Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
I reverted to KDE. I have 4.8.5 from Ubuntu 12.10 LTS. It is stable and fast now, and works fine with or without desktop effects (while Unity 2D is a disaster!). I know it was always more been complex, but now it's also very intuitive and straight-forward at a basic level. Check-out the option now for taskbar icons (like W7 or Unity). You can also customize the task switcher for best 2D appearance. On Sun, Nov 11, 2012 at 5:11 PM, Paul Tansom p...@aptanet.com wrote: ** john lewis zen57...@zen.co.uk [2012-11-09 10:27]: On Thu, 08 Nov 2012 22:37:24 + Gordon Scott gor...@gscott.co.uk wrote: So now, for the moment at least, we've both reverted to Gnome. Personally I'll likely now switch to an fvwm set-up, which I always preferred, only having changed to Gnome to 'go with the flow'. I am trying Enlightenment (e18) on my laptop, an ancient Compaq Evo N160 and it works quite well. It is easily configurable and I feel quite at home with it as left-button clicking on the desktop pops up the menu, a bit like windowmaker did. I have added various apps to the single 'Shelf' which sits at bottom of screen and have set it up with 6 'desktops' so can run each app in its own workspace. Just as I like it ;-) Worth a try ** end quote [john lewis] That takes me back a bit, I used Enlightenment back in 2000/1 (E16 iirc). Initially it was under Gnome, but after a while I dropped the overhead of Gnome as I realised I wasn't making use of anything it provided and really didn't miss it - I liked the middle click menu and still sometimes check for it! With the release of 12.10 I've abandoned Unity on my netbook. I've stuck with it since the start, but the performance on my netbook is too poor - I can see the four stages of shade when a menu comes up with a pause in between and a long pause before they start!! I am now back to XFCE which I left behind when I switched to Ubuntu in the first place - largely to go with the flow. I suspect my desktop is likely to be abandoning Unity too, although I've not tried 12.10 on it yet. Unity really doesn't do dual monitors well and bugs seem to come and go with each update - for a while I lost dual screens altogether (which only worked in the first place with a manual fix). The bug I've reported with the mouse jumping to the wrong side of the screen when you switch screens still hasn't been fixed, and has in fact got worse as I used to be able to avoid it by not hiding the dash. It also now doesn't drag and drop properly, when I drag an icon the mouse shows on the correct screen and the icon shows one screen left meaning it is impossible to drag files around in Nautilus for example. This may be related to my graphics driver perhaps, but the bug report has people with nVidia as well as my AMD cards suffering. I've not upgraded yet, partly because I want to do a clean install, and partly because the upgrade tells me my hardware may not be fully supported and I just don't want the hassle at the moment - I fear the worst as 2D has been abandoned (or merged) and my cards fail to run in 3D always defaulting back to 2D in spite of being plenty powerful enough to cope if the software supported them. -- Paul Tansom | Aptanet Ltd. | http://www.aptanet.com/ | 023 9238 0001 == Registered in England | Company No: 4905028 | Registered Office: Crawford House, Hambledon Road, Denmead, Waterlooville, Hants, PO7 6NU -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk -- -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On 04/12/12 16:38, Mihai Badea wrote: I reverted to KDE. I have 4.8.5 from Ubuntu 12.10 LTS. Me, I've gone all Lubuntu 12.10 and am mightily relieved, having tried the Unity thing for several months and never really felt comfortable with it. I considered Xubuntu as I'd used it previously, but felt like a bit of a change (although evidently not too much of one!) and so plumped for Lubuntu in the end. Sean -- music, film, comics, books, rants and drivel: www.funkygibbins.me.uk -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
** john lewis zen57...@zen.co.uk [2012-11-09 10:27]: On Thu, 08 Nov 2012 22:37:24 + Gordon Scott gor...@gscott.co.uk wrote: So now, for the moment at least, we've both reverted to Gnome. Personally I'll likely now switch to an fvwm set-up, which I always preferred, only having changed to Gnome to 'go with the flow'. I am trying Enlightenment (e18) on my laptop, an ancient Compaq Evo N160 and it works quite well. It is easily configurable and I feel quite at home with it as left-button clicking on the desktop pops up the menu, a bit like windowmaker did. I have added various apps to the single 'Shelf' which sits at bottom of screen and have set it up with 6 'desktops' so can run each app in its own workspace. Just as I like it ;-) Worth a try ** end quote [john lewis] That takes me back a bit, I used Enlightenment back in 2000/1 (E16 iirc). Initially it was under Gnome, but after a while I dropped the overhead of Gnome as I realised I wasn't making use of anything it provided and really didn't miss it - I liked the middle click menu and still sometimes check for it! With the release of 12.10 I've abandoned Unity on my netbook. I've stuck with it since the start, but the performance on my netbook is too poor - I can see the four stages of shade when a menu comes up with a pause in between and a long pause before they start!! I am now back to XFCE which I left behind when I switched to Ubuntu in the first place - largely to go with the flow. I suspect my desktop is likely to be abandoning Unity too, although I've not tried 12.10 on it yet. Unity really doesn't do dual monitors well and bugs seem to come and go with each update - for a while I lost dual screens altogether (which only worked in the first place with a manual fix). The bug I've reported with the mouse jumping to the wrong side of the screen when you switch screens still hasn't been fixed, and has in fact got worse as I used to be able to avoid it by not hiding the dash. It also now doesn't drag and drop properly, when I drag an icon the mouse shows on the correct screen and the icon shows one screen left meaning it is impossible to drag files around in Nautilus for example. This may be related to my graphics driver perhaps, but the bug report has people with nVidia as well as my AMD cards suffering. I've not upgraded yet, partly because I want to do a clean install, and partly because the upgrade tells me my hardware may not be fully supported and I just don't want the hassle at the moment - I fear the worst as 2D has been abandoned (or merged) and my cards fail to run in 3D always defaulting back to 2D in spite of being plenty powerful enough to cope if the software supported them. -- Paul Tansom | Aptanet Ltd. | http://www.aptanet.com/ | 023 9238 0001 == Registered in England | Company No: 4905028 | Registered Office: Crawford House, Hambledon Road, Denmead, Waterlooville, Hants, PO7 6NU -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
I am starting to dislike Unity also now. It is not configurable enough. For example, if you don't like the hidden menus, there should be a setting to show them. Similar to the auto hide option on GNOME 2. It should be easier to switch off features, like the dash amazon, but on a global basis, so that when I add a new user, I don't have to go in and switch off feature xyz again. If all I want is gedit, I don't want it asking Amazon about it. On 9 November 2012 07:27, Benjie Gillam ben...@jemjie.com wrote: A few more data points: My parents and uncle both find it confusing still after using it for a year. The invisible menus are the biggest issue for them. My wife who is a programmer (so a little more tech savvy ;) dislikes it and finds the window grouping to be annoying/frustrating and the tray indicators to be buggy - especially with LibreOffice. I don't find it confusing but I prefer GNOME 2 considerably and dislike the left hand tray (on widescreen you have to move your mouse further too!). I also find it's considerably slows me down, and the extra space produced doesn't seem necessary on my 2560x1440 monitor. I now use Mac primarily, despite having been using Linux almost exclusively since 2000 (when I was 14). I've not heard anyone IRL singing it's praises, unlike GNOME 2. -- Sent from my iPhone, so please forgive spelling/brevity. www.BenjieGillam.com Founder: FitFu.com, GymFu.com Brain Bakery Ltd. and GymFu Ltd have registered address: 7 Duck Island Lane BH24 3AA. Registered in England and Wales, Company Numbers: 5849251 and 7022440 respectively On 8 Nov 2012, at 22:37, Gordon Scott gor...@gscott.co.uk wrote: It isn't just me. I've been trying to warm to Unity and had pretty much given up. I'd set-up my wife's account in Unity to see how a less computer-savvy person gets on with the interface. She does just mail, web, and very occasional WP, so nothing special. Today she rebelled and declared it 'stupid'. For her also, menus on the screen top-bar were so counter-intuitive that she thought they'd been removed. So now, for the moment at least, we've both reverted to Gnome. Personally I'll likely now switch to an fvwm set-up, which I always preferred, only having changed to Gnome to 'go with the flow'. Sorry Alan, but we both strongly dislike Unity. Gordon. -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk -- -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk -- -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On 09/11/12 07:27, Benjie Gillam wrote: A few more data points: My parents and uncle both find it confusing still after using it for a year. The invisible menus are the biggest issue for them. My wife who is a programmer (so a little more tech savvy ;) dislikes it and finds the window grouping to be annoying/frustrating and the tray indicators to be buggy - especially with LibreOffice. I don't find it confusing but I prefer GNOME 2 considerably and dislike the left hand tray (on widescreen you have to move your mouse further too!). I also find it's considerably slows me down, and the extra space produced doesn't seem necessary on my 2560x1440 monitor. I now use Mac primarily, despite having been using Linux almost exclusively since 2000 (when I was 14). I've not heard anyone IRL singing it's praises, unlike GNOME 2. -- Sent from my iPhone, so please forgive spelling/brevity. www.BenjieGillam.com Founder: FitFu.com, GymFu.com Brain Bakery Ltd. and GymFu Ltd have registered address: 7 Duck Island Lane BH24 3AA. Registered in England and Wales, Company Numbers: 5849251 and 7022440 respectively On 8 Nov 2012, at 22:37, Gordon Scott gor...