President Obama has stated that he is struggling with this issue, and that he is open to evolving and changing his personal opinion. The President favors full civil union equality with equal rights and benefits for same sex couples, and the repeal of DOMA.
On 12/23/10, GregfromBoston <[email protected]> wrote: > You oppose the repeal of DOMA, which discriminates against legally > married same sex couples who only want equal Federal marriage > benefits > such as social security and joint tax returns, etc. > --------------------------------------- > > So does President Obama, as did Clinton before him > > Are they, "homophobic Reich wingnut fascists" too? > > On Dec 23, 9:52 am, Tommy News <[email protected]> wrote: >> Lil Keithie Kieth >> >> I am very sorry that you are such a homophobic Reich wingnut fascist. >> >> To repeat again, >> >> Don't you believe that when you called me "Asshole" "Moonbat" >> "Marxist" "Socialist" >> "Young Tommy" "Lil Tom Tom" "Ignorant" etc. you were being hateful, >> smearing and hurting me, and lying? >> >> I believe you are telling lies again.You have demonstrated again and >> again that you do NOT hold "beliefs of equality for all" as you falsely >> claim. >> >> You oppose the repeal of DADT, which has ruined thousands of lives and >> careers. >> >> You oppose the repeal of DOMA, which discriminates against legally >> married same sex couples who only want equal Federal marriage benefits >> such as social security and joint tax returns, etc. >> >> You oppose Civil Marriage Equality for same sex couples. Civil Unions >> and domestic partnerships are lesser, unequal contracts with fewer >> benefits and rights. >> >> You oppose UAFA, and favor tearing loving same sex families apart >> through deportation. >> >> You appear to falsely believe that being gay is a choice and a >> lifestyle, which it is not. >> >> You believe that all gays are flamboyant chaps wearing cross dressing >> exhibitionist sex fiends, which most are not. Most dress better and >> more conservatively than you do. Many are chaste and celebate. >> >> You, Keith, by your own admissions, are a prejudiced misguided >> misinformed homophobic Reich wingnut bigot with a dirty mind. Yes, you >> are. >> >> On 12/23/10, Keith In Tampa <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >> > LilMarxistMoonbatTommyTomTomForNews, >> >> > How, or why would you make such a slanderous statement as that? Can >> > you >> > point to something that would make you say such a hateful lie and a >> > smear >> > against my person? >> >> > Either point to a post, with the quote, or make an apology. One or the >> > other, >> >> > KeithInTampa >> >> > On Thu, Dec 23, 2010 at 12:09 AM, Tommy News <[email protected]> >> > wrote: >> >> >> Keith does not champion gays as equals. >> >> He sees them as second class citizens. >> >> >> On 12/22/10, Mark <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> > Tommy, >> >> >> > Where is the need to champion ANY group when you champion all as >> >> > equals >> >> ?? >> >> >> > On Wed, Dec 22, 2010 at 10:00 AM, Tommy News <[email protected]> >> >> wrote: >> >> >> >> Keith- >> >> >> >> Although you flippantly state that "Yea, I am an arrogant asshole", >> >> >> you are in fact a misguided homophobe, as you have demonstrated >> >> >> clearly in your anti-gay statements in these groups. >> >> >> >> I suggest that you make youself a New Year's resolution to become an >> >> >> ally, champion, and advocate for your oppressed gay friends and >> >> >> group >> >> >> members, as other Republicans have done. >> >> >> >> Merry Christmas. >> >> >> >> On 12/20/10, Keith In Tampa <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> >> > Hey Wayne! >> >> >> >> > How do ya think stereotypes get started? Any truth to them? >> >> >> >> > Hey Vince! >> >> >> >> > Well, the last thing