Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

On May 2, 2007, at 10:15 PM, Andrew Muller wrote: Ooh, does this mean that they forgot to announce IE for the Mac at MIX??? Thank goodness they won't... I'd be afraid of all the new CSS hacks I'd have to learn. Oh, and all those other hacked variations on standard languages... - jon

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Time to go home... Never! I'm with Weyert on this one as well, Browser restrictions make my job difficult. Bjorn On 03/05/2007, at 5:52 PM, Weyert de Boer wrote: No problem! You got my email address. Remind me offlist and I will respond tomorrow. Time to go home. :)

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

No problem! You got my email address. Remind me offlist and I will respond tomorrow. Time to go home. :)

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Weyert, I'm curious to learn more about what you mean by the "browser part". If we could take this offline (I'm concious of the mail-list's context) and anyone else for that matter would throw there pain points in this regard my way I can feed it back to th SL Team. Scott Barnes Developer Evange

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Hi Scott! I just don't like the browser part of it. Makes it all too complex, same from RIAs in Flex/Flash, though. Desktop Applications like Apollo and WPF/Avalon are more my thing. Yes, expression/Web looks nice even got good reviews from a popular magazine :) Trillion times better then Fron

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Cool, if you see Silverlight as another piece in your online delivery solution great, if you think it's pure evil - don't use it. It's great to have choice of offerings like this and more power to one and all :) p.s Frontpage = Expression Web in terms of the next generation of Web Designer tool

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

I dont really care about SivlerLight I want Ultimate Experience (WPF) on the Mac! All those stupid online applications

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

erm, i dont think so. what about visual interdev? you say it got reborn. no its not frontpage. its a completely new and different program. unless you can run your frontpage files in it Expression Web != frontpage. you wrote, I'll also talk more about how Adobe CS3 products can work with Expressio

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

You got to love how easy it is to obtain artwork from the XAML files used by the demos of Silverlight ;) Time to create some evil version of it. :>

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

"Microsoft are extremely committed to the Apple platform" Ooh, does this mean that they forgot to announce IE for the Mac at MIX??? ;-) On 03/05/07, Scott Barnes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On 5/3/07, sher_ali2004 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Never trust Microsoft products and projects.

[flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Now, I am really confused! I am going to look into Silverlight and see if it makes sense to switch. The only thing I love is the IDE and ease of development. Any suggestions? - Nick --- In flexcoders@yahoogroups.com, "Nancy Gill" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > It's about whether or not Silverl

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

On 5/3/07, sher_ali2004 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Never trust Microsoft products and projects. They bring products and destroy those products themselves because of their marketing strategy. They never succeeded to run a product more than few years except Window OS and MS Office. If you put s

RE: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

it will make Flex stronger. _ From: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of sher_ali2004 Sent: Wednesday, May 02, 2007 7:24 PM To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com Subject: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

[flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Never trust Microsoft products and projects. They bring products and destroy those products themselves because of their marketing strategy. They never succeeded to run a product more than few years except Window OS and MS Office. If you put some efforts in learning a technology than you would neve

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

If you ever watch the developer videos on Channel 9, you'll see that many MS devs have macbooks (or whatever they're called) sitting on their desks! -Scott On 4/29/07, dorkie dork from dorktown <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: the problem with microsoft is they live in a bubble. they live in their

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

On Wednesday 02 May 2007, emendezgonzalez wrote: > > Why would you want to do it though ? > I was suggesting an "escape route" just in case Adobe felt the heat > just too close. Pfft. -- Tom Chiverton Helping to dramatically maximize eigth-generation eyeballs on: http://thefalken.livejournal.co

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

On Tuesday 01 May 2007, Adam Reynolds wrote: > When editing out content, can you keep the context of the previous > message? I have no idea what this one is about :) Maybe you should turn threading on in Thunderbird. -- Tom Chiverton Helping to vitalistically harness cross-platform e-tailers on:

[flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

> Why would you want to do it though ? I don't want to do it but, perhaps, Adobe does. I was suggesting an "escape route" just in case Adobe felt the heat just too close. It comes with its own set of problems, namely that the Flash virtual machine will not be the "jewel of the crown" anymore but