@gscott.co.uk wrote: It isn't just me. I've been trying to warm to Unity and had pretty much given up. I'd set-up my wife's account in Unity to see how a less computer-savvy person gets on with the interface. She does just mail, web, and very occasional WP, so nothing special. Today she rebelled and declared it 'stupid'. For her also, menus on the screen top-bar were so counter-intuitive that she thought they'd been removed. So now, for the moment at least, we've both reverted to Gnome. Personally I'll likely now switch to an fvwm set-up, which I always preferred, only having changed to Gnome to 'go with the flow'. Sorry Alan, but we both strongly dislike Unity. Gordon. -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk -- In contrast, my wife says she can't see any difference. She uses Firefox, Thunderbird and LibreOffice and has been busy buying Christmas presents on-line. Three computers here are using Ubuntu 12.10. Granddaughter doing homework uses Jean's laptop or my PC in preference to her own Sony Vaio (Windows 7) which is 'too slow'. Unity suits me. My only beef is that sometimes the 'do it' button on web-pages is off the bottom of the screen because the top bar pushes it all down: the 'full size' icon can disappear if the re-size icon on the top bar is deployed. I like the 'Software Centre' and the (newly re-labelled) 'Ubuntu' key to find stuff on my computer. Only other distro I've properly tried was Mint12 on my PC and I didn't get on with that. (I'm going to try RISC on my Pi when I have some time.) -- Tony Wood (from Linux netbook) -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On Thu, 08 Nov 2012 22:37:24 + Gordon Scott gor...@gscott.co.uk wrote: So now, for the moment at least, we've both reverted to Gnome. Personally I'll likely now switch to an fvwm set-up, which I always preferred, only having changed to Gnome to 'go with the flow'. I am trying Enlightenment (e18) on my laptop, an ancient Compaq Evo N160 and it works quite well. It is easily configurable and I feel quite at home with it as left-button clicking on the desktop pops up the menu, a bit like windowmaker did. I have added various apps to the single 'Shelf' which sits at bottom of screen and have set it up with 6 'desktops' so can run each app in its own workspace. Just as I like it ;-) Worth a try -- John Lewis Debian the GeneWeb genealogical data server -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On 08/11/12 22:37, Gordon Scott wrote: For her also, menus on the screen top-bar were so counter-intuitive that she thought they'd been removed. Are you aware of the HUD? You press alt then search the menu rather than peck through them with the mouse? Sorry Alan, but we both strongly dislike Unity. :) Not a problem for me. Cheers, -- Alan Pope Engineering Manager Canonical - Product Strategy +44 (0) 7973 620 164 alan.p...@canonical.com http://ubuntu.com/ -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On Fri, 2012-11-09 at 11:48 +, Alan Pope wrote: On 08/11/12 22:37, Gordon Scott wrote: For her also, menus on the screen top-bar were so counter-intuitive that she thought they'd been removed. Are you aware of the HUD? You press alt then search the menu rather than peck through them with the mouse? I was, but as I reported a while back, it kept opening menu bars for the wrong application, possibly related to my focus-follows-mouse setup. Probably my wife was not and she always uses the mouse anyway. She does mouse and typing .. all special keys are alien. I do agree with and generally prefer keyboard access than mouse (I hate mice as they cause so much stress on and bruising of the wrist, when used a lot). My personal editor of choice is vi/vim for the no-mouse reason amongst others (other people's opinions will differ, of course!). One of the difficulties with menus is that they differ so much between applications and across platforms, that remembering more than a modest number of short-cuts is quite impossible, so we become conditioned to going for the mouse/trackball/whatever. I've been being conditioned since DR-GEM, so Pavlov's dog looks like an rank amateur. :-) Gordon. -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On 9 November 2012 11:48, Alan Pope alan.p...@canonical.com wrote: Are you aware of the HUD? You press alt then search the menu rather than peck through them with the mouse? What, not use a mouseimpossible!! ;-) On another note, it would be useful if the HUD contained the short cut. E.g. Press ALT-F and it shows Save page as has a shortcut of CTRL-S It would be nice if ALT, savwould display CTRL-S next to the save page as HUD item. -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On 09/11/12 12:14, Gordon Scott wrote: On Fri, 2012-11-09 at 11:48 +, Alan Pope wrote: On 08/11/12 22:37, Gordon Scott wrote: For her also, menus on the screen top-bar were so counter-intuitive that she thought they'd been removed. Are you aware of the HUD? You press alt then search the menu rather than peck through them with the mouse? I was, but as I reported a while back, it kept opening menu bars for the wrong application, possibly related to my focus-follows-mouse setup. I miss focus follows mouse, but not so much that I'd enable it on Unity :) I do agree with and generally prefer keyboard access than mouse (I hate mice as they cause so much stress on and bruising of the wrist, when used a lot). My personal editor of choice is vi/vim for the no-mouse reason amongst others (other people's opinions will differ, of course!). I have switched to a Lenovo Thinkpad keyboard with built in touchpoint (nipple thing). So my hands never stray from the keyboard :) I am tempted to get another one for my desktop PC and just use a 'real' mouse when playing the odd game. One of the difficulties with menus is that they differ so much between applications and across platforms, that remembering more than a modest number of short-cuts is quite impossible, so we become conditioned to going for the mouse/trackball/whatever. I've been being conditioned since DR-GEM, so Pavlov's dog looks like an rank amateur. :-) Since having Unity+HUD I have been conditioning myself to bring up the HUD and search for stuff in menus. It's taken a while and I still sometimes revert back, but it's worthwhile in the end. Cheers -- Alan Pope Engineering Manager Canonical - Product Strategy +44 (0) 7973 620 164 alan.p...@canonical.com http://ubuntu.com/ -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On 09/11/12 12:19, James Courtier-Dutton wrote: On 9 November 2012 11:48, Alan Pope alan.p...@canonical.com wrote: Are you aware of the HUD? You press alt then search the menu rather than peck through them with the mouse? What, not use a mouseimpossible!! ;-) See my last mail (I use a Lenovo keyboard now). On another note, it would be useful if the HUD contained the short cut. E.g. Press ALT-F and it shows Save page as has a shortcut of CTRL-S It would be nice if ALT, savwould display CTRL-S next to the save page as HUD item. HUD should display keyboard shortcuts for menu entries if available https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/921546 Great minds.. Cheers, -- Alan Pope Engineering Manager Canonical - Product Strategy +44 (0) 7973 620 164 alan.p...@canonical.com http://ubuntu.com/ -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On Fri, 2012-11-09 at 13:04 +, Alan Pope wrote: I miss focus follows mouse, but not so much that I'd enable it on Unity :) I use it fairly extensively and hate being without it .. on Windows, for example. I have switched to a Lenovo Thinkpad keyboard with built in touchpoint (nipple thing). So my hands never stray from the keyboard :) I am tempted to get another one for my desktop PC and just use a 'real' mouse when playing the odd game. Those touchpoint things seem quite good for normal mouse work, any idea if they're really workable for heavier graphics stuff, specifically PCB-CAD, which is the time I have to use it most, though some large cut-and-paste tasks can be as bad. (I'm _not_ doing freehand drawing.) I hadn't realised one could buy just the keyboard, I'd only noticed them on laptops and a laptop is totally unworkable in my normal context. Does that long 'nose' where a touchpad would normally be give any usability issues? One of the difficulties with menus is that they differ so much between applications and across platforms, that remembering more than a modest number of short-cuts is quite impossible, so we become conditioned to going for the mouse/trackball/whatever. I've been being conditioned since DR-GEM, so Pavlov's dog looks like an rank amateur. :-) Since having Unity+HUD I have been conditioning myself to bring up the HUD and search for stuff in menus. It's taken a while and I still sometimes revert back, but it's worthwhile in the end. Unfortunately I have to work in both Linux and Windows (correction, I choose to work in Linux, unfortunately I also have to work in Windows), and I haven't dared update the real workstation to 11.04 due to the presence of Unity and other changes. I've updated only the PC in the lounge, so 98% of the time the HUD isn't available. In the remaining 2%, I just don't adapt enough and, as you're aware, get seriously frustrated. It's the automatic stuff that gets you. Like when driving a hire car on the continent .. I'm happy enough on the right-hand side of the road, fine with the funny mirror locations, OK with priortie a droit, fine with back-to-front roundabouts and so on. But I keep hitting my hand on the door whenever I try to change gear. Gordon. -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
