file size back up. Cheryl D. Wise Certified Professional Web Developer MS-MVP-FrontPage www.wiserways.com mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 713.353.0139 Office -Original Message- From: jmwcruiser Why not just start with a class and not paint yourself into the corner? There must be some big advantage to suing IDs but I don't see it. Can anyone enlighten me? The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] RE: CSS? Div vs. ID
Thanks Cheryl and Andrew- This is obviously a complex issue and it will take me some time to fully absorb all the information provided and to work my way through the linked document! Right now I am just trying to learn how to create a totally CSS page. I have no need (at the moment) to address other devices. My clients (and their customers) tend to be at the low end of the tech spectrum. Heck-- some are still trying to accommodate folks with no email address and others who are still using Netscape 4! I don't need to worry about how the sites will look on a PDA but I need to be moving that way. I don't want to be creating sites that will be obsolete. One problem with the less than tech savvy client is they do not understand that the Internet changes. They seem to believe that a web site is static -- like a brochure. Once the site is up - it will work fine forever. So my job is to be aware of the technology and find the best compromise approach. Anyway, I got some great feedback and will now try to sort it all out. I have been working through the Eric Meyer book as well as Cascading Style Sheets by Molly Holzschlag. I was at the end of Mollie's book but now I see I need to go back to chapter one and spend some time with the info she presents on structured markup. Thanks for your comments Janet The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] RE: CSS - Table question
Had this saved in my snippets but haven't used it yet Filter: Shadow(Color=Hex color of the shadow, Direction=Degree of the shadow) hth jac. Is there a way in CSS where we can have a shadow behind a table? Amrit The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] RE: CSS - Table question
Is there a way in CSS where we can have a shadow behind a table? Amrit The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] Re: CSS Drop-Down - My solution
Just a quick note--successful has two cs. Cheers, Scott - Original Message - From: Matthew Macdonald-Wallace [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, January 13, 2004 6:55 AM Subject: [wdvltalk] CSS Drop-Down - My solution All, Following on from the discussion we have been having about CSS and IE, I have come up with the following: http://www.interactwiththe.net/ict/ ::snip:: Let me know what you think, The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] RE: css lineup!
This is an interesting one. Three things happening: floats, inline and the 3px jog. Put a border around your 2 nav headings and you'll see the problem. Floats sit on top of the normal flow of the document with content sliding out from underneath the float. This is what happens in your second text box (sub-nav). That's why the border extends under the logo. Your first nav (header-navigation) is done inline. An inline box is only as long as its content. Hence the text and the box slide out from under the logo. The second menu (sub-nav) is a normal display and hence begins under the logo and the text starts in Mozilla right next to the logo (the 12 px left is applied to the box which is why it doesn't start at the left edge of the logo). If you make the sub-nav inline, it starts next to the header-nav since the length of the line allows for both boxes. That is, the clear won't work since there is room next to header-nav to fit the sub-nav. Try it with borders and you'll what I mean. The sub-nav will be 6px lower because it is relatively positioned. If you do both as normal display, then improper 3px jog in IE will cause a difference in appearance. I'd suggest you keep the logo as a float. Then make the entire navigation setup a second float which is floated left against the logo. This will allow you to pad the 2 text menus since they will be within the containing div of the second float. Do both as normal flow not inline. If you do this, be sure to a clear:both after the second float. And never make the total width 100% even if you use a pixilated width (browsers actually add pixels differently when calculating widths as well as the ie 5 box model problem). It's not as complicated as it sounds. Leave the borders so you can see the fit. When you remove the borders, you'll get a little extra padding for width issues. You may even want to wrap the whole logo and nav in their own div to make it easier to work with. This may take a couple of huh's to work out. It's part of the process of learning to think css. I'll be glad to elaborate or work on the code with you. drew First thing to remember is that floats are out of the flow of the document but acknowledged by the document. This means that normal flow text boxes start under the float not next to the float. Your sub-nav text shows that. The header-navigation begins next to the float but not under it because it is an inline box not a normal flow box. -Original Message- From: timeforcake [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, January 11, 2004 10:56 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [wdvltalk] css lineup! Hello there everyone. I am stuck! I am currently working on the top section/navigation of a page, and the problem is that the secondary line of navigation lines up differently (vertically speaking) in IE and in Mozilla. It should not. I have been trying to read about the 3px jog/differences, and I've searched the Internet far and wide only to find a very large number of complicated hacks that were a bit over my head. I've also posted to a CSS forum, but no luck (or should I say. . . no responses! =) ) The page I'm working on is here: http://www.foxowl.com/index2.htmlhttphttp://www.foxowl.com/index2.html:/ /www.foxowl.com/index2.html The CSS file is here: http://www.foxowl.com/foxowl.csshttphttp://www.foxowl.com/foxowl.css://w ww.foxowl.com/foxowl.css (Note: Im still fiddling w/ the php nav. . . so I've not yet removed the php code to an external file, don't worry, I will! And the css file validates and the HTML validates, strict.) I'm hoping that someone here can: #1) Explain in plain terms what's going on and why it's happening. #2) Explain in simple, easy-to-understand English how I can go about fixing my problem. I'm looking forward to learning from all of the wise people here! Thank you so very very much!! -eRin. * The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM * To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%% To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with. The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription
[wdvltalk] RE: css lineup!
Laughing. This is what happens when you don't edit properly before you press send. Ignore the should-have-been-deleted-earlier-draft paragraph after the signature and before erin's message. -Original Message- From: Trusz, Andrew [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, January 12, 2004 9:48 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [wdvltalk] RE: css lineup! This is an interesting one. Three things happening: floats, inline and the 3px jog. snip drew --Ignore this: First thing to remember is that floats are out of the flow of the document but acknowledged by the document. This means that normal flow text boxes start under the float not next to the float. Your sub-nav text shows that. The header-navigation begins next to the float but not under it because it is an inline box not a normal flow box. -Original Message- From: timeforcake [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, January 11, 2004 10:56 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [wdvltalk] css lineup! Hello there everyone. I am stuck! I am currently working on the top section/navigation of a page, and the problem is that the secondary line of navigation lines up differently (vertically speaking) in IE and in Mozilla. It should not. I have been trying to read about the 3px jog/differences, and I've searched the Internet far and wide only to find a very large number of complicated hacks that were a bit over my head. I've also posted to a CSS forum, but no luck (or should I say. . . no responses! =) ) The page I'm working on is here: http://www.foxowl.com/index2.htmlhttphttp://www.foxowl.com/index2.html:/ /www.foxowl.com/index2.html The CSS file is here: http://www.foxowl.com/foxowl.csshttphttp://www.foxowl.com/foxowl.css://w ww.foxowl.com/foxowl.css (Note: Im still fiddling w/ the php nav. . . so I've not yet removed the php code to an external file, don't worry, I will! And the css file validates and the HTML validates, strict.) I'm hoping that someone here can: #1) Explain in plain terms what's going on and why it's happening. #2) Explain in simple, easy-to-understand English how I can go about fixing my problem. I'm looking forward to learning from all of the wise people here! Thank you so very very much!! -eRin. * The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM * To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%% To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with. * The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM * To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%% To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with. The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] Re: CSS and Netscape 7?
::snip:: Funny - no NS7 users ever emailed to say how crap the site looked. I guess anyone who uses NS7 is used to seeing weird looking sites by now ::snip:: They were probably both on holiday. ;-) Cheers, Scott The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] Re: CSS and Netscape 7?