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

It's about whether or not Silverlight will kill Flex. :) (subject line) Seriously .. this conversation has been going on for days .. would be impossible to keep it all. > When editing out content, can you keep the context of the previous > message? I have no idea what this one is about :) >

[flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

isn't that what the previous message button is for ;-) --- In flexcoders@yahoogroups.com, Adam Reynolds <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > Tom Chiverton wrote: > > On Monday 30 Apr 2007, emendezgonzalez wrote: > > > >> Just an idea, > >> > > > > Why would you want to do it though ? > > >

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Tom Chiverton wrote: > On Monday 30 Apr 2007, emendezgonzalez wrote: > >> Just an idea, >> > > Why would you want to do it though ? > > When editing out content, can you keep the context of the previous message? I have no idea what this one is about :) -- Flexcoders Mailing List FA

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

On Monday 30 Apr 2007, emendezgonzalez wrote: > Just an idea, Why would you want to do it though ? -- Tom Chiverton Helping to continually drive ubiquitous developments on: http://thefalken.livejournal.com This email is sent for and on behal

[flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Mmmm, let's see: + Flex (generates) Actionscript (runs-in) Flash So, if: + Flex (generated) Javascript + WPF/E (run-in) Silverlight Just an idea, Eduardo.

[flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

...and therein lies another horrible truth, the MBP hardware is a winner, OS/X is not. I myself am using a MBP and it is awesome, but guess what, I'm not using OS/X (although I return for doses of sanity). My anecdotal study of the three Starbucks in walking distance from my house shows 75% of pe

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

On 4/30/07, simonjpalmer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Does C# kill Java? > Does IE kill Firefox? > Does SQLServer kill Oracle? > Does Windows kill UNIX? > Will Silverlight kill Flex? The answer exists only in Tao. http://www.canonical.org/~kragen/tao-of-programming.html

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

>> Yeah, I was using Windows on my MBP ;-) > Yes i noticed. mbp is the nicest notebook IMO. Yeah, nice ones indeed! And fast too. > WPF is cool for sure, silverlight not so much. > At the moment Flash 9 and PV3D seems more interesting than silverlight. Yes, thats what I am thinking too! It woul

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Yeah, I was using Windows on my MBP ;-) Yes i noticed. mbp is the nicest notebook IMO. Indeed! Developing GUI components for Windows is fun too, though. Creating Grid components and such! WPF is cool for sure, silverlight not so much. At the moment Flash 9 and PV3D seems more interesting th

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Bjorn Schultheiss wrote: > > > I am of the same opinion. > > At the recent WebDU conference I spotted 1 presenter with a PC notebook, > all the rest were macbooks. Yeah, I was using Windows on my MBP ;-) > I am quite a fan of a lot of non-windows based software, and i enjoy > building flash

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

I am of the same opinion. At the recent WebDU conference I spotted 1 presenter with a PC notebook, all the rest were macbooks. I am quite a fan of a lot of non-windows based software, and i enjoy building flash-based applications that can be deployed on either OS. regards, Bjorn On 30/

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

the problem with microsoft is they live in a bubble. they live in their own little world where only windows exists. well, at the college i visit half the people have macs. i am in a college coffee / study shop with about 150 people and half have macs. this all changed when the mac books came out l

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

> In fact if you want a really scalable enterprise platform you would > choose the right hand side of the list above rather than the left. I am not sure about the C# and Java bit, though ;) It might my severe experiences with Java lately. But I C# does a good job... You just need to use the rig

[flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Does C# kill Java? Does IE kill Firefox? Does SQLServer kill Oracle? Does Windows kill UNIX? Will Silverlight kill Flex? >From my 20 odd years of software development, during which time the Microsoft hegemony has been at its apogee, none of the above are true. In fact if you want a really scalabl

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Title: QDC - Bjorn Signature Hey Jason,Even if 90% of internet's users are running Windows, how many millions aren't..If you can deploy applications that is guaranteed to only be used by Windows users, well good luck to you.Here we target creatives in the advertising industry and I don't have that