Unity is awful, Gnome 2 or Mate is what I use. Sent from my iPhone On 8 Nov 2012, at 22:38, Gordon Scott gor...@gscott.co.uk wrote: It isn't just me. I've been trying to warm to Unity and had pretty much given up. I'd set-up my wife's account in Unity to see how a less computer-savvy person gets on with the interface. She does just mail, web, and very occasional WP, so nothing special. Today she rebelled and declared it 'stupid'. For her also, menus on the screen top-bar were so counter-intuitive that she thought they'd been removed. So now, for the moment at least, we've both reverted to Gnome. Personally I'll likely now switch to an fvwm set-up, which I always preferred, only having changed to Gnome to 'go with the flow'. Sorry Alan, but we both strongly dislike Unity. Gordon. -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk -- -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On 09/11/12 14:30, Gordon Scott wrote: I hadn't realised one could buy just the keyboard, I'd only noticed them on laptops and a laptop is totally unworkable in my normal context. I hadn't realised until a co-worker with the exact same laptop told me about them. They're expensive for what they are, but I wouldn't be without mine now. Does that long 'nose' where a touchpad would normally be give any usability issues? It's a wrist-rest really. I prefer it to having a touchpad. I turn touchpads off usually, unless I'm on a Mac running OSX where their touchpad is better than all other touchpads in the world, ever. [FACT] :) But I keep hitting my hand on the door whenever I try to change gear. Hah! I do that driving in the US too! Cheers, -- Alan Pope Engineering Manager Canonical - Product Strategy +44 (0) 7973 620 164 alan.p...@canonical.com http://ubuntu.com/ -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On Friday 09 Nov 2012 14:30:41 Gordon Scott wrote: Those touchpoint things seem quite good for normal mouse work, any idea if they're really workable for heavier graphics stuff, specifically PCB-CAD, which is the time I have to use it most, though some large cut-and-paste tasks can be as bad. (I'm _not_ doing freehand drawing.) I do quite a bit of CAD now and again (usually part free-hand i.e. not using grid or object snapping), and I'm not aware of anything that beats the mouse for precision and speed. I have a touchpad on the laptop, and while it's a good one, it just doesn't compare. I've never had any luck with the touchpoints either. CAD packages are unusually mouse-heavy, but also require typing a fair few commands, so keeping the keyboard area clear is important. Tim B. -- Hampshire Linux User Group Chairman -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On Fri, 2012-11-09 at 16:53 +, Alan Pope wrote: On 09/11/12 14:30, Gordon Scott wrote: But I keep hitting my hand on the door whenever I try to change gear. Hah! I do that driving in the US too! You have to start worrying about that in the US .. They're all automatics over there, aren't they? :-) Generally I have more trouble with the clutch :-D G. -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On Fri, 2012-11-09 at 18:20 +, Tim Brocklehurst wrote: On Friday 09 Nov 2012 14:30:41 Gordon Scott wrote: Those touchpoint things seem quite good for normal mouse work, any idea if they're really workable for heavier graphics stuff, specifically PCB-CAD, which is the time I have to use it most, though some large cut-and-paste tasks can be as bad. (I'm _not_ doing freehand drawing.) I do quite a bit of CAD now and again (usually part free-hand i.e. not using grid or object snapping), and I'm not aware of anything that beats the mouse for precision and speed. I have both a mouse and a trackball and swap over when the pain get too much. At least the strains and bruises happen somewhere slightly different. But cf my comments elsewhere about gears and clutches :-) A similar problem, except a rear-end shunt is less likely. I have a touchpad on the laptop, and while it's a good one, it just doesn't compare. I've never had any luck with the touchpoints either. Yes, that's as I suspected. Good for occasional moves around, but probably slow as you're relying on pressure/acceleration rather than direct movement. I keep meaning to try a pen+tablet arrangement, but haven't yet done so. Memo to self.. CAD packages are unusually mouse-heavy, but also require typing a fair few commands, so keeping the keyboard area clear is important. Indeed. Gordon. -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On 29 September 2012 17:15, Andy Smith a...@strugglers.net wrote: On Sat, Sep 29, 2012 at 08:20:56AM +0100, john lewis wrote: I am biased towards Debian as you all know and make no apologies for promoting the Debian Way Me also ! :) A large majority of HantsLUG members were Debian users a few years back but for some reason chose to go with the new kid on the block. Thats sad , understand the newbies running towards the new kid and even newer kid (mint) , why would old LUG users ditch Debian? Is it because of the drivers and easy installation especially when your hardware wouldnt compulsorily not work with free drivers . And they are wrong and you will keep on about it until they change back? :) I will :D Luckily since Debian and other distributions do exist, users still have plenty of choice and the situation isn't really comparable to Apple. It is in fact very easy to run Linux and all applications that are made for Linux without using Unity or Ubuntu. I especially like Linux Mint Debian edition based on testing of debian with its bells and whistles , after all the bells and whistles are wjhat which attracted people in first place imho . I should also thank linuxmint project for caring about the user and his needs by bringing out forks of gnome2 and gnome3 aka mate and cinnamon , people who missed gnome 2 are so good in number that there are fedora packages for mate :D For my main desktop I always use debian but I carry the LMDE USB key so that I can pop in and do my tasks without installing a single package . Regards, Pavithran -- pavithran sakamuri http://look-pavi.blogspot.com -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
It isn't just me. I've been trying to warm to Unity and had pretty much given up. I'd set-up my wife's account in Unity to see how a less computer-savvy person gets on with the interface. She does just mail, web, and very occasional WP, so nothing special. Today she rebelled and declared it 'stupid'. For her also, menus on the screen top-bar were so counter-intuitive that she thought they'd been removed. So now, for the moment at least, we've both reverted to Gnome. Personally I'll likely now switch to an fvwm set-up, which I always preferred, only having changed to Gnome to 'go with the flow'. Sorry Alan, but we both strongly dislike Unity. Gordon. -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
A few more data points: My parents and uncle both find it confusing still after using it for a year. The invisible menus are the biggest issue for them. My wife who is a programmer (so a little more tech savvy ;) dislikes it and finds the window grouping to be annoying/frustrating and the tray indicators to be buggy - especially with LibreOffice. I don't find it confusing but I prefer GNOME 2 considerably and dislike the left hand tray (on widescreen you have to move your mouse further too!). I also find it's considerably slows me down, and the extra space produced doesn't seem necessary on my 2560x1440 monitor. I now use Mac primarily, despite having been using Linux almost exclusively since 2000 (when I was 14). I've not heard anyone IRL singing it's praises, unlike GNOME 2. -- Sent from my iPhone, so please forgive spelling/brevity. www.BenjieGillam.com Founder: FitFu.com, GymFu.com Brain Bakery Ltd. and GymFu Ltd have registered address: 7 Duck Island Lane BH24 3AA. Registered in England and Wales, Company Numbers: 5849251 and 7022440 respectively On 8 Nov 2012, at 22:37, Gordon Scott gor...@gscott.co.uk wrote: It isn't just me. I've been trying to warm to Unity and had pretty much given up. I'd set-up my wife's account in Unity to see how a less computer-savvy person gets on with the interface. She does just mail, web, and very occasional WP, so nothing special. Today she rebelled and declared it 'stupid'. For her also, menus on the screen top-bar were so counter-intuitive that she thought they'd been removed. So now, for the moment at least, we've both reverted to Gnome. Personally I'll likely now switch to an fvwm set-up, which I always preferred, only having changed to Gnome to 'go with the flow'. Sorry Alan, but we both strongly dislike Unity. Gordon. -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk -- -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On 07/10/12 16:45, Michael Pavling wrote: In Unity, I open the home folder, click file | connect to server, then enter my authentication details. Once done, and the share (or whatever sub-folder I want to have quick access to) is shown, I press crtl-d to bookmark it, and then next time I can skip the whole connect to server stage and go straight to it in my bookmarks. Kindof like a much more sensible map network drive approach. Yup, that works for me. You can right-click the mounted drive and make the bookmark that way, too. Gordon. -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity .. some more progress
I've made some progress on the following, though it's a bit patchy... On 27/09/12 19:27, Gordon Scott wrote: How can I get stuff grouped in a context-related way? In the recent past, as an example, I have a menu from the toolbar with top-level headings like Graphics, Programming and so on. Right now I find nothing like that on Unity, but I feel sure there must be a way .. dedicated lens or something? How to tidy the launcher? I've minimized the of icons on the launcher so I can see a fair percentage of them, but I'd like to remove most of the clutter. It's too full even before I open any applications. That's compounded somewhat, also, by the tooltip hovers vanishing after scanning just a couple of icons, and at present many icons are unfamiliar. There are (Gnome I think) .desktop files in /usr/share/applications and ~/.local/share/applications and I've devised a few that allow something like what I need, though I have some reservations. For the moment, I have one called DAW.desktop with some appropriate stuff in it, that runs a bash script, which changes to the working directory and starts related applications. In this case just to ~/Documents and audacity to demonstrate the principle. I have another called Programming.desktop that opens a directory ~/Programming in which I can presumably set up a bunch of links or scripts to location-switch and start applications as appropriate. I guess they too can be done as .desktop files. I guess this will mean that rather than just following a menu and opening the workspace I want, I'll have to open he directory, run the workspace, then close the directory again, which is clumsy but workable. Disappearing hovers seem not to happen when the launcher is still 2D. When it goes 3D, the problems start. Hopefully I can manage that by keeping the launcher tidy as per my question. There seems to be another oddity with the launcher in that if I run applications from the command-line, rather than from the Launcher, I get a second icon on the launcher for that application, which again means the launcher clutters very quickly. The apparently handy feature to show previews of open applications via Alt-tab, or double-click a Launcher Item, or Special-W only really seems works sensibly for low use desktops. Once there are a few dozen applications open, it becomes hard to tell one from another, particularly if they're mostly editor windows or nautilus windows or similar (I try to have one nautilus window with many tabs to help reduce clutter). A dozen little previews showing illegible program snippets is not wholly helpful. Hopefully sometime this can have the filename in the hover. OK, granted that doesn't help much if several files are all called main.c, but it's a start. Kind regards, Gordon. -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