Im not up on NN 7 myself,but older Netscape needed the css file reffered to
absolutely, not relatively, try that.
Also, do dthe body background gif in the CSS file, not the body tag
Let me now if it works.
Al
At 1/1/2004 01:10 PM, you wrote:
I have a Web site at www.realhhg.com which looks OK in IE, but in NS7 the
pages ignore the CSS and display a white background (which is a problem
since some of the text is white!)
The CSS lives in a separate file loaded by:
link rel=stylesheet type=text/css href=realhhg.css
and some of it, link colours etc, is being obeyed by NS but apparently not
the CSS for the page body:
BODY {
font-family: Times New Roman, Times, Roman, Serif;
font-size: 12pt;
font-weight: bold;
color: #C0C0FF;
margin-left: 25px;
margin-right: 20px;
background-color:black;
background-image: url(/graphics/twinkling.gif);
background-attachment: fixed;
}
Any idea why I get a white background and no image? In the HTML, there's
body background=/graphics/twinkling.gif bgcolor=black text=#C0C0FF
link=#55FFAA vlink=#CC66FF so if it doesn't want to obey the CSS, why
doesn't it obey the HTML instead? In a different page with the same CSS
inline it seems to work OK.
Any thoughts welcome
Bj
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[wdvltalk] Re: CSS and Netscape 7?
I have a Web site at www.realhhg.com which looks OK in IE, but in NS7 the pages ignore the CSS perhaps it could be that the first line of the style sheet is not valid css -- ?php header(Content-type: text/css); ? rudy p.s. in ie6, which (perhaps incorrectly, but let's not go there) interprets the style sheet, the left sidebar says Best viewed at 1024 x 768 but it actually looks fine i can see how you did that, in javascript, and you should forget that whole idea The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] Re: CSS and Netscape 7?
perhaps it could be that the first line of the style sheet is not valid css -- ?php header(Content-type: text/css); ? further to the above, a linked style sheet should not have these tags either -- style type=text/css !-- -- /style rudy The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] Re: CSS and Netscape 7?
I've tried a few things now: Changed the link (as you suggested) to /realhhg.css and even www.realhhg.com/realhhg.css Added an .htaccess file to say .css files are text/css Tried renaming stylesheet from .css to .php and adding a header() to set mime type to text/css Tried using a single body tag instead of separate body-color, body-background etc Added/removed DTDs I tried putting the same CSS code inline and it sees it OK so I'm sure the problem is a known one where Netscape 6 or 7 will only look at a style sheet if the server says it's text/css, and by default a lot of Linux servers send it as text. I though it would be fixed with the .htaccess thing but maybe I did that wrong and will try it again. The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] Re: CSS and Netscape 7?
- Original Message - From: rudy perhaps it could be that the first line of the style sheet is not valid css -- ?php header(Content-type: text/css); ? That was a failed attempt - gone now... further to the above, a linked style sheet should not have these tags either -- Hmm thought they were needed. I took them out and it doesn't seem to have broken things in IE but hasn't fixed them in NS either... could be I am still getting cached versions of style sheets of course, I will have a real clear out and then look again The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] Re: CSS and Netscape 7?
This might be a clue. When I use the back button the background
shows up in Netscape 7.1
AuntySpam, SLP Coordinator, pspug.org
http://www.pspug.org/edu/edu.shtml
http://www.pspug.org/edu/slp/assign.shtml
http://www.pspug.org/edu/slp/slpparticipants.htm
Bj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
| I have a Web site at www.realhhg.com which looks OK in IE, but
| in NS7 the
| pages ignore the CSS and display a white background (which is a
| problem
| since some of the text is white!)
|
| The CSS lives in a separate file loaded by:
|
| link rel=stylesheet type=text/css href=realhhg.css
|
| and some of it, link colours etc, is being obeyed by NS but
| apparently not
| the CSS for the page body:
|
| BODY {
| font-family: Times New Roman, Times, Roman, Serif;
| font-size: 12pt;
| font-weight: bold;
| color: #C0C0FF;
| margin-left: 25px;
| margin-right: 20px;
| background-color:black;
| background-image: url(/graphics/twinkling.gif);
| background-attachment: fixed;
| }
|
| Any idea why I get a white background and no image? In the
| HTML, there's
| body background=/graphics/twinkling.gif bgcolor=black
| text=#C0C0FF
| link=#55FFAA vlink=#CC66FF so if it doesn't want to obey
| the CSS, why
| doesn't it obey the HTML instead? In a different page with the
| same CSS
| inline it seems to work OK.
|
| Any thoughts welcome
| Bj
|
|
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[wdvltalk] Re: CSS and Netscape 7?
- Original Message - From: rudy further to the above, a linked style sheet should not have these tags either -- style type=text/css !-- -- /style Darn those caches. Yes Rudy - taking those out (even though they never bothered IE) lets NS7 do the right thing. Funny - no NS7 users ever emailed to say how crap the site looked. I guess anyone who uses NS7 is used to seeing weird looking sites by now ;o) Thanks Rudy Happy New Year from Bj (just think I could be the first person helped by Rudy in 2004! ...but surely far from the last...) The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] Re: CSS and Netscape 7?
Also, When I use this http://www.realhhg.com/index.php instead of this http://www.realhhg.com/ the background shows up. AuntySpam, SLP Coordinator, pspug.org http://www.pspug.org/edu/edu.shtml http://www.pspug.org/edu/slp/assign.shtml http://www.pspug.org/edu/slp/slpparticipants.htm Bj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: | I have a Web site at www.realhhg.com which looks OK in IE, but | in NS7 the | pages ignore the CSS and display a white background (which is a | problem | since some of the text is white!) The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] Re: CSS and Netscape 7?
(just think I could be the first person helped by Rudy in 2004! ...but surely far from the last...) thanks for the kind words, Bj yes, you are the first -- on this list, anyway my kids have taken over the tv today, so i cannot watch the bowl games, so i've been fairly active on several other forums which, by the way, in case anybody's interested, you should consider visiting from time to time -- dbforums.com -- database forums only sitepointforums.com -- web development (and several database forums) tek-tips.com -- information technology forums forums.devshed.com -- web development (and several database forums) rudy whose new year's resolution is... [ scroll down ] [ scroll down ] [ scroll down ] 800 x 600 tee hee The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] Re: CSS and Netscape 7?
In your link to the stylesheet you can put in the text/css in the link. link href=wiserways-a.css rel=stylesheet type=text/css / You need to make the background image url absolute because it isn't showing up in NN 4.8 either. Cheryl D. Wise Certified Professional Web Developer MS-MVP-FrontPage www.wiserways.com mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 713.353.0139 Office -Original Message- From: Bj - Original Message - From: rudy perhaps it could be that the first line of the style sheet is not valid css -- ?php header(Content-type: text/css); ? That was a failed attempt - gone now... further to the above, a linked style sheet should not have these tags either -- Hmm thought they were needed. I took them out and it doesn't seem to have broken things in IE but hasn't fixed them in NS either... could be I am still getting cached versions of style sheets of course, I will have a real clear out and then look again The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] Re: CSS and Netscape 7?
Bj,
I gather you have sorted it now, but if it helps it looks as you
describe it should in my netscape 7.1.
