Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-27 Thread Jouni Valkonen
Abd ul-Rahman: » I have seen no peer-reviewed criticisms that manage to impeach the *correlation* of heat with helium.» If I have understood correctly, the correlation is meaningless, because there are orders of magnitude too tiny amounts of helium compared to observed heat. Therefore there is

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-27 Thread Jed Rothwell
Jouni Valkonen wrote: If I have understood correctly, the correlation is meaningless, because there are orders of magnitude too tiny amounts of helium compared to observed heat. You do not understand correctly. The amounts of helium are right what they should be compared to observed heat.

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-27 Thread Charles Hope
How's that? According to what theory? On Dec 27, 2011, at 11:01, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote: Jouni Valkonen wrote: If I have understood correctly, the correlation is meaningless, because there are orders of magnitude too tiny amounts of helium compared to observed heat.

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-27 Thread Horace Heffner
On Dec 26, 2011, at 5:30 PM, Abd ul-Rahman Lomax wrote: However, in open cells, the oxygen leaves the cell as it is generated, and in closed cells, excess oxygen is still vented, my understanding (otherwise the pressure would rise very high, as oxygen isn't loaded into palladium. Some of

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-27 Thread Abd ul-Rahman Lomax
At 01:03 AM 12/27/2011, Rich Murray wrote: Hi Abd Lomax, I'm glad to see you posting a lot now, and expressing strong doubts about Rossi. Are you continuing to develop your low cost tiny CF kits for electrolytic codeposition of Pd in deuterium heavy water electrolyte, using plastic to record

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-27 Thread Abd ul-Rahman Lomax
At 01:35 AM 12/27/2011, Charles Hope wrote: On Dec 26, 2011, at 22:10, Abd ul-Rahman Lomax a...@lomaxdesign.com wrote: Then there is that pesky Coulomb barrier. What I found, though, was that there was ample opinion among quantum physicists that it was possible that the unexplored

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-27 Thread Horace Heffner
It is not theory, it is experimental result. Go to: http://www.lenr-canr.org/ and enter Miles helium and McKubre helium. On Dec 27, 2011, at 8:00 AM, Charles Hope wrote: How's that? According to what theory? On Dec 27, 2011, at 11:01, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote: Jouni

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-27 Thread Daniel Rocha
I'm reading his papers and I don't understand one thing: 1.What triggers the 4D/TSC? It looks like an ordinary configuration of D in palladium... 2.Why does he use a value that is so precise 1.4007fs to the 4D/TSC reach the minimum state. His calculations are approximations and even if they

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-27 Thread Abd ul-Rahman Lomax
At 03:53 AM 12/27/2011, Jouni Valkonen wrote: Abd ul-Rahman: » I have seen no peer-reviewed criticisms that manage to impeach the *correlation* of heat with helium.» If I have understood correctly, the correlation is meaningless, because there are orders of magnitude too tiny amounts of

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-27 Thread Harry Veeder
McKubre now acknowledges his 23.8 KeV was in error. Harry On Tue, Dec 27, 2011 at 12:24 PM, Horace Heffner hheff...@mtaonline.net wrote: It is not theory, it is experimental result.  Go to: http://www.lenr-canr.org/ and enter Miles helium and McKubre helium. On Dec 27, 2011, at 8:00 AM,

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-27 Thread Alberto De Souza
After some calculations, I think it is better to use the MPG-D751. See below. On Tue, Dec 27, 2011 at 3:17 AM, Aussie Guy E-Cat aussieguy.e...@gmail.comwrote: The 2.5 x 2.5 mm device has a max power output of approx 0.8 mW at 10 deg K differential. Assuming 1 Watt excess with a COP 5 yields

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-27 Thread Mary Yugo
On Mon, Dec 26, 2011 at 8:12 PM, Alberto De Souza alberto.investi...@gmail.com wrote: I'm a new member of the list, but I'm reading the posts since January. I'm addicted... If we have a large COP (10-100), I believe we can use thin film thermogenerators

