David
Getting a driver to 210 grams is easy just bring it to my shop
and we will get it done. We can also place the weight anywhere in the head you
would like. Set up the shaft for length and bring the head and we will hit your
target raw swing weight without any lead tape.
Charli
And it would have to have some far-out color scheme or else it would
probably be unhittable!! ;)
Tom
- Original Message -
From: "Dan Neubecker" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To:
Sent: Friday, October 14, 2005 8:21 AM
Subject: RE: ShopTalk: Wishon Short Driver Article
H
om: "Lloyd Hackman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To:
Sent: Friday, October 14, 2005 5:51 AM
Subject: Re: ShopTalk: Wishon Short Driver Article
RK
Below is a comment that was posted three years ago on this forum by a user
of the FitChip. Since you would not believe what I said maybe you can
CTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dan Neubecker
> Sent: Thursday, October 13, 2005 11:27 AM
> To: ShopTalk@mail.msen.com
> Subject: RE: ShopTalk: Wishon Short Driver Article
>
> Hi Tom,
>
> I think you are well on your way. You have the hosel weight port in
&
and granted I don't
know your history with him, but I do know that he is on to something and
it's outside the box of conventional thinking.
David"
llhack
> [Original Message]
> From: golf-equipment <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To:
> Date: 10/13/2005 4:16:38 PM
> Subj
Amen Brah!!!
Cub
- Original Message -
From: "Tom Wishon" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To:
Sent: Wednesday, October 12, 2005 8:37 AM
Subject: RE: ShopTalk: Wishon Short Driver Article
> LLHack:
>
> Fine Lloyd - you just keep on ignoring the simple fact that longer
>
damn! i'm down to 4 fairways a round then
sean
On 13-Oct-05, at 7:12 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
In a message dated 10/13/05 8:56:52 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
I hit a 48" driver and hit 85%
of the fairways and by theory pick up 20 yards with both clubs at the
prop
I'll second the opinion of the book.
Ed Reeder wrote:
Dave,
Good observation about Tom's 2005 offerings. In fact, that is one of
the reasons I believe his book is so valuable. Here he is recommending
clubheads/clubs that he doesn't make. Is there any other
company/person that would b
In a message dated 10/13/05 9:23:26 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Itry
to train every fitter using the FitChip in its proper use but can
notguarantee that they will use it as designed or adjust its results
withtheir own interpretations. I know for a fact that I
In a message dated 10/13/05 8:56:52 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
I hit a
48" driver and hit 85%of the fairways and by theory pick up 20 yards with
both clubs at theproper frequency.
Beating a fairway with your driver after loosing a ball in the woods or a
lake
d re-think the old 919's as they could get a new life and
a second wind!
TOM
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dan Neubecker
Sent: Thursday, October 13, 2005 11:27 AM
To: ShopTalk@mail.msen.com
Subject: RE: ShopTalk: Wishon Short Dri
PIECE OF CRAP"
RK
- Original Message -
From: "Lloyd Hackman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To:
Sent: Thursday, October 13, 2005 9:23 AM
Subject: Re: ShopTalk: Wishon Short Driver Article
TFlan
Every one that buys clubs from my shop has hit a driver and 5 Iron in the
recommended fre
significant improvement I can think of.
Dan Neubecker
-Original Message-
From: Tom Wishon [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, October 13, 2005 12:12 PM
To: ShopTalk@mail.msen.com
Subject: RE: ShopTalk: Wishon Short Driver Article
ED/DAVE:
I moved all driver headweights in our line
Hello everyone.
Some years ago I wrote to Tom when he was still at Golfsmith trying to
persuade him to design Metal wood heads with interchangeable segments
on the sole and back so clubmakers could design custom fitted
swingweights ball flight position and COG.. This request was was
par
: ShopTalk: Wishon Short Driver Article
Dan,
Even more help should be on the way to add headweight. On the Wishon
forum Tom announced that he is working with a company to produce
Tungsten (not lead) tip weights. I can't recall if the projected number
of grams was mentioned or not, nor wh
Subject: Re: ShopTalk: Wishon Short
Driver Article
Dave,
Good observation about Tom's 2005 offerings. In fact, that is one of the
reasons I believe his book is so valuable. Here he is recommending
clubheads/clubs that he doesn't make. Is there any other company/person
that would be
Thanks all for the suggestions. Unfortunately, none of them accomplishes
all of what I want. In fact, none of them trumps my current driver.