Joseph
I have a Web site at www.realhhg.com which looks OK in IE, but in
NS7 the
pages ignore the CSS and display a white background (which is a
problem
since some of the text is white!)
The CSS lives in a separate file loaded by:
link rel=stylesheet type=text/css href=realhhg.css
and some of it, link colours etc, is being obeyed by NS but
apparently not
the CSS for the page body:
BODY {
font-family: Times New Roman, Times, Roman, Serif;
font-size: 12pt;
font-weight: bold;
color: #C0C0FF;
margin-left: 25px;
margin-right: 20px;
background-color:black;
background-image: url(/graphics/twinkling.gif);
background-attachment: fixed;
}
Any idea why I get a white background and no image? In the HTML,
there's
body background=/graphics/twinkling.gif bgcolor=black
text=#C0C0FF
link=#55FFAA vlink=#CC66FF so if it doesn't want to obey the
CSS, why
doesn't it obey the HTML instead? In a different page with the same
CSS
inline it seems to work OK.
Any thoughts welcome
Bj
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[wdvltalk] Re: CSS Questions
Thank you Jure,
Sorry it took so long to get back to you...the holidays
have me running around in circles!
I appreciate the time you spent looking over my work. The
reason I asked about the comment in the code about HTML
emails is because this is a previous template that I just
recoded. The owner will NOT send text and he thinks that
this notice is showing up as text for those who can't
accept HTML. I have tested it myself but do not notice
that this is the case and was wondering if anyone else had
any comments on that technique and if it is missing a
crutial bit of code, (or even if it existis at all).
I always thought table properties went within the table
tags, but then I am just learning CSS so I will have to
experiment with putting them in td's and see how that
works.
Thanks again for your time and I hope you and yours all
have a safe and happy holiday!
Jenni
--- Jure Spik [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Hello.
I propose you ask your subscribers whether they wish to
recieve HTML or
plaintext mails, and to those, who wish HTML send also
the text-only version
(how to acomplish this depends on the way you send mail,
but AFAIK mail is
by default sent as text and HTML is just an attachement
that is displayed if
reader knows HTML)
Since you are sending it by e-mail the best way to write
your CSS is
probably in head of document in tags style
type='text/css'/*rules*//style
Paddings must be set for td's, not table, but you can
write a generic css
rule td{padding:5px;}
Best wishes, and compliments on a job well done
Jure Spik,
Carpe Diem d.o.o., Kranj
http://carpediem.si/
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://driversplanet.com/
- Original Message -
From: Pace Computing Limited [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Saturday, December 20, 2003 5:00 AM
Subject: [wdvltalk] CSS Questions
Hello everyone,
I have just finished (?) recoding an HTML email using
CSS.
I got it to validate for both HTML 4.01 and CSS2 (yay!)
BUT, I still have a couple of questions I am hoping
someone
can shed some light on.
I seemed to have trouble trying to declare my table
properties with CSS. I could not get any of my
paddings
to work up there. I wanted to omit all of that code in
the
body of the HTML, but could not, so I put them in the
table
tags. My question is this:
Is that really the right way to do it or is there a
better way with CSS?
I also wanted to know if anyone knows if the first
comments
tags in the document are supposed to show up as text in
an
email client who won't read HTML? I would like to
remove
it, but it was there from the original template and I
am
not sure if that is valid or not.
Also, I want to add that this is my FIRST real
HTML/CSS
job. I did my web site a year or so ago, but I was in
class...so I had my teacher there to rely on for
mistakes.
Does anyone see a better way I could have done
anything?
Is there anything you see in there that just stands out
and
says Amateur! ?
One last thing and I'll let you go...It took me about
15
hours to code this. Is that a long time, a short time
or
about average? How long would it take some of you
gurus
out there to get something like this done?
Any and all comments are welcome and appreciated.
Here is the link:
http://www.pc-limited.com/dtptemplate.htm
TIA,
Jenni
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[wdvltalk] Re: CSS files cached
Displays as a black bordered box with vsd centered, which is what the css says it should be. For consistency you should put 'centriraj' in double quotes centriraj. Flush the cache. drew The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] RE: CSS float question
Rita, you haven't defined a class for honorbox. If I insert a simple
.honorbox{float:right; width:50%;} it works fine.
Validates nicely for css and html.
drew
-Original Message-
From: Rita Crisafi [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Monday, November 24, 2003 5:57 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [wdvltalk] CSS float question
Hello good people of WDVL, I am still working on my first table-less
css site, with usually okay results except for the usual confounding
problems.
I look for your expertise in this particular situation:
I just put together a page based on a layout i was given with a right
float to contain a box.
The way I want the page to look, and a screenshot of the way it looks
in IE 5.1 Mac is here:
http://www.crisafidesign.com/jpo_profile.html
I used browsercam.com, and the way i set it up didn't seem to work in
IE 6 for windows at all
The page is here:
http://www.joanpatsyostroy.com/profile.html
the stylesheet is here:
http://www.joanpatsyostroy.com/styles.css
Can anyone suggest a better way to do this so that it works in most
browsers?
I would greatly appreciate it.
TIA,
Rita
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[wdvltalk] RE: CSS float question, MORE
Rita, you haven't defined a class for honorbox. If I insert a simple
.honorbox{float:right; width:50%;} it works fine.
Validates nicely for css and html.
drew
Drew, I wish it were that simple, but it /is/ in the stylesheet, here
it is excerpted:
#peachbody P
{
color:#133a6a;
}
.honorbox
{
width=50%;
font-size:11px;
line-height:14px;
font-family: arial, helvetica, sans-serif;
background:#E3E4D0;
color:black;
padding:15px 15px 0px 10px;
border:1px solid black;
float:right;
margin-left:10px;
}
here's my public link with browser cam (i always use browsercam since
i work on a mac, it's really important):
http://www.browsercam.com/public.aspx?proj_id=32048
as you can see, the float doesn't work at all in some browsers.
Anything glaring in the stylesheet?
--
===
Rita Crisafi
home: 212.673.8242 / cell: 917.822.7102
instant messenger: rlcrisafi
web/print production and design
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[wdvltalk] Re: css problem
The practice of including units of measure comes from padding, margins and borders. Since there is a choice of px, em, %, etc, it makes sense to specify the units used. So it becomes good practice to include units in all places since it is possible to specify such measures on images and tables as well. It helps the browser to not have to guess at what you meant. And not guessing (guessing is quirks mode) is part of what css is all about. Why you should do it is probably best stated in the discussion of length (which of course is both vertical and horizontal), found at: http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-CSS2/syndata.html#value-def-length And also, it does allow you to sometimes mix units. You can specify an image width of 100% and a pixel height since percentage heights are just disasters. I've seen units mixed usually on padding and margins. Although it tends to make most people cringe, it does seem to validate and work. Or do as Cheryl suggested and let the browser find the height. drew -Original Message- From: Jan Major Sent: Monday, November 24, 2003 8:37 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [wdvltalk] Re: css problem Drew No, I didn't know that we have to now put units of measure for images. My page validated without them, but I will definitely add the px to all image code. Do you know where I can find out that images require units of measures now. I know I can search through W3C, but am hoping that you have a particular page in mind. If not, I can find it. I found out what the p tag error was and fixed it. It doesn't want anything like this: p style=text-align:justify, so I made 3 classes for left, center, and right. Jan * The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM * To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%% The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] RE: CSS float question, MORE
--- Rita Crisafi wrote: ---
: Drew, I wish it were that simple, but it /is/ in the stylesheet,
: here it is excerpted:
snip/
: .honorbox
: {
: width=50%;
: font-size:11px;
: line-height:14px;
: font-family: arial, helvetica, sans-serif;
: background:#E3E4D0;
: color:black;
: padding:15px 15px 0px 10px;
: border:1px solid black;
: float:right;
: margin-left:10px;
: }
snip/
: Anything glaring in the stylesheet?