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-27 Thread Alberto De Souza
After thinking a little bit about the calculations I did (see below) and considering what I have learned from this year reading vortex, I came to the conclusion that the engineering approach proposed by Aussie Guy (and also Rossi) is the best approach forward in the LERN field... If one manages to

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-27 Thread Mary Yugo
On Mon, Dec 26, 2011 at 7:24 PM, Abd ul-Rahman Lomax a...@lomaxdesign.comwrote: SNIPIt's been called fusion confusion. Look, Aussie Guy is anonymous, what he writes is next to meaningless. Don't mix this up with the huge corpus of work from hundreds of scientists around the world. Hi Abd,

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-27 Thread Charles Hope
If the helium levels are what they should be compared to the heat, that assumes some theory that correlates them. Which theory is that? On Dec 27, 2011, at 12:24, Horace Heffner hheff...@mtaonline.net wrote: It is not theory, it is experimental result. Go to: http://www.lenr-canr.org/

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-27 Thread Jed Rothwell
Charles Hope lookslikeiwasri...@gmail.com wrote: If the helium levels are what they should be compared to the heat, that assumes some theory that correlates them. Which theory is that? Not a theory. It is an observation that deuterium is converted to helium to produce heat in the same ratio as

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-27 Thread Stephen A. Lawrence
On 11-12-26 05:16 PM, Jed Rothwell wrote: Mary Yugo maryyu...@gmail.com mailto:maryyu...@gmail.com wrote: Cells running heat after death have closed the loop. Apart from them, no laboratory scale device can produce electricity.The implication is clear. The cells can produce

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-27 Thread Horace Heffner
Excuse me. I didn't realize your level of understanding. Mass and energy are related by E = m c^2. If the inputs and outputs have a mass difference, then that mass is converted to energy, in kinetic form, radiant form, or both. This is the basis of most all nuclear reaction energy

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-27 Thread Stephen A. Lawrence
On 11-12-26 10:24 PM, Abd ul-Rahman Lomax wrote: At 05:31 PM 12/26/2011, Mary Yugo wrote: On Mon, Dec 26, 2011 at 2:16 PM, Jed Rothwell mailto:jedrothw...@gmail.comjedrothw...@gmail.com wrote: Arata ran a small motor with one heated by a self-sustaining gas-loaded cell. Cool! Did

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-27 Thread Horace Heffner
I wrote: The heavy lattice atoms are closer to absorbed hydrogen than hydrogen in adjacent lattices. That should say: Absorbed hydrogen nuclei are closer to adjacent heavy lattice atom nuclei than to hydrogen nuclei in adjacent lattice sites. Best regards, Horace Heffner

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-27 Thread Jed Rothwell
Stephen A. Lawrence sa...@pobox.com wrote: Arata ran a small motor with one heated by a self-sustaining gas-loaded cell. Jed, could you possibly give a URL for the paper (if Arata published one and if it's been uploaded anywhere)? I do not think he ever published that. It was just

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-27 Thread Stephen A. Lawrence
On 11-12-26 11:12 PM, Alberto De Souza wrote: I'm a new member of the list, but I'm reading the posts since January. I'm addicted... If we have a large COP (10-100), I believe we can use thin film thermogenerators (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermoelectricity) such as these

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-27 Thread Charles HOPE
On Tue, Dec 27, 2011 at 4:16 PM, Horace Heffner hheff...@mtaonline.netwrote: The conventional D+D fusion reaction, using mass differences, is: D + D -- 4He + 23.847 MeV OK, I get it. Am I correct that the conventional theory says this reaction doesn't really occur (it's either 3He + n,

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-27 Thread Charles HOPE
On Tue, Dec 27, 2011 at 12:23 PM, Abd ul-Rahman Lomax a...@lomaxdesign.comwrote: At 01:35 AM 12/27/2011, Charles Hope wrote: On Dec 26, 2011, at 22:10, Abd ul-Rahman Lomax a...@lomaxdesign.com wrote: Then there is that pesky Coulomb barrier. What I found, though, was that there was