I wanted to come across as, was >> >> >> > condescending! >> >> >> > Yea, >> >> >> I >> >> >> > am an arrogant asshole, but usually a pretty friendly asshole! >> >> >> > Nope, >> >> >> > not >> >> >> > pacifying anyone, ya wanna hear the truth? Come on over and I >> >> >> > will >> >> >> > shed >> >> >> > the light for ya! >> >> >> >> > Good to see ya, and Merry Christmas! >> >> >> >> > KeithInDC >> >> >> >> > On Mon, Dec 20, 2010 at 9:03 PM, vince brackney >> >> >> > <[email protected]>wrote: >> >> >> >> >> You know it isn't really worth the effort to get Keith to see the >> >> other >> >> >> >> side of the coin. Nothing more condescending than someone who >> >> >> >> claims >> >> >> they >> >> >> >> are not prejudice and then make the statements that he does. It >> >> >> >> like >> >> >> >> saying >> >> >> >> I have gay friends so I am not a hater, when really they are just >> >> >> >> pacifying >> >> >> >> us. >> >> >> >> >> He is really saying these things based on his experience of years >> >> ago, >> >> >> and >> >> >> >> I suspect that was before DADT was even in existence. He has >> >> >> >> opinion >> >> >> just >> >> >> >> like everyone else. And everyone has the right to his or hers own >> >> >> opinion. >> >> >> >> I >> >> >> >> just wish it wasn't aired in this group. >> >> >> >> >> I am very thankful for the straight friends I do have that are >> >> >> >> truly >> >> >> >> not >> >> >> >> prejudice and except me for who I am. Wish we had more of them in >> >> >> >> the >> >> >> >> world. >> >> >> >> >> On Mon, Dec 20, 2010 at 7:26 PM, wayne berry >> >> >> >> <[email protected]> >> >> >> wrote: >> >> >> >> >>> oh god, keith, i love ya! but do not tell me that you really >> >> >> >>> can't >> >> see >> >> >> >>> the >> >> >> >>> forest for the trees? >> >> >> >>> heterosexuality represents 90% of the population. in fact if i >> >> >> >>> am >> >> not >> >> >> >>> carrying a CD by madonna in my rainbow colored purse, no one >> >> >> >>> ever >> >> >> >>> suspects >> >> >> >>> i'm gay! no one suspects my husband is bisexual even when he >> >> >> >>> says >> >> >> >>> judas >> >> >> >>> priest is his favorite metal band! because most people are >> >> >> >>> straight, >> >> >> the >> >> >> >>> assumption both gays AND straights operate under is that when >> >> >> >>> you >> >> meet >> >> >> a >> >> >> >>> man >> >> >> >>> you recognize that odds are pretty good he likes the ladies - >> >> >> >>> you >> >> got >> >> >> >>> a >> >> >> 9 >> >> >> >>> in >> >> >> >>> 10 chance and rarely will you be wrong. except when you ARE >> >> >> >>> wrong. >> >> >> >>> stereotypes exist because in any group you can name there are >> >> >> >>> often >> >> >> >>> people >> >> >> >>> who fit certain ideas that are recognized - some jews ARE cheap, >> >> some >> >> >> >>> white >> >> >> >>> people ARE incredibly "uptight", some gays DO prefer flowers to >> >> >> >>> football... >> >> >> >>> but within any stereotype there are plenty enough dissonances to >> >> >> >>> reveal >> >> >> a >> >> >> >>> stereotype for what it is... a careless and casual painting of a >> >> large >> >> >> >>> group >> >> >> >>> of people as being all the same, when indeed none of us are. >> >> >> >>> no one has to say they are straight because there are so many of >> >> >> >>> you >> >> >> that >> >> >> >>> you can scarcely imagine people who are not like you. >> >> >> >>> my jobs in kitchens are not as regimented as the military, yet >> >> there's >> >> >> >>> still a certain amount of macho involved in the job! but here is >> >> >> >>> the >> >> >> >>> thing... in all but the most antiseptic atmospheres, someone is >> >> gonna >> >> >> ask >> >> >> >>> you about your life outside the job. and there is nothing that >> >> sounds >> >> >> >>> worse >> >> >> >>> than saying you don't have a girlfriend or a wife or even