Rita,
Glaring indeed:
width=50%;
should be:
width:50%;
I tested it and that'll take care of it. Looks like the site[1] has
come along quite well, though I must admit, the changing background
colors from page to page are *very* distracting... I especially
dislike the lime green, yellow and brown backgrounds. Is there a
reason that you're changing these from page to page?
[1] http://www.joanpatsyostroy.com/profile.html
hth,
Stephen Caudill
http://www.mechavox.com/
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[wdvltalk] Re: css problem
Jan, sorry to have been so cryptic. If you've worked things out skip this. By sizes I meant your images need units of measure as well. So it should be height=200px. You've probably seen that in your validation attempt. The p tag is probably not the actual error. That kind of error message usually means something went bad before then and the validator simply wasn't able to compensate anymore. I've had my share and then some of those. For me it turns out to be a really simple oversight. Cheryl, the exchange class was run on a box totally tricked out in only MS. Wasn't worth downloading another browser for 5 days. drew The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] Re: css problem
That brings up a question: Can images be sized on the web using percent instead of pixels? If so, will it look like a percent of the original image dimensions or would it be a percent of its container as seen on the viewers browser? AuntySpam, SLP Coordinator, pspug.org http://www.pspug.org/edu/edu.shtml http://www.pspug.org/edu/slp/assign.shtml http://www.pspug.org/edu/slp/slpparticipants.htm - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, November 24, 2003 4:03 AM Subject: [wdvltalk] Re: css problem Jan, sorry to have been so cryptic. If you've worked things out skip this. By sizes I meant your images need units of measure as well. So it should be height=200px. You've probably seen that in your validation attempt. The p tag is probably not the actual error. That kind of error message usually means something went bad before then and the validator simply wasn't able to compensate anymore. I've had my share and then some of those. For me it turns out to be a really simple oversight. Cheryl, the exchange class was run on a box totally tricked out in only MS. Wasn't worth downloading another browser for 5 days. drew The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] Re: css problem
I believe it is of the container in the same way that a pixel set of dimensions fits the picture in. -Original Message- From: Brewnetty (AuntySpam) [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, November 24, 2003 11:24 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [wdvltalk] Re: css problem That brings up a question: Can images be sized on the web using percent instead of pixels? If so, will it look like a percent of the original image dimensions or would it be a percent of its container as seen on the viewers browser? AuntySpam, SLP Coordinator, pspug.org http://www.pspug.org/edu/edu.shtml http://www.pspug.org/edu/slp/assign.shtml http://www.pspug.org/edu/slp/slpparticipants.htm - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, November 24, 2003 4:03 AM Subject: [wdvltalk] Re: css problem Jan, sorry to have been so cryptic. If you've worked things out skip this. By sizes I meant your images need units of measure as well. So it should be height=200px. You've probably seen that in your validation attempt. The p tag is probably not the actual error. That kind of error message usually means something went bad before then and the validator simply wasn't able to compensate anymore. I've had my share and then some of those. For me it turns out to be a really simple oversight. Cheryl, the exchange class was run on a box totally tricked out in only MS. Wasn't worth downloading another browser for 5 days. drew The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%% The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] Re: CSS Menus (was Re: menu advice)
Matt, Thought I would let you know that IE doesn't display drop-down (or side out) menus using css. If you notice: http://www.meyerweb.com/eric/css/edge/popups/demo.html this demo does work in IE, but it doesn't have drop-down or even side out. Opera should show it though, just like Mozilla because when I had a drop-down it displayed it just fine. Jan Matthew Macdonald-Wallace wrote: I've tried altering Eric Meyer's code, and come up with the page available at http://www.interactwiththe.net/css/ which works in Firebird 0.6, but I don't know about the others, any chance someone could try it out for me? The links don't work (just as well, they point to non-existent files!) but it would be nice if anyone can explain why! The CSS is at http://www.interactwiththe.net/css/menu.css The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] Re: css problem
Yes, I use percentages 100% for the width (the logo is in a table) but it doesn't work well for the height. I just recently changed my home page so that when the screen is taken from 800x600 to 1024x768, the width expands the logo and the bottom part (similar to logo) perfectly. But looked absolutely awful when I put the heights to 100% they sort of took over the page. Jam Brewnetty (AuntySpam) wrote: That brings up a question: Can images be sized on the web using percent instead of pixels? If so, will it look like a percent of the original image dimensions or would it be a percent of its container as seen on the viewers browser? The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] Re: css problem
Drew No, I didn't know that we have to now put units of measure for images. My page validated without them, but I will definitely add the px to all image code. Do you know where I can find out that images require units of measures now. I know I can search through W3C, but am hoping that you have a particular page in mind. If not, I can find it. I found out what the p tag error was and fixed it. It doesn't want anything like this: p style=text-align:justify, so I made 3 classes for left, center, and right. Jan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Jan, sorry to have been so cryptic. If you've worked things out skip this. By sizes I meant your images need units of measure as well. So it should be height=200px. You've probably seen that in your validation attempt. The p tag is probably not the actual error. That kind of error message usually means something went bad before then and the validator simply wasn't able to compensate anymore. I've had my share and then some of those. For me it turns out to be a really simple oversight. The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] Re: css problem
- Original Message - From: Jan Major [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, November 25, 2003 2:37 PM Subject: [wdvltalk] Re: css problem : Drew : No, I didn't know that we have to now put units of measure for images. : My page validated without them, but I will definitely add the px to all : image code. , Jan while width and height are still optional as browsers have to calculate the width and height, along with all your other marvellous css tricks and insert them into the document flow it actually is 'best practise' and does speed up page loading --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.543 / Virus Database: 337 - Release Date: 21/11/03 The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] Re: css problem
I don't think images are required to have a height and width but it is best practice to do so. Have you had to wait for a page then suddenly have it pop or had the page shift around when the images finished loading? That's because the browser either refused to guess the size of the images until they were downloaded in the first case or because it guessed wrong in the second. Specifying the height and width allows the browser to reserve the proper amount of space in the page layout so it will continue to load and display the text without having to wait for the images. Images do require an alt attribute and a title attribute is another nice thing to have since newer browsers such as Mozilla and Opera will not display the alt attribute on mouseover if the image loads but will display the title attribute. This also gives you another shot at the search engines. Cheryl D. Wise MS-MVP-FrontPage www.wiserways.com mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 713.353.0139 Office -Original Message- From: Jan Major Drew No, I didn't know that we have to now put units of measure for images. My page validated without them, but I will definitely add the px to all image code. Do you know where I can find out that images require units of measures now. I know I can search through W3C, but am hoping that you have a particular page in mind. If not, I can find it. I found out what the p tag error was and fixed it. It doesn't want anything like this: p style=text-align:justify, so I made 3 classes for left, center, and right. The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] Re: CSS Menus (was Re: menu advice)