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-27 Thread Horace Heffner
On Dec 27, 2011, at 1:05 PM, Charles HOPE wrote: On Tue, Dec 27, 2011 at 4:16 PM, Horace Heffner hheff...@mtaonline.net wrote: The conventional D+D fusion reaction, using mass differences, is: D + D -- 4He + 23.847 MeV OK, I get it. Am I correct that the conventional theory says

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-27 Thread Abd ul-Rahman Lomax
At 01:07 PM 12/27/2011, Mary Yugo wrote: On Mon, Dec 26, 2011 at 7:24 PM, Abd ul-Rahman Lomax mailto:a...@lomaxdesign.coma...@lomaxdesign.com wrote: SNIPIt's been called fusion confusion. Look, Aussie Guy is anonymous, what he writes is next to meaningless. Don't mix this up with the huge

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-27 Thread Abd ul-Rahman Lomax
At 03:28 PM 12/27/2011, Charles Hope wrote: If the helium levels are what they should be compared to the heat, that assumes some theory that correlates them. Which theory is that? This is an experimental observation, and what you are asking was stated. Helium is produced in PdD cells, when

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-27 Thread Abd ul-Rahman Lomax
At 05:13 PM 12/27/2011, Charles HOPE wrote: As to the opinion of quantum physicists on the possibility of there being unknown effects in the solid state, there was a recent revision of a textbook on solid state nuclear models, and it has a section on LENR, and it turns out that the author had

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-27 Thread Rich Murray
Hello Mary Yugo, I've looked at all of your posts for months, and appreciate your candor, spunk, restraint, keenness, patience and persistence -- it seems that the desire for a major game changing breakthrough since 1989 leads to premature big gambles that so far always fail -- so the whole

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-27 Thread Charles Hope
I'm going through Takahashi this week. How could a BEC exist at room temperature? On Dec 27, 2011, at 22:41, Abd ul-Rahman Lomax a...@lomaxdesign.com wrote: Bose-Einstein Condensate

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Aussie Guy E-Cat
That is the plan. With the help of Jed's archives, other private emails, the loan cell supplier and our local uni, we are confident to produce a simple FPE demo device that can be supplied to a wide market. AG On 12/26/2011 5:13 PM, Peter Gluck wrote: ...The history of demo cells in CF is

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Aussie Guy E-Cat
I take you do not read what I have written on this subject? We were ready to do a deal for the 1 MW thermal plant but Rossi suggested we wait as he is not ready to sell us a high temp thermal oil 1 MW E-Cat plant. Why? Because the plant is still in RD and the necessary technical specifications

RE: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread OrionWorks - Steven Vincent Johnson
Hi Aussie, I expect what Rossi will offer us is a complete package, including the 330 Ac kW gen set, all tied up with a nicely integrated NI thermal kW and Ac kW control system. That would be nice. When Rossi is ready to offer the system to us, we are ready to evaluate his offering. Do you

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Jed Rothwell
This could be extremely valuable for the field, and profitable for AG. It would be great to bring these to ICCF-17. Measuring ~1 W is not difficult. I recommend a Seebeck calorimeter. It simplifies matters and it has a large s/n ratio compared to other types, in this range of power. At ~10 W or

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Mary Yugo
On Mon, Dec 26, 2011 at 12:56 AM, Aussie Guy E-Cat aussieguy.e...@gmail.com wrote: I take you do not read what I have written on this subject? I try but sometimes my email client hiccups. Last I remember, you had sealed a deal with Rossi and getting a whatever-watt plant was just around the

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Mary Yugo
Here's what Rossi wrote today (good old Rossi -- always worth a laugh): 1. Andrea Rossi December 26th, 2011 at 11:39 AMhttp://www.journal-of-nuclear-physics.com/?p=563cpage=7#comment-157154 Dear Francesco Fiorenzani: I hope within 2012. We must have a production of 1 million