My struggle with Unity continues :-/ Can anyone tell me how to get a samba drive on my server mounted on my new PC with Unity, such that I can write to it and so it mounts automatically? Searches in the Dash for Samba, smb, map, mount, drive, window, even nfs all come up with usually nothing, occasionally nothing useful. I can browse and mount via the home folder, but the mount is always not-writeable and it always disappears at logout or shutdown. I can do it from Gnome-fallback, so the tools are there. I think I've asked before, but can't find a useful answer .. is it feasible to get the menus from the top-bat back onto the individual windows? Maybe when I get to the point of doing real work I'll adapt to the Alt-Menu operation, but presently that seems very unreliable and whilst I'm trying to set things up, I'm mostly using the mouse. Sometimes it's a long, long, way from window to the far top-left and back. How can I get to some different themes? The default four is all I can presently find and I really want something that shows better where the focus is, and ideally that puts the minimise/normal/maximise/exit button row top right, rather than top-left. Again I search on Dash and Ubuntu Software Centre, but can find nothing appropriate. Thanks, Gordon. -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On 7 October 2012 16:16, Gordon Scott gor...@gscott.co.uk wrote: My struggle with Unity continues :-/ Can anyone tell me how to get a samba drive on my server mounted on my new PC with Unity, such that I can write to it and so it mounts automatically? Searches in the Dash for Samba, smb, map, mount, drive, window, even nfs all come up with usually nothing, occasionally nothing useful. I don't know that this is a Unity question, as I've found this a pain in the last half-dozen releases of Ubuntu, and in Mint et al... but... In Unity, I open the home folder, click file | connect to server, then enter my authentication details. Once done, and the share (or whatever sub-folder I want to have quick access to) is shown, I press crtl-d to bookmark it, and then next time I can skip the whole connect to server stage and go straight to it in my bookmarks. Kindof like a much more sensible map network drive approach. -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On 07/10/12 16:16, Gordon Scott wrote: My struggle with Unity continues :-/ This is not really a Unity issue. Can anyone tell me how to get a samba drive on my server mounted on my new PC with Unity, such that I can write to it and so it mounts automatically? Searches in the Dash for Samba, smb, map, mount, drive, window, even nfs all come up with usually nothing, occasionally nothing useful. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MountWindowsSharesPermanently Cheers, -- Alan Pope Engineering Manager Canonical - Product Strategy +44 (0) 7973 620 164 alan.p...@canonical.com http://ubuntu.com/ -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On 07/10/2012 15:47, Alan Pope wrote: On 07/10/12 16:16, Gordon Scott wrote: My struggle with Unity continues :-/ This is not really a Unity issue. Um, OK, though as I say, it's there and working on gnome-fallback. Michael's method of using the File menu appears to pop up the tool that Gnome uses, so I'll likely try that. To me It seems telling that I'm not sure I'd even realised there _were_ menus as they're hidden until I hover on that screen-top bar. That still seems horribly counter-intuitive to me. Why move it away from where they're used, why hide them until hover? My eyes are much faster then waving a mouse over the top-bar to see if there's something helpful there. Alt-Menus again may be better when they work properly with focus-follows-mouse. Can anyone tell me how to get a samba drive on my server mounted on my new PC with Unity, such that I can write to it and so it mounts automatically? Searches in the Dash for Samba, smb, map, mount, drive, window, even nfs all come up with usually nothing, occasionally nothing useful. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MountWindowsSharesPermanently Cheers, Oh, right, just like we used to do it a decade or two ago. I'd completely forgotten and become used to the newer way. I'm comfortable with modifying fstab, if somewhat surprised. How is a newbie to Linux now recommended to find that out? I guess I'll search around there for theme and top-bar solutions? Kind regards, Gordon. -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity - Dash - context lists
On 01/10/2012 21:36, Alan Pope wrote: On 01/10/12 21:32, Gordon Scott wrote: Can anyone say if 'upgrading' from 10.04 to 12.04 would result in a default switch to Unity? It will. Frankly that is alarming, but also as I suspected, and precisely why I have not upgraded. Have you any idea how disruptive that change would be if it were unexpected? Do you have any idea how badly a change like that can be received? I have already spent many hours trying to work out how to make Unity effective for me as my _work_ environment. Unity is already costing me time, and I don't yet even have it on my work machine. Are there any nasty surprises in the upgrade from 10.04LTS server to 12.04LTS server, without the GUI? Hopefully with absolutely no bling at least that one should be relatively OK, though any upgrade is always a risk and challenge. If it does, is it reasonably easy to get back to the previous desktop? GNOME 2 is dead. If you want to get something looking like your old desktop then there's GNOME Fallback mode (which as I understand will also soon be dead), XFCE or a myriad of other desktop environments. I'm aware of Gnome Fallback, though I haven't tried it. Unfortunately as my 10.04LTS laptop just smoked, I don't have a machine on which to try that out for real. Does the upgrade process inform us of fallback, or better still offer it as an option? Does it remain comparable to my present desktop, i.e., I don't waste hours or days betting back to something with which I can work. The reason I'm on Ubuntu LTS was because I understood that there would be steady upgrade process and I hoped that that would minimise many of the disruptive changes that have happened in the past .. stupid things like a new blingy CD writer that doesn't work properly superseding the old drab one that did. Change is very much a two-edged sword. It needs to be for the better, and hopefully Unity will eventually turn out that way, or die, but change almost always also causes disruption, particularly if it's not carefully controlled. At this moment, Unity feels a little like Ubuntu threw a grenade into the mix. Yes, I know it's been around a year or so, but I ditched it back then as too profound a change. I'm trying to prepare for what seems presently to be an inevitable change, but at the moment that's feeling a bit of a struggle. I'm still hoping I'll mellow. I like Ubuntu, it's always been relatively painless to work with in the past. Hopefully it will be again. Gordon. -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity - Dash - context lists
Hi Gordon, On 02/10/12 11:42, Gordon Scott wrote: On 01/10/2012 21:36, Alan Pope wrote: On 01/10/12 21:32, Gordon Scott wrote: Can anyone say if 'upgrading' from 10.04 to 12.04 would result in a default switch to Unity? It will. Frankly that is alarming, but also as I suspected, and precisely why I have not upgraded. What's alarming about upgrading a system and getting new stuff? It happens in all software distributions. OS/2 2.x - OS/2 Warp, Windows XP - Windows 7, Android 2.x - 3.x - 4.x, Linux Mint 11 - 12. Some more dramatic than others, granted. Have you any idea how disruptive that change would be if it were unexpected? How would be unexpected? When you click upgrade to go from 10.04 to 12.04 you are presented with release notes and a clear link to:- http://www.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/features Which goes out of its way to detail what's new and funky in the later release. Do you have any idea how badly a change like that can be received? I recommend this book:- http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/0091816971/ - Who Moved My Cheese: An Amazing Way to Deal with Change in Your Work and in Your Life I have already spent many hours trying to work out how to make Unity effective for me as my _work_ environment. Unity is already costing me time, and I don't yet even have it on my work machine. So don't use it. Use something else if it's that much of a bugbear for you. There's lots of different desktops in the repository. I'm sure one suits. Are there any nasty surprises in the upgrade from 10.04LTS server to 12.04LTS server, without the GUI? Not that I'm aware of. We generally don't go for nasty surprises in Ubuntu, either on the desktop or server. We tend to favour new features and updated software. Hopefully with absolutely no bling at least that one should be relatively OK, though any upgrade is always a risk and challenge. You say bling I say beauty. Let's call the whole thing off. Does the upgrade process inform us of fallback, or better still offer it as an option? No. However it's as easy as clicking this link once you've upgraded. apt://gnome-session-fallback Does it remain comparable to my present desktop, i.e., I don't waste hours or days betting back to something with which I can work. You want the world to stay the same, but upgrade nonetheless? Should we have all stayed on GNOME 1.x or perhaps CDE? :) The reason I'm on Ubuntu LTS was because I understood that there would be steady upgrade process and I hoped that that would minimise many of the disruptive changes that have happened in the past .. stupid things like a new blingy CD writer that doesn't work properly superseding the old drab one that did. That's a reasonable set of expectations. Nobody is forcing you to upgrade right now, are they? I mean, there may be software you need for your work which isn't available in 10.04, or there may be hardware which is only supported on a newer kernel? But if you're on 10.04 then you've got until April next year before you need to think about no more bug fixes and security updates on this release. Why not sit back and take stock of the changing world around you and make the step when you're ready? At this moment, Unity feels a little like Ubuntu threw a grenade into the mix. Yes, I know it's been around a year or so, but I ditched it back then as too profound a change. I'm trying to prepare for what seems presently to be an inevitable change, but at the moment that's feeling a bit of a struggle. I'm still hoping I'll mellow. I like Ubuntu, it's always been relatively painless to work with in the past. Hopefully it will be again. I run 12.04 on my main machine and will probably stick with it for some time to come. I am enjoying 12.04 much more than any of the previous releases I've used. Each to their own though. I hope you find a desktop that suits you. Cheers, -- Alan Pope Engineering Manager Canonical - Product Strategy +44 (0) 7973 620 164 alan.p...@canonical.com http://ubuntu.com/ -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity - Dash - context lists