Hi Matt, http://www.interactwiththe.net/css/ No joy in Opera or IE 6 on Windows - you just get the first-level menus and nothing happens when you hover over them. Works a treat in Firebird though :-) Cheers Jon The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] Re: CSS Menus (was Re: menu advice)
Matt, Complete blank on IE5. Joseph I've tried altering Eric Meyer's code, and come up with the page available at http://www.interactwiththe.net/css/ which works in Firebird 0.6, but I don't know about the others, any chance someone could try it out for me? The links don't work (just as well, they point to non-existent files!) but it would be nice if anyone can explain why! The CSS is at http://www.interactwiththe.net/css/menu.css TIA, Matt -- +--+ |Matthew Macdonald-Wallace | |The Truth Will Set you Free | |http://www.truthisfreedom.org.uk/ | +--+ This is still a dangerous world. It's a world of madmen and uncertainty and potential mential losses. George W. Bush January 14, 2000 Quoted in the Financial Times. . The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM . To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%% The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] Re: CSS Menus (was Re: menu advice)
On Sun, 2003-11-23 at 15:17, Joseph Harris wrote: Matt, Complete blank on IE5. Joseph Joseph, Was it a completely blank page, or did it have the list as an outline? I've changed a few things, so if you could check it again for me? Cheers, Matt -- +--+ |Matthew Macdonald-Wallace | |The Truth Will Set you Free | |http://www.truthisfreedom.org.uk/ | +--+ Redefining the role of the United States from enablers to keep the peace to enablers to keep the peace from peacekeepers is going to be an assignment. George W. Bush January 14, 2001 Quoted in the New York Times. The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] Re: CSS Menus (was Re: menu advice)
Matt, I see 'Authors' which links (to nowhere) and 'us' which doesn't link. colour blue, and purple visited. These are on the extreme right and I had to scroll (may have been why I missed it last time, but I don't know) Joseph Chacha Joe For a site of laughs and a FREE ezine: www.smilepoetryweekly.com For cricket lovers everywhere: Batty Balls and other Wicket Wit www.ah-mah-son.com - Original Message - From: Matthew Macdonald-Wallace [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, November 23, 2003 3:46 PM Subject: [wdvltalk] Re: CSS Menus (was Re: menu advice) On Sun, 2003-11-23 at 15:17, Joseph Harris wrote: Matt, Complete blank on IE5. Joseph Joseph, Was it a completely blank page, or did it have the list as an outline? I've changed a few things, so if you could check it again for me? Cheers, Matt -- +--+ |Matthew Macdonald-Wallace | |The Truth Will Set you Free | |http://www.truthisfreedom.org.uk/ | +--+ Redefining the role of the United States from enablers to keep the peace to enablers to keep the peace from peacekeepers is going to be an assignment. George W. Bush January 14, 2001 Quoted in the New York Times. The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] Re: CSS Menus (was Re: menu advice)
Works fine in IE 6.0.2800.1106 on my machine (Win98SE). Hover turns selection background grey, if that was your intention. Cheers, Scott - Original Message - From: Jon Haworth [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, November 23, 2003 9:22 AM Subject: [wdvltalk] Re: CSS Menus (was Re: menu advice) Hi Matt, http://www.interactwiththe.net/css/ No joy in Opera or IE 6 on Windows - you just get the first-level menus and nothing happens when you hover over them. Works a treat in Firebird though :-) Cheers Jon The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%% The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] Re: css problem - ( concerning browsers)
Cheryl Great post. I hope you don't mind me asking you these questions : which Mozilla do you use and why did you recently remove NS 6.2 and do you intend on installing NS 7.1 (or NS 7.2 if you can find it)? I'm asking because I would like to somewhat update my browsers for testing purposes but still have that fear of losing some of my old ones (meaning IE 5 and NS 4.77 being overwritten - is that even a word? ;-). I have NS 4.77, IE 5, Opera 5 6 and Mozilla 0.9.5. I do want to upgrade to Mozilla 1.5 but given that one must purchase it and I do want it on a CD-Rom, it's not going to happen until I go home (they don't seem to want to ship it to France). I gapped out buying it last time I was in Michigan - still kicking myself. Thanks in advance, I'd really appreciate your feedback. Elisa Butler P.S. I keep my dinosaurs because I see that many of my clients' visitors still use them. CDW Jan, CDW While I applaud using percents so people can adjust sizes but 73% on my CDW laptop in its default configuration isn't readable. Nor will it be readable CDW on a Mac which renders text smaller than with IE on the PC. While many CDW designers love small font sizes from my informal survey (students where I CDW teach age range of 19-70, average 40ish) anything below 80% is uncomfortable CDW and most don't like it below 90% for body text. CDW BTW, why would training for exchange by which I take you mean Exchange CDW Server limit you to IE for browser testing? CDW I'm rather firmly in the MS OS camp (I dislike command line and gladly CDW abandoned it with Windows 95) but I still have IE 6, NN 4 (recently removed CDW 6.2), Mozilla, Opera 6 7 for testing purposes. CDW For a down and dirty comparisons of font sizes. The default size for IE is CDW roughly 13.5pt while for Netscape it is 12pt. CDW Cheryl D. Wise CDW MS-MVP-FrontPage CDW www.wiserways.com CDW mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] CDW 713.353.0139 Office The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] Re: css problem - ( concerning browsers)
Elisa Butler wrote: snip I have NS 4.77, IE 5, Opera 5 6 and Mozilla 0.9.5. I do want to upgrade to Mozilla 1.5 but given that one must purchase it and I do want it on a CD-Rom, it's not going to happen until I go home (they don't seem to want to ship it to France). I gapped out buying it last time I was in Michigan - still kicking myself. Elisa, I downloaded the program for FREE, and then installed it. Couldn't you download it then copy the program onto a CD-Rom of your own? Jan The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] Re: css problem - ( concerning browsers)
Elisa: You can have separate installs of Mozilla and NN, they will even share some preferences if you so wish, check out the site: http://www.mozilla.org/ thanks to a couple of geniuses who have 'cracked' MS IE you can now have more than one version of IE on the same partition, this only spread a week or so or go but I guess that was just before you rejoined. http://www.insert-title.com/web_design/?page=articles/dev/multi_IE and an easier one to download: http://www.skyzyx.com/archives/94.php Cheryl posted these originally. www.WellingtonLive.co.nz - Original Message - From: Elisa Butler [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, November 23, 2003 9:06 AM Subject: [wdvltalk] Re: css problem - ( concerning browsers) : Cheryl : : Great post. : : I hope you don't mind me asking you these questions : which Mozilla do : you use and why did you recently remove NS 6.2 and do you intend on : installing NS 7.1 (or NS 7.2 if you can find it)? : : I'm asking because I would like to somewhat update my browsers for testing : purposes but still have that fear of losing some of my old ones : (meaning IE 5 and NS 4.77 being overwritten - is that even a word? ;-). : : I have NS 4.77, IE 5, Opera 5 6 and Mozilla 0.9.5. I do want to : upgrade to Mozilla 1.5 but given that one must purchase it and I do want : it