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Vorl Bek
MaryYugo Wrote: Want respect, not mention tons of fame and fortune? Close the loop and make them self running except for (rare) refueling. You'd be the first. That's for sure. I wonder why the people AG bought the gadgets from did not close the loop, or why the high school students who made

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Akira Shirakawa
On 2011-12-26 19:23, Mary Yugo wrote: Want respect, not mention tons of fame and fortune? Close the loop and make them self running except for (rare) refueling. You'd be the first. That's for sure. With a small thermal excess power it's not trivial to close the loop in my opinion. It

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Mary Yugo
On Mon, Dec 26, 2011 at 10:51 AM, Akira Shirakawa shirakawa.ak...@gmail.com wrote: With a small thermal excess power it's not trivial to close the loop in my opinion. Agreed it's not trivial. But I was addressing Aussie Guy who said his devices have a COP of 5 in the range of watts and

RE: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread OrionWorks - Steven Vincent Johnson
MaryYugo Wrote: Want respect, not mention tons of fame and fortune? Close the loop and make them self running except for (rare) refueling. You'd be the first. That's for sure. I wonder why the people AG bought the gadgets from did not close the loop, or why the high school

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Mary Yugo
On Mon, Dec 26, 2011 at 11:53 AM, OrionWorks - Steven Vincent Johnson orionwo...@charter.net wrote: Nobody ever closes the loop. I think the majority of the Vort Collective understands the fact that Vorl and MY believe most CF/LENR claims are nothing more than horse manure. I

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Stephen A. Lawrence
On 11-12-26 01:51 PM, Akira Shirakawa wrote: On 2011-12-26 19:23, Mary Yugo wrote: Want respect, not mention tons of fame and fortune? Close the loop and make them self running except for (rare) refueling. You'd be the first. That's for sure. With a small thermal excess power it's not

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Jed Rothwell
Vorl Bek vorl@antichef.com wrote: Nobody ever closes the loop. That is incorrect. Many people have closed the loop, starting with Fleischmann and Pons. In cold fusion jargon, closing the loop is called running in heat after death mode. Fleischmann once called it fully ignited, borrowing

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Mary Yugo
On Mon, Dec 26, 2011 at 12:10 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.comwrote: Vorl Bek vorl@antichef.com wrote: Nobody ever closes the loop. That is incorrect. Many people have closed the loop, starting with Fleischmann and Pons. In cold fusion jargon, closing the loop is called running

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Vorl Bek
Vorl Bek vorl@antichef.com wrote: Nobody ever closes the loop. That is incorrect. Many people have closed the loop, starting with Fleischmann and Pons. In cold fusion jargon, closing the loop is called running in heat after death mode. Fleischmann once called it fully ignited,

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Stephen A. Lawrence
On 11-12-26 02:57 PM, Mary Yugo wrote: Try responding to a real argument: if the claim, as Aussie Guy made it, is for a device with a COP of 5 over an input measured in watts, then why not close the loop? What COP would you need? 10? 100? what? Defkalion, by the way, claims 35x.

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Mary Yugo
On Mon, Dec 26, 2011 at 12:22 PM, Stephen A. Lawrence sa...@pobox.comwrote: On 11-12-26 02:57 PM, Mary Yugo wrote: Try responding to a real argument: if the claim, as Aussie Guy made it, is for a device with a COP of 5 over an input measured in watts, then why not close the loop? What

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Jed Rothwell
Mary Yugo maryyu...@gmail.com wrote: In practice the requirement to close the loop with a wet CF cell is likely to be more stringent than that. I understand but, not to drive this into the ground, why is it necessarily so? Is there nothing you can do to such a cell to get a higher delta

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Stephen A. Lawrence
On 11-12-26 03:26 PM, Mary Yugo wrote: On Mon, Dec 26, 2011 at 12:22 PM, Stephen A. Lawrence sa...@pobox.com mailto:sa...@pobox.com wrote: On 11-12-26 02:57 PM, Mary Yugo wrote: Try responding to a real argument: if the claim, as Aussie Guy made it, is for a