Gordon, Popey probably won't thank me, but the answer may be gnome-session-fallback atop any Ubuntu/Unity, which will give you a Gnome-2-like desktop with all the other benefits of the 12.x releases (of which there are many. I've already gone to 12.10 on my two main machines - okay, the Beta is still a bit buggy in places, but so much better than 12.04, already. I *can* work in Unity, I know what it's trying to provide, mostly I choose not to use it; mainly because Unity seems to want to make me type more, whereas Gnome menus do 80% of the things I want within 2 clicks and there's the old Gnome search tool for files and ALT-f2 for everything else. Look on the bright side, Mark Spaceshuttle could have copied Windows 8 NOT-Metro, Modern-UI, Tiles-thing for a desktop instead! Overall I still think the Vancouver team book, Unity: Simplify Your Lifehttp://ubuntu-za.org/sites/default/files/unity-5-10-0-final-pdf.pdfis the best guide for the Unity doubter, and our Ubuntu and Unity Special Edition is available from the main *Full Circle*http://fullcirclemagazine.org/ubuntu-11-10-and-unity-special-edition/site. -- Rgds RC Robin Catling Full Circle Podcast On 2 October 2012 16:06, Alan Pope alan.p...@canonical.com wrote: Hi Gordon, On 02/10/12 11:42, Gordon Scott wrote: On 01/10/2012 21:36, Alan Pope wrote: On 01/10/12 21:32, Gordon Scott wrote: Can anyone say if 'upgrading' from 10.04 to 12.04 would result in a default switch to Unity? It will. Frankly that is alarming, but also as I suspected, and precisely why I have not upgraded. What's alarming about upgrading a system and getting new stuff? It happens in all software distributions. OS/2 2.x - OS/2 Warp, Windows XP - Windows 7, Android 2.x - 3.x - 4.x, Linux Mint 11 - 12. Some more dramatic than others, granted. Have you any idea how disruptive that change would be if it were unexpected? How would be unexpected? When you click upgrade to go from 10.04 to 12.04 you are presented with release notes and a clear link to:- http://www.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/**featureshttp://www.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/features Which goes out of its way to detail what's new and funky in the later release. Do you have any idea how badly a change like that can be received? I recommend this book:- http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/**product/0091816971/http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/0091816971/- Who Moved My Cheese: An Amazing Way to Deal with Change in Your Work and in Your Life I have already spent many hours trying to work out how to make Unity effective for me as my _work_ environment. Unity is already costing me time, and I don't yet even have it on my work machine. So don't use it. Use something else if it's that much of a bugbear for you. There's lots of different desktops in the repository. I'm sure one suits. Are there any nasty surprises in the upgrade from 10.04LTS server to 12.04LTS server, without the GUI? Not that I'm aware of. We generally don't go for nasty surprises in Ubuntu, either on the desktop or server. We tend to favour new features and updated software. Hopefully with absolutely no bling at least that one should be relatively OK, though any upgrade is always a risk and challenge. You say bling I say beauty. Let's call the whole thing off. Does the upgrade process inform us of fallback, or better still offer it as an option? No. However it's as easy as clicking this link once you've upgraded. apt://gnome-session-fallback Does it remain comparable to my present desktop, i.e., I don't waste hours or days betting back to something with which I can work. You want the world to stay the same, but upgrade nonetheless? Should we have all stayed on GNOME 1.x or perhaps CDE? :) The reason I'm on Ubuntu LTS was because I understood that there would be steady upgrade process and I hoped that that would minimise many of the disruptive changes that have happened in the past .. stupid things like a new blingy CD writer that doesn't work properly superseding the old drab one that did. That's a reasonable set of expectations. Nobody is forcing you to upgrade right now, are they? I mean, there may be software you need for your work which isn't available in 10.04, or there may be hardware which is only supported on a newer kernel? But if you're on 10.04 then you've got until April next year before you need to think about no more bug fixes and security updates on this release. Why not sit back and take stock of the changing world around you and make the step when you're ready? At this moment, Unity feels a little like Ubuntu threw a grenade into the mix. Yes, I know it's been around a year or so, but I ditched it back then as too profound a change. I'm trying to prepare for what seems presently to be an inevitable change, but at the moment that's feeling a bit of a struggle. I'm still hoping I'll mellow. I like Ubuntu, it's always been relatively painless to work with
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity - Dash - context lists
On Tuesday 02 October 2012 10:42:19 Gordon Scott wrote: On 01/10/2012 21:36, Alan Pope wrote: On 01/10/12 21:32, Gordon Scott wrote: Can anyone say if 'upgrading' from 10.04 to 12.04 would result in a default switch to Unity? It will. Frankly that is alarming, but also as I suspected, and precisely why I have not upgraded. The most obvious change from 11.04 to 12.04 was the font and the style of the login screen (which now seems to be running a Unity themed session manager rather than a KDE one). Other than that, KDE seems to be pretty much the same on both systems. I wasn't switched to Unity. -- Be seeing you,Games: http://www.glendale.org.uk/ Sam. Posts: http://www.google.com/profiles/samuel.penn -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity - Dash - context lists
On 02/10/12 16:06, Alan Pope wrote: On 02/10/12 11:42, Gordon Scott wrote: At this moment, Unity feels a little like Ubuntu threw a grenade into the mix. Yes, I know it's been around a year or so, but I ditched it back then as too profound a change. I'm trying to prepare for what seems presently to be an inevitable change, but at the moment that's feeling a bit of a struggle. I'm still hoping I'll mellow. I like Ubuntu, it's always been relatively painless to work with in the past. Hopefully it will be again. Interesting selective edit. You lost a bit. Change is something I deal with all the time. Every working day! I generally enjoy change provided it's manageable. But I also had a period a few years back when change was so rapid and profound that eventually we 'slammed on the brakes' and took stock. What we concluded was that we'd spent four months getting from a system where mostly everything worked to a system where very little worked because it had all been broken by the changes on the changes. We'd done four months very hard work and had simply gone backwards. Well, OK, I'm probably being over-sensitive at the moment. I'm feeling pretty stressed for a variety of reasons; I guess still here working now is one of those. As I said earlier, I'm trying to warm to Unity, but at present it's being a bit of a royal pain. Part of the reason I'm facing Unity right now is the smoked laptop I mentioned. That's forced a new install at very short notice whilst I'm under a heavy workload. I presume I could still have installed 10.04LTS, but the change will come and this is a chance to try get the new desktop in an arrangement where I feel I can work comfortable with it. The Alt- problem last night wound me up quite a long way. BTW, a big problem with animations is that they're so often in peripheral vision areas. If like me you wear varifocal glasses, you'll find that many of those animations are not just a big distraction, but because of the odd effects of the peripheral distortions can actually induce motion sickness. They're also, therefore, _very_ tiring and stressful at the end of a long day. Gordon. -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity - Dash - context lists
On 02/10/12 23:18, Gordon Scott wrote: On 02/10/12 16:06, Alan Pope wrote: On 02/10/12 11:42, Gordon Scott wrote: At this moment, Unity feels a little like Ubuntu threw a grenade into the mix. Yes, I know it's been around a year or so, but I ditched it back then as too profound a change. I'm trying to prepare for what seems presently to be an inevitable change, but at the moment that's feeling a bit of a struggle. I'm still hoping I'll mellow. I like Ubuntu, it's always been relatively painless to work with in the past. Hopefully it will be again. Interesting selective edit. You lost a bit. It was your opinion. I have no opinion on your opinion, so I edited it out. :D Cheers, -- Alan Pope Engineering Manager Canonical - Product Strategy +44 (0) 7973 620 164 alan.p...@canonical.com http://ubuntu.com/ -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity - Dash - context lists
On 28 September 2012 10:42, Gordon Scott gor...@gscott.co.uk wrote: Putting my present frustration with Unity into context, I'm a person who on first setting up any OS immediately turns off all the distractions from and obstructions to efficiency, like slide-out menus (I don't want to wait for those .. I want to get the job done!), fades, glass effects, beeps, boops and whoo-hahs. I want a quiet, quick machine that does what I ask with question, tantrums or flourishes. My computers are tools, not special effects playgrounds. Me too - for me the only worthwhile eye-candy is window shadows and transparency during window drags, That's why I use xubuntu. Hierarchical menus, custom drop-down entries on the panel for your own 'categories' and of course ALT-F2 works too! ATB, Peter -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity - Dash - context lists
On 28 September 2012 10:42, Gordon Scott gor...@gscott.co.uk wrote: I want a quiet, quick machine that does what I ask with question, tantrums or flourishes. My computers are tools, not special effects playgrounds. I fully agree with those comments. I have very simple needs and Debian has given me a system that does just that - with the exception of gnome3 in its initial form and we cannot blame Debian for that. -- John Lewis Debian the GeneWeb genealogical data server -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity - Dash - context lists