on a CD-Rom, it's not going to happen until I go home (they don't : seem to want to ship it to France). I gapped out buying it last time : I was in Michigan - still kicking myself. : : Thanks in advance, I'd really appreciate your feedback. : : Elisa Butler : : P.S. I keep my dinosaurs because I see that many of my clients' : visitors still use them. : : : : : : : : CDW Jan, : : CDW While I applaud using percents so people can adjust sizes but 73% on my : CDW laptop in its default configuration isn't readable. Nor will it be readable : CDW on a Mac which renders text smaller than with IE on the PC. While many : CDW designers love small font sizes from my informal survey (students where I : CDW teach age range of 19-70, average 40ish) anything below 80% is uncomfortable : CDW and most don't like it below 90% for body text. : : CDW BTW, why would training for exchange by which I take you mean Exchange : CDW Server limit you to IE for browser testing? : : CDW I'm rather firmly in the MS OS camp (I dislike command line and gladly : CDW abandoned it with Windows 95) but I still have IE 6, NN 4 (recently removed : CDW 6.2), Mozilla, Opera 6 7 for testing purposes. : : CDW For a down and dirty comparisons of font sizes. The default size for IE is : CDW roughly 13.5pt while for Netscape it is 12pt. : : : CDW Cheryl D. Wise : CDW MS-MVP-FrontPage : CDW www.wiserways.com : CDW mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] : CDW 713.353.0139 Office : : : . The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM . : To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] :Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] : To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. : To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: : http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub : : http://www.wdvl.com ___ : : You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] : To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%% : : --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.542 / Virus Database: 336 - Release Date: 18/11/03 The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] Re: css problem
Jan, I'm even less help. I can read the blue of white at the bottom, but they do look out of place when everything else has a coloured background. If you still have the problem, what shuld we be looking at/for? Joseph Chacha Joe For a site of laughs and a FREE ezine: www.smilepoetryweekly.com Deb The page shows properly in NS. The valid buttons are not supposed to be visible unless the mouse is over the name, so that part is right. I believe that IE 6.0 is not interpreting the style sheet default.css can anyone tell me why it isn't? puterbug wrote: At 09:59 PM 11/20/2003, you wrote: http://www.jdvisions.com/index.html I only notice 2 things that appear to be wrong, one is that your VALID buttons aren't showing up until you mouseover them. Second is that the text content on the white section is a very light color and almost impossible to read. Other than that, not knowing what your page is -supposed- to look like that's about all I can tell you. Deb . The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM . To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%% The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] Re: css problem
Several points. Neither your xhtml nor css validate. The xhtml issues have to do with tables in css. Tables do not behave exactly the same way when css designed. The validator indicates you have an element a p tag where one is not allowed. Also you failed to specify units for sizes. This is a minor error but a common one. Your css is performing an import loop. Your first line in default.css is @import=default.css;. You are importing the file into itself. Also div align=center is not valid css. You need a class specifying text-align:center. The nav links are set to specified size (7em), which is perfectly fine. It does however result in a fixed size menu bar which is clearly left aligned in higher screen resolutions. You might want to consider padding-left on the nav menu. Realize also that having set font size in body at 73%, your h1 is 125% of 73%. Font size is relative to the containing unit. Don't have NS to compare with since I'm in training for exchange and I'm therefore limited to the world of ms. And exccept for the nav bar, it looks ok for a small font site. drew The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] Re: css problem
Joseph For some reason, my pages in IE 6.0 are weird. The index page looks fine, but all other pages are messed up. I'm going to see if I can fix it, but I sure don't know why it's acting up. Jan Joseph Harris wrote: Jan, I'm even less help. I can read the blue of white at the bottom, but they do look out of place when everything else has a coloured background. If you still have the problem, what shuld we be looking at/for? Joseph Chacha Joe For a site of laughs and a FREE ezine: www.smilepoetryweekly.com The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] Re: css problem
Drew
This is a mess. I validated both my xhtml and css. Even though div
align=center is not accepted in the strict doctype, it is tolerated
in transitional, and since I'm not tableless in my design yet, I am
still using it [bad me :o( ]
I'll validate them again and fix any problems. I already have p {
text-align:center } but I guess that's why when you validated the p tag
was not allowed. Thanks Drew
Jan
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Several points. Neither your xhtml nor css validate. The xhtml issues
have to do with tables in css. Tables do not behave exactly the same way
when css designed. The validator indicates you have an element a p tag
where one is not allowed.
Also you failed to specify units for sizes. This is a minor error but a
common one.
Your css is performing an import loop. Your first line in default.css is
@import=default.css;. You are importing the file into itself.
Also div align=center is not valid css. You need a class specifying text-align:center.
The nav links are set to specified size (7em), which is perfectly fine. It
does however result in a fixed size menu bar which is clearly left aligned
in higher screen resolutions. You might want to consider padding-left on
the nav menu.
Realize also that having set font size in body at 73%, your h1 is 125% of
73%. Font size is relative to the containing unit.
Don't have NS to compare with since I'm in training for exchange and I'm
therefore limited to the world of ms. And exccept for the nav bar, it
looks ok for a small font site.
drew
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[wdvltalk] Re: css problem
Hi Drew
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Several points. Neither your xhtml nor css validate. The xhtml issues
have to do with tables in css. Tables do not behave exactly the same way
when css designed. The validator indicates you have an element a p tag
where one is not allowed.
I see what the problem is and Am working on this.
Also you failed to specify units for sizes. This is a minor error but a
common one.
Don't know what you are referring to in this, I have specified %.
Can you explain this one to me.
Your css is performing an import loop. Your first line in default.css is
@import=default.css;. You are importing the file into itself.
I took out the first line so there shouldn't be a problem anymore.
Also div align=center is not valid css. You need a class specifying
text-align:center.
Ok, I have set up p { text-align:center;}, but I guess I can set up a
class for it, and also one for justify as that with the p is causing the
invalid remarks for the html.
The nav links are set to specified size (7em), which is perfectly fine. It
does however result in a fixed size menu bar which is clearly left aligned
in higher screen resolutions. You might want to consider padding-left on
the nav menu.
I see what you mean, the nav links are left aligned, can you explain how
I should padding-left for it?
Realize also that having set font size in body at 73%, your h1 is 125% of
73%. Font size is relative to the containing unit.
Yes, I did it that way so I can use 115%, 125% with all font sizes
relative to the main size of 73%
Don't have NS to compare with since I'm in training for exchange and I'm
therefore limited to the world of ms. And exccept for the nav bar, it
looks ok for a small font site.
Thanks for compliment.