The issues are:
* I'm not upset about lead tape on my driver head, as long as there's
somewhere to put enough of it. I had no trouble adding more than 1
Tedd,
To cover both sides of the swingweight spectrum I thought I'd add
this. If you go the MOI route instead of swingweight you may not need
to add weight at all.
When I first started experimenting with Wishon's MOI system I built a
set of woods, 1w, 3w, 5w, using the MOI of my then favorite
Dan,
Even more help should be on the way to add headweight. On the Wishon
forum Tom announced that he is working with a company to produce
Tungsten (not lead) tip weights. I can't recall if the projected number
of grams was mentioned or not, nor when they will be available.
/Ed
Dan Neubeck
Dave,
Good observation about Tom's 2005 offerings. In fact, that is one of
the reasons I believe his book is so valuable. Here he is recommending
clubheads/clubs that he doesn't make. Is there any other
company/person that would be so honest and give you the straight facts?
FWIW - I'm stric
Dave Tutelman wrote:
...Ideally, one could buy a head at around
210 grams, toss in a 50-60 gram shaft and a 50 gram grip, and you have a
nice 44" driver with a D4 swingweight and a total weight around 310-320
grams.
I would certainly like to see that on the market.
They are all over the place.
this over drilling into
the sole of the head and adding weight in that fashion, which for me is
the last resort.
Dan Neubecker
> -Original Message-
> From: Childers, Tedd A [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: Thursday, October 13, 2005 7:33 AM
> To: ShopTalk@mail.msen.co
DaveT:
Ashton Golf makes a nice head called the MS-5. Comes in a 207g Heavy
Duty model for $110. Also comes in a Standard, Draw Bias, 192g
Superlight, and High Launch version.
http://www.clubmaker-online.com/ashton.ms5.html
...Ideally, one could buy a head at around
210 grams, toss in a 50-6
l.msen.com
Subject: Re: ShopTalk: Wishon Short Driver Article
Scott Bershing wrote:
> I built a Wishon 715 @44.5" for a guy that is 5'-10" at the most
> this fall. He really hit it well, very consistent & straight. He
> ended up selling it as he didn't hit it a
age]
> From: tflan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To:
> Date: 10/12/2005 8:08:32 PM
> Subject: Re: ShopTalk: Wishon Short Driver Article
>
> I won't discuss this on the forum cuz I don't want to get nailed with a
> slander or any other kind of suit. Suffice to say the guy
At 08:33 AM 10/13/2005, Childers, Tedd A wrote:
In my experience, I have found that I have to add considerable weight to
most driver heads just to get a D3-D4 swingweight at 45".
I agree. The driver that I described yesterday was 45.7" with no additional
weight. I added just over 10 grams to g
lete :)
llhack
> [Original Message]
> From: Childers, Tedd A <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To:
> Date: 10/13/2005 8:24:12 AM
> Subject: RE: ShopTalk: Wishon Short Driver Article
>
> Lloyd,
>
> That is the maximum theoretical gain by going from 43.5" to 45". However,
&
y, October 12, 2005 6:02 PM
To: ShopTalk@mail.msen.com
Subject: RE: ShopTalk: Wishon Short Driver Article
At 04:08 PM 10/12/2005, Childers, Tedd A wrote:
>Personally, I would
>love to build a shorter driver, but ideally I could get a reasonable
>swingweight (D2-D4) at 43.5-44" and with a very
do so? Thanks.