On Mon, 2012-10-01 at 15:37 +0100, Peter Salisbury wrote: On 28 September 2012 10:42, Gordon Scott gor...@gscott.co.uk wrote: does what I ask with question, tantrums or flourishes. That should, of course, have read 'without' as you realised. Me too - for me the only worthwhile eye-candy is window shadows and transparency during window drags, That's why I use xubuntu. Hierarchical menus, custom drop-down entries on the panel for your own 'categories' and of course ALT-F2 works too! Personally I'm not that keen on transparency even when dragging, though occasionally it's useful, so I'd likely not stop that. I guess quite a few people probably do like the eye candy, at least as an attention grabber if not in everyday use. I can't help feeling, though, that Unity is intended more to be a marketing hook than something for users to work with. Maybe I'll mellow on that as I use Unity more, though it's not going so well at the moment ... I've set up the focus-follows-mouse and stopped auto-lift, so the windows work as I'd like, but I very quickly found a problem where Alt-F was opening the menu for the wrong window. It didn't seem to matter what I did .. move mouse between windows, click on the window in question, right-click, escape, it simply would not open the correct menu. I spent two or three minutes messing about before it eventually opened the correct menu. I _think_ I moved the mouse to the top bar directly, without passing over the desktop or any other windows, clicked and selected on the menus and it was back to normal. Of course I had to return to the window to check it, so who knows what else might have happen in the meantime. I guess as with John's comment, in this case it's Unity in it's initial form and it may still be a bit previous. I am _really_ glad I'm doing this learning process on my new home machine and not yet on the ones on which I earn my living! Can anyone say if 'upgrading' from 10.04 to 12.04 would result in a default switch to Unity? If it does, is it reasonably easy to get back to the previous desktop? Gordon. -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity - Dash - context lists
On 01/10/12 21:32, Gordon Scott wrote: Can anyone say if 'upgrading' from 10.04 to 12.04 would result in a default switch to Unity? It will. If it does, is it reasonably easy to get back to the previous desktop? GNOME 2 is dead. If you want to get something looking like your old desktop then there's GNOME Fallback mode (which as I understand will also soon be dead), XFCE or a myriad of other desktop environments. Cheers, -- Alan Pope Engineering Manager Canonical - Product Strategy +44 (0) 7973 620 164 alan.p...@canonical.com http://ubuntu.com/ -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity - Dash - context lists
GNOME 2 is dead. ...And looking remarkably sprightly on my Fedora 16 laptop... Vic. -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On Sat, 29 Sep 2012 11:45:19 + Andy Smith a...@strugglers.net wrote: Hello, On Sat, Sep 29, 2012 at 08:20:56AM +0100, john lewis wrote: Apple have always adopted the attitude that their way of doing things is the only way and make it very difficult if not impossible to reconfigure the look of their OS. Is that now the route Canonical are going to follow? I am biased towards Debian as you all know and make no apologies for promoting the Debian Way Very much the paramilitary wing of the Debian Republican Army.. I wish! I am sure there are plenty of Debian users who are far more militant than me. I'm not even a true follower of the 'Debian way' because I use non-free software when I think open source apps aren't yet good enough. A large majority of HantsLUG members were Debian users a few years back but for some reason chose to go with the new kid on the block. And they are wrong and you will keep on about it until they change back? :) I don't suppose that my opinions will have much influence and in any case I may not be around all that much longer having recently had my 80th birthday. -- John Lewis Debian the GeneWeb genealogical data server -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On 29/09/12 08:20, john lewis wrote: I am biased towards Debian as you all know and make no apologies for promoting the Debian Way A large majority of HantsLUG members were Debian users a few years back but for some reason chose to go with the new kid on the block. I moved my laptop (and soon desktop) from Debian to Ubuntu over six years ago, for good reasons[1]. Although Debian have addressed many of the issues that made me move away, Ubuntu have not (yet?) given me a good reason to move back. http://tonywhitmore.co.uk/blog/2006/01/27/sorry-debian/ Tony -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On 30/09/12 10:08, Tony Whitmore wrote: On 29/09/12 08:20, john lewis wrote: I am biased towards Debian as you all know and make no apologies for promoting the Debian Way A large majority of HantsLUG members were Debian users a few years back but for some reason chose to go with the new kid on the block. I moved my laptop (and soon desktop) from Debian to Ubuntu over six years ago, for good reasons[1]. Although Debian have addressed many of the issues that made me move away, Ubuntu have not (yet?) given me a good reason to move back. http://tonywhitmore.co.uk/blog/2006/01/27/sorry-debian/ I am deeply appreciative of Debian including because Ubuntu depends on it heavily in a number of ways. I support and use Ubuntu a lot, in part because the governance and its ethic is most broadly community friendly, and not least because it has undiluted commercial, mass market, ambitions. These aspects, for me, make it seem most likely that Ubuntu will go mass market, other things being equal I wish. -- alan cocks -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On Sun, 30 Sep 2012 11:07:19 +0100 alan c aecl...@candt.waitrose.com wrote: On 29/09/12 08:20, john lewis wrote: Some like Alan went over lock stock and barrel;-) Moi? Non! Monsieur Pope -- John Lewis Debian the GeneWeb genealogical data server -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On 30/09/12 11:07, alan c wrote: On 29/09/12 08:20, john lewis wrote: Some like Alan went over lock stock and barrel;-) Moi? If referring to moi, then yes, the same techniques worked when I wanted to escape from Windows(!) which was a brutal and painful period, even though I had been using several cross platform programs for the previous 6 months. It came to a time when full immersion seemed appropriate. It paid off! :-) +1 -- Tony Wood (from Linux netbook - Ubuntu 12.04 LTS) -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On Fri, 28 Sep 2012 23:22:45 +0100 Alan Pope alan.p...@canonical.com wrote: On 28/09/12 22:27, john lewis wrote: OK, I had no idea such a thing existed, I have never installed any version of *buntu on any system I have owned and never actually seen it running on any computer. My only knowledge of that distro is from the complaints of unhappy users. I know nothing but I'll tell everyone not to use it anyway. Nice work. I wasn't exactly telling people not to use it but there do seem to be lots of people unhappy with the way canonical have imposed their way on users without giving them an (easy!) option of reverting to the old way. (OK, that may be an exaggeration and I expect it is possible to remove unity and run other desktops) Apple have always adopted the attitude that their way of doing things is the only way and make it very difficult if not impossible to reconfigure the look of their OS. Is that now the route Canonical are going to follow? I am biased towards Debian as you all know and make no apologies for promoting the Debian Way A large majority of HantsLUG members were Debian users a few years back but for some reason chose to go with the new kid on the block. Some like Alan went over lock stock and barrel ;-) -- John Lewis Debian the GeneWeb genealogical data server -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
Hello, On Sat, Sep 29, 2012 at 08:20:56AM +0100, john lewis wrote: Apple have always adopted the attitude that their way of doing things is the only way and make it very difficult if not impossible to reconfigure the look of their OS. Is that now the route Canonical are going to follow? I am biased towards Debian as you all know and make no apologies for promoting the Debian Way Very much the paramilitary wing of the Debian Republican Army.. A large majority of HantsLUG members were Debian users a few years back but for some reason chose to go with the new kid on the block. And they are wrong and you will keep on about it until they change back? :) Luckily since Debian and other distributions do exist, users still have plenty of choice and the situation isn't really comparable to Apple. It is in fact very easy to run Linux and all applications that are made for Linux without using Unity or Ubuntu. Cheers, Andy -- http://bitfolk.com/ -- No-nonsense VPS hosting signature.asc Description: Digital signature -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity - Dash - context lists
On 27/09/12 19:27, Gordon Scott wrote: How can I get stuff grouped in a context-related way? In the recent past, as an example, I have a menu from the toolbar with top-level headings like Graphics, Programming and so on. 1)Dash 2) click on Apps (lens??) [the icon at the bottom of the dash which is next to the house symbol, looks like a ruler with pens] 'applications' 3) notice the top right hand side option 'Filter Results' This seems to do exactly what you are asking? -- alan cocks -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity - Dash - searches