Jan
drew
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[wdvltalk] Re: css problem
Jan, While I applaud using percents so people can adjust sizes but 73% on my laptop in its default configuration isn't readable. Nor will it be readable on a Mac which renders text smaller than with IE on the PC. While many designers love small font sizes from my informal survey (students where I teach age range of 19-70, average 40ish) anything below 80% is uncomfortable and most don't like it below 90% for body text. BTW, why would training for exchange by which I take you mean Exchange Server limit you to IE for browser testing? I'm rather firmly in the MS OS camp (I dislike command line and gladly abandoned it with Windows 95) but I still have IE 6, NN 4 (recently removed 6.2), Mozilla, Opera 6 7 for testing purposes. For a down and dirty comparisons of font sizes. The default size for IE is roughly 13.5pt while for Netscape it is 12pt. Cheryl D. Wise MS-MVP-FrontPage www.wiserways.com mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 713.353.0139 Office -Original Message- From: Jan Major I see what you mean, the nav links are left aligned, can you explain how I should padding-left for it? Realize also that having set font size in body at 73%, your h1 is 125% of 73%. Font size is relative to the containing unit. Yes, I did it that way so I can use 115%, 125% with all font sizes relative to the main size of 73% Don't have NS to compare with since I'm in training for exchange and I'm therefore limited to the world of ms. And exccept for the nav bar, it looks ok for a small font site. The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] Re: css problem
At 09:59 PM 11/20/2003, you wrote: For some reason, my page is looking lousy in IE 6.0 and I can't figure out why it's not reading the style sheet default.css. Can someone please check out this page using IE only and tell me if there is a problem on your browser too. http://www.jdvisions.com/index.html I only notice 2 things that appear to be wrong, one is that your VALID buttons aren't showing up until you mouseover them. Second is that the text content on the white section is a very light color and almost impossible to read. Other than that, not knowing what your page is -supposed- to look like that's about all I can tell you. Deb The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] Re: css problem
Deb The page shows properly in NS. The valid buttons are not supposed to be visible unless the mouse is over the name, so that part is right. I believe that IE 6.0 is not interpreting the style sheet default.css can anyone tell me why it isn't? puterbug wrote: At 09:59 PM 11/20/2003, you wrote: http://www.jdvisions.com/index.html I only notice 2 things that appear to be wrong, one is that your VALID buttons aren't showing up until you mouseover them. Second is that the text content on the white section is a very light color and almost impossible to read. Other than that, not knowing what your page is -supposed- to look like that's about all I can tell you. Deb The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] Re: CSS Problem
I just answered a question about links on another list. You seem to
be making some of the same mistakes the other fellow I responded to
did. Just below I'm appending my answer to him.
If you want to see some complex links working correctly, take a look
at this site I'm developing [ignore red outlines on boxes, I'm trying
to figure what some of my tables' margins render incorrectly].
http://www.kimbwei.com/sabamed/dialysis/baxter550.php
RE LINKS:
Here are some simple instructions on how to code them:
#1 Do set up a separate selector to identify your links as in
.leftmenutext {
foo: foo; }
Your .leftmenutext wants to be the selector [the div, class
or table] which your links will descend from.
#2 But don't put properties specific to the links pseudo-class in
that selector. Put general and color definitions in this section and
the color that type which is not links will be. The background-color
won't be transparent, as the color you specify here will be the
underlying color for this section.
[NO GOOD
.leftmenutext {
text-decoration: none;
color: #232150;
background-color: transparent;
font-size: smaller;
padding-left: 10px;
} ]
GOOD
.leftmenutext {
padding-left: 10px;
color: #232150;
background-color: #666;
font-size: x-small;
} /* #666 is a gray */
#3 If most of the links in your code have no text decoration, nix
them once in a generic pseudo-class decoration as follows and you
won't need to enter it again anywhere. [If you want to underline some
links you can provide for the underline by adding text-decoration:
underline only where needed. So far your code will read:
a { text-decoration: none;
}
#leftmenutext {
padding-left: 10px;
color: #232150;
background-color: #666;
font-size: x-small;
}
#4 Notice I changed your .leftmenutext to #.leftmenutext. There's
only one section with this name so this works better. Browsers can
choke on selectors which are classed [.foo] when they should be id'd
[#foo]. Class is for selectors that will appear more than once in a
document.
#5 :visited :hover :active inherit from the pseudo-class a they
descend from, so you don't need to repeat in these pseudo-classes
properties that will be the same as the parent a selector. [You also
don't need to refer to them as classes themselves]. Additional
code will read:
#leftmenutext a {
color: #232150;
background-color: transparent;
}
#leftmenutext a:visited {
color: green;
background-color: transparent;
}
#leftmenutext a:hover {
color: #FF6600;
background-color: transparent;
}
#leftmenutext a:active {
color: #yellow;
background-color: transparent;
}
Best of luck with your project,
Kimi
Ok guys, ive got an annoying issue. CSS based I guess. Im putting my site
http://www.galatekinc.com/ to a major revision, and while testing it I
noticed that a small menu I have on the left hand side has a problem. When
the cursor goes over the Generator Gawl link, it highlights the way I want
but then it also covers all of the choices above it; it is the only link
that does that. The CSS class code for its properties and the HTML code for
the menu follow:
HTML
div class=highlightboxuANIME LINKS/ubr
A CLASS=highlightbox HREF=/anime/ranma.htmlRanma 1/2/Abr
A CLASS=highlightbox HREF=/anime/kurumi.htmlSteel Angel Kurumi/Abr
A CLASS=highlightbox HREF=/anime/gawl.htmlGenerator Gawl/Abr
--- This is the problem link
A CLASS=highlightbox HREF=/anime/trigun.htmlTrigun/Abr
A CLASS=highlightbox HREF=/anime/801tts.html801 TTS/Abr
/div
The CSS concerning the HTML code
div.highlightbox {background: gray; color: yellow; text-align: center}
a.highlightbox {color: white; text-decoration: none}
a.highlightbox:hover {color: yellow; border: thin groove silver}
Thanks in advance
Charles R King
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Galatek Incorporated/Wanderers Haven
Charles R King
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Galatek Incorporated/Wanderers Haven
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[wdvltalk] Re: CSS Problem
Thanks for the help that you guys gave me, but it wasn't really much of a
complicated thing after all. It was an extra line break underneath the
heading of the menu. Threw me for a loop though, I fixed it but decided I
didn't like the look it portrayed anyways and changed it to something else.
Thanks for all the useful information though, ill put it to good use in the
future.
Charles R King
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Galatek Incorporated/Wanderers Haven
-Original Message-
From: Michael Gordon [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2003 9:06 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [wdvltalk] Re: CSS Problem
Galatek Webmaster wrote:
Ok guys, ive got an annoying issue. CSS based I guess. Im putting my site
http://www.galatekinc.com/ to a major revision, and while testing it I
noticed that a small menu I have on the left hand side has a problem. When
the cursor goes over the Generator Gawl link, it highlights the way I
want
but then it also covers all of the choices above it; it is the only link
that does that. The CSS class code for its properties and the HTML code for
the menu follow:
HTML
div class=highlightboxuANIME LINKS/ubr
A CLASS=highlightbox HREF=/anime/ranma.htmlRanma 1/2/Abr
A CLASS=highlightbox HREF=/anime/kurumi.htmlSteel Angel
Kurumi/Abr
A CLASS=highlightbox HREF=/anime/gawl.htmlGenerator Gawl/Abr
--- This is the problem link
A CLASS=highlightbox HREF=/anime/trigun.htmlTrigun/Abr
A CLASS=highlightbox HREF=/anime/801tts.html801 TTS/Abr
/div
The CSS concerning the HTML code
div.highlightbox {background: gray; color: yellow; text-align: center}
a.highlightbox {color: white; text-decoration: none}
a.highlightbox:hover {color: yellow; border: thin groove silver}
Thanks in advance
Charles R King
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Galatek Incorporated/Wanderers Haven
Charles R King
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Galatek Incorporated/Wanderers Haven
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Hello Charles,
Perhaps the problem is the web browser version you are using that
renders the navigation links the way you see them.
In Netscape 7.1 all the links render correctly, none overlap any other
link. The grooved border is not grooved because you used Thin instead
of a pixel size, the thin border is too Thin for Netscape to render a
groove.
In Internet Explorer 6.0pr1 all of your links render correctly, and here
the border is grooved because IE renders Thin with a groove 3 pixels
in size.
You have one major problem with the menu, you have not set a pixel size
for the fonts used in the menu, as a result the title
Steel Angel Kurumi wraps in IE causing what appears as a double link.
