Ideally (or not ;/) IMHO what is needed
1: Separate repo for every software release; It would be even better
if this can be variableized in sources.list files (I don't see
such a feature in /etc/apt/sources.list; on the other hand for example
/etc/yum.repos.d/fedora.repo there is $releasever and
On Monday 22 March 2010 17:23:11 Tomi Ollila wrote:
1: Separate repo for every software release; It would be even better
if this can be variableized in sources.list files (I don't see
such a feature in /etc/apt/sources.list; on the other hand for example
/etc/yum.repos.d/fedora.repo there is
Niels Breet wrote:
Hi,
- Maemo 5 PR1.2 will ship with Extras enabled by default but will use
distribution: fremantle-1.2
- 'older' devices will continue to fetch from distribution: fremantle
- Autobuilder will be updated when PR1.2 is released and promotion will
only happen to
Niels Breet wrote:
Hi,
- Maemo 5 PR1.2 will ship with Extras enabled by default but will use
distribution: fremantle-1.2
- 'older' devices will continue to fetch from distribution: fremantle
- Autobuilder will be updated when PR1.2 is released and promotion will
only happen to fremantle-1.2
ext Dave Neary dne...@maemo.org writes:
Then a new version of the SDK comes out, which is not backwards
compatible. A number of potentially bad things can happen:
I agree with your points in general, but I want to qualify them a bit.
There are two issues:
- I think it is very important to be
ext David Greaves da...@dgreaves.com writes:
My wife must have done an 'ignore' on a Maemo5 update sometime in oct/nov.
The device never reminded her again. She only got pr1.1.1 because she noticed
my
device made a sound on account connections and hers didn't... I did 2 upgrades
in
Marius Vollmer wrote:
ext David Greaves da...@dgreaves.com writes:
My wife must have done an 'ignore' on a Maemo5 update sometime in oct/nov.
The device never reminded her again. She only got pr1.1.1 because she
noticed my
device made a sound on account connections and hers didn't... I
On Wed, 2010-02-24 at 17:48 +, Graham Cobb wrote:
On Wednesday 24 February 2010 17:18:29 Thomas Tanner wrote:
On 24.02.10 18:04, Graham Cobb wrote:
Why do I think many people will not upgrade? This device is a phone.
The N900 is a mobile computer.
I am talking about the people
On Thu, Feb 25, 2010 at 2:33 PM, Marius Vollmer
marius.voll...@nokia.com wrote:
That's a bug in the ignore machinery: I think we only store which
packages have been ignored, but not which versions. This means that if
you ignore a OS update, you will never be notified again about OS
updates
ext David Greaves da...@dgreaves.com writes:
That's a bug in the ignore machinery: I think we only store which
packages have been ignored, but not which versions. This means that if
you ignore a OS update, you will never be notified again about OS
updates ever.
Has a fairly big impact on
ext Martin DeMello martindeme...@gmail.com writes:
How do I clear out my ignore history?
Try this:
$ rm ~/.hildon-application-manager/{seen,tapped}-updates
We don't really keep a history of what has been ignored, just a brief
record of what has been shown in the Updates view. This is
...@maemo.org]on Behalf Of Xavier Bestel
Sent: Thursday, February 25, 2010 5:12 AM
To: Graham Cobb
Cc: maemo-developers@maemo.org
Subject: Re: Maemo 5 PR1.2 and Extras
On Wed, 2010-02-24 at 17:48 +, Graham Cobb wrote:
On Wednesday 24 February 2010 17:18:29 Thomas Tanner wrote:
On 24.02.10
On 24 February 2010 11:21, Niels Breet ni...@maemo.org wrote:
Nokia will encourage people to upgrade to the latest release as much as
possible and we expect people to switch to PR1.2 at a high rate.
Please let me know what you think, we have to come to a consensus as soon
as possible if we
Hi Niels,
Am 24.02.2010 um 12:21 schrieb Niels Breet:
- Maemo 5 PR1.2 will ship with Extras enabled by default but will use
distribution: fremantle-1.2
- 'older' devices will continue to fetch from distribution: fremantle
- Autobuilder will be updated when PR1.2 is released and promotion
Hi,
On 24 February 2010 12:21, Niels Breet ni...@maemo.org wrote:
Hi,
Maemo 5 PR1.2 seems to be a release with some large changes which are not
backwards compatible with previous releases. Most visible change will be
the inclusion of Qt4.6, but there will be some other smaller changes.