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Jed Rothwell
Stephen A. Lawrence sa...@pobox.com wrote: Now, to take up your second question, should it be possible to build a wet CF cell which gives enough thermal boost due to the PF effect so that you can get something useful out of it? Jed and Ed Storms have, IIRC, both alleged that it should be

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Mary Yugo
On Mon, Dec 26, 2011 at 12:43 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.comwrote: I suggest you stop guessing and read the literature. I suggest you stop referring vaguely to some amorphous literature and answer the question -- see below for a clarification. Cells running heat after death have

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Mary Yugo
On Mon, Dec 26, 2011 at 12:59 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.comwrote: hey figure that people who do not believe calorimetry would not believe this demonstration either. They have a good point. If someone revealed a device of this nature, Mary Yugo would surely say it must be fake, with

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Jed Rothwell
Mary Yugo maryyu...@gmail.com wrote: I suggest you stop guessing and read the literature. I suggest you stop referring vaguely to some amorphous literature and answer the question . . . No can do. I learned years ago there is no point to spoon feeding information to skeptics. First they

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Jed Rothwell
Mary Yugo maryyu...@gmail.com wrote: I'd believe almost anything, including most particularly Defkalion and Rossi claims, if they were properly tested, the tests were independently and properly replicated and someone or some organization I trusted did them. No you will not believe almost

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Mary Yugo
On Mon, Dec 26, 2011 at 1:27 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote: Mary Yugo maryyu...@gmail.com wrote: I suggest you stop guessing and read the literature. I suggest you stop referring vaguely to some amorphous literature and answer the question . . . No can do. I learned

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Charles Hope
On Dec 26, 2011, at 16:57, Mary Yugo maryyu...@gmail.com wrote: With Rossi and Defkalion truly acting and writing like clowns, it's not hard to see why there is no major press coverage or much of anything else going on, a full year after the original announcement and hoopla. And Aussie

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Jed Rothwell
Mary Yugo maryyu...@gmail.com wrote: Cells running heat after death have closed the loop. Apart from them, no laboratory scale device can produce electricity.The implication is clear. The cells can produce electricity. If that isn't what you meant, just say so. Obviously I mean they

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Mary Yugo
On Mon, Dec 26, 2011 at 2:16 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote: Arata ran a small motor with one heated by a self-sustaining gas-loaded cell. Cool! Did anyone verify this or replicate it? And how long did it run and at what output level? Why is it that specific questions as to

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Aussie Guy E-Cat
We need to generate electricity. To do that we need more than 120 deg C steam. So we wait for the high temp thermal oil E-Cat. The fame belongs to FP. I'm nothing more than a system integrator. As for closing the loop with a thermal FPE device, you do understand the Carnot cycle? If not,

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Jed Rothwell
Mary Yugo maryyu...@gmail.com wrote: It must do more than barely exceed the limits of chemistry, what ever exactly that is. The first report in the literature showed it exceeding the limits by a factor of 1,700. That's not barely; that is a lot. Like a person pole vaulting 10 km high. If you

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Aussie Guy E-Cat
I know he is very busy. I see getting the NI control system working very well is his current priority. I agree with that. I do know electricity generation is a high priority. He needs to show this before Defkalion does. The first to show electricity generation from their device will gain high

RE: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Mark Iverson-ZeroPoint
MaryYugo asks: Why is it that specific questions as to power output and duration are, to some cold fusion advocates, like sunshine to vampires? And Mary, the same could be said for your ANONYMOUS modeler. When asked in a very polite, respectful manner some specific questions by Dave

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Mary Yugo
On Mon, Dec 26, 2011 at 3:03 PM, Mark Iverson-ZeroPoint zeropo...@charter.net wrote: MaryYugo asks: “Why is it that specific questions as to power output and duration are, to some cold fusion advocates, like sunshine to vampires?” ** ** And Mary, the same could be said for your