Netscape's font sizing for what ever you used renders the text smaller
than IE so it does not wrap the link.
My suggestion is to set the border size to 3px and the font-size to
12px, or what ever looks good without wrapping the link.
By using font sizing with pixels you will come closer to creating a web
page that looks almost identical in all web browsers, even on a Mac.
Michael Gordon
--
Character is doing the right thing...
Even when no one is watching...
http://www.armadilloweb.com
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[wdvltalk] Re: CSS Problem
try display: block; for nav menus, just off the top of my head.
www.WellingtonLive.co.nz
- Original Message -
From: Galatek Webmaster
Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2003 11:37 AM
Subject: [wdvltalk] CSS Problem
: Ok guys, ive got an annoying issue. CSS based I guess. Im putting my site
: http://www.galatekinc.com/ to a major revision, and while testing it I
: noticed that a small menu I have on the left hand side has a problem. When
: the cursor goes over the Generator Gawl link, it highlights the way I
want
: but then it also covers all of the choices above it; it is the only link
: that does that. The CSS class code for its properties and the HTML code
for
: the menu follow:
:
: HTML
: div class=highlightboxuANIME LINKS/ubr
: A CLASS=highlightbox HREF=/anime/ranma.htmlRanma 1/2/Abr
: A CLASS=highlightbox HREF=/anime/kurumi.htmlSteel Angel
Kurumi/Abr
: A CLASS=highlightbox HREF=/anime/gawl.htmlGenerator Gawl/Abr
: --- This is the problem link
: A CLASS=highlightbox HREF=/anime/trigun.htmlTrigun/Abr
: A CLASS=highlightbox HREF=/anime/801tts.html801 TTS/Abr
: /div
:
: The CSS concerning the HTML code
:
: div.highlightbox {background: gray; color: yellow; text-align: center}
: a.highlightbox {color: white; text-decoration: none}
: a.highlightbox:hover {color: yellow; border: thin groove silver}
:
: Thanks in advance
:
: Charles R King
: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
: Galatek Incorporated/Wanderers Haven
:
:
:
: Charles R King
: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
: Galatek Incorporated/Wanderers Haven
:
:
:
:
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[wdvltalk] Re: CSS Problem
Galatek Webmaster wrote:
Ok guys, ive got an annoying issue. CSS based I guess. Im putting my site
http://www.galatekinc.com/ to a major revision, and while testing it I
noticed that a small menu I have on the left hand side has a problem. When
the cursor goes over the Generator Gawl link, it highlights the way I want
but then it also covers all of the choices above it; it is the only link
that does that. The CSS class code for its properties and the HTML code for
the menu follow:
HTML
div class=highlightboxuANIME LINKS/ubr
A CLASS=highlightbox HREF=/anime/ranma.htmlRanma 1/2/Abr
A CLASS=highlightbox HREF=/anime/kurumi.htmlSteel Angel Kurumi/Abr
A CLASS=highlightbox HREF=/anime/gawl.htmlGenerator Gawl/Abr
--- This is the problem link
A CLASS=highlightbox HREF=/anime/trigun.htmlTrigun/Abr
A CLASS=highlightbox HREF=/anime/801tts.html801 TTS/Abr
/div
The CSS concerning the HTML code
div.highlightbox {background: gray; color: yellow; text-align: center}
a.highlightbox {color: white; text-decoration: none}
a.highlightbox:hover {color: yellow; border: thin groove silver}
Thanks in advance
Charles R King
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Galatek Incorporated/Wanderers Haven
Charles R King
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Galatek Incorporated/Wanderers Haven
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Hello Charles,
Perhaps the problem is the web browser version you are using that
renders the navigation links the way you see them.
In Netscape 7.1 all the links render correctly, none overlap any other
link. The grooved border is not grooved because you used Thin instead
of a pixel size, the thin border is too Thin for Netscape to render a
groove.
In Internet Explorer 6.0pr1 all of your links render correctly, and here
the border is grooved because IE renders Thin with a groove 3 pixels
in size.
You have one major problem with the menu, you have not set a pixel size
for the fonts used in the menu, as a result the title
Steel Angel Kurumi wraps in IE causing what appears as a double link.
Netscape's font sizing for what ever you used renders the text smaller
than IE so it does not wrap the link.
My suggestion is to set the border size to 3px and the font-size to
12px, or what ever looks good without wrapping the link.
By using font sizing with pixels you will come closer to creating a web
page that looks almost identical in all web browsers, even on a Mac.
Michael Gordon
--
Character is doing the right thing...
Even when no one is watching...
http://www.armadilloweb.com
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[wdvltalk] Re: CSS
Anitha Here are some urls re css http://w3.org/TR/REC-CSS2/ http://bluerobot.com/ http://www.meyerweb.com/eric/css/ http://www.alistapart.com/stories/journey/ http://www.webreference.com/authoring/style/sheets/layout/advanced/ http://www.westciv.com.au/style_master/academy/css_tutorial/ http://www.meyerweb.com/eric/css/references/index.html http://www.thenoodleincident.com/tutorials/box_lesson/index.html http://www.glassdog.com/design-o-rama/webdesign-css.shtml?css http://www.mako4css.com/ http://www.websitetips.com/css/index.shtml Well, if that list isn't too intimidating, you can always find more. Anitha Paruchuri wrote: Hi, Can anyone suggest me some good example websites which have used CSS for formatting. Or any sites which talk about this giving examples? I am looking for examples of CSS which include graphic positioning. Couldn't find while searching on Google. Knew that someone would be able to help me here in the group. Thanks Anitha The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] Re: CSS
On July 30, 2003 at 13:38, Anitha Paruchuri wrote: Can anyone suggest me some good example websites which have used CSS for formatting. Or any sites which talk about this giving examples? I am looking for examples of CSS which include graphic positioning. Heavy use of graphics/css on this site in lots of configrations while still using the same html: http://www.csszengarden.com Regards, Mark Groen MG Web Services Web Site Hosting and Development www.markgroen.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] 604-780-6917 The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] Re: CSS
Anitha-- www.alistapart.com and about a dozen other sites I don't have at hand. Working on my laptop through dialup and haven't updated my Favorites on this computer. I miss my DSL and cordless keyboard/mouse! I feel so slow. ;^) -- Don - Original Message - From: Anitha Paruchuri [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, July 30, 2003 12:38 PM Subject: [wdvltalk] CSS Hi, Can anyone suggest me some good example websites which have used CSS for formatting. Or any sites which talk about this giving examples? I am looking for examples of CSS which include graphic positioning. Couldn't find while searching on Google. Knew that someone would be able to help me here in the group. Thanks Anitha . The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM . To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%% The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] RE: CSS
snip / :My point was that :tables have unique css properties not found in other elements. :Making it worthwhile to spend time studying the extended :properties of tables rather than just styling td and tr. Ah, well, in that case, I have to agree. As well as using more semantically correct tables including thead, th, tbody, tfoot, etc. -Stephen Caudill http://www.mechavox.com The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[wdvltalk] RE: CSS
Tables is tables. CSS tables are based on html tables. The tables are extended in some interesting ways as the last example in the specs shows -- grouping data around an axis. But they are still tables not boxes. drew -Original Message- From: Jan Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2003 12:45 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [wdvltalk] RE: CSS Ok, somehow this is confusing me. What is best to use for tables, columns or box model? Jan http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%% The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