Tedd
-Original Message-From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]On Behalf
Of golf-equipmentSent: Thursday, October 13, 2005 12:17
AMTo: ShopTalk@mail.msen.comSubject: Re: ShopTalk:
Wishon Short Driver Article
I TO WILL MISS
HIS QUCK WIT, I did however g
PROTECTED] Behalf Of Lloyd Hackman
Sent: Wednesday, October 12, 2005 5:22 PM
To: ShopTalk@mail.msen.com
Subject: RE: ShopTalk: Wishon Short Driver Article
Tedd
Yes, but you would give up that distance. The club head velocity is a
function of Radius squared thus giving you a 4.6% increase in club
ail.msen.com
Sent: Wednesday, October 12, 2005 9:35
PM
Subject: Re: ShopTalk: Wishon Short
Driver Article
IIhack,
I know from the past that your are to narrow-minded and stuck on
your system to see the forest from the trees. I hope you sell them all soon, I
just returned from
Mykey,
>On another note GS honored Al Taylor with its prestigious Harvey
Pennick award. Al is not doing well and is expected to pass shortly. He was a
dear friend and confidant to me, I will surely miss him.
Thanks for keeping us up to date on Al. The Admiral has always
had a unique sense
IIhack,
I know from the past that your are to narrow-minded and stuck on your system to see the forest from the trees. I hope you sell them all soon, I just returned from the GS convention in Austin and butt frequency has lived its useful life. If Tom W came back on he would tell you that too bu
Dave
How much did you change the frequency of the shaft?
llhack
> [Original Message]
> From: Dave Tutelman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To:
> Date: 10/12/2005 6:12:24 PM
> Subject: RE: ShopTalk: Wishon Short Driver Article
>
> At 04:08 PM 10/12/2005, Childers, Tedd A wr
lluva lotta years and as you no doubt are aware, I would never build a set
of clubs for a guy based upon a computer readout. He has to hit the clubs
first before I ever let him pay a dime.
TFlan
- Original Message -
From: "Lloyd Hackman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To:
Sent:
12/2005 5:46:57 PM
> Subject: RE: ShopTalk: Wishon Short Driver Article
>
> At 05:21 PM 10/12/2005, Lloyd Hackman wrote:
> >Yes, but you would give up that distance. The club head velocity is a
> >function of Radius squared...
>
> The clubhead velocity is a proportional to the
crease in club head
> speed. At 100 mph that woud mean 11.5 yards.
>
> llhack
>
>
>> [Original Message]
>> From: Childers, Tedd A <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> To:
>> Date: 10/12/2005 4:34:08 PM
>> Subject: RE: ShopTalk: Wishon Short Driver Articl
At 04:08 PM 10/12/2005, Childers, Tedd A wrote:
Personally, I would
love to build a shorter driver, but ideally I could get a reasonable
swingweight (D2-D4) at 43.5-44" and with a very light shaft (60 grams).
This would require a heavier than normal driver head (210+ grams), and that
is what I ha
r, they are trying to hit it too hard and throwing their body off
balance. So, they go back to their shorter length driver, maybe hit a few
more fairways and don't score any better than they did with the long driver.
That's my 10 years of observations on the subject.
Bernie
Write to: [EMAIL P
At 05:21 PM 10/12/2005, Lloyd Hackman wrote:
Yes, but you would give up that distance. The club head velocity is a
function of Radius squared...
The clubhead velocity is a proportional to the radius, NOT SQUARED,
assuming you can make an equally good swing with the longer club. A lot of
peopl
Date: 10/12/2005 4:34:08 PM
> Subject: RE: ShopTalk: Wishon Short Driver Article
>
> Lloyd,
>
> I think Tom's point is that even with perfectly matched shafts, the
shorter
> driver is easier to hit on-center than the longer driver. This is PURELY
a
> function of length. Lo
x. Absolute crap.