On 27/09/12 22:32, Gordon Scott wrote: I thought it searched for 'function related' things. It seems to with 'player', as it finds a number of applications that are players, e.g., Timidity++. It found nothing for 'transparency', nothing for 'glass', nothing for 'jpeg' and nothing for a number of other things for which I searched. What are the rules by which it works? The longer term intention of the dash facility seems to include powerful searches. This will move what is now 'category based' life towards 'search based' life. This already happened with internet search engines some time ago, courtesy of Google. It is no longer useful to declare a category of search, just enter some search terms. Microsoft, uncle Tom Cobly and all, are also moving away from categories towards search, eg in windows 7. This is ok as long as the machine power and the algorithms are up to the task. Google have proved they can do it. I do not have faith in MS, but they are rich, and I do have faith in Ubuntu and hope that it can be made to work well. I have noticed the Dash searches are improving, although I wonder if crowd sourced help activity could be used with any advantage, or machine learning action. After all Thunderbird has a learning spam filter which is pretty good. -- alan cocks -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On 27/09/12 19:52, Jack Knight wrote: As it happens, after I discovered some love for Unity, popey posted this: http://youtu.be/xA9EHaNc2VI Which for me added the icing on the cake. Enjoy. +1 -- alan cocks -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On 28/09/12 10:00, alan c wrote: On 27/09/12 19:52, Jack Knight wrote: As it happens, after I discovered some love for Unity, popey posted this: http://youtu.be/xA9EHaNc2VI Which for me added the icing on the cake. Enjoy. +1 +1 -- Tony Wood Member n* of Popey Fan Club (from Linux netbook) (*where 'n' is a large positive integer) -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity - Dash - context lists
Hi Alan, On Fri, 2012-09-28 at 09:40 +0100, alan c wrote: On 27/09/12 19:27, Gordon Scott wrote: How can I get stuff grouped in a context-related way? In the recent past, as an example, I have a menu from the toolbar with top-level headings like Graphics, Programming and so on. 1)Dash 2) click on Apps (lens??) [the icon at the bottom of the dash which is next to the house symbol, looks like a ruler with pens] 'applications' 3) notice the top right hand side option 'Filter Results' This seems to do exactly what you are asking? Ah, I obviously didn't explain well enough. Ideally what I want (need?) is a quick-access route to tools for a context. In gnome et al, that would typically be via the hierarchical menu, e.g., from the top-bar 'Applications'. Looking at Unity, what would make sense to me would be either a dedicated 'Dash' for each context, or a lens (or whatever) from the existing Dash. I have seen a Python Dash builder, though whether that's a sensible route is another matter. I briefly tried your suggestion, but again the searching seems flawed. As examples, 'Graphics' shows some applications, but not Gimp, 'Programming' similar but not Eclipse. Putting my present frustration with Unity into context, I'm a person who on first setting up any OS immediately turns off all the distractions from and obstructions to efficiency, like slide-out menus (I don't want to wait for those .. I want to get the job done!), fades, glass effects, beeps, boops and whoo-hahs. I want a quiet, quick machine that does what I ask with question, tantrums or flourishes. My computers are tools, not special effects playgrounds. (I'd dearly like also to turn off animations in Firefox, too. I think Konqueror will do that, but for me it has other shortcoming). It was Alan Pope's video that encouraged me to try again. A good video that helps with a lot. There are aspects of Unity that look very useful indeed. But I have to be able to work with it and at present I'm finding that not easy. It also means I've declined to upgrade any system since I first met it, though as I mostly use the LTS versions, that's only been a modest issue so far. Gordon. -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On 27/09/12 19:27, Gordon Scott wrote: How can I get stuff grouped in a context-related way? In the recent past, as an example, I have a menu from the toolbar with top-level headings like Graphics, Programming and so on. Right now I find nothing like that on Unity, but I feel sure there must be a way .. dedicated lens or something? I did this by installing cairo-dock - it's a bit of overkill, since I don't use any of the application icons, but I do use the menu icon at the left-hand side to find context-based items. This is handy if you don't know which music programs or games, for example, are installed on the machine - you don't really mind which they are, you just want the installed one(s). Simon -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On 28/09/2012 10:05, Simon Reap wrote: On 27/09/12 19:27, Gordon Scott wrote: How can I get stuff grouped in a context-related way? In the recent past, as an example, I have a menu from the toolbar with top-level headings like Graphics, Programming and so on. Right now I find nothing like that on Unity, but I feel sure there must be a way .. dedicated lens or something? I did this by installing cairo-dock - it's a bit of overkill, since I don't use any of the application icons, but I do use the menu icon at the left-hand side to find context-based items. This is handy if you don't know which music programs or games, for example, are installed on the machine - you don't really mind which they are, you just want the installed one(s). Hi Simon, I've just been looking around the glx-dock/cairo-dock website. My initial impression wasn't too good, but exploring shows there's more promise. I note particularly that it has sub-docks, which sounds like what I want/need. The manic animations are a turn-off for me, but it sounds like I may be able to stop those. I may well give it a try, though part of this was to try and tolerate Unity as it's Ubuntu's default environment. An awful lot of people seem to dislike Unity, though, so it may just fade away. Gordon. -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On Fri, 28 Sep 2012 14:43:32 + Gordon Scott gor...@gscott.co.uk wrote: I may well give it a try, though part of this was to try and tolerate Unity as it's Ubuntu's default environment. An awful lot of people seem to dislike Unity, though, so it may just fade away. many people disliked Gnome3 too but the developers listened to the complaints and there is now an option to use Classic Mode, at least there is when running Debian. Hint! Hint! ;-) -- John Lewis Debian the GeneWeb genealogical data server -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On 28/09/12 16:08, john lewis wrote: On Fri, 28 Sep 2012 14:43:32 + Gordon Scott gor...@gscott.co.uk wrote: I may well give it a try, though part of this was to try and tolerate Unity as it's Ubuntu's default environment. An awful lot of people seem to dislike Unity, though, so it may just fade away. many people disliked Gnome3 too but the developers listened to the complaints and there is now an option to use Classic Mode, at least there is when running Debian. Hint! Hint! ;-) Just install 'myunity' and when logging in, choose classic? -- alan cocks -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On Fri, 28 Sep 2012 18:45:57 +0100 alan c aecl...@candt.waitrose.com wrote: many people disliked Gnome3 too but the developers listened to the complaints and there is now an option to use Classic Mode, at least there is when running Debian. Hint! Hint! ;-) Just install 'myunity' and when logging in, choose classic? OK, I had no idea such a thing existed, I have never installed any version of *buntu on any system I have owned and never actually seen it running on any computer. My only knowledge of that distro is from the complaints of unhappy users. When Gnome3 first came out I soon realised that I would not be able to use it as it seemed to prevent me from doing things the way I wanted to do them. So I tried various alternatives, like xfce, until such time as the gnome developers made it possible to run gnome3 in classic mode. I immediately returned to gnome for my main system and I only have one alternative running today and that is e17 on a laptop. E17 reminds me a bit of windowmaker which was what I'd used exclusively before adopting gnome when I went to a 64 bit system. I have a Snow Leopard running on a mac-mini for comparison and quickly came to the conclusion I'd not want to use OS X for anything serious. I dislike lots of things about it, from the way files are organised on the hard drive, the lack of customisability and the actual look of the interface. I had a brief play with the latest incarnation of OS X on some fast apple hardware with the very expensive retina display and found it so strange I quickly gave up, even the mouse was weird ;-( -- John Lewis Debian the GeneWeb genealogical data server -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On 28/09/12 22:27, john lewis wrote: OK, I had no idea such a thing existed, I have never installed any version of *buntu on any system I have owned and never actually seen it running on any computer. My only knowledge of that distro is from the complaints of unhappy users. I know nothing but I'll tell everyone not to use it anyway. Nice work. -- Alan Pope Engineering Manager Canonical - Product Strategy +44 (0) 7973 620 164 alan.p...@canonical.com http://ubuntu.com/ -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On 27/09/12 19:27, Gordon Scott wrote: How can I turn off transparency on the Dash? I hate transparency at the best of times, but the Dash seems particularly hard to read. Much of the time it's hard to tell what's on the Dash and what's on the window behind it. Install Compiz Config Settings Manager. Run it. Find the Unity plugin - Experimental - Dash Blur - None. Dash searches not really working? One of the features I thought might be OK is the search box on the Dash, but so often it just doesn't come up with anything useful, sometimes even when I know it's there! As an example, I _know_ wget is on this machine, but Dash doesn't show it even if I type wget. If there some feature or option I need to get it to see stuff that exists? wgtab in a terminal works OK. For commands that don't have a desktop file (i.e. command line stuff) use ALT+F2, not the Dash. How can I get stuff grouped in a context-related way? In the recent past, as an example, I have a menu from the toolbar with top-level headings like Graphics, Programming and so on. Right now I find nothing like that on Unity, but I feel sure there must be a way .. dedicated lens or something? Nope. There have been suggested designs, but nothing implemented. How to tidy the launcher? I've minimized the of icons on the launcher so I can see a fair percentage of them, but I'd like to remove most of the clutter. It's too full even before I open any applications. That's compounded somewhat, also, by the tooltip hovers vanishing after scanning just a couple of icons, and at present many icons are unfamiliar. Right click, unlock from launcher. Can I set up so that I can type in a background window whilst watching the results in a foreground window? I use that a a lot for testing, but can't presently see any way that it's possible with Unity. Focus follows mouse as it's called. http://askubuntu.com/questions/64605/how-do-i-set-focus-follows-mouse Cheers, -- Alan Pope Engineering Manager Canonical - Product Strategy +44 (0) 7973 620 164 alan.p...@canonical.com http://ubuntu.com/ -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