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Silverlight does not require IE. It workes on IE and Firefox under Windows, and Safari for Mac. I also understand Firefox for Mac support is expected soon (if I've not already missed it). It has extensive cross platform functionality including streaming video support. It also has the advant

[flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

You are rigth Jeffry. I am sure there are a lot of people that do not work with Windows. And that's OK. I just wanted to say that a lot of people works with Windows and Adobe is letting these developers with no support. I am sure you will agree that the number of windows developers is very hig

[flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

I am sure that no one has a solution so good as Flex. What will adobe do, wait for them to be close. I do not know what are Adobe plans, but if at this moment there is not a solution ready to use, I am afraid that this solution will only be avaiable when Microsoft will have Visual Studio 2007

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Which department? Development. Creative. Windows does not have a monopoly. On 27/04/2007, at 12:34 PM, Jeffry Houser wrote: I think this is true for many enterprises. Not true for a lot of developers. At 09:41 PM 4/26/2007, Bjorn Schultheiss wrote: >Think again. > > > >On 27/04/2007, at 1

[flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

I think you are right that .NET support should be there, although I am not a .NET developer and probably never will be. I wonder if Microsoft could develop this solution? In theory they would have the best resources to understand .NET and enough people have figured out the protocols used in FDS tha

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Ummm no IE does not work on the Mac, the last few versions were awful and barely worked. MS hasn't been developing it in at least 2 years, maybe three. They stopped supporting it over a year ago. > Everybody uses Windows, almost all the workstations are windows. Macs > have IE working OK. T

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

At fitc Ted Patrick announced that Flex 3 will have platform-neutral support for data integration with .Net, Java, PHP, etc.. see Aral Balkan's notes from the keynote: http://aralbalkan. com/922 /*"I'm very excited about the back-end neutrality and the additional lan

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

I think this is true for many enterprises. Not true for a lot of developers. At 09:41 PM 4/26/2007, Bjorn Schultheiss wrote: >Think again. > > > >On 27/04/2007, at 11:26 AM, mvbaffa wrote: > >>Everybody uses Windows, almost all the workstations are windows. Macs >>have IE working OK. -- J

[flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

I beleive that Adobe wants to increase its participation in the software development market. .NET is very good and its number of developers is huge. That's why they should not be fogotten. This at least is naive. Adobe has one thing that Microsoft does not have, FLASH. This is the key to succ

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Think again. On 27/04/2007, at 11:26 AM, mvbaffa wrote: Everybody uses Windows, almost all the workstations are windows. Macs have IE working OK.

[flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Everybody uses Windows, almost all the workstations are windows. Macs have IE working OK. The better solution was a cross plataform solution, that's why I've been working with Flex. I expected, when I downloaded the alpha version of Flex 2.0, that at this moment Adobe would already havea .NET s

[flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

FDS Express is free provided you use for one application per server and the server has only one CPU. This is not exactly what I would call free. In fact it seems to me that FDS Express was delivered this way to provide a way to develop and test applications, which is very good. With this kin

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

On Wednesday 25 Apr 2007, Scott Barnes wrote: > developers more power in delivering their potential instead of reserving it > for Enterprise firstly, getting caught up in this Microsoft is evil war and > lastly forcing a technology like LiveCycle into the equation. > > How's that "misleading"? Bec

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

*sigh* you wanna play politics Mike, go for it, but if you spent more time focusing on the products and the issues developers face daily instead of engaging in politics around the semantics of what exactly should be disclosed vs shouldn't - on a public forum, that's not owned by Adobe - go for it.

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Scott, Don't you think you should make it clear in your emails that you work for Microsoft, as an evangelist with technologies that compete directly with Flash and Flex? I know you mentioned it a couple of times, but you are emailing from a gmail account, and don't put your Microsoft affiliati

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

How will they become a "true" competitor when as I understand it, the XBAPs really only work in IE, so the whole cross-platform notion goes out the window, doesn't it? I think that WPF definitely has it's place... on the windows desktop. It is my opinion that it will be huge in making windows app

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

On Monday 23 Apr 2007, mvbaffa wrote: > And It's free ! Isn't FDS Express free ? > When Microsoft solves the restrictions for the XBAP sandbox, XAML > Browser applications will be a true competitor of Flex. As long as you don't want to have small downloads. Or to work on Linux. -- Tom Chiv

[flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

I would like to remember that Windows Communication Foundation has duplex, or callback services. That allows the server notify the clients of any server events. Sounds like FDS don't you think ??? And It's free ! FDS is still more easy to use and more complete. But WCF is getting there.