RE: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Mark Iverson-ZeroPoint
This pretty much sums it up. If there is anything I have learned from the pathoskeps over the past year is that intellectual and well-reasoned arguments are not really necessary to get your point across, and that annoying repetition can be effective. -m

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Aussie Guy E-Cat
Your assuming their pay check allows them to change their opinion. MY and others put in so much time that I feel they have a stake in the game and it is not about FPE devices being accepted as real. AG On 12/27/2011 10:00 AM, Mark Iverson-ZeroPoint wrote: This pretty much sums it up… “If

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Mary Yugo
http://i.imgur.com/YdetE.png

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Mary Yugo
On Mon, Dec 26, 2011 at 4:12 PM, Mary Yugo maryyu...@gmail.com wrote: http://i.imgur.com/YdetE.png That was a response by Aber0der to this Alsetalokin remark: I'll buy a Mac when you can pour water in one end and make espresso with the steam from the internal iEcat out the other end. Here:

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread David Roberson
-Original Message- From: Mary Yugo maryyu...@gmail.com To: vortex-l vortex-l@eskimo.com Sent: Mon, Dec 26, 2011 6:19 pm Subject: Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells On Mon, Dec 26, 2011 at 3:03 PM, Mark Iverson-ZeroPoint zeropo...@charter.net wrote: MaryYugo asks: “Why is it that specific questions

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Abd ul-Rahman Lomax
At 07:32 PM 12/25/2011, Aussie Guy E-Cat wrote: I can't discuss the cell technology yet. I can say I consider a Ni-H cell as a FPE device. You can call a pig an eagle, but that won't make it fly. Seriously, the term Fleischman-Pons effect is taken. It usually refers to the Fleischman-Pons

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Aussie Guy E-Cat
I say DDSLA, Different Dog, Same Leg Action. Until it is proven what causes the FPE is not what causes the Ni-H effect, I'll continue to refer to ALL such devices as FPE devices. I will not stand by and see FP denied the right to the effect they discovered. To go further, after we start

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Abd ul-Rahman Lomax
At 03:14 PM 12/26/2011, Mary Yugo wrote: On Mon, Dec 26, 2011 at 12:10 PM, Jed Rothwell mailto:jedrothw...@gmail.comjedrothw...@gmail.com wrote: Vorl Bek mailto:vorl@antichef.comvorl@antichef.com wrote: Nobody ever closes the loop. That is incorrect. Many people have closed the

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Mary Yugo
On Mon, Dec 26, 2011 at 5:48 PM, David Roberson dlrober...@aol.com wrote: Mary, I would like very much to work with your acquaintance to see how his model compares to some of the in dept analysis I completed upon the October 6 test data. I totally understand how his model must work and

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Abd ul-Rahman Lomax
At 03:19 PM 12/26/2011, Vorl Bek wrote: Vorl Bek vorl@antichef.com wrote: Nobody ever closes the loop. That is incorrect. Many people have closed the loop, starting with Fleischmann and Pons. In cold fusion jargon, closing the loop is called running in heat after death mode.

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Abd ul-Rahman Lomax
At 04:27 PM 12/26/2011, Jed Rothwell wrote: Mary Yugo mailto:maryyu...@gmail.commaryyu...@gmail.com wrote: I suggest you stop guessing and read the literature. I suggest you stop referring vaguely to some amorphous literature and answer the question . . . No can do. I learned years ago

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Abd ul-Rahman Lomax
At 04:52 PM 12/26/2011, Jed Rothwell wrote: Mary Yugo mailto:maryyu...@gmail.commaryyu...@gmail.com wrote: I'd believe almost anything, including most particularly Defkalion and Rossi claims, if they were properly tested, the tests were independently and properly replicated and someone or

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Jed Rothwell
Abd ul-Rahman Lomax a...@lomaxdesign.com wrote: You have not even bothered to look at most, and the few that you claim you read you say make no sense and are poorly written. Jed, that's really unfair. You are mixing up two very different situations, the Rossi/Defkalion issue, and the full