TFlan
- Original Message - From: "Tom Wishon" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To:
Sent: Wednesday, October 12, 2005 11:37 AM
Subject: RE: ShopTalk: Wishon Short Driver Article
LLHack:
Fine Lloyd - you just keep on ignoring the simple fact that longer
length does not match w
, he would automatically start out questioning if it was the right shaft or not.
llhack
- Original Message -
From: Jeremy Ingle
To: ShopTalk@mail.msen.com
Sent: 10/12/2005 4:33:59 PM
Subject: Re: ShopTalk: Wishon Short Driver Article
is 5 cpm really that significant or is it
al Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Lloyd Hackman
Sent: Wednesday, October 12, 2005 3:44 PM
To: ShopTalk@mail.msen.com
Subject: RE: ShopTalk: Wishon Short Driver Article
Tom
Why should I do it with length when selecting the proper frequency shaft
provides t
: 10/12/2005 4:04:20 PM
> Subject: Re: ShopTalk: Wishon Short Driver Article
>
> Hey Tomas'
>
> Don't get into a pissing match with this guy. It's pointless. I recently
> rebuilt a set of clubs that were assembled based upon the FitChip. Freq's
> were all
d said that he had played 18 holes
that day and never missed a fairway!!!
llhack
[Original Message]
From: Tom Wishon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To:
Date: 10/12/2005 2:55:47 PM
Subject: RE: ShopTalk: Wishon Short Driver Article
LLHack:
Fine Lloyd - you just keep on ignoring the simp
Message -
From: "Tom Wishon" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To:
Sent: Wednesday, October 12, 2005 11:37 AM
Subject: RE: ShopTalk: Wishon Short Driver Article
LLHack:
Fine Lloyd - you just keep on ignoring the simple fact that longer
length does not match well with golfer athletic ability
ssage]
> From: Tom Wishon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To:
> Date: 10/12/2005 2:55:47 PM
> Subject: RE: ShopTalk: Wishon Short Driver Article
>
> LLHack:
>
> Fine Lloyd - you just keep on ignoring the simple fact that longer
> length does not match well with golfer athle
r 12, 2005 10:44 AM
To: ShopTalk@mail.msen.com
Subject: RE: ShopTalk: Wishon Short Driver Article
I am sorry but the Wishon article starts right off with the wrong
premise.
He throws in the premise that the shorter the club the better the
accuracy.
He ignores the fact that the real parameter for a
on 12/10/05 4:02 PM, Alan Brooks at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Hi John,
>
> I MOI match my woods to my irons and this results in a driver length of
> around 43.5 inches for a 420-cc driver. There is no question that I hit
> the shorter driver better. I also have a 'high launch' 13* driver with
5 10:01:47 AM
> Subject: ShopTalk: Wishon Short Driver Article
>
> Found this great article from pga.com that Tom wrote on playing
> shorter drivers.
> http://www.pga.com/improve/tips/equipment/improve_wishon080304.cfm
>
> What kind of experience have you guys have building
Scott Bershing wrote:
I built a Wishon 715 @44.5" for a guy that is 5'-10" at the most
this fall. He really hit it well, very consistent & straight. He
ended up selling it as he didn't hit it any longer than his TM
580. The thing he didn't notice was that he was in the fairway a
lot more,
Hi John,
I MOI match my woods to my irons and this results in a driver length of
around 43.5 inches for a 420-cc driver. There is no question that I hit
the shorter driver better. I also have a 'high launch' 13* driver with the
head hosel weighted to 210-g (think fat three wood) that I often
My personal drivers always seem to settle in at the 44.5" mark, as I just
hit them better than anything longer. Even @44.75", I find myself choking
down a touch. The problem is in convincing folks that they should probably
be hitting a shorter club. I built a Wishon 715 @44.5" for a guy that
John
My drivers rarely reach the 45 inch mark as my testing has
shown that shorter heavier drivers have produced more consistent results with
impact testing to validate the performance results seen on the launch monitor
numbers.
Charlie B
Found this great article from pga.com that Tom wrote on playing
shorter drivers.
http://www.pga.com/improve/tips/equipment/improve_wishon080304.cfm
What kind of experience have you guys have building 43-44" drivers?
--
John Muir
shoptalk
http://clubmaker-online.com
http://gripscience.com
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