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

i wouldn't say that. i think he has some valid points that echo my own. i love flex and i love the visual studio products when i worked in them. don't really like some of MS business practices but i feel more comfortable with MS than i have in a long time (well parts of it). but like scott, my fir

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

heh, FUD, Troll and there was another one .. think it was "sell-out" from memory... I've heard them all dude :) Just for fun, I did a google of *Brian Lesser + Macromedia*, you seem to be a very vocal member of the community, so given i'm "trolling" does that make you "fanboi"? http://en.wikiped

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Sadly, this seems to describe Scott's post Microsoft behavior: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_troll I wish it was otherwise... -Brian Scott Barnes wrote: > > http://www.youtube. com/watch? v=TyuDAzzKnz8 > > > :) > --

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

ese > > apps exist whether they are of interest to you or not. If you aren't > > interested, so be it. There is no tight coupling with Flex which is free. > > There is not now nor has there ever been a conspiracy. Whether many people > > or a few people are interested in L

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

eCycle is not really an metric that > matters to the success of Flex and I am not sure what you are trying to > prove. > > I trust one day you will come back to the fold -;) We'll keep working > on advancing Flex and Flash Player and Apollo in the meantime--no > conspiracies. &g

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

not really an metric that matters to the success of Flex and I am not sure what you are trying to prove. I trust one day you will come back to the fold -;) We'll keep working on advancing Flex and Flash Player and Apollo in the meantime--no conspiracies. -David ---------- *Fro

RE: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

___ From: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Scott Barnes Sent: Sunday, April 22, 2007 6:44 PM To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ? Paul: How many? Seriously, th

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Yeah, you would also say that when .NET was supported wonderfully and we got the problem with Java or ColdFusion connectivity? Now I can really care less about Java myself, but I can do tell that would hear the same sounds then. Of course, it ain't difficult to write some good connector .NET <>

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Oh yeah!..i agree.. I kind of wanted to dump and run on this rant as well... Happy to let it die of the natral death it deserves heheeh. On 4/23/07, Brian Lesser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Hi Paul, You made me laugh out loud when I read: "I shouldn't even be responding to this rant." I've

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Hi Paul, You made me laugh out loud when I read: "I shouldn't even be responding to this rant." I've had a very similar feeling! Some news that may be of interest from the FITC conference here in Toronto summarized by Aral Balkan: http://aralbalkan.com/922 /*"I'm very excited about the back-e

[flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

--- In flexcoders@yahoogroups.com, "Scott Barnes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Paul: How many? 37... I don't know... I don't even work in that group. I just know that it has been very lucrative. I shouldn't even be responding to this rant. I'm not too sure how to respond to it really. I don't

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Paul: How many? Seriously, throw the numbers on the table because I got to tell you, both pre-Microsoft and post-Microsoft things haven't changed that radically that DMS is more favoured then SAAS. SAAS is the new SOA dream, and people want it because it's less red-tape to fight for a capital exp

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

you wrote, How many enterprise / companies do you know are shopping around for electronic forms built in PDF vs SAAS solutions? PDF is a danger in some organisations, it's something they want to put as much distance away from as possible and prefer to leave them buried in the Document Management

[flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

--- In flexcoders@yahoogroups.com, "Scott Barnes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Paul, > > How many enterprise / companies do you know are shopping around for > electronic forms built in PDF vs SAAS solutions? Quite a few actually. The company I work for provides this as a service for many fort

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

I'll respond on the blog. :-D On 4/21/07, Scott Barnes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: John I agree with you on a lot of the points, but I am driven by the past, present and future and it's murky on both brands to be honest. I get were Microsoft are going, I don't get were Adobe ar going so I'm a

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

I only care about WPF not the crossplatform part of it WPF/e or silverlight. WPF is so much fun with XAML. I am even using it as the user interface engine for one Win32 project which hosting WPF content. Yours, Weyert