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Abd ul-Rahman Lomax
At 05:31 PM 12/26/2011, Mary Yugo wrote: On Mon, Dec 26, 2011 at 2:16 PM, Jed Rothwell mailto:jedrothw...@gmail.comjedrothw...@gmail.com wrote: Arata ran a small motor with one heated by a self-sustaining gas-loaded cell. Cool! Did anyone verify this or replicate it? And how long did it

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Alberto De Souza
I'm a new member of the list, but I'm reading the posts since January. I'm addicted... If we have a large COP (10-100), I believe we can use thin film thermogenerators (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermoelectricity) such as these http://www.micropelt.com/down/datasheet_mpg_d651_d751.pdf to make

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Aussie Guy E-Cat
The 2.5 x 2.5 mm device has a max power output of approx 0.8 mW at 10 deg K differential. Assuming 1 Watt excess with a COP 5 yields 200 mW input. Would need around 300 of the MPG-D615 devices with fitted finned heat sinks to each device's COLD side to get good thermal transfer into the air.

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Rich Murray
Hi Abd Lomax, I'm glad to see you posting a lot now, and expressing strong doubts about Rossi. Are you continuing to develop your low cost tiny CF kits for electrolytic codeposition of Pd in deuterium heavy water electrolyte, using plastic to record the impacts of any generated neutrons,

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-26 Thread Charles Hope
On Dec 26, 2011, at 22:10, Abd ul-Rahman Lomax a...@lomaxdesign.com wrote: Then there is that pesky Coulomb barrier. What I found, though, was that there was ample opinion among quantum physicists that it was possible that the unexplored conditions of condensed matter just might provide

RE: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-25 Thread OrionWorks - Steven Vincent Johnson
Greetings Aussie, and a Merry Down-Under X-Mass to you. I've taken advantage of a brief respite between family obligations by sneaking over to my home office for some covert posting. Despite MY's self-defensive tactic of hoping to remain passively ignorant of the issues by demanding you

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-25 Thread Aussie Guy E-Cat
We will be working with a local university to get the cells operational and then to build our own. We will go public when our cells are operational and we have the uni endorsed results. Please understand these are not commercial cells. They are to show, to potential clients and financial

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-25 Thread Aussie Guy E-Cat
The 2 cells were obtained from an Asian source. They are on loan for 3 months. The source will work remotely with our local uni to get them operational. They output greater than 1 watt with a COP greater than 5. We are funding the work at the local uni. The uni can publish the results from the

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-25 Thread Daniel Rocha
Oh, so you will let MY personally do any test she desires with your cells? 2011/12/25 Aussie Guy E-Cat aussieguy.e...@gmail.com The 2 cells were obtained from an Asian source. They are on loan for 3 months. The source will work remotely with our local uni to get them operational. They output

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-25 Thread Mary Yugo
On Sun, Dec 25, 2011 at 3:42 PM, Aussie Guy E-Cat aussieguy.e...@gmail.comwrote: They output greater than 1 watt with a COP greater than 5. Thermal or electrical? And if they output 5x input at a watt level, it should be almost trivial to run them on their own output. A long run without any

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-25 Thread Daniel Rocha
That's thermal... 2011/12/25 Mary Yugo maryyu...@gmail.com On Sun, Dec 25, 2011 at 3:42 PM, Aussie Guy E-Cat aussieguy.e...@gmail.com wrote: They output greater than 1 watt with a COP greater than 5. Thermal or electrical? And if they output 5x input at a watt level, it should be

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-25 Thread Aussie Guy E-Cat
We don't own any cells at present. When we finish the replicant stage and we are ready to provide cells to others, MY or anyone else can purchase them. Then MY can do whatever MY desires with the cells MY purchases. AG On 12/26/2011 10:14 AM, Daniel Rocha wrote: Oh, so you will let MY