On Wednesday 24 February 2010 12:21:45 Niels Breet wrote:
Please let me know what you think, we have to come to a consensus as soon
as possible if we want to have this change included in PR1.2.
How will this PR1.2 change be reflected on the maemo.org dowloads section
(i.e. how will it be
hi,
Niels Breet wrote:
Maemo 5 PR1.2 seems to be a release with some large changes which are not
backwards compatible with previous releases. Most visible change will be
the inclusion of Qt4.6, but there will be some other smaller changes.
When you say not backwards compatible, does that mean
On Wednesday 24 February 2010 12:21:45 Niels Breet wrote:
Please let me know what you think, we have to come to a consensus as
soon as possible if we want to have this change included in PR1.2.
How will this PR1.2 change be reflected on the maemo.org dowloads section
(i.e. how will it be
I don't know whether this has been discussed before:
what is wrong with forcing users that have the necessary Internet access
to download applications from Extras, to also upgrade to
the lastest firmware, which is supposed to fix bugs anyway.
Why would anybody not upgrade the firmware?
Why is
On Wednesday 24 February 2010 12:29:02 Andrea Grandi wrote:
Developers who are using Qt (both C++ and Python) know that are using
something still experimental (even if already so good).
That is incorrect. Even though Nokia calls Qt 4.5.x 'community supported', it
is shipped with all N900
I would prefer if devs could get the PR1.2 update a week or so earlier than
the general release. This way most of the necessary updates from Qt 4.5 to
4.6 could be done before the general public gets the new firmware. Also the
normal 10 day quarantine should not apply to these case.
Thanks,
Hallo!
What happens to apps (especially those with Qt dependencies) _currently_
in Extras, i.e., how will they get to the fremantle1.2 Extras repo ?
The Qt apps are currently blocked from being promoted to prevent issues.
The fremantle-1.2 repository will probably need to be 'legacy' clean.
On Wednesday 24 February 2010 11:21:45 Niels Breet wrote:
- Maemo 5 PR1.2 will ship with Extras enabled by default but will use
distribution: fremantle-1.2
- 'older' devices will continue to fetch from distribution: fremantle
- Autobuilder will be updated when PR1.2 is released and promotion
Hi,
On 24 February 2010 13:27, Sascha Mäkelä sascha.mak...@gmail.com wrote:
I would prefer if devs could get the PR1.2 update a week or so earlier than
the general release. This way most of the necessary updates from Qt 4.5 to
4.6 could be done before the general public gets the new firmware.
Hello,
On Wednesday 24 of February 2010, Niels Breet wrote:
- Maemo 5 PR1.2 will ship with Extras enabled by default but will use
distribution: fremantle-1.2
IMHO, it may be better to have a distribution name like freemantle-2 just to
not cause confusions if/when PR1.3 (or other) is released.
hi,
Niels Breet wrote:
Maemo 5 PR1.2 seems to be a release with some large changes which are
not backwards compatible with previous releases. Most visible change
will be the inclusion of Qt4.6, but there will be some other smaller
changes.
When you say not backwards compatible, does that
On Wednesday 24 February 2010 11:21:45 Niels Breet wrote:
- Maemo 5 PR1.2 will ship with Extras enabled by default but will use
distribution: fremantle-1.2
- 'older' devices will continue to fetch from distribution: fremantle
- Autobuilder will be updated when PR1.2 is released and promotion
Hallo!
What happens to apps (especially those with Qt dependencies)
_currently_
in Extras, i.e., how will they get to the fremantle1.2 Extras repo ?
The Qt apps are currently blocked from being promoted to prevent
issues. The fremantle-1.2 repository will probably need to be 'legacy'
I would prefer if devs could get the PR1.2 update a week or so earlier
than the general release. This way most of the necessary updates from Qt
4.5 to
4.6 could be done before the general public gets the new firmware.
It looks like there is a chance to get the SDK out before the actual
device
On Wed, Feb 24, 2010 at 15:30, Niels Breet ni...@maemo.org wrote:
Also
the normal 10 day quarantine should not apply to these case.
I'm not sure if that is a good idea. The quarantine is there for a reason,
the switch between these Qt releases can actually introduce issues. If we
have the
On Wednesday 24 February 2010 13:20:40 Thomas Tanner wrote:
Why would anybody not upgrade the firmware?