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

John I agree with you on a lot of the points, but I am driven by the past, present and future and it's murky on both brands to be honest. I get were Microsoft are going, I don't get were Adobe ar going so I'm affiliated to the MS Brand for my RIA going forward Want to know why? http://blogs.msdn

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Scott, you are right about co-existence. I've been following WPF (and /e) for a year now. Silverlight has quite a ways before competing with Flash but it is clear there is a market for Silverlight. Bottom line, competition breeds innovation, IMO. With Silverlight being here...Flash HAS to step up

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Paul, How many enterprise / companies do you know are shopping around for electronic forms built in PDF vs SAAS solutions? PDF is a danger in some organisations, it's something they want to put as much distance away from as possible and prefer to leave them buried in the Document Management Solu

[flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

I agree that Adobe is ignoring a large market. The low cost remoting product kind of already exists in open source, third party, and in house solutions. What Adobe is doing with Live Cycle is capturing the niche markets that do need PDF workflow in their RIA Applications. These companies have deep

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

I'd like to say "me too" to the FDS thing. It really is an issue. They only address Java while ignoring the .NET, PHP and Ruby crowd. They also market FDS way above what the market can bear. In marketing you have to know what clients are willing to pay for your solution over another solution. With

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Brian, I got could point for point with you and sound like a goose, but overall, I'll push back with a question. How many people on this list are in need of PDF work flow generation vs Remoting that's easier to work with on both JAVA and .Net while at the same time have a low cost barrier. I'd li

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

I personally don't see any reason to be newly concerned about "LiveCycle + FLEX" as opposed to Flex Data Services and Flex. LiveCycle is a suite of products including: Adobe LiveCycle Workflow, Assembler, Policy Server, Designer, Document Security, Form Manager, PDF Generator, etc. It appears

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

For the record, I was very vocal about Flash's potential all those years ago as well (In 2004, I made this post http://www.mossyblog.com/archives/276.cfm). I'm not trying to stir the politics, but i even look at the CS3 sku's and ponder what the hell is going on? (keep it simple). Flash has alway

[flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Adobe constructed a great product. The conception and architecture are excelent, but the comercial strategy is not so good. Macromedia had something like 4 years ahead of Microsoft, since Flex 1.5, that was a very good product too. Macromedia insisted to to seel it for US$18 k, nobody bought it

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Puff. Avalon or WPF just rocks! :-) I luv it. Great, to use a the user interface engine in application. Easier to leverage then the Flash ActiveX control Weyert

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Take it from me: Thomson v Microsoft 1. The documents I've seen waht to make me through up (dry heave) 2. Microsoft is involved in patent them, z4 technologies $140 recently is proof. So is Sun's settlement for MS hacking code. 3. Would you trust Microsoft. Bill Gates is a desp

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

On 4/20/07, Michael Schmalle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I have to put my 2 cents down for prosperity sake. which is important :) All you people that live in cities and constantly sicken yourselves by your own pollution, need to live on a mountain for a couple years, look back at what yo

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

On 4/20/07, Dave Wolf <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Scott, > Sillyness aside, there is substance to this and it was a great read, but i think what hurt it's purity is the undercurrent of "MS is evil, watch them" mentality. I assure you that undertone wasn't purposeful. I did flub the Sparkle re

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Always fun with Microsoft it's your competitor and your friend at the same time. I mean sometimes you cant without Microsoft when developing for the Windows platform.

[flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

I agree that there is room in the RIA space for another player. I think that MS has a few things going against it for this launch. First off it's a new plugin with little real world experience. It is going to take a long time for the market to become saturated enough for it to be relevant. It too

[flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

I agree it was a fun read, and I think Dave you got it right. It's a confirmation of the market and everyone it will benefit. Plus a little competition keeps everyone on their toes ;-) --- In flexcoders@yahoogroups.com, "Dave Wolf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Scott, > > > Sillyness aside, the

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

I have to put my 2 cents down for prosperity sake. All you people that live in cities and constantly sicken yourselves by your own pollution, need to live on a mountain for a couple years, look back at what you say and see how hilarious it all is. How many times can the battle of north and south

[flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Scott, > Sillyness aside, there is substance to this and it was a great read, but i think what hurt it's purity is the undercurrent of "MS is evil, watch them" mentality. I assure you that undertone wasn't purposeful. I did flub the Sparkle reference, but then again, most people misunderstood w

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Dave.C, Dave.W gets it :) He understands that the RIA space is not exclusive to one company but many, while I get the undercurrent of his blog-speech, I do however disagree with the "dark evil plotting" - MIX isn't because MAX exists, its actually because it's intent is to showcase a MIX of Micro

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

I hope this isn't taken with as some sort of corporate shill for my employer, as it's honestly not my intent, but Dave Wolf, Vice President of Consulting at Cynergy Systems, gives an excellent summary as to why Silverlight is a phenomenally important announcement to the RIA industry and why it's n

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Its an annoyance of mine aswell. I'm confused as to why .NET remoting was dropped from Flash/Flex (haven't yet seen FLASH CS3 and whether its back but yeah, no idea and all i can say is Mark's got his head screwed on right and he can help with WebORB in that regard. Actually the Flex Builder integ

[flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Ralph, The 1-4 were in regards to WPF vs Apollow, not WPF/E vs Flash. WPF does not use javascript, is definitely faster (is basically a standard winforms app), and by design doesn't need to be cross-platform. That is why it is a strong choice over Apollo if you know your customer base will b

[flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

>> Also at least in .NET the Fluorine gateway supports calling >> existing web services via AMF remoting so you get to use your >> existing code but the transport is actually AMF and not SOAP. Not to steer this discussion into a different route, but the same functionality (invoking web services

[flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

I've been working with Flex since its alpha version. Before the release version was avaiable I had an application with AMFPHP ready. That is I really love Flex and i have been working with it since it's 1.5 version. But I am a .NET developer, I have a huge legacy in .NET Framework 2.0 and 1.1.

[flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

I think MS's app is going to be as bloated and as convoluted to use as all of there other development platforms. I started out using CF because it was simple to catch on to, as compared to ASP. I tried VB and other programing languages but they are all bloated when compared to CF. Flex just nee

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

) Ability to leverage .NET developer pool -Who will have to do JS scripting 2) Performance (I'm guessing WPF will be faster due to the CLR) CLR extends to the XAML implementation. What speed are you referring too? Render speed? 3) Vastly (sorry, Adobe) superior IDE/developer tools (at least at thi

[flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

I would have to believe that WPF will win over Apollo for backoffice/intranet software for the following reasons: 1) Ability to leverage .NET developer pool 2) Performance (I'm guessing WPF will be faster due to the CLR) 3) Vastly (sorry, Adobe) superior IDE/developer tools (at least at this poi

[flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

If you go and see the sample of the technology on the Silverlight website, it is not as smooth and elegent as the ones Ely has created. I think it will have it's audience, but IMHO I think the movement of the community and the designer involvement is going to make Flex the king. I agree, mark

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

See there ya go ;) once you get past all this my muscles are bigger than yours stuff and you get to the heart of it, it doesn't hurt to know how SilverLight ticks though does it :) Scott. On 17 Apr 2007 06:29:35 -0700, driverdude <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: *snarf* I'm trying to stop laughin

Re: [flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

On Tuesday 17 Apr 2007, driverdude wrote: > I'll pay much more serious attention if they do a good job with .NET > integration. Flex + Coldfusion + SQL Server < Silverlight + SQL Server > with no middleware application server. .. except the one MS would have to bundle for free with SQL server ? C

[flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

*snarf* I'm trying to stop laughing! Realistically, Silverlight may pick up some heavy video developers, but Adobe is way far out there. I love Microsoft tools for coding, but doesn't this look like an opportunity to dis-include Linux and Solaris more than a real product? I'll pay much more se

[flexcoders] Re: Will Microsoft's new Silverlight Player Kill our beloved Flex ?

Version 1 of Microsoft products have historically been slow, unapologizing in their copycat nature, and hampered by large numbers of major bugs and gaps in functionality. However, their astronomical cash reserves and relentless commitment to establish market share has almost always led to vastly i