On 27 September 2012 19:27, Gordon Scott gor...@gscott.co.uk wrote: Hi Guys, I'm trying Unity in an attempt to get to work sensibly with it, but at present it's driving me mad. Hopefully someone can please help me deal with some of the worst irritations before I throw the whole thing out. I've been web searching, but can't yet find answer to any of this. How can I turn off transparency on the Dash? I hate transparency at the best of times, but the Dash seems particularly hard to read. Much of the time it's hard to tell what's on the Dash and what's on the window behind it. Dash searches not really working? One of the features I thought might be OK is the search box on the Dash, but so often it just doesn't come up with anything useful, sometimes even when I know it's there! As an example, I _know_ wget is on this machine, but Dash doesn't show it even if I type wget. If there some feature or option I need to get it to see stuff that exists? wgtab in a terminal works OK. How can I get stuff grouped in a context-related way? In the recent past, as an example, I have a menu from the toolbar with top-level headings like Graphics, Programming and so on. Right now I find nothing like that on Unity, but I feel sure there must be a way .. dedicated lens or something? How to tidy the launcher? I've minimized the of icons on the launcher so I can see a fair percentage of them, but I'd like to remove most of the clutter. It's too full even before I open any applications. That's compounded somewhat, also, by the tooltip hovers vanishing after scanning just a couple of icons, and at present many icons are unfamiliar. This next one's no so much irritant as vital Can I set up so that I can type in a background window whilst watching the results in a foreground window? I use that a a lot for testing, but can't presently see any way that it's possible with Unity. Thanks, Gordon. -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/**mailman/listinfo/hampshirehttps://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --**--**-- I'm not going to try to address each of these in turn, though I could, but there are some great resources out there already which will tell you. What I will say is, stick with it for a week, a bit like learning OSX after having had Windows inflicted on you for several years. Once you do get used to it, you start wondering why you did things any other way. I was initially as sceptical about Unity as I was about the Olympics, and can happily report I was wrong about both. I now love hitting one super key, typing (usually) the first or second letter of what I am looking for and that being it, rather than traversing endless cascading menus. I tried (and liked) Mate, Cinnnamon, various KDE versions and various other efforts. After several months of experimentation in my work environment (I have an enlightened employer who permits me to use whatever OS I like as long as I can conform to security constraints and spot checks) I have returned to, and am loving Ubuntu again, and now with Unity - which I really did not think would eve be the case. At work, I now run 3 x 23 monitors on a HP Z400 workstation with 8 cores, 16Gb Ram and a single, cheapo Sapphire radeon card. I struggled to find an Nvidia solution which would provide the same triple display at any kind of reasonable cost, and have now freed myself from the xinerama/compiz lockout loop. As it happens, after I discovered some love for Unity, popey posted this: http://youtu.be/xA9EHaNc2VI Which for me added the icing on the cake. Enjoy. /jfk -- Jack Knight -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity
Hi Alan, Well that helps a bit, thanks, though I'm still stuck on a number of these. On 27/09/12 19:41, Alan Pope wrote: On 27/09/12 19:27, Gordon Scott wrote: How can I turn off transparency on the Dash? I hate transparency at the best of times, but the Dash seems particularly hard to read. Much of the time it's hard to tell what's on the Dash and what's on the window behind it. Install Compiz Config Settings Manager. Run it. Find the Unity plugin - Experimental - Dash Blur - None. I'd found that, but unfortunately it does not turn off the transparency, it only turns off the blurring of the transparency. If anything that makes the situation worse, as then you can read one window through the other, which is pretty hopeless. Dash searches not really working? One of the features I thought might be OK is the search box on the Dash, but so often it just doesn't come up with anything useful, sometimes even when I know it's there! As an example, I _know_ wget is on this machine, but Dash doesn't show it even if I type wget. If there some feature or option I need to get it to see stuff that exists? wgtab in a terminal works OK. For commands that don't have a desktop file (i.e. command line stuff) use ALT+F2, not the Dash. Oh, OK, bad example. I thought it searched for 'function related' things. It seems to with 'player', as it finds a number of applications that are players, e.g., Timidity++. It found nothing for 'transparency', nothing for 'glass', nothing for 'jpeg' and nothing for a number of other things for which I searched. What are the rules by which it works? I guess one has to use a mix of Dash, apropos and a web search. Ho Hum. How can I get stuff grouped in a context-related way? In the recent past, as an example, I have a menu from the toolbar with top-level headings like Graphics, Programming and so on. Right now I find nothing like that on Unity, but I feel sure there must be a way .. dedicated lens or something? Nope. There have been suggested designs, but nothing implemented. So I guess I write a bunch of scripts and stick them in a folder hierarchy somewhere? :-/ How to tidy the launcher? I've minimized the of icons on the launcher so I can see a fair percentage of them, but I'd like to remove most of the clutter. It's too full even before I open any applications. That's compounded somewhat, also, by the tooltip hovers vanishing after scanning just a couple of icons, and at present many icons are unfamiliar. Right click, unlock from launcher. Erm, yes, or I've heard, drag to the waste bin. That makes them disappear, which is indeed tidier. I'd rather hoped to manage them more than that, but I guess your answer to the question before also answers this one. Can I set up so that I can type in a background window whilst watching the results in a foreground window? I use that a a lot for testing, but can't presently see any way that it's possible with Unity. Focus follows mouse as it's called. http://askubuntu.com/questions/64605/how-do-i-set-focus-follows-mouse OK, that's good. It's tricky getting to the menus with a mouse, but alt-keys seem work, so hopefully I can get there that way for most stuff. I also turned off auto_raise, which otherwise brings the window forward after a delay. Hm, I wonder does that always work? I have a number of tools with no declared shortcuts. Ah .. the cursor goes to the pull-down. That looks promising. I haven't yet properly investigated how one gets back, but at the moment that also looks sane. Good. I was quite concerned about that. Gordon. -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity Tutorial video
On 15/07/12 12:15, Alan Pope wrote: Hey, I finally got around to making a simple intro to the Unity desktop. Some of you may find it useful for other new users. Feedback welcome. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xA9EHaNc2VI Cheers, Thank you Will certainly check it out L -- The power of this life, if men will open their hearts to it, will heal them, will create them anew, physically and spiritually. Here is the gospel of earth, ringing with hope, like May mornings with bird-song, fresh and healthy as fields of young grain. But those who would be healed must absorb it not only into their bodies in daily food and warmth but into their minds, because its spiritual power is more intense. It is not reasonable to suppose that an essence so divine and mysterious as life can be confined to material things; therefore, if our bodies need to be in touch with it so do our minds. The joy of a spring day revives a man's spirit, reacting healthily on the bone and the blood, just as the wholesome juices of plants cleanse the body, reacting on the mind. Let us join in the abundant sacrament--for our bodies the crushed gold of harvest and ripe vine-clusters, for our souls the purple fruit of evening with its innumerable seed of stars . Vis Medicatrix Naturae, by Mary Webb, in Spring of Joy: Nature Essays, Constable, London, 1917 -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity Tutorial video
** Alan Pope alan.p...@canonical.com [2012-07-15 12:14]: I finally got around to making a simple intro to the Unity desktop. Some of you may find it useful for other new users. Feedback welcome. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xA9EHaNc2VI ** end quote [Alan Pope] Handy, a few tips that I'd missed, although a number of annoyances because I still can't run the 3D desktop, so miss out on some of the features :( Most of the Super key functions are missing, there's no options of only having a dash on one desktop, no option to resize the icons in the dash, etc.. Unity looks good, but only if you have the right setup :( -- Paul Tansom | Aptanet Ltd. | http://www.aptanet.com/ | 023 9238 0001 Registered in England | Company No: 4905028 | Registered Office: Crawford House, Hambledon Road, Denmead, Waterlooville, Hants, PO7 6NU -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --
Re: [Hampshire] Ubuntu Unity Tutorial video
Alan Popealan.p...@canonical.com [2012-07-15 12:14] wrote: I finally got around to making a simple intro to the Unity desktop. Some of you may find it useful for other new users. Feedback welcome. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xA9EHaNc2VI This is similar to the Ubuntu 12.04 presentation that Alan rehearsed to the LUG meeting in Addlestone a while back. Turned out to be good PR for Unity and converted more into enthusiasts. I was getting smugly confident with the desktop but learned a bit more from the YouTube demo. I've passed the link to non-LUG friends using Ubuntu and to the timorous three I'm still trying to convert away from Windows. So thank you Alan for the smooth and cool presentation. Still curious about that teddy-bear video on your desktop though ...? Tony Wood (from Linux PC) -- Please post to: Hampshire@mailman.lug.org.uk Web Interface: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/hampshire LUG URL: http://www.hantslug.org.uk --