just >> >> >> >>> some >> >> >> girl >> >> >> >>> you >> >> >> >>> bang now and again, than saying, "oh, i'm sorry i don't talk >> >> >> >>> about >> >> >> >>> personal >> >> >> >>> stuff like that." or weirder if you constantly avoid the >> >> >> >>> question. >> >> >> >>> when >> >> >> >>> there is no penalty for telling the truth you are much less a >> >> >> >>> freak >> >> >> when >> >> >> >>> you >> >> >> >>> answer truthfully, "well, no i don't have a wife or a >> >> >> >>> girlfriend... >> >> >> >>> i'm >> >> >> >>> gay >> >> >> >>> and i have a husband/boyfriend... ' or even, "i'm not seeing >> >> >> >>> anyone >> >> >> >>> 'special' right now, but i'm doing OK, if ya catch my drift." >> >> >> >>> i mean on one hand being gay informs a lot of my life (my tastes >> >> >> >>> are >> >> >> >>> somewhat different from yours, observably, aren't they?) but in >> >> >> >>> the >> >> >> most >> >> >> >>> mundane aspects of life - the need for personal connection, the >> >> >> >>> need >> >> >> >>> to >> >> >> >>> eat, >> >> >> >>> the need to have some sort of meaning in your work? it's the >> >> >> >>> same >> >> for >> >> >> >>> a >> >> >> >>> straight guy as a gay guy. >> >> >> >>> i really can't understand your need to cling to a fairly >> >> >> >>> outdated >> >> >> concept >> >> >> >>> of what a gay man is when you are the moderator of a group that >> >> gives >> >> >> you >> >> >> >>> every evidence of a gay men who are far from those stereotypical >> >> >> >>> pictures. >> >> >> >> >>> On Mon, Dec 20, 2010 at 1:07 AM, Keith In Tampa >> >> >> >>> <[email protected]>wrote: >> >> >> >> >>>> Hello Mustang! Good to see ya! >> >> >> >> >>>> First, I knew, when I wrote my initial missive, that there >> >> >> >>>> would >> >> >> >>>> be >> >> >> >>>> at >> >> >> >>>> least one thinking, "common sense" kinda guy (<Grin!!> >> >> >> >>>> asshole!!) >> >> >> >>>> who >> >> >> >>>> would >> >> >> >>>> call me on my last missive! Touche'! >> >> >> >> >>>> It is in fact a hard concept that I was attempting to frame, >> >> >> >>>> and >> >> >> >>>> you >> >> >> >>>> are correct....Sort of. >> >> >> >> >>>> Yes, as I stated, the military cultivates a "Macho" image, and >> >> >> >>>> it >> >> is >> >> >> >>>> hard >> >> >> >>>> to not separate the Macho Man who is the ladies' man. This is >> >> >> >>>> in >> >> >> direct >> >> >> >>>> conflict with my statement that the military does not allow for >> >> those >> >> >> >>>> who >> >> >> >>>> wear their sexual identity on their sleeve. >> >> >> >> >>>> There are a number of men in the military who do in fact play >> >> >> >>>> the >> >> >> >>>> "cassanova" role. I will admit that to a degree, this is a >> >> >> >>>> double >> >> >> >>>> standard >> >> >> >>>> and in conflict with my premise. >> >> >> >> >>>> Having said that, in my 53 years, I have yet to meet a >> >> Heterosexual, >> >> >> who >> >> >> >>>> identifies himself as a, "Heterosexual". That his whole life >> >> >> >>>> revolves >> >> >> >>>> around being, "Heterosexual". His politics; his social life; >> >> his >> >> >> >>>> mannerisms; his diet; his wardrobe; his decor; his passions, >> >> likes, >> >> >> >>>> dislikes, hatreds, loves, and yes, sexual appetite, are all >> >> >> >>>> defined >> >> >> >>>> by >> >> >> >>>> his >> >> >> >>>> "Straightness". >> >> >> >> >>>> Please point this/these individual(s) out to me. >> >> >> >> >>>> Therein lies the distinction, and no, nothing about the repeal >> >> >> >>>> of >> >> >> >>>> DADT >> >> >> >>>> will change the rejection by the United States Military on this >> >> >> >>>> one >> >> >> >>>> major >> >> >> >>>> issue, of Gay men or women who choose to defend our Nation. >> >> >> >>>> Just >> >> >> >>>> like >> >> >> >>>> their >> >> >> >>>> straight counterparts, they cannot and will not be able to >> >> broadcast >> >> >> >>>> their >> >> >> >>>> sexual proclivities, as is done so much in the Gay community, >> >> >> >>>> and >> >> >> maybe >> >> >> >>>> in >> >> >> >>>> some Heterosexual social circles; (Like the Nudist/Swapping >> >> crews). >> >> >> >> >>>> KeithInDC >> >> >> >> >>>> On Mon, Dec 20, 2010 at 12:33 AM, Mustang >> >> >> >>>> <[email protected] >> >> >> >wrote: >> >> >> >> >>>>> Keith, >> >> >> >> >>>>> While I agree with many, if not most, things you say we >> >> >> >>>>> disagree >> >> on >> >> >> >>>>> a >> >> >> >>>>> couple. This being one of them. >> >> >> >> >>>>> "The military does not allow for ANYONE, and this will include >> >> >> >>>>> heterosexuals as well as homosexuals, to wear their sexuality >> >> >> >>>>> openly, >> >> >> >>>>> or to >> >> >> >>>>> broadcast their sexual likes or dislikes publicly. >> >> >> >>>>> " >> >> >> >> >>>>> Heterosexuals already do wear their sexuality preference >> >> >> >>>>> openly. >> >> >> >> >>>>> Are you saying that everyone will suddenly be forbidden any >> >> >> opportunity >> >> >> >>>>> to display or even have pictures of their family and friends? >> >> >> >>>>> No >> >> >> >>>>> one >> >> >> >>>>> will >> >> >> >>>>> be allowed to admit they write, call, or discuss any >> >> communications >> >> >> >>>>> with >> >> >> >>>>> their wives, husbands, girlfriends or boyfriends? No one will >> >> >> >>>>> be >> >> >> >>>>> allowed to >> >> >> >>>>> talk about how things are going at home or plans after >> >> >> >>>>> discharge? >> >> >> >>>>> While on >> >> >> >>>>> leave, no one can invite a male or female military friend to >> >> >> >>>>> spend >> >> >> the >> >> >> >>>>> Holidays with a spouse, or to openly have two Dads or two >> >> >> >>>>> Moms? >> >> >> >> >>>>> The Israeli military has not gone to hell in a hand basket. >> >> >> >>>>> They >> >> >> have >> >> >> >>>>> no problem with both genders or gay people being drafted and >> >> >> >>>>> then >> >> >> >>>>> working >> >> >> >>>>> cohesively. It's the same as acceptance of blacks and women >> >> >> >>>>> was >> >> >> >>>>> decades >> >> >> >>>>> ago. Much ado about nothing. I am certain our military will >> >> >> >>>>> be >> >> >> >>>>> able >> >> >> >>>>> to >> >> >> >>>>> keep their minds focused on the tasks assigned. Anyone who is >> >> >> >>>>> qualified >> >> >> >>>>> should have the right to apply to defend our nation. Absolute >> >> 100% >> >> >> >>>>> heterosexuality should not be a requirement. Nothing will >> >> >> >>>>> change. >> >> >> >> >>>>> Mustang >> >> >> >> >>>>> Bigotry disguised as morality is still bigotry just as an >> >> >> >>>>> outhouse >> >> >> with >> >> >> >>>>> marble columns is still an outhouse. - D.A. Ridgely (whomever >> >> >> >>>>> he >> >> is) >> >> >> >> >>>>> ------------------------------ >> >> >> >>>>> *From:* Keith In Tampa <[email protected]> >> >> >> >>>>> *To:* [email protected] >> >> >> >>>>> *Sent:* Sun, December 19, 2010 9:18:24 AM >> >> >> >> >>>>> *Subject:* Re: [Historical Pictorial] Victory! Senate Repeals >> >> ‘Don’t >> >> >> >>>>> Ask, Don’t Tell’, Despite 31 Republican No Votes and John >> >> >> >>>>> McCain's >> >> >> >>>>> Fillibuster Attempt >> >> >> >> >>>>> No question, I see this issue from a different perspective >> >> >> >>>>> than I >> >> >> >>>>> believe most do here in HP. >> >> >> >> >>>>> I don't see the DADT repeal as being all that significant, and >> >> >> although >> >> >> >>>>> I agree with Rob and his assessment, I also think that there >> >> >> >>>>> is >> >> a >> >> >> >>>>> major >> >> >> >>>>> component to all of this, that Rob, or anyone else in the >> >> >> >>>>> group >> >> has >> >> >> >>>>> touched >> >> >> >>>>> upon. >> >> >> >> >>>>> The military does not allow for ANYONE, and this will include >> >> >> >>>>> heterosexuals as well as homosexuals, to wear their sexuality >> >> >> >>>>> openly, >> >> >> >>>>> or