Why is backwards compatibility necessary for Fremantle minor releases?
Enforcing the requirement could make our life so much easier.
There can be a number of reasons, ranging from various
On 24.02.10 15:18, Attila Csipa wrote:
On Wednesday 24 February 2010 13:20:40 Thomas Tanner wrote:
Why would anybody not upgrade the firmware?
Why is backwards compatibility necessary for Fremantle minor releases?
Enforcing the requirement could make our life so much easier.
There can be a
How will this PR1.2 change be reflected on the maemo.org dowloads section
(i.e. how will it be ensured that the user gets presented the correct
install-this link) ?
A different .install file can be offered based on your browser string.
How are you going to make sure you catch all of them ?
Hi,
Niels Breet wrote:
Niels Breet wrote:
Maemo 5 PR1.2 seems to be a release with some large changes which are
not backwards compatible with previous releases. Most visible change
will be the inclusion of Qt4.6, but there will be some other smaller
changes.
When you say not backwards
Hi,
Sascha Mäkelä wrote:
I was under the impression that for many Qt apps a simple repackaging
will do the trick. If this is the case, would it not make sense to make
those updates available? After all, before the updates are released to
Extras, many users are going to have Qt apps that won't
On 24 February 2010 14:18, Attila Csipa ma...@csipa.in.rs wrote:
simply firmware non-availability
(firmwares are not rolled out simultaneously for all countries, ask UK
folks :).
Me me me! I really wish to know officially why PR1.1.1 still hasn't been
rolled as OTA update for my device...
On Wednesday 24 February 2010 15:43:47 Thomas Tanner wrote:
In a (Debian based) distribution the proper way to handle such conflicts
would be to specify the minimum required version in each extras apps
(e.g. qt4.5) and to switch to a new package name if the new package is
no longer backwards
Hello,
On Wednesday 24 of February 2010, Dave Neary wrote:
Sascha Mäkelä wrote:
I was under the impression that for many Qt apps a simple repackaging
will do the trick. If this is the case, would it not make sense to make
those updates available? After all, before the updates are released
Graham Cobb wrote:
I can't say I like this. My personal view is that there will be a lot of
people running earlier software for quite a long time. How long do Nokia
believe it will be before 80% of new devices being sold in retail stores have
PR1.2 pre-installed? Can we keep track of stats
This will effectively mean that the 'old' Extras will not get any updates.
New versions of applications will go to fremantle-1.2 Extras.
Extras-devel
and Extras-testing will not be changed, as they are expected to run the
latest and greatest anyway.
What happens to apps (especially those
Thomas Tanner wrote:
Forced upgrades of some components for installation of a new package is
standard practice for all package management systems (keyword version
dependencies).
I think the main problem is that the mp-fremantle-pr packages
hardcodes the exact version of all PR packages instead
On Wednesday 24 February 2010 16:42:16 Michael Cronenworth wrote:
the Maemo update. If they want a new app, they must update Maemo, but
they can continue using their old apps as long as they want. Refusing to
update because of a personal preference should be discounted. Security
updates, new
Hi,
On Wed, Feb 24, 2010 at 5:06 PM, Attila Csipa ma...@csipa.in.rs wrote:
The complications stem from the way this is handled in Maemo, at least for Qt.
I just hope this slightly complex PR1.2 Qt transition is not a snowball
effect of how some Maemoisms were added (hacked :) ) into Qt4.5/4.6
Venomrush wrote:
Why not have 2 repos for Extras
1 called Extras Legacy (aka current Extras)
1 called Extras (aka fremantle-1.2 Extras)
The only inconvenience I can think of is users have an addtional repo on the
list, shouldn't do any harm!
They will fragment the Maemo 5 community unless
-Original Message-
From: maemo-developers-boun...@maemo.org [mailto:maemo-developers-
boun...@maemo.org] On Behalf Of ext Niels Breet
Sent: 24 February, 2010 14:19
To: Attila Csipa
Cc: maemo-developers@maemo.org
Subject: Re: Maemo 5 PR1.2 and Extras
On Wednesday 24 February 2010
Hi,
Michael Cronenworth wrote:
How can you not like this? What is your reasoning? You brought this same
response to the last Maemo update, and I still do not understand it.
Let's say that there are 10,000 applications in Extras.
Now every N900 owner can get all of those apps.
Then a new
How will this PR1.2 change be reflected on the maemo.org dowloads
section (i.e. how will it be ensured that the user gets presented the
correct install-this link) ?