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-25 Thread Daniel Rocha
Why don't you develop it open source? Like RepRap: http://reprap.org/wiki/RepRap 2011/12/25 Aussie Guy E-Cat aussieguy.e...@gmail.com We don't own any cells at present. When we finish the replicant stage and we are ready to provide cells to others, MY or anyone else can purchase them. Then

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-25 Thread Aussie Guy E-Cat
They are simple thermal electrochemical cells. We plan to trial various ideas to link a small external heat exchanger so you can flow water in the secondary circuit and do delta temp measurements. AG On 12/26/2011 10:16 AM, Mary Yugo wrote: On Sun, Dec 25, 2011 at 3:42 PM, Aussie Guy

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-25 Thread Aussie Guy E-Cat
We are moving into this field to make money. We have already invested over $100k to secure the first loan cells and to do the uni work. We expect to recover some those funds from the sale of the FPE replicant cells and other services. We will create a web site and discussion forum where FPE

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-25 Thread Stephen A. Lawrence
On 11-12-25 07:03 PM, Aussie Guy E-Cat wrote: They are simple thermal electrochemical cells. We plan to trial various ideas to link a small external heat exchanger so you can flow water in the secondary circuit and do delta temp measurements. I don't understand. That would provide you

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-25 Thread Terry Blanton
On Sun, Dec 25, 2011 at 7:20 PM, Aussie Guy E-Cat aussieguy.e...@gmail.com wrote: We are moving into this field to make money. We have already invested over $100k to secure the first loan cells and to do the uni work. We expect to recover some those funds from the sale of the FPE replicant

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-25 Thread Daniel Rocha
So, your aim is not to convince skeptics. That is something secondary in this plan and this is what we would expect from Rossi, DGT anyway. So, you won't get a better result in convincing any skeptics since we will have to wait mcuh longer since you are in a much earlier stage of development. If

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-25 Thread Aussie Guy E-Cat
I saw over 1 Watt of excess heat generated with a COP of greater than 5. That needs to be confirmed by our local uni before they can draw down the funding. AG On 12/26/2011 10:53 AM, Stephen A. Lawrence wrote: On 11-12-25 07:03 PM, Aussie Guy E-Cat wrote: They are simple thermal

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-25 Thread Aussie Guy E-Cat
I can't discuss the cell technology yet. I can say I consider a Ni-H cell as a FPE device. AG On 12/26/2011 10:53 AM, Terry Blanton wrote: On Sun, Dec 25, 2011 at 7:20 PM, Aussie Guy E-Cat aussieguy.e...@gmail.com wrote: We are moving into this field to make money. We have already invested

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-25 Thread Terry Blanton
On Sun, Dec 25, 2011 at 7:32 PM, Aussie Guy E-Cat aussieguy.e...@gmail.com wrote: I can't discuss the cell technology yet. I can say I consider a Ni-H cell as a FPE device. But it is not. The reaction is likely unrelated to PdD. T

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-25 Thread Daniel Rocha
It depends on the theory. The solar process can yield deuterium from protons. 2011/12/25 Terry Blanton hohlr...@gmail.com On Sun, Dec 25, 2011 at 7:32 PM, Aussie Guy E-Cat aussieguy.e...@gmail.com wrote: I can't discuss the cell technology yet. I can say I consider a Ni-H cell as a FPE

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-25 Thread Aussie Guy E-Cat
At this moment in time all I have are 2 loan cells. They will be tested at a local uni, which claims to have the necessary people and equipment to do a proper evaluation and to produce a report. When I and others see the uni report, showing the cells have repeated what I saw a few weeks ago,

Re: [Vo]:We have FPE cells

2011-12-25 Thread Aussie Guy E-Cat
I support McKubre's Conservation of Miracles or as I put it, Different Dog, Same Leg Action ;) AG On 12/26/2011 11:04 AM, Terry Blanton wrote: On Sun, Dec 25, 2011 at 7:32 PM, Aussie Guy E-Cat aussieguy.e...@gmail.com wrote: I can't discuss the cell technology yet. I can say I consider a

  1   2   >