to >> >> >> >>>>> broadcast their sexual likes or dislikes publicly. In other >> >> words, >> >> >> NO >> >> >> >>>>> ONE >> >> >> >>>>> in the military can be or will be identified by their sexual >> >> >> >>>>> proclivities or >> >> >> >>>>> sexual identification, which is a common factor in the Gay >> >> >> >>>>> community. >> >> >> >>>>> This >> >> >> >>>>> is where so many in the Gay community are mistaken. >> >> >> >> >>>>> The military will boot out a service member who is an admitted >> >> >> >>>>> adulterer. Service members who are into any type of >> >> >> >>>>> sado-masochistic activities and make them public will be >> >> >> >>>>> summarily >> >> >> >>>>> discharged. Those service members who are into "swinging" and >> >> have >> >> >> >>>>> multiple >> >> >> >>>>> sexual partners, and who make that aspect of their lives >> >> >> >>>>> public, >> >> >> >>>>> will >> >> >> >>>>> be >> >> >> >>>>> shown the door and discharged. All branches of the service >> >> will >> >> >> not >> >> >> >>>>> condone any member who bases his or her lifestyle upon their >> >> sexual >> >> >> >>>>> identiy. >> >> >> >> >>>>> Nothng has changed. >> >> >> >> >>>>> Just as important, the military does in fact have and embrace >> >> >> >>>>> a >> >> >> "Macho" >> >> >> >>>>> image. This is requisite for combat. Yes, there are women in >> >> >> >>>>> the >> >> >> >>>>> service >> >> >> >>>>> but not in combat arms. The lifestyle is tough, rugged and >> >> >> >>>>> most >> >> >> >>>>> of >> >> >> the >> >> >> >>>>> time >> >> >> >>>>> uncomfortable. The stereotypical Gay male will not be >> >> >> >>>>> condoned. >> >> The >> >> >> >>>>> combat >> >> >> >>>>> units of the Army and Marines are all male and all the males >> >> >> >>>>> talk >> >> >> about >> >> >> >>>>> doing their girl friends as they charge the enemy with cigars >> >> >> >>>>> hanging >> >> >> >>>>> out >> >> >> >>>>> their mouths; not penises. This is the image that our >> >> >> >>>>> military >> >> >> >>>>> cultivates. It is good for morale, it is good for unit >> >> >> >>>>> cohesiveness, >> >> >> >>>>> and >> >> >> >>>>> most importantly, it is but one component of what makes our >> >> military >> >> >> >>>>> the >> >> >> >>>>> mightiest in the world. Again, this image is not going to >> >> change. >> >> >> >> >>>>> -- >> >> >> >>>>> Thanks for participating in the Google Group, Historical >> >> Pictorial, >> >> >> >>>>> which is the premiere men's forum on the web; focusing on >> >> historical >> >> >> >>>>> media, >> >> >> >>>>> and discussions of contemporary issues as well as our >> >> >> >>>>> chronicled >> >> >> past! >> >> >> >> >>>>> For options and help, please visit the group at: >> >> >> >>>>>http://groups.google.com/group/Historical-Pictoral >> >> >> >> >>>>> -- >> >> >> >>>>> Thanks for participating in the Google Group, Historical >> >> Pictorial, >> >> >> >>>>> which is the premiere men's forum on the web; focusing on >> >> historical >> >> >> >>>>> media, >> >> >> >>>>> and discussions of contemporary issues as well as our >> >> >> >>>>> chronicled >> >> >> past! >> >> >> >> >>>>> For options and help, please visit the group at: >> >> >> >>>>>http://groups.google.com/group/Historical-Pictoral >> >> >> >> >>>> -- >> >> >> >>>> Thanks for participating in the Google Group, Historical >> >> >> >>>> Pictorial, >> >> >> >>>> which >> >> >> >>>> is the premiere men's forum on the web; focusing on historical >> >> media, >> >> >> >>>> and >> >> >> >>>> discussions of contemporary issues as well as our chronicled >> >> >> >>>> past! >> >> >> >> >>>> For options and help, please visit the group at: >> >> >> >>>>http://groups.google.com/group/Historical-Pictoral >> >> >> >> >>> -- >> >> >> >>> - wayne. >> >> >> >> >>> goto>http://waynes-nude-musicians.blogspot.com/ >> >> >> >>> http://blueguitar.tumblr.com/ >> >> >> >> >>> -- >> >> >> >>> Thanks for participating in the Google Group, Historical >> >> >> >>> Pictorial, >> >> >> which >> >> >> >>> is the premiere men's forum on the web; focusing on historical >> >> media, >> >> >> and >> >> >> >>> discussions of contemporary issues as well as our chronicled >> >> >> >>> past! >> >> >> >> >>> For options and help, please visit the group at: >> >> >> >>>http://groups.google.com/group/Historical-Pictoral >> >> >> >> >> -- >> >> >> >> Thanks for participating in the Google Group, Historical >> >> >> >> Pictorial, >> >> >> which >> >> >> >> is the premiere men's forum on the web; focusing on historical >> >> >> >> media, >> >> >> and >> >> >> >> discussions of contemporary issues as well as our chronicled >> >> >> >> past! >> >> >> >> >> For options and help, please visit the group at: >> >> >> >>http://groups.google.com/group/Historical-Pictoral >> >> >> >> > -- >> >> >> > Thanks for participating in the Google Group, Historical >> >> >> > Pictorial, >> >> >> > which >> >> >> is >> >> >> > the premiere men's forum on the web; focusing on historical media, >> >> >> > and >> >> >> > discussions of contemporary issues as well as our chronicled past! >> >> >> >> > For options and help, please visit the group at: >> >> >> >http://groups.google.com/group/Historical-Pictoral >> >> >> >> -- >> >> >> Together, we can change the world, one mind at a time. >> >> >> Have a great day, >> >> >> Tommy >> >> >> >> -- >> >> >> Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. >> >> >> For options & help seehttp://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum >> >> >> >> * Visit our other community at >> >> >>http://www.PoliticalForum.com/<http://www.politicalforum.com/> >> >> >> * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. >> >> >> * Read the latest breaking news, and more. >> >> >> > -- >> >> > Mark M. Kahle H. >> >> >> > -- >> >> > Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. >> >> > For options & help seehttp://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum >> >> >> > * Visit our other community at >> >> >http://www.PoliticalForum.com/<http://www.politicalforum.com/> >> >> > * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. >> >> > * Read the latest breaking news, and more. >> >> >> -- >> >> Together, we can change the world, one mind at a time. >> >> Have a great day, >> >> Tommy >> >> >> -- >> >> Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. >> >> For options & help seehttp://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum >> >> >> * Visit our other community at >> >>http://www.PoliticalForum.com/<http://www.politicalforum.com/> >> >> * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. >> >> * Read the latest breaking news, and more. >> >> > -- >> > Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. >> > For options & help seehttp://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum >> >> > * Visit our other community athttp://www.PoliticalForum.com/ >> > * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. >> > * Read the latest breaking news, and more. >> >> -- >> Together, we can change the world, one mind at a time. >> Have a great day, >> Tommy- Hide quoted text - >> >> - Show quoted text - > > -- > Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. > For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum > > * Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/ > * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. > * Read the latest breaking news, and more. -- Together, we can change the world, one mind at a time. Have a great day, Tommy -- Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum * Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/ * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. * Read the latest breaking news, and more.