A different .install file can be offered based on your browser string.
How are you going to make sure you catch all of them ?
They will fragment the Maemo 5 community unless the auto-builder will
build across both repos, as I will not be updating my apps on a Legacy
repo if one is created.
The way you propose makes it seem like Nokia is releasing a whole new
Maemo version (Maemo 5 - Maemo 5.99), which is not
Dave Neary on 02/24/2010 10:01 AM wrote:
1. New uploads get compiled with the new SDK, and get downloaded onto
phones with the old OS, where they don't work.
How? The only way that could happen is if a power-user downloaded the
file manually and attempted to use dpkg manually. This should be
On Wed, Feb 24, 2010 at 6:01 PM, Dave Neary dne...@maemo.org wrote:
2. Developers working with the old SDK upload applications which don't
even build with the new SDK
That's their own screwup, I guess (which they notice immediately when
trying to upload).
The group most impacted are the Qt
Venomrush wrote:
You do not need to update any apps in Legacy. Apps in Legacy remains the
same and does not get any further development work.
That's what Niels is proposing, unless I am mistaken.
fremantle = Legacy
fremantle-1.2 = The new Extras
___
You do not need to update any apps in Legacy. Apps in Legacy remains the
same and does not get any further development work.
Hmm sorry for the confusion, I should say if apps in Legacy are getting
updates, they'll be move to Extras.
It's not exactly what Niels's proposing, but just my
On Wednesday 24 February 2010 17:25:20 Michael Cronenworth wrote:
Dave Neary on 02/24/2010 10:01 AM wrote:
1. New uploads get compiled with the new SDK, and get downloaded onto
phones with the old OS, where they don't work.
How? The only way that could happen is if a power-user downloaded
On Wednesday 24 February 2010 15:42:16 Michael Cronenworth wrote:
Graham Cobb wrote:
I can't say I like this. My personal view is that there will be a lot of
people running earlier software for quite a long time. How long do Nokia
believe it will be before 80% of new devices being sold in
On Wednesday 24 February 2010 16:26:44 Ville M. Vainio wrote:
Barring regressions, we can probably expect everybody to upgrade to
1.2 in timely manner.
I disagree, but I may be completely wrong. It will be very interesting to
see. What do you consider timely? 3 months? My prediction: in 3
On Wed, Feb 24, 2010 at 7:08 PM, Graham Cobb g+...@cobb.uk.net wrote:
On Wednesday 24 February 2010 16:26:44 Ville M. Vainio wrote:
Barring regressions, we can probably expect everybody to upgrade to
1.2 in timely manner.
I disagree, but I may be completely wrong. It will be very
On 24.02.10 18:04, Graham Cobb wrote:
Why do I think many people will not upgrade? This device is a phone.
The N900 is a mobile computer.
If you want to use it as a phone, i.e. without applications from extras
or Ovi, then there is no need to upgrade the firmware.
If you want to use it as a
On Wed, Feb 24, 2010 at 7:04 PM, Graham Cobb g+...@cobb.uk.net wrote:
I'm not expecting you to agree but you asked why. You are free to choose that
you will not support users running on anything other than the latest OS.
Just don't force the same decision on me.
Not upgrading (again, barring
On Wednesday 24 February 2010 17:23:19 Ville M. Vainio wrote:
On Wed, Feb 24, 2010 at 7:04 PM, Graham Cobb g+...@cobb.uk.net wrote:
I'm not expecting you to agree but you asked why. You are free to choose
that you will not support users running on anything other than the latest
OS. Just
On Wednesday 24 February 2010 17:18:29 Thomas Tanner wrote:
On 24.02.10 18:04, Graham Cobb wrote:
Why do I think many people will not upgrade? This device is a phone.
The N900 is a mobile computer.
I am talking about the people who perceive it to be a phone. Like the
iPhone.
Maintaining
Graham Cobb wrote:
My personal view is that there will be a lot of
people running earlier software for quite a long time. How long do Nokia
believe it will be before 80% of new devices being sold in retail stores have
PR1.2 pre-installed?
FYI
My wife must have done an 'ignore' on a
ext Michael Cronenworth m...@cchtml.com writes:
If a user has access to downloading apps, then they will be notified of
the Maemo update. If they want a new app, they must update Maemo, but
they can continue using their old apps as long as they want. Refusing to
update because of a
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